Good evening, Rockwell.

Today is Wednesday, October 8th, 2025.

This is meeting number 13-25 of the City of Rockwell Planning Commission.

I am Jamie Espinosa, Chair of the Planning Commission.

I am joined in chambers tonight by Commissioners Susan Pittman and Eric Fulton, and online by Commissioner Mungsoon.

Commissioner Cheyenne Salhoudin should be joining us in chambers shortly.

Tonight's meeting is being conducted in person and virtually by WebEx.

Tonight's agenda includes final record plat applications subdividing lots of the Danick Technological Park Subdivision, a level two site plan application at one ninety-eight East Montgomery Avenue, a work session on the zoning ordinance rewrite, and all this will be followed by a regularly scheduled commission items.

So our first item tonight is final record plat applications PLT 2025-00632, PLT 2025-0063, PLT 2025-0634, PLT 2025-00635, and PLT 2025-00636 to resubdivide lots five, six, seven, and eight of the Danick Technological Park Subdivision in conformance with project plan PJT 2017-00007 and level two site plan stp 2020-00393, located in the MXE mixed use employment zoning district at one five eight one five Shady Grove Road, one five eight two five Shady Grove Road, two choke Cherry Road, and twenty ninety-two Gaither Road, Toll Mid-Atlantic LP Company Incorporated applicant.

Over to Mr.

Waselak for any staff presentation.

And our principal planner, Kimmy Azopagarion, is here to make the staff presentation.

Thank you, Jim.

Good evening, uh, members of the commission.

As noted, this is a final record plot application for the Shady Grove Neighborhood Center Plots, and you will be seeing the presentation for that on the screen.

This uh is a presentation for a total of five of the plates that are included in which is uh PLT 2025 dash zero zero six three two through six three six.

The subject property as shown on the aerial map seen on the right here is located at the addresses of one five eight one five and one five eight two five Shady Grove Road, two choke Cherry Road, two zero nine two Aether Road.

The land use is OCRM office commercial residential mix.

The zoning district is MXE mixed use employment.

It consists of a land area of approximately eleven acres, which combines uh all the five proposed plots and the existing uses office.

What you can see on the aerial image here is the existing four lots of five through seven.

Uh just a little bit of background for this application.

A project plan PJT 2017-0007 was approved in 2019.

Level two site plan SCP 2020-00393 was approved in 2020 for phase one of the approved project plan.

An additional major site plan amendment SCP 2024-00489 was approved in 2024, amending one of the conditions of the site plan level two site plan that was originally approved back in uh 2020.

The applicant is proposing to resubdivide lots five, six, seven, and eight of the Danach Technological Park Subdivision per SCP 00393.

Uh, and a one-acre park is also approved with the original site plan, which will be conveyed to the city.

With that, staff recommends approval with conditions of final record platz, PLT 2025-00632, 00633, 00634, 00635, 00636.

And this concludes the presentation with a recommended motion as shown on the screen here.

Thank you.

Do any of my fellow commissioners in the chambers have questions of staff at this time?

Hearing none, uh, Commissioner Sun online.

Do you have any questions?

Do we have a presentation by the applicant?

Representatives by the applicants are on the call.

Um, and uh I will let them take over any uh presentations that they might have.

Sorry, my apologies.

I was muted.

This is Pat Harris on behalf from Lurch Erlean Brewer on behalf of Toll.

We have no comments.

We're happy to be at this point in the process and looking forward to delivering needed townhouses to the city.

Thank you.

Thank you.

I think this one's gonna be a short one.

Does anyone have any follow-up questions?

Hearing nothing in the chambers, Commissioner Sun.

Hearing nothing, uh staff.

Can we put the proposed motion back on the screen?

Do any of my fellow commissioners uh want to make a motion?

I move that we approve final record platz PLT 2025-006320633, 00634, 00635, and 00636 to resubdivide lots five, six, seven, and eight of the Danek Technological Park Subdivision, subject to the conditions in the staff report.

I second.

All those in favor raise your hand, say aye.

Aye.

Uh the motion the motion passes unanimously.

Thank you.

That brings us to it.

Thank you.

That brings us to item number two, uh, level two site plan application stp 2025-00503 to permit conversion of 13,001 square feet of previously approved street level retail in 13 residential units at 198 East Montgomery Avenue, Comstock 33 Munro LC applicant.

Over to Mr.

Waslack for any staff presentation.

Well, thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Uh, this is also an implementation step for a project that you've seen previously, uh, which was to convert uh some of the retail space at Boulevard 44 to residential loss, uh, which require a project plan approval, which the mayor and council did recently.

And senior planner uh Christopher Davis is here to make the staff presentation afterwards we're gonna.

If you could identify yourself for the record.

Yes, Christopher Davis with community planning and development services.

And will you provide Drupal testimony this evening?

I will.

Thank you.

So this is the level two site plan for one ninety-eight East Montgomery Avenue as Mr.

Waseleck indicated.

This site plan looks to implement uh project plan which was uh approved by the mayor and council just last month in September of 2025.

The sub uh subject project area is shown on the screen at 198 East Montgomery Avenue, highlighted in red.

The site is located in planning area one corresponding to the town center, and the site area is approximately one point four one acres.

The land use designation is CRM corresponding with the commercial residential mix designation, and the zoning is the PDRCI zoning corresponding with the plant development for Rockville Center Incorporated with an equivalent zone of MXT.

The specific proposal by the applicant is for a conversion of the ground floor uh retail space, which was previously approved uh through the a project plan.

It corresponds with thirteen thousand eleven square feet of street level retail commercial space that will be converted into 13 residential units.

As you can see from the site plan on the screen, the units will front the abutting streets at Helen Hinnegan Way, East Middle Lane, and Monroe Street.

Again, this specific site plan is required by the zoning ordinance to implement the project plan approval.

So as the commission may be familiar, the project plan uh did come to this body for review and recommendation and was ultimately approved by the mayor and council on September 15th.

Um that approval authorized the change of use to the ground floor retail and adjust the mix of uses in the building overall.

So in review of this level two site plan, staff has found that it meets the necessary uh requirements for approval, specifically um finding one that the project will not be detrimental to the public welfare nor injuries injurious to property or improvements in the neighborhood.

Staff has found that the improvements will be limited to the existing building and will meet all necessary safety and adequacy requirements.

Staff also has found that the project will not violate any provision of the zoning ordinance.

Uh the proposed improvements are consistent with the mayor and council's approval through the project plan.

Um in addition, the site will maintain compliance with the zoning ordinance and the applicable standards.

Finally, staff has found that the project will not be uh incompatible with the surrounding uses and properties.

Um this particular proposal to convert um to a residential use is consistent with similar properties and mixed use buildings in the neighborhood.

Um further the project will provide additional residents to the area to support neighborhood commercial uses in town center.

Uh the applicant has met all necessary uh notification requirements as required by the zoning ordinance.

Uh specifically, there was a pre-application area meeting held on December 9th, 2021, and a required post-application area meeting on February 25th of this year.

So having found that all the necessary requirements uh have been met.

Um staff does recommend approval of level two site plan application stp two zero two five zero zero five zero three to permit conversion of thirteen thousand and eleven square feet of street re street level retail into thirteen residential units at one ninety-eight East Montgomery Avenue, subject to the findings and conditions and staff's report.

And with that, Mr.

Chair, that concludes staff's presentation.

Thank you.

Uh do any of my fellow commissioners in chambers have any questions of staff.

Hearing none, Commissioner Soon, do you have any questions?

No.

Uh is there a presentation by the applicant?

Yes.

Ma'am, we have a strict 10 appearances before us per year policy.

And I think you're getting very close.

Probably getting pretty close.

Thank God it's the calendar year is almost over.

Would you identify yourself for the record?

I'm Nancy Reglan from the law firm of Shuman Rogers.

I'm here as counsel for the applicant Comstock 33 Monroe.

And will you provide truthful testimony this evening?

I will.

Thank you.

All right.

So we have been here before on this project more than once.

And we actually gave you a advanced look at a lot of the perspectives during the project plan.

So I am going to go through some of them again just for the record, so that this is a complete record.

And if there's anybody watching online, they can also see them in the course of the site plan.

With me tonight is Chris Green, who's a vice president of Comstock, and we have architects and engineers online if there should be any questions.

So as we said before, we're going to show you the perspectives to show you how we did respond to the feedback that we got from the planning commission and the mayor and council and how that plan has evolved.

And I will also add a couple of comments telling you about some things that have evolved as we've moved forward into the detailed engineering because we are moving forward towards permits in anticipation of an approval tonight.

So if we can have the next uh slide, please.

Just to remind everybody, this is what the building looks like.

That's what the first floor has looked like, uh boarded up with the you know great advertising uh images on it for since uh the building opened in 2021.

Next slide, please.

And the white is the only part of the building that is actually being modified, and those are the conversions in white.

Next slide, please.

So this is the ill illustrative showing the corner of middle lane and Monroe to see how the existing conditions is now being changed with urban frontages.

Next slide, please.

And again, these are the middle lane, and the two things that I wanted to show about this segment of the conversion is that there are two lobby entrances here, one from middle lane.

It's with the red arrow at the top, and also a lobby entrance from Monroe Street, and it takes you back into this interior corridor, which allows people, even though they have a on street door to the sidewalk, they can have private access through the rear of their units through this lobby entrance, and it also gives them access to their mail and package, to some storage areas, and to the trash room.

Next slide, please.

So this is from Monroe Street.

This is the boulevard lofts entrance on the left, and then there's a colored door that's the first entrance.

Next slide, please.

And this slide is provided here because there's a condition to the site plan that says uh about stormwater management.

And this is the only area of the outside other than the planting of the landscaping that we're actually doing work, and we're regrading the sidewalk on Monroe Street because these are fairly sloped from middle lane up to East Montgomery Avenue in order to get an ADA entrance into the Boulevard Lofts lobby and to the first uh unit entrance.

We have to regrade it a little bit so that there's uh a landing right there.

So it's less than 250 square feet, so just to let you know that's what the conditions are about right there.

Next slide.

Okay, so this is the Monroe Street three bedroom.

Um because in front of all of these windows on the three-bedroom is actually uh transformer grates in the sidewalk, and we can't put any planters out there, so the door has been recessed to allow for privacy and uh delineation away from the uh pedestrians walking on Monroe.

Next slide, please.

Okay, so as we move along the Monroe Street heading down towards middle lane, these are the first uh of the units, and you can see how the front doors have been pulled back to give room for planters.

Um and you can see each of these doors.

Uh there will be privacy screenings for light and privacy control on all these units, and what the applicant is looking at is film on those door panes in order to give them some privacy, but to give them some light through those doors.

Next slide, please.

And you can see as we move along the same thing, planters that are indented into the building face.

Next slide, please.

And it takes us to the corner of Helen Hennigan Way and Middle Lane.

And you can see that we have a nice unit on the corner.

Next slide, please.

And as we go up Helen Hennigan Way, there is two units right here at the beginning of Helen Hennigan Way, right at the corner of middle lane.

And then you can see this gives us an opportunity though, because the way is the building is designed and where the garage is to be able to do landscaping in the ground.

And it will be a mix of evergreens with some annuals, and they will be all maintained by the building.

Next slide, please.

So where the woman is standing, she's actually in front of the residences on the lane lobby.

So they're sitting right there as a break between all these units.

And then if you've walked up Helen Hennigan Way, you know that the building floor actually transfers to a different elevation, which is why this is the one unit where the floor is the most stepped, um, that has the uh stair end landing, uh, and then the two additional units, and then another lobby unit, uh lobby door to do the same thing as we saw in middle lane, which is to give you a rear access for all of these residents for privacy if they don't want to use their front door.

Okay, next slide, please.

Okay, and then that's I'm just pointing out where the residences are and where that rear corridor is, and there'll be trash collection back there for these units as well from there.

Next slide, please.

And then last visual on Helen Hennegaway.

And the one thing that I want to point out, because this is one of our last perspectives, is you'll see that each of these stores are different colors.

They were a spectrum of colors, and as the uh design has evolved, um they're looking more at reducing the size of the spectrum of the colors and keeping them more consistent.

Um so we may see when they're actually built that the door are not this range of yellows and reds, and that they may be within a smaller spectrum of colors.

All right, next slide, please.

Okay, so to close, we do accept the staff's conditions, and we thank you for your consideration of the site plan.

We're very excited on behalf of the applicant to be able to provide this kind of alternative dwelling unit for people who want to live in town center, and so we respectfully request that it be approved so we can move forward to permits as soon as possible.

Thank you.

Thank you, ma'am.

Uh, any questions of uh the applicant from commissioners in chambers?

Nope.

Uh Commissioner Sun, do you have any questions of the applicant?

Uh I just have some comments.

I think uh as we've cut last time, we're just how one to make sure the uh the windows will be uh noise uh mitigated for all the units.

Yeah, absolutely.

Yes, we have gotten your comments back on that, and uh they are looking at that closely.

Um the windows in the ancel above it already has uh noise impacts, and so they're designed in certain way for that.

So they assume that they're gonna be the exact same type of windows in order to mitigate um noise as well as privacy.

So we take we've taken your feedback.

The architects are online, they've heard.

So any follow-up questions from any of the commissioners.

Hearing none, uh Mr.

Davis, can you put up that recommended motion, please?

Mr.

Chair, if you could ask if anyone would like to speak.

I don't see anyone online.

Oh, okay.

You're re-taking public testimony.

Okay.

Uh do we have anyone in chambers who would like to provide testimony?

I mean, can you ask questions?

Uh well, ma'am.

Uh you can ask questions through testimony, right?

Like you can make points through testimony and uh then we could potentially follow up with staff or the applicant if we so desired, but we don't take questions from the audience.

Okay, so anybody in chambers want to provide testimony.

Hearing none, anybody online uh want to provide testimony.

Hearing none, anybody online uh want to provide testimony hearing none.

Is there a motion?

Uh Mr.

Chair, make a motion.

Make a motion to approve level two site plan of permit application stp 2025-00503 uh to permit the conversion of 13,011 square feet of street level retail into 13 residential units at the 198 East Montgomery Avenue property, subject to the findings and conditions in staff's report.

Is there a second before our second, can I just reiterate the fact that if you've got a question, you can absolutely ask that question via public testimony.

You can't necessarily expect an answer today, but it will at least be on record.

So if you would like to provide public testimony, now is an extremely appropriate time to do so.

Well, before we go there, we have a motion on the table.

Okay.

So um, I get there's a motion on the table.

Sorry, I wanted to put that out there.

No, no, I I appreciate that clarification.

I'm just thinking with the motion on the table.

Let me ask would you want to provide public testimony after uh Commissioner Saladin explained?

Okay.

So my suggestion here, Commissioner Pittman, is to withdraw your motion.

What about Commissioner Fulton?

Or Commissioner Fulton, sorry.

My apologies.

Commissioner Fulton.

Mr.

Chair, I withdraw my motion.

I appreciate that.

And we could reopen to provide public testimony, ma'am.

If you if you give me a second, I'd like to provide the rules.

Um each individual will be allowed three minutes to provide comment on the application, however, one representative of an organization such as an HOA or community group, will be allowed up to five minutes for a presentation.

At any time, clarifying questions may be asked by members of the commission.

Please adhere to these time limits.

They will be in force.

If you intend to testify for any of today's agenda items, we ask that you sign in on the appropriate sheet on the stand in the back of the room.

Once public testimony is concluded, the commission will enter into discussion deliberation on the application among the members.

These proceedings are being televised and recorded.

We ask that you state your name and address for the record, allow a moment for staff to swear you in and speak loudly and clearly when you testify.

A video recording of the hearings will be kept on file with the city's cable television office, and we put it on the planning commission's webpage for viewing.

Okay.

Now with that preliminary uh instructions, ma'am, please come forward, state your name and address, and uh you'll be sworn in.

My name is Connie Robinson.

I live at two Helen Hennigan Way, residents on the lane.

Now, Mr.

Waselak will swear you in.

Ma'am, you've identified yourself for the record.

Uh will you provide truthful testimony this evening?

Thank you.

And ma'am, there's a timer in front of me, and it will start as soon as you start speaking.

Okay.

Okay, go ahead.

Okay.

I'm just concerned.

Um, the apartments residents on the lane were supposed to be senior apartments.

Um, they didn't quite live up to all of that for the seniors as far as the design and some pretty long hallways.

But I just wanted to know will there be a possibility of some of the residents getting um a chance for to apply to these apartments?

They're right up under us.

Um, the loft apartments.

Um, and will they be super expensive or will they have some affordable um housing?

Is that it, ma'am?

Okay, thank you.

Uh I think that concludes the public testimony based off that.

Uh do any of the commissioners in chambers have any questions of either staff or the applicant who's still in the room.

Hearing none, uh Commissioner Sung, since you're online.

Do you have any questions of staff of staff or the applicant?

Uh seeing none, uh is there a motion?

Any of my fellow commissioners want to make a motion?

Mr.

Chair, I Commissioner Fulton would like to make a motion.

Please go ahead, Commissioner Fulton.

We got to sit you guys further apart.

We look so much alike.

Uh I move I move that we approve level two site plan uh application stp 2025-00503 to permit the conversion of 13,001 square feet of street level retail into 13 residential units at 198 East Montgomery, subject to the findings and conditions in staff's report.

Is there a second?

A second.

All those in favor is your hand say aye.

Aye.

Motion passes unanimously.

Thank you.

That brings us to our third agenda item.

That's a zoning zoning ordinance rewrite ZOR work session, review of remaining topics, amenity space, landscaping signs, nonconformities, finding subdivision and plots, neighborhood conversion plans, historic preservation, and recommended rezoning near the Twembrook Metro Station.

Over to Mr.

Waslock for any staff presentation.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

This is the fourth in a series of work sessions on the zoning ordinance rewrite project that we've uh held with you as the planning commission.

Uh we've had a corresponding series of work sessions with the mayor and council, uh, as you know.

Um we are working toward uh putting together the draft uh document that will be the uh new zoning ordinance, um, but it will be a draft and uh it will be also be a zoning text amendment.

Uh, you've seen many of those uh in your tenure, and uh the process for this text amendment will be the same as the zoning text amendment process that you're familiar with.

Uh we will be bringing the draft text amendment and the draft map amendment uh to the mayor and council on December 1st.

Uh they are required to authorize the filing of both of those uh items, and then we'll proceed through the uh formal public uh hearing process, public hearings uh in front of yourselves and also in front of the mayor and council.

And we anticipate work sessions with both bodies as well as we work toward um the final document, which we expect um will be acted on uh in late spring of 2026.

So tonight we have a number of topics that we would like to discuss with you.

And uh I am joined by my colleagues Holly Simmons and Katie Gerbis online to kind of walk you through these topics.

We'd also like to talk a little bit uh about the process.

Um we know where you have uh we've come a long way, uh I'll put it that way.

Uh when we started in 2023, and uh we are in the process of now drafting the final zoning uh text amendment, and which will result in the ZOR.

So these work sessions have been set up to uh gain guidance from the mayor and council on a number of topics, although I will say the work sessions do not cover every single thing that is changing in the zoning ordinance, and uh, but they do cover the items that we felt we needed direction uh as we were putting together the document.

So uh when the document does come out in draft uh for December 1st, uh there will be some things that we haven't talked with you or the mayor and council about, uh, but we will have a document that kind of goes through the high-level changes uh between the current zoning ordinance and the zoning ordinance that we are um proposing and you'll be considering.

So I just wanted to um talk about that.

Um another aspect uh of course is the zoning map.

Um we had received direction from the mayor and council to conduct some additional outreach with uh neighborhoods that were have expect to be concerned with rezonings, and we have done that.

Uh we're not proposing to discuss that this evening, and but we will provide our recommendation on all of those uh as we uh get to authorization to file on December 1st.

So with that, uh I'm going to turn it over to uh Ms.

Gerbis, who will uh walk you through the historic preservation recommendations.

Thank you, Mr.

Rosalek.

Um nice to see everyone virtually here tonight.

We have quite a few slides here to provide you with an update on what we are proposing revising in the zoning ordinance relative to historic preservation.

I'll warn you up front the most slides of any topic are on this topic.

Uh so once we get through this, it should be smooth sailing for the rest of our work session here this evening.

So going back a minute before we look ahead, I wanted to remind you all about the historic preservation work plan.

Um so this is a document that was endorsed by the mayor and council in May of 2023.

Um, and really at its core, it's exactly what it sounds like.

It's a work plan.

So it kind of lays out the staff actions, um, budget requests, what our divisions priorities are here in historic preservation over the course of 10 years.

And ultimately, the end goal of the historic preservation work plan is that once we've done all of these discrete actions, I think there's about 40 or so actions in the work plan total that we would be able to update our preservation plan, which sort of sets the policy direction and policy guidance for preservation in Rockville.

So of those 40 some odd work items that we have or actions, there are six work items.

One of those six, work item A specifically talks about necessary updates to the zoning ordinance that are needed.

So through this zoning ordinance rewrite process, we are looking at all six of those items.

That being said, almost all of the edits that you will see discussed here tonight come directly from that historic preservation work plan.

There are a few that are staff suggestions based on feedback we've heard, what we've seen work in other places, potentially issues that we've seen with that code here in Rockville.

Your staff report has quite a bit of detail on which of these recommendations come from which documents were staff generated.

And the last thing for you all to be aware of is the Historic District Commission did discuss these edits at their July meeting.

They were positive, like favorably for almost all of them, a couple of tweaks that they had suggested.

But so at this point in time, the HDC has reviewed this as well as the mayor and council when they had their work session on Monday evening.

So now to go through these changes.

The certificate of approval, we're having a couple proposed changes here.

As a reminder, certificate of approvals or COAs is what we often call them.

These are essentially the permit that is required to do any exterior work on any of our locally designated historic sites and structures here in Rockville.

There are very, very limited things that do not need a certificate of approval at all.

And even more limits on what staff could approve themselves.

It's really limited to three things.

Staff can approve a sign, we can approve a fence, and we can approve the removal of a diseased, dead or hazardous tree.

Anything else must come to the full historic district commission.

You have to submit an application five weeks in advance of the meeting date, go through a hearing process, staff write a staff report about the compatibility of that alteration with the historic district, then ultimately you would get permission to make that modification or you would not.

The other thing to note about certificate of approvals is currently they expire after one year.

