I apologize.

I have kind of a cold thing going on, so I sound like I'm talking like that.

Good morning to all of you who are watching on channel 16 or 28, and to all of you who are able to make it here in person.

I want to welcome you to the monthly meeting of the Marion County Alliance of Neighborhood Associations.

We have several speakers with us this morning who are all going to talk about neighborhood driven initiatives to make positive impacts and address issues in their communities.

So it's going to be a variety of issues of topics that we're addressing today.

Not for profit, a mouthful, neighborhood-based organization that encompasses all of Marion County.

And our purpose is to provide support to neighborhoods that are addressing issues or generating projects in their neighborhood.

And also to help lend support to each other when we do have issues that we need to have addressed.

Sometimes, as we all know, getting the people to come out and speak their voices and show up at meetings is a challenge sometimes.

But we want neighborhoods to be able to talk with each other to learn about what they've done that was successful in the past, things that they might have tried differently, or to seek help in how to get an initiative started.

And the other core thing that we try to do is to address issues that are countywide issues, such as the Comp Plan review, which is currently going on, that is going to have impacts all across the county.

So we want to make sure that McCana is fulfilling its purpose by supporting countywide issues, but also looking to help neighborhoods with issues that are specific to their own neighborhoods.

There are lots of things that we all have in common, and there are some characteristics of our neighborhoods that are unique to us, but that will resonate with other communities that may be clear across the county.

Part of the way that we do that is to have our monthly membership meetings, which are held on the third Saturday of every month at North United Methodist Church, which is at 38th and Meridian.

You can't miss it.

It's the great big stone church with the bells in the top.

It's centrally located on the Indigo bus line, so it makes it easily accessible to everyone.

And we want to thank the church for allowing us to use their meeting space.

We have, in fact, invited their community outreach coordinator to come and speak with us about all of the myriad of community outreach programs that they have going on, some of which I just learned about.

But our meetings are held from 9 to 11 a.m.

Um on Saturday morning when many of you are out doing other neighborhood projects or trying to sleep in or catch a breath from whatever work week you might have had.

But we do also have the and those meetings are open to the public.

You can be a member of McCana, but you don't have to be.

I'm not sure.

But but you can watch those meetings on channel 16 and 28 throughout the month.

So if you're not able to meet or come to those meetings in person, you can still find out what's going on in the neighborhoods in Marion County.

I do at the beginning of this time of year, I always say our pop McCannna's policy is for those candidates who are running for public office.

Um they are always welcome to attend our meetings and have about five minutes to talk about their qualifications, um, their issue the issues that they think are important, their goals.

Um they we appreciate it if you contact me ahead of time, but you don't have to.

And we try and make that time equal so that we're so that anyone, any candidate has an opportunity to come and speak with McCannna members about the upcoming elections and what they hope to accomplish if they are successful.

Um pause and put on the glasses.

Our next meeting will be on April the 19th, and our speakers will be from the City of Indianapolis and from the and Jim, correct me if I get this wrong.

The Coalition for Homeless Intervention and Prevention.

Did I get it right?

Um, to talk about the homeless problem in Marion County.

There are a variety of initiatives that are being conducted by the city as well as other not-for-profit organizations such as CHIP to try and address the number of homeless people that we have that we need to find safe, secure places for them to be able to stay.

And that has been a topic that has long been on McCann's Horizon.

And thanks to one of our mayor's neighborhood advocates, Julian Novak, we were able to finally get all the connections made.

So homelessness will be the topic in our April meeting.

And then in May, we will be honored to have with us Dr.

Virginia Kane, who is the director for the Marion County Hospital Health and Hospital Corporation, or excuse me, the Marion County Public Health Corporation.

They have been wonderful partners to have with McCannna.

Dr.

Kane is nationally recognized as an expert in public health.

She has a lot of information to share about programs that are available through the Marion County Health Department, as well as a recent study that they completed again, which I believe is done every five five years that talks about the help of Marion County.

So we certainly welcome you to come and hear what all of those speakers have to say.

It's called Sharing Our Strengths, where if there is a specific issue in your neighborhood that you have tried to get addressed and are not getting any traction on, you can ask to have neighborhoods from across Marion County way in.

You can pick this up and tell what you can do to help just basically say to our elected officials, you need to include us in the process before the plans are done and made.

Which one?

I'm looking at the map trying to figure it out.

We do ask that you email if possible.

That makes it easier for those elected and uh elected officials and city representatives to kind of track things and keep track of things and get to them when they can.

Sometimes they can't always answer their phone.

It also gives you a record of the fact that yes, in fact, you did communicate with them.

So if you want some follow-up, you can ask for that.

And also out on the sign-up table is the form if your neighborhood has an issue that you would like to see support from other neighborhoods across the county on that you can complete and then get it back to me.

You can either fill it out and leave it with me, or you can email it.

Um if you want to contact McCannna, you can do so by mail at P.O.

Box 1082, Indianapolis 46206.

I do not get downtown to the mailbox on a regular basis, so that's probably the slowest way to get a hold of me.

You can contact me by email at CB7801 at AOL.com, or you can reach me by phone at 317 84759.

I can also get texts there, but don't send me links.

I don't carry smartphones, so that won't do you any good.

You can either text or call.

With that, I am going to ask if there are any announcements of upcoming events that anybody here would like to talk about.

I know we've got a lot of spring cleanups coming up, um, and then we'll have the mayor's neighborhood advocate come up.

So anybody have an event or I know that there is a hearing date coming up from Martindale Brightwood.

Do you want to talk about that, Jackie?

April the first.

Okay.

April 1st will be downtown at the Department of Metropolitan Development by Hearing.

And that is for the proposed data center at 25th and Sherman in the Martindale Brightwood neighborhood.

And so if you want to show support for that neighborhood, um, again, that hearing is on April the 1st.

The agenda starts at one o'clock.

We don't know yet where on the agenda that will fall, but I know that they would certainly appreciate the support from other neighborhoods.

Anyone else?

Okay, with that, I'm gonna ask if the mayor's neighborhood advocate would you want to come up here?

Alright.

Good morning everyone.

My name is Natalie Van Donggen.

I'm the director of community outreach for the city.

I oversee our Mayor's Neighborhood Advocate program and the Mayor's Action Center.

I know that spring has sprung because our team is all out at tabling events this morning, different events happening in the city.

I think the one that's happening this morning, or one of them is the IMBD Easter egg hunt.

So I hope that that's going really well.

I think that's why Tanya Terry was not able to be with us today.

Yep, I think that would be it.

So you guys get me instead.

I apologize.

I wish that uh one of our MAs were able to be here, but they are out at other events.

So I'm stepping in.

So I'm a little rusty on this front.

I was a mayor's neighborhood advocate at one point in time, but I haven't given announcements in a while, so bear with me.

But hopefully I can answer questions if you have any.

So first and foremost, I mentioned spring has sprung.

That means a couple of things.

It means a lot of cones, road closures, traffic closures.

Um we've got our DPW crews out there with that hot mix asphalt.

That's the asphalt that adheres a lot better to the roadway than the stuff that they have to use when it's really cold outside or when it's really wet and rainy.

So that's very exciting.

It means that hopefully when we're out there filling those potholes, they will stay filled for longer.

But as always, continue to report those via request Indy or to the Mayor's Action Center.

Um, they're also starting to work on their strip patching segments.

So strip patching is when they are taking off kind of that top layer of the roadway and doing a more kind of comprehensive patch that's done mostly along thoroughfares and those areas that have gotten kind of pretty uh patchy over the last couple of years, so just kind of smoothing that out.

So they increase the budget for that program quite a bit in the 2026 budget, and they're gonna be able to get to work on those segments when the weather allows when it's wet and rainy as it has been or when the temperature is fluctuating, that throws a wrench into planning, but they will be out there on days that it allows.

With all of these uh road closures with all of the uh pothole patching, strip patching, one thing that I think is a really helpful tool for residents is a feature called dot maps.

Um, this feature essentially is a it's a map that if you see a road closure and you're wondering how long is that going to be closed, what is that closure?

Is that part of a DPW project, utility work?

You can go to road closures.ind.gov.

It'll bring you to this tool.

You can then type in the name of the street that you're looking at, and it will tell you okay, is it closed for a special event?

Is it some utility work or is it a DPW closure?

It also will give you kind of that time frame, that rough estimate based on the information they have available.

So that's a really helpful tool.

Of course, if um you know you don't have access to internet or aren't able to use that tool, just reach out to your mayor's neighborhood advocate and they'll be able to assist you with that.

Can you repeat it before the move?

Yeah, road closures.ind.gov.

Yeah.

Um, next up, so this inter the city has been operating on the winter contingency plan um since the end of November.

So that is the plan that activates our two city operated uh winter activated shelters.

So that's a family shelter and a men's shelter.

The winter contingency plan because it is weather activated, it does run through the end of March.

So March 31st will be the last day of that winter contingency plan and the opening of those shelters.

As of March 31st.

Yeah, that's when they close.

Correct.

So they open uh at 25 degree windshields and below from end of November through March.

Why don't they close?

Seems like they would be helpful.

So it's operated on that time frame because there's a number of different contractors involved.

There's a lot of resources that go into opening the shelters and operating these shelters.

So that was the time frame that was attributed.

This is the city's first year operating under this weather activated time frame.

So I think that was a large part of the consideration of the time frame as well.

Um, is being able to plan and resource plan around it.

So given that it was the first year, how often is this going to be active?

What is the kind of uh resource load that's required?

Um, so I think that team has learned a lot throughout this process.

I won't say that it will look the exact same next year, um, but this was the first year of operation, and uh so that was just kind of the time frame that was set.

Um I do know that they also worked very closely with, I believe it was Kansas City, who is operating under a very similar structure and was able to provide the both kind of time frame estimates and uh the the weather threshold.

Natalie, can you tell me?

Do they intend to operate those?

There's been a lot of predictions that we could have some extreme heat swings this summer.

Do you know if we're gonna operate them if they hit a threshold for heat index?

That's a very good question.

I do not have any kind of confirmation about that, but would be happy to ask.

Okay.

So when these do close, the individuals that have been legalizing the facility, or you want to have some kind of uh list where they could go if it since that one is closed if they do need some kind of shelter.

Yes, so the the teams that have been operating those shelters are also uh resource providers, so they've been able to help engage these residents that are coming and utilizing the shelter resources, and the goal has been when possible connecting them with more long-term resources.

