I'm gonna I'm gonna appoint slide.

Good morning.

Today is Thursday, uh June 25th.

Calling the Utilities Committee to chair.

Before we call the roll, Madam Clark, I want to let you know that we're gonna appoint uh Charles Slife Pro Temp until we have a uh a quorum of the utilities committee.

So Madam Clerk, can you please call the roll?

Present.

Ray, uh here, here's thank you, madam, madam chair or madam clerk.

Just uh I know we got a packed house today, just for logistics for everything.

I want to let everybody know how today is gonna go.

Um, we have about 12 pieces of legislation that we need to hear that we're gonna do first, then we're gonna do the data center piece of legislation, and then we have a presentation from uh first energy on their uh uh their ask of a rate increase.

I do want to let people know that they are setting up council chambers for any overflow there.

Hopefully, we're gonna get through the legislation extremely quick.

I know that a lot of people here are the data center piece for the legislation.

Um, so we'll we'll reserve enough time for there.

Anyone who wants to do public comment, please sign up with the clerk over there.

We have not decided yet, depending on how many people sign up for public comment, how long it will last, or if we'll let everybody speak, but we will take some public comment.

So at this time, director, uh, if you want to come to the table, we'll get things rolling quickly as we can.

Good morning, director.

We're gonna start out with uh two pieces of legislation.

We're gonna hear it together.

Ordinance number 587, 2026 by council members Casey and Griffin by departmental requests and emergency ordinance to amend Section 523.25 of the codified ordinance in Cleveland, Ohio, 1976 to amend ordinance number 1662-09 passed December 7, 2009, relating to interconnection service for distribution generation, and ordinance number 588 2026 by council members Casey and Griffin by Department of Request and Emergency Ordinance to amend Section 523.26 of the codified ordinance in Cleveland, Ohio 1976 to amend by ordinance number 1662-09 passed December 7th, 2009, relating to net metering services.

That's that's correct, Chairman, and good morning to the members of the committee.

Um, these the net metering ordinance or the codified ordinance of net metering established in 2009 is obviously antiquated when it comes to renewable generation behind the meter.

So these are your either commercial customers that do it on their warehouses, on their buildings or properties, and also residential customers that would do it on the rooftop when they generate power behind the meter and then consume that power within the structure or residence.

Historically, based on the 2009 codifieds, we we do credit and we anticipate to continue to credit.

However, the availability of the resource, what we have to maintain, roll trucks, the metering is what we intend to now collect based on a formula.

So there will continue to be reduction in their power supply recovery, which is the amount of money we pay as a utility to buy the power to deliver to the customer.

But we do seek approval to charge the kilowatt hour charge, which is the charges that we uh establish based on staffing capital, all those things.

So the two ordinances are joined together because we can't do one without the other.

Um essentially it our our main purpose is to continue to promote renewable generation behind the meter and make it as transparent as possible, but we don't want to um subsidize those renewable generation customers by the other customers because currently if you generate more than you consume, you get a zero across the board.

Fine, but all of our other customers continue to pay for the availability of that resource to that customer.

So we are coming up with a reasonable formula to charge for the availability of the of the power when those solar generation facilities are not producing.

And what we anticipate based on analysis for uh a long time, a average customer, and it's difficult to determine an average customer because everybody has different consumption, everybody has different solar panels on their roof and different technologies associated with it.

But we anticipate in the summer months approximately $13, and in the winter months, $16.

So we we will continue to credit if you produce more than you consume.

It will still be the availability of a zero bill that will roll over to the next bill.

But we're trying to be forward thinking in how this impacts our entire system and also the reliability of entering that power back into our distribution network.

So we're T we're we're being forward thinking, it is some iteration of this across the industry in a multitude of different variations.

But in our instance, to the 2009 net metering, if it continues to expand, and if we continue to promote local renewable generation behind the meter, then our other customers would continue to subsidize it, and we're trying to write that ship now so we can as I said continue to promote it and uh encourage all of our customers to benefit to reap the benefits of local renewable generation behind the meter.

It is kind of complicated, but um that's how I understand it.

And I apologize, the commissioner of CPP is out of town, as is CFO Troy.

They will be here without a doubt if this is successful at this committee uh at committee of the whole on the 15th of July.

All right, and this is just for residential, right?

So if we have a community solar project somewhere like West 11th or whatever, right?

How does that how does that work?

So a community solar project chairman um would be in front of the meter and then distributed through the grid into.

So this is all behind the meter.

Okay yes, residential, but also there are a number of large commercial customers who are seeking to have significant uh renewable energy production on, like I said, the rooftops or their properties, and which is which is great, and we want to continue to promote it, but we don't want those customers who are not benefiting from the solar re or any renewable generation behind the meter to subsidize that.

The availability of the resource, there's a cost associated with it because we still need to maintain the poles, the substations, the transformers, the meters, all that wire.

So that availability of the resource in the event of a cloudy day, and it's not generating, right?

But the next day it could generate a lot of power.

So what we're looking to do is to just spread that over all of the customers equally, fairly, uh, equitably, and transparently.

And right now it's kilowatt credit, correct?

But we're changing it to customer owned generation credit?

Well, the the yes, the customer owned generation credit is what you the customer would continue to receive the benefits of post-change.

Uh it's the power supply recovery that would be reduced by the amount of power that's generated behind the meter.

So the power supply recovery is reduced, but the kilowatt hour charge, which is based on how much it costs to run the business, would still apply.

All right, and then is there an impact to customers if credits are forfeited or removed at the end of the year?

Not at the end of the uh, yes.

So if if those credits are not um used by the end of the years, then they would uh they would forfeit.

And also if a customer no longer uh is a customer of Cleveland Public Power, right?

Then those credits would forfeit.

So then anybody that either moves into the premise and becomes a customer of ours, hopefully, then would be able to start that clock.

All right.

Um from the committee, any any questions on 587 or 588 2026?

Councilwoman uh Hudson.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Uh, through the chair, I just have one question.

Uh just to clarify.

So these these customers who are uh who have solar panels and are generating their own electricity, they do not have backup batteries.

Is that correct?

Chairman, to the council member, um, that is correct.

In I don't I can't think of one instance.

The the solar battery backup uh is gaining momentum across the country as the batteries, the price of these uh fixtures, these instruments kind of right sizes, but I don't know of any customer currently that has solar battery backup.

We have a large customer um that is exploring it currently, but to I don't believe that it is active yet.

Okay, and so then just for my own understanding and for the public, the extra energy that might be created by these customer solar panels instead of being stored for future use, it's being um used by other CPP customers, and then the customer with the solar panels are given a credit for that performance.

Okay, got it.

Thank you very much.

That is all.

Thank you.

Council Councilman Shah.

Thank you, Chair.

Uh, just a quick question, Director.

Uh, what's the percentage of customers that were anticipating this will impact?

Like what's the rate that our customers are actually adopting solar or other renews?

Uh chairman of the council member currently less than 1% would have an impact on this.

But as I stated it, we do have continued interest in renewable behind the meter generation and also from the large commercials, right?

As as the market gets as crazy as it has been with the capacity charges.

We don't want to discourage it.

And some people would think, well, you sell power.

How could you?

Well, it's it's the right thing to do, right?

And with this, we're making sure that that's not being subsidized by those customers who do not take advantage of the opportunity.

Thank you.

That's all Chair.

All right.

Any other questions?

On 587 or 586 2026.

If not, please sign up.

Ordinance 621 2026 by Council Members Casey and Griffin by departmental request, an emergency ordinance to enact new section 523.252 of the codified ordinances of Cleveland, Ohio 1976 relating to interconnection into the division of Cleveland Public Powers Electric System by qualifying facilities, eligible large commercial customers.

And eligible large industrial customers and authorizing related agreements.

This is the PERPA legislation for anybody else who wants to connect into our grid, correct?

That's correct, Chairman.

So the public utility public utility regulatory policies act is federal law.

Anyone who wants to connect with an existing utility can follow PERPA, the federal law and interconnect.

What we're asking for is for the authority in the event of a qualified facility as defined under federal law, or anyone who else who wants to interconnect to our grid to give us the authority to uh engage, but then to accept funds for the necessary feasibility study and engineered study, design engineered study to ensure that that connection, that interconnection does not adversely affect our electrical grid or our existing customers.

So we want to, well, in some instances we could be forced to interconnect by the P by uh FERC, the federal government under PERPA, and we want to define key terms that are specific to interconnectors, the application process, reviews and approvals of any who's looking to connect to our distribution system, and also prohibits any potential interconnector from delivering electric service within CPP's municipal boundaries, which is the City of Cleveland.

Yeah.

The big point is that we don't want to spend all we have is our customers' dollar.

And we want to continue to look at these opportunities before we're forced to accept.

So we want to be able to accept funds, perform the studies that is all proprietary information that we don't share with a lot of people about our grid and our infrastructure, and then tell them whether or not it is feasible, and if it is not, how it could be feasible at their expense.

And that's the importance of this now new proposed codified ordinance.

That's that's correct, Chairman.

And the important part of this is should that they have to come to us before they can go through the federal process and then dictate the terms on us.

So we would then control the process.

They come, they say they're looking at an interconnection agreement here.

Uh we say that's fine, you need to give us X amount of dollars for us to perform the feasibility and the designed engineered study and then cooperative cooperatively perform the PERPA process through the federal government and then hopefully interconnect or ultimately not.

If it's not feasible, what we can't do is spend our current customers' dollar on chasing that wagging dogs.

All right.

Any questions on 621 2026?

Councilwoman Hudson.

Um Mr.

Chair, I have some amendments to propose.

Go ahead.

At the end of new section 523.252 C1A, and at the end of 523.252 C1B, insert the director of public utilities shall provide written notice to the clerk of council whenever any purchases made through the cooperative process, which notice shall include the details of such cooperative purchases.

Next amendment.

C insert new section D.

Prior to entering any contract authorized under this section, the director of public utilities shall provide written notice to the clerk of council, which notice shall include the details of such contracts.

And the final amendment and such and the last paragraph of new section 523.252 C2 after accepted insert and matching funds appropriated.

Alright, we have three amendments.

Do we have a second?

Discussion?

Mr.

Chair.

Sir Councilman Polansa.

Mr.

Chairman, I would also add that besides the clerk being notified, the chair of the respective committee should be uh notified as well.

So that would be chair of the utilities committee.

All right.

I'll second.

All right.

We have the any other discussion.

All right, all in favor of the amendments?

Aye.

Any other discussion on 621 2026?

621 2026 as amended will stand approved.

Please sign up.

Ordinance number 600 2026 by council members Casey and Griffin by departmental request.

An emergency ordinance authorizing the director of public utilities to enter into one or more contracts with ST Engineering Telematics Wireless Limited for the hosting and technical support required to manage the bright city lighting system, including cloud migration, remote control, monitoring for the division of Cleveland Public Power, Department of Public Utilities for a period of three years.

That's that's correct, Chairman.

So uh as the committee is well aware, as is council going back now eight years maybe we started the conversion from the high pressure sodium to the LED streetlights across the city of Cleveland, having a positive impact on every single neighborhood and the downtown corridors, which have been converted.

There has been um bumps in the road, to say it lightly, about the technology as you go from the 240s to the 480 volt smart photo cells, which are those large corridors which includes the majority of downtown.

All of those except for uh the last stretch on Opportunity Corridor, which is being installed today with the 480 volt smart photo cell uh will be completed within the next week.

So this is the technology.

This is the Bright City technology that is proprietary to those smart photo cells that gives us the ability to remotely uh manipulate the light.

We can turn it up, turn it down, but also more importantly is the outage notification when that light is out.

The purpose and the goal is to know that a street light is out before you get the call.

We are not there yet, unfortunately, as council is aware who continues to call, which I appreciate, and email, no problem.

But ultimately, our goal is to relieve you of that burden.

Once we get to it, the important part was the 480 installation.

Once the entire network is established with these smart photo cells, now with this piece of legislation and the continuing engagement of ST telematics, we can improve Bright City, the technology of Bright City and the hosting of Bright City to then be able to better perform uh outage management, customer service, all of those things that we all strive to do.

All right, modest price of almost $30,000 a year over the next three years.

Um look, we we look forward to continuing the uh engagement.

Chief LASIK is here if you want the gory details of IT world.

No.

I've heard them.

Um, you have Chairman.

So once this passes, all the city except for a small portion of opportunity corridor, LED, bright city, all main corridors, residential, everything's gonna be ready to go.

Yes, Chairman.

All right, there continue to be ones, these two's level.

I know in my ward purity isn't confirmed last night, Chairman, that that Puritus Avenue is converted to LED and does have the 480 volt smart photos.

And now this will be this takes care of everything.

Yes.

Opportunity corridor is the last piece of the puzzle.

Any questions on 600 2026?

Yeah, put it in the middle of the case.

Councilwoman Councilwoman Hudson.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Uh through the chair, would this also solve the issue that's been occurring where occasionally the LE LED streetlights turn into strobe lights?

Chairman to the council member, um, yes.

And that is part of the very difficult and complicated conversion to the 480 volt.

Um not a lot of people use 480 volt street lights anymore anywhere.

So uh we've had I think it's the fifth iteration of the 480s that we've put up, taken down, sent back, put up, taken down.

So uh it's been difficult, but that's our goal.

That is that is the smart photo cell reacting to fluctuations in the voltage.

And their fail safe is to strobe like a dance party in front of George's kitchen, which the chairman loved.

And and would you be it would solve it or you would be notified if that happened?

Solve it.

Our goal through the chairman to the council member is to solve that.

Final forever.

Done.

Thank you.

That's all.

Thank you.

Uh Councilman Palency.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Mr.

Chairman to the director.

So again, I want to get this clear.

So outside of opportunity corridor.

The rest, the entire rest of the city that is under Cleveland Public Power lights will have this in place.

Chairman of the Councilman, as you'll recall, um, all of the street lights in the City of Cleveland are the property of Cleveland Public Power and an asset of the City of Cleveland.

So the answer to your question is yes.

Okay.

And the um I want to go over the cost again.

Go over the cost.

Total cost of this ordinance through the chairman of the council member is approximately $30,000 a year for the next three years if approved with a grand total of $89,781.

Okay.

Because I thought that was a mistake on this, but it is correct from what I'm looking at here.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Thank you.

Councilman Conwell.

Uh take me off.

I'm good.

Thank you.

All right.

No other questions.

600 2026 stands approved.

Please sign up.

Ordinance number 612, 2026 by Councilmembers Casey and Griffin by Departmental Requests and emergency ordinance authorizing the director of public utilities to enter into one or more requirement contracts.

With S T engineering telematics, wireless LTD for proprietary adaptive control photo cells needed for LED street lights and security lighting fixtures for the division of Cleveland Public Power, Department of Public Utilities for a term of two years.

Director.

Thank you, Chairman.

So this is continuing to buy those smart photo cells.

We are lucky uh to have a 10-year warranty on each from date of installation.

So we will continue to engage with ST telematics for the continued purchase of.

Unfortunately, people also like to hit our polls.

Um and in the event of replacement, we will continue to have them in stock.

But more importantly, as any of them fail under this warranty program, we want to continue to engage uh on this proprietary technology to be able to return the any photo cells that malfunction and have it replaced at no cost to our customer.

Uh approximate, we put an approximate value about 400,000 a year uh for the next two years.

All right.

Any questions?

Um Councilman Shah?

Just wanted to understand is this gonna help us speed up the pace that we replace once they're out.

Um Chairman of the Council member, yes, we will need the smart photo cell in stock.

So we will once we have a better handle of the how many we we need to hold on to and then the replacement of in the event of some accident.

Um but yes, it will be part of the response to an outage.

If it's the photo cell, we need it there.

If it's a malfunctioning photo cell, we send it back to telematics and they replace it at no cost to us.

What's the time frame for all that whole process to go through to the chair?

To currently respond to an outage, Chairman to the councilman.

Um that's what we're working on to improve upon.

Um right now we have to get all of the ones lit and in Bright City, the technology we talked about in the last ordinance, and then have the resources to deploy.

Right now, we continue to get as we work on the communications part of this part photo cell, we continue to get a lot of false negatives.

So we'll have circuits that are saying they're down when we have to roll a truck with employees to check it, and it's on.

So we're gonna continue to tinker with it, but always our uh objective is to decrease the time of response to an out its uh an outage uh street light.

Thank you, Chair.

Uh um Chair.

Are you good, Councilman Shah?

Yes, Councilman Conwell.

You know, I want to thank the um director whenever I call you.

It could be in a wee hours of the morning or that's true, but they they they beat Mike Mike Polensk and I up.

Uh but I want to thank you also.

It could be we hours of the morning, whatever the case may be.

Now, what you're saying for point of clarity that I won't have to call you anymore.

Because for example, 123rd Street, pitch black.

You remember that lady, I put her on the phone with you.

I won't have to deal with that ever again.

And then I write with your people sometime looking at my lights.

But this is what I see through the chair.

Also, the vegetation is blocking the lights.

The vegetation from the trees, and I yield to the director.

Glad Councilman Conwell can see the light.

Any any other anything else?

Thank you, Councilman.

Council certainly agree.

Councilwoman Hudson.

Uh Mr.

Chair, I have two uh amendments.

Go ahead.

In section one, insert at an estimated cost not to exceed one million dollars to give wiggle room.

All right.

And uh the second amendment in section two, strike the proper appropriation accounts and insert CPP operating or capital fund numbers.

Do I have a do we have two amendments?

So I have a second.

Any discussion?

Councilman Conwell.

So why did you say what made you say um not to exceed a million dollars?

What gave you that figure?

What to look at?

Um right now it's currently set for 300,000.

300,000.

That will give us some that will give us some wiggle room.

So I'm there.

I understand.

Thank you.

Any further discussion?

All in favor of the amendment, say aye.

All opposed, the ayes have it.

Ordinance number 612 as amended, stand approved.

Please sign up.

Ordinance number 586 2026 by Council members Casey and Griffin by Departmental Request and Emergency Ordinance to amend the title and section one, two, and three of ordinance five three twenty-five twenty twenty-five past May 12, 2025, and to supplement the ordinance by adding new section 1A relating to the Oracle customer care and billing system.

Director, we're going from customer care billing to customer or C2M, right?

The customer to meter.

Yes.

This is uh this was this is the reason we're all here today.

Um the hold up in law with this piece here because we're changing basically changing a name, correct?

Or if you want to explain how we're doing it or what's going on, please do so.

Thank you, Chairman to the committee.

Um yes.

In May 12th, uh about a year ago, 5125.

I came to council and sought authority to enter into a master agreement with Oracle for our customer care and billing system.

That is everything that we do, everything that touches a customer, from water and power from over a million customers, uh, the consumption data, the billing histories when you call, we have a log.

C C and B is the heart of how what we do for our customers.

We came and sought authority, it was granted, thankfully, and then about 13 months of negotiations with Oracle brought me back to the table today.

So the master agreement that we had sought and thought was going to be uh we would receive the benefits of um of the the size of Cleveland Water, Cleveland Public Power.

Uh it didn't work out.

And yes, it was law department, and yes, I'm not at all uh begrudging our law department.

They did amazing work, uh, but ultimately Oracle would not meet us at our basic standards, which are indemnification, our customer data, which is sacred to us.

It is not a public record under Ohio law.

