Right, it being 7 p.m.

I'd like to call the meeting to order.

Uh Councilor Conan, would you like to lead us in the Pledge of Allegiance?

And to the new Republic for which it stands under individual liberty and justice for all.

Katie Gargano is our recording secretary.

Would you like to call the roll, please?

Sure.

Councilor Hildriff.

Councilor Susi.

Here.

Councillor Hoffman.

Present.

Counselor Haynes?

Here.

Councillor Bogart?

Here.

Counselor Conan.

Here.

Mayor boards.

Here.

We have as usual City Manager Kirk Biotti and Glenn Smith in the as far as staff in attendance.

First up, we have the acceptance of the minutes from the previous meeting.

So with no corrections to change submitted to the clerk.

The minutes will be accepted as distributed.

Do I have a motion?

Council Conan, seconded by Councillor Bogart.

All in favor.

Next up, we have recommendations for appointments to the boards, uh, to boards and commissions.

Would you like to speak to that, Councillor Susi?

Okay, so the appointments committee has met a couple of times.

We have we have a number of different applications and vacancies we need to fill over probably the next two to three council meetings, okay.

Tonight we're gonna specify and would want to talk directly about the building code of appeals.

Okay, we we presently have that board probably people haven't heard about it much.

Okay, so it it shows how good our uh buildings and everything else staff is by keeping things in check.

We have an issue that's come up.

I think we've we've been well aware of the person's come in front of us.

I don't know if he's here this evening or not.

But uh so we had we have to fill a vacancy, and one of the reasons we have to fill a vacancy is that tomorrow night there is a meeting of the Billing Code of Appeals.

Okay, and I believe Councillor Collan and we'll be there.

And we one of the we would have a quorum, but one of the people is away on vacation in Florida.

So we have to uh we went out and advertised, and we have two candidates that would like to bring to the council.

The council have the opportunity to vote on.

And uh so do we have two positions open or one?

We have one that we're looking at right now.

Okay.

And um there's there's more than one vacancy on on that board.

There's there are two positions open right now.

Okay, I thought there was only one.

So we have we have two people that were bringing up for uh to vote with for the council, okay.

So if you want to go through those, the first one, and I think everybody has their resumes or their backgrounds, so we can go through that point.

Okay.

Mr.

Mayor, just uh uh clarification.

Are we voting on one position tonight or two positions tonight?

We we're voting for just two different people, okay.

So we can ask if the council votes it, we can have both people on the board.

The council votes yay or nay on one or the other, and then we just one or the other.

Okay, what we guess you put.

But will we have a quorum at that point if we don't appoint two?

Mr.

Mayor?

Yes, we do.

Yes, we'll have a quorum as you need three members here.

As long as one is appointed tonight, they need to be three present, and the fourth one will be on Zoom, but you need three for a quorum to be present.

Okay.

That's where I got mixed up earlier.

Yeah, I was a little confused on that as well.

So we need a quorum because that was advice from legal.

That's why we have the three people there.

Thank you.

Okay.

So we have two people, and you're gonna remember these are both five-year terms.

Okay.

Um we'll go down right by the list with the where we're on the thing.

So first there's Mr.

Robinson.

I think we're familiar with him.

His his paperwork and his res or his resume as qualifications are all attached.

So he would be the first person, and then followed on by Mr.

Pearson.

Let me finish the on Mr.

Robinson.

Mr.

Robinson's paperwork shows that he's been a maintenance man for a private health company for many years, and that's his background.

And then I'll get into the second person after we do the voting if you wish.

So are we making uh so uh I'm still kind of confused.

Are we going to make a motion to appoint both or one or one by one?

We can take each individually.

Okay.

Okay.

I mean, that's the way we should do the votes, and that's the way we do the all the other votes.

Okay.

I I I guess I'm still unclear.

One position, one person.

What one each person takes a position.

Now we we're not saying that we have to fill both positions.

We have two empty positions.

Okay.

So we have two seats, so we have the objective is to fill two seats.

So we we voted on position.

These are vote, right?

We've vulnerable on each one of them separately.

Okay.

Yeah, there are no alternates in the alternates on this board committee on that board.

And um we need to have at least three um skilled professionals, electrician, plumber, engineer, architect, and we have two right now.

Mr.

Pearson, the second that will the second person will vote on is uh a licensed plumber for 22 years.

Okay, thank you.

Okay, so as I'm gonna go by what the sheet is in front of me.

Okay, okay.

And the first person is Mr.

Douglas Robinson.

Okay, so do I hear a I'm gonna do I hear a motion to accept his nomination?

Uh well, yeah, I think I can I can move their approach.

He he will you can ask for the motion, but he should be kind of doing that piece.

But I'll ask for the motion because I thought that's what it's supposed to happen.

You could make the motion, right?

No, I'll let you do that, Mr.

All right.

I move to approve the appointment of Doug Robinson to the city's boards and commissions as presented and as recommended by the appointment subcommittee.

Represent uh councillor Conan, made the motion.

Do I have a second?

Going once.

Going twice.

I do not have a second on that motion.

So correct.

Okay.

The second person is Mr.

Benjamin Pearson, and he is a licensed plumber for the last 22 years.

Just to uh people know, including the public.

He came out of our Vogue School as a plumber.

I mean uh Corner High Vote, which is a real attest to his you know dedication.

And uh he lives on parade road.

His paperwork is also attached.

Um we did confirm that he is he is licensed, he's well aware of the codes, so that's all here.

If there's any questions, we can go through that.

So go ahead.

So I move their approve Benjamin Pearson to the city's boards and commissions as presented and as recommended by the appointment subcommittee.

I'll make the move.

Councillor Hildriff, seconded by councillor Conan.

Any discussion?

Seeing none, all in favor.

Six zero.

Congratulations, Mr.

Pearson.

If he's here, uh I'm not sure he's here.

He'll be contacted, and since there's a meeting uh tomorrow evening, he'll be contacted.

Do a swearing in tomorrow so you can participate.

And maybe if I may, Mr.

Mayor, for a moment, okay.

In regards to the uh uh appointments committee, okay.

We have over the last couple of weeks we've met with different people for reappointments, for example.

And what we're asking for is and I'll use the we met with Mr.

A member of the trustees of the trust fund committee last week.

Okay.

Nathan for reappointment.

And one of the things that we're saying to all of them, and we also had the library in.

I think we have a couple of others, but we're we're pushing them and we're looking for your help with the city manager for them to come a couple times a year and present to us what do they do?

Where do they stand?

What's been going on?

Okay.

Kind of an update.

Yeah, an update because we haven't seen that many lots of times.

And I mean, for example, whether it's the trustee of the trust funds or the pundam fund, we would never hear from them here.

And I think it's important that the city council.

So as part of that, we've been pushing that.

Gets an idea of what they're doing and what they're accomplishing.

And okay, great.

So next, um agenda item 8B.

We have a clarification of the public hearing date for making Clay Street one way from about Bowman Street to Fair Street and no parking on the odd numbers side of the street.

Uh city manager, would you like to speak to that real quick?

Yeah, and that's fine.

Excuse me.

The uh when the motion was made last week, it was an error in the printing that we did.

Um the the public hearing is supposed to be on the 13th.

We had it as the sixth.

Um notices went out to the abutters as as was required.

That's all correct.

Um, the once you guys say okay to this, the um posting that we'll have in the papers is it's all gonna be correct.

Uh and it didn't shorten any time frame, it only made it longer from when we said so.

Um I think just a clarification, just so everybody's on the same page publicly, and then like I said, all the notifications were done correctly.

Perfect.

So I moved the schedule a public hearing on April 13th, 2026, adjourned the regular city council meeting to gather public input.

We've gotten the request to make Clay Street one way from Bowman Street to Fair Street, and no parking on odd number side of the street.

Councillor Haynes, seconded by Councillor Susi.

Any discussion?

Seeing none, all in favor.

Six zero.

Uh next up, we have citizens' comments from Matt is not on the agenda.

Would anyone like to speak?

Bill in once.

I apologize for my attire.

Hi, I'm Sue Higgins, Ward 2, and I just have a question.

Um I just would like to know how come the wow trail from Lake Port to Messer Street.

I know it's roped off so that you can't have people snowmobiling on it, but I'm wondering why it's not maintained so that we can walk on it in the winter time when we have a sidewalk plow.

Yeah, I'll take a look at it.

I um which section was it so?

From Lake Port to Massa Street.

It has in the past, though.

All right, I can just tell you it's so yeah, no, I'll I'll I'll take a look and reply back.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Would anybody else like to speak about matters not on the agenda tonight?

I'm gonna start at two, seeing none, we are going to move on.

Skipping anything today.