So if you got your approval on January 1st of 2025, come January 2nd of 2026, that would have expired.

And if you did not request an extension in advance, you would have to go through that process all over again.

So the two changes that we are proposing to make here, one is creating a system whereby staff can administratively administratively approve certificate of approvals for work that we think is minor, common, not really very impactful.

So a couple examples I have here of work that we believe would fall into that description.

If there's a minor alteration to a certificate of approval that was previously approved by the historic district commission.

So say you came to us with a very specific make-in model of the front door that you want to have replaced, and the HDC said yeah, you can install company A's model seven door.

And let's say company A stops making that model seven door, and you have to go to a model eight door, which is practically the same, it's the same dimensions, it has the same characters and features features.

Um, you would still, currently under our current code, be required to get a whole new certificate of approval.

Um so if there are minor things like that and the kind of substance of the work has already been approved, we believe that staff should be able to sign off on that.

Um, other things, we're talking minor landscaping here.

Um perhaps you are swapping out your mailbox or your light fixture.

One that we see a lot of that we would really like to administratively approve, has to do with the installation or replacement of utility meters and devices.

So if you want to install, let's say uh ring camera or a motion activated light outside of your property.

Maybe you need a new HVAC unit.

And as a result, the unit that sits outside is going to look very different than what's there now.

We should be able to administratively sign off on that as staff and not make you go through a full lengthy process.

Regarding the expiration date, our proposal here is to extend this expiration period from one year to five years.

That would be consistent with what the ZOR is proposing for several of our other planning application types and their respective expiration dates.

Moving into local designations.

So right now, anyone can file an application that would nominate a property for local historic designation.

You do not need to be affiliated with that property in any capacity in order to do that.

I can wake up tomorrow and say that house over there, I'm going to nominate it.

Additionally, property owners are not required to consent to the nomination of their property or the actual designation of their property.

And this is something that we've had a lot of feedback on in the past couple of years where we have had some cases where either the property owner was vocally against designation, or we've had most recently in Four Courthouse Square, which came before you all in 2024, I believe it was, where the property owner didn't take a stance one way or another.

So it kind of puts you all as approving bodies and recommending bodies in a little bit of an awkward spot.

It's easy if the property owner is like, yes, I really want this, please do it.

But when the property owner says no, or the property owner isn't taking a stance one way or another, you know, ultimately we are rezoning a property when we put it into the historic district.

It comes with a whole new set of regulations.

So we want to be aware of the property rights there.

And I believe a few members of this body had kind of expressed during the four courthouse square process how this felt problematic for them.

So that being said, proposed revisions that we have here is first we're going to limit who can file an application that nominates a property for designation.

And our proposal is to limit that to the property owner themselves, the historic district commission, or the mayor and council.

If there is a third party who is not one of those groups who is interested, so if I was interested in nominating a property, I would then let the property owner, historic district commission, or mayor and council know and say, hey, I really think you should consider this property.

Here are the reasons why I think you should consider it.

And I can't speak for property owners, but I can speak for the historic district commission since I'm one of their staff liaisons, that we would report that out to them and then they would have a discussion as to whether or not they wanted to consider filing a nomination application for that property.

The other thing that we are proposing here is owner consent and how that's factored into this process.

So our proposal that you see on the slide before you is that if the property owner consents, we would want the majority vote of the mayor or the HDC to file a sectional map amendment and then ultimately a majority vote of the mayor and council to in fact rezone that property to the historic district zone.

That's what it currently is now.

We just need a majority.

The proposal that we initially brought to the mayor and council on Monday would be saying that if the owner does not consent or is silent in their consent, that a unanimous vote would be required.

So it would still be possible to designate that structure.

If, say there's a really important resource that we are truly at risk of losing forever, even if the property owner doesn't want it, there's still an avenue to go ahead and designate that property, but it raises the bar.

It makes it a little bit more challenging to do so.

I will add that on Monday night's mayor and council meeting, there was discussion and general consensus to kind of add a third option here.

So to make it where if the owner consents, we just need a simple majority.

So in the case of the historic district commission, they're a body of five, so that would be three for the mayor and council, that would be four.

If the owner vocally and adamantly does not consent, then that would be unanimous.

But if the owner is silent on the issue, that was the case we had in four Courthouse Square, they didn't say they liked it, they didn't say they didn't want it, that we would need a super majority.

So it would kind of be a three-pronged approach there to reflect the owner's wishes in the process as well.

Again, I want to clarify there would still be a way to designate against the owner's wishes, but it would just make that bar a little bit harder.

Delisting.

So the delisting is the process of taking a property and removing it from our historic district zone, which is really removing it from our local register of historic places.

Right now, we do not have the ability in our code to do that.

So as a result, there are structures that physically do not exist anymore that are still on our local register.

The best example that I have is just a block away from where you all are here.

The district court building that was originally the site of the 1977 Rockville library.

That library ended up being demolished to make away for the district courthouse, but that library is still on a register.

So when I go and I count up our historic districts and I do a report showing what all those sites are, we still see that library.

So our proposal here is to create a process to remove a property from the historic district zone.

If the site or structure has lost the physical characteristics that justified its designation.

So in the case of the library, it's just straight up not there anymore.

So we should remove that from the register.

Perhaps we have an instance where there was a natural disaster or a fire of something of that nature that has ruined all or a very large portion of the property.

We should have a way to pull that off of our register so that way our register is the most up-to-date and accurate list of historic properties here in Rockville.

Next slide.

Demolition by neglect.

So I'm gonna literally read you the definition of demolition by neglect in our zoning ordinance.

And it reads that demolition by neglect of historic properties is the failure to maintain property or any component thereof located in a historic district so as to jeopardize the historic integrity of the property.

So we have this definition, it's a defined term, but it doesn't actually appear any more than in that definition in our ordinance.

So it says what it is, but it doesn't say you can't do it.

It doesn't list a punishment or a penalty for doing that.

So here we're proposing to make those two revisions, expressly prohibiting demolition by neglect.

And so saying that if you have a historic structure, you have a certain obligation to maintain that structure.

And we're not talking like peeling paint.

We're talking like roof has caved in, and as a result, it's lost the entire second floor of the building.

We're talking, you know, big things that are kind of an intentional neglect that happens over an extended period of time here.

So we would be proposing to prohibit that and then allow a municipal infraction to be levied in instances where we do find there is a case of demolition by neglect of a historic structure taking place.

And then I think this may be my last slide here.

Um this is about evaluations of significance.

So we shorthand that as EOS.

Um, so evaluations of significance, this is the process where we review a property to determine if it meets any of our nine criteria for historic designation.

Um, there are two ways that an evaluation of significance can be triggered.

The first is if you file a nomination application to designate that property.

So we already talked about that.

That would trigger this evaluation of significance.

But the second reason that that would get triggered is currently in Rockville, any time a demolition permit comes through, we are required to do a full evaluation of significance.

It doesn't matter how old the structure is, it does not matter the condition of the structure, it still has to go through a full evaluation of significance.

Um, so we mentioned a hypothetical example of there was a fire and a structure was, you know, partially or completely taken down as a result of that.

If it was partially taken down and you wanted to demo the rest of it, you would need a full evaluation of significance.

Um let's say there was a structure that was built last year that for whatever reason we've decided it needs to come down.

Obviously, a structure that was built a year ago is not historic, but we would still be required to do a full evaluation of significance.

So we're seeing quite a few of these come through in the last couple years as our community is looking to redevelopment opportunities, especially in commercial areas, as we're taking vacant and obsolete office buildings offline and repurposing that land largely as residential, although not exclusively.

Um, those are all requiring evaluations of significance.

As we've had redevelopment in some of our commercial corridors of shopping centers and things of that nature, that all still needs a full evaluation of significance.

The EOS process is very laborious from a staff perspective.

We have to do a lot of research, it's quite a heavy lift from staff to research all of these different nine criteria.

Um so that's things like the architecture, but that's also like did an influential person live there or do an activity there.

Um was this an important site to the culture of Rockville in some way?

So it's really quite a lot of research and we have to do it a lot.

And there are cases where we think it's pretty obvious there's no historic significance here, but we're still required to do it.

So our proposed revisions here is saying that we only have to bring an evaluation of significance to the full historic district commission if the structure has been identified in our historic buildings catalog as potentially having historic significance, or if as staff were doing their research, we think it meets at least one of those designation criteria.

If either of those two cases happen, we go ahead and we bring it to the full HDC.

In an instance where it's not in our historic buildings catalog, staff are researching, we don't see that it meets any designation criteria.

We believe that staff should have the ability to sign off on that administratively and not bring it to the full commission.

The other addition here that we are proposing is a note adding that if we've done an evaluation of significance, um, in the last five years, we shouldn't be required to do another one simply because a new triggering event has happened.

So this would prevent us from doing things kind of back to back.

Um, and the off chance that something happened in that year in between or whatever it would be, um, we think this would significantly improve response times for staff and really laten our workload here for cases um that are pretty cut and dry.

So that is our historic preservation section.

Holly and Jim, do we want to take any questions now or wait until the end?

I think we'd probably take questions now by topic.

So how do we want to approach this?

Do you want to go through the areas where you are seeking feedback and questions?

We can just kind of go one by one.

We certainly can do it that way.

Um, Holly and Jim, is that how you'd like to handle this?

Well, the work session was really intended to um one, provide information to the to the commission on some of our recommendations and what the mayor council have discussed about them.

Um you're not obligated to to weigh in on in any or all of these.

Certainly welcome to.

And if you'd like to discuss them, get more information, that's fine.

Or if you'd like to make a recommendation, that's also fine.

For just kind of ease of administration, I'd like to go one by one so we aren't throwing questions at different topics and going back and forth on slides.

So if we can kind of start at the beginning and we can pull the commissioners, and you know, we may not have any questions or feedback.

So, Holly, I think we could skip this one because this is really just background and information.

All right.

So certificate of approval.

Do any of the commissioners in chambers have any questions or feedback on this proposal?

I got one.

So can I give a clarification?

So it sounded like what we were saying was if the property owner was against the idea of a historic designation that we needed a majority vote of mayor and council.

But if a property owner was agnostic, then we needed a supermajority.

Is that right?

Or did I mishear that?

Yes.

So Holly, if you could, that's on a separate slide here.

So if we can hold the question until we get to that topic.

No, this certificate of approval.

You see what I'm saying?

That way we're not going back and forth.

Oh, my bad.

Yeah, yeah.

This is not the question until we get to that topic.

So on certificate of approvals, do any of the commissioners in chamber have any comments?

Hearing none, Commissioner Simon.

Uh, I have a question.

Uh so you mentioned the extended experiment uh exploration period is to five years.

So, does the applicant still have options to extend that?

I would need to look exactly how it's drafted in the code that we're kind of working on behind the scenes.

Nick Dumay, do you recall?

I know we talked about this.

I think we said that after five years they would not, but I don't have that up in front of me at this moment to confirm for sure.

Sure.

Yeah, Commissioner, I can answer that question.

So the way that we're proposing to draft the new zoning ordinance, there is a common extension provision in a separate section of the ordinance dealing with sort of the general administration of all sorts of different uh plans and approvals.

Um, generally we are allowing extension of implementation periods.

Uh, but Ms.

Gerbis is right that uh tentatively in our current draft, the decision was made that for certificates of approval, we really do think it's reasonable for folks to get their construction completed within the five-year period.

And because the sort of historicity of structures can change over time, we felt that extending beyond the five-year period, which is already a pretty generous implementation period might raise some issues.

So that's certainly something that the commission could comment on, but that's the decision I believe that we've made at this point.

Thank you.

I think I agree.

I think from one year to five years, the applicant already has landing time to construct the work, and five years is long enough.

The structure might change tool.

So I agree with this.

Thank you.

Any follow-up from any other commissioner?

Okay, hearing none, let's move on to the next topic.

Any of the commissioners in the chamber have any questions or comments on this one?

This is Cheyenne.

So if it's me, right?

Yep.

Oh, yeah.

So take it away.

Yes.

So as staff proposed, kind of in the working draft that was mentioned earlier, it was a two-pronged approach approach.

So if the owner um, you know, in writing consents, it would be a majority.

If the owner does not en writing consent, it would be unanimous.

Um, so that would apply if the owner is silent or if the owner in writing said no.

Um, what the mayor and council discussed on Monday night is they want to make a third option.

So there's a difference between an enthusiastic yes, an enthusiastic no, and being silent on the matter.

So in the case of an enthusiastic yes, it would be the majority.

In the case of a I'm silent on the matter, it would be a supermajority.

And in the case of an enthusiastic no, it would be a unanimous.

That does answer the question.

In my mind, um, any land, you know, any owner that doesn't take a stance on this is tantamount saying yes.

So in my mind, that's kind of how it should be uh treated.

Not proposing a change necessarily, but um if they're agnostic to me that that means that the will of the city should prevail, in which case it shouldn't, you know, that we shouldn't have a higher bar for that than than the uh enthusiastic yes.

Any follow-up comments or questions in the chamber.

So if the HDC is five members, so a supermajority is four, because five would be unanimity.

Uh, what about for mayor and council?

I believe it's it's at six, Mr.

DeMay.

Um I think that if we uh because we don't have the supermajority defined right now in the code, this is something the mayor and council just recently recommended rather than use the term supermajority, although that's what we're using when we describe it, we would probably specify a number.

So it could be five, for example.

I was just curious.

Thank you.

We we've done that elsewhere in the code where we've talked about supermajorities for the mayor and council.

Got it.

Thanks.

Not to get too far down in the weeds, but if you start specifying numbers and then HDC is not full, you know what I'm saying?

Like we're missing two people that we're supposed to have.

So that uh that would make give me pause.

And I I don't have strong feelings about the two versus the three metrics, but that might be something to think about.

That if you start putting specific numbers in there and then you don't have a full compliment on the historic district commission, you might get stuck.

That's a very good point.

Yeah, we would think about that for sure.

And I think I want to rephrase what I said earlier.

It's not in my mind, it's not being agnostic, right?

If you're uh an owner and you don't opine, it's indifference.

And indifference in my mind is a um, you know, like at that point, it becomes obvious to me that the city's decision should should uh should prevail.

Commissioner Singh, any comments or questions on this one?

Yeah, I just want to clarify.

So you'll say when the owner doesn't give opinion, is the owner being informed about this?

Yes.

So that is in both our current code and the proposed code, too, that within a certain number of days um from an application coming in, the owner is required to be notified via certified mail.

Obviously, if we know who the owner is and we have contact information, we will also call them or email them.

Um, but we would also have it by certified mail.

So there is that formal record.

Okay.

Yeah, I don't have any strong opinion on this.

Any follow-up?

Okay, hearing none.

Let's move on to the next one.

D listing.

Any questions or comments uh in the chamber?

I would just say this is a great idea.

I I can't believe I I really can't believe that we can't delist.

And so I'm glad you guys picked up on that and are doing it.

Hearing nothing else, Commissioner Singh, any questions or comments on this one?

Yeah, I don't have thought have a scientific situation.

Let's say like uh this building is uh called a fair and uh partially damaged and it might is not entitled in all the criteria, but the owner were or someone is rebuilt to his original status.

Was that process or the new building still considered historic?

Yeah, so it would in that case.

So if you were reverting a building to kind of what its original um, you know, character looked like the original design and stuff, yeah, that would absolutely still be a historic building.

Um, in preservation, there's kind of a couple of different terms that I think are used different in the preservation world than in like the layperson world, um, but rehabilitation, preservation, and restoration.

So what you're describing would be a restoration.

We are bringing it back to what it once was at the time, versus preservation is we're keeping it frozen in whatever it is right now.

Um, or a rehabilitation is you know, we're we're keeping the historic character, but we're bringing or modernizing it in some way.

So, yeah, that would absolutely still be a historic structure.

And delisting is not something we think will happen often.

Um, we are limiting who would be able to initiate this process because this is not meant to be a tool.

If I'm tired of having a historic designation on my site, um, you know, maybe I don't want to go through those regulations.

That this is not the tool for that.

Um, this is really in those weird cases, like the library where it physically does not exist, but it's still on our register.

Okay, thanks for the clarification.

Yeah.

I have a question on the previous slide.

I'm sorry, I just thought of it.

This is why you get his name wrong all the time.

Um I just want to ask the planning commission does play a role in the historic designation process, and it's not mentioned on the slide.

I just want to make sure that our role will remain the same in what's being proposed here, correct?

Yes.

So it would still be a sectional map amendment process.

So that would be initiated by the historic district commission.

So this vote of the HDC here is referring to the initiation of that sectional map amendment.

Then, like all map amendments, it would come to you all as a body for your recommendation, and then ultimately the final authority lands with the uh mayor and council.

Okay.

And so then the votes on this body in situations where unanimity is required by HDC or Mayor and Council does not necessarily impact as currently drafted, yes, because you would be making the recommendation, not actually making that final decision.

Okay.

No, that that's fine.

I'm okay with that.

And I think just as I think about it, I I certainly had reservations about the the not having owner consent.

I think I still lean more towards unanimity across the board, whether it's uh no consent or indifference as it is, but uh I think that there's there's a I think I'm in the minority on that, but I did want to just state that.

Thank you.

Okay, so on delisting, any follow-up comments or questions?

Okay, hearing none.

Next topic.

Demolition by neglect.

Any questions or comments in the chamber?

I think my only comment or kind of question comment is why would this does this apply to to structures that are not designated?

Like can someone just it does not.

It only applies to structures that are historically designated.

So you could have oh, go ahead.

I'm sorry.

No, go go right ahead.

So I think we're all on the same line there.

Yeah, so you could have just uh a house that's built in 1983 or 85, whatever that is outside the zone of historic preservation, and you could just neglect it, and that's okay.

Well, that would fall under our typical property maintenance code.

Okay.

So our code enforcement team would be out there, and you know, that chapter of the city code kind of lists what is and is not acceptable from that regard.

This would be above and beyond because it's possible that you are neglecting and damaging the historic character and historic features of a historic property without actually being in violation of elements of the property maintenance code.

Does that make sense?

Oh, yes, thank you.

Okay, very clear.

Thanks.

Any follow-up questions or comments in the chamber?

Commissioner Sing, any questions or comments on this one?

Okay, hearing nothing else.

Next topic.

Hearing none, Commissioner Sung.

Do you have any questions or comments on this one?

No, next topic.

That's all for me.

We'll pass it over to Holly.

Thank you so much, Katie, and good evening.

So diving right into our next topic.

As the commission is aware, our zoning ordinance includes a number of development requirements, things that apply to all developments or a broad variety of developments, including things such as our parking and loading requirements and our pedestrian and bicycle facilities requirements, which you all heard more about during our August work session.

Another example is landscaping and signage requirements, which are included in the staff report for this evening's work session, but which we will not be addressing directly in the presentation.

And also what we are proposing to call amenity space.

So this amenity space requirement would in fact take the place of two different requirements that we currently have in our zoning ordinance, open area and what is sometimes required as a subset of open area public use space.

Currently, these are required for a broad variety of developments, and we are getting the quantity of open area and public use space that is required generally, but within that quantity, we really are not getting the quality of public use space, particularly that we are looking for.

So we are proposing to reconfigure these two requirements as amenity space with a new definition that is clearer, more narrow, and specifying criteria that really get at quality over quantity.

So with this, we would be slightly reducing the quantity that is required, but greatly increasing ideally the quality of amenity space that we are receiving.

We are proposing that this space would continue in most cases to be publicly accessible.

It would be required generally for mixed use projects and residential projects in the mixed use zones, the residential medium density zones except for the RMD infill and our proposed residential high density zone, with some exceptions.

And we are also proposing that there would be flexibility, particularly in the mixed use transit district zones, in understanding that these are intended to be our most high density walkable zones where space really space and land really are at a premium costs are higher.

So although we are proposing that this requirement still be in place for the MXTD zones, we are proposing that up to 50% of that amenity space could be available to residents only.

So for example, an applicant could come in and propose that the rooftop of a multifamily apartment building be amenity space and not make it available to members of the public.

So that is the high level on this.

I would say that on Monday evening's mayor and council work session, mayor and council did agree that this was a good direction to go in the zoning ordinance rewrite.

So I think it might make sense to pause per topic area to give us the time to process and then ask questions instead of getting a ton of information and then trying to remember questions.

So is it accurate that we are proposing to eliminate the current exemptions for affordable housing projects, senior persons, disability persons projects across the board?

Is that right?

That's an excellent question.

In the draft, currently, we do have a number of exceptions.

Currently, as you stated in our zoning ordinance, we do have a broad exception for any project that is for housing for seniors with disability housing for seniors and persons with disabilities, and also affordable housing projects.

We did discuss this exemption both with our recreation and parks uh colleagues and our housing and community development colleagues, and ultimately landed at a place where we would have an exemption that's a little bit narrower.

So it would be for an application for a residential development, which is 100% affordable at an average AMI of 60% or less, and that is also located within one quarter mile of a public park or publicly accessible amenity space.

So that is the current what's in the current draft.

Okay, so we're not eliminating the exemptions for senior housing for housing for disabled and for um uh so only for that low AMI population.

100% low low AMI that is in that category of the housing for seniors and persons with disabilities and also affordable housing, yes.

We would we would not be including or we are proposing not to move forward with the exemption for housing for seniors and persons with disabilities and slightly revising the exemption for affordable housing projects as stated in my previous response.

I will note that we do have four, I think four other exemptions.

I am happy to go over what those are proposed to be if that would be useful.

I think it would be.

Please do.

Absolutely okay.

I I I don't want to cut off your line of questions.

No, no, no.

I I think that's actually I think it's totally appropriate.

Like my my concern is about equity, right?

Like anytime we carve out a certain population um that gets treated a little bit differently, right?

I I I'm concerned about equity and my concerned about um the maybe unforeseen consequences that may in fact work against the goal of the um of the proposed rule, and that is to increase development um for disadvantaged folks.

Uh, when we create a situation where there's some amount of inequity or maybe tilting the um you know the the the playing field on one side versus the other, we end up uh you know with a with with an environment that actually inhibits that development that we're trying to encourage rather than you know actually making it easier.

So that that that's kind of the crux of my uh my my question here.

So yes.

So yes, I would like to see more.

Absolutely.

So as currently drafted, the following applications would be exempted from this requirement.

