Good afternoon.

Good evening.

Welcome to the Wednesday, April 15th, meeting of the Animal Wellbeing Commission.

The meeting is now called to order.

Will the clerk please call roll to establish a quorum?

Yes.

Commissioners, if you would unmute your microphones.

Commissioner Treat.

Present.

Commissioner Verga.

Present.

Commissioner Hayes.

Here.

Commissioner Badagon is absent.

Commissioner Bell.

Here.

Commissioner Benedict.

Here.

Vice Chair Bagley.

Here.

Commissioner Christie.

Here.

Commissioner Aswith.

Here.

Commissioner Few.

Here.

Commissioner Garcia.

Here.

Commissioner Morris.

Here.

And Chair McDoll.

Here.

Thank you.

We have a quorum.

Thank you.

All right.

I'd like to remind members of the public and chambers that if you'd like to speak on an agenda item, please turn in a speaker slip before the item begins.

After the item is called, we will no longer accept speaker slips.

And you will have two minutes to speak once you are called on.

We'll now proceed with today's agenda.

So first uh land acknowledgement and pledge.

Please rise if you're able for the opening acknowledgement uh in honor of Sacramento's indigenous indigenous people and tribal land.

Commissioner Benedict, if you would be okay.

Uh to the original people of this land, the Nisan people, the Southern Maidu, Valley and Plains, My Wook, Patwin, Winton peoples, and the people of the Wilton Rancheria, Sacramento's only federally recognized tribe.

May we acknowledge and honor the native people who came before us and still walk beside us today on these ancestral lands by choosing to gather together today in the active practice of acknowledgement and appreciation for Sacramento's indigenous people's history, contributions, and lives.

Thank you.

All right, next is the approval of the consent calendar.

Um, just for members of the public, the consent calendar is considered one item consisting of matters deemed routine and non-controversial and typically adopted in one motion.

Any member may comment on any item or request to pull an item from the consent calendar for a separate vote.

Uh clerk, are there any members of the public who wish to speak on the consent calendar?

I don't have any speaker slips for this item.

All right, thank you.

Are there any commission members who wish to speak on this item?

Commissioner Morris.

Thank you.

Um I don't really want to pull anything off.

I just want to thank you all for adding to the follow-up log the two items related to um implementing strategies from the adoption ad hoc committee as well as following up on uh potential new shelter site and sheltered um fundraising efforts.

So I appreciate that those were on the uh follow-up log, and I wanted to acknowledge that.

Um as we move along later in the agenda in terms of the dissolution of the rates, the adoption rate study ad hoc.

I hope that we can also talk a little bit about some of the implementation of the findings of that because I think it segues into our at-risk discussion.

So thank you for letting me comment about that.

Appreciate it.

Any other comments?

Is there a motion to approve?

I move to approve.

Is there a second?

Second.

Um all in favor, we're doing a verbal vote.

You can just say aye, but please use your voice.

Aye.

Aye.

Any opposed and any abstained.

The motion passes.

All right, we're now going to proceed to our discussion calendar.

And first item is the dissolution of the dog adoption rate study ad hoc.

Ryan, did you want to introduce that?

Sorry.

Oh, they can say it.

Okay.

Sorry.

Correction.

Uh, first up, amending of the Sacramento City Code section 9.44.370 relating to the number of swine dogs and cats per dwelling unit.

Okay.

Well, I sent a briefing to the commission, so I believe everyone's familiar with this topic, but uh for the public, I wanted to give uh a bit of an introduction.

So at today's meeting, the Animal Wellbeing Commission will be discussing a proposed amendment to City Ordinance 944370, and passing a motion to recommend or not recommend that amendment to city council.

We will be noting the commission's recommendation, summarize the discussion, and include this in a staff report to council.

Um I just want to take a moment to say this code um amendment came from the vision of uh this commission about a year ago uh with the intention that by increasing the number of dogs that could be you know legally owned within the city from three to four, that that uh could have a positive um impact on increasing adoptions.

So it's it's taken a bit, but I'm really glad to see it here at this point.

Um some background for the public.

Uh, the previous version of this ordinance allowed for ownership of three dogs, um, and it was amended to allow a maximum of four dogs, provided all those dogs are spayed and neutered.

Uh the original draft version that went to the law and legislation committee uh did not include uh any exceptions to the spay and neuter requirements, but due to public comment, the law and legislation committee uh directed staff to bring a version with those specific added exceptions to the animal well-being uh commission for consideration.

Uh the amended ordinance that you're reviewing uh has been through the draft ordinance review committee and the law and legislation committee, and will be going to city council for approval after being reviewed by the animal well-being commission.

The complete version of the ordinance amendment along with the red line version are attached to the agenda online uh for the public.

And um just to introduce the paragraph in question that mentions a spay neuter exemption, uh states a person or group of persons may keep, harbor, or maintain in or about any dwelling unit or adjacent yard, a maximum of four dogs over the age of four months.

If each of the dogs one has been spayed or neutered, two has a valid unaltered license under section 94490 F.

Three is certified in writing by or three is certified in writing by a licensed veterinarian as not being a suitable subject for sterilizing due to health or age reasons, or for is eligible for a fee exemption under section 94490 G.

That's the background.

Thank you.

Uh Clerk, do we have any speakers?

Yes, I have one speaker, Dia Good.

I'm sorry.

Um, the language before you was agreed to by the law and ledge committee and the former shelter manager.

It aligns with Bradshaw and other shelters in the state.

It also doesn't discriminate against dog owners with legally licensed dogs who may have a dog too old or with medical problems, making them per their vet unable to be altered, thus prohibiting them from adopting a fourth dog.

So that this language fixes that problem.

Thank you.

Thank you.

All right, uh, we have a couple of commissioners.

Uh Commissioner Bagley.

Thank you.

Uh I was on the original working group with two other commissioners.

And I had strong beliefs and feelings about the fact that if a person would have the privilege of having a fourth dog, they should all be spayed and neutered.

So I was disappointed to see the exceptions added.

This is not or would not be the first program initiated in the city whereby spay and neuter is incentivized by a number such as this.

For instance, on the Front Street website, you'll see that senior citizens are eligible for a discount in their licensing if their dogs are spayed and neutered.

There are also there's also another provision whereby folks who are receiving assistance on their utility bills will uh be exempt from a fee, a licensing fee, as on the condition that their animals are spayed neutered.

So I really wanted that to be a condition of having a fourth dog.

With that being said, I've spent some time with this, and I would like the language to be clearer.

And Mr.

Hinderman, I'm not sure what the process is, whether you go back and you talk to the PPE committee.

When I read this, I realized that what this says is, and I it it at least relieved a little of my anxiety about it.

What it says is a maximum of four dogs over the age of four months if each of the dogs has been spayed or neutered, or each of the dogs is signed off by a vet is as unsuitable for alteration, or each of the dogs is a purebred show dog, or each of the dogs is a service or law enforcement dog.

I would like the language to be clearer because I missed that the first time I read this.

I would like the language to say if all four of the dogs, because it's clear in looking at the linking verbs on one, two, three, and four, the PPE, PPE committee was clearly anticipating that all four dogs will fall under one of these four exemptions.

So I would like the language to be if all four of the dogs, or it might even say each of the four dogs.

Um the one exemption I oppose is pure bred show dogs.

And I don't think it needs to be in there.

But given what's gone on in this city, the explosion of breeding, the number of litters, the progressive programs that have led to nothing but breeding, breeding, breeding.

I don't it's clear to me if a family that has purebred show dogs wish to have another dog, it's in it's in that household to breed.

When are we gonna have enough of this?

So I would like that taken out.

That's my opposition.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Uh Commissioner Morris.

Thank you.

Thanks for raising your hand when it's two names.

I realize maybe that'd be helpful.

Uh so I I uh have two questions.

One is more of an informational question, which is I'm curious why we aren't requiring cats to be spayed and neutered, given the horrific growth of cats, etc.

If we have an opportunity to amend this section, why not wrap that in as well?

You can have seven cats in your house that are not spayed and neutered, and seems to me likely there's gonna be procreation.

So that's a question for the people who worked on this.

The final question, other question is I had to go up, go look up nine.44.490.g, which is referenced in this language but wasn't provided, and um I was a little confused slash curious about the fee exemption status for guide dogs.

I totally get it for law enforcement dogs, which I can understand the law enforcement world wants to control those dogs reproduction, but I'm I'm not really comfortable that we wouldn't require guide dog, signal dog or service dog to similarly be altered.

Um maybe there are reasons from that community, but I'm kind of wondering why we are not requiring guide dogs, signal dogs or service dogs to be altered as well, um, since we're looking at this section.

Thank you.

Good question.

Uh Commissioner Hasquith, I'm guessing.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Um I, as a new commissioner, I didn't know if there was backstory on a conversation about cats, but I also support um some verbiage about cats.

kind of wondering why we are not requiring guide dogs signal dogs or service dogs to be altered as well since we're looking at this section thank you good question uh commissioner hasquith I'm guessing thank you thank you um I I as a new commissioner I didn't know if there was backstory on a conversation about cats but I also support um some verbiage about cats um in reviewing the title of the ordinance the title of the ordinance does talk about numbers of swine dogs and cats per dwelling unit and so this ordinance as I understand it covers cats and again the explosion of cats um and if you have seven kiddies in a in a household um you're gonna you're gonna have some some more kiddies pretty soon so thank you commissioner benedict um yes um oops um that's a good um that's a good uh point you made here but it does say cats are in a separate C in um number C or that letter C there um can we add the verbiage to cats as well I mean just with that with the um with the spay and neuter um and I totally agree with Commissioner Bagley for the add all four dogs and also the purebred show dogs which yes we have a huge problem with people breeding and also Commissioner Morris the with the cats you know so yeah let's add the cats in there too that's my only comment okay so question oh hold on what is the process so we just request as a commission to have send it back with these suggestions and I know we do have other speakers but just getting clarification on good so the direction from the law and legislation committee was for speaking and if you could give us your name for the record yep please on yep my name is Mike Benner from the city attorney's office and I'll be staffing this for the time being the direction from the law and legislation committee was for this body to consider the ordinance and then we're to forward it to city council with your recommendations.

So no language is going to be modified tonight we'll be making recommendations based on what you decide in a single motion at the end of this discussion and the staff will be making note of those recommendations and that will be noted in and then city council can decide to change the ordinance on the dais the night it is considered so the language that is from law and legislation is what they considered will be going to city council with your notes attached in the staff report is that make sense okay so there will be notes the exception or the request that uh commissioners have made for changes will be no to just noted no you guys have to make a motion and whatever the motion says you guys are gonna make a motion for this whatever you decide at the at the end of this discussion for the comments you're gonna make a motion and it's seconded and if it votes those comments will be forwarded to city council as part of the staff report to be part of the record for city council to decide when they decide what to do with this ordinance but the language that's going to city council the red line language is the stuff is what's in front of you and then when they decided when they consider this ordinance they'll look at the staff report and your recommendation and they can choose that night to make these changes on the fly okay all right commissioner verga um so I absolutely agree with what Ms Bagley said and and Leah as well and I did want to point out regarding cats because uh Shannon I'm not sure what what you were saying about that what you what your recommendation was about cats my recommendation is we add cats to the uh the cats should be spectacular that they be spade and neuter correct I just I would started with I wasn't sure if there was a backstory if there was a previous conversation but at this point I'd like to add cats to be spayed and neutered and and I would absolutely agree I'm just gonna tell a little uh make a little comment right now though um currently front street continues to turn away um pregnant cats um and I know that because I have two that just recently had babies that for instance to take in that uh I I I just don't leave them on the street and so I don't know if we need to discuss what happens in an instance like that that there may be more than seven like right now there's more than seven at my house um and I hope you know it's just gonna be temporary but you know I if if we're gonna go down that path and discuss cats that maybe we need to think about how that's gonna work I don't know thoughts commissioners and that may require that sorry point of order there's no back and forth sorry uh commissioner Garcia or Morris is it on uh I think as long as a cats are considered fosters I don't think that would apply to them once they're out and out for adoption is when they would be spaying neutered fosters don't because wouldn't be possible to do all those but we

I don't know.

Thoughts, commissioners?

And that may require that sorry, point of order.

There's no back and forth.

Sorry.

Uh Commissioner Garcia or Morse.

Is it on uh I think as long as a cats are considered fosters, I don't think that would apply to them once they're out and out for adoption is when they would be spay and neutered fosters don't because you just wouldn't be possible to do all those, but once they're out of foster and up for adoption, then they would be commissioner Christie?

Yeah, so all four of the cats all being fixed.

I guess the question that I have in the context of this modification is just with the dogs, we're dangling a carrot and saying you could acquire one additional dog.

So what's our proposal for the cats?

Because if we turn around and suddenly say yesterday you were allowed to have seven cats, tomorrow they all have to be spayed and neutered.

We access is not allowing that.

So are we are we suggesting that they could have an eighth cat if they were all spayed and neutered or like what's just specifically what are we asking?

