Thank you so much.

We have a quorum, which means we're now in second.

In session, excuse me, I want to bring up the BZA.

Director Bribron, come on down.

Mr.

Brubron, is that for us?

Those documents or no.

Okay, good.

Tell you what this is.

Uh oh.

He's got props.

He's got props.

All right.

Mr.

Burrown, we do, and uh, Madam Clerk, if you can know that we've been joined by Pro Tim Young.

Thank you much.

Uh Director Rip Brown, the floor is yours, sir.

Uh good morning, council members.

Happy 313 day.

It is a pleasure to be before you once again.

I believe this is uh year 13 for me.

The irony of it.

I love it.

Um I'm here today to present my uh BZA budget presentation for fiscal year 2026-2027.

This presentation provides a concise overview of the BZA's budget, operational needs, and strategic priorities for the upcoming fiscal year.

Next slide, please.

This slide that you see is the desktop computer that is in the office of the Board of Zoning Appeals at the front desk, so people, citizens, anybody can come and look up a BZA case.

There is no reason for anybody to say that they don't have access to our files because the computer is now on the desk and being uploaded with all of our files.

We're working our way backwards, but right now I think we're up to about 2200.

So that should not be an issue going forward in terms of people having access to the files.

So the BZA mission comes directly from the fiscal year 2027-2030 financial plan, emphasizing public interests, ordinance integrity, and equitable land use decisions.

The BZA's mission and role is that we are a quasi judicial body that administers the Detroit zoning ordinance.

We hear appeals, variances, and exceptions, and land use modifications.

We ensure decisions are upheld according to the spirit and intent of the ordinance, and we support neighborhood and commercial stabilization.

The fiscal year budget reflects a leaner staffing model and a significant decline in projected revenues compared to 2026.

One thing that you have in your packet, council members, is uh this graph, and this breaks down the BZA cases by district.

Uh it is not based on the fiscal year, it's based on January to December.

Um we're working on getting that adjusted to the fiscal year.

So you will see in 2023 how many cases we had, how many we had in 2024, and the significant drop in 2025 and 2026 is continuing that that trend.

So our budget snapshot, our total expenditures are $57,100.

Our total revenues are $53,040.

Net text tax costs are $5,000 $118,768, and we have three full-time positions.

The personnel and benefit accounts for 71% of the total budget.

Contractual services primarily are court reporting remains a major cost driver.

Salaries and wages around $308,000, employee benefits, about $98,000.

Professional and contractual services, 141,000, operating supplies, 4,500 operating services, 18,250.

The reduction from four full-time to three full-time increases the workload on remaining staff and impacts our processing capacity.

So this position that we have been trying to fill is now frozen.

Revenue from sales and charges for services dropped by more than half in fiscal year 2027, which is why I wanted you to see that chart.

Fiscal year 2026, the adopted revenues 112 proposed for 2027, 53,000.

Forecast for 2028, 54,000, forecast for 2029, 55,000, and forecast for 2030, 56,000.

Now these are based on cases that come into the BZA, and you know our workload is based on development in the city, and I'll speak on that closer to the end of my presentation.

Expenditures rise steadily over the four-year period, driven by primarily by personnel and contractual services, and you see those uh numbers that I just spoke about.

Our strategic priorities aligned with effective governance, economic equity, and efficient operations.

We want to improve zoning and land use training.

All of our members are a part of the National League of Cities and the State Board, and they attended the training.

Two members attended training last year in 2025.

We provide technical assistance at application intake, and I will note that we are now also in the Excel system.

So all of us are now, and that's the system that where people apply for a building permit, and it comes through XLA through BC and cases come to us.

At one time we were doing around 100 buildings and safety cases completed annually.

Our ability to do that tremendously.

A loss of the one full-time employer.

We have high contractual service costs, and I'm going to speak to that in a second.

We want to continue to modernize our technology.

I'm a fan.

More transparent hearings.

Improved public access to zoning information.

Again, the computer is allowing us to move in that direction, and stronger legal defensibility.

So there are four overarching issues that have been plaguing the border zoning appeals for the last year or so.

Community appeals, cost of transcripts, court reporter cost, and circuit court.

Let me begin with uh community appeals, because the ordinance state law dictates that uh the BZA cannot proceed with evaluating the merits of a community appeal until it first determines whether the appellant is an agreed person.

In 2002, a court decision and the Supreme Court set forth three criteria that the appellant must meet to satisfy the agreed person's standard.

I've included that standard in your package so that you can see what it is a community person has to overcome to be heard on a case that may be impacting their community.

