Hi, good evening everyone.

My name is Miguel Sanchez.

I'm calling the special committee of ways and means to order is 541.

Thank you for your patience, a little bit of technology uh challenges.

I think that is needed to be.

Any of us at this point?

Uh Madam Clerk, can we take roll call, please?

Chair Miguel Sanchez.

President.

Vice Chairman James Galen.

Council Jill Davidson.

Present.

Councilwoman Audia Gray is that Councilwoman Shelley Peterson, present.

Well president, one absent the other quantum.

Thank you, Madam Clerk.

I also want to recognize our colleague Councilman Oscar Vargas has joined us.

Thank you for your participation in the budget process.

We've been here for quite a few meetings.

We appreciate your service.

Also want to recognize our policy staff and our project management slash budget.

So Kyle Vergano and his amazing assistant today.

Of course, their home administration.

Lawrence Mancini, Chief Financial Officer.

Sarah Savery, I'm sorry.

Crystal Limber, Deputy Fine Instructor and Budge Office.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Who we're gonna start off with today, Crystal.

Uh completely okay with your chairman.

We'd like to start with the Bureau of Licenses.

Um before sorry, before we say uh motion to leave the reading of items one through five.

Uh motion made by councilwoman Peterson, second by Vice Chair Taylor.

All those in favor, aye.

Any nays, any extensions, ayes have it.

Thank you.

Uh you said license.

Um you have a packet.

I do have a packet, but we'll just do that.

This time I'll entertain a motion to enter uh this packet as exhibit 31 into the record.

So motion made by Vice Chair Taylor.

Second as well.

Second by councilwoman Davidson, all those in favor, aye.

Any nays, any abstentions, ayes, have it.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Uh the budget of the TL for this department can be found on page 214 on your budget.

Thank you.

I don't mark them, so we'll just get right to it.

Uh I'm joined today with our license administrator for the GC.

Um, and we start talking about the budget.

You guys are ready.

Uh the licensing department generates a significant amount of revenue in fiscal year 2027 in total departmental revenues, which have been itemized on the surplus on this slide, are budgeted at 1,828,000.

This represents a 45,000 increase over the fiscal year 2286 budget and has been supported by this local trend.

One thing that we'll need to note in adjust your final budget is that the IDPE municipal ID fees are actually the revenue of the bio statistics department.

So when I had divested these departments last year, I did not realize that bio statistics was generating that revenue.

Um so for final budget, we'll be moving that revenue allocation out of this budgeted into the bio statistics budget.

Um both departments are being heard tonight, so um we'll go through their budget in a few moments.

Uh total proposed expenditures in this department are 1 million 8,212.

This represents a 20,335 increase of the fiscal year 2026 budget of 987,877, or just over 2%.

Uh there are no proposed changes to FTE council salaries in this department.

Uh in 2026, we budgeted 493,751 dollars.

In 2027, we're making adjustments for cost of living increases for $14,818 and that increases for $2,165.

Bringing total salary so fiscal year 2027 to $510,749.

There is an org chart included in this packet.

We'd like to look through how the organizational hair is structured.

This budget has been broken in to fix some discretionary craft.

Advertising and marketing is our largest line item.

A large portion of this does get reimbursed by applicants.

So if you look in the revenue, you will actually see an advertising feed revenue that offsets the cost of these advertisements.

Printing, professional development, and legal expenses have all been level funded and are supported by historical trends.

When we move on to the supply line items, the bulk of their supplies are considered discretionary.

Thank you.

Of course, that's up the financial portion.

If there are no questions, I can turn it over to the license administrator.

Thank you.

I don't think there's any questions from the participation.

Hi like this administrator, how are you?

How are you?

Members of the committee, thank you for having me today.

So yeah, I mean, I can give a brief overview of the department.

You can do whatever you want.

So obviously, as some of you know, we moved uh physical locations from City Hall, as you probably heard from uh my colleagues in economic development.

Uh we moved on March 23rd.

We got a closing day of March 20th, so that we can physically move the office to our new location.

Um ever since then it's been going well.

Some of the things we had a ripping cutting as well not too long ago.

And some of the things that we plan to do that are forecasted is programming, workshops, info sessions uh for the communities, different communities, doesn't matter which part of the city.

We plan to do that and host those events in our new center.

We have more than enough space.

We have hotel spaces too that are based in basically basic cubicles.

Um, and um we plan to bring in local community groups in there and um to you know be able to share the space and utilize the space um and network and things like that.

Um for for licensing, um you know, last year we received the process over 3,000 applications.

Um, and then this year we're probably gonna see more because even though some businesses closed, there's still new businesses that open.

Um we just never know what those trends are until people come into the door and we understand what they're there for and what their goals are.

Um and um other than that.

Um the office obviously consists of two licensing clerks, uh, two licensing inspectors, one is in the process of being filled, so we'll have a third one.

It was filled, but things happen.

Um, so um that's why that person is taking again.

Um and uh two of those second years will be trained and sent to Rogers University to uh take the noise um training to be able to use the board readers.

There's a class that's running and one signed up for uh next month in June.

Um, and then the other ones that we finish the onboarding process, we'll send them to if we can make it to June, we'll send them.

Otherwise, the class the next class is September.

Um, but the goal is to send them sooner.

Um other than that, uh we have prepared for fan zone.

We created new applications for that.

Um, we're prepared and ready for the influx of visitors that are coming into the city.

Um we I created uh two new applications, one for the extended uh service hours uh request, which is a pending legislation that's waiting to be signed for at the state level right now.

Um, and then once that gets moving, then we'll start fielding um and reviewing applications for those that are interested in taking advantage of that um extended hour service.

Um other than that, if anybody has any questions, more than happy guys answer them.

Uh thank you, sir.

We would appreciate the work that you and your staff does.

Like you mentioned stuff we have very busy time, and we definitely appreciate all the work that is being put in to make not only these tourists uh experiences of the best they can be, but more importantly, the day-to-day operations, uh interacting and services and all of our small business owners.

We definitely appreciate you.

Uh I'm sure there's committee questions.

I think everyone's trying to tie the notes together, making sure question comes out the way it's meant to be.

Uh counselor Peterson.

I don't know if it's gonna do that, but I'll try.

How are you, Director?

Nice to see you.

Um quick question.

I know that we have a first and a second shift um inspector.

Yes.

What happens when you get a call about a business after a second shift, like at 2 a.m., 3 a.m.?

Great question.

So that is somewhere where we have to rely on actual score and police to take those matters into their hands and report back their findings.

Um it's one of the things that I hadn't mentioned before we posted the position, was to kind of see if we wanted to do some negotiations with the union on changing the times and if there was any appetite for that.

The job description does actually uh they say must be able to work in alternate schedule.

I just have to the conversation actually came out today as a matter of fact, where I want to confirm with the union and DPC to see if that's something if if it has to be between 8:30 and 11, or if there's written rooms, maybe have them come in for a 12 on a day to be able to cover that in case police are tied up, or let's say they're not working or whatever the case may be.

So that's actually one thing that I'm looking into to see if it's a possibility and not a breach of the CPA.

And can you tell me a little bit just for just for knowledge when the inspector goes out, if there's a call or what is it that they're looking for?

What is it?

How are they kind of conducting their form of business?

So the inspectors um on both first shift and second shift.

Um, the second shift more tailored towards like um, you know, they do check for non-compliances, but some of the other things are um you know surveillance if we receive a complaint and it's within the time um to to go out there and investigate and and assess the situation.

If we receive a complaint that's not the top of our purview or that's on private property, we'll still send the inspector and whatever they can see and capture from the street, we can collect that information and then forward it to whatever respective department it is.

Because we do collaborate across multiple different departments from fire to police to DPW, um the collectors, uh assessors, so on and so forth.

So that's one of the things I always train them to do, um, just to kind of work collaboratively and collectively in a sense.

Um but they're checking for non-compliances, whether I send them to a location, whether I learn of it on the news, and I look look it up and see that there's no license, I'll I'll deploy an inspector for that uh to do a compliance check.

Um, but I also rely on them to kind of find these things on their own.

If I do send them and they see a location that's next door that maybe is questionable, they haven't heard of to check that too, not just whatever I send them, but whatever's in their travels too.

And to follow up on that and kind of like use their memorization skills to try and remember if they see something out of the ordinary to stop and check it and um and look into it to see if they have the proper licensing for it.

Um, and the same thing with complaints that are not on that that do fall within our purview.

Yeah, um, I also send them out and collect the information and send it back to me so that I can turn around and determine whether I'm gonna um you know check in with the law department or just simply for a note straight before the board since we do have two solidists, two solicitors excuse me, that do kind of rotate um you know with each other.

Thank you.

Um just a quick how many um complaints have we received so far this year?

Um for for complaints in general.

Uh so like for no for noise, we don't really let me see.

A lot of it goes, we get a report from reading one.

Um, but as far as um like complaints in general for this year, I didn't bring that with me today, tonight, but um, I can certainly get you that information.

I appreciate it.

Well you also council here?

No, yeah.

Counselor Davidson, are you also uh I have a quick follow-up about what Councilman Peterson was just asking?

Thanks.

Um nice to meet you.

Um I about the noise complaints.

Um just walk me through the process.

If there is a complaint and it gets, I assume it would go to the police.

What how do you how do you get involved in an enforcement capacity?

I just want to better understand how it works.

So basically police are the only ones that can actually write you know police reports and and violate folks.

Um if the inspectors come across something, they would have to contact them to kind of follow up on that.

Um so then what happens is police will write write the business or the establishment up.

It's usually stuff that's falls within us, like if our residence is called from law music, that's never gonna cross my path.

Of course, that's specifically a mistake as a police matter.

Um, but it'll get forwarded to me.

Um, they'll they'll send it over.

Usually the solicitors on are on the email, and then I take that complaint and then I generate a letter and send them a notice to come in for a pre-hearing conference, which is before it gets to the board level.

At that stage, the board's not even aware that the violation exists.

It only they only become aware of it once it moves through the process and it goes before the board for uh disposition and review.

And usually at the pre-hearing conference is when an agreement is reached between either the license holder or they have an attorney, usually if it's an entity or corporation that LC or something like that, um, it they have to be represented by legal counsel.

Um and um, and usually that kind of delays the process a little bit because council maybe is in court or can't make it, or they're part of the general assembly and they do set at the state.

So, but at some point we the turnaround is usually as soon as we get it, though we have that where I'm scheduling it for a pre-year in conference and never let it go more than that, um, unless it's something that they you know that that they seem to run into an issue.

Um, but that's how the process goes for any violation that's received in the city.

Thanks.

That's helpful.

Thank you for share the overview of the process.

If I just have one follow-up question, which this looking at sort of like the budget book mentions that there have been far fewer hearings this year than apparently in the past couple.

What is that?

What is the reason for that?

Like the board licensing hearings, yeah.

Um, so at one point, at one point when it tricks number.

Gotcha, yeah.

So I I think part of it is also like the way that the fiscal year falls, because it runs June 30th until the first.

So um we'll definitely reach more than what we have so far between last fiscal year and this year, um, a little bit more by the end of this fiscal year, anyways.

Um, but um, I know in previous years we were holding two hearings uh a week, um, but there was uh a conflict with um the chair uh and his primary job, so they had temporarily reduced the hearings to one day.

Um there's been talks recently about bringing another Wednesday hearing right now, the Thursdays at 4 30.

There's been talks about bringing up another that if that Wednesday hearing again because 4 30 doesn't work for anyone, you know, the hospitality industry obviously some of these folks run the restaurants themselves.

So my argument is you know, five o'clock is prime time and standard time, you know, it's hard for somebody to come in.

My justification is we need another hearing date on a different day of the week at 12:30 or one o'clock, where it can kind of fit everyone's schedule, um, which obviously you run into issues there too with the attorneys again if they're being represented because a lot of times court is early in the week.

So we're trying to like gauge that on both sides of the spectrum to make sure it works.

We have our attorneys that do a lot of licensing work, and then we have our some attorneys, very little attorneys that don't really do it.

So the ones that do do it often and do represent uh a large portion of the of the uh business owners in province that fall within our purview, um, run into that kind of obstacle.

So we gotta kind of work with them, you know.

And sometimes Thursdays don't even work that up.

Um so um that's the reason why there's less hearings.

Thank you for clarifying that.

Uh Vice Chair Baylor, how many uh food truck licenses do we have roughly in the city?

Roughly from a recent report that I pulled, it was around uh um around 15 per minutes and the inspector, so they inspect them to make sure they have a license out of that work, but I know they got to be registered with the state and the city.

Right, yeah.

So in 2019, that whole process changed, um, where now they have to go to Department of Business Regulation first to obtain what's called a mobile food registration, and they basically do all the light work, whether it's a pushcart, a whole uh pedal, whether it's a trailer, whether it's a driverable truck, even just a little bells lemonade or a little ice cream car, they still all require that same MF registration.

So in all 39 cities and found in order for them to provide them uh a permit to bend in their city or town, they need that registration.

Um so that registration, our application takes 10 minutes or less.

If your text out of you can probably get it done in five minutes, all you have to do is upload that state MF registration, pay it for 75 dollars, and your permit expires at the same time.

It mirrors the DBR one, so it expires at the same time that your DDR um permit or registration expires, but they do all the like work.

But they do all the like work.

They check the Department of Health license, they check the retail sales, they check the registration from DMV, the insurance on the on whatever vessel it is.

Have we looked at, I don't think we do short-term rentals licenses.

Because I know the EBR does short-term rentals.

But I know other uh cities and towns that new what I know does it uh middle town is starting there.

He's not charging um for short-term rentals to the city or actually get any money.

Have we looked into doing that?

I know we don't know, but right, yeah.

The world needs money.

So yeah, that's true.

Yeah, and get a piece of that buy at our own.

Yeah, for sure.

And um, and and that's a really good point.

Um, I'm always looking for ways to generate revenue.

Um, probably I'm always uh looking for ways to um enhance the department and find creative ways where we can legally do that.

Um I've mentioned that before for short-term rentals.

You're absolutely right, as you know, it's grown as something it's something that we can certainly look into, but at this time it'd be like I feel like it'd be starting from ground zero.

Um, but it's an avenue that we could explore to see, you know, if it's in conjunction with the law department to see if it's something that maybe we can we can do now with the new um well, what the entertainment license that we're getting for the different places for the that can have you feel you have enough inspectors for that if that goes through.

Yeah, but between between police and um and the three the two inspectors on second shift that I'll have because I think that they'll be dealing with it.

Um myself included, um, you know, especially at first uh for training purposes and things like that.

I think that I'll also be kind of on that um just kind of providing guidance and educating even my own staff on the new changes, um, because it's gonna be new to them.

Um at this time I don't know, I don't know how to confidently say that I if I have enough inspectors or not.

Um, in my opinion, I think it's definitely gonna be an add-on.

So there might be a slight chance um that we need them, um, but I won't know until we actually like start the fielding applications work.

But I think it's gonna be a little bit more that's asked of us, and that's okay.

Um, I just want to make sure that we have the people power in order to be able to execute in a timely fashion.

Um you know, due to some budget constraints in the recent past.