Yeah.

So next up, I have Indy Parks.

A lot of really exciting news for our parks as we enter spring summer.

So first and foremost, it is that time of year where if you know anyone who's trying to get kids signed up for day camps, they need to go to the park's website, indie.gov/slash parks as soon as possible.

These fill up very fast, and once they are filled up, we are not able to guarantee that we're going to be able to add more slots.

So spread the word if we need if folks need day camp, go and check out indie.gov slash parks at their earliest availability.

Also, we have a lot of summer job opportunities with Indie Parks.

If you know any teenagers that are looking for some summer employment, this is a great option.

We need lifeguards, day camp counselors, and then other kind of seasonal parks employees.

Um, this is also part of the Project Indy project, so or initiative.

So if you've heard of that before, that is the mayor's youth jobs initiative that is in partnership with Employ Indy.

So any kid from the ages of 16 to 24 can go to ProjectIndy.net and be connected with a plethora of different jobs and employers throughout the city that have agreed to uh employ our city's youth.

So these are employers that have already been engaged by employee Indy, have signed on to the program, and who want to engage the young talent of the city and give them a good summer job.

Is there an age record on those?

16 to 24.

Yep.

And then we also uh celebrated some new amenities and improvements at Wish Park and Canterbury Park this week.

So you might see some news about that.

And do I understand that the Martin Luther King Park is ready to roll here?

Great question.

I don't have a timeline on that.

So I thought I'd gotten an email about it.

Yeah, I can check into that sure.

You had is on April the 4th, I believe.

And then this dedication at Martin Luther King Park on April the 4th.

I'm not sure of the time right now.

Okay.

Okay.

Yeah, I can get confirmation on that and have parks on the update.

All right, thanks.

And then finally, um, I know that this has been very long awaited.

Uh, Indianapolis Animal Care Services is prepared to open the new animal care uh services shelter within the next couple of weeks or so, fingers crossed again, construction timelines uh so working through that, but they are very eager to get into that new facility to move all of the animals into that new facility, um expands capacity and resources for both animals and staff.

So that'll be very exciting.

It is at uh 5001 East Raymond Street.

Um this new and approved shelter will have 234 dog kennels, 80 cat condos, state-of-the-art vet care, two-acre public dog park, and more.

Additionally, they have a number of uh public adoption events happening.

Uh the first one is today, March 21st from 12 to 3 at the Pet Smart at 9749 East Washington, then one on March 28th from 12 to 3 at the Pet Smart at 7801 US 31 South, then at Puppy Playground on April 11th from 12 to 3 at 724 Rockville Road, and finally April 18th, 12 to 3, they will be at the City Dogs Grocery at 1028 Virginia Ave in Fountain Square.

So that is what I have for you all today.

What questions can I answer?

Yes.

We're getting cracks.

Do we call the same number to ask them to attempt the cracks so they don't become chuckled?

Yes, you can absolutely call into the mayor's action center.

I would also encourage engaging your mayor's neighborhood advocate.

So they would do something called crack sealing, which is not a requestable thing within like request Indy or through the Mayor's Action Center, but it's good information for us to have and be able to relay to the department.

I know DPW has really been investing in those preventative maintenance programs in the last couple of years.

So I know that they're trying to increase crack sealing efforts, etc.

throughout the city.

Rather, it's something that they have kind of the pavement conditions to move them to these.

Yeah, I would um definitely call into the Mayor's Action Center, or you can report uh any kind of degrading road condition through requests, Indy, and just put in the comments.

Or as always, I would really recommend reaching out here, Mayor's Neighborhood Advocate.

What if we don't have a mayor big advocate?

Which area are you?

And what you're doing.

So yes, so I hope to have very good news on that.

Yes.

Uh coming very shortly.

Um, but for the time being, you can email me directly, Natalie Period Bandongan at Indie.gov.

Any other questions or comments for Natalie?

Okay, well, thank you very much.

Thank you.

I appreciate it.

Um, a couple of other things I want to remind people about the partnership between Indigo and um Second Healthings.

It's called Food in Transit for people who may need to have food and can't get to it.

Um, they do give out free groceries and health hype items on the second and fourth Tuesdays of every month at 3 30 p.m.

at the Carson Transit Center, which is there at Delaware and Washington.

Um I understand that people begin lining up early and the supplies go quickly.

So if you know of someone that may need me that may be in need of food, um that is a way that they can get it.

It is a downtown location, but they do and my understanding is, and if I'm wrong, correct me, you don't have to show ID or proof that you live in a certain area, you just have to show up, get in line and be orderly.

Um the other thing is it's kind of a statewide thing.

Um DNR, the Department of Natural Resources recently announced that at all of the state parks now.

They have available um mobility wheelchairs that are electric that are all terrain for people to be able to go out in the woods and pass and stuff.

If you're wheelchair dependent, um they now have.

I'm assuming that there's probably a waiting list for them, and I know that the picture that was in the press release was of Fort Harrison.

Um but I know that they have those available now at the state park so that people who are wheelchair bound can still get out and enjoy walking, going through the woods and enjoying the benefits of that.

Um, with that, if there are no other upcoming announcements, our announcements, we are gonna go ahead to the speaker portion of our program.

Um, the first, and now which one of you is gonna talk?

Me, okay.

Um, I'm gonna introduce Trisha is it Pollman.

Okay.

Um she is with the um Indy RBI, um, which is an organization that is seeking to get um inner city youth engaged engaged in low or no cost baseball opportunities to get the kids involved in a positive experience in youth sports.

So, with that, Trisha, if you would like to come up and talk a little bit.

Thank you.

Thank you for having me.

Thank you for giving me some time, and thank you to my friend Jim here who uh suggested I come and visit.

I've been a gross gross uh neighborhood.

Um I know spring has sprung because there are baseball, softball, littly league signs everywhere.

So I wanted to share ours.

Um, of course, I'm a little biased, but ours is special.

Right, Bob.

I'm here with Bob Haney, he's our director for RBI baseball.

Um, so um, as was said, we're an organization that provides uh low-cost softball and um baseball, uh affordable options for young kids in the inner city.

RBI stands for reviving baseball, and I always had softball.

I'm a softball person, so right, surprise, in the inner city.

So I wanted to come.

You know, I just want our whole community to know that there are options like that for families who can't pay.

Most little leagues have to have to charge $100 or more for umpires, uniforms, field maintenance, things like that.

We happen to be so lucky that we are a program that is supported in certain ways by Major League Baseball.

They don't give us enough money to run our entire program.

They, you know, they are pretty smart with that, I think, huh, Bob.

They um they um give us bare, you know, things that we need to get this uh baseball and softball in the inner city because there are so many other options.

I feel that our um our um uh national sport as well as I was a kid knew you know baseball was you know America's sport.

Now we have so many other options that you know, and I think a lot of kids out there picking dandelions, they're like, you know, this is not very this is not very exciting, but you know, when you get a good coach and you learn how to play and you know the game, it's not all that, you know, it's it's a little more involved than that.

So um uh we collaborate with also Indianapolis City Parks and uh IPS.

We go to a lot of those schools and uh and try to get kids sign up, let them know about our program, uh Indianapolis City Parks.

Uh they allow us to have fields at uh Brookside Park, that's where we have softball, softball only at Brookside Park.

Forrest Manor, Christian Park, and Rhodias Park are all parks where we provide baseball.

Um so um we're signing up kids now to play Indy, where is it say it?

Somewhere indierbi.org.

Yep.

Oh, right at the top in the red letters.

I can't even read when I'm up here trying to talk.

Uh I had to put out my bubblegum because I certainly can't talk and walk and do bubblegum at the same time.

So thanks for that.

I'm here all week.

Don't go.

Oh my gosh.

Okay.

So we would love to have everybody sign up as soon as possible because we have those sign-ups.

We can get the coaches uh, you know, uh I in what kind of how many kids are gonna have on their teams?

We can get uniforms ordered, we can get uh uh sponsor banners ordered.

We have certainly on our website, we have opportunities for people for businesses to sponsor.

We have opportunities for individuals to sponsor individual kids.

So for $25, you can sponsor uh a young person playing baseball and softball because sometimes even the $25 is is a stretch for some families.

So we offer those scholarship opportunities.

Um our opening day is May May the 2nd.

All parks.

Some of us are playing softball that day, some of us are just marching around and having a good time and getting excited about the season.

So uh let's let me see what else.

Talked about our parks.

Thank you, Indianapolis Public Parks.

Thanks, IPS.

Thank you guys for uh letting me talk to you.

I have some flyers I'll pass around to you before I leave.

Anything else, Bob?

Thank you, you think I did okay.

Any questions?

Thank you.

Goes to about the end of June.

Yes, yeah, end of June.

How do kids get to the park?

That is is you know, is also a situation where it's difficult.

But we uh have very good coaches, we have very good parents, we have a lot of carpooling and things.

We do not have, you know, that is something we really need to look at.

We also have spring, fall, uh games, and we have winter workouts, and especially in the fall, we we definitely have uh some problems getting kids because there's other things going on, especially in the fall.

People are geared for baseball in the spring, but we we do our best to give them whatever they can get, and most of our parks are like close to bus lines and things like that.

I tend to put these signs out in neighborhoods where kids might not have cars and whatnot, but I put them out at bus stops.

So I'm we we expect that there's gonna be some issues with that.

Do you expect them to have multiple teams at one park?

They would always play at that park.

Absolutely.

Yes, all the parks.

Yeah, the the rec leagues will play at the park they signed up for.

Uh sometimes softball might have we have trouble signing up maybe three teams instead of four in a certain age group, so we'll try to go to different places, but not very often.

And there again, you know, we have great coaches and great parents that get kids to where they need to go, but we do our very best to keep them in the same park.

Now there are other uh Sunday options for baseball and softball where kids can play up a little bit level and they can go to different townships and and play other teams, and that's um you know, uh a step above the regular rec softball, baseball.

There is baseball.

Trisha, for people that may not have access to or don't use the internet.

Um, can you for the people who are watching on channel 16?

Can you give the names and phone numbers for people that they might contact?

Sure.

Well, right here, sitting Bob in front of us, uh Bob Heaney at 317-626-2788, or Brandy Moorhead at 317 566 4531.

Great, thank you.

Well, I wish you luck, and I would say um we have a lot of conversations in the in the city about how do we engage teenagers to get them off the street so that we don't have violence.