Next up, we have item 13A, a public hearing on resolution 2026-03, acceptance of unanticipated health insurance rebate and the amount of 86,316, and authorization to give the Belknap Mill 20,000 of said funds for building repairs and to deposit the bounce of the 66,316 into the health insurance stabilization reserve fund.

Um I'd like to open the public hearing on this.

Well, I didn't mention time.

One minute.

The public notice of the public hearing was made available in the February 2026.

I mean, February 26, 2026 issue of the Laconia Daily Sun and posted at Laconia City Hall, Laconia Community Center, Laconia Public Library, and the offices of the SAU.

Now I'd like to open the public hearing at 7.13 p.m.

Thank you.

Sorry.

Yes, no problem.

Thank you so much.

Uh my name is Laura Lamin.

I'm representing the Belknap Mill today.

I am the chair of the board.

Um, I've been a board member for six years and um the chair of the board for about two and a half.

Um today we're just here to um hopefully ask the city of Laconia for some assistance while we do some uh structural repairs to the the mill.

We have received an LCP grant, but we are looking for um some help with the matching part of that.

And my counterpart here, Kevin Spitala, the secretary of the board is going to mention a little bit about the um structural repairs that are a need.

Thank you for having us and allowing us to speak on this need.

Uh, for those of you not familiar with the Bellknap Mill Society, where the nonprofit that runs the Bellknap Mill, the Bellknap mill itself, and the society have a long rich history.

We are an anchor in the community.

We offer significant value, not only socially in terms of community and engagement, but economically as well.

We're over 200 years old.

We represent an industrial heritage of Laconia that's preserved.

We want to take our kids to farms to see how you grow food.

But do you have a place you can go to see how you make stuff and how they made stuff 200 years ago or a hundred years ago?

And tell that rich story.

We're an organization that really has four key pillars arts, history, education, and community engagement.

For the arts, we have rich programming that brings craftsmen from across New Hampshire through the league that are juried to present their arts for the community to consume.

Members of the community may not have any access to that, if not through organization.

For history, we have a number of history programs.

Over 300 kids came through our mill last year as part of the fourth grade curriculum for understanding the industrial revolution.

And we have storytelling that's really rich and help them understand connection to the drones that they use and the video games they use to the past that is right here in Laconia.

And they can touch and feel and look at the machinery and see how it works.

For education, we have a wide range of education programming, not just for fiber arts and how you make things that you can actually use at home, but we're expanding that program to understand how you grow food locally.

How you grow food inside your home to feed your family.

We're looking at enriching that education environment and that experience for residents around the area.

And the insurance of community engagement.

Inaugurations held for free at our location.

We have several civic engagements, and we are bipartisan, so any kind of uh civic engagement from planning meetings to debates occur in our building, and that's usually for free.

We have community engagement that occurs through our programs that brings, I think last year, over 3,000 visitors to our doors.

Now, those are visitors that are coming for music.

They're coming for the art gallery, they're coming to understand the mill and the history.

They're not just coming to a mill to come and walk through for an hour.

They're coming here, they're eating lunch here, they're shopping on Main Street, they're going around to other locations and spending money in Laconia because we are here.

Now we have a challenge.

We have a challenge right now because a 200-year-old building needs some care and maintenance every once in a while.

We have a structural stability issue in our sluice way.

That's where the water runs underneath the building that used to power the turbines.

Seven years ago, there was a structural assessment.

There are two steel pillars in that area.

After decades of being in place, they're starting to corrode, they're approaching end of life.

If they fail, that's pretty catastrophic for the building.

We're not there yet.

No structural engineer will give us a specific timeline.

They don't do that because of risk and liability.

We also have structural beams in the basement that have developed cracks.

May or may not be attributed to the same issue.

We need the cracks repaired to stabilize those structural beams in the basement as well.

And to continue offering that rich programming.

We really offer a safe place for people to mingle.

How many times do we have that in public right now?

A safe place, cross-generational space where three to four generations mingle in programs.

Together in one place.

So we're simply looking at how can we get some money to address a near-term structural issue.

Well, for decades, we've been paying for the park's electricity and water and all the irrigation that goes on there too.

And we're willing to keep doing that.

But this near-term need is going to become more and more desperate here over the next 24 months.

So we're asking for 20,000.

As Laura had said, the state believes in us.

They've already given us a grant for 38,000 for the 76 that we need to do the estimates, the engineering work, the design, and the repair itself.

So we have 38 in hand.

We're asking for 20.

We're very confident we'll get the remaining amount that we need to actually finish not only the plans, the design, the engineering, and the contracting.

So your 501 C3.

Have you tried any fundraising to get this money?

Yes.

We had to have multiple channels because we're a nonprofit.

38,000, well, even 76,000 for this project is a small amount for the annual amount we have to raise to keep the lights on.

That total this year is 126,000 to keep the lights on and to do this project.

So it's a significant amount to raise in a community like this.

We have six different channels we're looking into and growing, not just individual donors, but corporate sponsorships looking at other philanthropic organizations, like the independent order of Oddfellows, the Putnam Fund, we received a children's fund grant.

So there are other kinds of grants that are out there.

We've tapped into the one that is good for this, but uh a lot of other grants aren't available for this kind of specialized structural stability.

So we've exploited the one we had available to us.

Council Susie.

Oh god.

Question, sir.

I'm just trying to remember is there still water flowing through those that operation.

So there's not active water flowing, but there is seepage for several inches of water that is nearly impossible to prevent in that location, leading to the corrosion.

Well, how are you going to handle that water?

I would say the materials that are available today based on the engineers are far superior than the veil the materials that they use to make the pillars 30 years ago or so, 40 years ago when they were put in.

There is seepage.

We do not have the money for doing that next step yet because that would I understand putting the materials, but at some point in time we're gonna have the same problem all over again.

Fifty years from now, possibly.

In fact, with new materials, maybe far longer than that.

Excuse me for one second.

Question for the manager.

Okay.

Is this link in anywhere with the I don't know the federal discussion we've been having with replacing the Mill Street Bridge?

No.

Okay.

I'm just no two different topics.

I'm just wondering if they tied somewhere.

No.

Okay.

Anyone else?

I just had a question for the gentleman.

Um you indicated that the inauguration was held there free of charge.

Is that accurate?

I believe.

I thought it was that was accurate.

Um would you like to speak to that, Mr.

Manager?

Um I I was under the impression we spent some money.

I couldn't tell you what it is off the top of my head, but I think you might have some documents.

Was it for the space or for catering or things that we weren't for the space for the space itself?

It's my understanding that um we paid five hundred and fifty dollars for that event.

I just wanted that.

Is that okay correct?

Or uh I am not aware of that.

Okay.

Anybody else?

Yes.

All right.

Anybody else like to speak to this, Matt?

Thank you very much.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Hi, I'm Lois Casson Ward 3.

You might want to lower the microphone a little bit.

Okay, I can do that.

There we go.

Yeah.

Uh Lois Casson ward three.

Uh saving that mill was not simple.

It went through the courts, it was a battle.

And on the day that the bulldozer dozers rolled in, uh, Pete Carragianis, Norm Weeks, and my father, Nat Kesson stood in front of the bulldozers not to let them come and take it down until the court order came to stop it.

And they were successful.

And we have this beautiful piece of history.

Let's just preserve it.

I'm a Kessen.

I have to speak for it.

Thank you very much.

Anybody.

Hello, my name is Mason Pettit.

I live in Ward 3 also.

What is the health care stabilization fund?

Pardon my ignorance.

Well, that's a different topic.

Um that's where the money is clear too.

That's why it's a good question.

Oh, for this.

Oh, do you want to speak?

Yeah, so uh I couldn't tell you how long ago, but at one point um there was some leftover money out of some of the health insurance lines.

So they put some money into a reserve account.

Essentially, so all of a sudden we're hit with a year where health insurance is higher than budgeted, or we get an assessment like we did, or something along along those lines that we have some ability to help offset those costs.

Uh been a few years since we put money into it.

I couldn't tell you when.

It's been a few years since we have, but that that's what that money's in there for.

So that's for public employees.

Yeah, yeah, health insurance.

Correct.

Public employment health insurance plans.

Okay.

So uh has the public employee union weighed in on whether or not they want 20,000 uh to go to the uh uh mill, which I think is a great, great uh uh uh purpose.

But I also wonder if all of that money should go to the health care stabilization fund uh to fund it more fully.

They haven't weighed in on it.

Um it's it's didn't come out of any of their monies, just so that question came up to me prior if this was a shared money that we spent out and then the return, which happens occasionally.

That's not this case.

This was city funds that went out and coming back into the city, so there would be no distribution to employees.

I don't think that's exactly what he's asking, but that question did come up to me in an email that I received.

Yes, ma'am.

Hey, good evening, Towershore.

Um Street, I don't know which word it is, I'm so sorry.

Six.

Thank you.

Um I'm the president of the Laconia Historical Museum Society, so obviously the Bellnet Mill, and I do have a past with the mill.

