Good evening and welcome to the September 3rd, 2025 regular meeting of the Town of Erie Pointing Commission.

The time is now 6.29 p.m.

I'm calling this meeting to order.

Please join me for the Pledge of Allegiance.

Pledge of allegiance through the flag, United States of America.

One nation on your guy.

In the visible liberty and justice.

Will the Secretary please call roll?

Commissioner Booth.

Here.

Commissioner Solbush.

Live from the Council Chambers.

Commissioner Drekman.

Here.

Commissioner Burns.

Here.

Commissioner Baham.

Here.

Vice Chair Brodus is absent and excused.

Chair Hempel.

Here.

We have a quorum.

Thank you.

And we have an agenda before us.

So staff have any changes?

No changes.

Do we have a motion?

Motion.

Second.

Motion and a second.

All in favor say aye.

Aye.

All opposed say no.

All right.

Motion passes unanimously.

Brings us to approval of the August 20th, 2025 appointing commission meeting minutes.

Do we have any changes?

Or a motion?

Motion.

Second.

Burns.

Motion and a second.

All in favor say aye.

Aye.

All opposed say no.

Motion passes unanimously.

This brings us to the public comments portion of the meeting.

This is for public comments intended for items not already on the scheduled on the agenda.

Is there anyone in the waiting room signed up or in the audience for public comment?

There are no attendees in the virtual waiting room.

We have one person signed up on the sign-up sheet.

All right, let me do my uh explanation of public comments and then we'll get right into it.

So public comment is limited to three minutes per person.

When you are called upon, you will be asked to state your name and place of residence for the record.

A reminder that public comment is not an interactive question and answer form, but rather a time for you to state your comments on a particular item or issue.

You will be given a 20-second warning when your three minutes are almost up.

At the three-minute mark, I'll ask that you wrap up your final sentence.

If you are giving comments virtually, we ask that you wrap up and meet your microphone.

You may resume watching or disconnect at that time.

So we'll we have one person here and it's Teron Gangwani.

Please state your name and address for the record, please.

My name is Tarun Gangwani.

I live at 967 Highland Circle, Erie, Colorado, in Erie Highlands District 2.

And then I'm joined by Sarah Morgan, who is also resident of the same neighborhood.

Cool.

Sorry, good call.

Yep.

Okay, cool.

I'm gonna read.

Sorry about this.

Uming, members of the commission.

My name is Turin Gangwani.

I'm joined by my neighbor, Sarah Morgan.

Our two families have been proud residents of Erie for more than four years.

We live in the Erie Highlands neighborhood directly adjacent to the proposed commercial development on the corner of Highway 7 and Erie Parkway.

Erie Highlands is full of families, especially on the street where the project's entrance is planned.

When we purchased our homes, we were told by Okwood that this land would be planned for carriage homes.

Then we saw a sign for a middle school.

Now we're told it will be a commercial development with national chain restaurants.

This is a sudden and significant change that's created a great deal of concern.

And I'm here asking your help for addressing this.

My first and most pressing concern is the project's direct impact to our safety.

The proposed design includes an entrance and exit that will bring commercial and interstate traffic directly to our resident streets.

I have a copy of the site plan for you to see.

As you can see, our neighborhood was around walking a neighbor, uh is around at walking elementary school.

We've already had a child hit by a car last year, which led to a new crosswalk.

And we have been asking for more stop signs and crosswalks to address the current traffic issues.

The idea of adding even more high-speed traffic from a commercial development is terrifying.

We need a clear plan for the police department on how to intend to protect the children and pedestrians if this project moves forward.

I urge the commission to work with developers to relocate the access point to the existing road, north or south of the current entrance.

This is a critical step to protect our community.

We understand that the proposed development includes fast food restaurant change, an oil change facility, a medical office building, and many more national uh sorts of developments.

The type of development is typically designed for being close to a highway.

In fact, the developer has explicitly stated the intent for this to be a transit-oriented commercial space to draw visitors from the highway.

We called them.

The intent is misguided due to the fact that similar developments are far more conveniently located on the highway, north or south of our current entrance.

If you had a choice between driving two miles to fast food versus 0.5 miles, one exit up the road, which would you choose?

While our city and while cities across the country are promoting healthier lifestyles and better eating habits for children, which by the way, there's a high school, middle school, elementary school, bunch of kids and families living nearby.

It seems our town is doing the opposite by promoting fast food restaurants directly across the street from the high school and in our neighborhood.

This sends a contradictory message about our community's values or priorities or so.

Instead of attracting businesses that promote unhealthy habits, we should be seizing this opportunity to bring businesses that enrich our community while also supporting our local economy.

Local businesses are the heart of our city.

They're often healthier options, employ neighbors, and contribute directly to the city's unique character.

I asked the commission to reconsider the project's direction.

We should be encouraging a bidding process or offering incentives that prioritize local and small businesses.

Let's build a development that's a true reflection of our community's spirit and values.

In closing, I'm asking the commission to consider two key actions.

One, work with the developments to redesign the traffic flow so that our residential streets are not a thoroughfare for commercial vehicles, and so our traffic cannot feed into local neighborhood roads that are already subject to error and other things.

And encourage local businesses to uh foster development.

Thank you.

Thank you.

All right.

We will move on to general business.

Um I think we'll be all right without Commissioner Burns.

Uh we have two items on the agenda for general business.

Um I'm gonna try something new where I state the time so we can see how long things take.

Um, but it is 636, and our first item is 25436.

Resolution of the point of commission of the town of Erie recommending town council adopt an ordinance, amending Title 10 of the Erie Municipal Code regarding public hearing notice.

And I will turn it over to Steph for the presentation.

I don't actually have a formal presentation for you all.

This is a very um uh an item that we discovered was not codified that was originally passed back in 21.

There were a few things during that time period that we had some issues with Municode, our our uh codifier, and this is one of them.

So um this would just uh actually put those changes into effect.

Um, and it's just really simplifying um what is required for notice as far as how the property is described.

Um this, you know, when people get a um a mailed notice and it has a very complicated legal description on it, they often don't know where that is.

So this would allow um, you know, more uh a map and then either an address or cross streets, things like that.

So just trying to make it more clear for folks.

And um, yeah, happy to take any questions you might have.

All right.

Um I will open the floor if anybody has any questions.

No questions of one question, Commissioner Salash.

Okay, so um this was something from 2021, is that correct?

Yes.

Okay.

And was it part of that massive update that occurred at that time?

Whereas like chapters two, three, four, five, six, seven, nine, ten, and eleven.

I I do not know.

I I was not here.

Um I can pull it up.

Or was it a small update that had occurred?

Well, she's looking at is there uh a reason for since 2020 I've seen every UDC update that has occurred, and this is the first time that this has happened.

Where that what has happened?

That it wasn't codified, but it was intended to be codified at that time.

So the question is how did we identify that this had not occurred so that we had to bring this forward?

I know it's very small, but our legal staff um was reviewing a a notice and recognized that that change did not actually get made.

Good memory.

There was so there was one notice where the description is all these legal I forgot what the application was.

Yeah.

But um then the notice did not accurately, even though there was all these legal descriptions, that's didn't really articulate to any like neighboring property owners or anything like easily what the property was.

Yeah.

Right.

So that was the application was about.

And then we heard complaints that like this notice, we had no idea that it was even about this property, like you have to make it easier for someone that doesn't have like a law degree or planning degree to understand.

Um and so legal, we won't kind of went through saying, you know these this sh we need to revise the code, obviously, to make sure that this doesn't happen.

So okay, so I I totally understand that rationale.

Um the change being name is identify the property subject to the application without any guidance.

So how in that situation where it wasn't even close to where it was supposed to be, didn't know notice properly to other locations, how will they be able to now identify the location without us, you know, saying a street address, legal description, um nearest cross street, something to that effect, what what is it envisioned that they're going to use then?

Because I know this is for all you know, specific applications, um, but it's a broad swath of different applications that that use this section.

Yeah, so I'm not sure what you're asking.

How how are applicants intended to identify the property now?

Uh I mean they can they they can still use a legal description everything, but they also have to provide specifics.

I think the problem was they would say section 14, you know, quarter, but you would they would just be putting the quarter of you know a section.

That's a lot of properties within that area.

So you can still use the l legal description, but you need to provide more specifics in the application.