But coming from an early childhood background, I would say don't get your kids over involved in too many things, but getting them involved in something like this at an early age is a really good way to make an impact by the time a kid is 13, 14, 15 years old.

You may have a more difficult time getting them drawn into that positive let's work together thing.

So getting them involved at a younger age is very hard.

We have kids from uh I don't know how how long's baseball three, three, three or four softball.

We're doing five or so up to high school.

So we can get them as they can walk, I could teach them how to hit a ball.

There you go.

All right.

Thanks again.

Well, thank you very much for coming.

Um, to follow up on something that Natalie had to say about road repairs.

Um, I have witnessed, unfortunately, people who are driving down the road who are who are aggravated by the conditions of the road, seem to often vent their anger at the crews that are out trying to patch the road, um, yelling things at them, sometimes throwing things at them.

You know, the the men and women that are out there shoveling those you know big piles of hot asphalt.

They're not the ones that made the holes in the road.

They're trying to fix it.

So please be courteous and watchful for those road crews.

Um, it is not as perfect as getting every road in the city repaved, but they're out there trying, so you know, give them a little bit of grass there.

Um, I'm gonna put James Whitfield on the spot here because I just saw him walk in.

Um, James, we put the information out about those two-way street conversions at 29 Capitol.

Um the information that I had was Grammand David, but can you give us an update?

Have they started holding meetings or including the neighborhood in the conversations about how that's gonna go?

Uh far as I know of right now, they are uh this is still kind of in the plan and stage what it is, ready to go.

And uh this is actually the the guy to talk to and uh also uh DPW.

Okay, so we are really just kind of at a standstill right now to see when, but they are running uh sewer labs and uh uh some of the utility labs on 29th Street, not as yet at on Capital at this point.

Okay, James is the president of the Highland Vicinity Neighborhood Association, and you'll find his name and email listed on the sheet out front.

Um, but again, I think that the community's real issue at this point is that they want to be included in the planning and the review of the project to make sure that you know they can continue to live their lives in um as peaceful a manner as you can have in the middle of road construction.

Yeah, so again, all that contact information for that is on that sheet out front.

Thanks.

Um, with that, I am going to invite our next speaker up.

Um, I want to introduce Robin Heldman who serves as the chair for the wetlands not warehouse initiative in Franklin Township, which happens to be my township.

Um, but I'm gonna let her take the floor.

This is an initiative that was started as a result of a rezoning petition in Franklin Township for um an industrial park that had a significant wetlands on it, and through the efforts, Robin's diligence, along with a lot of people with some really excellent expertise in environmental issues, was able to to first of all have that portion of the wet of the the entire acreage that included the wetlands taken, dropped out of the zoning petition, so that that wetlands was not paved over, but has taken that a step further in an effort to try and purchase and preserve that wetlands in perpetuity.

So I asked her she would come here today to talk a little bit about the project, how it started, um, where it's going from here, and and we're kind of it's kind of learning as we go along.

Yes.

So Robin.

Good morning.

As Kathy said, I'm Robin Heldman.

I'm a proud resident of Franklin Township, and I'm an advocate for wetlands and natural woodlands.

Today I'd like to talk about how a grassroots movement changed the trajectory of a warehouse development and sparked a movement that is helping bring awareness to the need for nature conservation in our communities, and that movement is wetlands, not warehouses.com.

I wanted to intentionally.

Thank you.

So in 2022, a rezone petition with the variants was filed for the area of I-65 and County Line Road.

In 23, a wetland permit was filed.

In 24, Idem had a public hearing and ultimately denied the wetland permit.

This was unexpected, but a very welcome decision.

It was a victory that set a precedent and propelled our purpose of wetlands, not warehouses.

And then oops, I sorry about that.

I need to get to my notes here.

So let's go here.

Then in 2025, we started advocating for the combs Road Nature Preserve and the beginning process of a site plan for that nature preserve.

In 2026, we are continuing to pursue possibilities to advocate and educate the general public on the importance of wetlands in our communities through conversations and collaboration.

And we're finalizing a conceptual site plan for the Combs Road Wetland Nature Preserve to help with fundraising campaign for the development of a master plan.

So just to go into a little bit more detail, that rezone petition that was filed in 2022 was for 208 acres of agricultural land that had wetlands and natural woodlands on it.

The proposed warehouse development was six buildings that encompassed a million square feet of warehouses.

Over 45 acres of that 208 of the proposed development was wetlands and woodlands.

And it was the last remaining wetlands in the Pleasant Crink watershed.

Franklin Township Land Use Committee filed for a continuance and allowed more time for the research and for us to work with the city as well as the developers for the impacts not only on the land and the ecosystem but also on the residents that were there.

Hoosier Environmental Council took an interest and began advocating for the wetlands and the woodlands as well.

We went to the hearing examiner meeting and she voted to approve the rezone with the variance petition.

An appeal was filed, and the petitions were scheduled to be heard from up before the Metropolitan Development Commission, myself and Susie McGovern of HEC, Hoosier Environmental Council, testified in opposition.

Despite the compelling testimony by both of us, MDC voted in support of the rezone and the variance petition.

A lot of you sitting in here today kind of have know that feeling and also know that process very well.

In 2023, the developer filed for tax abatements in a TIFF district.

It was heard before the IEDC, and I testified in opposition.

Unfortunately, the IEDC approved the tax abatements and the TIFF district.

In May of 2023, Gershman Partners, the developer, filed the application for Department of Army permit to determine the jurisdiction of the wetlands.

In July of 2023, Gersman Partners applied for a wetland permit with IDEM.

Susie McGovern of HEC and myself submitted comments to IDEM requesting that public hearing.

HEC created the wetlands not warehouses slogan that caught the attention of the public and the media and began a movement.

In 2024, after garnering 2300 signatures on a petition asking for a public hearing, Idem granted that request.

In April of 2024, over 50 concerned citizens were present at the public hearing along with local media.

Several, including HEC's Indra France, myself, Kathy Burton for the land Franklin Township Land Use Committee testified in opposition asking Idem to deny that wetland permit.

As a result of strong grassroots advocacy and compelling testimony, item denied that wetland permit.

Robin, I'm gonna break your thing.

Could you tell people what a wetland permit is?

Yes.

The wetland permit is if a wetland is a particular classification on the property that is being proposed to be developed, it's determined who oversees the jurisdiction of that wetland.

There's there's four classes of wetlands, and each class kind of has specific steps that have to be taken for mitigation.

Class one is not really anything that is detrimental.

They don't think they don't foresee it as being detrimental if it's lost.

So there's really not any kind of jurisdiction or any kind of mitigation that's required.

Class two can have some, depending on if it's an isolated wetland or if it's connected to a WODIS, which is the waters of the United States.

Class three is a more protected classification.

Class four, they've kind of done away with, so now class three is one of the highest.

So the one wetland that we've filed that they filed a permit for was going to require mitigation for sure because it was a class three, and it was significant as to the delineation report that was done.

So that's kind of where that happens.

There's certain particular steps that have to be taken.

An item was determined to have jurisdiction over that wetland.

So you have to kind of it's it's a lot of due diligence to do your work and to continue to communicate with these departments to know what the next steps and processes are for fighting something like this.

There's not anything that's going to tell you that come falling out of the sky to tell you that.

So it's really up to you and the grassroots advocacy to kind of do that work.

Unfortunately, that's just the way it works.

And if items not brought, if it's not brought to items attention, sometimes it's just kind of a rubber stamp.

So it's really up to the community, if it's in your area to protect it.

And unfortunately, it falls on the hands of you to do all of the work and heart, you know.

Being, I would call it the bulldog.

That's what I kind of consider myself a bulldog.

And they see me come running down the street.

Here I come barking.

That's true.

So hopefully that answers if that explains that a little bit better.

No, that's fine.

So the developer changed their plans, and the most eastern portion of the site was saved from a 575,000 square feet warehouse.

And the wetlands were protected.

Hence, the wetlands not warehouses campaign had its first chapter, Franklin Township.

The wetlands not warehouses, Franklin Township.

Did that not switch?

Yeah, it did.

Good.

Umprise of concerned citizens.

What I did is the sign-up sheet that was at the public hearing.

I took that information and reached out to everybody that was there concerned and asked if they were interested in serving on a task force.

And the ones that sparked interest are the ones that I kind of combined and collaborated.

We had a meeting, and we formed our task force.

And then as we formed it, what our purpose is to advocate and educate and collaborate for the wetlands.

Who we are.

By forging a collaborative team comprised of key stakeholders, the vision is to create a green space that will not only benefit the members of the community, but also set a precedent for future amenities in the township and in the city to bring about positive change for the approach of nature conservancy and quality of life for the relev residents in those developing areas.

What I want to do is hit, and a lot of you know this.

I know some of you sitting here, and I know you've been through probably this process and understand it, but there are several who don't, and these are key topics that I like to bring up is that engage as a citizen and a resident in the local area.

It's necessary to engage in that rezone process and to take a proactive approach on that and a position.

You want to educate yourself and those in your community about the process and the potential impacts that you on the ecosystem and the wildlife that inhabit that area.

You want to connect with community partners and like-minded organizations.

There is a tremendous value in connecting with those community partners and allies that appreciate and value those natural resources.

And for that, what I'm saying is, you know, Hoosier Environmental Council was a strong partner for us.

The Great Lakes Audubon Society, the Nature Conservancy.

You want to advocate for the conservation of the wetlands and woodlands within that development site.

And nature conservancy needs to be advocated for because these are valued and essential ecosystems in our community, that wildlife inhabit.

And this is just getting gobbled up in a rapid pace.

It's just it's astronomical that they're just paving over all these beautiful spaces and green spaces.

And then you want to collaborate with key stakeholders to form strong alliances and achieve positive change for the approach to nature conservancy for wildlife habitat and natural green spaces for the residents in the developing those areas.

And basically, what I my little motto is pursue with purpose and determination.

So the our particular area of focus is approximately a 45-acre tract that contains lowland marshes, old growth hardwood forest, upland prairie, and it's nestled between subdivision, a church, and a family farm.

This area serves as a valuable habitat for migratory birds, raptors, songbirds, along with a multitude of wildlife, foxes, coyotes, everything, turtles, amphibians.

It's just amazing what's what's in this nestled in this.

There have been nine different bird species of the greatest conservation need identified in this wetland.

This wetland has over 225,000 cubic feet of storm water storage.

