To call to order our public health and safety standing committee for today, Monday, May 18th, 2026.

May the clerk please call the roll.

Yes, good morning.

Councilmember Gabriela Santiago Romero.

Good morning, present.

Councilmember Denzel and Ton McCampbell.

Present.

Councilmember Mary Waters.

Madam Chair, we have quorum.

Thank you, Madam Clerk.

Given a quorum, we'll get into the agenda for today.

We have received our minutes from our last session.

If there's a motion to approve, motion to approve.

Hearing no objections, our minutes will be approved from our last session.

For chair remarks, uh we have a pretty standard agenda for today.

And we can get right into our agenda by going into general public comments for public comments this morning.

If you are in person and you would like to make general public comment, please raise your hand now.

We'll make sure that you jot down your name and that we get your information.

If you are online and you would like to make public comments, please raise your hands virtually.

And I've just been notified that you can't hear committee on Zoom.

We might still be able to hear committee on the channel, but uh for IT.

If anyone can help us, we got it now.

All right, thank you all so much.

So again, if you are online and you would like to make public comments, I will cut off public comments at 10.07.

So two minutes to raise hands.

And we'll begin with the folks that we have here in person.

Everyone will have two minutes for general public comment this morning.

And we will begin with the again with the folks that we have here in person.

I see Brother Cunningham, if you wouldn't mind going over to the mic, taking a seat.

We'll begin with Brother Cunningham.

We'll begin with the folks that we have here in person.

Mr.

Hanshu, you're also here for general public comment.

You can go ahead and take a seat next to Brother Cunningham.

And Brother Cunningham, the time is on the clock.

So whenever you're ready, you can go ahead and begin.

Last week I wasted my time on the internet.

They couldn't hear, but glad today everything is working.

Just being persistent.

313 444 9114 313 4449114.

313 4449114.

That number was made so you can remember it.

Um so I give out bus tickets at the bus stops and uh just some things from last week.

I have to limit them to 15 a day or 20 a day so I can so it can be stretched and also add about 300 to it, 300 worth to it from donations.

And so I had somebody cuss me out.

So this is what it is.

I've had somebody key my car.

It is what it is.

Um while helping folks, things happen sometimes.

And um, sometimes it's a dangerous situation.

So I stay prayed up.

I'm asking you to stay prayed up.

Um I need to pray for all those in authority, everyone in this room, especially chief.

And when he was deputy mayor, I was homeless for over 10 years, and he assisted me getting housing.

So I'll I'll never ever forget that.

After all those years of advocacy.

He steps in and uh councilman pro Tim Young's office.

Um so I'm asking everyone to pray.

Uh I've been praying periodically in the Holy Spirit and unknown tongues, and people scratch their head, laugh.

That's cool.

Just pray.

And please call my name in the atmosphere, my mom's show Marie Lyons and myself.

And for the last 20 seconds, that's exactly what I'm gonna do.

It is in the shandakuyadabasandara Masandara Masha.

So thank you.

Last call for public comments.

If you are online, please raise your hands now.

I will be cutting off public comments.

If you are here in person, public comments is now cut off.

We will hear now from Mr.

Handshu.

I see your hand, sir.

You can go ahead and uh speak for general public comment as well.

Mr.

Foster, are you here for public comments?

Okay.

So we've got everyone here in person.

Accounted for.

Mr.

Hanshi, whenever you're ready.

Make sure your microphone is on.

Oh, thank you.

Sorry, Mr.

Hanshu.

One second.

We're gonna make sure that we can hear you.

There you go.

Okay, is this better?

Yes.

Thank you so much.

Um today I'm not representing either of the two organizations that I'm usually representing.

I'm speaking on my own behalf.

Um I came to ask you to not pass out the contract for shot spotter.

I am not opposed to law enforcement.

I work with law enforcement frequently, as any citizen of Detroit really needs to do.

Uh however, uh I feel this is a uh technology that has been proven to not work yet.

Most cities that have used it have not renewed it.

Uh it has major problems in terms of uh the big brother uh possibilities that it permits.

It's a microphone.

So today, maybe it's only we're told, I find it hard to believe that it only pays attention to a very narrow frequency response of firearms.

It's a microphone.

It can pay attention to anything, any sound that comes within its microphone range.

And um, I think it has huge uh police state uses that frighten me.

In addition, I want to say that the big problem with the police isn't the money they get every year, they get more.

The problem is that the job isn't being done.

I went into my building on Saturday night between eight and nine o'clock on Saturday night, and a drug dealer was out there slinging.

He was out there all last summer slinging.

We went to the police community meetings, we had the community officers to our tenants.

Anyway, I'd like the job done with our commands.

Thank you.

Thank you, Mr.

Hanshu.

I will now turn it over to Mr.

Clay, followed by I believe Mo and Diego.

So we've got Mr.

Clay will have you go next, and then I invite okay.

Thank you.

There you go.

Thank you.

Can you hear me?

Yes, Mr.

Clay, whenever you're ready.

All right, good morning.

Uh, my name is Richard Clay.

Um, and I uh am here this morning uh to personally encourage you uh not to pass out the contract for Shot Spotter also.

Um Shot Spotter is uh basically uh a contract for a wasteful technology.

Um there's so much that council and the new mayor is doing right now that is good, that is uh uh things that the people have wanted, uh the people of Detroit.

And yet there's so many other things that the people of Detroit need money to be spent on that we just don't have time for wasteful, hopeful projects, especially those that could easily be used and turned against us uh to spy for these billionaires.

Um we just don't need this.

Um so many times already people are calling the police when they hear shots in the community and they're not coming.

Um why do we need something like this to just say if it all it says is that there are shots being fired?

The people of Detroit know this.

They don't want it, we don't want it.

If it was such a revolutionary and helpful tool, we will see it out in all of the our surrounding white suburban cities.

We don't see it.

We don't want it here, we don't want our tax money used simply to turn it around and spy on us.

We need these funds in much more important and productive places.

Please vote no on it.

And to the people of Detroit, if it passes out, then you know we gotta build a movement to get rid of it and all of these other spy technologies and all of the data centers that are coming.

Our funding has to be productive.

And we have to make it productive if our political representatives cannot find it within themselves to do so.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Mo followed by Alejandro.

Good morning, madam chair.

Um also uh here to speak on the sound thinking uh contract.

So I first want to read uh a quote about this technology from an associated press report uh that occurred over a number of years is quote AP's investigation found the system can miss live gunfire right under its microphones or misclassify sounds of fireworks or cars backfiring as gunshots.

Forensic reports prepared by Shot Spotter's employees have been used in court to improperly claim that a defendant shot at police or provide questionable counts of the number of shots allegedly fired by defendants.

Judges in a number of cases have thrown out the evidence.

The company's methods for identifying gunshots aren't always guided solely by the technology.

Shot spotter employees can and often do change the source of sounds picked up by its sensors after listening to audio recordings, introducing the possibility of human bias into the gunshot detection algorithm.

Employees can and do modify the location or number of shots fired at the uh at the request of police, according to court records.

In the past, city dispatchers or police themselves could also make these changes.

Um I just wanted to read that in to call into question some of the things that we might hear directly from uh from the company, which of course is trying to to make money from a contract from the city.

Shifting out to the costs, as we know that uh the city is in dire need of revenue, and during the budget process, several worthy items weren't funded due to our budgetary constraints.

Um, and uh, you know, with an increase in revenue uh that would come from the the uh declination of this contract.

We could see an increase in programs for mental health or youth activities, two things that are common sense and proven approaches to reduce gun violence.

Um I would invite a robust discussion on how two million dollars could be redeployed to help our city to help our CVI groups to help Chief Bettison uh reduce gun violence.

Um but I think due to the questionable efficacy of this product product, um this is just not a good use of of our city funds or city time.

Thank you so much, madam chair.

Thank you.

Alejandro?

Good morning.

Uh Alejandro Navarrete, uh resident of District 6.

Um, I think the what's interesting is is the overlap between those of us that are against and those of us that are for shot spotter, uh agree that DPD cannot prove causality.

DPD has struggled to actually prove direct causality between the shot spotter expansion and implementation and uh reductions in gun crime.

They've done this by other double dipping into statistics, uh claiming in uh taking credit for all of the reductions in gun crime and in the areas in which it's expanded, even though there are countless other uh uh community violence interventions and uh uh human services that are intervening and getting uh gun crime to go down.

Um they've also written trends back in the 2022 um expansion.

Uh gun crime was already in its way down across the city, for one, including in the areas in which two it would in which it was expanded in.

And in other precincts in which they've never seen shot spotter, we had a even sharper decline in gun crime.

So there's a double dipping and there's a writing trends, which proves that we're all agree.

DPD cannot prove that shot spotter is actually responsible for any reductions in gun crime.

They'll also say, well, it we don't that the efficacy is not measured in uh uh arrest, but in changing behavior.

I can't imagine anybody who's gonna who's about to pull out a gun is gonna pull out their phone, Google if they're within a shot spotter zone, and then decide to talk it out.

They want to take us into la la land.

I don't think we should be take taken for a ride along with the sorry.

Um and also want to point out that DPD is also shopping around for other services.

That's why they want the extension.

So we agree they can't prove the causality, and shot spotter's not effective, which is why they want to look for something else.

Because it is unpopular to begin with.

And in a in a time when we have all these budget cuts to other essential services, spending two million dollars on a service that we all agree is not helpful.

Um responsible.

Do not recommend thank you.

Thank you, Alejandro.

We will now hear from Mr.

Foster.

And then I believe that's everyone that we have here in person that was able to raise their hand before public comment was cut off.

And then we'll go into the folks that we have online.

Mr.

Foster.

Um, good morning, through the chair.

A couple of things.

I just like to first make it clear that I've always come down as a nonpartisan individual, which means that I just focus on issues here in our city.

I don't take sides, have biases or anything like that, one way or the other.

Everything I speak on is about policies that affect our city and our community.

That's it.

So I just want to say that our city is nonpartisan.

Our law enforcement have to be nonpartisan.

It's required across this country, aside from sheriffs who are elected.

But um, I want to speak about RICO real quick.

RICO can apply to fraternizations.

It can apply to any organizations that do not conduct themselves right or properly.

Right.

So I want to ask this question.

How many um are on that bus for unfinished business that I've been hearing about that are tax dollars that pay for through our law enforcement?

Unfinished business.

Everybody on the unfinished business represents an unsolved case or unreported case.

So if it's a busload of these people, then that may be why people are scenarios to keep the numbers down.

Right.

And so we have to be more transparent.

Uh, like Miss Victoria Camille over and Board of Commissioners, what she's been doing.

But I always want to bring to this board's attention.

Every time a major homicide occurred here, higher profile, right?

Yeah, former gang leaders come down to city council and make themselves presently unknown for whatever reason, making their little statements.

Well, you could check it yourself.

And so I have an issue with our security threat group.

I have an issue with oversight of these um these folks.

I have an issue with retaliation.

I have an issue with um invading people's privacy to promote um somebody's endorsement, but I could go on forever, but I like to speak on the side to redress these issues.

Okay, Mr.

Foster.

That's it for in person.

We'll turn it over now to the folks that we have virtually.

Thank you, everyone, for coming down.

Uh to the folks that we have online.

How many hands do we have raised and who do we have first?

Madam Chair, we have 15 hands raised, and our first caller is Jadante Smith.

Jedi, you're up next.

You have been made a panelist.

Good morning, Mabby Hurt.

Yes, good morning.

Good morning.

I want to say uh I do a poll shot spider as well.

Um, I want to say also, and I go to almost every single board of police commissioners meeting and I have heard no conclusive evidence in those meetings, and uh, there's even a commissioner Durr Woods who couldn't answer a simple question after hearing information.

He couldn't even relate information back to the audience correctly.

Uh so I think that there needs to be more help with teens uh with their takeovers and just giving them recreational opportunities and jobs uh and things to do within the city, and I'm gonna try to put my efforts towards doing some of that.

Also, uh I'm not gonna ever stop talking about Chronos Concrete and that downzoning process until we get that um brought before before council, and uh we get that five votes.

So I'm getting it down zoned.

Also, I'm requesting meetings with all of city council members, and I'm a bit disappointed in the response from Cole Mee Young's team and his office.

Uh, and I want to have someone from that office please send me the information on how you guys want the request to be made specifically on having a meeting.

I appreciate that.

Um, also the Maroon family who owns Cronos Concrete just settled a discrimination lawsuit for 5.5 million dollars because of their hiring process and specifically discrimination sexual discrimination uh against women.

Um still requesting a meeting, a meeting with the mayor on behalf of the Detroit Hand Travel Coalition about Chronos concrete and some of those issues.

Also, still talking about Nicole Curtis and four or five Winnie's Fantas Boulevard.

I spoke to Arthur Rushing last week.

I was told that the matter was referred to um the law department, so I'll be talking to Kyle Rad Mallet if he is he's willing to speak to me about it.

Um, because there is a substantial amount of blight in the city of Detroit, so we don't deserve to have millionaires have homes um in nice residential neighborhoods and not have to maintain their properties.

I think that's so unfair.

Um also there's an issue with the Wayne County treasurer.

Eric Shabri is allegedly picking and choosing who he um forecloses properties on, specifically people like the uh Dion Larkins, who owns multiple properties that are four to five to six to seven years, sometimes twelve years behind on property taxes, even vacant and they're not being foreclosed upon.

We need equal um punishment.

Thank you.

Who do we have next?

Our next caller is on our papa, Miss Carolyn Hughes.

Good morning.

You have been made a panelist, Miss Hughes.

If you can hear us, we cannot hear you.

You would just have to unmute yourself.

Oh, Miss Hughes, we still can't hear you.

We can add you to the bottom of the queue.

Unfortunately, we're going to have to move on to the next caller and come back to you, Miss Hughes.

Miss Conn, who do we have next?

Our next caller is you, Matter.

Miss Warwick.

Good morning.

Good morning.

Can you hear me?

Yes, we can.

Okay, thank you.

Number one, I also oppose Shot Spider.

Number two, may we please get clarity on whether people are allowed to use plywood to board up buildings or not.

The city does it.

The land bank uh land bank board member does it, but the land bank's telling people they can't do it.

Yet people in BC have already approved people having plywood on their windows, so we really need some clarity on it.

Number 5.12.

Uh, the DAH should dismiss all tickets if BC cannot prove that they properly serve someone.

That's the way you get them to do their job.

And yes, I think we should figure out a way when you're dealing with people who don't have a lot of means.

You hit them with the ticket.

If you really do we really want people to fix properties up, and if we do, you should let them use their money for that.

You might have a problem with this memo, which is a nice concept, but you might have a problem with the age discrimination.

5.9 pre-sale inspection reports.

That seems like the city's trying to grab money from people.

I mean, usually these matters are taken care of between the buyer and the seller in the first place.

So I'd like to know why the city feels the need to do this, and clearly they're going to be grabbing more money from people, and that's a bit problematic.

Um the item about post-traumatic prison disorder.

I think it should be changed to post-traumatic incarceration disorder.

Someone could have been in a lot of people don't know the difference between jail and prison, unfortunately.

Somebody could have been abused at a detention center as a pre-chailed detainee that causes them PTSD.

Like what happened to me when I got abused at the detention center and nobody seemed to care.

Um reached out to my elected officials, Mary Sheffield's office wouldn't do anything about it.

Stephanie Chang's office didn't do anything about it.

I mean, it's really sad.

You can't be abusing people in detention centers, and then everybody looks the other way.

I've asked the OIG to look into it, wouldn't look into it.

But again, we need clarity on the plywood, please.

Also, I think you should introduce an ordinance that if BC cannot prove that somebody was properly served, the ticket must be dismissed.

It shouldn't be people learn about it by getting notice.

Thank you, Miss Warwick.

Who do we have next?

Our next caller is phone number ending in 169.

Caller ending in 169.

You're up next.

Hello, can you guys hear me?

Yes, we can.

Great, great.

Um, bad unity, bad unity, bad unity.

It is easy to unite and hold little brother Cunningham down.

That is easy, but to take on harder challenges is hard.

Unity.

One John 3 17, but whoso have this world's good and see if his brother have need and shuts it up and shuts it up his own bowels of compassion from him.

How dwelleth the love of God in him?

The love of God is not in you.

The love of God is not in you.

The love of God is not in you.

Ask yourself, yes, you listening, ask yourself, look into the mirror and ask yourself if the love of God is in you.

Thank you for my honor.

Thank you.

Who do we have next?

Our next caller is Betty Verner.

Miss Varner, good morning uh good morning, madam chair to all within the sound of my voice.

I'm Betty A.

Barner, president of the Soda Els World Black Association here to share some information in regards to Wayne Metro.

Wayne Metro has a mobile unit.

They're calling it Wayne Metro on the go mobile unit.

They are looking for uh communities and neighborhoods to bring the services to the community.

If you would like the services uh in your community, they they have a um survey they would like you to fill out with uh locations and zip codes.

You would contact a Mr.

Mohammed Otman.

I don't know if I'm pronouncing the name correctly, but it's OTH M A N.

Again, O T H M A N at 31389799, 313 3889799.

That's the main number for Wayne Metro, and you would ask to speak to him.

He is the community engagement team coordinator.

Also, his email is community outreach at Wayne Metro.org.

Community outreach at WayneMetro.org.

