Thank you.

Okay.

Welcome to the 2 30 Public Works Committee meeting.

I call the meeting to order.

That's number one on the agenda.

Number two.

Carolina Gante.

Is she here?

I don't see her.

Okay.

Yeah.

Okay.

Thank you.

Okay.

Number two discussion of proposed emergency operations department budget, including fiscal impact.

And I think we have Commissioner Roberts here to talk about that.

Good afternoon.

Hello.

Welcome.

Thank you for the opportunity to discuss this.

Commissioner Roberts, Little Robertson, Commissioner of Public Safety in the Mayor's Office.

And we're on the back slide.

We're going to go backwards.

I can go backwards, it's fine.

That's the that's the loan that we had earlier.

Just report from the probably management.

There we go.

Alright, what do I put this click in here?

That's the down and go.

Thank you.

So this is the newly formed department within the city of Tulsa, Tulsa Emergency Management, that will fall under public safety.

So it will be another department along with police fire animal services municipal court under public safety.

The purpose of us doing this is because we have signed a disillusion agreement with Tulsa County.

So TEMA no longer exists.

So we are, as a matter of fact, that was on the mayor's signing agenda this morning, and the uh county commissioners have signed that uh previously, so that is um done, and these are the steps moving forward for the city of Tulsa emergency management response.

Okay, and I will say a municipal emergency manager focuses on immediate localized first response efforts in our city limits.

So the coordinated emergency response is tailored to our unique needs and what our community needs.

Um there are lots of pros to this.

Um it allows us to tailor risk mitigation and planning, faster initial response, immediate action, um, faster decision making, improved resource of allocation, um, improved focus on recovery resilience.

One thing I think is really important we can touch on in a little bit is direct control and accountability for the city of Tulsa itself, and then of course, you know, potential legal liabilities, but we'll go through the the uh the high points first.

So this is obviously falls under Mayor Nichols, um, one of his priorities to make Tulsa the safest big city in America, so public safety continues to be a top priority for the city in this fiscal year.

We proposed a budget that places strong emphasis aligning these resources and investment to achieve better outcomes.

So as I mentioned earlier, we're working on an agreement to dissolve TEMA, which happened officially this morning, um, and that includes a separation of assets.

So that was actually a pretty lengthy process separating the assets that were over at TEMA.

There were things such as um beta tapes and video projectors and it was kind of a uh an exploration of antiques and some some aspects, uh, but an audit of finances as well.

There's cash on hand, there's reimbursements that are still outstanding.

Um there were a couple of grants that needed to be navigated.

So Chrissy with finance here, along with Jen Finance with the county.

We're very diligent about working through those numbers, pulling them out, and so we got to a very comfortable place between county and the city, so we will be uh taking physical assets as well as finances, though that is all part of the separation.

Um can I can I may I ask a quick question.

Um I guess.

It has to do with the assets.

Okay, um, so does that include the trailers and the cots and all that stuff from used from the uh winter sheltering?

Everything was um audited, and it was either assigned to the city of Tulsa, it was assigned to Tulsa County, or it was assigned to surplus, and anything that was surplus that had a monetary value was going to be split as well.

So that's it.

Yeah, no problem.

Sorry.

So moving forward, Tulsa County will have their own emergency management office, as will the city of Tulsa.

Uh the budget of resources and personnel is what we're gonna talk a little bit about today.

Um, and explain some of those.

And I will say that the emergency operations center, the city of Tulsa will keep control of that, the one that's currently in the basement at the police courts building, and there is the still the plan to move it to the public safety center when that building is complete.

So, City of Tulsa will retain possession of their own emergency operations center.

Um, so the high points of the budget are personnel services or personal services, materials and other services, and then of course, you know, any public safety center uh move in the future.

There's the budget, it is in your budget book as well.

Um, sorry, I did not write down the page, but um it is on the screen to walk through.

So our previous allocations with the county was a 263,000 dollar obligation, and you'll see a hundred and sixty-two thousand dollar increase for the FY27 budget, which is four hundred and twenty-five thousand dollars.

Um, that is in the five ones or the personnel costs.

Uh the plan is upon uh the budget approval, and starting July 1st, we will post as a director of emergency management.

I'm currently operating as the emergency manager for the city, but uh the plan is to hire somebody with an extensive background in emergency management certifications, and get somebody who's really credible.

That uh salary point is a the um is it it's in the higher end of the range for that classification, and then we would like to hire a grants or a fiscal fiscally fiscal compliance assistant, uh lots of finances, lots of reimbursements, um lots of uh very nuances that have to do with um the financial aspect for emergency management, and so having that position in there and um having that person with that kind of intimate knowledge is essential, and then a senior administrative assistant, which we were able to allocate uh in the latter part of this fiscal year, and uh currently being it's currently monitored scout check operating in that position, and the plan is just to continue that administrative assistant as well, and then you'll see office supplies training and computer equipment, a lot of this mirrored what uh we were already contributing to TEMA, some of it's a little bit higher, and then a capital cost of a vehicle, which is a Ford F 250, very excuse me, similar to what asset management drives, um lots of equipment to get around, need to make sure that there's a reliable response vehicle um county.

I'm sorry, the previous director was driving a Chevy Paho that was retained by Tulsa County, so we do need a purchase and emergency manager a vehicle, and we need something that's reliable and can get through all the potential disasters that we have here in the city.

I talked a little bit about the positions.

We will retain um the siren system, it's all on the same network.

We currently have a hundred and eight sirens, very few of those are in the county, but because they all run on the network system, we will manage those internally from the city of Tulsa, and then I just have failure to prepare is preparing to fail.

Uh preparedness is the number one thing, obviously, for emergency management.

We can't what if we can't think every possible scenario, but being prepared for it and having um a team that's ready to respond is the most important.

So I will open it up for questions.

Okay, very good.

First of all, we have counselor or cheap.

Thank you, and thank you so much for the work that you do in all of your jobs.

Thank you.

I think we were talking in the last meeting about giving you some more.

Yes.

10 more.

Please, I welcome them all.

You can handle it.

Okay, so the last emergency that we had uh or that I recalled we had some tornadoes or um there was some of the damage 33rd and 81st, we texted back and forth.

It turns out that um I think it was the damage was done at Sapalpo, not in Tulsa.

Um, and yes, we care about Tulsa, not Sepulfo.

No, we care about Sepulpa very much.

But the question is what sort of access or collaboration will you have with Creek County or uh the city of Sepulfo, just in case we do want access to those reports to communicate, you know, for our for those who have districts right on the boundaries, so great question.

Um emergency management, as we know, especially with natural disasters and whatnot, don't contain themselves to specific geographical boundaries, right?

So relationships are very important and coordination with other emergency management, and that's that's part of the layers that go into it is local, state, and federal and how they all operate together.

So not operating operating in isolation, but really working with right.

So coordinating what the emergency mitigation plans are for each jurisdiction, especially those that were adjacent to others in the state that we might work with, and then of course, all emergency managers operate under the men's system, right?

So it's a standardized structure for incident response.

And in your case, Counselor Archie, uh I will say that you know one thing we've really been working on is a communication plan, and trying to make sure that everybody knows and is aware of what the potential, you know, whether it's bad weather coming in, whether it's damage assessments after the fact.

Um one of our challenges as well is everybody's out there taking pictures and putting them up on social media, and so the that response is very immediate when we are controlling the situation that could potentially be ongoing.

So it may appear sometimes that we're behind the curve or we're not aware of what's going on, but we do monitor that we do keep our reports in, and so um I think that's one of the challenges, but our goal is to obviously keep um all of you informed and aware and up to speed of what is um what's going on out there, what has happened out there.

Well, I know I appreciate that.

Uh you talked about um county and state uh city divided up a bunch of stuff.

Um who got more?

Tulsa or or um I think it was based on me because I don't know who got more, but it was an equitable split.

So if there was more of actual physical assets going to one entity, then there was a bigger cash portion, and it also is based on uh the city always paid a little bit more.

We paid about 53%, and the county paid 47%, and so there was a division based on that.

So one of the grants I know the county used a portion of the grant to purchase some equipment, so the remaining balance came to the city of Tulsa.

So there were okay ways to sort of divide it up equitably.

Yes, thanks.

Thank you.

Counselor Gilbert, um, again, I will echo the gratitude of everything that you do.

Um you have a lot under your umbrella, so and you do a great job with everything.

Um, I'm just curious why the split.

Why why did we split with the county?

And why are we doing duplicate services?

So I think um this is I understand that the concern.

Um, we know it was about a year ago that the previous director, um, yeah, we're we're all aware of that.

So, we have who seems like a qualified successor, right?