Um but in my opinion, um I'm hoping that with the two that I have at the in police that that's enough.

Um I'll be more better positioned to answer that once we actually have that's it.

Uh counselor Peterson.

Thank you.

Um do you have any mechanism in your systems to inform counselors of any licensing issues in the wards?

Because there are notifications that goes out.

I don't have we don't have a whole lot of brick and mortar in the board 14, so uh it's more of a curiosity question for me.

But yeah, nothing opened very late at night either.

So okay.

Um yeah, and um I know like ladder 133 was in not my work, all right.

So maybe Google Maps is wrong.

Um, but they are one that just it was a transfer that fell through and it just never went in.

Um, but um right now there's no mechanism in place to inform.

There is a mechanism in place where the chief clerk sends um any new businesses that are opening up, and there's a it usually goes to the chief of staff on on the city council then.

Um, and those are new licenses or transfers that are happening in the city, and it does show the address.

Yeah, um, so that mechanism is in place where we do send that every time we send a list.

Not only do we send it to the city council, we also send it to the division of taxation too.

Um, because obviously they require study of the standings and stuff like that.

Um, but it's not something that I feel is out of reach.

I feel like that's something that we could that I could probably look into and and and and do.

I actually have all the war, I have a ward map in my office um specifically for that reason, and I'd love to utilize it more than just looking at it.

So I can definitely uh explore those options.

I appreciate that.

Um sometimes it's it's helpful to know um ahead of time or even while news is coming out about something that might have happened in the neighborhood, and it when it comes to licensing, um we don't always get a chance to know about that stuff.

So yeah, and it's tough sometimes because like surrenders for liquor, um liquor licenses, like sometimes we don't get those back, but then we get a new person that's applying and has lease.

So obviously that tells us that the other person's out at least you don't have a license technically um by law.

So um I have a list that's actually coming your way pretty soon of surrenders, uh, just throughout the city of ones that we were able to capture from folks that try to like tell my staff to really you know stick it to them and let them know that we just need them for the former, you know, because that's before the board as uh as a not a withdrawal, but like a surrender, yeah.

Um so I do have a list that's actually coming your way as promised.

It's in the um, I know I I apologize for the for the no, that's okay.

Don't even us there, but um it's in the lot you could do.

Just a little, yeah.

Um, so but that is coming your way, and that's gonna show you all the surrender that are taking place.

So people that didn't renew or surrender late this year.

Perfect.

Um, we still have 16 incomplete liquor license renewals in the city that expired December 1st.

Those are on before the board tomorrow.

Um, and so we still have some folks and liquor renewal season start is honest because it starts in August.

So it's like we're cleaning this up just to start it all over again, and everything else in between.

Sorry, one more question.

How many liquor licenses do we have total?

So right now in province, we're at 483 liquor licenses and counting.

So that number is subject to change as licenses are ready to be issued.

But from my latest most recent report, it was 483, and 50 of those are uh liquor stores, so they're just package stores.

Okay, thank you.

Council borders.

Thank you.

Thank you very much for your question.

Like, is any law in the city that we can protect, like for example only?

I got 20 licenses, 20 legal licenses.

Even the church is getting a license now in the area.

Like how we can for real as that joke.

No, yeah, no, even the church can get a license.

I didn't know if you were being serious.

No, because they they very close to each other, like is any way to control that?

Like, because there's so many liquor licenses in one spot only.

Um I'm I'm sure there's a way, and I'm sure that there's something in the law that um that would allow that.

Uh the only negative effect that that would have is the impact on economical growth.

Um, you you you restricting that.

Um, but I understand your point.

And the rule still applies if there's a church or a school within 200 feet, they gotta get an exemption.

And and to your point, yeah, there is one-day licenses that the that the office is, you know, uh that the office does issue like a class that one day uh for full or limited, which simply means beer online or full spirits.

So sometimes the churches do apply uh for those one-day licenses.

Um, but there is like geographical areas.

The I know for liquor stores for sure there is.

Um, I just don't know for certain from a legal standpoint if there is one for to limit the amount of liquor licenses in a certain area.

Um that's a that's a good question that I can think of.

Thank you.

Do we also use the departments also in charge of the little legal shops licenses too?

What type of licenses?

Like uh auto mechanic shops or uh under you.

Yes, yeah, so a motor vehicle repair falls under us, and those require a license, and then we also require it to be advertised in the private external and uh an annual renewal, and um that that fee was it went up too for that license last year.

Um and we look at everything when we go there and I send inspectors oh, we look, are they parked on the sidewalk, are they fixing cars on the street, are they spilling and creating an environmental hazard?

Um are they closing on time and not staying there drinking and smoking and treating it like a nightclub operation after hours?

Um, we look at all that stuff and and we bring them in.

And sometimes it's more than one that we bring in before the board to address those types of concerns.

Uh not to mention that that treatment treating it like a junk shop, you know, with parts everywhere.

That's a zoning violation.

So we would bring them in before the board there as well.

And and obviously speak with zoning first to see if if they identify any violations before we take action, but I think with my experience, I think I already can identify them without looking at the ordinance.

So I know uh just looking at photos if something's in violation or not, and what action I can take.

Thank you.

And that's just one of 28 plus different licensing categories that we that fall within our property that we regulate and license.

Uh only four people, four people in the euro.

Four people do you on the organizational chart?

On your department.

You got a bacon position and you've got four people.

Oh yes.

So licensing clerks, I have two.

And then for licensing inspectors, I have two right now, and in the process of filling another one.

So the first the first one obviously just works per ship.

That's that's by contract.

Well the whole city.

For the whole city, yes.

Yeah.

And then the other two instructors on second ship.

Um so yeah, it's it's not New York, but it's still a big city to provide coverage on it.

And that's why I'm kind of like in a little bit of an urgency to fill that other position because it sees what's picking up, and I want to get them trained, not just on the uh specifics of the job, but special events and things of things like that.

How long has it been vacant?

Uh so this position's been vacant since April of this year, and the reason for that, you know, while I'm not at liberty to discuss personnel matters in depth.

Um, they just didn't make it past their 60 days.

And and the position was still before that, and some things happened also that I'm not at liberty to discuss where you know they didn't make their 60 day mark either.

And that was just in December.

Um, so I had to repost the position, that takes some time.

And um, and so that's why I'm in the interview and process right now, and I've already made a selection, I just have to send the recommendation to this person who makes it through the six year old.

I have faith that they will, yes.

Sorry, back to the council borders.

Do you think uh that you will need another daytime inspector?

I mean, I wouldn't say no.

I wouldn't say no.

I wouldn't be opposed to the idea if I can allocate some funds for it.

Because according to the information that I see that you do use the power and do a lot of licensing special businesses, plus whatever they fall into or they had you have to go review and work through that.

Yeah, uh, I have an idea that you might need another another inspector for data.

Think about it.

Yeah, and um yeah, doesn't it seem like we need to think about it?

Well, I I would love to.

I would love to.

I just you know, with the budget constraints, I don't know that that would be feasible this year.

Thank you.

Are you also thanking you on that?

Um, I just have a few questions.

Um does anyone else have anything?

Yeah, nope.

Um first question is um uh administrator, you mentioned uh the initiative uh about short-term rentals regarding uh the World Cup.

It seems like that's a new initiative that administration has pushed out.

Um but when Vice Chair Taylor uh mentioned uh short-term rental licensing, you said that's not uh that's not uh policy or or an idea.

So I guess what what's the difference between what you're saying and what vice chair uh Taylor asked about?

Um I was asking if we license it the city, and he said no.

And we don't and just to clarify you mean like Airbnb.

Yeah, the we don't we don't do it.

I thought I said like there against it.

Yeah, not for what they've already started by a certain percentage.

The state also gives a certain percent.

Yeah, as of now I would ask for if we've thought about it in the future too late for FIFA, but I'm saying that down the road, I mean the it's quite a yeah, it might be wise to look into growing and grow.

Right, yeah, they are, and they do exist on province.

Um I just don't think that's I'd have to look.

I guess so.

My question is so what's the short-term rental licensing uh that was recently launched in licensing?

Yeah, short-term rental.

That are terminated for website.

Oh, I'm sorry, I can I can provide uh clarity on those.

So it was one, it was for the fan zone specifically.

There was uh a vendor market license that was created to capture those interested in vending in that area, and then the other one was the temporary extended hours request, which is the legislation that hasn't been signed yet.

Um, and those we created an application for right.

Um yeah, I created an application for that code so that way when that legislation passes, we can capture those that are interested.

We can capture those that are interested in and take it advantage of the 3 a.m.

close uh stock service of alcohol and the forward closure.

Um and those will be looked at and considered carefully and reviewed, depending on you know what violations they have.

You know, they're on a reduction of hours already serving a penalty, um, and uh you know, um blackout dates that the city might have due to resource capacity and or limitations, and um also um the other thing was for the the temporary extended hours is um whether or not some games start late and if we're going to entertain those or for a whole 39 days, um, because the legislation talks about it being up to the local licensing authority, and um they have to file an application 14 days in advance, but there's no fee associated with that.

Um, but we want to at least capture it in case a year from now, some or after fee for somebody has hey, how many places you know, can you pull a report?

I'm able to do that rather than guessing.

Um, so we're doing it, we're going back, and that's what I was referring to as far as creating the two applications.

Um, but for the short-term rentals, um that's like a new conversation.

Yeah, so so just so you're aware of administrator, and I think this is where some of the confusion is.

So the the mayor's office has put out um uh uh short-term rental uh uh permitting process specific to people, I believe, but I think that's being housed under inspection standards.

So I think uh some type of uh overlap conversation, maybe with some counselors uh to explore that possibility would be going forward.

Um for the record, my position is that short-term rentals should be uh prohibited in a city like Providence that's facing uh such uh uh housing prices uh shortage.

This is a policy we we see enacted in a lot of other places.

I'm just voicing my opinion here uh for the for the record.

But I mean, if they're here, I think definitely seeing uh some type of revenue coming in, I think would be the next possible best uh policies my personal thing.

Um but moving forward, um how has the move into 444 or Westminster?

Are you seeing uh more people come in?

Uh what's the feedback been uh so far?

Um I I think it's I think it's been good.

Um I think it's been positive.

Um we're a public facing department as it is, so we get foot traffic anyways.

Um, but we've been getting we've been getting folks, especially after the ribbon cutting, we've been getting folks coming in looking for information for a different variety of different topics.

Um that are strictly economic development questions, some that are both, that we can tag team together and have sit at a round table and discuss different things.

Um, and we've already done that for several times.

Um, and as I mentioned before, it that's not where it ends.

Like we plan to kind of put ourselves out there, create the workshops, create the info sessions and and things like that, especially like the entertainment, you know, ones wherever we land with that.

Uh, I think, in my opinion, that maybe we should teach the businesses who are not zoned for entertainment currently of what this means for them, you know, and what it doesn't mean for the folks who are zoned, there's nothing really changes for them.

Um, so I think that that's forthcoming too for the new business center.

Um, I think that there's plenty of opportunity and different ways that we can engage with the community and make it a positive thing and uh really make it a one-stop, one-stop shop as much as we can.

Um, obviously, there's some regulatory requirements from the Department of Health as I mentioned from like the food trucks and stuff like that for breaking mortgage as well.

Um, but so far I can honestly say that I I've seen foot traffic for people asking you know, generic questions of all different kinds.

Thank you.

Um last question I have, uh is um outside of the decibel training um that you mentioned, is there any other training that new hires?

Like I guess what's the what's the requirements or eligibility to become an inspector?

So uh to become an inspector with this department, um, you need to high school diploma.

A lot of the training is on the job training, except for the noise training.

That's something that they have to be sent out of state for right now.

It's at Rogers University in New Jersey in Brunswick.

Um, that's a training that we we can't do because it's done by professionals, and there's a cost associated with that.

Um, but other than that, there's you know, we we work on different training offerings with the union, uh, whether it'd be training on Microsoft Office, um, any I always tell my folks to think of trainings that would help them be better at their job.

Um, any I always tell my folks to think of trainings that would help them be better at their job.

Um, and you know, we have a line item for professional development.

So I want to try and utilize that more for them.

And you know, obviously, I have to do it within limits because it'll be so much allocated for that.

But I would love to see them, you know, take more trainings that would make them better at their job.

Even if it's down to like a communications class, if somebody's creative or oral speaking or speaking in public or speaking before the board they have to testify on a on a matter.

Um, but right now it's very very limited.

It's called for experience, um, you know, uh understanding and knowledge of local and state laws.

Um obviously a high school diploma, the training is a requirement and a condition of their employment um as an inspector, uh, but a lot of it is done on the job, learning the software, learning um you know uh the different databases that we use uh to enter information.

Uh there's a lot of data entry, there's a lot of preparation work that goes into advertising hearings, um a lot of communications with Profits Journal.

Um, but um that is very clerkable hands-on training.

Um are you responsible for most of the on the job training?

Or yes.

But for the most part, the majority of it I am.

Um, obviously, if uh since I lost the deputy, uh sometimes I rely on my chief clerk to kind of help and assist and train um when I'm not available, but for the most part, it is my my duty to change.

And you know, as some of you may know, I was the inspector, so I'm not saying that I'm the right guy for the job, but I think I know a thing or two about how to be an efficient effective inspector.

Um, as I was in 2021.

Um, so I think that I can help there in many different areas.

I take them out.

Sometimes I run the show and I show them how an inspection should go, and then I tell them to just kind of tailor it to what they feel is right.

But I've always told them that it's all about how you talk to people, and that's gonna get you the furthest.

You know, if you come in hot, you're gonna get them hot and they're gonna be upset, and it's not gonna go well.

But if you go in with a calm, you know, level headed to meaner, you're gonna get further.

You're gonna get people to actually respond, and um, and people remember those things.

And and I always tell them that I speak from experience on um to that regard.

Thank you.

Um the other questions, committee.

Uh thank you as well.

We appreciate you and your department.

Thank you.

Uh motion to enter exhibit 32 into the record.

So thank you.

Motion made by Vice Chair Taylor, second by counselor givens it.

All is in favor, aye.

Any nays, any attention?

I have a two.

Um the budget book details on page 259 of your budget book.

If you're not there already, I'm joined state by C registrarts and can link, and we will begin with my actual presentation.

Uh as mentioned previously, uh, the vital statistics department does generate revenue.

Um primary source of revenue is certified records, as you can see on the slide, they generate quite a few certified copies of final health records.

Uh, as well, they also process marriage licenses, there are some miscellaneous fees, and they do collect and process PD IDs in the total expenditure this year 2027, but was it 520,466?

This is a 78, 337 increase of a display 26 budget at 442,129, or 72%.

So the proposed salaries are budgeted at 298,949.

Uh, this represents a $14,000 increase of a fiscal year 2026 budget at 285,485.

There are no proposed changes to FTEs or salaries in each department, and all of the increases are achievable as a cost of living increases or second cases for eligible employees.

Uh, this department does have a small service and supply line item, but it has some broken fixing discretionary costs.

In the discretionary services, we have postage, which is necessary for the department and mailings that we need to send out, as well as season subscriptions.