You can also call that number 313-388-979 as a city resident and just ask for the services.

Ask to speak to someone in regards to regards to the different programs and services that they offer.

We're still in need of money to redevelop and revitalize our corridor.

We are so appreciative for all this help that we have received, but we need more.

Thank you for this time.

Thank you, Ms.

Varner.

And if the clerk can please note, I did just uh review member Waters' notice of absence, so her absence is excused.

Clerk will note.

Thank you.

Who do we have next?

Our next caller is Blackbag.

Mr.

Ruben Crowley, good morning.

You're up next.

Hey, what's up, uh Gabriella?

Do you hear echo in the background?

No, sir, but we can hear you.

Oh, that's good.

I can hear y'all on the other's phone.

I'm on a legendary Detroiter too.

Now, I'm gonna tell you, and all the citizens, taxpayers, and residents of the city of Detroit.

You're a liar.

But I also want to emphasize, extra emphasize that I support shot spotter because when somebody is got a cap bust in them, and they laying down on the ground, and maybe ain't nobody around.

That shot spotter can't alert to that person that's in need of it.

And it's a small amount of money come out amount of money compared to the money that's been stolen, misappropriated, like Gabriella.

You got a million dollar a year office budget, but you're a liar about election fraud, the findings on the allegations of LCT ballot voter fraud that you said you read on May the 9th, 2024, and I got it on April the 25th, 2024, and you didn't have it.

I called your office on the 20th of May, and I gave it to Coleman's mom and Fred Durhaw and that whole committee.

But it boils down to the alumni naughty.

That's the University of Michigan graduates that are in key positions.

Yours included key financial positions all throughout the state of Michigan, the county of Wayne, and the city of Detroit, led by the craftsman, crafty mic.

I know what I'm talking about.

Thank you, Mr.

Crowley.

And as you mentioned, you are calling in with different accounts.

We will uh give you your floor with the one accounts and uh not call on the rest, just so you know, and for the record.

Who do we have next?

Our next caller is Molly.

Good morning, council members.

My name is Molly Menning, and I work at Wayne Law as a postgrad fellow researching police practices.

And I believe the city of Detroit should not renew its contract with ShotSpotter, nor should it invest in any gunshot detection technology.

When the city invests in gunshot detection technology, police are brought out to a scene to question people who may not have had anything to do with the supposed gunfire, but are now subject to questioning and heightened emotions from interactions with law enforcement.

All of this for very little payoff, as studies have shown that ShotSpotter does not get officers to the scene faster, does not lead to more homicide arrests, and does not decrease non-fatal shootings.

Gunshot detection technology, like shot spotter, is reactive and has not demonstrated a deterrent effect.

When the city invests money into community violence interventions, however, gun violence can be addressed proactively.

Detroiters are given the opportunity to help themselves instead of paying millions of dollars to a private company who is also capable of surveilling them.

And CVI costs less than ShotSpotter.

And the programs have actually been linked to crime reduction and lower homicide rates in the city.

Community violence intervention in Detroit has demonstrated its effectiveness at addressing the problem of gun violence.

So council members, I urge you to not renew the shot spotter contract or pursue any gunshot detection technology, and instead invest more money into community into community to address violence before it occurs.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Who do we have next?

Our next caller is William M.

Davis.

Mr.

Davis, good morning.

Good morning.

Can I be heard?

Yes.

Okay, I'd like to start off by saying that I am not anti-police.

In fact, my degrees are in law enforcement and criminal justice administration and not at seriously thought about.

And I put in to be a Detroit police officer at one time, but then I heard there's about to lay people off.

This is way back when, before both of y'all was born.

But you know, my thing as it relates to spot shot or the gunshot detector, you know, this is like over $2 million for nine additional months.

You know, there are a lot of other things we could be doing with that kind of money.

Uh we could, you know, like at least 90 homes could be um home repair.

You know, there's a whole lot of more things we should be doing with that money, especially in that it's not as effective as they present it to be.

And you have to be outside, and you have to be somewhat near a detectant, you know, a mic in order for them to know.

Uh, most recently, you know, and all the most I would say 95% of the people who appear before the Detroit Board of Police Commissioners are anti-gunshot, you know, you know, the gunshot detector, gunshot, you know, they they think it's you know, it's not good.

And most recently we had uh some people appear before the Board of Police Commissioners, that you know, the the young white lady uh talked about how the police treated her one way, and a next door neighbor, a black gentleman treated him very, very poorly.

You know, like say, and that's that's an excuse to put on the treat black people and young people and brown people differently than white people.

You know, so I don't think we should have continue a practice that discriminates against people.

And y'all have a good day.

Thank you, Mr.

Davis.

You as well.

Who do we have next?

Our next caller is Maya Sapori.

Maya, if you can hear us, you're up next.

Excuse me.

Good morning, counsel.

Can everyone hear me?

Yes, good morning.

Hello, my name is Mai.

I am a member of the Detroit Anti-War Committee.

I'm here today to voice my concern over the shot spotter contract.

I just want to echo the many other community members who have come forward today and urges council to end the contract with ShotSpotter.

Uh, though this technology is meant to keep us safer and reduce gun violence in the city.

The numerous questions about the efficacy, accuracy, potential racial bias, and privacy concerns are not worth the millions of dollars that this contract is worth.

Uh, as the renewal date comes up, I strongly urge this council to not renew and instead redirect that money towards Detroit's many much more effective and much more sound uh uh CBI programs.

I can yield the rest of my time.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Who do we have next?

Our next caller is Gwendolyn Howard.

Gwendolyn Howard, if you can hear us.

Good morning.

I think that um what I'm calling about to satsfire.

I think that there should be more information because I don't think that the um the project itself, it started out with a small number, then it's a huge number, and the surveillance part of it is just over overshadowing and is taking away your privacy.

Um, I don't I think that there are some more projects that the money could be best used and served as, but as far as the um shots fire contract, I don't think that it should be renewed.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Who do we have next?

Our next caller is Jacob Smith.

Jacob Smith, if you can hear us, you have two minutes.

All right.

Good morning.

Uh my name is Jacob Smith.

Um District 5 resident, and I am here also today to speak against the renewal of the Shot Spider contract.

Um, you know, outside of the questions of surveillance, which you know, I I think by themselves are very dire.

Um, you know, we we shouldn't have more surveillance in our communities.

I don't think we need that.

Um, but even outside of that, um, it doesn't work, right?

You know, I I think we all want to have like safe neighborhoods.

We all don't want to see people uh, you know, getting shot, right?

But at the end of the day, you know, the uh shot spotter uh all available data um implies that it's not effective.

Uh police response times in Detroit.

I think are about 14 minutes for a 911 call for shots fired.

Uh ShotSpotter, it's over 30.

Um, I think it was maybe what only 12% of ShotSpotter uh calls resulted in uh any kind of arrest at all.

Um and on top of that, even you know, I think that somebody earlier's uh thing about uh well, what if somebody got shot and you know uh shot spotter calls a cops to your location, they might help you.

That doesn't happen in practice.

Uh only one percent of shot spotter alerts resulted in somebody being put into an ambulance.

So uh I I think 2.5 million dollars is a lot to be left on the table.

Um, if we want to improve public safety, we should be putting it toward community violence interventions group and the shot stoppers program.

Um but there are plenty of other great things we could spend it on, you know, like our schools, like uh, you know, after school programs, rec centers, libraries.

Um yeah, that's it.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Who do we have next?

Our next caller is Alexandria Trombly.

Alexander.

Good morning.

Good morning.

Good morning.

Can you hear me okay?

Yes.

Okay, great.

Um, I am a trauma and addiction researcher here in Detroit, and I'm here today in the middle of a work day, like so many other people, giving their time to um to advocate that you not review renew the shot spotter contract.

You've heard statements from folks talking about how it does not work, about how there are proven solutions in community violence uh intervention programs.

We have many of those here in Detroit who could use support to support public safety because um not renewing surveillance technology does not mean that we don't care about public safety or that we don't want our neighborhoods to be safer.

It's simply the fact that we have proven interventions that cost less that um don't racially profile neighborhoods, which ShotSpotter openly admits to doing.

Um and and that frankly are not um contributing to uh genocide in Palestine and tested on civilians there in order to bomb them.

Um so I want to echo those concerns that other folks have raised today, and I'll yield the rest of my time.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Who do we have next?

And just for everyone listening, we're getting close to the end here for general public comments.

Our next caller is Danielle Sayan.

Hello, council, can you hear me?

Yes.

Okay.

Hello, everyone.

My name is Daniel said, alongside with all many other people who have spoken today.

Um, I'm against the renewal of shots um shot spotter.

Um, as everyone else has already said, we there is not there's very little evidence or and no evidence at all that shows that um shot spotter is actually um helpful in any case.

Um I believe that the um TPD has said has um claimed that the um shot spotter has decreased crime, but this is not even this is not true because even of all the arrests less than three were made through um less than three percent were made through uh shot spotter, and there's no evidence of what those arrests were even led to.

Um, as many others also said, it would be much more beneficial to the communities if there were of those two million dollars that is only for a nine-month uh extension was spent into communities into um CVI programs.

I mean, we just this year there's uh talks of four um schools in the uh Detroit are being closed because they don't have enough funding.

It's clear that there's a lot of um funding that could go into other stuff in the city, but um the city keeps choosing to spend more money on the police.

Um so I urge the city council to um and or to not renew uh shot spotter.

Thank you.

I yield the rest of my time.

Thank you.

Who do we have next?

Our last caller is Victoria Camille, and then we'll go back to owner Papa.

Thank you.

Police Commissioner, if you can hear us, you're up next.

Greetings, council members.

Can I be heard?

Yes, you can.

Good morning.

Good morning, thank you so much.

Um, and I'd like to give a special greetings as well to my own council member uh Denzel McCampbell.

Thank you for the amazing work you and your staff are doing in District 7.

Uh my name is Victoria Camille.

I'm the police commissioner elected from district seven, and I'm speaking here on my own behalf as a resident of Detroit, and I do not speak on behalf of the board.

Some of us are probably barely old enough to remember driving without GPS on our phones.

When you actually had to remember various streets and directions, and when there was traffic or construction, we had to use critical thinking skills to get where we were going.

I'm not opposed to all technology in general or technology and law enforcement.

I am, however, concerned that adoption of technology is happening so rapidly that we're not considering the broader impacts to our society by doing so.

Some of these automated uh technology subliminally reduce our ability to use critical thinking skills.

We've seen examples of police officers making errors because of instead of using critical thinking skills, they rely too much on the technology what the technology was telling them.

And we don't need officers on autopilot going into our neighborhoods on high alert from a technology that is so inaccurate.

In addition, we as community members don't need to be on autopilot either.

When we hear or see something in our communities, we need to care about it and we need to take action, not become desensitized and rely on automated technology to respond.

We need to build relationships with each other rather than hiding behind machines to solve our human problems.

There's a claim that ShotSpotter changes behavior.

Um is that true, or does it just send a message that to harm someone you need to use a quieter means to do so?

None of the data I've seen about SHOSPotter convinces me that it improves our society, and instead it makes us disconnected from each other.

I am asking you to reallocate those funds to boots on the ground resources for community violence intervention, relationship building, de-escalation training, and youth programming.

Thank you.

Thank you, Commissioner.

And we will now turn it back over to Ms.

Hughes.

If you can hear us, you have been made a panelist.

You would just have to unmute yourself.

Uh yes, thank you.

Good morning.

And through the chair, may I be heard?

Yes, good morning.

You've heard you've heard some very good reasons why shot spotter should not be um renewed.

Um we are surveillanced too much in this city.

Uh now it's it's been extended to flock cameras, and we see that this is leading to a totally surveillanced community.

Um people have to go back to how Shot Spotter got here.

It got here in an illegal way.

Gabe leaving leaving Leland did not this whole thing.

That nine million dollars could fill the holes that we have according to Duggan and the city.

Um we have no recreation center in the 7th district.

Um, and in spite of the amazing work, councilman.

Um that money could be spent for our youth.

We have many ways to spend nine million dollars.

We've squandered a great deal of it, and we don't want to spend any more of it on this project or this program.

And we would like for you to reduce the flock cameras that are being placed all over the city.

These things are surveilling us.

Now you want to go to data centers.

Um, I I agree with the last caller.

You are you are embracing technology that you don't know anything about.

And until we figure out the impact of these things, we should not be engaging in uh bringing them to our community.

I I know um Mr.

Davis mentioned the black and white issue.

This is a issue for all people in the city of Detroit.

It has nothing to do with black and white.

If he's if the police are treating a white person differently than a black person, that's a whole different problem.

But at any rate, I am against uh 6.5, and I'm also against uh 5.15.

Thank you.

Thank you, Ms.

Hughes.

I'm glad we were able to get you on for public comment this morning.

Thank you, everyone for calling in.

I will be without objection moving us to 6.5.

I see we have police here with us.

Want to respect your time as well.

Um if you wouldn't mind joining us, taking uh the stage here.

I believe there are some presentations that were shared.

So uh we can jump right in to have this discussion and more than anything, I think, just to learn how ShotSpotter has been used so far, why DPD is requesting the extension, and we'll get into some questions.

Um, if there's a motion to discuss, then 6.5.

Motion to discuss.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

And again, just for the record to allow DPD to set up uh 6.5.

This is contract number 600434.

This is amendment number one, utilizing 100% city funding.

This will be to provide an extension of time and an increase of funds for the subscription based gunshot technology.

Uh, this is for forensic analysis services.

The contractor here is Sound Thinking, also known as ShotSpotter.

They are in Formont, California.

Originally, this contract was to go through June of this year.

The extension is being requested for March, the end of March in 2027, March 31st, 2027, increasing the contract by 2,587,778.

Bringing this total contract for ShotSpotter at 9,58,788.

Again, this will be for police.

We are joined by DC Bliss by our chief.

Thank you for being here.

I'll turn it over to you both now.

Um will you have your presentation also shown on screen?

Okay, so you guys are all sets.

I'll turn it over to you whenever you're ready.

Make sure your microphones are on, and just introduce yourselves for the record and you can begin.

Hi, Todd Bettison, Chief of Police, and um glad to be here to the Council Member Santiago Romero Chair and to Councilmember McCampbell as well.

Thank you for having us here.

And I'll turn it over to Deputy Chief Mark Bliss, who will be running through a presentation, and we're here to answer any questions.

And I'll just say that um a lot of the information that data statistics to some of the callers spoke about.

Um, we do have accurate facts here, and you know, is for educational purposes, and we will continue to educate and update the community as well.

Thank you.

Good morning, honorable counsel.

Uh let me start by saying uh first, in regards to gunshot detection technology.

Uh, we're we're before you today because we're asking for that extension to March of uh 27.

Uh the reason why we want this extension is because we have an RFP that has already gone out on gunshot detection technology, and what we would like to do is we would like to take our time to go through to uh ask those those evaluation questions, um, do some testing um and uh look at the technology.

Uh originally when we got this type of gunshot detection technology, there was only one vendor.

Uh now there are several.

Uh, and we'd like to evaluate it, uh, but we'd also like to have the coverage, and that's why we're requesting this extension.

Um, I want to give an overview of the technology, what it does and what it does not do.

If you could please play the uh slide, please.

A gun is fired somewhere in your city.

So what happens now?

In the past, there was a slim chance the shooting would be reported to police at all.

Even when it was, it took precious time, and there was often confusion regarding the location of the shooting and other pertinent information.

At least that's how things work.

By utilizing advanced technology honed over two decades, we have automated the process.

We monitor gunfire activity 24-7.

The system detects, locates, and immediately alerts police of the gunshot.

So, how does it work?

It starts with acoustic sensors that are placed on buildings or street lamps throughout a neighborhood.

If a gun is fired anywhere in the area, multiple sensors detect and timestamp the sound.

The precise location of the gunshot is determined based on the amount of time it takes for the sound of the gunshot to travel to each individual sensor, effectively triangulating the sound.

The exact location of the detected gunshot is indicated by a dot on a map.

Once an alert is generated, it is immediately sent to our IRC or incident review center, where trained acoustic experts then analyze each incident in mere seconds, determining if the sound is gunfire.

Analysts receive extensive training on reviewing and classifying gunfire by distinguishing gunshots from other impulsive sounds that are not gunshots.

In addition, they're trained to append additional contextual information, such as multiple shooter alerts or full automatic weapons alerts that can prove to be essential tactical intelligence for law enforcement agencies responding to these crimes.

The entire transaction takes place in less than 60 seconds.

Police can immediately be dispatched to the scene.

Utilizing the gunfire audio clip and tactical information.

Officers can approach an exact location quickly and safely interview witnesses and collect key evidence at the crime scene.

Making it easy to find evidence and reducing risk for police officers.

Next slide, please.

Thank you.

Gunshot detection policies.

Technology is only as effective as a policy that we have that's controlling it.

And there's a couple things that I would like to kind of point out in regards to our policy and our layering of control on gunshot detection.

Uh and that is that there's a lot of false narratives out there.

Uh and I and our policy is to kind of uh eliminate those narratives.

First, no live audio recording.

Uh our members shall not be able to uh monitor live audio from acoustic sensors.

We don't get any audio before, we don't get any audio after.

We only get the audio from, in this case, shot spotter, uh, of the gunfire, the gun discharge.

And that access is only limited to confirmed gunshot incidents only.

