Good evening, everyone.

It is 5 30 p.m.

on Tuesday, November 25th, 2025.

Welcome to the Rules and Public Policy Committee meeting for the City County Council.

We're in the public assembly room.

We'll start our meeting this evening with uh introductions of our council in the first row, counselor leader Maori.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Brian Mowray, District 25.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Paul and A, District 22.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Allie Brown, District 10.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair Renee Allen, District 15.

Thank you, Chairman Andy Nielsen, District 14.

Maggie Lewis, District 5.

And I'm Lee Warrior Robinson, Chair of the Committee representing District 1.

We do have three items on agenda this evening.

And the first step is proposal 343, 2025, directs the rules and public policy committee to review and reprepare the report pertaining to the fiscal impact statement associated with the Marion County Public Defender Union Agreement with International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers Union Local Union 481.

Who was speaking to this agenda will come forward, please and or state your name, please?

Hi.

Good evening.

My name is Jake McVay.

I'm deputy controller with the Office of Finance and Management.

Um proposal 343.

So as a reminder, municipal code section 291-6100.

Mr.

McBay, my going.

Is my microphone on?

It's on perfect.

Thank you.

So as a reminder, municipal code section 291-610 requires that the controller prepare and present a fiscal impact study before a union agreement can become fully effective and enforceable.

So negotiations with the union began last summer, and a tentative agreement was reached earlier this October, signed by both the union and the city.

This contract covers the attorneys and support staff of the public defender agency for uh fiscal years 2025 and 2026.

Uh salary adjustments for these employees were implemented as of the November 21st paycheck to be effective January 1st, 2025.

It was necessary to implement the contract when we did so that we can ensure the pay increases happened within this fiscal year.

So on this table uh shows the components of the contract that directly impact an employees paycheck that includes base salary uh seniority pay and the premium pay for certifications.

The union agreement sets base pay schedules for attorneys and support staff to be effective January 1st of this year, then a 3% increase to salaries as of January 1st, 2026.

This table breaks down the total pay components from the fiscal impact statement by attorney and support staff.

These numbers also include increases to PERF and other fringe benefits.

We used uh we based our calculations off of 223 current employees.

Uh that's 137 attorneys and 86 support staff.

The average increase for attorneys is 24.6 percent, and the average increase for support staff is 18.1%.

I do want to note that the total line from this table differs from the total line in the fiscal impact statement submitted to this committee.

Um, the difference is the estimated increases for student loan and professional fee reimbursements.

The student loan reimbursement uh in this contract mirrors the same reimbursement program offered by the prosecutor's office, and then this contract will also provide reimbursement for annual attorney, notary, social worker, uh, and interpreter registration licensing fees.

And then we base our estimates off of assumptions on which uh attorneys and support staff would be eligible for these reimbursements.

So, next I want to cover at a high level how we plan to fund this contract.

Um keep in mind that the financial proposals for this negotiation were tended tentatively agreed to based on projections of income and property tax growth prior to uh this year's legislative session and SEA 1.

So typically the full cost for the first year of a new new union contract is not included in the budget based on the timing of negotiations and budget development.

So OFM has addressed as addressed these first year union increases through uh fiscals at the end of the fiscal year.

So like the other new contracts that began January 1st of this year, the PDA's budget includes cost of living adjustments for these union positions, and this allowed OFM to get a portion of the funding into the budget.

The difference between the COLA and the contractual increases in 2025 is addressed in the year-end fiscal.

This was proposal 342 that was presented last Wednesday to the public safety and criminal justice committee.

So a portion of this contract is addressed through the budget and the cost of living adjustments.

The remaining costs will be funded by the 40% reimbursement, the public defender agency receives from the State Public Defender Commission and the uh and then the last component is the 2026 supplemental public safety income distribution, income tax distribution.

So at this point in time, OFM is confident that we will be able to fund these increases while affording or adhering to our own fund balance policies.

I also believe that we will be able to work collaboratively to ensure that we live within our means for 2026 and we'll be able to build this contract into the 2027 budget.

So with that, I um happy to answer uh any questions.

Thank you, uh Deputy McVeigh.

Commissary question counselors.

Anyone in the audience could have speak proposal 343.

Seeing no turn to any motion.

So excuse me, take a look at the You don't have to vote on the just accept it.

Just okay.

So we're good.

Thank you.

Uh up next, proposal 351, 2025.

A mis revised code of exotic city of Indianapolis, Marion County by adding a new chapter 820, establishing the creation of designated outdoor refreshment areas.

Who's speaking to this proposal?

Councillor Nielsen.

Uh thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Uh, with your request uh with your consent, um, I'd like to hear, I'd like to present both on 351 and 352, subject to a couple of amendments that I would offer after the presentation if that works for you.

Um the motion or just one consent, Council.

Yeah, just as that works for you for process wise.

Thank you, sir.

Um thank you, members of the room.

Thank you, members of the rules and public policy uh committee.

Um tonight uh we are gonna hear two proposals, proposals 351 and 352 as amended.

Uh, we'll walk through those specific amendments in the presentation as well.

Uh as first, and not to be overly repetitive in this presentation, but the reason that we have two proposals is uh because the city of Indianapolis does not currently have a regulatory framework for designated outdoor refreshment areas in our city.