It is something that we work very hard to protect, but they wanted it, and then they what they wanted to do with it, and then the other was a long-term exclusivity clause, which would then I would have to sit here and say things like proprietary until I no longer sit in the seat.

So um I'm not at all complaining about our law department, but it resulted in me coming back to ask for authority to amend that ordinance to include requirements contracts.

We would like to see we we would like the authority on licensing, hosting, and professional services for C CMB under Oracle, which is a humongous conglomerate that buys up every company that they've ever touched or worked with, because we can then bid each of those three um areas by way of requirement, and then get a better price for our customer and continue the conversion to C2M, which again Chief Lasek is welcome to come up and talk about clouds and things that he loves to talk about.

Um, but that's where we need to get to is to the C2M uh Oracle product, which allows us to expand our digital self-serve so our customers can look at their phones to request a shutoff, they can look at their phones to pay a bill, um, so we could then relieve the stresses on our call centers and on everything else.

But that's where again our goal is to continue to make our customers um recognize uh that we're making changes to their benefit and easing the burden of calling us over 3,000 times today.

So uh long way of saying this an amendment to an ordinance you gave me authority to do about a year and a half ago.

Uh I want to I'm asking for an amendment to for us to go out and continue this engagement as we go down the path of conversion from C C and B suit to CTM.

All right, Director, this is more like an application upgrade, correct?

So we're going from customer care billing to customer to meter.

Yes.

Basically, correct?

That's absolutely correct.

All right.

Any questions on 586 2026?

Councilwoman Hudson.

Mr.

Chair, I have uh three amendments.

Uh the first uh insert not to exceed five million dollars in section three the second at the end of section two in section one.

Insert the director of public utilities shall provide written notice to the clerk of council whenever any purchase is made through the cooperative process, which notice shall include the details of such cooperative purchases.

The third amendment strike and shall be charged against the proper appropriation accounts.

We have three amendments.

Do I have a second?

Second.

Second, any discussion?

But I want to add, Mr.

Chairman.

I would also add, Mr.

Chairman, that the chairman of the utilities committee be notified as well.

Okay.

Chair person.

I'll second.

Okay.

We have the amendments.

Do we have any disc uh we have a second?

Do we have a discussion?

All in favor of the amendment, say aye.

Aye.

Any other questions?

Uh the eyes have it.

Um other questions on 586 2026.

Seeing none, 586 2026 as amended stands approved.

Please sign up.

598 2026 by council members Casey and Griffin by departmental request, an emergency ordinance authorizing the director of public utilities to exercise the second option to renew contract number CT20 2002-PS2024-277 with Kendrill Inc.

to provide professional services for hosting and hosting support of the Oracle customer care and billing system.

Director, this is IBM or this is CCB runs on the our previous one, right?

C C B runs in Kendrill.

Now Kendrill's upgrading.

Go ahead and explain.

Thank you, Chairman.

All that stuff I said last time.

Right, same thing.

This is the the first year extension with Kindrel.

Um, as for the hosting portion of what I talked about on the requirements contract, because if we don't have the authority by the end of August, we would uh our service would be interrupted.

Um so we're seeking that one year extension on this contract, approximately six hundred and eighty-four thousand dollars to maintain um the system as we get into that last ordinance and go out for a requirement contract.

Thank you.

Any questions on 598 2026?

Seeing none 598 2026 stands approved, please sign up.

Ordinance number 596 2026 by Council members Casey and Griffin by departmental request and emergency ordinance authorizing the director of public utilities to exercise the first option to renew contract number CT2002 PS2024-0299 with one call concepts utility locating services in to provide utility location and marking underground infrastructure services for the various divisions of the Department of Public Utilities.

Director, this is our Opus contract.

Oops, yes, Chairman's Oops, opus.

Um so we're looking to extend um first option to renew our contract with one call concepts locating services to comply with the state's Ohio revised code section 3781, damage prevention law, um call before you dig, whatever you want to call it, approximately 1700 of our own holes that we call for to mark, but then anybody else that's digging into the public right-of-way in our service area would we would utilize this to go out and mark our underground infrastructure by way of water, power, and sewer.

Um so this is a very important uh part of what we do.

Compliance is determinative of liability, including to those other entities that are digging in the right of way when they break our stuff.

If you don't follow this law, it's what you use to then seek uh restitution.

So it's a very important part of what we do.

We take it very seriously.

Um we have been happy with the uh services as provided by this vendor, and certainly the commissioner it can give you any detail you wish to have.

Director, commissioner, this is a 1.5 million dollar contract.

Is this an a per dig uh cost, or is this just a flat 1.5 and no matter how much we use them?

Um Mr.

Chairman, the way it works is the OOP system issues tickets.

They're called excavators, somebody who wants to dig at this specific site, it routes through the OOP system, and then we or our vendor in this case receives the ticket.

Um and it is uh they bid on a per utility per mark.

And it actually, if if they're in the suburbs and CWD is the only utility, there's a price for that.

If it's in the city and it's CWD and WPC, they actually make the marginal cost to mark two of them less.

It's not two times the cost of one utility, it's less than that.

And the price for three marks in case CPP has underground is even less than that as well.

So there's a price break the more utilities that they mark.

Okay, and then we've all heard the commercials, right?

Call 811 before you dig.

Correct.

So if somebody's needs to dig on their own private property, if they need to call OOPs because they want to put a tree in their front lawn instead of the tree lawn.

So, Mr.

Chairman, this law applies to the public right-of-way, which does include the tree lawn and the sidewalk.

Right.

So if they're digging in the tree lawn or the sidewalk, um, they are required to make it.

So we have we have a resident wants to put a tree and a tree lawn tree.

City says it's okay.

Oops comes out, they mark the underground utilities so you don't hit a gas line or whatever.

Correct.

We get charged for that, or does the the resident get charged for that?

The the uh there is no charge per se uh on this.

We pay our vendor to do it.

Okay, but uh so the ticket comes to us, the ticket comes to the utilities are obligated on their dime to get marked.

So the so the the resident or the customer never that they don't get charged for the oops.

All right.

That is correct.

Any questions on 596 to 26?

Councilman.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Mr.

Chairman to the commissioner.

So I'm just gonna get this straight.

So we have a water line leak in a street.

You contact them, they come out and mark the utilities, physically mark the utility educate us.

So uh Mr.

Chairman, uh, to the councilman, I think it's important to remember there are really two roles.

Right.

There's the excavator who's doing the digging, right?

And there's the utility, so we're required to mark.

At times we fill both roles.

If we there's a water main leak, we're the excavator.

Our oops contractor doesn't have to mark the water in the case where we're doing our own digging.

Our crews have the water maps with them.

Okay, we don't pay to get that one marked.

But the gas company will get that notice.

Any uh you other utilities will get that notice, and they will mark their utilities so our crews know where the gas line is.

So the physical, the utility itself will mark them, not oops.

That oops is just a clearing house under the state of Ohio.

Okay.

That's what I'm trying to understand.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

All right, thank you.

Councilwoman Hudson.

Anybody else?

Okay, Councilman Humphrey Codson.

Mr.

Chair, I have one uh amendment.

Go ahead.

In section one, insert not to exceed two million dollars.

All right, it's currently set at 1.5, so it won't exceed two million.

Do I have a second?

I'll second it.

All in favor, say aye.

Aye.

Any opposed?

The ayes have it.

Ordinance number 596 2026 as amended stands approved.

Thank you very much.

Please sign up.

Orders number 599, 2026 by council members Casey and Griffin by Departmental Request and Emergency Ordinance Authorizing the Director of Public Utilities to enter into one or more requirement contracts without competitive bill bidding with hock company to provide laboratory equipment, supplies, and services for operational calibration, preventative maintenance, appropriate repairs, and to clarify accuracy with laboratory and an inline process equipment used to test drinking water that is manufactured by the hot company for the division of water, department of public utilities for a period of two years.

Director, you know I am in no uh favor of direct awards, so tell us why this is a direct award contract.

Thank you, Chairman.

Um the Ohio EPA regulates everything we do at the at the production of potable water uh from receipt from the lake to distribution to our customer.

In that process is any number, hundreds of tests that are required to run constantly, daily, weekly, monthly, quarterly.

Those tests are performed in many instances on hock equipment.

So throughout the water plant and distribution network, hock equipment, which is industry standard, widely used, is the equipment that's used.

And it's so this ordinance is twofold.

Council, you're well aware, used to get two ordinances specific to hock, one's for supplies and one for instrumentation and calibration.

We have at the behest of council put into one straight ordinance.

From the supply side, we're talking about spectrometers, plug and play meters, uh, color emitters, turbidometers, titrators, um, and appurtenances.

So those are the the supplies that are used in the performance of the tests.

It also calls for the calibration and certification of the instruments, which are specifically turbidometers, chlorine and chlorine analyzers, particle size analyzers, pH meters, fluoride analyzers.

Um the calibration, preventative maintenance, and appropriate repairs to this instrumentation.

It does, as I said, the reports that are generated from this these instruments are submitted to the EPA for certification.

In the event of a malfunction of any one of these multiple instruments, we have three days to fix it, or else we get a notice of violation from the EPA.

Um so we this again includes all of the materials and supplies we use in the performance of the instrumentation, the calibration and maintenance of the instrumentation, which is critical to the delivery of high quality water.

Chairman.

In other words, this is this is the contract that keeps our water safe.

Yes, and keeps us uh compliant with a heavy, heavy regulatory umbrella.

Commissioner, did you want to weigh in?

Um, just as the uh directed pointed out, and uh the USCPA as a general rule requires that the manufacturer calibrate their own equipment.

They don't want third parties to calibrate these things.

All right.

Any questions on 599 2026?

Yeah, Councilman Conwell.

I need some background history to the director on um Hawk.

I really don't.

I don't know.

I like the systems, I like structure, but I don't know their background history.

Chairman, to the council member, it is it is a um as I said, industry standard uh uh instrumentation.

These are this is equipment that runs tests on water that is sampled, as I said, hundreds of times a day at different points in the distribution um system.

So hawk is simply the the manufacturer of the equipment.

But more importantly, the the certification and the can't think of it, calibration of the instrument, um, which then gives credence to the data that we submit to the Ohio and US EPA.

So they say that our tests are accurate based on this equipment that is certified and calibrated appropriately, and then we don't get in trouble, and everybody knows that our water is the best.

Okay.

Thank you, thank you.

I see it, I see it.

Thank you.

All right.

Any other questions from 599?

Seeing none, 599 2026 stands approved, please sign up.

Ordinance number 601 2026 by council members Casey and Griffin by departmental requests and emergency ordinance determining the method of making the public improvement of constructing a new pump station and ground level tank at the Pleasant Valley Road Station and demolishing and removing the existing station and tank.

Authorizing the director of public utilities to enter into one or more public improvement contracts to construct the improvement, acquiring, accepting, and recording necessary right-aways, authorizing the director to employ one or more professional consultants necessary for the improvements and authorizing the director of public utilities and or the director of finance to apply for and accept one or more water supply revolving loan account loans, grants, or other funding.

Director, we're rebuilding the Pleasant Valley Pump Station.

Pump station.

That's correct, Chairman.

So as again, council is well aware, we have completed a focused assessment of the secondary booster booster pump stations.

We have four four water treatment plants, 12 secondary pump stations.

Um Pleasant Valley is up next in Parma, serves third high service district.

Um Parma, North Royalton and Broadview Heights, Brexville Hinckley, Richfield, Richfield Township, and Bath constructed in the 50s, capacity of approximately 16 million gallons per day.

Boosts water from second high to third high.

Um the big thing here is the um end of the useful life of a number of these pumps, but also more importantly that it has a five million gallon underground concrete reservoir that we have determined to be inefficient.

So the design and build of this reservoir to make it more efficient to more easily pump and deliver will make the system will re relieve the strain on the system.

Um again in an effort to better serve our customers.

We estimate $15 million, includes an estimated two million dollars for design, $13 million for construction.

We believe it will appro take approximately two years.

Uh that's correct, Chairman.

That's on the your executive summary on your tablet.

And then it is an end.

This it is complicated.

The $15 million.

Unfortunately, what we have seen in recent bids is it's kind of all over the place when it comes to ductile iron pumps, large valves.

So those are estimates that we probably came up with 18 months ago.

Okay.

Um, so if you are going to put it not to exceed, I would hope you have a little more flexibility than you have.

I'm not being critical.

I'm not, I'm not, I'm just saying that these numbers come in all over the place.

I have no problem coming back to you with the details of a bid spec or how it came in way higher than we thought it would.

Okay.

I'm anticipating your amendment, I guess.

I shouldn't do that.

I apologize.

Well, it's coming.

Um is this is this going is this going out for bond bond?

Bid or bond.

Are you gonna bond these?

There's gonna be bonders the the pump station rebuilds our combination of any available resource that we have.

We we aggressively seek grant funding through the OWDA or any other grant funding available uh with a mix of um capital, existing capital, proposed pet capital.

But if we were to borrow on the bond market, then we would potentially seek to include this depending on all of the other capital improvements going on.

But you have no intentions of just saying, hey, we're just gonna take this for bonding it out.

You're not gonna questions on 601 2026.

Councilman Palencick.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Uh the new reservoir.

Will that be above ground?

Chairman of the council member, that's correct.

Okay.

Do you have to get approval from Parma?

Do you have to go through any zoning approval?

Chairman of the Councilman, I would anticipate yes, but of course, we have a strong working relationship with all of our suburban customers and believe that we will be favorably received.

The present reservoir is below grade.

Chairman of the council member, that's correct.

Okay.

And that's estimated to be how large is that tank?

Uh reservoir is five million gallons of potable water storage.

And that's in bad shape.

Chairman of the council member, it's not in necessarily bad shape.

It was designed.

Anything underground is gonna take a lot of energy to push that up and out.

Okay.

So we're seeking a better method of delivering, which better floats on the second high to third high system.

Uh commissioner is happy to give you details on that.

I just know the word float.

I don't know what it means to just briefly, because we have a lot of other stuff to do here today.

Will this be a tower?

Chairman of the councilman, no.

It will be a reservoir, a tank, similar to several of our pump stations.

Okay, that's all I need to know.

Thank you.

All right, councilman.

Councilwoman Hudson.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

I have two amendments to propose.

Uh the first one in section one, after the improvement, insert at an estimated cost not to exceed 20 million dollars.

The second amendment at the end of section five, insert the director of public utilities shall provide written notice to the clerk of council whenever any purchases made through the cooperative process, which notice shall include the details of such cooperative purchases.

All right, do I have a second on the amendments?

Second.

Any discussion?

Yes, I need to repeat against sure.

The the first amendment in section at the end.

Excuse me.

In section one, after the improvement, insert at an estimated cost not to exceed 20 million dollars.

Currently it's at 15 million dollars.

And then the second amendment at the end of section five.

Insert the director of public utilities shall provide written notice to the clerk of council whenever any purchases made through the cooperative process, which notice shall include the details of such cooperative purchases.

We got the amendment.

We got the second.

Any discussion?

All in favor say aye.

Opposed, eyes have it.

Ordinance number 601 2026 as amended stands approved.

Please sign up.

We got two more here.

Ordinance number 602 2026 by Council members Casey and Griffin by departmental request.

An emergency ordinance determining the method of making the public improvement of inspecting, repairing, renewing, and replacing transmission water mains, valves, and appurtenances, and making corrosion control inspections and improvements as part of the transmission water main renewal and corrosion prevention and control program for the 20 from 2027 through 2031, authorizing one or more professional consultants for the improvements and to apply and accept additional funding.

Either way.

First indicator is potentially corrosion.

We send in this firm to investigate and then make a recommendations on mitigation, whether it be replacement, lining, cathotic protection, or any number of other approaches that are used in the industry to extend the useful life of that pipe to the to the benefit of our customers, right?

Replacement is the most expensive.

The longer we keep it in the ground performing properly, the better we are running a utility.

So that's this that's this ordinance in a nutshell.

Alright.

Any questions on 602 602 2026?

Councilman Shah.

Thank you, Chair.

Uh just I see there's a three different contractors that we have these uh contract out to.

I wanted to just understand have how have they been performing?

Are we planning on rebidding these?

Or are we planning on giving them back to those same contractors?

Chairman of the council members, certainly this would be rebid.

Um this will go out to the market to see the most competitive prices for these currently identified phases of the approaches at corrosion mitigation.

Um it's anticipated that these would projects be uh 2027 through 2031.

So as I said, we have these current ones in place, but the commissioner and his engineering staff and the water staff uh continue to analyze transmission mains and trunk mains throughout the distribution network.

So this is the next phase in continuing the um this plan.

Sounds good, thank you.

Anyone else?

Councilwoman Hudson.

Oh, before you do that, director, do you plan on going out for bond this or is it the same as 601?

Um again the the funding is identified for 27 through 2031 without the vendor.

I I can't definitively say right now that I wouldn't use, we wouldn't use bond funds.

Okay.

I have a question.

All right, councilwoman Hudson.

I have a question.

Oh, hang on, hang on if she has an amendment letter me through.

All right, go ahead, Councilman Hudson.

Okay, thank you, Mr.

Chair.

I have two proposed amendments.

In section one, after the improvement, insert at an estimated cost not to exceed 25 million dollars.

The second amendment at the end of section five, insert the director of public utilities shall provide written notice to the clerk of council whenever any purchases made through the cooperative process, which notice shall include the details of such cooperative purchases.

All right, we have two amendments, so I have a second.

I'll have second.

We have uh an amendment two amendments in a second.

We have discussion.

Seeing no discussion, all in favor of the two amendments signify by saying aye.

Aye.

Any opposed?

The ayes have it.

602 2026.

Oh, yeah.

Councilman Palency.

Mr.

Chairman to the Commissioner and Director.

Who's doing the work at Trubisky in Richmond?

The Congressman.

I believe that is Fabrizi, if I recall.

Man, that is taking forever.

It's a big job.

You could have built terminal tower first before you did that thing.

I mean, somebody needs to write on that one.

I mean, that's ridiculous.

I mean, there were some delays and some valve deliveries on that one, Councilman.

Okay.

I'm just dumb in.

I that has taken forever up there.

Okay, thank you.

All right.

Uh seeing no other questions, 602 2026 as amended, stands approved.

Our last one before we do the data center one.

Ordinance number 625, 2026.

By council members Casey and Griffin, by departmental requests, an emergency ordinance authorizing the purchase by one or more requirement contracts of labor and materials needed to repair, maintain, and replace water mains, fire hydrants, service connections, valves and appartenances, including tree lawn restoration and other repairs through division of water, one or more requirement contracts for labor materials needed for repavement restoration, including installation for the division of water, water pollution control in Cleveland Public Power, Department of Public Utilities for a period of two years, and to apply for and accept any loans, grants, or any public or private entity.

Yes, Chairman.

Correct.

And this is an area C and D.

This is CA, our contract assistance ordinance.

All right.

Yeah, so uh as council is aware, Cleveland Water, 10th largest in the country, 50, 50 uh thousand valves, 5400 miles of water main, 70,000 hydrants, 440,000 service connections.

Uh we're seeking authority to hire contractors via requirements contract to assist with repairs and include pavement restoration, uh, edge ceiling, pavement cuts uh from utility work.

So um the big thing as council is aware, in certain seasons, we have an uptick in main breaks.

By way of an example, at some point in the last eight months, we were averaging 30 breaks a day.