So any other type of audio we never see.

We never get at all.

And we do not monitor any of the uh audio and any of the sensors.

That's all done through the vendor.

Secondly, is recorded audio reviewability.

We only review the audio that's sent to us if there's an active investigation.

So if there's not an investigation on the gunfire, we're not reviewing it whatsoever.

And that's two-layer protection.

Actually, it's actually the third layer, because the first layer comes right from our vendor shot spotter where they go through the incident review center, reviews the gunfire, uh, determines it is, sends it to us, and then our policy rules.

Next, gunshot detection is just an investigative tool.

And that is that it's a tool and it's not the only answer.

Uh, we have a lot of technology in the in the Detroit police department, but all of that is just an additional tool in the toolbox.

We can use it, we can choose to use it, we can choose not to use it.

In this case, it's more of the same.

It does not solve crime, it is a part of the puzzle.

It's a piece to solving crime.

Uh the alerts help us identify the gunfire incident, its location, and the time.

That's it.

The rest is up to regular police investigation.

And then finally, our arrest policy.

There's no arrest solely on gunshot alerts.

Members have to develop that probable cause.

Now, the gunshot alert gets us there, but that does not eliminate the investigation that we have to start and continue in order to find out what's going on at the scene.

Again, I go back to it's an investigative tool.

It's like anything else.

Next slide, please.

Gunshot detection technology and cover coverage area.

Uh, we started uh in 2021 uh with the eighth and the ninth precincts uh for uh rollout for gunshot detection technology.

Uh our largest area was the ninth precinct, uh, and we continually added areas in other precincts up until April of 2023.

Um how do we select these areas?

The coverage was based on hot spot areas of firearm-related calls, non-fatal shootings, ha homicides, and also shots fired.

Our total area is about 31 square miles, and we do not have it have coverage in the seventh and third precincts.

Our largest coverage area is 11 square miles in the ninth precinct, and our smallest area is in the fourth precinct, uh, which is 0.49 square miles.

Next slide, please.

So let's look at the change in shots fired calls in the gunshot detection coverage areas from 2022 versus 2025.

Overall, all gunshot detection coverage areas experience a decrease in shots fired calls.

And I want to point out a couple uh in the night precinct in District 4, almost 60 percent less calls for service uh for shots fired calls.

In District 7, 61.8 percent reduction.

District 2, 58.9 percent reduction.

Again, all the areas went down, including uh indicating that there's less sh less shots being fired, less gun violence, and yes, hopefully a change in behavior is occurring in all these areas.

Next slide, please.

Now let's specifically look at the look at the percent change in fatal and non-fatal shootings in 2022 versus 2025.

As you can see, there's a lot of green areas.

Uh again, in district four, sixty percent reduction in fatal and non-fatal shootings.

But I want to point out two where there was an increase.

First, there was a 200 percent increase uh right in uh district two.

Uh and the reason why you see such a big change is because uh we went from two shootings in 2022 to six in 2025.

Uh and that was one homicide and three nonfatal shootings.

Uh I want to also point out the 100 percent increase uh that's right there in District 1, I believe.

Uh and that was an increase in two shootings, one being a homicide and one being a non-fatal shooting.

So overall you see reductions and it and a change, um, but we're not finished yet uh looking at those those two areas.

DC.

Deputy Chief Bliss, before you um move on from that point, um, if you look at the ninth precinct, um, the fifth precinct, but the ninth precinct, the entire precinct is covered, um, we've seen the the most substantial um reduction when it comes to homicides.

For example, that's been a hot spot throughout my 30-year career in that particular area has been known as 4820 die, 4205 has been historically.

And one of the things that I've always advocated for, even when I was deputy mayor, is a and approach, not an OR approach.

So I came before this council then advocating for shot spotter expansion contract approval and was successfully able to get council to um approve that.

Also, we advocated for CVI as well.

And so being able to put the technology, also the wraparound services through community violence intervention in the same areas on those hot spots.

Um we don't have any C VI groups here today, but if they were, they would tell you that they support shot spotter as well, and so much so that's how they actually got their name of shot stoppers.

It was a playoff with shot spotter because shot spotter and shot stoppers, you have a prohibitive piece, but you also have a piece to identify individuals that are utilizing guns, firing them in the city of Detroit, and so it's indiscriminately.

If you fire a gun in the city of Detroit, we need to be able to identify exactly where you are, be able to collect the shell casings and be able to change that behavior.

And so it's a whole system that we do have, and in our areas, um and in particular that area where we have the largest square mile coverage is paid off.

Thus far in the ninth precinct this year, we've only had in in I shouldn't say only, but I've never seen our homicides lower.

We've had historical crime reductions, but in the ninth precinct, it's only been two homicides this entire year.

In the fifth precinct, we've had zero homicides at this point this year.

And so it's an AND approach utilizing people and technology, but that technology is also vital to the Detroit Police Department, and it's just an investigative two that we rely heavily on.

Please continue.

Thank you, sir.

Next slide, please.

And now I want to look at the percent change from 2023 to 2025 and gunshot detection alerts by precinct.

Uh that's when there is confirmed gunfire from shot spotter, uh, and it's sent to us.

If you can look from the second precinct all the way to the 12th, in each of our areas, uh, you can see from uh 2023, 2024 being the green, and 2025 being the yellow, uh, a reduction in these alerts, which means there's less gunfire occurring in those coverage areas.

Um I want to focus in on the ninth precinct because as uh Chief Bettison indicated, it's full coverage.

Uh you can see that in 2023 we had over 6,000 alerts.

Uh 24, we dropped to 4,000, and then in 2025, 3,000.

Again, so uh overall, if you're looking at the trend is going down, uh there's less gunshot alerts, there's less gun fire in those coverage areas.

And then let's look at the percent changes.

Uh in the second precinct, and I'll just go through a few, uh, reduction of 36 percent, uh, eighth precinct, reduction of forty-one point nine, ninth precinct, reduction of forty-five percent.

Uh 12th precinct, reduction of 32.9, total reduction, about 40 percent.

Again, uh less gunfire, less alerts, change in behavior.

We're not resulting to gun violence.

Next slide.

Now let's look at the investigative side of shot spotter.

Let's specifically look at firearm homicides in regards to gunshot detection and case closures.

In 2024, we had a 167 firearm homicides.

Out of all those, 65 had a shot spotter alert, which is about 38.9 percent.

Looking at those 65 cases, we were able to close 32 out of the 65, which is 49.2 percent.

2025, again, 135 firearm homicides.

60 cases, 43.1 percent had a shot spotter alert tied to it.

And then 26 out of those 60 were closed, 43.3 percent.

And then year to date, 32 of the uh firearm homicides, 13 had an alert, 40.6 percent, and we were able to close five out of those 13, which is 38.4 percent.

Again, I want to go back to the slide where I said it was an investigative tool.

It's a tool in the toolbox that helps us solve crime.

Next slide, please.

And let's talk about investigative follow-up.

Because when we get a firearm alert, it's very important that we get there, and it's very important that we do a very concise investigative follow-up.

And what does that give us?

Well, looking at from 2025 to 2026 year to date, our follow-ups, we ended up typing 250 search warrants, which were executed, taking 278 guns, which were seized off the street, and then 78 arrests.

And I want to kind of focus on the arrest.

We don't look at arrest as a metric, as if it's working or it's not working.

That's not how we view this.

Again, our chief is change in behavior, less violence, not more arrests.

But there's also another statistic on investigative follow-up that's not on here, but I definitely want to make sure that uh the honorable counsel does hear it.

Uh we also collect a lot of these casings uh at the scenes.

Uh in 2023, we collected over 16,000 casings.

2024, we collected 15,473.

And in 2025, 11,954.

As you can see, the pattern and then trend is going down.

Less gunfire.

And I just really wanted to jump in and highlight the fact that, but for shot spotter, being able to triangulate within square footage area of exactly where the gunfire happens, and when a gun is fired, and if it's a semi-automatic, whether it's a handgun or um an AR-15 or assault rifle, it ejects shell casings.

Those ejection casings have specific markings on them.

We go there, collect them at the scene, put them in to our NIBAN system, and that's able to give us a vital information as to gun linkage analysis, and that allows for us to be able to tell if this gun was used in a previous crime, regardless of where it was used even in the country, and we've been able to substantially close cases based off of that information, and also when I say cases non fatal shootings, homicides, and just in general when that gun is fired.

Next slide, please.

And let's talk about getting help because time is of the essence when there's a gunfire.

Uh we're looking at gunshot detection alerts and the average response time.

And this is the time from the gunshot alert, which is confirmed gunfire to our officers arriving on scene.

In 2024, it was eight minutes and eight seconds.

In 2025, we improved upon that.

Six minutes and 49 seconds.

That's an average improvement of 1.19, 1 minute and 19 seconds.

Year to date.

Next slide, please.

And I think this is the most important one.

This slide right here.

And that's the gunshot detection alerts without 9-1-1 calls.

And this is for non-fatal shootings.

In 2024, we had 139 non-fatal shootings with an alert.

Out of those 139, 17 of those alerts did not have a 911 call that was received.

That came strictly from Shot Spotter that said there is confirmed gunfire.

You need to get there.

And in 2024, it was 12.2%.

In 2025, 151 total nonfatal shootings with an alert.

But 37 alerts had no 911 calls it received.

37 times there was gunfire, but no one called it in.

24.5%.

In year to date in 2026, so far we've had 21 total non fatal shootings with an alert.

But five of those, there was no 911 call received.

That's 23.8%.

Again, that's people not calling, but us still responding to make sure if there's medical uh aid that's needed that we're there.

Next slide.

Now let's look at some success stories.

Uh the first one I want to talk about is out of the 11th precinct.

It was a non-fatal shooting.

17,000 block of church.

Um the gunshot alert came out, multiple rounds were detected.

Uh there was uh casings on the sidewalk consistent with the alert.

Our officers responded, dispatched on the alert, two minutes and eleven seconds.

What's important about this is there was no 911 call received, and we still responded within two minutes, 11 seconds.

We were able to get vehicle evidence, recover a firearm, get ballistic evidence, and also uh eventually have an arrest uh for the subject.

Next slide.

Success story out of the second precinct.

This is a current active investigation.

Multiple rounds were detected, casings consistent with the alert location.

Our officers were dispatched on the alert.

We responded two minutes and 14 seconds.

Again, no 911 call was received.

Ballistic evidence was collected, firearm recovered, and the and a victim was identified.

Uh in this case, the victim uh took themselves to the hospital, but we were able to uh look at this and be able to process the scene and make the connection based upon the alert.

Next slide, please.

Now we're in the ninth precinct, another non-fatal shooting.

In this case, there was sixty-six rounds that were detected fired.

Our officers got there in three minutes and seventeen seconds.

We were dispatched on that alert.

66 rounds.

The 911 call came in five minutes and 49 seconds after our officers had already arrived on the scene.

Five minutes and 49 seconds after.

So we were already there.

And that was 66 rounds.

Again, we had we were able to look at ballistic evidence.

Uh we were able eventually to have a uh person arrested on this.

But I want to go back to 66 rounds.

Our officers got the alert.

The call came in five minutes after we were already on scene.

Uh this one is out of the 12th precinct.

It's an act of investigation.

I just want to say that there are multiple rounds where were detected.

Um and the call came in four minutes and three seconds after the gunshot alert.

But what I'd like to show is if you can do the next slide, it's going to show the body warm camera of the officers responding.

If you could please play the video.

The officers turn it on.

And I want you to listen specifically to the dispatcher.

Shotter came up.

Be careful, be careful.

Oh yeah, I see.

There is Detroit Walk on the Island.

Well, you saw that.

Oh my god, I just want to make it.

I don't know.

Well, you start at your leg?

Oh my god, I'm wrong.

I'm sure you should sit down.

Sit off.

Yeah, Chelsea.

Right after me.

Your armor good.

You can sound good even now.

And taken care of.

Uh but I want to go back to the dispatch.

These officers are hearing the alert.

They're knowing that this is real gunfire and they're responding appropriately.

Next slide.

Thank you.

So now I want to reverse course.

Because we talked about that gunshot detection will validate a location, will tell us uh if there was gunfire.

It'll uh also help us out to determine if there really was gunfire there, because what we're able to do with this technology is eliminate uh the stories that we get from individuals uh that claim that they were shot in the city of Detroit.

And thanks to this technology, we're able to eliminate uh the location and the city of Detroit.

Uh so the first one, the victim reported at the 14,000 block of Myers Road that they were shot uh using the technology.

There was no detection reported at the location.

But we determined that the actual location was in Waterford Township, not the city of Detroit.

See, this individual it was determined lied on his initial statement uh and was in a home invasion case in Waterford Township.

Now without this technology, we would have been stuck with this shooting.

We would have been told this is still an open case.

Another shooting in the city of Detroit that didn't occur.

Next slide.

Before you go into it, just we we see that often where um and it helps us actually get to the bottom of actually what happens where an individual may be involved in some type of criminal activity and they're shot, and rather than tell exactly where that scene is, they'll try to give or mislead the police as to another location, which happened in this particular case as well.

But if they say it happened at um a certain intersection and it's within a shot spotter boundary, we're able to determine that no shots were fired at that particular time, and we're able to ask more appropriate type questions to determine where in fact it had happened.

Um it could be a situation and we see this often times where we're given one location, but the actual shot spotter alerted us to shots fire in another area.

It could be five blocks over, it could be a mile over, but going there, we're able to determine that that is the actual scene.

And so as far as being the investigative lead, helping us be able to close our cases, determining the actual truth of it.

It's been an invaluable to our officers and just really honing in on the fact too with our officers are trained.

We have what we call shot spotter cars where we have officers that are um on patrol, that's what they do.

They wait for the shot spotter alert so that they're getting there fast within that two to three minutes, and they're some of the bravest of the brave because as the shots are coming out, they're getting right there to that location.

Um, if you were to talk to any of our officers that work those particular units in our precinct, they would tell you that it's one of the most valuable tools that the Detroit Police Department has.

And um, I just want to say that they're some of the bravest of the brave, really um have a lot of admiration for what they do each and every day.

Continue, Mark.

Thank you, sir.

Uh the next case uh we had something similar uh where the uh victim reported a shooting at the intersection of uh seven mile and Kelly Road.

Um but there was an absence of uh gunshot detection uh activity there at the time and it prompted further investigation.

Uh it was determined that it actually occurred in Hufton Lake, about 150 miles away from Detroit at a house party with friends.

But if you have an argument and you get shot, it it makes sense that you were shot in Detroit.

Because that's that's the story.

But in this case, we were able to eliminate that and place it right where it belonged at Hufton Lake.

And then finally, uh we had one at the 15,000 block of Madeline Street.

Uh but again, no with our gunshot technology, we were able to eliminate that location.

Uh and uh what we found uh through the investigation and also through other investigative techniques.

Again, shot spotter is just a tool.

Uh we were able to use a cell phone warrant and found that the shooting actually incurred in East Point and not in Detroit.

So those three cases alone using the technology eliminates the city of Detroit.

Those are three shootings that aren't ours.

Next slide.

Any questions?

Thank you, DC.

Uh yes, I I do have um many, and this is really important information uh for us to have, so thank you.

Um first I'm gonna start with questions regarding the contract itself, less about the technology.

Uh but previously we approved a contract, it was seven million for four years.

Uh this is uh again, the ask is two million for nine months.

I'm just wondering if someone can help me make sense of that math.

Uh please.

It's my understanding that that's for the full coverage.

Originally there were two separate contracts for ShotSpotter.

There was the original, I believe the eighth and ninth, and then there was the expansion.

Uh, this is for the for the uh for all of it together for that extra nine months.

Understood.

So when I was first told about this contract, I was told it was six months, not an extension of space.

So the maps as they are for two years, for two million.

Six months, two million map as it is.

So now this is nine months, two million, an extension of the of the map of ShotSpotter.

No, it's it's not gonna be an expansion.

It's the map as is.

Okay.

So just wanted to make that point of clarification.

So then what do you mean by extension or expansion?

Uh it's just the extension of time.

Of time.

Yes.

It's not the area of the coverage.

Okay, thank you.

And if I could add this additional information, the extension will allow us to, because when shot spotter first came out, they were the only gun detection technology on the market.

And so now there are numerous other companies that offer gunshot detection technology, and as a way to be prudent, um, we want to put it out for RFP.

Um, but we don't want to lose the coverage area and the benefits that we have.

We we believe that this technology definitely is beneficial, it saves lives.

I've never seen a point in time when our non-fatal shooting closure rate was as high as it is.

It's in the 60 percent, hovers at 70 percent.

Um typically throughout the nation, non-fatal shootings, they're very, very hard to solve.

You have uncooperative witnesses, they're in the 35 percentile area, and so this is the highest I've seen it is allowing us to detect, hold individuals accountable, give family members justice for homicides and non-fatal shootings.

So we don't want to see a lapse when it comes to that coverage, but we want to be responsible when it comes to taxpayer dollars as well.

So put it out for our RP, see what companies bid on it in hopes of being able to get um lower cost.

I I guess I'm still confused.

Why two million for nine months?

The math does not make any sense.

Why is it costing us so much money when the contract for more time cost us roughly just um you know, double that?

This is double the time for $2 million.

So that's what doesn't make sense to me is just the contract itself, the time and the funding based on what it cost before.

