0:00 With attendance, John Bassemeyer.
0:24 Everybody had a chance to look over the minutes from April 15th.
0:30 Can I get a motion to approve?
0:35 The motion is second.
0:36 All those in favor say aye.
0:44 Moving on to applicants.
0:47 First we have Timothy Chewy.
0:53 Journeyman signed the rector.
1:03 Looks like he has it.
1:08 I have a motion and a second.
1:33 If it means anything, he has no recommends in his letters.
1:41 Juan, excuse me, I missed one.
1:46 Now technically we're going to be about that.
1:49 We've had that question before.
1:56 The lawyer said that as long as it speaks to his knowledge and has substance to the letter about what he can do or what he's been doing for how long.
2:10 And it's not for the business, it's for the individual.
2:26 Got a motion and second.
2:36 Is this or come back?
2:38 Have we done this one before?
2:42 All his notaries are out of date.
2:49 I just wonder if they've been through.
2:51 He'd been through before and something changed.
2:53 Can he put the same letters through?
2:56 That's a good catch.
2:57 I didn't catch the date.
3:02 So letters look good.
3:12 What's the requirement of the dates on the voters?
3:17 They have to be if their notary is expired, their notary doesn't count.
3:23 It's not legally binding any longer.
3:26 Oh, I see what you're saying.
3:32 So appended correctly letters.
3:39 Okay, we have a motion and second to postpone approvement of Jacob McDowell pending him getting letters with notaries that haven't expired.
4:04 And the next one is Andon McCleod McLeod.
4:14 Commercial contractor.
4:25 Did you second that, Pete?
4:28 We have a motion and second.
4:40 We have Sean Miller, Brick and Masonry contractor.
4:45 I only have two letters for Sean in my packet.
4:48 I would have written something down.
4:56 I have four, but two of them are the same.
5:00 Yeah, that's all I've got to.
5:04 And is that notary for both letters or just for one?
5:09 Oh, he's got two notes.
5:11 The notaries at the bottom.
4:59 But only got two letters.
5:14 Yeah, I only have two letters.
5:17 So is there an extra one here?
5:30 Well, that's the notary, isn't it?
5:32 No, I've got that letter of recommendation.
5:37 Well, not from Jess Paint.
5:38 Yeah, that's for that second letter.
5:46 Yeah, we've got Bobby Quick.
5:51 That's the only two letters we got for it.
5:55 I don't know if there's another one for him or not.
5:58 That's the only letters I got is two.
6:24 Yeah, it's on the top.
6:26 That's one we don't have.
6:30 Yeah, if there's a third letter, I'll make a motion to approve.
6:34 Do we have a second?
6:39 We have a motion second.
6:44 Motion passes for Sean Miller.
6:49 Next up is Kyle Wayne Page, residential building contractor.
6:57 So I think his name's Syle, right?
7:13 Well they spotted with a K on the back and a C on the front letter.
7:18 So his name's spelled wrong on the last letter.
7:22 Focusing on the wrong part.
7:25 That's if you focus it on the wrong part.
7:28 And he doesn't have a notary on the last letter.
7:30 Well, I think it's backwards.
7:34 So here's the last letter on the back, and then the notary for that letter is on the front.
7:58 We have a motion to approve.
8:02 We have a motion and a second.
8:09 Next is Charles Reeves Jr.
8:13 Fire Sprinkler contractor.
8:19 I will go ahead and say I've looked at this one and none of his letters are addressed to him.
8:26 They're all for the company.
8:33 So with that, I would accept the motion to uh deny until he gets letters of recommendation for him instead of the company.
9:04 Next is Bradley Rose, residential contractor.
9:16 I only see two letters of recommendation on this guy, too.
9:19 Yeah, so I want to see.
9:23 Make a motion to approve pending one more letter, notarized letter.
9:28 We have a motion to approve pending the one letter.
9:30 Do we have a second?
9:32 We have a motion and second.
10:01 There's only two finally.
10:06 Well, this last one's a bond.