We're historically uh system-wide, we would average five.

So, in that um, in that kind of spectrum, it's very difficult to hire staff, right?

It's very difficult to have enough people ready to go out in 10 degrees below zero to fix a main break when you're getting 30 a day.

So we use this contract to hire contractors to assist and augment existing Cleveland water staff to go out and perform those necessary repairs.

We also use this contract to hire a contractor to button up our utility cuts by way of asphalt.

As you'll see in the current vendor list, the the utility cut vend uh contract expires at the end of this year.

I just looked at it.

Yeah, November.

So we need to get that out to bid in very short order to make sure that there is no interruption in our paving over these utility cuts.

Uh, common concern of council and of ours.

So those are our customers, those are our streets.

We want to make sure that we get it as quickly as possible.

We'll also use it on tree lawn mitigation and the fire hydrant portion of it.

A part of this is also those emergency responses where we do not have the staff to respond and stay on a single project for an extended period of time, as much as I don't like to say the word sinkhole.

This is what we use when we have those things that you can't prepare for in the delivery of service.

We have a number of vendors ready to deploy to address it under the leadership of Cleveland Water and as a representative of Cleveland Water to continue to deliver the high quality service that our customers expect.

So we do budget approximately 27 million dollars a year.

We currently have our entire system broken into four quadrants that we would bid by quadrant.

Uh and then on top of that would be the um the uh asphalt contract.

So currently five contracts.

Um we try to diversify the vendor pool just in terms of available resources, not to negatively say anything negative about any individual contractor, but our objective is to spread them out as to not have all the same in all the same grids, calling on all the same crews.

So we need to get out to bid um in order to prepare for our busy busy season, which uh is right around the corner.

So currently, director, there's five separate contracts that are under that are under contract, right?

There's five separate entities under contract.

Looks like three of them are expiring in 2026.

Right?

out as to not have all the same in all the same grids calling on all the same crews so we need to get out to bid um in order to prepare for our busy busy season which uh is right around the corner so currently director there's five separate contracts that are under that are under contract right there's five separate correct chairman entities under contract looks like three of them are expiring in 2026 right these five these five contracts are worth about 55 million dollars right just all together give give or take right the five contracts four of these are by terrace and one's by cook right we got two in area C and D that are expiring at the end of November at the end of December beginning of December uh one expiring in November um I think they do a good job with um utility cuts right when they get to them right once no no complaints there but we definitely need to tighten up tree lawn restoration right way too many times it's just rake something throw some leaves use you I you know people have to do it themselves so we definitely need to have a conversation with whoever has the tree lawn restoration as to what our our customers would expect if their tree lawns get get torn up any questions on 625 Councilman Polency.

So I just want clarification so they will do the utility cut correct or not Chairman of the council members so yes we do go out to bid for the asphalt cap on a utility cut.

So they they finish it Chairman of the councilman that's correct.

Okay.

So and then we have somebody checking on those chairman of the councilman that's correct and pictures in city works and verified before we pay the vendor and those are our people doing the final inspection.

Chairman of the councilman that's correct because again this council is the chair indicated um we have um we have a water division public utilities that the war have awarded a great deal of um contracts out to these companies and it which is beneficial to them ultimately hopefully beneficial to our residents and our customers but I want to make sure the fit and finish is there on all this stuff.

Tree lawns, street work, etc.

Want to make sure that is done right and on red brick streets bricks go back correct they have since 1996 the chairman of the councilman thank you Mr.

Chairman Any other questions?

Councilman Shaw uh yeah just uh you want to go for no no no no no you got the next mean Shaw um I just had a quick question regarding it's uh slightly off topic director uh through the chair but I was curious uh speaking of fire hydrants I actually am not familiar if the city provides this but I know I've seen other cities have this was curious do we provide fire um through the firehouses sprinkler caps for fire hydrants if um neighborhood organizers or kids wanted that in the summer chairman to the councilman we do not okay is that something we've ever looked into Chairman to the councilman um happy to have that conversation possibly offline um a lot of people exercise our hydrants and break them on a regular basis so we there's a lot of uh yeah happy to have that conversation when you have time yeah no would love to at especially in light of you know a lot of our outdoor pools that are not going to be online this summer that we know about um and we want to provide a way for the kids to cool off my understanding is how this program usually works in other cities is the fire department the local firehouse will come out schedule a time and they turn it on and off so it wouldn't be any other people turning them on or off but it would provide a way hopefully for kids to have some spray uh fire hydrants but um thanks I'm happy to chat about that thank you any thank you councilman shaw councilman conwell you know what um Mr.

Chairman in my ward especially the new area that I inherited the utility cuts are not being um service they're not it's probably at least a dozen utility cuts are plan to ride my neighborhood drive my neighborhood next week write it down and give them to you so what's the timeline when they're given to you that uh these utility cuts because you know what do the chair to the director and make unsafe routes also for the residents and people that travel to the city of Cleveland in my neighborhood.

Duty chair to the director Chairman of the councilman and and and certainly um the department or the the division of public utilities aren't the only ones that make holes in streets first and foremost.

So happy to take the addresses happy I know as I said in multiple times today um this was a brutal winner uh and there were a lot of holes dug in a very short amount of time so no none of us were happy with the restoration of the asphalt um but I I we didn't have another way to do it there was no one to to pass so I'm happy to take those addresses those streets and and we'll have them done within 10 days.

If you want a timeline, I'll give you a timeline.

If they were ours, we're gonna take care of them.

But I just want to always to say that the public utilities is not the only one that digs into streets, right?

There are all any number of that we regularly and our vendors regularly take the heat for.

But if it's ours, we'll get it, and I'll tell you right now that I'll get it within 10 days, probably because the contract expires, and I need to get it to the vendor.

Um or I'll send uh or commissioners happy to ride with you, councilman.

Okay, great, great, great.

And so let me actually just last question.

So when you see the utility cuts and they're not yours, do you pass it on to the other utility companies?

Do the chairman of the council member, absolutely, whether it be another city department through MOCAP or a city contract or vendor, absolutely, it would be reflected in the city system if there hadn't come through us for a permit in the right of way.

We do our best guess as to who it might be.

Nine times out of ten, we cover it because it is ultimately we're gonna catch the heat for it.

But you do I blame it on you.

Yes, I understand that.

And I'm okay with it.

We're gonna figure it out together.

Do you have someone let's say to drive the wars and drive the city, and when they see issues and concerns like utility cuts, they write it down and forward it to their uh supervisor to the chair?

Chairman of the council movie, we don't have that in in any individual job description, but we do encourage all of our employees, right, who are also customers of ours to take great pride in what we do and when we drive, and we encourage all of the employees, which or council members or any employees of the city of Cleveland to bring.

These aren't complaints, right?

We don't take these as a gripe.

We take this as a workmanship question or a quality of service question.

And and so we encourage everybody to bring us any utility cut, and we'll do the due diligence, try to find out if it is ours and get it get it squared away in very short order.

You know, when you send the worker out, you know, I believe in cross-training.

When you send that worker out director, and they see the utility cuts, but if they also see catch bases that need to be cleaned out, they can uh turn that in as well to the chair.

Absolutely.

Through the chairman of the councilman, yes.

All right, thank you.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

All right, thank you, Councilman Conwell.

See another no other questions, Mr.

Chair.

Councilwoman Hudson, I forgot.

Thank you.

Uh sorry, I have two amendments.

Um the first in section one after the appropriate in the approximate amount, strike as purchased during the preceding term and insert 30 million per year.

The second amendment at the end of section two, insert the director of public utilities shall provide written notice to the clerk of council whenever any purchases made through the cooperative process.

Which notice shall include the details of such cooperative purchases.

We have two amendments, so I have a second.

Any discussion?

All in favor say aye.

Opposed, the ayes have it.

625 2026 as amended stands approved.

Please sign up.

Thank you, Chairman.

You're welcome.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

All right, I don't know who here from the administration is going to be presenting on 556, but please come on forward.

Five fifth ordinance number five fifty-six, twenty twenty-six as amended by council members Slife, Casey, Santana, and Griffin, an emergency ordinance declaring a moratorium on the review and issuance of zoning permits, certain certificates of occupancy, and other licenses or permit applications, including licenses or permits issued by the Department of Public Utilities for data centers in the city of Cleveland.

The amendments are as read.

Insert the following whereas clause after the existing ninth whereas clause to read as follows.

Whereas data centers that are a principal use in standalone facilities and buildings may negatively impact residential properties and the availability and use of land or other types of development that better serve the needs of the community, and two in section one line two after issuance of insert all use building and in line four after the department of public utilities strike for data centers for a period commencing on the effective date of this ordinance and ending on either the effective date of an ordinance regulating or prohibiting data centers on May 1st, 2027, whichever comes, whichever data occurs first, and insert for the expansion of an existing standalone data center or establishment of a data center as a principal use in a standalone facility or building for a period commencing on the effective date of this ordinance and ending on an earlier of one the effective date of the ordinance regulating or prohibiting data centers, or two three months after the effective date of the ordinance, unless extended by council for an additional three months.

If council determines the additional time is needed to further review and determine what action is appropriate for the city.

Tell us what your roles are and give us an before we start.

Just directly right across the hall, there's a live broadcast setup.

So go ahead.

Thank you, Chairman.

I'm Kate Nielsen, senior policy advisor to the mayor.

Good morning, Councilman.

Uh Shannon Leonard, Chief Zoning Administrator, City Planning Commission.

All right.

Do you have any comments or opening statements regarding it?

The intent of the amendment is to ensure that during the moratorium, this is a workable period to ensure that we are not stifling existing work while being smart about how to do this going forward.

Um get a little bit of time to be able to be thoughtful and think through this and have the stipulations and regulations and guardrails to make sure that data centers are supporting the work of the city while also protecting the residents.

I don't have anything to add, but I'm here to answer any questions anybody may have.

So, councilman, if you if you have anything you want to you want to say regarding before we get into the testimony.

Yeah, thank you.

And then I'm not on utilities committee, so thanks for having me today.

But just to give a little bit of context of why I I came to this idea, I represent council on the planning committee or planning commission and um just maybe more information about zoning than the audience cares to hear.

But um our zoning code is over a hundred years old at this point, is that correct?

Nearly a hundred years old, over a hundred years old, give or take.

And the challenge that I believe there is with data centers is um as this industry has evolved within our zoning code, there's arguably no differentiation between a small server room and a large standalone facility as we've seen constructed uh across the state and across the country.

Um I viewed this as a proactive effort to give us a period of time during which we can review our zoning code to determine how we need to more meaningfully define data centers so that we have clarity instead of ending up with a situation where we're having to uh approve building permits by analogy rather than by definition.

Um I think it's important to note that when the city receives a building permit, we cannot reject it simply because we don't like it.

We can reject it for cause if it's incomplete or there's other questions or it's not applicable within the zoning code, but there's a scenario in which an application could come in, and now we have to determine how a data center is and would be defined by analogy in the existing zoning code.

And what the determination, and I can let Miss Leonard speak to it more if she'd like, is we we have a bifurcated zoning code.

Um in most of the city, it would be comparable to a light industrial use in large and growing parts of the city, it would be considered more like an office.

And what I think we've seen grow across the most familiar with the Toledo area, a million square foot facility is very clearly not an office space, right?

Um the goal behind a moratorium, which since this legislation has been introduced, a number of other cities across Northeast Ohio I've seen have instituted their own moratoriums in I'm only speaking for me at this point, is not to say that anything should ever be banned outright, but it is to understand that we need to do a zoning effort to under to to analyze what the difference is between say a server room and a standalone facility.

Uh zoning legislation takes um uh a lot of effort, it takes a lot of time.

Zoning legislation is never passed under emergency authority.

Uh so a zoning, we can't just do a zoning change on a on the turn of a dime, but the moratorium allows us to have a pause and and to do that work so that I view this as the beginning of a longer, a larger step.

Um that is so all of that is to say that I came at this from a zoning perspective.

The reason we are, I believe, here before utilities today is that one of the questions people have asked as it pertains to what what we'll call let's say the hyperscale data facilities, which is really the the spirit of this legislation is to understand how to define that uh does revolve around utility usage.

Uh we are obviously all utility customers.

The city of Cleveland is also a utility provider, and uh I think it's worthwhile to ascertain not just what our zoning code is saying, but also what the strength of our utility network is, whether that is the utilities uh like First Energy, which I have at home, because my neighbor does not have CPP, and uh my neighborhood has been struggling with power outages alongside Lakewood, and there's a lot of anxiety about being able to bring on major new users when we're struggling to keep the power on on days like today where there's no reason the power should go out.

Uh we are also a power provider through Cleveland Public Power, and it's worthwhile to understand uh what the network can accommodate, what improvements would need to be made to our network.

I think the same could be said about Cleveland water and water pollution control and understanding if new uses are coming in, uh what are their utility needs and how would those utility needs be paid for because there's a lot of anxiety that those costs would be passed on to a customer base who are already struggling with increased utility rates.

Um I I suspect that's gonna be a uh uh a particular focus of this committee, since this is a utilities committee, um, and then also the the the larger zoning things.

But but I I'll just close by saying I've I've gotten uh a couple calls, fewer than I would have expected, honestly, um, asking me why I'm you know, well well, what about what about the Cleveland Clinic having a server room?

And what about what about this?

What about that?

What about this?

And and I've my answer is that's exactly why we're here, because we don't we don't have those answers.

And I think that we need to understand if this is a new use that we couldn't have anticipated when the zoning code was created a hundred years ago, then we need to define, differentiate, and give people a sense of comfort that we at the city of Cleveland understand the difference between a room with a couple servers and a million square foot facility.

They should not be treated under the same definition.

That's I'm not saying that at this point anything good or bad or in asserting any values, just that they're fundamentally different things, and we need to define them accordingly.

So thank you.

Thank you, Councilman Councilman.

And just to reiterate and just to recap this piece of legislation that's before us today, it's pertaining to standalone data centers for a three-month moratorium on issuing permits for the standalone data centers.

It does not include a data center that is set in a mixed-use facility such as the Cleveland Clinic or Progressive or anything like that, because we need the next three months to figure out exactly what we're going to do.

So this is go this as it if it passes today, it's a three-month moratorium.

Uh we do have a scheduled utilities committee meeting set for September 24th.

So I am going to encourage everybody in the room, and obviously there are a lot of different varying uh opinions and thoughts and beliefs on data centers.

The administration and council will put together a working group.

Um, and in that working group, I don't want anybody left out, whether you are 1,000% for data centers or a thousand percent against data centers.

We want to be able to gather as much information as humanly possible to come up with whatever it is that the city will decide um on the zoning issues uh in in pertaining to data centers moving forward.

So at this point, we're not we're not saying absolutely no to data centers, we're not saying absolutely yes to data centers.

What we're saying is that today is the beginning of gathering that information.

So anybody in the room can either contact myself, Kate Nielsen with the administration, Brooke Saban, Councilman Slife, um, to be a part of that working group moving forward.

Because what I don't want to do is I don't want the city of Cleveland to bite our nose to spite our faces.

Data centers are here, right?

They're probably not going anywhere anytime soon.

But what we need to figure out is do we have infrastructure that's going to support them?

Will uh Cleveland Public Power infrastructure be able to to provide the the necessary power without the the grid enhanced.

There's too many questions that need to be answered.

So I am extremely happy that we have such a uh a wide variety of sloth of people here today because we're gonna need all of your input moving forward so that nobody gets left out uh of this um this endeavor that that the city's facing.

Uh but again, I do not want to uh come up here and say absolutely no not because we already know that there's a proposal for a 1.6 billion dollar investment in the city of Cleveland, right?

If it was anything but a data center, everybody would be bending over backwards and offering TIFFs and doing everything else to get that project up and going.

And you can't say we wouldn't because we would.

But because it's a data center, right?

There's there's a wall that's been put up because I'm can I'm I'm comparing this to almost like somebody said to me the other day, data centers are the boogeyman, right?

You either believe in them or you don't believe in them.

And if you believe in them and he's there, you're scared.

But if you don't believe in them and you could care less, you're never scared.

But it's how are we going to educate the public currently at this time um in order to get this whatever is moving forward off the ground and running.

Um and I believe that the councilman Slife, that was the intention as well, right?

It's just everybody here's data centers, and if you're for it, oh it's a it's the most wonderful thing, right?

Because listen, if they weren't a good thing, people wouldn't be investing the money that they're investing into them, right?

And if there's such a and if there's such a bad thing, then all you're gonna say is electricity and water and da-da-da-da-da-da-da.

But today we're gonna start hearing on for for both sides of this.

So uh I can tell you as the chair utilities, I do not have an opinion either way, right, until we get all of the um information gathered and we can come up with a more permanent solution to this.

So um anything else from the administration?

Okay, if you guys could could hang out, but um, we did have people who um we've been speaking to on both sides of the aisle.

I hate to use that term being uh being an elected official because this isn't both sides of the aisle.

We've been talking to people who are who are proponents and opponents of data centers.

So we're gonna hear from those in uh a couple of those individuals that have been selected and wanted to come and present today.

So we're gonna start with um people who um are proponents of of the data centers.

So we have Tom Bullock, executive director of Citizens Utility Board of Ohio, Molly Breardon, sustainable research policy matters Ohio, and I don't know if Zach Schiller is here.

Okay, Zach, uh research director, policy matters Ohio.

So if I can have you three individuals come up to the table, I'm gonna let you know uh five minutes apiece, right?

You can tell us whatever it is you want to tell us, what you don't want to tell us, your stance on that.

We've got staff here, everybody's taking notes.

Um Mr.

Chairman, point of information.

Yes.

You will take you'll take questions from councilman.

Okay, yeah.

And we will take questions from council after each after the the three presenters present.

Okay.

So Tom, if you want to introduce yourself, tell us who you are, where you're from, what you do.

Uh, and one thing I will ask any of the presenters, if you could please tell us your um city of residence.

Okay.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

No, you got to turn turn turn green.

There you go.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Uh Tom Bullock, executive director, citizens utility board of Ohio.

I'm a Lakewood resident.

I like to say Lakewood is the neighborhood of Cleveland.

I'm also Lakewood Councilperson, so I understand and respect the job you're doing and and the excellent turnout from so many members of the public.

But I'm talking here as a statewide nonprofit consumer utility advocate.

We do a lot of work in Columbus.

So I would say I'm speaking today as an interested party, which is in between pro and con.

Um, we care very much about this issue uh ordinance 556-2026 and emergency ordinance to declare moratorium on data center development through May 1st, 2026.

Our nonprofit uh works for residential and small business utility customers, uh, natural gas and electricity.

Seems like electricity gets all the focus and all the time for various reasons.

Uh we also care very much not just about the state regulated utilities like First Energy, but Cleveland Public Power and other municipal utilities because your home rule authority put sets up the possibility of you delivering to customers innovation and clean affordable power and programs to reduce energy burden at a faster clip than the regulated utilities.

I think Cleveland Public Power is your secret weapon.

It's a treasure in the state.

It's the largest and the oldest and the most mature, and we should be doing everything we can to invest in that system and just outshine everybody else.

And there's members uh in the audience of the RCPP coalition who we're working with informally who want to do that very thing and support you and your work and help uh consumers get better educated on everything, electricity.

And I kind of think electricity is going to become like the health insurance.