Um so that's a question.

If we need to go back and look at the numbers, really what I'm asking for is why does it cost us much for this amount of time?

Because the time and the money does not make any sense if you look at it.

So that's a question that we can go back to.

Um there are others.

Um so and that's just regarding the contract itself.

Um wondering when have any of the shots water alerts resulted in any EMS calls?

Yes, they they do result in EMS calls.

Um police are there first, and so as police arrive at the scene within that two, three, four minutes, um, if an individual is injured, then we're on the radio and we're notifying um that we need EMS when we're finding a victim there.

Okay.

And then I know there was I know there's a lot of support for this because of um people not calling into 911, and that makes it difficult for the new to response.

But the percentages that were shared, um, I understand they can be frustrating.

They were pretty low.

Is this an average?

If it wasn't for shots, like is this just I guess in on on average, how many times do things happen?

Would you not be able to know that?

I am assuming then you're able to track because you have a gunshot or alert, so then you're able to know, excuse me, when someone doesn't call you for that.

But I'm just wondering in general, how often do people not call in 911?

Would you happen to know that information?

Because I'm trying to figure out what we're comparing this to.

Uh so it is also, well, first it's important to point out that this is that those percentages are only for about 38 square miles.

So it's not the entire city of Detroit, because we we don't have complete coverage.

So uh I mean, I'm sure our numbers would probably increase it the more coverage we have.

Uh, but what we have now, you know, we're looking at 24, 25 percent.

Uh so I mean that is pretty high just to the coverage.

Again, it's about what we're comparing this to that's helpful for us to understand, because I'm trying to figure this out with you.

I'm trying to figure out how we lower crime and what this all looks like and how this actually helps.

Um, and and again, what we are comparing this to, we're trying to change behavior.

I am as well.

Um it comes to audio recording.

So is it safe to say DPD is not listening to audio recording unless there is an active investigation, but the vendor is, correct?

The DPD only gets the firearm discharge.

That's the only audio we get.

Um as the the first video showed where you saw the the wave of the audio, we only get that snippet.

Uh if there was audio in the beginning, we never hear it.

If there's audio after, we never hear that.

We only get the gunfire.

Now I'm not sure if the vendor, what audio the vendor gets, but whatever they listen to, they cut out everything but the gunfire, and that's what is sent to DPD.

So for those that want to ensure DPD does not overstep, over surveil, we have the policies that do that, but this technology though does still listen in, collect information, collect the audio, whether it's shared with you or not, that's important to Detroiters, but I think it's also important to them whether or not audio recording is being recorded, which this vendor will be.

It's about whether or not they share it with you, and it's that's only going to be shared with you during an investigation.

Just the audio of the gunfire.

Okay.

And Councilmember Satiago Romero, I have actually heard um I've been sent the audio recordings, and the only thing you hear is an example of what was displayed during the video clip is gunfire.

Okay.

Well, what was shared with you from the vendor?

Yes.

Okay.

Understood.

I have a number of questions.

I will hand it over to my colleague if you have any others, because I uh don't want to hog the mic.

Uh vice chair.

All good, madam chair.

Thank you so much.

Good morning.

Um, I thank you for the presentation.

Um, I have a few questions.

Um you all know, as we talked about, you know, I'm very skeptical of um surveillance technology, uh, especially uh around folks' civil liberties and and privacy.

Um also the use of technology when it comes to public safety, I think that is a very important conversation for Detroiters um and for folks across the country, right?

Folks deserve um to feel safe and be safe.

So I want to underscore that um as I'm asking questions and giving my remarks there.

I have very particular concerns around surveillance that uses a third party vendor, and and to the questions that um Madam Chair was asking, understanding that DPD only gets the actual gunfire that is detected, that audio recording, it is one.

I have a question around do we know that where the actual sensors are that the vendor has placed.

That's one question.

Through the chair.

Uh currently we don't have the exact locations.

We know based upon the area, uh, but for us, when we when those sensors were placed, they have to triangulate in order to cover the area.

So where they are specifically, um, I'm sure if we wanted to know exactly where they were, we could ask that question.

Um, but it's it's no benefit to us to know where they are or if we don't know.

Uh it's about the coverage area and making sure because uh when that when the sensors are triggered and it comes in, they're doing the first review and the first analysis before we even get it.

And I hear you on that.

I think I I would push back a little bit and say it would be beneficial for us to know where those sensors are for this reason.

Um because I know you all only get the gun shot that the detection, the audio there, and and I know Chief, you you said you heard the audio, but I'm just saying, as we know a technology, especially audio technology that is supposed to identify what something is, um, it is my assumption that it would be able to pick up voices to say, oh, that's not a gun, uh uh gunfire that's detected or such and that way.

So my concern is that if the vendor has that audio technology, then it could also be sold to other folks to say, oh, there are folks walking down the street in this neighborhood that care that is talking about bikes, right, or talking about something that gives data to other folks to be able to sell it to folks.

I just want to make that point there in that.

Um sorry go ahead.

Yep, Councilmember McCallus, I mean uh McCampbell, the vendor shot spotter, um, they have strict policies and procedures as well where they don't um sell the third party data as far as audio voice transcript, and so we can get that for you.

Um and the the primary um concern for um DPD when it came to the placement of the sensors was that the triangulation of it actually worked and get us within a few feet of where the actual gunfire happened so that we would be able to find victims, shell casings, evidence, um, because it is so precise that if the shots are fired in a backyard of a residence versus the front yard of a residence, it allows us to know where to go to be able to collect that.

Um oftentimes when an individual calls 911, they'll just say we heard shots fired in the area, officers can't find somebody possibly bleeding out, we can't locate it.

We don't have the um the precise information or reason to necessarily go in somebody's backyard, but with shot spotter with the triangulation, it can lead us right to where we need to be.

But to your point, we can definitely get with the vendor um and be able to provide that information or know that information as to where the exact sensors are.

One of our major concerns were though, um, if people, if individuals, and it's just documented where the sensors are, now it could be sabotage to the sensors and damage to the sensors to try to um um avoid gunshot detection.

That that was DPD's concern, but we could get that information for you.

Thank you, Chief.

And I um and I hear you on the uh vendor having those in writing that they are not to sell, I would bring this up again that we know we've seen instances where those vendors do have that right and and there's been reports to come out that they they actually do sell that information.

I think as we're getting to technology, especially around surveillance if it's what if it's with this vendor or if it's with Amazon, right?

Or it being in our homes and such, we have seen time and time again to come back and say, oops, we have sold this, or someone that has gotten hold of this audio uh um recording.

So I just want to make that note that as much as we can, is there an I know you say you've heard some of that audio.

Do we have an audit process in place um to just hear like to just randomly check in with the vendor on what they are collecting, what they have stored, and and anything like that.

Do we have that in process and practice?

So, in our in our policy, unless it's an active investigation, we are not allowed to look to listen to any of the audio.

That's part of our privacy in regards to that.

We can ask the vendor uh about some audits, but for us to to view it, um again, as I indicated before, our policy is is that unless it's an active investigation, you're not allowed to listen to any audio.

Yeah, I think if there was to if if if this contract were to continue, or as you are looking for uh exploring the RFP on future technology, it does bring me a lot of concern.

I understand the reason why it's in place that you all are not able to hear the other audio, and I get that, and I and I understand their privacy, but for us for the city to be a customer of this vent vendor, this third party vendor, and they have all of these recordings, and we're not able to even to double check what they're keeping or not, um, that brings me uh uh uh concern there.

I I I'll shift gears on the aspect around folks reporting shootings, and I and I agree that that is a very important aspect because I think when we think about public safety, having community involvement is the number one aspect to keep our neighborhoods safe and being community um connected and making sure that we're all safe.

My on the slide that you showed on the percentage, um from 24 2024 to 2025, um it more than doubles the percentage of no 911 calls received.

And I'm assuming that that is I just if you can just speak to that, because if the thought is that one shot spotter is changing behavior, um I would say one of the changed behaviors I see here is actually on the negative that more folks are not calling in for 911 for shooting us to 911, and as the police commissioner stated on a um public comment, that actually may show us that a change behavior is that folks are now depending on technology to do that work instead of us doing the work of saying, hey, as community members, we should be in a place that we can keep each other safe.

We could make sure that folks know that if there is uh someone I hear shooting to make sure that folks to get EMS services, that that is actually happening.

The data here shows that that's not happening.

So if you could just speak to that, uh I I'll start it out and thank you, Commissioner McCampbell.

Um I'm sorry, um, Councilmember McCampb.

With the expansion of area coverage, because ShotSpotter, we didn't add all of the square miles at once, it was a layered approach.

As more area came online, it would identify more gunshot detection alerts, but it also identifies by a comparison in our CAD system.

Now we have awareness of matching, did a 911 call come in.

And so I would expect that as we expand it, that the number of no 911 calls would um increase as well because we simply have more um area coverage.

And then I wanted to flip back to your previous statement also when it comes down to the contract, as we go out for RFP, um, that any concerns when it comes to the data aspect of it, um, working with our law department, um, our procurement department, we could absolutely write in and ensure that that's a part of it so that we would have that auditing purposes with council approval as well, working closely with you, council member um Santiago Romero and the other council members, so that um you all have the comfort of the the protections and the protection of privacy that you want through an auditing process because I have a certain lens that I'm looking through it in, and it's really the enforcement, the um pr preservation of life, and I know you have that as well, and then also the protection of the equipment and making sure the individuals don't know exactly where it's at and only using what we need because all we need is really the alert, the gunshot detection audio, and we're not going forth as far as um audio of conversations.

That's not what we're interested in.

And then another piece that we did not highlight that is so so important is this gunshot detection um technology is for outside of a residence, and so it very rarely will pick up on gunfire inside of a residence, and so when we're talking about gunshot detection, that's a shot that's fired outside, not inside.

I would like to just add a few questions on data since we're here, and I do also want to go back to change behavior.

Just I think it would be important to know do we know how long audio is stored for?

If not, that's a question that we need to ask these companies.

How long do you store your your audio data?

Where is it stored?

Um is it a private cloud?

Is it their own how long do you keep the files for?

Um because quite frankly, to my vice chair's point, these are private companies that get bought by other companies.

What if this is bought by Amazon or Meta, who is literally looking at our chats for God knows what reasons?

These are the the real dystopian times that we're in right now, we have to take care of our information.

So we have to ask these questions first.

How long is it stored?

How can you where is it stored?

And what happens if your company gets sold?

What happens to our data, our information?

Um, because that happens often.

Um so as you're going through your RFP process, as and and if you can find that information for us now for sound thinking, that would be very helpful, because that's also a way to protect our residents.

That's another way that we're trying to protect our residents.

Um sorry, member McCampbell.

That was a question on data.

Back to the changed behavior.

Did you have anything else for data?

Um I have I have one more, but you go right ahead, and I'll come back to that.

That was it for me for data.

I think if we're still there, I just have one more um for the data.

I I see here in um the response time is listed as I believe it was six minutes.

Let me make sure that I have this down.

I think it was um six minutes or such, but um in the in our budget hearing memo when we talked about uh shot spotter, we um the department had indicated a 14-minute response for uh cause or cause initiated by shot spotter and 1254 initiated by 911.

So just if you can just speak to those differences there of what we see here and what was in that memo.

It's important that uh in some of these cases, uh, when these alerts come out, uh the officers sometimes get the alerts uh before the 911 call comes out.

Uh and in some cases, even before our dispatcher says we've had an alert.

Uh so uh we have officers that are looking at uh we have an app, a shot spotter app, uh that allows us to it it will show you the air and say, hey, this just came in.

So right when our dispatcher or right when our communications gets it, our officers will be getting it.

So there is a time difference.

Um and if you're talking about uh when there's a 911 call, uh again, in some of the examples, it's minutes.

So that skews things entirely where I may get something before and I may get not only get it, but get there and begin investigation before anyone even says anything about hey, there was an alert.

Absolutely.

I understand that aspect.

I'm just looking for the true numbers of response because we got a different set of receives forty-nine here, the average, but in the memo, it was I need to see that memo okay um so that if you could provide that to me, I would be able to give you a um a thorough response.

But okay, we can follow up on that.

Um that's it for now, man.

I'm sure I heard more, but uh absolutely there was a question about change behavior.

Did you get the answer to that question?

I I got a little bit, I think I still I mean I understand the expansion of area, right?

But I I I was still focused on the percentage, right?

Because I'm like from 2024 to 12.2% for it to double, understanding that the the area has widened, but are we I would still think that the percentage across the city was still match up with the number of folks who are not calling 911.

So I'm that's still a large discrepancy for me.

Um it might be a point that we could follow up on, but uh I'm still not completely understand that that jump there.

But that's that was the last point I had on that for now, Madam Chair.

Thank you.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

I I had those similar questions, which is what I'm trying to see how we can compare.

When it comes to changed behavior, we don't know DPD doesn't know where these uh uh sensors are located.

I'm assuming the public doesn't know either that they live in a shot spotter range.

So how would they change their behavior based on shot spotter?

That because they don't know, but they know the technology exists, and um with officers' response very quickly to persons in neighborhoods that fire gunshots, and is not just that initial response, um, it's even a wraparound response as well, where we're coming and collecting the shell casings, we're out there, and so um you know Detroit is a small big town, and through storytelling also, where I fired my gun, police came, they did this, it creates a thing like wow, and they're talking to other individuals, and even though they're not in a shot spotter area, that can cause a change in behavior, also because you don't know exactly where said, and if residents did know that the exact location is um this area is shot spotter, even to the point of individuals being able to say now with crafting a story is I was shot here, knowing it's outside of a shot spotter area.

Now we don't have the opportunity to cross-reference or challenge.

And so we have and we're very intentional in led in in keeping the exact locations of our shot spotter areas private, to the point we didn't even want necessarily our officers to know exactly where their sensors are.

Okay.

Um and and just when I hear that, frankly, it sounds like people will act right if they know they're being surveilled, instead of you know they have support, they have care, they know their neighbors and know how to talk things out, which I know we're working on, but I'd rather do that more instead of being like I'm I'm being watched and the cops are gonna show up.

And and to that point, I believe in the and that we do it all, because we do have certain members of the population that definitely need um um the enforcement, but not everybody.

That's a small percentage.

The majority of individuals, when they know better, they're gonna do it the right way and given the the proper support.

And so that's why I supported CVI as well, and even with the Lancing the stomp for additional money through um state funds for CVI, the push for ab um allocation of ARPA dollars for CVI, and we'll continue to do that, and then our CVI groups are in areas where shot spotter is there is also, and council member Benson, one of the conditions and things that he really advocated for was hey man, um with us approving the contract for um shot spotter, you know, what type of community support will you have?

Because initially I really didn't have a CVI that was in his area, and we expanded, and our CVI actually goes a route and and and provides wraparound services um in support with ShotSpotter.

Thank you.

So we have ShotSpotter and Shotstoppers.

We have a we have a detection piece, but we also have a prevention piece where the CVI works on the prevention of shots being fired from the first place so that shot spotter doesn't have to detect or get an alert of gunfire.

Or have to even exist because we have figured that out somehow, some way.

When it comes to shot spotter calls versus 9-1-1 calls, do you prioritize shot spotter calls?

Or how does that work?

That so anytime gunfire is happens in the city, whether it's a 9-1-1 call or shot spotter alert call, they have the same priority, which is a priority one.

Okay, thank you.

Just wanted to make sure that we weren't prioritizing shots, calls from shot spotter versus calls for 9-1-1.

We don't do that.

Okay, thank you.

Okay, I think for myself, um, when it comes down to this, it's it's the and piece that I'm I'm I'm missing.

Um, because I'm trying to figure out what and shot spotter brings.

Um last time this came across uh this table, we were being bombarded by ShotSpotter is gonna prevent shots.

It's gonna save lives, it's gonna prevent crime.

I'm glad that we are here now having a conversation about how it supports as an investigative tool.

That I understand.

I I it's good to see how you use it to investigate crime.

I think that is probably the most helpful from what I'm con what I can see if we're not preventing, I would rather us prevent crime in the first place and invest more in CDI, more in what has research has shown works.

Now, when it comes to research, I I'm sure you have seen the amount of research stating that shot spotter actually doesn't work.

The data is wrong.

Um we have heard um uh not just the research on on response, but also how it impacts people.

About there was a shot spotter call, and there were negative interactions with police officers.

I guess what makes us so sure, and and with this information, like there's so much research that speaks that speaks against this.

I'm I'm just confused by the information that we're receiving here, the stories that I hear too, and then also the research that I'm seeing that this is a not necessarily worth the money, that there are other ways that we can reduce crime, that there are other ways that we can serve people.

I guess why and and I and here tools.

Tools are great.

And some of them like are just expensive and we might not need it.

I'm trying to figure out this and right.

Like I'm trying to figure out the the the worthiness of this tool.

And I'm also quite frankly really curious to see if we removed shot spotter and we continue to invest in CDI, if you would still continue to see a reduction of crime, which saves us money from spending millions of dollars for technology that supports billionaires that supports data collection versus putting it in into our communities and keeping it here.

That's that's what I'm I'm trying to get us to do here.

Um so quite frankly, I have more questions around the contract itself.

If we can please get that information.

But I'm I'm still very doubtful that Shot Spotter has helped the city reduce crime.