Uh Commissioner Morris.

Um I was actually gonna propose a motion related to this, but I'm gonna go ahead and ask uh Commissioner Bagley to give her input, and then I had a couple thoughts about how we might make a motion.

Okay, Commissioner Bagley.

I think these are two totally different things, valuable, of course, concerning cats.

Totally different thing.

That means that we are um changing the ordinance specifically section C totally different thing than what we're discussing tonight.

We're just discussing basically the language in B2 tonight.

That doesn't mean that we shouldn't do the cats, or we shouldn't do if you say you have to spay all seven cats, you're almost leaning into a mandatory spay and neuter, which is a topic for a totally different day.

Okay, so that's something we should just talk about, maybe have a working group on.

I agree.

Um, I do think Mr.

Benner, if it requires a motion, it may require more than one motion.

Um so um I'm not sure if this is time for a motion, but I know that one of the motions I would like to bring is that the language in line three of number two after the word if should be each of the four dogs.

Okay, that changes it minimally, and then that's just one motion.

A second motion would be taking out purebred show dogs.

So that's kind of where I'm going here.

So there is a motion on the floor for moving line three, and in lieu of if each of the dogs to change it to each of the four dogs, correct?

Yes, there are seconds.

Oh, that's the pure bed thing part of it.

No, no, it's a separate motion.

Yes, um, I just I agree with all the logic, everything being said, but wouldn't shouldn't the motion be more a motion afford the amended ordinance to city council for approval with the following recommendations and then list your two points and whatever.

I think that's the cleanest way.

So before we vote on your motion, I just wanted to suggest restructuring that.

But there is no second on the floor, so it's not in action.

So this, you know, that would be a new motion be a cleaner way to do it and would be a new motion.

If there is no second to the current motion on the floor, she withdraw she can withdraw, but there is no second, so it's not active.

So would that be a motion?

Yes.

So I am my motion is to forward the amended ordinance to city council for approval with the following recommendations.

The recommendation to amend section uh B two B2, and with the language that Commissioner Bagley mentioned, and also to strike the uh the um quantity or I don't know, the language about show dogs.

And I also heard some other uh comments that I thought were noteworthy.

Comments about guided dogs, signal dogs.

Right, and I and and that as well the recommendation to maybe be a little bit more um or less broad about the limits of the language, so by including that as well, yeah.

Yeah, that's a hairy one.

Uh the motion is to forward uh the recommendation to city council with amendments to strike or to modify line three number two to state each of the four dogs, strike the language regarding show dogs, and strike the language regarding service dog section 9.44.9490 G.

Uh I think I think it was not strike service dogs, but modify the service dog language to include others.

Isn't that what I heard?

Or did I misunderstand that?

Commissioner Morris.

Well, I think where I was trying to get at was it seems to me reading this that we are exempting from the rule that they be and neutered because they they fit 944.9490 G, which then leads you to 510 that says fee exemptions, and it lists the government law enforcement agency, but also guide dogs, signal dogs, or service dogs.

So it suggests to me that you what one would be exempting enforcement animals, guide dogs, service dogs, signal dogs from the requirement to be spayed and neutered.

So that's where I was so so it'd be I would just modify them then to say, but include the additional list, or but not exclude.

Not exempt them from not exempt, yeah.

I'd have to work on the language a bit, but that's no you've got service dogs and law enforcement dogs together in that particular ordinance that they're relying on.

Right.

So it's cleaner to just say you don't want the service the service dogs, guide dogs signify or service dog.

Those are the three that are listed on the current law.

Right.

So those three should not be exempted from spay and neuter requirements for four dogs.

Uh I still think it's cleaner to go three separate motions.

Okay, yeah, that's not my it's getting kind of on the two.

I I'll I'll retract my motion and with the modification of just the first two amendments proposed by Commissioner Bagley for now and see what people want to do with that.

Well, I'm not even sure I understand though about her motion your add-on motion to the uh show dogs, because I don't see show dog listed in this language that is was not is show dogs any owner unaltered dog mutual following criteria uh registered each dog with the American Kennel Club Well, and I'm just can you clarify, Commissioner Bagley?

Is it do show dogs fall under the 9.44 point four nine zero F uh the show dog is F, yes?

So that's where it is in the code, yes, which is uh point two, yes, and G is the service and law enforcement dogs, which is point four.

Can we just outside it's just does that clarify?

Clarify for you where show dogs fall.

I can I can I break in real fast.

I think this is I understand why we're trying to do separate motions and vote on each one of these little individual things, but rather than drafting this on the fly because we could be here for not more than three hours.

Uh I think the general gist of what law and ledge was asking you to do was to chime in on general ideas of what you want to see this ordinance to be.

Right.

So the idea was we want to clarify it to be each of the dogs.

So that sounds great.

But rather than drafting ands and putting semicolons, and we want a comma here and there, just to talk about your general ideas of what you want this ordinance to look like, and then we do one motion at the end with the general ideas, and we come up with a list of we wanted to do A, B, C, D, and E without a general, and then we do one motion and we see if it passes.

And then if it doesn't pass, we can go back and find out what will get enough votes to get it passed, right?

That'll be cleaner for everybody rather than doing motions for every comma that we want to try to amend on the fly.

That is the recommendation of the city attorney's office how to make this the cleanest way possible.

For clarification, there is actually only one motion with with lines at this point.

Because the idea from law and ledge was they wanted to hear your they wanted your opinion on where you wanted to see this ordinance go.

But I don't think they wanted you drafting language up here on the dais.

They wanted to hear what your thoughts were just from a general policy direction.

And I I'm hearing the guide dogs and the service dogs and the each of the the each of makes complete sense to me, but I don't think they want you drafting actual language.

So that's that's my opinion.

But I think one motion is the way forward on this, and to see if we can get enough votes to get one motion to go forward one way or another.

Well, to clarify, as I've written it down, I am not drafting language, it is a recommendation.

It is recommendation to forward to city council a motion to amend regarding each of the four dogs for clarification, as well as strike show dogs, service dogs, guide dogs, and signal dogs.

So far, are we the is that is that all we're we adding more?

Are we got the I haven't heard of the case?

Well, I have three commissioners to speak, but at this point that's it.

Okay.

And that is a motion that's been made.

It has not been seconded as of yet.

Can you read it again?

Yeah, I please.

Yep.

Move to forward to the recommendation to city council uh to amend line three to state each of the four dogs as well as strike link strike the exemptions for show dogs, service dogs, signal dogs, and guide dogs.

So that is the motion on the floor.

Second.

There's okay, there is a second.

Uh Commissioner Barragon.

Oh, I think that needed to just be removed.

Okay.

Oh good.

Commissioner Garcia.

I'm good.

No.

He clarified it.

Okay.

Commissioner Benedict.

Um, I just wanted to, I just wanted to um see if we wanted to add or make a separate motion to accept to make an exception for fosters in any way.

Um, this city attorney can correct me if I'm wrong, but fosters are not considered owned by the by a resident.

So therefore they they do not fall under this guide.

I couldn't answer that on the fly.

I'd have to give you some research on that.

I don't think they are, but don't quote me on that.

That that is that is what I've as a foster have been told many times.

So no exemptions needed there because they're not considered your owned pet.

They actually are the property of the Red Rescue or uh shelter that you are fostering through.

Okay, good.

Thank you.

Any other comments?

I actually Commissioner Morris.

Can we can we put a um a footnote that says the committee commission reserves the right to return to law and ledge at a future time to discuss spay and neuter of cats?

Yeah.

I mean you can, but I don't think it's necessary.

We can return to discuss anything that this commission kind of puts it on the record that we see an opportunity to look at it.

But it is unusual that this commission would be tasked with looking at an ordinance at all.

It's only by the grace of law and legend the law and legislation committee that you were tasked with this, so that's not a thing.

So we could pass our motion and add to it or request that staff comment that this commission is interested in spare neuter ordinances for cats and have that go to city council and and ledge at some point.

Yeah.

Yeah, because what is the ordinance or is there one?

So all right, so there's a motion on the floor.

Any further discussion about the motion.

And again, to clarify the motion is to uh forward to city council approving uh the motion with amending line two to state each of the four dogs as well as strike the uh exemption language for show dogs, signal dogs, guide dogs, and service dogs.

Okay, all right.

All in favor, anyone opposed.

Any abstentions?

All right, motion carries.

Thank you very much.

All right, next up is uh item five, initiate a pilot program to promote adoption or rescue of senior animals and animals at risk for euthanasia.

This has come to the commission.

Commissioners have had interest in trying to promote animals that are at risk of euthanasia for quite some time.

In similar circumstances, as does Bradshaw and a number of other local shelters.

Stanislaw, member of the LA area shelters all have volunteer groups as well as staff groups that try to really focus on and show the personality for dogs that have dogs and cats that have been in the shelter for uh quite some time and are uh at risk of being euthanized for various reasons, uh, whether it be uh longevity in the shelter, uh stress, uh medical reasons.

So there was a subcommittee that was uh formed, and uh Commissioner Hayes was chair for that, and there have been recommendations that have come forward uh for discussion and a motion tonight, and so um that will be what we are discussing.

Um I'm sure that we have some speaker slips on this.

Yes, I have three speakers Paul Hefner, Susan Falcone, and Dea Good.

Just when I thought I was done losing sleep over this commission.

Um take a look at this graphic.

Think about what's behind it.

What I see behind it is fear and anger.

And you know what?

It's justified, it's righteous because if you think about our system, we penalize animals for the carelessness of human beings.

That's fundamentally wrong, right?

And it it makes me angry.

I hope it makes everybody angry, and the impulse to want to harness that anger and that fear and to sort of shout to the world, there's a real problem here, folks.

Get down here and help, right?

That impulse isn't wrong.

The problem is it doesn't work.

You've seen the data.

Most people don't get their pets from animal shelters.

Why?

Because the research tells us they don't want to feel sad and they don't want to see animals at risk of euthanasia.

Yet this proposal calls for taking those very fears and putting them front and center.

In the campaign world, we call that spreading your own negatives, and it's a mistake.

Adoption efforts come down to three simple metrics: foot traffic, conversion rates, and returns.

The proposal before you doesn't even mention them, and it moves all three in the wrong direction.

You scare folks away, they can never come and adopt an animal.

Lives depend on getting this right, and what's before you tonight unfortunately does not.

Thank you.

Thank you for your comments.

Next is Susan Falcone.

With all due respect to former Chair Hefner, I disagree.

I believe his time and serve to the animals at Front Street has proven that it didn't work.

So I think it's time for change, and I think that I don't know what data he's referring to, but um I do know what I see on next door every day, and it's an app that people talk about all the time, and when they find out that an animal is due for euthanasia, they take action.

They're not sad, they're gonna stand up and do what needs to be done, and they will come home with the dog that's on the death row list, whatever you want to call it, you know.

People want to know the truth, they're tired of not being told the truth, and you can't keep um kicking it under the rug because they're smarter than that, and that's what I'm hearing.

And so I um I respect your service, sir, but I disagree.

Thank you.

Thank you for your comment.

Last is Dia Good.

Thank you.

First, I want to thank Julia for bringing this forward.

It's the first start in a lengthy discussion that needs to be had.

Are you aware that the shelter manager quit last month?

The ops managers on administrative leave.

One of the kennel supervisors quit, and applications are being considered for filing, for filling the rescue coordinator position.

Who knows what other vacancies exist?

Front street is hurting, it's struggling.

They don't have the staff.

My point is there is no one there to implement or consider any major proposal that you're doing tonight.

There have been many concerns raised that need to be addressed before moving forward.

Bradshaw's program is not one size fits all.

Conversations need to be had with the Front Street staff who make up the euthanasia list and who put together the transfer list.

Plus, you need to bring in the volunteer coordinators who need to uh discuss if you start putting if you keep slapping on the kennels like dead dog walking, it will impact the mental health of your volunteers.

There are many volunteers who just come in, do their work, want to go home and think that every dog gets adopted and is living with a great family on 10 acres.

They don't want to know that the dog is going to be euthanized or killed in a day.

Plus, you can't look at final pleas without discussing the two ancillary issues.

How the rescue department can be strengthened and the transfer list made meaningful.

And the most important thing is how to keep dogs from deteriorating so they don't get on the list.

Prevention, not reaction.

And no one is looking at that today.

Sadly, this needs more work.

Thank you.

Comments?

That's all the speakers I have for this item.

All right.

Commissioners, uh, Commissioner Asquith.

Thank you.

Uh, as a member of again, I'm just gonna preface it.

I'm new, so I'm learning the processes, but as a member of the working group that um was addressing the uh final plea process.

I uh I have a couple of questions, and one is just confirming, and I don't know how that the document we have here is the actual document that we came to the final draft that we came to in our last meeting.

I don't know, I don't know if any edits were made after the fact because I didn't have a copy.

And um, and then my other question is after the this working group work together, we have two meetings.