Um proposal 351 uh establishes the rules and processes for all potential DORAs in the city of Indianapolis, and proposal 352 establishes the specific rules and processes for a proposed DORA in the neighborhood of Irvington, which is in District 14.

So again, this would be the Irvington Dora would be the first door in the city of Indianapolis, not the first in Marion County.

There's one in Speedway.

Um then if a future community and working with its counselor wanted to bring forward a uh DORA proposal, this committee or a relevant committee would just see one proposal.

So part of the reason why we're doing this together is because we have been starting from square one in this process for the city of Indianapolis.

Next slide, please.

So by way of background, a DORA, again a designated outdoor refreshment area, allows individuals who are at least 21 years old to purchase alcoholic beverages from approved vendors and establishments and carry them outside to be consumed within the DORA boundaries.

The DORA statutes, again set by the state requires that the city adopt an ordinance establishing the DORA that will be submitted to the Alcohol and Tobacco Commission, and the DORA has to include a number of components, a map of the refreshment area, the boundaries of the refreshment area, the location of proposed designated retail permites and temporary vendors, a statement that the refreshment area is consistent with municipal zoning ordinance, the number spacing and type of signage to be used, and the dates and hours of I of operation.

And an important note on DORAS is that there can be no more than seven DORAS established in a given municipality.

So for the consolidated city with our four excluded cities, right?

Each one of those excluded cities could have seven DORAS, and the city of Indianapolis can have seven DORAs.

So the DORA allows an individual to walk in and out with a beverage in a designated area that they uh that the business themselves may not be selling.

So next slide, please.

DORAS are also consistent with existing open container laws.

So DORAS are a natural extension of existing state law that allows individuals to carry an alcoholic beverage in its original container out of a premise, including an individual's own home and consume in public.

So that includes if you were going to a liquor store, or if you were going to uh establishment that allows carry out, you or your own home, so long as that uh is in its original container, you can go wherever you'd like in public.

Additionally, um original manufacturers of an alcoholic beverage are permitted to sell their products in open containers for public consumption under special event permits.

So if any of you have visited uh our neighborhood uh during the Halloween festival, you will notice that there are a number of breweries who come and serve their products, and you can walk around the designated area under the special event permit with an open container because they are the original manufacturer of that product.

So DORAS streamline this process for brick and burner businesses.

It allows businesses in a designated area to do these other things.

So next slide, please.

There are 46 operating DORAs across Indiana.

So what's also important to note is much of our proposals, both 351 and 352, we have model legislation in 43 other communities.

There are there are three communities that have two DORAs.

So in 43 other communities, we have 43 other examples and 43 other data sets to indicate how these are working and how we design legislation accordingly.

So next slide, please.

So again, the first proposal, proposal 351 as amended, and we'll walk through the specifics of the amendment in a few slides.

So this lays out the city process for internal approvals.

So we really wanted in designing this and working really closely with the city on what we want the internal process to look like.

We wanted to not create an administrative burden on our city-county agencies who are in charge of signing off on multiple of these internal processes, and we wanted to ensure that the district counselor has is the one leading the way on these projects, that they are working with the business community and the community, but that they are the ones bringing forward proposals to the council to establish DORAS in their community.

So I cannot establish a DORA if 351 becomes local ordinance.

I cannot establish a DORA anywhere else other than District 14.

Um 351, uh you as you read through this establishes again, this is the internal process for how we do this, the basic sets of rules that the ATC requires us to include, but a few things that I want to be I want to point out because I think it's very important.

In the DORA, it does not allow for unlimited use or taking taking beverages in and out of businesses.

So listed here you will see that you can have a combination of these three volumes of beverage, right?

So 16 ounces of beer, 12 ounces of wine, a mixed drink no more than 10 ounces, two ounces of liquor, and some combination of two of those.

So I cannot go into a designated permittee, buy a dozen beers, and walk out with them.

I'm only permitted to do two of those things.

Next slide, please.

Signage must be posted on the exits, uh exits of each designated permittee and within the public right-of-way of each pedestrian exit of the DORA.

So what that means is that if I am a designated permittee, if I am selling alcoholic beverages, if I choose to participate in the DORA, then I have to have a sign at my entrance and my exits indicating that I am participating, and then there are signs placed around the borders of the DORA that say you're now entering and exiting the DORA.

And as I just indicated, no business is obligated to participate in this DORA.

So that means we could go through this whole process of creating an Irvington DORA.

No one could choose to participate.

There's a whole secondary process after this, which we'll get to, that requires businesses at that point to say we are going to participate in the DORA.

And we've structured this that all costs must be covered by the applicant, by the business community.

So I think the business community sees this as an investment.

I think we should see it as an investment, but there is not an additional taxpayer burden on funding the signs and the trash cans associated with the DORA.

And we've also built in some penalties in the event that there are ordinance violations to any of these things that we've indicated, right?

And those are listed here to provide an extra level of accountability in these designated outdoor refreshment areas.

So next slide, please.

So on your desk, there is an amendment to proposal 351, and it does two things.

First, uh the sanitation plan is the on the responsibility of the applicant.

We have that in 352, but we also wanted that in 351.

And in working, again, we've worked very closely with the city on this, provides for additional clarification on the use of glass containers in outdoor dining areas, but not in the DORA.