Um it's a historic piece.

We certainly need to keep that in mind, and it would be important to save it.

I will say, however, I know that maybe this year was a little different in regards to inaugurations for the city.

I will state that for many, many years, those were free at the mill.

So keeping that in mind and its history.

Um so yes, I'm in favor always of making sure that our historic significant extort historic structure stays standing.

I would say, however, um, is there an application for extra funds somewhere?

Also speaking on behalf of a nonprofit, another nonprofit.

Is there I didn't see that there was um an application for this type of thing?

I am not aware of any application.

Generally, the way applications work for nonprofits is that they come in uh sometime during the year like that.

I know that yes, I know that's the rest of them uh are are uh if they come up during mid-year as we're on a case-by-case basis, something like this.

I think we have an actual form.

Do we don't yeah?

I was gonna say I don't think we have an actual form, but it's how does a nonprofit find knowledge about this type of thing?

Uh this happened to be from meetings that some of the council members happened to be at and questions came to us uh either into my office or to one of the counselors.

So going forward, if someone is a nonprofit in the city, should they just stay in ta in touch with their counselors?

Or it's either ward counselor or myself.

Can someone tell me who the counselor is for downtown or who would cover where we are located on Water Street?

That should be great.

Nice to meet you, Mr.

Hoffman.

We'll be in touch.

I knew that was coming.

Anyone else?

Hi, Doug Lopinson, ward five.

Um 20,000 isn't gonna make or break the town of Laconia, so it is what it is.

Um, but I asked myself this is where the money should be coming from.

We have a TIF district for a reason.

Um rehabiliting rehabilitating property is one of those reasons that we have a TIF district.

Um also, you know, I know at one point in time they talked about using some of that money for the antique um center downtown Laconia, the old JJ Newberries.

Um if I had to choose between JJ Newberry's in 1970s, 1960s building um with a bad facelift or the mill, I'd pick the mill every time.

Um but that being said, this money was supposed to go back to the health care fund, um, not to a nonprofit.

We just had another lady here from a nonprofit who said, You're giving away money here.

Mr.

Hoppman, I'm gonna be in charge, I'm gonna be in touch with you soon because I also run a nonprofit.

How many of those nonprofits can we afford to give 20, 30,000 to before it is a big deal, before it doesn't come out of the right funds, and before it affects other budgets that we shouldn't be touching?

That's my question.

And I'd ask you guys to think about that.

You know, again, I'm not saying don't save the mill, I'm saying do it the right way, use the right funds.

Thank you.

Anyone else?

May I speak again?

Yesure.

Thank you.

Uh Mason Pettit District 3.

District is a district.

Ward ward.

Yeah.

I'm from Washington State, actually, and words aren't out there that I'm aware.

I'm a public employee, I've been a public employee my whole life.

Um when we were negotiating for conditions, um, one of the things that management would say to us is gosh, the health care costs have gone up so much, we just can't afford it.

And um I I really do think this money is not appropriate for the purpose that it's being asked to be used for.

And again, I think you need to talk to your selves, but also the public employees, other public employees, about the fairness of giving what potentially is going to save them uh uh some pain.

Um twenty thousand is not a lot, but it's something, and it came in as excess, it should go back to the fund to which it was intended in its full amount.

Thank you.

Thank you very much.

Anyone else, Mr.

Mayor, City Councilors, thank you for your service to our community.

My name is Jennifer Anderson.

I am I live in ward four, and I formerly held the position of the Bell Matt Mill board chair for nine years, and I can speak to the stewardess that the board and staff hold for the mill.

And this investment to the structure, I view as an investment to the structure of our community, as the oldest unaltered textile mill in the entire country and as the official meeting house for the state of New Hampshire.

We have a legacy that I believe should be protected.

And I will say that over the last number of years, which I know is uh is a big cause for you, Mr.

Mayor, is our our issue with food with not food necessarily, but with housing and security.

The mill does not have control over the property that it sits on, which is city property, and what was once a very booming event business has been very significantly impacted by the uh activity that happens in downtown Laconia and around Rotary Park, to be frank, that is very difficult when you are touring to a would-be couple who's gonna get married, and they are concerned about how much they'll have to uh pay for police protection at said event.

And what was what was literally the bread and butter of our budget has been close to demolished by that.

And to Lois' point, we don't want to see any more demolition of our history, as Tara said as well.

And so we just hope that you will consider supporting the Bell Matt Mill and consider supporting uh the future.

Thank you.

Thank you very much.

Anybody else?

Good evening.

Uh John McCartell Award won and I sent the email to city manager.

And uh, do appreciate you getting back to me on that.

I don't think anybody is gonna uh dispute the value or the importance of the Bell Nut Mill to the community.

Um my point is simply uh these funds I I don't look at as being discretionary or disposable, and that's what it seems like the council, you two-thirds vote, you can do whatever you want with it.

I I understand that.

Um 20,000 dollars may not be a whole lot of money, but it is an amount.

You're coming in a pothole season, you have road work that has been uh delayed for years, and I think you're sending a message that quite possibly, as one lady uh previously spoken, can other nonprofits come in here and ask the city for assistance?

And I think we should be able to do that, but there's a process for that, and that process would include going through the budget uh preparation, and although they they may not have known about these uh uh deficiencies at the time of that, but that's part of the process.

If if we want to be able to support these things, then we should be able to do it through budget process so we have some control over that.

That's the only thing I'm saying is by uh moving forward with this, you're taking that choice of the voter of how their tax dollars are being spent away from them.

If I want to make a donation to the mill, I can do it.

We can all do it.

It's a different story when you're taking the money from the taxpayers where they don't have a say where it's going, they're believing it's going to an established budget, but then it's going someplace else.

That's all.

Thank you very much.

Anyone else?

I have just a couple questions on it.

Um my name's Mark, I'm from Ward 5.

So exactly what is the health care fund?

Uh the city managers went over it.

Yeah.

But what exactly is the health care fund?

So we have a we provide health insurance to our employees, they pay a certain percentage of it, we pay a certain percentage of it.

If it comes to a position where at the end of the year um the it was underfunded, under budgeted for because we had new employees, something didn't work out right.

Usually it doesn't happen, but if it was, it gives an opportunity for us to have a uh a fund that we can go through the council and the trustees for to be able to offset those uh those costs.

So the next question comes to mind.

Why are you considering taking somebody's health care budget money and putting it into a mill?

I have nothing against the mill, but the money in that fund is not for the mill, it's for the employees of the city.

So why are we even considering this?

The returned money that came back, and I'll just speak to you guys, but answer this question.

The the money that came back didn't we didn't pull it out of that account.

It's not like we pulled out that and we're putting it back in.

It is it's money that's coming back to the city that we have to do something with because it was related to a health insurance assessment that we got hit.

That's why my recommendation was it goes into the health care stabilization account as a place to put it.

Um kind of fit that's where it belongs.

Yeah, it kind of fit that process, and then the the discussion went on from there.

So it didn't come out of anywhere like that particular, it just went in.

Council Susi, real quick, yeah.

Mr.

Manager, that money that is in there, that came from the city, not from the employees.

Am I correct?

The money that's the the money, which which money?

The money that's currently in the thousand dollars.

No, that came from the city.

Came from the city, city funds, not from the employees.

It came from a multiple lines.

I have that breakdown, I can certainly share it with the same.

But it's a whole bunch of lines that it wasn't from the employee.

It was not from the employees.

So the the I I think we're getting into a question and answer your own public comment, which really isn't appropriate, but Council Vogert, you could be the last one.

Thank you, Mr.

Mayor.

Uh this question is to the city manager.

If we budgeted for a project, and the project was completed, and there was money left over from that project that didn't get spent, then we would be able to use that money as needed with after the council had go through a process like this to what to do with the money.

So it would be the same as my question would be this is the same difference.

We were given a quote, we paid the quote, and then we get a rebate on our refund on it, refund on our quote.

So it's no different than any other project that we've done in the city, essentially, yes.

Thank you.

I do have an issue with um trying to make everybody happy most of the time.

So why can't you take the whatever money since you have the option to do with it as you please in a sense, and put it in the nonprofit fund that we are allowed to request funding from at the end of every year or the beginning of every year, and let it sit there so that nonprofits like the Bell Net Mill, ourselves or anybody else can then request from it.

So that 20,000 can go into that fund, and people can request under the application process that you already have for nonprofits.

If I there is no non-profit fund well, whatever that it was.

No, but it's not a good idea.

No, no, no, but I'm just no sorry.

It's really not it's really nothing.