So, I'm sorry, but it they have like a so it with all the right credentials, etc., without that, who's there now?

That was the county hired that right so um I but that incident opened some doors on some conversations about um moving forward and some some things that were really kind of not working to or necessarily in the city of Tulsa's favor, right?

And I addressed some of those about being very specific to what our needs are, and I can get into those more so, but like we have first responders that go to the city of Tulsa and are on the scene.

So, so when we have our first responders, we always have an incident commander that's in the same structures reporting to them up through the same emergency management.

Um we can tailor our risk mitigation based on what our needs are.

Urban areas, city of Tulsa areas have different needs than more you know, rural type county areas.

I know that there was somebody had told me that there was one time that the former director was out in jinx dealing with an emergency, and there was something in the city of Tulsa that also needed it, and so there was a neglect to the to the city, it allows us to improve our resources, like what is specific to us and our needs in the city, as opposed to what the county might need based again on what their different demands are based on their um different, you know.

They've got we've got urban fires, they've got more, you know, well, cedar trees are thank you fires, yes.

Um, you know, and I think one big thing for us was direct control and accountability as well.

I mentioned that in the beginning.

Um, one hurdle that we found with the previous director was payroll was coming out of county, but they were maybe subject to the policies and procedures of the city of Tulsa.

Um there was it wasn't clearly delineated how there was accountability, and so if there was potentially um an investigation or an HR investigation into any of the allegations, where did that what that path was really kind of just really undetermined?

Um and then it took obviously a joint agreement between the mayor and the county commissioners, and if there was a differing opinion about something, how does that all work out?

Um, and then it's just direct direct control um working for the elected officials, the senior officials of the city of Tulsa who represent their constituents directly and not having to also involve the the county commissioners.

So you said that there was an incident that happened in Jinx that the director was more focused on as something else was happening in Tulsa and neglecting Tulsa.

Can you go a little bit more into what that was?

Just so that we have a better understanding of why we need to have that split.

I don't have the details on that specific one.

Okay, I know that that was brought up at one point that I didn't ask for follow-up details.

I wasn't there and I was a part of that.

Um also um the sirens, um, how how is that going to how is that going to work?

Because if we're having the split with Tulsa County, we have we have a tornado coming in in East Tulsa, it's borderline between broken arrow and East Tulsa.

Who calls the sirens or who sets the sirens?

Is it going to be Tulsa?

Is it going to be Tulsa County for broken arrow?

What happens in that type of situation?

So the tornado sirens are set to be automated based on the predictions from the National Weather Service and their key thresholds that trip those sirens going off.

And if at any point, and I have said this at this table before, the National Weather Service drops a polygon, which is either rotation is detected or wind speeds are at a threshold of 70 miles an hour, and drops a polygon.

If any of that polygon touches the city limits of Tulsa, any city is in four quadrants, that quadrant sirens will sound.

So if the polygon is dropped over the city in East Tulsa and Broken Arrow, both sirens will go off.

So who is setting off those alarms?

Is it us or automated through the network to go out?

So the the National Weather Service is the one that will set them off.

No, once they the networks talk.

So when the National Weather Service says there's a tornado on the ground, it talks to the network and sounds the sirens.

That it is supposed to be automated and go off.

There are redundancies that if that doesn't happen, we can push a button.

I say that, and that's a very elementary, you know, um way of saying that is we can activate those from the EOC, we can activate those from a remote location, and the final redundancy is 911 has the ability to set those off as well.

One it one thing we came up with as we were kind of working through this whole process was that James Plumley for seven years sat at the EOC every single time there was severe weather.

He was the only person that knew how to set the sirens off.

You know, other folks, first responders, to be able to be in that room, so we don't have to depend on one person to do it, right?

Um, so yes, I just want to have it clear that where this where the boundaries are of our sirens as opposed to Tulsa County.

I mean, because that's part of the split.

So I mean, you're not going to be pushing the button if a tornado is going to be hitting broken arrow.

If it's correct, unless it touches any of the the warning touches the city of Tulsa.

But we we I mean, we're so close together.

That's and with and with Councillor Archie bringing up Sapulpa, it just made me think about well, what about our the border lines of the suburbs that we touch?

I mean, and jinx as well.

I yeah, I think the likelihood of it a tornado being so close to the city of Tulsa and not touching the city of Tulsa is a very rare opportunity.

I mean, I I think it's I mean, there's there's been plenty of East Tulsa tornadoes that have been right there on the border of Tulsa and Broken Arrow.

Um, so um these um emergency management employees.

How many were there again?

We have three current though, one's already on full-time, yes.

What are they going to be doing when they're when we don't have severe weather?

I mean, I asked this question earlier in our one o'clock.

So, and I was told to ask you during this meeting.

Sorry.

So, it's my one, blame him.

He didn't want to run your so emergency management is much bigger than just weather.

Oh, I know.

It was talking about droughts, we're talking about fires.

We're yes, let's flood it.

So we're talking about, I mean, potential, um, you know, data breaches.

We're talking about potential social events, terrorist organizations.

I mean, they do help on some large-scale special events as well.

Um, it is, I mean, it was there were four full-time employees at Tema, I believe there were four.

Um there is so training, certifications.

Like I said, there's a nuance on financial impacts.

Um, we have started with the administrative assistant, uh, Monica is working on helping transition this build this up, but she is also helping in other public safety aspects.

Um, she's housed up on the 15th floor.

Um, she is more than willing to go to work and do what's needed for her, so she has been a great help.

And because police fire, even animal services.

We saw it with the cold weather, all touch on emergency management, and so utilizing her and those kind of capacities to help out is has been very helpful.

So you already have a person in place for the direct as the director of no, I have the administrative assistant and okay in place.

Okay.

We will hire the director this summer after the fiscal year comes out or the budget.

Yeah.

So is that um are people applying for that or is it?

So we will work with human resources to develop um an announcement.

We will post it internally just like we do every other city council position.

Um, it's a merit-based system for selection, and if nobody internally is a qualified candidate or get certification, then we will post it externally.

I am confident we can find somebody that will do uh just as good a job if not better than we've had in the past, okay.

But it will be, I mean, open uh for the everybody within this that works for the city of Tulsa to apply for it, absolutely.

And if you don't find somebody within that pool, then you will outsource it.

I mean, the application process.

We will post it externally with the processes that HR has in place, yes.

All right, that's all I have for now.

Thank you.

Counselor Bellis.

Uh yeah, a few questions, I think.

Hold on, writing down another one.

Um, going back to the you know, you mentioned some of those reasons for splitting off and having to do with like right making sure that we're getting the right kind of focus, um, and concerns about accountability and things like that, which I could definitely understand though.

I know it's like we're standing up a whole department, so that's a lot of like additional costs to us.

Um so I'm just trying to think about what gets us like, of course, the best service.

And I'm curious was there like was there a look at renegotiating the contract to add in more accountability markers?

Like, I just wasn't sure if there was like a kind of a longer process before deciding to make a split.

Um there were conversations about what that would look like.

I know that there was a joint HR investigation that was done over some complaints and some issues that were going on at Tema.

Um I think it was just there wasn't a lot of alignment between the two, and I I think there was just really a we're we're gonna go in different directions and have you know to take these in different approaches.

So I I really didn't feel, and I kind of get the impression after meeting with the county commissioners.

I don't want to speak for them that that was the joint, you know, consensus, okay.

That's helpful.

Um, is there um related to it this might just be like in like one year compared to the next year as you guys kind of like staff up?

Um, are there because I know there's so many certifications and things that are part of doing emergency management across per year plant all sorts of different types of uh emergencies?

Are there um trainings and certification costs built into like to both okay to both years or yeah?

So the budget does have some training in it.

Um my goal is to obviously bring in uh an emergency manager that's got all the certifications and credentials.

Um but yeah, training and recertification is a big part of that.

Yeah, because I know that I'm just because I was also wasn't sure with some of the things that we were cost sharing before, or that might have been a cost burden more on the county than us, like where some of that, you know, here but there's like equipment things or some of that.

Um I think it's hard to wrap my mind around like you know, where if you know, we're paying more and getting better services, or I think right now, especially because we still need to staff up, like transparently it's kind of like we're spending it maybe a bit more on the trajectory too and might have re reduced services to some degree.

Um you said so you have an admin assistant right now, right?

What bucket of dollars is that one out of?

Um, it is in an emergency management, but okay.

So, some of the money we've recouped from county, we have we have identified or built it, and so okay.

Um, and then you mentioned um, you know, like the audit for the sirens, which I know it's like there have been some like one or two wacky siren experiences people have, you know, it happens.