I I really do think that that's CBI, that that is the city investing in our communities and working together with police.

Because you do work together with with CBI groups.

You you know who the folks are that need help.

So for me, Chief, I guess what are your thoughts on this?

And if you wouldn't mind, I would like to bring this back to get some of that information around the contracts that we still have, information around 911 calls versus the shot spotter calls.

Um, but quite frankly, I'm still trying to figure out whether or not this is worth the money.

Uh um council member, I I can tell you that it has been invaluable for the Detroit police department.

Okay.

I never speak for other departments and how they do things because um you have um approximately 14,000 law enforcement agencies across the country, and um they have different policies, rules, and procedures in how they roll out and how they respond.

But in the city of Detroit, the way that we have utilized it with our shot spotter patrol vehicles, our officers specifically trained, that when those alerts come out and even with the app, they're getting there even before the 911 call.

And so we rolled it out initially in the ninth precinct years ago, and because we didn't have specifically trained officers at that point, the designated cars, nobody got there fast.

And so it's the same as if you had a computer and gave it to two different kids, and one was very, very proficient, they could make apps, they could do some amazing things.

The other one may just choose to just surf and look at look at Instagram.

You get different results.

And so, but the Detroit police departments, we have been good stewards.

Um, our patrol officers who are getting to the scenes of rapid gunfire within two, three, four minutes finding individuals, rendering aids, oftentimes and sometimes catching individuals with the smoking gun still in their hands, and also um going through the courts getting search warrants to get inside of those houses to get the weapons that fired the show casings and that are inside the houses and taking out other guns as well, taking guns from individuals who are not responsible because it should never be a situation in the city of Detroit where you're firing a gun.

You should not be firing a gun.

But if you look at the data, you see as far too much of that.

And so we have been strategically working and over the ninth and fifth precinct where we have the largest area that's covered, you can see that we've had substantial reductions.

Now, here's the and we have technology, we have men and women of Detroit Police Department working very, very difficult jobs and very, very hard, and they're good at what they do.

And we invested in community violence intervention.

I think that's the sweet spot in the city of Detroit where we're doing it all, and we have to continue to do that.

And so when you create an OR situation, this or that, I think that's when you have winners and losers.

I know that it's different things that are at play.

And so I just don't want to lose this.

And I'm currently um reaching out to the University of Michigan as well, so that we have third party validation to be able to do an overall big evaluation on chat spotter.

And so and welcome any member for council to be able to participate so that as we go through the RFP, I'm not stuck on a bender company.

We're past that.

We I'm I'm all in support of the gun detection technology.

And so if if you hear me start to not even refer to it as shot spotter, because it's about the technology that we need in our city.

And if I can get it for a better price, that's why we're gonna put it out for RP and other conditions.

I think that we can all work to get that in and want you right there with us as we get what's best for the citizens in in the city of Detroit.

Chief, if every time there was a gunshot, somebody called that in, would you need gunshot technology?

Um I don't believe if if every time, I don't believe that I would, but it's still some benefits.

Um I know that the reality is so many people are afraid they get desensitized, but here's the other thing.

You can call it in, but you can't tell me where it's at.

See, that's the sweet spot with the technology.

When you call 911, and we can listen to some 911 calls, and I could play them here, and it would have to be redacted because I wouldn't want to, you know, um put any citizen in jeopardy.

But when they call in and our officers are on the street, they're gonna they call 911 and say, uh, how can I help you?

I'm hearing gunfire, I'm hearing you know, rapid gunfire.

And so the 911 call taker is gonna ask, well, where's it coming from?

I think it's coming from down the street or the street over, and you get multiple calls.

That doesn't help our officers, and so we'll send, and in the past we will send officers out, and the officers would have to listen and see if they heard it.

So if they get there four or five minutes later, they're just rolling up and down the street.

If they don't hear it, they close that run out, you know, no problem found, and they go away.

Community upset, police came, didn't get to the bottom of it.

And so we have so many individuals that were able to shoot in their backyards of their homes.

Public probably got disenfranchised, just stop calling.

It wasn't the result.

My 911 caller is not gonna tell you to go outside and you know, see if you can find it closer.

Like, you know, you you're not able to help me.

Um, can you go out and search for the exact location that will put citizens in jeopardy in danger?

This technology lets us know if it's in the front yard, backyard, side of the house, uh failed.

So, but for that, oftentimes we would never find the show casings, those 15,000 but plus showcasings that we've put into the Niven system that we've done crime linkage analysis to to tell us the gun, whether it was an Inkster and other places, it is identifying quickly how many other shootings the gun has been linked to so that we can bring justice to families.

Thank you, Chief.

I I hear you wanting to take uh us having to move this out.

Um I can't commit to you moving this out of committee into formal before your due date.

So there I I can give you that.

So we've got time.

You still have a full month before this contract is up.

Um and I would rather not be rushed through this.

I would rather get the information first.

Um so I would like to bring this back, and not only because of the questions that we asked today, but also I'm hearing from colleagues that they might be receiving different information regarding the contract.

Um I'm told that some members were told the contract is for 12 months at 3 million dollars.

Is that accurate?

No, it's um I will tell you exactly what it is now.

Um it's for nine months and two million.

Okay, so that's what we're seeing as well.

Uh so just want to get that con confirmed as well.

Um and give us time to to to continue to review all this information as well, Vice Chair.

Thank you.

Um, I am I'll be transparent because I'm I'm not I'm not there on um volume to approve the contract.

Um I think I just have a couple uh if that's okay if I subscribe.

Yes.

Um on the aspect of like looking at the areas of the map here, and I understand the aspect around not or but and but how confident can we are we able to say right that this technology has led to the decreases that we've that we see on the map and it's not just related to the overall downward turn of crime that we have seen across the city and across the country.

Um how are we able to confidently say and connect that to Shot Spider?

I will council member, I will tell you that it's a large contributing factor.

It's not the only factor because that would be disingenuous.

Community violence intervention has been um significant as well.

But shot spotter, the technology has absolutely been a key to allowing us to find the evidence and also get guns that are used to shoot off the streets in the city.

And so when you look at the ninth precinct and the fifth precinct, but in particular, how that was such a violent area, that whole precinct, we put the whole precinct under shot spotter, and I've never seen the ninth precinct crime this low.

And so we do have CVI there as well, but we have CVI in other precincts also, but ShotSpotter covers that entire precinct.

And so that's where we have seen the tremendous reductions in the gunfire.

That's where we have seen um the search warrants that have been executed based off the shell casings to get the guns off the street, um, to get the guns out of these houses where individuals um are actually firing them because ShotSpotter, it identifies individuals and and and um the guns that are actually being used because we have the shell casing that is on the ground that has been spent that came out of that weapon.

And so I will I would tell you that it has been um a significant contributing factor, but not the only factor.

Got it.

And and are you able, thank you for that, Chief.

Are you able to get this like are we able to see the areas that are not covered by a shot spotter just to compare those the decreases there?

Because I think that will also be beneficial.

Understanding, right?

You know, people, you know, if someone wants to shoot a gun, they're not gonna say um like understanding that if there is somebody that is uh a shooter, they may do it in a different place and all of that under that, and I and I hear you on that that you're taking the guns off the street to prevent that in other areas.

But I think also just seeing uh the comparison to non-uh coverage areas will also be beneficial to us as well.

Um the last thing I'll say around the case studies that you brought up about seeing it in Halton Lake and such.

I'm still of understanding that you're able to verify that the censors did not pick up gunshot there.

I get that part.

Um also like beforehand, right?

If we if there are folks, and I think this again goes back to change behavior, if there's folks that was at the that live near the corner of Kelly and Seven Mile, right, to say, yeah, I didn't I didn't hear anything, right?

There's 10 folks on this block that say I didn't hear anything, wouldn't that also lead to you all your detectives saying, Oh, we have to dig deeper because we haven't heard like their neighbors here that are cooperating and they have not heard any gunfire as opposed to what this person said.

Would wouldn't that be the same case in that way?

Through the chair.

Uh I think that when you are doing an investigation, you look at every single piece, and the more the more pieces that you can put down when you're when you're uh interviewing someone, uh it's it's a more effective strategy to get into the truth because uh regardless of how many people do lie.

People are unsure or or don't give the full truth.

And anything that we can take, take another piece of technology and say independently, this also confirms that there was nothing there.

That's just another piece of it that we can go back to that individual and say, not only did I have 10 people that said that there was nothing, I also have shot spotter.

So again, it's it's it's stacking the deck against the individual that will have them come to the truth and say, okay, I there is nothing there.

Um and again, uh I go back to it's just one tool in the toolbox.

I guess and it's it's something that we that we utilize not only to solve crime but also to eliminate crime that never happened here.

And and I would I would add this um if you look at eyewitness testimony, and um it can be um based off of perception and can be extremely unreliable when it comes to date time, and if it was a gunshot that had occurred um in the area, it they heard it, they could think like yeah, I heard gunshots, but it might have been four hours prior to that one where the shot spotter alert it time stamps it, and so based off of that, we have more empirical data to be able to link it.

But taking the and approach, interviewing them talking to witnesses as well, and then the other thing is when you're in the Detroit police department uniform and you go into folks' houses, a lot of times people don't want to open the door, don't want to be cooperative for fear of people looking, um, for fear of what their neighbors are saying, talking to the police.

That's the reality of where we are.

Um, we're working through it, and we will continue to work on that to the point where you know we we don't need it, but as of right now, this particular point in time, I still need um gunshot detection technology.

And I hear you on that.

I I think and I absolutely eyewitness testimony and such, uh, understanding that that could be flawed, but I think the the point that I'm bringing up here is that community aspect that I left with when we opened up is that I think and as Mount Chair entered indicated, the more that we can do around that community aspect, the folks are able and willing to um be partners in uh in public safety in their neighborhoods.

I think the better place that we get, and for me, what I've seen like with this piece of technology, understanding that it's a tool that may cut down the time there.

I'm just not seeing this be a tool to increase that public aspect, engagement around public safety.

So and that's what I'll just say there.

And and I don't and I do want to make a note for uh Madam Chair, um, and this is not to you, Chief and DPD, but just for the administration.

Um, this is yet another contract that we have before us that um as we are wanted to take time to um dig deeper into it, we've been told that there's a time crunch.

And and I just want to stress that knowing that when we're thinking about going through all RFP for this, knowing that there are contract end dates, um, even the research that you brought up, partner with University of Michigan Chief, I think that's great.

I just would have loved to see that earlier on.

So even if we're considering any type of extension or any type of new um contract that we have that at the front end, um, because shot spotter has been a topic of controversy throughout the years, so I would have just loved to see this work before, um, so that we could make a thorough and and informed decision at the council table because I know um getting into formal uh it is uh as been indicated by our colleagues, they want us to do that that work here in the committee.

So I'm in favor of bringing it back, but I just want to make that note uh for the administration that we when these type of things come up, we need more time to do our due diligence in this.

So thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you all.

Thank you.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

I I share your frustration.

Uh it's not fun to be forced uh or pressured to approve something because of the timeline.

Um and just to be clear, I I can commit to getting this out of committee to the full body before the end of the contract, again, at the end of June, does not mean that it'll leave here with supports.

Last time it did not, but it'll at least be given the opportunity to be at the full table for discussion amongst my colleagues.

Um also just want to share um I I know that you mentioned Chief that CVI groups are gonna come in supports of ShotSpotter.

Um, but I will say um my frustration with that experience last time, that really frankly happened because council said no to using ARPA money to support Shot Spotter, and we pushed that we invest in community groups, and you did the right thing and saying we have them, they should be funded.

We'll go ahead and make this switch, but it felt more like a bargaining chip.

CVI should not be a bargaining chip, it should be funded, it should be cared for.

So just want to share that, support CVI completely.

And if we're gonna do and how do we support policing, and how really is the technology helping us or not?

It's it's a technology piece for me here.

I want to end by saying thank you for your work.

I you know I support your work, but you know that I will come and push when I feel like something isn't supporting us.

And this is one of those moments.

So I apologize for for how hard this is going to be, but I think it's important that we have these discussions because at the end of the day, I do believe that we want to make it safer to be here.

I want to make your jobs easier, so I want to reduce crime so that you don't have to be attending to crime, right?

So let's let's have those discussions.

Um we're gonna bring this back in a week if there's a motion to do so.

Motion and bring back in one week.

Thank you, and we'll continue to discuss.

But thank you all so much.

I really appreciate your time and your commitment to having these conversations with us.

See you in one week.

See you soon.

Thank you.

I will now take us to the top of this agenda, everyone.

Thank you all so much for your questions for your care.

And at the top here under unfinished business 5.1.

This is contract number 600746.

This is utilizing 100% city funding.

This is to provide specialty uniforms and other specialty items.

The contractor is Alley Brothers Ally Brothers uniforms.

They are located in Livonia.

This is a two-year contract at 275,324 with 40 cents.

This will be for police.

We have brought this back to committee from formal session if there's a motion to discuss.

Motion to discuss.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

And I believe you had done you have some you had some more questions for this contract, correct?

Yes.

I'll turn it over to you.

Thank you, actually, Vice Chair, so sorry.

Let me bring in our panelists so that we I have you someone to I have someone for you to speak to.

Um, we should be joined by Captain Jason Adams, Johnny Thomas, and Lola Clark.

If they are online, if we can please make them into panelists.

And once our panelists have joined us, if you wouldn't mind sealing your names and titles for the public.

Good morning to the chair, Captain Jason Adams, Detroit Police Department, Management Services section.

Good morning.

Thank you for joining us.

I will turn it over to our vice chair.

Vice Chair.

Good morning, Captain.

Um, I just have a few questions on this contract.

It was brought back because colleagues had lifted up concerns around it.

Um, just wanted to note, you know, I I think one thing is that this um I had some concerns around there.

This this contractor has been in the news previously for um uh bad actions of an employee.

Um say criminal actions of our employee.

Um did the has did the department explore that and and know about that, and are you all still good to move forward with this?

Just wanted to touch on that.

Through the chair, the contracts are handled by uh Office of Contracting and Procurement.

We provide them with the scope of work for the services and goods to be provided, and they bet the vendors to the satisfaction of the city.

Okay, I'm sure is there's someone from OCP that uh I believe Lola Clark is from OCP, if I'm mistaken, please correct me.

If we have Ms.

Clark with us, yes, to the chair I am here.

Can you hear me?

Yes, we can.

Um wondering if uh if you need me to repeat the question.

Uh so I did hear that the contractor was on the news for bad behavior.

Is that what the question is um ploy with um uh some I believe is criminal behavior?

Okay.

So that was not something that I was aware of, but the contractor was vetted, and we are speaking of Allied Brothers uniform, is that correct?

Yes.

Okay, so they were contacted, the references were contacted to uh determine whether they met the minimum requirements, which is something that we have uh as part of our process, and that was something that they met.

Um I was not aware that they were in the news for anything that was inappropriate, um, but as part of our process, uh that didn't meet all the requirements set forth uh in the solicitation.

Thank you for that.

And and Captain, a question from you um for the members of DPD, have you all understanding that you all don't go through the contract process, but have you all um talked to folks of the department on their experience around this contractor since I believe you all worked with them before?

Um just want to see about that feedback.

The chair.

Uh we didn't take a formal poll of the contract.

Um opinions and services can vary.

Um what we look at is do they provide professional standard?

Do they meet the requirements of OCP and the city standards?

And have you had any complaints from folks about this contractor?

I have to the chair, I've not heard any complaints about their service that stands out.

Okay.

Um those are the questions I have for right now, Melcher.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

I uh looking back at our notes from formal session, and there were some very valid questions asked by my colleagues regarding why we are using the Livonia uh contract when it seems like Enterprise.

Um Enterprise, I believe we have worked with in the past, correct?

To the chair, correct, ma'am.

And they are in Detroit.

Correct.

So I think the question was why we went with the Livonia company uh when Enterprise, it seems like why did we leave Enterprise?

We still have uh Enterprise as one of our vendors.

Uh we have found that we have been successful by having multiple vendors to provide uniforms and equipment to our members in a timely manner.

So Enterprise was not meeting our needs of capacity and timeliness.

Uh it's difficult for a single vendor sometimes to meet the needs.

And so multiple vendors ensure that uh for lack of a better saying, we don't have all of our eggs in one basket.

Sure.

May I add something to this as well?

Yes, please.

And so um this particular contract or this particular um service will be serviced by both Enterprise and Ally Brothers.

Um, so we will not be eliminating enterprise from this uh service.

So Ally and Enterprise will be providing service to both the uh to DPD.

I think the question is if the eggs all fit in one basket and they're safe and it's working, why split it?

Is it necessary if it's not then why not have it in the city?

Uh to the chair.

Uh it has been our experience with all vendors as it pertains to uniforms is that it's difficult to be timely with the orders we place from time to time.

Uh I don't know exactly how they do their inventory, um, but police equipment uh uniforms are expensive.

And uh I don't believe that any one company will keep enough uh in stock for every instance that we have where we have a uniform need, like for promotions or um uh new new units or things that that come up where we need specialty uniforms.

And this contract is for specialty uniforms.

Understood.

Um if you wouldn't mind sharing, because I I don't believe that this can be sent back to formal with that information that shows enterprise failing to meet our needs on time, things not being done on time.

Kids, is there a way OCP that that we're able to see timelines and services?