With that, with the rate of the development in Indianapolis, in particular Franklin Township, this wetland also serves as a critical piece of infrastructure for flood control.

Right now, with the heavy rains that we've had, it is filling, and you can see kind of in this picture.

This all is water, full of water, and it disperses that naturally and allows all of the residential areas there not to experience any flooding.

I've been there for 28 years, and I have not had any flooding in my backyard.

And I think a lot of that's attributed to this wetland.

I'd like to explain who we've been connecting with and communicating with, and how that's led to the connections and collaborators that we've partnered with to help advocate not only for this wetland, but also wetlands in Franklin Township.

So the ones that we've connected to initially after the wetland permit was denied was the Nature Conservancy, Great Lakes Audubon Society, Water Alliance Group, DNR, DPW Land Stewardship, U.S.

Fish and Wildlife, Jim and Nancy Carpenter who have a preserve up in Zionsville.

They're the ones that took that golf course that was closed, purchased that, created a beautiful nature preserve up there.

They did a lot of that with their own money, and then the city bought it back, but they also had a lot of help with some of these groups, and we met with them just to kind of get an idea on how they did some of that.

Life Point Church, which is just north of the wetland, and of course, local media brought took on to this and have shared some positive and some neutral stories about this.

We collaborate with and have built partnerships with are the Franklin Township residents, concerned citizens within the Marion County area, Hoosier Environmental Council, Franklin Township Civic League.

They act as our fiscal agent because we do take in donations.

We met with him and asked for his support.

He said, if you can get me a master plan that I can take, he said, I I'm interested in learning about it.

Indy Parks, GP CM County Line Road, that's the developers.

Believe it or not, we partnered, we met with them after this wetland permit denial.

And Kathy was at the meeting, Hoosier Environmental Council was at the meeting, and we showed them what we wanted to do.

After several attempts, a lot of communication, Robin shoots out emails ever so often.

Hey, I'm just following up.

They gave us a $10,000 donation to help with the development of a conceptual site plan to ultimately hopefully that will allow us to apply for grants for the master plan.

But I think I attribute that to transparency, communication, and compromising.

You know, I was, and Kathy can say this.

I went to Franklin Township land use, and I was the bulldog in the room, and I was not very happy, and I didn't appreciate that because my backyard faced that warehouse development.

But I also had to take an approach of knowing that I can't stop development.

I know what the comprehensive plan said on this site, and it was it is you know industrial, but there's also a strategic plan that says how that should be developed, and their theirs was not really adhering to that, and knowing that there needed to be a voice for the wetlands, that's kind of what my purpose was.

So it that was a win for us.

And then we partner with Taylor Seifker Williams Design Group, who's working on our conceptual site plan.

And the Indianapolis Foundation was one foundation we applied for a grant.

Unfortunately, we didn't get it, but they've also now have given us some avenues to look at for other connections that might align with what our mission is.

So continued communication, being compromising, being just being present makes a big difference, and there are people out there that will help you connect dots.

You just have to really get your crayon out and say, can you help me connect this dot?

So what we hope to accomplish, we want to bring those identified key stakeholders to the table, strategize how to transform the area, demonstrate the conservation practices that lend to the diverse responsible and forward thinking conservation plan.

We want to create a wetland preserve that allows the community to enjoy the natural green space while protecting the natural resource and biodiverse area that lends to the quality of life, the conservation of natural resources that serve as a stormwater basin to the community in that area.

And if you look at this slide, this actually is one of the images that Taylor Seifger and Williams drafted.

This is kind of what our task force, this is our wish list.

This is what we want this to look like.

It's going to have some paths, it's going to have some bird uh observation decks.

So that's kind of what we're trying what we're reaching for.

So our initial goals are simple.

We want to build those partnerships.

We don't want to be afraid to ask for help.

We want to keep an open mind for compromise, and we want to move forward with purpose.

And so what we're doing is we're applying for local grants to help fund that initiative for the development of a master plan.

We want to use that master plan to apply for federal grants, gain support of identified key stakeholders for the match of federal dollars, and then acquire the 45-acre tract through the federal grants that are approved for land acquisition.

Not all of them are, so you have to be really careful on which ones you would apply for.

So what we're trying to do is with those partnerships is community members and organizations, state and city agencies and officials, developers, private business sector, advocacy groups, and land trusts.

Those are our key identified people that we want to partner with.

And I like people to realize the daily threat that this space is under because it's already zoned.

So and a developer could come in, but of course, with the wetland denied permit, it adds to their expense.

So it's not quite as attractive, but it is there's a daily threat.

And it's not just this space, it's other spaces in our city and what they could become: warehouses, pavement, semis, noise, data centers, but versus the promise of what it could remain and a vibrant, beautiful space that residents and wildlife can cohesively enjoy.

Spaces for residents' well-being and self-reflection, quiet enjoyment, a wonderful example of nature conservation in the developing area.

I think that's critical.

We need people to realize that that compromise, you can have a little bit of both if you strategically look at the spaces and determine how it could be developed and have the best best of both worlds if possible.

It's not always going to be possible, but it can be possible.

And unfortunately, the threat has become more critical with the passage of House Bill 1383 in July of 2024.

It narrowed the definition of class three wetlands to focus only on the most rare and ecologically important wetland.

It provides exemptions for many class two wetlands, further reducing the protections for wetlands that were previously more regulated.

And it increases the mitigation options for developers and property owners, allowing them to count restoration existing, the restoration of existing downgraded wetlands toward the mitigation requirement for developing new isolated wetlands.

So here's another hurdle they put just five feet higher for me to try to jump over.

But guess what?

Put my running shoes on, and I'm gonna start practicing jumping.

So I'd like to end my presentation with a quote from Henry Ford that encapsulates what's transpired in this process that our task force is working toward.

Coming together is the beginning, keeping together is progress, and working together as success.

We have a wet we have a long road to go, but I feel very confident that we're on the right road.

We just got to get moving in a little bit quicker direction so we can do that.

Each one of these photographs has been taken at that wetland, and it's a tribute to the significance of the wetlands and a reminder of what we stand to lose without mindful stewardship.

Our vision is to build this movement, inspire other communities to take an active role by starting their own chapters of wetlands not warehouses.

I encourage you to visit our website, which is WNWFT.com.

Also, who's your environmental counsel has a link on their website to wetlands not warehouses for anyone that wants to start a chapter in their community.

Like us on Facebook, and what we hope is to build momentum, connections, partners, and ultimately save our wetlands.

I thank you for your time.

And if you have any questions, I'm happy to answer.

Um I will say, if the part of the reason I invited Robin here today is because this has been something very positive that has happened in our community.

Um, when a lot of times when it comes to land use, we face negative results that neighbors don't want.

We want to encourage other neighborhoods, whether you are in one of the outlying suburban townships, if you can still call them that, or you're in the urban areas, our natural resources are finite.

Whether it is a tenth of an acre of woods or 45-acre wetlands, um, it is going to be up to the citizens to really advocate and make sure that those are preserved.

We can't sit on our hands and wait for government to take care of it for us.

We have to stand up together as citizens to advocate for these, and we are hopeful that the positive strides that have happened in Franklin Township can be encouragement for other neighborhoods, especially those who feel like they've been beat down to stand up and say, No, this is important to us.

These natural resources are important to us.

And once they're paved over, you can't get them back.

Nope.

Robin?

Yeah.

You had Brian Mary as a partner.

I have found him to be extremely pro-business.

What was the key in getting that conversation going?

I think uh transparency and just being due diligent and letting him realize how many of the residents in the area are advocating for this.

Believe me, uh I pound my head on the wall with him sometimes thinking, what are you what are you doing?

You know, I don't understand how you don't see the value in this.

But he also is pro-business for the most part, but he listens and he knows that trial connectivity, he knows green spaces are a priority for this administration and also for the residents.

So that's where compromise comes in.

You know, I can't say I told him I said, I know I can't stop all this development, but my hope is that we can come to a comprehensive compromise.

Thank you, compromise that we can have the best of both.

We're gonna lose a lot, and we did lose a lot in those wetlands.

But if we can save at least two or three of those, it's to me is well worth that fight.

Um so you just have to communicate.

Um so you just have to communicate, and he is he's difficult to get a hold of, he's difficult, but I send him text messages frequently, I send him emails frequently, I leave him voicemails frequently, and I think if he doesn't return the call, he knows he's gonna get 10 times as more because he hasn't answered my call.

So I think if you if you do that, unfortunately, again, it's that bulldog type mentality.

You you just have to hold their feet to the fire.

And we did a virtual with him back in 2023 with a presentation about what we wanted to do, and point blank asked him, are you supportive or are you not?

And that's when he said, I can be supportive, but there needs to be a master plan.

Now, was that strategy on his part to think that's going to take some time, it's going to take some money?

Because I will tell you right now, that master plan is about $35,000.

So we have a way to go, but I have a plan of what I want to do next to try to get that $35,000.

If I can't get a local grant, then I'm gonna bring all the developers within the area together at the table and say, look, you're taking a lot of our land in our green spaces.

What can you give us back?

So we'll see what happens.

Well, one option that we've looked at, and we are still have that door open, is we had a meeting again, a meeting with Indy Parks.

And we did get an indication that they if we could get the land donated, they are supportive of taking over that project.

Yeah, I'm dealing with a similar project in Nora, and uh it's indie parks is as you know, they're very stretched in terms of their resources.

So you know, I know there's a developing a friends group is a key function of anything that you're gonna turn over to them.

So hopefully you have that.

Yeah, you know, that that kind of commitment of sort of like a holiday park as a friends or holiday park and other have a similar organization.

Crawlfield Park has very similar setup as well.

So develop that develop a sustaining fund to support the indie parks activities, you know.

Yeah, unless I can hit the lottery and buy it myself and say, here you go.

Well, have at it.

I don't think that's gonna happen.

Well, and also the community in the future because 25 years from now, the land will still be there, but the people who live there are all gonna be have changed.

So we need to enable that activity, you know.

So I think that's very important because a lot of times the idea of creating something is wonderful, and people get very excited about it, but then maintaining it, that's a whole different ball game.

Yeah, so you have to really think ahead.

We don't want to just purchase it and get it saved, but we've got to make sure that it's gonna be taken care of.

Yeah, the a lot of some my sister, she's up at Minnesota, but she does a lot of this similar work, but not quite to this extent.

But you know, she said your your land trusts are probably your best avenue at this time.