Um I you know, it wasn't like the same as like that time in Hawaii wherever I got text messages, so we're could be worse.

I was curious though, um, you mentioned that there's like this automated aspect for what was happening with the county.

Do we know we're we're sirens like within letting it be automated national weather service monitoring, and then that automated okay, the sign's gonna go off if this, then this, or were there people also actively monitoring like is I just wasn't sure if it we're always like the National Weather Service do that and pass on to us or are there like people on staff or had there been people on staff at the county who are also actively monitoring because I know first it's like the Father's Day storm it's not like anyone saw that coming or you'd need much more micro attention to have caught that.

Okay so I'm gonna try to get all your questions it's okay I can go back to the I'll address your text messaging yeah um and we are working on a communication structure um I know that that is something that Monica is working on and we have tried to send out those slides and I have asked that if those are not what if you there's more information that you want please let us know because we are building that I know VOCs to go out I know Everbridge has to go out we are exploring what those officers are going to look like and once we get the department you know staffed and and running we will we will have all of that in place and be sure to let you guys know what that looks like.

National Weather Service automation National Weather Service automation um so I just wasn't sure if there was more specific monitoring that was happening separately from letting that automation play out yes so when I say that they're automated so we've had several so far this year it seems like we've had an early spring with our weather when there are the when there are not just thunderstorms right we live in Oklahoma we have thunderstorms but when there are threat levels elevated threat levels of potentially damaging winds lightning hail tornadoes we I don't want to say activate because that's a a different I know there's different levels of we will we will monitor so we have had folks in the EOC during these events I was there Friday evening when the big hail storm rolled through there are the ability to actually push the button is in that build is in there right so we've got National Weather Service conversations.

One of the big things is we there's a there's a Slack channel with a lot of communication that goes on and there are the the notifications of we are going to issue so when counselor archie's example about the West Tulsa there was we are issuing a tornado warning for Tulsa County.

So we were like all right here we go watch make sure that the automation's working and when it's not then you need to you know take the the measures but there are folks in the EOC it's a very small contingency um but it is usually an IMT person from the police department uh Bill Smiley from the county and typically uh Derek Loto has been in there from 911 and then fire has representation as well so that's yeah that's not a full scale activation yeah I would invite any of you to come down and look at that if you're more curious about what it looks like during a storm maybe potentially this weekend from what we're looking at Saturday.

But I'm happy to show it to you and then a full scale activation of course is the room is full and that's helpful because I was curious you know I know we like with federal cuts to the National Weather Service and they're like moderating teams like I know they have reduced capacity too so any like you know it's reassuring to hear that there's also those kind of contingencies and necessary kind of like built-in resilience things for being able to activate something if we notice something that maybe they haven't caught that's what I was kind of concerned about.

I also it sounds like though it's helpful with the context that there was kind of maybe like this mutual agreement to split at that time though part of his also hearing right as we're getting ready to staff up now I'm kind of could you offer some reassurance to be that for the past year we haven't had significantly reduced capacity for emergency operations.

It kind of sounds that way I am very confident okay that we have had the right people in the room and doing the right things okay that's okay we have so yeah between police fire, um, you know, the folks that we've got.

I am extremely confident that we've done a met our our name.

Okay, that's that's and moving forward until we get this bully stood up.

Then I am confident as well, counselor.

Yeah, okay.

No, that's really good.

And then okay, so from what you're mentioning, just as a last question related to the um like slack messaging thing.

So we are still in communication with the county's team, like you know, all the different area management organizations are talking to each other and yeah, absolutely, and that's important, and that will never stop regardless of whose command structure it's under.

You know, it's Rogers County, it's you know, broken arrows, EM.

Um, you know, there are there's constant communication.

And then, of course, their shared resources.

If you'll remember back in March, Beggs got hit.

We are we are the big hub in northeastern Oklahoma.

We sent folks down there to help with the rescue and recovery on that, and so those asks will always continue to come in as the you know, big entity on that, and it's that's what makes emergency management, you know, so niche and unique is um yeah, you really have to coordinate it's a balance between looking out for your individual needs and also looking out for uh you know the regional and state as well.

Yeah, you know, tornadoes don't acknowledge municipal boundaries, so that's good.

Oh thank you thank you.

That's only counselor deck direct.

Thank you.

Um we had talked before, and so I just want to amplify what the commissioner said.

Our nearby municipalities are already doing this, which was new information for me.

I think sometimes when we think about county, we think they're doing broken arrow loss and all of them, but they've been independent, and so this that was a little reassuring to me that like that was we weren't the outlier, you're right, and 85% of Tulsa County's um populations in our city.

So, uh I appreciate you.

You know, we're um the uninitiated just kind of responding.

So I will do want to amplify this is a 61.6% increase in um the fiscal 27 plan.

You know, we've heard why.

Um I think there's an error in the map on page 23 because in fiscal year 28 this added position of deputy directors coming in at 113 and then there's some 40,000.

I'm just trying to understand how we add 113,000 position, but we only add 40,000 from this fiscal to the plan year.

So, capital because we have a that capital costs for our lower local dominator three.

I don't know.

At the bottom of page 23, it says next year you're gonna add a deputy director for 113,000, so it'll be four people on staff.

Yeah, or is that just like at a certain percent of the salary?

Christy's looking at it if you can get Christy a minute.

Yeah, yeah.

And then she may have a some of its capital.

Sure, I understand.

Come on up, Christy, please.

Anyway, while you're looking at that, is there a reason that you don't want to just add the deputy straight out?

Is it just a financial reason or yeah, I think there was just a you know, financial growth reason of we know that there's still startup and um so just for my colleagues, I think this will be closer to a half a million dollar venture once we get fully stopped up, and that's just something to be mindful of.

It sounds like we don't really.

I mean, I'm just gonna say it sounds like we really don't have an option if they just dissolved with the county, yeah.

I feel like we're being told we get to vote on a thing, but it's already happening.

Yeah, it's happened.

The train is pulled out of the station largely.

We don't have a choice, which is a little interesting, right?

It was on the mayor's signing agenda today that we're gonna stay in a county agreement as it was conceived.

Um, so I find that so it was done before the budget was approved.

I find that interesting, and you know, we already have the senior administrative assistant on staff right now, so um those are things I have questions about, just how we find ourselves backed into a corner in this way.

I'm I'm not opposing or in disagreement that it's probably better for our city to take this on for ourselves, um, because of the accountability pieces that you talked about.

Uh the grants fiscal compliance assistant is a pretty low wage compared to the other ones, and I'm just wondering if that is conceived as just purely administrative, and the only reason I'm flagging it is um government grants have a lot of boxes to check, and I just know a few years ago we had an incident where as I understand it, things were not tracked properly, and we did not get we were not eligible for the FEMA reimbursements, and that negatively impacted some of our larger partners in the homelessness space, and they're still struggling to close that gap.

I see Mr.

Smith sitting behind the uh counselor Lakin.

So it would be crucial that that grants compliance assistant really can manage all of that.

And I just wonder, you know, yeah, it's like AT 28 and it's a 46,000 dollar year job.

Like that's pretty entry level sounding.

And when we're talking millions of millions of dollars on contract reimbursements, I just I want to flag that because I know that our nonprofit partners that step into those spaces a lot of the times then get left holding the bag, and I just don't think we can continue to do that with them.

And I'm guessing that the grants will be primarily through FEMA, maybe some state reimbursements or matching grants or something.

So can I comment on both of your points?

So I want to go back to the timeline for everyone.

Um the discussions with the county about moving forward started the day.

I don't have the specific date, but the date of the former director's arrest, sure.

Um, I was actually up there that afternoon, and he showed up on the ninth floor of the county building.

It's his access card hadn't even been turned off yet.

So those discussions started almost 10 or 11 months ago.

Um, moving forward, it there were so it was, but it wasn't just because of him not like him having a criminal issue.

It wasn't like that just that created that opened the door for the company.

Okay, because I was like obviously that's one major personnel problem, but okay.

The position's been replaced every time.

Right.

It's it opened the door about what what are we gonna do moving forward?

Right.

And so those conversations took place.

I I realized what the perception is that it's on the mayor's signing agenda today, so I want to give some background.

It is completely coincidental that it was on for today that was not aligned or strategic or anything.

Um legals involved.

There are several iterations of contracts going back and forth.

I will say that Jen and Christie, it was a tedious process going through the financials as well as some of the IMT folks and some of the um fire guys and Bill going through literally the junk in the EOC that had been down there for 30 something years, um, and so it was not it didn't go our goal was to have this done by January 1st.

It just didn't work out that way.

The county commissioner signed this two weeks ago, we would have had it on the signing agenda last week.