This $150 is allocated for the Rhode Island Town and City Clerks Association membership.

Additionally, there's a small allocation of $1,500 for stationary.

This is necessary for office supplies and any branded materials the department may need.

There are some very ancient and specialty books that need a specialty binding done regularly to maintain them.

And so we do have a modest allocation of $2,500 for that service.

And then there is a fixed cost of $3,000.

This is the copy or lease maintenance for the department and the wonderful contract in Rico.

And with that, if there are no budgetary questions, I'll tip it over to quick question for school.

What's up with the increase in benefits?

I am going to take a diff deep look at that.

Carlini and I worked on an updated allocation based on current FTE counts.

So total benefits will not change, but the way we allocate them across the department is probably real performable budget.

Alright, and once you get the most updated, can you so when we do the final ordinances, you'll see the red line of how the benefit numbers have changed?

There's a couple that look a little high and a couple that look a little low, so we just want to smooth that out for the next fiscal year.

But as a reminder, the bulk of our benefits are medical and pension, which are an actually determined number, so it's a matter of how that number is allocated across departments, not that the number is not in that.

Yeah, of course.

Registar.

Good evening.

They keep adding new titles, I gotta say it's illustrator.

We have collector, controller.

We'll we'll respect you, sir.

Thank you.

Um you want to share with the committee or the hundreds of people listening at home.

Yeah, explain what we do over there.

Um we're responsible for maintaining preserving a lot of the essential records for the city of Problems.

Uh when people come in, they're going through some of the most important times of their life.

You know, it could be a death of a loved one, birth of a child with marriage.

Uh so we make sure that we take special care of them.

And you know, the process that we've been going through since I've taken over is we're modernizing and kind of streamlining the experience so we can get them in and out of there and kind of um make them feel like they got a good service and expedite.

Um we as far as going through with uh 311 and vitals.

It's kind of a it's it's perfect because it is a constituent service.

So through our customer service training, it falls over to the course in the office.

Um of it.

Fair enough.

Uh and you're located, you you're still here in the hall, right?

Yes, one of those.

Um I certainly don't have any uh questions.

Is anyone from the committee?

Uh counselor Davidson.

Yeah, hi.

I just like clarified question.

Um why do we not garner any revenue from birth or death?

Oh, we do.

We can oh maybe I'm misreading the revenue.

So certified copies are worth their copies of those certificates.

People need licenses that are issued for the city.

Thank you for clarifying that.

I understand now.

Okay.

Um you have um we don't expect that right now, but do you have a breakdown of how many type of uh copies are uh distributed on an annual basis?

Uh I can get that for you for sure.

You want to break down of birth, marriage?

Yeah, okay.

Um any other questions?

Are there any questions?

No, sir.

Um I think we're all set.

Thank you, sir.

All right, thank you.

That was easy.

Okay, so I just applied for the city health insurance.

Oh, yeah.

Um, I literally might have mine if promote certificate, like in my back right there.

I was like, I might do that.

Um I also was should be calling.

I found my areas.

Um I have a new speech.

We realized that we had never decided like you have kind of ceremony.

I have not done it yet.

We're 17 years, and I was like, you know, let's wait for 20.

If you have a marriage, I did for social security.

And we accepted my um international translation.

Okay.

I was very nervous that they wouldn't.

Okay.

Um it was one of those things that it's like.

I had a different list in my council if I had to see my health insurance.

I have to do that.

Uh motion to enter exhibit 33 into the record.

Motion made by counselor uh Pearson, second by Vice Taylor.

All those in favor, aye, any nays, any abstentions?

I have direction.

Are we gonna go through uh the whole presentation first?

Uh crystal.

You are comfortable with that, you think that would make the most sense we can have it in the financial questions on the packet as we go through.

As long as you don't mind uh questions, not at all.

Uh committee members, if there's any questions on the budget reposition aspect of it.

Please uh reach your hand.

Okay.

We've got a lot to get through, so very important to part.

We've got a lot of time.

We do, I know.

Still are uh I am joined today with uh fighting director of Patricia Fuente.

Uh you will be changed to people to refer to her as a director, so we don't really want title changes to this meeting.

Uh and they will begin the presentation.

Uh the first division is the engineering division in their budget book details on page 307 of your budget book.

Um this division, you know, it does generate some revenue procurement fees, those revenues are to record it in the highway division.

Uh total proposal expenditures for the engineering division of fiscal year 2027 are 1,868,499.

This represents a 402,376 increase of the fiscal year 2026 budget of 1,466,123 or approximately 27.4%.

There are some changes to FTEs in this budget in fiscal year 2026.

We had budgeted 926,800 in fiscal 2027.

We're making adjustments of volume items, cost of lending increases for $32,438, step increases for $8,109.

We are funding an important utility ordinance, um, a new associate engineer for an annual salary of $75,504, as well as a new engineering project manager salary of $79,202 for total proposed fiscal year 2027 salaries of $1,122,089.

And it's also important to note that while these are not funded because they are non-UM based performance increases, the salaries for the chief engineer, deputy chief engineer, assistant chief engineer, and engineering project manager were expanded to around for a greater range in those salaries.

Um the previous cap for the chief engineer was an A26, it is now an A30.

The deputy chief engineer from from a capital A24 to a capital A26, the assistant chief engineer went from a capital A21 to a capital A24, and the engineering project manager went from a capital A19 to 21.

And those salaries were all um consulted in conjunction with reviewing state level salaries and comparable cities.

Umaries um so while it's not funded, um I guess what's the mechanism in place uh for like a mid-year raise?

So assuming that staff received an adequate performance evaluation, the director would recommend a salary increase.

The finance department would then review that in coordination with with all of the planned salary increases.

Um as we mentioned previously, the process for non-union steps in fiscal 27 has changed, so instead of budgeting them at the position level, we've put an allocation in nutrition for all non-union steps, and so my homework this year will be managing that allocation throughout the year to ensure that it's actively distributed throughout departments so that we're not in place where everybody getting a review in July is getting a raise and everyone gave review in June is not.

At this point in time, the mechanism of how we're going to do that is still in works with the department of people and culture, but all raises will be done in conjunction with performance evaluations and will be in accordance with the approved salaries and importance.

Just a quick follow-up.

Do all employee uh reviews happen in the months of June and July, or no, those are just examples so that you know I was you know, someone who's at the end of the year didn't end up missing out because the funds had all been expended.

Um performance evaluations should be happening on an annual basis based on the the date the employee entered into that role.

So if you started in April of 2026, you would get a promotion evaluation anyway with 20%.

Uh their budget has been broken into fixed and discretionary line item.

The first considered fixed cost is private contractors.

This is emergency design and engineering services for non-CIP projects.

Um, under the supply line items, both of their items are considered discretionary.

First is miscellaneous expenses.

This is engineering state fees, registrations, and survey equipment.

There was a small increase to small tools and stop supplies, which we're seeing citywide of $3,800 for the national budget to $4,800 into two years 2027.

Maintenance and servings are engineering tools and equipment that's currently needed, and we have a modest budget of $5,000.

Copy and lease maintenance is the copier that is under contract for this department, and this budget of $8,000 in fiscal year 2027, which is unchanged from fiscal year 2026.

The last line item that's considered discretionary is hurricane barrier maintenance.

There's been some considerable upgrades in the hurricane barrier, and we would like to add an additional $15,000 to continue to maintain that out of our operating budget so they can stay well for working repair condition.

There are no contracts in this division above $50,000.

The next division is environmental control.

Their budget begins on page 310 of the budget.

This department does generate some revenue.

They are generated from sale of replacement trash and recycling parts.

We did decrease this budget by uh about $51,000 in fiscal year 2027 due to the rollout of the new parts.

We felt that they would not be purchasing as many replacement parts since all our states had new parts.

Um we'll be reevaluating that revenue next fiscal year, depending on what part replacements are, and trend in fiscal year 2027.

Uh total proposed expenditures in fiscal 2027 are 17,994,976.

This is a 46,000 46,183 decrease from the fiscal year 2026 budget of 18,41,159 or reduction of about 2%.

Uh fiscal year 2026 salaries were budgeted at 728,253 in fiscal year 2027.

We're proposing the following adjustments.

Cost of it living increases costing 25,489, step increases at costing $6,372.

Uh additional additionally, there's a request to remove to move the environmental court liaison position out of the DPW administration budget and into the environmental budget to more accurately reflect the reporting hierarchy of that position.

That is no cost in the reduction in the division it is coming from what that change.

The budget in the environmental division has been broken into fixed and discretionary line items.

The bulk of their LA items are considered fixed or in public processing and trash pickup.

Uh, the first line item is considered other services.

This is $75,000 for port toss.

We are seeing an increase in the cost of that, and so we are needing to fund a little bit more money to provide uh necessary towing and remediation of those tolls.

Um is that tied to uh a contract or it it ties both the contract and historical spend in fiscal year 2025?

We spent 100,000.

Um, those port towes do go out to date and are under um are under contract, I believe.

Yeah, that's on the next page.

Thank you.

Yep, of course.

Um, the next discretionary line item is pest control, which we all think raised is pretty important.

We are seeing an increase in that cost of $5,000 for next fiscal year and requested to increase that line item.

Uh program expense has been reduced by $50,000 in this case on historical spend.

Uh, this is commercial core cleanup program, uh, which is something the director can talk in more detail about if we're questions about.

Uh, additionally, we have a small or we do have a substantial decrease in recycling pickup due to the new waste management contract, which has been offset by the increase in the garbage pickup fees.

Um, the two of those net at a $50,000 increase in garbage pickup costs throughout fiscal year 2027.

I'm sorry, Crystal.

Can you repeat that?

Yep.

So the new contract terms have the cost of recycling pickup going down, but the cost of garbage pickup going up.

So the net cost of those, if you see the negative 957 and positive 135,000 dollars from that correctly.

Okay.

Um waste recycling education is pretty self-explanatory and has been level funded at $50,000.

And the collection agency on environmental tickets.

Again, because we are rolling on the new parts, we thought we would not utilize any replacement parts in fiscal year 2027, and so it felt like a safe reduction in that line item.

The last fixed cost is referenced processing.

These are what I am our stores recovery fees for processing refuse.

We are seeing a substantial reduction of $500,000 in that, which is supported by our trend.

Um we are hoping that that number comes in even greater as we see better recycling rates in the city, but we felt $500,000 reduction was a safe number's budget for this year.

We we can get into this probably more of those directions, but I guess like what what what exact numbers are we seeing to support that that trend?

So right now when we look at our year-to-date expenditures for refuse processing, it is at $2.7 million on a $5.2 million budget.

So when we look at the role 12, which is what I do when we analyze our budget regularly, um, we looked at the last 12 consecutive months in a row, and we budgeted what that actual number was.

Um and so that is where the four sum budget is from.

Uh follow-up question, uh counselor didn't.

It's actually a slightly different question, but I don't want to lose track of it.

Um where are uh where's why are recycling fines not showing up on revenue for this department?

The environmental tickets show up in the non-dened departmental budget.

Okay, um, with the rest of the final forfeitures, that's where all the municipal port revenues are also built.

Okay, thank you.

Yeah, um the last line item is a supply line item and small tools and shop supplies, which are tools and equipment for this position.

One quick question.

Um, with regards to the environmental court liaison, um, how many tickets and fines have we seen, or how many how much revenue has been generated from that in the last year?

Um environmental tickets environmental.

So in fiscal year 2025, the collected 153,782 year-to-day revenues out of this budget book being printed.

So as of April, we're 91,611.

And um, director, are you still having the same issue where there isn't really too much push at I mean if they get the ticket and they don't pay it, there isn't anything really correct.

Okay, do you know by any chance off the top of your head how much outstanding that leaves?

I don't, but I can find out.

Thank you.

Um this department has several contracts above $50,000.

They've been itemized on slide 11.

Uh the first is the series week telling for the someone looking at vehicles.

That contract's at $37,000 currently.

Re-Rick Pacific is replacement tracks and recycling parts.

The current contract for fiscal year 2027 has a authorized $149,942, so we need to not anticipate spending our quantity of money in fiscal year 2027.

Rhode Island Resource Recovery is budgeted $4,750,000.

And then we have the waste management contract for recycling pickup and garbage.

Recycling pickup is $4,200,960, and risk garbage is budgeted at $7 million, $300.

Yeah, statement lines of the $4,750 is optimal now.

The $4,750.

Yeah, the $4 million, yeah.

Um, so the $4 million $750 is what we have budgeted because that's tied to um like load size and volume and all of that.

We don't have like a contract for a fixed amount of resource recovery, but we do list the amount of subject here.

So we have something to stack to follow-ups, or that's what's for that's when we're budgeting to spend from the next fiscal year and fees for bad recycling.

Well, and actual there is fee.

There is a portion, a large portion of that is actually the cost of processing the garbage.

So there is like not all 4.7 million is the fee for bad recycling.

Uh theoretically, we would pay less than 4.7 million if we had better recycling rates, but not all of that for rates on this time to reception.

Yeah, um, have our recycling rates improved at all?

I know that we were at 4% last year, roughly.

I'm gonna defer that to the director in maybe environmental information.

I would say yes, okay.

Um excuse me, brag about when sorry, I dumped the gun.

I have that hack it fragments.

Um through the uh this is Brandon Olson, who's our our new associate director for environmental services, has come in hot, and that's already a really good impression.

Um, and a really good change, even just to the culture of that division, the work of that division has changed a little bit.

Um, so I can talk about some more later if you want.

Um, but in partnership with Zero Waste Providence, and also in a really good team at work with sustainability, um, Brandon and his team have worked on doing a better job inspecting people's recyclement um the three hours of the morning, different wards.

Um it resulted in some routes being sent to the MARF to the to the municipal recycling and sorting facility um and passive the MARF um routes that had traditionally not passed tomorrow, and so we are seeing that rate go up.

That's good news.

And we're very uh we're sort of cautiously optimistic that that's that's a trend that we want to sustain.

Good job.

Thank you.

Excellent.

Um the next division is the highway division.

Um I think this has come up in previous times.

I want to say maybe public property, and we were reading our budget that was discussions on how we manage auto repairs and maintenance.

Um, this is how DPW does that.

So this is the division where all of the vehicle repairs and maintenance are budgeted and finished.

Uh total proposed expenditures in this division are 1,253,306.

This represents an $11,923 decrease for the fiscal year 2026 budget of $1,265,229.

Uh, to your point earlier, Chairman, that decrease is attributable to the change in benefit allocation.

Um, and when I look at what uh we are budgeting in fiscal year 2027 for total benefits of $385,000, um, which is very close to the actual fiscal year 2026 of $363,000.

So this reduction is just us right-sizing the benefits to what the actual um expenses have been in historical years.

Fiscal year 2026 salary, so budgeted $527,286.

This department, this division is proposing notions to FTEs or salaries.

As a result, we are only adjusting for cost of lending increases at $18,455, except increases of $7,098 to 12 proposed fiscal year $2027 salaries of $552,839.

This budget has been broken into fixed and discretionary line items.

Uh the vast majority of their land items are fiscal, all of them are considered discretionary.

