Hey, good morning, everybody.

It is the 10 30 a.m.

Urban and Economic Development Committee meeting.

I'm Councillor Bellis chairing this meeting.

First item on the agenda.

I call this meeting to order.

Second item on the agenda.

Scott Abjornsen reappointment to the HUD Community Development Committee.

Term expires June 30th, 2027.

Attended, hey.

2426 meetings for Tassel District 2.

If you want to come to the table, orver you see a seat.

Thanks so much for being with us today.

If you wouldn't mind telling us a bit about yourself and why you'd like to continue serving.

Well, so my name is Scottis Bjornsen.

I'm concerned citizen.

I have had the opportunity to serve during this first appointment and learn how the committee operates.

So I'm currently serving in that role.

And that's really why I'd like to continue serving.

That would be awkward if you didn't with the chair election.

Right.

It might be nice meeting next week, by the way.

No, that's uh I'm so glad you're down to continue serving.

Um is there, I know you just mentioned having gotten your feet under you from this first year serving.

Is there any kind of key kind of observations or things that you've learned or encountered during that time?

Well, the the thing that I learned most importantly is how this system operates a little bit.

Um it's very open to community involvement.

A lot of the direction of how the money is allocated is formed at meetings that city staff holds among residents, and they come to our meetings with kind of a list of feedback recommendations and a plan of how they believe the funds ought to be allocated.

Um, and you can see shifts in approach between previous administration and current administration.

Um in particular, they seem to have made a stronger emphasis on focusing spending and focusing it most importantly upon affordable housing and trying to improve that availability.

Any other comes or questions?

Thank you for serving.

Yeah, thank you so much for serving and your willingness to continue serving.

Uh this will we will be voting on your reappointment on our 5 p.m.

Um meeting on April 1st.

You are welcome to attend, but do not have to.

Thank you so much for spending time with us.

We really appreciate it.

Thank you.

I appreciate it.

Thank you.

All right, so you're going to see us.

Agenda item three, Steve Mitchell, reappointment to the Tulsa Development Authority.

Term expires July 31st, 2028.

Had attended seven of 15 meetings from Council District 4.

All right.

Okay, I'm the CEO and owner of Organized Private Equity here in town.

We buy uh and sell uh privately owned companies that are manufacturing industrial in mostly Middle America.

We do happen to own I think six companies in around the Tulsa area.

We've been a 30-mile radius of here, we're probably going six or seven hundred people in that.

Um so we know the finger, we kind of have our finger on the pulse of uh I think uh the economy and kind of what matters to local entrepreneurs and things like that.

Am I here for TDA or TAEO TV?

T D A T A T.

Good question though.

Sorry.

Yeah, for anybody either.

We're a subset of one.

Yes, yeah.

And then why the TDA?

I've been on TA for a while.

Um, you know, I moved back to Tulsa in 19 in 2005 from Los Angeles.

I grew up here and went to Memorial High School.

I was disappointed to see that North Tulsa had not progressed at the same level that most of the rest of the Tulsa had.

And so that was important to me to try and make the difference there.

A lot of the kids I grew up with were bust over from North Tulsa into Memorial at that time.

I don't think we do that much anymore.

Uh so I've taken a keen interest in working on that at the time when I came on the TDA.

Most of the downtown stuff was kind of on on its way, and so we were hoping to hop over 244.

I think we did a really good job, and I spearheaded the effort to get Kirkpatrick Heights back within the city's purview and outside of the UCAP situation, which some people may like for doing not, but I think it is a good thing.

Uh it has been surprisingly slow to change, and so my goal was to kind of have see that develop and something that could be a big big rock in a pond that could create some great ripples from the development standpoint.

Um I would have thought that would be over by now, but that's not over by now.

And so uh I hope the city council is also supportive of that over the long term.

Tons of land down there, tons of development down there.

We have two businesses in North Massa.

You know, they're both thriving.

There's no reason they can't be 50 more businesses down there.

Any follow-up questions?

Or thank you for saying thank you.

Um thank you, Steve.

Go chargers.

Oh my gosh.

Well, high school territorialism.

Okay.

Well, we will also be voting on your reappointment on April 1st at the 5 p.m.

meeting.

You were welcome to attend, but do not have to.

Thank you so much for your time.

Yeah, I would throw in a if I can.

Data centers, I mean we have low power, lots of power, lots of water, lots of land, and they pay lots of real estate tax that pays for lots of good schools.

Don't be scared of that sick.

Oh, I don't think we are.

Thank you.

Okay, well, now I'll comment on your attendance though since we did that.

50%.

All right.

Yeah.

Um, all right, we are on item number four, rezoning application Z7848 from CS to RM2 for property located west of the southwest corner of Charles Page Boulevard and South 49th West Avenue, requested by Matthew Ward, property owner MKW properties LLC.

Uh this is in Council District 4, TVC voted 80 to recommend approval of RM2 zoning.

And we have Susan Miller with the planning office.

Hi, good morning.

Um, so this is uh so this is pretty straightforward currently zoned CS.

This is out on Charles Peach Boulevard at West.

Um currently there are there are two homes that are intended to stay.

Um there's two lots, two homes.

Uh they have been remodeled.

The the request is really just a rezone to RM2 because sometimes financial institutions have had take issue um with lending money.

If the property is zoned commercial, they want to make sure because it is not by ride in commercial, so they want to make sure that the that the zoning is correct on the property.

Um, so it's really that's the reason for their request.

Just to make sure that they have residential zoning on their residential property.

Yeah, counseling goals.

We're sitting there now.

Two homes that have just recently been remodeled.

Oh, okay.

Okay.

So those are intended to stay.

Okay.

That makes sense.

Yep.

All right.

Any other questions on that one?

That's a good question.

All right.

Thank you.

That was home.

All right, we are on uh oh, I forgot to mention, but I'll just let you all know right now.

We're gonna be doing item 15 before item 14, just because we know 14 might take a little bit longer, just so 15's the um the uh review with about the domestic violence task force.

So we're just gonna do that one prior to 14, which is not downtown commission, just to make sure we get that up front.

Okay, we are on agenda item five ordinance amending the fiscal year 2025-2026 budget to make supplemental appropriations of 10,000 dollars, recognized from grant revenues to your seed from International Association of Chiefs of the Police, IACP within the victim services technical assistant program subfund, setup of two victim interview rooms.

We have Jared more with us from finance.

Yes, thank you.

And actually, you've done my full job there.

That's uh this is a grant award to the police department, uh 10,000 dollars, and uh it will be used to uh create uh soft interview rooms for victims uh at the police department.

Is it out a specific site or um sure where the site was listed?

I mean it's listed, but I don't think it's in front of me.

No, I apologize on that.

Yeah, Councillor Gilbert.

Yeah, I I was gonna ask the same question if this is gonna be set up in the um uh public safety center.

That well, the public safety center that we're moving into, or if it's going to be at the uh headquarters.

So are we spending the 10,000 dollars now on the side of the co-located with our same setup?

I just not at the uh public safety center, probably an existing site.

We have someone checking on it.

It's not or the family safety center.

That I don't want to.

We will see someone's checking or yeah, we're checking and we've got several budget items, so we can always go back to that answer before Jared leaves the table.

Are there any other inquiries on this one before you go to answer on that soon?

Thanks for looking into it.

Mysterious person looking into it.

Okay, all right.

Um we're on agenda item six ordinance amending the fiscal year 2025-2026 budget to make supplemental appropriations of $50,000 recognized from the unappropriated fund balance within the PD equitable sharing justice subfund for department training.

Yeah, this is uh appropriating $50,000 from fund balance from the equitable sharing fund to the police department, and it will be used for uh training uh the travel conferences such as the uh major cities chiefs association conference.

Okay.

Any follow-up?

All right, we are on agenda item seven, ordinance amending the fiscal year 2526 budget to transfer unencumbered and unexpended appropriations of 146,511 between account groups within the sexual assault kit initiative subfund.

So this is uh transferring dollars uh within that uh grant project.

Um we're just moving some um from their other services and to uh personal services to pay for additional overtime worth the kids.

Is this oh go ahead?

Um questions.

Um well I was wondering if we could go back to six.

Oh, yeah.

Sorry.

Yeah.

Um so the fifty thousand dollars transfer uh from supplemental appropriations uh for the you said it's for the um chiefs conference.

Uh that is one of the identified uses, yes.

Oh, okay.

Suspect they're spending all 50,000 on that one conference.

Well, I was gonna say that's a expensive conference.

No, I I think it'll be used for uh various training and conferences to a transfer of it.

It's money that's uh sitting there for cash reserve and appropriate.

Right, but you just mentioned one conference, and so that's my ears perked up.

I was like, okay, that's so conference.

That was a good one.

I want to go to that one.

Yeah, just sounds like a really lovely.

I'm sure it's an aspen.

Um back to agenda item seven.

I'll just try to imagine what conference costs that much.

Um agenda item seven.

For those kits, is this related to the kit backlog, or do we know if this is retroactive like that or more proactively going forward?

It's okay if you don't.

Yeah.

Let me ask you these detailed department specific questions.

Sorry, this is really in the weeds.

Um we'll find out.

Um, that's more of a curiosity than a need to know for obviously.

No, I mean, it it's a good question, especially with all the um focus on trying to catch up on the floor.

I suspect it is for the backlogs if they'll find like you know, financial uh opportunities or savings to move money around.

They do traditionally put it towards overtime to work down the log.

Okay, that makes it caught up.

Okay.

Um any other questions on that one?

All right, we are on agenda item eight.

Ordinance amending the fiscal year 2526 budget to transfer available appropriations of $82,567 between projects and account groups within the American Rescue Plan Act Subfund, municipal courts, community outreach mental health initiatives, organizational development and facility improvements.

I do have a safety net one on this one if you have uh detailed questions to grant managers behind me.

But this is essentially as we're approaching the ARPA deadline uh for the overall program.

Uh we're moving money around so that they can be sure to spend all the dollars, and so uh municipal courses identify needs in each of these areas where they would be able to spend down that remaining balance.

So we're trying to put it where it's most effective there.

Yeah, um what where it says the facility improvements part, which is it just within the current courts building?

That's what we're which I know is in great issue.

They had they had I don't know what the specific one is, but it was like signs and TV screens and things that could move um if they needed to go somewhere else.

Oh okay.

Okay, that that's good to know.

Yeah, I'm I just want to know what the organizational development personal services 63,000 is for just staffing.

Oh, just staff just per staffing.

Staffing that already exists.