They forgot the front page when they signed it, so they had to re-sign it the following week.

So there's I just wanted to be transparent and put that out there that there's not any kind of plan in place to have it signed today before this presentation.

So, and then counselor to your uh points about the grants.

We know we have to get that right.

We understand that we have felt the impact of getting that wrong.

I worked with HR, we looked at kind of where that is uh in the workflow and classification system, and that's where it fell.

Um, I know that we have had several folks reach out about hey, you're standing up an emergency management office.

I'm interested.

So I am confident that we're gonna find really good folks, and we know what's happening on the federal level with the shift with FEMA.

There may be some folks looking for a job as well.

So hopefully capitalize on that and get the best people in there that have the city's best interest.

Can you just clarify this plan year is going up 40,000 or is it 113 plus 40?

So 153.

Oh, yeah, what's the salon?

Plan years going up 117, so on that very top line, it's going from 306 to 423, and that's one 117,000 dollars, and that is described down in the FY28 changes as 4,000 for benefit and compensation adjustments and 113 for the deputy director.

Um that 42, they I think you're referring to the first line.

No, I was just looking from fiscal year 28 changes for operation at the bottom of the page, and then on the next page, the other.

Is that all contiguous?

Okay, one, two, three.

This all goes together and ends up at a 40.

Yeah, so okay, that's hard to extrapolate from a page term, but now I've bought it.

Yeah, it looks like this was a total, and that there was another total.

So even with adding the new position and the other computer and all that stuff, it's just a 40,000 dollar increase.

And that's because of the capital.

This in FY27, we're one vehicle.

Yeah.

And so then next year it's not there to that in a lot of.

It's not really if that so these one-time expenses that we're realizing this year will then become an ongoing expense in a staffing position of 113.

113 will be ongoing, yeah.

Okay.

So I retract my half a million.

It's 465, at least for 843.

Okay, are you done?

Guessing the deputy might want a vehicle too.

No, I'm just gonna guess I'm done.

Councilor Lakin.

Um some of my questions have already been asked or stated in a different way.

Um I'm just still a little bit um, I don't know, concerned about the actions.

We tour cities where we intentionally tour cities where city and county governments have moved, and now we're unmerging not just this, but the 911 center.

So this is at least the second time we've done it.

Um sheriff's office says 911 versus being, right?

That's been years though.

That's a few years back.

Yeah, but but still, I mean, the the chamber intentionally takes takes us to places where city and county governments are cooperating rather than acting independently.

So I don't I don't know if I can properly assess like so for 150,000 extra, what's our return on investment?

So we're spending 150,000.

What are we getting for that extra 150,000, if you will?

Yeah, no independence is one of them.

I've heard that.

Yeah, it's and the accountability and really just being able to be more strategically focused on what the city of Tulsa needs are, um, making the city of Tulsa our priority.

Um I will say that the city and county Tema was an outlier, it was in a vast minority in Oklahoma.

Oklahoma City does it, and I'm what do you mean?

Oklahoma City has a city emergency manager and an Oklahoma County emergency manager.

Or broken arrow Owasso, you know, so we were it probably the only that still had a city county um emergency management system.

Um I I don't I I could speculate that we would be paying more into TEMA in this budget year simply because we would be replacing a director and the price of the director is a little bit um I mean to be marketable, right?

We want somebody with certifications, we want somebody that meets the standards, and there's a a market demand for that, and so I can't anticipate what growth would have been asked if we were still at TAMA, so I'm not sure it's a full 162,000 dollars.

I believe he was a 91.

Yeah, what was posted?

Wasn't it super high, which is well below marketing for the managers.

Yeah, so we could have been going up 70,000 or so compared to 150 in this case, and then I'll always have to continue to dig.

I was I I am concerned whenever we do have to make these decisions like what if we just as a council said no, we're not gonna appropriate anybody toward this.

That was gonna be my next question.

I mean it's it's a possibility like if we don't like this decision that's been made, but we don't have that luxury, we have to do it.

So it's a it's a catch 22 position, um, probably unless there are things that I can't think of at this table that we cause it.

We wouldn't we wouldn't do that, but we're also caused to do something that could could potentially be less efficient.

I'm not saying that because I haven't really studied it.

That's why you're here, and we're just discussing it.

Um help me think through like I don't know if you were involved in the EOC whenever we were sitting down there in 2019 watching the you know waters rise to nearly 300,000 cubic feet per second, but there's everybody crammed into a very small room.

County officials, fire officials, sheriffs, senators, PSO, ONG, you name it.

Okay, so what happens now?

2019 happens again.

Where are we?

Are we in two different places?

Our fire and our fire and police for the city of Tulsa sitting in one facility, and sheriffs and no, we still have a joint command in one location.

Okay.

So the the sheriffs, the county does plan to stand up their own EOC for county operations, we will operate out of our EOC as the joint command until we get a brand new one at the public safety center.

And then we'll all fit in there much better.

Okay, so if if some big regional disaster happens, they all come to our place.

So we're not trying to staff two different centers at the same time.

Costs should not go up for us in that scenario because we have to be two places at the same time.

Okay, and neither does PSO or O and G or okay, those other entities.

The coordinated response is what's the important part and having everybody in the same room, same communications and the same planning and strategy is what makes that successful.

So that is important.

Yeah, good.

Okay.

I I think that that was my major concern.

I keep in my head around the return on investment yet.

But it's not because of the way you've answered the questions.

It's I'm trying to I'm trying to assimilate your information into what I'm thinking about this, given that you know we all are focused, regardless of our background, we're all focused on saving money and using money most efficiently.

So I just need to figure out how this is more efficient.

Well, how this is more efficient, or the outcomes are better, or both or city and county.

Okay.

That's all we have, Commissioner.

Okay.

Thank you.

Thank you.

We appreciate you being here.

Okay, number four, discussion with Healthy Minds policy initiative and partners on city budget considerations for addressing treatment needs of Tulsa adults experiencing the homelessness, serious mentality.

I'll get your stuff in.

I requested this agenda item because I know that we keep asking about uh different monies and different pots going to different things, and is me.

We just need a better understanding of what we have funded, what we haven't funded, what we might need to fund in this arena.

And so um had a meeting with Zach Stoikhoff, and um after talking with him and seeing his presentation, I thought it was very worthwhile sharing with you all so that we can ask questions.

So with that, I welcome Zach to the table.

And welcome to you.

Yeah, thank you, Counselor Zach's like now President CEO of Healthy Minds Policy Initiative.

It's so good to see you all twice in one day.

We had the big press conference earlier to announce some work that we've been doing for crisis response with mental health and public safety also.

I got my colleague Mark Smith from Housing Solutions here, who has some expertise in the the homelessness service side of things that I thought might be valuable for this conversation.

Um so what I'd like to do today, as the counselor said, is walk through with you some research that my organization, housing solutions and others have been doing to really look at what is it that Tulsa needs to really address this problem of the confluence of mental health and homelessness, right?

So if you've got somebody who has a serious mental health issue and they are experiencing homelessness.

What is a system look like for that person for that person?

And I think what we've done in the past is we've really looked at the homelessness continuum and what kind of housing and things like that that we need.

And we've looked at the mental health continuum and what what all of our residents need in terms of mental health care.

What we wanted to do, and I think what is unique about what I'm going to present to you today is we wanted to look at where these two systems sort of coalesce and intersect.

And what does it look like for them to be highly coordinated and really addressing this challenge?

I know that we've been, I serve on a way home for Tulsa, the coordinating committee for federal funds for homelessness services and housing in Tulsa.

And I know from that work that we're housing more people than ever, but I also know that we're seeing folks who have mental health challenges.

And this is we all understand a relatively small percentage of those who are experiencing homelessness.

However, we all want to solve that problem.

We want to get folks help who need help, and we can't have these conversations in silos or in discrete buckets.

If we're talking about those folks who have these two needs combined, we've got to talk about how the system needs to be combined to kind of to work on that.

I want to walk through just briefly if I could.

Do they have this?

Sarah's gonna pass yourself.

That's up there.

So this is what you all heard earlier today, because it's really the foundation of what we're gonna talk about.

Is what we've done in Tulsa to really work on folks who have mental health emergencies.

How do we deliver the right support at the right time to people who call 911 and we need copes or whoever to go out and respond?

How are we creating a coordinated system here?

Because I think it's relevant that we look at that level of coordination for the entire system.

And we've got some things to celebrate today.

Today we announced that Tulsa has effectively seen a 54% decrease in police going out on mental health, primarily mental health calls.

When someone calls 9-1 center with primarily mental health issue, they need police 54% reduction.

And it's not that we're delivering no help, we're delivering the right kind of help in this situation.