It's during the budgeting process, is one of the it's under the administration, one of the lines, uh one of the um sections under the administration is the special um special items that that we and we receive letters from um different nonprofits say, hey, can you add me to this this year?

thousand dollars can go into that fund and people can request under the application process that you already have for nonprofits if I there is no nonprofit fund well whatever that it was no but it's a no no no but I'm just no sorry it's really not it's really nothing it's during the budgeting process is one of the it's under the administration one of the lines uh one of the um sections under the administration is the special um special items the that we and we receive letters from um different nonprofits say hey can you add me to this this year sometimes we can sometimes we can't um sometimes you guys want to fund a little bit more a little bit less depending on what the years look like so it's it's not like uh there's not like a fund it's it's more what you're a budget line item it's a budget line it's it essentially it's a budget line item with a bunch of breakdowns underneath it can you add money to that budget line item that's done during the budget process typically so when something like this comes along it's not it's not something you can then add in as like a deposit to that line item no okay all right so you're just trying to fix something anyone else so as I listen to every Sue Higgins board two so as I listen to everybody speak here tonight it is clear to me that there are there's more than one nonprofit in the city that needs funding.

And I also think it's clear that the Bellnet Mill is an important part to the city and that it only makes sense based on the the population that has been outside that they have lost a significant amount of business that they could have funded it themselves.

I also think that listening to them in their presentation it doesn't seem to me like they are only looking for money from the city.

They have looked for various other sources for what is going on there and I don't envy your decision to decide whether to give them the money or not but there are lots of nonprofits that need money and the city does own some onus for the situation that they're in now because of what lost income they've had so I don't know what the right decision is but I don't envy you.

Thank you.

anybody else seeing none I will close the public hearing at 741 p.m next up we have a agenda item 13b another public hearing ordinance 2026 221 dash 36 amending article three parking standing and stopping chapter 221-36 winter parking notice of this public hearing was made available in the February 26 2026 issue of the Laconia Daily Sun and posted at Laconia City Hall Laconia Community Center Laconia Public Library and the offices of the SAU I will open the public hearing at 741 p.m.

Would anybody like to speak to this Higgins thank you.

So um as I mentioned at the last meeting I was I was the one that brought up the um winter parking ban and um it's my understanding that the new proposal is to move it for 15 days further in in the fall and 15 days further back in the spring so that instead of a six month ban it's a five month ban month month banned which is a start I do believe but I still think where are the people that have no place to park gonna park during the five months when it's a total parking ban so I applaud that you for looking at it and it's a starting point but I mean even if you did at the beginning if you said this parking ban starts at the first snowfall instead of a date of November 15th it would at least give I mean we didn't have our first snowfall until December 2nd this year.

Like why do we need to have no parking when there's grass on the ground and there are several people in the city who have plenty of parking but there are people that don't and so for the 10 to 20 percent of the city that have that does not have any parking in the winter I want you to seriously consider permanent permit parting parking those people so that they can have a place to park and they're not getting a ticket from the from the from the the police I I get tickets every year when there's grass on the ground it just doesn't make any sense and it doesn't seem like when zoning is reducing the amount of parking that the city has that we are limiting parking to you can't park on the street for five months out of the year.

Thank you.

Thank you anybody else on this matter seeing none I will close the public hearing at 743 p.m.

Next up on our agenda we have a presentation from the Pillsbury group regarding the Laconia State School.

Hi Kevin Thank you Mr.

My name is Kevin Smith, and I'm a project manager on the Laconia Village Development.

With me this evening in the audience is attorney Ari Pollock, who you may know from other projects in the city.

And so he's joining us this evening as well.

Other members of the team are Michael Kettenback, who's the owner or soon to be owner of the development, and Jimmy D'Angelo, who's our internal engineer, as well as Justin Kiernan, who is also a project manager on the Laconia Village Development.

Just a quick agenda.

I'm going to be very brief this evening just to re uh review the process to date thus far, recap the project vision for all of you, and then summarize our planning board submission and open it up to any questions and answers.

Just going over the process to date, it seemed like a long time ago, but back in July of 24 is when we were awarded the second time the state put the project out to RFP.

We immediately began discussions and planning with the city planning staff.

Fast forwarding to December of 24 is when we had our first conceptual discussion with the planning board.

And then we went through a number of TRC reviews and design reviews with staff all the way culminating to this past fall in November, when we were given uh reached our first milestone and given approval on our master plan and sign off on our master plan by the city staff.

We still have to close uh on the land itself, which I'll get to that in a little bit.

And we don't anticipate construction beginning actual shovels in the ground until probably the earliest would be at the end of 27, but more likely in 2028.

Um recapping the project vision.

Again, there's really kind of three uh themes we were going for with the Laconia Village, one being a vibrant civic life that includes a myriad of uh diverse housing along with a mixed use of commercial uh and retail, um, hacking having an active recreational spirit to the development and also keeping a lot of the lush natural environment that's already in place there.

I think the total amount of acreage is 217 acres, and as you've probably seen from the project, we are planning to develop nowhere near uh that many acres as we want to include a lot of open space uh in this project.

And the conceptual in the next slide just kind of uh restates uh those three themes I went over.

We're really looking at having this planned in five phases.

Uh the first phase being a mixed-use gateway, which will include a mix of again commercial and and retail uses.

There's been talks of a grocery store, I'm sure you've heard uh and uh probably a mix of some housing in there as well.

Uh phase two will be probably more heavy on the housing component.

Uh phase three incorporating a civic campus, and then phases four and five, really concentrating on the neighborhood trails as well as uh recreational areas within the uh within the development.

And again, uh this is a schematic that shows uh our vision for what the village will look like at full build out.

Uh, this will not happen overnight uh and will take many years to develop, uh, but that's our plan for this.

And as you see on on both sides of the project, there's a still a significant amount of uh open space in areas that we will not be uh touching.

Um back to the planning board submission process.

Again, this just kind of uh uh goes through the different steps we took to finally get uh final approval on the master plan.

Uh all of the supporting documents and exhibits are on file uh with the planning department.

So if anyone from this board or the public would like to review those, um they're all fairly accessible.

And so where do we go from here?

Still some outstanding items.

Uh one is uh having completion of the master plan traffic review by the New Hampshire Department of Transportation, uh, much like the city, they need to uh bless our traffic plan uh before we have kind of the state's approval of the master plan, and then the other issue is the completion of the sewer membership transfer from the state to the city, which we've been working with the city manager on uh and staff as well.

And so with approval uh of the master plan, um we're looking to advance the phase one of development, which will require DOT signing off on the traffic, the overall traffic plan, as well as having a resolution to that sewer infrastructure issue.

Just to restate here again as we've done at a number of the public hearings.

And we're looking forward to that, and we do anticipate closing with them on that date.

But right now, as we don't own the land, we're certainly not going to be moving any dirt around there.

Though it does not prohibit us from starting our phase one uh design uh which we uh plan to do in earnest.

And with that, uh happy to open up to any uh questions that anyone might have.

Great presentation, Council Susi.

I'd like a copy of what you just presented.

Sure.

And maybe the rest of the council would I would really like to see that.

Because I think I have an electronic back and send it to us, okay?

Because um I know everything through the planning department, the traffic study is a very, very big concern, I think everybody here, especially when you come to Elm Street and North Main Street and what mess are we going to create.

Right.

How we're gonna fix it.

Sure.

Yep.

So those are the things I know we get the state approval, but I think it's also very important, and I know you're going through it, the local community approval.

Absolutely.

At the same time, thank you.

Counselor Bogan.

Thank you, Mr.

Mayor.

I was just curious if you think it would be to all of our advantage if a story board type thing was provided to us so that we could put it in the lobby of City Hall down in our lobby.

So as all of our residents pass back and forth, they'll have an opportunity to see the direction that you're going and that the city is uh uh in favor of so far in or encouraging so that our future is shown?

Yeah, I would say uh counselor, if if you think that's a good idea, we think it's a good idea.

I I think it's an excellent idea because a lot of people we get a lot of emails, phone calls and such about what your guys' plan is, and we can kind of it's a phased in, you know, but we we don't have a diagram to actually show them.

So if they walk into city hall and they're able to see it, I think that's a great idea.

We'd be happy to provide such.

Thank you very much.

You're welcome.

Anyone else?

Up, Councilor Hildreth.

Do you mention the traffic study, and it's obviously not signed off with uh DOT at this point.

Do you have a preliminary uh result of your traffic study?

We do, we do, and again, those are on file with uh with the city staff with the planning department uh because they looked at all of that.

Um so all of all of those documents are accessible.

And again, when you're doing this master plan, you're looking at it from kind of a 30,000 foot level and looking at all we had a whole traffic scoping meeting with DOT and with the city to look at a myriad of intersections, um, how they could be improved in the future.

Uh, and so that provides you with your framework going forward, but as I said before, now as each site plan comes in, we're gonna relook at all of that again and to make sure that we're on the right path going forward with traffic mitigation.

Council Seuss.

And just one more question, sir.

Sure.