You can't, so it's not gonna take away what was previously, but you have to pro provide more specifics.

You can review some of these applications and these properties and legal descriptions and if you look if you followed it, you still couldn't tell what property it was.

You have a whole section in the PLSS with multiple properties in it.

So I know that between what we see and what is heard by the council, um, can undergo some slight revisions.

Um, but I might recommend trying to hone in and denote how we still want applicants, how we would prefer applicants to identify this property because as it sits right now, identify the property subject to the application.

And it gets rid of, you know, the ways that we had previously by cross street by legal description by the actual address.

It just says identify the property in what way, where how specifically am I supposed to do that?

Um I know we have again, you know, we have the Alta um Alta titles that do have, you know, this cross section, north 64 of, you know, like totally understand that, but um how we can guide applicants into the way that we would like them to identify the location of the property.

So that's we we do have like a template that we provide to applicants and we review as legal reviewed a notice and notice that it was referencing uh the previous code that didn't get codified.

So I don't think we're gonna we want we don't want to put this that's why we're taking out this specific thing.

So do you do we have the way to identify in the user guides?

Um I don't I don't know off the top of my head if it's in the user guides.

If we have a template, that's probably where we'd want to put it, a way to identify and those user guides can be updated at any time because our UDC references those for the specific application.

So maybe we can add something in there of how to reference in the user guide specifically.

So that's all.

Thank you.

Any questions from my left?

When we talk about notices, are we just are we talking about the mailings, anything in papers?

Yes, those two things only or mailings and what?

Did you uh like the notices in the paper?

Uh-huh.

Just those two items.

Yes.

Okay.

Well, and the posting.

The sign.

Like the actual oh, the yellow sign.

The yellow sign.

Yeah.

Gotcha.

All right.

I don't have any questions.

It seems pretty straightforward.

Um, just gonna add, I mean, during the or during the submittal process, you guys are working with the applicant to give definition.

Yes.

That's part of the answer for expansion.

It's defined because if you got multiple pieces of property that are being rezoned, there's no physical address to identify those yet.

So it's a matter of identifying it for the local property owners, some form of fashion.

So all right.

Any motion.

Motion to approve.

You have a motion and a second.

Does anybody want to do a roll call vote?

All right.

We will do a voice vote.

All in favor say aye.

Aye.

All opposed say no.

Uh motion passes unanimously.

Um time is now 646.

And the second item is 25482, discussion of planning commission roles and responsibilities.

There's two attachments to this discussion, and we'll start on the administrative responsibilities and then move on to the rules of procedure.

Um for the administrative responsibilities, the for my review of it, our only decision role is uh as a planning commission is site plans and everything else is review for this body.

So part of this is our presentation is next Tuesday.

I will be doing that.

And on the slides, I had a note that we talked about about expanding roles.

So just opening the floor to a discussion about what we as a commission want to do and how I can report that to the town council to really start this.

Uh it's a it's a great timing to discuss it and uh get the ball rolling with the meeting with the town council and working through roles.

So um I'm just gonna open the floor to I'll start with my left.

Anybody have comments to start we can start, I guess.

Um looking at the the current roles that we have, really the only thing that we show that does not involve a further town council action is the site plan review.

Um so I I don't know that there's any concern that currently that we have uh responsibilities that are outside of the council's ability to weigh in and make the ultimate decision.

So um we're talking about adding essentially more roles.

I think yeah, I guess volunteering.

Okay.

I you know, and we've talked about this before, I think the last three presentations six month presentations.

I've made the uh we talked about wanting to be able to do more.

Um the only thing I would caution is I I'm not sure I'm comfortable um with the majority of us not being planners, taking on roles that are specifically um planning department roles.

Um I always saw this as something more of helping council um just take some things off of their plate if necessary, um, more so than taking responsibilities from staff just because I'm not a professional planner, and so I'm not sure that I'd be the best uh judge of of some of these things if we were to get into those specifics.

So that's my kind of general comment.

I wholeheartedly agree with anyone over here.

Um I'll start with maybe an maybe an easy one.

Um but I need clarification first.

So um I was looking at other municipalities and seeing what their planning commission does.

Um I did not go into whether it's home rule or not, but one of the municipalities um it looked like they were actually the liaison to some of the other um councils or commissions out there versus their town council.

So I didn't know if that was something that could be where we could step in.

I don't know how many hours they dedicate to being the liaison to some of those other commissions, but to like other advisory boards, yeah.

I mean, okay.

Do you know if that is um like the town council wouldn't be there and then there'd be appointed commissioner and I don't know, I didn't read that far into it.

I don't know what I don't even know what town council's role is once they go to those meetings, what they then do with that.

Um that's true, you do have experience sustainability, and they're having a meeting if we want to recess and see what they're doing back there.

It's gonna be it's gonna be aid on it.

Yeah, it's more of a kind of being there, and at least the first agenda item on ours was just get a report from town council kind of updating what is happening at the council level.

Yeah.

So that would be, I think a little bit harder for us to do in that role, but then they just have a direct um a direct access to a council member.

Yeah, have experience on the town council side of being a liaison.

That that is spelled out in the code.

So I mean, any change like that would take a um a code change.

Like how many hours do you commit being LA bought?

Um depending on their meetings and not being canceled.

Or the town boards and commissions, um, as long as their meetings went uh probably averaged, you know, two hours call it.

Um two hours a month, two hours per meeting, so two meetings per uh month, basically, because uh we're the only ones who meet twice a month or schedule twice a month.

Yeah, yeah.

Um, but then there's also say um if we wanted to have uh you know potentially liaisons to any regional boards or commissions, which is another aspect of that.

So I think there's like 26, 27 different different organizations that the council is also liaisons to, um what ranging from the Denver Regional Coalition of Governments, Dr.

Cog, all the way through resource conservation advisory board, um CML, um, there's a number of them.

But those are the ones that are within the purview of the council currently, and there's a lot more that I know the town isn't involved in, potentially could be.

Um there's been talks in the past about um attending county commission meet uh planning commission meetings potentially.

Um so that's something to look into.

There's also um what is it, the professional planners of America, I think it is.

Um APA, yeah.

Um I know they have a lot of um outreach efforts and different uh networking events and sessions of various topics, so those are also something that we could do.

I'm interested in the county commission.

I know that that's something that we're not participating in today, and that's not alleviating, but I have interest in that.

Well, it's just the question would be how so on one hand, um, you want to have great relationships with the other entities, the other um governmental bodies.

On the other hand, you don't want to involve or interfere in their activities, or be perceived to do so because then they may decide to do the same thing when it comes to something that is within your own boundaries.

So there's always um, you know, that that fine line you have to walk there, but even just you know, sitting in and seeing how these different commissions work, what it is that they're doing, things that are different than we do, or topics, those are those have always been brought up as something to um to sit on, sit in on and you know, just evaluate and then bring back what could be done.

So yeah, I know we've talked about this in the past, and vice chair lawless, he was uh planning staff for Boulder County, and well, his comment was it's not terribly different than what we're doing in his experience.

So I think I think he was helpful and not sending us down that.

Um I mean, I think it's still valuable to understand it, but um I think that's one reason why it hasn't happened in the past.

I mean, it makes sense um for how much interaction is there between the planning staff of Erie and uh Boulder and Weld counties.

We do um coordinate with them.

Uh Weld County is probably a little bit more active.

They tend to have a planner lunch.

Is it quarterly, Sarah?

I feel like maybe Sarah Normala, planning and development director.

So yes, quarterly, and they also we also do um or we're hoping to do an area, a sub-area plan with Weld County.

They're a little more proactive on when they're doing they're initiating comprehensive plan process right now and um engaging with staff on that, and then again the sub-area plan that they would work on with us.

I don't know if it's necessarily a plan, but it's at least an agreement on how we want to uh treat development kind of with near our boundaries, and so that's coming soon as well.

Um trying to think of what else.

But and then of course we use them as a referral agency, yeah, when needed.

So we have some ideas for liaison to other commissions, regional commissions, and then appropriate county ones, any we want to discuss those or I think it'd be good just to get a bunch of ideas and then discuss all of them at once and see with the other positions.

Are there referrals from different agencies or that would come our way that we could respond to?

Are we actively going out and trying to uh engage other municipalities, other uh entities to help advise or planning boundary?