Is the next goal that we come back and share with the entire um commission, or is the next goal that we have other steps again?

I'm I'm learning and learning and I'm new.

So those are my two questions for the group for you, Chair.

Uh so what uh is attached is what was sent to me.

Um and as far as next steps, so uh we bring forward discuss what the um and actually commissioner uh commissioner Hayes, you probably should kind of present a little bit about what you guys came out with.

Um but yeah, discuss it here at this point.

If this commission is in agreement with what's then there can be a motion to move it forward if it needs further discussion, they can go back to the subcommittee.

Yeah, and I wouldn't can I make one more comment?

And that is that um the graphics that were shared were um not shared in any way, shape, or form with the group that met on uh on March 23rd and also on April 1st.

Um those were not part of what that group um worked on that was created later.

Just I want to um have that on the record.

Thank you.

Uh point of privilege I'm gonna have Commissioner Hayes talk next.

Um thank you both for for speaking and um sharing your your input on this.

Um so I as mentioned last meeting.

Um I took it upon myself as well as um the other commissioners that were a part of this subcommittee to initiate and look at a final plea pilot.

Um something that I have been talking about since I joined the commission last year, um, as well as other members of the commission, um, because as you all know, the shelters not as well resourced as other shelters.

There's not we're trying to do what we can within the the um purview of what we're we're working with with with with our resources.

Um this is something that can save lives.

This is something that other shelters are doing, and I think the we we can go back and forth about sadvertising about what not to do, but if we don't act and try something, um that's that's that's harmful.

Um this was a very um you know, coordinated process.

We had multiple meetings.

Um I took multiple meetings with outside folks, including the folks from Bradshaw, and this of course can be modified as you've mentioned Front Street is a lot smaller, we don't have as many staff personnel.

Um, there are vacancies.

So this if you look in the language for internal use, there's a lot of if applicable wordage, and that that verbiage is to ensure specifically for the weekly meetings that we propose that um shelter staff should have to discuss what dogs end up on the list.

Um, there's a multitude of positions there, but it's if applicable.

It's if those coordinate if those positions are filled, so those personnel members can participate.

Um so that was to cover that aspect.

Um we we decided upon this, you know, multiple conversations.

This can still be um discussed, um and opinions can still be heard out.

It's not a right now in this moment, it is not set in stone, but this is what we'd like to go with.

Um, but of course, like we've heard from the public, input is welcome.

Um, but this is this is important.

I want to reiterate that.

Um, I just got off the phone while walking in this meeting with a longtime front street volunteer.

She's a part of the five or four rescue volunteers that they call themselves as.

They're pleading, they want something, they need something.

Um, without them, the shelter would not be able to operate.

Um, they they want something to work with.

They this the public needs to know.

Um this the graphic can be changed.

I uh the graphic, like you know, Shannon mentioned or Commissioner Asquith mentioned, um, we were not made aware of.

Um, I don't personally like the look of it anyway.

Um, and so we can we can change that um definitely it's not something you know we're gonna go with.

It's just is sort of an idea, but um, we hear that it's pretty daunting, and I I don't like that.

I don't you know see that working in the in the lobby or or whatever it may look like.

Um so yeah, the the I can get into the nitty-gritties if people have questioned about certain um aspects of the language.

Um but it is it's something that's needed, it's something I've heard from shelter staff.

Um, Commissioner Garcia also shelter of you know, volunteers and stuff.

Commissioner Garcia can share her um perspective.

She went ahead and talked to certain personnel at the shelter about a program like this, and um yeah, it's it's important.

So that's that's what I'll share for now.

Um happy to answer any other questions if needed.

Uh Commissioner Christie.

When we take initiative, we can make a lot of progress on.

I think what I'll just say is that based on the draft, I just don't think we're at a point of making a motion and pushing something forward with the staffing limitations at Front Street.

I I appreciate the if applicable language, but the burden on each of those existing staff members right now is increased based on those absences.

So adding something additional to their plate, if the list is shorter, it's still adding to a full plate.

Um I don't like to lean hard into the sadising debate, but I think that our at-risk dog population is the tip of the iceberg.

There is a much larger problem, puzzle, complex issue that is being seen all over the country in thousands of shelters.

Um, we can't toggle the switch for sadvertising and see amazing results that are not being seen anywhere else.

Um I am really concerned that if we hastily push through a pilot program without being really careful and methodical about it, that it's not going to be really easy to undo potential negative results from that.

We talked about in the past how it's really it would be easy to measure the metrics of like whether those specific dogs got adopted, but what we can't really put a number on is how many people saw that social media post and they were like, oh, I'm gonna go to the SPCA and adopt, or oh, I'm gonna check out that breeder or go on Craigslist because I just can't be around that that sad stuff.

So the the threat of um, you know, I know you're saying not doing anything is a risk, but the threat of disengaging and causing like avoidance behaviors in the general public is a equally or potentially larger risk.

Sometimes we have to focus on the health of our entire population of animals and do the greatest good for the greatest number versus sacrifice potentially good outcomes for adoptable animals in hopes that we can have a good outcome for a smaller number.

So I think that it's a great initiative.

I think that there's a place for targeted marketing for at-risk animals, but I just think we need more time to spend on it.

Commissioner Garcia Morris.

I do.

Okay, I go um uh referring back to what Julia said.

I I spoke to some um volunteers at the shelter um, and I posed two questions.

Um, number one, would you like to see a pilot program similar to similar to this?

Or and or would you like to have some sort of knowledge ahead of time?

Something a little more preventative before it gets to that point of um being on a list, um, such as maybe a pre-list.

These are the dogs we really need to pay attention to today.

These are the ones that are having problems.

If you were gonna come in and walk this dog today, let's come in and walk this dog today because we're seeing some harm or some uh regression with that animal.

So maybe something pre-so they they're kind of there's a knowledge out there between volunteers and staff that some of these dogs may potentially start going downhill if we don't get to them ahead of time.

Um, and they were really interested in that.

One of the volunteers said when she goes in as a greeter, she actually asks the staff, which animals would you like me to focus on today?

And so they'll circle on her little list.

These are the dogs we prefer you show ahead, like here's a long timer that's been here, great dog, do some really nice intros to these dogs, and what's done.

So that's one volunteer who took that on herself to um kind of initiate that type of um pre, you know, these dogs need a little more attention than some of the others.

So you're and I think we talked about this at one of our um uh committee meetings on this, and we thought maybe we could maybe add that in later or kind of maybe start with something like that, where the volunteers and staff know ahead of time what dogs they're looking at before it escalates into something else.

Uh Commissioner Barragon.

Um I was not here last meeting, so I appreciate all the work that went into this, and um I think it's it's great.

Uh anecdotally, uh, as you all know, I I adopted a dog from another shelter not that long ago that does does have a similar program or a variation of a program like this.

And I actually had volunteers there trying to draw my attention to certain animals, which I did appreciate.

Now, that's me.

I recognize that there's some science that maybe suggests that it could have deleterious effects on you know, uh people actually going in the foot traffic.

Um, I heard I appreciate I heard all three the three speakers today that kind of commented on this, and something stood out to me, which was the comment on, you know, the shelters depending on foot traffic and conversion, and that resonated with me because I spent six years managing uh a retail store, and you know, there's a lot of factors that go into an experience.

So if I could share like a metaphor here, you know, you go in there, there's the music that makes it really awesome, and the it might smell nice or the way things are arranged in a space, and that's the physical structure of a shelter, and we can't change that when it comes to Front Street.

But there's also the human aspect and what we would call a tagline, which is hey, did you know there's a 20% off today, right?

And I look at a final plea as that tagline, that opportunity to give these animals a chance to um maybe be picked up or to draw some attention there, and in a way, I actually think it would increase conversion.

So if we're talking about conversion, I think that a final plea program, and and I'm recognizing that it it may not be fully mature.

I also recognize the risk of if not now, or if we don't make some recommendation today, where does it leave this program?

Are we going to have this conversation five months from now to get it back on discussion to then try to get it as an as an item to pass a motion to make a recommendation to city council?

So, with that said, um, I'm I I recognize everybody's feedback.

I think it's fantastic, great work, but those are my two cents.

Commissioner Benedict.

Thanks.

Um, yes, I I do understand about the feeling sad, but I honestly believe uh watching the next door app and seeing this app every day, probably 80% of it is about animals needing homes, being rehomed.

Um, I think the public wants transparency more than anything.

They want to know the truth.

And I personally, personally know uh several neighbors as well as friends who have adopted dogs because they knew they were going to be killed.

In fact, one of them I just had an opportunity to walk for a couple of days.

My friend broke her arm.

Cooper, Pitbull, uh Labrador Mix never would have been adopted if she didn't know that he was about to be euthanized.

Um he's as spoiled as he can be spoiled rotten now, and this is this is what we should do.

Let the people know we don't have to hold everybody's hand.

Um the public wants to know the truth, they want transparency, and I wouldn't even go one step further.

What I'd like to see is a sign on the door as you walk in saying this is not a no-kill shelter.

They should know, and um they can take it from there.

I think and coming to a dog shelter, whether you know a dog's gonna be euthanized or not, seeing all those dogs in cages, it's a sad thing.

But you're coming there to adopt a dog, and that's a happy thing.

Uh so that's my thought on the sadvertising thing.

People should just know.

The public wants to know the truth.

And second of all, um, as far as staffing, Commissioner Um Christie talked about the staffing, and I think a couple of us commissioners would be happy to establish it, volunteer, set it up.

Um, it's just needs to get started, and I'm willing to give up my time and volunteer my time to help the staff so it doesn't impede in their on their time and make a greater burden.

Um, from what I understood from the last commission meeting, uh, Mr.

Jasso already pre-authorized we should just get this started.

We don't even need to take a vote.

He said, you know, we should just go ahead and start this.

Like you've got you've got our, you know, you've got the you know, the all ultimate uh okay.

So um I think the pilot program should just get started.

We can make recommendations along the way.

We can, you know, a month into it say, oh, you know what, maybe we need to do less of this and more of this, but we just have to get it started.

And the people want to know, people want truth and transparency.

Commissioner Verga.

I absolutely agree, and thank you, Julia, for leading the charge on this.

Um I think what needs to be said here is having worked in advocacy for a long time, having a 5013.

I know other people here also have rescues.

What a final plea is is what is how you save lives.

It's what we do every day.

It's it's networking animals, it's saying that their lives are at risk and this is urgent, and if their lives aren't saved, you know, they're gonna lose them.

And we find every day, I mean, we we have a Facebook page that lists nothing but animals whose lives are at risk.

And as Kathy had mentioned, when she talked to volunteers at the shelter, they were desperately wanting this and thought it was a great idea.

That's what Julia said too.

And so I think you know, to imply that it's somehow going to not allow adoptions or that it's gonna harm adoptions just doesn't make sense because what we see every day is that it does work.

Um, and I think you're absolutely right.

The sooner we can get this pilot started, I'm I'm happy to devote my time.

I know Julia, Hillary, Kathy, probably numerous of us that are able to, we'll do everything we can to make this a success, uh, understanding that the shelter um is is understaffed right now.

And I think then at the end of the day, you know, um, to send this as a recommendation to the mayor and council, it's it's up to them to decide.

You know, what what we're doing is just making a recommendation.

It doesn't need mean it's gonna be the law, but I do know that our mayor, I'm I'm thrilled to say, has supported notification of euthanasia in the past, and I just remember he said quote unquote, if it saves lives, why wouldn't we do that?

And and I so agree.

So thank you.

Commissioner Morris.

Um, thank you.

I think um I'm I'm kind of struck by process and also content.

Process, partly because it's my impression that this is a draft document.

This is not ready for prime time, honestly.

As I read through it, I saw a lot of areas where I had questions.

I was like, what about this?

What about that?

So I I'm I'm interested in such a project in terms of the improving adoptions for animals at our shelter.

But I this document to me seemed very draft, not a final document.

Um, and I don't want to go into the details today, page by page, but there were quite a few things that I was like, I don't know what this means.

I also, for example, aren't quite sure what's going to be measured in terms of how do you measure success with this pilot, when would the pilot start, how long would the pilot be, etc.

So there are just some general uh things that are blank for me.

Things that I wonder about, like, okay, so five dogs come off this list.

If four of them are returned, how do we calculate what impact that had or what we may do?

If they're taken out three more times and they're kept, okay, great.

But those are questions that I am curious about.

In the midst of reviewing this material, I started to look into like what else is out there, etc., as well as went back to my photos from a year ago when Kathy and I went to Stanislaw.

The photos that Stanislaw puts up do not say euthanasia list, they say long timer.

It says a long timer.

Um, so it's not quite so acaustic in in your face.

Um of you also will will maybe recall that Ryan sent all of us this article recently, which is from uh state of shelter pet adoption report, spotlight on large dogs.

They outline um a project in Massachusetts that ultimately increased live outcomes by 26 percent and reduced length of stay by 12 percent.