And then when we decided that we needed more capacity, uh because I I do believe there's a desire like this and many other contracts to try to keep this in the city.

Can you repeat the question?

I you said can we send you some timelines regarding how enterprises servicing the contract?

And how they have failed to service us on time, send us the things that we need, because if we're doing both to meet a need, that that shows up.

We we are currently they are they are falling short um on getting things to us on time.

So if you wouldn't mind sharing us proof of of when that happened to then really show us proof of why we need to have multiple vendors that the one vendor was not meeting the need.

Are we able to show that?

I don't have that detail.

Um, this is a decision that the department has made that they wanted to have a multiple contract just to ensure uh coverage capacity.

Um I can also state that Enterprise is providing um somewhat a different manufacturer than Ally Brothers, so there's coverage in that capacity as well.

So Ally will be providing different um uniforms and enterprise will be providing different uniforms as well.

Ms.

Clark, to that is what Allied Brothers providing us separate and different, and Enterprise cannot provide us that.

So we went with Allied.

The department made the determination as far as uh who was going to provide the specific items uh when it was sent over to them.

Um they I can uh defer that to them.

Yeah, Captain, is our as is Allied Brothers providing something that is separate and different, and Enterprise cannot provide?

Through the chair, the different vendors, Ally versus uh uh enterprise that may stock different manufacturers.

We're very specific about the manufacturers, the colors, so we have uniformity in our attire.

Uh, without looking at specifics, I can't tell you examples right now.

Um, but that does come up with uniform contracts where some vendors only provide certain brands or certain uh parts from a brand.

And uh these two companies were the understanding were the only two that um got this far in the contracts because the other companies that did on the contract couldn't provide the make and model and equipment that is required by the Detroit Police Department.

Okay, I will say that my colleagues um member uh Whitfield Calloway and Council President Tate did have a lot of questions at this about this at the table.

Um could you reach out to both of their offices and get their questions answered before we move it out of committee?

Because if not, we're gonna have these discussions in formal session.

Um, and I would rather the information that they need be given to them and to into this committee before we move this out.

We can uh respond.

Okay, and again, for for both of my colleagues, the question is why allied when it looks like enterprise can do the work.

Um, so again, if you can come with the information on how they have either failed, fallen short, or cannot provide us the other specific specialty items that Alley Brothers is so that we are able to um uh really get more support for this contract.

Uh Vice Chair, any other questions?

No, madam chair.

Okay.

Yep, no matter all right.

If there are no other questions, I would like to bring this back.

Um if we can bring this back actually, just looking at the time.

Uh next week we will not be here.

It is memorial day.

So if we can get a bring back in two weeks.

Um motion to bring back in two weeks.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

Hearing no objections, 5.1 will be brought back in two weeks.

Thank you, Captain.

Thank you, Ms.

Clark.

Moving us along.

5.2.

This is contract number 3091448.

This is utilizing 100% sponding.

This is to provide an emergency demo at 1456 Trinity.

The contractor is SC Environmental Services.

They're located in Detroit.

This will go through June 30th of this year.

The total contract is 16,457.

And is there a motion to discuss?

Motion to discuss.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

This contract uh has been here before.

We've been told that again this site might be remediated later this month or in June.

So I would like to also bring this back in two weeks.

Motion to bring back in two weeks.

Hearing no objections, 5.2 will be brought back in two weeks.

5.3 is a memo relative to request for a report concerning hydrogen fueled buses.

We've been asked to bring this back in two weeks.

Motion bring back in two weeks.

Hearing no objections.

Hearing no objections.

Five points three will be brought back in three weeks.

And vice chair.

Correction.

Two weeks.

Two weeks.

Two weeks.

Thank you, everyone.

I'm reading multiple things at the same time.

Thanks, everyone.

So again, 5.3.

We brought back in two weeks.

And vice chair, uh we did discuss six point five.

If we can bring that back in two weeks as well.

So motion to bring back in two weeks.

Thank you.

Okay.

Motion to be back in two weeks.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

Thank you, Dr.

Powers.

6.5.

We discussed the shot spotter contracts.

This will be brought back in two weeks.

5.4.

This is a memo relative to accessibility of the 36th district courts.

We are waiting to hear a response from the 36th district courts.

If we can bring this back in three weeks, motion to bring back in three weeks.

Hearing no objections, 5.4.

We brought back in three weeks.

5.5 memo relative to what type of services the newly formed office neighborhood of community safety will offer.

We are still waiting to hear a response.

We were told to bring this back in one week.

Motion to bring 5.5 back in one week.

Hearing no objections, that motion carries.

5.6 is a memo regarding after our establishments for member Callaway's office.

Is a memo regarding after our establishments for member Callaway's office.

We've been asked to bring this back in three weeks.

Motion to bring 5.6 back in three weeks.

Hearing no objections.

5.7.

This is a memo regarding securing city property against federal overreach.

This is the memo.

We have received the draft ordinance.

So 5.7 can be received and filed.

Motion to receive and file 5.7 hearing no objections.

5.7 will be received and filed.

Madam Chair.

Yes, LPD.

That's fine with the committee, but I was asked if the if it is to go forward, it needs to go to the law department for review.

Okay.

We can do that once we get to the ordinance.

Thank you.

Thank you.

5.8.

This is to amend an ordinance.

Chapter 4, the 2019 Detroit City Code, advertising and signs by amending Article 1 generally, sections 4-1-1.

Definitions to include religious institutions in the definition of advertisement sensitive properties.

This would be for an introduction and setting up a public hearing.

And this is for the setting of public hearing.

Motion to discuss.

Discussion.

But there are some uh questions.

I have another questions and concerns that we had discussed before around how this change relates to undesirable land uses, but just want to see if that has been rectified in this through the chair.

It has.

Okay.

Thank you.

Um that's all I have, madam chair.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

Is there motion?

Motion to send to formal with a recommendation to approve.

This would be wait.

Oh, this is for an introduction and setting of a public hearing.

Well, motion to send to formal.

Or yeah, yeah.

For an introduction and setting of a public hearing.

Hearing no objections.

5.8 will be sent to formal for an introduction of an ordinance and for the setting of a public hearing.

5.9.

This is to amend chapter 22 of the 2019 Detroit City Code.

Housing by adding article 6, sales or conveniences of one or two family dwellings, sections 22-11-1 definitions, sections 22-11-2, presale inspection required.

Section 22-11-3 Exceptions, sections 22-11-4, inspection guidelines and inspection reports.

Sections 22-11-5, dangerous conditions and deficiencies found in dwellings.

Sections 22-11-6 violations.

I believe if there's a motion to discuss.

Motion to discuss.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

This needs to be referred to the law department, correct?

Through the Chair Graham Anderson Law Department.

Um it has been referred to the law department, but addits are still being made.

We'd request um uh one or two-week bring back with the holiday.

Motion to bring back in two weeks.

Hearing no objections, 5.9 will be brought back in two weeks.

5.10 is a memo relative to immediate attention to the Stevens Thompson Mason School property located at 19635 Mitchell Street Detroit.

This we have been asked to bring back as well.

We're still waiting for a response.

If there's a motion to bring back in two weeks, motion to bring back in two weeks.

Hearing no objections, 5.10 will be brought back in two weeks.

5.11.

A memo relative to requests for reports and draft an ordinance concerning after hours establishments.

If there's a motion to discuss, motion to discuss.

Thank you.

LPD, how much time would be needed for 5.11?

I believe.

Is this something that you guys are working on?

It is, madam chair.

Three weeks.

Three weeks.

Yes.

If there's a motion to bring back 5.11 in three weeks.

Motion to bring back 5.11 in three weeks.

Thank you.

Hearing no objections, 511.

We brought back in three weeks.

5.12 is a memo relative to requesting a draft ordinance concerning waiver of blight fines and fees assessed by the Department of Appeals and Hearings.

If we could also bring this back in three weeks.

Motion to bring back 5.12 in three weeks.

Hearing no objections, 5.12.

We brought back in three weeks.

513, a memo relative to information on DPD storage requirements.

We've been asked to bring this back in two weeks.

Motion to bring back 5.13 in two weeks.

Thank you.

Hearing no objections, 513.

We'll be brought back in two weeks.

This is contract number 308.

Okay.

This is contract 308966, utilizing 100% bond funding.

To provide a safe fire response at 19487 for your contractors of Damo.

This is in Detroit.

This is the 47,000 dollar with 11 47,001 and 39 cent contract for construction and demolition.

Is there a motion to discuss?

Motion to discuss.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

I believe you and I keep bringing this back.

I asked for pictures.

We asked for breakdown.

I know I really don't have any other questions.

It's I'm not happy with the cost, but wondering if we have any other questions.

Anything else that we might need.

Um work has already been completed.

Um how would you like to move forward?

Madam Chair.

Yes, Vice Chair.

Uh yep, no further questions.

Um, still continue to have concerns around the cost as you mentioned.

Um, you know, this is a conundrum that we get to when the work has occurred.

So again, I would push for us to have a conversation around emergency demos and the process um before this committee um in the near future, but with that out a motion to send to formal with no recommendation.

Hearing no objections, five points fourteen will be sent to formal without recommendation.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

And I do believe um our offices are working on meeting with BC soon.

It's for us to at least begin to also ask these questions, and I agree.

Once we learn what's going on, we should definitely have the conversation here at the table to help residents understand this as well.

5.11.

This is uh the ordinance to address federal overreach.

Um again, we've we've been seeing the memos.

This is the ordinance.

Uh thank you for LPD for working on this with us and the law departments.

I would like to bring this back um in three weeks to allow us the opportunity to review, but this is for um us to codify uh limiting ice activities on city property.

There's a motion to bring this back in three weeks.

Motion to bring it back 5.15 in three weeks.

Hearing no objections, 5.15 will be brought back in three weeks.

516.

This is a petition of Lee Plaza.

This is a request for an encroachment within the East West Public Alley for a storm drain encroachment.

Is there a motion to discuss?

Motion to discuss.

Thank you.

Is Mr.

Doherty on with us?

If so, if we can make him a panelist.

Good afternoon through the chair.

Good afternoon, Mr.

Washington.

Um, can we please promote Georgine Gertsoff?

I believe she's listed under Georgine.

Yes, we can, and we have.

Thank you.

Georgine, once you've met, uh joined us if you wouldn't mind stating your name and title for the public.

Good afternoon, Georgine Gersdorf.

Good afternoon.

Thank you for joining us.

I have a question regarding 5.16.

This is the petition of Lee Plaza.

Uh I we usually have a map or resolution attached.

We were not able to receive that information.

Do you have that information for this petition?

Uh would you like to see the map?

Yes.

The sketch.

Yes.

Yes.

I can I can pull that up for you.

Just one moment.

If you wouldn't mind sharing that with us, email any to the committee, myself, member waters, member McCampbell.

Um that information it usually is attached, but the map and the resolution is missing.

Okay.

I can do that.

Yep.

Okay.

Thank you.

Um, Member McCampbell.

Any questions for this item?

No questions.

Yeah, just looking for the information.

Okay.

Uh DD D.

If you wouldn't mind, um, Georgine, correct?

Yes.

Uh, is this urgent or can we bring this back in two weeks for us to review the resolution and map?

We can bring it back in two weeks.

Okay, appreciate you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Motion to bring back 5.16 in two weeks.

Hearing no objections, 5.16 will be brought back in two weeks.

Thank you for joining us.

Moving us along.

517 is a memo relative to a request for a report concerning demolition cost and collections.

If we can bring this back in three weeks, motion bring back in three weeks.

Hearing no objections, 5.17 will be brought back in three weeks.

5.18 memo relative to recognizing post trauma prison this order.

This is the resolution.

Member McCampbell motion to discuss or approve.

Motion to discuss.

Thank you.

I think we have one amendment that is being made to the resolution.

Well defer to LPD.

LPD.

I believe the amendment was made.

Okay.

It's kind of hard to check right here, but I will I I checked it before the meeting.

Okay.

And yes, I believe it was made.

Yeah.

Well, um, motion to approve a sent to formal.

There's a motion to approve.

Hearing no objections, 518 will be sent to formal with the recommendation to approve.

Thank you.

As amended.

Yeah, thank you.

5.18 would be approved.

Sent to formal as amended.

Thank you.

519.

This is the memo.

Also the resolution.

519.

This is a memo relative to the South Fort Street Road Diet Resolution.

I do believe that.

Oh, is your motion to discuss?

Motion to discuss.

Thank you.

The resolution is attached to this.

Uh, so we need to move it out to come to formal for it to be approved.

Correct, Dr.

Powers.

It reads member memorandum, but I see the attached resolution.

Um, so this is just the memo.

Okay, great.

So if that's the case, do do to do 519.

Um is just the memo for a resolution that we requested uh to request to the Michigan Department of Transportation, M Dots, to complete a road diet at South Ford Street from Schaefer Highway to Outer Drive.

This is really exciting news for uh district six 42 and 7 residents, but this is just the memo.

Um I believe the resolution has been completed, uh, but we can bring this back until we have that line item as a resolution.

Uh so if we can bring back 519 in two weeks.

Thank you.

Hearing no objections, 519, we brought back in two weeks.

5.20.

This is a memo relative to request for data, police activity at lovely vibes bar and grill.

There's a request to bring this back in two weeks.

Motion bring back 5.20 and two weeks.

Hearing no objections, 5.20, we brought back in two weeks.

5.21.

This is a memo relative to policy concerns or concerning police training programs and employment requirements.

The department did respond back.

We have receive the response.

So 5.21 can be received and filed.

Motion to receive and file 5.21.

Hearing no objections, 5.21 will be received and filed.

Under new business, Office of Contracting and Procurement.

6.1.

This is contract number 6007 eight zero seven, utilizing 100% capital funding for construction services for DPD Oakman Boulevard Renovations.

Contractor is Gandalf.

They're located in Detroit.

This is a two-year contract at 2 million 4,800.

And this will be for construction and demolition.

There is a request for new business for this item, Vice Chair.

If there is a motion to discuss.

Motion to discuss.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

And I believe we should have Raquel Harrington and Raymond Green to join us as panelists if we can make them as panelists.

And then once our panelists have joined us, if you can please state your names and titles for the public.

Yes, Mr.

Washington.

We also have Nicholas Payne joining from construction and demolition.

If we can make him into a panelist as well.

And again, once folks have joined us, please state your names and titles.

We can no longer see folks on screen when they've joined.

You have to speak for the camera to focus on your screen.

Through the chair, my name is Nick Payne, construction and demolition department, planning and strategy manager.

Good to hear from you.

No, Raymond Green, Office of Contracting Procurement.

Thank you.

Okay.

Thank you both for joining.

Sure.

And I I see my colleague through the chair.

I see my colleague Raquel Harrington is joined as well, our uh press secretary.

Um a summary of the scope uh for this contract is focused on uh several miscellaneous uh improvements to the building.

This includes adding new electrical panels, outlets, and data port to support DPD's operations.

In addition, we are performing some HVAC repairs and new HVAC controls.

We're upgrading the fire alarm systems and we're performing minor interior renovations to support the armory office uh at the facility.

Okay, thank you.

There's mention of a chain link fence enclosure.

Is this for parking or for something else?

Uh through the chair, I might have to get back with you on the chain link uh fencing portion of the contract, or I'll have to pull up uh the additional diagram.

Thank you.

Yeah, if you can just let us know what's being enclosed.

Um and hello, Raquel's uh thank you to IT for putting all the screens on the big screen now.

I can see everyone.

I'm I apologize, I I could not see before, but good to see you all.

Um I guess as a follow-up.

Uh, how frequent are these upgrades that we're doing uh to our buildings?

Would you happen to know?

And do we know um which building might be next for maintenance?

I ask because this is utilizing capital funding.

We have a lot of needs.

It'd just be helpful to know what the overall plan is and how we're gonna maintain all of our assets.

Uh through the chair, I think uh, you know, facility upgrades are usually contingent on like you said, what funding is available and the the age and depreciation of uh you know various city facilities and assets.

Um but we can get back with you on more of uh our comprehensive plan.

That would be helpful um to know both for police and fire.

Um all of our assets, how old they are, what needs they have.

Um, that way we can work with you and and think ahead and see how we can make sure that that we're meeting all their urgent needs.

Um those are my immediate questions, Vice Chair.

Any questions for 6.1?

Uh yes, Madam Chair.

Um just a couple questions for you all.

Uh would the contractor um Gandalf.

I hope I'm pronouncing that right.

Um, just wondering, is this a does this contractor use union labor?

Uh we'll have to uh through the chair, we'll have to get back with you on the answer to that question, unless uh OCP, if you're aware.

I'm not aware, but I can check into it.

Thank you.

And in addition, do you have any numbers on the makeup of their workforce uh when it comes to the Detroit residents?

Yes, we do give me one moment.

Okay.

Um while that information is being um found, just wondering, I know this is a two-year contract, but where does the um anticip is the anticipated timeline for construction two years or is it shorter?

Uh through the chair, uh it's it'll be uh three phases of improvements with each phase taking approximately uh 18 weeks.

So we believe it it'll likely be shorter than two years.

Thank you.

And and also in this contract, does it include fixed pricing for materials or are there other provisions that allow for price adjustments?

Um if there is any cost increase to tariffs or market fluctuation, if you can just give us a view of how this contract handles those price controls.