We're getting a mental health clinician on the phone who's invited at the 9-1-1 center, we're sending out an alternative response team, or just mental health folks, clinicians, um, to go respond to those needs, and essentially diverting away from traditional first responders to the tune of 89%.

So 89% of the time, if you call 911 center with a mental health need, our system and protocols say you don't actually need police and fire, you need a mental health clinician, and the city is saving uh by a conservative estimate, uh half a million dollars, I'm sorry, uh yeah, half a million dollars on that, I think 400 some thousand dollars on a year.

And that's conservative because we don't even know or calculate the impact on you know legal costs and things like that associated with with taking a mental health-centric approach.

Um why is this important?

Because it's where I'm gonna start.

Um, as we go through this chart here, what you're looking at on the screen is really a visualization of what is a combined and coordinated system for folks who have serious mentalness and homelessness.

What does that need to look like?

We would expect virtually every community in America to have services aligned with each of these buckets.

We would expect the appropriate level of services in each individual bubble that you see here.

Now there's multiple services associated with each bubble, so there might be three or four different things that we're doing under each category, but we want that category to exist appropriately.

So, what healthy minds and our partners did was look at does that essentially exist in Tulsa?

And where are those glaring gaps?

Because, frankly, in any of these streams, these horizontal streams that you see on this screen, you can sort of take an education analogy here.

First grade, second grade, third grade, but if there's a fourth grade gap and we don't have fourth grade, then a lot of students are gonna go through third grade and not be able to succeed in fifth grade, right?

Because they don't have fourth grade.

And what's gonna happen is in the case of homelessness and mental health, you're gonna have people fall through that gap and go straight back to first grade.

And that's what's happening is the waiting room of the street, when we don't have something that can catch them along this pathway to stability, they are going back to the waiting room in the street.

What we are saying is that we need all of this at one time.

And I hate to say that because we all want a silver bullet and we want we all want to know what the one program is that we need in Tulsa.

There's not.

Uh, it needs to be a coordinated system, and we need all of it at the same time to really be working.

I'm gonna walk through a little bit more detail on this, and I'll ask Mark to talk more about the housing and homeless supports line with this.

But what you're seeing here is essentially on the left side of the screen, these are the systems that are designed to catch you in your most unstable uh element, right?

You have an acute need, you are mental, you have a mental health challenge, suicidality, significant drug issues, um, you are a danger to suffer others.

Um, and then we we ultimately want to get you over to the right side of the screen, which is the services that you need to be a little more stable long term, and then ultimately off the screen entirely, so that you're you're stable and secure in the situation that you have.

So what we would expect to see is an evidence-based mental health crisis system.

We heard about that in the press conference today.

You need someone to call, someone to respond who's a clinical support, and a safe place to go for short-term mental health stabilization, medications, one to three to up to five day stay.

That's what a crisis system is, right?

Those three components.

And we learned that there's some things that are working in Tulsa in this side of the spectrum right now.

When you go a little bit further down this, this is where we start to fall off, and you'll see in a moment we've got a chart that shows you where we're falling off.

But what happens when you get released from a crisis center, right?

That three to five day stay.

Are you discharged back to homelessness?

Or are you maintaining your treatment beyond that?

We would expect to see a respite crisis center.

We would expect to see services that can go to you wherever you are, home, community, neighborhood, and we would expect ongoing outpatient services, largely at a certified community behavioral health clinic, but other kinds of providers too.

And as we know, those are, and also we've got family children's career's counseling recovery services, and grand, those are our C C BHCs.

Those services need to be deployed effectively, right?

So if you'll bear with me as I just walk through briefly what each of these things mean, and then we'll get to kind of where the gaps are.

I'm going to pitch it to Mark right now to go through housing services and supports and generally what this continuum needs to look like.

Yeah, so in a similar way, from the homeless response housing services system, if we look at that individual experience crisis, right?

They might need just need some day supports to help figure out what next, or they may need uh shelter as a place to sleep, recover stability.

And you see, as an individual has more progressive, challenging situations in order to get back into housing and be sustainable, that needs to be a more progressive sort of housing resource.

So again, as uh as that kind of mentioned, you're expecting most folks, there's going to be a progressive drop-off, we're going to meet their needs early, they won't need more significant care.

But certainly we all know there's individuals with significant care.

And so that can go from shelter access to more of a transitional space in some stands.

Uh that can be in a facility, or that can be sort of like a short-term supportive intervention.

Because sometimes, you know, just getting someone reconnected, there's not an instantaneous, but if we can give them two or three-month time frame, that'll give the person a chance to maybe re-employ, recover from whatever traumatic incident may happen, and then they'll be supportive from there.

And then for other individuals, it can look like more of a long-term housing need.

These folks are gonna need more time and support for civilian and recovery.

Um, you know, rapid rehousing is typically something one to two-year time frame, affordable housing, right?

These are folks who are gonna struggle to just pay what the market can bring us in terms of units currently, so we need to find something that they're gonna be able to afford on their income.

And supportive housing can be part of supportive housing, so that's a homeless response system term for individuals who are both chronically homeless and have a documented disability, so they're going to have uh likely need some more long-term supportive care.

Support of housing could also be for some individuals, like the end result of the homeless response system, could be assisted living, it could be nursing care.

Like that's really so it's going to be more of like their individual independence is gonna be really, really challenging long-term and having that right intervention.

In a lot of communities, what we see is that permanent supportive housing is really tightly paired with the mental health with the substance use services because there's a housing component, but there's also that healthcare well-being care, and those are really tightly coordinated.

Sometimes it's all in one, oftentimes it's a partnership.

And I think one thing that isn't always here is that sometimes the permanent support of housing is actually the long-term care when an individual has transitioned through the mental health and substance abuse.

So once we've gotten to them to a point of stability, we'll need some long-term support to ensure that they don't fall back into crisis.

But if you have that inventory of housing there for those, yeah.

Thank you, Mark.

This third in the middle here is really, I think an important, an important area to talk about because it's not strictly just the treatment system, it's not strictly just the housing and homelessness system, right?

We feel, and that we've talked with experts ranging from clutch to other communities who have been looking at this and doing this kind of system work, that you do need this element of mobile outreach and engagement that looks like a similar spectrum of in community from light touch to we're trying to connect you to the early interventions and the services like we do on the outreach side, all the way to we want to get you employment skills and get you connected to jobs.

And we see a lot of gaps typically in communities in this in this space, and we'll talk about that in a minute.

But really, this is the transition between the two.

This often, these services often float with you wherever you are, whether you're in transitional living all the way into affordable housing, or whether you're in a crisis system, you're getting connected to work here.

Because we really do want to see both the horizontal kind of flow appropriately, that you're getting transitioned between you know to the next level, next grade, so to speak.

We also want to see the whole the vertical flow.

So that if you're in day supports, you know, you're connected to the crisis system.

I mean, that's a rough way to look at it, but but there's this sort of connection between the housing side and the treatment side that needs to be there.

And often this is how we do that.

Zooming out a little bit, actually, on that front, um, the complicating factor is we could actually, and I didn't say this before, and I'll tell you that I lied to you, we could have every single one of these bubbles at capacity and strong, and still not be solving the problem.

If they're not coordinated, if people are falling in the cracks between the referrals, if they're trying to go from one level to another and they kind of fall through, that's where a lot of the problems happen.

Um, and if you're not coordinated with the criminal justice and legal system, because that is both an entry point and uh frankly a way for some individuals to get access to care and services.

So, what you're seeing added to this chart at the top is a reflection of what of really three components of a coordinated system that we need to see in Tulsa and in every community.

We need to see somebody who's looking out for their safe transitions between levels of care.

Are there is there a recognition that each of these bubbles is operated by a totally different kind of provider in many cases, and are they sharing or there are collaborative data sharing agreements that we can talk about this?

Which is hard to talk about individual clients when there's uh private health information involved, right?

With HIPAA, we've got to talk, we'll look at that.

And that these organizations are actually coordinated.

And what do I mean by that?

What I mean by that is it's nobody's job to look at this, what we're looking at right now and say, is this healthy in my community?

It's been nobody's job to look at homelessness services, housing, mental health, and outreach at all of it together, and is this working well?

The providers and the the community partners and players involved really need to have a place to coordinate and look at that, look at the health of that.

Like we do on the crisis side, when police fire, MSA, mental health, they get together at the first responder advisory council and they look at the crisis system and they say, is it healthy?

And are we transitioning people appropriately?

Are we looking at the data?

That needs to happen as well.

Emergency detention on the bottom, court-ordered outpatient, alternative courts are ways that the criminal legal system interacts with this housing and treatment system.