So the first is an application for up to five dwellings.

The second is an application for an industrial use or an automotive use.

The third is an application for a non-residential use with a gross floor area of up to 20,000 square feet.

The fourth is the one we've already gone over, and then the fifth is kind of a two-parter, it's an application covering a site area that is either in the MXTD zone, one acre or less, or in all other zones where this is a requirement, 20,000 square feet, which is just under half an acre or less.

So basically smaller projects and industrial focused projects.

I would say that's a fair characterization, yeah.

Okay.

Any other follow-up comments or questions from in the chamber?

Commissioner Sung, do you have any comments or questions on this item?

Sure.

Uh yeah, I'm just thinking uh first I want to ask like how much reduction in the amount space required compared uh to the current requirement.

That's a great question, a little bit of a tricky one to answer.

Currently, our open area and public use space requirements vary based on zone and on the size of the development and on where they are in relation to the South Pike area.

Um there are a number of different factors, and I would say kind of generally the requirements right now for public use space, I believe vary between 10 to 15 percent.

Jim's nodding his head as well, and we're proposing that they be 10% across the board where this is a requirement.

Okay, thank you.

Yeah, I think it's reasonable, and uh I think maybe the simpler is better to understand and for everyone to remember that tool.

And so I'm just consider uh the point of the equity, right?

So if we we require for every progress, let's say around the 10%, and instead of exemption for all those uh different groups, and can we maybe require um smaller percentage?

Or maybe they can do the fee in law.

I feel like uh if they they um the affordable housing if there's also a cough that you see for the housing, right?

But if they can pay a smaller fee for them to um tend to be able to a public park, the city that the residents can walk walk there, that that's also better, maybe better than totally exempt from the requirement.

Just one thought.

And another thought I have is uh I totally agree with this um quantity versus quality, and do we have a clear definition of what does high quality amenity space mean?

Like what items or facilities we should list in there to determine the high quality.

We do we have a working definition in the draft, and I think this is the main way that we are um conceptualizing and regulating what what that high quality looks like and is.

Um I will read the beginning of it and then kind of give you a framework for understanding the rest of it.

So currently the working definition is amenity space is an area within a development site designed to meet the active or passive recreational needs of residents, patrons, employees, and the general public.

Amenity space includes but is not limited to, and then we have a list of eight different four instances.

I think it is important to remember or keep in mind that it is a list of things it includes but is not limited to.

So if there are things that are kind of in the same vein, um, those would also be included, and then we have a list of six additional items that clearly state amenity space does not include the following.

If it would be useful to hear that list, both of those lists as well.

I'm happy to share them.

Sure, please share with us.

Absolutely.

So amenity space includes but is not limited to active and passive recreation areas such as children's playgrounds and totlots, sport courts or fields, informal green spaces and picnic areas, fountains and swimming pools and associated improvements.

That's number one.

Two, urban plazas or other gathering areas improved with seating and shade.

Three, linear parks and trails, four publicly accessible interior gathering spaces, five natural and forested areas and water courses, six historical resources, seven, those portions of a stormwater facility, including walkways and landscaping designed for human enjoyment, and eight landscaping, which is contiguous to or integral to the features listed here.

And then the next list, amenity space, does not include the following.

Two street rights of way, including sidewalks located within those street rights of way or easements, three vehicular parking lots and required landscaped and circulation areas, four walkways when not otherwise associated with amenity space, five driveways and drive aisles, and six land covered by structures not designated, not designated for recreation or gathering.

Thank you.

Yeah, I think it covers the all the facilities in there.

I don't have following no, thank you.

Um any follow-up questions in the chamber.

Okay, my seven's back to your presentation.

Thank you so much.

So next up is non-conformities.

So we're moving out of our kind of general development requirements and into the question of what do we do with a use or a structure that used to conform to our requirements, but that no longer conforms to our code requirements.

So all of this information is on one slide, but I do want to um provide a little bit of a framework here.

We kind of have um recommendations in two buckets corresponding to the first two bullet points in the current heading.

So the current issue is there's one current issue at the first bullet point and a recommended change at the first bullet point in proposed.

And then the second bullet point under current corresponds to the next three under proposed.

So I'll take them one at a time and go a little slow.

We are the two buckets really are proposed changes in the use table, which would create strategic nonconformities.

And then the second deals with the regulations that govern nonconforming uses and structures.

So to address the strategic non-conformities first.

Generally we try to avoid creating nonconformities.

However, there are certain instances when doing so is viewed as strategic.

And we have two examples that we wanted to highlight in the mixed use transit district zones.

So the first is gas stations, which are currently a special exception, which have a higher standard of approval and need to go before the Board of Appeals, additional process to be approved in the mixed use transit district zones.

And the second is drive-throughs.

Currently, in our zoning ordinance, only four use types are permitted to have drive-throughs at all.

They are banks, pharmacies, cannabis dispensaries, and restaurants.

And I will say of those four in the MX TD zones, restaurants with drive-throughs are not permitted at all.

The other three are permitted so long as they are located inside of a building or a structure.

So we're probably talking about a parking structure, maybe not a hotel lobby so much.

But that is the requirement that they be located inside of a building or structure if they're located within the MXTD.

We did a full review of the uses in the mixed use transit district zones, the zoning zoning division, the comprehensive planning division, and then our colleagues over in DPW environmental management.

Just understanding that again, this is intent, these are intended to be our most walkable, highest density transit-oriented zones.

So we were looking at them through a comprehensive planning lens with the comp plan in mind, and also through the climate action plan lens.

So we did ultimately land at a place of recommending that these should no longer be permitted within the mixed-use transit district zone.

The uses could continue if they are currently in existence.

If they are made non-conforming, if they are no longer permitted within this zone or these zones, they would be subject to our nonconformities regulations, which we're going to go over in just a moment, the changes that we're proposing there, or they could be brought into conformance with our code requirements.

So to move on to the second bullet point under that current current heading.

The first is that we are proposing to reduce the process required for nonconforming structures and uses to be altered in certain instances.

These are really things that things or scenarios that we would like to encourage if a property owner has a non-conforming use or structure, but they want to improve it with pedestrian or bicycle facilities.

We would like to see that happen.

For example, we had an application in 2022 where we had a non-conforming car wash, they wanted to remove their car wash base and install vacuum vacuum stations instead.

That was viewed as reducing the nonconformity, bringing it into greater conformance.

But because of the way that our regulations are structured currently, the applicant needed to go through a level two site plan and concurrently a non-conforming alterations process.

Under our proposal, that would be a minor site plan amendment.

We are also proposing that non-conforming uses and structures could be replaced in kind if they are damaged by accident or by natural disasters.

So today, if you owned a small business and it burned down, you could not replace it in kind under our regulations, which we do not think is appropriate.

We do think that if if that destruction happens through no fault of your own, you should be able to replace it in kind.

And finally, our code does not allow for the expansion of any nonconforming uses whatsoever.

However, we do have nonconforming uses that have been in existence a number of years.

But we do think that there should be allowances for not nonconforming uses to expand a nominal amount.

And this we are proposing would have to go through that additional process, that non-conforming alterations process.

So if you want to reduce your non-conforming use, we want to ease the process.

If you want to increase or expand it, that additional process would prop would apply as proposed.

So that closes out our recommendations for nonconformities.

Is that 20% by square footage?

What's the metric there?

And is that annually or in total?

These are excellent questions.

Currently, the language is a nonconforming use may be expanded by no more than 20% of the total square footage of the use at the time it was rendered nonconforming.

So it would be 20% total from the time that it was rendered nonconforming, and it is in the draft based on square footage.

I think we're all just processing all of this.

Any other questions in the chamber comments?

I'm sorry.

Did I hear you right that it's not permitted to have a drive-thru for a gas station?

But it is permitted to have a drive-thru for a cannabis dispensary.

You can't drive through for something you need to drive, but you can drive through for something you're not allowed to do if you're driving.

I think some of that comes down.

The short answer is yes, but some of that is going to come down to our definition of drive-through.

Um and I think that the fueling bays at a gas station would not be considered a drive-thru.

So certainly you can have an area where a car could you know stop and then traverse through those fueling stations.

We just would not classify it as a drive-thru.

But it is also correct that we do permit drive-throughs for cannabis dispensaries, yes.

Which I'm not necessarily against, but I would be against it if it meant that you couldn't have a drive, you couldn't drive through a gas station.

But you're I I get what you're saying.

That's not what you mean by drive-through.

Gas stations are cool.

Got it.

Okay.

Any other questions or comments in the chamber?

Commissioner Sung, do you have any questions or comments on this?

On these proposals?

I would just comment the fact that uh in my mind, um, I think it's not fair to penalize anyone who is doing business currently.

Um, that the because of the fact that the um the city is sort of playing catch-up and and making decisions ex post facto, right?

So limiting a business's ability to expand or to remain profitable in a changing environment because the regs change to me is not fair.

Um, they had an idea, they executed on that idea, and that idea was put in place and has been successful to date.

We as a city um uh should encourage that sort of behavior.

Um, and they shouldn't be limited because we're we're we we as a city are playing catch up uh to maybe something we should have thought about or we didn't know about.

So uh in my mind, limiting their ability to expand because they're non-conforming by virtue of no nothing other than the city change their mind is unfair.

Any follow-up in the chamber?

So uh Commissioner Selling made me think of this.

So for the final bullet point, we were talking about allow non-conforming uses to expand by up to 20%.

Uh, is that a one-time deal, or could I expand by 20% and then come back and expand by another 20% and come back and expand by another 20%?

Excellent question.

So based on the language in the draft, currently, it would be a total of 20% from the time that the use was rendered non-conforming.

So it would be kind of based off of that point in time.

You could come back for 5%, 7%, 8%, up to that total of 20%.

Commissioner Sung, do you have any questions or comments on this proposal?

I'm just thinking like so under this new change, what yields will become the new nonconforming mules.

So what kind of yields will be affected by this?

By the proposal to create the strategic nonconformities or by the changes in regulations governing nonconformities.

I'm sorry, I'm just seeking a little clarification.

Maybe the curriculum, the strategic nonconformities.

Yeah, yeah, what affected by this.

Yes.

So generally it would be drive-throughs and gas stations, which are currently in existence in the MXTD zone, or the areas that are proposed to become one of the new MXTD zones.

So that would be the MXTD 85, 200, and 235, which, if you'll recall, those correspond to the town center master plan character areas.

Okay, so so it's mainly if uh yeah, facting the drive-through yields.

Drive-throughs and gas stations, yes.

Okay, okay.

Okay, I'm fine with that, yeah.

Any alibis in the chamber.

Okay, hearing none.

Back to you.

All right, moving on to subdivision and platz regulations.

So one of the quirks of our zoning code is that it does also deal with subdivision.

Other jurisdictions uh may separate this out into an entirely separate chapter, but ours does not.

It addresses it within the zoning ordinance.

So subdivision generally speaks to any time that you are creating entirely new lots or you are moving lot lines.

This section of the zoning ordinance honestly to me was very exciting.

It wasn't touched in the 2009 rewrite of the ordinance, so there was a lot of opportunity to really work to create a new structure that helps clarify our regulations and outline um how our processes really work when it comes to subdivision.

So I'm going to touch on that more specifically in just a moment, one of those kind of foundational structural structural elements, things that we've introduced.

But the first the first thing that we identified that we are proposing to change within this portion of the zoning ordinance is that currently the subdivision regulations allow planning commission to accept land dedication.

And as we thought about this, um, really keeping in mind the financial and long-term maintenance implications that land dedication entails and the mayor and council's policy and budgetary responsibilities.

We really thought that um we need to kind of correct this and move that authority from the planning commission to the mayor and council.

So that is the first recommendation to place the authority to accept land dedication with mayor and council.

The second one, um, I am going to talk a little bit about the framework that we are introducing into this portion of the zoning ordinance in order to lend a little bit more clarity.

Um, currently the planning commission approves all plats, including minor subdivisions.

We have uh a definition of minor subdivision in the ordinance, but we don't really use it in the subdivision regulations.

So we thought that could be a helpful tool to lend a bit of structure to group different types of subdivisions and plats into minor subdivisions and major subdivisions.

And that helps us to more clearly outline the process for the minor, which is less versus the major, which is more.

So we did go through thinking about all of the various types of plats and subdivisions that have come before this body that might come before this body.

We did research into other jurisdictions and how are they defining them and came up with a number of different circumstances which would qualify as a minor subdivision?

Things like if you are moving interior lot lines, if you are consolidating two lots into one lot, um all the way up to creating four lots so long as they front a public street, there's no required extension of utilities, and there are no forms of relief that are requested.

If you are subdividing five lots, you're a major.

If you are subdividing four lots and there's a need to extend utilities, you're a major.

So in 2006, it was introduced via a zoning text amendment that uh a prohibition on creating pipe stem lots, and I can actually move us to the next slide so you'll see a visual representation of two pipe stem lots in the Twin Brook neighborhood.

These are lots which are kind of interior, maybe behind other lots, and access is provided through the STEM of the pipe, which you can see kind of at the right and the left here.

Um fee simple lots, we do think that allowing these again would be in alignment with the city's housing goals, and it would allow for the use of underutilized kind of rear yards on infill properties, particularly ones where they are excessively large over the minimum lot size requirements, and certainly where they can provide that access from the public right-of-way.

So that is that is the synopsis for the recommendations regarding subdivision and plats.

We do have our one question for feedback.

Um, just do you support allowing record plots for minor subdivisions to be approved by the chief of zoning, certainly subject to delegation from this body?

And also happy to answer any other questions regarding the other recommendations.

Can you go back two slides just for a moment?

One more just to give us a second to look at the current and proposed, and then we'll go back to your question.

Before we address the question staff has for us, do any of my commissioners in the chamber have any questions or feedback of staff on the proposals that are on the screen?

I do.

Um is there any context you can give us on why those pipe stem lots were prohibited in the first place?

Because to me, this is a no-brainer, but I I want to understand what I'm not thinking about here.

There was a concern uh obviously 20 years ago that these types of lots were out of character with our existing residential neighborhoods.

There had been some subdivision plots that were within existing communities that were not viewed as a good thing for that community.

And so the mayor council decided to eliminate their possibilities.

I will say that we had did have uh pipe stem lots in larger developments that were kind of within, say a plan development uh that had lesser impact, but it was really those ones that were within existing communities that had caused uh issues.

Um I appreciate the context.

Okay.

I think the teenagers in those homes didn't want to take the trash out to the curb.

Kind of a long walk.

Um any other questions or comments on this slide?

Commissioner Sung, any questions or comments before you get the staff's questions?

Okay, we can go forward a couple of slides.

So here's my preliminary question.

You know, I I'm always reluctant uh to take away the public character and feedback of like the planning commission, but I can understand why for ease of administration this might make sense.

When it comes to delegation, what would staff's recommendation be on the term of a delegation?

I ask that because I don't want to tie the hands of a future planning commission.

And I think any delegation, because I don't think there's any now, should be looked at periodically whether or not it continues to make sense.

And I suspect Mr.

Dumay is going to give me the response of it's kind of up to us, but what would be staff's recommendation as to length of a delegation?

I think um we haven't specifically talked about setting a particular term.

Um my recommendation would be that the delegation would be open-ended.

Um it's really unusual because it would it would it's required by law, the delegation is required by law to be memorialized in local law.

So not only the criteria that staff would utilize, but the delegation itself would have to be at least acknowledged in local law in order for it to happen.

Mayor and council is the one that adopts local law.

I think it's really probably if a future planning commission, let's say, in 10 years decides that they didn't think the delegation was appropriate.

Um, I don't see anything in state law that would prevent them from effectively revoking the delegation.

And we would probably ask that at the same time or roughly the same time that the zoning ordinance was adopted, if we move forward with delegation, the planning commission would adopt a resolution that would expressly delegate.

Um, but personally, I wouldn't recommend that you know you create like a pilot program or set a particular term in part because it it's honestly it will probably generate discussion uh and and work at the end of that term that probably isn't necessary if the system is working appropriately.

I also think that when you see a draft of the subdivision regulations, you really will see that as um Ms.

Simmons noted, the types of subdivisions that are proposed for administrative approval really are incredibly minor.

Um and and really at least in my view, very appropriate for administrative approval.

So the only other concern, and I completely understand in your position and staff's position, why an open-ended delegation might make sense.

My concern is when we're all gone, after years, potentially decades of administration, people might forget that it was a delegation that granted this authority.

And it just that's the way it's always been operating.

And and it kind of gets lost and forgotten that the planning commission could potentially take that back.

And so I don't know how we could potentially address that concern.

Yeah, one thing in part in recognizing the fact that the delegation isn't necessarily guaranteed.

Um, you know, one proposal that we had been batting around was actually writing into the code specifically that you know, sub subject to the delegation of the planning commission, you know, staff may administratively approve the following subdivisions.

So it's not setting a term, but it would be a memorialized in the code for anyone to see at any time that that this is subject to a delegation.

Um and again, I mean it would be incumbent on a future planning commission to see that language and say, wait a second, do we do we want to continue doing this or not?

But I think it would be really readily apparent to anybody looking at the code that that there is this delegation and it would need to need to continue.

Any other questions or comments in the chamber?

Commissioner Summer.

Um but staff is looking for feedback.

So my initial feedback is I have concerns, but ultimately for ease of administration, I would be supportive of a delegation.

Um I don't know how my other fellow commissioners feel about it.

I would say that I also am generally supportive of this, but I do understand um Commissioner Espinoza's concerns that it could get lost in the shuffle without some kind of and will be reviewed every five years or every 10 years, or having it as part of our rules of procedure that you know this, hey, by the way, don't forget this is delegated authority.

So I I get that.

Uh, but I also get that these are really very minor.

And I think Mr.

Jimmy, some of the language you proposed would help to clarify all that.

I'll just uh echo that I'm supportive of this with some of the caveats that my fellow commissioners have said, but anything that I think uh makes things easier for for both staff and the volunteers and the the people of Rockville, I I support this.

I agree.

Any comments or questions, Commission?

Yeah, I'm also ugly with this.

I think is it's like a we're doing the zoning rewrite for this faster track.

I think there's minor uh subdivisions.

I agree with the dedication and I think that the the terms in the zombie ordinance will remind everyone that it can be reverted in the future if that is included and um in support.

Ms.

Simmons, is that enough feedback for you?

It is.

Thank you.

Moving on to findings of approval.

So, as I'm sure you all are aware, um many of our approvals include findings that need to be made.

So for site plan applications, project plans, and preliminary subdivision plans.

The findings, um, the findings that these applications require are highly discretionary.

Although they are essentially intent upon accomplishing the same thing between these three application types, they are very inconsistent across them.

They are also substantially addressed through our regulations.

And finally, because of this, they rarely determine staff's ultimate recommendation on any one of these application types.

So we've looked at them.

Um there's a comprehensive table of all of the various findings of approval in the staff report, which you can review if you if you feel a desire.

But generally, we are proposing to rework and simplify and simplify the findings of approval to be objective and accessible, to be consistent across all three of these application types, to be very strongly tied to the comprehensive plan and also strongly tied to city regulations.

So specifically, we're proposing to narrow the findings down to three three primary findings.

Is the application consistent with the comprehensive plan?

Is it supported by adequate public facilities?

And does it conform to the requirements of the zoning ordinance and other applicable law governing health, life safety, natural resources, and the environment of the city?

So that is all for this topic.

Happy to answer any questions.

Any comments or questions in the chamber or online?

Okay, hearing none.

Neighborhood conservation plans are up next.

So neighborhood conservation plans were created conceptually with the 2009 update to the zoning ordinance.

These plans can be initiated by a petition of local property owners, and in the intervening time, the only uh neighborhood conservation district plan that we have adopted is the Lincoln Park Conservation District Plan and district.

We are proposing with the zoning ordinance rewrite to eliminate um the possibility to create any new neighborhood conservation plans.

It's important to note that the existing one, the Lincoln Park Neighborhood District Conservation Plan would not be impacted.

It could continue to be amended as it was very recently in January through our master planning processes, through zoning map amendments.

But any new any new plans of this nature would need to be initiated through our master planning process.

So this could include neighborhood plans.

And any of our plans, neighborhood plans could continue to be initiated and amended through those processes.

So we really are viewing this as kind of cleaning up the code and eliminating what is essentially a duplicative process.

Any questions or comments?

Commissioner Sun, any questions or comments?

But yeah, I have one.

For this one, so the nature of this plan, I assume, is uh emphasized on the conservation and the historical preservation aspect.

So for just this aspect being integrated in the standard master plan process.

So like if other neighborhoods want to do a similar plan, so can these collaboration elements be included in those plans?

If Ms.

Gerbis is still on the line, I think it might be best to defer to her.

So I think the answer is yes.

Commissioner Sam, would you mind stating that question again just to make sure I'm following properly?

Right.

So I'm just thinking like the the what's different this type of plan than the other standard master plan by name, I assume is the coloration and for size, right?

And for size on the conservation aspects.

So if other district neighborhood plan won't we have a conservation elements of that plan, can that element be include be included in the standard and master plan process?

I would think so.

As I understand it, this would be kind of eliminating standalone neighborhood conservation plans, but wouldn't necessarily prevent the inclusion of some elements that would be in a neighborhood conservation plan from being in other policy documents and planning documents.

I think it would be okay to do what you're proposing.

Um Mr.

Jume, do you have any thoughts on that?

Sure, yeah, I'd be happy to provide a little bit of context.

Um I know I'm not we're gonna play kind of tag team here.

Mr.

Waslick might also have something to say about it because he was around when we created these.

Um in the current ordinance, the purpose of a neighborhood conservation district zone isn't specifically historical preservation.

Um I can read the purpose, it's only a sentence.

It says neighborhood conservation district zones are overlay zones intended to provide a vehicle to implement programs for the revitalization or conservation of older areas or districts within the city possessing distinctive features, identity or character worth retention and enhancement.

So there's an historical element there, but there's nothing in that purpose statement that it's in any way inconsistent with all of the variety of topics that can be addressed through a typical master planning process.

So, as Ms.

Gerb has said and and and Ms.

Simmons said earlier, you know, this is this is entirely duplicative of a completely legitimate scope of a of a of a master plan.

So if down the road we wanted to create a master plan for a particular neighborhood because we recognize that it was worthy of preservation and we wanted to look at a variety of things we could do to preserve and enhance a neighborhood, that's entirely appropriate to be done through the master planning process.