I present this to you so that you have an understanding as to when people have community appeals and come before you complaining about the process, it's state law.

Number two, the cost of transcripts.

This box represents one transcript, a community appeal.

Most of our cases are like this.

However, and the average trans average transcript is around 300 pages.

This is about 300 pages.

But the ordinance, section 52-66, speaks that for each matter or case heard, the border zoning appeals shall cause a record of its proceedings to be prepared.

We do Zoom and I do backup recording.

We make sure that those transcripts are available through our court reporter based on the request.

It is not the responsibility of the border zoning or the city to produce a transcript.

If someone is suing the board, it is their responsibility to obtain that transcript.

On that note, you have in your packet a memo that I sent to procurement requesting that the contract be reviewed.

You have a copy of that contract in your package also.

Council members, we do recognize that it's an expensive contract.

However, this was bid, and it was bid out properly, and the court reporter that has the contract, one to be it.

The court reporter, and so the last one is circuit court.

We currently have three cases and a fourth one in circuit court.

Those are all community appeals.

Those are all community appeals.

It does not cost the community any money to file a case with BZA.

You you all have graciously allowed that to continue.

However, the cost, the staff time, border zoning, buildings and safety, planning and development, law department.

All that time goes into preparing these transcripts and packages for circuit court.

I will end by saying the trouble that I have is that the BZA is the last step in the process, and it bothers me when I got 50 people standing up in front of the board screaming and hollering about something that they don't like, and it's the last step in the process.

We gotta do better.

Thank you.

Thank you.

We will now go to questions from colleagues, but before we do that, we'd like to note that we've been joined by member waters as well as member McCampbell, ma'am clerk.

Thank you so much.

Uh pro Tim Young.

Uh always good to see you, sir.

I'm glad you're a fan of AI.

I will submit my questions and my recommendations about what you should implement AI that you would write it.

So, but other than that, good to see you, sir.

Thank you.

Mr.

President.

Thank you.

Member McCampbell.

Thank you, Mr.

President, and good morning.

Apologies for my tardiness.

It's good to see you all.

Um, I was listening listening in, and I just have a few questions as you as you brought up the uh contract with the court reporter, and we've heard quite a bit about the costs around that.

Uh, do you know how much it would be to bring, and I know you talked about the high contractual amount of services that the BZA has.

How much would it be to bring that in-house to have a court report or to um or is that just a contractual service?

Excellent question.

Um we are required to have a a court reporter.

Um of the conversations I've been having with the law department is to let's look at all uh departments and boards that are using court reporters, or there's required to use a court reporter, and we kind of have one contract that we all kind of use this this contracting service.

So that's that's an excellent approach.

Um that's something that we are looking into and possibly may happen.

Uh, but I I would contend that we make sure that we're dealing with those that must have a court reporter.

Everybody is not required.

Absolutely.

And I I'll have a motion on that.

The second question is as you talked about the BZA being the last step in that process.

I mean, in your view, if you are open to what would you what changes would you would you think would be favorable to see so that we're not getting to less uh step with the community appeals and such.

The ordinance allows for people to have a pre-hearing or a pre-review of their proposal with BC.

I don't think anybody uses that.

It's in the ordinance that you can go down to B seed and ask them to review this and they will look at it and give you an opinion before you submit.

Uh I also contend that uh people should read their mail.

Uh most of us send notices about hearings, uh things that go on in your neighborhood.

Uh just like anybody else, when I get something that comes from the city, I'm suspicious.

Uh but I I encourage us to open that mail because oftentimes uh for the BZA, if you're within 300 feet, that that's gonna be letting you know what's going on in in your community.

Uh but I I think that uh we we can use the ordinance and help people understand what the ordinance allows them to do and use that process.

Thank you for that.

And you know, we had this conversation yesterday with the land bank on various notifications and such, and um, as you talked about the use of technology, um, and they talked about a text messages system or such in that way.

Uh so definitely would love to continue the conversation around how do we go forth around other means of communication so folks can get that notice as well.

Uh so thank you for that.

Um, Mr.

Chair, I have a motion to put into executive session, the conversation around court reporting and across um departments or across government.

I can I'll have more wording, but that's the motion.

Okay.

That's for the closing resolution, sir.

Yes, sir.

All right.

Colleagues, there's a motion on the floor.

Any objections?

See none, that action shall be taken.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Member Benson.

Thank you.

Mr.

Reron, thank you for being here today.

Just a couple questions.

Um we focused on over the past the technical assistance or technical assistance and training for the BZA members.

Want them to be on top of new laws, what's going on, new technology, new trends in the space of land use law.

How are we doing with getting all of our BZA members trained?