So you may have a business in the DORA that has an outdoor patio.

We want to be able to allow those businesses to continue to serve maybe a beverage in a glass container, but that doesn't apply to the DORA itself.

So you're still physically outside, but you're not participating in the DORA.

So we added some language that clarified that.

Next slide, please.

So that's 351.

So those are the rules that are again are going to apply to all seven potential DORAs in the city of Indianapolis.

Now you get to come to District 14, and we're going to talk about a DORA in Irvington.

So again, this establishes the rules and processes specific to the Irvington DORA.

So what's important is all the things we talked about in 351, they apply, plus a whole lot of other things.

So again, 351 applies.

Trash.

Designated permittees, our businesses who choose to participate, must install trash cans in front of their establishments and empty the cans and maintain cleanliness around their business and within the DORA.

The responsibility of keeping the community safe and are the key community clean is on the businesses.

Safety.

We have allowed IMPD to have broad authority to intervene if necessary and establish additional rules should they be needed.

They don't have to come in front of this council.

They can unilaterally do that.

We want to stay out of public safety officials' way if something that we do not anticipate would happen does happen.

And these proposals don't attempt to, nor can they preempt ATC.

It's a state aid, it's a it's a state regulator.

So ATC still has oversight and ultimate authority over any establishment in the DORA serving alcohol.

Hours of operation would be functional and open during normal business hours.

Again, these entrance and exit signs would be installed around the boundaries of the DORA.

And businesses, again, the designated permittees are required to have that sticker or that sign at the entrance and the exit of their establishment saying, hey, we are participating, and other businesses, so maybe a retailer who's in the DORA, right, may say we want to participate, and we could put, they could put a sign of their choosing on their establishment.

And containers and cups.

So there has to be a standard cup used in the DORA, and the designated permittees are to use a non-glass, non-plastic, and non-breakable container.

So next slide, please, Candace.

So the second amendment that we will consider tonight is uh does a number of things.

First, um there was kind of a there's a clerical error that was some numbering that you will see.

We're just getting that numbering right.

But amendment two addresses community concerns and feedback related to the introduced proposed map and the types of containers to be used in a proposed Irvington DORA.

So the first map, and those will be some of the next slides, was the footprint of the Irvington Halloween festival.

We have now narrowed that down to just be the business district of Irvington.

And so if you've been in the, if you've been to Irvington before, if you've participated and contributed our community in that way, you understand that there are two business districts, one on Washington Street, one on Bonna, and they're connected by Audubon Road.

That is the DORA.

So this residential inclusion has been significantly reduced and minimized to ensure the DORA still remains functional and signage language is revised accordingly.

And the business community has already made a commitment to use non-glass, non-plastic, and non-breakable containers, i.e., recyclable or compostable containers, and this amendment formalizes that commitment.

So this is already a commitment that our business community and show of good faith to make this work, has made this community commitment.

This amendment just formalizes that.

Next slide, please.

So there has been a great deal of community engagement on this proposal.

We have worked in collaboration with the Irvington Business Community and Community Leaders to ensure a positive outcome for the neighborhood.

In your packets, you have letters of support from the Irvington Business Association, the historic Irving and Community Council, who represents who serves as the designated neighborhood organization for the neighborhood, the Irvington Development Organization, which is our local CDC.

We also have had positive conversations and letters of consent are coming from the Irvington United Methodist Church, the Irvington Presbyterian Church, George Julian's School 57.

We've also discussed this in depth with the IUMC preschool, the Irvington branch of the of the public library, and we've held two public meetings, one in September and one just last week of this year.

Next slide, please.

We also have been working very closely again with the city to ensure that this again makes sense, that we have rules and regulations, a process, the boundaries conform to other local ordinances, and to minimize administrative burden and allow individuals who are responsible for doing these things to do their jobs.

This includes DMD, business and neighborhood services for those in the audience, that's formerly known as code enforcement, the Department of Public Works, IMPD, including both the administration and the East District Commander, the Office of Corporation Counsel, which is our which is the city's lawyer, and the mayor's office.

Next slide, please.

So why a DORA in Irvington?

The goal of an of a DORA in Irvington is support is to support Irvington's thriving main street and entertainment district by leveling the playing field, streamlining the regulatory process for small business owners in the neighborhood.

Many of our small business owners who are participant want to participate in this, live in the neighborhood.

But specifically is going to be a huge benefit for community events like First Fridays, the Irvington Halloween Festival, Irvington Pride, which is from my understanding the uh only uh neighborhood-based pride celebration in our city, the Holiday Open House and St.

Patrick's Day, and daily operations.

And colleagues, I want to be really clear on this next point.

Establishing a DORA is not an attempt to create a bar crawl scene in Irvington.

Why?

It's not part of the neighborhood's culture.

The community does not want that, businesses do not want that, and as the counselor who represents District 14, I do not want that.

While there are a number of safety and accountability measures in place, ATC's ability to continue to regulate these establishments, IMPD's flexibility step in at any given time and establish a safety plan that they see fit, code enforcement's ability to issue code violations and ordinance violations, and myself.

I think it's important that all of these measures are in place.

The objective is not to create a bar crawl scene, and ultimately, again, if you've been to Irvington, you will know that this is a community that holds everyone accountable all of the time.