10:10 It's not a letter of recommendation.
10:13 So it's got a bond, so he doesn't add that.
10:30 So with that, all those in favor of approving, pending the receipt of one more recommendation letter.
10:44 So we'll get him on that one more recommendation letter.
10:51 Christopher Savaka.
10:55 He's a excavating and concrete footing flat work contractor.
11:01 I only have two letters of recommendation for him as well.
11:14 Yeah, the I make a motion uh pending the third letter.
11:22 That's what I was getting ready to ask.
11:24 This the one we have is the license process.
11:28 We don't have a third.
11:31 Might have been a mix of.
12:04 We don't have that person.
12:08 You don't have Christopher Sabaco.
12:12 I make a motion to approve.
12:14 He does have all three letters.
12:39 So I make a second.
12:42 Yeah, so we do have a motion and second, but John's gonna look over.
12:45 He didn't have the packet.
12:50 All those in favor?
13:00 Next up is Joseph Stock.
13:03 Commercial waterproofing.
13:06 They're only recommending the company on that one on all three letters.
13:19 License goes with the person, not the business.
13:30 All right, make a motion pending three new letters recommendation for the individual, not the business.
13:41 All those in favor?
13:46 Pass pending receipt of new letters for the individual instead of the business.
13:53 Next up is Justin Sullivan.
13:57 Dan Cole Roofing Services.
14:08 We got all three letters with the notary.
13:59 Yes, I second that.
14:14 We have a motion and a second.
14:18 You don't have him.
14:20 I'll give it to them.
14:31 All those in favor?
14:38 Justice Sullivan is approved.
14:50 He's a commercial building contractor.
15:02 I think it's a thing.
15:03 We got all three letters.
15:13 John, you have that one.
15:20 We have a motion and a second.
15:22 All those in favor?
15:32 Next we have Burke Watts, a structural steel contractor, residential building.
15:41 He has all three letters with the notary.
15:43 I make a motion to approve.
15:49 We have a motion and a second.
15:52 All those in favor?
16:00 Burke Watts is approved.
16:07 Next up is Francisco Fabian Torres.
16:12 He is a wood framing contractor and siding and guttery contractor.
16:20 I've seen you add all three letters of recommendation with the notary.
16:24 I'll make a motion to approve.
16:26 Yes, I will second that.
16:29 We have a motion and a second.
16:31 All those in favor.
16:39 That gets done with the applicants.
16:41 There is no continuing education to be approved.
16:49 Bill, do you want to discuss the uh update us on the testing?
16:56 Bill Petke with the Southwestern Indiana Builders Association.
17:00 So I'm here to answer questions or uh if you have any uh to talk about it.
17:04 The update is that uh we have made really good progress, still not ready.
17:09 The part that's uh taking longer than I thought was getting the testing software to mesh well with the proctoring software.
17:18 Uh the the part about the getting registered on the windows, getting through the payment window easy, is all done and it's ready to go.
17:28 I hopefully we will be able to have people take practice tests real soon.
17:32 Um I think that uh probably the last thing that we need is uh Bart has already given us questions that are like administration type questions.
17:46 The code questions are there.
17:48 Probably what we need to do is work with Kat or and or BART on the messaging that we send.
17:54 So that would like the guys that you guys approved today.
17:57 What's the email that they're gonna get saying congratulations?
18:00 The board has passed you to take the test.
18:03 You're gonna get a link, go through the payment page, then you get a link to get with a code to start taking the test.
18:10 Here are the rules, you know.
18:11 You know, here's what you're allowed to do.
18:13 Here's how it's gonna work.
18:14 So everybody understands as soon as they get approved, they get their first email.
18:18 They should know the whole process in that first email.
18:21 Now they might go slow and taking the test, I guess.
18:25 I don't know how long what's typical, I don't know.
18:29 But um, but it'll be ready to go.
18:34 Anything specific questions or I mean, I've gotten really positive feedback about this decision and and where we're going with it.