Um the other thing I will note is that the neighborhood conservation district zone process itself includes a number of really unusual elements that I frankly have never seen before in in my career, and and I think it it goes a long way in explaining why the process has never really been used again because it's it's far simpler and and um and straightforward to go through a standard master planning process.

Thank you.

Yeah, I think uh by understanding that I think by combining maybe not combining eliminating this one and to be included in the standard process, and generally really in support of that.

I just want to emphasize that this conservation elements should be included in the standard process, and I wouldn't want to forget about that.

Thank you.

Any other comments or questions or follow-up in the chamber?

Okay, the hearing none.

All right, I believe that this is our final topic for the evening.

We are revisiting one more recommendation related to our comprehensive map amendment before releasing the draft map in short order.

If you will recall back in our work session, I believe it was in May, we recommended rezoning the area shown on the right portion of the screen in blue to our newly proposed MX T D 235.

So that corresponds to the Town Center Master Plan Maryland 355 character area and would allow heights up to 235 feet as a base with a hundred foot bonus.

Mayor and Council supported that.

We also presented this information to this body.

Understanding that it's kind of resting on the precedent set by the Town Center Master Plan, but also the support of the comprehensive plan when it recommends that and the climate action plan when they recommend to steer our densist development toward our transit oriented areas.

So following that meeting, we received a letter from a property owner in one of the areas on the right side of the screen in red saying, you know, we looked at your recommendation.

We appreciate and support Mayor and Council's support of the proposed rezoning, and we think you should look a little bit further.

The Town Center Master Plan has kind of a stepped approach, and this is not mirroring that.

So we did go back and take another look and ultimately are recommending that the MX T D 200, so the area or the zone that corresponds with the core character area, which has a base height of 200 feet with an additional bonus height of 100, be applied to the areas in red.

These are generally areas that are within a half mile of the metro station down at Twinbrook and that are currently zoned MXCD or mixed use corridor district.

What was Mayor and Council's feedback?

They were very supportive and also encouraged that additional properties throughout the city be rezoned as well.

Ultimately.

Any questions or comments in the chamber.

Okay.

Hearing none, uh Commissioner Sum.

No, thank you.

All right.

Thank you all.

Uh, we did want to take just a moment to go over next steps, understanding that this is the last work session that we are having leading up to the release of the initial draft of the zoning ordinance.

Mr.

Wazilak did go over our timeline.

I know you all have seen this a number of times before.

Um, so suffice it to say, we are at the at the red.

We are at the red point, which makes us look like we are quite toward the end, and we really are at the end of the beginning, I would say.

We're headed toward that adoption process.

Uh release, release of that first draft of the zoning ordinance and um zoning map, and then we will have a whole adoption process, which you all have seen many times before with zoning text amendments and map amendments.

I think you know the drill there.

This really we are we are leading up to the beginning.

So we did want to go over the next steps.

Um, we've had a number, as you are aware of pre-release Mayor and Council and Planning Commission work sessions.

These began in January of 2025.

We've covered a lot of really significant policies, though, as Mr.

Wazilak said at the top of this item, certainly not all of them.

There will be a lot of information in the zoning ordinance that is new that we haven't addressed yet, but we have gotten direction on kind of big ticket items that has helped us do what we hope is a good job of that first draft.

So when we get to authorization to file the zoning text amendment and the comprehensive map amendment, those will proceed as two separate items introduced on December 1st.

We will be doing a public release of the draft map and draft zoning ordinance as well.

We will also, as Mr.

Wazilak said, be um preparing what we're calling a CLIFS notes version of the zoning ordinance that's going to highlight major changes.

It's um going to be a more user-friendly document that if you wanted just to see the highlights, you could go and look just at that document, or if you want to use it as a jumping off point to kind of dive into topics of interest in the zoning ordinance, you will know where to go.

So they're really intended to be used in tandem.

And this, as you all are aware, authorized uh authorization begins the review and adoption process, which we are anticipating will take uh six months from its outset, ending in late spring of 2026.

As you're aware, we will have formal public hearings both before this body and before Mayor and Council.

We will have additional work sessions.

There will be plenty of opportunity for public comment.

Um, and we will also we're also anticipating that there will be revisions and amendments to that draft.

I'm sure that comes as no surprise to you all.

And as I said, we are again tracking toward adoption in late spring of 2026.

So I think we might have addressed all of the question and answer at this time, but we did want to pause and see if there is any any remaining question.

Spring 2026 seems ambitious to me, but that's just me.

So we'll see we'll see.

Um questions or comments in the chamber.

Just a general thank you for getting to this point the end of the beginning as we move towards the beginning of the middle of the end.

Um just all the work that's gone into this, and that will that we appreciate it.

Thank you.

And particularly tonight, I saw a lot of things that just made sense, makes things more efficient for again for staff for us up here, and makes it easier kind of to live work in Rockville.

So thank you very much.

Any other questions, comments?

Commissioner Stone.

Yeah, I just want to echo uh coming from the foot point.

I really appreciate the staff hard working on this.

I think we are making uh really good progress on the modern adding the thing code and make this easier for everybody to yield and understand.

Yeah, thank you.

Thank you, Miss Simmons.

Thank you, Ms.

Gerbis.

Uh Mr.

Wasselak, over to you for staff liaison report.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Just looking ahead.

Your next meeting will be uh two weeks from this evening on the 22nd.

We have a final record plat as well as a project plan amendment uh coming forward to you that evening.

The project plan is the 41 Maryland Avenue project that you have seen before at briefing.

Um so there'll be those two items.

Uh looking ahead beyond that, uh, your next meeting would be on November the 12th.

And there is a site plan for Shade Grove Neighborhood Center slash innovation district uh phase two, uh lining up for that meeting, as well as an ownership plat for uh 850 Nelson Street, which is the Woodley Gardens uh pool and school.

Thank you.

Any old business?

I think we have some old business.

I have just two quick things.

Mr.

Rosalak, do we know what's going on with 255 Rockville Pike?

Is that progressing?

Do you know?

Doesn't it appear to be?

Yeah, they are not on our advanced calendar.

Um obviously the applications are on file, but um we do not have a projected date, then the next step would be to come forward to you for recommendation.

So let me see if I can find out more about that when I can email the commission.

That's such a vital project for us here in the city.

So the other thing I just wanted to share with my fellow commissioners that Mr.

Rosselak and I accepted the um proclamation for planning month on Monday night at Marin Council.

It's very nice.

The mayor herself did made the proclamation, said some very nice things about us and about the staff and just the whole process.

It was really nice.

So I just wanted to share that.

And thank you for being available available to accept it.

Also, I will not, I just as a reminder, I will not be at the next meeting.

That's it.

I'm done.

Good for us.

Good job, Miss.

That brings us to new business.

And I did want to bring up something because Mr.

Wasalak, I think uh, as you mentioned, we have one meeting left in October.

We'll only have one meeting in November, and then one meeting in December.

I know I will be out of the country in December.

And I bring that up because uh our rules of procedure say that we have to elect a chair um in December or at any other time before that.

So since I know I won't be there in December, and we only have five commissioners, right?

That leaves us only four.

And you know, for any election, I don't like even numbers.

So I just throw that out there.

We can wait till December to do it if we we we think that won't be an issue.

We could do it in November potentially, and have the person, you know, fill in for me in December and then formally take over in January, however, we want to do it.

I don't think we have to make a decision tonight, but I'm just bringing it up so we can think about it and potentially discuss it in October to make a plan of how we want to proceed, if that makes sense.

And then on the evening of uh the thirtieth of October here at City Hall, there will be a candlelight vigil to uh remember and memorialize uh those who have uh we've lost to uh traffic in it incidents over the past few years.

Thank you.

Thank you, Commissioner Fulton.

Any other new business?

Um, I just wanted to go back to Commissioner Espinoza's uh point about holding the election in November.

I would be in favor of that.

I won't be here next week or next time to say that with we'll let you know what we decide.

Yeah.

Um one other new business, Mr.

Waselak, since we are getting near the end of the year, you know, some of our commissioners have busy schedules.

If we could get proposed meeting, I I know we meet the first Wednesday, but if there's any changes that you forecast throughout the year, because I know sometimes we'll hold we'll hold an August work session or maybe have to move something because of a holiday if you're aware of something like that.

Getting a reposed schedule, you know, November, December would be very good.

We can look into that.

And uh also there will be work sessions on the zoning ordinance.

Um, probably in the January, February time frame.

So I don't know if we'll need to add meetings uh for that, but um, we'll be mapping that out here in the very near future and can let you know what we think.

Okay.

Uh I didn't see any minutes.

So that brings us to any FYI or correspondence.

I think you were copied on several pieces of correspondence regarding a rezoning uh adjacent to New Mark Commons.

That's part of the comprehensive map amendment.

So if those are the only ones that I was uh aware of.

Okay, and for those that have stuck it out with us, that brings us to the end.

Uh is there a motion to adjourn?

I move to adjourn.

Second.

All those in favor, raise your hand say aye.

Aye.

Aye.

The motion passes unanimously.

Thank you.

This is a proud and meaningful night for the Rockville Police Department as we come together to celebrate the promotion of six outstanding individuals who represent the best of who we are.

Today we had a promotional ceremony for the Rockville City Police Department.

Officers that get promoted are often promoted on the merit of how hard they've worked.

As a lieutenant, I will be able to bring efficiency to our civilian staff.

Bringing efficiency to the department means that we'll be able to better serve the community.

Congratulations, and may you lead with courage, serve with honor, and never stop earning the trust you've been given.

Oktoberfest is sort of an end of harvest festival that is uh in time has become centered around beer.

Right, so and that that's the influence of Bavaria and Munich.

Montgomery County beer culture is alive and well.

You can see it all around us right now.

But we found out, of course, that the uh sister city to Rockville, Maryland is Pinneburg.

And we decided we would go with that name and honor the relationship that we have.

With Rockville, it's great to see um lots of different kinds of people showing up for the community, especially for the small businesses.

I love to see the support there.

In addition, we had another really really cool thing happen at Rock Tobia Fest.

We opened a time capsule from the Millennium Year.

What they were predicting would happen.

They said flying cars.

We had we don't have those quite yet.

But I think this is a great gathering to help support our city to bring people together and just get together with neighbors and friends to have a good time.

We are collaborating with Tree of Hope for our Lunch and Learn is part of our Rockville Ghost Preposition for the month of September, which is natural recovery month.

So we're just trying to create a space where we can raise awareness about what substance addiction and substance misuse looks like.

I came here for Rockville Ghost Popal Initiative.

People who are under substance abuse, it's very difficult for them to come out.

If they're coming and attending this event, it's like that itself is a first step in the recovery phase.

Opious has been such a major player in marketing, and we make sure that we respond to all substances, whatever it is.

I have been struggling with addiction since I was about uh 15 years old.

I was introduced to 12 step meetings, working a program.

What was um the moment or the experience that really made it click for you to like that you can make the change?

I had to learn to get help because if I did it, you know, I was gonna probably be dead.

I think this event is amazing.

We can open up the community more so that way we can actually bring awareness of the opioid crisis that's going on.

The more that we can get trained up on what it looks like and get trained up on how to administer Narcan, the healthier our community will be.

This USTA gave the City of Rockville participants an opportunity to attend the US Open.

We're able to take 24 kids to the US Open with their parents.

Um the kids got about 10 minutes on the courts for some Orange Experience, which included Red Balls, youth size racket, and about a pickleball size um tennis net.

During the program, they were able to meet some um famous players like Coco Golf, Ben Shelton.

They got to watch a couple matches, doubles, singles.

Um they had a huge experience.

My experience at the US Open was a lot of fun to go on the ground that the US Open players play on and play tennis on there.

We went to a tennis court to practice with all the players.

That was a lot of fun.

First started playing tennis when I was four with Mrs.

Era, and it was very fun.

I really enjoyed playing City of Rockville.

They have a lot of patience.

I can notice they actually put effort into teaching the kids.

Coaching says it's very rewarding to work with young children and see them progress from week to week.

It was really awesome to be in that environment, and I learned how much hard work and determination it takes to get to that level.

Well the kids were able to run around the courts, uh, wave to the crowd.

Uh, they were able to hit the ball back and forth with their peers.

One of our participants was even able to flip the coin to start the match off, and that we were able to watch.

The experience was great.

There was lots of players from around the world playing.

It was like awesome.

I started playing tennis when I was like five.

I started practicing at like the Rockville courts.

Grow on the court from here, going all the way to the US Open.

It's a really rewarding experience, and I and I'm sure they'll only grow from here as well.

This was something that we've never had done before or have done this before or been selected to attend this event.

Um, so it was really proud for us as a City of Rockville Recreational Parks department to be able to offer this for our City of Rockville residents.

Two, three.

Today we're having the dedication of the F.

Scott Fitzgerald Theater for the new ADA renovations that it was just completed.

The arts are extremely important in Rockville, and supporting them and supporting the variety of arts.

It's a part of our humanity.

We are here celebrating the return to our home.

We performed our very first show here in 1960.

The city has been a great partner for us all over the years.

These theater companies are the heartbeat of our venue, and their dedication ensures that our community continues to enjoy high quality performance performances right here in Rockville.

We have made it possible for this disabled and seniors to comfortably listen to uh and enjoy uh the theater as the same as everyone else.

I've been performing here for an 11 years now.

I've spent so much time here over the years.

It's really a second or third home to me.

Rockville prides itself on being truly a center for the arts, especially the performing arts.

Every patron coming from all over the DC metro area and beyond can truly enjoy the performing arts here in Rockville.

Good evening.

Welcome to the Rockville City Police Promotional Ceremony.

Before we begin, I'd like to take a moment to honor three fallen members of the Northern York Regional Police Department.

Detective Sergeant Cody Becker, Detective Isaiah Emmanheiser, and Detective Mark Baker.

These detectives served with courage and dedication, and their losses felt deeply across the law enforcement community.

Please join me in a brief moment of silence as we remember their service and sacrifice.

Thank you.

Now, please stand if you're able and join me in the Pledge of Allegiance.

Thank you.

Please be seated.

Thank you to family, friends, and colleagues for coming out tonight.

This is a proud and meaningful night for the Rockville Police Department as we come together to celebrate the promotion of six outstanding individuals who represent the best of who we are and what we stand for.

It's my honor this evening to recognize Sergeant John Lee, Sergeant Kelly Reedy, Sergeant Anthony Casabona, Lieutenant Dan Romrell, Lieutenant Javier Paquero, and Major Bill Neverding.

Promotions in this police department are never automatic.

They're earned through performance, professionalism, and perseverance.

With each promotion comes not just a new rank, but a new level of responsibility.

Every step forward in leadership means that you're now responsible not only for yourself, but for those you lead.

Sergeant John Lee.

Sergeant Lee is an 18-year veteran police officer serving five years with the DC Metropolitan Police Department before joining the Rockville City Police.

Sergeant Lee serves as a firearms instructor and has served as a first line supervisor in the patrol division as a corporal.

With his promotion, Sergeant Lee is now assigned to the community engagement unit as the supervisor.

Sergeant Lee is joined this evening by his wife and daughter, and his wife will have the honor of pinning his badge of Sergeant.

Sergeant, Sergeant Kelly Reedy.

Sergeant Kelly Reedy is a 23-year veteran police officer.

His service with Rockville City began in 2002 following five years of service in the United States Army as a military police officer.

Over his career, he served on all three patrol shifts, transferring to street crimes where he excelled in drug investigation.

In 2019, he was assigned to the Montgomery County Task Force with the Drug Investigative Unit, furthering his expertise.

In 2022, he returned to the criminal investigations unit, where he handled a variety of cases and served as a first line supervisor as corporal.

In November of 2024, he was temporarily assigned to the criminal investigations unit as the unit supervisor, assuming full responsibility.

Sergeant Reedy will remain in the criminal investigations unit as the supervisor as of his promotion.

Although his daughters, Kendall and Finley, could not attend today's ceremony.

Sergeant Reedy has asked that I pin his badge, and it is certainly my honor.

Sergeant Anthony Casabona.

Sergeant Casabona is a 12-year police veteran.

He served with the Baltimore City Police Department for five years prior to joining the Rockville City Police Department.

I was his field training officer.

Sergeant Casabona has served as a field training officer, a first line supervisor in patrol as a corporal, and also serves the department as a firearms instructor.

Sergeant Casabona is joined this evening by his wife Mary and his daughters Natalie, Grace, and Julie.

Mary will have the honor of pinning his badge.

He worked two years on patrol before being assigned as a detective in the criminal investigation section.

For nearly a decade, he investigated major crimes.

He rose to the rank of Corporal and Sergeant.

In his roles, he oversaw the Persons Crimes Unit, the Fire Investigations Task Force, the Sex Offender Registry, and the Internet Crimes Against Children Unit.

After retiring from the Sheriff's Office in 2019, Lieutenant Romerill began his second career with the Rockville City Police Department.

He served on the day and evening patrol shifts before his promotion to sergeant in 2022, where he was assigned to supervise the midnight shift.

After eight months, he was reassigned to the criminal investigations unit until November of 2024.

In November of 2024, he assumed the acting commander's role for the Special Operations Division.

Lieutenant Romeral is joined by his daughter Paige Romerill, who's in her final year of the University of Maryland.

She'll graduate with dual majors in business and biology before pursuing dental school.

Paige will have the honor of pinning her father's badge tonight.

He served as a patrol officer on day and midnight shifts, a member of the street crimes unit, a first line supervisor in patrol as a corporal, later as a sergeant, and most recently the sergeant of the community engagement unit.

His career is punctuated with multiple wards and recognition.

Lieutenant Picaro prides himself in his strong work ethic and strives to enhance RCPD and community service.

Lieutenant Picaro now serves as the Support Services Commander in the Administrative Services Bureau.

Lieutenant Vicero is joined by his family member Christopher Carpenter, who will have the honor of pinning his badge.

Major Nieberding is a 28-year veteran police officer.

He's held positions as a detective, undercover narcotics detective, street gang investigator, deputized Haida agent, street crime supervisor, criminal investigation supervisor, and served as a deputy U.S.

Marshal.

In addition, he's been on the honor guard and serves as a firearms instructor.

He's been a guest instructor at the Montgomery County Police Training Academy, Frederick Police Academy, Montgomery College, and the University of Maryland Global Campus.

He's been the recipient of departmental awards for distinguished service, driver safety, and recruitment.

Major Nievering holds an associate of arts degree in criminal justice from Montgomery College, a Bachelor of Arts degree in sociology from the University of South Carolina.

He's a proud graduate of the prestigious Northwestern University School Police Staff and Command, Session 545.

He's married with three kids.

Major Nieberning has served as an acting administrative bureau commander since November of 2024 and now officially assumes that role.

Major Nieberding's twin daughters, Lindsay and Carly, will have the honor of pinning his badge.

At this time, I'd like to invite Rockville City Police Chaplain, Father Timothy Carr to come forward for the blessing.

Dear God, we thank you for the courage and dedication of these officers.

As they step into new leadership, grant them wisdom beyond their years, and compassion that reflects your heart, dear God.

Place your hedge of protection around them and their families.

And may their leadership bring honor to their department and be a blessing to the city of Rockville.

Amen.

Thank you.

Gentlemen, please be seated.

To our new sergeants, you're stepping into one of the most influential positions in a police department.

A sergeant's a backbone of every police department.

I believe it's the most rewarding rank you'll ever attain in your career.

You guide day-to-day operations, answer calls in real time, and you're the first point of leadership for our officers on duty.

You set the tone.

You model the standard, and you carry our culture.

With your mindset that every moment is a teaching opportunity.

Your teams will look for to you for not just answers, but for the vision of the department.

You must now lead through influence and example more than just direction alone.

But you've shown time and time again that you're ready.

Be the kind of leader who builds bridges, solves problems, and elevates others.

Your impact will stretch far beyond the shifts or projects you manage.

Major Neighboring.

Your leadership journey has already been defined by your strength, consistency, and quiet confidence.

As a major, your role now touches every corner of this police department.

You will help chart the course ahead, how we operate, how we adapt, and how we serve our city.

And just as importantly, you will help develop the future of this department by guiding these other emerging leaders.

Leadership is not about being in charge.

Lifting people up and helping them become better than they thought they could ever be.

Now we ask you to show others what is possible.

Rockville's proud of you, your family's proud of you, and I'm proud to serve alongside of you.

Congratulations, and may you lead with courage, serve with honor, and never stop earning earning the trust you've been given.

Thank you.

Good evening, Rockville.

Today is October 6th, 2025, and we'll begin meeting number twenty-four-twenty-five.

We're gonna start with the Pledge of Allegiance.

Please join me as you're able.

I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for way to stands.

So today is a special day.

Once a month we do our certificates and proclamations, and so we're gonna begin.

We do have several uh proclamations and recognitions for folks in the community.

And so if my colleagues would join me.

Okay.

Afternoon, good early evening.

It's so beautiful, it's kind of hard to imagine that's actually fall outside.

Sometimes I wish we can hold these meetings outside, but I'm not the mayor, so I'll stay in my lane.

Yes, ma'am.

I have the honor to recognize one of our own.

Um it's I would what go so far as to say a native son returning home.

Today we are going to recognize Nicholas Lo Priato, Dr.

Lo Priato, Commander Lopriato, in his um, in recognition of his recent earning his next rank, his promotion.

Um his father is in and mother longtime residents, and Nicholas did a lot better than I did in the Navy and sticking with it in uh to this day, proudly serves at Walter Reed, taking care of uh many children as an orthopedic surgeon.

With that, I'll go ahead and read this recognition.

It says that the mayor and council of the city of Rockville, Maryland.

Recognize and congratulate Nicholas Patrick Lo Priato, commander, United States Navy Medical Corps.

The mayor council proudly recognize and extend their sincere congratulations on the promotion of Nicholas Patrick Loprial to the rank of commander in the United States Navy.

All right.

Okay.

Um, and I will ask my colleague, Councilmember Jackson, uh, to join me on this proclamation.

I figured it would be a wonderful bookend.

Um we're honored to be able to read uh the proclamation for Ageism Awareness Day.

Um, and why I thought it was important is that I am the mayor and council liaison to the youth commission.

And I am the liaison to the commission on aging.