Um, and are total in total level funded from year to year.

Uh $4,000 has been removed from auto parts and repairs to outer equipment based on known DMD registrations between quite a few um vehicles purchased from the NASA leads for this department, and so we can make sure that we're appropriately registering them as a result we need a little bit fewer auto parts, and so we thought that was a good way to balance out the budget for this year 2027.

Uh their budget, um their contracts are not necessarily $50,000, but when added to other divisions, they make up $50,000.

So we've dumped out of the fundamental profession.

We would list them here.

Um, they are for heavy truck parks and auto services and have gone out to fiddle and the finish social contract and stuff.

Uh the next division.

So there's logistics to confirm.

So we have some contracts uh that um different departments, I guess, have access to or the benefits.

Certainly, so we have some blanket contracts for sure, right?

And that's gonna be many city departments participating in one contract.

In these contracts specifically, they are contracts specific for the department of public works, but multiple divisions are utilizing them.

So when we added up truck pro for all of the DPW divisions in total, it was more than $50,000.

But it's is it one contract or is it one contract with multiple accounting like funding sources underneath that contract?

Um we are into the highway division.

They are on page 316 of your budget book.

Um, as I mentioned previously, the engineering permit revenues are reported in this division.

Um they are budgeted in fiscal year 2027 at 598,000, which is about the 200,000 dollar increase of a fiscal year 2026 budget of 387,000.

Uh the spoke of this increase or all of this increase is in the permits revenue line and supported by our historical trend.

Uh, we are seeing an uptick in the number of permits um happening in this division.

Total proposed expenditures are six million in fiscal year 2027 are six million five hundred thirty-five thousand four hundred and one dollars.

This is a four hundred three thousand dollars three thousand seven hundred and thirty-five dollar increase over the fiscal year twenty twenty-six budget of six million one hundred and thirty-one thousand six hundred and sixty-six dollars, or approximately six point five eight percent.

In 2026, salaries in the highway division were budgeted at $2,92,105.

We are adjusting salaries in 2027 for cost of living increases at $140,595, step increases at $39,178.

Additionally, an MLA was executed in April of 2025, which is resulting in an additional $109,055 in salary costs.

Then we proposed salaries of this year 2027 to $3,180,933.

Crystal, um, is this MOA the same one as is, yes.

Exact same.

That's the exact same one.

Um, there were multiple divisions listed on that.

One of the titles changed in that MLA was the heavy equipment operator position, which has been some a position we've had a hard time actually maintaining a whole staff in.

Um, but that's why we're seeing such a jump in here.

There are many heavy programmers, many of the positions that were adjusted are in this position.

Uh this budget has been broken into fixing discretionary costs.

The first fixed cost is under contract at three streets with the tricky one.

Street we and it's required by ordinance, and that is budgeted at $500,000 and unchanged from fiscal year 2026 to 2027.

Total supplies again are unchanged from 2026 to 2027.

There's $125,000 out allocated for asphalt products.

This is how people catch materials.

Miscellaneous expenses covers any temporary speed bumps and road plates needed in the department, and those are budgeted at $5,000.

Small toll shop supplies are pretty self-explanatory and are level budget of $20,000.

Cement plaster products represents ready mixed sidewalk materials and are funded at $25,000 in fiscal year 2027.

Uh house kicking supplies are clean supplies and trash bag miners, those are budgeted at $25,000 and remain unchanged.

Lumber and hardware are necessary, you know, lumber and hardware supplies the department may need.

That is a small allocation at $1,500 and remains unchanged in fiscal year 2026.

Uh, the last items is uniforms and wearing apparel, these are safety materials and the uniform of service that's necessary, and that is budgeted $90,000 and unchanged from fiscal year 2026.

Um this department also has a capital budget.

Uh, there's a $50,000 allocation for structures and improvement.

These are non-capital CIP urgent repairs that may come up in the fiscal year, and that budget is unchanged from fiscal 2026 to fiscal 2027.

All contracts above 50,000 have been itemized from flight 23.

Uh, the first is with Vinavaro for cement at $50,000.

HJ Lynch provides ASHL at $60,000.

Um, AWL has won the street sleeping contract, and they are estimated to earn $500,000 as a result of that.

CINTES says uniform rental and cleaning, that's a $90,000 budget line item.

And Narragans also provides asphalt at $60,000 annually.

Is uniform mostly for mechanics or who else uses the relevant except for like the map you didn't three?

Yes.

Oh, sorry.

If there are just that of curiosity, is there a reason why we use two different asphalt companies?

So sometimes they're not open.

Um at different times.

So we have a list and we always choose a copy.

Thank you for that.

Excellent.

Uh the next division is the parking administration division.

Their budget can be found on page 320.

This is a revenue that generated department.

Uh revenues in the 2027 or budgeted 3,650,000, $3,650,000.

Um, this is a $250,000 increase, or I'm sorry, it's $200,000 increase over fiscal year 2026 budget.

All of that increase is in the permits revenue line and is supported by the historical revenue receipts we've received in that line.

Uh total proposed expenditures are $739,173.

This is a change of eight reduction of $86,593 from the fiscal year 2026 budget of $825,766, or approximately $7.5% less.

There are no changes, or there are no changes, proposed changes to FTE counts of salaries in the division in fiscal 2026, we have budgeted 247,521 dollars.

In fiscal 2027, we're making adjustments for cost of living increases at approximately $9,901, step increases to $1,070.

To bring total proposed fiscal year 2027 salaries to $258,492.

This budget has been broken into fixed and discretionary line costs.

The first fixed cost is private contractor.

This is brief coin collection, which is necessary for all of our meters, as well as IPS service fees.

There is a reduction of $100,000 from the fiscal year 2027 2026 budget.

This $100,000 was one-time funding provided to the department to provide additional parking signage.

And so we're anticipating all of that finance will be purchased in fiscal 2026 and will no longer be in the budget for 2027.

There's also a small supply line and budget of $55,000.

$5,000 is machinery and equipment.

This is poll replacements for meters throughout the city, as well as $50,000 for parking permit tax, receipt paper, and point tax.

This contract is for $366,000.

That $366,000 does include a portion of the fees that are passed through to customers when they pay their needs.

Next up, we have the public works administration division.

That begins on page $323.

So proposed budget for fiscal year 2027 are $1,314,223.

This is a $1,829 increase of the fiscal year 2026 budget of $1,312,394, or approximately 0.14%.

In fiscal 2027, they're making adjustments for cost of living increases for $25,107, step increases for $563.

Additionally, the environmental court VA fund mentioned previously, it's being reduced from this budget and added to the environmental budget.

That is a reduction of $63,420.

The total proposed fiscal year 2027 salaries of $767,404.

The first discretionary line items are posted, which is self-explanatory.

The next is Jesus and subscriptions.

This is CDL testing reimbursement for staff as well as membership dues for GPW staff.

There is a modest allocation of $7,700 for office supplies for all divisions, as well as $2,000 for stationary, which remain unchanged.

There's a budget of $1,998 for miscellaneous expenses, which represents state licenses and fees.

Maintenance and service is building security, and that we are seeing a decrease of $2,000 based on historical spending in Trent.

And the last fixed cost is the copy and lease maintenance, which is under contracting budget at $7,000.

There are no contracts above $50,000 in this division.

They are on page $326 of your budget book.

It is generated from engineering-related sewer fee.

This is another division that was being affected by the MLA we discussed previously.

That is adding $39,985 to this division's budget.

When we factor that in with cost of living increases of $27,276 and step increases of $1,091, if we're just total proposed proposed fiscal year 2027 salaries to $847,657.

This budget is in Brooklyn to fix the discretionary line items.

The first discretionary line item is small tools and shop supplies, followed by construction and maintenance supplies and gravel and sand.

All of those line items are level funded and unchanged from fiscal year 2026.

Maintenance and services saying of a small reduction of $6,000 and supported by historical trend.

The last discretionary line item in this is special casting.

These are passing manhole covers and inlet stones that are needed throughout the fiscal year by the Superman throughout the city.

And we are reflecting an increase of $15,000 based on the bid we received from that vendor.

The next is structures and improvements.

This was a $20,000 elevation, which remains unchanged, and this is for non-capital CIP investments, and or we have had to dip into this previously if there's a repair or something above and beyond traditional fountain maintenance that we need to pay for in the fiscal year.

This contract is listed on page 39.

It's a fell teleco and you did go out to get this law.

Yeah, it just thank you.

Did parks also have a budget item for fountains?

I do not believe so.

This to my knowledge is the only one contract.

Sorry, I thought it was I thought this was in part.

Okay, thank you.

I think it's been a little bit of a decision who's going to find the captions, but they've been here for the past couple of years.

Got it.

Um the next division is store response, which is a change from a few years ago.

Um the fiscal year 20.

This is certainly not a revenue generating department.

Um fiscal year 2027 proposed budget is $2,291,500.

This represents the $80,000 increase of the fiscal year 2026 budget of $2,235.

Uh the bulk of these contracts are considered discretionary.

However, private contractors is considered a fixed line item that's budgeted at $150,000.

And this is any sort of private snow vendor in the original throughout the fiscal year.

When we move down to the supply line, we can see that there's a small increase in miscellaneous expenses, which is additional funding to provide enhanced GTS service, should that be available, like where the department is looking into that option right now.

Uh but this line item in general covers any sort of necessary food for activations, winter apparel, as well as salt storage.

Construction and maintenance supplies are level footed at $50,000 as our materials snow and ice removal.

This is salt, sand, and magnesium fluoride that is needed for uh snow and ice removal.

Uh rentals not classified, our budget is $611,000, which is a $56,000 increase over the fiscal year 2026 budget.

We're hoping to get some sort of enhanced contract or more specialty equipment in the next fiscal year.

And repairs for equipment has been level 100 out of $150,000.

Um so when it says $500,000 for salaries, uh is that like overtime for standard GPW employees?

It's overtime for anybody working on snow removal.

So it's no matter what department.

No matter the public safety, doesn't typically like if there's some sort of emergency activation of public safety needs to participate, they don't charge their overtime here.

But uh parks, DPW, um, and sometimes public property will charge their their overtime to this budget if it's related to historical income for the next division.

Oh, I'm sorry, we didn't get into the slide on the contracts.

Um, so these contracts have been itemized on site 43.

Uh they're all fairly straightforward.

Um, and we believe the contract and outputs here are what we had anticipated fiscal year 2026.

Um talking to that, but um, just going back to my question, Crystal.

So obviously the actuals for 2026 um fiscal year uh regarding snow uh response uh it's pretty high.

Um what's uh I guess what is finance where did finance find the extra revenues that's covered that expense for the current year?

Uh so right now we're still working on that.

The finance structure turned on essential spend the moment that form started, and so we've been really trying to hone in and buff down our years time to be.

Um, I think at this point in time it's really departmental savings are where the bulk of this is coming from.

Um less offering the order on the top of my head, but I think that's the bulk of where the savings is coming from essential spend.

Yes, we are at yes, the director's trying.

We are seeking federal reimbursement, however, we can't count on that for this fiscal year, so we are just trying to control costs as much as we can for the remainder of the fiscal year to stay within the budget and ensure we can work those costs.

Uh the next division is the traffic engineering division.

Uh their budget details can be created by page 331.

They have budgeted $620,000, which is a slight increase of the 26 budget of $195,000.

This is primarily in a detailed salary revenue line and supported by historical revenues.

There are no proposed changes to FTEs or salaries in this division in fiscal year 2026.

They budgeted $788,124.

And fiscal year 2027, we're making the adjustments for cost of building increases at $5 million,000, step increases to $624,000.

And proposed to bring total proposed fiscal year 2027 to $785,301.

The traffic engineering budget has also been programmed to fix the discussion and line items.

The vast majority of these line items are considered discretionary.

The first is being non classified at 10,000.

Next up, we have the mislayed professional services, which are budgeted at 10,000 dollars.

There's an allocation of basically expenses for $3,000, small closing shop supplies for 10,000, traffic signs of $70,000, repairs to equipment for $56,100 necessary for signal repairs and maintenance.

Additionally, there's $180,000 allocated for line shipping, which is usually under contract.

Contracts related to this department that we've listed on slide 49.

The largest of which is safety markings for line searching.

Additionally, there's a contract that's just date signal for purchase and repair traffic signals and from a line for traffic signs and related materials.

And we should drink the water.

No, no, no, thank you.

I appreciate it.

So they know I actually did allow the move so anyone have any questions for Crystal before we move on to direct their question.

I'll be here.

No, this is this meaning is not a goal to continue about Crystal.

So she leaves where we're all done.

Director, the floor is yours.

Before you start, I just want to say uh obviously your department has uh dealt with a lot this past year in many ways.

Um we're 15 counselors uh are very grateful to all the work that we just do uh for all the service you do.

Thank you so much.

That means we'll start we'll start on a positive.

I'm probably more of a positive because now it's just so it's just so you're aware where where I've come before.

Um before uh a director starts sometimes I'll say um you know thank you for everything you've done.

Um are your concerns uh where uh where are we falling shore uh because of limitations, so sometimes I kind of throw directors or administrators off a little bit.

I'm probably more positive in that aspect.

Not saying that this conversation is gonna go negative or anything.

I actually I actually have a couple of remarks if you would allow me.

Um and they are actually very positive.

Um I'm almost halfway through my fourth year as DPW director, and in this last year, I've seen really a lot of um uh advancements, if you will, um not just within the culture itself, but in the work and the productivity that's happening.

Um certainly the move for um many of us from 700 Allen's um to 75 chapter has has played a big part in that.

Just having just having a workspace that's clean and safe and professional and um really uplifting.

Um it has made a huge difference, I think, in the quality of people's um outlook when they come into work.

Um, and I think the work actually reflects that.

Um, I'm very grateful to be part of this team.

This is the reason I I bring all of them here is they're the experts.

Um, and so um you know it's important that you hear from the experts in their individual divisions.

Um I do want to acknowledge that we do receive an awful lot of support from council and from the Rainers Administration, and without that, we wouldn't be able to do the work that we've been doing.

Um, starting with uh we touched on a little bit the trash and recycling cart rollout.

It's a huge undertaking for a city this size, and I have to say that um not been without hiccups, and we're not 100% done yet because we still have to take care of some of the some of the things that lag there.

Um, and again, it's been an amazing team effort from sustainability and DPW environmental that literally deal with it every single day.

Um we did make some changes to how the environmental inspectors do their work.

Um, when we made the move to 75 Chapman, we we kind of restructured them in a way that allows them to be able to feel longer during the workday and to have eyes on things in a different way and to do some of the work that would normally drive them back to the office in the afternoon to be able to do that work right there at the field.

So I feel like that's um been a real improvement.

Um we are working with the recycling team from uh Zero Waste Providence, as I mentioned, and between an RO and environmental staff and sustainability.

Um we are seeing an increase in recycling rate that I'm really hopeful and and confident is going to continue that trend, and that's the real savings.

Uh that's a real dollar savings for province decisions.

Um snow clouds have started to arrive.

Hallelujah.

Uh we've gotten three so far.