Federal grants are very far and few between, they're they're very competitive.

You don't the guaranteed funding isn't always there.

Um so it's a lot of work.

I work full time and 10 hour days, so this is come home, go upstairs and start working on this.

So, but I have two or three options and plans that we just once we get this conceptual site plan, that's imperative before we can start moving forward and actually engaging in serious conversations with a lot of these associations and organizations because they want to see a tangible as to what are we envisioning here.

So that's kind of where we're at that spot right now.

Um, I'm very excited that we're just about this close to the conceptual plan.

We have some minor tweaks, but I think hopefully that's going to propel this just a little further and kind of expedite the process a little bit more because we have that tangible there.

So Pat.

You mentioned uh House Bill, which is it state level or Congress?

Uh state level, Indiana House.

So they can just uh there's no federal protection for different wetlands preservations.

They still have to go through the thepartment I not IDEM, but the U.S.

Army or Engineers because they determine jurisdictional.

Is it a is it a water of the U.S.

protected, or does it fall under state jurisdiction?

Now unfortunately, Governor Holcomb's that was the first bill fast track through that legislative session, and it it just went through like a speeding bullet.

I was very upset about that because to me I it was that was crazy.

I don't understand why it went like that.

But so that's at the state level.

So that that's wetlands that fall under IDM's jurisdiction.

Yeah, I understand that um the state legislation legislature is quite happy to tie the hands of IDEM.

Yeah, and I tell you know, IDEM was wonderful.

It has been wonderful to work with because they they care.

I mean that they have their job to do, and they have to be unbiased and look at it and you know, for what it's worth.

They can't really put any bias or emotion into it.

But you know, the people there that I worked with, they're they care.

They were like, this is great, this is wonderful.

You know, I I met with DNR because I thought this could be a perfect mitigation site for wetlands that are being lost at a rapid pace within Franklin Township, make this a mitigation site for that and make it a preserve.

And DNR has looked at that area, and what I've told is it it's great, it's it's a wonderful area, but it's not quite big enough, and for what we would have to purchase the land for versus the credits we would get back from developers, it wasn't cost intuitive for them to do it.

So I mean, it's believe me, I am I'm lifting that rug up and looking at all the corners, trying to figure out how how can we partner with someone that to save this if it's if it's a mitigation site, if it's a nature preserve, if it's a park, but it needs to be saved.

It like she said, once you pave over it, it's it's done, it's over.

And and you can create what you think is a wetland, but destroying one that naturally has occurred, you're never gonna re recreate that.

You just never are.

No.

Um did the developer go through the step of buying the property, they had it under contract, yeah, and it was contingent on getting things in place.

Uh first contingency was the rezone, which passed.

Then when they had the jurisdictional and that they were told they had to mitigate so many acres of the wetlands, they went back to the property owners and said, Hey, we have to pay X amount of dollars to mitigate.

Can you drop the price per acre?

Fortunately, one of the owners said, I don't need to sell the land, and if you can't give me what you offered, I'm not gonna sell it because there'll be another developer come along.

So it was kind of a double-edged sword, it was a saving grace for the fact that we it allowed us time, but it's also with the developer offering the price they did per acre, set that price so high that it isn't attractive to DNR, it's not attractive to because it's so much more expensive than what the land is actually worth.

But with the wetland denial, that's almost kind of set a precedent that that is not as highly valued land as what they were going to be paid for.

So we'll see.

Are the communes on the ground or in the zoning at all?

Um that won't let it be um developed as their site plan.

Even pulling at 45 acres aside 150-ish acres.

Um zoning that would hit and down and going forward.

And you develop a floor.

I don't believe so.

Our only saving grace is there's a 10-acre um physician.

I don't have it up, but at the very north top of that, there's 10 acres that's owned by another individual that wasn't part of the warehouse development.

That one we just fought because we had that owner wanting to put a truck and trailer repair on that 10 acres.

Well, luckily, one of the task force members said, see if there's any commitments to that zoning that happened, I think it was 2006, and there was that prohibited.

Well, again, it probably would have got rubber stamped, except we all jumped on and I started shooting emails out to Idem, the DPW to the city planner saying, hold on a second, hold on a second.

And so the permits that they filed were put on pause until those could so I that's helpful.

So even if this doesn't come to fruition, I've learned a tremendous amount of processes, and knowing how critical Franklin Township land use committee is educating people on asking for particular commitments because that does, and the I mean, 20 years later, you've got that commitment saying, hold on a second, time out.

So the city wasn't as aware of that commitment as they should have been because they were ready to payers' jobs to put these it is, but again, Julie, you know, they're stretched pretty thin and they turn over.

So there's a lot of institutional knowledge that's lost here.

So it's it's unfortunately it's computerized, yeah.

It's up to the grassroots to hold that hold them accountable, unfortunately, and it's a lot of work, and I admire all of you for what you're doing because I know the battle that all of you have faced.

I know what Julie's in that area went through.

I know what Martindale Wrightwood's going through, I know what Decatur is going through, and I believe me, I feel for you because I know what it takes, and I know it's not easy, but I do commend you for what you're doing.

I would give everybody one caution, and that is when you're talking to the elected officials or the city represent you know, employees, even when you're frustrated with the situation, I can guarantee you that calling them names and yelling at them and telling them I pay your salary or some iteration of that gets you nowhere.

It is very difficult sometimes because land use issues are very emotional, yes.

It is really difficult to keep your temper sometimes, and I'm not saying that you shouldn't let them know that you're angry, but threatening them and calling them names and yelling at them, that doesn't get you anywhere.

And Ruth Hayes with Nord North Side sitting here probably has the longest history of any of us dealing with land use issues and would probably concur.

Although I've seen I've seen roof, I've seen Ruth on line of fire under people before.

As I see it.

First of all, IDEM threw us under the under the bus.

Idem did nothing for us, nothing, but that comes from the top.

Our problem is the legislature, it's controlled by developers.

Uh it's controlled by people who really don't understand the importance of the natural areas, and until we can change the attitude of the legislature.

Uh that's where this all comes down.

And um the planners who who are ethical are as frustrated as we are, and we've lost a lot of expertise because those planners just left.

And so we get new people coming in, rookies, yeah.

Um it's an educational process.

George and I used to emphasize when you appoint somebody to the development commission, you need to do training.

They don't know.

I had an attorney actually, who sat on the variance board, and I was remonstrating on a variance, and I went, they cannot prove number one, cannot prove number two, you cannot prove it.

Went through the five, and she said to me, aside from the legalities for this age, what's your problem?

No, when you have people who are making decisions on these issues who have that kind of an attitude, it's very difficult.

But I didn't yell at her, I just looked at her, went home and laughed because I could not believe that she would say a thing like that, and she had a vote.

She had a vote, yeah, and we don't have those votes.

So we have to we have to become, I hate to say it, somewhat political.

Very political.

We have to change the politics.

We are elections coming up, and um perhaps one of the questions that can be asked of candidates as they come through is will they appoint um neighborhood people to these boards and commissions?

Yes, like when you appoint these people, you need you need to have.

She would call the new appointees in, and they had learning sessions, training sessions.

Um if it was on the variance board.

They'd look at you like you're crazy.

Um the state statute support what you're trying to do.

But if you talk to the to the people who are serving on those boards, they don't know what you're talking about.

It I'm old, I'm old fashioned, I'm old school, but I I think that we need what I training stations.

We have to be more political, I'm sorry to say.

Did you talk about it now?

Oh, yeah.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

I kind of want to come back.

You have a question.

I do.

I'm just kind of curious if are there any others in the city or outlying areas that they reached out to you or you know where they are for wetlands and woodlands that might be needing your guidance.

Well, I've I've spoken at a couple of you know events, but yeah, no, and we have you know, our Facebook page and our website, but yeah, no, I have not at AEC is kind of the wetlands, not warehouses is their slogan, so they kind of are monitoring if there are other communities that are interested in being you know having that campaign, they're kind of leading that forge for that.

Um they are very they are very strong advocate for the wetlands and and a lot of that.

They they lobby at the state house, they do a lot of things like that, but I have not been no one's reached out to me specifically and said I've had I think one area ask me how did you get it done, and I said, Well, it's a lot of work, but I think it it just proves that it can be done, but I will tell you the day before Idem said they were gonna pass their decision, HEC called me and said, Robin, I've worked on a press release, and I know you're not gonna like it, but it it's geared toward that it's gonna you know be approved.

We just want to be prepared once that announcement comes out, and I said, he said, I'd like you to read it because you're quoted in it, and I said that's fine, but I'm not gonna accept it right now, so you can send it to me, and then the next day that it hit that it was denied, and I think that shocked it shocked a lot of people.

It shocked there were a lot more than 50 people in that auditorium.

Yeah, yeah.

There were a lot, but I think it shocked all the people that were there to to protest getting those wetlands paved over.

You know, we walked out of that room thinking it was it was a done deal and we're gonna get their permit.

Yeah, and I think the developer, it was so they I think they thought they were assured it was gonna pass, they didn't even come to the hearing.

What they did not even come, Gershman and City Mark partners did not come to the public hearing because I think they felt that it was a done deal, so they didn't feel like they had to show up, and I think that I think it spoke volumes, you did.

I think it really did.

So, you know, that's that shows you, and and this is just on a sidebar, and it's I don't want to be gossipy, but after a lot of this happened, I called Kathy because Andy Starr called me what four months ago.

Yeah, when this whole little story about somebody that worked for the mayor and had a relationship.

Well, that part of that was when all of this development process was going through, and they said, Well, we kind of want to talk to you to know do you think this affected what you had?

You know, I said, Look, it's done.

There's nothing I can change.

It is done.

I said, So I really don't want to get into that.

I don't want to get involved in that.

My focus is saving this wetland.

And this will not help with that.

So you know, it and like Kathy said, when I when I want testified, believe me, I was very emotional.

I'm very attached to this area.

And it is hard to stay level headed and civil at times when you get highly emotional.

And I think I was fighting this development, probably I felt like an I was on an island, basically because all the other property owners within that area were under contract with the developer.

They never offered us anything for our property, which by right, they they didn't have to, you know.

They asked me, would you sell?

I said, Well, if it's to my financial advantage, I would entertain it, but no, I don't.

I'm per I'm happy here.

So they led the city planner and all of the neighbors to believe that they offered me something, and I did not I passed it up.

So when I stood in front of MDC, I said, I'm gonna be fully transparent with you.