And do you have the budget to support that?

We all of our members are members of the Michigan Association of Planning.

We had two members that participated in last year's training.

We have training two times a year where we bring in professionals for MAP and other entities, and we also do in-house training.

With the loss of uh the 112,000 dollars, we will have to look and see what kind of impact that will have.

We do know that I think the memberships for MAP are paid up for two years, so at least the memberships, but um I I do believe we will be impacted in terms of people being able to continue participating in those statewide trainings.

Negative.

Can you modify that?

Less less or uh the 112 dollars was uh just a uh taken, so I need to look and see what kind of impact that that is um uh maybe my my finance people uh may know a little bit more on that, but uh I I I contend that uh I would continue to focus on training being central, a central part of what we do in the BZA, and that uh whatever we do, we will ensure that that training and them participating in the state conferences continues.

Okay, and then looking at your mayor proposed budget, see a reduction in total revenues and a reduction in total expenditures, including the loss of one FTE.

Let's talk about a more than half 50 percent reduction in your revenues, and you said earlier that's tied to development projects.

Is that your forecast?

Um that you're well the the chart that you that you have in your packet in 2023, we had 66 cases, 2024, we had 93.

2025, 42.

We're we're we're only right now in this fiscal year at around maybe 3035.

So we're trending down in terms of cases, and that's where our revenue comes from.

So I'm I'm just looking at the numbers based on the cases we've had over the last couple of years, and it's going down.

So that that's where that revenue projection comes from.

Okay, uh, Mr.

Chair, motion to place the BZA budget into executive session.

Colleagues, there's a motion to place the entire BZA budget into executive session.

Any objections?

See none, that action shall be taken.

Thank you.

Thank you so much, Mr.

Chair, and good morning, everyone.

Um you might have answered this when I was um away from um uh my chair, but the board of zoning appeals must provide transcript of BZA proceedings, is that correct?

Shall shall provide a let me read that exactly what it says.

The for each case or matter, the board of zoning appeals shall cause a record of its proceedings to be prepared, and I stated that we have a court reporter, we do Zoom, and I do a backup recording.

So shell is must.

Shall means that we we if a transcript is requested, we can provide that.

Okay, so shell is must.

That means you must provide a transcript of your BZA proceedings.

Um what are the costs for a BZA transcript?

Six dollars and twenty-five cents per page, and this this councilwoman is an average community appeal.

Okay, 300 pages plus that would be six times three hundred, yes.

Through the chair, how did you arrive at the cost of six dollars?

It was bid, it was bid through procurement.

We we only provided the information that was needed.

They went through the process.

Um I I do have a memo to procurement asking us to review this contract through the chair.

Through the chair, I think we should, because $6 is a lot for a page of information.

And I did see your desktop.

I don't it didn't look like it's ever been used, but I did see the desktop.

That's the computer on the front desk for people to look up cases.

Yeah, I was here when you when you introduced it.

I saw the picture.

Do people through the chair, do people use that?

Do they come in?

Well, the this is the first time I'm actually announcing it publicly, because I think last year we talked about trying to do that.

So I I expect that people hearing this will now be lining up to come down and use that information.

Thank you.

You might you might have to have more than one computer.

That's wonderful.

And then my last question is what are the costs to a person average on average taking an appeal from the BZA to the circuit court?

They have 21 days after I may be off a little bit.

And the the cost for circuit court?

I I don't know what the cost for circuit court is.

Yeah.

I was told it one by one of my constituents who have appeared before your um the bone of a uh board of a board of um zoning appeals that it was three thousand dollars to go to circuit court.

Uh I know, I know you can't, but and then um after the minutes, how soon after when can someone expect to get the minutes after a meeting since it's 21 days before you can file or file for an appeal at the circuit court level?

How many days does one wait to get the minutes after the meeting where the judgment was made or the decision was made at the zoning level?

Um at the next board meeting when the board approves the minutes.

So we meet uh three times a month.

Um at the next meeting, they are available that day.

But like in a couple weeks after the meeting where the decision was well we meet we meet Monday, last Monday's minutes will be approved and they'll be ready the following Monday.

No, they'd be ready that day.

That's you don't have to wait.

Right.

It's all electronic.

I mean, we you know, once once the board approves it, okay.

You know, we could hit the button and send it if somebody requests it.

Okay, thank you.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Uh Director Ray Brown, I mean, uh you indicated there's a excuse me, a reduction in the cases that you have coming before you while we have development that is not stopped at all.

Um some would say that uh reduction in BZA cases is a good thing.

I know that it certainly affects your budget and your revenues clearly.