So I also want to emphasize, because we are talking about serving alcoholic beverages, that we do not have a public intoxication or over serving problem in our community.

That is why our community overwhelmingly is supportive of this, and you know why?

Is because they trust our business community.

That is the truth.

And so I understand this can be a difficult topic at times, but I want to be really clear on what we're trying to do here, and that is to level the playing field and the regulatory burden on our brick and mortar businesses in our community so they can spend their time reinvesting in our community, focused on helping our community grow instead of filling out paperwork and uh paying the state permit fees.

So next, yes, this was the uh map that you would have seen in your uh at uh 351 when it was introduced.

Excuse me, this was attachment A, and then Candace next slide.

This is attachment B.

Or attachment A revised.

So again, we've cut out that kind of western gut of the original DORA, and to emphasize again uh when you come to our community, this is how we connect the business district to itself already.

The red border is the red uh dashed line is the border.

Uh blue dots on the sun on the map indicate where those entrance and exit signs will be located.

The green is location for temporary vendor locations, and then the orange text are inclusive of all of the businesses in our district that have a some sort of some sort of liquor license.

Beer, wine, spirits are a combination of the three.

So next side, next slide.

Um this is not necessarily required as part of the ordinance, but I just wanted to share with you all like how our business community is is is thinking about this.

Um these signs and cups will eventually be revised, but just kind of an idea of what how other communities have done this and how our small businesses are thinking about this.

Also, next slide, please.

Um so as part of the uh application process, we also have to again we pass the proposal and then we kind of start all over again, and we go then to all these businesses uh who may want to participate, and we have them indicate hey, I want to participate, that receives city approval, and then that goes to the ATC in a package that also will include uh consent forms from the two churches and um the school that are within 200 feet of the border of the door, excuse me.

Next slide, please.

So tonight uh we hear this in public rules and public policy.

This would go to the full council on Monday, and then the timeline is a little unknown, only because we have to take all those materials, we have to package them together, we submit them to ATC, ATC then reviews that uh application, and after they approve that application, if they do, uh we work with uh DPW to ensure that signs and trash cans are installed, and the businesses then have to put those again, those window cleans, those signs on their establishments, and then the door opens and becomes operational.

Uh in talking with the business community, once we kind of get to that final step, our objective is to kind of when we see what the process may look like after that, kind of pick a date that we say that the that the door is operational, so that we are communicating with our community that the DORA is now functional.

Um so with that, Mr.

Chairman.

Uh that concludes the presentation.

Um, and I'd be ready to offer amendments if you are ready.

Thank you, Councilor Nielsen.

Comments or questions from members of the committee on these two proposals.

Councilor Brown.

Thank you.

I just have one quick question for Councillor Nielsen as I'm looking at the map.

So Audubon Road, that like if I get a beer at Jack Mo's and I've decided I'm gonna go get a cocktailed strange bird, I can walk down Audubon.

Either side of the street, and that'll be marked.

That's correct.

Okay, that's correct.

Sorry, just wanted to double check.

Thank you.

That's been some of the the back and forth and ensuring that that would be compliant uh to in order to do that.

Yes, but that's correct.

Okay, Leader Lewis.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Thank you, Councillor Nielsen, for your presentation.

Uh, just a question of clarity.

Um slide eight around safety, it says IMPD would have broad authority to intervene if necessary.

Um you felt the need to put that in there because doesn't IMPD currently have the authority to do that?

Yes.

Oh, sorry.

Thank you.

Thank you, Leader Lewis.

Um, so in the state statute, it it it it provides the option for the the community and working together with IMPD to create a safety plan.

But uh one of the again, one of the points to emphasize is we don't have these some of these issues right now, and so there wasn't a need to put together a safety plan.

But what we want to be able to say is IMPD, if we get to the point, you know, hope that we're working together to solve any potential problems, but we we're stepping out of your way.

So no other regulatory burden is being put on the police department to comply with.

Yes.

So yeah, maintains their broad authority.

Yes.

Thank you.

Thank you, madam leader.

Comments or questions, counselors on these two proposals by Council Nielsen.

Anyone you ready for public comment?

You got you want to do your amendments?

Uh you want to do amendments to uh uh Mr.

Chairman, I move to amend this is on proposal 351 amendment to 351.

I move to amend section sections 820-105 and section 820-106 of proposal number 351 2025 by adding the underlying language to reads as follows.

And on page two, it is the language uh containing uh glass containers in the outdoor dining areas second.

Motion probably moved and seconded.

Uh comments from counselors.

The trend to any motion on the um second, do a roll call vote or comments on the amendment.

Let's go do it together one time.

Um all those in favor saying aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Those opposed.

Motion Q.

Councillor Nielsen.

Uh thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Um amend proposal 352 now.

Correct.

Okay, thank you, sir.

Um, I move to amend on proposal 352.

I move to amend sections 820-202, 820-205, and 820-209 of proposal number 352 2025 by deleting the language that is stricken through and adding the underlying language to read as follows.

Updates our boundaries according to the updated map, updates signage according to our updated map, makes conforming changes to numbering and makes the uh containerslash cups amendment that I mentioned in my presentation as well.