They never offered me anything, and I'm kind of thankful that they didn't, because this probably wouldn't have come to this point, but I'm fighting for what I believe needs to be saved.

So, you know, it's it's sad, it's sad, just the game that is the politics that are involved in it, and it's frustrating, but I think that's by design.

I think they try to wear you, they wear you down, and then there's no hope.

I can say Julie and their group when they were fighting that data center.

I I thought it was a done deal.

I I thought you're not gonna get, you know, it's gonna go through, but they all stuck together and did their due diligence, and it was amazing that was a big victory too.

So it can be done.

It's not always in the cards, but I tell you, you there's days that you just think it's not worth all this.

I'm forget it, it's gonna get the belt.

But you know what?

I just I asked myself, and I'm a religious person, so I pray about it too, and I asked, I asked God, give me some guidance.

Am I doing the right thing?

And as soon as I asked that, a calling came over me, and I thought, yeah, I am doing the right thing, and I'm gonna stick to it, and I will until the brick walls up and I can't climb any higher.

But but let me tell you something.

I can climb pretty high, and I'm gonna keep trying.

So well, um I'm interested in this discussion.

I think I don't think it really works.

I don't think it makes any difference if people show up with signs.

You can show you can have a hundred of them standing there with signs.

It doesn't change the mind of the people who have the vote.

They have the control.

The people are sitting up there in front, and they don't care about your signs, they don't care about the public, they care about the power, and the power comes from above.

So all of the people who are remonstrating, they're showing their love for the property, they're showing their but they believe in the system.

So we have to elect people who will change the system.

We have to find right now, a mayor who really cares about how the system works and who they appoint to be on those powerful boards.

That's the bottom line.

And so again, through the years, Nora has always said we're bipartisan, which we are, but that doesn't mean you can't be political.

You have to get into the political system and change the top.

All of this power comes from the top, and if they are controlled by the developers, uh if they and and it's the same with the state.

I am so discouraged that they passed this legislation that takes away from the the um the protection of statewide they did, and then who did we elect to go to Congress?

The woman who pushed for the removal of the protection of the wetlands again.

It's I daughter said, Mom, you're sounding like you're kind of flipping on your uh political side, and I said, No, just don't put a label on me.

We have to be unlabeled, we have to fight for people who will take away the control of these people who don't care about the wetlands, they don't care, and we've got to start a point getting getting somebody who will appoint people who do care about planning and zoning and protection.

Well said, Yep.

Okay, um, Robin, before you leave the table, if people are interested in the Franklin Township project or in starting a similar movement to same same natural resources in their area.

What's the contact information?

Well, they can um go to the website and there is a contact us, there's an email there that that they can send their information that they're interested.

Um, or I'm happy to give my personal email if you if you want.

I I work full-time, so I I usually check emails in the evening time.

Um it is Robin R-O-B-I-N at R H R Corp.

That's C-O-R-P dot US.

I'm pretty quick to answer uh if if I get home in time and and still have uh the mentality to tackle emails, but yeah, I'm happy to answer questions, I'm happy to assist where I can, and again, you can also reach out to Hoosier Environmental Council, they are the ones that are kind of overseeing the different chapters within the area, and they will help you get started with starting that chapter and actually being able to use the wetlands not warehouses slogan.

Um I don't know whether it's even available anymore, but many years ago, I there was a book that was made into a mini series called The Big Trees, and it's the story of how the pioneers came in and literally cut down and burned the trees so that they could plant, but one of the women who had been instrumental in cutting down the trees suddenly realized what they were doing, and so she started planting trees, so it's a matter of education and sensitivity to understand what they're doing.

There are some developers who are more aware of it.

Yeah, we had one, I know that that was a big surprise.

Yes, it was that we you know they came to for residential development, and and it was a beautiful piece of property that had natural woodlands and some wetlands, and Kathy and I advocated that they incorporate it into their development, and they agreed to do so.

But then they didn't get there, they but then they withdrew the petition, and I'm like, ah, I think it my hope is that it even if I don't save this wetland, which I pray I do, but that it sets a precedent and it starts and sets a standard that developers are gonna have to listen and be aware of what residents are saying about their area.

These developers don't technically live in those areas, so they don't really have any skin in the game per se.

They're looking at dollars, but I think if there's a loud enough voices and concern that they will listen, and that was proof positive that they did listen.

So I I have hope, I have hope.

And and I think Kathy, when you you know, the thing that that Kathleen Blackham taught me, the city planner when I was going through this initially to uh to you know, you have very limited time to to state your case.

It's that's very to me is very disheartening as well that you only have this very limited window to convince them, and it's it's good to be emotional, but stick to the facts, don't bring in the emotions of I hate this or I hate that, or you it has to be factual because the people sitting there, as you had said, are there, they probably read 10 minutes before they walked in and sat in that seat what this was pertaining to.

So giving them factual information to the statutes or whatever is more critical than the emotional type base of what you do.

That's why I say the signs don't miss.

Yeah, I mean they're visually there, they show the people feel better.

Yes, but it's not important.

But those that that are remonstrating is it's critical to take out that emotion as much as you know, it's good to have a motion, but just stick to the facts and present those because that's what they're gonna listen to.

That's and it's sadly it's unfortunate that you only have limited time.

Well, Robin, thank you very much.

No, it's my pleasure.

We've got our fingers crossed.

Although I have to tell you one time I heard my father refer to Ruth as a pit bull, so apparently Ruth's here.

Um while we're changing speakers, uh next we're gonna have Pat Andrews up, who's gonna give us some information about the proposed data center in Decatur Township.

But I want to remind anybody everybody that it along environmental issues, um, there was a walk yesterday, I believe it was yesterday, it could have been the day before, in Pike Township, um, relating to the proposal to take water from um the Eagle Creek area and pipe it up to Lebanon or data center, and there are concerns about what that's gonna do to the watershed for and water supply for all of Marion County.

Um, so keep an eye on that as well because again, Eagle Creek.

If if you have city water, what happens in Eagle Creek should be important to you.

Um, I understand they also recently actually spotted some river otters of the Eagle Creek, which have been absent for a long time.

Um this is Pat Andrews, she is um on the Canvas board, but she's here today wearing her Decatur Township hat.

Um the Decatur Township Decatur Township um recently, just this past Wednesday, had uh had approval issued by the Metropolitan Development Commission that would permit the construction of a data center.

And as we all know, Martin Dale Brightwood's hearing, um which is a smaller site, but just as critical to that neighborhood, their hearing is coming up on the 1st of April in front of the MDC.

Um Pat is going to talk with us a little bit about what the next steps are for the um proposed data center in Decatur Township.

I'll come up there in a minute.

Thank you very much.

We all use the data centers, whether we know it or not.

If you have a smartphone, if you have the internet, um, if you're watching us on Channel 16, even if you carry an old-fashioned flip phone like I do, we all use the internet.

So the fact that it is becoming critical part of our daily lives and how we function is without a doubt.

The issue before us now is how do how do those function within our communities.

McCanned did at our last meeting um adopt a policy requesting that the city of Indianapolis pause giving permits or granting zonings for any more data centers until a zoning ordinance can be a pass or drafted, reviewed, amended, passed, whatever the process is that would put up the guardrails and the standards to be expected of data centers if and when they develop in Marion County.

Um currently the current zoning ordinance that we have, which I believe was adopted in 2000, might have been too did not contemplate data centers.

Just as many many years ago, cell phone towers were not contemplated and what stand development um standards might be required.

Um we went through a similar process with signs.

What McCamna is asking of the city is to pause this whole process, which is a freight train until we can get appropriate standards that can be acceptable to the communities for if and when these data centers are developed.

So that the developers are not the ones writing the rules.

Um that should be a collaborative process that brings in input from the residents, the city, the developers, the residents.

Ruth.

Well, I was just gonna say you talk about the water situation coming from Eagle Creek, and we just had an otter show up, uh, which says now it's probably in pretty good shape.

And it I hate to beat a dead horse, but remember that situation leave up there.

Where did that come from?

Political.

Political.

We had a governor who evidently thought it was a great idea.

They didn't know to the public.

The public had no voice.

The public doesn't have any voice now.

Now I'm sorry, but I just don't see any hope unless we change the political.

There is a children's book called Don't Let the Pigeon Drive the Bus.

Um which would give everybody kind of a good read on making sure you know that the person who's driving the bus knows what's important.

We're doing technical things here so it works.

Okay, are we ready?

No?

Okay.

Before we're getting a TV show.

Okay.

Is it a good one?

Is it gonna tell me how to fix the somebody's lasagna or no?

And while they're getting that set up again, I want to remind everybody that our next meeting will be on April the 18th.

And if you have a concern about people who are unhoused in our community, um, this would be a great meeting to attend.

They're gonna bring information that we'll have representatives from the city as well as from CHIP talking about the different initiatives that are already underway.

I think sometimes part of this situation that we have is that we have lots of organizations out there that are trying to do good things for people who do not have housing, but they're but we need to get our arms around what are all of the resources that are available so that we when we come across you know a homeless camp or somebody who is who does not have um access to housing to be able to point them in the direct right direction to get the resources that they need, not just a roof over their head, which is important, but also what resources are available to allow them to keep that roof over their head.

Jim, I can tell you got something to say.

And Mirror is having a previous here Tuesday evening in regard to housing.

Yeah, mirror ending, which is an online news platform that's been around for approaching a couple of years, I think, um, is having what they call one of their chat and chew situations.

I'm sorry, I don't have the time right off the top of the state.

6 to 7:30 on Tuesday, which is March the 24th, it's coming Tuesday um to come in and talk about those same content here from the community about potential solutions, issues that need to be addressed.

There are lots of conversations going on all around the city, um, including at Nakana, but we need to find a way to all work together so that like I said, when we when we come across somebody that is experiencing homelessness, whatever the reason may be, and you know, we all sit in this room and we're gonna leave here and we're gonna go to our homes.

Um, but you never know what's gonna happen tomorrow.

It is that phrase of there, but for the grace of God, go on.

Tomorrow, it could be one of us.

So when we're looking at this situation, it is that we need to really think ahead.

It could be any one of us, and we need to make sure that people have the resources not just to get in out of the cold or the heat, but to be able to lead constructive lifestyles after that, so that they're not just going from place to place to place and ending up on the street again next week.

Okay, Pat.

Well, I'm gonna rephrase what Kathy said.