How would you uh frame the reduction of BZA cases uh outside of just your department, but just the the ecosystem itself, and what do you attribute that uh reduction to it?

I may have missed it and I apologize if so.

No, that that's an excellent question.

Uh development is happening in Detroit.

I think that people are complying with the ordinance.

You know, they they they're doing their homework and and somehow complying with the ordinance with no need to come before the BZA.

And that's a good thing.

Uh the uh the other thing could be that development may not be happening as uh vibrantly as we think it is.

Um I I indicated um earlier in the year uh to uh Mr.

Todd, Marcel Todd, this trend that I saw, and I told him it's either people complying with the ordinance or development is down.

I don't know which is probably a combination of both, but I will say that uh I I think that because of the Excel system, everybody has to go through that.

Now you cannot do a paper application.

You can't call me and ask me to submit an application.

That that technology is also making it uh uh possible for people to submit better applications because you cannot go through the Excel system without having completed every section for your proposal.

Uh again, uh maybe development uh improved technology or things are just slowing down.

Uh yeah, cannabis and um auto-related.

Okay, and I know for a fact those have slowed down.

And auto-related too, because there was a moratorium.

Right.

You know, we're we're getting more development types, you know, housing developments with retail on the first floor.

A lot of people doing things to their homes.

You know, we're getting a lot of those types of uh so that that's that's the same.

So I'm just trying to try to get like a percentage.

I mean, I know those again were the line should do with that looking at and trying to really put a lens, uh uh a more sharper lens on uh what's what we're seeing here.

Do we see that because of those two major um uh areas where you would get the most most of your cases now decreasing uh tremendously?

How much of that plays a role in your overall reduction of cases?

Uh I I think we're probably gonna see a leveling off at around 50 to 60 cases a year.

Um that that's what it's it's trending at.

Um that I think in when you saw that big jump in 2024, that was a lot of marijuana cases.

You know, so I I think we're beginning to average out in terms of development in the city because we're we're seeing more consistent development and not marijuana and uh auto-related.

Um I think we're gonna level off at about 50 to 60 average, and and those numbers that were projected by the mayor's office is consistent with that 50 to 60 number.

Gotcha.

And I and I know at you know, the regardless of where you go, there's various laws that change uh city by city, municipality by municipality.

But have you looked at your counterparts in other major cities to see how we land um in comparison with cases with costs, with manpower, um, and et cetera.

And if you have, can you talk to us a little bit about what you found?

Um I have not done a comparison, but I do know that the the Detroit has more development than most other areas in in the state, number one.

Uh number two, we're one of the few that has its own border zoning.

Uh most other cities, uh, the city council or the planning department or some person does it because and they meet you know uh three or four times a year because they just don't have that much.

I was trained in in Port Huron, and uh they met, you know, maybe six times a year, and and they only had a couple of cases.

Uh when I did a study around um fee increases, I did notice that uh cities like Chicago and Cleveland, uh they are similar to us in terms of their development.

Uh there it was pretty consistent uh uh um around cities same size as Detroit.

Gotcha.

Thank you for that.

And thanks for the work that you do in the time that you have done it uh within the city of Detroit, all of your uh capacities that you've worked in within this building here.

Um we uh I I want to say I appreciate the assistance that you provide and the guidance in uh our upcoming nominee that's coming your coming the way of the uh internal operations for uh the BZA.

Um not a question for me, but for the body, how many vacancies uh do you currently have uh at this moment?

One.

All right, it's coming your way.

All right, coming your way.

Uh I I will say that in 2026, four members' terms will expire.

So right after budget, I'm gonna start again like I do every year.

Uh I'll say now, I'll let you know you have you have the sheet.

There's that's that second sheet and speaks to um who's uh they are sorry, yeah.

So you see on the terms ending.

So you can look on there and see your district, and you can see whose terms are ending December 26th.

So after budget, I'm gonna contact each of you whose terms are ending and ask you do you want to reappoint?

Director Ribround, what what page is that in your booklet?

It's the behind this page.

And if you if you don't have it, it looks a little different.

Uh if you don't have it, oh you know, but it it didn't print.

How did mine print and yours didn't?

Okay, I will make sure that you get this.

As a matter of fact, I'll send bring it back up so that you have that, but because this is important, it lets you know who your current member is and when their term ends.

I I can also ask if you can email it, that would help as well.

Okay, thank you so much.

Uh member Miller.

Good morning, Mr.

Ribron.

Thanks for joining us today.

I am a fan of the BCA, I always have been.

I just wanted to say this is one reason why I created this.

The district five, I go around and knock on doors when there's important cases going on.