That's not good news, meaning it's a life skill now to call the medical doctor and the billing company and sort through all that.

It's a big headache.

I think electricity prices are going up and going up to stay.

Uh so we're going to be talking about electricity a long time.

Data centers have been a big part of this.

Not the only driver, though, of costs going up nationally and in our region.

In fact, there's national studies that show more than half of utility prices going up are not data center, but it's just utilities seeking to increase their rates or work on their poles and wires.

In our region, though, it is fair to say that data centers are about half the inflation.

Our 13 state PJM region where Ohio is together with Pennsylvania, New Jersey, and a bunch of mid-Atlantic states.

And of that uh little less than half of inflation that we've been experiencing, 80% of that is for data centers not yet built.

So there's a market speculation effect that we're all experiencing.

In fairness, that's probably a state and an and a national issue, but in this context, the City of Cleveland has to deal with all of this.

I would also say probably there's going to be federal focus on data centers for a long time because it's a national security issue, it's an industrial competitiveness issue.

China is growing stronger and stronger and is pushing hard on automobile exports.

Only America prohibits Chinese auto imports now, and the Trump administration tries to fight, but it actually they're inducing Canada and Mexico to import war cars.

Data centers are like the railroad or the steel mills of the late 19th century.

They're going to provide the foundation for the 21st century for how American competitiveness grows.

That's a big picture thing that goes beyond uh just this uh question here.

But uh I I guess the the key question would be uh from our point of view, some data center development has been done poorly and has been harmful.

30 seconds.

But all of it can't uh could the question before you is could some of it be done well and could you negotiate to get community benefit agreements as is advised in the Cuyoga County document, uh which is a good resource to you.

And if Cleveland Public Power needs investment, to me, one question for you to look at is could you have a large customer buying into the system and sharing the financial burden and paying for some deferred maintenance and lowering the costs for all customers over time.

That's an if, but that's the to me the major question before you.

All right, thank you.

Um next up.

Zach?

Hi.

Uh I'm Zach Killer.

I'm research director of Policy Matters Ohio.

We're a nonprofit, nonpartisan research institute.

Our office is over on Perkins.

Um I live in Shaker Heights.

Um, and I'm gonna talk a little bit and then my colleague Wally Bryden will talk about some of the other issues.

Um Policy Matters Ohio has been receiving requests for support from residents across the state who've expressed concerns about planned data center projects coming to their communities, including impacts on water quality and availability, implications for energy affordability and the absence of adequate ratepayer protections and air quality and public health impacts among a lit litany of other concerns.

Notably, one of the key sources of concern and the motivation for residents' efforts to organize communities and municipalities against them is because developers often maintain secrecy about development negotiations through non-disclosure agreements with local electeds and policymakers until decisions about them are already well underway.

The council should consider adopting restrictions on such agreements, which undercut local democracy by excluding residents from providing input on economic development decisions.

Officials cannot be fully accountable when they operate in secret.

Council should also reject financial incentives to induce data center development.

As you probably know, the state offers a sales tax exemption for data centers that cost the state, counties, and transit agencies two billion dollars last year, leading to a pause on new data center exemptions initiated by Governor DeWine.

While this is of limited utility, because it does not affect the giant existing exemptions of Amazon, Google, and Meta, it is still good policy, and we recommend that council pass a resolution urging the governor to maintain that pause until the General Assembly acts.

Data center operators should pay their fair share of local taxes.

The city city should not risk public revenue by offering incentives.

A leading Microsoft executive said, quote, I can't think of a site selection replacement decision that was decided on a set of tax incentives, unquote.

Lydia Mahalik, director of the Ohio Department of Development, told the General Assembly's select committee on data centers earlier this month that since the industry is already firmly established in Ohio, quote, exemptions may not need to be as broad or in some cases may not be necessary to support continued industry growth, unquote.

As most and as most data centers in Ohio don't have a sales tax exemption, incentives may not be as much of a deciding factor in Ohio moving forward, she said.

Ohio House Bill 646, an omnibus bill, which would regulate various aspects of data centers, would limit local property tax exemptions for them to 50%.

But as Director Mahalik told legislators, given the giant sums that are pouring into data centers, tens of millions of dollars to them is quote, just a drop in the bucket, which I think indicates further that these incentives are not necessary.

Now I think Molly will go ahead, Molly.

Hi everyone.

So irresponsible data center.

Molly, where do you reside?

Oh, I reside in Lakewood.

Okay.

Irresponsible data center development has long-term, wide-ranging consequences for host communities.

To create proactive, robust guardrails, city officials must establish a distinct classification for large-scale data center facilities in Cleveland's code without specific permitting requirements.

Projects bordered by residential homes like the one proposed in Slavic Village, which was rejected on in technicality, could move forward with limited opportunities for local intervention.

Yet firming up local zoning restrictions to establish these protections takes time.

And given the pace of this expansion, a moratorium would be useful until they are established, enabling lawmakers to craft to craft deliberate deliberate, measured policy and regulatory guardrails.

Ohio's electricity grid is not equipped to keep pace with the unprecedented growth in electricity demand driven by data center development.

CPP or Cleveland Public Power or CPP, the city's public utility is already grappling with a deep need for infrastructure modernization and investment ranging between 70 to 100 million dollars, while Cleveland residents are already facing growing reliability and affordability concerns, both CPP and first energy customers.

Given data centers' unique energy needs, approval of any data center project should hinge on the developers' commitment to investing in reliability and resilience for all ratepayers by leveraging the tech industry's significant financial capacity to invest in needed upgrades for municipal utility infrastructure to lower residential energy costs and improve reliability and resilience rather than subsidizing the industry at ratepayers and taxpayers' expense.

Additionally, city officials must understand that approving a data center project in or near residential areas or major community hubs could mean forfeiting your authority to regulate accompanying behind the meter generation or on-site generation to supply the facilities' energy needs.

Proposed on-site generation projects, which are overwhelmingly powered by natural gas, enjoy accelerated review timelines and are automatically approved within 60 days of that permit applications filing if the Ohio Power Sighting Board doesn't reject the application.

And since the OPSB has sole authority over major utility facilities, local officials wouldn't have any power to block the project or require the implementation of less emissive technologies or pollution control equipment.

Data centers also rely on backup diesel generators during curtailment events and planned monthly maintenance periods, which produces harmful air pollutants linked to increased risk of a range of chronic health conditions, along with long-term climate impacts.

A recent study found that data centers can produce negative health outcomes for residents living at least uh 0.6 miles away from a data center, sometimes farther.

Yet a considerable number of Ohio's planned hyperscale facilities directly about residential areas, public parks, or schools, and Cleveland's existing zoning code doesn't protect residents from potential harms of irresponsible development.

Large scale data centers can also impose significant burdens on water distribution systems and wastewater treatment systems.

The US EPA has announced rules around maximum levels for forever chemicals or PFAS, which are often used in data centers cooling systems.

And because there's a lack of state regulation around these chemicals, the city could be left with those remediation costs while data centers substantial water use also risks long-term water security and ecological the ecological health of the Great Lakes region.

We have some recommendations, including um integrating stronger transparency and reporting requirements into the application process to enable lawmakers and administrators to have a more holistic understanding of potential impacts associated with planned projects.

City officials should also use require conditional use permits for the construction or expansion of all data center facilities because the use of buy right zoning could enable data center developers to bypass important community oversight and public participation mechanisms, which limits local officials' authority to regulate the industry.

Cleveland lawmakers must increase regulatory oversight and transparency requirements for data center construction and operations, improve community accountability measures, and expand opportunities for residents particip participation in local economic development decision making to support responsible and informed development decisions that center the needs of Cleveland residents.

All right, thank you, Molly.

Um at this time I'm gonna open up uh for questions from my colleagues.

Um Councilman Polentzik.

And remember, these are individuals who are proponents of the legislation.

Thank you.

Um Mr.

Chairman, my colleagues, and to the presenters here, and who's everyone who's gathered here, I want to direct my comments to the administration as well.

Um and to the presenters.

Part of our challenge, and and you know all of us around this table, um, the 15 of us here, we're dealing with a whole host of issues.

Um you name it, we deal with it.

And so I'm not aware of anyone on council who's an electrical engineer.

I'm not aware of anyone who ever been in electrical engineer.

I'm not aware of anyone who is a structural engineer or even an architect that has served on city council over the years, or some who think they're architects, but they're not.

Um the administration.

Here is my uh thought.

First of all, I want to say I support the legislation before it's the moratorium.

Um because again, um I don't have the expertise to say that data centers are a bad thing or a good thing.

I'm trying to learn, and I've been trying to read as much as I can.

On top of everything else that I've been I have to read as it pertains to the issues that we're confronted within the city.

But I want to say to Kate and Shannon, who is advising administration on data centers.

Um through the chart um with regards to the moratorium, just a reminder that this is council initiated and we're working to gather a group and information from a host of advisors who are both within the administration and were seeking input from stakeholders.

It's an ongoing process that is underway with the time limit within the moratorium designed to ensure that we can get all the right inputs.

But what I'm trying to understand again, because so often we make decisions here at the table without having outside um input.

We're confronted, you know.

We're gonna be dealing shortly with Burke Airport issues.

We're dealing with a whole bunch of other issues.

Um IX Center, I could go on to list work.

IX Center, I could go on the list where we where we need to have either outside consultants, outside experts.

We need to have those folks advising this on the data centers.

I'm trying to listen.

I'm looking at emails that I have received.

I'm looking at texts that I have received from people.

And the fact of the matter is we need to have the council needs to have the expertise so we can weigh the benefits or the downside of data centers.

I'm looking at it from a standpoint now.

I know, because I've been reading and they're saying that the great consumption of water and electricity.

I know within the division of water, we have the capacity.

That's not the issue.

The issue is with power, with Cleveland Public Power.

That there are large industrial sites that are abandoned that are sitting there just rotting away.

Old industrial buildings.

So I'm thinking to myself, could this be used as a form of blight clearance to eliminate these sites as it pertains to the construction of these potential facilities?

But I'm also looking and reading about the downside about the potential for pollution, the fact that there is not a lot of job creation as it pertains to the data center.

I don't know on a on a 500,000 square foot building or 750,000 square foot data center, how many jobs are actually created.

I I have no knowledge of that.

I would like to learn.

So I'm here to learn.

I read one set of documents that say that the Communist Chinese Party is behind the data centers.

Then I read another one that says, no, they're the ones opposing the data centers because they want them all in China.

I don't know.

You don't know what to believe half the time from what you read, especially online.

So I'm trying to act in the most appropriate way.

I'm trying to gather myself, gather information.

I want to learn.

I appreciate the people who have come to the table who either for or against the data centers.

But what I want to say to my colleagues and to the administration, we need the accurate information.

We need to act.

The zoning code was set up in 29, 1929.

It was last revised in 1949.

So the world has changed in that period of time.

But we know there are great issues in our neighborhoods, especially where there's been industrial abandonment.

And the East Side is a prime example of it.

Every place you look, you see these reminders of yesterday's manufacturing, which has disappeared.

And just to tear down the National ACME plant, which used to be in my ward, now is in Councilman Conwell's ward, to tear down that one plant was 11 million dollars.

One plant.

So again, I'm I'm thinking all different angles.

Could these again be utilized for site clearance for enhancements in some of our neighborhoods, or is there that tremendous downside that we're hearing as well that diesel generators, other issues that we could be confronted with?

I just want to I want as a part of as a member of this body, Mr.

Chairman, my colleagues, I want the facts.

The good, the bad, the ugly, I want the facts.

And that's what I'm gonna be looking for.

So I'm hoping the administration is going to reach out in connection with the council for outside uh consultants if need be to advise us so we can act properly so we do not negatively impact our community.

So we do not negatively impact our community.

And at the same time, we're very mindful of job creation and the potential for development.

Can we strike a happy medium?

I don't know.

I'm concerned about this tearing down of these businesses on St.

Clair Avenue.

These storefronts that are being wiped out down St.

Clair Avenue.

Businesses that have been there for a long time with the expansion of that data center there.

So again, Mr.

Chairman, I appreciate what the time that you've taken and your due diligence on this matter.

Um my colleagues who are involved in the legislation that is before us.

I I want I want to act appropriate.

I want to respond appropriately.

And um and if if we do this right, then our citizens will benefit.

So thank you, Mr.

Chairman, my honorable colleagues.

All right, thank you, Councilman Pluncing.

Councilman Shah.

Thank you, Chair.

Um, and thank you to everyone for your time this morning.

I w wanted to understand.

Can you repeat your name again the first uh interview?

Yes.

Tom Bullock, B-U-L-L-O-C-K.

Tom, thank you for your time today.

Um through the chair, I wondered you a line that you said stuck out to me.

Um you said something along the lines of what data centers are the industries or what factories of our what was it?

The steel plants or the railroads of the 19th century made the foundation then for industrialization, then arguably we're looking at a new round of industry for the 21st century that's going to be digitally driven and we're beginning to reshore American industry, that's a good thing that increases electricity demand.

We're beginning to electrify our homes and our automobiles is a good thing that increases electricity demand.

These are very large versions or components of that.

So it's possible to get it wrong, but it could be possible to get it right.

Are you sure you were anti-data center at the end of the day?

I think I'm trying to uh speak from a perspective of information for you to consider your temporary.

I you know, I appreciate the the bill sponsors' points that if your existing definitions don't fit the new categories, and there are new categories all the time.

For example, e-bikes and e-dirt bikes and short-term rentals, these are things that have evolved uh because of modern technology and long time zone code doesn't apply.

And the reason why that really stuck out to me, I think is it's it's an act, I don't think that's an accurate statement because I think in those times, those factories, those steel mills came with hundreds and thousands of jobs that created communities that created our city as we know it that led to such a big growth.

We are not gonna see that type of development with data centers.

We already know this.

There are fractions of the jobs that are being promised even when they come, and that's all there is.

And there is no reshoring of American industry that is going to happen, no matter how much the president tries to convince us.

We know that we're not living in the industrial age anymore.

We are living in the software age, and we've already seen how big tech is not on our side.

If we're using that same uh you know analogy, uh the billionaire oligarchs that actually are going to be profiting from these data centers, because let's be honest, that's who it is.

What whoever owns the local ones, it doesn't matter.

That's what the bottom line is that big tech is the one that's gonna be profiting from this.

They're the ones that are pushing this across the country.

They're buying up midterm elections, they're already been a big influence in the primaries.

We saw their influence in our Senate race last year as well.

So we're seeing this impact across the board.

But those billionaire oligarchs, like Bezos, Musk, and Zuckerberg are dependent on these data centers to be put in our communities so they can continue extracting our money.

They're actually the robber barons of our times, and we're seeing this inequality rise more and more.

So if anything, to me, that's really more of an apt comparison.

And you know, big tech is not on our side.

We already see this.

They're not on Ward 12 side, definitely not my residence, they're not on Cleveland side, they're not on Ohio, they're not for the working class, and they're not even for human beings.

Because we see, once again, the impact of these data centers across the country already.

We don't need to wait for complicated long studies, wait for years and years, and then they tell us, hey, these weren't good for your communities.

We know that.

People are already, their health is getting impacted, water usage is going through the roof.

We see electricity already not being able to keep up with the pace.

We can't even have our grid support our neighborhoods right now.

I mean, how many times have there been blackouts on the east side?

Yeah.

I mean, in Lakewood, I'm sure you know better than me, there's been how many times ever blackouts.

I had residents, business owners calling me the whole time.

It was about all the produce they lost.

We are already seeing our electric grid not being able to keep up with our current demand.

And if we're suggesting introducing data centers, even if they try to pay their own way, that's not how electric grids work.

We know this.

It needs a massive in uh infusion of money to upgrade the whole grid, and that's going to be on the backs of our residents because that's who runs CPP.

It is not these individual facilities.

So I I'm I'm really, I think three months to me is not enough time.

I I would push.

Um I believe that the amendment is not sufficient for us.

If we were ever going to try to come up with guardrails, um a year is much more of a um ample time for us to actually be able to come up with this, uh Chair.

So I'm I'm not in support of the amendment.

Um I want the original year.

Um and once again, we we see what big tech and AI are an attack on labor and working people everywhere.

Their sole job is to actually reduce jobs and make us dependent on their software.

So I'm I'm gonna be surprised if I hear you know, labor coming to the table.

I understand there's construction jobs, that's important.

I understand that's how people foot put food on their table.

Those are important things.

But these are short-term gains that we're giving up for long-term really net uh negatives for our communities, and it's not a good bargain for the working class people of Cleveland.

Um, I I appreciate the testimony.

I'm looking forward to hearing from the public comment folks that are here.

Um, but I really believe that local government, especially in Ohio, has to hold this line.

We've already seen, you know, uh this is a bipartisan issue.

We've seen Republicans, Democrats, it doesn't matter, rural areas, urban areas all really come together against data centers because they understand they are not believing the garbage that big tech is trying to sell them.

And we should listen to them.

Our grid, once again, can't handle this.

We should be looking out for our water usage, protecting Lake Erie.

Um, and I'm looking forward to seeing what guardells we can come up as a city to make sure that we put in um those guardalls so they don't get exploited.

Thank you, Chair.

All right, thank you, Councilman Shaw.

Councilman Conwell.

Thank you.

You know, uh looking at this, and you look at history and and council member, would you do the chair?

Would you you know our job is to try to bring in resources for our community?

And you're in Lakewood, right?

Would you bring something like this to your neighborhood to the chair to the council member?

Mr.

Chair Um I would take it just as seriously as you are.

Um, number one.

Number two, I do get the zoning definitional question.

Number three, as a practical matter, Lakewood's so built out and smaller than the city of Cleveland with a lot fewer industrial zones.

I don't anticipate that we'll we're gonna get that kind of proposal.

Yeah, we could clear some land and probably put it in Lakewood, and you can uh and I respect Lake Wood, and you can service Cleveland and you can put it right there in Lakewood if you're a proponent of it and you champion it, then you're your word is your bond.

Is that right, do the chair to the council meeting Mr.

Chair?

So uh I'm trying to describe yourself as a third country interested party means I'm not for or against them trying to talk about an important issue in the I'm just asking the question.

So what I would say is the so what Mr.

Shaw was talking about was the robber barons, although I think you spoke with admiration about the jobs entailed by railroads and steel.

So there was a Robert Baron era, but then it resulted in benefits for a lot of people, including the city of Cleveland.

So which will it be is a valid question.

The economic upside, if it's done well, would be you'd have property taxes, you'd have the replacement of blight with new development, you'd have a long stable electricity customer who could then pay be on the balance sheet for Cleveland Public Power and pay for some of the repairs to improve the outages that you're correctly noting, um, and the outages by the way were driven by first energy, not Cleveland public power.

Cleveland public power has a superior record to first energy in terms of uh recovery from outages.

So there's many good things to say.

So it's it's a mixed bag.

I don't think it's all good or all bad.

And so there's scenarios in which a community like Cleveland might say yes, and there's certainly scenarios in which you might say no.

And it's a valid question.

Um, but I don't think we're well served by black and white thinking.

You know, and you mentioned black and white thinking.

Um you mentioned history, every time there's an experiment, every time throughout history, since 1619, is always you put it in the African American community.

And I have to walk the streets of my neighborhood and to let my residents know about this.

And Shannon, I'm telling you through the chair, we will at this moment we will fight to battle against something like this.