They had about I think eleven approximately that many positions that were some in some like tied to the various programs that are either on ARPA or CRF and those are the cover on the yeah, those are the same positions that you've moved some of them onto the general fund and you've been program evaluating, and so it's just those positions, so it lets their CRF dollars last longer if you put some of these on ARPA.

And watching ARPA just slowly disappear is sad.

Um has to disappear by disaster.

I know it has to, but it's just knowing that every time we see these, these are the last of it.

It's a lot to see what we got to do with it and watch all of it wind down or get carried on or not.

Yeah, a lot of good with it.

We did.

Um, we are on agenda item nine.

Ordinance amending the fiscal year 2526 budget to make supplemental appropriations of 41,010, recognized from available fund balance and transfer available appropriations of $18,646.49 cents between departments and account groups within the social and economic development non-federal grant fund, animal shelter donations.

This is kind of a two-part piece.

Um about 41,000 of it is just appropriating uh donations that uh animal shelter has received throughout the year.

We do this periodically as needs arise.

That's when they request a budget action and we'll pull it forward for this.

So they'll use that uh they'll use all of these funds for food, medicine, uh, medical equipment, etc.

The second half of it, that 18,000 that you see um being taken from planning and neighborhoods and moved to animal services is just a product of the uh reorganization that happened in FY26.

This is to fix workflow so that department uh planning neighborhood people aren't having to approach the basis for animal shelter staff.

All right, and follow-up.

Okay.

Um we are on agenda item 10.

Ordinance amending the fiscal year 2526 budget to make supplemental appropriations of 110,000 dollars, 20,000 recognized from grant revenues to be received from Oklahoma Department of Commerce and a grant match of $90,000 transferred to be received from the Culture Recreation Non-Federal Grant Subfund and to transfer unencovered and unexpended appropriation balances of $90,000 between departments and account groups within the 2014 sales tax fund.

Yes, this is a uh grant award from the state commerce.

It's uh Oklahoma Route 66 revitalization grant.

It's for a musical road.

That sounds exciting.

Um did they start construction like today or yesterday?

We're supposed to have a room that can be used to start.

Okay.

And the grant award itself is 90,000, and uh we're moving another 20,000 from that IoT one project, the corridor and small area plan, because the uh total project is 100,000 plus some contingency as uh unforeseen events might happen.

So we'll put the funding in place so that they can uh finalize that road.

That's exciting.

And then do we know like does this include maintenance dollars for the because maybe the company does that we don't do anything?

Well, we got let's not get ahead of ourselves.

So I don't think it includes any maintenance funds and the very limited knowledge I have about musical roads, which is next to none, but I don't think uh you maintain them the same as a road and they eventually just wear out.

But you know you're gonna be traveling up and down that road.

Yeah, this is about three to four year line.

Okay, so we're not trying to maintain a musical road in perpetuity here.

Okay, all right.

They eventually just get quieter and quieter.

Facet okay.

Well, I'm glad there's built-in obsolescence for the um we are on agenda item 11 ordinance amending the fiscal year 2526 budget to make supplemental appropriations of five thousand three hundred and ninety dollars, recognized from grant revenues to be received from the Oklahoma Department of Homeland Security within the Homeland Security Program Subfund.

Okay DHS boat trailers.

That was a journey.

This is uh it's uh it's a grant for three boats in a pragmatic sense, it's replacing three boats that the fire department had total when they were responding to uh North Carolina during Helene, and so these are they're getting restored to uh replace those boats and trailers like they used.

Okay, well, that's a pretty reasonable cost.

Sorry, it reminded me of a Craig was sad.

I apply it's gonna be really hard not to ask you to share that right now.

I apologize.

I think Councillor Bengal had something you wanted to add.

Um we'll come back to that if there's time.

This feels also important.

Um agenda item 12 ordinance amending the fiscal year 2526 budget to make supplemental appropriations of 22,532 dollars recognized from grant revenues to be received from the Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation with the Internet Crimes Against Children Subfund Cyber Crimes Unit.

This is a grant award from the OSBI to the police department.

Um it will is a uh pass through of funds and will be used for uh reimbursement of authorized expenses from the uh cyber crimes that will be used for equipment and training on that move.

All right, any thought questions there?

Okay, we are on agenda item 13 ordinance amending the fiscal year 2526 budget to transfer unencumbered and unexpended appropriations of 196,160.19 cents between departments within the 2025 Vision Capital Fund, Route 66 improvements.

This is uh kind of similar to the animal welfare one, uh administrative in nature.

Uh the funds were tied up at the time that we were doing all the reorganization of funds, and now we can actually move them.

They're not tied up in contracts, or we're simply moving the existing dollars from uh the planning and neighborhoods department to the parks and recreation department, which now have houses all of our engineers.

So again, it's to accommodate invoice approvals and workflow.

Okay.

Any other questions?

Yeah, Council Megal.

Why does it say Route 66 improvements?

Well, that's what the uh the project was obligated towards.

Is that old uh Tulsa County Vision uh money?

And these are the project appropriations to planning in neighborhoods, and so we're just a different department is overseeing those funds now.

Okay.

But the the scope and intent of the dollars is not changing.

Okay.

Just different managers.

And I was just gonna check back on item um should we can go back to item five, yes, five if we got any updates there.

Yeah, yeah.

Speaking to uh Park Warmer's house or deputy chief uh speaking to victim services unit supervisor, most of it, some of it will be used towards the family safety center.

Um most of it will be used for the current building, and about 90% of all of it will be transferable to state barn when when the move does go.

Okay, thank you.

That's really level.

All right.

Um, what about item seven?

Yeah, that was the no item five was about item five, sorry, I got back to item seven.

So we have an answer on that if it's for the backlog or backlog and elastic.

Oh, I think that's a different different division.

Okay.

We can hopefully get some security there soon.

All right, anything else with finance before you like to hear and be free from this too.

All right, thank you so much for thank you so much.

All right, we are on agenda item 15.

As mentioned, we're doing 15 before 14.

Agenda item 15 discussion and update with the public safety commissioner or her designee and Amalfi Parker Elder, director of the National Center on Systems Change and Advocacy regarding the current efforts and activities of the domestic violence task force.

This is brought to us by Councillor Doctorate.

And we have people coming up anywhere that can sit at the table.

There are some scenes up here.

Depending on how the image appeared, I was thinking I might point at things on the screen.

You can point it as a touch screen as a heads up.

I don't need to move it.

Okay, yeah.

Or if you touch it by accident, it will do things.

I might say next if you can move it for me.

Yeah, and you can have to keep on the yellow.

Oh, it's no problem.

I'm actually, and I you can go to the next slide.

We're just I'll start with some introductions, and I'm gonna let my colleagues introduce themselves while you're gonna be able to do that.

You might have to take down the mic.

Yeah, I'm sorry.

Yeah, we'll just pull it over.

Or we can let's do it.

That mess with the configuration.

Yeah, it was fine.

It's fine where it is.

She just can't stand by the mic.

So it's okay here.

Okay.

All right.

Thank you all so much for including us on your agenda today.

My name is Amalfi Parker Elder.

I'm with the Battered Women's Justice Project.

We go by BWJP, and I direct our National Center on Systems Change and Advocacy.

Um, I have been doing this work supporting communities, uh jurisdictions at the city and county levels around the country for over 10 years, almost 15 years now.

I started in the city of New Orleans, and we have been here working uh with Tulsa for the last two years.

So we're very excited to tell you about the great work that's been going on.

I'm just gonna pass it over to let my colleagues Rosario and Sujata introduce themselves to his lawficer and see for a minute here.

Uh okay, good morning.

Uh Rosario de la Torre and I'm Cananiu is you know the new person at this project.

Um the senior community and a decay ciliaison.

And my main role is to make sure that the voices of the survivors at the out of the center of any project that we do with the uh BWJP.

And I'm gonna let Sujet take the seat.

Yeah.

It's okay.

I'm gonna just have it.

You can you can sit over here.

Thank you.

You won't have to keep them.

There you go.

So thank you.

Do you want to just morning everybody?

Thank you for inviting us to share the work that has been uh conducted by BWJP for the last couple of years.

I'm Sujata Warrior, the chief strategy officer for BWJP, and I've been in that role in different roles for now 10 years.

And my job really is to develop the strategy for the organization since I've been working on the issue of gender-based violence now for over 50 years.

BWJP is the national legal resource center on gender-based violence for the name, and we've been in this from 1994 in different capacities.

It's actually organized by different centers.

Amalfi directs the Center on Systems Change and Advocacy.

We have six other centers the Center for Gun Violence in Family Relationships, Legal Approaches to Family Violence, the Center on Children and Domestic Violence, the Center on Criminalized Survivors, the Center on Global Rights for Women, and I think I got all of them.

Sometimes I forget them because sometimes the shifts occur.

And each center is devoted to really ensuring that the systems meet the needs of survivors at all levels so that the survivors are really able to create safety for themselves and their kids.

And I will transfer it back to Amalfi to have her share with you the work we are doing in Tulsa.

Thank you all.

If you can move to the next image for me, please.

And I know it's it's quite small, so I'm gonna talk us through this flow chart, but um the work has become quite expansive over the last two years, and as we keep expanding the initiative, folks are thinking there's so much going on, help us understand it all.

So we've created a bit of this flow chart, and it'll give you a sense of how this evolved over the last two years.

So it was really at the very end of 2023 that then Mayor Vynham had visited uh the domestic violence intervention services to learn about programming, and the CEO Tracy Leall really spent time explaining really this the pandemic of domestic violence and how great of an impact it is having for the state of Oklahoma, the county of Tulsa, and the city of Tulsa in particular.

Um and so he agreed at that time that this was a critical issue that needed to be addressed, and he instituted a domestic violence commission.

Now there is a slash for task force.

We're gonna do a little what we're gonna do a little bit of name changing, which I can explain for you all a little bit later.

Um but at the time um Mayor Vynam appointed representatives, primarily the heads of these agencies from these 11 agencies, the Department of Human Services, Divis, Family Safety Center, Justice Link, the Native Alliance Against Violence, which is a state level organization, still she rises, uh, the district attorney's office, uh, district court, public defender's office, the sheriff, and TPD.

Um, and so we are thrilled uh whenever we come in to support a community that already has that buy-in from top leadership.

It's essential.

Um an incredible team, um, particularly um the chief of police, uh, as I'm gonna share some of the initiatives that have been coming out of the work that we've done.

Um, and so we do.

We need their buy-in and support to make change happen on behalf of survivors, but we also know that we cannot really do this work and dig into the root of the gaps that survivors experience, the places where they need us to better coordinate and organize the most, without the people who are on the ground doing that work with survivors and in the community every day.