I it's called the District 5 community awareness notice.

Because I came in and running on this premise alone community engagement.

So I just I did one over on Lawrence when there was a big blockade of stuff being done in the neighborhood, our team walked that neighborhood on both sides of the streets because everybody said they never get the notice.

So what we won't do in district five is call my office and bombard us saying we did not know, we did not hear, and we did not receive.

Because I am sending you a notice with the date times that you should be there.

I will say um I had one, this one's coming up with the BZA because a lot of our residents in some of the communities are elderly and they're still trying to maintain those neighborhoods.

So for you, I will say you do make sure they documented and uh post it, and you do come out and check.

But if the requirement is 300 feet, sometimes in historical districts, the houses require a thousand feet because the one house may be 300 feet.

So therefore, the next neighbors may not even get the notice.

So for my for my area of the city, I am adamant about making sure they know.

So if you get a lot of people, it's because we're double down on our community to get involved.

So because I don't want to utilize any other source in the city to say that this is what district five residents said, because I've been a product of what we did not say.

A lot of that stuff don't be true.

So therefore, because I have experience, I can say that we need some extra notices.

So I appreciate what you're doing with the BZA.

I want to say thank you for bringing the computer for the Excel.

And the computer looks really old and outdated.

I just gotta say that.

I'm looking like this is new because it update can they use it?

Can they use it?

Is it gonna be really thinking savvy?

It works.

It works.

Um, so that's a new addition to the BZA.

Yes, yeah, we worked with IT to make sure that with the hours that's residents can come use that.

Uh we're there, the office is staffed uh nine to four.

Or nine to four.

Nine to four every day.

Someone is there.

Um, if if no one is there, uh my cell phone number is on the door, and and you know, we'll arrange, but somebody's there all the time.

Do you come out to the communities and speak?

Yes.

All right.

I I enjoy coming out and and talking to people.

I will be the first one on your list.

I am I've already told them make sure you get on the calendar for April.

Also, because our residents need to know the zoning changes.

You are the last line of defense.

And it's sad that I mean you hold uh some people's livelihood in your hand it at that BZA.

I mean, oftentimes, even with the BC, I I I one time was notified that there was no appeal process.

I was told there was no appeals process, and we neglected to file.

And so when we sued, it was 22,000.

Every committee don't have 22,000 to sue.

And then it we got the transcripts, uh 975 pages one week before the hearing.

So the process is so flawed that when it comes to you, it's it's like do or die.

So I would like to sit with you to see how we can expand your budget because there's an issue going on with this last result.

And I wish BC was sitting right here beside you because you're picking up all the things that leave from BC, and then they come to you as a result.

A lot of people just think if you're putting in the application, you have the right to appeal a denial, but the community, a lot of them do not know that they can come, and our community are starting to be vigilant to see what's in their neighborhood.

They're asking me, any new development coming?

So I'm telling them, this is coming to your neighbor.

You have a right to know if SAT is gonna be transmitted environmentally in your area.

And so while we are apt to, well, we must fill our commercial corridors.

We must bring in small businesses to generate the revenue in the city, but we gotta be cognizant of those of our neighbors and our residents.

So the biggest problem is that six dollars and twenty-five cents.

So the person the procurement department contracted, they set that price.

It was bid and in the bid of the total contract.

And in the bid of the total contract, there were other things that were asked of that the per page cost has risen to the top.

But in the totality of the contract, I think there were two or three others that be it, they won the bid.

And the contract is attached to your your package so you can see that.

If you cannot afford that, again, it makes it unfair.

So how can we work with so we just need to actually uh member Campbell probably bringing in house your right?

Because I just cannot imagine six dollars and twenty-five cents.

We had we had that's one community box, right?

How many pages is that?

Would you say about over 300?

300 pages.

So somebody's coming to your neighborhood.

How about I was at a development where they were parking on it?

Was a uh community under the bottom, residents on top, they had parking lot going back to the neighborhood.

So the fence stopped right under someone's bedroom window.

So I'm out there and I'm looking like so.

They gotta hear you start your car every day.

In the winter time when the car is idling to warm up, they gotta hear this car every day.

It's less whatever the footage was, it was I would say maybe the length of this desk to where the car could actually pull up and line across the back of these people's houses sideways and park for their residents.

I mean, for that new apartment complex.

So that means the per person that lives in that house, and it was approved.

It was approved, Mr.

Ribron.

So don't be dismayed when people come to you for help because they need the help because our department, some of them are not hearing.

For one, the people don't show up.

I'm gonna say it's fall on both sides.

You gotta show up.

So here I'm saying here, show up.