So there are activities, there are projects, there are initiatives out there because in the in the bigger discussion, I think that's what we want is fewer animals in the shelter, animals staying a shorter length of time, and more animals being released from the shelter, uh, which is a live release.

And so looking at these other projects, I forwarded to um Julia and Commissioner uh Garcia and Asquith and information I I learned about today as well, which is the city of LA has a program that they adopted last March.

They the title is something like at risk, but they have reduced length of stay, they have increased their live outcome, live release rates, they've um decreased the numbers in the shelter, and they've decreased dog bites.

So I I would really appreciate a little more time to do some research on best practices that are out there that our team has the opportunity to uncover and look at and see how we can adopt some of those best practices as we try to focus on some dogs that are struggling.

One of the things I went back and looked at our euthanasia statistics.

Some of you may recall May of last year, we had a whole report on euthanasia in the audit.

There is euthanasia number listed, live release rates, numbers.

Sort of shorthand, 60% of dogs who are euthanized, are euthanized due to behavior stress.

So if we want to really focus on what might help reduce euthanasia of dogs, we might want to focus on what we can do to address that those dogs are stressed out.

We also last year did a whole discussion about large dog adoption with many recommendations from that ad hoc committee.

I find myself wondering of the animals that were euthanized, are most of them large dogs?

And I I'm looking at Ryan and asking, can we take can we dive into our 575 dogs that were euthanized last year and get a weight on them?

According to this Hill report, a large dog is over 55 pounds, a medium is 26 to 55, and a small is less than 26.

I suspect these are large dogs.

I I don't know, but I would be interested because that segues into our large dog adoption ad hoc last year, where we talked a lot about how we might be able to support adopters, volunteers.

Now, a lot of it's you know, reliant on volunteers, which is what people have talked about here today.

They're willing to volunteer.

Well, things like making a phone call to a person who's adopted a very rampunctious husky and helping them with behavior, figuring out how we could create an app for a phone that says, here's free tips for you for uh, you know, um how to uh how to deal with your dog that's jumping on you.

There are many things that would be great to look into.

So again, I see this document as a start, I see it as a draft, I see it as a beginning of helping us put our minds together around some best practices.

Um, but I do feel like it's a little premature at this point to sort of take some action on.

Um, in this document as well, they had a thing called bench warmers.

So again, it's not dogs at risk of euthanasia, it was dogs that are bench warmers that people are just not picking up that maybe need a little more attention.

So it may be a way, it may be semantics, but maybe semantics aren't gonna scare our audience away, as many of us are concerned about.

Um so that those are some of the things I wanted to talk about.

Yeah, I feel like this is a good start for some things, but we need we lead some more structure around it.

Uh thank you.

Okay, so there's a lot a lot said, so I don't know if I'm gonna be able to respond to everything, but um, just to touch on a couple things you mentioned.

Um, so this was a very, you know, we we thought this through.

What you're seeing here is not just you know, chat GPT, it's it's notes from Bradshaw, it's it's how other shelters are doing their final plea.

So this is what works, this is what has worked.

Granted, front street's smaller, but this is what's worked.

This is the communication standards in here.

This is everything that sort of I took in from folks.

Um, I didn't just come up with it off the fly.

The five of us didn't come up with it off the fly.

So that's the language piece.

Um, sure, there could be tweaks, but I work in the legislature.

When we pass bills, when we pass legislation for agencies for organizations, we pass the language, we pass the bill, they deal with the specifics and how it looks logistically.

Front street would deal with the logistics and how it looks specifically, with of course our outreach and volunteer efforts that we are willing to do on behalf of our time.

Um it's you you you pass things as a starting point, you don't always get it right the first time, but you do it because it's needed and it's warranted, and other shelters are doing it, and it's it's it's now.

I don't see this as a this is a first step.

We come back and visit this in a couple months.

We do this now.

We continue to work with Ryan, we maybe pass a motion, something of this or this, and then we meet with Ryan, we meet with shelter staff, and we continue to work out the kinks, but we do it.

We do something like this.

Um my dog Boston that we unfortunately had to put down, we got from Front Street.

The only way we got him was because one of those five rescue volunteers that I mentioned that are now wanting to collaborate with Front Street to post their videos along with Front Street.

They posted that dog saying he actually has like five hours left.

So we went at when the shelter opened and we rescued him, it took us an hour to get him from his kennel.

Granted, we're patient people, so we could do that.

Um, but that's that's how we saw the dog.

That's how we got him.

Um he would have been killed, he was a black dog with a white stripe, no one would have gotten him.

Um, and he had a euthanasia date.

So it it works.

Like the if we want to keep harping on advertising, we can do that, and we can stay in the place we're at of Front Street not moving forward.

But this is something we can try, and we can work with shelter staff.

We are collaborative, we are open.

Um, this is a starting point that wasn't just thought from the fly, it wasn't AI, it was five people.

It was us reaching out to volunteers, it was us reaching reaching out to another shelter to establish something to move forward.

Um the graphic.

I understand where you're coming from.

I understand where everyone's coming from on that.

That will not be the graphic we're using.

I hope.

Um, it's you know, it was well-intentioned, and we thank Julie for bringing something like that forward.

Um, but that's not what we're gonna be using.

It's not welcoming, it's not inviting.

Um, but we need a graphic of uh like that.

Um kind of like that.

Um, but if you look at I I think there's a lot of fear that this will be some fear-mongering cloud covering thing.

If if you I scroll Bradshaw's Instagram, I scroll, I scroll LA shelters Instagram all day, and they are not sad posts.

They are not that it's normally other people, volunteers or other like um people that walk into shelters and will post for likes and outreach.

It when it comes from the shelter, when it comes from that organization, they're not sad.

They're pretty positive.

Um, and they're really happy photos of the dogs.

Front street's done an amazing job posting really cute photos of the dogs.

Those photos are what I envision being used.

It's this will not be.

Um but this is this is something Front Street can take back, and we can keep on you know, communicating with them, but this is something that should be adopted in my opinion.

It was well thought out.

Um, so that's what I'll say.

Um my turn.

Uh staffing comes and goes.

Sorry, does.

Uh, and if you don't, if we don't get this started now, then the question is when and how many more dogs have died, and how how much time has gone by that we've done the same old thing and nothing has changed and nothing's gotten better.

It like Julia says, this is this is just a start.

This is trying to get something moving, some change going.

Um yes, the staffing is is low at the moment, but there are commissioners on here who have said more than you know, multiple times that they're willing to help.

Uh, one of the things that I would suggest as part of this, uh, Commissioner Hayes, just so you might want to mark down.

One of the things to really try to figure out how well this is going is to have have follow-up calls.

And I know that Commissioner Bagley is even offered that she would call anyone who's adopted an animal that's been advertised and have the conversation of so what brought you in, what brought you to that animal, why did you select them?

That you know, you everyone wants data, that's how you get the data.

Um so, and then uh Commissioner Morris uh uh you brought up the city of LA.

Um, I'm sorry, they city of LA and frankly the entire county is an utter disaster as far as animals go.

Sure, the uh shelters have lower intakes, that's because they are not taking in dogs.

Um, their statistics on their number of dead dog pickups have exponentially increased.

That's where all the dogs are going, they're dying on the street.

So I would not take anything out of this out of LA area to heart or as a suggestion.

Um I personally have uh my last couple of fosters have all come from down in LA and LA County.

Uh the I started fostering a couple of years ago, and I only take euthanasia list dogs.

Um, so that is one of the things about euthanasia list when you're actually advertising and you're actually being transparent, as people know these are the ones that are at risk.

Um as I mentioned before, my last two fosters I picked up because they went on the euthanasia list while I was watching three husky puppies who were not on the euthanasia list, and literally because I picked those two up, these they happen to be from Apple Valley, they decided to kill the three huskies that same day without putting them on the list.

And and the volunteers and all the the people down there knew exactly that it was because the the two black dogs that I picked up were rescued.

Um, so again, anything out of the LA County, I would not take that as any recommendation whatsoever.

Disaster down there for the most part.

Um so, and then you mentioned that the large dot ad hoc committee.

It I was reading the information.

There were some good suggestions.

My question is how many of them were actually implemented?

Um, because I'm not sure if if anyone's um lack of staff, yeah.

In which case that that then comes back, I think, to trying to see how much commissioners are willing to help out, um, willing to help out both uh directly in the in the shelter as well as helping talk to volunteers and trading up on doing the different things that were suggested out of there.

Uh this is just a start.

This is a start of trying, you know, to improve things.

There's so many things that we have to work on or needs to be worked on at Front Street.

Um the some action at this point is literally better than nothing, and some action will save lives.

Oh, and the one other thing is that I still question the the euthanasia list when it comes up, how how is it uh formulated and decided upon.

Um, it certainly seems that the any dog that the youth the sorry the rescue list does not seem to include all of the dogs that are then euthanized.

Um, and so that's a that's a huge disconnect, unless those animals are you know too sick or something, uh even stressed, they should be going out to the rescue list as uh as an option.

It certainly seems that the number of dogs euthanized is well in excess of anything that ever goes out on our our uh rescue list, and I mean one of our other projects we should look at is really beeping up our our uh uh relationship with rescue so that that there's a a lot more that can assist front street than it's currently happening.

But um personally, I just to be clear will be voting that this moves forward because again, some action is better than continuing to do the status quo.

Uh Commissioner Christie.

Thank you.

Um I don't feel like I think we're coming to a point of we're not really debating the merits of the final plea, but we're maybe discussing the methods.

And I'll just bring it back to my concern about the way that we go about this is very important.

I don't know why some of us are pretending like there's not data and research in these areas and that there aren't surveys and studies that we can look at and experts and and people that have built a a career and and have done peer-reviewed and and and have looked at this across the country.

I don't know why we think that we uniquely will come up with the the system that will finally do the trick.

Um I just I and and we're relying on next door app, which I am also in the trap of looking at that every day and becoming thoroughly depressed by what I see on there.

But these are anecdotal things that are just the people that care the most.

We could not be a more biased room of people that care the most, and I don't want us to fall into a trap of assuming that level of caring for the general public because where are they?

They haven't all shown up to our meetings.

I there is a great benefit to transparency.

Um, and I don't think we're lacking that in this specific area.

I feel like there are ways that we can increase that without the public like Facebook push of this dog has a final date.

Um, I think that there's a lot of merit here.

I'm just concerned about how we go about it.

If this is all very draft language, great.

It seems to me like we're motioning for this to get pushed forward in its current form.

I don't know enough about how that works.

I'm curious from staff, what is the next step of this look like if it goes forward versus if we keep working it?

Yeah, sure.

Yeah, so I think um, if you kind of look at the way the staff report is written, the um the motion is for the shelter to initiate a pilot program.

That's the the first um first item.

And then the second item, so that's kind of very generally that the the recommendations the staff initiate this final pilot program, and then the second item is for the discussion kind of of the methods.

So um I think the motion tonight would you know simply be to suggest that the shelter does a pilot program and then the details be worked out after that.

Um we have committed to doing a pilot program of some some version of this.

Um, and this was a we had this discussion before even the last meeting that we were we were open to this and and interested.

I think um you know, I've heard really good things from both sides.

I think you know, uh like I say all of the issues that maybe there's disagreement on, it's it's tough because there's there's pros and cons to each, and we're trying to weigh like which which is gonna have the greatest benefit for animals, right?

And so um I think the next step would be uh for us to continue collaborating, continue discussing.

Um we got this language on Friday.

I've had a chance to do a brief review, but I think it would take going through it with my team and assessing it, and I would say working collaboratives collaboratively as we dial in, you know, what what methods within this, and we mentioned lots of things, social media, um signage, you know, other types of digital notification, so getting down to specifically what methods um which may factor in a little bit with with staff resources possibly, um, although I'm optimistic we can we can make at least most of this work um with what we have.

Um, and then uh kind of like dialing in the exact language that I'm hoping can balance um can balance the concerns because you know people have kind of brought up two different things.

One is sort of a anecdotal evidence, like hey, I adopted this dog because I saw something like this, or someone else adopted a dog because something like this.

And that's very valid.

Like that's that's a real, you know, that that is a form of evidence that hey, this this works.

Um, but I also uh don't want to discount that you know, um, on the evidence hierarchy.

I think I put that in our sort of pros and cons analysis thing I put together, you know, these these sort of studies that really look at the general population and maybe not sort of these audiences that might be a little bit more niche that we are sort of very connected to that that data also has a lot of validity.

And so my hope is through this collaboration we can get to uh a middle ground that that still is conveying the urgency for these animals, still giving those animals the same benefit, but not reducing um adoptions overall through the more general audiences and families and kind of normal normal folks that you know come to visit the shelter.

So thank you.

Uh Commissioner Asquith.

Thank you.

Uh a few comments.

Um I think that um I'm sort of reiterating what some of the other commissioners have said, but I feel like it is the framing of the messaging going out, whether it's um down to the specific words you're using, like killing and things like that, um, that um I take pause with.