We are always the one that they want to put something in our neighborhood, and then we end up with high cancer rates, and then we end up with high noise in the community, and you mention taxes, but then you end up devaluing the community in our neighborhood.

So I have to get this to my residence.

And Councilmember Mike Balenciag mentioned the area acme and all that over there.

Well, sometimes you could put things in there and it's it's a subtraction.

And then you know what else is sad.

When they build in the African American community, we have to fight just to get jobs there.

So we can take care of our family, and then that money goes out of our neighborhood, and we turn around and we end up with the poor environment drinking water.

And then we end up with the high noise in the community, and then we end up with the devalue.

No, no, no, no, no.

So something like this, and I know they're battling downstate.

They're downstate right now.

Although we might, and I agree with you with the year moratorium on this, downstate right now where we're speaking, it's lobbyists downstate battling against the people.

If we put a year on here, councilman, they'll go over us and say we can't do it.

So I even plan to go downstate to battle against this and talk to try to seek to understand so my residents will know what's going on.

I'm tired of us not benefiting from you say it's a benefit, but it's not a benefit for African Americans.

It's not a benefit for us, and I have to battle against that.

And um that's where I'm at right now on this.

So I support a year so we can seek to understand what's going on, and that's where I'm at.

Is that it, Councilman Camel?

That's it for me.

All right.

All right.

And again, we're gonna do we're gonna do a very extensive research over the next three three weeks.

But one thing that I'm not going to do is I'm not going to pit any neighborhood against another neighborhood regarding this legislation.

Nobody is saying where it's where any of these data centers are going, because truth be known, in my ward, I have the largest data center in the city of Cleveland.

Standalone.

Okay, so nobody's saying that we're picking on anybody.

This is a city of Cleveland thing.

This is not an east side neighborhood thing versus a west side neighborhood versus a downtown thing.

This moratorium will be for the whole city of Cleveland, not just a specific area.

So uh thank you, Councilman Conwell.

And and I know you're gonna go downstate, and I know I know you'll be you'll be vocal down there.

Councilwoman Gray.

Thank you.

Thank you, Chair.

I just want to just may have a couple comments too.

Um when uh I know this complex, but as everybody knows that the uh the data center uh developers came to me first, uh, I believe that was in May, whatever, uh, and they approached me with the idea of bringing their data center into Savic Village, which I was very surprised to even to be presented with this uh opposition for them to bring something so largely in a um in a uh uh poor neighborhood that has been struggling for years before I even came counsel.

So I couldn't even give it any feedback on the data center because as my colleagues stated that I wasn't even aware of what data centers, you know, um, you know, that provide for what they presented to me, it was um it was it was a mind opening to understand what these Danor Cities, you know, would bring to the community, and I know it wasn't standalone jobs for a lifetime, it was jobs for uh it was jobs for labor jobs for uh you know for it to be built, but not long-term jobs for people to have to feed their families, uh, you know, for long term.

So um I'm here to also to learn to understand, you know, what the aspects of data centers, you know, you know, whether they pro or con.

And I have a few residents here as activists here in the uh audience now, you know, that still voice their opinion and they boots on the ground.

But I also want to just say this.

The data centers that do want to that are here in the city of Cleveland, we're not aware of you know where they are right now, and we know there are many, but I can tell you this.

This one company, and I mentioned it to my chair.

This one company that's that's downtown on Superior, has a building and it's a data center.

I wasn't aware of it because that company owns another building.

I wasn't aware of that then, but one of my residents that worked in that building with uh, you know, with her boss that was a tenant for 12 years in the building, he came to them and gave them eviction notice within 30 days for them to move out that building, because he wanted to turn his second building into a data center.

So we're talking about providing jobs, providing a livelihood, providing for those people to able to sustain their lifestyle, because that one building he uh you know that he owned, he wanted to extend his data center larger into his second building, and to give people for 12 years that uh you know, you know, that you know, that is staying their personal building, business, and created it, and to give someone eviction notice to move out in 30 days after 12 years, and for me to hear that, and they came and spoke to me because some things that uh was done, and um and that's a personal friend of mine, also a constituent in the new ward three.

We just had a conversation and I had no idea.

So you can imagine in 12 years and 30 days, they had to break down, break down and store their stuff and find a different type of livelihood, you know, to survive.

So to say what these data centers can do drastically, can change someone's lifestyle after 12 years and 30 days to move out, that is a that is, you know, that's not positive.

So uh, you know, so we have to look at how how someone wants to integrate a new business and turn it into a data center, but also people are losing jobs, you know, from behind it, and you're trying to say there's more jobs.

That right there showed me example of how devastating that someone's life was turned to, you know, was turned around by someone kicking them out in 30 days.

They went ahead and left without an argument, but after 12 years of doing that business, that person had to readjust and go somewhere else and find another job instead of running his own business.

And the employees had to adjust to find other jobs too after the fact.

So we just need to know what happens to um, you know, you know, what happened to the aspect of people want to get into investing in data centers, but also how crucial lifestyles can be changed.

So like my uh chair said, we got a lot of learn.

We gotta understand.

My colleague said that you know, we don't have backgrounds in data center, and I have to contest that since I'm the new Council of War 3 and that's part of Savic Village.

Uh I was even outdone, and I did not even speak on it.

And I appreciate my colleague uh Cal Simon Starf has spoken on it, and I'm still learning to understand what we need to do.

But I know right now, even though we have a lot of industrial areas that have not been uh maintained and kept up, we don't even know, you know, we don't even know the sustainability, you know, what can be built on those industrial areas.

And they were all happy that this was rejected over there because it was on the other corner of their street, and they're dealing with a whole lot of stuff right now, and just to see if up and close, and the residents came out and said, Councilwoman Gray, we're glad it was rejected because uh because we're right here, and it's in our face.

So just understand you guys need to go out into the community and be boots on the ground and not on these residents' doors and have a conversation with the residents who paying taxes who struggling to say, do you want a data center?

This is the information that we have.

This is information that we want to share.

But none of you guys been in the but none of you guys have been in community meetings.

You are not connected to the residents.

You're not connected even to the councils, but you have the dacity to come to our D's and just present a data center and say this is what we're going to do, and this is what we're going to bring.

I was even clueless.

I was clueless, but however, I have have been patient, open a reception to understand what needs to be done, so we can at least try to understand what it can bring and what it can offer without without someone telling me, said Councilwoman Gray, we lost our business because the guy wanted to put a data center in the building I had for 12 years.

Now I don't even have a business, and I have to go find a regular job.

You cannot treat people like that because you want to bring a data center in.

But I'm open to receptive to understand, and I want to um digress to to say that uh I'm glad that my chair brought everyone in the room to the table so we can have this open and honest conversation.

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you, Councilwoman Gray.

Councilman Slife.

Uh thank you.

And just just uh a brief, I can't remember who said it, but um an example of something that I think uh a moratorium period will allow us to dive into further.

And also these this the a lot of this analysis has already begun.

So I want to say that we haven't been waiting for a moratorium to do the zoning analysis and things like that.

I've already been engaged with the administration and I know that they've been uh working uh within themselves uh to start to align all of these these these thoughts.

Um there's a difference from a utilities perspective.

Can if if a new user, any new user were to come in and say, I need five million gallons of water a day, just make it up a number, could Cleveland water produce five new five million new gallons of water a day at the plant?

I very likely yes, that is of a small compared to what uh director Kane said is the tenth largest water network in the country.

Something that I want us to understand though is I highly doubt you could deliver five million water, five million gallons of water from the plant to my home, say on Lucille Avenue, the infrastructure is not adequately sized to deliver that much water to a specific site.

And so when we talk about from a utilities perspective, part of this is understanding in a city with an old utility network what improvements would need to be done, not at the plant where that's not gonna be our issue, but throughout the network to deliver whether it's water, uh we're not gas, but electric to specific locations, and what would the cost be to the uh how would that how would that be done?

How would that cost be borne?

Is it by the user?

Is it by the larger network?

Is it some combination thereof?

Because we are a city with old aging utilities, and I think for some time sometimes we take for granted that utilities are there just because you have to build a house in Cleveland, there's gonna be a water line nearby.

The question is, is it the right size water line and and how much infrastructure are we having to build and improve to get utility service from the point of generation to the to the point of use?

Thank you.

And I can tell you that we're there's a deeper dive being done that we'll have better answers for within the next 90 days once if this passes once it's over.

All right, so uh Tom Molly and Zach, thank you very much for your time and your your comments.

Um now we have opponents of the the legislation.

Mike Bremer, business rep, IBEW Local 38, Jamie Davis, business rep IBEW Local 38 and a Cleveland resident.

Uh Shakori Davis, President of Next Gen Construction, and Norman Edwards, uh, American Center for Income Equality and Black Contractors Group.

So that group of people can please come to the table.

Norm, if we can have you down, what we have a seat for you down here.

All right.

Thank you very much for for all your time and and energy, and we're sorry that it's getting to a late hour, but you see what an important issue this is.

So again, we'll we'll start at this end of the table.

We'll just make our way down the table.

And uh if you could just state your name, where you're from, and uh where you reside.

Uh good morning.

Uh Tony Long with the Ohio Chamber of Commerce, uh, General Counsel uh and director of uh energy and uh environmental policy uh from the Columbus area.

Is that what you need right now?

Yeah, that's fine.

Go ahead.

Oh no, no, no, no.

No, no, well, yeah, go ahead and if you have your comments.

Yeah, sure.

Uh thank you, uh Chair uh Cassie, Vice Chair Gray, members of the Cleveland Utilities Committee.

Uh thank you for the opportunity to present opposition testimony.

Um given the time, I'm gonna skip over some of these uh Tony.

Can you just pull the mic closer closer to is that better?

Yeah, go ahead.

Okay.

Um in my research, I've noted that moratorium directly affects a project recently proposed in the Slavic village neighborhood in Cleveland.

And as such, it makes sense to use this project as an example for data centers and referencing back to the moratorium.

One note the project's been categorized as a hyperscale project, perhaps, but this is not so.

Such projects need about 200 acres.

The project in question is using about 35 acre site, and it's either a co-location or other small category data center.

Um these data centers, data centers uh enhance the use of digital tools in the region by many businesses operating.

For example, such a facility can reduce lag for industrial drawings, imaging and other large data processes or products like digital modeling.

Reducing lag brings better opportunity for three-dimensional models and deployment of other modern technologies coming to market.

This project also has agreements to secure its power and will pay for its fair share of power consumed and the cost to build the infrastructure to build power bring power to the site, will upgrade the grid, make it more reliable and resilient, and will not strain the system.

As for water usage, the data center industry uses less water than other industries.

I saw one estimate of 39 billion gallons a year of water consumed throughout the uh the US.

In contrast, the food and beverage industry is estimated to consume 533 billion gallons, and utility water leakage is estimated to be 2,500 billion gallons per year, or set another way, 18% of municipal treated water is lost to leakage in this country.

According to a joint legislative audit and review commit um commission in Virginia, 83% of data centers in the world's largest market use the same or less water as large commercial office buildings.

And our recent study on water readiness and data centers concluded that Ohio has sufficient water resources to support projected near-term data center growth.

I would ask why impose a moratorium at all.

Uh instead move directly to updating zoning and related codes.

Is that clear appropriate rules?

The city can clearly state the conditions on which it will accept a data center, leaving developers with the duty to comply with those standards.

A moratorium feels like an extra unnecessary potentially harmful measure that could cost the city meaningful revenue jobs and leave it behind as technology uh dollars look elsewhere to build uh throughout the country.

I'll leave it at that and turn over to McCullough.

Okay, uh Mike Brummer, I'm with Local38 IBW.

Um currently a Brunswick resident.

Uh I represent 2100 union electrical tradespeople and apprentices.

Uh my current job is I am a downtown agent, so I spend two or three days a week going through downtown, looking at the projects that are coming up and uh some that are going to be constructed.

Uh I can see the chasm, the rock hall expansion.

I see the global performance center.

One thing these all have in common is the people they're gonna hire from Cleveland are gonna be low-level jobs.

These jobs are important, but my concern is how do we maintain our our students and our graduates in the city of Cleveland.

My example is I had two kids that went to Cleveland schools.

One lives in Chicago, one lives in DC.

There was no jobs here for them.

So it's important that uh that we uh get jobs like these data centers.

For generations we're building heavy industrial, we've all gone over that.

What I'd like to see is the vision of the Cleveland schools with the help of the Tri-C, Cleveland State, partnering with the new data centers to train and employ future graduates.

Much like the Cleveland Building Trades, who reaches out to the community, reaches out to uh recent graduates to get them involved in construction.

I believe these data centers could do the same thing.

We need our people working at these places.

A lot of people say, okay, uh, there's not many people that work at these places, there's other jobs that come with it.

There's everything inside there from cafeteria staff janitors, people working outside, suppliers, vendors.

This is more than just the people working inside the data centers.

Another question of concern is the shortage of electricity.

I I will guarantee you, local 38 will provide electricity to these communities.

Um just amazing me that everybody's against the data centers, but you don't even know where they're at in the city of Cleveland.

There's over 50 data centers in the Cleveland community.

How can they be so bad if we don't notice them?

My take.

So these these uh data centers will come in and they'll put a new electrical grid in, and it'll be a redundant grid.

We'll build new powerhouses, we'll build substations, we'll utilize solar, we'll use a lot utilize wind, and we will utilize battery storage.

Uh the people from CPP, there's a lot of battery storage out there.

So this clean new energy that's coming to Cleveland.

We'll bring in more commercial vendors and more industrial.

Clean power is the golden ticket, and redundant clean power is the golden ticket for these new industries.

Uh there's also a bigger picture worth naming.

Data centers are critical to national infrastructures.

The systems that power our hospitals, coordinate our defense, and keep our financial networks running, flow through these facilities.

Our states and countries are building them aggressively.

Please don't let Cleveland behind.

Cleveland needs an identity.

It's not steel, it's not the railroads anymore, and it's not auto.

We could be the tech capital of the Midwest.

Thank you.

All right, thank you.

Thank you, Mr.

Bramer.

Good morning, council members, labor leaders.

I'm Jamie Davis, uh Cleveland resident, card-carrying union member of local 38 for 30 years.

But more importantly, today I'm speaking to you as a lifetime lifetime resident of Cleveland.

Born and raised in the Lee Harvard area, been in Cleveland all my life, went off to college and came right back to Cleveland.

My phone number's always been 216, pretty much as Cleveland as Cleveland could get.

And uh I've been in a IBW for 30 years, and it's definitely a life-changing experience.

What I want to speak to is a common might hit on a lot of good points, but I'll speak to a couple points that people are so concerned about temporary jobs.

And I'm active in the community as well.

So I just spoke at Lonnie Burton's center a couple weeks ago.

The same question came up, concerned about temporary jobs, and I understand it's a legitimate concern.

But with the data centers, what I'm pushing, and everybody else in the building trades is it uh like a pre-apprentip program to get these kids into their apprenticeship, not necessarily kids, but adults into your apprenticeship.

Because what that is is their ticket to the middle class.

Now it's today.

I wish Councilman Conwell could be here right now, but to address a couple issues that he brought up.

As of today, local 38 employees, 238 Cleveland residents.

As of today, 10 o'clock today, local 38 employees, 240 minorities.

And these jobs start off roughly as an apprentice, roughly around 36,000 a year.

And you go up to a journeyman or form in our general form, and that could be 100, 120,000 plus per year.

So these are great jobs to remain in the city.

So the the hard the hard advantages are easy as far as the infrastructure upgrades and everything else to help out the city, but I'm more concerned about the soft advantages, and that's giving somebody opportunity to learn to trade.

So these jobs are these, let's call them project, might be gonna say a job.

Projects are temporary.

But if you teach somebody a skill, they'll have a 30-year, a 40-year career, like an electrician or like a pipe fitter, I like a laborer, I like a plaster.

So these careers are permanent, but every single job comes to an end.

Just like what throughout Mike's career throughout my career, I'll probably be on a hundred jobs.

And every job we get to the point where we put up the last light fixture, you know, I hook at the last switch, all those jobs come to an end, but uh the skill still remains.

So I go into the next job and the next job and the next job.

And I'm speaking from experience because I just left the field.

A couple weeks ago, I was out in a ditch group gluing four inch pipe together.

Now I'm a business agent, a business rep.

And the beauty of it is um I will be representing the area that you're the councilperson for for that particular job.

Now to address Councilman Conwell, I understand it.

His points are valid.

But to dig in a little bit deeper, Slavic Village is one of the most diverse areas in Cleveland.

50% black, 42% white, 8% Hispanic.

So it's not even a black or white issue for Slavic village.

It's not.

It's not.

And I spoke to people just like I spoke to people at the Lonnie Burton Center.

A lot of people were concerned, because everybody, and it's not a black, white, or Hispanic issue, but Clevelanders are concerned about seeing all this development going on within our city, within our communities.

You see these guys walk to their brand new trucks at the end of the day, and they drive out to Medina or Homestead Falls.

Nothing wrong with Medina or Homestead Falls, but we see all those good jobs.

Nothing wrong with that, not to offend anyone, but we see those jobs go far out, you know, outside of the city limits.

And that was a gigantic, a gigantic concern.

So what we want to do, like Mike and everybody else, the who are pro for it, want to keep some of these jobs in Cleveland and train these people.

And while I could speak from that, and I could stand on that, because I'm the longest tenured member on our interview board.

I've been doing interviews for electricians for 12 years.

So I know what to look for.

So that's why I'm pushing this, pushing for this so hard.

Get a lot of these people in here from within the community to train them a skill that can never be taken away from them.

Because jobs come and go.

That skill is gonna last for 30 and 40 years.

And that's what I'm pushing for.

And there's no perfect scenario.

You missed a few things.

But there's you heard me?

I did job yesterday.

Okay, man, it's not a black or white issue for Slavic Village either.

This is this is everybody included.

And there's no ideal situation.

I mean, there's pros or cons on everything.

But I think if if you look at the the long-term effects, as far as training people within that community, giving them the skills, we call it the ticket to the middle class, giving them the skills to take care of their family, to buy a new house, to rehab their house, or whatever they want to do, it starts with union labor.

And obviously, I'm pushing for it because I'm an example.

Cleveland resident through and through, and I'm still in Cleveland to this day.

So there's no perfect scenario with the data centers.

You know there's pros and cons on anything.

But one thing you can't argue, when you teach somebody a skill, you can't take it away from them.

And that's that's 30, 40 years, and that's retirement, that's a pension, that's health insurance, and that's benefits.

That's about it for me.

All right, thank you very much.

Thank you.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Hey, how are you?

Good to see you.

Uh my name is Shikory Davis, uh president of Next Generation Construction.

Do want to say uh uh proud to see Jamie here when I was an apprentice 18 years ago.

I mean, he was a confident for me on the job site uh back at uh yeah, yeah, university hospital.

Can you just tell us where you live?

Oh, you got it.

I do that now.

Uh so uh I live in Pepper Pike, um, but uh I have uh two businesses and uh Cleveland, three businesses in Cleveland High, uh Cleveland, Ohio, uh, two different locations.

Uh also have a hundred employees, uh over a hundred employees in uh the city of Cleveland as well.

Um I am a servant leader.

Um I used to sit on the board of a CDC.

Um, and I currently sit on the board of uh a university hospital in Austin, uh I'm sorry, uh University Circle, and also GCP, so I think it gave me a pretty uh unique perspective on um uh civic uh uh public uh partnerships.