I can help you if you show up.

If you show up, I'm there to support you if it is reasonable.

So I just wanted to find out how I can get you to come out and um can you give me uh a list of the new zoning, uh, what is it called?

The zoning changes for the BCA changes because I can disperse them out.

I know you have court cases.

I believe my community have you in court and you've been in court for a while, probably your three cases probably all come from district five.

But I I know because district five is one of the most sought-out places.

Everybody wants to develop a five, and our residents, because our structure is so old, we don't have the parking, and we're trying to make it work.

We got to get both sides to come together and have a give or take.

So I would like to get the new zoning changes so I can let my residents know this is what the process is, and maybe um is there classes that people can take?

Because I like to see people have BC BC classes, they need to know how that process works.

Uh Michigan State University, um, through the extension program, uh has a land use section where they provide uh training videos.

Uh I I that's where I would start.

Also, the Michigan Association of Planning, but that that's a membership organization, so that's a little different.

Extension uh by virtue of who they are, who it would be the first place that I would start.

Okay.

Well, Miss Rum, thank you.

I know that's a hard job.

It seems like um I see you said the numbers are coming down, so maybe things are are turning around.

Are you okay?

Okay, I don't want to make sure.

Hold on, I'm sorry.

Okay.

So I was just thank you, um, Mr.

Barbara.

I appreciate it.

Thank you.

All right, thank you.

Um Member Johnson, sorry.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Good morning, Director Ribron.

Morning.

Uh always great to see you, and certainly do appreciate the work that you all do.

Um I as a former BZA member am not happy that the uh position, the the resources for the appeals specialist position uh has been removed.

Um, that the person in the position always helped me tremendously when I was on the board to make sure I understood what was before me.

Um, and so hopefully the board members are comfortable in their role.

I know training is being provided, but I also feel like there's some additional support for the board members that may be needed.

Um, I would certainly encourage you to um maybe have a survey of the board members and and how they're feeling with the information that they have because I think it takes some time to understand zoning and to really um be impactful in the position as a board member.

Just wanted to set that there.

Um I did hear what you said um when you talked about being the last entity that people can appeal to for a development project.

Um and so what I heard was do people go through other hearings, other public hearings as often as they come to BZA.

Um I know that's not the case.

I think it has all to do with outreach.

Um so can you talk a little more about the outreach that you all do?

I recall when I was on the board of my neighborhood association that a neighborhood association could sign up to get emails so they see the agenda.

So it's not just the 300 feet of folks who receive it.

Community organizations could sign up.

You know, an individual could sign up to get your agenda to know what's on the agenda.

The departments don't do that.

So talk a little bit more, and I may have already answered the question.

But if if there's additional outreach that you all do, um, do the board members share with community groups that are in their district.

Can you talk a little bit more about that?

We we do send to community organizations.

Uh we we have a a running list where people ask to be added to that list to get every uh BZA docket.

Uh we we uh posting the legal news uh because that's the required uh legal news is the paper that we use, though uh I didn't start reading the legal news until I started work with the board of zoning, so that tells you uh what's what that's doing.

We uh it was mentioned that we it's required that the petitioner post a sign on where the development is is occurring.

Uh I and the information that we send to the developer, we strongly encourage them to reach out to the community and let them know that you're doing development in your area.

That's not required.

The ordinance doesn't even speak to that, but I I say you don't want to get to your hearing and have 25 people standing up there talking about we don't want this, and you tell the board uh it's the first time I've heard this.

You don't want to do that.

So I and that that's come from that comes from being on the uh the directive for so many years and seeing people coming unprepared.

You know, so uh we we provide uh information, the approval criteria three weeks in advance to everybody.

The even I even the community appellants.

I even give them their information in advance so everybody can come to the hearing prepare, everybody.

Uh the board members uh I do not believe uh speak to their community groups.

That that is something that I I will encourage.

Uh I do encourage them to uh speak to you all, whoever their representatives are, and to be a part of uh district meetings that you all have that that they they could be there.

Um I I try to be there, um, but uh since they're represented by you, you know, I would encourage them to be there.

Um so that that's how we get the word out.

Thank you for that.

And um I will encourage the district four appointee to engage a little bit more with us.

Um our office started to shift the way we do community outreach as it relates to development projects because of Chick-fil-A.

So Chick-fil-A didn't come before City Council.

Chick-fil-A went through ZC, Chick-fil-A went through BZA, and everybody looked at me and said, Why did you approve that?

I didn't.

So then I really started to realize people don't understand the processes that take place.

Now there may be an instance where development project comes before city council if they're buying city land if they need rezoning and you know a variety of things, but not everything comes before city council.