Um I did manage an open intake shelter for almost two years in Downey, California, which is part of the largest animal sheltering system in the country, Los Angeles County.

I dealt with this at a very high level every day, and what I what I really want to reiterate and drive home is something that we haven't spoken of yet, and that's the staff because the staff will have to walk by a sign like this every day, and that staff might be assigned to euthanasia, and there might be a dog or a cat on here that didn't make it because it was one that wasn't pulled because of that plea.

And so because we know that not all of them will still be pulled.

It's great that some that many are, and Bradshaw is an example of that.

But these staff people are real people, and they have to walk by this red euthanasia kill the kill date, the kill dates tomorrow.

I agree this is awful, it's awful.

But I also know that we have got to take care of these people that do this work that walk back there, and they have to do it because they're assigned to it.

And they might also have a relationship with that dog or that cat because they've been they've seen that animal and they've been there for a while because of the ones we're trying to get out, right?

And so they have to go back there, and they have to do that work.

And I have never done it, but I've been present, and boy, it's rough.

And then you take a deep breath and you go out and you try and save the next one, and you try and save the next one.

So I just want to be mindful of that.

But with that, I also want to also bring up that the the process is underway now to bring in our next shelter manager.

And that there's there's a time frame and there's dates and so forth for interviews and things, which are really it feels like it's it's it's going to be happening very soon.

And so I also feel like um finding out from whomever's gonna step up or whoever's gonna be interviewed, or who's ever going to be accept ex um uh recommended?

What is their comprehensive placement program?

Are they going to have a are they gonna have the experience and the expertise that we're all that we we are all learning about because we're all going out and doing and learning about different programs and whether it's Bradshaw or MSPCA or our own experiences, what is that person gonna bring to the table and what kind of leadership are they gonna bring and and how are they gonna structure it?

Who's gonna do what?

What leader, you know, how are we gonna engage the the volunteers and what staff's gonna do this and what staff's gonna do that?

So that I'm I believe it feels like that's right around the corner, and it doesn't help the dogs that are there today, but hopefully that person will bring that leadership, and um and um I do look forward to hearing more from interim manager Hinderman about what's happening right now today.

Are we working with the res rescues right now?

Are we what are we doing?

And hopefully we'll hear some more of that in the um in the manager uh the shelter report.

But that's what I have to say.

Commissioner Benedict.

Thank you.

Um yes, uh, as to uh Commissioner Asquith's comments.

I do understand that it's difficult for the staff, and I I couldn't imagine, but um I guess I have to remind uh the commission that we are the animal well-being commission, not the shelter staff well-being commission, and um they have a job to do.

The reason we are here to protect the animals is because they don't have a voice, and that's the whole point of the existence of this commission, and to kind of oversee and make sure that they do have voices.

Um, also this is a pilot program, um, which means that it's kind of a like a living document, as I would say.

So we're gonna if we get it started, then we can come back next month, and in you know, the previous or subsequent months, and we can report and we can say and I understand a little language might need to be massaged too.

Um, so we can work on that during this pilot program, we can formulate how it will finally end.

Maybe we get it perfected six months down the line.

But in the meantime, dogs are being saved, and you know, we'll fix the language later, we'll get it in there, we'll soften it or do what we have to do so the public knows, you know, these dogs are dying.

Um, but maybe we we do what we have to do to make it more palatable.

Um as far as gathering data, um, you know, I know Commissioner Bagley has you know agreed to make phone calls to anyone who has adopted a dog that was on the youth list, um, you know, to touch base, let's get the data.

Let's let's really focus on getting some data and we'll help, you know.

Um, so let's bring the data back and talk about these things next time.

Wow, this is kind of going.

It's a pilot program, it's not a yeah, it's it's not the end result, it's the beginning of a process.

So thank you.

Uh clarify what this was about that I attached, and it was my very lame attempt to try to show.

Okay, I don't know how to use AI clearly.

Um one of the steps did ask that there be a bulletin board in the entryway that shows which animals are eligible for the final plea program.

And the reason why that is important and why Bradshaw doesn't have that is because there's a lot of animals at Front Street that are in areas that are not viewable by the public.

And um I I actually have ideas with flowers, you could do really cute things to make the animals look fabulous.

I this I couldn't do it.

I I tried, um, and Julia said I could do it, and I I know she could because you know she's much younger.

Um, but I just wanted to clarify that this is not going out to the public.

This was a mock-up of what the bulletin board what the entryway may look like, and so that obviously could be open to a lot of different great interpretations.

Um, the other thing that in my talks with staff of a lot of different shelters, um, is that they prefer there to be an open transparent conversation about what animals are at risk, and when their lives are saved, that makes their lives a lot easier, and that makes their lives better.

And you know, 1,823 animals were euthanized last year, you know.

That that's a really high number, and I'm sure if we could reduce that number, first of all, if they're going to be going on the euthanasia list, which we're we're hoping that as time goes on, we can make that everything more productive and efficient and reduce that list, and even if it's one animal in one day, that's an animal's life that's saved that should matter to all of us, and if it doesn't, we shouldn't be up here.

Um, but you know, it it is a process, and I think it you're absolutely right.

I mean, we could do the data and all this analysis, you know, ad nauseum, and at a certain point I think we just need to move forward.

I agree with Chair Um McDowell on that.

And my question would be from a procedural standpoint, um, as I think we already know that that uh Mr.

Jasso had also indicated that it should be a pilot program, and I think it's time to take a motion and vote.

If we don't get the votes, we don't get the votes.

But my question to the chair would be um I I think it should also be a motion to go to the mayor and and council or the PPE.

We know that process takes a long time.

My thought is that in the meantime it can be a pilot, we can work the kinks out, see how it works, when it actually gets to the mayor and council for them to be considering whether or not it should be implemented as a permanent program that can happen.

And so my question is are those two separate motions, or at what point um is a motion in order.

Uh well uh Jacob Redberg, Office of the City Clerk.

Um is my voice coming through on this microphone.

Excellent.

So the item today was agendized to pass a motion to forward a recommendation to the personnel and public employees committee so that they can then review this proposal for a pilot program.

So any pilot program would have to first be sorry.

Some are long-term friendships.

And I'd actually like it to be a seven-month pro uh pilot.

And I would say that the next month that you'd walk through with all the parties involved, as long as it's not breaking the Brown Act, and actually come up with the kind of proposal going forward for the pilot for PPE to understand to look at themselves.

I mean, obviously, there's a lot of great ideas.

Everybody just wants these adopted, and we want it to be foster, you know, failures, as many as possible.

Um, there's a lot of really good ideas here.

I know Ryan has good ideas, I know Paul has good ideas.

I I think we need to try something.

I mean, I I don't really think that if you try a pilot and it doesn't work out to be as fruitful as you hope, it doesn't mean that the whole system goes down the drain.

But it's something to start with.

Um, and I think that after a month of of talking back and forth with a variety of different people, um, that you'd get to a sweet spot with the language that PPE, you know, uh could consider in a good light.

Um, I will throw in that this is exactly the kind of conversation that I asked for a year ago to try and have a work day, that we would have a whole day to talk about these kinds of things and bring in experts so that we could actually hear not just data from a booklet, but actual not just anecdotal either, but some real ideas from across the US of people that we know to get us to a sweet spot with the tiny shelter that we have without it being a giant burden on staff, and that's why I love the idea when I hear that there are commissioners who are willing to step up and make the calls, maybe do the data.

Um some people are really good at that.

I'm good at making calls, I'm not good at doing data.

Um they said there'd be no math, so um, but that's my suggestion is that we go ahead, offer the fact that we do need to have a pilot going forward with working commissioners helping the shelter out any way that we can so that the staff isn't totally burdened by a new project, but hopefully getting as many animals as possible.

Um with happy promotions.

I mean, however, you want to do it.

Uh there's lots of good ideas.

It doesn't have to be a death notice.

At the same time, I think that there are probably some really good ideas out there to bring it to, I think, uh a fruitful pilot.

That was me.

Um I I just want to actually thank Commissioner Treat for summarizing because I think she captured a few ideas I was bandying about, which is if we could have a bit more time to look at this proposal that is in a draft form, as it says.

Uh and if the right person and without breaking the Brown Act, that's where it's a challenge to like give feedback to Julia per se about some thoughts on, for example, um data being gathered to measure success.

What and what's the framework of the pilot?

When would it start?

How long would it go?

What would be measured, what would be indicated as a success of it?

Things that went through my mind as I was reading it.

So another month to get a chance to wrap our head around this document that that for me only arrived less than 48 hours ago.

So um that seems kind of faster.

Um and I appreciate the analogy to the legislative process, but we also don't have departments that then write the regulations.

So while the legislative bill comes out and it it leaves all the detail to the department of health services or whomever.

We don't have that here.

So there's a certain amount of trying to do some fine-tuning here as we're as we're trying to save lives.

Um so that's a bit of where I'd like to see if that is acceptable for us to send feedback to the lead on the work group.

Is that a if we do that, is that a um a problem with the Brown Act?

I'm looking at our city attorney uh and taking Commissioner Treat's idea of a month to do a little bit more fine-tuning on such a document.

Right now, the matter before this committee is a thumbs up or thumbs down vote to forward this to P and P.

So there either has to be a motion to forward it or a motion not to forward it.

That's where we're at.

I hear that, but my question is is it is it allowable for since we've had this discussion for us to send comments to the lead of the work group.

Well, then the motion would be to not forward it, and then there would be a second, and then you'd have to get enough votes to pass that, and then it would not go forward.

Sorry, I'm I'm not asking.

You'd have to make a motion for to not go forward and get a second and then get votes for that.

So right now it's just a thumbs up or thumbs down vote whether this is going to go forward to PNP.

Okay, let me she's asking regardless of the vote.

Yep.

Can she personally make comments to the chair of the subcommittee regarding the document without violating the browser?

Well, the number two on here is are the discussion.

We're discussing the details of it's it's been agendized, so we can talk about the details here, but there's no action to be taken on that.

The only action is the motion that's been just agenda.

So outside of this meeting.

Oh, outside of this meeting.

Yes.

Well, we've talked about, I mean, uh, Mr.

Van Der Linden has told told you in the past of you can have your you know, less than a less than a committee amount of your your your coffee.

That would be more because there's less than a quorum.

Seven people can't be a part of the subcommittee because I don't know.

But you can send stuff to correct you can individually send comments to first to the chair or not to be distributed out, but for the chair to internalize.

Correct.

Okay.

Thank you.

Okay.

All right, Commissioner Hayes.

Um, I'd like to make the motion clarifying the motion, it is to move this on to PP.

Correct.

The acronym, yeah.

Um, and then like you mentioned, Commissioner Morris, this will be discussed with Ryan with shelter staff.

This is like we will work out the kinks, we will be collaborative, we will um work out the specificities and within the purview of the resources that they have.

Um I don't know if we can amend it to be a seven-month pilot.

Well, that that would your motion would could specify a time frame because this oh there is not a look at that.

Okay, uh I can I mean I I'm I'm sympathetic to that.

Um, just so we have you know, an entire month to to have those you know, stakeholder conversations per se.

Um so I'm I'm sympathetic to that.

Just to clarify, the motion is as written in the agenda is to forward a recommendation to initiate or not not initiate, right?

If we want to discuss the details, we can if that if that's what you if staff will include that in the report to PNP, what your what the discussion here is, but it's to initiate or not initiate.

That's the that's the motion.

So the motion will not include details, correct.

But the staff report that goes to PNP will include these details that we're all talking about.

But right now, the the motion is going to be to initiate or not initiate.

Okay.

Oh so your motion is to initiate uh or to rec to recommend forwarding to the PP and D to initiate a pilot program to support policy goals related to the promotion of at-risk and senior dogs, correct?

Yes.

Oh, sorry, animals.

Thank you, animals.

That was a question dogs.

It's animal it's animals.

I have animals in there.

But it's not your did it say dogs?

I thought I changed it all to animals, but it's and the motion will be animals.

Is there a second to the motion?

I second.

So that's that's what's in the agenda stopping after the order.

And clarification, madam chair.

Yes.

By voting for this, it does not prohibit any of us from going to PPE and suggesting certain things that be considered.

That is correct.

Thank you.

Let's take it.

What I have is pass a motion to forward a recommendation to the personnel and public employees committee for city staff to initiate a pilot program to support policy glows related to the promotion of at-risk and senior animals to include such items as kennel cards, kennel marketing identification board in the lobby of the front sheet animal shelter and social media posting and digital notification.

Motion by Hayes, second by Benedict.

Would you like to take a roll call?

The motion that's listed for the recommendation.

The motion that's been typed by staff on our agenda is the motion that goes forward.

So why do we why can't we work on this just like we did on the one with the ordinance?

Just on the one the one above that has a motion to forward the amended ordinance.

We did some word work on that.

Well we moved with the so you can't just stop it after the word animals.

The motion itself is as listed.

Yeah.

In the staff report as it moves on to personnel and public employees committee will include said recommendations.