Are you referring to items within our planning boundary that they're supposed to refer to us?

Well, if we're expanding this to weld and boil county throughout and municipalities, and how do we kind of contain this to where it's manageable would be my question?

So staff when we're doing development review will um use the you know, when it's appropriate, have the counties be a referral agency.

Um and again, you know, we also with in terms of other neighboring municipalities, we also may have them be, you know, um we have a we have borders with Roomfield, the Mafa and everyone um and all of these other communities that um we do have intergovernmental agreements.

We're actually staff right now is engaging with multiple communities, um, Frederick and Mafia specifically on intergovernmental agreements, and that's just can cover a number of things in terms of which direction are we group are we growing or not?

Um transportation and other uh types of you know, maybe even economic development agreement terms.

So those are things that we do.

Yeah, I guess with a scenario that I'm hearing, so not reversing that, hoping our availability to local jurisdictions.

Is that kind of the intent?

Mine?

Yeah.

No, not necessarily.

Um I think I try to start smaller scale than that, thinking of the advisory boards like open space, that kind of thing.

I don't know what the interaction between town council and that, those advisory boards are.

They are dedicating some of their time to those boards in addition to everything else that they um are a part of.

And so if that was one small win, I don't even know if we can do something like that.

I don't know if it really does alleviate anything, but it was just a small idea, small win, maybe.

So I have so this is um this is a little bit of deja vu.

Um sitting in the old council chamber.

Um, we had this conversation four years ago.

And it was, you know, what what is it that we could be doing that we aren't, or what is it we could be doing with our time because um there was a lot more development at that time, and we were starting to see some canceled meetings, not to the scale of what is occurred since that time, obviously, a lot less development occurring.

Um we thought of the same ideas, the planning commissions, the liaisons, you know, those kinds of things.

Um but on the other side, it was um you know, anything that we could do, we had to receive authorization from the governing body to do so.

So at the time board of trustees, now town council.

Um so we would have to have their approval to say, hey, we want to have liaisons to these bodies, they can approve it or deny it.

If they approve it, then sure we could have liaison positions, but um, it's all dependent on what they decide, no matter what.

Right now, um we have some semblance of bylaws, really.

It's our charter and municipal code, and basically it says we have all the vested rights provided to us by statute, which that's where you start talking about the comprehensive plan.

Anything that is within the comprehensive plan, anything that is related to the comprehensive plan, anything that is basically future growth related to the town is technically within the purview of the planning commission as long as it's authorized by the governing body.

So when you look at what is it that we could do, yes, looking at these other commissions, what it is that they're doing, also looking at, hey, what is it that the current council is having brought before them something that we could have a cursory review beforehand, um, kind of like when we had the recent um what was it, uh recent ordinance of 07 2023 or something like that, um, where they spent no time on that when it came to them because they had pages and pages and of all these items that we had already discussed and you know, really delved into.

So it's that same idea where we spend the time here so that they don't have to.

Um if you're looking at the different commissions in the state of Colorado, some of them are just like what we do currently, comp plan updates, master plan um revisions, um, and UDC amendments, and then also you know, applications.

That's the bread and butter for all these planning commissions, but then there's the ones that do more trying to look at that long-range planning, and that's the aspect I think that we um director Mella can can you know correct me if I'm wrong.

We in the past haven't done a great job of and we're trying to do a much better job of now with how much we've grown and are still planning on growing long-range planning aspect within the town today.

So we have we've had a comprehensive plan for many many years since the 1970s.

Yes, and it just you know, they evolve over time.

I mean, it was very much um Colorado really only just required a land use plan.

Um our plan has been rather robust.

Um, you know, in terms of including other aspects to planning, like the relationship to transportation and resources and the like.

Um, and our latest plan, which um when did we adopt that now?

Um, I guess at least still last year.

Over eight 2024.

These years go by so quickly.

Um, but in that one was an even greater update to um you know that more comprehensive inclusion of you know, housing and land use and transportation and everything.

So um I wouldn't say that we were doing a bad job of it.

We've we've known where we were growing for quite a while.

We have a planning boundary that's been pretty steady uh over the years.

So I guess it would have to have to give me a little more guidance on what you're so I and I know you've done a great job since you've come here.

Um the the survey uh came out recently, the town wide community survey, and the two most um most recognized issues that residents faced um was sitting in traffic as well as the growth.

And for probably the past call it 11 years, that growth has been substantial to the point where we are one of the fastest growing communities in the nation, one of the fastest growing affluent communities in the nation, have been the fastest growing, one of the fastest growing in Colorado since 2016.

Um, and I know that we're halfway to where we're supposed to be, I believe.

Um estimated.

So we're about 40,000, just a little over, still on our way to 80, 87.5, somewhere on there.

73 to 85.

73 to 85, okay.

Um, so we're still we're still on our way.

So if we look at the growth that is still to come, it is substantial.

We're still, you know, we're if you know, looking at the lifetime, you know, compared to a human probably in their 20s, 30s, you know, or give or take.

Um, so they've still got many years to to go.

Um I look at this as what are some things that we can do to help main help um help council and help staff to get a better understanding of that where we're going and how we're getting there.

So we are where we are right now.

We know within the next uh two to three years, we're give or take gonna be um what 47, 549,000 or so with the current growth rate that we have.

Well, we are slowing down.

Um in fact, we had uh zero building permits for single family homes last month.

So um, you know, the the pace is really reflective of the larger economy um nationally and regionally.

So we are we too are slowing down.

So I don't think we would be growing at the same pace.

We do have a lot of entitled development that's existing.

I mean, we you know, roughly have about 5,000 units that are or probably more now with um northwesterly, probably closer to 6500 plus entitled units.

That doesn't mean every those are all being built tomorrow.

Those that could be 20 years um of time, you know, it really depends on the market and the economy.

Um so we we do know where a lot of our growth is going to go.

It's within our planning boundary, and we have like I said, a lot of entitled land that a lot of projects that are still building out, like westerly and parkdale, um several other very large areas.

So you said we have about 5,000, and then we have northwesterly, which is what uh five, six thousand or so another eight eighteen hundred units, something yeah.

They were talking about northwesterly not being complete for 15 years, yeah.

Yes.

So give or take about 10,000 entitled units throughout town with Spring Hill, Summerfield.

Well, less than that.

I'd say maybe closer to 6500 or 7,000 that have not been built but are entitled, that means they are zoned.

But um we certainly have more that's in application that are in application right now.

So 2.87 uh population per dwelling unit, give or take.

I know if we go high density residential, it moves down some.

We've been at 3.04 in some areas.

So call it a little over 18,000 five over 20 years, that's still just shy of a thousand population every single year that we're still adding.

So there's still obvious need.

So when we talk about what is it that we would need, there's certain aspects that a comprehensive landmaster plan is required of having transportation aspect, water aspect, um facilities, um, storm drainage, um, sewer, we have then the recreational, we have open space, you know, the list goes on.

So all those are brought into that comprehensive plan, that master plan.

So all of these sub plans that occur have to be in line with that.

I know that we have uh the TMP that was brought online, we have the PROS that is going to be going undergoing an uh update shortly, as well as some other plans that are significantly outdated that basically staff is keeping updated as they go.

Um so when I think about what it is that we can initially do, um obviously looking at what the other communities are doing, how they're doing things over there, then also looking at the other master plans within the town, seeing how those are impacting what it is that our comprehensive plan has.

So if we say we're gonna get to this population estimate around this date, um do we have the water?

Do we have the storm drainage?

So we understand basically there's this map that exists that staff has that they know the flows, the um current the current capacities and at what points they need to be upgraded.

So having that cursory review of those as time goes on.

Um there was one item that approached the council beginning uh of this year, where because of what is happening with NISP, I believe it is.

Um the ability to have the water for the future growth is um not as solid as it once was it was a lot of uh water rights that we were going to have, but there's still delays that are going on.

Um, so making sure we have you know adequate water for all these developments.

Um we've been fortunate enough to have enough of the CBT credits to date where we've actually been leasing these out to other communities because we haven't used them, but we're getting to that point where we're gonna need them for our own purposes as we add on more developments, more dwelling units, making sure that we have that in there.

So again, that's just the water aspect.

We also have then, yeah, please, please.