And so we have now started to scour everybody's list for district four projects that may not come before us and let the community know.

There is a site plan uh review or you know, whatever hearing is going before BC so they can interject there where they whether they support it, don't support it or indifferent, if they just want to know what's happening in their community.

So that is not only when it gets to BZA that the community responds.

So um our office is doing that as well just to make sure people can be involved, and and if they want to encourage some changes, some shifts in the project before it goes through the approval process, they have that ability, they at least have the knowledge of it, however, they want to move forward.

Um but we are and I'd like to make a motion to um add to executive session just community outreach in general um for various departments.

So that is my motion, Mr.

Chair.

Uh there's a motion on the floor with uh discussion.

You said for various departments.

Are you gonna mention that with other departments moving forward?

Or we want to talk about just BZA at this moment.

So I really wanted to wrap it up into the community outreach ordinance.

Um that may impact the work BZA does, BC does, and maybe a couple of other departments, but I can certainly bring it up when those departments are before us as well.

Okay, colleagues, there's a motion on the floor.

Any objections?

See none, that action shall be taken.

And my second question, Director Ribron.

So, okay, you showed the computer.

Um does the computer allow a resident or anyone to put a USB into the computer to save any documentation that they can pull up on the computer.

We will provide the USB.

We're not gonna let anybody put anything in in these computers for safety reasons, but we have USB drives.

We we we can email it.

Um so we we will provide that information if requested.

Uh it's probably simplest just to email it to them though, because we have the same files on our computers.

Well, sometimes if if if it's 300 pages, it'd be challenging to the the this is an anomaly.

Most most cases are we've seen them, but they're not that big, and this is a court case, you know.

Um they they probably would not be able to request all of this because we're in court, you know.

So some information is is not that available.

Um but we will provide it uh either emailing it or we have the jump drives to be able to do that.

Thank you.

And based on your interaction with the courts, would the court allow them to utilize whatever it is being provided on that USB in court, or would they does the court require them to get a copy of the transcript?

They require a paper transcript.

The judges want to wanna read a paper transcript.

They don't want to read anything electronically.

This is what I've been has been indicated to me.

So I just want to make sure I understand what you're saying, but the information that you provide on the USB, which can be printed out, would that be permissible?

They have to get a the legal court transcript.

Yeah, uh copy certified by the court reporter.

So anything they get from us would not be certified by a court reporter.

So that's and and we don't provide the transcripts.

Right.

This this does not include the transcript.

This is the the transcript is the record of the the court report of the hearing that the court reporter would provides.

All right.

Um so there is the the challenge that the residents keep raising with the six dollars and seventy-five cents a page.

Correct.

Yes.

All right, thank you.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Thank you.

Member Waters.

Thank you.

Good morning.

Good morning.

Um, I just want to could you state for the community information.

Um you reported through in terms of change chain of command.

Could you tell them that?

I report to the city council.

Okay.

I want to make sure the community understood that.

Yeah, I report to the city council.

All right.

You all are my bosses.

I want to I want to take my colleague from the third district of putting the entire budget into executive session.

Um, so I just want to ask you um about attendance, you know, participants.

You you're it's easier for you to uh get a quorum now, right?

Yes.

And tell me about some of those those people who are habitual has you know absent.

I want to know who they are.

Absentedism is not a problem.

Is that hardiness is a problem.

Tardiness.

Yes.

Okay.

And um I'm I'm reluctant to call names.

I will let you know.

I I will let you know in a memo.

I will I can I can send it the attendance.

Uh we we get people showing up.

Corma's not a problem, but tardiness.

Yeah.

Tardiness is is and it's one or two people that that just show up late all the time.

Just just before you end or something, huh?

Well, they they they they get there, we start at nine, they get there nine forty-five, ten o'clock.

Uh-huh.

Okay.

Huh.

Okay.

All right.

I I look forward to uh having that information because those are the kinds of things that that I certainly want to look at across the board uh in terms of folks that are not doing what they're supposed to do, people who are absent, extremely tardy.

I mean, you can't get things done like that.

Right.

So one of the things uh council members that I try to do when your appointee is up is to give you that information.

Okay.

Like you know, your your person, this is I kind of like to know beforehand if I could.

Okay.

I I I can I can provide that.

That's that's not a problem.

Okay, then well, well, thank you so much.

That's all uh that I have.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Thank you.

Uh Director Rembrandt, any uh well, colleagues, any additional before we wrap up, member Johnson.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Um I'd like to invite an member uh Miller to join me on the um executive session item, the community outreach review.