As staff has taken them into account.

Yes, please.

Okay, Commissioners, please unmute your microphones.

It's what's in the agenda.

Commissioner Treat.

Aye.

Commissioner Verga.

Aye.

Commissioner Hayes.

Aye.

Commissioner Bartagon.

Aye.

Commissioner Bell.

I'm gonna abstain.

Commissioner Benedict.

Aye.

Vice Chair Bagley.

Aye.

Commissioner Christie.

Nay.

Commissioner Asquith.

Nay.

Commissioner Fhew.

Commissioner Morris.

No.

Commissioner Garcia.

I'm gonna abstain.

Chair McDoll.

Aye.

The motion passes.

Right.

Thank you, everyone.

There are some other speakers on there.

Did you have anything further you wanted to say before we move on to the next agenda item?

I do.

Okay.

Commissioner Benedict.

Oh, Commissioner Asquith.

Did you have anything that you're okay?

Commissioner Benedict?

Um, yes, it is it's regarding the motion that just passed.

Um city um the city staff.

I don't, I'm sorry, I don't know your name.

Um you said that we, you know, the commission uh cannot start this pilot program.

Um but um Ryan, our interim manager can, correct?

The interim city manager can start it.

Okay.

All right, I just want to make sure that's clarified.

Also, I wanted to um just clarify for the PPE that this motion is going now being forwarded to the PPE.

And forgive me because I don't understand the process, but um is there a way that we could see the staff report with the recommendations?

Because I I don't know.

Do we get a copy of that?

Or how does that work?

Ryan, I do you want to yeah?

I mean that it's gonna be public.

I mean that's gonna be published before PNP.

Okay.

So I don't do you want to speak on that?

I I assume you could circulate it after we're done putting together.

Yeah, I think I think I think should be able to send it by uh the BCC email.

Um like feedback as far as I know.

I don't think there's any I mean it will it's gonna be agendized just like the reports are for this.

It's a matter of you'll be able to see it online and and like was mentioned here earlier, you'll be able to go to PNP and comment on it if you're unhappy or happy about how it looks and just like anybody else.

Yeah, and thank you.

Clerk's office staff will work with um Ryan to bring it to the next available uh personnel and public employees committee meeting.

Um staff presentation Hinderman.

Congratulations on that, by the way.

Oh thanks, thank you.

Appreciate that.

All right.

So our statistics for March are on the screen.

Oh, I see.

Uh on the screen here.

Um take a look.

Um I don't know, there's a lot of information.

I don't know what's uh all you'd like me to announce, but um intake 236 cats, 535 dogs.

Who's got access to the one that can say cancel?

What does that even mean?

All right, thanks for that.

And um 29 cat uh outcomes, which you can see listed along the bottom there, and 513 dog outcomes, which you can also see along the bottom bottom there.

Overall I have release rate 83 percent, cat 76, dogs 86.

Oh, someone probably left me a clicker.

Maybe not.

Perfect.

Okay.

And just for our uh fun story of the month, um, this dog uh came in.

He he actually looks fairly well well kept there, but uh very severely matted, very uncomfortable boy.

Um we had him groomed, he actually fell asleep in the lap of the groomer.

Um that tub full of fur, that's actually a very large, like full-size dog grooming tub.

So a lot of fur came off of him, and that's his uh happy adoption picture on the right there.

Um let's see.

As far as other updates, just a few I wanted to touch on.

Go through our staffing updates.

Um we are currently have an open recruitment for an animal control officer.

We have um two officers um with hiring in progress, so that is great.

Uh we are hiring for our um dog foster and rescue coordinator position.

Uh we are um one of our vacancies is a senior animal care technician, so we will be uh that should be posting relatively soon.

We've uh just had an applicant accept an offer for registered veterinary technician.

It's another huge win.

Uh we have open recruitments for two animal care technicians.

We will likely be scheduling interviews for those shortly, and then the animal care services manager position um closed, and so those applications are currently under review.

Let's see, in other news.

Policies and procedures is moving right along.

Um we are currently in the contract negotiation phase uh with the vendor we selected through the request for proposals.

Really optimistic about that.

Um I've been working with staff.

Uh we sent out a uh an internal survey to get uh staff's uh opinion on on what um policies and procedures are the the most necessary.

Um, you know, things that aren't just gonna sit and collect dust.

Unfortunately, um we're not gonna have funding to do every policy and procedure that that we would like to do.

Um my understanding is those completed documents can be hundreds and hundreds of of pages long.

Um so we're kind of looking at what are our top uh our top um policies and procedures and figuring out what we would be able to get developed uh out of that budget.

Um and so staff put in their recommendations.

We were all we're also prioritizing um the policy and procedure recommendations of the audit, which primarily focus around animal uh field enforcement activities.

Um and so we're still in the stages of compiling that and as well as compiling the existing documents that we have, um, which will, you know, the more that we already have, the more the less kind of development will be needed with this firm.

Um but uh you know I will say that I think um generally speaking, things that this commission has um has expressed interest in euthanasia policies, rescue policies, intake policies, those are uh very high on the list and will definitely be included.

So I see a lot of alignment um between the commission and the staff and and my priorities and other managers' priorities.

So uh really looking forward to um getting started on that.

Um, you know, in an interim role, my um I see my role really is stability and kind of keeping the ship afloat, and um, you know, I hesitate to to make any big changes when you know we don't know what leadership is gonna look like in two months.

Um, but uh you know the policies and procedures really cannot wait.

Um, and it's gonna be a huge project, huge undertaking.

Um, and so I'll be um you know basically initiating a lot of those uh processes in order of of priority, uh especially the ones that I mentioned.

We've talked about you know, rescue policy and procedure um that's very high up on the list.

Um, euthanasia uh decision making that's super high on the list, so those conversations um are gonna be get started very quickly.

Um I also was able to apply for a grant.

Um it's a grant that we apply for through Petco Love each year, and what Petco Love loves to see is um innovation.

Um, and so uh I asked for a number of different things.

You don't ask for a monetary amount, you ask for a bunch of stuff, and then you you kind of get a surprise, hopefully.

Um, but uh one of the big things that I did ask for, um, and thank you to uh Commissioner Berga and Commissioner Bargain.

We've you know had the conversations about social media um social media ads uh recently, and that kind of jogged my my my thought process to put that really high on the list as far as not only um you know, Commissioner Bargan and I have talked about reaching our Spanish population, right?

There's a huge opportunity there.

Um, and you know, for example, we've you know, 15 about 15% of the population speaks Spanish as primary language.

Well, 15% of our adopters and folks reclaiming their pets are not coming and asking for you know someone to help them with language.

So the city is very is being very intentional and and doing a lot of work to make language more accessible in general.

Um but I think that you know, if we had a strong budget to reach that community and other communities, that would be extremely helpful, as well as actually getting a professional to come in and help us set up these ads, teach us exactly how to how to use them and market them and and hopefully be able to pass on that knowledge to other shelters so they could they could benefit as well.

Um let's see.

And there were yeah, some other things as well.

Um, ask for additional funding for our homeless outreach program.

So fingers crossed, probably won't find out about that until the fall, but uh Petco Love has been incredibly supportive of our shelter over the years, so I'm hopeful.

Um and then lastly, as part of this you know report, um, the chair and I met uh a number of weeks ago and talked about like what are what are ideas that for the commission.

Um and so you know, now that there is this this uh this body and growing apparently by two two members soon.

Um, you know, like I said in the last meeting, I see really a lot of potential with this group, and I appreciate your open your interest in participating in in you know this project that we've discussed tonight as well as others.

Um so I just thought as part of this report, maybe I'd you know share some ideas.

Maybe there's certain things that that peak pique your interest or that you see um potential in.

You know, I really appreciated uh Commissioner Christie, your comments about hey, there's a lot of there's a lot of other issues like that was I was kind of discussed by um by multiple folks tonight.

Um there's there's just there's so much that that there's so much that can be done to improve animal welfare in our community, improve outcomes at the shelter.

Um and so I just you know have kind of been brainstorming as I think of things here and there.

So just wanted to share um a couple things here.

One is the steps towards the new shelter.

So that's on the follow-up log, so I I really want to try to get that back.

You know, it's gonna take I think when things seem so far out, um, it almost seems like oh, well, you know, it's so far out, why bother?

But it's like everything is it to get there, it's like one step at a time.

It's that journey of of you know 10,000 steps.

So I'd like to you know keep moving that forward in the discussion.

Um there is um actually staff brought up today, you know, trying to make the shelter more welcoming, right?

Because we do have we do have the oldest shelter, the most the most jail-like shelter, I think, in the region.

Um, and so you know, finding ways to make the shelter more welcoming.

Um, you know, this kind of came out of concerns for you know the bulletin board, certain types of signage, but you know, people said, well, how can we, how can we, you know, are there things we could do proactively to make make the shelter more welcoming for folks?

Um span neuter um spay neuter budget budget utilization.

Uh I know this has come up before of doing research about about spay and neuter access and availability in our community.

Um, so there's some interest here, but you know, as we ask for this $500,000 to do more community spay and neuter clinics, I think something that's really important is how can we use those funds for the highest impact, right?

So do we want to have income requirements?

Do we want to base it on geographic location where we know most of our animals come from?

Do we want to you know focus on on certain breeds?

So start having that discussion.

We don't know if we're gonna you know get the funding yet, but um uh but figuring out if we do get that, how can we deploy that?

You know, I think it's about 2,000 surgeries, 2500 surgeries.

Where can we make those surgeries count the most?

That would be a project.

Bottle baby recruitment.

This is this is has always been a struggle for us to get it's pretty easy to get fosters for those those those uh weaning kittens, but bottle baby fosters, Denise knows we struggle.

So if you all have you know ideas and projects related to getting more of those, um you know, one of the things I included in my social media advertisements was to try to get that in front of more people.

That the older kitten posts seem to get shared a lot more than the bottle babies.

I think there's something about a kitten with closed eyes that maybe you know, they're just look a little more like a mouse.

I think they don't quite resonate and get as many shares as like the the kittens when their ears pop open and everything.

Um, but that's a big area.

That's that's something we struggle for um every year.

Something we've talked about a lot internally is school presentations and sending information home with students and assemblies, right?

So if we're able to talk to, you know, maybe if it is spay and neuter and there's these programs in certain areas that we think could be um uh you know areas where they really need the service, maybe we can send home information about an upcoming clinic.

Maybe we can promote fostering, you know.

I think there's I think there's a lot of potential there.

Um, and then as we kind of go forward with some of this policy and procedure development, you know, let's take rescue for example.

If you know you all are familiar with shelters that you feel like, hey, kind of similar to Front Street, do a really good job in a certain area, have a really successful program, especially if they have data behind that program.

Um I would love to know about them.

Um for example, you know, if you have shelters where you feel like hey, they they do their rescue program so well, um, they have similar, you know, similar sized city.

Um I am in contact with Bradshaw um to uh specifically learn more about their rescue process, um, see what we can learn.

My understanding is they have two rescue coordinators, which might open up like we have half of a rescue coordinator, dog foster and rescue coordinator.

So um, but um I'm really interested in in that as well.

So um I know um Commissioner Hayes was looking at you know, look reached out and found a lot of shelters of successful TikToks sent them our way, that was helpful.

Um so that's an idea.

Um, and then lastly, this is kind of a wild card, but rental housing restrictions.

Um we know that the inability to have, especially a large dog is one of the greatest um one of the one of the biggest reasons animals are surrendered.

We don't know exactly how many animals come to us as strays or strays, put it that way.

Um it is hard, I think, to imagine a change that would have um like a single change that would have a bigger impact on shelters than getting that changed to ensure that large dogs can be, you know, there isn't can't be a ban on large dogs or certain types of breed.

That is just I think it's a huge reason why shelters are so full of pit bulls and shepherds um and huskies.

Um so this group is a powerhouse for advocacy.

You all have you know tremendous experience in a lot of these different areas, so just throwing that out there, that's a huge project.

But I think if any group could get it done, it would be this one.

So just something to something to chew on.

And I'm pausing everybody, time check.

It is 728.

Uh unless we vote to extend the meeting, which we don't have too many more things, so obviously hopefully not be an hour.

Uh we cannot discuss anything really further unless there's a motion to extend the meeting.

Is there such a motion?

I'll make the motion to extend up to an hour because we can't go any more than that, and hopefully a whole lot less.

Second, very good.

Uh aye.

Anyone opposed?

Any abstentions?

Is that was that an actual opposition or no?

We do have vote call, please.

Roll call.

Commissioners, please unmute your microphones.

Commissioner Treat?

Aye, Commissioner Verga.

Hi, Commissioner Hayes.

Hi.

Commissioner Bardigan.

Hi.

Commissioner Bell.

Commissioner Benedict.

Aye.

Vice Chair Bagley.

Commissioner Christie.

Hi.

Commissioner Asquith.

Aye.

Commissioner Fiw.

Aye, Commissioner Morris.