And so we requested that each of the commission representatives appoint somebody who's kind of on the ground doing the work for their agency to form a working group.

And so this kind of second section here is kind of the flow there from the top down.

And so that working group is really robust now.

There are um actually it I just updated this flowchart after submitting it to you all.

There's really 65 plus practitioners, advocates, service providers, community members.

When I say practitioners, I mean folks who work for our for the local systems here, police officers, prosecutors, uh, child welfare workers, etc.

Um, across 30 different organizations, and we continue to grow because a big part of this is doing community outreach to ensure that we are touching on and learning about all of survivors' experiences across Tulsa.

We don't want to limit ourselves and only be doing work that that serves or represents a small portion of survivors here.

So we continue to invite stakeholders into that working group.

If you all know of important folks who are touching survivors or even work with harmdoers in the city, that they should be linked into what we were what we are doing.

There is an open invitation to our domestic violence working group that just continues to grow and grow.

And so between these two groups, um, the first year of this work in 2024 when it commenced was really about goal setting, priority identification.

What do the folks currently at the table who do work around domestic violence in Tulsa feel are the biggest gaps and issues that if we address could really reduce domestic violence incidents and fatalities.

And then there are survivors who literally could change their mind about that preference at any given point, day to day in their experience that they're navigating.

So what we would what we are trying to do to support this initiative in Tulsa is to create as many of those pathways that are readily available and understanding of that need for flexibility and adaptability for survivors.

And so, really, the expertise that we just bring here to support the work of really the amazing service providers and practitioners you already have responding in Tulsa is to bring our approach to how we assess systemic responses and community responses.

I'm sure the chief can attest to it.

We spent a lot of time making sure TPD really understood that we have an approach that isn't looking at, you know, do people care or not care about survivors?

Are they doing good work or bad work?

We really get to the institutional organization of these structures and processes because that's usually where we can find a missing thing where we can make a shift and we can make change happen, and then it comes out from there.

And so if you scroll down here for the last part of the flowchart, um what we've now done because the working group is getting so expansive, and we only meet with that group quarterly.

We the task force and the working group meets quarterly every year, and so this week is our quarter one meeting for the task force and the working group.

Um we created three different subcommittees to do a little bit more focused intentional work.

And so the criminal legal system committee is currently primarily focused around the law enforcement and prosecution response, and through that work, um, one of the most exciting things that's happened in the last couple years is this really great initiative that TPD instituted to follow up.

It's it's a little technical.

I don't want to go too far into the weeds of it, but essentially there are many times where the suspect the officers have probable cause to make an arrest, but the suspect uh they have probable cause to arrest is no longer there.

They fled the scene before officers could arrive.

And so many times across the country, those are the kind of cases that can tend to just sit somewhere because you have active cases that need to get responded to.

Um, but those can be some of the most dangerous cases for survivors when that suspect right is somebody who's at who's trying to evade right accountability.

And so TPD first started with an uh just a temporary trial period of assigning two patrol officers to the DV unit to just be responsible for working that list of gone-on arrival cases within within Oklahoma, they have 72 hours to make an arrest without needing to get a warrant from a judge.

And uh what resulted was kind of truly incredible for the work that we see that those two officers were able to make, I think it I think by the end of the trial period, it was just over a hundred safe apprehensions, meaning the officers reached out to suspects to family neighbors, were able to safely find ways to meet up with that suspect, do the interview, conclude the investigation, and make a safe arrest.

And uh, even more incredible to me were that they collected a number of firearms safely in that process as well.

You had a question.

Yeah, what was the trial period?

I I think you ran the trial for two or three months, Chief.

Yes, and then it became permanent.

Yes.

We never stopped the trial.

Yes.

That's right.

And so it is so it's permanent now, and I that's a better way to say it, that it really rolled right into them creating two permanent positions within the DV unit.

Um, and from we held four listening sessions with 32 survivors in Tulsa in 2024, and two of the things that really stood out to us were one survivors who really do want that law enforcement response, but were feeling frustrated because the law is really restrictive on on what the bar is before an officer really can make an arrest.

And also, and many within that, many survivors kind of talking about how their partners would taunt them, you know.

Well, we'll just run away before they get here if you call them.

And as soon as they leave, we're coming right back, you know, and they would use that.

So this initiative that TPD instituted that is continuing to be very successful, is really going right to the heart of survivors saying this is something missing, and TBD responded.

That's the kind of work that we really try to do in this process when we talk about centering survivors.

What are they really telling us they need, and how can we maneuver our our systems and our community partners to do that?

And so the second way that we're doing that, and jumping over to our community response protocol committee, um, survivors said we know that there are lots and lots of services in Tulsa, they're very difficult to access.

We get a list of phone numbers when people are like, oh, you need a referral.

Here's a resource directory, and then we have to call and call and call, leave voice messages, retell our story many times.

So this protocol, we're gonna start piloting it April 1st.

We're training our 10 initial partners on it this Friday.

Um, it's essentially a warm referral handoff process.

The the really good folks doing this work in Tulsa already do this.

They take the time to call someone for the survivor and make sure they get what they need.

Um, and this is really just institutionalizing really good practice so that we can try to have a really consistent mechanism across providers in Tulsa, even if they are DV service provider or not.

We actually, Rosario is primarily focused this year on doing outreach beyond just DV based organizations because we want as many of those pathways I talked about as possible.

And in the middle, we have our DV mentality review, which is really the place where we're gonna be able to look at both system and community responses and look at it's essentially what they are doing at the state level in the AG's office, but we're gonna do it in a localized way to really understand over the last few years, um, looking at cases that have been fully adjudicated past the point of appeal.

What can we review and understand about the gaps that led to those losses in Tulsa so that we can also provide some analysis and recommendations for the city uh related to those losses?

So I will pause there.

That I did that may or may not have been 10 minutes, but um really you know, we're so excited.

It this is just the tip really of what I'm sharing because within each of those three subcommittees, a lot of work is going on.

We're getting connected to the culturally specific city commissions to make sure that we're reaching all of the diverse populations within Tulsa.

So we're just so excited.

Um, the stakeholders um they're truly committed.

Uh, like I said, we know really good work is already happening here, and our role is just to help facilitate tightening it up, enhancing it, making sure where any of those little gaps are, that tends to be the most fatal places for survivors where we're tightening that up and just enhancing what you already are doing here in the community.

And we're happy to take questions if you have them.

Council Dunham.

I just wondered how protective orders play into all of this, and that that's usually the first step that gets recommended.

And a lot of times from individuals I have spoken with, it's not effective.

And it's frustrating to even get to begin that process of a protective order.

So what kind of collaboration and partnership are we going to do, or are you guys working on tightening uh the ability?

Number one, making it easier for people to get a protective order and for it to actually have meaning.

Yes, I understand.

I under it's a it's definitely a two-part question because the meaningful piece of it, the enforcement piece of it that can make it effective, is really kind of a separate separate consideration to the initial part, and I say that because the initial part is really us starting to work more with the civil legal process, and that's with district court and Judge Greeno and the DV court program, they're really big supporters of this initiative.

They've been working with us from day one.

So I think ever all of the stakeholders are truly aware of the challenges around the local process, um, especially now that the family safety center has switched locations and it's not at the courthouse, but they're looking into ways that filing can happen there at that location.

That's one of the first steps that might actually start to make this process much more simple because the way it had been, even though the family safety center was right there next to the court, so if survivors went to the court first, they were told go to the family safety center, and if they went to the family safety center and they were at capacity, they needed a letter of proof to take back to the court.

So to your point, um, so right now we need to see what this process is going to look like that the family safety center is trying to create to start to address the front end process of how can we just make that much more simple for survivors on the front end.

And on the back end, what you know, my background is in law, and I did family law and represented survivors for a while before I started this work.

And what we always have to say to survivors is yeah, a protection order is still just a piece of paper.

And for some survivors who can afford the long haul, there is a strategy in that.

It is just a piece of paper, but get it, because then if something happens, you call the police, that's an arrestable offense.

But that's a long, that's the long game, and that's not gonna work for every survivor.

So we are also through our community outreach.

What we are trying to do is identify if there are any existing community-based mechanisms.

And what I mean by that is there's one initiative we're interested in, we've been talking a little bit about it with folks.

We really want to bring it to the table at some point, is uh is an initiative that would kind of um build up the capacity of local respected community members to be a first touch point.

It would be similar to community violence interrupters, and it would be a little bit similar to the AA sponsor model where we can train up and build the capacity of local community responders so that when there is something that might not raise the level of an arrest, so you don't think calling the police might be as effective, there is somebody else you know you're gonna call who can intervene.

Um, and also it's that other alternative where if the protection order doesn't seem like something that's the most immediate thing that's gonna help me, but calling this person right now immediately is gonna help me, those are some of the things we're also trying to look into, so that we are creating these other alternative pathways when some of the legal system pathways can be too tricky, or it will take more time for us to understand how to make them work a little bit better for survivors.

So it's my understanding you have to actually go in person to file the detective order.

So I I'm thinking of transportation type issues for some folks where maybe the car is enabled the vehicle, or uh the perpetrator has taken the vehicle or created a situation where they'd be able to make it inoperable for them to leave.

So, how how can we work to get uh to them where they're at?

And I and I do think that that is part of the critical importance of why we're focusing so much on the community outreach piece this year in particular, because to your point, um there's not gonna be one way to know where every survivor is positioned in Tulsa at the point where they're like, I need to get to court to file something.

But if we have tapped into enough of the community helpers, the natural helpers that survivors are turning to, their faith leaders, their hair salons, where their WIC clinics, literally any door that a survivor could be walking into in Tulsa, that's that's the place they were already going to for help.

And if we have helped that place learn how they can effectively get the survivor to where they need to go, that's the mechanisms we've got to really create if we're gonna reach all survivors.

So that's what we're trying to do to address that piece.

Okay, thank you.

I appreciate that.

I'm just curious if you all um, from doing this work, and you know, there's so much of the community outreach part in the systems change with the existing systems part.

Are there any either local or state policy kind of changes that you all are looking at or pursuing or just see is maybe barriers that need amendment or so?

I will say that um two of those areas that are relevant, and that I would not say that it that because the task force is still fairly early, right, and in its positioning, and Mayor Nichols is going to be executing an updated executive order that will really lay out kind of more formally, I think, how this group is going to provide policy recommendations in a formal manner to the city.

But two of the areas that we know are really critical, um, and so what we're doing right now is information gathering.