We had a contest today in the first one, it's called Plough Vidence.

Where is this contest advertised?

So the first contest was held among DPW staff as part of our celebration of public works week last week.

We had a contest where staff suggested names.

Uh and uh and uh so that was the winning name, and I liked it because it wasn't Google, someone actually thought of that.

Um it's on the side of the snow plow now.

We've already had it put on there, and and uh we plan on running another contest to name another snow plow.

We did kids from the rec center, so we can see so.

In addition to that, we we continue to make operational improvements to snow response.

It was a really tough winter, as we all know.

Um, but if nothing else, we've learned some lessons.

We always learn lessons after every storm.

After every storm, I can be my team that we have what we used to call in my old place a hot wash, basically.

Okay, what worked?

What did what do we need to do better?

What do we need to do different?

How can we make this work better?

Um, and so we've certainly learned a lot of lessons from this past winter, and we're spending the off season, if you will, to um to work on initiatives to improve our response to snow.

So we can continue to get better every season.

Um, we're continuing our proactivity in sewer operations with strong water response and proactive preventative measures.

Um not seeing the again, not what the flooding that we saw in our in our in the first year that I was here, and that's due to a large amount of work done every day preventatively by the super division.

Part of that is the hurricane barrier that work complete.

That was a can that was kicked down the road for for many, many, many years.

And I'm very very pleased that it's finally gotten done and done right, and it's going to be maintained, and that's that's just for the preservation of the city itself.

Um, and so there's a really smart thing that has been done, and I appreciate the council's support on that.

Um, spring is here, so sidewalks, road paving underway, um an awful lot of bridge work um has been spearheaded by our chief engineer Craig Hoffman in a way that has really not happened before in the city of Providence, and certainly by DPW, and I credit Craig for that for taking the lead on that.

Um, that's gonna ensure safety and good uh safe bridges to the city of Providence for decades to come.

Um, traffic calming and curbside management are slammed as we as we talked about in a in a hearing uh a couple of weeks ago.

Um recently, um the curbside administrator um Melanie Jewett and I visited the DPW in Boston to look at their operation, pick up a few tips from them.

Um it was very informative, but we also have some good networking now.

We have some other experts in that field that we can tap into to help improve our own operations.

Um and traffic calming, certainly.

Um I know Nate works very closely with council staff on all of those requests and to get them right.

Um we've even made some administrative improvements.

We're using less paper, uh, we're using figured out ways to use staff time more efficiently.

Really feel like the professionalism in that area has been has been raised again in part because of the community building.

And when you look out the window of my office now, you can see the construction of the new DPW complex, um, which is really good to position DPW to provide top-tier city services for decades to come.

It's going up fast.

Every day I look at it, I can't believe how much has already been done, and it's um incredibly gratifying, especially to long-term staff who thought it would never happen.

Um, but it's it's gonna be an amazing benefit for the city.

Um so happy to be here and happy to answer your questions.

Awesome, thank you.

Before we open it up to committee, uh, just because this topic uh has been so or was, and I mean, now neighbors are starting to ask what what lessons have we learned, and more importantly, what are we doing uh to provide a better response when it comes to uh snow removal and obviously you know we all know this was historic uh numbers uh but neighbors pay taxes and demand uh services from us.

So what can you tell us uh right now, director, uh on lessons learned and more importantly, what are we doing and how can we uh supplement any requests uh that that might uh support those efforts?

Sure.

Um some of the things we're frankly already in the works, they just hadn't arrived yet, which is the snow plows, and we expect um I believe six more uh new snow plows.

So that you know, certainly the equipment, our equipment is aging, and so we're very happy to be bringing our new equipment.

Um we struggle with our vendors who who in in decades past brought us large trucks.

Um there were companies that that would use you know their bring us their six-wheelers, their ten wheelers, and those have kind of fallen off.

Um, and and we've really rely, we're really relying now on vendors that they're great, but they're bringing us pickup trucks.

You can't really plow problems with pickup trucks.

So we're looking at now better utilizing vendors who can bring us better machinery.

And so that's one of the things that we're looking at.

We learned that certainly you don't want to ever have to deal with another 38-inch storm.

We don't have to, um, but there are opportunities to use larger trucks, and so we we're breaking up our storm response into tiers, if you will, and so there's a level of storm um prediction where we know we can handle it in-house, and then there's a level where we need a little help from some vendors, and then there's a level where we're going to need a lot of help some from bigger vendors.

Are those tiers and plates already, or are you just no?

This is all as I said.

We're meeting we're meeting um our team is meeting, and we're working on really a snow playbook, if you will, um, for the future and for even just next winter.

Um, and so that's one of the concepts that that we're looking at.

We're also looking at better communication with the community.

We heard that loud and clear.

Um, people want to know what can I expect a snowplow in my neighborhood?

Um, and so we are researching with public property um enhancements to the GPS system that currently exists that might provide us better opportunities to provide better communication um with constituents for things like that when might see a snowplow in my neighborhood.

It's not an unreasonable request.

Um, and so we want to be able to do that better and provide a better link between Snow Ops, uh, which is the war room, if you will, at DPW during the snowstorm in the community that relies upon us.

So we're looking at a lot of different things.

Um nothing's been totally pinned down right now because it's it's 85 out of God, but we know that we'll be ready when the first flake hits, we know we're gonna have a better system.

Yeah, follow-up uh counselor Pearson.

Thank you.

Um, just a quick question.

What was the structure of the communication with this big one that we had in um because of the reaction of our constituents?

It's it's probably good to know so that way we can understand a little more.

Sure.

I mean, it wasn't it wasn't really um formal.

Um with the Glizzard, we did have, I mean, the mayor moved in.

The mayor and his team worked in a conference room down the hall from me for the entire week.

Um, and so we did we had good um interaction with the comms team from the mayor's office, and they pushed out an awful lot of messaging through social media, through you know, through those avenues.

Um we want to build on that, and so that's why we're looking at how can we how can we take information literally from the truck that's on the road in your ward and and and turn that into some information that the community can use.

Um, and so it's still early on, yeah.

Um talking to our current GPS vendor and working with the fleet manager to see what kinds of options there are for us.

Thank you.

Um is it a follow-up on the topic?

Oh, okay.

So I do have another follow-up or go ahead.

Sure.

Um, my my question on this topic, uh, director is the whole system of inspectors.

Um to me, it makes sense when we have the um capability, I guess you could say, to keep open with Slower, but I feel once the once uh once we reach a certain limit where we're not able to keep up with it for me, in my opinion, unless I'm not comprehending something is not uh resources spent well.

Um so maybe if that could be factored into the tier system would be my feedback.

Um it has been.

Yeah, um, I don't disagree with you at all.

Um, I think you can hit the nail on the head.

So one of the things that we're looking at revamping is that entire system of inspectors.

One thing we we did toward the I don't want to say the end of the blizzard, but kind of that midweek point when when we almost started turn a corner, and but we weren't there yet.

Um we divided the city up into quadrants rather than just the 15 wards.

We still have people, we still had someone in every ward.

Um, but we divided the city into quadrants and made kind of like super inspectors, if you will.

Um, and we found out that it worked really well because it allowed for the for an exchange of resources among those different parts of the city in a much easier way than when there were 15 of them, each guarding their own territory.

Um, and we also frankly hand picked them, and so we picked the the best ones.

Um, and so it's um the management of inspectors has at times been very challenging and counterproductive and a time suck, if you will, during snow operations, um, the time and resources that can be better spent, and so that is absolutely something that we're looking at to change and improve.

Thank you.

Uh my chairs are let's follow up on that.

I don't think the inspectors worth at all, my opinion.

Some do.

No, no, I'm just saying I don't think I agree.

The whole system I think it would have been it needs to be overhauled, absolutely.

I went out of my own ward, and I know all the council people did.

I went out and I got stuck, so I went back in.

Like I'm calling stuff in that inspectors, I don't know where they were, and I called the inspectors, and then they weren't where you know.

I'm like, how about this?

Oh, that's not my area, that's this guy's area.

So I call that guy.

Oh, I thought I had this area.

It was very confusing.

They were not on the same day, in my opinion, that and that.

But as far as the GPS, um, does all vehicles in DPW including yourself from top to bottom?

Do they have GPS in their vehicles?

Yes.

And who keeps track of that?

So I have access to all the DPW vehicles.

Um, property has access to all this all city vehicles because it's not just us, it's parts, it's property, it's DIS.

Um, yeah, I think each director has access to their own department.

Um, I but what do we do in the vendors?

In other words, the vendors that come in, there's quite a few.

They don't have GPS.

So that's one thing that we're looking at too is is how do you how do you install, if you will, a GPS system in a gender to vehicle.

We're we're looking at everything from air tags to add-ons to our own GPS system that would that are more portable that would allow us to like hand is there something I can hand to a vendor and say, go put this on your dashboard that will allow me.

Um we're still in the early early part of um that conversation to find out what the options are, but it's part of the problem.

So if we have a snowstorm tomorrow, that's a bid we're not ready.

I know it's off the track, but I mean we've had we had back-to-back snowstorms and when everybody talks about the blizzard, right?

But I personally thought the first one was a failure.

In January, the January 23rd snowstorm was was um the date burned into my memory.

Um that was 17 inches, right?

And it was followed by that deep freeze, which is really what hurts.

17 inches we probably could have dealt with at some point, but the fact that it froze into cement within a day, that's where the really hard part came.

Um I know we talk about it.

Back to back being in the fire department for 28 years, we did the same thing.

We talked about this, we talked about, we talked about a shooting with Brown and Odd, and it never happens.

You know what I mean?

Then when it happens, we're like, oh my god, what do we do?

Even though we talk about it so much.

So I mean, I like the idea of talking about it, but my fear is that come because I mean we all heard it as council people that you know, what are you doing?

You know what?

I'm like, listen, my street's not uh oh, you got Yank, you got poll, and I'm like, I got no poll.

My streets look, I got a four-wheel drive pickup, I can get out in and out, but I couldn't get out.

So these are three days.

There's so many aspects to it too, um, including training.

We have a lot, uh we have a cohort of younger, newer staff who don't have the experience in snow clouds that this department used to have.

So we're addressing that issue.

We're working with the public works association to provide them with some specialized training.

Um, we are matching up experienced cloud drivers that we have on staff with some of the new guys, and on the off season, they're gonna drive their wards.

There's no snow cloud, but they're gonna they I've seen I've seen this done sort of like unofficially or informally with an experienced cloud driver who takes it upon himself to take the new kid under his wing and show them what's what and how to do it, where the trouble spots are in that ward.

Um we want to formalize that.

So Sal and I are working to identify who we can who do we match up so that they can have that kind of muscle memory before there's someone around.

Um so training is definitely part of it.

It's it's not just that a snow uh plow didn't go down your street, it's what do they do when they get there?

Did they plow perfect curve or did they just do one pass down the middle?

That's a training problem.

Um so we need to address that as well.

So there's there's a lot of different aspects to it, not just not just knowing what to do, but knowing where they are, having people assigned to the same wards to the extent that we can every time so that they're comfortable with it, they know where they're going.

And having a plan where we're we're working with a project manager, um, and he's gonna help us with whether it ends up being a GIS system for us or not, or even just a paper system where if if if you're going, if I'm sending you to ward five, where are you going first?

Where's the first street you're going to?

Oh, I'm going to, you know, Joanne Street to still have my off.

I don't go there.

And so like I wanna I want to be able to know as we're sitting in Snow Ops that if if we started plowing at five and you're in ward five, you should be on Street X, you know, and then when I look at the GPS and you're not on Street X, now I'm asked, where are you?

Why are you on Street X?

That's where you should be.

Um at the beginning of, you know, because we we have a priority of cloud, mains, hills, hospital roots, trasher, school groups.

And so we we have an idea where you should be.

Um we need to make sure that that's where you are, and that when you're there, you're actually doing what you're supposed to be doing in terms of the way things are supposed to be cloud.

So many people at DPW do this well, they've done it for decades.

They can stay awake for an ungodly amount of time doing this work, and they do a fabulous job.

But it's it's a big city, and we need to do better.

And so we know that, and that was that's what working on that.

Of course.

Have we looked into because I know I was listening and hearing on the radio, like the trucks were sliding down the hill, obviously because I see and everything.

Have we looked into it?

I'm going back back in the fire department days because they don't have them either, like chains for the vehicles.

It's very hard.

Is what I'm it's what it's what the experts said to me.

The chains are we we have a long talk about chains in Sally.

That's the back of the road, but it's also it it puts a lot of wear on the truck.

Okay, and also I've been kind of monitoring since the last year and a half or so on jobs.

There seems to be a lot of job openings in PPW.

Can you explain that?

Like why I'm hearing people leave and go into the state.

I'm hearing people leaving just in general, like and I question like what's going on now.

I know you can't part two on that question is when you hire these people, do the directors of that department get their choice of people, or it goes up to the you know, the witch-caller.

Yeah, we've got this guy's got a CDO, he's got this, da-da-da.

Oh no, we've got to hire this person because he was recommended by blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

How does that work?

So, two questions.

One is why is there so much turnover in this in the in the uh department?

So part of the turnover is related to something like work is comp if you have a few people out of work as comp, then you then you do that kind of shuffle where you take that guy's job on a limited basis until he gets back.

If I can real quick, how many people off on work that's comp?

On uh I don't have a number of my fingertips.

It's a handful.

I don't well, but I guess the problem is so there's that kind of shuffle that happens, and that's what that's kind of that's kind of a pain in the neck, really, because then everybody goes back, and it's very difficult to keep track of.

I will say that the the entry-level positions in the highway um are have generally been able to be filled, the laborer positions, and those are chosen by the superintendent and his deputy.

They interview people and they choose who they want.

Um, and I will say that some of the some of the positions we've challenged we've been challenged to fill that require a skill set that is not, I guess, as widely available as it once was.

Cement footage.

You and I have talked about this before.

Are we filled?

Are we full on that or not?

We just brought one on, and I think do we have a second opening?

One work.

Sure.

I mean, we we recently how long was that guy hired before he went off on work with Scott?

Oh, and was he reasonable?

He had to have been a recent hire because we didn't have anybody before.

No, he's he's gone a couple of years, but I think I will say that we did have two really good candidates.

We we brought them all the way to the to the end, and and then one failed as we see.

And so that it happens, and so we hired the other.

Um, salaries are not always competitive depending on the job.

Um, some people can decide that they they might make more money with either the private sector or for the state.

Um, but we we've we've been rolling along hiring pretty well more recently in hydro.

We filled a lot of positions, but there's you know, it's first channel.

My last one.

So I know and I've got a quick careful on this one.

But um, you haven't been working with a deputy director for like five months, my understanding.

Uh, who has been doing that job?

And in my opinion, I don't think we need that job.

I would rather see that go to laborers because if you have done without five months with a deputy director, in my opinion.

Director Burger is a good idea.

Can you um can you confirm um has it been five months since since you haven't had uh a deputy director, or what's the time frame?

So to the extent you should not talk about, I would not recommend that you speak about personnel matters just because I don't think it's been properly right.

But the question is is there a deputy director now?