Uh stay.

You may.

Commissioner Garcia.

Chair McDole.

Aye.

Motion passes.

Thank you.

All right.

Uh comments uh for Ryan.

Uh Commissioner Treat.

Yes.

Um good report, Ryan.

Uh, question had you thought of maybe even doing some kind of uh uh partnership with the veterinarians in the area about some of the foster ideas.

I mean, if someone comes in with a boxer and they know that there's also a boxer that could be fostered or that kind of thing, um, we might be able to collectively get a list of those make calls and find out a list of of uh veterinarians who would post, you know, on their own bulletin boards also.

Um, but it's a place where people go with their animals.

So just a thought.

Yeah, I wonder if um it might it I imagine it'd be fairly labor intensive, you know, even for you all to if it was like a specific animal, but I think you know, advertising some key shelter, you know, initiatives like fostering in general, um, could be a really good idea.

Commissioner Marragon.

Um point of clarification.

This is only comments to his report.

Correct.

Oh, then just thank you.

Uh I feel a little bit heard um on the social media.

It's exciting to hear you guys are pursuing funds, so I appreciate that.

Commissioner Bagley.

Yes, um, I just had a question regarding return to owner here.

It's 171 dogs.

I had a question whether those were returned from the shelter or out in the field.

It looks when I add the them up, it looks like it may be from the shelter.

Um saying the number the animal animals that got back to their owner like over the counter from the shelter to the owner as opposed to in the field or turn to the owner.

Yes, it would be it would be from the shelter.

From the shelter.

Is there a way you can break down whether that was the first time they were redeemed or uh second and more?

Not right now.

I mean, maybe the next report.

That would be amazing.

I wish I could.

Uh I don't know if there's a way to do that in a like obviously there's a way to do it for individual animals.

I don't know if there's a way to like, for example, take that bar graph and chunk it up into multiple returns, yeah.

If you said, hey, the first it was a first time returned owner, a hundred.

And 71, they they've been returned a couple times.

That's what I'm I'm questioning.

I will ask our uh chameleon specialist.

He's he's a genius, so if anyone could figure it out, he could.

I know who that is.

Okay.

And then I had just had one other comment, Ryan.

Um, I talked to a rescue who's been around for a while, and she mentioned that she doesn't pull from Front Street, and I asked her why, and she said, because they don't offer adoptable animals, only medical and temperament.

And so I'm just wondering because the the local shelter she does pull from, they mix them.

There's certain adoptable animals that don't have those requirements, special training and all the medical needs.

Yeah, you know, I'm I'm still getting familiar with with that process, um, stepping in from my role into the shelter operations as well as the shelter management.

So that's these are all there's there's a lot of things that are kind of up in the air as far as protocol.

We actually just met today, discovering that there's a lot of confusion around different subjects, so that's why the rescue procedure development is super high up on the list.

Um so I should be able to give a better response or an overview to that at some point.

Okay, and then my last question is I know you've been very busy with these additional duties.

I can only imagine, but were we gonna receive a poll or a questionnaire as to what we felt our priorities were for the follow-up log?

Because I know it was referred to in the follow-up log quite a bit this month.

Yeah, so um in so I emailed um the chair and yourself uh kind of giving that heads up about upcoming agendas.

Yes, um, and I believe one of the items for next month was potentially um having the poll um where we would uh where we would basically what we've been discussing where everyone could live here basically select their top priorities as far as agenda items or follow-up log items.

Okay, but we'll collaborate.

Uh we'll I'll I'll email both of you with uh maybe maybe there's been an update with what we have in mind for May agenda in June.

We're trying to stay two to three months ahead um to kind of stay ahead of of the deadlines um for submitting agendas and whatnot at um staff reports, so um we can we can talk about that.

But yeah, that's still I think I think that's still really important item, so I know where the group as a whole stands as far as what your priority arts are.

Okay, Commissioner Benedict.

Thank you.

Um Ryan, thank you.

I want to say thank you first.

I'm finally on the rescue list for Front Street, so thank you.

Um I do notice though that it is pretty short, you know.

So yeah, I mean when I'm scrolling through um other rescue lists, especially especially Bradshaw, you know, my thumb gets tired.

So it'd be nice to see some more adaptable dogs because some of the rescues won't pull the um, you know, they won't pull the behaviorally challenging dogs.

They're just, you know, they they just won't be able to do that.

Um, so I just a suggestion.

And um really like your idea about going into schools.

I've been wanting to do that since I applied for this position.

Um, but the rental thing.

This has been my pet peeve for so long, and it's another reason I see so much on the apps on the various apps, Facebook and next door, people not re-homing their dog because they can't take them with them.

So, do you have any recommendations as to how we can get that fire started?

Honestly, I think many of you are the experts on this topic that have worked in you know um legislation and lobbying, and um I would I would defer to the group on that.

Yeah, it's really one has any thoughts, but I was gonna that is a huge undertaking and probably getting like a bill going and passing a law to you'd have a lot, that'd be a huge fight against all of the housing.

I just in my brain, when you said that, I'm like, oh my god, so much opposition, like so but but I that's like my perfect world.

Like it it's a huge pet peeve of mine.

Those are just when I think politically huge players in the in the legislative process.

Um, I mean, there's different ways to get it.

Yeah, yeah, there's different ways.

Sorry, no crossing uh okay.

Well, I suppose we could um maybe just have a discussion outside of the commission meeting and talk about that one.

So I realize that's a big bite.

I don't know if it would be a local ordinance or a if a you know a whole state ordinance or what that would look like.

But I agree with you, it would do the most good, you know.

So thank you.

Commissioner Christie.

Thanks, Ryan.

Um, I just wanted to give some additional underlining under the bottle baby foster recruitment urgency.

So I I don't foster bottle babies because I work a little more than full time and it doesn't work for my schedule, unfortunately.

Um, and I know that the the demographic that can you know take care of those babies is small, but the email that came out from the foster coordinator, and I so appreciate like the clear proactive communication from them.

So I just want to appreciate that.

Um, but they said they had two available bottle baby fosters at the moment.

We are like any cat people know this is the worst scenario because I'm sure those two bottle baby fosters got full by today.

And you know, when we talk about euthanasia transparency and like what kinds of demographics of animals we can help avoid euthanasia, the bottle babies are a hard one to help because it's foster-based, but it is kind of a group we might be able to reach if we build capacity in that area.

Um, so I'm I'm really concerned that like a month from now we'll have a lot of public comment of people drawing attention to like really high cat euthanasia, and it'll have been those euthanized bottle babies.

And you know, they're not I know they they may be actually treatable and able to be cared for, but the shelter could classify them as untreatable if the resources don't exist at the shelter to provide treatment for them, and it's not humane to let them languish in the shelter overnight without care.

So I just want to really draw attention to that population.

Um they demand a lot of resources, but they are gonna flood the shelter like any day now.

So Commissioner Hayes.

Um, yeah, I think one of the things that stood out to me a lot from what you gave updates on and your sort of ideas is a new shelter, that's gonna be a long road.

Um but I think one of the things I've thought about, and I've talked with other commissioners on parks and recreation is and this would be a conversation for council and mayor and and staff of that nature, but a bond measure has always been something that I've thought about.

Um, and I'm sure it's probably something that we've all thought about.

But a bond measure, people are like, you know, we loop it in with the parks people and their bond initiative on the ballot, and some of their money from that comes to a new shelter.

Um, but and then that's you know uh you'd have a you know a um an avenue there.

Um, but I I'd love to be involved in those conversations um going forward.

Commissioner Burga.

Uh thanks, Ryan, for your report.

Um, a couple questions uh regarding the um company that you hired for the SOPs.

Are you able to tell us who that is?

I think I'm still unable to because the contracts are still this contract is still under negotiation.

Okay, so you you haven't started working with them.

Okay, so you you haven't started working with them, you're just in the selection process kind of still.

Well, it's it's figuring out um basically how we can coming to an agreement of what will be done with the budget that we have.

So we did have a meeting this week and we introduced some of our high priority items and um uh you know our some of our, I should say a big list of things that we'd like to do, and we're so we're working with them to pare that down to what we think we can accomplish uh with the budget that we have based on also what I'm doing now, which is gathering everything that we already have from all of our different sections to see how much work there is still to be done.

Gotcha.

So if I'm understanding what you're saying, is you're just trying to get a a better number from them based on you know what you can afford for them to do in terms of creating the standard operating procedures.

Right.

We have a 75,000 dollar budget, so we're figuring out what can you do for 75,000.

Gotcha.

Yeah.

Um I'm just wondering if they're if you're addressing what the law is regarding intake of stray animals in that context.

Well, the good thing about um this agency is there's there's uh they work with many different government agencies on different they sort of they call it I think uh what is it?

I guess a city council and a they they have ac experts from a lot of different areas, and we'll be working with um several folks who are very experienced in sheltering, um who've worked with hundreds of shelters.

Um they're in California here, so I'm confident that they will be able to advise on on the laws.

Because I would like to make a recommendation in that regard, in that we do have someone on our commission who is very knowledgeable about um California state law as it pertains to shelters and the requirements to take stray animals in uh in uh Hillary Bagley Friend Zoya, and I don't know if that's anything that's a possibility to bring her into that conversation or she'd be agreeable to that.

Well, I think one of the one of the requirements that we put out for the vendors is to come to the commission and and discuss the items.

So likely what we probably won't there's probably a lot of policies you're not you know super interested in, like uh personal protective equipment, although it's a very important policy that we need to have.

Um but oh okay, you do have um but uh you know if if we have them for the evening and we have you know they're the top ones we'd like to discuss, I think that should be a possibility.

Okay, great.

Yeah, and then cats.

So I know I sent you an email a couple weeks ago because I I usually pop into the shelter once a week and the cat kennels remain on pretty much vacant.

And I get calls all the time.

That's why I have two mama cats, well, two cats now that have had kittens.

They were pregnant and now they've had kittens.

And uh I I'm just wondering why those kennels are vacant, and there hasn't been some effort to allow more in as required in my opinion per law.

Well, speaking of of the law, you you're all aware the city um is um is under threat of litigation, so I have been advised by um city attorney's office that it I shouldn't speak on certain topics related to that litigation until it's resolved.

So cat intake, that that would be one of those topics.

Um I'd just like to point out I think it's just very um upsetting to see our shelter empty um and so many cats and kittens that are needing help and they're not allowed to, you know, you're not accepting them.

But what I would like to point out is Denise, thank you for helping all the cats and kittens that you're been helping.

And I think if anybody is, I will just say this about the the mama cats that have had kittens.

It's it's really an easy foster in a lot of ways.

And you know, if you get a big pin, which I have rescues that I work with that that will help you get the large dog pin, and then you can put a a smaller kennel inside that for the mama cat and her babies and a litter box and their food, and they're quiet and they don't cause any trouble and they they're they're quite lovely actually to watch and take care of.

So if anybody um can help, it's greatly needed right now, and they're not as hard as bottle babies at all.

Commissioner Asquith.

Thank you for the report.

Appreciate it.

Uh good information.

Real quick, just uh heads up that a Best Friends Animal Society has worked on a national or a statewide level as far as the rental issue and and legislation because they do um they if anybody is you know looking at making that contact.

And then um I know that Sack County way back in the day, um, they did float their bond for their shelters, so there was some of that way back.

And um quick question Do we know how many rescues we're currently working with?

I know a lot of schools send out newsletters and that kind of thing um I also don't know if this is like a possibility but I know some of my friends used to get volunteer hours from posturing and I think that's a really great way to get parents more on board with having pets come home.

Very good yeah yeah no no one is better and no one's a better salesman than it than a kid that knows how to nag so I think that might be our in good suggestion Commissioner Bell.

Yeah one of the things that I've tried to many years is something that um commissioner also brought up with taking in pregnant cats and I understand that because there is a straight hole that has to be observed that there's the risk that the cat can deliver at the shelter which is highly stressful.

But I just wish that there was some place to put them which I know is like we have no place to put them but try to figure out something as far as getting those cats in so that they don't deliver um but Commissioner Virgo's right moms and babies are really easy to um take care of as long as the moms are friendly.

Now for myself I do feral moms and babies so I have um four feral moms right now with litters and one friendly so um yeah but it's it's so much nicer than both can I ask your opinion um because this come up for me with um feral moms with babies they are okay with being contained and doesn't they still take care of their because I've done this for a while I can I try to judge their behavior if I see that they're starting to get too stressed or if they've injured their kittens in any way shape or form and get them uh neuter a spade or neuter or spade and return back to the field.

I've had pretty good success actually last year I had a friendly mom who injured her kittens much more than what the feral moms did um which was interesting but um you know I had a lot of I had some panluke at my house and I think that was part of what was going on with that friendly mom because her kittens were part of that um but yeah the feral moms do at times shut down um but like I say I just kind of keep an eye on them and like I say because I've had I've done this for so long not intentionally many times yeah it's you know mama cats that deliver their kittens in a trap so you know and then what do you do?