We're trying to fully understand the root of these issues before we could be in a place to really take a policy stance on it.

But it is um the impact of the way the current child abuse statute in Oklahoma is written and the way that it encapsulates in caps capsules.

Thank you.

Oh my goodness.

Such a you know, large range of um I turned my back when my child was in the kitchen with the stove on for two seconds to some of the worst right accounts of of child abuse and neglect, and within that is the failure to protect, which really comes up so much for survivors because it can simply just be that you're you're staying in a residence with your abusive partner.

Maybe the kids have never seen it, but just the fact that they reside there, you you have not left that house or relationship will charge you a failure to protect, but the sentencing impact on the survivor parents is just it incredibly disproportionately high.

It's extreme.

It's extreme, yes.

And so that's for sure one area that we are that we're looking at, and then um the other area that has just been evolving since we really came into Tulsa to do this work is how the Survivors Justice Act implementation is kind of playing out since um since that passed.

And so those two are are fairly critical because we know that what is happening related to the criminalization of survivors um is one of the most damaging things, right?

That continues to put survivors at further risk, um not only of harm but fatality and their own future, you know, use of of any kind of protective force that could continue to be used against them.

So those are two um significant areas, um, but there are many, many other things.

There's a lot of work we're trying to do around the response to tribal DV cases and clarifying the um uh interesting array of of legal right um jurisprudence around uh tribal domestic violence cases.

So we're doing some work with Muscogee Creek Nation and with TPD and the Oklahoma Northern District around that to try to create some you know some understanding there.

Yeah, just so you know if it's ever um of interest.

I do in my my other job a lot of work related to uh we work with pregnancy justice on criminalization there and have been doing a lot of work in the state on that.

Oh, yeah, well, whether it's connecting that.

Interesting interplay there where it is someone having challenges accessing whether it's legal system or medical system, and where the yes, where's the coordination across those different especially because you end up with some of that DA, you like I know what you were just speaking to too has a lot to do with DA just like where there's space for discretion related to who gets charged with what or what mandated reporting happened in a hospital setting that ends up in a uh legal setting.

Let's see, I had Counselor Benkel and then Counselor Hall Harper.

Yeah, I appreciate this being brought to the table because I'm just gonna share why it's important to me.

My youngest um went through this, um, and what you said has some validity.

Being encumbered by a process as a victim can be troublesome, and if it's elongated, it can just give up on it.

And like you said, the piece of paper can feel irrelevant.

Um I had to pursue a young man out of sight because he wasn't served, couldn't be served by our county, so I had to trick this young man by hiring a process server in that other state to serve him to trick him to coming back to Oklahoma.

That's a problem.

So I think we can think of different scenarios, but to me, um my daughter didn't want to go through this process, and I said you have a responsibility, um, not just to yourself, but to also the potential victim of the future of this person.

So hopefully, in the work that you're doing, we're encouraging, especially young ladies, right?

Who um I think in in certain ages uh they're more susceptible to this type of behavior, and I hope that you're encouraging them to go through that process that we're working to make it less cumbersome for them to get through this process because I'm sure it feels shape, right?

Um I want us to figure out from a legal perspective, right?

Since you are a lawyer how we can pursue people that are avoiding or trying to uh get away from accountability.

It's this was a scenario where it just happened to work out, yeah, you know.

Um that may not be the case for other folks.

So that's to me the biggest thing is having people that are in that type of situation report those things, and how are we working to make it less cumbersome for legitimate abuse victims?

Because I've been accused of it wrongfully.

But there are those scenarios, but the ones that are legit that legitimately have this occur to them, how do we make it less cumbersome for them?

Yeah, absolutely.

And and it and it really is about the dual approach.

It is about on the system side, we've talked with um TPD and the DA's office about better tracking of repeat offenders, um, high risk level offenders because it's a small portion within any given population, and you can really there's some models where you can really call those folks out and let them know we're watching you, right?

And and we're gonna keep upping the consequence every time you choose to continue the behavior.

But it is also on the community side where I think um we part of our outreach for this year is we do want to hold a few town halls in the community.

And I think what we're learning from the survivors we're talking to, we actually did a couple sessions with with men who have been court-ordered into better intervention programs, and we sat down with some of them a couple years ago.

Um, what we're really hearing across the board from both survivors and harmdoers is nobody taught us anything about the dynamics of what was happening in these relationships, what we could have done, what we should have done, what we should have been looking for, until now when I was sent to Divis to do the victim class, or I was ordered by a judge to go to better intervention.

And they all overwhelmingly really asked of us, and this was a third policy piece I didn't mention earlier, is education, and that's why we do have in our public schools now, but did not previously.

Well, and that's I'd like to hear a little bit more about that, not now.

But um, like healthy relationships, healthy relationship of staging violence information.

Say again that it's an appropriate we have to be taught that it's an appropriate.

It's not so much about the hitting part, but I'm told I wasn't.

It's usually consent issues negotiating differently.

Just like learning how to actually negotiate hard conversations.

Yeah, it happens.

Yeah, relationship.

So good point.

Yeah, there's some mic is all which mic?

All of them.

The mics are what?

We can't pick up.

I can't pick up because we're all talking.

Yeah.

Okay.

Um what?

I'll just find work.

We can't even pick up.

Which if people want, I'll just like putting on a different organizational hat again.

There is a lot of healthy relationship education that happens now, um, starting in I want to say it's in sixth, ninth, and like 12th grade, and even sometimes a tiny, you know, just a tiny bit earlier, but it's around the same time that that's kind of that age appropriate version of sexual health education that can happen really early, where with you know, younger, more like you know, early teens, they can really start just talking about hey, what's the healthy relationship look like?

What does it mean if someone's having positive you know, conversation and communication with you?

Um, so it has to do with things like even just like partner control with that intimate partner violence, like you know, even some of it's like cell phone stuff.

Like, does your partner always want you to tell them exactly where you are?

Are they tracking your location navigating that kind of conflict?

Um, happy to talk about that curriculum sometime as well.

Where do we still rank it in this in this issue?

Um, so the latest um the latest data that I came across um uh just a couple weeks ago was that Oklahoma is leading is the leading state for DV incidents in the country, and it previously was second in the nation for homicides, this last year it moved to third in the nation for homicides.

And then the Oklahoma Domestic Violence Fatality Review Board out of the attorney general's office puts an annual report out every year, and that report provides um data by county, so then that gives us a little bit more of a look.

And I and they and they say in the report, you know, due to population size of Oklahoma uh County and Tulsa County just being the largest populated areas, right?

That that they lead the state in the highest numbers.

But also by is it like raw number by rate as well, like a number perhaps.

Yes, the rate is the rate's highest, the highest.

Okay, so even regardless of population.

Yes.

I was gonna just check that to 40 too.

Yeah.

Yeah.

A lot not important.

Yeah, there's just of what we know that happens, just to follow up on the data point uh with Counselor Bengal's question.

Um for us dropping to third, is that because our like numbers are rates decreased or just because other states increased?

I honestly from the data that I saw from the 2025 state review board report.

It looks as it's probably more likely due to other states increasing because the number of homicide events and victims slightly coming down in in the overall projectory, and um we have uh we have some screenshots of that kind of data that you don't have to go through the whole 30 page report.

If you all are interested in that, we can definitely share the number of that.

Hi, Counselor Harper.

Yes, um, I was looking at your the organ is partnering organizations.

Um in your flow chart and then your processes are there any I don't know what you would call it, education or training on self-defense um as an option, in addition to everything we do.

I mean, we're constitutional carry state.

Um if you are going to carry, you need to be trained appropriately on how to defend yourself.

Uh if someone is is trying to kill you, the only response you can do is return the favor.

So in the flow chart of activities, and in the process, do you all offer that to women who are battered and who continue to you know continue to be mattered so that hopefully they won't end up?

That's I see I really appreciate that question.

Most of my work when I was doing this work for the city of New Orleans was around uh self-defense and uh self-defense determinations because there's such a high high percentage, disproportionately high percentage of black women getting arrested for DV, and when we started to look into that, it was missed self-defense the vast majority of the time.

And we ended up doing a lot of work around that, but we one thing that did not come out of that was thinking about promoting kind of self-defense classes or training for survivors.

I don't see that have you come across that.

It never is.

We're expected to remain biggest.

Yeah, yeah.

But that's I I think that speaks more so to our our justice system in how you know.

And I do think that that's related to cultural dynamics around like you know, gender, women's roles, and firearms, there's just a lot of cultural considerations around those, and that's what becomes very particular for different people.

But I think it is if we talk more about it and include it in our programming on these issues, then you know, maybe that'll change.

But if we're gonna continue to be considered, oh just be the victim and you know, be a little lady, you get beat down until you know and it's not gonna change.

I think that I think that the emphasis has been on supporting women to leave, and then as a movement, we've learned to say, well, we shouldn't only just push that.

We really need to let the survivor lead what's best for them.

But I think that that overall emphasis has been on overall bringing down the levels and usage of violence, which might be why it doesn't get promoted to encourage it as I totally appreciate what you're saying about it, but I think that's just why as a movement it's about you know de-escalating it and lowering the violence.

So that's probably why it's not widely promoted in that way.

But I definitely understand what I'm saying.

If you've gone in and a judge has given you a protective order, then obviously it it's heightened to a level of just saying, Oh, I'm gonna leave and and they're not going to chase me after I leave.

Right.

But in those situations, unfortunately, they're too common.

Yeah, that even after you've done all of that, if you chose to leave and been able to leave, they should they show up a month later on your doorstep.

You need to be able prepared to prepare, I mean prepare to protect yourself and your thing.

And I do think advocates talk a lot about that when they safety plan with survivors, they talk through those things with survivors, you know, but they're more than talking.

I'm saying put it in here, yeah.

That these are trainings that you can learn how to handle a weapon.

Yeah, because if you don't think he can take the weapon from you and turn around and use it on you.

So that training needs to be out, I think, in that process.

Any uh can be for disagreement.

There's the political horseshoe joining together for the second one.

Are there any other follow-up questions or sounds like you have so much?

Let us know when it's time to come back with policy items as well.

Absolutely.

Thank you all so much for your time.

Yeah, with you guys too.

Yeah, definitely.

Well, we will come back to the case.

Thank you all so much.

Okay, we are real quick.

We had an answer to seven.

I was told related to if it was a that was the um the sexual assault kit, and if it was for backlog or proactive oh that Sarah stepped out.

Okay.

I'll oh Sarah, I just thought we were just hopping back to seven real quick.

He said we had an answer about it for the backlog.

Yes, it is for the backlog.

Okay.

