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Record of Proceedings

Erie Town Council Study Session – February 4, 2025: Community Survey, Water Portfolio, and Annexation Discussed

Town Council — Tuesday, February 4, 2025
BodyErie, Colorado
SessionTown Council
DateTuesday, February 4, 2025
StatusFILED
Video Record
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Transcript — Verbatim
4:33

All right.

4:34

It is um two um four twenty-five.

4:39

This is uh the town of Erie Town Council study session.

4:42

It's uh six oh two PM.

4:46

Um and we're gonna go for about three hours here on four important topics.

4:50

Um I'll just kind of set the stage that this is conversational, so we want everybody to chime in.

5:00

I won't um actually interrupt anybody unless we start to talk over each other, and then I'll I'll definitely um ask people to ask for the floor, but hopefully this goes like our last study session where we could just have an informative educational um conversation.

5:11

And so with that, um we've got four items on the agenda tonight.

5:15

Um, I'm just gonna go through them briefly so everybody at home or in the audience knows what we're doing.

5:20

Um, we're gonna talk a little bit about the community survey.

5:23

Um, the big item on the agenda is our water portfolio and our capital projects that are associated with water.

5:30

Um, our annexation information discussion.

5:33

This is specifically about the annexation uh that we um postponed to a future date at our last meeting so that we could have this uh study session to learn more about that.

5:44

And then the last item time permitting is an update on the Erie Town Center and uh with Evergreen at the four corners.

5:52

Um we won't go beyond um nine ish, and so um, if we're running out of time, this may be one that gets bumped to a future day.

6:01

All right, with that, I'll turn it over to our uh town manager, uh Malcolm Fleming.

6:07

Um Gabby on this one and act as backup on that.

6:13

Gabby and Pat.

6:14

And I'll I'll jump in.

6:15

I wanted that, and actually um I'll end up probably taking off after this, but uh, I wanted to just uh one kind of I guess apologize for the expediency of putting it on the agenda.

6:27

Um I think you all probably saw an email from me, you know, a week or so ago with this practice, which uh I think we talked about hopefully briefly.

6:37

I was suggesting hey, if you want this on the agenda email staff.

6:41

Um I had given Gabby direction thinking that we were good to move forward, um, not realizing that that we needed the agenda item to be pulled.

6:50

So I one just wanted to say thank thank you all, recognize that there was um probably two different email chains there.

6:57

It was something that we had instituted previously just to make sure that staff was um putting the correct things on the agenda at the correct time.

7:06

So just wanted to kind of um recognize that uh and also I I think completely open the door for any other types of conversations we want to have as we're continuing to kind of get to know each other and work together.

7:18

Um so yeah, with that, I just wanted to make sure that I was being clear with you all as to why um staff was sending those type of emails.

7:26

That's that's something that we had done saying, hey, do you want this on?

7:29

Do you want this on?

7:30

Um so I'll add a little bit of color here because I'm uh at least partially responsible for it being at the study session and not just moving forward.

7:38

There was a discussion with Malcolm and myself, and I think Patrick, you and I had a conversation, and um it was around the other surveys that likely will be coming out once we get a chance to talk about the comp plan and whether we should move forward with this survey.

7:53

Um, in that discussion, um, I recognize that there is longitudinal type data.

7:59

You've been doing this survey for some time.

8:01

Like to get the update for this uh this time.

8:04

I didn't realize there were gonna be new questions, and it was through a discussion that another council member had recognized that there was a tax question on there, and um, that's when I started to say, hold on, I thought this was the same as everything else, and we held it back.

8:20

And so here we are to learn about what those new questions are and what the urgency is and whether we move forward or or not.

8:28

Sure, that's me then.

8:29

Um I printed off some copies of the draft survey, so I'll just pass those around.

8:34

I did only print 10.

8:36

So um, Todd, please don't take one.

8:38

Um sorry, everybody else is gonna have one.

8:43

Um so I'll just kind of start by saying first I'm Gabby Ray, director of communications and community engagement.