As you know, a police officer or a license mental health professional can order someone into compeled treatment if they are a danger to themselves or others.

At times that's appropriate.

A court, a civil court, can be petitioned by family, for example, and order you into court-ordered patient, and there's specific services that we have to do this, that can be a tool.

And then alternative courts for individuals who have felony convictions who uh may have an opportunity to reduce that felony charge if they go through treatment and there's sort of a carrot in a stick approach.

All of that is an appropriate and healthy part of a functioning system, and that needs to be coordinated as well.

Moving into what we really we feel like we need in Tulsa, and really the point I think of this conversation is to sort of look at, and we wanted you all to have a not only an understanding of the framework of what a community ought to have, but in Tulsa a relative idea of where the gaps and strikes are.

Because we've got some good things going on and some gaps.

And just to go here, so what you're seeing is a color coding indicating that those outlined in blue generally are strong.

They're not perfect, and in fact, in every blue box here, I could tell you about scale and quality issues that we need to improve.

But compared to the others, it's a relative strength.

Okay, a yellow box would be it is a it is partially existing in Tulsa, that service, or it is just an extra relatively extreme need in terms of scale or quality.

And then red is it is not here at all.

And this is a major gap where people are gonna certainly fall through and go back to that street waiting room.

So starting at the crisis side, there could be an argument to be made here that we're not entirely blue.

And the reason I'll say that is because although the last year we've worked hard to divert 54% of police calls, we're getting more people mental health care.

But the reality is that there's still a chunk of the 911 calls that come in that are not benefiting from the mental health diversion program that we've set up.

And that is that is not anybody's fault, and that is a challenge that we're working through right now.

And what I mean by that is that if you call and you say police fire medical, I want police, you get the benefit of this wonderful 911 housed clinical support.

If you say medical, you go to the MSA call center.

It doesn't interact with the diversion program that I just described.

So by policy, MSI is going to send police out most of the time to a mental health call, they're gonna send an ambulance out actually 100% of the time.

On the other side, we only need to send police out 89% of the time, right?

And again, that's not at all a criticism of EMSA, who's at the table and very actively working on this problem earnestly actually with us right now.

And I think they're actually at the first responder advisory council meeting happening currently.

So this is an active area of work that I think they're very supportive of.

But the reason I bring this up is because if about 40% of the 911 call volume intersecting mental health is going to EMSA and we figure out a way to get the mental health side plugged into that, which we think we will, we're gonna see about a 40% increase in demand on our mental health provider, which is family and children's services, which operates the COPS program.

That is not possible under the current state funding environment.

So if we want to not just solve 60% of the need, we want to solve 100% of the need.

Family and children's has provided a budget for how we would potentially staff up to do that.

They would need to add a mobile response team.

They would need to add additional staff at 911 center.

Um we would be looking at a need of about 800 to a million dollars annually to staff up to do that to again get us from 60 to 100% of the need.

Um I have that budget if anybody's interested in that and happy to pass it out.

Yes, please.

So what you what you're saying is someone DAO's 911 for them to access COP, which we're we finished celebrating just, we're all celebrating, uh, they would need to request police for five.

But if they but if they if they request um paramedics, then they wouldn't have access to the to the coach uh resource.

So a couple of ways that happens.

You may answer police right away, say I don't have mental health needing police, and then you'll get it you'll immediately get you know through this this model.

If you immediately say medical, then they're gonna shift you to ENSA.

They don't want to waste a second any possible time when we know this needs to be there.

There's a good reason for that.

Now, if in the course of this early conversation the call taker at the 901 center does identify it as mental health, they're gonna put it through the mental health reconstruction.

Yeah, it's just if you immediately say medical, and that's the piece we're gonna work out.

EMSA is a great partner in that.

But when we do, again, we we would have no ability to staff up to meet that extra 40% currently today.

Okay, and I think it's important to realize that family and children's is essentially providing this core city service for their charge to the city just out of their own funding, um, and it's saving us money, right?

And we should look at that.

Hang on, are you done with your presentation?

I've got more to go through, but if there's questions on this or actually, I think it's about this slide.

I can I can finish going through the slide or happy to take a look at.

Let's go through the finish your slide and then we'll come back.

I got you.

Okay.

Um then if I could just briefly, Counselor Bellis, if you're gonna ask about what I just handed out, um, just so the council knows this left-hand column that's titled TPD, what they mean by that is a bad thing.

We need a rename this.

What they mean is that's the current police centric mental health diversion system that they are currently funding out of their own budget.

Um, medical would be if you say medical at the 911 center, that's the piece that we don't currently have funded at that.

And then there's the additional mobile response, just so you know what you're looking at.

Um, and then going back to this chart, um, so on the treatment side, our biggest gap here where we have nothing at all is what we would call behavioral health medical respite.

Um, this is an evidence-based model where if somebody who particularly is experiencing homelessness comes out of our crisis system or is discharged by an emergency room, where do we send them?

Do they need a longer length of stay somewhere?

And usually the answer is yes.

Because three to five days is not enough to straighten out many years of mental health challenges.

And 30 days is not enough, but 30 days is often enough time to start the family reunification process to get somebody sober and to start thinking about long-term solutions for their life.

And it can be transformational in that 30 days where the treatment folks and the case managers really know where somebody is.

We actually just took some folks out to a model in Denver that does this.

They have a crisis center, and then the second floor is a respite center where people just get discharged to the second floor and they're there for 30 days, and they're working on housing for them during that 30 days, but they're working on treatment too at the same time.

They're trying to get them ready to take that housing, right?

So I think that's an important model.

We just don't have it at all.

And Mark, I don't know if you can comment on the things of that.

I think that's one of the challenges we use, you know, you where you would say high utilizers, and there's been a lot of work on high utilizers of these individuals who are going frequently into crisis care for sometimes even into the jail, right?

Because that crisis can result in uh justice involvement, and then you're seeing a re-release, and so those individuals are kind of cycling back into the street, or they may be cycling into a shelter, and then there's a crisis happening because the acuity of need, right?

Somebody can, if we go into a sobering set or a crisis facility, they may achieve sobriety in a short period.

Um but if you're especially if you're dealing, kind of I'm looking at Zach here with a co-occurring mental health condition, right?

There just needs to be time for that treatment to start to take effect and then what can happen next.

And so I think you hear this from homeless response service providers.

They talk about individuals that are like really, really high acute needs that like we're not equipped to serve their needs, like right, and you've seen different aspects of that we tried hotels or we tried other types of transitional space, um, but you know, that part of having like the intensive treatment portion is a pretty significant gap.

Zach mentioned for many of those folks, that could be a reconnection of family and then ongoing care.

It might be now that a person is at a level of stability, the other interventions and homeless response system can meet their need.

But if we can't get some of these like really acute issues up to a baseline, then this is where we continue to kind of see the cycle.

Yeah, thank you, Mark.

And then moving along here, um, we have a relative lack of these intensive services that can meet you in your home and community.

We've got some of them, largely at the CCBHCs.

Moving down to the middle row, um, we've got street outreach teams, okay.

Um, I'm not saying they're deployed everywhere they need to be all the time, but relative strength compared to the others.

Intensive case management and assertive community treatment are two I really want to focus on here.

So, what we need are something a little that looks like a mobile team that's able to provide wraparound supports for people, everything from medical to mental health to social services to you know job connections, all of these things sort of combined, and many times communities don't have this.

We have the outreach teams that don't provide long-term case management in that way necessarily.

They can connect you with with other folks who can provide pieces of it, but a team that can really be with you through this process of getting stable and connected to housing and treatment, right?

And be with you ongoing.

Intensive case management would be a term to cover anything that is that level of case management, those other supports surrounding somebody who isn't necessarily very seriously mentally ill, could help those individuals, but if you are very seriously mentally ill, you need something called an assertive community treatment team.

This is a decades-long approach that has been well studied.

It is nothing innovative or new.

It is a tried and true approach that is a mobile hospital room that goes and meets you where you are, that is available 24-7, that if we're doing the model right, is providing all the stuff I just said in terms of in terms of case management, but also psychiatric support and medication, all those things that somebody needs to be stable.

We have and don't have this in Tulsa.

We have lots of ACT teams, we're continually working on ensuring that those teams are you know hitting the mark.

But what we don't have are what we call forensic act teams, and this is a big need that we've identified in Tulsa because for those individuals who are both in this category, they've got serious mental illness, potentially homeless, those who are in and out of the justice system, interacting with police a lot because of a variety of reasons.

There may be a violence risk in a small subset, right?

There needs to be a level of intensity here around the forensic and criminal justice side.

We don't have this at all.