And so I think that it was really important for both of us to speak to this because ageism is a continuum.

It does not lie within one age group or the other.

Everybody can be impacted by it.

It is insidious, it's pervasive, and I think there's a lot that we can do in our everyday life to ensure that our actions do not make fit people feel less than anywhere along the spectrum because of their age.

So that is my spiel.

Um I guess we'll do these two.

Okay.

Sure.

Whereas ageism refers to the stereotypes, how we think, prejudice, how we feel, and discrimination, how we act towards others based on age and whereas ageism awareness and preventing ageism are beneficial to all residents of Rockville, Maryland by improving the quality of life within our communities.

Now, therefore, the mayor and council of the city of Rockville, Maryland, do hereby proclaim October 2025 as ageism awareness month, and want to emphasize the profound impact of meaningful interactions and social connections on the well-being and healthy or and health of older adults in our community.

We call upon all residents, regardless of age, to recognize the contribution of both older and younger residents and promote programs and activities that foster connection, inclusion, and support for all.

Madam Mayor, we move I move the proclamation.

I was seconded.

All those in favor, please.

Hi.

Oh, sorry.

Yeah.

Oh I think that we have Torrents Dawkins here, is what I was gonna say.

Oh, we do?

Is Torrens Dawkins here?

Yes.

Come on.

I didn't have that on the board.

Okay, all right.

All right.

So no one is here.

Okay, all right.

Yeah, never mind.

All right, I have great hair.

We can all accept that one.

I love the sense of humor of my colleagues.

All right, so I have the honor of uh acknowledging youth sports.

I will say I am a sports mother.

Uh my house is like PT and uh physical therapy, and I I really uh think that uh sports contribute to confidence, they help our children.

Um and we also need to make sure it's safe for all.

Um I also want to acknowledge our recreation and parks team, they plan incredible sports leaks for our children, but part of uh recognizing uh this sports week, which is October 6th to 11th, we're also committing to a bill of rights for children to make sure that's a sports are safe and uplifting, and the city of Rockville will be committing to this as well.

I also wanted to flag that there will be an event on October 9th, it's a countywide recognition event um during National Sports Week.

So please check out the county's page for that.

And I'll read the proclamation.

Whereas youth sports are vital to healthy child development, linking participation to improve health, academic success, social connection, and life satisfaction in line with Rockville's commitment to community well-being.

And whereas national strategies such as Healthy People 2030 and the National Youth Sports Strategy call on communities to expand access to safe, inclusive and supportive sports, opportunities for all children and youth, regardless of background or ability.

Now, therefore, the mayor and council of the city of Rockville do hereby proclaim their support for the children's bill of rights, as well as October 6th through 11th as National Sports Week.

And we also affirm the city's commitment to ensuring that every child has the opportunity to play, grow, and thrive through sports.

Now, therefore, the mayor and council in the city of Rockville do hereby proclaim October 6th through 11th as National Youth Sports Week and call upon our residents, coaches, parents, schools, and community organizations to join in celebration to uplift our athletes to celebrate their achievements to promote safe and inclusive and fun opportunities for play and for advancing Rockville's proud tradition of excellence of recreation and community life.

Councilmember Shaw moves this proclamation, Dr.

Miles Seconds.

All those in favor, please raise your hand and say aye.

Excellent.

And check out our Rockville leagues as well.

And now I'd like to invite up Torrance Dawkins.

Come on up.

Yes, please.

You play sports?

Okay.

Do you want to say anything?

It's up to you.

No pressure.

No pressure.

Here we go.

All I can say is I've been uh coaching with the city of Rockville for about to tell my age now.

35 years now.

All right, and I started out with wow, some of you guys might know Anthony Gumby and Yvette Yobas, her husband, uh coast him.

You see what sports can do for you.

Oh yeah, it keeps me young.

As well as coaching with Sarah's daughter.

And now I'm still going and I have my grandson, so I'm gonna keep on going besides that, Derek and I'm not gonna let me go anyway.

We'll see you for the next for the next 35.

Yes.

So much for what you're doing.

So I've got the honor to uh read the proclamation for Indigenous People's Days, and it's important, as we often say here in Rockville before a lot of our programs, all of our work sessions, we have to remember this land was not ours.

This land was not the city of Rockville land.

It started with the indigenous peoples who were here.

And it's important that we recognize that, and it's important that we honor their heritage throughout the city of Rockville.

And that's why it's important to remember that and why this proclamation of what's happening next week is so important.

Whereas the second Monday in October is recognized by the City of Rockville, Maryland as Indigenous People's Day.

And whereas this day honors the vibrant cultures, traditions, and histories of the indigenous peoples of the Americas.

And now, therefore, the mayor and council of the City of Rockville, Maryland, do hereby proclaim Monday, October 13th, 2025, as Indigenous People's Day in Rockville, Maryland, and call upon all members of the community to join us in celebrating with our family, friends, and neighbors.

Madam Mayor, I move the proclamation.

Second, Councilman Valeri.

All those in favor, please raise your hand and say aye.

Hi.

Do we not have any?

We don't have any daughters.

We'll post all these on the website.

You don't need a pitcher.

We have pictures all the time.

All right.

I am honored to give the next proclamation in honor of Diwali.

Whereas Duwali is a festival of lights and one of the major festivals celebrated by Hindus, Jains, and some Buddhists.

And whereas the festival lasts five days and is celebrated during the Hindu Lunisolar Month Kartica between mid-October and mid-November.

And whereas Bandit Chur Devas is celebrated by Sikhs on the last day of Diwali as the liberation of Guru Hargo Mind from imprisonment and will be commemorated on the same date.

Now, therefore, the mayor and council of Rockville, Maryland, hereby proclaim October 20th, 2025 as Diwali in Rockville, and invite all residents to understand its principles and enjoy the celebration of the victory of light over darkness, good over evil, and knowledge over ignorance.

The city encourages everyone to share the principles of the Festival of Lights and to share love for all residents of Rockville and beyond.

Madam Mayor, I move the proclamation.

All those in favor, please raise your hand and say aye.

Aye.

Aye.

And before I read, I just wanted to underscore how vital economic development is for Rockville, especially as we deal with job losses from the federal government.

Growth only happens when all of us, businesses, leaders, entrepreneurs work together to create new opportunities.

Whereas the economic growth and stability of the state affect all regions and jurisdictions of Maryland.

And now, therefore, the mayor and council hereby proclaim the week of October 20th through the 24th, 2025, to be economic development week in the city of Rockville.

In recognition of the importance of economic development and its role in supporting the business community, creating new and dynamic opportunities for residents and visitors and enhancing the fiscal health of the city.

Madam Mayor, I move the proclamation.

Councilman Bank Rag seconds, all those in favor, please raise your hand and say aye.

Aye.

I now uh want to provide an opportunity for Ready to receive the proclamation.

Thank you.

And you can say if you worked.

So I'm Nancy Reglan, and this is Bayma, and we're the chair and vice chair of the board of directors of Rockville Economic Development.

We've been very proud as an economic development agency to serve the city of Rockville since 1997 to make it a destination of innovation and vitality and to make it a great place for everyone here to live, work, and play.

So if you're not familiar with Ready, please make sure that you check out a lot of our uh presence online.

So Rockville Ready.org, or if you're interested in things to do around the city of Rockville, you can check out Explore Rockville.org, or if you're in the biotech industry, you can check out our new website, biotechcorridor.org.

Um, and so at this time I just want to say thank you for the support from the city of Rockville for economic development.

We continue to work very hard on all of yours' behalfs.

Thank you.

Thank you so much, everyone.

Appreciate it.

Thank you.

Thank you.

And I know she wanted to appreciate and honor National Arts and Humanities Month.

I also serve as the Council liaison for the Cultural Arts Commission.

There's a meeting this week if you want to check it out.

Um but arts and culture and history have enriched our community.

Uh the city of Rockville, you may not know this has walking tours where you can see where our artwork is.

Uh and it's all throughout our public spaces, but also in some of the private spaces.

There also have been a number of events celebrating arts.

The F.

Scott Fitzgerald Literary Festival is coming up in October.

And uh I know that F.

Scott's gel is buried here, and we're celebrating the 100th anniversary of the Great Gatsby.

And just the weekend before last, my colleagues and I uh cut the ribbon on the new F.

Scott Fitzgerald Theater, which has been made more accessible, more sustainable, and uh including more opportunities for the arts.

So we are committed to arts and humanities here in the city of Rockville, and you can see multiple art galleries north and east and west of the city.

Um I know that we'll have Karen Asking to talk about this arts a little bit and cultural arts as well.

They have a fantastic gallery in town center, and Glenview Mansion has a free art gallery that you can go and check out any time.

Now I will read the proclamation.

Whereas the month of October has been recognized as National Arts and Humanities Month by thousands of communities, cities, and states across the country, as well as by the White House and Congress.

Arts and Humanities enhance the census, stimulate creativity, and enrich every American.

Now, therefore, the Mayor and Council of Rockville, Maryland, to hereby proclaim October 2025 as National Arts and Humanities Month in Rockville, Maryland, and call upon our residents to celebrate and promote the arts and culture in our nation and to specifically encourage the greater participation by those residents and taking action for the arts and humanities in their own towns and cities.

Colleagues, can someone move the proclamation?

Councilman Van Crack moves.

Do we have a second?

Councilmember Valerie Seconds.

All those in favor, please raise your hand and say aye.

All right.

Welcome Karen Askin, who also serves as the chair of the Cultural Arts Commission.

We also have, while she's coming up, Great Rescoes.

These are nonprofit organizations that help to do a lot of arts.

Welcome.

Thank you.

Thank you.

It it dawns on me that Rockville really is an amazingly diverse place that is made better by us all working together.

So I'm very excited to accept this proclamation.

And I also want to thank the city for its longtime support of VizArts.

We um we really believe that the arts help us speak when words cannot.

And whether it's dancing, like Barry and Adam, you know.

I don't know whether you've caught their great video online celebrating is it a new hotel?

Yep.

The Hilton.

Um actually the mayor did it as well.

She didn't make it on to the video that I saw.

But you know, the arts are everything, dances included.

Um, and so uh in honor of uh that it does we all rise together.

I let um our city manager know today that um VizArts is going to be offering free classes to furloughed um federal workers.

Um it's our way of saying um come in, be creative, reduce your stress.

Let's um let's let's um focus on the positive things that the arts are all about.

So thank you, and um I hope you all sign up.

Well, you have been furloughed, but um make sure your constituents and your friends and your neighbors know that there's a place for them.

And uh I look forward to seeing them.

So I have the honor of reading Breast Cancer Awareness Month.

And before I read the proclamation, I just want to remind everyone to schedule your mammogram and urge the women in your life to also do the same early detection saves lives.

Whereas October is referred to as National Breast Cancer Awareness Month in the United States.

Now, therefore, the mayor and council of the city of Rockville, Maryland, do hereby proclaim October 2025 as National Breast Cancer Awareness Month in Rockville, Maryland, and call upon all members of the community to join us in encouraging and supporting those experiencing treatment and celebrating our survivors.

Madam Mayor, I move the proclamation.

So the next proclamation is something that's pretty serious, and that's bullying.

And it's important to address bullying.

I know we've got numerous members from a number of our Rockville schools here today, and that's important because bullying often starts in the schools.

But bullying is everywhere.

Bullying is in the workplace.

It's everywhere.

And it's important that we recognize that this is something that we need to stand up to.

And it's important here in Rockville because one of the worldwide proponents of kindness in the anti-bullying spirit is from Rockville, Matty JTs to Panic.

We've got a park named after Maddie.

And I know Maddie's mom wanted to be here, but unfortunately, what she is doing right now is teaching kindness in actually programs here in Rockville.

And I think it's important when we're talking about bullying.

The way to combat bullying is with kindness.

Kindness matters.

See kindness in each other and in our world.

Be kindness for each other and for our world.

Kindness is a critical characteristic of peace.

And I think what Maddie would say it's also critical characteristic of combating bullying in our society.

Whereas bullying is the most common form of violence in our society.

More than 70% of young people nationwide say they have seen bullying in their schools.

And 30% have admitted to bullying others.

Membership in either the bully or the victim group is closely associated with actually dropping out of school, poor social development, criminal activity, and other negative long-term consequences.

And now, therefore, the mayor and council of the city of Rockville, Maryland, do here proclaim October 2025 as national bullying prevention month and ask that everyone be models for our children and adults to help combat bullying behavior through kindness, empathy, and compassion towards others.

Madam Mayor, I move the proclamation.

Thank you.

Councilmember Jackson seconds.

All those in favor, please raise your hand and say hi.

Hi.

Now I know we've got members of a number of our Rockville schools, and if you'd like to come up, accept the proclamation and say a few words.

And I also want to thank you all for coming because it shows the dedication that our Rockville schools have with regard to bullying.

Do you guys want to say a few words?

Yep.

So I'm Dr.

Penn.

I am accepting this on behalf of Principal Powells at Rockville High School.

I can tell you one of Principal Powell's core values is to make sure that every student, staff member, and even parent, when they walk through our building, that there's a level of respect and that we lead with love, and we are imitating that for our students to show the same.

And so she definitely wanted to make sure that someone from the school was here to accept this tonight because it means so much to her.

Thank you.

Thank you.

And likewise, my name is Matt Martini.

I'm here representing Alicia Deene and uh Richard Montgomery High School community.

Um similar to what's been echoed tonight.

We feel that obviously academic excellence is what we achieve for in schools, but that's hard to do if kids don't feel safe.

And so we firmly believe that every student that walks through our halls undoubtedly feels safe, secure, so that they can just worry about kid problems, algebra tests, English essays, and not worry about what's going to be said or done to them.

Thanks.

Thank you so much.

Uh good good evening.

Um Dr.

Bostick at uh Thomas Wooder High School, I'm the principal there.

Um, and I echo my colleagues here that every day we want our kids to walk into the building and feel a sense of belonging, and not only our kids, but our staff as well.

Uh, we want everyone to feel like when they walk in that building, they have a sense of the lifestyle and mood that they're gonna feel each day, and that's important to us because if you're not psychologically safe or you don't feel safe, then it's hard to feel like you belong and you could be a functional member of a community.

So thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

We will now move on to the proclamation, which is very timely for today because we'll be talking about the zoning ordinance rewrite.

And I want to acknowledge the planning commission uh because they do so much work.

If you ever watched their meeting, they're what they're reading packets that are quite dense, making very important decisions about our community, how we welcome the neighbors, how we do placemaking, and how we create a safe and welcoming community for all.

And so with that, I'd like to read the proclamation for planning, and I'd also like to thank our staff.

Tireless hours, lots of feedback from the community, and it's what makes Rockville a special place to live work in play.

So thank you.

Whereas change is constant and affects all cities, towns, suburbs, counties, rural areas, and other places, whereas planners can help navigate this change with data-driven insights and expertise that provides better choices for how people work and live.

Whereas community planning provides an opportunity for all residents to be meaningfully involved in making choices that determine the future of their community.

Now, therefore, the mayor and council of Rockville, Maryland, do hereby proclaim the month of October 2025 as community planning month in the city of Rockville, Maryland, in conjunction with the celebration of National Community Planning Month throughout the country.

I'd like to welcome our Planning Commission member, Susan Pittman.

Welcome.

We'll move it.

Madam Mayor, I move the proclamation.

It's been moved.

I'll say it.

All right.

All those in favor, please raise your hand and say aye.

All right.

Come on up.

Thank you so much.

Madam Mayor and Council members, thank you for recognizing the value of community planning.

Thoughtful people-centered planning has the potential to elevate the quality of life for every resident of Rockville now and well into the future.

Thank you for creating the context for our community to do this essential work.

And special thank you to the community planning and development staff.

You are instrumental in the work that we do and supporting our efforts.

And Jim Waselak is here tonight.

He's the long-term chief of zoning and is uh Chief Sherpa of the Planning Commission.

We appreciate you so much, Jim.

Thank you.

Jim, do you want to come up?

Yep.

You can't see that coming here.

He likes to be behind the scenes.

No, now you get to be in front of the scene.

Thank you.

So it is my pleasure to read the proclamation proclaiming the October 2025 as National Disability Employment Awareness Month.

I've said it before, but it repeats, uh bears repeating.

Everyone can join the ranks of the disabled, whether from birth or because of a chronic disease, a car accident, or a sudden health issue like a stroke.

To this end, we have made wonderful strides in making the workplace more accessible, broken down barriers to those with a disability in the workplace, and through the landmark Americans for Disabilities Act, the ADA.

Disabilities no longer have to be a barrier for productive work for many Americans.

There are many nonprofits and employers who are cooperating in ways to help break down those barriers.

Among them is the ARC of Muggama County and SSEC, which stands for Seeking Employment, Equality, and Community for People with the Developmental Disabilities, who partners with businesses like SurfPro to hire employees with disabilities for the mutual benefit of both employees and employers.

Sticking with the local Rockville theme, uh, I would be remiss not to point out our own Sunflower Bakery in Twinbrook, which enables pathways for employment for young adults and teens with learning dis uh uh differences through pre-employment uh exposure and workforce development, training in spacery arts, culinary arts, hospitality, and related industries.

Now I'm honored to read the proclamation.

Whereas October 2025 is National Disability Employment Awareness Month, and this year marks us 80th anniversary with a theme, celebrating value and talent.

And now therefore, the Mayor and Council of the City of Rockville, Maryland, do hereby proclaim October 2025 as a National Disability Employment Awareness Month in Rockville, Maryland, and urge everyone to embrace the talents and skills that individuals with disabilities bring to our workplaces and our communities and affirm our commitment to an inclusive community.

With that, Madam Mayor, I move the proclamation.

Thank you.

Councilman Seconds.

All those in favor, please raise your hand and say aye.

So I don't think we have uh anybody uh scheduled.

I did talk to uh Sunflower, and they were uh they cannot be here today to celebrate uh this uh proclamation or accept it.

Umflower is a kosher uh facility, so they're closed on all Jewish uh holidays.

But they did ask me to read this brief statement.

Sunflower Bakery is honored to be recognized for our work in closing the employment gap for young adults with learning disabilities, differences, sorry.

Through our workforce development programs, we create pathways to employment that builds a more inclusive workforce, strengthens our community, and fosters a brighter future for our graduates.

Thank you.

Uh we thank my colleagues and Madam Mayor for the opportunity to present with my colleague a sobering yet necessary proclamation.

It's a recognition of October being domestic violence awareness month.

Before we begin reading, I just want to offer a couple of lessons I've learned.

Um my journey dealing with domestic violence is one that society often doesn't see.

During that journey, I've learned two very important lessons.

One, domestic violence doesn't discriminate.

It affects all socioeconomic statuses, races, religions, sexual orientations.

Umbody is left immune.

Two, there are resources available.

Even here in Montgomery County, we have the Montgomery County Crisis Center and the Abused Persons Program.

I personally benefited from their services if for no other reason than to have an unbiased person hear a story, make some recommendations that prompted me to make recommendations as well.

Thank you.

And like Dr.

Miles, I also uh come to this space with some lived experience, and it is not easy for me to share, but I am grateful for all of my colleagues uh and for their support in providing this opportunity.

I am a survivor of domestic violence.

I once believed uh I found a perfect partner, and that dream was suddenly shattered.

And I was forced to leave my home and facing a real daunting task of managing the mortgage alone, and I became a landlord, not necessarily by choice, but by survival.

Uh and I came to Rockville seeking safety, a reputation that this city has rightfully earned, and one I am committed to upholding as a council member.

I understand the constant fear of looking over your shoulder and the struggle to break free, uh, a battle that I fought several times.

And the turning point was the unwavering support I found here through the Crisis Center, the Family Justice Center, nonprofits, and shelters, some shelters that I used for a bed sometimes.

Um being empowered by local government and resources in my community, I transitioned from a survivor to a council member, now shaping uh my housing and public safety policies and my insight in how I do uh insights in how I do fore policies was shaped by my journey.

And so um I wanted to read the proclamation, whereas the National Coalition Against Domestic Violence reports that on average nearly 20 people per minute are physically abused by an intimate partner in the United States, and victims of intimate partner violence lose a total of eight million days of paid work each year.

And now, therefore, the mayor and council of the city of Rockville, Maryland, you hereby proclaim October 2025 as National Domestic Violence Awareness Month and call upon everyone to speak out against domestic violence to support organizations that assist domestic violence victims in our community and to help victims of these crimes find the assistance and healing that they need by sharing the 24-hour hotline at 1-800-799-SAFE.

That's 800 799-7233.

And the TTY number 800-787-3224.

With that, Madam Mayor, we move the proclamation.

A second.

All those in favor, please raise your hand and say aye.

We'd like to uh call up Miss Judith Clark, who's done amazing work in the community with survivors.

Thank you, Ms.

Judy.

And as she comes up, just want to thank our colleagues for allowing us a bit of an audible to present this.

It means a lot to us both.

So thank you.

Thank you very much.

Hi, everybody.

I'm Judy Clark.

And um, on behalf of Women Who Care Ministries, we're deeply honored to receive this proclamation tonight.

And we're also proud to share Rockville's shared vision of safety, because we believe that every resident deserves safety, dignity, and freedom from fear and harm.

And our mission is to help victims break free from the clutches of abuse and to rise as survivors.

And in times like this, when so many of us are struggling on so many levels, we're committed to spreading encouragement, compassion, and light wherever dark tries to linger.

And that's why we're also grateful for once again, City of Rockville standing beside us and being the core sponsor of our upcoming Restore the Joy Empowerment Luncheon, which takes place on November 15th, and you're all invited to attend.

And if you are a victim or survivor of domestic violence, and if you're a furlough worker, a mission is totally free.

And you can find out information about that on our website at Women Who Care Ministries.org.

And we intend you, we invite you all to attend, not just if you are surviving domestic violence, but there are so many things going on, so many unprecedented issues going on during this time that we promise if you come, you too will be uplifted.

You will be uplifted and you'll be transformed.

And I, you, we all deserve a life that is filled with peace and joy.

Let's go after it with everything that we've got.

Thank you.

Thank you again.

So I'm reading the proclamation for LGBTQ a month.

So the City of Rockville recognizes the growing politization and attacks on LGBTQ plus inclusive curriculum in schools across the United States, and the need to reaffirm support for increased visibility and awareness of LGBDQ history.