8:49

This will be the third of these that I have um administered on behalf of the town of Erie.

8:55

So in 2021, when I first started, there was a community survey process.

8:59

In 2023, there was one, and now there I assume will be one in 2025.

9:04

Um the town has been doing this for more than a decade.

9:07

I believe the first one, at least with our current uh contractor was done in 2013.

9:12

Um and all of this was in the memo, and I'm gonna just assume that all of you read all of the attachments um to tonight's meeting, but this is just high-level information for you.

9:21

Um this is part of the national community survey um that originally was administered by um the National Research Center who has partnered with Polco.

9:32

That's all just background to say that we are under contract with Polco, who has been doing this for decades and is experts in their field of statistic uh statistically valid survey.

9:42

We at the town of Erie have been participating in the benchmarking survey, so the one that is sent nationwide to all communities since 2013 at least.

9:52

Uh, that's the last records I have because that's when we redid our website.

9:55

So if there was more before that, I don't have record of it.

10:00

In each of those, which are all available online, we have had the opportunity to do at least a page and a half of our own custom questions.

10:07

So there you'll see those are highlighted as questions 13 through 20 on this year's this draft survey for 2025.

10:14

But every year we have been given the opportunity to add our own questions to the survey for things that are relevant to us or things that we're genuinely curious about from the public perspective.

10:24

It is really useful for us to do that in this space because of the cost savings.

10:31

Um and it's a perfect opportunity for us to get statistically valid data data on something when a large company who is doing this for us will basically give us a deal because we're already working with them on the rest of the national community survey.

10:46

If we were to ask those questions, there are seven of them this time in a separate survey, it would cost nearly the same price as what we're doing for this whole survey.

10:54

So we tend to take advantage of this opportunity.

Discussion Breakdown — Share of Meeting
Water And Wastewater Management████████████████████████████████████36%
Community Engagement█████████████13%
Engineering And Infrastructure██████████10%
Planning And Development██████████10%
Public Engagement███████7%
Legal Affairs███████7%
Environmental Protection█████5%
Procedural██2%
Budget Process██2%
Summary of Proceedings

Erie Town Council Study Session – February 4, 2025

The Erie Town Council held a study session on Tuesday, February 4, 2025, from 6:02 PM to 9:48 PM. The meeting covered three major topics: the 2025 Community Survey, the town's water portfolio and capital projects, and the Erie West annexation. The fourth agenda item, an update on the Erie Town Center, was postponed due to time constraints. Council members provided direction on the survey and engaged in detailed discussions on water supply and annexation costs and benefits.

Community Survey Discussion

  • Staff, led by Communications Director Gabby Ray, presented the 2025 National Community Survey (Polco). The survey costs $23,000 to mail to 4,000 statistically selected households, with an additional $20,000 for open participation. The survey includes benchmark questions (cannot be edited) and custom questions (13-20). The custom questions cover topics like a potential lodging tax, traffic flow, and K-12 education.
  • Council discussed timing: the survey is normally conducted in March/April to inform the budget cycle (starting in June). Mayor Yu proposed holding off until after the comprehensive plan discussion on March 4, 2025, to align survey questions with broader growth and development priorities. Other council members supported this delay, citing the need for a deeper dive on priorities like police station funding, rec center expansion, and growth management.
  • Staff noted that delaying would break the longitudinal data chain (since 2013) and potentially miss the budget cycle. Council acknowledged the value of benchmarking but wanted to incorporate comp plan questions. Final direction: hold the survey until after the comp plan study session, then bring in Polco consultants for a future study session to refine custom questions.