18:42 So I don't know if you guys have, but yeah.
18:45 Well, I have a question on the test itself.
18:49 Is there because I know once we approve them to take the test, they have a year to take the test, correct?
18:57 How long do they have to take it once they start the test?
19:03 Just the three hours.
19:03 So I think that's what it is that works.
19:05 It looks like they can they can leave and then come back to the right.
19:10 See, that's part of what we're gonna have to tell them up front.
19:12 Make sure you've got a three window, three-hour window up to that to take the test.
19:18 Don't don't take it 20 minutes before you gotta go pick up kids at school or something, right?
19:25 You gotta have a window ready to go for yourself to give yourself that time to take it.
19:28 So they can't come back another day and finish the test.
19:32 I I don't know, it's a three-hour window.
19:36 But there's other things that there's other things that we're kind of tripping into, like everybody has their ID.
19:42 You get the stuff, you get online, you take the test.
19:44 It's not always that simple.
19:46 What if they don't pass the test?
19:49 They gotta go through the process again of getting a retake code and stuff like that, because you they the first test, if they don't pass it, God bless them, but it shouldn't count for, I mean, they shouldn't get points or anything like that.
20:03 Should they should have start over with taking it, so you just gotta think of every situation or every scenario that we could think of to, yeah.
20:11 So, how many times do they get to take this exam?
20:16 Like, for instance, the electrical is doing the NASPOX.
20:21 They're only allowed to take that test three times in one year, and if they don't put it, they've got away.
20:29 So I I get it, but I'm telling you, the beauty of this is it is your hands.
20:35 You can decide that.
20:37 We'll we'll follow whatever pattern you guys want us to follow.
20:41 We're not changing the policies.
20:43 We don't want to change policy, we just want to fix the test.
20:47 So if you guys say three is the magic number, then you gotta wait a while.
20:51 Okay, we'll do that.
20:52 If you say, listen, we need contractors, let's get them in.
20:55 If they're willing to sign up and get through this testing part again, uh let them we'll do that too.
21:02 Or whatever you guys want.
21:03 Yeah, ID tech doesn't have to lend it.
21:05 They can take it as any time.
21:07 But they pay for each time that we have a pay for each time.
21:10 Well, that's another thing.
21:11 I I would say that they need to get a new code and a new session set up and you know, pay again to take the test.
21:18 I I'm not trying to be harsh, but they need to take this test seriously.
21:24 And if they just go, Well, I'm just gonna, you know, I've been in construction, I'm just gonna I'm just gonna wing it, you know.
21:30 I'm gonna send it five dollars a test.
21:32 That's they better take it seriously.
21:35 Well, uh 175, yeah.
21:37 Yeah, that's a lot of money.
21:40 Well, but there's guys that think that they've been building long enough and they know what's in the code.
21:45 I mean, we're talking about ego problem here, is what I'm thinking of.
21:49 But you you probably run across these guys.
21:52 Sometimes they take the test the first time just to see what is line.
21:58 And then if there's anything, they need to start.
22:00 So the software is pretty dang cool.
22:03 They can take this test and uh they might learn the question, but the four answers that are provided, the three wrong ones plus one right one, they won't show up in the same order again.
22:14 It'll it'll be I mean the right answer might be D this time, but it might be B or A the next time.
22:19 So if they just memorize letters or answer letters, that they'll be in trouble.
22:24 Same question, same questions and same answer.
22:28 Yeah, um, it'll it'll pull those from the bank.
22:34 So, like for a for a residential contractor, it'll pull 100 questions out of the pool of you know 150 that we got now, but we'll keep adding.
22:43 But um so they won't get the exact I mean, it'd be really uh highly unlikely they'll get the exact same thing.
22:52 It'll all be shuffled around, yeah.
22:53 Yeah, numbers and right, I so guys, this is gonna be really slick when we get it.
23:00 I'm just sorry, I'm just sorry the software's are it's taking longer for the software to get put together, but both sides say this is gonna work.
23:07 It's just a matter of getting it together.