It's a deputy director, but not so yes, and so to that end, like whether or not like that is a matter of public record if the person is in a position or not.

So yes, so yes, but then so yes, what so yes to answer that question to say surface level if you go any further?

I can't I know that question, but I want to hear from here.

No, yeah.

So then it would be so there is a currently today a deputy director.

Right.

But is how long is that deputy director, but how can I ask that question?

It would depend on whether or not it would depend on whether or not the response speaks to a personnel issue.

If it does, then I would recommend that that matter not be touched upon in a public meeting without a publicity.

And I'm just gonna I'm gonna kind of go off track here.

This is a problem I have when a department comes in front of us, so we can't ask questions because that's the big elephant in the room in my role.

Not the fault of the director, not fault of the administration, not fault from the water.

But if we can't get answers, then what are we doing?

Like we're we're bringing through, we're hearing all these money, money, oh we've got this, that, and that.

But the big answer is we can't ask that question.

So I would just indicate I look at it as a business.

We're the we're one part of the the business owners, and then there's the other part of the administration, but we can't ask questions because no, no, no, that's it's the personnel matter.

I'm not getting into personnel matters, but I just want to know like if there's not a deputy director for the last five months, if that person's not there, whoever does, they're not there.

Then why do we need a deputy director?

That's my question.

Is it that money well spent 130,000 more spent?

We couldn't hire almost three laborers where we need the they could fill potholes, but we eliminate the claims and pending suits with all the top hole people that put in stuff.

So that's where I'm trying to go with it, but it's like and I can't ask those questions.

I knew that coming in here, and I actually talked to the uh chairman that I was upset on that because I personally wanted to go into an executive session to do that.

And I was told I couldn't.

Um I can respond with that guidance.

I threw a lot back.

I'm not throwing, I'm just I and uh here's the thing, I'm I'm a research, so to the extent I can help at all.

I'm gonna try, and if you can ignore me, of course.

Um so to your question as to whether or not the director now has a recommendation to have a deputy position or allocate resources otherwise, that's I think an appropriate question because that is general and not specific to a position of a person.

So whether or not the comp structure, that structure, which is what you're going to pass on, or as part of the budget, that's an appropriate question.

It's getting into the granular who, what, where, when, why the particular person that's something that I would agree with you that in the correct it should go to executive session if specifically talking about it.

But I was denied that.

So not you.

Well, I know someone in the department, but not you.

But to but to the extent, make it no for the record that was the chair.

It wasn't the chair, it was someone in the law department.

But to the and I go back to say that's why I say that the city council, and I've said it all along in my eight years, I've been here, no disrespect to you.

But the city council should have their own voice.

But to the extent that you have that question about allocation of resources, I think that's a perfectly valid question to ask.

I guess my question was respectfully.

I I think the department does need a deputy.

Um it's a it's a large, I mean it's a it's a small department, but it's a large department, if you know.

So they mean there's seven divisions.

It runs the gamut from emergencies, snowstorms, floods, to the mundane of potholes and but then sidewalks and trash pickup and um sink holes.

I met with a woman this morning um on in Federal Hill who had a tree invade her sewer system um something like a week after she moved in uh and and bombarded our house with sewage.

Um was out there this morning with with Sal and with the city forester talking about this tree, try to figure out how to her husband's blind and she's afraid he's gonna trip on the sidewalk, which is being disrupted by this tree.

So we went out there to look at it and to talk to her about it.

These these are things that really matter to people.

Very many great quality of life things.

Um, but it's it's a lot, I think, for one person, i.e.

the director, whether it's me or or another person who's who's the director of this department to try to manage um alone.

And I think that there is and has been a need for a deputy who can be a real partner to that director to forward the priorities of a department to to be someone as a backstop from the director who might not be available.

Um I will say that that in the period of time that we're not gonna mention, um I have relied on division heads um in this department to help me with a lot of kind of the extra that I that I've needed to deal with, and they've risen to the occasion beautifully, but that's going to seem the detriment of their of some of their own work.

Um, I really do think a deputy is very much um in need in this department.

Just a little history on that for people that don't know, because I've been in the city for 39 years and 28, 29 of them being in the fire department.

There was no deputy in in public works recently within the last probably eight to ten years, they hired a deputy and then before your term, and then you know that person was like whatever happened on the left, and then you or somebody hired the new deputy.

Um but I'm just saying that I didn't hire them.

Okay, well, but um, do you think don't you think that three if you could do three labors would be more productive than someone going out to talk someone because if you had the three labories to go out and fix that problem, they wouldn't be calling you or any director head to fix the thing.

Um don't call me impertinent, but I want oh I'd love to have as many laborers as as I can get.

Well, they'll say they'll say they'll say it in the fire department is uh or anywhere.

There's more chiefs than Indians, yeah.

Yeah, so the workers are the ones, and I'm not disrespecting you, but there's more we need more workers because when I was in claims and pending six, I would look through things and say, okay, there's a pothole at my house, 6 Thursday Street, and Shelly Peterson hit it, and she wants to what you call it.

Oh, well, but somebody somebody hit it and they're looking for it.

Now another person a month later hit that same pothole, and then two months later, and I would be like, Is this one hole fixed?

Like, and every time nine times out of ten, they were like, we don't know.

So we're just paying out money like an ATM and we're not getting things fixed, and then we have a deputy that's not there getting paid.

I just uh without getting into this specific situation.

I will I will respectfully um disagree that that that doesn't need to be a chief somewhere overseeing that.

Um you'll achieve it.

So that's your point over.

I am, but there's like every other department in probably.

If we have someone under you that's doing your job, then we don't need you.

Um I'm just saying, I'm just saying.

All right, so there's just you guys can say whatever you want, let's just one person speak and another person respond, and vice versa.

I I will say that um I'm not looking for a deputy to do my job.

I don't want to put my feet up.

Um but I really do believe that it's a necessity for a department that has been asked uh to do as much as this department is asked to do, and that those duties kind of increase as time has gone on as the world evolves.

A lot of us are asked to do different things.

So with climate change, we're doing a lot more with stormwater than we ever did.

So the department is growing in terms of its its span of responsibility, and I really do think that having you know, we're thin managerial, managerial leap.

Is that a word?

Yes.

Um, and so having a deputy for that director, I don't think makes this department um top heavy or wasteful.

I think it's it's it would provide an ability to be more responsive to frankly, the council, um, to be more responsive to the community because it's there's uh there's a division of labor there, if you will, that I think is really important and needed.

And I can tell you that that in this last period of time, um I don't want to I I can just tell you that that it's been work for a long time.

Um to not have that ability.

Um thank you.

There's a couple of follow-ups, I think.

But I just want to say one thing uh we're about getting into the weeds.

Um, as the legislative branch, our our job is to legislate, you know, provide policy, due review.

Um it's not in our best interest to get in the weeds of certain personnel, but there is concern uh once a certain dollar amount has been reached, uh attached to any personnel uh that's not working.

So I just want you to know that that's where I'm coming from with these questions, these concerns.

Although I think I I speak for for a lot of the committee members.

Um we we don't care about the the back and forth rumors, whatever, whatever.

Obviously, you know, uh uh the gossip we might be curious, uh, but our our core interest and responsibility is uh to investigate any time uh a certain dollar amount of employee uh on leave, whatever you want to call it, is being met, and I think that's where a lot of these uh concerns, questions are are coming from, director and folks from the administration.

Um thank you.

Uh I think is your not a follow-up.

Okay, I think counselor Peterson is a follow-up on this.

Yeah, but I don't necessarily know if I remember it right now.

Um with regards to we were going through salaries, and I think that this sort of fixed all of that um indirectly.

Um we did um Chris, you spoke about um changing up the salary grades on certain positions within DPW, and one of the things that um director you pointed out was that we actually are not very competitive in certain areas.

Um, and this is a consistent problem that I've been noticing um across the board on certain things, and it's um it's something that I think is important to highlight because this is a larger conversation that um I've been kind of nudging very very gently.

Um we have a salary review that is still being um I think vetted for a proper uh company to come and help us with.

But I one of the questions, it's a question and a comment.

One of them is that the comment is um I really wish we would have um done a little bit more review on some of our labor positions so that we can actually maintain some of the people.

Um, oftentimes, and this is something that we consistently hear um is that because we're not competitive and they have been able to learn from here, they move on.

And I get it, an opportunity for an increase in cost of in in in wages is something that any of us would do.

Um, but it is certainly um a topic of conversation when we're we consistently hear from our neighbors that things are not um accomplished in a timely manner, and we have gone into detail um for many years at this point about how long certain things take.

Um but what the question is on this particular one, why did we move for an upgrade in the salaries on this one and haven't done the investment to be able to do it on the lower grade um salaries?

So um part of the reason is that the the quote unquote lower rate salaries are local 1033, and any change in that competition would be.

However, what I will say, and I don't have the exact data in front of me.

I do believe recently a salary for laborers had been increased in part because of this issue.

And the MLA that I spoke to earlier today was addressing a lot of those positions.

So included on those positions, particularly in public works are sewer equipment operators, sewer uh senior sealers, equipment leading supervisors, for in general foreman heavy equipment operators, equipment operators.

While this is a costly MOA, these are positions that I'm seeing to your point that are regularly either revolving doors or vacant, and I do think you know, without having to do an analysis, that's not my background, but that that's probably part of the problem, right?

That these salaries are not necessarily competitive.

And so while this did happen mid-year, I do believe it was an effort to acknowledge and immediately correct that as we're getting into, you know, particularly for these rank construction season, right?

Yeah, we need to make sure that we have these people on hand so that we can do all of these road repairs and get all of this work done, and it's in time in the air.

Um, so you know, I think I agree with that.

I would love that process to start year a year ago and be holistic, but I think right now the focus is like band-aiding and kind of triaging in emergent positions while that RFP stay to get out in the entire city that publicly.

Thank you for that.

I um that clarification was needed on my end, and I certainly don't like the band-aid approach, but I certainly understand the need and the reason why.

So thank you.

Um Director, with regards to the position of deputy, um, one thing I would actually like to hear of is from your division leaders on how that might actually be needed.

Um, I know that you said that they've taken on so much more extra responsibility, and I think it's really important to also hear from them to be able to say, yeah, actually, we referred to this and the deputy role.

Um, I think it's helpful to be able to understand.

I know that um I'm gonna flag for you that I'm still I'm waiting on a conversation about uh parking signs on a dead end street in my neighborhood that my neighbors have been waiting five months for a response about, and that is another um these are I don't know if this was something that the deputy handled, but it is something that makes the point that I'm trying to make in terms of or even to um the vice chair's point that certain things if we had a little bit more understanding of the of what's happening, it would be very helpful so that we can also save up the conversation with our neighbors because while they do the process of the 311, or they're reporting it to constituent services, or um finally they're coming up to us to actually try and find some result.

Um to your point, Chair, they are the taxpayer, they we work for them at the end of the day, and it's never, in my opinion, and this is solely my opinion, it's never okay to not provide an answer to a taxpayer um after 60, 90, 120 days.

So I the the division leaders, I would love to be able to hear from just feedback.

Yeah, if I could.

Um when I was hired, um, I remember, and I think I've read this in other forums with some or all of you.

When I was hired, um, I was explicitly, you know, I had a conversation with Mayor, and I said, public parks, huh?

Um, and he said, and this is almost quote.

I think I don't need you to drive the snowplow, I need you to lead the department.

He said the department has been without effective leadership, effective management, and you know how to manage because I was managing an enormous department, so it was basically like a small city, and part of that is the structure of what that management team looks like, and and to councilman Taylor's point, the deputy position is is was a new thing, kind of for DPW.

And my understanding, again, as we want my time, is that the first one didn't work out the way maybe people thought it should.

Um, and then when I was hired, um, as I said, it I did not hire a deputy, there was a deputy there.

Um, and so part of my mission, I'm being very careful.

Part of my mission is to move that department forward in a number of ways.

And but my main mission, as given to me by the mayor, has been to leave that department and to and to help form it into a better managed entity, an institution that that is that is where the lines of authority are clearer, where the lines of responsibility are clearer, um, where the where the professionalism has been raised, where expectations are clearer, and I have spent the last three plus years trying to do that, and I do look forward to continuing to do that.

Um, I think right now that role it has not been fleshed out the way that my vision as gig as directed to me um would like to see it.

Um, and so I I don't know what they honestly think about it, but I think um in fairness to them, it's still been a very amorphous kind of concept.

And so um, certainly any any one of them is certainly free to free to answer you now or later or whatever.

Um, but that's kind of my thought process that it that it's positioned that it was still very much kind of uh in um evolution, and and that evolution needs to continue.

Thank you.

Can I have a follow-up?

So um, what if any if any of the division leaders want to speak up, that's absolutely okay if we want to talk separately, that's okay too.

Um four years in what's the vision now?

As I was saying earlier, I think a deputy director should basically be ready to stand in the shoes of the director of an almost notes.

And I came from a place where I had I had that right hand.

Managing an enormous department with an enormous budget and a lot of responsibility.

You have to have that right hand person.

Which is not to say that these are not incredibly reliable public service.

Every last one of them is they're incredible.

They never fail to answer the call.

But they all have their own divisions to deal with in their own work and their own specialties.

And so none of them can really be like that in their current position, can't also be that right hand.

These are the direct.

And so there needs to be someone who shares the vision, who understands the directives from my voice, and and can help not just divide that workload, but to be part of that team to be that part.

If I asked you who the director is, you could tell me.

If I asked you who's a deputy, you need to tell me.

Because when you see that director, you see the depth.

And to me, that's that's how it's supposed to work.

Thank you.

Um question, but I don't know if it's a follow up.

Yeah, we'll go to counselor Davidson.

Old topic, new topic.

So bring it back to snow, drifted back to snow.

Uh I look forward to talking about snow.

Well, about uh specifically um had a number of constituents who repeatedly requested that bike paths be cleared, and when bike paths weren't cleared, they really wanted to know a why not, and B, well B A when like where is the priority, and eventually it never happened, so it became why not.

So I'm gonna get ahead of their questions for next winter, but I assume this applies in lots of places.

My specific question is in your in your estimation, is the problem not enough people to get in there to do it?

Is it do we not have the right equipment to do it?

Or is it just neither it's just not going to be a priority, in which case we have a sort of a legal problem because we do have requirements to clear those paths.

So it's it is a priority, it's obviously not the number one priority.

Let's be fair.

I mean, it's hills, hospitals, uh, who's got trash pickup the next day.

Um you know, schools, if schools gotta be in session, gotta make sure that the buses can get where they need to be, kids can be dropped off and picked up same um bike paths kind of fall down the the priority scale.

That said, a lot of those bike paths are adjacent to rip to stops with handicap access, and that needs to be clear.

The first two uh things you kind of guessed at, you're you're absolutely correct.

There's a resource issue within DPW, but also an equipment issue, and those are two of the two of the things that we're looking at for next winter.

One of the one of the asks, if you will, when we talk about potentially getting more uh new equipment, is the kind of machinery that will allow us to plow those bike paths, but also bringing on people that we can form into a team to do that work specifically.