Now we know.

Thank you.

All right, we are on agenda item for teen discussion with the chief of police or his designee and the public safety commissioner or her designee regarding the Tulsa Police Department's downtown division brought by myself and Council Gilbert.

Oh yeah, any chance you can say any chairs.

We don't have coonies at the works today.

You can send you a I thought we'd just have on the agenda just reads police chief or his designee.

I'll be doing speaking uh unless there's something we get down into the weeds and Chief Ormaus or the research.

Okay.

Oh, okay.

Okay.

Question.

Yeah, so if you could all I know there was an announcement that some of us who represent downtown, we'll get myself a classical harper heard about kind of last minute.

Um, but I'm so glad we're getting time to get kind of more updated information.

Now I know I have a little list of questions, but I'll let you all kind of just share more first and then well, would you like me to give you an overall description of what we are doing and then answer questions, or would you like me to just go straight into the questions?

No, no, I think if you would give us an overall description, I think that would be most helpful.

Not a problem.

Yeah.

Uh well, as uh, you know, I think you've all probably seen it's been 38 years since we opened a new division, which was the last one as Riverside, and uh 15 years since we looked at how we deploy our people uh across the city, meaning in how many calls per uh district uh like Adam Baker Charlie and how close we are to those calls and how quickly we respond.

And if you just look at the downtown area, it kind of speaks for itself.

What we've seen in the demographics and also the uh the development over the last decade as you saw the uh creation of or the BOK Center two decades ago rise, the thrillers move downtown, green road revitalization has been just overwhelming.

The arts district, uh the uh uh millions and millions of dollars spent on the convention center, swooping down to the probably the biggest entertainment draw to gathering place, and um we have been flexing our force to try to meet those demands.

When I came into office, the two things that I did was I went around and talked to every division and talked to the officers on the line.

And uh we talked about uh things that other chiefs had done that they wanted to see me do differently.

And the other thing was I was immediately started meeting or getting calls to meet with uh everybody from uh the chamber of commerce to our downtown uh building owners, both uh apartment and business, uh, to the arts district where major honor search and I try to attend their monthly meetings uh to meetings with the tenants around Greenwood about and we've seen the uh Juneteenth celebration just explode in popularity and the BOK uh center with the commissioner, everybody's needs.

But what we recognized was we are meeting every call, and we had over uh 26,000 calls last year.

And I'm sorry, I said that wrong.

We had over 272,000 calls last year, and we responded to every one of them.

We we looked at is are we responding from a ways off?

Which makes our response time longer if we have to drive several miles uh to Cherry Street or the gathering place, or or is there a way to reposition our people, make it budget neutral, and um be more effective force, especially because what we had and everybody at this table is gonna know this as soon as I say it.

We watch every day downtown transform from business to entertainment zone.

It's like it's like the setting of the sun, and uh all of a sudden our night life has grown down here.

People are coming down here to go to some of the best restaurants and Tulsa.

They're coming down here for the bar and club scene, they're coming down here because last weekend we had the SEC here with all the gymnasts from the S uh SEC competitive to go to the NCAA weekend before that we had the big 12 wrestling, and we were constantly moving our people around.

Weekend before that, we had the Big 12 wrestling.

And we were constantly moving our people around.

And I just talked to Lieutenant Honer this morning who runs our special events.

He said probably his best estimate is 87% of every special event we do touches downtown.

So we took all that.

I challenged uh we actually did a study in 2024, and we held community meetings in the downtown area, and we developed a plan and we shared it with Commissioner Roberts late last year in 25.

And that morphed into how can we do this?

And Chief uh Deputy Warmerhouse is sitting at the table, uh developed a working group.

Uh we talked to the commissioner much so in January 20 this year, 26, saying, hey, we're looking at this, we're targeting next year's shift change.

I I realize there are some uh probably mistakes made.

And uh and I will say this.

I went back and we looked historically, like you heard me say, the launching of Riverside Division was then 1988, so 38 years ago.

Before that, when there was only one police station, I think I'm the only one at the table that can address that because I was here.

Uh it was uh the East Side Division.

It moved three times in its first year.

And so we tried to look back historically and learn from our mistakes and what we did with Riverside.

And downtown, we've tried to look at all those things to make sure we do it the best way we can.

So that's kind of how we got to where we are today.

The when I opened this uh talk, I talked to you about talking to the officers.

One thing the other two chiefs, my predecessors had not done is they learned about working things that change that we were changing in the department that affected them at the line level from the Tulsa World.

Kevin RMG 26 and 23.

Uh and I made a commitment to them that wouldn't happen.

So when we launched this, I've it was really a very small working group working on it.

The same time I started talking to my command staff on that day, uh, we sent a video to every officer and we gave them four hours to look at that video to basically say, hey, this is how we're changing, and we want you to hear it from the command staff me.

Uh, we don't want you to read it in the paper or hear it on the radio or watch it on the five o'clock news today.

So I do apologize that I think some people at uh our some of our counselors at this table were not happy that uh they didn't hear about it from me before we called the press conference.

I do want to highlight that the chamber was present.

The chamber at the press conference, right?

Yeah, they were, but they did not know about it until we asked them to come because in 2025, Bill Knight was the president of the chamber, and uh Mike Neal was a well, Mike Neal's this I think his title CEO, but we held multiple luncheons that they coordinated to talk about what was going on in downtown with businesses, especially with the remodeling of the Arvis Convention Center and the more the bigger, more robust uh events that were holding at our best and his concern.

Yeah, which I just want to do.

You invited the chamber before without letting us even know as a day.

Yeah, like I don't take issue.

I'm glad you know, as someone who represents a big chunk of downtown and the surrounding neighborhoods that it looks like this will encompass.

I do want to get a map if we could and check on the if there's no map.

Oh but I didn't bring a map.

Okay, I just wasn't sure if this included 15th and trip and 15th in Denver, not have had questions about that.

Um but um but I'm just gonna say I I'm you know, I'm glad we're doing a kind of urban core um division.

I think that's really critical.

I know this is a need, and I know it can help us allocate resources.

Um so I think a lot of us at the table are I don't want to put words by colleagues' mouse, but aren't aren't supportive of the concept.

It was just you know, I got um, you know, I think kindly by uh Commissioner Roberts told about it the night before, and you know, counselor call Harper got a quick text the morning of um and so you know, knowing that the chamber had got an outreach or seats at the table in this conversation, and I you know, I I am interacting with my constituents who this division will be serving on a regular basis as well.

Just going forward, and it sounds like I know we're not launching this till was it August?

Uh it'll be shift changed by contract with the FOP.

Uh that's when we can move people around.

And I knew the councillor, you counselor and counselor uh Hall had been invited.

Uh we didn't tell the chamber about it until the evening before, the same time I believe you all were invited.

That when I said we met with them, we met with them, we met with the arts district, we met with Greenwood uh gathering place with Major McCord.

We met with all of them, but we didn't tell sent out the invites to the press conference till the evening before.

Okay.

Well, that's that's helpful clarification.

Yeah, counselor.

Um actually I have a line going with that.

Let me address it.

I instinctively was like there's a um just as a you can let someone go before.

Okay, just as a quick follow-up question.

So does it include the quick trip at 15th in Denver?

Okay, I'm getting it.

What about the I'm sorry, what's your question about that?

Just if it's included in the map.

Okay.

Just double checking.

Okay, I've seen nods.

The map goes picks up the gathering place outside of the idea of the ideal picks up Cherry Street, it picks up the growing restaurants and uh bar district down by 18th in Boston.

Okay, yeah, and I I've and I it goes all the way out to the low barrier shelter in Southwest.

And I have had over by the hospital area, could have forest orchard asked if they are included or not.

Um that's like 11th and Utica.

I think the the cutoff line is Peoria, but it does cut in kind of in the pearls.

There's a little cuddle that avoids the hospital, and they would love to be included, I think.

Yeah, can I clarify that roadhouse?

So part of part of looking at uh service response and just kind of how things evolved over decades.

Uh we ran the numbers in the current Riverside Division is servicing like 80 percent of hospital calls.

Yeah, uh, which was crazy.

I was actually shocked that that's how many.

Sorry.

I'm sorry.

Oh, Crest Hospital, not OSU.

Which hospital?

So no, he's talking about the whole division.

It was crazy that Riverside was handling 80% of that.

And so part of looking at that because hospitals do take significant call volumes, uh, was making sure that uh because the the new divisions are already going to be handling uh OSU and the new veterans was making sure that the the priority and focus of that division still stayed centered towards this this new model, and so originally, and I think to counselor Dr.

Wright's originally it was cut into Peoria to keep Hillcrest into Gilcrease.

However, uh in talking with some some folks and probably uh also to your point about the neighborhood.

Uh the most recent revision pulled it back to St.

Louis so that one the neighborhood um itself would it would have a um neighborhood response aspect to it, but two, because those shops on 11th uh interact so much with the rest of what the new division would be.

That's that's where that beach.

Okay, oh great.

That's good to hear.

Yeah, I'd had yeah, I know so the it sounds like the map is still in flux a little bit, or is it okay?

Mo most of it's done.

That was just a very recent yeah, okay.

That makes sense.

No, I had constituents wanting to double check about that.

Okay, and then just as a last quick question for me, and then I have uh Gilbert if she wants to go extra not.

Um but just as a quick you mentioned it being budget neutral, but if we're setting up a new division, I'm just assuming there's things like I don't even know, like material.

It's gonna be in our building, and we're obviously in our building for at least another 12 months, maybe longer.

Uh so there's no we're not having a rent space to have it in in the origin the police courts building right now.

We're putting it with the family safety center was located.

But what about just for materials?

Like, are there I don't know, like radio?

I don't really know.

I'm sex for computers.

Um I'm sorry, would you one more time?

I there for each does each division have its because I'm imagining there's certain things like each division has been.

Some of it would be brought with it.

The furniture uh when the family safety center moved out, they left all the furniture because the Muscogee Creek Nation fully furnished the new family safety center, and we will just be will you be utilizing a lot of the desk and the chairs and everything that's already there.

We actually have probably more than we need uh to man that and then the other uh part of it is there will be a CADS rewrite, and we're gonna absorb that cost within our budget.

So we don't foresee any significance well, we don't see asking the council for any additional funds to launch this division.

Okay, is that just for this fiscal year you're thinking for the next problem?

We don't see anything down the next because we we've been working with our uh private public partners and we have uh several business owners that have said they would love to host us in their uh first floor.

And uh we would be more than welcome.