23:09 So I think I mean they've done this before, haven't they?
23:14 Um I don't know that they've done the testing for a contractor test with proctoring software like this before.
23:22 Now they've done other websites and done testing and stuff like that, but I don't think they've done it with the proctoring, which it's pretty sophisticated stuff.
23:32 I don't know what you mean by proctoring things like that.
23:37 They're the website watches them over a camera.
23:42 And then it kind of measures their behavior.
23:46 You have your behavior score and then you have your actual score, and at a certain level, the behavioral score will flag, and then you review so that you know to review because their behavior might be off.
23:59 If you're using something that's not approved, yeah, to take the test, it'll alert them.
24:05 That's what they're being watched through their own.
24:09 They're being watched, and it doesn't mean it automatically trips them and fails them, but if it's below a score, that means CAD or whoever can go back and watch them take that test, watch the video of them take the test.
24:21 It's like, wow, yeah.
24:23 So I mean it's it's pretty slick system.
24:27 That's how the college class.
24:29 If you go to any talk to any college kid, teenagers, they know all about this stuff, but I had to me and John Bassmeyer were we just so what is it so?
24:42 We don't have a limit currently.
24:48 We just have they have a year to get the license out.
24:54 So they want to extend it.
24:56 Is that something maybe we want to talk about at another meeting before it gets implemented to maybe check with the council?
25:04 The applications are only good for one year.
25:07 So after they expire, they do sometimes get an extension, depending on the certain circumstances.
25:17 But other than that, um, if it's been passed a year, we may go through the working.
25:25 You know, if they take if they take the test and they don't do well, and then they go, you know what, maybe I should take a class about this stuff or a codes class.
25:32 There are people that offer codes classes for this purpose.
25:36 So maybe that's a caveat if they if they don't do well in a certain number of times.
25:40 I would I would say three might be a little low, but if they if you pick a number and say if you hit that number, you still can't pass it, but you go take a class on the code or whatever, then maybe that's it makes sense that now they're trying, right?
25:57 I don't want to get in it.
25:58 I there's just all kinds of good ideas.
26:00 We're already running behind, so I'll just say we can bring up that at another meeting and before we kick it off.
26:06 So either way, they're going to be held accountable.
26:09 Well, they're not gonna get they're not gonna get they're not gonna get a uh register to a company or pull permits until they pass that test.
26:20 Yeah, and they're watched on the camera and everything else, yeah.
26:26 We made it we made it a lot easier to take that test.
26:29 Not we didn't make the test easier, we made it a lot easier to take the test, but at the same time it is getting scrutinized more.
26:35 I know we're running over it.
26:37 Once you all started on this, I looked it up somewhat on the internet, and some of these get pretty pricey, taking these tests, these practice tests.
26:46 Well, you're kind of on the leading edge of bringing the code book up to test together.
26:54 I'm just wondering, maybe you can have an idea.
26:58 How are these training sessions on the internet?
27:00 How do they do it with the code book?
27:04 You know, I think it's just uh former code inspectors, quite honestly, that are very familiar with the code, and so they try to walk people through the you know how basically it's it's not what do you know in the code book, it's how fast can you look it up?
27:19 Because it's you know, span tables are this chapter, and planning and separations are in chapter three and foundations are four, and so I mean, if somebody asks a concrete question about foundations, you don't go to chapter five, you'll be lost in floors.
27:36 So, I'm sorry, too.
27:29 No, no, it's it's fine.
27:46 Um does anybody else have any old news they want to bring up before we move on?
27:53 Uh new new business, new news, Bart Schult Bart Schutz should shoots.
28:05 He will be retiring on July seventh as deputy building commissioner.
28:11 Um so we will be looking for a replacement if anybody knows anybody that may be interested.
28:18 Um have them watch for the posting of the job so that they can apply for it.
28:28 Or they can contact Johnny.
28:31 Um with that uh I'll make a motion to adjourn.
28:39 Alright, we'll close this meeting out.