We also recognize the many contributions of LGBTQ plus activists, organizations, students, and other residents who have contributed to making Rockville a welcoming and accepting place to live, work, and attend school, including the Montgomery County Pride Center, Live in Your Truth, Trans Maryland, Maryland Transunity, and Pride Prome.

We have made much progress in trying to see our LGPTQ plus friends and family and others as having the same rights, the same status and the same freedoms as everyone else in this country.

Sadly, those rights, status, and freedoms seem quite literally to be under attack.

From trans rights to marriage equality to even service in our military.

Everywhere you turn, it seems that some government agency or politician or group is trying to roll back time.

A brief story personally.

I have a friend in Tennessee.

I have known since 1996.

He is gay.

I watched if he went from a very closeted individual to living his full life as things changed around him for the better, as our society grew more accepting.

I recall his joy when he and his now husband got engaged.

That was real change, not, I believe, a coincidence that in October 1994, the first LGBTQ month was started.

Now he and his husband are thinking about moving full time to Massachusetts because there's also real change the other way.

The Supreme Court may reverse equality in marriage.

These are real worries for the millions of uh LGBTQ plus people in the United States.

We cannot go back.

That is why I am proud to live in a state like Maryland that values everyone.

And that is why I'm especially proud to be living and serving in Rockville, where we not only stand for equality, but we embrace it as a city, and we wave the banner freely that Rockville sees and values everyone.

Regardless of who you are, who to choose to be, what you believe, or who you love.

Isn't it said before, and I know it some hate to hear it because it is true, diversity is our strength.

I'm proud of our diversity, and I hope that you are as well.

With that, our read the proclamation.

Whereas in January 1994, a teacher from a suburban St.

Louis, Missouri High School, Rodney Wilson, conceived an idea that a month should be dedicated to the celebration and teaching of LGBTQ plus history.

He gathered other teachers and community leaders to join him in this cause and selected the month of October as LGBTQ plus history month.

And now therefore, the mayor and council of Rockville, Maryland, do hereby proclaim October 2025 as LGPGQ History Month, and that the Mayor and Council encourage all residents to participate in observances and celebrate the many contributions of notable members of the LGBTQ community and further commit to protecting LGBTQ students and ensuring that LGBTQ history is recognized and acknowledged.

With that, Madam Mayor, I move the proclamation.

Aye.

And I believe we have several people to uh uh accept the proclamation and uh make brief remarks if they uh so choose.

Uh I call up Rebecca Murphy and Dominique Rosilli of the uh Human Rights Commission and my friend Annie Messick.

Oh, and Nigel House I forget.

On behalf of the Human Rights Commission, we gratefully accept this proclamation.

LGBTQ plus history month reminds us that the struggle for equality is not ancient history.

It is happening right now in our schools, in our courts, and in our communities.

Last year, when this was introduced in Rockville, we celebrated it as a recognition of historic struggles.

Today, just 12 months later, federal attacks on LGBTQ plus history have intensified.

The Supreme Court decision now allows parents to shield their children from learning about LGBTQ plus contributions to our society.

The Park Service removed the word transgender from the Stonewall National Monument, attempting to erase the very people who sparked the modern equality movement.

These attempts at erasure make Rockville stance even more vital.

History cannot be selective.

The LGBTQ plus activists who helped build our community deserve to have their stories told.

When our students learn about all Americans who shaped our nation, they feel safer, more accepted, and better prepared to contribute to our diverse democracy.

We extend our heartfelt gratitude to the mayor and council for standing firm when others retreat.

Thank you for ensuring Rockville remains a beacon of acceptance where we don't just tolerate our LGBTQ plus neighbors, we celebrate them.

So thank you, Madam Mayor and Councilmembers, and especially Councilmember Jackson for inviting me tonight.

This month is an important reminder that LGBTQIA plus history is and has always been an integral part of American history.

From Baron von Steuben, who transformed early American militias into a disciplined army to Bayard Rustin, who organized the march on Washington, DC with Dr.

Martin Luther King, to Marsha P.

Johnson, who started Pride with a riot at Stonewall.

Countless modern history makers continuing the legacy of LGBTQIA plus individuals have stood at the forefront of the fight for civil rights and progress of this nation.

And at a time when our fundamental rights are once again being challenged with the Supreme Court considering a case that could overturn marriage equality.

And I am not from Rockville, but I do live in a neighboring city, and I'm very proud to have two places that I very much love and very much consider home support everything in everyone in their community.

And would this month serve not only as a reflection on how far we've come, but as a renewed commitment to protect the rights, the history, the humanity of all who call this community home, and thank you guys.

We welcome you to Rockville.

Thank you.

I don't know where to go here.

It's already up here.

Okay.

Our our last but not least proclamation is in honor of Woktober.

Uh Woktober, if you're unfamiliar with it.

Actually, we should probably rebrand it as walk and rolltober, um, because it's really all about pedestrian uh safety and pedestrian does not just equate into walking, it is rolling, it is all different modes of uh transit in that way.

And I think that Waktober is absolutely critical to not only celebrate our ability to get places without uh the benefit of an automobile, um, but it also allows for um more of a uh a focus on things like all the years of of impact of traffic violence on uh especially the Rockville community.

Um some of the people uh that we will talk about um there's gonna be many activities.

Um and the city of Rockville has always uh been proud to support all the activities within Wachtober.

We even had a bingo card once, um, which we discontinued because it was about it dangerous intersections of where you should go.

Um so at any rate, Woktober is truly it from the very silly, very funny to uh the ending event, which is uh memorial candlelight vigil for all those that we have lost um due to to traffic violence.

So um I will proceed with the proclamation.

Oh, I should probably also say as council liaison to the Transportation Mobility Commission, as well as the Rockville Pedestrian Advocacy Committee.

There are many different ways that people can get involved this October.

Um so here we go.

Whereas the state of Maryland was the first state in the country to designate walking as the official exercise in 2008.

And whereas Governor West Moore designated the month of October as Woktober in Maryland by recognizing the state's official exercise, walking, for its health benefits and well-being for all Marylanders.

Now, therefore, the mayor and council hereby proclaim October 2025 as Woktober in the city of Rockville, Maryland, and invite all residents to take advantage of walking for its health, recreation, and transportation benefits, as well as October walk-in ours focused on pedestrian safety.

The city encourages everyone to find time to walk every day or roll every day and to make it a priority for residents of all ages.

Madam Mayor, I'm very honored to move this proclamation.

Hi.

Thank you.

And I don't think we have anyone, so I'll just accept it and share it with the Commission and our PAC later.

Thank you.

Thank you, everyone, for joining us today.

We have a lot to celebrate.

But we thank you for your patience and for joining us during our proclamation and celebration time.

Montgomery Al Dia.

Un programme presentado por el Condado de Montgomery con el objetivo de manuten sobre todo lo que acontece in Nestro Condado.

Aquí the initial Montgomery Al Dia.

Lorna Virgili.

It's been a little different this year.

Um with many in our community worried about the immediate issues.

What have you been hearing from the community?

Some of the staff is, you know, less willing to come in because they're afraid people are worried about their kids going to school.

But they're worried that they're gonna come.

And they're probably right.

What continues to be your message for the Latino Hispanic community in the county, Mr.

County Executive?

We we've tried to reassure people that first of all Montgomery County's not going to change its policies.

So we continue to support the health clinics and the social services in the county.

We understand how important they are.

We're looking at what we might have to backfill in case there are cuts from the federal government that affect our funding and ability to provide services.

And uh we want to reassure them that you know our police are not going to be enforcing what ICE is doing.

So when you see people out there, you're gonna see you may see ICE agents out there, but Montgomery County Police will not be there to assist them.

Talking um about police, uh there is something that I wanted to ask you regarding uh our police officers in Montgomery County Police Department.

Um they don't ever wear masks while on duty.

And how can county residents identify someone who is an MCPD officer so they feel uh secure, they don't experience fear.

Right.

So we've ordered uh replacement patches for the back of the officers' uniforms that say Montgomery County police, so that you won't have any reason to be confused if you see a police officer.

Those were ordered, those were ordered.

They've been ordered, yes.

Okay.

So that's so it when they come in, our officers will all have these um big they're big, they go all the way across the back.

And instead of saying police, they'll say Montgomery County police, so people know that it's our police.

Um the only time they wear masks is if they're in um uh like SWAT the SWAT team will wear masks if they're doing a SWAT operation, undercover officers might wear a mask and if they're involved in something like that, but none of them are the kind of things that involve um immigration.

So there are police will continue to look like regular police.

Um talking uh you know, circling back to some of the celebrations that you participated in this year.

Uh you tested it, you mentioned restaurant, but you visited uh some um Latino owned businesses up county um as part of the celebration.

There were the race of hope awards as well, and the business accelerator um graduation that took place also during Hispanic Herance Month.

Out of all those moments, uh, which one touch your heart?

I like the one about giving 10,000 dollars uh to uh uh entrepreneurs.

Does that touch your heart or touch your wallet?

It was um I think all of them were really interesting and different.

The the awards uh to the entrepreneurs are really nice because these are people who have worked really hard and they got recognized um for the way they'd grown their businesses and you know what they what they taken away from you know what they were taught and how they were able to implement it.

And that was nice to see these small people business people very excited and getting awards, you know, for the work they've done.

That was that was pretty good.

I'll tell you more after you translate that.

Uh celebration, visitas uh negotios Latinos in la zona north of the condado.

También una presentación, rayos de esperanza de reconocimiento certificado in nuestra community con la community migrante.

But one interesting fue la graduación de un programma acelerador para empresarios Latinos, it was a program donde se otorgó un total de 10 mil dollars for three galardonadas que were reconocidos for el impulso emprendedor y también el apprendizage dentro del programma de Asselerador.

Business, porque es possible que vaya a ver otro programma celebrador, not necessariamente in Spaniel, but in English, but in caso que le interesse.

Okay, you wanted to continue that thought.

So, you know, we we did a tour this last weekend, we went to a few businesses, and that was also really nice to see the owners there.

Um, you know, one woman who had the uh Minuteman Press up in Gaithersburg, she started as an employee when the and when the her employer got ready to sell his business, uh she was able to buy the business and keep it going.

And uh she's done a really impressive job over there.

And I think uh there was a guy who's opened up a gym, and he's done a again uh really creative um kind of specialized gym services.

I thought were uh I wish I had the time to do.

Um personal training and things like that.

It was it was really, really nice.

And then there's uh restaurant which has uh uh has one in near where I live in the Tacoma Park, but also one in Gaithersburg, and they're in one of my favorite old places.

There used to be a sub a sandwich shop in Gathersburg called Royce, and it was the greatest sandwich shop ever.

Now they've turned it into a restaurant.

It is really it is really good.

Um just nice to see that the fact that you know that old building is being used for somebody else's you know, new adventure.

And they're just uh they were really nice people and it seemed like they had a great ambiance there and a workforce there.

It was just nice to be out.

I did not do any eating on that one.

Ah, you missed out.

Well, I missed that, but I will go back there because now that I know they're there, and uh I'll definitely go back there.

It's close enough to my office to even have a meeting there.

Exactly.

Uh quizás are hasta una reunión allí.

I'm really glad you enjoyed those uh um business uh visits.

Um we know that you always do.

It siempre disfruta mucho esta visitas and los commercial.

Um let's go back to the immigration and uh how the county has focused, especially in the last uh ten months, um building trust, informing the community and supporting the community.

Uh, can you share with uh our audience why these uh priorities are important, um building trust, being rightly informed, and also um resources, support.

Well, I mean they're all important, and uh I'll just start by saying, you know, this this isn't something we've recently done.

This has been kind of long-standing policy in the county to try to build trust in the communities, inform people of you know what information we have that would be helpful to them, and then provide supports.

And you know, trust is important because just on basic things, you they need to be able to trust the police.

They need to know that if something happens to them or to somebody they know about that they can come to the police and ask for help, and that they're not going to wind up in front of immigration services, that we actually we don't enforce immigration through our police department.

They're here to help you and to give you the same same services and the same help they give anybody else.

And that's important for the community to understand that.

Go ahead.

Um, the second one is you know to inform, and you know, people because it's an immigrant community, they don't know what the government does, they don't understand necessarily the school system, uh, they don't know where they can get you know help from, and so it's important for us to get information out in the community so they understand what programs we run.

You know, we have an Hispanic liaison.

Um we've you know made a lot of effort to do outreach with the community during COVID.

We started doing hubs where we were able to empower people in the community to help us first with getting people tested, then for vaccinations.

Uh it continues with food distribution and you know, clothing distribution.

So making sure the people know where the services are, who's providing them, and basically letting them know that the government's here to provide support.

We're here to help you, and that's why informing them is important.

Um about resources, the Gelker Center has um taken a big role about informing uh the community.

Do we know how many people they serve us more or less on a weekly basis, how busy are they?

Do we know historically they've been pretty busy, but I don't know, I don't know the number off the top of my head.

We can get you that number.

Okay.

But they serve a lot of people.

They've always been considered a safe place to go to.

I think residents have gotten used to being able to go there for help.

Um and that that's why we created it.

So we we continue to fund it and make sure there are programs that can actually you know assist people.

You know, I've been there for you know things related to small business.

I've been there for people, you know, who are you know getting citizenship?

You know, there's a lot of stuff going on.

And uh they're basically there to help make sure that the communities, uh Latino and otherwise have support um and know where to find it in the county.

Exactly.

Let's talk about money.

That's all about money, your favorite subject, our favorite subject.

You've hosted already about six of them.

Six or seven.

I lost count already because we're having twelve this year.

What have you heard mostly from county residents?

Um and it varies from location to location, but what's been your biggest takeaway so far and how tight is that budget this year?

Um we don't know how tight the budget's gonna be because we're not yet sure.

What are the impacts of the federal government going to be on the state and the state's budget from which we get money?

What are the impacts on the county from programs the federal government's not gonna fund anymore?

And what's it gonna cost us to try to keep those programs running without federal money?

Are we gonna have enough money to do that?

We don't know the impact of the president's tax cuts, except that it's supposed to have a negative impact on county revenues.

And so there are a number of things that could further reduce their revenues, and then there are the mass firings in the federal government that the president is firing, you know, thousands of people, and the numbers could easily go from ten to forty thousand in Montgomery County, somewhere in that range.

And that's really concerning because that would be incomes that would be lost.

And so right now we're planning as if things are normal, but we're we know that over the next couple of months we'll be getting the updated information and we'll put our budget together in the end based on the latest information we have.

But none of it's gonna be good.

It's possible that nuestro condado was 1000 and 40 miles that federal no lo ten in a mesh actualizadas perdidos, y ahí entonces se terminará de formular el presupuesto operativo del condado.

Señores, la cosa está apretada.

La cosa está apretada y todavía con mucho incertidumbre, porque ya escucharon esa larga explicación.

It's hard not knowing what you're gonna be working with.

Exactly.

Still, we have a community conversation coming up on Monday, October 27th in Spanish.

Yes.

Um Patricia, si nos pues compared about the conversation community that we're gonna have in Espanyol, in the Second Gather's Burg, in Lunes 27, comment at the 7 de la noche hasta las 8 and 30 of the noche.

It's very important for you to conduct these in Spanish in other languages, because we conduct them in other languages too.

Do you think taking into account that you know some events have been cancelled in the county, concerns about eyes, activity and all of that?

Do you know that you know a whole lot of folks might not show up on uh on the 27th?

Look, that that's a concern.

Um, but we're you know, it's also available virtually.

And so people have been able to tune in to these, you know, this presentations on their computers at home.

They don't necessarily have to come in, so that's an alternative for people.

Um I don't anticipate a problem there because you know these will be in government buildings, and uh that's a little bit there's a little bit more safety to being in a government building.

But um I would encourage people to come out unless something changes in the next week or two.

If we start seeing larger raids in the county, then one might worry a little bit more about being in a place where you believe lots of Hispanics will be gathering.

That's the reason the reason we wound up cancelling an event uh just a little while ago because of a concern by the people who wanted to have the event that they wouldn't be able to keep people secure there.

So you've got to think about that.

Uh town plaza, right?

Is that it?

Okay.

And the alternative of participation virtually at the platform Teams, and for sure, we will start transmitted in video in vivo in our page of Facebook, Montgomery County in Spanish.

But we have to watch the community, leaders of preocupation and the person, and for the event, cancel it.

We've run out of time.

I think we have about 30 seconds, one minute left, Mr.

County Executive, Senor Ecutivo.

Also that I just want to thank everybody for you know tuning in to this.

And uh I just want everybody to understand the county that you know you've lived in for however long you've been here.

Uh we're the same place that we've been.

We're still welcoming, we're still inclusive, and we still value every member of our community, and we're going to continue to do that.

Um we're committed to that.

I'm committed personally, I know the council members are committed, so the government that you're used to is going to remain the same government that you have.

And our community, no more quantum time we've been here.

Bye.

Montgomery Al Dia.

Sabia usted que existem más de 10 mil números telefónicos in el gobierno del condo de Montgomery.

Bueno, ahora solo debe reportar el número 31 para cualquier llamada que no sea de emergencia.

El tres uno es el sistema de information via telefónica que ofrece el gobierno.

Necesita information, tiene algún problema con un servicio del condado, desea localizar algún departamento o agencia del gobierno.

Entonces, marque el 3.

El Centro de Operadores está abierto de lunes a viernes desde las siete de la mañana hasta las siete de la noche.

El sitio de Internet está disponible las 24 horas al día.

Opio has been such a major player in marketing, and we make sure that we respond to all substances.

We welcome opportunity, we welcome housing, we welcome businesses coming into the city.

Today was a state of the city, and it's a great opportunity to bring together the mayor and council, our staff, residents, as well as the business community, nonprofit community to get together and hear updates and highlights on what the city is doing.

We hope to partner with Mayor Ashton and her team to help people get jobs.

I mean, right now it's such a difficult time.

Try to support people where they are.

What we're we've been doing as a council, we've been having these difficult discussions is how do we Bob and Weave to build back jobs.

The State of the City is a great opportunity for uh residents and community members across the county to know exactly how great Rockville is.

Mayor Ashton gave an incredible discussion about the initiatives that the mayor and council is pushing.

What's happening with public safety, what we're doing with housing, and how we're encouraging economic development.

So I want to thank our staff for helping to make that possible.

Two, three.

Today we're having the dedication of the F.

Scott Fitzgerald Theater for the new ADA renovations that it was just completed.

The arts are extremely important in Rockville, and supporting them and supporting the variety of arts.

It's a part of our humanity.

We are here celebrating the return to our home.

We performed our very first show here in 1960.

The city has been a great partner for us all over the years.

These theater companies are the heartbeat of our venue, and their dedication ensures that our community continues to enjoy high quality performance with performances right here in Rockville.

I've been performing here for 11 years now.

I've spent so much time here over the years, it's really a second or third home to me.

Rockville prides itself on being truly a center for the arts, especially the performing arts.

Every patron coming from all over the DC metro area and beyond can truly enjoy the performing arts here in Rockville.

Today was a state of the city, and it's a great opportunity to bring together the mayor and council, our staff, residents, as well as the business community, nonprofit community to get together and hear updates and highlights on what the city is doing.

We hope to partner with Mayor Ashton and her team to help people get jobs.

I mean, right now it's such a difficult time.

Try to support people where they are.

What are the major challenges facing the city in the next few years?

What we're we've been doing as a council, we've been having these difficult discussions is how do we, Bob and Weave to build back jobs.

The state of the city is a great opportunity for uh residents and community members across the county to know exactly how great Rockville is.

Mayor Ashton gave an incredible discussion about the initiatives that the mayor and council is pushing.

What's happening with public safety, what we're doing with housing, and how we're encouraging economic development.

The city host this event to really get a sense of what people need, what they want, but also what we're doing to make life better for the residents.

We really know the Rockville difference because you have partnership with comedian respect for community.

So I I want to thank our staff for helping to make that possible.

This USTA gave the City of Rockville participants an opportunity to attend the U.S.

Open.

We were able to take 24 kids to the US Open with their parents.

Um the kids got about 10 minutes on the courts for some one court experience, which included Red Balls, youth size racking, and about a pickleball size um tennis net.

During the program, they were able to meet some um famous players like Coco Golf, Ben Shelton.

They got to watch a couple matches, doubles, singles.

They had a huge experience.

That was a lot of fun.

And it was very fun.

I really enjoyed playing City of Rockville.

They have a lot of patience.

I can notice they actually put effort into teaching the kids.

I started practicing at like the Rockville courts.

We've been having these difficult discussions how do we Bob and Weave to build back jobs.

Mayor Ashton gave an incredible discussion about the initiatives that the mayor and council is pushing.

What's happening with public safety?

What we're doing with housing and how we're encouraging economic development.

Good evening, Rockwell.

Today is Wednesday, October 8th, 2025.

This is meeting number 13-25 of the City of Rockville Planning Commission.

I am Jamie Espinosa, Chair of the Planning Commission.

I am joined in chambers tonight by Commissioners Susan Pittman and Eric Fulton, and online by Commissioner Mungsoon.

Commissioner Chehan Salhuddin should be joining us in chamber shortly.

Tonight's meeting is being conducted in person and virtually by WebEx.

Tonight's agenda includes final record plat applications subdividing lots of the Danick Technological Park Subdivision, a level two site plan application at 198 East Montgomery Avenue, a work session on the zoning ordinance rewrite, and all this will be followed by a regularly scheduled commission items.

So our first item tonight is final record plat applications PLT 2025-00632, PLT 2025-0063, PLT 2025-00634, PLT 2025-00635, and PLT 2025-00636 to resubdivide lots five, six, seven, and eight of the Danick Technological Park Subdivision in conformance with Project Plan PJT 2017-00007 and level two site plan STP 2020-00393, located in the MXE mixed use employment zoning district at 15815 Shady Grove Road, 15825 Shady Grove Road, Two Choke Cherry Road, and 2092 Gaither Road, Toll Mid Atlantic LP Company Incorporated Applicant.

Over to Mr.

Waselak for any staff presentation.

As you noted, these are final record plants that will implement the prior approvals for the Shady Grove Innovation District.

This is phase one of that project.

And our principal planner, Kimmy Azulfagarion, is here to make the staff presentation.

Thank you, Jim.

Good evening, uh, members of the commission.

As noted, this is a final record plot application for the Shady Grove neighborhood center plates.