Water Portfolio & Water Capital Projects

  • Presenters included Utility Director Todd Petzendon, water attorneys Andrea Carroll and Pete Johnson, and Water Superintendent Chris Harris. They provided a comprehensive overview of water rights, supply, and demand.
  • Key terminology: Prior appropriation system (first in time, first in right), transmountain water, acre-foot (325,000 gallons), single-family equivalent (SFE = 0.5 acre-foot per year for a lot <7,000 sq ft).
  • Current supply: 7,382 owned CBT units + 955 leased units (lease expires 2025, renewal in progress). In 2024, the town served 13,228 active taps, using 6,100 acre-feet of potable water for a population of ~40,000. Per capita water use has decreased due to conservation.
  • Future projects:
    • Windy Gap Firming Project: Chimney Hollow Reservoir (90,000 acre-feet, 30,000 AF annual yield). Construction ahead of schedule, expected to start filling in late 2025. Erie has 20 Windy Gap units and 6,000 firming units. Cost: ~$46 million, financed through pool financing.
    • Boulder Creek Project: Horizontal wells and a 1,000-acre-foot reuse reservoir. Water court approved; first wells being completed. Estimated yield: up to 2,700 AF/year (conservatively 500 AF).
    • Philly Lake Well Project: Well completed, pump testing done. Sustainable yield conservatively 350 AF/year.
    • Northern Integrated Supply Project (NISP): Two new reservoirs (Glade Reservoir 170,000 AF, Galeton Reservoir 45,600 AF). Erie is the second-largest participant (16.25%, 6,500 AF). Cost estimate: $365 million for Erie plus $75 million for conveyance line. Federal permit issued Dec 2022; environmental mitigation cost for Erie is $9.5 million. Construction could begin 2030, subject to litigation (Save the Poudre lawsuit).
  • Demand projections: Current 6,100 AF for 40,000 population; at 80,000 population, demand could reach 13,700 AF; at 100,000, up to 17,100 AF.
  • Cost allocation: Projects are funded through water rates and tap fees. The rate study apportions costs between growth (new development) and existing residents (for redundancy/resilience). Most new supply projects are heavily weighted toward growth.
  • Council asked about risks: if NISP is delayed, the town may need to throttle growth or purchase additional CBT shares at high market prices. The leased CBT water is a bridge until Windy Gap firming comes online.

Annexation Information and Discussion

  • Special Counsel Jerry Dahl (replacing Town Attorney due to conflict of interest) and Planning Manager Kelly Jessal presented the Erie West annexation, initiated in 2021 after a Boulder County proposal for a composting facility. Originally 19 property owners, now only 5 remain.
  • The annexation uses series simultaneous annexation along rights-of-way (Kenosha Road, Highway 119) to achieve contiguity. The property is currently rural/agricultural.
  • Cost-benefit analysis:
    • Road maintenance: Kenosha Road is in fair condition; estimated $150,000 over 5 years for resurfacing. Property tax revenue over that period is slightly less (approx. $130,000), resulting in a net cost to the town.
    • Other services: snow plowing, police, and other city services would add further costs. No IGA with Boulder County for road maintenance or service boundaries is in place.
  • Benefits for the town: Staff cited increased influence over the area, potential for future annexation of neighboring properties, and preservation of rural agricultural character as per the comp plan. Council questioned these benefits, noting that Boulder County open space to the west reduces competitive annexation threats. Mayor Warshauer expressed skepticism, stating the town would take on a burden with minimal benefit to existing residents.
  • Several council members indicated they are leaning toward not approving the annexation unless property owners provide a compelling case. The annexation eligibility hearing is scheduled for February 25, 2025; zoning hearing for March 11, 2025.

Key Outcomes

  • Community Survey: Council directed staff to hold off on the 2025 survey until after the comprehensive plan discussion on March 4, 2025. Staff will schedule a future study session with Polco to align custom questions with council priorities.
  • Water Portfolio: No formal vote, but council acknowledged the critical need for ongoing water supply projects. The town will continue with planned projects; the 21st interim agreement for NISP will be brought forward the following week. Council requested a tour of the Chimney Hollow Reservoir and other water facilities.
  • Annexation: Council provided significant feedback that the current proposal lacks clear benefits for Erie residents. The question of whether to proceed will be decided at the February 25 hearing. Staff will communicate council's concerns to property owners and may prepare a motion to deny the annexation eligibility resolution if no compelling case is made.