Um, and I will tell you that basically for those who work in the criminal justice system in Tulsa who know about this model, they say this is our number one wish list item is a forensic act team.

Our data indicate we ultimately need to in Tulsa.

But these teams are difficult because they're expensive, they're they're not as expensive as continuing to jail and house people in the ER, but they're expensive, and they have relatively small caseloads because you have to in order to provide that level of intensity for those individuals.

But this is the team when we're looking at somebody who is shouting at the street or you know, making people feel kind of unsafe.

There's a serious mental illness there, and they are homeless.

This is that level of care that we are missing for that individual.

This is what we need.

And we do have a willing partner in family and children's services that Healthy Minds has partnered with to develop a proposal to launch a forensic act team in Tulsa with some of the best national consultants to ensure we get it right in Tulsa.

This is something that we've been working on for a number of months, I think we and telling everybody in town that we've got the model for this, it's ready to go.

Is this in this budget?

No, that's the kind of starting different.

So the forensic act team again saves about 50% of the costs on the hospitalization and jail side and the interaction with law enforcement that gets reduced because we're actually meeting the needs of these individuals.

So I wanted to highlight that as a proposal that has been made to some private funders.

Um, there is some interest in that.

Um, it's not fully funded.

There's not commitment, but there's interest if the city were to come in at a small amount to entice private funders, I think we could get it done ultimately.

Um, and then moving down to housing and homeless supports.

We are about to have a little very overnight shelter.

Mark, would you like to kind of talk through just briefly what and I think this is a lot of more safe move is filling in some gaps too.

Yeah, so you can really look at safe move in terms of the long-term housing support there.

I mean, that's been a huge gap in our community, and there's been this uh this first investment, and I think you've seen in terms of what we need in a sustainable investment there of how to be able to provide enough housing for every individual so they can move off the street.

So those are the areas I think we've talked about a bit with safe move about how we move those individuals off the street and housing, what that level of investment will look like.

Um, and I think that you know, over time and getting to that level of investment and seeing the result, you know, we can get some of that long-term housing, certainly on the rapid rehousing into blue.

Certainly what the city has been working on for quite a bit in terms of our affordable housing, that is another area where through um oh my gosh, I'm I want to say impact Tulsa that's not the uh the investment 75 million into improve our Tulsa.

Started with an I improve our Tulsa and addressing the affordable housing stack, that's another area that we're working to get to blue, and so it helps both areas.

I think with Save Move Tulsa, I can talk about just a little bit of this overlap.

So as we've worked in uh encampments, right?

If we think about those areas, the individuals that we're working with, we're having a 90% success rate of the individuals who are there who are working with outreach, who are moving into housing, and certainly there's co-occurring mental health and substance use issues, but those are individuals who are at a state, right, where they can engage with us, and and they're in a regular place.

Like safe move Tulsa is looking at geographic location.

What Zach is describing is those individuals who, because of their severity of needs, we can go and try to have a conversation, right?

And and it's not and they make they are people who are constantly physically moving, but also physically cycling through these systems, and so that's um again a small percentage of the population, but the acuity that needs the acuity of the impact to the community.

Um their needs not being met is pretty significant.

So as you think about like where we're at blue, where we're at yellow, where we're working towards blue in this collaborative aspect.

Um, this is the I think one of the talk about it shows the progress of the investment that's been made over the years.

Like we're gonna we're addressing the local shelter need, which will be really critical.

How much folks can we avoid needing to move further down this if we can catch them in Chefards?

Create resolution really quick?

Um, and for the folks that we have who are long-term homeless through the investments in safeguard right now, getting them into housing stabilize, making that fast so they can start to recover from that trauma.

This last piece of the really acute mental health substance um uh abuse issues, criminal involvement, having that level of the right level of care so we can get some resolution there.

I think that paired with again the hair medical course, but like we're going to have to get to a point where the earlier interventions can sometimes prevent the need for the more significant, we'll always have to have that.

But we have to do both, right?

We have to invest in the early intervention, and we have to work with some of the really high needs on and co-occurring between homelessness and mental health issues that work with currently.

Very last thing is this top bar that's mostly red, and I will shout out to Dr.

Jabron Pasha and the mayor's health initiative because the collaborative effort that's kind of gone around behavioral health through that work has identified that top area as their number one priority is to figure out this data coordination levels of care transition and make Tulsa leader in that.

I think that's a lot lofty goal.

It's going to take some time.

We don't know how to do it yet.

We're really early in the process of that, but just to point out that that is an emerging priority coming out of that work.

Can I have one extra point here?

Sorry, which is I'll be very brief.

One thing that Zach and I didn't mention is that healthy medicine housing solutions have been working with the CCBHCs and the current supportive housing providers.

So these individuals who are chronically homeless dealing uh struggling with disability.

So we've been working with this providers for over a year now on addressing some of these data challenges where many people who are going into homelessness are actually connected to a CCBHC for services, but because PIP uh for the number the volume, that coordination of care has not always been delivered really well.

And so where we're at now is that every individual that is moving into permanent supportive housing through the partnership or identifying if they already are eligible and are working with a CCBHC.

If they're not, we're getting them connected to that because we know it's really critical, and now there's actually coordination on the actual wraparound services that is happening.

We found a way to, you know, there's a lot of technical aspects about how we can share information, but that's been a significant amount of progress, and that's something that is coming at no cost to the city that's leveraging existing Medicaid uh resources, which is really important.

Um, that's why that's yellow.

That's why that's yellow because of the year's worth of work on that.

Okay, ready for questions?

Absolutely.

I know we're running short on time here, so I'm gonna try to be brief with mine.

Number one, I'm gonna go first, and then um, the counselor had made that.

You talked about the the red up there, the coordinate and somebody doing like we're here, there with things.

I guess my question is: are there any cities that have this type of model where they have one person that's kind of coordinating everything as they go through the bubbles?

And who is that, and are they doing it well?

We are looking into that right now.

We think there's a model out of Dallas we can look at, and there's a community in Illinois that we're exploring as well, but I don't have a great answer for you yet because we're researching that.

Great.

And would you report back when you do find that out?

Thank you.

Oh, thank you.

I have a lot of questions as you guys can imagine.

Um, I'm going to try to condense.

Um, I'm questioning, I'm just gonna throw some points out, and then um, if you need further uh explanation, I'd be glad to email.

So I was thinking of the crisis centers, of which we have very few, if not at two, maybe and short-term beds.

I I'd like a number of the short-term beds that we're looking at for the crisis centers.

Um also looking at uh as I mentioned earlier.

Uh Clubhouse International Crossroads is closing at Tulsa, they were instrumental for helping people with mental illness, create community plus look for jobs, and so we're gonna have an entire population that had a community that's going to now be displaced.

Um that's closing at the end of the month, and of course, more details on a low barrier overnight shelter.

Uh, what are we looking at as far as like number of respite beds?

Um, um I know it's a lot of questions, but these are just things that popped up as I was um listening, as well as partnerships for employment.

Do we have partnerships that we're we're already talking to?

Yeah, okay, and I'd I'd really love more of that information.

And then I'll just close it.

My questions because we are short on time.

So the FAT team, I know that the PAC teams actually took a hit this year due to funding, and they also converted from uh a method of stability to levels, which includes stability and medication, and so this fact team that we're looking at, what does the team consist of?

What are the professionals that would be involved in that?

Would it be case management, a nurse, a psychiatrist?

What are we looking at?

Yes, those three, there's typically a peer or a social worker as well, and then a probation parole officer.

Okay.

Typically is involved.

Psychiatry consults.

Okay.

Yeah.

Okay, and then um, how many teams are we looking at in the in this request?

The proposal is for one, but we ultimately need two until so we think.

Right.

And so one team would consist of say five professionals that would um no more than that, I believe, but I'll have to get back to you on the specific number.

Okay.

And would the court system be involved in that as well?

Yes.

100% on a forensic act.

Okay.

And then would it also incorporate levels like the PAC team, where uh you're utilizing, say, level one for you know three months, six months, and then you move up to look uh level two or three or four, whatever.

I just wondering about the time.

I'll have to look more into the levels.

I think we get in a trap sometimes of putting people on actions too long.

Right.

And what we need to do is make sure that we're graduating people off further into stability.

And so it's one of the things that we would look at with the technical assistance provided by the national consultants we've identified, so making sure that's happening.

What's the time frame that would be the minimal?

Once the funding is identified, we can get one launched in a matter of months.

Yeah, okay.

So we're looking at six months maybe.

Okay.

And then I know that there probably are specific conditions that would put somebody underneath the FACT team.

Um, can you elaborate on that or would it be better to do that via email?