Well, over the next 12 to 18 months, we'll look at where the best place is it, and plus Mark Hogan is committed to uh helping us find if we can't find a public partnership uh handshake, and he's committed to helping us find a vacant city facility we can move into.

But uh at this time, the costs of actually launching the vision is is fairly minimal.

And all the resources, the people, the the hierarchy.

Uh Major Honor is in the room because he will be the major of the downtown, and he has been working closely with not just the businesses but the nonprofits, uh, the homeless shelter, uh, all of that, and very crucial.

He's gonna bring all that already established contacts with him.

And um, we could see it as a win-win-win.

But go ahead.

Oh, who's taking over Gil crease?

Uh it'll be Major Phippen.

Okay.

We're we're not adding any majors, we're not adding any captains, we're not any adding any officers.

Uh, like I said, 272,000 calls last year.

We covered every one of them with the number of officers we have.

We're simply repositioning so we can respond quicker instead of driving for one of the outside divisions a year.

Yeah, I appreciate the efficiencies.

Um, Councillor Gilbert.

Um, okay, so I think what um Councillor Bellis was getting at was the the setup of the the radio system, the consult, the CAD system.

So with the new division, you don't need a new setup.

No, we'll have to have some CADS rewrite.

Right.

But right now that is $13,000 will absorb that in our budget.

And we're looking at buying them a training console to do it too.

Then I I have multiple sources I can fund out out of uh some of them grant sources.

Okay, so we'll be paying attention to that.

Okay.

Um also um is does that mean that you're I mean, with this new division, are you going to have to add more uh 911 dispatchers specifically for this new division?

It'll be a reconfiguration of the people that are in that division.

We're not gonna hire any more additional dispatchers, if that's the question.

Yeah, that's we don't foresee that no.

Okay.

So right now I know that there are a lot of residents that get very frustrated when they call 911 because they're put on hold because of the call volume.

And so, how is that going to affect the regular call volume now if you're just redirecting or reconfigurating?

The number of people who answer the phone that that particular uh job assignment, and we really should have their number one uh director here is not changing, so it's gonna be the same.

I know they're trying to make some improvements through the dispatching system and automation to make that a better experience for them, but we're not we're not changing the number of people that when somebody calls 911 and they say uh police fire or no I I get that, but it goes to I mean, after the call is dispatch or sent over to a dispatcher.

Are we going to have enough dispatchers to keep up with this new division and the call volume?

Is my I would the short answer would be yes, and I believe the reasoning behind that is we're still going to be dispatching the same number of calls, and uh we're gonna deprior.

Well, we're not gonna depriortize, we're gonna restructure.

We may run with uh instead of three back or top groups that are off the main size, we may run with two, or we may run with uh instead of having three tactical channels available, two tactical channels, and use one of those channels uh as the dedicated for the new downtown division.

Okay.

Okay, so I'm saying we're not adding any additional radio frequencies.

Okay, um, because I mean already right now, I get um I hear concerns from residents about 911 calling 911 because of the call volume.

So that's what I'm just I I'm trying to get my head wrapped around this with a new division and more there could be possibly more call volume coming in.

How is and you're not adding any uh dispatchers how that is going to affect uh the call volume and uh answers to in response to calls out in um other areas?

I get what you're doing downtown.

I mean, and I it's as counselor Bellis um mentioned it's it's time, it's it's been needed for quite some time, but again, I'm just trying to uh wrap around get my head wrapped around how we're going to provide this service without adding more dispatch.

You say that you're not adding more police officers, even though you do have a class getting ready to graduate.

Um, but you're not adding you're not adding administrative staff, right?

You're not adding more or new uh uh lieutenants, more sergeants, or uh captains.

Correct.

So um you are at or you are take you're not adding a major because the major Phippen has been at headquarters.

So, but is Major Honorsorge when he takes over this new division?

Is he going to have a captain?

Is he going to have uh Lieutenant?

Is he gonna have sergeants and how many patrol officers?

Maybe uh just a little bit higher level than in down in the weeds.

We are going from four shifts to three shifts, and we're changing the uh assigned hours from some right now.

We're split some of our shifts work ten hours, some of our shifts work eight.

The tens are extremely popular with our officers.

So we're going to three 10 hour shifts by dissolving four ships.

We gain the captains off of well, actually we gained three captains, and we gained those lieutenants and sergeants that are on there.

Uh two of those captains will be working directly for major ones.

Um the third one is in play right now, but uh talking with uh city legal about uh areas we need to have better supervision and to keep us in compliance with ORAs, et cetera.

We need we have both our police presence there putting some back.

So there are positions for those extra supervisors that uh myself and the three bureau chiefs will work out in the next couple of months.

But as far as downtown, this the dissolving four shift it frees up three captains.

Um Mark am I correctly saying nine lieutenants?

Uh more than more than that.

Uh I think it into the number is uh sufficient number to staff done countless all using the same number of lieutenants we have right now, the same number of captives and the same number of acres.

Okay.

I mean, and I get that this is again this is needed, yes, but it's going to be a smaller division than let's say Riverside, Mingo Valley.

Um it's not gonna have the same staffing numbers.

Riverside, uh Mingo Valley and Gilkers have a little over a hundred.

This division's only gonna have officer-wise, probably around 40 to 45.

Yeah, and then you've got to add your sergeants, lieutenants, captains, and so total capacity, somewhere between 65 each.

Is this gonna be categorized as a specialty unit?

No, no, it is bid board.

Meaning the officers will have a chance to bid uh to work downtown, and really we want that.

We want somebody who knows they're coming into the area that's a lot of entertainment.

So we have more visitors in downtown than we have anywhere else in Tulsa.

This is if you talk to the head of Williams, he talks about wanting to bring more professional staff into Tulsa.

We want to have our best footboard, we're gonna have bike patrols uh that the foundation has given us 10 electric bikes.

We're gonna have we're starting a part-time mounted unit, we're gonna have uh some foot presence.

We're we're changing the look of the police department with this new division downtown.

And and I get it, but I still have we still have residents out in the the city that are wanting um just as much uh response as what's happening, you know, as visitors uh coming into our city of Tulsa.

Don't get me wrong, I appreciate the the the um the visitors coming to Tulsa and that you are doing what we need to do to keep them safe, but we also have residents out there that um that need that um safety feeling just as much as the visitors.

I agree, and those units I named off are not exclusively going to be used in downtown Tulsa.

Uh the mounted unit is going to be great for Turkey Mountain when we have an event like we've had in the past.

Bike patrol.

No, both bike and mounted.

Uh but okay.

Well, that's that's something else that we don't even know about.

Well no, mounted is just it's not even in creation yeah, we're just going through the training, it doesn't launch till later this year, and it's not a full-time unit, it is a hybrid part of it like several other but that's that's another unit that we don't know about.

Okay, we haven't had that discussion yet, um, which could be another.

My as we've discussed this before.

Um, my worry is the the bud or the impact on the budget with this.

And so you just brought something else to the table with the um the mounted patrol bringing mounted patrol, so I assume that that's going to be categorized as a specialty unit, and so what's going to be the impact on your budget um with that?

So I'm going to be maybe come back, but I know that you have a list of other counselors, so I'm gonna um give others the opportunity.

Yeah, and I do just want to clarify since I know we keep saying downtown, but when you look at the map, it is a lot of surrounding neighborhoods, um just uh just for the public record.

Um I have counselor Lakin and then Hall Harper, then Dudden, then Bengal, and then maybe Gilbert again.

Oh, let me make sure you're on who's choosed before me.

Oh my gosh, I'm so sorry, that was really big of you.

Are you case directory?

Thank you.

Um I want to stay on this fiscal impact line of questioning.

So I just jotted down a hundred at each of the current divisions and then 50 in the downtown division, switching from fours to three by tens.

So you know, we know that we're down in our staffing pattern.

What are we talking about for overtime impacts with this restructure?

Have we done any analysis?

Because um you all know, like that's a huge conversation is the overtime expense of the end of the year.

We have to pay it, but we have to also budget for it properly.

So, have you done analysis in the re-org?

So, a lot of our overtime is not regarding anything that um is like late calls or anything, it is contractually somebody takes off, okay.

Then we have to do a hire back and fill it.

Um we want to do task forces.

Okay, we bring people in, we run task forces, but when we do that, it creates the vacancies out in the field that that hirebacks have to occur again.

Um so it's it's not that in fact, actually, this is an opportunity to try to reduce some overtime in regards to moving some uh people to a certain area and have an entire chain of command focused on hey, what are the problems?

How can we evaluate this better?

What can we what can we send to this?

And and so it's really done in an opportunity to try to reduce overtime.

Um so you don't anticipate a scaling up of what overtime has been.

You're basically taking your eight, ten and reallocating them across four divisions instead of three.

I understand like going three uh three by ten versus four by eight kind of does a shift, but there's no big fiscal impact on the overtime that you're anticipating with the network how people are scheduled.

Right.

And then and then it's um I think maybe to your question.

Uh and then it's yeah, just a reallocation of looking at okay, where does overtime occur?

Percentage out, okay.

Then that's the org object for that division.

Okay.

Um, and I think I heard that it'll go through the bid board process.

So somebody who's on second shift in Mingo Valley might be able to bid to then be in downtown.

So every division will have a shift of who's we do every year the last Sunday of August.

And uh the last part of June and July, and part of it is because officers have families.

Sure.

And we want them by the start of the school year to be able to plan who's gonna drop off, who's gonna pick up and work out child care and other family commitments they have so they know by August 1st, usually by the middle of July, hey, after the last Sunday in August, I'm gonna be working these days, these hours, and they can work out within their family or bid to a spot that is family-friendly for them.

Maybe they go to midnight, so they want to be there at breakfast every morning.

That makes sense.

I'll add one thing too, also in regards to to that.

Um, also looking at a staggered timing piece too.

And so it one from a public safety standpoint of keeping everybody here and then letting everybody go, trying to roll people off at different times.

Uh, that's what we're moving to, but it also then provides uh options for officers, and so hey, I'd like to get home later so that I can stay at home with kids a little bit later or go to work earlier, get home.

So this also in thinking about workforce and talking about staffing and everything, um it will provide more options similar to some other agencies that are trying to provide for work-life balance lines.

Okay, um and then I I just want to reflect back what I heard.

We'll be in the police courts building in the former family safety center.

You're going to use $13,000 absorbed with already in your budget to get the CAD and the technology and you need the office furniture will already be there.

In 12 to 18 months, we have to have a new conversation about space.

Sounds like you have a private partner that might be hosting you or something.