So what you're saying, like the water and then what you'll want to continue to talk about is the subplans that the staff already monitor like already does, and they're already in charge of planning.

We would then add a review on top of that.

Is that what you're saying?

I I I'm just kind of confused on what you're proposing, you know.

So um, besides for the comprehensive plan and the recent transportation master plan, there's very few other master plans that come to the planning commission.

And I mean, there's there's countless master plans that are out there.

Um, so basically having it so that staff, you know, first and foremost, staff lets us know about these master plans, what they are, whether it's um, you know, our our enterprise division, you know, Todd Fessadin, um, Dave Pasik come before and say, hey, these are you know a few of the master plans that we have, and maybe an annual, you know, report of how things are looking towards these master plans.

Are we in line based on the projections?

Um, the other aspect is having projections.

So many of these communities work with the planning department to say, here are current, here's the current population.

I know this is something you guys already do.

Here's the current population, here's where we intend to be within the next year, two, three years, you know, so that we can have that 40,000 foot view of we're gonna get to 72 to 85 approximately.

You said I believe.

73 to 85.

73 to 85.

So we'll get there, but having these intervals where we have these check-ins so that we can maintain that these master plans, not just the comp plan, these other master plans are still in line.

So the the intention was to do um annual reports to you all and to council.

Um that kind of got put on hold because there was a lot of um getting council up to speed and then um study session on the comp plan itself.

That's also led to um some of the other master plans being put on hold, but the comp plan does inform those plans as far as population projections and um things like that.

And a lot went into the build-out scenarios for the comp plan to ensure that there was water, and that's yeah, that's I guess what I'm like confused on.

Is it like I understand if they came before us and they told us, you know, these are the water bank for the town of Erie and stuff.

Like, first of all, none of us are water engineers, you know.

So, like, we don't really understand.

I mean, I work high appraise water like every day and a half or 10 years, and I don't think I know anywhere near what a wire engineer does.

And I'm pretty confident that like toward NIST more than anyone, you know, probably here.

So, but I I just don't know if them I guess I'm confused on, and I know it's not just water, it's tons of master plans coming before us.

And they've already been told, right, by the comprehensive plan that you know, we need to plan for this amount of people.

So they need they know that they need to plan for this amount of people.

So I guess it just almost seems kind of repetitive to me.

Out of our wheelhouse.

I don't know.

It's it's also having the expertise.

I mean, right across different yeah, I guess, uh, entities that we may be uh reaching out to planning staff does a lot of this to interact with them directly, and then we as an advisory board help solidify that and send it on the council.

So I think maybe there's a possibility for us to offer up when needed to some of these other agencies the opportunity to interject some of our uh comp plan opinions or some of that rather than seeking it out, and maybe that comes through uh planning staff as they see some of these things between the different agencies.

Well, this isn't this isn't other agencies, this is internal.

So this is the with the the departments here.

Is this similar to we got a review of the TMP?

Yes, and that was under review, but it was just an informative presentation, and I think that was really valuable, but effectively requesting that planning commission sees more of these master plans and to task town council of having us review it before them.

Yes, because um, you know, having having been on both sides, as it goes through the different bodies, there's feedback, there's discussions, there's these things that might be noticed or thoroughly delved into that may not have initially because you know it's uh typically it's a group of individuals on staff that are developing whatever this plan is, and then you get some other individuals where they're reading through this material, asking the questions, so that again when it comes to council for their final approval, oh yeah, we already addressed that issue, we know about these things, this was brought up, you know, just these things that help them to make a better decision and have a better impact.

And then on our side, making sure that these things are still in line as time goes on.

Um, I mean, one of the things that I you know keep saying is um 2016 to 2020, our comprehensive plan said that we were gonna grow by um it was 16 percent.

We grew by 40 percent.

So that put a strain on a bunch of services.

We had to actually um uh we had to front load some things faster than initially planned, like our uh water um our water treatment facility up there.

Um we had to do an expansion sooner than we had had anticipated initially.

That was because of our growth.

So just having an optimal need to help staff out, because I know that there's if we if we just rely on planning, I mean, they they have a lot on their hands.

Well, um, you know, those are going to engineering and transportation, different departments, and then you guys interact with them.

I just went through the process locally here on a project, and it reaches several different departments, and the communication goes back and forth over the course of a few months.

I guess how are we trying to benefit that process with our limited capacity and limited expertise?

Would be my direct question.

So some of these are um some of these are updated every three to five years, right?

Um, again, the only two plans that I can remember coming before this body when an update occurred was the transportation master plan and the comprehensive plan.

Those are the only two.

We've had a number of these other ones that have actually been updated throughout time.

They're supposed to be in line with the comprehensive plan.

Umstab provides feedback, say for PROST with um with parks and rec when they're doing those updates.

Um, they say, hey, you know, these are the items that are noted within the comprehensive plan.

So same idea.

How does that plan fit within the comprehensive plan?

Because then when it comes to council, staff had to say, hey, we have this plan that we just updated.

This is how exactly it is aligned with the comprehensive plan.

So again, you provide that, you know, that other set of eyes so that you can ask the questions and discuss the item prior to it moving to that council for final adoption approval.

So another item um that I've seen a number of these communities have, and this is something that uh as of 2023, we now have um it's a uh formal recommendation to the governing body of the capital improvement plan.

The reason is because there are so many things that are intertwined with all these different plans with that growth, and you take into account these different plans and the growth factors and where you know we have dollars available to spend now versus later, and we provide a recommendation saying, hey, based on what we're seeing, um, you know, we do recommend, you know, even just to um to second the recommendation of staff saying, hey, we really do believe that we need to have improvements in infrastructure of upsizing for the water lines going down that path.

And um, you know, some of it is now into the open space, some of it is more parks and rec general fund potentially.

Um, say we have what is it, 19 million dollars.

I think we need for the water line on I-25 gateway.

The um sanitary sewer line that and the um pump station that would serve it, it's over 30 million dollars.

Um as projected, but it could be more as we as construction costs uh increase every five seconds.

Yes, again, where does our technical expertise play into that as a benefit?

So I don't feel so so no matter so.

Obviously, um, as you know, Commissioner Booth said, we you know, starting small, we don't start with everything.

Yeah, we we have to start, you know, putting stuff on a wall and saying, okay, these are the things that are something we can do now.

Other items we could you know receive training on or have these discussions so that we can better understand it so that it isn't completely foreign to us if this were to be brought forward to us.

Um I'm gonna just make sure we keep things moving.

Um for recommendations for next week.

We don't want to start too big, but um right now I have uh an idea to be liaison to other commissions, we aids on to regional commissions, county planning commission, long range planning support, um, review of other TOE master plans and recommendation of capital improvements.

Is there any other any other item just to get it on the table that we want to talk about here, and then we can kind of discuss amongst ourselves which one of those that I present to town council next week?

So if we're our the question is, are we right now throwing stuff on the wall and saying, you know, these are what some of the other commissions in the in the okay.

So if you want to do that, um and keep in mind, um, some of these communities, it's been in their charter for some time.

So the planning commissions, they do a lot more because they've been doing this for some time, and this wasn't you know, all at once they started doing this.

So when I look at what is possible or what is it that a planning commission is currently doing, um, again, recommendation body.

So it's not like they're approving these items, they're you know, having these cursory looks at it, providing recommendations, feedback to staff, greeley.

Um the Greeley Planning Commission, and um this is over some amount of time.

Um, they review tax initiatives, uh, outdoor strategic plans, household occupancy standards, open space master plans, drainage master plans, engineering development review, oil and gas reviews, short-term rental guidance and recommendations, economic health and housing, water and sewer public facilities, energy action plan, master street plan, uh, municipal code updates, uh, Kiersey Evans Greeley IGA agreements, growth and development projections.

Um, they actually work with their staff to create these projections every single year.

Um, the strategic housing plan, housing accessibility strategy, transportation master up uh master plan, wireless communications facilities, um, they have uh liaisons to the art commission as well as I'll get the other one.

Um they actually review annexations of land.

That is something that may be something we would want to discuss with the council, having um a few very specific applications come through, knowing that that is a legislative item.

Um I'll get into that in a moment.

Uh owner reports, uh, developer contributions and dedications, air quality natural resource, uh they act as the air quality natural resource commission, um, sign code community development, redevelopment reports.

Um, they approve URAs and URA activities.