Okay, I know that in the original plans that we were given a couple of years ago or something else like this with way outline.

I think the um your firm presented to us that they were gonna total population increase when it comes to students.

It was gonna be around a hundred and fifty to or maybe no more than two hundred total students.

I don't remember.

And I know I was speaking to factories here in the audience, Ms.

Anderson, about how high, and I know I I did some little bit, I was thinking more like 500 plus, and what effect that would be upon our school system.

So I hope you take another look at that.

Sure, we'll take another look at that.

And we did as part of the process provide the fiscal impact statement, which did talk to the school district and the superintendent about what impact it could have.

You know, all of us in in New Hampshire and in most communities have been experiencing a decline in student population over the last 15 years.

And there's a number of factors going into that.

I live in Londonderry, and we've we're down over 1,500 students from what the uh max was 20 years ago.

Um, even though the the total population has continued to go up, you know, we've gone from 24 to 28,000, but the student population has seen a stark decline.

Um and even with multifamily housing, you're just not seeing it product um school children.

Uh so, but I'll make sure you know that the um group we worked with to come up with that fiscal impact study.

We're we're gonna continue to monitor that the whole way through this this build out.

Right.

I totally agree with you.

I mean numbers are all over the place, right?

I remember when I was going for my MBA, there was a book we had to read and be part of a class on a lie with statistics.

That's I just want to make sure everything anybody else of council Hoffman.

So we've been made aware over the last few meetings that uh it sounds like natural gas is gonna be maybe off the table for this development.

Um have you looked at possible solutions for that aside from propane?

Like solar, geothermal, I think we're gonna look at all potential options that are on the table, not just propane.

Um, but that is my understanding as well that um this area will not be able to be served by natural gas until I think what seven to ten years, Kirk.

Is that the number?

Yeah.

So I think we have to look at all options, all potential energy options.

Thanks.

Yeah.

Anyone else?

Uh I'm just gonna make a comment.

A few of the documents that he referenced were sent out pre-election.

So I have copies of those.

I'll get them to I'll refresh everybody with them, but that way the three of you are definitely have them, so we'll get those taken care of.

Thank you very much.

All right, thank you, Mayor.

Appreciate the time.

Thank you.

Thanks, Kevin.

All right.

Next up, we have the mayor's report.

Uh not a whole lot going on right this minute.

Um City Manager and I met with Senator Shaheen recently about getting some grants and uh some housing funds from the feds.

Uh and the most important thing right now is I'm in the final phases of putting together a homeless subcommittee.

Um anybody wants to volunteer, please reach out.

We just need a few more people, and uh, we'll be moving forward with that.

Next up, I will let the council comments come.

Anyone has a comment?

Seeing none.

Do we have any committee reports to discuss?

Seeing none.

Uh now we're up to citizens' requests to comment on current agenda items.

Does anybody want to comment on any of the agenda items tonight?

Can we please keep this uh under two minutes?

We're gonna try to keep this under two minutes.

Yeah.

All right, so I've been before you guys before on my reasons and my personal beliefs for allowing the short-term rentals in residential neighborhoods.

Um now I'd like to present to you some legal reasons why you should not change the ordinance that you have.

Um if you guys don't know, House Bill 1619 was introduced and has been tabled for 2026.

However, and I'm gonna quote this the bill of firms codifies and attempts to clarify property owners' rights and municipal limits on regulations.

Property owners shall have the right to use their property as they see fit, provided such use does not infringe upon the rights of others or violate clearly defined public safety standards set forth in New Hampshire law.

Property owners may set rental prices based on market demand free from government imposed rent controls.

Municipal zoning shall be limited to the minimum necessary to protect public health safety and welfare and regulations shall not unduly restrict property development or usage.

Property owners may develop the land for the residential commercial or mixed use purposes, subject to transparent and predictable municipal regulations.

Property owners may challenge government actions that infringe their property rights through judicial administration reviews as provided by law.

Beyond minimal public regulation, use restrictions may only be imposed by private covenants and homeowners associations established by voluntary agreement among property owners.

All warrant articles affecting property rights proposed at town and municipal meetings shall be reviewed by constitutional compliance by the courts.

All warrant articles affecting property rights proposed at town and municipal meetings shall be reviewed by constitutional compliance by the courts now.

If this passes and this council goes through with its intentions concerning changing the ordinance for short term rentals, it's almost assuredly that we'll be back before you concerning this.

Again, because of this new law that's coming.

Just a few Hawkeaster versus Town of Sunnepe, James Carter and Susan Carter versus Town of Freedom, Edward Zoni and Climber versus Town of Madison.

Just kind of skipping on.

And then the two biggest one is Conway versus Kudick, and he's also in Portsmouth.

For this purpose, the chapter of vacation rentals and short term rentals are residential uses of the property and do not include non-residential uses such as retail restaurant banquet spaces, events, and et cetera.

RSA 48A 2 provides that the powers granted under the section shall not be used to impose any additional ordinances, codes, bylaw, license certificates, or other restrictions on dwellings used as vacation rental or short-term rentals.

RSA 48A-8 colon 8 similarly states that the enforcement powers under the chapter shall not be used to impose additional restrictions on short-term dwellings.

Finally, the last item for this counselor to consider is the New Hampshire Constitution.

Okay, it has a doctrine of preemption.

Anyone ever hear of that?

All right.

So in contrast, state laws can preempt local laws when there is a conflict, often grounded in state constitution or statutes that delegate specific powers to the state legislature.

The state preemption clause in the New Hampshire Constitution is not explicitly mentioned.

However, the Constitution includes various sections that address state sovereignty and the authority of the state government.

For example, Article 2 of the Constitution discusses natural rights and state sovereignty, which may relate to the state's authority over certain matters, which would be this ordinance that you guys are trying to pass.

As stated before, we are having this discussion due to a handful of short-term rentals that have had numerous parties, loud gathering, trash parking, all of that.

With the understanding that short-term regulations can become legally complex, municipalities already have tools with existing ordinance, such as noise parking nuances, health, and trash informant, to address impacts without creating additional regulatory regulatory structures that may increase litigation exposure.

Finally, I would just like to state that members of this council represent the residents of this town.

I honestly don't believe that the majority of the residents of this town want to do away with short-term rentals.

So I asked this simple question to those on this council who are trying to eliminate the short-term rentals.

Are you really representing the majority of your constituents?

Okay.

You indicate that a person may always apply for a variance, but we know that the reason for this is variances aren't going to be given because you're trying to eliminate.

Thank you.

You know.

So a bit over two minutes.

So that's my thank you very much.

Anyone else?

Please keep it under two minutes.

Hi, I'm Carol Viney from 58 Edgewater Avewood 1.

No fly, no fireworks, no cookies.

Sorry.

Um, but I did want to come and I wanted to applaud you as the city council and also the planning board, perhaps even the zoning board, um, for the amount of time and effort that has gone into this issue.

It's a long time coming.

Um I was especially impressed with the planning board last week.

That they took the time to um ask questions of the planning director to ensure that those people in the city who have been relying on income for short-term rentals and how this change would impact them, and the planning board director, the planning director, you know, showed uh explained how the options that those people had that they could exercise to preserve that right.

Um so this is not the demise of short-term rentals in the city of Laconia.

And it's also not the sky is falling situation that some people uh make it out to be.

One of the things that was revealed at the planning board meeting was that we are talking about as far as the residential zones, we're talking about 20 percent of the property in Laconia.

That leaves 80% of our city open to short-term rentals by right or by exception, and that also is any income that they might uh you know, financial benefit that they might bring to the city, 80% of our city is available, and that 80% is much better suited than the neighborhoods that were never ever established to be homes to vacation rentals, short term, you know, revolving door hotels, um unsupervised.

Uh so I think you know what I'd like to just say is um tonight do the right thing.

Let's put this to bed, let's vote it, vote on the uh the pass the language changes as they are and preserve our neighborhoods, preserve the peace and safety.

We talked about safety a lot at the planning board.

How you know we don't know who's in our backyard.

Um families let kids walk to school, at least in my neighborhood.

Kids are walking to memorial middle school all the time.

But um, we need to make sure that they're safe.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Anyone else on the two minutes, please?

I'll keep it under two minutes.

I promise.

So I said it once, I'll say it again.

Um litigation's expensive.

I emailed almost every one of you guys with some numbers.

Um, the cases were being held.

And some of those cases are 200, 300,000 to the case to the town of the town of Sunapee and others.

Um why jeopardize taxpayer money?

You know, we're talking about 20,000 to a nonprofit like it's gold, but yet we're gonna throw 200, 300,000 away in litigation because we don't want to wait.

We don't want to do the right thing, we don't want to see what the state's gonna do.

Um I ask that you stop, think, make a clear choice to postpone this vote until the state's figured out what's going on, and someone said 20%.