I do again want to say um I feel frustrated sometimes, and I and I run a business in downtown, and I will say that we were stuck in the wormhole of being at the border of Riverside and and Gil Creek's division trying to get some help in the alleyway, like two weeks ago, to the point where it was like, oh, we were talking to people thinking we were talking to Captain Seibert, thinking that you were in the downtown division, but you're actually in Riverside, so we got no response.

So I ended up just like calling 911, which is what I was trying not to do in this situation because it wasn't really a 911 needed call, but going through non-emergency and stuff, we just got stuck in this, and we're at 16th and South Boulder.

So when this was announced, and I saw that Sobo is in there, I was like, well, that takes care of that issue, which also includes 15th in Denver.

Now, as the counselor for district seven, we have millions of visitors that go to our businesses in District 7, and I feel frustrated sometime when the conversation about business leaders is very focused on downtown to the detriment of businesses all across the city.

District five has a lot of manufacturing and big employers, district seven, district six is starting to get that.

So the needs are across the city.

They're not the same as like a downtown um party district, entertainment district.

Um I I understand that, but I would want to voice for my constituents that they do also feel the frustrations, especially with Woodland Hills Mall bringing millions and millions of people in.

I think we're doing a good job on the retail um crime unit strategy and and making sure that people are being more aware aware about securing their um firearms because we know that my district was overcontributing to that problem.

But I do want to say when we hear about we don't have enough police staff to do traffic enforcement or some of the other things that in our communities we've been asking for, and then we get this downtown focus, there is a push-pull on us, especially when we get the calls about we want all this information and we don't have it to share.

And I don't ever want to have to say like, well, just watch the the press conference because I'm learning as you are.

So I appreciate that you're owning that like the timing of that was not great.

Um, and that the sooner we can be informed, even with the the talking points, um, the better we can respond and not contribute to more confusion.

Um I I hesitate to embrace a budget neutral um title to this project because I think we're gonna have some budget impacts, whether they're now or in 12 months or in 18 months, it's just not possible to launch something of this magnitude and have it be completely neutral.

So I just want to voice that I do expect that there will be added costs as anything, any creation of a division or um unit comes with, I think even when we had um under the former chief, um the community um policing unit, like there's costs that come with those things, whether it's bullions, hot dogs, whatever it is, there are costs that will come with it.

Um so I do want to hold to account the private sector that said we need this, and we will partner with you when it comes time to providing space, equipment, the other things that that will be needed, otherwise we're going to get into a push-pull of um in order to fund this, we'll have to not fund that or um make different choices.

Um I would love to know more about the study in 2024 and the engagement with community members.

I think um that was surprising to me to hear, and it could just be that I have forgotten about it.

Um but if there is a published study, that'd be great to know.

Um and I think that was oh my final question is what kind of KPIs goals and benchmarks will you guys be kind of looking for as you roll this out, you know, call volumes or response times or like what are the things that you're looking to impact that caused us to say we need to have a focused downtown unit.

Yeah, so every year in regards to um bid board staffing, uh we always kind of look at beats and everything, right?

And it was quite crazy to me that when we looked last year, how many officers with certain designators were responding to calls in other designator areas, and so the the evolution of the city had changed so much that it wasn't just the new division, it was we have got to rewrite our map.

The city has changed, call volumes have changed in areas, and so part of that wasn't just carving out the new division.

The the map will show you that that all the divisions changed based off of what that looks like.

So one of those KPIs is going to be re-looking at okay, so we did all this, or those designators responding to calls in their area in a larger percentage than what we looked at last year.

So that's one called out.

Yes, exactly.

And and so that's also in regards to the new division.

I think we talked about this maybe around the uh curfew ordinance piece, is doing things so that we put about as about the right sweet spot of assets and resources and people to an area so that we don't all of a sudden have to constantly be dragging resources out of other districts and areas.

So that that'll be one of those those big times is are the designators we've got answering the calls in the designated areas that are assigned to.

Council Wright.

Just one quick comment.

Um I think if you talk to any business, and I've used the most recent big one, Shields.

Sure.

Uh, from the moment they said they were coming to call, so we had a seat at the table, and we did it, and they still are a phenomenal partner.

Uh they caught a significant threat because we were aware that he had come in Woodland Hills.

They found him in their store for us, and we worked to bring that threat or get that threat off the street.

But we started working with them a year before they ever showed up, and we actually have presence on their construction site.

So we're always going to support the entire retail district, not just with uh hoping to attract and and doing everything we can to be part of, hey, you want to move your business here, but also once they get established, the retail crime units and stuff, making sure that they are prosperous.

So I think if you talk to any of those target shields, Woodland Hills, they'll tell you that they've never worked as closely with our us as they have right now, and we're doing really good work with them.

And then a lot of a lot of it is because of the money they're investing on the private side to have such great security within that they can help direct us and address something quickly.

Absolutely, and I think you touched on like they're providing their own security, and sometimes I am frustrated by the kind of demands that we see from downtown businesses as if you know publicly funded police are the security.

So it's a balance, but again, I represent a part of town that generates a large portion of the sales taxes that fund all of this, and um it can start to feel a little bit like hunger games of like if they get this resource, we're gonna have less.

But if it sounds like part of the strategy is to be closer to where the calls are coming from, that also will impact out in Mingo Valley division that they don't have to get pulled off to go clear down to 11th in Peoria, they can be spotted at 15th and you know memorial and ready to respond.

So thank you.

Okay, I have Councillor Lincoln next.

Um thank you, Chair.

So I don't have an order for any of this, it's just gonna come out in a way.

So I'll just um I I'm grateful that you all are doing this.

Um, it seems like something that's needed.

It seems like you have a lot of support around the table.

I don't want to say you know, 100% support or anything as we continue to ask questions, we're learning more.

Um, I was envious of the chamber.

I have to put it on the table that hey, they're there, and I really wanted to be there because I like supporting what you guys are doing.

Thanks, sir.

And I think I think that's maybe the sentiment that's coming from others as well.

Is that hey, we like we like knowing and we like supporting.

Um so I would just encourage you all, just as I I get encouragement from other people when I don't do a perfect job communicating, especially my wife.

Um yeah, just improve.

We can always continue to improve the communications.

Yeah, and so um one thought is that we have IMSA come to this table once every quarter to just provide updates on various things that EMSA is doing.

I would say for you and for TFD, maybe we need to do that quarterly or semi-annually, just so that we have an opportunity to really um hear what kinds of things you're thinking about, and then speak into those things as well because you're getting a lot of good feedback and questions, like I was listening to Counselor Gilbert thinking, okay.

So we have the there's probably the same number of calls that will come into 911 to the same number of individuals, but how does that get dispatched differently?

So you know, just listening to your answers helps me.

It's just better communication.

Um I ate um dinner after the gymnastics thing at uh McNelly's and we ate outside.

I just watched the intense amount of people coming from not just that event but also simultaneously the soccer match and watch the number of interactions police officers had with individuals during that time and how many times I saw officers circulating.

Um I I can very much understand the need for you to be present here close to a divisional headquarters, whereas you would have to send those people either up to Gil Creeks or to one of the other two divisions.

So I get it, I I like it.

I um wish that it could have been conveyed differently, but maybe if we make a change going forward, then uh we have more opportunities to to know what you're doing and to provide input whether you want it or not.

Whether you want it or not.

No, we'll we'll endeavor to make those corrections and do better in the future.

And I would like to thank the entire council.

You all have been extremely supportive and extremely reactive.

Last year, let's go back exactly 12 months.

Uh 20 people wounded in multiple shootings, three people dead in a period of two weeks at the end of May, first of June.

Council Gilbert spearheaded the curfew violation, and you all attached your emergency clause clause to it.

We changed how we patrolled downtown, and there was not one more shooting downtown after that ordinance but in effect and how and how we've changed our policing process posture down here and address those.

And we may we make downtown better.

And some of that, what we did last summer is what we were looking at to try to say we need to do this.

Uh unfortunately is somewhat seasonal.

Uh we were really hoping to launch and uh start increasing our presence downtown in May, but we had a spring break that the average temperature during a day was well above 80.

And if anybody was downtown or especially the gathering place over last week at spring break, they were lined up with the parking lots full, parking in all the neighborhoods.

It is so popular, and then our entertainment district downtown.

It wasn't just Thursday, Friday, Saturday, it was almost every night during spring break, but you predict Oklahoma whether it would help me budget for it.

I'd be grateful for that, but unfortunately, it started early this year, and so now we're already in the summer mode, and we're just at the end of March.

Yeah.

Well, downtown's a very different place.

Um I should just say generally the downtown area within two or three miles of downtown.

So I'm grateful for that, and I think we we just have to change the ways that we respond and interact with the numbers of people that we have now.

So I appreciate you being here to answer the questions and uh hopefully we can make some adjustments going forward too.

Thank you.

All right, I have Councillor Dudden and then Bangle.

Or did you have a well now?

I have you last, but if you had a follow-up one, that was into that.

Yeah, I'll I'll follow up later, but let's counselor Dunning and then I call him.

Okay, and then lunch is here, someone else.

Yeah, so try to be as brief as I can okay.

Um, what are the top five calls related to downtown?

Do we have that information?

Uh broke out by category.

That would, yeah.

I mean, is it is it alcohol related?

Is it um trespassing?

Is it um I know we've provided that in the past, and I wouldn't like admitted to minimum right now.

Okay, I'd like that information if that can be provided going forward.

Um, with the chamber and the way this was announced, I echo the sentiment of my colleagues.

And I really appreciate um what counselor Dr.

Wright pointed out as far as uh the entertainment district, and I'm wondering where is the responsibility of the business owners and all of the alcohol that gets served downtown and the behavior of the crowds that are gathering.

I just don't I mean I appreciate that TPD is going to be involved in this, but I also think that business owners need to be held to account and not use taxpayer dollars for their security.

And so this is what I'm kind of seeing and understanding that this might entail that these business owners downtown aren't doing enough on their own to mitigate some of the issues that are occurring that require extra police presence.

Counselor, uh, just real quickly on that.

We do not put sworn public safety personnel inside private businesses.

I get that.

Uh council or major honest words is already held at least is it one meeting with the club and borrowing us?

Two meetings uh and and basically try to look ahead at the coming months and say, how are we going to do better than we did last year?

Uh we do stress accountability on their part that uh if it's inside their business that if it's not a crime in progress, uh you should regulate what's going on inside your business and not serve somebody, or the correct term would be over serve somebody.

We do engage outside entities to help us too, like the fire department is a tremendous partner in engaging the downtown communities because their fire marshals go in, they they make sure that uh a restaurant or club or entertainment is not overpopulated.