Um but even more uh to date.

I also uh finance the uh lay at renovation program, uh 0% interest, uh so I know how to be a good partner, and uh I'm here today, uh not necessarily to um talk about uh I'm sorry, not necessarily uh speaking on behalf of data centers, but speaking more on behalf to negotiation.

I think a lot of points that was made here are very valid, but I think those are concerns that you bring to the table.

I mean, you guys are already on top of it.

You talked about the environmental aspect with uh the commissioner here.

You guys also uh talked about the uh connectivity grid.

Um and also if you use an example in Missouri uh with Amazon on a 10 billion dollar project, I think Amazon pretty much covered most of the uh connectivity grid and also the infrastructures.

But I think those are all things that we can bring to or the city of Cleveland can bring to negotiations.

Uh and if you know, if if you feel that there are um there's not enough permanent jobs, well, take that in consideration where you're negotiating with them, and hopefully you can have something in community benefits agreement.

So I I want to double back and talk about my time with um uh with a CDC.

As you all definitely know, as being council members, um being on the board of a CDC is very challenging.

Um and most of the time, it's almost like being that poor kid.

I graduated from East Tech High School, lived in the housing projects.

It's almost like that uh it's it's it's almost like that uh you know, poor kid waiting for that rich uncle to come, right?

Uh and you're hoping that that rich uncle actually leave you something.

I think that as a CD working inside of a uh, I mean, being a part of a board, um a CDC board, we were always looking for an anchor institution.

We had civic dollars, uh public dollars came through, but there was no private uh dollars coming through uh communities that especially the CDC that I was that I was on.

So when I heard about data centers and these billion dollar uh companies wanting to come to Cleveland, first thing I thought about was an opportunity to negotiate, right?

How can we, since we already had a civic dollars, we have the public dollars, and we can't say that investments are moving in disinvested communities.

How now, how does that look if we put the private dollars with it?

So um I'm hopeful that uh we find a way to consider taking all of that in consideration and creating uh and and right now there is a window, right?

Um after we talk about the environmentals, after we talk about the uh connectivity grid, and those things are assured, not just to council, but also to your uh to the residents in your community, how can we then start talking about negotiation so that we can bring um uh the right benefits to certain communities?

So thank you.

All right, thank you.

Norm.

Uh Norman Edwards, resident of Shaker Heights, Ohio.

Uh have a lot to talk about.

We're losing a lot of jobs in the city of Cleveland.

You have uh the Brown Stadium that left that I don't think should have ever left this city.

You have uh the federal building, you're gonna lose over 4,000 workers on 9th and Lakeside at the end of this year.

You have the Justice Center that's going to Garfield Heights.

So uh the Double Tree Hotel.

You got about 17 restaurants closed last year.

We lost a lot of economic laws.

You bring in a project that will be built on a contaminated site, a contaminated site that if I if I had it, they probably had me locked up by now for leaving it, contaminated and just sitting there.

So we're gonna do something positive.

We made some significant changes here.

And Jamie, uh congratulations, one of the first black, well, he is one of the first blacks in a skilled trade other than the labors in the history of the Cleveland building trades.

We made a lot of progress.

I've been coming down here for only over 40 years.

Polinsky is the only member that that's sitting there, so I go all the way back to when Voinovich was made.

So I have a long history here, a long fight for blacks and minorities.

We're finally making progress.

Jamie is evidence of that.

Dave Wondolowski with the Cleveland Building Trades has done a great job.

We've taken a lot, I come from 2641 short scov.

We've and I still go down there to recruit.

And guess what?

We've been putting them to work.

We're putting them to work.

So we want to now you have a 1.6 billion dollar economic boost coming to the city of Cleveland that we desperately need.

We desperately need the economy to grow here.

We definitely need the jobs, even it's only three or four hundred permanent jobs there.

The construction jobs we do need.

New Albany, where all of the major, larger uh data centers that are being built, all white communities.

So something somebody made a comment about the black community or building in the black community.

That's not true.

It's a beautiful site.

The building is a it's gonna bring other business.

And we better start recognizing we have 15 council members here now.

You won't need 15 council members with 100,000 residents in the city of Cleveland.

It's gonna be out it's gonna it's gonna be wiped off the map.

So you can argue if you don't bring business here, there will not be a city of Cleveland.

So wake up, City Council, wake up, do the right thing, bring the business here.

Bring the bring the business here.

Because we're losing.

You see the statistics, statistics on crime have gone down.

No way, because of the blacks that we've taken off the streets and stop them from robbing and give them these jobs in the building trades that pay good money.

They're making more than the drug dealers now.

At least 100,000.

Give me that job.

I'll take it.

So now you we're gonna stop now.

We have a chance to keep things going, and you guys want to put a freeze on it, a year moratorium.

Absolutely.

No, absolutely not.

Can't be that way.

Do your homework, do your due diligence, like I did, like everybody else did.

If you come in late to the party, shame on you.

It's an ask to that, not a liability.

We we have to change and we have to change quick.

We don't have no long term.

It saddens me to look across over in the Brown State is is a lead.

This is an iconic Cleveland Brown and Jimmy and Dee Haslam are good people.

They're really good people.

I've met them, been to the house in Bratnall several times.

Beautiful people.

And I know something could have been worked out if you had not waited too late.

You can't wait till yesterday.

Then it's too late.

Don't let this slip away.

This is a necessity.

Grow off of it.

Learn off of it and grow off of it and go to the next stage.

I'm not going nowhere.

I'm gonna fight for this thing, and I'm I'm knocking on doors, and don't BS the public.

Be honest.

It's not gonna kill nobody.

There's no uh a radiation or nothing.

Nothing's gonna happen to the residents.

Okay, there's no health issues that are no different than from the steel mill.

Okay, you're safer with the with this than you are with the steel mills, being next door to the steel mills.

Thank you.

Thank you.

All right, this time I open it up to questions for my my colleagues, uh, Councilman and Council President uh Blaine Griffin.

Good afternoon, and it's always good to have all of uh so many people here to discuss a hot topic in the city of Cleveland, and quite frankly, one of the hottest topics in the United States of America.

And I have to start out by saying I've never seen so many, uh it's an old saying that um in politics there are strange bad fellows.

I have never seen more strange bad fellows than I have seen on this topic.

Uh between Republicans and Democrats, rural and urban, uh, between unions and others, and even to hear policy matters at the table today to bring some insightful uh comments, I think was very important.

Um I think as my good friend Norm just said, um, and Norm is someone who I consider a very good friend of somebody who we don't always agree, and you see the kind of debates that we have at times.

Uh but we do want to make sure that we get this right.

But we also don't want to say that Cleveland is closed for business.

So I think what we are trying to accomplish as a council is one to try to make sure that we do our due diligence, that we put in zoning and protections that protect our community environmentally, that make sure that we protect the social impact of our community, and yes, make sure that it benefits Cleveland in an economic fashion.

Everything we do, we look at it from a triple bottom line impact.

So this is something that I'm glad that my colleague, Councilman Slight really um brought this to the forefront because I think it was a much needed, hard conversation that all of us needed to have.

And I do want to caution people that move business moves fast, and sometimes you know, business goes, government business goes where government has already uh made fertile ground.

And what we're trying to do is make sure that we have fertile ground.

I know that there was recently a data center in Canton that was put in place.

I know that um you know, a lot of these other cities have started to outright ban them.

Um we don't want to make a knee-jerk reaction, but we do have to protect our citizens.

And I make no bones about that because one thing I learned a long time ago is never to get mad at a man or woman for who they're there to represent.

And we're here to represent the citizens of the city of Cleveland and make sure that we make good decisions.

So a couple of things that I really want to make sure that I understand.

One of the things that I don't want us to get into is to enter into these agreements, and the technology is still being developed.

Is there anyone here that can one before we even get to that question?

Give us, and some you might have already answered this.

I apologize.

I had the um some prior engagements that I had to be at.

Um I really want to understand, help us define the difference between hyperscale that needs those hundred acres or whatever, and the smaller scale.

Because I would tell you that the city of Cleveland has a data center.

I know I don't want everybody to start panicking and looking at that word like it's a curse word.

Um the city of Cleveland has a data center.

Cleveland Clinic is tied into a lot of data.

So some of our biggest employers in the city of Cleveland have floors and things dedicated to data centers.

Is anyone here prepared to really kind of make sure that they help define to my councilman uh to majority with uh slice point earlier, can anyone really truly define the difference between these hyperscale centers and these smaller scale centers?

And I'll be willing to hear if anyone has any answers for those.

I think the administration has an answer.

I'll chair, thank you.

Go ahead.

Uh, through the chair to the council president Shannon Leonard.

Um, so that is one of the real issues of why the we're requesting the more are you all Councilman Slife put in the moratorium is to really get a handle on the definition of you know, is it hyperscale?

Clearly, there's a difference between a server room or um the business centers that are that have these um large uh computer infrastructure versus the larger scale multi-acre uh projects, and so I think that's really the the intent behind the moratorium is to get a handle on what exactly and is there a different is there a clear defining line between the different types of spaces.

And and council president, I know when I met with the administration last week, that was the number one topic was what is this gonna what's it gonna look like, right?

What is this gonna be defined?

How's it gonna be defined?

Do you take something like the clinic or progressive, right?

Who are these monster, you know entities and their own data centers too, and are they attached to their current locations or are they going to need something to stand alone somewhere else, and so we and we didn't know when we were discussing it, right?

So that is part of this working entity that we're gonna put together for the next three months to come up with that answer to what would best benefit the city, the construction trade, the data center people, you know, if there is anything, um, you know, anything.

That that's what that's the stuff that we're gonna be putting together over the next three months.

And to the councilman's point to to chair, I'm confident that you, I know you do your research, and that's what I really want to get to.

I hope that we're opening it up to external experts as well to really try to help give us guidance so that people can really look at this.

But I want to be careful with verbiage as we're putting that working group together, because it's my understanding that what is concerning to a lot of the business community, and not just the actual data center people, but the broader business community because it's going to be hard to attract high performing healthcare entities or high performing aeronautics groups and high performing cybersecurity entities where industries are actually growing and we're trying to attract them to our city, and we say Cleveland's close for business.

So we want to try to have that balance where we do our due diligence through this working group, but at the same time, don't just say we're stiff arming and Heisman given the Heisman to everybody.

So it's kind of a very um you know tender conversation, and I want to make sure that we're clear as we're having that discussion that council isn't trying to just basically say you're out.

We're trying to make sure we get this right.

And in getting it right, I think we also need to make sure, and I'll take guidance from the authors of the legislation as well as uh the chair, Brian Casey, but I think verbiage is something that we really need to listen to and hear as we put this working group together to come up with the recipe that I think is going to be solid and uh and work for us.

The other couple of questions, and Ms.

Chair, I yield my time after this, is um we want to be careful of any unintended environmental protections.

You know, nobody knew back when Cleveland was in the height of its one million residents and the steel mills, and we still live in the shadows of a band of steel mills and industries.

Nobody knew how much it was going to pollute our lake.

So, how can we make sure that we have protections in place to make sure that we have systems that have internal cooling systems so that to councilman slice point, we are not pumping five million gallons of water into this place every day, but that we have technology and other things that can actually recycle and use that kind of technology to cool the systems and not need that abundance of water.

Have anybody looked at what are the best practices around that through the chair?

Um through the chair to the council president.

Thank you for um all your questions, and um I want to lift up and respond to a few different things.

Um, we are doing extensive research.

Um, and can I make this thank you about all of the different impacts, and I actually think that the collective testimony that we've heard today from both the proponents and opponents are reason for a short moratorium to do just what you said to get this right.

I think if we get this right, the process of doing business will be streamlined, will be better, we'll get some of the CVA elements that everyone is talking about, make sure that we have the parameters in place to support our community.

Um, so um I want to lift up a lot of the different points that we've heard today and a short-term pause on immediate construction will allow us to do this right and get all of those voices to the table to make sure that this is a complex and nuanced conversation, not a gut reaction one that has all of those voices at the table.

Um, I also want to lift up to the point about um the city servers, Cleveland Clinic servers and whatnot, that the text of the amendment um prohibiting the having the moratorium be on principal use standalone facilities, I think is really critical to make sure that we are not stopping existing projects that are underway that are already within the fabric of our code and have been anticipated.

Um Shannon and her team are working very hard, as she said, on the definitions.

Um, and I think getting that right for the large scale standalones is really important to make sure that we understand the differences.

Um, and so the text of that amendment I think is critical to make sure that we are supporting the flow of business while making sure we get this right for our citizens at the same time.

And again, I think this is about balance.

I think it's about taking all of this community input and getting it right so that the guardrails are there.

Thank you.

And and council president, just so just so you're aware, we anticipate a new piece of legislation coming through September 14th, um, to be heard in utilities on September 24th, which is the day before the sunset of the if this passes of the uh the moratorium.

And I was very clear with the administration is the three months because I want to get this this right, but I don't want it to take a year to get it right for that exact purpose where I don't want to hold people in limbo over moving forward with whatever they need to do in order to progress their own businesses.

So um that's why we had this the time frame here in June introduction, September 14th, another committee hearing on the 24th at the 24th.

If we haven't figured it out, this council has every obligation and right to sunset them to sunset it, and then it's 100% completely open for business.

I know the administration doesn't want that.

I know some council members, so by putting that time frame on it, it's gonna force everybody to come together in order to get this right.

If we can't get it right in 90 days, then we're never gonna get it right.

And thank you for giving me that uh that background, uh councilman.

Uh one of the things that I do want to understand better as well is PUCO's rule um role in this.

Is my understanding because we've been hearing a lot about higher bills in the city of Cleveland because of these data centers, and it's my understanding and doing some background on this that a lot of this is because of some of the provisions that the PUCO that PUCO have in place.

Uh so I hope that we actually are looking at them as well uh to see what role they are playing in this because once again, I think somebody said it is that the state house kind of kicked the ball down the curb and didn't really um take the bull by the horns, and we um now need to challenge a PUCO in order to try to see what their stance is and how they're going to play a part in this.

I just want to close by saying this, Mr.

Chair, and I'll turn it back over to you.

Um, you know, I have a seven billion dollar investment that is on the cusp of coming in the city of Cleveland, and we're gonna get that investment.

Uh I just want that's one of the reasons why it's very critical for me to get the language right to not scare away some critical investments that we have in the pipeline, but at the same time, I do want to make sure that we have strict guardrails in place that nobody is waking up and have uh the equivalent of uh of a speaker in their backyard making a whole bunch of noise.

Um so I think that uh that's that's good.

Uh last thing I want to put out this and what's your name again, sir?

Jamie Davis.

Jamie Davis.

I mean, this is great to see you leave it up to my good friends at local 38 to you know really break the mode.

I see Mr.

Ambrasia and other guys here.

I will I do want to credit, you know, Norm and uh Dave, my you know, Dave Mondelowski and those guys.

I I really hope we look at this as a challenge and opportunity that not only if we do get these construction jobs, but that we utilize those folks that are coming into the apprenticeship pipeline to help fix some of the most abandoned and left behind neighborhoods in our city.

So as we put together community benefits, which I think is probably the most critical part of all of this, other than the environmental impact.

I hope that we can use this as a platform to take us into Central Fairfax, Collinwood, Lee Harvard, and rebuild and repair some homes, build some homes, build some businesses so that we are not just saying we got the jobs and then we on to the next project, but how are we gonna really make this a long-term benefit, not a short-term benefit?

So I challenge all of us to be creative as we think about that.

I do want to commend the trades because they have been working closely with us in order to try to work with friends like Norm and Shaq to really try to make sure that we have good apprentice jobs in the city of Cleveland.

But ladies and gentlemen, we have to get this right.

I just want to make sure that we're using the right language, that we're not being overtly dramatic as we do this.

I know that people like the word moratorium and they say go get it, and I respect what the body uh decides that we want to do at the end of the day through the leadership of the chair of public utilities, but I do want to make it clear that we have to make sure that we get the zoning right, the environmental protections right, the social impact right, but at the same time, we can never shut the door that Cleveland is closed for business because in order to get some of these broader businesses, they're only going to come to cities that have access to these type of facilities, even if they're not multiplex.

So I hope that this conversation continues to take place, that it's not just a news article today and then tomorrow everybody walks away because clearly we all have some hard work to do, and I want to commend my c uh colleague, Councilman Charles Sly, uh, for making sure that we bring this uh this conversation to the forefront.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Thank you, Council President.

Uh Councilwoman Hudson.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Uh I just want to start by again thanking uh Councilman Slaife for bringing this moratorium to uh to council.

It is incredibly important um that we as council set guardrails, um, which is I see our our role as a body, um, especially when it is a subject like this, which could have such a catastrophic uh effect on the future of our city, uh one way or another.

Um Ward 11 does have a uh a large swath of vacant industrial land running right through the middle of it.

But most importantly, the implications that they might have on the future that for my children, which is really what I think about, you know, when I make decisions like this is what effect will this have.

Um, what will this do to the city?

What will this do to the earth?

Um, and and how will this leave things for for my children?

Um, you know, this is uh short time short-term construction jobs.

It might be five or six years where there's a a boom of you know a lot of construction, but really what we're doing is it's a long-term liability for for Cleveland's future.

You you might have you know uh one or two workers for every megawatt of power capacity for these hyperscale data data centers, and the permanent roles focus on security, equipment maintenance, and facility maintenance.

These are not the high-tech jobs that you know many of you are promising that would you know bring our children back after they leave for college.

These are um you know, low-paying, often not unionized jobs, and um, you know, I I don't see you know, there was a comparison made to uh the few the water consumption for uh the food and beverage industry.

Well, you you can't eat or drink what data centers produce.

So to me, that is not an adequate comparison.

Um, for our union representatives, have you uh I meant you I know you mentioned that there were 2100 members that you represent.

Have you polled your membership about how they feel about data centers because I you know uh union represent union members have reached out to me as as recently as this morning to let me know that they are against, despite working in the trades, they are against data centers in our city because of the implications that they might have on our energy consumption and our natural resources in the city.

Um there's also a mention of the pollution that we faced as a in the history of the city of Cleveland, you know, which is another reason why we have to take this so seriously and really think about what types of regulations we can set in place.

Uh business, the profit motive of business is not thinking about keeping our water clean, which we have seen play out in real time as recently as the 1970s when our uh Cuyahoga River caught on fire.

You know, this it things are different now.

We're not talking about pollutants that catch on fire, we're talking about PFAS that causes cancer.

So these are not imaginary circumstances, these are very real possibilities, and something that I take very seriously in thinking of uh this type of legislation.

And um I also um want to um just say that I understand that this will uh come back up utilities in September.

I don't think that three months is long enough.

I would like to see a longer moratorium so that we can really do a deep dive and see uh what uh really is needed to um prevent um you know some of the catastrophic effects that we've seen across the country.

It was also mentioned that we might not notice the data centers that we have.

I I'll tell you that I've certainly noticed the impact that data centers have had on my utility bills.

Um, and um I'll leave it at that, Mr.

Chair.

All right, thank you, Councilwoman.

Councilman Conwell.

Thank you very much.

I listened to my uh best best friend uh Norman Atwards.

And I've been working, we've been working together to the chair for a long time.