Meeting Transcript

All right. It is um two um four twenty-five. This is uh the town of Erie Town Council study session. It's uh six oh two PM. Um and we're gonna go for about three hours here on four important topics. Um I'll just kind of set the stage that this is conversational, so we want everybody to chime in. I won't um actually interrupt anybody unless we start to talk over each other, and then I'll I'll definitely um ask people to ask for the floor, but hopefully this goes like our last study session where we could just have an informative educational um conversation. And so with that, um we've got four items on the agenda tonight. Um, I'm just gonna go through them briefly so everybody at home or in the audience knows what we're doing. Um, we're gonna talk a little bit about the community survey. Um, the big item on the agenda is our water portfolio and our capital projects that are associated with water. Um, our annexation information discussion. This is specifically about the annexation uh that we um postponed to a future date at our last meeting so that we could have this uh study session to learn more about that. And then the last item time permitting is an update on the Erie Town Center and uh with Evergreen at the four corners. Um we won't go beyond um nine ish, and so um, if we're running out of time, this may be one that gets bumped to a future day. All right, with that, I'll turn it over to our uh town manager, uh Malcolm Fleming. Um Gabby on this one and act as backup on that. Gabby and Pat. And I'll I'll jump in. I wanted that, and actually um I'll end up probably taking off after this, but uh, I wanted to just uh one kind of I guess apologize for the expediency of putting it on the agenda. Um I think you all probably saw an email from me, you know, a week or so ago with this practice, which uh I think we talked about hopefully briefly. I was suggesting hey, if you want this on the agenda email staff. Um I had given Gabby direction thinking that we were good to move forward, um, not realizing that that we needed the agenda item to be pulled. So I one just wanted to say thank thank you all, recognize that there was um probably two different email chains there. It was something that we had instituted previously just to make sure that staff was um putting the correct things on the agenda at the correct time. So just wanted to kind of um recognize that uh and also I I think completely open the door for any other types of conversations we want to have as we're continuing to kind of get to know each other and work together. Um so yeah, with that, I just wanted to make sure that I was being clear with you all as to why um staff was sending those type of emails. That's that's something that we had done saying, hey, do you want this on? Do you want this on? Um so I'll add a little bit of color here because I'm uh at least partially responsible for it being at the study session and not just moving forward. There was a discussion with Malcolm and myself, and I think Patrick, you and I had a conversation, and um it was around the other surveys that likely will be coming out once we get a chance to talk about the comp plan and whether we should move forward with this survey. Um, in that discussion, um, I recognize that there is longitudinal type data. You've been doing this survey for some time. Like to get the update for this uh this time. I didn't realize there were gonna be new questions, and it was through a discussion that another council member had recognized that there was a tax question on there, and um, that's when I started to say, hold on, I thought this was the same as everything else, and we held it back. And so here we are to learn about what those new questions are and what the urgency is and whether we move forward or or not. Sure, that's me then. Um I printed off some copies of the draft survey, so I'll just pass those around. I did only print 10. So um, Todd, please don't take one. Um sorry, everybody else is gonna have one. Um so I'll just kind of start by saying first I'm Gabby Ray, director of communications and community engagement. This will be the third of these that I have um administered on behalf of the town of Erie. So in 2021, when I first started, there was a community survey process. In 2023, there was one, and now there I assume will be one in 2025. Um the town has been doing this for more than a decade. I believe the first one, at least with our current uh contractor was done in 2013. Um and all of this was in the memo, and I'm gonna just assume that all of you read all of the attachments um to tonight's meeting, but this is just high-level information for you. Um this is part of the national community survey um that originally was administered by um the National Research Center who has partnered with Polco. That's all just background to say that we are under contract with Polco, who has been doing this for decades and is experts in their field of statistic uh statistically valid survey.

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