Well, I could just tell you briefly, serious mental illness and um you could add homelessness as a criteria, not necessarily serious mental illness is a criteria for the model, as well as repeat interaction with the criminal justice system and or repeated inpatient hospitalization.

Okay, so repeated felony, misdemeanor, both of those, are we talking like over a year, six month times, yeah?

I think it's lifetime, I believe.

It's designed for individuals who clearly they've had documents, we haven't been able to solve this problem for this individual with the traditional systems.

Okay.

Um I will hold the rest of my questions to email, but thank you so much.

The presentation.

Um I think that's exciting about like, and I know it's not as the need for the um fact teams to go stay let's get some private funding, and we're going to get one team going, see the outcomes and then look at scaling.

Um, I'm curious going back to what it would take to scale the like just kind of cope's integration to work like right, the more medical facing proposal here.

Um just a quick clarifying question.

When you mentioned so this is like the full cost of the program just to family children's okay for the current model, versus the full medical okay.

Um when you talk about this budget and if we were gonna scale it, what it would look like for the city to come alongside that it is can you say the dollar amount, like again that you like would say that it's but you or you would say it to provide stability that it would be coming from the city for this.

Yes, uh you all are the policymakers on this, of course, but what I would say is a third-party just Tulson.

Yeah, is that we have a provider who is providing a service that directly benefits the city and our city services, including stretching the manpower of our first responders, yeah.

And so I I think it's a fair conversation at least somehow.

So just to clarify though, is this the cost just to make sure I'm reading this right?

The TPD side, that's what we have, that's what they're covering right now.

Okay, so the delta for it to be scaled to go full medical.

Would be really the last two columns on the right.

Okay.

Yeah.

Um, so it's the 245,000 dollar number.

Plus the 800.

Plus state age.

Plus the A25.

Okay.

That's a million.

And what we would do is I want to stress too, because F site can be able to do that.

So this is all just scaling cost, but yeah, and it is an estimate.

So if there was a real series, if we want a serious number, we'll get a serious number.

This is an estimate.

Is the TPD?

Sorry, just to make sure I'm understanding.

So the TPD column is it if we were to scale the current model and then the medical ones, if we scale fully to a medical one.

Yeah, so the TPD is what Family Inchildren's is currently paying to do this.

And then the other two columns are if we were to take on the medical side of it and then add the appropriate mental health level response.

Okay.

Wait, when you say take on the medical side, that's in addition.

Like the TPD side stays, and then in addition.

Okay, I went to be helpful.

It's a little confusing, I apologize.

Yeah, no, no, it's okay.

I think it would be helpful to have laid out more.

And then one of my thoughts also, or my curiosity would be acknowledging like kind of you the journey we've even been on when you talk about ART and CRT and it's been iterative and scaling over time.

If there's like a if you guys have recommendations about if we were gonna do part of this over the course of like a year or two and then be able to scale in pieces, just being realistic about, you know, every the nature of everyone's budgets.

Absolutely.

Yeah, I think that would be really helpful to see kind of a hey, if we could try to scale up and meet this need by this year.

Here's a creation of ways we could approach that that's bite-sized.

I think that could be really helpful if you can kind of maybe lay that out as well, just so we can think about okay, optimally to really try to meet a need or scale and build on what we have going just in the next year, if we could just assemble this or maybe add one more you know, like clinical social worker, let's try to do that.

And then in year two, it would be great to scale to this.

I just trying to think through this capacity.

It would just be so helpful if you all kind of had a proposal around that.

Yeah, I think that could certainly be done.

I think to some extent it would you could also start with what is the possible what is possible within the city budget, right?

Yeah.

Um we wouldn't want to pull money from anything else impacting this continuum because that would be robbing meter to pay for what we want to do is if there was 100, 200 or something, we could look at what that could get us and then develop a plan appropriate to multi-year scaling.

Or one of my thoughts is, and Mark, maybe this fits in with some of the recommendations that have come from, like you all and clutch, things like that, where you know if we're having these more upstream interventions really start coming into play and getting less into triage mode, and that's starting to offset those downstream costs that we can like then like if there's a point where it's like, hey, if we've done some of these like very um urgent interventions, which I know this is still like a downstream intervention, simply, but if we've done that and then it frees up some of the dollars we're spending after X amount of time, we're like, hey, we're not in a place where we're closing as many encampments or this or that.

I'm just curious if there's a way to then know that that hey, by this year we'd be able to offset the dollars over towards this one, which I don't know that this is the right thing to you know since this is emergency response, it's probably not the right thing to like delay scaling, but I'm in trying to think about what year the different interventions come online or we scale up, or when one need or dollar amount might sunset, and then we'd want to reallocate those dollars within still the same bucket of kind of right housing compasses mental health, just trying to think about what that flow is on a broader scale, if that makes sense.

Absolutely, yeah.

I think it's a it's it's a little hard for to bring it.

We'll make an algorithm or make a promise uh about some future.

I do think that there's something we said, so currently, just speaking from homeless response system, and this is why I kind of mentioned like you need to have a really effective crisis on all sides, um, crisis and early entry point, and then what we need to do right now, because we have so many people who have like not been had their needs met, whether it's substance use and mental health, whether it's homelessness, whether it's co-occurring, is that we really do have to address it at both ends, uh and this low barrier shells are right, helping to mitigate long-term harm and trauma, and then what we're doing with safety, what's happening with uh permanent support of housing within the way home for Tulsa system is also meeting some of those acute needs.

If we can start to see that shift of really we don't have people who are spending 10 years outside and dealing with whatever uh issues might have been there before they experienced almost just that have been exasperated, like there's a potential opportunity to write that we could see some cost savings uh over time.

We'll I think we'll really have to get there.

Um, you know, if by we really do need to I think you can't just invest on the front end and then not address the most acute, and then if you only address the most acute, but you're not doing so.

Unfortunately, we do have to do both.

I think the part here to mention too is like while these do all have you know, certainly save moves, it is a significant investment for the city, these would be significant investments as well.

There is a part here, like all of these interventions do bring cost savings to the city, and like I think we keep mentioning it first responders.

And so there could be some real savings there or like as opposed to we may not see it on a budget line item but if first responders are then more appropriately able to answer other calls where is that a savings to the community you know whether it's we have an individual that first responders aren't constantly engaging with that they can't meet their need or like we've seen in the encampment decommissioning work we don't have first responders that are constantly responding to a site with you know police and fire calls now that so I would say I think that we can get there.

Certainly if if we can make these investments over time that you know there could be an opportunity to scale down a little bit but it's it's pretty hard to predict that.

Yeah well but I think she's on to the ROI the return on I mean we keep talking about that it's like okay if we're investing a million dollars what are we getting in return and whether it's in savings over here or whatever it's a lot easier to um you know weigh it out weigh it out and justify if we're increasing a budget well here's what we're getting in return right so I think that type of analysis even if it's an estimate or whatever based on what we've known so far today is super helpful.

And I would point out that we have that estimate for the crisis system work which is on that sheet in front of you.

Yeah.

488000 I think is the savings.

That's great.

Maybe if you could um give us I love your fact sheets or one pH right now you learn that.

Something like that I think would be helpful with because this is a complicated system and I appreciate this is what excited me was this all made sense the way you have it laid out but maybe doing this if you invest here we save here type one sheeter would be helpful for us.

Okay.

Emergency room costs EMSA all of that providers going out to mitigate uh an episodic event or crisis you know what does that look like when the Meta Health Association might even partner and intervene in a situation of what is that cost and um I think the the clearest one actually where we have overlap between like the investment and then I want to call seminar and save and tell us the very first one is the first responder time save like now Riverside Patrol about how much they have had to spend less time uh at some of the encampments on Riverside since those have been decommissioned you have the same thing on we haven't actually done a cost estimate I know we have like an hour's weekly estimate and you can certainly put a dollar amount to that but I think yeah if we can put our heads together and try to think of like what what that ROI is and there's some on like homeless services like the cost of housing versus emergency services.

I think this is something you're kind of hitting at the crux of it in many communities this is even at the federal level you have HUD and you have SAMHSA and mental health abuse and home uh health and human services in at the federal level state level local level all of these things are kind of seen as different pillars and what we're trying to build at the local level is that integration so we we might have to cook something up here a little bit.

We do have this research here on the fact teams which show they have a 1.5 times return investment.

That's from national studies.

That's great.

I'm so sorry we're out of time I know we could spend two hours talking about this but I really appreciate you coming and just encourage counselors to reach out to them.

I know you have a lot more questions too and people had to leave for other meetings so you guys are our experts so we really appreciate being here.

Thank you.

Thank you and with that word adjourned.