Motion probably moved and seconded to amend proposal 352 comments or questions from counselors on the amendment.

Seeing none of the motion probably moved to second it.

All those in favor by saying aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Those opposed?

Motion carries Councillor Nielsen.

Um thank you, Mr.

Uh Mr.

Chairman.

Uh with that, I think we move on to to public comment.

Thank you, Ms.

Clerk.

You want to read the uh statement for the public comment.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Before we open the floor to public comments, we would like to remind committee members and the public of a few ground rules so everyone can have a fair chance to speak and be heard.

It is important that we each observe the following rules.

First, each speaker will be limited to two minutes.

Second, any public comments must reasonably relate to the agenda item under consideration.

Third, speakers who stray from the item under consideration or become unduly repetitious may be asked to move on to their next point or conclude their comments.

Finally, attendees who cause disruptions that prevent the committee from proceeding through tonight's agenda in a reasonably effective manner will be removed.

Please remember that some types of threatening speech or enticements of violence are not protected by the First Amendment at all.

We will deal with those issues if they come up, but we do not think they will.

And now, Mr.

Chair, if a committee member asks for consent to adopt these rules, we can proceed to public comments.

Thank you.

Thank you, Ms.

Clerk.

Thank you, Counselors.

Ms.

Clerk, you have a list of those that signed in to speak to these proposals?

Mr.

Chair, we do have uh couple of people signed up.

Read their names, please.

I'm gonna read the first couple.

Thank you.

Is that okay?

Absolutely.

Thank you.

Carrie Shea, Derek, Kendall, Carrie, Yazel.

Thank you, Ms.

Clerk.

Sir, state your name for the record, please.

My name is Carrie Shea, co-owner of the Snug.

I'm reading a statement from my business partner, Jim Arnold, owner of the Snug, who could not be here tonight.

Go ahead.

Good evening.

My name is Jim Arnold, and I am both a resident of Irvington and one of the owners of the SNUG.

I care deeply about Irvington and the small businesses that make it unique.

Over the past months, I have had a chance to speak with many neighbors and business owners about the Irvington Dora.

There have been many questions.

As we have had the opportunity to explain and clarify the DORA, its support has been consistent and enthusiastic.

Irvington already has incredible festivals, events, and small businesses that give our neighborhood its charm.

Allowing patrons to purchase alcoholic beverages from licensed establishments and enjoy them responsibly within the clearly defined area will help drive foot traffic, support local businesses, and create a more engaging and walkable environment.

Communities across Indiana have seen clear benefits after establishing similar districts, and Irvington deserves the same opportunity to grow.

Adora isn't about creating disorder, it's about creating opportunity.

Next for the record, please.

Yeah, my name is Derek Kendall.

Um I've lived in Irvington for more than 10 years, and in that time, I've seen how hard it is for small businesses not just to open their doors, but to stay open.

I've watched wonderful shops and restaurants come and go, and I know how brutal that cycle can be for owners who pour their lives into this neighborhood.

I've also attended every Halloween festival, the St.

Patrick's Fest, and just about every community event Irvington has hosted.

And in all those years, I've consistently seen how responsible, community-minded, and self-policing our neighborhood is.

We show up, we support each other, and we take care of our space.

For me, bringing a door to Irvington is simply the next logical step and giving our small businesses an additional tool to thrive.

When our small businesses succeed, it strengthens neighborhood vibrancy, walkability, safety, and the overall desirability of the East Side.

I understand that some people have concerns about alcohol.

Those experiences are valid, and no one is here dismissing them.

But policy can't be shaped around meeting the needs of every individual who has been impacted by alcohol because that list is endless.

What is harmful is when individual experiences are used to stifle innovation, hold back local growth, or create fear when it is not warranted.

Irvington has proven time and time again that we can handle large crowds, celebrations, and open container events responsibly.

We have a strong support system in place from businesses to neighborhood organizations that will address any issues that arise.

Thank you.

Thank you for your comments.

Your name for the record, please.

Yeah, hi.

I am Carrie Yazelle.

Uh, I am an Irvington resident as well.

Uh, I'm also the director of the Irvington Halloween Festival and have been for the last six years.

Umanimous support from the Irvington Community Council, which is the organization that throws the festival each year.

But I wanted to share as the festival director how excited I am about the potential the Dora provides for the neighborhood, and most importantly, for our small businesses, who are such an important partners of the success of the festival.

Each year we welcome more than 60,000 people to our neighborhood.

If you haven't come, you should.

Put it on your calendar.

Uh we have not had any reported issues of public intoxication or unruly behavior in years, or at least that I've been aware of.

Uh, due to a large part of the close partnership that we have with law enforcement and the hard work and attention of our small businesses.

Our small businesses continue to be trusted partners and have demonstrated that they are invested in the success and safety of our community.

This proposal will allow them to benefit even more from the festival events.

Irvington is an incredibly strong and engaged neighborhood, and our small business community is a large part of what makes that very, very special.

We've been in conversation with Councillor Nielsen for months now about this idea and how it affects and benefits the neighborhood, and in particular the Halloween Festival.

I'm excited to stand in support of this proposal and very excited to see all of you at the 80th Annual Halloween Festival next October.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Ms.

Clerk, additional three more names, please.

Julie Widow.