And you will be seeing the presentation for that on the screen.

The zoning district is MXE, mixed use employment.

It consists of a land area of approximately eleven acres, which combines uh all the five proposed plots and the existing uses office.

What you can see on the aerial image here is the existing four lots of five through seven.

Level two site plan SCP 2020-00393 was approved in 2020 for phase one of the approved project plan.

An additional major site plan amendment, SCP 2024-00489 was approved in 2024, amending one of the conditions of the site plan, level two site plan that was originally approved back in uh 2020.

The applicant is proposing to resubdivide lots five, six, seven, and eight of the Damak Technological Park Subdivision per STP 00393.

Uh and a one-acre park is also approved with the original site plan, which will be conveyed to the city.

With that, staff recommends approval with conditions.

A final record platzed PLT 2025-00632, 00633, 00634, 00635, 00636.

And this concludes the presentation with a recommended motion as shown on the screen here.

Thank you.

Do any of my fellow commissioners in the chambers have questions of staff at this time?

Hearing none, uh, Commissioner Sun online.

Do you have any questions?

Do we have a presentation by the applicant?

Representatives by the applicants are on the call.

Um, and uh I will let them take over any uh presentations that they might have.

Sorry, my apologies.

I was muted.

This is Pat Harris on behalf from Lurch Erleen Brewer on behalf of Toll.

We have no comments.

We're happy to be at this point in the process and looking forward to delivering needed townhouses to the city.

Thank you.

Thank you.

I think this one's gonna be a short one.

Does anyone have any follow-up questions?

Hearing nothing in the chambers, Commissioner Sun.

Hearing nothing, uh staff.

Can we put the proposed motion back on the screen?

Do any of my fellow commissioners uh want to make a motion?

I move that we approve final record platz PLT 2025-00632, 00633, 00634, 00635, and 00636 to resubdivide lots five, six, seven, and eight of the Danek Technological Park Subdivision, subject to the conditions in the staff report.

I second.

All those in favor raise your hand, say aye.

Aye.

Uh the motion the motion passes unanimously.

Thank you.

That brings us to item.

Thank you.

That brings us to item number two, uh, level two site plan application stp 2025-00503 to permit conversion of 13,011 square feet of previously approved street level retail in 13 residential units at 198 East Montgomery Avenue, Comstock 33 Munro LC applicant.

Over to Mr.

Wasak for any staff presentation.

Oh, thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Uh this is also an implementation step for a project that you've seen previously, uh, which was to convert uh some of the retail space at Boulevard 44 to residential loss, uh, which require a project plan approval, which the mayor and council did recently.

And senior planner uh Christopher Davis is here to make the staff presentation afterwards wear him in.

If you could identify yourself for the record.

Yes, Christopher Davis with community planning and development services.

And will you provide truthful testimony in the seating?

I will.

Thank you.

So this is the level two site plan for one ninety-eight East Montgomery Avenue as Mr.

Wasselike indicated.

This site plan looks to implement uh project plan which was uh approved by the mayor and council just last month in September of 2025.

The subject project area is shown on the screen at 198 East Montgomery Avenue, highlighted in red.

The site is located in planning area one corresponding to the town center, and the site area is approximately one point four one acres.

The land use designation is CRM corresponding with the commercial residential mix designation, and the zoning is the PDRCI zoning corresponding with the planned development for Rockville Center Incorporated with an equivalent zone of MXT.

The specific proposal by the applicant is for a conversion of the ground floor uh retail space, which was previously approved uh through the a project plan.

It corresponds with thirteen thousand eleven square feet of street level retail commercial space that will be converted into thirteen residential units.

As you can see from the site plan on the screen, the units will front the abutting streets at Helen Hinnigan Way, East Middle Lane, and Monroe Street.

Again, this specific site plan is required by the zoning ordinance to implement the project plan approval.

So as the commission may be familiar, the project plan uh did come to this body for review and recommendation and was ultimately approved by the mayor and council on September 15th.

Um that approval authorized the change of use to the ground floor retail and adjust the mix of uses in the building overall.

So in review of this level two site plan, staff has found that it meets the necessary uh requirements for approval, specifically um finding one that the project will not be detrimental to the public welfare nor injured injurious to property or improvements in the neighborhood.

Staff has found that the improvements will be limited to the existing building and will meet all necessary safety and adequacy requirements.

Staff also has found that the project will not violate any provision of the zoning ordinance.

Uh the proposed improvements are consistent with the mayor and council's approval through the project plan.

Um in addition, the site will maintain compliance with the zoning ordinance and the applicable standards.

Finally, staff has found that the project will not be uh incompatible with the surrounding uses and properties.

Um this particular proposal to convert to a residential use is consistent with similar properties and mixed use buildings in the neighborhood.

Um further, the project will provide additional residence to the area to support neighborhood commercial uses in town center.

Uh the applicant has met all necessary uh notification requirements as required by the zoning ordinance.

Uh specifically, there was a pre-application area meeting held on December 9th, 2021, and a required post-application area meeting on February 25th of this year.

So having found that all the necessary requirements uh have been met.

Um staff does recommend approval of level two site plan application stp two zero two five zero zero five zero three to permit conversion of thirteen thousand and eleven square feet of street re street level retail into thirteen residential units at one ninety-eight East Montgomery Avenue, subject to the findings and conditions in staff's report.

And with that, Mr.

Chair, that concludes staff's presentation.

Thank you.

Uh do any of my fellow commissioners in chambers have any questions of staff.

Hearing none, Commissioner Sun, do you have any questions?

No.

Uh is there a presentation by the applicant?

Yes.

Ma'am, we have a strict 10 appearances before us per year policy.

And I think you're getting very close to the probably getting pretty close, thank God it's the calendar year is almost over.

Would you identify yourself for the record?

I'm Nancy Regland from the law firm of Shulman Rogers.

I'm here as counsel for the applicant Comstock 33 Monroe.

And will you provide truthful testimony this evening?

I will.

Thank you.

All right.

So we have been here before on this project more than once.

And we actually gave you a uh advanced look at a lot of the perspectives during the project plan.

So I am going to go through some of them again just for the record, so that this is a complete record.

And if there's anybody watching online, they can also see them in the course of the site plan.

With me tonight is Chris Green, who's a vice president of Comstock, and we have architects and engineers online if there should be any questions.

So as we said before, we're gonna show you the perspectives to show you how we did respond to the feedback that we got from the planning commission and the mayor and council and how that plan has evolved.

And I will also add a couple of comments telling you about some things that have evolved as we've moved forward into the detailed engineering because we are moving forward towards permits in anticipation of an approval tonight.

So if we can add the next uh slide, please.

Just to remind everybody, this is what the building looks like.

That's what the first floor has looked like, uh, boarded up with the you know great advertising uh images on it for since uh the building opened in 2021.

Next slide, please.

And the white is the only part of the building that is actually being modified, and those are the conversions in white.

Next slide, please.

So this is the ill illustrative showing the corner of middle lane and Monroe to see how the existing conditions is now being changed with urban frontages.

Next slide, please.

And again, these are the middle lane, and the two things that I wanted to show about this segment of the conversion is that there are two lobby entrances here, one from middle lane.

It's with the red arrow at the top, and also a lobby entrance from Monroe Street, and it takes you back into this interior corridor, which allows people, even though they have a on-street door to the sidewalk, they can have private access through the rear of their units through this lobby entrance, and it also gives them access to their mail and package, to some storage areas, and to the trash room.

Next slide, please.

So this is from Monroe Street.

This is the boulevard lofts entrance on the left, and then there's a colored door that's the first entrance.

Next slide, please.

And this slide is provided here because there's a condition to the site plan that says uh about stormwater management.

And this is the only area of the outside other than the planting of the landscaping that we're actually doing work, and we're regrading the sidewalk on Monroe Street because these are fairly sloped from middle lane up to East Montgomery Avenue in order to get an ADA entrance into the Boulevard Lofts lobby and to the first uh unit entrance.

We have to regrade it a little bit so that there's uh a landing right there.

So it's less than 250 square feet, so just to let you know that's what the conditions are about right there.

Next slide.

Okay, so this is the Monroe Street three bedroom.

Um because in front of all of these windows on the three-bedroom is actually uh transformer grates in the sidewalk, and we can't put any planters out there, so the door has been recessed to allow for privacy and uh delineation away from the uh pedestrians walking on Monroe.

Next slide, please.

Okay, so as we move along the Monroe Street heading down towards middle lane, these are the first uh of the units, and you can see how the front doors have been pulled back to give room for planters.

Um, and you can see each of these doors.

Uh there will be privacy screenings for light and privacy control on all these units, and what the applicant is looking at is film on those door panes in order to give them some privacy, but to give them some light through those doors.

Next slide, please.

And you can see as we move along the same thing, planters that are indented into the building face.

Next slide, please.

And it takes us to the corner of Helen Hennigan Way and Middle Lane.

And you can see that we have a nice unit on the corner.

Next slide, please.

And as we go up Helen Hennigan Way, there is two units right here at the beginning of Helen Hennigan Way, right at the corner of middle lane.

And then you can see this gives us an opportunity though, because the ways the building is designed and where the garage is to be able to do landscaping in the ground.

And it will be a mix of evergreens with some annuals, and they will be all maintained by the building.

Next slide, please.

So where the woman is standing, she's actually in front of the residences on the lane lobby.

So they're sitting right there as a break between all these units.

And then if you've walked up Helen Hennigan Way, you know that the building floor actually transfers to a different elevation, which is why this is the one unit where the floor is the most stepped that has the uh stair and landing, uh, and then the two additional units, and then another lobby unit, uh lobby door, to do the same thing as we saw in middle lane, which is to give you a rear access for all of these residents for privacy if they don't want to use their front door.

Okay, next slide, please.

Okay, and then that's I'm just pointing out where the residences are and where that rear corridor is, and there'll be trash collection back there for these units as well from there.

Next slide, please.

And then the last visual on Helen Hennig away.

And the one thing that I want to point out, because this is one of our last perspectives, is you'll see that each of these stores are different colors.

They were a spectrum of colors, and as the uh design has evolved, um they're looking more at reducing the size of the spectrum of the colors and keeping them more consistent.

Um so we may see when they're actually built that the door are not this range of yellows and reds, and that they may be within a smaller spectrum of colors.

All right, next slide, please.

Okay, so to close, we do accept the staff's conditions, and we thank you for your consideration of the site plan.

We're very excited on behalf of the applicant to be able to provide this kind of alternative dwelling unit for people who want to live in town center, and so we respectfully request that it be approved so we can move forward to permits as soon as possible.

Thank you.

Thank you, ma'am.

Uh any questions of uh the applicant from commissioners in chambers?

Nope.

Uh Commissioner Sun, do you have any questions of the applicant?

Uh I just have some comments.

I think as when you've cut last time, though, we're just want to make sure the uh the windows will be uh noise uh mitigated for all the units.

Yeah, absolutely.

Yes, we have gotten your comments back on that, and uh they are looking at that closely.

Um the windows in the Ansel above it already has uh noise impacts, and so they're designed in certain way for that.

So they assume that they're gonna be the exact same type of windows in order to mitigate um noise as well as privacy.

So we we've taken your feedback.

The architects are online, they've heard.

So any follow-up questions from any of the commissioners.

Hearing none, uh Mr.

Davis, can you put up that recommended motion, please?

Mr.

Chair, if you could ask if anyone would like to speak.

I don't see anyone online.

Okay, yeah, we're taking public testimony.

Okay.

Uh do we have anyone in chambers who would like to provide testimony?

Can you ask questions?

Uh well, I'm uh you can ask questions through testimony, right?

Like you can make points through testimony and uh then we could potentially follow up with staff or the applicant if we so desired, but we don't take questions from the audience.

Okay, so anybody in chambers want to provide testimony?

Hearing none.

Anyone online uh want to provide testimony.

Hearing none, is there a motion?

Uh Mr.

Chair, I make a motion.

Make a motion to approve level two site plan of permit application stp 2025-00503 uh to permit the conversion of 13,011 square feet of street level retail into 13 residential units at the 198 East Montgomery Avenue property, subject to the findings and conditions in staff's report.

Is there a second?

Before our second, can I just reiterate the fact that if you've got a question, you can absolutely ask that question via public testimony.

You can't necessarily expect an answer today, but it will at least be on record.

So if you would like to provide public testimony, now is an extremely appropriate time to do so.

Well, before we go there, we have a motion on the table.

Okay.

So um I get there's a motion on the table.

I wanted to put that out there.

No, no, I I appreciate that clarification.

I'm just thinking with the motion on the table.

Let me ask would you want to provide public testimony after uh Commissioner Saladin explained?

Okay.

So my suggestion here, Commissioner Pittman, is to withdraw your motion.

What about Commissioner Fulton?

Or Commissioner Fulton, sorry.

I have Pittman on the right, Commissioner Fulton on my left.

My apologies.

Commissioner Fulton.

Mr.

Chair, I withdraw my motion.

I appreciate that.

And we could reopen to provide public testimony, ma'am.

If you if you give me a second, I'd like to provide the rules.

Um each individual will be allowed three minutes to provide comment on the application, however, one representative of an organization, such as an HOA or community group, will be allowed up to five minutes for a presentation.

At any time, clarifying questions may be asked by members of the commission.

Please adhere to these time limits.

They will be in force.

If you intend to testify for any of today's agenda items, we ask that you sign in on the appropriate sheet on the stand in the back of the room.

Once public testimony is concluded, the commission will enter into discussion deliberation on the application among the members.

These proceedings are being televised and recorded.

We ask that you state your name and address for the record, allow a moment for staff to swear you in and speak loudly and clearly when you testify.

A video recording of the hearings will be kept on file with the city's cable television office, and we put it on the planning commission's webpage for viewing.

Okay.

Now with that preliminary uh instructions, ma'am, please come forward, state your name and address, and uh you'll be sworn in.

I live at two Helen Hennigan Way, residents on the lane.

Now, Mr.

Wasalak will swear you in.

Ma'am, you've identified yourself for the record.

Uh will you provide truthful testimony this evening?

Thank you.

And ma'am, there's a timer in front of me, and it will start as soon as you start speaking.

Okay.

Okay, go ahead.

Okay.

I'm just concerned.

Um, the apartments residents on the lane were supposed to be senior apartments.

Um they didn't quite live up to all of that for the seniors as far as the design and some pretty long hallways.

But I just wanted to know will there be a possibility of some of the residents getting um a chance for to apply to these apartments?

They're right up under us.

Um, the loft apartments.

Um, and will they be super expensive or will they have some affordable um housing?

Is that it, ma'am?

Okay, thank you.

Uh I think that concludes the public testimony.

Based off that, uh, do any of the commissioners in the chambers have any questions of either staff or the applicant who's still in the room.

Hearing none, uh Commissioner Sung, since you're online.

Do you have any questions of staff of staff or the applicant?

Uh seeing none, uh is there a motion?

Any of my fellow commissioners want to make a motion?

Mr.

Chair, I, Commissioner Fulton would like to make a motion.

Please go ahead, Commissioner Fulton.

We got to sit you guys further apart.

We look so much alike.

Uh I move I move that we approve level two site plan uh application stp 2025-00503 to permit the conversion of 13,001 square feet of street level retail into 13 residential units at 198 East Montgomery, subject to the findings and conditions in staff's report.

Is there a second?

A second.

All those in favor raise your hand say aye.

Aye.

Motion passes unanimously.

Thank you.

That brings us to our third agenda item.

That's a zoning zoning ordinance rewrite, ZOR work session, review of remaining topics, amenity space, landscaping signs, non-conformities, finding subdivision and plots, neighborhood conversion plans, historic preservation, and recommended rezoning near the Tranbrook Metro Station.

Over to Mr.

Waslack for any staff presentation.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

This is the fourth in a series of work sessions on the zoning ordinance rewrite project that we've uh held with you as the planning commission.

Uh, we've had a corresponding series of work sessions with the mayor and council, uh, as you know.

Um we are working toward uh putting together the draft uh document that will be the uh new zoning ordinance, um, but it will be a draft and uh it will be also be a zoning text amendment.

Uh you've seen many of those uh in your tenure, and uh the process for this text amendment will be the same as the zoning text amendment process that you're familiar with.

Uh we will be bringing the draft text amendment and the draft map amendment uh to the mayor and council on December 1st.

Uh they were required to authorize the filing of both of those uh items, and then we'll proceed through the uh formal public uh hearing process, public hearings uh in front of yourselves and also in front of the mayor and council.

And we anticipate work sessions with both bodies as well as we work toward um the final document, which we expect um will be acted on uh in late spring of 2026.

So tonight we have a number of topics that we would like to discuss with you.

And uh I am joined by my colleagues Holly Simmons and Kitty Gerbus online to kind of walk you through these topics.

We'd also like to talk a little bit uh about the process.

Um we know where you have uh we've come a long way, uh I'll put it that way.

Uh when we started in 2023, and uh we are in the process of now drafting the final zoning uh text amendment and which will result in the ZOR.

So um these work sessions have been set up to uh gain guidance from the mayor and council on a number of topics, although I will say the work sessions do not cover every single thing that is changing in the zoning ordinance, and uh, but they do cover the items that we felt we needed direction uh as we were putting together the document.

So uh when the document does come out in draft uh for December 1st, uh there will be some things that we haven't talked with you or the mayor and council about.

Uh but we will have a document that kind of goes through the high-level changes uh between the current zoning ordinance and the zoning ordinance that we are um proposing and you'll be considering.

So I just wanted to talk about that.

Um another aspect uh of course is the zoning map.

Um we had received direction from the mayor and council to conduct some additional outreach with uh neighborhoods that were have expect to be concerned with rezonings, and we have done that.

Uh we're not proposing to discuss that this evening, and but we will provide our recommendation on all of those uh as we uh get to authorization to file on December 1st.

So with that, uh I'm going to turn it over to uh Ms.

Gerbis, who will uh walk you through the historic preservation recommendations.

Thank you, Mr.

Rosalek.

Um, nice to see everyone virtually here tonight.

We have quite a few slides here to provide you with an update on what we are proposing revising in the zoning ordinance relative to historic preservation.

I'll warn you up front, the most slides of any topic are on this topic.

Uh so once we get through this, it should be smooth sailing for the rest of our work session here this evening.

So going back a minute before we look ahead, I wanted to remind you all about the historic preservation work plan.

Um so this is a document that was endorsed by the mayor and council in May of 2023.

Um and really at its core, it's exactly what it sounds like.

It's a work plan.

So it kind of lays out the staff actions, um budget requests, what our divisions priorities are here in historic preservation over the course of 10 years.

And ultimately the end goal of the historic preservation work plan is that once we've done all of these discrete actions.

And ultimately the end goal of the historic preservation work plan is that once we've done all of these discrete actions, I think there's about 40 or so actions in the work plan total that we would be able to update our preservation plan, which sort of sets the policy direction and policy guidance for preservation in Rockville.

So of those 40 some odd work items that we have or actions, there are six work items.

One of those six, work item A specifically talks about necessary updates to the zoning ordinance that are needed.

So through this zoning ordinance rewrite process, we are looking at all six of those items.

That being said, almost all of the edits that you will see discussed here tonight come directly from that historic preservation work plan.

There are a few that are staff suggestions based on feedback we've heard, what we've seen work in other places, potentially issues that we've seen with that code here in Rockville.

Your staff report has quite a bit of detail on which of these recommendations come from which documents were staff generated.

And the last thing for you all to be aware of is the historic district commission did discuss these edits at their July meeting.

They were positive, like favorably for almost all of them, a couple of tweaks that they had suggested.

But so at this point in time, the HDC has reviewed this as well as the mayor and council when they had their work session on Monday evening.

So now to go through these changes.

As a reminder, certificate of approvals or COAs is what we often call them.

These are essentially the permit that is required to do any exterior work on any of our locally designated historic sites and structures here in Rockville.

There are very, very limited things that do not need a certificate of approval at all.

And even more limits on what staff could approve themselves.

It's really limited to three things.

Staff can approve a sign, we can approve a fence, and we can approve the removal of a diseased, dead or hazardous tree.

Anything else must come to the full historic district commission.

You have to submit an application five weeks in advance of the meeting date, go through a hearing process, staff write a staff report about the compatibility of that alteration with the historic district, then ultimately you would get permission to make that modification or you would not.

The other thing to note about certificate of approvals is currently they expire after one year.

So if you got your approval on January 1st of 2025, come January 2nd of 2026, that would have expired.

And if you did not request a extension in advance, you would have to go through that process all over again.

So the two changes that we are proposing to make here, one is creating a system whereby staff can administratively administratively approve certificate of approvals for work that we think is minor, common, not really very impactful.

So a couple examples I have here of work that we believe would fall into that description.

If there's a minor alteration to a certificate of approval that was previously approved by the historic district commission.

So say you came to us with a very specific make and model of the front door that you want to have replaced, and the HDC said yeah, you can install company A's model seven door.

And let's say company A stops making that model seven door, and you have to go to a model eight door, which is practically the same, it's the same dimensions, it has the same characters and futures features.

Um, you would still currently under our current code be required to get a whole new certificate of approval.

Um so if there are minor things like that and the kind of substance of the work has already been approved, we believe that staff should be able to sign off on that.

Um, other things, we're talking minor landscaping here.

Um, perhaps you are swapping out your mailbox or your light fixture.

One that we see a lot of that we would really like to administratively approve has to do with the installation or replacement of utility meters and devices.

So if you want to install, let's say uh ring camera or a motion activated light outside of your property.

Maybe you need a new HVAC unit.

And as a result, the unit that sits outside is going to look very different than what's there now.

We should be able to administratively sign off on that as staff and not make you go through a full lengthy process.

Regarding the expiration date, our proposal here is to extend this expiration period from one year to five years.

That would be consistent with what the ZOR is proposing for several of our other planning application types and their respective expiration dates.

Moving into local designations.

So right now, anyone can file an application that would nominate a property for local historic designation.

You do not need to be affiliated with that property in any capacity in order to do that.

I can wake up tomorrow and say that house over there, I'm gonna nominate it.

Additionally, property owners are not required to consent to the nomination of their property or the actual designation of their property.

And this is something that we've had a lot of feedback on in the past couple of years where we have had some cases where either the property owner was vocally against designation, or we've had um most recently in four courthouse square, which came before you all in 2024, I believe it was, um, where the property owner didn't take a stance one way or another.