Okay, colleagues, any objection for joinage in that particular situation on that motion.

See none, that action shall be taken.

Director Rearbon, any final thoughts?

Um I I would like to uh thank my board members, Robert Thomas, who's the chair who is leaving.

Uh his last meeting was Monday.

Scott Bowman, Robert Weed, uh Aletheia Carr, who is new, Maya Campbell, who is new, Jerry Watson, Byron Osburn, Bob Roberts, and Anthony Sherman.

But I would most definitely like to lift up the two people that hold me up in the office, Tamina Davison, uh who knows more about this city than everybody in here.

I think I'm looking at you because you know how valuable to Tamini is.

Uh yesterday in the office, we got a call at four o'clock from from someone who had a DAH ticket, paid it to border zoning because they saw appeals and now they're trying to get their money back.

$600.

I feel sorry for him because he's gonna be a while.

Uh my other staff person, April Peri Foy, who is our uh inspector, she takes all the pictures out there in the field.

Uh they do tremendous work, you know, and always safe behind a halfway decent men are strong black women.

So thank you for this opportunity to present.

Um I got a few more years to go, and um I'm not going anywhere.

Thank you, Mr.

Mr.

Chair.

Thank you so much.

Um, Member Callaway.

Um, thank you, Mr.

Chair.

I just want to ask you.

Um you you made the comment that someone is owed $600 and they're not gonna get it, or it's gonna be why would you say that?

Well, because they paid it to it was a DAH ticket, uh-huh.

They paid it to the board of zoning appeals.

They're trying to we're gonna give them their money back, but it's gotta go back through the process, and it's just cumbersome.

What's the process, sir?

Because if that were me, I would want my money back right away, and I wouldn't want to know that what the process is.

If they accidentally paid the money to you and you got it, well we we don't money doesn't come to us.

Okay, it goes to Treasury.

It goes right.

So we have to we have to find it, send it to whomever is supposed to process it, right?

And then they they get that money back.

So we don't we don't handle any cash.

Go to the city's treasury.

I I'm not to me this gonna I'm I was just speaking to the fact that you know how she's able to handle things that are outside of the scope of BZA.

Okay, and through the chair to you, I'm just concerned about the citizen who paid the six hundred dollars, and it was the citizen's error, perhaps it went to the BZA and it should have gone over here.

I would want that uh issue to be expedited.

So that individual can't that's a lot of money.

Just to say, you know, hold the breath, you might get it back, something like that.

That's not the that's not what I would want to tell a constituent.

I would do everything I could to get that money back.

$600 is a lot of money.

So if there's anything that I can do, I don't know where that individual lives or whose district.

Maybe you can contact the council person who um, if that individual lives in the district, and maybe they can work with the Treasury department to expedite it.

It just may be a phone call from one of us.

But $600 is a lot of money, and they may have to pay it again to the right um, the right recipient, and still be out.

That's $1,200.

So please let me help if I can to see if we can get that money back um expeditiously.

Okay, sir.

Thank you so much.

Please do.

I would help.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Thank you.

I've got this gentleman here who wants to provide the last comment during this particular hearing as we transition to the next.

Yes, sir.

Uh and this is just a uh What's your name for the record?

Andre Blair, um, agency CFO.

This is just a follow-up to Councilmember Callaway's concern.

So we've seen this a few times where um uh citizens are going to pay tickets, it could be blight.

We've had one where it was something that was supposed to be paid to BC, it got credited to DAH, and then we've had the reversal through the divdet machines.

What you can do um is have the young lady in your office reach out to me because I'm also the agency CFO for DAH with the ticket, and what we can do is so they don't have to go through the whole refund and repayment process.

We can try to just get it moved over and credited to the proper account with that ticket.

Miss Davidson is watching this and she she got that instruction.

Thank you.

See that?

And just try to make the process a little bit a little bit easier and smoother.

Appreciate it.

I mean, so so uh thank you for that, Member Callaway.

And it sounded like it happened to Member Miller as well.

So how do we without prolonging this?

And because we're gonna talk about this afterwards, because we're about to transition to the next committee uh or the next uh hearing, but it shouldn't take a hearing for this to happen.

You know, uh there should be a conversation that could be held uh offline and just like that.

I mean, all it was was just a couple of words that were said and boom.

Um so let's talk all offline and figure this out uh as we move forward so we don't have to do this again.

But thank you for uh your willingness to make that uh happen uh expeditiously.

All right, thank you so much.

Thank you, Brown.

Appreciate you.

All right, thank you for all your work you do.

Next up, we have the public lighting department, public lighting authority.

Come on down.