There's a certain number they can have in there, and they make sure that we also bring in the state agency able uh on the weekends to look at liquor licenses and force.

Also, has their safety.

Right, well, and I was layers, and I just I want to emphasize I wasn't talking about inside the facilities so much as outside in their properties and their parking lots.

Yeah.

Um I know when I was a small business owner, I was responsible for what went on on my property as well as what happened inside my property.

Right.

And when there was a strong armed robbery that occurred at my business with me, it was my responsibility to do everything in my power as a small business owner to ensure that that did not necessarily occur again by implementing safety and security measures and hiring security personnel for inside and outside.

So that's what I'm thinking is that you know I think the accountability on these business owners that want all of these extra measures downtown, chamber and whatnot.

Um they really also have to take some accountability in dealing with that.

Sure, and a lot of them do have private security, they're already paying for I do it.

I understand that.

Um I can promise you uh every time there's there's a weekly or a nightly event that occurs and I see it, I am peppering major auto storage of what are we doing to that business so that they become either uh they do the steps you're talking about about delivering the public safety from their set side, or that we're using other city mechanisms to make it miserable for them to continue to operate in the manner they are and putting everybody else at risk.

So I brought probably no, I I appreciate that.

And I also I'm wondering about collaboration.

I know some of the calls are probably dealing with the unsheltered population that congregates downtown due to services.

Um I'm wondering what sort of collaborations in tandem with TPD can be brought in to work with these um say outreach organizations so that TPD does not have to be called.

That's that's one of the pieces as we get more into the map and we have more meetings.

It was an very intentional about that because it's it's not just the entertainment piece, it is that um the homeless touch a lot of homeless in Tulsa touch this area, and so the the partnerships we have uh with Emily Hall and the mayor's office as well.

We are making a coordinated effort in this area to make sure that we're addressing that as best as possible and reserving law enforcement action as as a last resort.

Okay, thank you.

I I don't have to counselor Bengal.

I think you've been tenderized enough over this.

Um I'm gonna reiterate supportive look like mine.

Uh let's get in there.

Yeah, so my questions are a little more simplistic.

So I heard you kind of implied that you were gonna kind of cannibalize some of the top groups.

Only one from each of the divisions.

Uh no, talk groups like tacticals are shared.

Right.

Yeah, we we were gonna do we can't none of us can remember when we needed the three tacticals all of the same.

Oh, so you already you have three tactical talk groups for each division.

We have okay, there's two different things talk around channels, which is an all if I want to if if Karen and I are both working at them 201 and 202, and I want to say go to the back side.

That's your car to car.

Car to car.

And I'll say, Karen, can you come over here and help me instead of tying up the main channel?

Let's start a car.

There's a tactical frequency for it, and that's a second channel that each one has they're not monitored.

They're just they're there, and if we have a large uh tactical tactical situation, like the St.

Francis shooting, dispatch will announce move everybody to TAC one, and everybody goes to TAC one, and they put a dispatcher over there to coordinate just that event that was unforeseen or you know, a SWAT call, etc.

I mean, all those things.

But we have three of those, and we have three talk arounds.

So we we're and then you still have RMA, right?

And we still have oh, yes.

Uh you had an RMA channel.

There's a I think uh gaggle would be a good word for how many RMAs are so oh really?

Yeah, okay.

We have quite a few.

Okay.

And we can talk to all of our sister agencies, Broconaro, Jinx, Sepulpa, OHP, etc., over on RA.

And still 800 megahertz, right?

Yes.

How many channels are is it still 24 channels?

I'm not sure.

I I think so.

Okay.

No, I'm sorry.

I'm just asking.

I don't even know what a budget is.

When you said it's not necessarily going to be I'll find out in the email or text you that this afternoon, Chris.

Neutral, budget neutral, right?

Yeah.

Um I'm assuming we're still using motor oil radios.

Yes, sir.

Um so you're gonna have to do some are you gonna have to do any reprogramming of radios?

Yeah, we'll have to touch them.

Okay, so that means you're going to have to create some sort of main channel for this fact upon A side, right?

That's the cat channel.

That's the cats.

Right.

Okay.

That's the 13,000 that's going to be absorbed.

Yeah, and as such, I'm looking at also providing cat as a training uh block for that.

So it again, it will be absorbed out of my because we're gonna need dispatchers to be able to train on it.

So we're just talking about budgets.

There's a little bit of cost here.

So we're gonna have to go out to the radio shop.

These folks are gonna have to go out to the radio shop, have their radios reprogrammed.

So that's a cost of the of that staff, right?

Well, how we generally do that is we gather the radios in, and their uh equipment officer takes them up, they touch them and we take them back and hand them back to the officers.

It's they're being paid whether they do that or not.

The radio services.

No, I'm talking well, the radio services work for us.

I uh not work for us, work for the city at Tulsa.

Yeah, that there's a when we bring them and say, well, like when we encrypted, we they had to touch every radio that we had and enter that encryption.

So is there a cost there that you're paying for that technician's hourly rate?

Right, yeah, but he's working money through 58 to 5.

We don't press them to work overtime.

So there's it's like uh City Legal have a whole full of lawyers.

Uh uh.

That's a question.

When we take a question of them, if we take like the curfew ordinance and we say, you know, Mr.

Blair, can you run through this and look at it and go, is this how the wording should be?

There is certainly a cost to his time that we're paying him to be uh the head of the city legal, but it's what he does.

And the same thing for Radio Shop, it's what they do every day.

Yeah, so kind of going back to what Counselor Dr.

Wright said, I think we're gonna want to see uh what this is a little really gonna cost, even if it's outside resources, right?

Right to see what that legitimately looks like because even to counselor Gilbert's point, um it's going to feel different, and as Major Womershover indicated, the city has shifted, and as we move to the public safety center, that's going to change some policing dynamics in East Tulsa.

So I feel like that's going to be closer.

So I feel like there's I feel comfortable and like how that's going to look as people as officers now drive through that area instead of into that may create a dynamic shift to your uh constituents perspective.

I just want to make sure that we're not forward thinking in when you're saying we haven't created uh we've it's been 38 years since we created another division that we're not thinking for that beyond this.

Where would these folks land outside the municipal courts and police building after we move?

Where would they wait?

And how far along are you in that process?

Uh probably early stages because we know we have a home form for the next 12 to 18 months.

Okay, but uh we've already opened a discussion with Mark Hogan because he controls city asset and and venues that we own.

But we've also we were approached by uh I don't want to say the business building owner's name over a year ago about saying if you will have a greater public safety presence downtown, I'll give you the space.

So you know, we'll we'll continue having those talks, and uh I am going to do my best for this to be completely budget neutral.

In other words, I've got some uh grant funding I can look at for those small expenses and compared to our overall budget 13,000 as a small expense.

Uh it's not it's not jump change, but at the same time, I'm not gonna come to city council and ask you to transfer funds.

Um this is a bold step, and and we realize that.

And then we did go back and look historically at other bold steps when I came on one division downtown, and that's sort of first that I put on a badge I reported to.

When we moved to the east side, I had three different stations in the first year because we were moving from one storefront to another storefront to another storefront.

And I could probably say the name of the location and the department store there, and you and I would be the only ones we recognize the name.

But you're so told that everybody and you want funding?

No, I don't want to process the case.

But uh it is a bold move.

We do know that they're gonna be unknowns that pop up, and we're committed to making it uh budget neutral, but we're also working closely with the FOP and and I could have Chief Warhammer speak a great length of this, but I don't want to prolong this meeting.

It's it's malleable if we get six months into it.

It's just not working on platoons, which is what uh system of scheduling we're going to.

We can say, well, ma'am, we're gonna change RID back to the standard format we were.

Uh it's it's adaptable to the point that we realize there's gonna be a bump or feedback and somebody's gonna come in at the Westman and go, did you think about this?

We're gonna go go, but I also have some of the brightest certificated most educated demand stepped in the state.

Every one of them has a college degree, and most some of them have masters.

And we challenge them to do something we've never done before or for 38 years ago.

And they came up with a plan with advice commissioner would work on it.

We showed it to her, she she talked to the mayor.

We came back and said go no go.

And uh she said the mayor's and well, the mayor's office said we're good.

So we I do expect there to be small pumps.

Yeah, and we will we will work through those bumps.

And I think like Phil said, we support you.

And I've never obviously you'll want to make sure that we're transparent to the public because the way we found out our way I found about it, I was like, what the hell were they talking about?

Creating a new division.

Yeah, right.

I'm like, how did this come about?

Yeah.

So we will do better with that.

I know you promise.

And that's why I said uh as long as we're transparent about it and people understand how we're shifting uh resources and how those reasons how those shifts are going to benefit us uh overall as a community.

I think people will be more supportive of it.

So thank you for coming here and taking the grilling.

Yeah.

So just to wrap this all up, I I hope that you heard um from everybody how I mean we're we're not against this at all.

We we all want to work together um to make this successful.

Um, but we uh it was just the way that it was done.

Um is what I think a lot of us are most frustrated about because again um there were other people outside of the city of Tulsa that were aware of this press conference, and we we did not know about it, and then we got bombarded uh with questions about it that we could not answer because we did not know.

And it's it so um i if anything out of this, I hope that what you all got was that this takes teamwork, it's not an I work or I did this, it's a we did this, and we need to work together to make sure that there aren't any bumps in the road.

We need to make sure that everybody feels safe in the city of Tulsa, um, and that we're not taking away bits and pieces of safety away from uh neighborhoods from other business corridors, uh, from especially in our district's manufacturing corridors, um, so and making sure that um that by budget that which we control that we are aware of what the police department wants to do, the future of the police department, so that we can we can look at that as uh as what we are supposed to be doing as a budgetary uh decision.

So I know that there are uh you are being um given and talked to by other business owners about using space.

I know that we have the space downtown, we have the office on Main Street that could be used, uh, that we already own, we already paid for it.

So um and uh I just hope that we use resources that uh that we already have instead of um looking for other resources from other um privately owned businesses to the point of uh counselor Dutton that um I mean and others talking about uh private businesses uh making sure that they have that they don't use public resources to uh keep their business safe.

Our our job, your job is to keep the public safe, period, no matter what.

So um again uh I I love the idea that Councillor Lakin came up with of make having you guys come back on a quarterly basis or whatever we feel uh needs to to happen to make sure that uh we have that information and that we aren't blindsided again.

So thank you.

Okay.

Thank you.

With that, we are adjourned.

Thank you all so much.

There's lunch here because we have one o'clock.

It's 28 miles an hour.

Stay away.