Not for not, you guys were elected for 20%, right?

You weren't elected by 80%, right?

You're elected by 100%.

People went out and voted, those 20% matter, they do matter, right?

It's not oh well, it's everybody should have a say, and everybody should be able to be heard.

And when you take 20% off the table, you're just told 20% they don't matter, and that's a shame.

People matter, every one of us matter.

20% matters.

Thank you.

Anybody else word five?

Um, gonna just reiterate real quick what I talked to the uh planning board about the thing that makes Laconia special at any small town city, or that you have different zoning districts.

If someone wants to move to the city and they want to be near the night life, they can.

They can go into the commercial resort areas, whatever.

If they want a quiet life, they tend to look towards the residential.

Um I think you lose some of that variety if you start allowing things that were meant for certain zones into all zones.

Then why don't we just make the whole town commercial resort?

Anything goes.

And it's easy to point out, yeah, we have laws and stuff, noise ordinances, but then basically what we're doing is saying let's go wild west and leave everything up to the police department, which we know there are better things they could be doing.

Um talking about the 20 percent, 80 percent.

I know the numbers get split up, you can spin it whatever way you want, but there are certain wards that are basically single family residential.

And those people are the ones that are counting on you guys to make the right decision.

I moved into single family residential because I didn't want to live at the weirs.

I didn't want to have to deal with all that stuff, and better yet, I moved on a dead end street, so I don't have traffic going by all the time.

You know, people say government shouldn't tell you what you should do with your property.

Well, then can I have cows and pigs and chickens up there by the hospital?

No, zoning tells you that you can't do that, and if we're gonna start throwing zoning out the window, then it's gonna be a free-for-all.

And uh, as far as litigations and stuff, it happens.

There are too many lawyers in the world, so people are always gonna be suing someone, bringing someone up to court.

So don't don't be strong armed by that stuff.

Roll with the punches and uh just for the people that are in the single family residential, keep them in mind.

There are other places they can go to, and like it was pointed out to the uh people at the planning board.

If they're already doing that stuff, they're gonna be grandfathered.

And they actually pointed out that if you're thinking of doing it, get an application in quick.

Um, so the door was open, there were possibilities, but please just keep the landowners because if you start taking them off, they're gonna move.

And then you're gonna have commercial resort everywhere, except for maybe at the new state school property development.

That's all I had to say.

Thank you.

Anyone else?

Seeing none, we will move on to city manager's report.

Thank you, Mr.

Mayor.

A couple of points just to make before move on.

Um reminder, and if we can make it public, we haven't uh noticed it yet, but we will March 18th, 2 p.m.

is a reminder is the goal setting uh here at City Hall for your city council.

Uh and all of our department heads will be there as well.

Um then we will get that to public, you know, to uh to a meeting so you can kind of hear it all and anybody can comment on it if they'd like to.

Um, but it is that is open to the public.

Uh social districts.

I haven't done any work on that in a little while.

It was supposed to go back to uh public safety, but it's I've got some opportunity to work on that now, so we'll get a uh follow-up meeting of the public safety committee and get that taken care of as well.

Thursday night, uh this Thursday coming up here uh 6 p.m.

Freedom Energy will be here in City Hall Chambers to do a presentation on on their community power.

So if it's open to the public, if anybody's interested in coming in to hear that.

Um, and then just a couple of updates for you guys, old Prescott Hill Road.

Um we should hear a response back from our traffic engineers that we are working with by the third week of April.

Uh sure home in Linwood.

We have been working on some of the stuff with that.

One of the things was uh uh was a very poorly placed street uh stop sign that was out there.

Uh hopefully that just a simple fix like that is gonna help a little bit.

Um, so that was taken care of, and they are still looking at the uh speed control devices.

I'm not gonna go through section by section tonight, so we can keep tonight moving along.

But uh in your packet and in the agenda is the financial and operational trends for the month.

Um, you'll see the current year for the building report.

That is again.

I'm gonna have the final numbers on that by the end of the month.

That'll come down a little bit, but uh that is there.

Um, the mobile integrated healthcare community paramedic, they were supposed to be here tonight with the fire department to do a presentation without knowing we had a presentation stuff, we moved it to the next meeting, so we'll be out of order a little bit next month with my report, but uh they'll be here next month.

No real change in general assistance data, police and fire activities.

Um we're working with the department heads who are if they have a department that is uh either nearing or over their two date year to date uh overtime.

We are working with those department heads.

Nothing really standing out on any of the other lines.

Uh the reserve fund balances.

I will just point out the winter maintenance reserve account.

I'm gonna hold on to that one for a second.

Um again, no other major changes.

Uh except for on the last page.

Um, this winter storm cycle that we had this year, um overspent us.

Um, as expected, it didn't help that I think every storm came in on a uh a nighttime and a weekend, uh, which obviously adds to a lot of overtime.

Um the way we handle with this here, um, and we do it every year, is if there's any overage, we look to see if there's opportunity to just take it out of the general operating fund for for DPW budget.

Sometimes there is, you have a little extra money on a certain line, you can move it around and take care of that so we don't have to go into the reserve account.

Don't know if we're gonna be able to do that this year.

We won't know that answer until um at best uh towards May or June, uh towards the end of the fiscal year.

If it does, and we do need to go into that um the winter storm maintenance reserve account, it would require both your approval and the trustees, and uh we would work through that process.

Um I'm hoping today was a sign of good things with the weather, but I can't it's New England, I know.

So, but uh you we are we are tracking that.

We do know we're over and we are evaluating how we're gonna handle that.

Uh and that's all I have unless you want to go specific on something.

Counselor Bogett.

Uh going back to social district.

Are we still on the glod path to be ready for summertime?

Yes, yeah, we will we will get this back to public safety and then to you guys, so we're ready for summertime.

Absolutely.

Thank you.

Yep.

Yeah, oh yeah, no, we will lose a lot of revenue if it's not ready.

All right.

Next, we're on to unfinished business.

Agenda item 22A.

Resolution 2026-03.

Acceptance of unanticipated health insurance rebate in the amount of 86,000, $316, and authorization to give the Belknap Mill $20,000 of set of funds for building repairs and to deposit the balance of $66,000.

And to read by title only.

Councillor Hildreth.

Seconded by Councillor Hoffman.

Any discussion?

Seeing none.

All in favor.

6 0.

I move a second reading of resolution 2026-03.

Acceptance of unanticipated health insurance rebate in the amount of $86,316.

And authorizing to give the Belknap Mill $20,000 of said funds for building repairs and to deposit the balance of $66,316 into the health insurance stabilization reserve fund.

Councillor Hildress, seconded by Councillor Hoffman.

Any discussion.

Yeah, I I would uh Ms.

Mayor, may I?

Of course.

Um this is taxpayer money.

Um the mill is a beautiful, beautiful building.

And um it's a non-profit, and the city should not be funding the building.

Um as I indicated, we were charged for using the building.

Um I just don't see that I certainly can't, as a councilman representing taxpayers in my ward to give away their money to a nonprofit.

So I think we should discuss what you're discussing on the next motion.

This is a motion to move the second reading.

Okay.

Yep.

All in favor.

60.

Now I move to approve resolution 2026 03.

Acceptance of unanticipated health insurance rebate in the amount of $86,316, and authorization to give Belknap Mill $20,000 of said funds for building repairs and to deposit the balance of $66,316 into the health insurance stabilization reserve fund.

Councilor Seussy, seconded by Councillor Hildriff.

Now we could have discussion on this.

So as I indicated, um the city's gonna need these funds.

We should not be um donating $20,000 of taxpayer money to a nonprofit.

Um if there was a public vote on that, that might be a different scenario.

Like I said, and I think everyone agrees.

The mill building is beautiful.

Uh it's a it's definitely good for the city, but that building doesn't pay taxes.

I know they have a couple of professional offices in there.

Um yeah, perhaps when this when the downtown area was running amok um with unhoused people, it wasn't attractive, but I think the city has done a fabulous job cleaning that up, and I think with our the lighting that we will hopefully see soon in that area, it will only make it more attractive.

And I think we need to hold these folks responsible for sustaining themselves, and I just don't see fit as a counselor to spend the people I represent their tax money on a haphazard situation like this.

This isn't extra money, this is taxpayer money.

And we need a lot of work on our city roads, and we certainly don't have the budget for it.

I don't believe we should be donating to a nonprofit.

So I will not be supporting it.

So I will say I'm all in favor of the Bellknap mill.

I don't know if these funds are the appropriate funds to be given to them, considering where it comes from, where it's supposed to be going to.

I think the intentions are great to give them the $20,000, but I think we should look at that at budget time.

Not right now, but that's just my personal opinion on it.

I fully support the mill.

Any help they need, I'm more than willing to give them, but I don't think this is a proper funding method to give it to them.

Councillor Susi.