Um, so it kind of puts you all as approving bodies and recommending bodies in a little bit of an awkward spot.

Um, it's easy if the property owner is like, yes, I really want this, please do it.

Um but when the property owner says no, or the property owner isn't taking a stance one way or another, um, you know, ultimately we are rezoning a property when we put it into the historic district.

It comes with a whole new set of regulations.

Um, so we want to be aware of the property rights there.

Um, and I believe a few members of this body had kind of expressed during the four courthouse square process how this felt problematic for them.

So that being said, proposed revisions that we have here is first we're gonna limit who can file an application that nominates a property for designation.

And our proposal is to limit that to the property owner themselves, the historic district commission, or the mayor and council.

If there is a third party who is not one of those groups who is interested, so if I was interested in nominating a property, um, I would then let the property owner, historic district commission, or mayor and council know and say, hey, I really think you should consider this property.

Here are the reasons why I think you should consider it.

Um, and I can't speak for property owners, but I can speak for the historic district commission since I'm one of their staff liaisons, um, that we would report that out to them and then they would have a discussion as to whether or not they wanted to consider filing a nomination application for that property.

The other thing that we are proposing here is owner consent and how that's factored into this process.

Um, so our proposal that you see on the slide before you is that if the property owner consents, we would want the majority vote of the mayor or the HDC to file a sectional map amendment and then ultimately a majority vote of the mayor and council to in fact rezone that property to the historic district zone.

That's what it currently is now.

We just need a majority.

The proposal that we initially brought to the mayor and council on Monday would be saying that if the owner does not consent or is silent in their consent, that a unanimous vote would be required.

So it would still be possible to designate that structure.

Um, if say there's a really important resource that we are truly at risk of losing forever, even if the property owner doesn't want it, there's still an avenue to go ahead and designate that property, but it raises the bar.

It makes it a little bit more challenging to do so.

I will add that on Monday night's mayor and council meeting, there was discussion and general consensus to kind of add a third option here.

So to make it where if the owner consents, we just need a simple majority.

So in the case of the historic district commission, they're a body of five, so that would be three.

For the mayor and council, that would be four.

If the owner vocally and adamantly does not consent, then that would be unanimous.

But if the owner is silent on the issue, that was the case we had in four courthouse square.

They didn't say they liked it, they didn't say they didn't want it, that we would need a supermajority.

So it would kind of be a three-pronged approach there to reflect the owner's wishes in the process as well.

Again, I want to clarify there would still be a way to designate against the owner's wishes, but it would just make that bar a little bit harder.

Delisting.

Um, so the delisting is the process of taking a property and removing it from our historic district zone, which is really removing it from our local register of historic places.

Right now, we do not have the ability in our code to do that.

So as a result, there are structures that physically do not exist anymore that are still on our local register.

The best example that I have is just a block away from where you all are here.

Um, the district court building that was originally the site of the 1977 Rockville Library.

That library ended up being demolished to make away for the district courthouse, but that library is still on a register.

So when I go and I count up our historic districts and I do a report showing what all those sites are, we still see that library.

So our proposal here is to create a process to remove a property from the historic district zone.

If the site or structure has lost the physical characteristics that justified its designation.

So in the case of the library, it's just straight up not there anymore.

So we should remove that from the register.

Perhaps we have an instance where there was a natural disaster or a fire of something of that nature that has ruined all or a very large portion of the property.

We should have a way to pull that off of our register so that way our register is the most up-to-date and accurate list of historic properties here in Rockville.

Next slide.

Demolition by neglect.

So I'm gonna literally read you the definition of demolition by neglect in our zoning ordinance.

And it reads that demolition by neglect of historic properties is the failure to maintain property or any component thereof located in a historic district so as to jeopardize the historic integrity of the property.

So we have this definition, it's a defined term, but it doesn't actually appear any more than in that definition in our ordinance.

So it says what it is, but it doesn't say you can't do it.

It doesn't list a punishment or a penalty for doing that.

So here we're proposing to make those two revisions, expressly prohibiting demolition by neglect.

And so saying that if you have a historic structure, you have a certain obligation to maintain that structure.

And we're not talking like peeling paint.

We're talking like roof has caved in, and as a result, it's lost the entire second floor of the building.

We're talking, you know, big things that are kind of an intentional neglect that happens over an extended period of time here.

So we would be proposing to prohibit that and then allow a municipal infraction to be levied in instances where we do find there is a case of demolition by neglect of a historic structure taking place.

And then I think this may be my last slide here.

Um, this is about evaluations of significance.

So we shorthand that as EOS.

Um, so evaluations of significance, this is the process where we review a property to determine if it meets any of our nine criteria for historic designation.

Um, there are two ways that an evaluation of significance can be triggered.

The first is if you file a nomination application to designate that property.

So we already talked about that.

That would trigger this evaluation of significance.

But the second reason that that would get triggered is currently in Rockville, any time a demolition permit comes through, we are required to do a full evaluation of significance.

It doesn't matter how old the structure is, it does not matter the condition of the structure, it still has to go through a full evaluation of significance.

Um we mentioned a hypothetical example of there was a fire and a structure was you know partially or completely taken down as a result of that.

If it was partially taken down and you wanted to demo the rest of it, you would need a full evaluation of significance.

Um, let's say there was a structure that was built last year that for whatever reason we've decided it needs to come down.

Obviously, a structure that was built a year ago is not historic, but we would still be required to do a full evaluation of significance.

So we're seeing quite a few of these come through in the last couple years as our community is looking to redevelopment opportunities, especially in commercial areas, as we're taking vacant and obsolete office buildings offline and repurposing that land largely as residential, although not exclusively.

Um, those are all requiring evaluations of significance.

As we've had redevelopment in some of our commercial corridors of shopping centers and things of that nature, that all still needs a full evaluation of significance.

The EOS process is very laborious from a staff perspective.

We have to do a lot of research, it's quite a heavy lift from staff to research all of these different nine criteria.

Um so that's things like the architecture, but that's also like did an influential person live there or do an activity there.

Um, was this an important site to the culture of Rockville in some way?

So it's really quite a lot of research and we have to do it a lot.

And there are cases where we think it's pretty obvious there's no historic significance here, but we're still required to do it.

So our proposed revisions here is saying that we only have to bring an evaluation of significance to the full historic district commission if the structure has been identified in our historic buildings catalog as potentially having historic significance, or if as staff are doing their research, we think it meets at least one of those designation criteria.

If either of those two cases happen, we go ahead and we bring it to the full HDC.

In an instance where it's not in our historic buildings catalog, staff are researching, we don't see that it meets any designation criteria.

We believe that staff should have the ability to sign off on that administratively and not bring it to the full commission.

The other addition here that we are proposing is a note adding that if we've done an evaluation of significance in the last five years, we shouldn't be required to do another one simply because a new triggering event has happened.

So this would prevent us from doing things kind of back to back.

Um in the off chance that something happened in that year in between or whatever it would be, um, we think this would significantly improve response times for staff and really lighten our workload here for cases that are pretty cut and dry.

So that is our historic preservation section.

Holly and Jim, do we want to take any questions now or wait until the end of the day?

I think we'd probably take questions now by topic.

So how do we wanna approach this?

Do you want to go through the areas where you are seeking feedback and questions?

We can just kind of go one by one.

We certainly can do it that way.

Um Holly and Jim, is that how you'd like to handle this?

Well, the work session was really intended to um one, provide information to the to the commission on some of our recommendations and what the mayor council have discussed about them.

Um you're not obligated to to weigh in on in any or all of these.

Certainly welcome to.

And if you'd like to discuss them, get more information, that's fine.

Or if you'd like to make a recommendation, that's also fine.

For just kind of ease of administration, I'd like to go one by one.

So we aren't throwing questions at different topics and going back and forth on slides.

So if we can kind of start at the beginning, we can pull the commissioners.

And you know, we may not have any questions or feedback.

So Holly, I think we can skip this one because this is really just background and information.

All right.

So certificate of approval.

Do any of the commissioners in chambers have any questions or feedback on this proposal?

I got one.

So can I get a clarification?

So it sounded like what we were saying was if the property owner was against the idea of a historic designation that we needed a majority vote of mayor and counsel.

But if a property owner was agnostic, then we needed a supermajority.

Is that right?

Or did I mishear that?

Yeah.

So Holly, if you could, that's on a separate slide here.

So if we can hold the question until we get to that topic, is another stuff.

No, this certificate of approval.

You see what I'm saying?

That way we're not going back and forth.

Oh, my bad.

Yeah, yeah.

This is not the hold that question until we get to that topic.

So on certificate of approvals, do any of the commissioners in chamber have any comments?

Hearing none, Commissioner Simon.

Uh I have a question.

Uh so you mentioned the extended experiment uh exploration period is to five years.

So, does the applicant still have options to extend that?

I would need to look exactly how it's drafted in the code that we're kind of working on behind the scenes.

Nick Dumay, do you recall?

I know we talked about this.

I think we said that after five years they would not, but I don't have that up in front of me at this moment to confirm for sure.

Sure.

Yeah, Commissioner Son, I can answer that question.

So the way that we're proposing to draft the new zoning ordinance, there is a common extension provision in a separate section of the ordinance dealing with sort of the general administration of all sorts of different uh plans and approvals.

Um, generally we are allowing extension of implementation periods.

Uh, but Ms.

Gerbis is right that uh tentatively in our current draft, the decision was made that for certificates of approval, we really do think it's reasonable for folks to get their construction completed within the five-year period.

And because the sort of historicity of structures can change over time, we felt that extending beyond the five-year period, which is already a pretty generous implementation period might raise some issues.

So that's certainly something that the commission could comment on, but that's the decision I believe that we've made at this point.

Thank you.

I think I agree.

I think from one year to five years, the applicant already has plenty time to construct the work and five years is long enough to structure my change tool.

So I agree with this.

Thank you.

Any follow-up from any other commissioner?

Okay, hearing none, let's move on to the next topic.

Any of the commissioners in the chamber have any questions or comments on this one?

This is Cheyenne.

So I think it's me, right?

Yep.

Oh, yeah.

So take it away.

Yes.

So as staff proposed, kind of in the working draft that was mentioned earlier, it was a two-pronged approach approach.

So if the owner, um, you know, in writing consents, it would be a majority.

If the owner does not in writing consent, it would be unanimous.

Um, so that would apply if the owner is silent or if the owner in writing said no.

Um, what the mayor and council discussed on Monday night is they want to make a third option.

So there's a difference between an enthusiastic yes, an enthusiastic no, and being silent on the matter.

So in the case of an enthusiastic yes, it would be the majority.

In the case of a I'm silent on the matter, it would be a super majority.

And in the case of an enthusiastic no, it would be a unanimous.

Does that answer that question?

That does answer the question.

In my mind, um, any land, you know, any owner that doesn't take a stance on this is tantamount saying yes.

So in my mind, that's kind of how it should be uh treated.

Not proposing as change necessarily, but um, if they're agnostic to me that that means that the will of the city should prevail, in which case it shouldn't, you know, that we shouldn't have a higher bar for that than than the uh enthusiastic guess any follow-up comments or questions in the chamber.

So since the HDC is five members, so a supermajority is four, because five would be unanimity.

Uh, what about for mayor and council?

I believe it's it's at six, Mr.

Dumay.

Um I think that if we uh because we don't have the supermajority defined right now in the code, this is something the mayor and council just recently recommended rather than use the term supermajority, although that's what we're using when we describe it, we would probably specify a number.

So it could be five, for example.

I was just curious.

Thank you.

We we've done that elsewhere in the code where we've talked about supermajorities for the mayor and council.

Got it.

Thanks.

Not to get too far down in the weeds, but if you start specifying numbers and then HDC is not full, you know what I'm saying?

Like we're missing two people that we're supposed to have.

So that uh that would make give me pause.

And I I don't have strong feelings about the two versus the three metrics, but that might be something to think about.

That if you start putting specific numbers in there, and then you don't have a full compliment on the historic district commission, you might get stuck.

That's a very good point.

Yeah, we would think about that for sure.

And I think I want to rephrase what I said earlier.

It's not in my mind, it's not being agnostic, right?

If you're uh an owner and you don't opine, it's indifference.

And indifference in my mind is a um, you know, like at that point, it becomes obvious to me that the city's decision should should uh should prevail.

Commissioner Singh, any comments or questions on this one?

Yeah, I just want to clarify.

So you'll say when the owner doesn't give opinion, is the owner being informed about this?

Yes.

So that is in both our current code and the proposed code, too, that within a certain number of days um from an application coming in, the owner is required to be notified via certified mail.

Obviously, if we know who the owner is, then we have contact information, we will also call them or email them.

Um, but we would also have it by certified mail.

So there is that formal record.

Okay, yeah.

I don't have any strong opinion on this any follow-up.

Okay, hearing none.

Let's move on to the next one.

D listing.

Any questions or comments uh in the chamber?

I would just say this is a great idea.

I I can't believe I I really can't believe that we can't delist.

And so I'm glad you guys picked up on that and are doing it.

Hearing nothing else, Commissioner Singh, any questions or comments on this one?

Yeah, I have a have thought have a scientific situation.

Let's say like uh this building is uh called a fair and uh partially damaged, and it might is not entitled in all the criteria, but the owner were or someone is rebuilt to his original status.

Was that process or the new building still considered historic?

Yeah, so it would in that case.

So if you were reverting a building to kind of what its original um, you know, character looked like the original design and stuff, yeah, that would absolutely still be a historic building.

Um, in preservation, there's kind of a couple of different terms that I think are used different in the preservation world than in like the layperson world.

Um rehabilitation, preservation, and restoration.

So what you're describing would be a restoration.

We are bringing it back to what it once was at the time, versus preservation is we're keeping it frozen in whatever it is right now.

Um, or a rehabilitation is you know, we're we're keeping the historic character, but we're bringing or modernizing it in some way.

So yeah, that would absolutely still um be a historic structure.

And delisting is not something we think will happen often.

Um we are limiting who would be able to initiate this process because this is not meant to be a tool.

If I'm tired of having a historic designation on my site, um, you know, maybe I don't want to go through those regulations.

That this is not the tool for that.

Um, this is really in those weird cases, like the library where it physically does not exist, but it's still on our register.

Okay, thanks for the clarification.

Yeah, I have a question on the previous slide.

I'm sorry, I just thought of it.

This is why you get his name wrong all the time.

Um I just want to ask the planning commission does play a role in the historic designation process, and it's not mentioned on the slide.

I just want to make sure that our role will remain the same in what's being proposed here, correct?

Yes.

So it would still be a sectional map amendment process.

So that would be initiated by the historic district commission.

So this vote of the HDC here is referring to the initiation of that sectional map amendment.

Then, like all map amendments, it would come to you all as a body for your recommendation, and then ultimately the final authority lands with the uh mayor and council.

Okay.

And so then the votes on this body in situations where unanimity is required by HDC or mayor and council does not necessarily impact as currently drafted, yes, because you would be making the recommendation, not actually making that final decision.

Okay, no, that that's fine.

I'm okay with that.

And I think just as I think about it, I I certainly had reservations about the the not having owner consent.

I think I still lean more towards unanimity across the board, whether it's uh no consent or indifference as it is, but uh I think that there's there's a I think I'm in the minority on that, but I did want to just state that.

Thank you.

Okay, so on delisting, any follow-up comments or questions?

Okay, hearing none.

Next topic Demolition by neglect.

Any questions or comments in the chamber?

I think my only comment or kind of question or comment is why would this does this apply to structures that are not designated?

Like can someone just it does not it only applies to structures that are historically designated.

So you could have oh, go ahead, I'm sorry.

No, go go right ahead.

So I think we're on the same line there.

Yeah, so you could have just uh a house that's built in 1983 or 85, whatever is outside the zone of historic preservation, and you could just neglect it, and that's okay.

Well, that would fall under our typical property maintenance code.

Okay.

So our code enforcement team would be out there, and you know, that chapter of the city code kind of lists what is and is not acceptable from that regard.

This would be above and beyond because it's possible that you are neglecting and damaging the historic character and historic features of a historic property without actually being in violation of elements of the property maintenance code.

Does that make sense?

Oh, yes, thank you.

Okay, very clear.

Thanks.

Any follow-up questions or comments in the chamber?

Commissioner Singh, any questions or comments on this one?

Okay, hearing nothing else.

Next topic.

Hearing none, Commissioner Sung, do you have any questions or comments on this one?

No, next topic.

That's all for me.

Pass it over to Holly.

Thank you so much, Katie, and good evening.

So diving right into our next topic.

As the commission is aware, our zoning ordinance includes a number of development requirements, things that apply to all developments or a broad variety of developments, including things such as our parking and loading requirements and our pedestrian and bicycle facilities requirements, which you all heard more about during our August work session.

Another example is landscaping and signage requirements, which are included in the staff report for this evening's work session, but which we will not be addressing directly in the presentation.

And also what we are proposing to call amenity space.

So this amenity space requirement would in fact take the place of two different requirements that we currently have in our zoning ordinance, open area and what is sometimes required as a subset of open area public use space.

Currently, these are required for a broad variety of developments, and we are getting the quantity of open area and public use space that is required generally, but within that quantity, we really are not getting the quality of public use space, particularly that we are looking for.

So we are proposing to reconfigure these two requirements as amenity space with a new definition that is clearer, more narrow, and specifying criteria that really get at quality over quantity.

So with this, we would be slightly reducing the quantity that is required, but greatly increasing ideally the quality of amenity space that we are receiving.

We are proposing that this space would continue in most cases to be publicly accessible.

It would be required generally for mixed use projects and residential projects in the mixed use zones, the residential medium density zones, except for the RMD infill and our proposed residential high density zone, with some exceptions.

And we are also proposing that there would be flexibility, particularly in the mixed use transit district zones, in understanding that these are intended to be our most high density walkable zones where space really space and land really are at a premium costs are higher.

So although we are proposing that this requirement still be in place for the MX TD zones, we are proposing that up to 50% of that amenity space could be available to residents only.

So for example, an applicant could come in and propose that the rooftop of a multifamily apartment building be amenity space and not make it available to members of the public.

We are also proposing that this requirement could in instances be met through dedication of land or through a fee and loo or alternative compliance if an applicant comes up with a better alternative.

We would want to see that entertained as well.

So that is the high level on this.

I would say that on Monday evening's mayor and council work session.

Mayor and council did agree that this was a good direction to go in the zoning ordinance rewrite.

So I think it might make sense to pause per topic area to give us the time to process and then ask questions instead of getting a ton of information and then trying to remember questions.

Do any of the commissioners in chamber have any questions or comments about this proposal?

So is it accurate that we are proposing to eliminate the current exemptions for affordable housing projects, senior persons, disability persons, um projects across the board?

Is that right?

That's an excellent question.

In the draft currently, we do have a number of exceptions.

Um currently, as you stated in our zoning ordinance, we do have a broad exception for any project that is for housing for seniors with disability housing for seniors and persons with disabilities, and also affordable housing projects.

We did discuss this exemption both with our recreation and parks uh colleagues and our housing and community development colleagues, and ultimately landed at a place where we would have an exemption that's a little bit narrower.

So it would be for an application for residential development, which is 100% affordable at an average AMI of 60% or less, and that is also located within one quarter mile of a public park or publicly accessible amenity space.

So that is the current what's in the current draft.

Okay, so we're not eliminating the exemptions for senior housing for housing for disabled and for um uh so only for that low AMI population.

A hundred percent low low AMI that is in that category of the housing for seniors and persons with disabilities and also affordable housing, yes.

We would we would not be including or we are proposing not to move forward with the exemption for housing for seniors and persons with disabilities and slightly revising the exemption for affordable housing projects as stated in my previous response.

I will note that we do have four, I think four other exemptions.

I am happy to go over what those are proposed to be, if that would be useful.

I think it would be.

Please do.

I I don't want to cut off your line of questions.

No, no, no, I think that's actually I think it's totally appropriate.

Like my my my concern is about equity, right?

Like anytime we carve out a certain population um that gets treated a little bit differently, right?

I I I'm concerned about equity and my concerned about um the maybe unforeseen consequences that may in fact work against the goal of the um of the proposed rule, and that is to increase development um for disadvantaged folks uh when we create a situation where there's some amount of inequity or maybe tilting the um you know the the the playing field on one side versus the other, we end up uh you know with a with an environment that actually inhibits that development that we're trying to encourage rather than you know actually making it easier.

So that that that's kind of the crux of my uh my my question here.

So yes.

So yes, I would like to see your more.

Absolutely.

So as currently drafted, the following applications would be exempted from this requirement.

So the first is an application for up to five dwellings.

The second is an application for an industrial use or an automotive use.

The third is an application for a non-residential use with a gross floor area of up to 20,000 square feet.

The fourth is the one we've already gone over, and then the fifth is kind of a two-parter, it's an application covering a site area that is either in the MXTD zone, one acre or less, or in all other zones where this is a requirement, 20,000 square feet, which is just under half an acre or less.

So basically smaller projects and industrial focused projects.

I would say that's a fair characterization.

Yeah.

Okay.

Any other follow-up comments or questions from in the chamber?

Commissioner Sung, do you have any comments or questions on this item?

Sure.

Uh yeah, I'm just thinking uh further one to ask like how much reduction in the amount space required compared uh to the current requirement.

That's a great question, a little bit of a tricky one to answer.

Currently, our open area and public use space requirements vary based on zone and on the size of the development and on where they are in relation to the South Pike area.

Um there are a number of different factors, and I would say kind of generally the requirements right now for public use space, I believe vary between 10 to 15 percent.

Jim's nodding his head as well.

And we're proposing that they be 10% across the board where this is a requirement.

Okay, thank you.

Yeah, I think it's reasonable, and uh I think maybe the simpler is better to understand and for everyone to remember that tool.

And so I'm just consider the point of the equity, right?

So if we we require for every product, let's say around the 10%, and instead of exemption for all those uh different groups, and can we maybe require um smaller percentage?

Or maybe they can do the fee in law.

I feel like uh if they they um the affordable housing there's also a cost that you see for the housing, right?

But if they can pay a smaller fee for them to um kind of build to a public park, the city that the residents can walk walk there, that that's also better, maybe better than totally exempt from the requirement.