I'm sorry, I thought I was supposed to sign in, but I have to use it.

She's not a good question.

Lynne Carroll.

Kyla Thompson, Dave Garrett.

Thank you, Ms.

Clerk.

Welcome to the Kirk King.

Hello.

Hi, Mr.

Chair, remainder of the counselors.

Thank you so much for hearing this issue and having us tonight.

I am Lynne Carroll.

I am a six-year resident of Irvington, as someone who has poured time, money, and mostly heart into our historic home and neighborhood, and whose house is on the border of the Dora.

I fully support this initiative.

But I'm also here as the vice president of the Irvington Development Organization to speak on behalf of our support for the proposed Dora.

And I'd like to remind the members that you have a letter of our support in front of you.

I do has been serving Irvington for over 20 years, focusing on the nexus of community and business support.

I do is work with our businesses to responsible to responsibly roll out new ideas before.

Our organization was at the front of advocating to bring the first brewery to our neighborhood, Black Acre, and we all grew to love that.

We assisted in getting the first three-way liquor license in the neighborhood, and the community did express concerns about these initiatives.

But we listened and rolled them out responsibly.

Since then, the businesses have proven what an absolute asset asset they are to our neighborhood.

And that leap of faith that our neighborhood took led us to the successes that we see today.

Residents from all over the city come to Irvington to dine at our award-winning restaurants and bars and shop at our unique shops.

Our streets are full of neighbors walking to get a bite to eat or meet friends for drinks.

Our home values are improving, and families are even moving back from the suburbs.

This is because others are learning what us Irvingtonians already know and cherish.

We are a community who looks out for each other and our neighborhood, and we are devoted to our history and our vibrancy.

We are people who love to brag that we can walk to coffee, the library, and a handful of schools.

And multiple award-waiting restaurants.

Is that me?

Okay.

So for those reasons, uh, this is why I do is confident that this door is the right way for the neighborhood and an opportunity to cut red tape for our small businesses to continue to thrive.

Thank you so much.

And your name, please.

Hi, my name is Kyla Thompson.

I am a 30-year resident of Irvington.

And I have to piggyback on what Ms.

Carroll said and exactly what Mr.

Kendall uh just said to all of us.

Um I I've seen a lot of changes come and go and happen in Irvington, all of them being positive, uh, especially when it comes to the businesses that are serving alcohol.

Um, I know Miss Carroll uh just talked about the three-way license.

That was a huge, huge hurdle that we all crossed when that took place.

Uh a lot of uh attitude was the sky is going to fall and there's going to be all kinds of people rolling around drunk in the parking lot.

None of that's happened.

None of those things have taken place in Irvington at all with any business ever that has been serving alcohol in the last 29 years.

So I just want to just reiterate and say um Councillor Nielsen has really, really put forth a lot of effort for all of this for our community, for our businesses to be successful, and I think that he deserves all of our support, and I hope the city looks at us and supports us as well.

Thank you.

Thank you so much.

Welcome.

Thank you.

Uh my name is David Garriott, and I'm here with my wife Susie.

We have been residents of Irvington for 34 years.

We live in one of the old historical houses.

We have been on the home tour twice.

We have been heavily involved in Irvington as a community.

The I will point out that the original area of the Dora was over 50% residential, and the current area, the uh the proposal with the amendment still goes down a residential section, which is Audubon Road.

Next point.

So why wasn't the community given time to express opinion?

We've heard from other speakers that said, oh, we've worked on it for months.

One of the owners, one of the business owners himself told me we've known about this for a year.

Early November is when a lot of us first heard about this.

The first public meeting that we attended was last Tuesday.

So if there's a zoning request, you've all seen those little signs that go out that say public hearing.

We didn't have that for this.

We are a historical area.

If you have a historical change, you have to send out notices to neighbors, even the fire department, for them to come to a hearing.

None of that happened here.

We are very confused about why the community wasn't given adequate time to express their concerns.

So the council or um the next point is I will point out that Councillor Nielsen did say uh and express from the Methodist Church that uh that there was positive indication.

I personally know that they have not given approval.

They have not voted on it.

Two minutes.

A few more seconds, sir.

Okay.

Um so uh one, why can't we do this as a special events um uh permit?

Why does it have to be through 65?

And the next point is our request is this be delayed at least 60 days to give the community time to talk about this, understand what's going on.

You've heard a lot of people that have said, oh, we're for it, but the community has not had time to weigh in on this.

Thank you very much for your time.

Thank you for your comments, sir.

Ms.

Clerk, you have a few more names.

Ruben and Vicky Flack, Neil Warner, and Julie Slaughter.

Thank you so much.

Good evening.

My name is Reuben Flack, and I'm here because this Dora has been pushed forward forward far too quickly and unfairly, in my opinion.

Residents were not given real notice or time.

A policy affecting an entire neighborhood was moved in about 30 days with no mailed notices, no flyers, and no direct outreach.

Most people only heard about it through Facebook or word of mouth.

This is not transparency.

This is advancing something before the public even knows it exists.

The one neighborhood meeting that allowed questions gave reticents just 20 minutes total for a change this large affecting families, schools, churches, and our library.

The process has simply not been fair, in my opinion, and others as well.

Second enforcement under this current proposal is impossible.