And there's line items in our budget for them.

Um I don't sure if there's a specific timeline from the mill.

I didn't hear anything about that.

And if they wanted to ask that we ask the city manager to put $20,000 into the budget and go through the budget process.

I know this is probably a an emergency, or I'm not sure, but I didn't hear a time.

I didn't hear a timeline.

That's the only only question I have.

Can you give us a I I hate to call you up real quick, but what what is the urgency of this of this?

Is this a needed now or is this down the road?

And real quick, please.

So there's a time limit to the L chip grant money from the state that we have to expend the money in.

There's a time limit that's unknown for the structural stability and the possible consequences of the pillars failing.

No engineer would tell you exactly when that will be.

The first statement you made is that there's a timeline tied to the state grant.

That if we don't expend that grant money in a certain time, what is the timeline?

That I do not know off the top of my head.

Because we're going to be entering on budget season here very shortly.

And by the I don't know, first part of June, end of May, we'll know whether or not we can expend this or anything else like that.

I'm just trying to put a timeline to this.

If we have time to hold off till June, July when the next fiscal year comes up, or are we under the gun?

Part of the consideration is we're requiring materials that may not be domestically sourced.

Long-term design challenges that need to be overcome by a design engineer.

So the sooner we start the design process, the faster we get the remediation in place.

But you have grant money already coming in that you have to spend that could be used for that.

But I still haven't heard any timeline.

I'm not disagreeing.

I think the mill is fantastic, okay.

I mean, I know Lois is in the audience, and I think the mill is fantastic, and I can remember those days when the bulldozer showed up.

Okay.

And I think it's great.

But I'm just running at the timing.

The optics don't look very good because I'm not hearing any dates that you need the money by.

The state's money is going to dry up.

You know, I I I'll give you money out of my pocket to help.

I'll make a donation.

But then again, I also wish there was something like that.

Secondly, it bothered me when Councillor Conan says that we paid $550, and you had no idea that, and you made a statement that we did it for free.

I would say was it a donation on the part of the city, or was it payment for an invoice that our organization sent the city and the city paid us?

Those are two different conditions.

I would say it was an invoice.

Okay.

Okay.

Thank you.

Councillor Hildriff.

Um excuse me, I just want to point out with all due respect, whenever we use monies like this for a nonprofit, it's coming out of taxpayers' dollars.

This is not a unique situation.

Um I believe that the situation is dire over there.

I also believe that if we don't act on this and they don't get the the structural the structure fixed, this is just gonna cost more and more as time goes on.

Nothing stays the same, especially in today's world.

And I think that uh the fact that I mean the lights were mentioned, the new lights that are gonna light up the park, um, are gonna be on their electric bill.

So this is a uh a nonprofit, but they've got expenditures that take care of city property that I don't think you'll see in any other nonprofit.

I think that uh again, wherever the money comes from, or what whatever you call it, it's coming from taxpayer money.

So I highly recommend that we move forward with this, and uh I hope that uh the council can uh can concur.

I'm just gonna reiterate, I really feel this is a budget season item, not a take Robin Key to the PayPal item, but that's what my personal view.

Councillor Hoffman.

I guess I just want to clarify my understanding of this.

I mean the money is not coming out of any health insurance fund, the money is coming from a rebate of something we overpaid.

We're diverting 66,000 and change of that into the health insurance stabilization fund, and we're talking about taking 20,000 of it to get to the Bell Nat Mill.

So it's I think people aren't exactly understanding how that where the money is flowing from and to, but I just wanted to clarify that we're not taking this out of any program or anything.

We could this money could go directly into the general fund if we so desired.

Correct.

Right.

Um so instead of waiting until budget season, we could take money that might as well be in the general fund and spend it for this.

Um it's just expedient, I think.

I think at the end of the day, it's not it's not really a shell game of where the money is coming from.

I think Council Hildreth was correct when he pointed out it's all taxpayer money, and I think not all nonprofits are created equal.

I think we talk about the Bell Knight Mill, it's a cornerstone of the community, it's it's right there on city property.

It's it's in our backyard, we hold city events there.

Um I'm all for this, and I think it should go forward.

Thanks.

Council Susie.

Council Hoffman, I totally agree with you.

I just wish that the representatives would come with some more timeline factual information.

Um I'm getting I'm hearing a lot of words, word salad, whatever you want to say, but no actuality.

I mean, I agree with doing it.

I just wish we came up better.

I just yeah, I don't I don't see a problem.

I mean, personally, waiting to June or July.

It doesn't seem like it's an urgent they need the cash now, they don't even have all the cash now.

They still have to come up with another what, $18,000 or more that they're gonna have to fundraise for, and that takes time too.

It's not gonna happen overnight.

So there's to me, this is something we can address in the budget and not just rush and and handle almost you know about 20 something percent of our refund over to a nonprofit.

That's just how I feel counselor bogat.

I've sat here to listen to both sides of the coin here, and the money was already spent.

So the city manager felt that it was the right place to put this money was in the uh uh health insurance stabilization reserve fund.

And no one questioned that.

He could have just as well said, I want to send it over to the uh DPW, and everybody would have sat here and said, Yeah, Sam makes good.

Uh we sit here on many occasions appropriating monies for different projects uh that weren't budgeted, but we find ways to make that happen because circumstances come to us that are unforeseen at the budget time.

The uh the new lights that were mentioned and stuff, they should be owned city electricity at that time, and I think that's probably one of the problems that we're uh having getting this quote done is to ensure that we have the appropriate amount of electricity to do this.

Now one of the uh the uh funding mechanisms the mill had was rotary park, and for two years, rotary park was taken off of the market, right?

And that's not including the COVID situation where they had another two years of shutdown.

So for four years they were not able to do what they needed to do in order to have income coming in.

Some of it was caused by federal issues, and some of it was caused by city issues.

So it's not like we clicked our fingers to do this.

So all of that revenue they lost for those two years is kind of on us because we as a city failed to clean up the park.

So I will say to that, so what about the homeowners that lost use of their property due to the same situation for how many years should the city be paying them for their loss of use of their own property?

No.

Okay.

And I agree with that.

And I understand that.

And that's why I've sat here quietly trying to disseminate which way to go.

The I think that this is a cornerstone of our city.

It's one of our it sits on city property.

So uh the city does have a stake in that building.

If we choose as a city to not help them to fix something sitting on our property, we're now what are we gonna do with all the excess cars?

We have the same problem downtown where theoretically we let people park in the street overnight and stuff.

They can't, so where are they gonna park?

The big issue is where are people supposed to park if the requirements only one parking space, and they have two cars and they park in the street.

So where are they gonna park?

And that's a question I've been playing with since the last meeting in my head, and I don't have an answer.

I don't think any of us do.

You know, uh and I understand shortening the time, but I'm just curious.

I'm fine for them.

But I I mean I voted against that.

So I'm one of these, I'm one of these people that if it's no, it's no, and that's the end of it.

Period.

Um I have sympathy for these poor guys.

I can't imagine trying to duck and dodge cars all over the street.

I can't imagine the police officers have to get out of their cars, shining flashlights on every car to see if they've got a permit.

And the thing that bothers me the most is monkey see monkey do.

Okay, Mr.

Jones has a permit.

Well, Mr.

Smith says hell with a permit.

I don't need a permit, I'm gonna park there too.

So, I mean, okay, so now you're saying, oh, well, we're gonna tow the cars.

Okay.

Now we got to have a place to tow them.

We gotta have a company to tow them, we've got to have a a police officer or some mechanism to collect the fines and the whole way.

No.

My answer is no parking on the streets from the dates, period.

No counselor Hoffman.

Yeah, I think between this and I previously mentioned that the we have some parking issues downtown where it's exactly not, it's not exactly convenient for the residents, and I mean that occurs 12 months out of the year.

Um, I think we need to look at parking in the city, I think a little more holistically.

And I'm not really sure how to do that.

I don't think it's specifically part of the master planning process.

I don't know if it needs to go to a committee.

I don't know if one of the city departments needs to look at it, but I think we need to look at all of the parking in the city.

We rolled out this permit program for one portion of the city.

Is it working?

Should we expand it?

Is it not working?

Should we get rid of it?

Uh I think we need to look at all of these things, not just in regards to this.

I think shortening this is a good start, but I I agree that it needs it needs more work.

Yep.

Don't kill what don't kill it.

No.

Counselor Hilger, if you had something.

I I'm just I was just gonna say this is this is a good start, and all those points are very valid, and I feel for anyone that has to juggle their cars or find somewhere else to put them for five months.

Um and that needs to be looked at.

But I think for this is a good step in the right direction.

I think we should pass this.

I would just make a recommendation that if you if you think this is gonna get reopened up again, you're not sure if this is enough, if it's too much, whatever.

I I instead of passing or or not passing, I'd I just remand it back to uh committee motion to table.