I think they act as the URA board.

Um, mid-range expected service area boundary, annual growth and development projections coupled with the three-mile plan, coupled with mid-range expected service area.

Um they act as the final decision authority for preliminary uh subdivisions, final plan unit developments, uh SRUs and other directed duties from the council.

They prepare the annual capital improvement plan that is then brought forward to the uh their council.

Um they can initiate a rezoning, I believe by statute we can too, hypothetically.

So what what's attainable by our standards?

Exactly.

Exactly.

And we're we're in what I'm hearing, we're asking maybe planning staff to a volunteers for planning commission to get engaged when needed to offer an opinion based on comp plan or anything else we have jurisdiction of.

So is that correct?

So yes, we we so ultimately we need um we would need approval by the governing body to say yes, this is something that we can task you with.

Ultimately, we also have to have staff buy it because we are volunteers.

This isn't our day-to-day what we do, it's theirs.

So we don't want to be a time burden on staff.

We want to help staff and help the council.

That is obviously why we're here in our volunteer advisory roles.

So it'd have to be buy-in from staff.

Obviously, again, there's laundry list of things that I went with went through.

All right.

So on that note, um, we had a lot of lists.

I'd like to just go around and see what people think that we've talked about of it's kind of uh, these are the ones that you like.

If you have a list, um start with Commissioner Dreckman.

Um I think the presentation of the master plans of different departments sounds useful.

I'm hesitant to go beyond that, but I think the traffic one seemed useful and beneficial to us, and obviously I have no professional traffic experience, and I still felt like that was you know useful and stuff.

So I think uh at least where they you know, maybe once a year, once every few years came before us in reviewed how their plan is being updated um with the comprehensive plan once the comprehensive plan is not in like a pause position, and you know, once they're given guidance to move forward again, I guess.

But I don't know.

Beyond that, I'm not yet on board.

Okay.

Commissioner Baham.

Uh my thought is voluntary position that's directed through planning that regardless of what I guess uh agency or department it comes from.

Opens it up for one of us to volunteer to give commentary opinion based upon the influence for our specific planning commission.

And it's an opinion that's taken forward.

It can be either adopted or used for the purpose or whatever that uh is and let that be what it can be.

Uh we have no jurisdiction above and beyond we can do within these chambers.

So Burns.

Um I'm still a bit reticent to say that we should be like any kind of decision making review.

Um, I think it's fine for us.

Um you mentioned like the traffic management plan, like the affordable housing program, getting updates, providing feedback is one thing.

Um having oversight, whether it's over the shoulder or whether it's formal kind of sign off.

It it seems a little bit um out of our reach, and it may not really expedite anything, it may end up making the process longer.

I'm worried.

Um having to either planning or engineering uh needing to come for approval before moving on to different steps.

Um, but I'm I'm open to I think the discussion to see what we can maybe able to provide um assistance.

But if it's if it creates any kind of additional workload burden or lengthens the process, I'm not sure that it's a benefit.

Um and I'm not sure just from what we talked about it.

I am an engineer, I'm not doing water resources stuff.

Any uh beyond hydraulic analysis, maybe, but um, and I can stand it, which is ridiculous in itself, but um it it's it's um staying.

I I think just because we have the ability to be oversight, and this is why I still think it's it's sort of taking place of of responsibilities that council has to so that they either can we you know trust that we're going to make these decisions instead of having to go to a second cycle of hearing and so or if it's something that um you know that they feel confident that we can provide enough in information and uh in our recommendation that it goes on the uh consent agenda versus a full hearing.

Um you know, I think those things will help expedite.

I'm I'm I'm just wary of of us stepping into areas that we or development that is um not a final presentation, you know, just kind of the over-the-shoulder stuff.

I I just worried that it's gonna be hindering the process versus making it more efficient, but I'm still open to hearing specifics.

I just haven't heard anything specific enough to say yeah, that'll work or that that's not gonna help them.

So thank you.

Commissioner Booth.

Um so I have probably been involved in town government in Erie since 2010, like watching obsessively every board meeting since 2010.

There is a lot of time and energy that they put into some of those.

Like right now, I think they're meeting almost four times a week.

Some of their meetings, I'm watching four hours worth of meeting.

Um, and so I think my idea of this was again again, not to burden staff, but to try to help alleviate some of what is on the town council's plate, and if we can do that, that's what I want to do.

Um, I don't know if this is if it's appropriate, but I don't know based on some of what's been mentioned tonight, if staff has any opinions.

Um, surely you've looked at other municipalities on what some of their boards and commissions do.

Is there anything in your purview that you think would be appropriate?

Voted question.

I'll just say that you know, we do have a lot of long-range planning efforts that are coming down the path for planning commission.

Um, certainly the comprehensive plan and TMP were the biggest ones that we had um over the past few years, but we do have a UDC update that we do want to be engaging the planning commission in.

But we do have a UDC update that we do want to be engaging the planning commission in.

And we also have potentially, you know, we're right now doing some outreach with the old town area with the old town neighborhood.

That was one of the things that was in the comprehensive plan.

That may lead to a plan effort as well.

And so that's another opportunity for planning commission to engage on that long range side.

And so I um and of course we also now have a requirement to produce a housing action plan within the next few years.

So that's also we've been engaging with the planning commission on housing the past few years as well.

And so that wouldn't change that would actually probably be more work to do.

So I do see a lot of um opportunity for the planning commission to kind of move into and continue to engage in our long range planning efforts.

And in addition to what you're already doing with respect to reviewing the the applications that come along well I guess I will say that you know when we talked about looking at some of these other plans outside of transportation or housing like the water plan and stuff I I do think that there has been some good feedback that has been given um so I'm not opposed to looking at some of those um additional plans um I don't know that I have looked at greeley they have a long list um I have seen the capital improvement on other municipalities I think that is on green lease but I think I've seen that in other municipalities I don't know if that's something that we indicate some interest in I'll start I'll start there.

Thank you.

Commissioner Solch top three um honestly I don't I don't think we're at that point where we should be coming forward with these are the ones that we should be doing right now.

I think we're at the point where we have to first off we as a body have to decide you know do we feel that certain things are within our within our within our purview within our expertise things that we can actually you know chew on and then seeing what staff has in mind things that staff can bring forward and then ultimately council I don't think we should be coming forward to the council and saying these are the specific things that we want to do because I don't think we're at that point yet there's a lot of things that we can do.

Anything that is within our comprehensive plan remotely right what is it that we should be doing what is it that we want to invest our time in how do we want to invest our time like what specifically yes bringing the master plans is a great idea.

I think that we should do that.

We should be understanding of every single master plan that this town has because all of them are supposed to relate back to that comprehensive plan.

But in terms of specifics I don't again I don't think we're at that point yet because I I can I can hear there is hesitation saying this isn't my expertise this isn't my you know day-to-day um water rights water law it's a show okay you know that alone is a two and a half hour uh presentation by our water law attorneys just to get understanding at a high level of water law and it's very dry years I would say two and a half hours wouldn't get you 40,000 foot yeah 400 foot yes um no put in it is it's very dry um but like there's there's a lot in these topics and we can't just initially say hey these are the things that we want to do right now because we we may start talking about okay what does that involve what is it exactly and how does it relate to the town and to the comprehensive plan and we say that's well without well outside of our our purview you know so again I would say yeah you can bring the laundry list of ideas but we should have one or two additional you know conversations about what is it that how is it that we feel what is it that we have here at the town obviously we're going to need staff's help in terms of what is it that other departments have or subplans that are currently out there submaster plans that are currently out there that we should probably know about um and how then they relate because um you know over five years I've learned a lot and there's still so much more to learn and we are supposed to be you know experts to review this we want to make sure we are knowledgeable about this before we start delving into something so again I would say I don't think we're at that point to say these are the exact things I think we should have more conversations about this or exactly what it means.

Um and how then they relate because um you know, over five years I've learned a lot, and there's still so much more to learn.

And we are supposed to be, you know, experts to review this.

We want to make sure we are knowledgeable about this before we start delving into something.

So again, I would say I don't think we're at that point to say these are the exact things.

I think we should have more conversations about this or exactly what it means.

More conversations between us as a commission or as a joint session with council or both.

Um yes, with a joint session with council, but at that point we have already said, hey, we've gone through all these different things.