Irvington already faces crime challenges that the east and north have even higher crime.

Expanding public alcohol consumption next to these areas without a funded enforcement strategy creates predictable risk.

Adding alcohol statistically increases crime by itself alone.

A door requires daily monitoring of boundary compliance, cup misuse, intoxication, outside alcohol, littering, disorderly behavior, underage drinking, and drinking and driving.

Yes, this proposal uh yet this proposal includes no dedicated IMPD officers or no dedicated security.

IMPD East East District is busy.

Without guaranteed enforcement, the burden falls on businesses and residents who are not trained to handle intoxicated or dangerous behavior.

A Dora without enforcement becomes a 365-day unmanaged alcohol zone.

Because notice was an uh inadequate, because enforcement is unworkable, and because this risk is significant, I urge you to remick uh recommend denial of this Dora.

But if dials not is if denial is not considered today, I ask for at least 60 more days for proper more public input.

Uh and if approval is being considered, I request limiting the DORA strictly to major Irvington Council approved approved events, not year-round.

This would uh drastically or reduces the risk while allowing participation during planned events.

Thank you.

Thank you for your comments, sir.

Next ma'am come forward.

Thank you.

I only learned about the DORA project in Irvington where I live, incidentally, from a short news uh network news broadcast around the first week of November.

Um I kept hearing the phrase we will be proud.

We have been working, we and we, and I wondered who do we was.

Uh I talked to my neighbors, none knew about it.

For two days I walked the business trip and talked to any owners or shopkeepers that were available, and found only two knew of this project.

Some had heard the name, didn't know what it meant.

It became clear during the most recent uh community council meeting in Irvington why there had been no outreach meetings, flyers, mailings, etc.

on the subject.

Um and opinion were not especially welcome.

Uh why only support a few uh businesses, many of whom the owners uh do not live in Irvington.

Uh only seven selling alcohol.

There are 11 residents uh in Ervington, so that few out of 11,000.

Also noteworthy is the scheduling of the pertinent meetings and hearings during a holiday season.

If working on it for such a long time, why now?

Um, the reason seems obvious.

And why would we ask for an extension?

The very reason we would ask for that.

Um hard to know how many people affected by this uh proposition may not even yet know about it.

I can speak from my own uh experience.

I lost two wonderful family uh neighbors this summer because of issues we already have in the neighborhood.

I'm sorry if anybody doesn't like to hear that, but I know what happens where I live.

We have seen an increase in late-night pedestrian traffic.

Um theft, uh homeless problems, trash, including empty liquor bottles and cans.

My neighbor uh adopted two blocks of our street, and he could vouch for that.

Um the last straw was uh gunfire in front of our house, our homes last summer.

It was the last draw for these couples.

They planned to stay there, have their families there.

We could get no police response.

So it's hard to imagine how they're going to come and see to uh any violation of the Dora rules.

Also, I've seen the revised ma'am.

Let's wrap it up.

Wrap it up.

Yes.

A few more seconds.

It's not my time's over.

You're fine, but just a few more seconds, yes, please.

Say what again?

A few more seconds, please.

Oh, I'm sorry.

Sorry.

Okay.

Sorry, thank you.

There's a little reverberation here.

I'm sorry.

Um so we all have uh already have problems, and it's hard to see how more public intoxication can possibly help that.

I've seen the revised district plan.

I don't think it'll take two minutes for people to figure out where the shortcuts are.

That would be where I live, Julian and Johnson Street.

Um, uh, there's been talk about not wanting the strictly.

I'm done.

Almost, real quickly.

Almost go on.

Uh it shouldn't be a bar crawl.

Uh the plan itself is facilitating exactly that.

Okay.

Thank you so much.

We appreciate you for coming down.

Up next, Ms.

Clerk.

Thank you so much, ma'am.

Hello.

Um my name's Neil Warner, and I started a restaurant in Irvington called Strange Bird in 2019.

Um I've been living there since uh, well, I guess 10 years or so.

Um I support the Dora.

And um I think it's important to recognize what it is and what it isn't.

Um this is going to streamline the regulatory framework for businesses like mine during those big events.

Uh if you've gone to the Irvington Halloween festival, you may have been confused that you could get a beer up on Washington from one of the uh breweries that came into the neighborhood and walk around with that, but then you would go down to our friends at the Snug and have to stay within some certain area with your uh with your cup to do that.

Um so you know, another reason that I support this is, and I want to echo my friend Alicia who couldn't be here tonight, who owns a record store across from us.

Um, the Irvington Dora for us in particular at Strangebird, um, it's going to be helpful for some of those events, but we're particularly interested in the way that it's going to be able to connect us to our neighbors who also have businesses here in the community.

Um Elisa has indicated that she's interested in participating, and so she can put a little sticker on the door that says, hey, if you want to get a beer at the Snug or a cocktail at Strangebird and come in here and shop, uh, you can.

Um and in that way, I view this proposal as something that enhances Irvington's um appeal to um walkability people from business to business and seeing what we have to offer in our neighborhood.

I've been um really honored to see that.

Well, it's quick.

Um I've been really honored to see that Strange Bird has grown to have a reputation beyond the neighborhood, and I'm really grateful to be able to tell guests when they come in, hey, check out the rest of what the neighborhood has to offer, and this is going to support that.