And businesses have said they were gonna hire African Americans and you and I do the chair, we protest to make sure that we get to this point that we are today.

And I was the only council member out there this protest right along with you, but my people you had your people.

So you see where I'm at, and you can learn skills that could pay the bills.

I used to be called Kevin Cowbury Jobs, man.

I would take people to job interviews and linking electric in different places.

And they had the skills, but they would not hire my people.

And we even won't we push legislation like this.

They would not hire my people.

And I had to walk in to make sure that African Americans and females got hired.

You and I even chase construction workers to the chair, Norman, off of the grounds, didn't we?

Because they said they were going to do this.

I'm in tears right now.

And that's why I act the way I act.

Because I've seen it, and if you look me up, you will see it.

That me and this man, this is like my brother, brother.

His name, if you don't know it, his name is Kevin too.

And we sit and we talk and we plan and we work together so that we can get ahead.

So you can teach us skills.

And that's why we had to pass policy and legislation.

Civil rights acts and all of that.

I'll go, that old Clarence Thomas took my people down because he don't think he's African American.

You know, he took us down, but I bleed for us.

And then you know in the neighborhoods, they put it in our neighborhoods, and we can't even get a job.

The last place we did was with the school system, said all of this at the table.

And you know they did not hire black folks, did they?

And we had to chase them off of the construction site.

I'm not going just by talking, I'm going by experience.

So I hear all that stuff, but I gotta monitor and I gotta see it.

And this brother would go down state with me, we talk with the governor, all of that stuff.

So I'm saying it because I bleed for us, not just to be talking and talking.

You know, he knows it.

Because he even told me when I left, he said, Kev, this deputy on the wrong side.

But I'm gonna watch, and I'm gonna make sure that we get hired.

And I think that three months is uh, no, I don't think it's enough time, Norman.

I think three months is is too short.

Maybe we'll look at it in six months to a year, or we'll sunset it, and maybe I could do another six months.

Because you can't rush things.

You gotta first try to seek to understand it, and then we put systems in place to see what's going on.

But uh that's where I'm at.

And I'm gonna talk with my residents, they need to know.

Because right now, around here, you don't see anyone from Ward 9 on the Glenville, Fairfax community, huh?

Community here, right here, right now.

You don't see us here.

They're working, just trying to make it.

And they need the council members, they're my bosses, they're my board of directors.

So I would just wouldn't acting up, man.

This is serious.

He knows.

He was this my guy right here.

One of our best friends in the whole wide world.

So that's where I'm at.

So that way you'll know.

So I'm I'm open.

I'll listen to things.

I'll listen, Council President, but I don't want to see, and I'm not saying this do you be apologetic.

I don't want I'm sick and tired.

It's Fannie Lou Hamer said, I'm sick and tired of being sick and tired.

I don't want to see my people get hurt.

I don't want to see that.

And that's where I'm at.

Thank you.

Can I uh sorry?

Sorry.

Through the chair.

So I'm sorry, go ahead.

Through the chair.

Yeah, go ahead.

Uh thank you, um uh councilman uh Cornwell.

I mean, I always appreciate your authenticity.

Um, but uh I do want to say uh when I first got in the union, I got in the union through uh Yusuf Asa, and uh um probably 18 years ago and uh Yusuf Ace of kind of went away.

Uh and that was the uh pipeline where most minorities got into the business uh industry.

Uh I mean the construction industry.

Uh Daywandelowski created um and give him credit for that, uh, created Cleveland Bills.

Uh I would say that Cleveland Bills has uh putting more minorities uh through the building trades over the last few years than uh any other union uh or any other organized uh program.

Even um there's a lot of other programs that still rely on Cleveland Bills, so the numbers can really be swayed.

Uh another thing is um, I think it's uh councilman Harsh.

Um at one point uh he mentioned um about the IV program, the led uh mitigation program.

He mentioned, yeah, he mentioned why would a business ever want to be that IV owners rep.

And uh because they were taking on all the risk.

It was a lot of truths to that.

So one of the first things I did was reach out to Daewand Lowski once again, and probably shouldn't throw that out there.

And um uh he's been very instrumental because we talked about getting diverse uh of the the union doing their part, like in the horror areas and other parts of the city.

Um but uh Cleveland Bills has been very instrumental in the layer program, and they've been doing it very quietly.

Um and if you notice, um we are getting stuff done now.

Uh so uh there's a lot of roles that the union play and uh Cleveland Bills in particular uh that don't necessarily get the credit that uh that that's due.

So just wanted to share that part about the construction industry and how things are evolving uh in that space.

So no, to the chair.

Uh we were talking about yesterday.

I was at the union club talking about you.

It was all good.

It was all good.

And through the chair, I just don't want to see my people get hurt.

If you look at history, and you look at we've always through the chair Benikine pigs throughout the whole, and I don't want to see that.

And as I said earlier, to the chair, people have come to this table saying what they're we're gonna do for us in the African American community.

And this man and I right here, this man right here before 18 years.

We had to get out there and fight in the neighborhood.

And I was the only council member.

Isn't that right, Norman?

They went out there to fight some of the stuff you guys are talking about right now.

I was the only one.

And we had to battle the unions and the whole nine yards when they didn't even let us in.

They didn't even let us in.

Isn't that right, Norman?

He know it.

So I look at the history of what's going on, and I have to watch and try to make sure.

And you're doing a good job by bringing in African Americans, and you did a good job with that UCI project also.

I was talking about that yesterday.

Thank you very much.

Goodbye.

All right.

Thank you.

Are you done, uh, Councilman Camel?

I am Chairman.

Okay.

Uh Councilman Shah.

Thank you, Chair.

Uh wanted to just quickly understand we're you've you have an amendment.

You haven't voted that in yet.

The amendment is for three months.

The underlying legislation is for a year.

The the legislation has come to us as amended.

So we would vote on the piece of legislation as it comes to us as amended.

Through the chair to uh councilman.

Also want to lift up that as part of it, there's the option for council to extend for an additional three months.

That's part of it.

Um as part of the amendment, and also that the moratorium will lift when a more full-throated uh ordinance regulating data centers is in place.

Um so I want to lift up both of those components.

So I I just want to understand maybe to to law.

Are you are we looking at the same thing?

Can you confirm that the legislation right now is it's already been amended to three months, or do we still have to vote vote on that?

Councilman, the amendment um would have to be read in.

It was it was read in, I believe.

It's been read in.

And so yes, uh, what council president said was correct, you'd vote on this as amended, unless you want to amend what has already been read.

That makes sense.

When we read it in, though, we didn't vote.

You'd vote for it collectively.

Right.

But we haven't done that yet.

You've not done that yet.

No, no.

So we vote on the piece of legislation as amended, the way it came to us because it's already been read into the record, right?

So you've already amended it.

It it came to us as amended, and we read the amendment into the legislation already at the beginning at when we started the hearing.

Yes.

If you were to through through the chair, if you were to amend this further, you you need to vote on that asset motion.

Okay.

Thank you.

Sure.

All right.

Uh with that, uh, I I appreciate that.

I I I would like to offer an amendment to revert this to a year.

Through the chair to the council.

Hang on.

I yeah, go ahead.

You got come up with the language that you want.

You can't revert to a year.

No.

I'd like to hear what the you have an amendment?

Oh, wait.

I would like to hear what the administration wants to say.

Through through the chair to the councilman.

Any amendment will take it back through the various committees, including city planning commission delaying this process further, just for clarification.

Okay.

Understood.

I wanted to uh ask a few of the questions to the folks that were here.

Uh I think from the Chamber of Commerce, I forgot your name um through the chair.

Mr.

Langs uh long.

Tony Long.

Mr.

Long, thank you for your um testimony.

As I understand at the Chamber of Commerce, is this the same Ohio Chamber of Commerce that's right now advocating at the State House for lowering property taxes and eliminating capital gains tax?

Are you from the same Ohio Chamber of Commerce?

Mr.

Long.

Everything runs to the Chair, please.

Yes.

Through the Chair to the Councilman, yes.

Thank you.

I I appreciate the testimony in support of the data centers.

We're being incredibly short-sighted.

We're we're prioritizing profits over people.

This is not sustainable actual development for our city.

It is not going to bring the types of jobs we believe it's going to.

We're seeing these tech companies break their promises across this country, time and time again towards communities.

And we have to rely on federal courts that have already been stuffed by appointees from this Trump administration that are not intent on actually protecting the people, but rather companies.

That is not a bet that I'm willing to take or when we have to rely on the courts.

We have to protect our residents.

And unfortunately, I'm I'm really surprised and shocked to hear that the administration is supporting three months.

I mean, we can't even get our street lights fixed in three months.

And you're telling me that the administration is going to be able to get this done in three months.

It's I I've been talking about swimming pools.

We can't even get lifeguards.

An issue we've had year after year.

We're kicking people out every 45 minutes.

And I've tried to be patient with the administration and waiting on different results.

We still haven't been able to figure that out.

We can't figure out lead.

These are all ongoing issues, and we're saying we're going to be able to turn this around in three months.

If that's true, I question the priorities of this administration.

Because if that is true, then it is it's possible for this administration to move fast when it wants to do something, but not when it actually impacts the working class people of this city.

Because that's the conclusion I'm taking away.

So if if you're able to do this in three months, I'll be shocked.

We weren't even able to provide a definition for a data center as you testified.

So I'm once again, this is um yeah.

If this has already been amended, um and what I'm hearing is that it's going to take additional time.

I I I would still like to offer an amendment for a year.

And I would like to put that forward.

Um so I can provide the exact language if that's okay.

Through the chair to the councilman, um right now, uh the way the way it's stated with the with the current amendment is that um it will be for a period commencing on the effective date of the ordinance and ending on the earlier off three options.

The effective date of an ordinance regulating or prohibiting data centers, or three months after the effective date of this ordinance, unless extended by council for an additional three months, if council determines that additional time is needed to further review and determine what action is appropriate for the city.

So sorry, there are two options here.

Let's just do um change the threes to six.

So it'll be a six month with an additional extension of six months.

So that would give us up to a year if we need it.

I want to take what the administration is saying at good faith and give enough time.

I believe six months would be a better time frame for us.

Would that work?

Uh you have that amendment?

I have that.

Yes.

Okay.

Uh Chair, that is the amendment I'm offering.

Um I would like that to be put to a vote.

Can you can you repeat the amendment?

Can you give us the exact language for your amendment?

Sure.

Good.

So what this would do.

So if if this is coming from the law, is this coming from the the law department, this amendment?

It's coming from councilman Shah.

So let's let Councilman Shah come up with his amendment.

Yep.

I mean he could it's this exact same amendment.

It just changes a three to six, and that would make it a six-month moratorium with a six-month extension if we need it.

The same things, nothing else would change in the language.

Um to the uh to the attorney, can we amend an amendment?

Yeah, yes, you can at this table.

All right, so there's an amendment on the table to extend it from three months to six months.

Is there a second?

All right, seeing no second, the amendment does not carry.

Councilman Shaw, if you want to continue.

All right.

Yeah, that's I I guess we'll do the three months and we'll see what the administration comes back with.

Thanks.

Thank you, Councilman Shaw.

Councilman Palency.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman, my colleagues, and to the folks that are here, and I do support the existing amendment that has been put forth to the council.

I don't know anyone else at the table here except Norm, and I go back a long way with him.

And I concur with you that we have lost far too much in the city.

When I came in, there were 33 council people.

Now there are 15, and we're going to redistrict again 2030, 2031.

And if we cannot stabilize the city, we'll be losing two more wards under the present structure of the way it's structured.

We'll lost the losing the jail, losing the Browns, stadium going bye-bye.

Most of those are on the east side, on top of the 29 that have been closed already on the east side.

So, Norm, I'm very much aware of what we have experienced.

I've seen it, I've experienced it firsthand.

I was a former United Auto Worker before this job, local 32.

And where I worked is now an empty lot that stores school buses.

Where my family worked at Eton, Axel, four members is now where they store shipping containers.

So I know firsthand the loss of jobs.

And that's why I go back to the previous discussion and to those who are at the table.

The administration, and I want to direct this to the ladies again that are here from the administration.

We need the accurate information, the most accurate data we can.

And I would say to my council president who's stepped out for a moment.

If council is well needs to hire outside consultants to advise us on this, we have to make the right decision.

We have three months, and we also have a provision within the ordinance that we can extend it another three months if need be.

But too often, again, as I have said, we have acted without having good data, good information.

So this is an opportunity for the people who are proponents of this to make sure we have the proper data.

To the people who are opposed to this, we need to have their data as well so we can make a decision.

We need to create jobs.

We need to create opportunity.

The poverty, the lack of of uh opportunity, the despair that I see in this city, um, specifically on the east side, angers me greatly.

So what I'm also hoping, because Norm, you touched on it briefly, and this gentleman from Local 38.

We need to make sure when we talk about community benefits that there is a real linkage as it pertains to any job creation, because as we all know, CMSD stripped all the vocational and vo and technical programs from the schools.

They stripped them for God knows why, but they did it, and now our kids don't have the opportunities that even suburban kids have for vocational technical programs.

So this is an opportunity for the council working with the administration and working internally.

If we're gonna go forward with some form of data center provisions that we have it structured in a way that our citizens really benefit, and we protect the environment and we protect the zoning code, and we do.

This might be a unique opportunity.

We maybe Cleveland has an opportunity to really set the tone in the State of Ohio if we do it right.

I'm not about to uh allow anything on my ward that's gonna contribute to an environmental negative environmental environment.

I'm not gonna support anything that is gonna cause um air pollution, affect our water system, affect our electrical grid.

I'm not gonna support that.

But again, as I said earlier, there is so much mis, even while I am sitting here and people are texting me, and I'm looking at with extreme from one extreme to the other.

The communists are running this.

The communists are running it.

The other say, no, they're not.

This is I mean, I'm looking at my phone saying there is so much misinformation, and that's why to the administration.

We need the facts.

And whoever can provide it to us, and I believe the council today is equipped.

I don't know.

If we get the right information.

To do what is right on behalf of the citizens of the city of Cleveland.

You know, I be I was a UAW guy, and now I'm a journeyman councilman.

Okay?

That's what I become, a journeyman councilman.

And I want to make the right decision on behalf of my constituents and all of my brothers and sisters here at the table and all of our constituents.

But we can't make it in a vacuum.

I would say the administration, with been too many decisions made around here without getting proper information.

And so the proof will be in a pudding.

The ball is in your court.

And I'm hoping again with the council present leadership, and I would say this to the leadership team here, because Councilman Slife is at the table.

Uh we need if we have to go out for outside um uh data collection, then we need to do that.

And we can do that if we want to do that.

And then we can make the sound decision.

So whether you like it or not, you'll know that we made a decision based on facts.

And not based on who who's put forth the greatest lobbying effort.

We want to make the right facts, and then hopefully our citizens benefit.

So, Mr.

Chairman, I appreciate the way you've handled this committee.

Um I'm here to support the legislation as it's structured as amended before us.

All right.

Thank you.

Um thank you to to you guys.

We've got one more thing.

I gotta we've got public comment.

We have six people.

If they're still here, sign up for public comment.

I'm gonna do one minute of public comment, um, which hopefully will last less than 10 minutes, then we'll call the roll on on this piece of legislation.

So thank you very much.

So uh David Beach, are you here?

Are you still here?

Mr.

Beach.

Thank you.

I'll give you one.

Lou?

Come on up, Lou.

Lou, you can just sit right there, grab a microphone.

All right, good afternoon, everybody.

You woke everybody up, okay.

Now this has been Lou, hold on, I gotta save your time.

All right, go ahead.

This has been a very constructive and informative meeting.

However, as a community member, I really wish uh our council members uh stife, you will actually really get everybody on the table, including myself.

Now, if we want to do environmental uh studies, please do not submit a study just based on what you can see.

Let's study how, for example, Slot the village residents, how their health conditions are actually are being affected by all the elements in this area.

We already know data center, the one right now we are talking about is the one to consume lots of energy resources.

So let's check out the impact.

And don't forget, some of the these data centers are already in our city somewhere else.

They may not be included in the current plan.

So we shall study that together as well.

Then you will know this is a right thing for us or not.

Should we benefit the rich and wealthy people, or the real people residing in Cleveland.

All right, thank you.

Dallas looks like Ekman.

I have a minute.

Yeah.

You ready?

Go ahead.

Go ahead, Dallas.

Chairperson, um, members of the committee, thank you.

I want to begin by thanking Councilman Slife for his leadership and authoring this moratorium as a homeowner in Cleveland's Award 15.

I'm grateful to have a representative who understands that we need to get this right.

I've lived long enough in the city, though, to know that three and even six months is not sufficient.

If the paving of my street takes two months to accomplish, this amendment is frankly laughable.

It should be restored to the original year, which we have collected hundreds of Clevelanders' signatures to support.

As Council President Griffin said, we have to get this right.

And if the zoning code hasn't been updated in nearly 80 years, getting this right will take significantly longer than 90 days.

Hyperscale data center construction is happening across Ohio at breakneck speed, the sixth highest in the country, despite widely reported impacts that have given surrounding communities.

Given this, continuing with a method of community input and consultation that relies solely on infrequent committee meetings for working people broadly will not be sufficient.

The only reason I can be here today is because I'm a public school teacher and I happen to be off in the summer.

Most workers cannot be at a meeting like this, as you saw this room emptied out with the length of time.

These conversations are going to take hours and hours and hours and hours.

This simply will not happen in six months.

That's a fact.

News Nation recently reported on a hyperscale project in Virginia that promised loud worrying generators on the perimeter of the property would only be temporary.

But they have operated for two full calendar years.

Thank you, Dallas.

Appreciate it.

Randy Cunningham.

Is Randy still here?

Jesse Search Jesse Sear.

All right.

All right, ordinance number five.

There was six.

The one was one was this guy.

All right.

Just to recap, right?

Legislation, moratorium, standalone data centers, three months.

The council has an option to come back for another three months.

I'm anticipating a work this working group put together of everybody.

I don't want anybody left out, right?

Pro, anti, middle of the road, our staff, your staff, any council member that wants to be involved.

This is and it's got to move quickly, right?

Because I'm anticipating a permanent solution to this to be introduced September 14th.

To be heard in utilities on September 24th.

That's our three, that's our our three-month window.

Um if you come back and you're not ready to go in three months, this council will decide on what we want to do.

We could let that sunset and we could go forward for a year, two years, five years, whatever we want to decide to do at that point.

But we're giving everybody the opportunity to say, hey, look, let's educate everybody who needs to be educated on this topic.

I want this council to definitely make a very educated and well-informed decision at that point.

I think there's a lot of education that needs to be that needs to go on.

And if it means bringing in outside people to educate us on data centers.

And again, right now I'm good, bad, or indifferent.

All I want is is what's gonna be right for the city of Cleveland moving forward.

So with that being said, uh uh five, six, twenty twenty-six as amended.

Madam Clerk, can you please call the roll?

Yes.

Davisone?

Yes.

Yes.

Five minutes.

All right, with that 556 2026 stands uh stands uh uh confirmed.

It'll be heard at uh committee of the whole.

Uh but we've got the time frame coming forward in September, and we've talked about that.

So with that being said, please sign up.

Oh, I'm sorry.

Yeah, I'm gonna think if we take a five minutes.

All right, I'll just left.

Oh, you're gonna want to hear this one.

You want to stick for this one.