We literally had the laundry list of you know, these things, these are the ones that we feel that we can do now to help the council to help them best.

Okay.

Um, and then so for my ideas, I do like the master plans um recommendation um for reviewing those.

So with at least three check marks, unless I misunderstood someone.

That is something I I appreciate you saying we shouldn't come up with that idea, but I do have on my slide that we need to that we're exploring it.

So I want to have an idea.

So I'm gonna present to them that uh planning commission is willing to uh work with the have review sessions of the the master plans as they're coming up, similar to what we did for the transportation plan.

Um just to see how it aligns with the comp plan.

And that's what I'll mention them on Tuesday.

And I'll also mention that we want to work with them and we'll continue discussions about other options that we can do.

Um and point degree that there's a lot that a planning commission can do, but that we aren't ready to turn into Greeley's planning commission or I don't think much of a desire to do that uh at this point.

Um I think unless oh one question you had mentioned URA.

Um we've we had a URA application.

Julian came in and talked with us about town center, and that isn't on this list.

Is that just because the URA is in a different section of the code?

On on what list?

What list are you?

The summary of administrative and review roles.

It's in the state statutes.

So when the code refers to all the powers imbued by the state statutes, that is one of those.

Okay, so it didn't get put in here because that would be redundant.

I guess conformance with the master plan, I believe it is.

Okay.

So we have that also.

Yes.

Yeah, that's right.

Um so unless there's any other, I think that gives me an action for Tuesday to bring that up and discuss more.

It's on the night.

Yeah, are you still there?

I told them you were gonna be there.

Yeah, I'm gonna get I would I would also say, you know, one of the small things we can do is um obviously through staff, um seeing if we could have presentations from some of the other departments that we don't regularly see here, um, whether that is um our utilities department, whether that is our public works department, um, our sustainability or that are environmental services.

Um, because I mean there's 20 plus master plans that are out there, and these are things that they know the they live and breathe by.

So we should know a little bit about them at least, you know, what is it that they are, what are they, how do they relate, you know.

So not only future plans, but also us understanding what current plans we have with the time.

May I suggest on that one that we could provide a staff report that starts to just give you an idea of what are all the other plans that are produced that relate to the comprehensive plan and uh the timing on when those are being updated.

For instance, the PROST was just updated, which is our parks rec open space and trails plan.

Um and Commissioner Browis was on the um steering committee for that, and then the steering working on a master plan.

And you're serving in some capacity, right?

As a resident, yes.

As a resident, okay.

Sorry.

We can provide um an overview of where those plans are, and maybe once you have that information, you can discuss how you may want to, you know, or even know when those might be coming through a process near you and whether or not you want them to to come in and present.

And maybe once you have that information, you can discuss how you may want to, you know, or even know when those might be coming through a process near you and whether or not you want them to come in and present.

I mean, that's something that we'd want to be able to discuss with other staff as well.

I mean, they also have timelines on these um on these plans and um so we can get at least a baseline of information to you.

And that would just be effectively uh a list of these are all the plans and when they're coming in, whether making a presentation or just kind of uh almost the presentation that we had for our first general business item to where we get more reading, but not too much talking.

Yes, it would be a staff report.

I mean, we and we could have you know if you have questions on that, then we can discuss that.

Um but that I'll try and keep it shortly reading.

Should we ask for that for our next regular meeting or in a month, or how long did that take to put together?

Um maybe let's there is a comprehensive list of all the strategic plans on the town's website.

Um we can write up a little thing about how each of the plans you know interact with each other and what's due for update.

Is that what you were thinking, Sarah?

Yes, just a little more detail on the timing of when it would be updated.

Um I don't know that we would make the next meeting with deadlines, but we'll take a look.

Yeah, I mean, I found the the list.

There's 25 odd.

It's a good number of them.

Yeah, yeah.

Well, we can time it with when we have a meeting with some on it.

Yeah, no.

We can we can do it for the next meeting actually.

If it's not too much of the stressor, I don't want it to be too complex at this early stage.

Yeah.

So and one thing you'll see is the dates next to all those when they're approved.

Obviously, there's a reason why we've only seen the comprehensive plan and the transportation master plan come through.

Most of these are very excited for the Cole Creek major drainage plan.

Yeah, plans.

Oh, yeah.

All right.

Um I think that's uh a good for that one.

Uh we'll move on to the the second item is the planning commission rules of procedure.

Um just to I have one question about this before I open it up, and then one minor question.

The rules of procedure are a resolution from the town council, and I'm just curious if we have to abide by those rules, or if we could effectively make our own rules and procedures and just ignore the resolution.

Uh no, you're you're you should be following them.

There, I mean, they're more than just guidelines, I guess, but um you guys can't create your own ones, I guess.

Yeah, I was just was there any particular.

Um we're supposed to do the call to order and then a roll call and then the pledge of allegiance, which we haven't done in years.

So right now we're not doing it right again.

It's you generally you should be following they're more than guidelines, but less than I guess uh, you know, the town code.

I'm not gonna get arrested for no no.

We did part of two before you finished one.

But if there's if there's any that like a specific thing that you've noticed, you know, that like, oh, I think there should be added to the rules and procedures, then you know, I myself and Kendra and Austin can revise it.

So I mean, I read through this, it seems to basically match the agenda that I was given to work with in 2023.

So it's I mean, it seems pretty consistent with the exception of that one level with the pledge and the roll call.

But the um I don't know if the the other thing was more or less about the more Robert's rules kind of steps.

Yeah, so some of the uh motions and um those kind of steps.

I think maybe that's what we don't follow scrolls or exactly.

Yeah, and I think it's the Roberts rules is something that the town has said that the all boards and town council should be following.

So as close as much as we can get, obviously, it's not like a strict letter of the law.

Yeah, this is my understanding that there was a sort of a variation that exists.

Um it's not the strict interpretation of parliamentary procedure, but it's yeah, it's it's yeah, following the general rules.

Thank you for speaking.

Yes, yeah.

You can talk at town council too if you want.

Yeah.

Monthly functional.

Yeah.

Um.

So yeah, I don't know.

We need to add anything to that.

Procedural.

Unless someone anyone feels like we're missing something.

I have a question about the procedures.

Um I'm looking at C four under motions procedure.

And I have questions about that.

Um, I guess if you you start at the top, um if a commissioner proposes a motion, if another one seconds the motion, then there's the um ability to debate or discuss the motion.

And then it says amendments to the motion or other substitute motions may be made.

What does that mean?

Is that so um let's say you say motion to just you know approve some some resolution or whatever, and then there's the discussion and it gets seconded.

If you still want the motion after the discussion, you still want to maintain a similar motion, you can say, okay, I'm amending that motion, so still approving it, but maybe some minor motion, um, you know, amendment that still the motion still essentially the same, and then you don't have to redo a second and um you know all that stuff.

Is that would that be similar to what happened with the affordable housing ordinance?

Uh the vice chair Brodus had kind of amended on the fly, so to speak.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Well, and I get so I have a question that I feel like was similar to this in one of our meetings that maybe this can help clarify is that when we were going around and electing positions, the new chair and vice chair.

At one point, I had made a motion to elect Mr.

Sowich to vice chair, I received a second, and to me at that point you can still discuss it, maybe, but then on top of my motion and second, another motion came in to nominate somebody else without a vote on the first nomination.

So I feel like that that was done incorrectly.

Yeah, and you would you had emailed me about that and I'd responded that you know, as I responded.

Yeah, so I didn't know if this was like that tiptoe of like this almost makes it sound like you can do another motion on top of a motion.

No, no, you're not it you it wouldn't be so if you had a motion, you that same motion, and then someone else did there was a second motion, that's not the same thing as you amending your original motion.

Yeah, right.

So we can we go back to my example though and clarify that for for everybody.

So in that instance, when I did a motion and I had a second, I guess you can discuss it, but then shouldn't it just go to vote before somebody else can just jump in and make another motion?

Yeah, and and that's what I had said, yeah, email to you, that that's what should have happened, but at the time it was because this was a vote, it had done slightly differently, where we were just having all of them together at the same time, right?

So just yay or nay for either one.

Um since I was the one that stepped in on that, yeah.