Thank you so much.

Thank you.

Yes, um, my name is Julie Slaughter.

Um, I am a 26-year resident of Irvington, and um I came here not necessarily to speak against the Dora, but just to ask for more time.

And the reason I want to ask for more time is because in talking with about a number of the people in my neighborhood, no one's aware of it.

And I think um the fact that people aren't aware of it, they may feel blindsided.

I think it's important that um the businesses that are concerned or um the individuals who would benefit from it, that they communicate with the neighborhood.

We are a very tight-knit neighborhood, but as I say, I've lived there many years, and I lived in Irvington and moved to Irvington when we had issues with the Butler Inn and the Indy East, and the reputation wasn't so great, but it was always been a wonderful, wonderful community.

And I think very quickly a reputation of a neighborhood can change.

And we don't want that to happen with the concept of a DORA if people don't have accurate information and if they don't feel that they've had time to have input.

The concerns I personally have are more data-driven.

Do we have data from other jurisdictions in state or out of state?

Does this affect our homeowners' insurance?

Does this affect the values of our homes?

What are those really important issues that do affect homeowners in this area and businesses?

So I guess what I would need is where are the data, where's the data that helps us feel secure about this coming to our neighborhood?

Because for many of us, the one big value we have, the asset we have is our home.

So if if we can get that type of information, get that to the community in an open form so people know that this is okay or this is something to be concerned about.

So I would ask or echo those who wanted a little more time for community involvement.

That's all.

Thank you.

Thank you so much, ma'am, for coming down speaking.

Anyone else, Ms.

Clerk?

No.

Thank you.

Counselor Nielsen.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Um I would ask that my colleagues support both proposals this evening.

I have the privilege of representing a very engaged neighborhood, and there's always a desire for more engagement.

There's always a want for more.

I I I do want to emphasize that there has been a robust engagement process on this.

I recognize that as it applies to zoning decisions, the notices notice is is mailed, that is not a requirement under the DORA.

Um, but understand that that may have been a preference to neighbors.

Um but nonetheless, this has been done with substantial community engagement.

And as I have committed since I've been working on this as I committed when we introduced this, as I've said in community meetings, I ultimately will be the one responsible for the success or the failures of the DORA, and this community has my commitment that if anything goes poorly that we cannot address immediately, that we will take the appropriate actions we need to.

This is an opportunity for our community to lead, and Mr.

Chairman, um, I would ask that we move to passage.

Thank you.

I will actually make a motion.

I'm sorry.

Yeah.

Mr.

Chairman, I move that we send proposal 351 as amended to the full council with the due pass recommendation.

Probably moved and seconded.

Madam Leader.

Yeah.

Well, one quick question, Councilor Nielsen.

On slide 10 under community engagement, you have about nine organizations that signed off on a letter of support, if you will.

Roughly, how many individuals do you think uh slide 10 represents?

So and if you have roughly how many individuals attended the two public meetings that you have?

Um I'm working on it, you know, on Fast with Math.

Yeah, yeah.

Two and sixty over.

So between the organizations I have 30, 45, close to 50 community leaders and um respective of both community meetings, th 35 attendees.

Um I will also say that I've uh received uh a great deal uh of engagement via phone calls and uh emails, and I've been advertising this and discussing this thoroughly in monthly newsletters for for four months now.

So you feel like you have you're confident that you have the support of the community.

100%.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Thank you, Counselor.

Thank you, Leader Lewis.

Counselor Allen.

Sorry.

Um Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Uh this is actually done at Speedway, correct?

Yes.

Okay, so have we looked at the data or because I I heard what the community said that they were concerned about the safety and you know the shootings.

So have we looked at that to see if this is a success for the community in Speedway?

Yes, so in actually we had a member of the Irvington Community Council do some of this lifting.

Uh and and she found that kind of pre and post Dora that the business district there on on Main Street had one additional or two additional runs over a period of time that they could attribute to that period of time, not necessarily attributing to behavior in the Dora.

Yeah, and that's one of the challenges with some of the data as well.

Thank you, Counselor.

Final comments or questions?

The most be probably moved and seconded.

Ms.

Clerk, you want to do a roll call vote, please.

Absolutely, thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Counselor and A.

Aye.

Counselor Allen?

Yay.

Counselor Brown.

Aye.

Counselor Lewis.

Lewis, aye.

Counselor Maori?

Aye.

Counselor Nielsen?

Yes.

Chairman Robinson.

Robinson aye.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Proposal passes as amended.

Thank you, Ms.

Clerk.

Thank you, Council members and those who came down to speak the seating.

Thank you all.

Oh, Mr.

Chairman.

Counselor Nielsen.

Yeah, yeah.

Mr.

Chairman, I move that we send proposal 352 as amended to the full council with the due pass recommendation.

Second.

Thank you.

Uh the most probably moved and seconded it would do a roll call vote, Ms.

Clerk.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Counselor and A.

Aye.

Counselor Allen.

Aye.

Counselor Brown?

Aye.

Counselor Lewis.

Lewis.

Aye.

Counselor Maori.

Aye.

Counselor Nielsen?

Yes.

Chairman Robinson.

Robinson, aye.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Proposal passes as amended.

We are now adjourned.

Thank you.