Uh through the chair, it's kind of a hybrid.

There's fixed um fees for um design permit drawings and uh general conditions, um insurance bonds and a cap on markup fees.

Uh the additional costs are uh rate based based on the hourly rates of uh various personnel thank you for that.

And so with this contract, um I know again, I know it's for two years, but is the amount that's listed there based on the anticipated hours, or is there I'm just trying to make sure that we are um paying for the actual work um in that way.

I know there's some some controls here for overruns, but so the hours that we're anticipating for the two million is based on the three phases of 18 weeks, correct?

Uh yes.

Okay.

Through the chair, they're using 60 percent Detroit residents.

Okay, 60 percent.

Okay.

Um would love to get that uh union question asked before um formal if possible.

Thank you, madam chair.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

To to that question about unions and really we're asking about safe, good quality jobs that that pay their employees well.

Um we have a responsible contracting ordinance.

Um to OCP, does that only apply to certain contracts, or is that for I don't recall anymore, and I and I should.

I I know that it was very big for big major construction capital projects, but is that at all something that that we have to follow as well when it comes to all contracts, no matter how big or small they are.

Can you repeat the question?

We have a responsible contract uh ordinance.

Do we utilize that for all contracts, or is that just for big major construction jobs?

Um in the city.

We are we typically that's for major, and that is part of the uh inside the the contract description or when with the RFP is solicited as well as uh subcontractors and Detroit residents, or we've tried to get a certain percent.

That's why we we asked that question and to go through major contracts before it actually comes to you guys.

Okay, thank you.

Just wanted to get that confirmation.

Okay.

Um agreed, it would be helpful just to know whether or not this is also union work.

Um there was a request for new business, Vice Chair.

Do you feel comfortable uh sending this off note uh expecting the information before tomorrow morning?

Um, or would you like to hold this?

Um what are your thoughts?

Uh through you, madam chair.

I'm just wondering, I mean, okay.

I know there's a request for new business.

When are we anticipating when are we wanting construction to start at this location?

Would anyone happen to know the start date, the anticipated start date for construction services for this?

It's gonna be like a week or a month.

Uh through the chair, we're we're anticipating starting work uh upon receipt of uh executed contract.

So we we would get started uh as soon as this this contract's approved.

Okay, thank you.

And through the chair, I I will have that information for you today.

Okay.

Thank you.

All right.

Vice Chair, the other thing that we can always do is hold things and not approve them at formal session if we have not received the information, which I'm very okay with doing as well.

Absolutely.

Through you, Madam Chair.

I I don't want to put a recommendation to approval until I know that union information.

So if we can just send a new business without recommendation, uh um, I'll make that motion.

Okay.

I am in support hearing no objections.

6.1 will be sent to new business without recommendation.

Uh Mr.

Kane.

Through the chair, I did just uh receive confirmation that that candle does uh is union.

Thank you for that information.

Well, madam chair, I will amend my motion and send to motion to send to do business with a recommendation to approve.

Hearing no objection 6.1 will be sent to new business with the recommendation to approve.

Thank you for the information.

We promise you we will help you as long as we get it.

We just need the information.

So thank you all.

Um I will now move us along to the rest of the agenda.

6.2.

This is contract number 6007 eight thirty-one.

This is utilizing 100% capital bond funding.

This is for citywide firehouse renovations.

The contractor is W3 Construction Company, they're in Detroit.

This is for two years at 3,861,640 with 38 cents.

This too is for construction and demolition.

I believe we will be joined by the same members that we have here on the panel, along with DC Hillman and Rhea Bautista.

If we can also make them panelists, Mr.

Washington, is there anyone else that should be joining us for 6.2?

No, those are the correct representatives.

Okay, thank you.

And the questions that I have are for fire.

Thank you.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

There's a motion to discuss six points two to our new panelists.

If you can please introduce yourself.

Good afternoon.

Uh Deputy Commissioner Derek Hellman.

Thank you for joining us, DC.

We're discussing 6.2 regarding firehouse renovations.

Um, if you wouldn't mind sharing with us what these renovations will do for fire.

Sure.

Um I want to make sure I'm talking about the right one.

So I apologize.

I'm pulling it up on my screen right now.

This is the capital funding for citywide firehouse renovations.

So what can the public expect from this?

Sure.

Um, so there's several projects, and uh um if RIA, I don't know if Rhea's on here, but uh through the chair.

Oh, first off, thank you for taking the question.

That's a great question.

So uh we have identified uh numerous different areas that we want to um attack with uh this funding.

Uh a lot of it is making sure the roughs are um 100% completed within the department.

Uh we're gonna look at doing uh tuck pointing, uh concrete work, uh foundational work, your your uh um HVAC, all those things have been identified throughout different uh phases.

So um, and obviously having um over 38 locations, this amount of money goes very quick.

So um we we've identified several different uh projects throughout the city, and um Rhea could probably uh talk uh a little bit better on the different ones that are on the top of the list, but uh we have sat down and went through um the major projects that we want to get taken care of.

Thank you.

Would you happen to know what those are?

I guess how many fire stations or you know how many of these buildings are we going to renovate.

Gotcha.

Um manager Batista director, I apologize.

She's looks like she's on.

She can uh I do believe she's joining us as a panelist now.

Hello.

Hi.

Good afternoon.

Good afternoon, if you wouldn't mind setting your naming title for the public.

Um my name is Rhea Bautista.

I am the capital planning manager for construction and demolition department.

Thank you for joining.

Um I'm just wondering.

Here we have a contract for for firehouse renovations.

Uh how many firehouses are we looking to to to renovate?

There was very little information shared for this contract.

So I'm just wondering what we can expect to be addressed.

Yes.

Through the chair.

This contract is throughout all firehouse stations.

So there's about 30 plus on the list.

And what we did to prioritize the work is items that needed to be addressed right away, things that we did preventative maintenance for for a while, or did some minor repairs that we knew the end of life is coming to the end.

And we also work with DC Hellman as well as or the fire department to kind of prioritize the needs of their operation of two.

So a lot of the work is data good repairs.

You could see throughout the firehouses.

There's some roof that needed to be replaced as well as gutters.

We have concrete aprons at certain firehouses.

So have I believe two houses that needed some windows replacement, minor electrical updates as well, and some um what else was overhead doors was another one that is the main item on the list.

Thank you for that overview.

It would be helpful to know two things.

One again, this contract does not tell me what those 30 are, what you're trying to do.

It's a very blanket contract, which is not helpful to understand how we're helping you guys.

And the other is how these renovations, the changes are gonna help the overall strategic capital investments and growth that I know fire needs.

How does this contract support those needs and and does it support those needs?

Yes.

So through through the chair.

Okay.

So these uh like I said, our main items that are in media needs.

Um like for example, um, at Shoemaker, there's a couple leaks that we did some repairs and um we but it's came up or the repairs is not unfortunately um fixing the whole uh problem.

So we have to change the roof.

So right now these are kind of just the safe that we're focusing on safety of the environments as well as to make sure um nothing deters them from their operation.

And we do have um a strategic planning RFP that's gonna go out here um in the new fiscal year, and that will focus a lot on the operation of um fire and um DC Helm can expand on this, but more so of making sure there are coverage throughout um Detroit.

Okay.

DC, do you have anything to add?

So uh through the chair, uh I I really appreciate your questions here because this is you know what we've been talking about is trying to get the department moving into the future.

And these contracts right now are just a state of good repair.

So we're just fixing our current infrastructure, right?

So to move forward, that's what that RFP is gonna do.

We're actually going to put out uh comprehensive RFP looking at our deployment, looking at um exactly how many uh possibly new stations, what kind of different um uh facilities we may need, you know, type you know, size and actually reducing the number of uh stations out there, but still keeping the same capacity, if not increasing our capacity to serve the citizens better.

So that's uh that's where we need to get to, and we we look forward to bringing that plan to you.

Okay, thank you for that clear.

So 6.2 addressing the immediate needs that we know we have because we've we we've heard it from our our firefighters and the need to address um a lot of these stations um and a strategic plan is to come.

Um DC, to that point, any idea when you'll receive if you sent out an RFP recently, when are you expected to receive the information?

Excuse it through the chair.

Uh the RFP has uh not gone out yet, but that should be uh happened here shortly.

So uh we do have uh the scope of work uh pretty much laid out so we can uh look at uh getting you more updated at the next time we meet.

Okay.

Vice Chair, any questions for six points two?

Thank you, Madam Chair.

In addition to your question and the information uh requested, thank you for that.

I I have some requests on this as I actually on the previous one.

Would this work?

Um let me just go back to the contractor um for this with W3 construction.

Um I know they're a Detroit-based, but if you have insight on the number of Detroiters they have employed or the percentages of Detroiters they have employed will be on this this work, and also if there are if they are a union contractor.

Technically or not union signed up as union employees.

Okay.

If there is someone on from OCP to just give insight on the percentage of the charges that they have, and also were union contractors considered for this bid.

Mr.

Washington, who do we have from OCP for 6.2 through the chair?

Can we promote Raymond Green?

Oh, yes.

Mr.

Green uh will be promoted, and we should be able to see when he has joined us.

Raymond Green, Office of Contract and Procurement.

I did hear the question.

Excuse me.

So they were gonna have 75 working on this project with 51 being residents of Detroit, which is 68%.

And they are union.

Oh so they are union.

All right.

Thank you for that.

And glad to hear that percentage as well.

Um, those are the only questions I have, Madam Chair.

Okay, thank you, Vice Chair.

Um, to is it director Bautista?

Yeah.

If you wouldn't care, capital planning manager, yes.

Our capital planning manager, if you wouldn't mind, uh, you said that you do have the list of what is to be expected to be repaired with this contract, correct?

Yes, we have a priority list.

You have a priority list.

Okay.

Um, if you wouldn't mind sharing that with us today, um, there was a request for this to also be sent to new business.

Um, but I I just would find it helpful to know what we're looking at.

If you can share that with with committee members, um uh maybe all of my colleagues will have the same question to share it with with the full council.

Um, and then if we get this in today, um, I can confirm it tomorrow morning at formal session.

Um, that is really what I what I would be looking for.

Um, to well, we'll be looking for before the final votes.

Vice chair?

One additional question.

Um, when does I know this is for citywide and you have priority projects.

When do you all expect to start that work under this?

Through the chair.

Um, so usually when we get these contracts, and once we get it, we'll do a full assessment of um our lists and what needs to be done to accomplish those services.

So that usually takes about I would say two months, and from there, um, we will get another month for the contractor to bid it out, the scope of services.

Um, and we'll be able to start the construction within like three months after um getting the contract.

Thank you, madam chair.

I'm just I asked that because I'm wondering, I know there is a request for new business, but I know there's a request for additional information.

Um so I'm just trying to see if it would be detrimental if we brought it back once we fulfill all that.

I'm I'm fine with moving forward, but just want to do our due diligence in it.

Yeah.

Heard.

Um they are hiring Detroiters.

It's it's a union, it's a union company, which I appreciate.

Hearing that timeline, I don't know how much more of the year will be left um to begin a lot of this work.

Although this isn't necessarily outside construction, right?

This is to a facility, so they can work inside.

Um I'm just thinking about the weather here.

DC, I see you got offline.

Yeah, through the chair.

Yes, this is actually out a lot of outside work too.

So um, if we could uh move forward, I'd appreciate it, and we could provide you that list.

Okay, I'm okay with that.

As a chair, I will move it out.

My vice chair is completely correct, though.

We are, and this is to the administration once again.

We really want to work with you.

We need information before we are set to approve something that is utilizing so much of our money, and that we need to get done, and we need to we want to know what those expectations are.

So we'll move it out, but I I might just begin to hold things back, but we'll work with you here, but please, folks, to the administration to the OCP's office.

Getting this with more time would be very helpful for all of us.

Is there a motion?

I'm okay with this moving forward to a formal two new business with the recommendation.

Actually, we can do no recommendation.

Madam Chair.

Yes, Vice Chair.

Um, since there is incomplete information, I would actually make a motion to send to new business without any recommendation.

I support hearing no objections, 6.2 will be sent to new business.

It will be sent without recommendation.

We will share with our colleagues why it moved out of committee without recommendation.

And quite frankly, it's just because of the of the lack of information.

So the the better that we get at this, the the better we'll be able to support these contracts out of committee.

But for now, this is out.

Um we'll be on the lookout for that information.

Um, but please do work together with us and the office of contracting procurement to try to get this to committee before because these requests to new business really what it is is requesting to approve without asking these questions, uh without waiting for this information, um, which I'm not comfortable with.

Uh, there is a motion.

This has been sent to new business with no recommendation.

Thank you all so much for taking the time.

I appreciate it.

I will now move us along to the rest of the agenda.

Okay.

Thank you.

You got the second group for the next one.

Six points three.

This is contract number six zero zero six two one five, amendment number three.

This is utilizing eighty-two percent ARPA, 18% UTGO funding.

This is the third amendment to ex to provide an extension of time and provide additional contract language for construction services for the DFD annex additions at three different existing fire stations.

The contractor's major contracting, this is in Detroit's.

This amendments will be through December 31st of 2026.

And the contract number will stay the same.

We should have Raquel Harrington, Sonia Clifton, and then our manager in DC.

Is there a motion to discuss?

Motion to discuss.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

To whoever can answer DC, thank you for joining us again.

Can you let us know what's this additional contract language is for this for this uh contract?

Uh through the chair, the main thing is the extension of time.

Okay.

Because of uh the construction has uh exceeded the time that it was originally on the contract, so we were looking for a small extension.

They are in the wrap-up phase in the almost uh completion phase, you should say for two of the annexes and the third annex will be completed uh later this year.

So we're we're moving along pretty well with them.

It's mainly just the extension of time.

And I feel like I do remember the additional contract language before, and that was something that if this is the third amendment we discussed, we approved.

I don't see additional funding here, and it is a smaller amount of time just to wrap up the work.

Um yes, vice chair.

Thank you, and thank you all so much.

I just have one question, and DC um this may be one of the locations that is wrapped up, but for engine 55 on Joy Road, um, has that work?

Is that work in a wrap-up phase?

Or still ongoing?

Through the chair, that is uh that is correct.

It's still ongoing, but it's getting very close.

Okay, just one on that location.

I we did receive some concerns around from residents in the area on um traffic because that's also area that's impacted by the construction of the new Cody High School.

Um, so I think it was just around um street blockage and and such.

If folks have those concerns, um just want to one, I want to check if there is like a traffic plan in place around the area because I already know it's already tight um coming off of Southfield Freeway, but also is there a direct contact uh residents can reach out to if they have issues around the impact of construction there.

The chair, I would have to decur to manager Batista on the construction like uh parking if that's if that's being an issue.

Um I haven't heard of that as of lately, so um if there is uh can always contact the the fire department to to let us know through our um relations division, which would filter all the comments to the appropriate individuals too.

So okay.

All right, we will definitely let folks know about that.

We'll do the same.

Um, but just on the question, um, manager Batista.

Um do you have is there a traffic plan in place for this location?

Chair, um, I know in regards to traffic they you and permanently they have to work with DPW, but I'll we'll get mid-major on the plan.

Um, and if there's any issues or concerns, they are welcome to reach out to construction demolition department or myself directly if uh and we could make sure we address those concerns.

Okay.

Thank you.

Yep, I would love to follow up on um, yeah, just the plan move before.

I know it's gonna wrap up phase.

I think a lot of these um concerns came up around when it was really in a thicker thing, so um, we'll definitely follow up on that.

Thank you.

Thank you, madam chair.

Thank you.

Um, Miss Harrington, would you happen to know if there's a contract or if there's a contact um for this construction project?

Uh if there are any concerns with traffic, just echoing through the chair echoing um where Rhea mentioned we would go through DPW um when it comes to the traffic and all that stuff and notifying the public.

Well, at this time I do not have that information for you.

Okay.

And this is extension of time only, no additional funding, correct?

No additional ARPA money or anything will be used for this contract.

Okay, thank you.

Uh Vice Chair, uh, guess what?

There was also a request for new business uh for this item.

This item contract ends June 30th, so at the end of next month.

Um I I think it's a valid question, especially when residents need someone to call.

Um, and and really that person should be provided by the construction company, the ones that are on site doing the work.

Um Madam Chair.

Yes, vice chair.

I guess I just have an additional question for the folks who are on with us for an administration.

Um can you all before tomorrow just get me you know any plans around traffic, um, what has been told to residents what's the plan moving forward until the ending of the wrap up of this location and with that direct contact.

Um, are you all able to do that before tomorrow?

Okay.

All right.

Um with that, madam chair, I will um make a motion to send to do business without any recommendation.

Hearing no objections to the motion, 6.3 will be sent to new business without recommendation, and we will be on the lookout for that information.

And I'm just realizing too, we're giving them more work in a very, very quick turnaround.

That's not a fun thing to do.

No, I would not want to do that.

Uh, but if we get the information before, then we can also, and if and if we had more time, right, then we wouldn't all have to feel so rushed to do this so quickly, Vice Chair.

I would say, yeah, I think the the time and aspect of getting the information and and um and whether yeah, just having these conversations beforehand would be useful.

I will also say um as we are thinking about also the uh contract around um the overall maintenance, and I think this is for not only DFD um but for DPD and and and CDD as well with these projects, like having a clear plan on notification of residents, notification around um how long I know some departments already may do this, but giving us that information of what is that plan for that public outreach beforehand would be beneficial as well, so that we can let our constituents know, but also um the accountability piece as well.