I my understanding was we were nominating, it wasn't a motion to no, yeah, that's and that's what I had said in the yeah, so it was a just a misunderstanding what it was, but it was a motion, so we should have it should have been just um Commissioner Boots motion for so in the future if we have um I guess it only really comes up in that kind of vote, like nomination.

Um if there's there's no multiple person candidate nomination, it's just yeah.

So there, so just for the next time it happens, so like it would be uh, you know, I motion to nominate um Commissioner Salwich, and then it's a second, and then a vote on and then a and then we have to have we have to have a vote on that first understanding that there can be other nominations after the fact so and they would be voting on the nomination, yeah.

Yeah, just on that specific candidate, yeah.

What if no one else gets nominated?

Well, yeah, then yeah, that candidate would win.

Would win.

Well, yeah, because there's no other nominations.

Well, there, but you wouldn't have an opportunity nominate.

That's no, you you would there's still a chance or discussion during after the session vote.

Yeah, the second vote.

Yeah.

Yeah.

If that like the say one person was nominated, um, didn't get a majority of the votes, and it so we were kind of back to where we were, we need to still fill that position, but there is no other I I guess that's I I um it's just my misunderstanding of how that works.

So yeah for a like a nomination kind of vote versus I mean, I understand it for like a um a motion to recommend or to not approve, et cetera.

Yeah, yeah.

No, and that and that's what we had uh, you know, we had discussed with um, you know, Commissioner Booth that how the nominations is kind of unique thing, but when she did a motion, right?

Motion uh to nominate Commissioner Sowage, right?

And it was seconded.

At that point, the motion had been made and had been seconded, we needed to have a vote.

So let's say still the vote happened, how it happens at three, you know, so then he wasn't put as vice chair, then someone would have to make another motion to nominate, and which then that would have been for Commissioner Brodus.

Another person could do it.

It doesn't have to be Commissioner Booth again.

So should we void the election?

No, we talked, we talked about it and legally it didn't, you know, it wasn't so my apologies.

Then I did not understand what the that was the specific process for nominations, yeah.

Well, and that's what because it had been done as we had to discuss it had been done differently, but then once there was like motions being made specifically, then once we're following Robert's rules, then it has to be so you know, and that's how we do any other motion.

So and I guess that I mean I read through this and I knew when I was asking for a motion for the agenda and the minutes tonight.

I wasn't following this rules because I didn't um recognize you, Commissioner Booth.

So we I've already broken the rules tonight twice.

So that's something making sure that well the area collis left the and that's actually a good point because that's I think the major variation of this is um since I've been on the board, we haven't the chair is hasn't ever recognized someone.

They just either point them out or yeah, someone just starts speaking, yeah.

So I could change my terminology to be who wants to make a motion, and then someone says I do, and then I say I recognize Commissioner Booth, and then she can make the motion, and then if two people say I do at the same time, I get to pick my favorite or who I think so we we shouldn't go Roberts Rules and stand and rise for to make our motion.

Yeah, that means but speaking to the microphone, yeah.

So you gotta work a week.

Um, I so I I will say though, there are sorry, may I have a floor.

I opened the floor earlier, so I think there are um so it's town council has the rules of order and procedures just like this.

Um I remember the coming through and thinking like this is very lean, like in terms of what the planning commission does, same process, same everything to a T that we do as they do in the procedure that it's supposed to do, um, in terms of like motions, you know, like it just says you know, motion to amend, you know, these kinds of things.

So it gets a little more specific on these.

So um again, this is something that has to be brought up by the council, but uh approved by the council, but I think maybe having a version of the town council rules as it is where it provides a little more direction, it's it's a little nicer looking too um might be something that is helpful.

So um, oh uh back to that last conversation by laws as well in terms of the planning commission bylaws, what it is that we do, and that also includes then the rules of order procedure, how we operate our meetings, just what we're talking about right here.

Um, I will say the one thing that's um I'm not naming names, I'm gonna say um planning commission.

I'm not gonna name years, planning commissions of the past, even councils of the past, board of trustees of the past, um, playing fast and loose when it comes to quasi judicial hearings.

There is a specific time where you ask questions of staff and the applicant, and all you ask are questions.

You do not provide any opinion or comments, and then you close the public comment period, and then you have the um deliberation where you can make all your comments.

That is because um, correct me if I'm wrong, because um of the legal nature of a quadjudicial hearing and how it has to be operated in order to make sure we don't have any potential recourse for the future.

So I know that's something that um says in here, you know, follows 1073 or whatever it is, 1072 for um specifics of the how to hold the public hearings, but that really doesn't hold doesn't address how those public hearings in terms of procedure should be done.

So I think that's something that we may want to have addressed in this as well, where the exact procedure you open up the the public hearing, you have the applicants, you have the uh public comment, you ask questions, only questions.

That's it.

Because that's how it's written in the the town council procedures, right?

They had that listed.

Well, uh correct me if I'm wrong, but this is statute that is applied to how we operate here, correct?

In terms of our the the methodology and order and process of our of our well, no.

Unless unless there's there's something in the obviously in our ordinance because we're home rule, we don't have to.

I don't know if statutes, what's like what planning commission is based on statute.

It's in our it's in the ordinance.

As in the outline or the hearing, how the hearing operates the process for opening up public comments, all that.

Yeah, it should be it should be in the I mean it should be in the code.

It is, yeah.

So yeah, it wouldn't be by statute.

I and I do note um it was something I I did change last year um in terms of the deliberation and um questioning of the applicant and staff in our public hearings because I noticed that from the council meetings was we were having everything on one bunch because that's how it I've seen it before, and we changed that to match their policy where we had the um the question with the public hearing open and then close that and then have the deliberations separate.

So that was procedurally to try to match that better because that yeah, when I came on commission, we'd always it had been run hearing this as like questions any point, even during deliberation, so it's kind of crazy, yeah.

Um it's defined in 1072 G G.

Yeah, yeah.

So I think we're so mostly in line with that.

It's and I think maybe a bigger picture of what commissioner Salich is mentioning.

Um, it may I I hadn't dealt with Robert's rules since I was in college, you know, in a fraternity.

Um and very loosely at that point, but um it might help to have some sort of orientation or introduction when especially when new commissioners are at just so familiar with the process because when I first started, I had no idea how things were run.

You just like thrown into it.

There you go.

So that's what the chair is for the guide.

Well, you feel like I'm guiding you, Tim.

I do.

I'm not sure where the clip, hopefully.

Um any other comments on rules and procedures.

Um I think the it's it's generally good.

I was thinking if we wanted to make our own resolution to follow, but I don't know what I would change.

Um, and I'll just skirt by.

But one thing that I will try to do is redo my wording.

Uh so when we're doing a motion, uh, that I'm gonna ask who wants to make the motion, and then someone just volunteer to do that, and I'll recognize you.

Um then make sure I follow the procedures, especially on the quasi-judicial things.

So more formalized, very very formal.

I'll have a print off the years in the paper.

I would say also um so this is something that's in the town council rules of order and procedure.

There's also the aspect of the agendas and the advanced agendas, and um within the past you know, month and a half, two months, we now have an advanced agenda.

So adding that aspect in there as well.

Again, this all has to be approved by council, but um having a version that is ours that is very in line with this because you know, same idea.

We're planning purposes on our end to talk about all these different things, having that advanced agenda is helpful because we can see what is you know in line of these things, but having it in there and how this navigates and guides us as well.

Yeah, so just I know we got our latest advanced agenda a few last week or something.

So I mean, in their procedure, it's required that they get it.

I think I read it every two weeks.

I don't think we need that.

Um but I assume you updated it monthly, or how you update it whenever you update it?

Sure.

Way more often than monthly.

Yeah, more often than monthly.

So I I think having it at our monthly meeting would be helpful.

Just to or whenever you get it out, I don't unless you have a stronger preference.

I mean, we're here every other week.

We'll we'll start with monthly and see if that's enough.

Okay.

Um the the other thing that is uh um do we receive the development staff development reports like the council does?

The monthly development reports that indicates how many how many uh dwelling units, how many permits, um all those items?

Council uh requested those go away.

They requested they go away.

Yeah, we don't we don't do the monthly reports anymore.

We used to.

Melinda used to send that out.

Yeah.

Are you talking about the quasi-judicial report?

So there's there's the quasijudicial um development activity.