Right because that's that is a concern I've heard is like concerns that taking in a feral mom like maybe she wouldn't take care of her kittens and then the kittens have a worse possibly a worse outcome.

A lot of times it depends on the age of the mama cat also um you know the older feral moms do a better job some of the younger ones are are um more scared so anyway that's um that would be my wish to be able to get those mamas in and I've got two very very pregnant cats in my garage right now that are going to the clinic tomorrow we hope they make it job commissioner morse uh I just wanted to share kind of related to the potential for a new shelter and the campaign and whatever um uh counts Commissioner Verga you and maybe Commissioner Hayes might want to meet with council member plucky bomb in fact there was some work done a year ago on um a bond including um efforts to do a community survey um and uh I learned about this survey because the chief veterinarian at Bradshaw Dr.

Uh there has uh uh our past chair Hefner was actually mostly involved in that.

Um I think about $35,000 was basically donated to get us into that survey uh by the firm that conducted the survey.

So you might follow up with council member pluckybom because I have an impression that he was sort of involved with decisions.

A little bit of what I learned through that effort was the different kinds of bonds, and people can correct me, but there are a particular type of bond that would be put forward by the city council, which would require like 50% vote.

Uh, and then there's a different type of bond that maybe member treat can clarify a different type of bond that comes from the community but requires 75, or maybe it's the reverse.

The community one requires 50 percent vote, and that if the city council puts it forward, it's a 75% of the voting populace who has to vote for it.

So there was some discussions about trying to go for a citywide bond for a 50% vote, but the idea of polling because you have to collect signatures and the estimates were the point of order.

We're on the monthly report.

Yeah, that it's sort of coming back to the bond and the discussion, and to say that uh you know there was some discussion about that, so you might follow up possibly with uh council member fluckybaum, half a million dollars approximately to collect signatures.

Commissioner Benedict.

Thank you.

Um I just had a question.

I did notice that we did go to the shelter.

I've been there a few few times in the past month, and I did notice that um the cat the cats area was there was only four cats there.

Um, once there was three, once there was four.

Um so I I'm wondering if is there a um do you is there a policy or some sort of procedure for uh intaking cats and is there a way that we can take in enough cats so that we at least fill the capacity that we have there in the shelter so we can um have more available cats for adoption and get more cats off the streets, maybe.

So this is this is a topic that I would love to discuss, but for reasons I mentioned I'm not able to at this time.

Thank you.

Commissioner Christie Super quick.

I just want to say to Denise that I think that our pregnant cats that are contacting Front Street should be returned to field cats and just spayed and with no stray hold.

And if that's not something Front Street can do, we need an underground volunteer army that can field those calls and get those cats in.

And if that's something that we can do and actually make somewhat of a dent in the kitten armies that are coming, that would be great.

And Commissioner Bell.

Yeah, I was actually I was actually contacted by one of the shelter staff a while back who brought somebody brought in a very pregnant cat, and they contacted me asking me if I had appointments, and I just so happened to have and was able to take the cat and get it taken care of.

I did have one question for you regarding the statistics.

Uh there's a 111 dogs confiscated last month.

Is that normal?

It's not one I haven't normally really watched before.

And I was like, wow, that seems excessive, but is it uh that could potentially be to be due to um homeless encampment sweeps?

That's possible.

Um we'd have to look uh if you go if you change date from March to February, January, so you can like look through the months and see if there's a uh but I I don't pay a super close attention to that number uh because that's kind of field services for the most part, but um yeah, I'm not sure if that's the the average, but yeah, I hadn't really noticed paid attention to it before until I was like, Well, that's a lot.

Yeah, yeah, it is a lot of animals for sure.

All right.

Well, thank you for the report.

Um, quickly, just for the record, there's no public comment for this.

Oh, no, I didn't receive any speaker subs for this item.

I did ask at the beginning.

Did yeah, I was on it.

Don't don't expect that all the time though.

All right, moving on.

Commissioner comments, ideas, and questions.

So anyone who has suggestions or things that they want to discuss or and or put on a follow-up blog for future.

Uh, first up, Commissioner Bagley.

I just wanted to invite commissioners who have not undergone training and cruelty before now.

I'll be training Front Street Field Services and others on April 29th.

It's not held at the shelter.

It'll be held off facility.

That's all.

Thank you.

Commissioner Barragon.

I will try to be very quick quick, but I want to uh pass out this is a follow-up to the conversation I had with you, Ryan, um, about uh utilizing Facebook ads as a way to increase adoptions and so it's great to hear that you're already pursuing some funds there, but I did kind of memorialize some ideas as I said I would as well as some links and some studies that I think would be helpful for the whole commission to uh be exposed to.

So I'll pass that out and then I'll put a copy up front over there so you guys can have that um record.

Um and I'll say one thing when I'm or actually if you just want to press this down, I'd be like, um with that said, I don't know if I could do a motion to add to the follow-up log a request for a discussion item proposing a pilot Facebook advertising program to expand awareness of adoptable animals and to increase the utilization of animal services, uh existing animal services within the shelter.

Um I am proposing just a very small stipend allocated, but um there is a lot of data as well as a study that is cited in there from the University of North Carolina um that says that Facebook shares and Facebook advertising are really efficacious way to increase the amount of animals that are adopted and recognizing that that might be a matter of having the resources disposable because you're pursuing that.

Hopefully the request um and the discussion gives you a mandate to be able to secure and allocate those funds because you know, with just 250 dollars dedicated um a month, even just to highlight some of those adoptable animals you can reach underserved communities that might be engaging Facebook, but also reach a much broader you know constituency within the city um and make sure that they're hearing about these animals and hopefully save more lives.

So thank you.

So you don't need a motion to put on the log, but we can put on the log as a motionable item.

Perfect.

Thank you.

Commissioner Treat.

Uh real quickly, we do have someone who's to go to school tomorrow, so I don't want to take up too much time.

Um, but on the bottle feeding the baby kittens, right?

They need like 24 seven watching, right?

I'm wondering if we might consider talking to some of the senior citizen homes about bottle beating who are gonna be there all the time.

Is that not an idea that might be looked at?

I mean, they got nothing else to do, and they love little baby animals.

And they don't weigh a lot.

Yeah, just an idea.

Just and maybe we can talk about it further and just see if it might be some of those things that it's one avenue.

So Commissioner Morris.

Actually, okay.

Are you on are we on?

Um just a thought again with all the the ideas and and that Ryan has and some of the recommendations.

Would it be would it be beneficial to start some sort of a work plan like we had before so we know what members are working on what or what areas they're interested in, and then folks can join in with um someone they want to work on with something say um bottle babies or whatever um in a work plan.

We found that to work extremely well um prior.

Just an idea.

Great, uh, and certainly uh people can look at all the ideas that have been floated out today and to think of what you want to do and look at forming subcommittees or work groups for next month and enter them into the work plan because I don't think anyone would be ready to do it right now.

Um thank you.

Um so I wanted to bring up the idea of the ad hoc committee on large basically on large dog adoptions, which we uh received a report last November with that recommendations and today we've sunsetted that ad hoc committee, but again to chair McDoll's comment.

Most of the recommendations were not adopted or implemented, and um I'm gonna point out that uh Mr.

Hinderman had uh reservations about most of those recommendations.

Uh given that there are rec reservations, it would still be helpful to look at some of those things.

I see Hillary who was on the ad hoc committee nodding her head.

I think that some of these things could segue to the work that uh Commissioner Hayes is is heading up.

For example, uh updating some online pet biographies and the resource was rescue writer AI.

I don't know about rescue writer AI, but if we're gonna write things to help move animals on an at-risk list, is that something that you might use or investigate is rescue writer AI to do those sorts of things.

Um we did talk in the um ad hoc committee about putting pictures up as long-termers, et cetera.

So that's sort of a segue as well.

Um scheduled phone call follow-up was a topic that we had investigated, came out of some research on large dog adoptions, doing support for uh two days later, two weeks later, two months later, and then offering resources, so we would have to have the resources of behavioral issues or um temperament issues.

But some of these things are actually part of probably the reason why some of the dogs are not being adopted.

So I just uh am interested in working with a few people on a work group possibly to look at some of these ideas, potentially segue with the the other work group on at-risk dogs and see which ideas rise to the top.

Um I know several of us put in a fair amount of time on this ad hoc committee, and as um Chair McDowell pointed out, we didn't really lift any of those uh recommendations into real action, and I don't want to see that disappear.

And I know Mr.

Hinderman, you had some concerns, but I think it would be good for us to continue to talk about how to address those concerns.

So just putting that on the table, and I'll I'll reach out to Commissioner Hayes about some of these ideas that might segue into the other work.

Commissioner Benedict?

Um do you want to go to uh Mr.

Hinderman to respond?

I think he wants to respond, and you can circle back to me if you want.

Sure.

Oh sure, thanks for that.

Um yeah, I mean, I I think um so you know, we participated in that was a big like research project, right?

We got data.

I think that the data and the findings of of that committee were phenomenal.

And I know there was uh I think there's there's a lot of different places we can go.

And I was actually meant to bring that up as I had on my list, but I think it was in the wrong place.

Like, what are the next steps of the result of that data?

I think that uh the committee had kind of come up with um uh a few ideas um that I it's been a it's been a while.

I'd like to discuss it and revisit it for sure.

Um I think my concerns were potentially around having the staffing available to to do that.

Our group has grown quite a bit.

Um, and then also you know, concerns about um you know if that if staff time was dedicated to that, that I think I was concerned the impact might not justify the staff time being used for that as opposed to maybe other activities.

But now that we have this group, I think it would be great to have a discussion about it.

Would you like to see that as like a discussion amongst the group?

Or would you like to talk more independently with a smaller group?

Maybe a few conversations like maybe with the folks who are on the ad hoc committee.

That includes Commissioner Bagley and Garcia, I think, and yourself uh maybe bring in the chair on some of those ideas since you raised the recognition that they hadn't been implemented, um, and maybe we could get some ideas sort of fleshed out.

Um, and again, I we'd love to give some of these um things to segue with the at-risk dog discussion as well.

Yeah, um, so if that is something the folks are interested in, anybody else who wants to join in on a discussion is welcome to let me know.

Uh but yeah, if under a I'm seeing some nine, I'm seeing some nodding heads.

Um, so if that's all right, we can initiate that.

Thank you.

Commissioner Benedict.

Thank you.

Um I just kind of wanted to real quickly circle back to the final plea that was passed here.

I'm um moving forward at this time today.

Is there a way we can kind of get this started with your approval to come in and work with a couple of volunteers, a couple of us, um, and maybe put this on the follow-up log as you know, we come back with some recommendations or how you know how to make it better, um, how to soften the language or um whatever it might be.

Yeah, I think the next step um I'm kind of open to to different things, so I mean, we could um myself and staff could kind of take a look at what's been created and and maybe come back with hey, here's a version that that's you know, we feel balances the the concerns and and opportunities um and kind of have a you know either an email exchange about that, or we could we could we staff would be happy myself and our public information coordinator would be happy to meet with the committee um to talk about it in person.

Um sometimes an email is faster, but it's probably good to discuss.

Um yeah, we're eager to to get started.

Um there may be um there may be, you know, an iteration, but sort of uh a phasing of the the different sort of methodologies um that were discussed.

Social media is an easy one to get started quickly, and I think actually the um the language that was included um is is fairly close for us.

Um, we definitely need to take some time to look at it.

Um, but I would say that would probably be step one and also probably the highest impact.

So um I think we could get that started, let's say this month, halfway through the month.

Yeah, uh, you know, soon within the within the coming weeks.

Um yeah, so you guys let me know how you'd like to communicate about it.

We'll email you.

Thanks.

Commissioner Hayes.

Yeah, I'll just make this quick.

Um, I think y it would be best, you know, you you could review with your people and then come back to us, the committee, and then we can meet to discuss and go from there.

That'd probably be like next steps.

And the last item is public comments matter not on the agenda.

Uh we have two people to speak.

I have two speaker slips, but I believe Susan Falcon.

She's no longer here.

Um, dear good.

Um I wanted to pr uh provide the commission with the Friends 2025 list of accomplishments.

And to remind you that the big day of giving is coming up on May 7th.

Big day provides funding for a multitude of programs and services at the shelter.

So if you want any more information on Friends, they have a website.

It's Friends of Front Street.

And then I just also wanted to add about this whole conversation about cats and and spaying cats.

It's in the city code.

It's section nine point four four point four three oh.

The section that you just amended earlier today basically just outlined how many animals of the different categories you could keep.

Then there is a section, like there's a special section for dogs that says, you know, that they all have to be spayed and neutered and whatever exemptions and there's and nine point four four point four three oh tells you that all seven cats have to be altered, or there are some exceptions.

So it's there.

Thank you.

Thank you very much.

All right, and that is all of our speakers.

Very good.

That concludes today's agenda.

Thank you, everyone, for your particip participation.

The meeting is adjourned.