It's never gonna be the day of the storm, it's just not um because we we just don't we'll never have enough people so that we're also doing bike paths on the day of the storm or the next day.

Um, but it I wouldn't say it's not a priority, it is a priority.

We've been stymied by by resources and equipment, but we know that, and that's the problem we're trying to solve.

Yeah, uh you know, appreciate that, and you know, that may see like who wants to ride their bike in the snow, like you know, it just doesn't there a there are those people who really do rely on that, but b it's a it's an important those paths are important protected corridors for pedestrians, especially during the snow where we all know the bigger picture and hard to play with the sidewalks, hard to walk, like you know, I would just say, you know, I would do everything I can to support you to get all the resources you need, but include that in the priorities, um, because I you know where where those paths exist in the city, they're important for folks, um, and they're an important element of transportation, especially for people who don't have cars and don't have access to vehicles.

Appreciate it.

Sure.

Thank you, John Liberson.

Uh I'm gonna go to the solicitor first and ask her the question to see if I can ask the question or she can answer.

She's ready.

You ready?

Okay, so my question is what is the disciplinary action?

How is it is it different for a union member versus a non-union member in this department?

That's almost like a legal question because that requires well you are union the union, just to you know if a union person gets in trouble, they have 10 days to suspend it with pay for 10 days, and then after the 10 days, they're either disciplined, fired or we found nothing, bring them back.

Is that the same with non-union?

It is not, I can tell you that just from an understanding of the appointed positions versus union, but that's Kenny's the employment person, and when it comes to like really getting to the nitty-gritty of employment actions, I that's as far as I I personally know.

Okay, so but how is that fair?

I guess I'm gonna say if if they both do one does something wrong, one does something worse.

The non-unus does worse, but the union you know did whatever.

The guy gets suspended, whatever whatever got suspended for 10 days, they got paid, so it's not you know, but then all of a sudden now they get disciplined and they get demoted or they get this or that, or whatever the deal is, they the discipline can be, can't take overtime, whatever it is, but the non-union person is not um discipline.

How is that same thing?

So they did the same thing.

How is that fair?

Well to the union person.

Oh, is the union have to stick by the rules?

It's in the CPA, that's what they have.

The non-union is kind of like a flip of a coin, and they're still getting paid or doing whatever.

This guy's only paid for 10 days with leave, and then he's like I said discipline, found nothing, the molded by it.

Non-union does something wrong, months go by, still paid without leave.

How is that different?

I mean, how why is that fair?

So, fairness as um just to say it's a policy decision, and uh our office can only speak to what the law requires, and with union employees, there's a contract in place, and that's negotiated instruments.

It takes luckily not involved, but I understand it takes months to negotiate those different aspects, and it's intended to be a meeting of minds between two parties.

Uh an appointed position is gonna be dictated by state statute, normal charter, and different ordinances when it comes to the separation there, and it should be a case-by-case analysis in that situation as a how to handle the situation, whatever it may be, uh discipline, etc.

But if we talk charter, we'll talk chata.

In the charter, it says if that non-union person goes past $10,000, they come here and explain why they're still being paid the $10,000.

Why I guess hasn't that happened?

Why the non-union?

Why the non-union person has not come in front of us?

I don't I don't know that that to be true.

I don't know that structure, I don't know that what you're referencing.

So to the extent it has it happened, I don't know that is necessarily the case, but um if you'd like us to review the homework charter and its application in a particular instance.

I'm saying we have charter rules, and it seems to be no matter through my eight years I've been there.

We pick and choose what we're gonna use.

We want to do something here, I forget that and it's all in counsel to everybody.

We all do.

And I just I just I'm going like I said I can't talk about this because I've my hands, I feel like this.

I'm gonna ask you a question, and I can't really ask you the question.

I want to ask because I'm hand off.

Not your fault.

No, I hear you.

Um and did you say you ever want to speak to anybody in the law department?

Um always able to provide legal advice and counsel as well.

Is this including I'll let it do what it would take to go into executive session with adequate notice to any party to not be able to talk about personnel matters or just legal advice is the application of the Home Charter two series of facts.

So you know, I know.

I just can you um just uh since we're talking about it, can you explain if we're gonna go on an executive session?

What what what needs to happen?

A note as you said, yeah.

So similar to the uh general on law open meetings act compliance requirements.

Uh you didn't do a 48 hours notice with posting as to what um what issue you would like to bring to executive session.

Whatever that item is, needs to conform with one of the different topics under the open meetings act that all can be allowed for executive session.

Personnel matters, legal advice, is few other categories that don't have them memorized.

Um, but we would make sure that those that whatever you'd like to speak about falls into those categories.

Um then there's if it's a personnel matter, I believe that notice has to be provided to the individual who's identified as personnel matter for legal advice.

There should be a lawyer in the room because otherwise it's not legal.

So you're just gonna talk about a case.

Um, and there are other different requirements for the different elements, and then the notice itself needs to explicitly cite the um executive session uh exemption for an open meeting within that notice when it's published.

But there's a checklist that I can help.

And just to go on record, I did give that to the chair way more than 48 hours because I know the rule, not his fault.

He was told not to go in the executive session, but I just want to let people know that I know the rule I have to be in the executive session, not his fault, but it's public couldn't go into executive session.

That's why we're here today.

That's why I feel like my hands are tied.

Not your fault.

You weren't the person that told him no.

So yes, no, it's a little more complicated than that, but um just to be clear, I I think um is that gave you more.

My question, I get my my uh my reason to ask the question was regarding the notice to the person.

I I wanted that to be clear that like yeah, we we I think we all know about the 48-hour agenda, but it also has to be notified to uh personnel that is speaking about personnel.

I just wanted to make sure that was clear.

Um, but uh unless anyone else has anything, I think the last thing I would say is that I mean the city council definitely needs to go in executive session over this topic, whether that's in this committee or not committee because committee that's too big.

I think it's um I I disagree with that, but I think that's either here or there, but uh I definitely agree that some type of conversation between council and folks from the administration need to have in executive session on this.

We're all arguing all right, is that more than one councillor Davis?

Are you also sorry?

Uh counselor gorgeous, thank you very much.

Definitely we need a solution, but it's 40,000 that we lose them and you really need a different there.

So for the last six months we've been out with no, and you ask one, and at the same time we're losing money more than 40,000.

Well, let's leave that item for another sanction.

I got a question for you.

Do you have any idea how much fuel we've spent in so far?

Fuel.

I do not pull that for you.

That's in the public work, it's in the public property budget.

Is there a budget?

Are you talking about auto fuel?

Autofuel, yeah.

Yeah, yeah, I can get that budget number for you.

I don't have on the DP Lobby only.

Uh so all the fuel costs are charged to the public property budget.

So please fire anybody who's buying fuel for an auto is is being paid for.

But they separate it by cars.

They DPW they know who's pumping gas today.

Uh the Department of Public Works does get a report from the vendor on the accounting side, we see 100% of the expense paid by public property, but I could reach out to the fleet manager and see if he has a report of usage by department if that's what you're looking for.

Right.

Yeah, but I'm saying like a DP loaders bumping 20 gallons today, those voting works will find out is come from came from the DP loading.

That's the question.

Um, so the the gas cards that are given to individuals are tracked by the individual.

I believe there's reported capability from our vendor, but I there's not like I don't think the DPW director gets a report once a month of how much per division is spent, her departments have spent on gasoline.

Like I don't think that's a process that exists currently.

The reason is because with five dollars a gallon, or five dollars in this, we need to find out ways how we can start less use in the trucks or make one tree for the whole city or anywhere by start saving money and um on fuel because you asked for a lot of money in this budget, and we have to figure out how you guys want to say, look, today these departments are taking the car home because they're starting using your own car now because we pay him for you to take the car home, go back and forth.

It's not an emergency on summer time.

Tell me what the merging is.

Well, there can absolutely be sewer emergencies.

We have uh uh we have sewer two employees in our sewer division who respond to emergencies at all days or hours from home, um, and they need to have those vehicles.

I mean, one of them has a band full of uh equipment in order to respond to that emergency.

If you're in your home, your constituents in a home having a sewer emergency, you don't want to wait for that guy to go to the EW, you get his truck, get the equipment, and then he can go right to that emergency.

And so they're not limited to snuff.

There are many emerges in the hub we get so far in these years.

Oh, I don't know.

I can find out.

That's the question.

Like every time we ask you a question, nobody knows.

I can find out that the same well, to be fair, Congressman.

I mean, it's it's it's the it's the contingency, right?

having a sewer emergency you don't want to wait for that guy to go to the DPW get his truck get the equipment and then go he can go right to that emergency and so they're not limited to snow there are how many merges in the hub we get so far in these years oh I don't know I could find out that's that question like every time we ask you a question nobody knows I can find out that the same well to be fair counsel I mean it's it's it's the it's the contingency right it's the it's the um I might not have had any house fires in my house in the last year but I have smoke detectors and I bought smoke detectors in case um and so a lot of that a lot of those um the the people that have the take home vehicles and this is a very small number in DPW who have the take home vehicles um there that's the it's not um it's not like a perk of their job it's it's in recognition that the work that they're could be called upon to do is going to require a speedy response to that emergency we hope it never happens but in case it does you want that guy to be able to go from home to that emergency um one of the one of the people that has a take home truck is our uh traffic electrician you have traffic lights out you want that guy to be able to go from home with the equipment with the truck that he needs to that emergency not to have to stop up at DPW to get his equipment and so forth and so it's yeah I hope it never happens I hope the number is low but I I'm very comforted by the fact that if it happens that guy that staff person's gonna have the equipment in the vehicle needed to get their equipment hopefully never happens but by the time the question gets to the emergency that baseball is going to be a throat that I mean they live three hours away from here no one lives three hours every take home vehicle in DPW is driven by someone who lives in the state of around no one is three hours away from DTW or from properties I think we should name one of the PLOs council no unless you counselor Peterson I would like to ask for an opportunity to work on something with regards to sidewalks and trees that abut um sidewalk my favorite subject um oftentimes when and it's I specifically relate this to an issue that happened in my neighborhood where a tree came down from a windstorm last year um the sidewalk is completely lifted the trunk is not fully removed yet um and the essentially the neighbor was left to call back to 311 to say hey Forester I need somebody to come and assess this so that this can get removed.

Oftentimes when we hear and we have a lot of these um it's the reason why I asked for the forester to be here when DPW was here because it would be helpful to have the back and forth um oftentimes we're uh when our constituent services team does go back and forth to try and figure this out um it kind of just falls or goes into the abyss and we don't actually have a follow up if it's not um if the response isn't necessarily from the sidewalk side but actually the forester needs to come in and assess um and then we don't hear any or or vice versa and then we don't hear anything back.

And so one of the things that I'd like to see if there's a possibility of creating a system for and actually having a little bit of a follow-up uh perhaps to our constituent services team or something through 311 that will allow the neighbor to be advised once the conversation between both parties has happened so that we can then move on a better relay of communication on that particular topic it's one that um is happening a little bit more as our trees are the the trees that are left over and I to the to the forester and to the you know the um the the team here at DPW you guys do a tremendous job but this particular part for neighbors even though we understand that there's a very long process to this sometimes it is very helpful to be able to have just a little bit of um understanding of what it's going to cost if this something that we can do through our very small pockets of funding as counselors um either helpful opportunities to be able to create um just a little bit more communication uh for the neighbor if we can create that and then just follow up um with what that might look like that would be great um and then I think I have one more question no I'm good with that that's it I have a couple of you if you could think of anything else do you have a moment all right yeah sorry um quick question um sorry to go back to the clouds is there um is there any camera equipment on on clouds that they lose the road so one of the um possible add-ons to GPS has to do with um cameras whether they're forward facing cameras that you can see what the chain cloud or whether they're driving facing cameras you can see what the other person driving is doing um and that's uh that's currently in process where we're talking to it's through public property frankly the fleet manager is talking to some vendors to see what the options are um and then getting feedback from all of the departments that have vehicles um in use for city business to see what what our thoughts are in favor of a uh forward facing camera I think that could be really useful too you are supportive of a forward freezing camera plow yes well there isn't any on any right now there's not but it is a potential

And that's a that's currently in process where we're talking to it's through public property, frankly.

The fleet manager is talking to some vendors to see what the options are, um, and then getting feedback from all of the departments that have vehicles in use for city business to see what what our thoughts are.

So in favor of a uh forward-facing camera, I think that could be really useful too.

You are supportive of a forward facing camera plow?

Yes.

Well, there isn't any on any right now.

There's not, but it is a potential, there's a potential for that to be added on.

I don't know where that stands today, but I can say that I have it in conversations with public property, and they've been in conversations with some of the vendors to see what the what the possibilities are.

Right.

Um, and then just the last question on plows on this.

Um I I keep hearing the the the concern or the not the concern, the the challenge of um heavier equipment uh by vendors not being available anymore.

And at the same time, I hear you know, us getting a few more plows.

Um, but I don't I don't think that like closes the issue.

So I guess like what else are we doing to make sure that we have uh proper level of caliber of equipment to handle some of these bigger storms?

Sure.

So that's I mean, we're very grateful for the allocation of new vehicles.

It's it's been a long time coming.

Um literally, it's I think these vehicles were ordered almost two years ago.

They've just taken forever to get here.

Um I'd love to say that they're like adding to our fleet, they're really they're gonna fill holes.

Right.

Um and that's nobody's fault.

That's I don't I don't blame anybody for that.

It's just it's the way it is.

There's never enough money to go around for everybody's aid.

I get that.

Um, but we are really grateful that we that we are receiving that investment.

Um, but to your question, that that goes back to what I was saying before about looking at storms in terms of levels and and what we did learn um when we brought what it what we kind of informally have been calling like the big boys uh with the blizzard.

When we brought the bigger companies in with the bigger machinery, and I'm not talking about the the thing that blows the snow and has the dump trucks following it.

It was fabulous during the blizzard.

Hopefully, we'll never need to have that kind of thing again.

But some of those other larger vehicles that are bigger than what our vendors have been bringing us, like to clear the snow and stuff you're saying.

Yeah, yeah.

So like front end rollers or or or payloaders and some of the backhoes um equipment that we brought in with the the bigger snowstorms, we are looking at how can we utilize those kinds of contracts for non-blizzard snowstorms that are still bigger than our vendors can really handle.

Right.

So that's kind of one of the things that we're looking at and developing um a way to bring some of those on, depending on the tier of storms that we're going to be dealing with.

Okay, actually last question on uh snow response.

I know a couple of counselors introduced uh certain resolutions regarding like reports, um, which obviously I don't know how much justice will do at this point.

Um, but I guess that going forward, um it seems like you're you're doing a lot of work uh around this.

Um do you plan on like writing anything down?

Like what what can I guess what could you provide in writing to counselors in the near, hopefully very near future um regarding snow response um changes, improvements, policies uh going forward.

I I guess hopefully this tier system is is on a paper document at some point, and at least be aware to so we're able to communicate with our neighbors um around this.

So, with the overhaul of the of the city's policy manual in total, that the all the policies that that got um kind of re reissued, rewritten and readmanced, um one of those policies was actually on snow operations and it was um you know timing is everything, right?