Whatever.

All right.

This is the the this there's no legislation involved with this, but one of my most giddiest days on council was when I got a call from First Energy saying that they would like to appear before a utilities committee hearing.

I mentioned to the individual who had called me.

I said, you do know my history with First Energy.

Um they said yes, but it's the right thing to do because the city of Cleveland, about a uh a third of the city of Cleveland is covered by First Energy.

And uh you have a proposal that you're you're taking on the road, correct?

So please both of you guys can introduce yourselves and uh and then let us know what your proposal you're proposing.

Thank you, Chair.

Just start it, it turns green.

Just press it a little.

There you go.

Thank you, Chair Casey, members of the committee.

Um David Turner, the director of customer accounts and local engagement for first energy, uh, with me as my colleague.

Charles Chico, local engagement specialist for first energy.

And I know you both, and I think you know everybody at the table, so welcome and the floor is yours.

Thank you, I appreciate it.

Uh, we're coming before the committee this afternoon to talk to you about our three-year rate plan.

Uh as you are all aware, back on May 22nd, we filed with the PUCO a three-year rate plan to take effect between 2027 and 2030.

As part of this process, we have sent over to you uh some information on the three-year rate plan before you today is an update, a fact sheet that we'll also send out to other members of council, uh, the mayor's office, council president Griffin as well.

And our purpose today is to go over at a very high level what the rate plan does for the city of Cleveland and its residents.

So, as you can see from the rate plan, we're looking at for the aluminating company uh investing in Calga County, uh about $50 million in substation and critical equipment, uh behind the scenes infrastructure, really like the blocking and tackling that we see that needs to occur to keep the lights on and move things forward.

Another 130 million dollars and what we will consider to be capital investment.

So upgrading our poles, our wires, other equipment deliver power to your homes and businesses, and then last part of this priority circuits.

We recognize that within our system that we have what we call uh worth performing circuits, ones where we see reliability is very poor, we've identified those, and we see us making those a priority to do upgrades along with in the system along along those lines.

Uh understanding that affordability is a huge subject, no matter where you are.

Um we also have and have allocated another million dollars for emergency support funds and four million dollars for emergency assistance funds.

Uh those funds are there to assist our customers, uh City of Cleveland residents uh who may have difficulty in paying their bills as well, but this is gonna look like on the bottom left.

There is a QR code that if you tap that, it takes you to our three-year rate plan website.

Uh we can get a lot of valuable information as well.

Uh the average annual increase we see, and this is for a non-shopping residential customer using about a 1,000 kilowatts of power per month as actually about 2.6 percent year over year.

The monthly impact is about five dollars and fifteen cents uh per year over that three-year cycle.

I'm gonna stop there and through the chair, take any questions that you guys may have.

Do you have any you have anything you want to add?

Is that the end of your presentation?

Yes, it is.

He stole my thunder.

Thank you, Chair.

So I know I know both of you guys.

Yes.

Okay.

And I respect both of you guys, all right.

And I respect every single line lineman and line woman who does everything they can in order to keep the power on.

But you also both know my feelings about first energy, and not you guys who are running the day-to-day, but I'm talking the corporation itself.

Remember, you guys came to me.

Okay.

So you're asking us, or you're you're telling us that you're going to the PUCO in order to ask for a rate increase for our for our residents, your customers, correct?

Correct.

And this is actually due to the House Bill 15.

There's a change in how we actually file for rate increases.

So every investor-owned utility in the state will be doing the same thing.

Um AES.

Every what?

Investor-owned utility.

What are you saying?

What owned?

Invest it.

So investor owned.

Right.

CDP does not have to do this, obviously.

Right.

Um, but AES, formerly Dayton Power and Life has already filed theirs.

We're filing ours, or I have filed ours, and you would expect to see the same thing to the other utilities in the South.

Right, but you don't have to file.

I mean, you don't have to ask for an increase, correct?

We are mandated that, yes, this is the process for rate increases moving forward.

Right.

No, but but but what I'm saying is that you don't you could just say we're not asking for a rate increase, we're good with where we are.

I would say you could potentially, right?

You could.

If we are looking at improving system reliability, okay.

So I I think Mr.

Turner, the answer is you know, you you don't have to ask for a rate increase, right?

You could just say uh our infrastructure is fine, everything's going honky-dory, we're good.

We don't have to ask for I understand why you're doing it, yes, but I'm just saying I just want to make it clear that the PUCO is not telling you you have to ask for a rate increase.

Is that accurate?

They're saying that we do not have to ask for a rate increase.

Right.

If we are going to invest in our system, this is our process.

Okay, right.

Okay.

Anything else you want to say before I get into things that I've been wanting to get off of my chest regarding first energy.

Please.

Okay.

We're ready, Chair.

All right.

And and I don't think it's to any surprise that I I'm I I feel like I'm getting my opportunity or my moment to shine as the chair utilities who is overly protective of your competition within the city of Cleveland or our competition within the city of Cleveland.

So as you're asking for a rate increase, I have to go back and try to sell that to my residents as well, right?

Because I have to to this is what what this is why they need it, this is what they're needed.

It's not our decision.

Unlike Cleveland Public Power, where Cleveland Public Power, the only way to raise their rate is through the council.

And then we we set the rates.

But I want to I just want to bring up some some topics that people have come to me over the years that maybe you want to discuss them, maybe you do not want to discuss them.

I will totally understand if you just want to just move on.

But we're gonna start with the scandals of of First Energy with your $60 million bribery scheme, um, securing a billion dollar legislative bailout, uh paying millions to influence a utility regulator and 4.3 million to Sam Rendazo, criminal charges and a 230 million dollar federal penalty in 2021.

And here's the one that really gets me.

All right, you guys funded a campaign against Cleveland Public Power and called it the consumers against deceptive fees in 2018 and 2019.

Secretly paid 551,931 dollars to a group called Consumers Against Deceptive Fees to attack Cleveland Public Powers rates and billing practices through mailings sent to Cleveland residents in 2019.

All but ten thousand dollars of consumer against deceptive fee funds came from First Energy.

First Energy used that same 501 C4, Partners for Progress to give a fund to CADF and approximately 15 million to householders 501 C4 generation now.

That's the one that really really gets me.

When First Energy, and I'm not talking you two here.

You you're just you just happen to be sitting here, right?

When First Energy actively knowingly funded an organization to try to put Cleveland public power out of out of business, will never ever ever sit well with me.

Never ever sit well with me, which is one of the reasons that I'm never gonna be supportive of first energy.

In 2024, you had a securities fraud and SEC settlement for 100 million dollars.

2024, improper use of customer funds, where you paid a 250 million dollars in penalties and refunds.

In 2003, we had the Northeast blackout investigation, where 50 million people were without power across the United States and Canada.

We had in 2002, the David Besse nuclear power plant cover-up, uh repeated Northeast Ohio reliability complaints.

August 2024, we had the storm fallouts.

We're 256,000 first energy customers in Northeast Ohio lost power.

You guys are intricately involved in the Lakewood and West Side complaints about losing power over there, and I understand just yesterday um there was a a resolution to to one of those issues.

Um negligence.

Introduction of an Ohio or I don't want to get into your to the negligence of misleading regulators and investors, the distribution of modernization rider beginning in 2017.

First energy customers paid the extra charge, right, on their bills, uh called the distribution modernization rider, which then again in 2018 and 19, you wanted to turn around and use that same thing with consumers against deceptive fees when we had our our our power recovery uh charge.

Um refunds offered after improper cost recovery in 2021, you guys had to rec had uh 306 million dollars uh after litigation over charges that courts found that you were improperly collected and calculated.

You have your three-year rate plan now.

Uh it just goes on and on and on, right?

The the scandal.

I led the I led the charge to remove first energy's name from the stadium.

So I'm asking my two friends sitting here in front of me today.

Why should we be supportive or how sh how is it that I would be able to go to my residence and say, hey, listen, First Energy wants to raise your rates.

To the chair, thank you.

And I will say that the list of items that you mentioned, which are substantial, do not reflect who we are today.

Looking at our senior leadership and Brian Tierney, uh Fretter Johannes President Torrance Hinton uh and his staff, which I am a part of, uh that is not who we are today.

We are a company committed to operating with ethical guidelines.

We're a company committed to providing safe, reliable, affordable electricity.

So while you put out various things, I don't think now is the time to address those or if they're even worth addressing, considering that's not who we are today.

Okay, well, I'm glad you mentioned that because your CEO Brian Tierney, who I do not know, but the average income for a resident of the city of Cleveland is 41,000.

In 2025, Mr.

Tierney made over 13 million dollars in co in total compensation.

1.5 million in base, 2.4 in annual bonuses, and 9.4 for stock options.

The company's median employee salaries 160,000, making first energy CEO to employee pay ratio 84 to 1.

So as you stated earlier, you're a publicly invested company who lives on the backs of the ratepayers who pay your who pay for first energy services, and you can afford to pay your CEO $13 million a year, all the while asking somebody who's making less than $41,000 a year for an increase in in their utility bill.

How does that sit well with any customer?

When we look at what the system requires, future degradation, ongoing maintenance, investment to provide reliable power to not just the homeowner, but also the business.

All right.

Just earlier this year, you asked the PUCO to extend outage time.

PUCO got it right and told First Energy, no, you cannot, right?

Um we own our own utility as well, right?

So we know what you go through when a storm rolls through or when we had two years ago, two tornadoes hit us.

We we understand that.

But what we do is we get on the boots on the ground and we get things up and running as as fast as we can, right?

It is the perception of the city of Cleveland that first energy works from the suburbs inward, right?

Where you're going to turn the suburbs on first and then you eventually get to the city of Cleveland when it comes to outages that last more than we'll say 10 hours or or what whatever.

Can you can you address that perception that first energy makes sure that Cleveland's turned on last?

Yes, to the chair.

Um that's an inaccurate.

Uh I would tell you that if you look at our restoration process, it starts really at the transmission level and then works down to the distribution level, down into the neighborhoods.

So when we're talking about how we staff, how we support and prepare for uh large scale events where we have scabbers that will be out, um, that is not an accurate statement at all.

Uh our circuits and how we function are not bound by quote unquote the stuff the suburbs to the city.

So our process is not bound by the suburbs to the city.

What was first energy's net profit last year?

I don't have that before me, I'm sorry.

You want me to Google it real quick?

If you'd like to.

All right, I'll open it up to to questions.

Uh councilwoman Gray.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you for coming to the table.

I appreciate you both.

I don't know you as well as I like, but I've seen you plenty of times per se, but I definitely know Charles and uh in uh in another position, and he moved over into uh the first energy position.

So I have a great relationship with Charles prior to him coming into first energy uh um family per se.

But my question is this um I know uh the chair just brought up chair to the team, the chair just brought up that that the PUCO uh rejected first energy requests for additional time to restore power outages, since uh since that was just rejected.

Why would you believe that a rake height for uh for our customers will be justifiable due to the rejection of this?

It's it's like one is one is consistent with the next, but but it's not you understand the question.

I believe I do.

Okay.

So when we're looking at what we're proposing and our rate plan filing, really is about investment again to increase our reliability.

Right.

So you're talking about nearly 35 million dollars in substation programs, nearly 67 million dollars for specific projects, including wall repair and infrastructure replacement, 3.6 million dollars in reliability circuits.

So we're looking at from a substitute, uh again, you know, breakers, transformers, critical equipment, all those things that will help us as far from a reliability perspective and reduce outage time.

Right, and I understand that, but I'm saying that it's just ironic that you get rejected for uh dish for additional time to restore power outages when you turn around want to raise you trying to do a rake hike, but the but to see but to look at it, chair to the team to look at it through the customer uh lens, uh they would think that's ironic per se, because now they like more dissolutional on um on the belief of what first energy is trying to constantly do.

If you lose one, you know, you're trying to push another.

I'm just bringing this up because in my community meeting last month, it came up when uh when the announcement came up due to some type of I can't remember because I text Casey when I left my community meeting.

I text him immediately with what was out here uh out there on and I Google because the rest isn't brought to my attention that a rake hike was going to be presented, and they found it prior to they found it and they sent it to me, and I sent it to Casey because I wasn't aware of it.

But Casey said that um that uh that first energy was gonna come out to the residents speak on that uh per se to announce why you want this rate hike.

But um, I have first energy because believe me, I'm not against you.

I didn't have it for years.

First time I ever got my first apartment, and I had first energy, and I never and I and I always kept it regardless of anything that go down and stuff.

I've never had too many complaints about first energy, but I'm saying that the residents will who brought it to my community committee last night, they already on top of it because their income, they're afraid that where they are in their income, you know what would be the rate how you know the rate hike, and would they afford it per se?

So um that uh uh and then certain things, I'm not trying to ramble, but certain things to the fact that what residents bring to me when you uh when uh one thing is rejected, you know, now you want to bring uh uh a rate hike.

How do you explain that to the customers, you know, that you still have?

Sure, and and to be clear that our goal is always to restore our customers as quickly as possible.

So the goal is not to say because our reliability standard is this number that we're gonna use every bit of that number.

The goal is to restore customers as safely and quickly as possible.

And I believe looking at what we've done with our crewing, uh, our operations folks, uh obviously when you guys have concerns or questions about outages that are occurring, uh, we respond as quickly as we can.

Okay.

All right, and then one last thing.

I have sent the um a request to have in my uh um over there in my neighborhood, at least three times.

It's first energy lighting, it's not CPP, because it's around near the uh Look Eastern Park.

We have some uh um uh some uh polls that's been flickering, flickering for at least three months.

I have sent three requests for a crew to come out to uh uh adjust the flickering of those light poles on Autoba um on Ramona on Romona Road, and I sent the the addresses from one address to the next.

I live in that neighborhood, and I sent it three times for the last three months, and the residents still saying Councilwoman McGregor is still flickering, and I and I drive alone with Mona Home, you know, with Mona Road coming home, and the evening times when no lights come on, flickering, flickering, flickering, they still flickering.

And it's been three months.

So due to the service that you sit here to talk about, and I agree with my colleague, services is great good, but it's not always great when you live in darkness or you haven't consistent problems, and the residents say, I'm paying my bill for this, and that is a first energy area, as you guys know.

The uh the uh you know, the uh part, Lou Eastern part, you guys collaborate with CPP because CPP do come over and do their part, but on this part, first energy hasn't come over to do their part to stop the flickering of those uh light poles.

So who do so uh so should I email you, Charles?

Yeah, uh through the chair to the councilwoman, yes, please email me if you've already submitted those online or over the phone.

If you happen to have the uh numbers that you received uh afterwards, I'll run those through and I'll be happy to figure out where those requests are at.

I re-email you or just call me.

I'll be happy to look into it.

I always do.

All right.

I know you jotted on the spot, and I so appreciate you still in the game, even though you left one organization and you went first energy.

I know how well you do, and I know how well you take care of business.

I put this my leave chair.

All right, thank you.

Thank you, Councilwoman Gray.

Councilwoman Hudson.

Thank you.

Uh through the chair, um good question.

It was mentioned um in uh one of our earlier presenters that um the rising cost of utility bills aren't simply data centers, but it's also the work on poles and wires.

Can you provide us with the amount that First Energy has spent on improving infrastructure over the past five years or six years since 2020?

Are you talking in the city of Cleveland?

Um, yeah, uh in the city of Cleveland, yes, in the city of Cleveland.

Right now it could not, but I'm sure we're gonna be able to do that.

If you saw something provide us, yes, and um through the chair, um councilwoman, something to keep in mind, the three-year rate plan again at the distribution portion of your bill, distribution only that 2.6 percent.

If you look historically at your the the increase in bills has really been on the generation component, which is on average has gone up 63%.

The generation, yes.

So, and I would not here to hear the government that spoke earlier about those costs increased.

So, really there's probably some inaccuracy in that statement that was presented.

So when you look at what we're asking for and you look at what your generation component of the bill is.

No, I appreciate that, um, which is also why I'd like to see how much has been spent in the last um you know, five years in the city of Cleveland.

Also, you know, I'm on my street, um, it could be often every other house that you might have uh first energy versus Cleveland Public Power.

Um my neighbor actually has Cleveland Public Power where we have first energy.

Um and so obviously, you know, when we have bad storms, we both houses experience the same storms.

And um, you know, we might ex both experience a power outage.

However, my neighbor with Cleveland Public Power will get his power back on within a matter of hours.

And since August of 2024, in my house, we have had two week-long power outages with uh and you know, and again, I have first energy as my provider.

Um something is going on that is and it's not simply attributable to uh the strength in storms because like I said, my neighbor experienced the same storms as I did, but he had his power restored in a matter of hours.

Where at my house, we were out for a week, two times in the past year and a half.

I I don't know if you have children, but a week-long power outage with children is a really long time.

And thank God for my neighbor with CPP, because he let us run an extension cord from our refrigerator to his house, which allowed us to stay in our home and we didn't have to, you know go someplace else, stay in a hotel.

Um it it sucked, quite frankly, to be in that home in the summertime with no air conditioning, nothing for the kids to do.

Um, but we were able to do it because we could we could eat.

Um I we've also experienced brownouts during the winter for the first time ever.

Um I don't know why.

I have to assume it's related to the infrastructure of uh first energy.

Um it is it is concerning when on the you know one of the coldest days of the year um you suddenly have a brownout.

Um this is something that I've never experienced, and we experienced it twice this past winter.

You know, um it makes me nervous for my appliances.

We've experienced surges where we've um you know lost appliances, we've had to file um claims with our insurance company because of the damage that's been done to you know refrigerators, dehumidifiers, different appliances.

Um so now I know to shut off the breaker when the power goes out, and um, because I don't want that ever to happen again.

But these power outages with first energy specifically have gotten longer and they've gotten more frequent to the point where you know, every time the wind blows, and I'm not exaggerating, you know, the storm cards start to gather.

My son says, you know, mom, are we gonna lose power?

I I can't, I can't say no, don't worry about it.

We're we're not gonna lose power every time it storms.

Because sure enough, pretty much every time it storms, even if it's not bad, we lose power.

And it doesn't take one or two hours to get it back on.

It takes 10, 12 hours, or sometimes, like I said, as long as a week.

Um that's all.

I think your answer should be if you're having that problem like that that maybe you should convert to Cleveland Public Power, right?

Is that your answer?

That's that's not my answer.

Okay.

This has been such a problem that we are honestly looking into you know, alternative sources of energy, um, solar panels with battery backup, maybe a gas powered generator.

This is not a way to live.

Um if I do not feel confident that uh first energy can provide us uh reliable power.

So is there an ask or are you guys just here to present?

No, just to present.

Uh we will make sure that this fact sheet is out to all members of council and the administration.

Okay.

Um the most important part is the QR code, so that way if uh people want to see what's in the plan, and you can even go out there and see what the average bill impact will look like.

Uh it's here.

All right.

All right.

Well, before I adjourn this utilities committee meeting, I just want to end it with um your revenue and your profit in 2025, 15.1 billion dollars in revenue.

Let me repeat that.

15.1 billion dollars in revenue and one point two billion dollars in profit.

You could literally give every one of your Cleveland customers more than a hundred thousand dollars and not and it not be a drop in the bucket for one year's profit for you guys.

With that being said, we'll adjourn this utilities committee meeting.

Thank you very much.

Do you have anything else to say?

You're good.

Thank you, Chair.

Thank you.