That's that list of yeah, it's also on the Tom's website of all those that are currently in application and where their current status is, tentative, you know, and then there's also what I'm talking about is the staff monthly report, the ones that had those items of um like nice bar charts, yeah.

Yeah, basically the permits.

I mean, these these have been these have been since as far back as I can remember, these have been produced.

Yeah.

That was my understanding.

Yeah, yes, that is true.

We are we're we are working with communications to um massage our website to try and put uh put some of that information out there because it does tend to be you know, building permits and how many commercial building permits, useful information that we we do get asked for.

We're still tracking the information.

So can you just ask me?

Um did they just ask that you stop producing them or do you stop giving them to town council, but you could still provide them to us just as like staff report.

Oh, I don't know.

Sarah, do you have clarity on that?

I'm trying to remember if it was I I know council requested less things to read, um, and that we consolidate communication.

And so we um moved a lot of our and it wasn't just planning and development, we had multiple departments providing these updates and we have a mechanism that um our town manager provides every month to council an email form that says you know that gives updates from every department, and so that's where we consolidated information.

However, we are not providing those the bar charts that you're you know used to seeing those are not in that email.

And so we have been working, like um Kelly said, to um get those on our website because we'd like to have it more easily accessible, not just to decision makers but to the community as well.

So I don't have a date yet for when that'll be live, but that is in pro it's in process.

Um we are happy to send.

I mean, we do at the end of every month.

Um we have a uh spreadsheet that we can share with you.

It's kind of the the native form of those um those bar charts, but it they're still legible and um happy to share that if um folks are interested in having and then um quarterly um internally uh planning has been tracking um completed residential COs so that we can um have a better idea of population projection for the year, but we can share those with you all as well.

Would that be something easy to put in like the staff report monthly as well?

Yeah, and we just get to track that and then it'll be on the agenda and until the website's up and running at least.

Yeah, we can do that.

It's out there and we can point them to a PDF.

I was gonna ask the same thing.

Is that something that we could request?

So um with those those monthly develop development reports, um, not the ones that Melinda sends out that is the quasi judicial development reports, but the one that goes on the council staff reports.

Um was it are those time consuming for staff to produce, or is it basically just repetitive, the same same methodology, same formats?

It's easy to produce for staff, or is it taxing on staff?

Uh I don't know on the building side, Sarah.

Do you it's uh they pull, I mean there are there building staff are already pulling that information and we just have our operation staff maybe spend 20, 30 minutes just putting it in formatting and you know, formatting them so um you know we can for the next few meetings where it makes sense on the cadence of the meetings and the when we get the information, we can add that as a staff report until it's available online, not a huge lift for us.

So I was gonna ask if uh we can revive that for us potentially.

So perfect, thank you.

And uh it doesn't have to be too pretty.

Black and white is fine.

So all right.

Well, that concludes our general business.

Uh we have no specific items on the agenda for staff reports, but yeah, I do have a few things.

Um so Sarah mentioned old town, and that was um a component of the comp plan as you all are aware.

Um and when we did some initial um data gathering and analysis, we discovered there wasn't a real cohesive voice.

Um, and so we made the decision to do what we're calling a social capital exercise, just going out and listening to residents, hearing um what those emerging issues may be.

Um it may very well lead us to doing uh an area plan.

We don't know at this point, but um Josh has been out in the community.

Uh we have a couple of we have several actually events coming up um this month.

Um Josh has had a booth at the farmers market, he will have one tomorrow.

Um, and then Saturday, this Saturday from eight to eleven.

Um, we'll have community coffee at Coal Minor Park.

There was one two weeks ago.

I think Josh said 20 some people showed up, so that was impressive.

Um, and then Sunday, September 14th from one to 4 p.m.

We're gonna do an ice cream social at Col Creek Park, and thankfully the splash pad won't be closed yet, hopefully.

Um, and then we're kind of culminating everything on um September 20th with a neighborhood walk um in the larger old town area.

Um the intention is that we will come back to you all and to town council kind of reporting out on those findings and next steps.

Um then there are some changes that are necessary with the municipal code to kind of align with the charter as far as boards and commissions.

So that is coming.

Um I think council's talking about it later this month.

I remember right, Sarah.

Do you remember what date?

I didn't write it down.

I don't want to go wrong.

Um it might be the 23rd.

Okay.

Um and there's there is also some discussion there to make um board appointments right now.

They all fall on even number years, and there's some discussion about should those be shifted to odd numbered years.

Um and then the chair, Sarah and I were discussing, you know, we we had a a sort of planning commission dinner year, year and a half ago.

Is there interest in that again?

You know, something before uh a regular meeting, or we could schedule you know a different time.

Uh we just have to notice it as a public meeting if you're all gonna be in the same room.

So um free food.

What was that?

We have budget.

We do I don't think it's turned down for a second for email leftovers.

Yeah.

So is everyone else interested?

I think it was nice having the last one just to talk not formally or at least recorded.

On the last on a light agenda.

Sure.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, we could do that.

Okay.

We will identify a good meeting for that.

Um, and then I guess I uh I was not present at the last meeting, but I guess it came up that um seat six, which is Commissioner Browdis.

Um there was some error in appointment.

Um the town clerk and administration have done extensive research like back to 2014 or something ridiculous.

Tracing um seats and appointments, and it looks like it was um a mistake.

So that is um coming back to council on the 9th, and it would it would basically what's the legal term?

It's non pro tunk.

There you go.

Which means right making it retroactive effective from the date that it was supposed to happen.

Right May 2024.

Yeah.

So yeah, the Browdis got left off whenever um Delaney Pill laws was all extended because you guys were filling out that end of a term, and we were in the middle of comp plan and TMP.

Um, and for whatever reason, Bob Browdis got left off.

Yeah, it's like we looked through all the staff reports and everything, and it was in town council at the time heard directed for both all four commissioners to be reappointed, but um that resolution that's a town council did not include us for Commissioner Bows.

Yeah, and um I will say the administration and clerk's office has um identified some process improvements to ensure things like this don't happen again.

So they'll go over all of that on the 9th with council.

So it was a lot of turnover, yes, yes, last couple years, yeah.

So that's all I had.

Staff reporting, all right.

Yeah, thank you.

Uh this brings us to the final agenda item with commission reports and discussion.

Uh any commissioners start commissioner salish.

Um, so I did see Josh at one of the farmers markets and asked him what he was doing, and same exact uh summary of we are thinking about a specific plan for old town, and he made the remark saying because there isn't an HOA, it's hard to get in front of these individuals to hear what they have to say um because they're you know widely dispersed out and there is no common congregation area, so um that's that's good to hear that uh there's more out there um that he that he and staff are doing.

Um definitely definitely support our staff.

Um it's it's definitely a good thing to do.

Um, and then let's see, Sunday from 10 a.m.

to 2 p.m.

is the Erie Airfare.

Um, not an air show because it's not approved by the FAA for an air show air fair.

Um this is now uh so they're doing uh this is the airport economic airport economic development advisory board.

They're they're spearheading this.

They did it two years ago.

It was six thousand individuals um within a four-hour period that attended.

Um so a lot of individuals.

Um this that was the first time in 10, 12 years that the airfare had been put on.

So um I definitely recommend going there.

Um I'll be there with my little one.

He is loving to see airplanes in the sky, so he'll he'll get a kick out of it because he was very young last time.

So but uh that is all I have.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Commissioner Booth.

I'm going to the airfare for sure.

Um, and then I think last meeting I had mentioned the dedication for the new fire station that was postponed.

Um, I don't believe it's been rescheduled yet, but stay tuned for that.

That's it.

Thank you.

Commissioner Burns.

Commissioner Bahan.

I'll add Commissioner Booth's announcement.

Uh we will be uh doing a topping out party, but I'll let everybody know as soon as we have that date established.

So that's the only other thing.

Commissioner Drickman.

Sorry.

Um the even more exciting one is the recycle event for your hazardous waste on September 13th.

The airfare is more exciting than that.

I'll bear you.

So I think there's a landfill day the week before uh going up to that, then uh bring your hazardous waste to the Weon World Center and get rid of all the things that you shouldn't put in the windfill.

They accept it and then if they don't take a charm.

So that is all I have.

Motion to adjourn.

Second.

Time is now 8 19 and we are adjourned.

Can you even wait?

Oh.

Yeah, it's just a recognize us.