So that so the policy that got um you know included in that binder when the all the new policies or the you know refreshed policies from this administration were unveiled.

That's that's the policy I'm rewriting.

Right.

So it's it's it's gonna be rewritten.

Um and so I think that would be a good vehicle for you to see the changes that we want to make.

Um we're not there yet, but we will be um because the work we're doing in the wake of this past winter is is gonna change what's in that existing policy in a significant way.

So I think it will definitely be written rewritten, and I think that'd be a good vehicle for you to do that.

Counselor Peterson.

Thank you.

Just a quick question on the plow vendors.

You had mentioned earlier that um we were beginning to see a lot of plow vendors just bringing the trucks with the front plow.

Can you is there a particular reason why did the contract change?

So they would just bring them on their own.

Well, um, and and so I have the benefit of uh of um people who have worked for this department and work for the city in Snow Ops for a very long time, so they have a lot of history that they tried to educate me on it.

Um, people have just aged out of doing that business.

Um, and then some people who have businesses that utilize that equipment during the day, they don't want to plow the products.

Um they might maybe they'll I can explain.

So maybe they go to the state because when you plow for the state, it's a highway, it's a long straight, generally flat thing.

A city has little streets, powerful sidewalks, uh hills, speed bugs, um all kinds of challenges that really beat the daylights out of the truck.

Okay.

And for a person whose livelihood is dependent on that truck during the day, they don't really want to bring it to us during a storm and have it beaten up.

Now they have to deal with that headache.

Um and so as years have gone on, the the I would say many women, but it's mostly men who have who have brought us those big machines have kind of aged out of the business and and they're still not doing it more.

Okay.

Um whereas you have you know, kind of a crowd of people who's looking, hey, I have a pickup with a plow on it.

Let's go.

It's great.

Can't plow a whole city of the pickups.

Um so that's why I do want to rely on on looking at some of those businesses that we use really kind of for the first time during the blizzard of bringing on some people with the bigger machines when meetings, not every storm.

There are storms where our vendors of pick up trucks in conjunction with highway, no problem.

Um that was the majority for the longest time until this year.

Right.

Thank you.

I think so.

Um last like I have two last questions.

Um the last question uh regarding um it's uh in regards to um mechanics.

I um I dived into this a little bit when public property wasn't it, got brought up, or it was um explain to me how different departments have different mechanics.

Um is your amount of mechanics um obviously we know wars is better uh times, but I guess like what's like the average amount of vehicles that are out of commission at any given time.

So they did with a big roof or snow vehicles?

Um I I I guess yes to both parts.

I guess like they're in the snowstorm.

I'm sure you had uh DPW vehicles go down, or were we able to get them?

Well, the mechanics would identify what the problem is, um, getting the pot as well.

Right.

I can use a sewer truck, for example, uh boom is broken.

It's eight weeks to rebuild crane on that.

So that's a sandwich on depending on if they have to send it out for a contract uh ways to have it done.

So all some similar than these high ranges from that day, I know my truck when my other plan goes down, it's in a hour.

So we can't solve like know what the problem is.

Um if we don't know what the problem is or work on Judy, they're finally will send it out professional and most of the time on mechanics do know what's matter with the vehicle.

So you know we're waiting for a pot or something pre-fat.

So have we um so have we been at this staffing level in terms of mechanics and DPW uh for quite some time, or have you seen was there more before?

Was there less before?

Or has this kind of stayed?

It's about the screen.

We've hired the mechanism in the last two months.

Um pretty much more closer.

Is the equipment maintenance supervisor also a mechanic, or do they just run the garage?

Um, the one that garage.

Yeah, right.

Is he a mechanical?

So what's um what's like his main?

I don't want to say like the personnel.

Well, we're supposed to check the inspection stickers, uh, make sure the vehicles are registered.

Uh some of the guys check the oil.

Then we have like the work ones, so like uh pre-clip uh vehicles.

Um that person.

So the two outside of the senior mechanics, so wait, so you said there's two mechanics higher in the past couple months.

Right.

And one of those is not the mechanic on leave.

Right, one of them is filling in for the one.

So I see here, so under the DPW garage, there's a shoot the shop supervisor, the equipment maintenance supervisor, equipment body repair, senior mechanic, uh, which is specific to body repair, I'm assuming.

I don't know.

And then senior mechanics, there is three, one on leave, so that leaves two.

I I'm referencing an org chart just so you're aware.

Uh so that leaves two.

Um, and then you said two just got hired.

So I guess I'm just trying to understand if all we have at DPW uh mechanic shop right now is is two senior mechanics that are fairly new to the three.

If I may new to DPW, but not new to being an academy.

Right.

Right.

So basically one of the last questions would be hired, uh work for a fleet.

Um stuff.

So right now we have four on duty.

Four on duty.

Correct.

So when the one comes back from leave, you'll have five.

Correct.

No, one will have to go.

Well, unless we can zone from somewhere else.

Okay, we'll get rid of it.

There's one of them, what's called limited because he's filling in for the guy in the military.

My last question.

Uh is it Brandon?

What's uh Brandon?

Yes, sir.

Our first interaction was you uh appearing before us uh in the council chambers uh in regards to uh was it a blizzard?

Or was it pre-lizard posts?

So I I feel like I feel like the council committee and you maybe kind of got off on the wrong start, you could say since then there's obviously been a lot of development uh when it comes to recycling.

Um hopefully we you know we continue some of this work in terms of uh getting our our fines down, more people recycling.

Um so yeah, I guess you just give us a quick overview of what your experience has been, what what you envision?

Um I I've heard positive things about you, you seem like a stand-up guy.

Um so so yeah, just give us uh a couple paragraph or two.

Don't be pressured at all by the fact that I'm three feet away from the speak free.

Um yeah, so far um with regards to the rollout, um here's a passage before uh additionally we've had a good week, it would be like seven trucks passed at the landfill or at the recycling facility at the landfill out of like 60 that we take there weekly um over the last you'll see six to eight weeks, um kind of in conjunction with the car rollout, some of the education enforcement efforts.

We've been averaging probably closer to like I think high point is in 18 Fast.

So we probably average closer to like 13 or 14 taxi weekly.

Um which I mean does it sound like a top of it's uh you know double what we were doing before?

Sure.

Um so that's very encouraging.

Um yeah, so anything other specific that you'd like to hear more about?

Yeah, I I guess what I'm most interested in in getting your thoughts or opinion on is um outside of the um recycling and education, which seems like we've been doing for the past few years.

Um what I guess what what else are we are we doing outside of what this zero providence waste contract.

I mean, shout out to to everyone that that's doing that work and they invited me but uh four again, so it's gonna be hard to get together.

Um I guess like what I'm what I'm thinking is is like how can we continue some of this type of work going forward?

Obviously, you're you're one person, your team is is limited.

Um I guess yeah, how how can we continue?

I just want to what of my concern is I I feel like there needs to be uh a slightly bigger investment.

We were investing obviously in these carts, millions of dollars.

Um I I just feel like there's still something kind of slacking uh or lacking um in this proposed budget to keep that momentum going forward.

And and I love to hear the the collaboration uh with you guys and sustainability and obviously zero ways providence.

Um I I always in the back of my mind uh thought that there should have been a little bit more there from the beginning.

Uh so the fact that that's happening, um yeah, I guess.

I don't know about my question is clear or not.

Yeah, so kind of touched on like the collaboration um between you know DPW, CWP, sustainability, um a little bit deeper than that.

Um our our vendor, WM, um I think really kind of aligned and like strengthened our partnership with them.

Uh they've been a great asset resource um as well.

Um, you know, they're they're fleet of drivers.

I think they have probably the greatest on the street day to day understanding of the status of each of their respective routes.

You know, they see them day in and day out in the of their drivers have been seen the day in the day out for tens of years.

Um and then the folks at resource recovery.

Um we've worked very closely with them as well.

Um, and so I think just kind of all all five of those entities working together all in the same direction, is already starting to yield some pretty good results.

Um, and uh I think you just kind of stayed the course of what we're doing.

Um there's just plenty more to be had.

Um we sat down myself and uh some of the folks at WM and took that info from their drivers, really kind of create a uh call it like a ranking system of you know routes that pass, routes that are like kind of close to passing with a little bit of help could probably get there pretty easy.

Um routes that maybe aren't so close to passing, but have some things working in their favor, you know, lots of single family homes, things that are easily accessible to help get them across the finish line.

Um and admittedly there's also plenty of routes that are just in very bad shape that's gonna take a considerable amount of work, but it gives us the opportunity to kind of prioritize and kind of you know do things are gonna have very immediate impact um you know both for the residency environment, bottom line, um you really kind of capture all that uh with our efforts.

So when did um how how long has that been happening in the prioritizing um levels, I guess, of routes?

Sure.

Um we sat down and kind of went over all that data um you know, maybe three, four weeks ago.

Um so a lot of the work that CWP does, you know, we kind of do in conjunction with one another.

Um, and we try to steer them in the direction where they can make the most impact as well.

Right.

Um and another kind of key thing that we started to do is typically these trucks when they're on your routes, um, you know, it takes two truck fulls to complete one route.

Right.

Um so kind of as you touched on before, you know, these a lot of these trucks are getting on routes very early in the morning, you know, 4 30, 5 o'clock in the morning.

Um so you just that first truck load is almost impossible to capture, like you just can't get out there early enough to get far enough up ahead of them where they don't catch you.

Um so we've had a concerted effort to chase the second truck or a second truck load because it gives us plenty of time to get out ahead of them.

So we can canvas almost that line almost that entire second truck load before that truck catches us.

So therefore, if we're gonna send it to the recycling facility, we can send it with a pretty significant level of confidence that we will pass your real time that day.

Um, and then we keep them on the same routes each week for typically three or four weeks at a time.

And then uh now we're kind of gonna want to see if you know after these weeks of direct intervention, right?

If they start passing their own.

Follow up.

Yeah, so uh so we're kind of coming into this like exciting next phase of some of the routes that we've given a lot of attention.

Um how we'll see how they'll do you know, before not leaving them that direct attention.

So see if you need to be able to make some leeway or headway or kind of interchange.

Right, yeah.

Um I guess the last question I have, thank you.

Uh that's uh that's helpful.

I think a lot of this work uh you know, it's it's kind of in the in the weeds, but like you definitely have to get into it to try to improve on, especially ones that are pretty close.

I think the fact that we can spend a little bit more energy, know which routes you know have got it accepted 75% of the time.

You know, 25% they need help, so giving that extra attention um, you know, helps us in the long run, but also going back and making sure that you know they don't only just do good when we're giving them extra attention, but how do we change some of this uh behavior uh over time?

Um the last question I had regarding garbage routes.

Um is that is like what streets are picked up when um like I don't know, like I I've always have had garbage day on the same day, I feel like since that since I've ever lived in in Providence.

Um but I guess like has that been reviewed, like making sure that it makes the most sense that you know this ward or this part of the city gets picked up on day A, like has that like I don't know when is like the most comprehensive review on garbage collection, and I'm sure waste management plays uh a big role in determining this, but I guess have you done that type of work or uh you need the next type of work like currently like in my current market?

Okay, um, so the the route A's and areas, um my understanding is that that was kind of predetermined by uh WM and what they should be done here in the city.

So we haven't uh you know done any type of analysis to see if changing that would make sense.

Um I don't know that that would you know anything necessarily uh to go through all that.

I guess where what where I'm thinking where it might hope is you if you you know the routes can stay the same, but if say truck A is starting on Leah Street at 4 a.m.

every day uh or every garbage pickup day, but the next week is started at another street.

Um so you could get Leah Street inspected.

Um I don't know if so much work for the drivers, obviously, they're pretty sure probably in uncruise mode, but I think that would be a way to at least be able to capture the data on the streets um that aren't getting picked up so early.

Uh so typically when they're kind of constructing the routes, um, there's certain things for taking into account um offer times, it's like your major thoroughfares, um, areas that if you try to collect them at certain times a day, it would just be nearly impossible with regards to you know just be creating like major traffic issues, um accessibility streets where there's lots of like on street parking, um they just wouldn't be able to physically get to the carts.

Um that side of the core system um so like the accessibility for student work.

Um so typically they're routed, um take a bunch of that type of stuff into account to where they can just kind of speak to service areas that would be difficult as service later in the day.

So that would be hard to pivot off of those things, but yeah, not to say that there couldn't be some type of thing.

You could tell me it was a bad idea.

That was like a personal, that's why I I did this scene for waste management.

Yeah, uh counselor Peterson.

Um I just want to think of a quick point of feedback.

I was going through my emails.

Um I have many service.

Um and I had a couple of neighbors reach out and say that the trash cans are already broken um for a variety.

I don't uh the handles are ripped, the the lids are kind of split in half.

So I don't know if it's just uh a fluke kind of situation, but it's just a little point of feedback that the ward 14 got them less than about three weeks ago.

So um, or some of Ward 14 got them about three weeks ago.

So it's just uh I don't know if this is you guys give any information back to the people that sold us all the cards, but um, I know that I was not the only one to receive um some notice on trash cans that were breaking.

Um already left.

But um you forward those emails to me?

Yeah, absolutely.

We'll do um and I'll have them do the same.

It's just uh just wanted to provide that feedback point because it's a large investment and we should be able to my understanding those are under warranty for a period of time.

Oh great, yeah.

Oh, good.

Yeah, so they came with some sort of warranty.

Good to know.

Yes, um, and if I may also add to just address the concern that the moment on recycling and some stock now that the carts have been delivered, um a large portion of the funding for those carts came from a flipper grant, a team by sustainability department.

Um a large portion of the funding for those carts came from a slipper grant obtained by the sustainability department.

Right.

My understanding is that grant comes with the required reporting requirements on recycling compliance, and so at the very least during the term of that grant experience period, they will be monitoring recycling and reporting back to the EPA on the status of recycling.

Um and so again, not to describe any of the work that the director alluded to, but there is actually like a funder that is requiring this monitoring to report it to them.

Thank you for the consultant.

Um if uh if neighbors report a GARA broken new barrel, what's the 311 or so one?

Okay, but I thought I was still appreciated.

Yeah, absolutely.

It came through my consumer.

So is everything, so I yeah, I'm happy.

Yeah, I've seen a couple on social media.

Oh really?

Yeah.

Uh any other questions?

I gotta use the restroom or something.

Uh I drink a lot of I I drink like five of these a day.

So why are you looking at what you got?

No, I'm just looking at these.

Okay, last question, counselor.

Yeah, that question.

Thank you.

Appreciate it.

Uh appreciate your work and appreciate all the answers today.

Thank you.

We're gonna continue this partnership going forward.

Thank you, Director.

Thank you.

Um at this time, I will understand a motion to continue items one through five.

Second.

So motion made by uh counselor Peterson, second by counselor Davis.

All those in favor, aye, any nays, any opposition, any absence?

Uh motion to adjourn.

Motion made by counselor Davidson, seconded by Oh, second, I'm sorry.

Counselor Peterson, I any names have any absence, eyes have it.

Motion the meeting has adjourned.

More that's why I'm looking.