Do I have a second?

All right, counselor haynes.

It's a tabling motion, so there's no discussion.

So all in favor six zero.

It is set on the table.

Thank you.

We'll we'll call it uh it it this motion's tabled.

Um so I'd be looking for a separate motion that that you'd like to send parking sort of globally back to um probably public works to start with.

Uh no, well, we I mean, I guess that'd be up to you.

Public works or government operation ordinance is really 5050.

Well, we would have to remove it to the table and then make a separate motion, wouldn't we?

No, no, we don't have to no it's it governments.

He's correct now.

It's in government ops.

No, isn't that where it came from?

No, it came from public works public works, yeah.

Council Hans, do we think we should send it back to public works?

Motion second Mr.

Mayor, I'd like to make a motion that we uh move this back to uh uh public works for review.

Do I have a second?

Council Susi with the second any discussion on this seeing none, all in favor.

It's going back to public works.

All right.

Oh, yep, councilor bogan.

Mr.

City Manager, yes, will we do hear this?

Could we have someone from the planning department?

And DPW yeah, and I'll have police there as well.

And police so that we can make sure we uh would it be the fire department I think if the police can you know handle the I've just informed about maneuvering the trucks, they'll I think the whatever the police do, we'll we'll put that you know in there unlike the officer well on a committee because I'm gonna ask the committee to get together and get an outline of all the city public parking places.

Okay, let's go agenda item 22 C Ordnance 2026-235-410, amending chapter 235, zoning relative to Article 2, definitions and word usage, section 235-13, definitions article seven, supplementary provisions, section two three five-41, residential accessory uses, article not article 11, zoning board of adjustment, section 235-70, powers and duties of zoning board of adjustment and attachment two, table one, tables of permitted use.

I move the wave a reading of ordinance two zero two six-235-4170 in its entirety and to read by title only.

Councilor Hoffman.

Do I have a second?

Counselor Hiltruth second.

All in favor.

I move to conduct a second reading of ordinance two zero two six dash two three five-41 70, amending chapter 235, zoning article two, definitions and word usage, section 235-13, definitions, Article 7, supplementary provisions, Section 235-41, residential accessory uses, Article 11, zoning board of adjustment, section 235-70, powers and duties of zoning board of adjustment and attachment to table one, table of permitted uses as presented.

Say that 12 times fast.

Yeah, right.

Councilor Hildress, seconded by Councillor Hoffman.

All in favor.

60.

Oh, here we go again.

I move to approve ordinance 2026-235-41.

70.

Amending chapter 235, zoning.

Article 2.

Definitions of word usage, section 235-13.

Definitions, Article 7, supplementary provisions.

Section 235-41.

Residential accessory uses.

Article 11, Zoning Board of Adjustments, Section 235-70.

Powers and duties of zoning board of adjustment and attachment to Table 1, Table of Permitted Uses as presented.

I have a question also left the Well, we have a I'll I'll move the motion.

Okay.

Councilor Susi, seconded by Councillor Hilgeth.

Now we have discussion.

One question for the city manager.

And this is just for the record only.

Okay.

This has all been reviewed by legal.

Yes.

And legal actually worked us, and you're welcome to ask the planning director this conversation with legal because he handled it, but yes, they the reason it was delayed getting here was because legal was working on some of those changes that were coming out either through the state or through some of the court cases.

Thank you.

Any discussion?

Councillor Haynes.

Thank you.

This is for the city manager.

Correct.

Our attorneys are aware of these cases that have been cited and Yeah, I look.

I didn't work with the attorneys directly on this.

One of the questions I asked him was about the court cases and what's going on with with the RSA's, and he was you know, he's a very good thing.

Well, you know that he got their confirmation.

You and I had a private conversation.

Yeah, he got their confirmation that's a very good thing.

That's the important thing that concerns me.

Yeah, uh, is that this is airtight and it's that's it.

Oh, it's not airtight.

Yeah, I mean anything's gonna, you know, this is always the opportunity.

There's always a potential for a loss, no matter what you do, lawyers.

Um we try to avoid them as much as we can, obviously, you know, for the reasons brought up.

Uh yes, good evening.

So we did send this to Mitchell Group for them to review.

Um, Laura Spector Morgan, uh, the attorney over there, she did write uh about 95 percent of it.

Uh and that was in uh in reference to uh the court cases that had come down and um and all the changes in law that had happened, including the occupancy.

Uh so it's been very thoroughly reviewed uh with legal to make sure that we're in compliance with state law.

Council Bogett.

And there was no red flags raised by the city attorney with this.

Uh she did not address any red flags with me.

No.

Thank you.

So I do have some concerns about possible pending litigation in regarding this.

Uh I also have some concerns.

Residential zone RS1 is right in my backyard almost.

I have neighbors down the block that rely heavily rely on short-term rentals in order to pay their property taxes.

One elderly woman might have to actually sell a home if this goes through.

It's unacceptable.

We cannot be doing an entire zone.

It should be a case-by-case basis.

We we can't tell private property owners what they can and can't do on their own private property.

This is government overreach in its entirety, and it it's it's it's just not right, and it's gonna cause issues, and I I know for a fact it's gonna cause issues.

Thank you.

Council Seussy, Mr.

Mayor, um, I don't disagree with you, but that's why we have a ZBA.

Because if there's a concern and somebody wants a variance to this, they just go to the ZBA and make their case.

You make it sound like it's so easy to get a variance, it's not so easy, but there is a process.

Counselor Hilljith, uh, no problem.

These I'm gonna I'm gonna interrupt you.

I'm gonna look back to Rob real quick.

Uh these will not be available through variances, correct?

I want to make sure I'm right.

Uh everything is available through a variance uh a variance as the New Hampshire constitutional right to for the due process.

Uh that is our our our constitutional right to do that as residents uh to request a variance from the zoning board.

There is another option as well.

Um, should uh a resident uh apply for a variance, uh they can also appeal to the housing board of appeals.

So there are multiple options.

The state has granted the several options for relief to residents.

Thank you.

I just want to make sure we determine that.

I just feel like we're we're opening Pandora's box and legal litigation will be on its way, is my understanding.

Go ahead, Councilor Hilljith.

Um yes, that those those options are available to anyone.

And um, I I want to point out that um this was sent back to planning as is and passed four to one by this council.

And at planning, they send it back all but unanimous, one vote in dissent.

And I think that um this is something that's been we spent an awful lot of time on.

I think the council and the planning board have made clear their feelings on it.

And um, and a lot of my constituents and a lot of other constituents have made those feelings very strong too.

So I firmly believe that we should move forward with this.

So what I find interesting is I have had way more constituents reach out to me against this.

I've barely had anybody reach out to me personally in favor of this.

I will say it's probably a hundred to one as far as people against this to people in favor of this.

Council Bogan.

As I can appreciate that, I've had people who live in the RS district get a hold of me, and they are elated, they are extremely happy that the city council is looking at moving in this direction.

The RS section uh district was not set up for commercial business.

And short-term rental, you pay a tax, and the tax indicates that you're a business.

So if you're a business, then you should, we're not eliminating it.

Everybody seems to think we're eliminating it.

What we're doing, and rightfully so, is asking that the harder criteria for putting a business in a residential area is followed like anybody else.

If if you wanted to open up another type of business in an RS district, you would have to go get a variance.

If you wanted to open up a laundromat, you would have to go get a variance because it's those businesses are not allowed.

So if you allow one business to be able to build in there, then you start to open it up and say, Well, why can't I not open my business up in a residential area?

So therefore, asking for a variance, and yes, it's harder.

So where is it?

And it's meant to be harder.

We have warming shelters, we have sober housing in RS zones.

Is that considered a business?

They are operated by the uh uh nonprofits.

And they don't pay property tax.

And well, I don't know about that.

They don't pay property tax.

Uh I don't necessarily agree with those kinds of things in residential areas, but I don't always get my vote.

Because I had a none of us do, but I I had a constituent reach out to me about a warming shelter on their block.

And you know, we're worried about short-term rentals, but that there are uh where do we draw the line?

We're gonna say it's okay for one business and not another.

You're calling it a business, I don't feel it's a business.

It's somebody trying to be successful once.

If someone doesn't live in it and it turns into uh just for renting short term, then that's a business.

So if you look at the city, the the makeup of the city, a lot of people say, oh, it is all uh uh tourists, and yes, we have a lot of tourists, but we have districts set up for tourists, we have uh for the recreational areas and stuff, but we also have a lot of year-round business that are manufacturing, and we're trying to encourage more manufacturing to come so that we can have more achievable wages.

If we don't have the homes to put people in, then they're not gonna come because business isn't gonna come here.

Now, the second thing is, and including myself, I like to go home and not have an unknown neighbor next to me.

People say, oh, it's all this, that, and the other.

I don't care.