My purpose here is today, perhaps we didn't communicate too well.

Okay, um, data center uh Decatur Township had a data center approved by the MDC um this past Wednesday.

Um we will be taking it to court, period, and the story, and there's plenty of reasons for hope on that court action.

So um, but I know Julie was enormously helpful.

Jackie and um Jack, oops, what that slipped past.

Uh Jackie and uh Paula Brooks were really helpful.

So this idea of people who have gone before you can help you climb that it's a huge uh learning curve about data centers because these data centers that they're proposing here are not the you know your older brothers' data centers.

These are a new beast, period, and a story, um, and they need to be tackled um specifically by the city.

Um to that end.

To that end, I wanted to share some pertinent big pieces of information and offer to just as Julie and Jackie and Paula helped me put myself out there for the next people.

And McCannna too will be pushing harder at this point to educate counselors, etc.

But we did have some key information that everyone needs to know about these data centers.

In our case, it was a 250 megawatt data center on 132 acres that was zoned I2 for an RD park.

I won't go into all those details.

And they went through a variance of use instead of a rezone.

But it was important to share this information.

Diesel, in our case, they were proposing somewhere up or down of a million gallons of diesel storage on site.

The generators they were proposing 120 generators with 12,000 gallons of diesel tank under each generator.

And for prospective I DEM or the state of Indiana through IDEM will allow a data center to have up to a hundred hours a year of non-emergency burning of the diesel.

Then an unlimited amount of emergency combustion of the diesel.

Diesel combustion products are scientifically, medically conclusively related to health incidences of those who are exposed to it over time.

And I've listed here the there's they kind of separate out.

You know, when you see one of those semis going down and they just starting off from a dead stop, and that black stuff comes out.

They need to tune up their stuff, but it it illustrates that there are particulate matter that people breathe in, and this it is very tiny, and they can get into the very uh corners of your lungs, and that is the precipitating problem that causes lung cancer due to diesel combustion.

There are other products as well, and going back to particulate matter because that's what I'm going to talk about for a little bit here.

Um it also exacerbates other you know existing lung issues.

If you have COPD, if you have asthma, if you catch a cold or the flu, having all of this exposure can make those conditions uh worse, um, even up to allergies.

So, combustion of diesel is scientifically medically clearly linked to human health issues.

In our case, they wanted to put uh this uh data center right up against neighborhoods with with no intervening space.

So I found a study.

It turns out that the state of Oregon does things differently than the state of Indiana, and the state of Oregon requires these data centers when they want to put some generators online, they have to go through and model the health effects of the diesel combustion on the area.

So it is possible to model the health effects of the diesel combustion on the area.

This is from the um state of Oregon's analysis of Sabbies who were the developers in our case.

Own proposal to put online a net of 25 generators, and again, for perspective, they wanted 120 here.

This plume at the top is 3.6 miles wide, and the the depth of that plume is nearly eight miles long.

This bluish area prompted the state to require them to go to the stage two or tier two uh step of the study, the health effects.

And what they had to do was go to the nearest neighbor, residential neighbor, which I found distances for was about three-quarters of a mile away.

Because this is on an edge of town that's more rural.

There's an industrial park, it's more separated from little town of Quincy, Oregon.

But the the nearest home was about three-quarters of a mile away, and they had to look at model exactly at that spot.

And they had to look at model exactly at that spot.

What's the condition on the health effects at that spot?

So they did that calculation, and they found that three quarters of a mile away, the incidence of cancer would rise by 5.6 people per million people.

The state of Oregon only allowed it to go to 10.

So you get a perspective there.

So little outlined black thing.

Is that where the data is?

That is sorry, yeah.

That is the data center location.

So there's the dimensions again with the data center.

So I took uh with the magic of PowerPoint, I I made the same shape and reiterated it on a map of Decatur Attachment, which I'll show you in a second.

But I did calculate Quincy, the uh Savvy wanted uh the generators they wanted to put in in Quincy were smaller capacity than the ones that they wanted to put in in Decatur.

So I went for the the megawatts and it was seven and a half times larger megawatt uh capacity of the generators generators in Decatur.

So I translated that by simple math that uh the incidence in Decatur Township would be 41.9 additional cancers per million people, which would be four times the limit that the state of Oregon would allow.

Again, I haven't found any information yet that the state of Indiana requires anything like this.

So we're going off another state's standards, um, but at least we know they can model health effects and they could model the health effects before zoning.

So I superimpose that plume on Decatur Township, and I know you won't be um you won't be familiar.

Maybe if you go to the airport, this stretches into Hendricks County at the interchange on the northeast corner, sorry, northwest corner, um just past the airport, uh the interchange where the Meriplex Parkway and 70.

And it stretches well into Morgan County to the south.

Uh you see a faint line in the yellow area towards the south there.

That's the county line there.

So the box is where Savvy wanted to put the data center.

Now the little orange uh box is a quarter mile perimeter around that.

In Oregon, Savvy had to alert every residential and commercial property in a quarter quarter mile distance from their their plant there of the health effects of diesel, and they had to give the planning department for the city of Quincy a copy of that letter so the planning department could share that letter with anyone new who comes in to develop a house or a a um uh commercial business in the area.

The green box is the three-quarter mile where the incidence in Decatur would you know be calculated at nearly 42 additional cancers.

And you have to wonder what I mean, the houses you see on the the right, um, those are the number of houses or um in some cases their their um apartment units that are in that three-quarters of a mile.

What's the incidence of cancer right there abutting?

If you're sharing a property line, are you sharing a street with this development?

What on earth is is your exposure uh to the diesel, the downsize of the diesel combustion.

And again, um another little rabbit hole that I have to fully um go it down that I haven't done yet.

Um it turns out these data centers, uh the generators themselves, they can be either a tier one, tier two, tier three, or tier four of somehow it's related to environmentally um sensitive uh stuff.

It's tier they uh SABI and I believe uh well, SABI definitely was only going to go for tier two because it's cheaper, it's older technology.

Tier four is newer technology, um, and uh this the uh statistics are if you go for tier two um you're gonna operate your diesel uh uh uh for maintenance or what a short-term uh uses 22 hours more a year than if you have tier four.

So I just want you know to put all that out there that there's some stuff uh that can be brought into the picture too, being the um the scientific literature and the medical literature, and when I got into this, I I knew noise was an issue, and I thought it because it was bothersome kind of an issue.

Um that's not the case, it's actually with surprise, but um noise actually affects a lot of human health systems, um, you know, from your brain to your blood pressure, it can even induce um premature births.

I mean it's crazy, and they're still trying to figure out exactly how this all goes.

Um but hearing you you're familiar with your your vision, right?

And you don't see all the light spectrum, you only see a piece of the light spectrum, but you know that ultraviolet that you can't see causes skin cancer, right?

So what you can't see uh can bother your health, and so too the case of hearing.

There's um high higher pitches that you can't hear, higher frequencies you can't hear, and lower frequencies you can't hear, but they can affect your um your health.

Decibel, everyone's probably heard of a decibel meter somewhere along the line, and for anyone who's uh uh an arithmetic nerd, decibels are a logarithmic scale.

So if you go up 10 from from say 55 decibels to 65 decibels, it's actually 10 times the power, which means it's 10 times the ability to go further.

Um for the sensation of hearing, it's twice the volume.

So 10 decibels is a significant um increase.

We're used to the airport where we are, and every so often they do a noise study from the takeoffs and landings, and they plant decibel meters all around, and they take recordings of these uh numbers, and any number they get on an overnight, they add 10 decibels to it because of the ambient uh noise levels are much lower.

So it's well regarded in sound um ANSI of the American National Standards Institute, World Health Organization, etc.

That these standards are in place because noise is problematic, and not just because it's annoying.

That's an ingredient that needs to be spelled out.

It is because it's actually a health issue.

Okay, sound is uh movement of air, you know, they have in the frequencies, um, and I already mentioned this high pitched sounds, low pitch sounds you can't hear as far as no um air movement goes.

Um the base are sounds, they go further at the same power.

So, like when you know, when you're pulled up at the stoplight, and the car next to you's got their their radio going full blast, even though they're they're roll their windows are rolled up, your windows are rolled up, you can hear the base.

You're not hearing the the higher pitch, it's kind of it's getting filtered through your car and their car.

So too are houses.

So when you have a data center, these base notes and the sub-base notes that you can't hear, they can go one and a half, three miles.

They go through buildings because it's such a shallow wavelength.

The higher wave, the higher frequency wavelengths get stopped by trees and leaves in your the walls of your house.

You'll hear stories of people who um they can't they're they're they live near data centers of the higher level, and their windows vibrate, their walls vibrate, and that's that low base, and it's real.

And um, so the health the World Health Organization says that in a person's residence, the decibel level should be lower than 30 decibels in order to allow for sleep.

And if you can't sleep, you're not just gonna get cranky, you're gonna have health effects.

So this is um an issue of there was a Amazon data center in Virginia, and the neighbors are 600 feet away.

Um, and they the data center came in, it was one of the larger ones now for Virginia at that time, and they started they were so bothered by this, they started monitoring the decibels themselves, and they started uh talking to their their um elected representatives.

At this point in time, Prince William County requires 60 decibels at most at a residential property, not at the property line of the data center.

So 60 decibels at the property line of a residence in the daytime and 55 at night.

The residents have been trying to get them to reduce that nighttime one.

And this is the data center people put out these.

Well, a 65 decibels is a is just a conversation level.

And one of these folks said that you know, because it's incessant, it never stops, it's over all the time.

They said it's like a conversation that never stops and you don't want to have.

So they created their own graph, and I'm happy to share that with their personal experiences because they had, like I said, had been monitoring the decibel uh levels themselves.

This the Prince William County officials started a noise commission, and they hired an acoustics firm to analyze whether the 60, 55 decibel requirement at the residential spot, not at the data center spot, was strict enough.

And this was an eye-opener.

You know, now they put up those uh those sound barrier walls along freeways.

That is an incessant non-stop noise.

And so they've been dealing with the idea for decades.

It is not new and can be applied in the case of data centers.

Um, and what the acoustics person found with the standards was that uh the 55 decibels in the evening wasn't strict enough.

Um, and again, I mentioned that they brought it up that the World Health Organization uh says that it should be less than 30 in someone's home to allow for sleep.

Okay, and then so we've got the health effects from diesel, we got the health effects from noise, and we got the how do you measure and what should be the measurement of noise.