The next thing I will say um since these are new projects, um, especially the two that we consider beforehand, um, would love if there's a contact that we can connect with with CDD to invite, you know, if these contracts are to go through to invite some of the contractors to the skill trace task force um to connect even more residents to these opportunities that would be beneficial as well.

Thank you, madam chair.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

Yes, we need to do all of those things.

Um appreciates your comments and we will we will get through this.

Uh we will I I do believe we can get better.

Um so there was a motion already made.

This has been sent to new business.

We'll be on the lookout for the information, and I believe we have a few more contracts where we might be speaking to you guys again.

So I'll move us along to the rest of the agenda.

Thank you for being with us to discuss six point four.

We have already discussed six point five.

So we are now down to 6.6.

This is and vice chair.

We have two or no, this this is our last request.

Clarification, we didn't consider 6.4.

Oh, I'm sorry.

Thank you.

Oh, we have not.

I'm sorry.

It's just also requested for new business.

So I confused it because there are so many.

Um, and just with that, there are two other requests in our agenda for new business, Vice Chair.

So just preparing this for that.

6.4 is one of them.

Thank you for the correction.

6.4.

This is contract number 6006502 amendment number one.

This is utilizing ARPA funding.

This amendment is to provide an extension of time and an increase of funds only for design build service for the design engineering and construction renovation at the Mount Elliott Senior Community Center for the neighboring community contractors, DMC consultants.

They're in Detroit.

This amendments will go through September 30th of 2026.

This total increase will be for 300,000, bringing this total contract and investments at 3,943,687.

This again will be construction and demolition.

We should be uh joined by Mr.

Kell Harrington and Sonia Kilt Clifton to discuss 6.4.

If we can please make them into panelists.

Motion to discuss.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

Madam Chair.

Yes, madam.

This is the second amendment.

Thank you.

This is the second amendment.

We're adding time and funds.

Hello to our press secretary.

If you wouldn't mind sharing with us the status of this uh construction project, it's ARPA funding.

It looks like it's towards the end.

If you wouldn't let us know where we are in in this process, yes, uh, through the chair.

Uh Rhea would be better uh to answer that, but right now I can you repeat the question.

My apologies.

What is the status of this construction project?

Why are we asking for the extension of time?

And if Rhea's better prepared to answer that, I I am more than happy to turn it over to Rhea if she's on if she's still with us.

Or Nick, if Nick is on the call as well.

This will probably be Nick because Ria, I believe, works with FIRE, and this is for community or RIA to our manager.

Would you also happen to be prepared to answer questions for 6.4?

You're in the chair, yes.

Oh, okay.

And then just to confirm, sorry, you do capital management projects for fire and for the city or just for fire.

It's for um all of the city of Detroit.

Oh, you're in construction and demolition.

Correct.

Thank you.

Okay, this is helpful.

I appreciate that.

All right, so if you wouldn't mind um giving us some information of where we are in the status of this project or the status of this project.

Yes, uh through the chair, we are roughly about 80% done with the building itself, and I think I mentioned 60% um of the parking lot um renovation.

And so the reason why we need extension is mainly of the um the connection of the sewer line.

So we try to use an existing sewer line that we thought was parallel to the building.

Um, but when we did excavation, we couldn't find it.

Um, so we work with DWSD to kind of find our another option that we um or essentially to find the connect the connecting points.

Um, so we did end up finding one in the back alley, but since the elevation is a little bit higher than what we wanted, we have to add some pump plus the linear feet is about three or four times more than what we originally designed.

Okay, and then with the additional ARPA funding, we we would be using ARPA funding, correct?

That is correct.

With the additional ARPA funding, um 80% complete.

This ends in September.

That is when we are set to complete this project then.

Okay, vice chair.

Any questions for 6.4?

No, no further questions.

If there are no questions, there was a request for new business.

Is there a motion?

Motion to send to new business with a recommendation to approve.

Hearing no objections, 6.4 will be sent to new business with the recommendation to approve.

Thank you both.

Thank you.

6.5.

This is contract number 6004, amendment number one utilizing 100% city funding to provide an extension of time.

Oh, we have discussed 6.5.

This is the uh shot spotter sound thinking contract.

So moving us along to 6.6.

I believe, Vice Chair, this is our last request for new business on our agenda.

6.6.

This is contract number 6007828 utilizing 100% major street funding.

This will provide manufacture and delivery of by two by two minutes aggregate uh paving mixtures.

The contractor here is Ajax Paving Industries.

They're located in Warren, Michigan.

This is a one-year contract at 6,840.

And this will be for public works.

We should be joined by Christopher Jones and Director Brundage.

If we can please make them into panelists, and again, this is uh being requested for new business.

If when our panelists join us, if they wouldn't mind stating your names and titles for the public.

A motion to discuss.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

Hi, good afternoon.

Chris Jones, Office of Contracting and Procurement.

Good afternoon.

Thank you for joining us.

I have really just what would what would this mixture be used for?

It's six million dollars is for one year.

Would you happen to know what it's being used for?

Uh yes.

I I know the name is is kind of longer than it needs to be, but it's it's really just the yasbar.

Okay.

And then this is the asphalt for sidewalk, or what will this be addressed?

No, yes, but for various streets throughout the city of Detroit.

Oh, for various uh street projects.

Okay.

Um that's helpful to know.

It would just be helpful to know what those projects are.

Um usually, oh, I think our director is joining us.

Oh, Mr.

Washington.

Yes, through the chair, director Brundon is joining joining us now.

Okay, thank you.

If you want to bring this item towards the end, Director Bronte should be on.

He had a conflict, so he was juggling multiple meetings.

No worries.

We are also uh in committee longer than usual, so I understand if he's busy.

We can come back to 6.6 then.

Um without objection.

I will move us along under the Department of Appeals of Appeals and Hearings.

6.7.

This is a dangerous findings, the dangerous buildings findings and orders for April 17th, 2026.

If there's a motion to receive and file, motion to receive and file.

Hearing no objections, 6.7 will be received and filed.

6.8 is the dangerous buildings findings and orders for May 1st of 2026.

If there's a motion to receive and file, motion to receive and file.

Hearing no objections, 6.8 will be received and filed.

6.9 is a report on an ordinance requiring locked storage containers for 2.5 ounces or more of cannabis in residences.

This is the report.

We can receive and file.

Motion to receive and file 6.9.

Hearing no objections, 6.9 will be received and filed.

Under the departments of public work city engineering.

6.10.

This is a petition of SC development.

They are requesting to vacate at varying widths.

Um this would be vacating alleys that are bounded by West 8 Mile, Telegraph Road.

Suwasi.

How do you pronounce this?

Sawahasy.

Oh, I'll see.

Uh, and Grandview Avenue.

There have been no objections from any private utility companies.

There's been a request or not a request.

Nope.

And this would be for and this will be protecting the utility installations.

Is there a motion for 6.10 and motion to approve or discuss?

Motion to approve.

Hearing no objection, 6.10 will be approved.

Sent to formal with the recommendation to approve.

Under miscellaneous 6.11.

This is a memo relative to documenting adult-oriented businesses in district four.

We've been asked to bring this back in two weeks.

Motion to bring it back 6.11 and two weeks.

Hearing no objections, 6.11 will be brought back in two weeks.

6.12.

This is a memo relative to request for district five hazardous materials.

Currently in use.

Hearing no objections, 6.12.

We will be brought back in two weeks.

613, a memo relative to request for fire departments to change a plan update with the request for bring back in two weeks.

Motion bring back 6.13 in two weeks.

Hearing no objections, 6.13 will be brought back in two weeks.

614 is a memo relative to a request for resolution recognizing April 25th, 2027.

As Drudas promised day.

Okay.

Then we can I know the resolution is complete.

Um the resolution will be coming.

I I feel more comfortable receiving and filing once we see the resolution at the on the agenda as well.

So if we can bring this back in two weeks, motion to bring back in two weeks.

Hearing no objections, 6.16, we brought back in two weeks.

That brings us down to member reports, but we need to go back to 6.6.

If we have director Brundage on with us, if we can please make them into a panelist if there's a motion to discuss.

Motion to discuss.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

Good afternoon.

If you wouldn't mind stating your names and titles for the public, sure.

Good afternoon.

Ron Brennan's director of DPW.

Thank you for joining us.

Christopher Jones introduced himself earlier as well.

Thank you for joining us.

Uh director, we're discussing 6.6.

This is a six million dollar um asphalt contract.

Just wondering if you can let us know what streets will be repaved.

Would you happen to know what projects this will uh support?

Uh thank you, madam chair.

Um this is our astral materials contract, uh contract for materials that are delivered uh for paving residential streets.

Uh the streets will actually be paved by BPW street maintenance crews.

Uh and this is the materials delivery contract.

Uh this year we're gonna be paving about 27 miles of local streets uh throughout the city.

Uh, I can certainly provide to your office uh listing by city council district of all 27 miles of streets that are going to be paid this year uh with the material that we receive from this contract.

Okay, I would appreciate that.

Also, um I believe DPW then is is also going to is this going to be residential streets, so not sidewalks, but residential streets, and you are notifying the public, correct?

Once uh you will be coming to their neighborhood.

Sorry, madam chair.

We are we will notify the um the residents before any work begins on those particular streets.

And just as an FYI, uh in addition to uh paving residential streets, uh, whenever we pave a residential street, it also gives us the opportunity to inspect and identify any damaged curb or city tree damage sidewalk uh adjacent to those streets.

So that ends up becoming part of the overall construction project.

So in addition to paving the streets, uh, we'll also uh address any damage curve.

And if there's any city sidewalk uh along those adjacent streets, I will also take care of those as part of the overall pavement program.

Understood.

Okay, thank you.

Um we are getting reports that that work is coming much as exciting.

There are flyers um that are being sent to to neighborhoods letting them know that paving is coming.

Uh there's just no uh start dates, um, you know, time or or even streets that can be expected to change um or they're going to be addressed.

Uh so grateful that we're that we are notifying the public, but we are we're not giving a lot of information.

Would it be possible to send out to include dates, start dates, or to include project timelines so that the public is is better informed?

It's challenging for us to provide accurate start dates.

You know, a lot of things factor in, uh, such as weather that can you know push uh starting dates back, or find the last thing that we would want to do is provide you know dates that we're not able to comply with.

Uh, but we would we certainly notify the residents on the blocks where work is occurring prior to construction beginning on those blocks.

And then in addition, we also uh will put no parking signs on the streets in advance of uh any construction occurring.

Okay.

But it's actually really difficult for us to provide a written schedule that we're gonna be able to really uh maintain.

Okay, that's fair.

Would it be possible to have a map that just overlays which sites or which streets will be impacted with construction?

That way at least people know, and also if people have to park off the street, then they will know that they're they're gonna have to come up with uh alternative parking solutions.

We we we can certainly provide on our website uh a sequential list of the streets that we anticipate getting to, say within the uh within a relatively short period, say the upcoming two to four weeks or so, just to give residents an idea of when we're gonna be in their neighborhood, when we're gonna be on their block.

That would be really helpful.

Um so maybe that looks like an additional QR code if you want to learn more to a website that you can update and provide more information as needed.

That sounds like a good idea to me.

Um, so thank you for that, Director.

Uh any other questions for 6.6.

Vice Chair?

Uh good morning, director.

I'm not sure if this is a question for your for OCP.

Um, I know there were two contractors, uh, there were two bids for this project.

Um, just wanted to knowing that Ajax is in Warren.

Um, I know they do quite a bit of work, but just want to give insight to get insight on the other contractor where they Detroit-based.

Uh to the chair, the member McCampbell, uh, the other contractor or the other bid was from Cadillac Asphalt, uh, that is a Detroit-based uh company, and they did receive uh, I believe uh if Chris knows is still on the call, he can uh respond to it.

I believe they did get the uh that the city of Detroit uh adjustment to their bid that was taken into consideration.

Uh uh Ajax was still the overall low bidder.

Uh when we put this particular bid out, uh we actually it actually has two separate uh unit uh unit uh items that uh each contractor bids on.

Uh and we we like to award to the overall low bidder.

Uh we have two separate items because when we pave a street, uh we apply one layer of asphalt with a specific mixed design, and then we come back and apply a second layer of asphalt uh with a different mix design and it has a different cost.

So we uh ask we we uh have the contractors submit to submit two separate uh unit costs.

We like to award to the same company uh because any event that we have any uh warranty issues or any defects, uh we'll know that uh which manufacturers responsible for the defects.

So we really try to avoid uh having one contract to provide one layer of asphalt and then a different contract to provide a different layer.

So uh in this particular case, you are correct.

Uh the other company was Detroit based, and uh that was taken into consideration, but Ajax was still the overall obidder, uh, even with the Detroit-based adjustment.

Thank you for that, director.

And do you know?

I know um Warren is a border city of ours.

Uh, do you know how many Detroiters Ajax employees?

Uh I don't have that information.

I I know that the Office of Procurement uh did I thought they provide that with their uh with their write up.

Uh and again, if Mr.

Jones is still on the call, uh I think he can he might be able to provide more information there.

I see Chris now.

Hi, yes.

Uh to the chair, I can provide that information for you.

Okay.

Do you know how soon we could get that info?

Mr.

Jones, are you?

Oh, he's he's tapping away.

He might be trying to find that information now.

Are you the chair?

It will take me a couple minutes.

I don't know how much time you have available.

Okay.

The question is, Vice Chair, the amount of Detroit employees.

Okay.

We can give you a few, uh, Mr.

Jones.

This is our last item.

Um, this is also requested to new business.

Um so I'm I'm okay with taking the time now to get this uh answer to a question, which I think we should have the information already.

And I know sometimes the weight is the system itself being slow.

So I think how about Dr.

Powers?

Can I move us to member reports and then move us back?

Okay, so OCP, while you look for that information without objection, I will move to member reports to give us some time.

Um, and then we'll come back to 6.6.

But for member reports, vice chair.

Thank you, madam chair.

Just for me, all member reports that we will be having a our month our D7 monthly meeting tomorrow, May 19th.

Um, it will be virtual uh at 6 p.m.

We'll have folks from the department of neighborhoods and also from the public light lighting authority um to talk about the mid-block lighting program and to just hear folks' concerns of uh for the department of neighborhoods.

So please do join us again.

That's Tuesday, May 19th, virtually at from 6 to 7:30 p.m.

Um if you do need to get the Zoom link, um you can either reach out to our office at 313-224-2151 again, 313-224-2151, or send us a quick email at Councilmember Denzel, D-E-N-Z-E-L at Detroit Mi.gov.

Again, that's council member Denzel at Detroit MI.gov, and we'll make sure to get you the link.

That is all for me, madam chair.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

For our office, would like to invite District 6 residents to our office hours tonight from 4 to 6 p.m.

I will be at recognition uh at Kemini Rec Center for our office hours.

This is a really great time for us to have a one-on-one.

If you have any questions for me, concerns, ideas, uh, this is where you will find me.

Um, and happy to discuss anything that you'd like.

We can even talk about fund summer plans, whatever you got.

Um, and then want to also invite folks for this Friday, our coffee hour.

We were gonna uh co-host our next coffee hour with Team Chang.

We are going to be at uh Kitab Midtown coffee shop.

Um, and it's going to be at 11 a.m.

So would love to see folks there.

These are very informative.

Um resources and updates from the state.

Um, and then we're able to both take questions together from from residents.

Uh so hope to see you there.

With that, Madam Chair.

Oh, Vice Chair.

Just one more.

Um, I know Member Waters is not with us today, so uh be remiss if I didn't not mention that there is the skilled trace task force meeting this Wednesday, May 20th from six from 4 to 6 p.m.

Um again, Wednesday, May 20th from 4 to 6 p.m.

at the Farwell Recreation Center.

That's 2711 East Alder Drive uh in Detroit.

So please do come out uh to the skill trades task force meeting.

Thank you.

Thank you.

With that, is there a motion to discuss 6.6?

Motion to discuss.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

Yes, OCP.

Um thank you.

Thank you.

Um for your patience.

Uh yeah, this is a goods contract, and they estimate a total of 12 individuals working on this project, four of which uh are City of Detroit residents, so about 33% okay.

Thank you.

I would um thank you for that.

I would just say I know I know Ajax gets a lot of work, and and this is uh I know this is a goods contract.

Um for them to be so close to Detroit and especially getting so much money from the city for this.

Um, I would just encourage if there's something that OCP or DPW can do to work with Ajax and work with you know the members here on the council and administration to increase the number of Detroiters that work there.

Um that I think that is something that is needed, especially with the amount of money that is going to them.

Thank you, ma'am chair.

Thank you, Vice Chair.

I have no other questions for this contract.

Uh is there a motion?

And again, a reminder there was a request for new business.

Yes.

All right.

I so I I I will I will be transparent and say I do have concerns around um the number of Detroiters.

Um so I I would actually make a motion to send a do new business without any recommendation.

Hearing no objections, six point six will be sent to new business.

It will be sent without a recommendation, and our colleagues will ask why we will mention it at the table.

Um but this will be sent for discussion at formal session.

So thank you both for joining us.

And I will now move us along to the end of the agenda.

Seeing that there is nothing else before us, we are now adjourned.