These things need to be tackled by our city council when the ordinance finally the draft finally comes out.

Um but one thing I have been stunned is how many people don't know how property taxes work.

These data centers come in saying we're gonna give you all these property, we're gonna pay all these property taxes.

And I I know I've seen it in my own community with Sabby coming in, and they say, well, before an abatement or after an abatement is over, we'll be um contributing 22 million dollars a year.

Well, that sounds great, doesn't it?

And all these elected officials and all these you know people are going, wow, that's gravy, that's wonderful.

You know, million dollars more to the schools every year, and so you know, 700,000 dollars more to the fire department a year, and that is not true.

Okay, so we're getting a quick primer because this just really for some reason this one really bothers me that they don't understand.

People who can uh increase your property taxes don't always understand and just your neighbors need to understand that it's not gonna help them at all, too.

Uh so the Department of Local Government Finance at the state of Indiana every year tells every governmental unit that wants to uh uh raise money through property taxes how much money they can raise.

So say they can raise a thousand dollars with property taxes.

That's it.

So then they the the governmental unit says, okay, I can do a thousand dollars.

Then they take all the property values in their district and divide it into a thousand dollars to get the tax rate.

So SABI, for instance, comes in, and after ten years of forgiveness, they come in with 22 million dollars a year.

Well, that goes into the AV, but what it does is it decreases the rate.

And in Decatur Township, which are numbers I know, but I don't know your numbers, um, the tax rate right now is 2.9%.

So say it dropped the the tax rate to 2.3%.

Well, if you're a homeowner, you're at a 1% tax cap.

That drop doesn't mean a penny more in your bank account.

If you own apartment complexes or a rental property, you're a 2%, still isn't gonna help you.

You're not gonna see any change in in your bill.

What uh who it will help are the industrial and commercial people, including the data centers.

They will drop their how much money they have to pay every year.

So they're the only ones who are benefiting from this thing.

There is no gravy train.

There is no additional money going to your school, there is no additional money going to your fire department, there's no additional money going to your your library or your city or your county.

Period.

End of story.

It's not how property taxes work.

And these guys, when you hear them and you're listening with that in mind, they're talking with the legal thing.

They're not saying it's gravy, but they're not telling you it's not gravy.

And so the population needs to understand that, and our elect officials need to understand that that is no extra money coming in.

And the state of Indiana, in its wisdom, is giving them 50 year uh bait or they don't have for 50 years, they do not have to pay uh sales tax.

7% we all have to pay.

They don't have to pay, and so they're talking about putting billions of dollars initially.

That seven percent, no, they don't have to pay that.

But these um uh servers and the chips and the servers that they get are outdated in two or three years, seriously outdated.

So they have to replace them every two to three years, and not again for 50 years, they don't have to pay any sales tax.

I don't understand why this the state has given away the farm, and I don't understand uh why um so many people think that uh this is a gravy train and we're all gonna get rich somehow.

The only ones getting rich are the data center people and the uh folks who are temporarily employed to build these.

Um so we need to get engaged because the council will be having a draft at some point here of a of an ordinance that includes data centers.

Um and I would you know I want to push out as much information I think is critical to the proper placement location of these things, depending on their size, um, and the things that need to be in place should they um be considering putting them next to homes.

And um anyway, that's my spiel.

I made it all the way to the end, but have it answering any questions.

Oh, um, one thing.

If anyone wants to contact me, because you know I I really benefited from the folks who'd gone before me.

Um, and you can reach me at uh my email is PC Andrews at Comcast.net.

Um so please contact me and I'll do what I can to help.

Um I would add with the property tax thing that we need to keep an eye on uh even if we get a local ordinance passed that tries to address the property tax inequities that at the state and at the federal level, there are frequently um laws proposed that would take away a local government entity's right to regulate anything anything more heavily than state or federal government could.

So if we get a local ordinance passed, we can't just assume that that's going to make sure that the scales are balanced.

The state legislature or the federal government can either one pass laws that say our laws are the prevailing laws.

Right now, the local government is the one entertaining an ordinance and needs to to protect us.

The state legislature is out of session, so we're a little more protected there.

So we can't we have to we have to deal with what um the the local is doing right now.

Um it would be nice.

It would be really protective if there was a moratorium while these things were were fit put in place.

Other communities in Indiana are doing the moratoriums um until they get something in place.

Some have already put some stuff in place.

I think there are six counties right now that have moratoriums.

Okay, I think could be more than that by now.

So um we can't we have to we have to deal with what um the the the local is doing right now um it would be nice or we really protective if there was a moratorium while these things were were fit put in place other communities in Indiana are are doing the moratoriums um until they get something in place some have already put some stuff in place I think there are six counties right now that have moratoriums okay I think could be more than that by now well there's also issues like um I think Hoosier Environmental Council it was their their materials um that mentioned it um data centers and the AI which is what the these level data centers are all about however whatever they have to say it's it's actually it's AI um that it's such shaky ground right now if you hear anything about the finances that they're kind of weird um it's unclear if there'll be some things some development in server technology that you now don't need this big a space etc um so there's a lot of things could happen still um and who's your environmental council was mentioning that you should they should have a a reclamation plan for reclaiming that property should they uh go under or not need that space and move on um and there should be a bond that would finance the reclamation of these places because they do they will be they can't be repurposed they just can't so yeah yes you're just starting with yeah right and so um I think that that is a really pertinent point to be bringing forward too that we don't need to be sitting here holding the bag of something that um got started and is no longer of use even if it got started and was operating for a couple of years so um anyway there's a lot of ingredients it's new that the learning curve is huge right and uh getting on top of all this is um incredible so if if if any of the information that I have is useful to somebody else I'm happy to share it and I've appreciated that from others so I know we're we're kind of out of time but Pat is there anything specific that people could do to help support Decatur Townships efforts at this time okay um the Decatur Township Civic Council will be considering um the lawsuit um and uh at that point once that decision is made by the members um if you know I don't I hate to second guess what people are gonna do but our vote on the Saby thing was two to support and 95 to oppose so um but we will be doing fundraising and I'll be pushing out as hard as I can to um uh put this in court there there's a lot of problems with the zoning and the process um in our case and um there's a lot of issues that that the court can deal with that we are not going to be able to deal with does the council have standing to bring this in or do they like a homeowner um well the it there has been an attorney hired by somebody other people um through the process and and I've spoken with her um and uh she believes that the civic council does have standing because we are listed uh in uh being able to enforce the commitments which is routine for us to do I assume frankly township does it as well uh but homeowners for sure I haven't I live half a block from this so I am a homeowner my me and my husband so homeowner I thought the fact we had in touch no I don't believe so it has to be affected we do have there are people who live across the street or next door sort of um situation too closer than you know that that they would do it if there's no if you can have multiple client you have multiple people listed um as being aggrieved if you have a um if you have a um diesel plume that runs for seven or eight miles I think you can get a lot of people so but nonetheless that's not my determination and ultimately it would be a judge saying uh A or an A on anyone but I know we have people stepping up in addition that the civic council um is probably allowed in that that camp too can they go ahead and start building will they um they have hurdles um number one is they have to plat on the ground right now that doesn't look like they're what they want um and we are denied going to the city council the elected representatives because of the way they chose to file they keep saying they were told to file that way and clearly that was not the case they were they chose to file that way and um so um the that just alone will we'll will buy some time but I don't believe if it's in court that they would be taking risk to um try pulling permits I don't even know if permits would be allowed if it hadn't been fully adjudicated and I know I'm over in Monrovia which is AES territory also um that they they purchased the ground over there who you know Google or whoever because Open Meta I'm not sure which which big um one is over there and they've stationed equipment ready

look like that what they want um and um we are denied going to the city council the elected representatives because of the way they chose to file they keep saying they were told to file that way and clearly that was not the case they were they chose to file that way and um so um the that just alone will we'll we'll buy some time but I don't believe if it's in court that they would be taking risk to um try pulling permits I don't even know if permits would be allowed if it hadn't been fully adjudicated and I know I'm over in Monrovia which is AES territory also um that they they purchased the ground over there whoever you know Google or whoever is over meta I'm not sure which which big uh one is over there um and they've stationed equipment ready to go but they're not actually working that I kept checking so they are actually they've stopped they are not doing anything more than using it as a parking lot from what I understand so I'm assuming that that is a wise um Pat but I don't know that I don't know the conditions of the um option agreement and whether they have to get through platd or through any court action because this clearly was going to court every the city was preparing everything for court the petitioners you know the binder was like this big and then there was a couple more things you know and we were preparing as well so and am I correct in it if it goes to court that the city of Indianapolis will be named as a defendant in the suit because it was the Metropolitan Development Commission's decision that they are actually contesting.

So they would not just be taking um say to court.

Oh you're not taking Sabi I don't think I'm not a lawyer.

Save's not in it I don't think that Savey would not name I think it would be the MDC.

Okay.

Yeah I think you and and if it was a variance that went through the BZA you would be suing the BZA.

So you can see that there's a big hurdle to clear in the court because it is a group of residents going up against the city of Indianapolis but they're gonna yeah because I don't know if you're a bulldog or a pit bull or some other canine breed I'm a can I don't think it works.

Yeah um there's there's no giving up this is too important to our community it's it's a uh one of those dirty rotten shames that our counselor wouldn't stand with us um it's a dirty rotten shame the MDC did the way they did I have to say we did get two votes there were two petitions technically one of the commissioners voted uh no on both of them and one voted no on one of them and um I I'm we'll be internally grateful um that they gave us that positive feedback that you know this is critical to the health of our community I mean not just but actual word health um the you can't imagine that um the property values in this whole area aren't gonna start because who wants to be next to a day come on who wants to live next to to that um so uh yeah there's a lot of effects um downstream from locating something like this right next to neighbors so okay well thank you very much any other questions from people we do we're running over time here so we gotta get wound up pretty quick but neither questions or comments hey Pat thank you how to get out of here I think everybody can see the impacts that neighborhoods can have should have and hope to have um a reminder to be sure and get the information about um the SOS project which is the um highland vicinity neighborhood's participation in the conversion of the the two-way streets in downtown Indianapolis that information is on our Facebook page and there's some out on the table please share it with other people that neighborhood is small but mighty and they would appreciate your support um in making sure that their voice gets to be part of the process hope to see everybody next month on the 18th of April where we will be talking about homelessness in Indianapolis.

Thanks very much and enjoy the weather that email is uh