Good morning.

My name is Ben Weber.

I'm the Boston City Councillor for District Six and the Chair of the Committee on Ways and Means.

Today is May seventh, two thousand twenty six, and the exact time is ten thirteen AM.

I have a few preliminaries to get through here.

So the hearing is being recorded.

It's also being live streamed at Boston.gov slash city dash council dash TV and broadcasts on Xfinity, Channel Eight RCN, Channel 82, and FIOS, Channel Nine Sixty Four.

We strongly encourage residents to engage in this hearing process.

First, you can attend one of our hearings and give public testimony.

You can do so by showing up in person in the hearing chamber, sign up on the sign-in sheet that's near the entrance, and you'll be called on to testify.

The full hearing schedules on our website at Boston.gov slash council-budget.

You can testify by Zoom by either filling out a online form on our council budget review website, or by emailing the committee at ccc.wm at Boston.gov, or by emailing uh Chris Machohan at K-A-R-I-S-H-M-A.CHOUHAN at Boston.gov, and you'll be sent a zoom link for this hearing.

You can also uh come to our public testimony listening session.

We'll have our fourth of four of these, will be Thursday night on May 26th at 6 p.m.

here in the chamber.

When you're called on to testify, you'll have two minutes.

Please state your name and residents or and if you have any affiliation with an organization, name the organization, and uh please watch the clock for when your two minutes are up.

In lieu of test testifying at a hearing, you can also submit written testimony to the committee at ccc.wm at Boston.gov.

Uh lastly, you can submit a two-minute video of your testimony through the form on our website.

For more information on the city council budget process and how to testify, please visit the city council's budget website at Boston.gov slash council-budget.

In-person testimony will be taken after the first round of questions from my council colleagues.

Again, you'll have two minutes to testify.

And if you if you haven't signed up, uh please do so uh here in the chamber or again email our legislative uh uh budget analysis director, Karishma at K-A-R-I-S-H-M-A.CHOU-HA-N at Boston.gov for the zoom link, and your name will be added to the list.

Uh we are having two hearings today uh on docket numbers 0733 to 0740 and 0749 to 0750 on the Boston uh with the Boston Police Department.

Um this morning's hearings, uh well, you know, so hold on.

So the hearings will be with the Boston Police.

We'll cover the Boston Police Department, police revolving funds uh specifically uh this morning regarding to um mental health and substance abuse of response, community policing, firearms, homicides, and the crime lab.

I encourage my colleagues to stick to these topics during questioning this morning.

This afternoon's two o'clock hearing will cover over time the detail system, officer mental health and diversity and recruiting.

So uh, you know, it could be some of the questions could be that you have, could be deferred to this afternoon.

Again, uh so again if you're we have questions about police overtime, the detail system, officer mental health and diversity recruiting.

That will be covered in this afternoon's hearing.

Um these matters were response or we're sponsored by Mayor Michelle Wu and referred to the committee on April 8th, 2026.

I'm joined by my colleagues in order of arrival, Councillor Murphy, Councilor Culpepper, Councilor Braden.

Uh, we've received a letter of absence from Councilor Mejia.

Um we generally waive opening statements from the counselors at our budget hearings, and we will stick to that this morning.

I'm gonna introduce the panel.

Uh we're joined uh this morning by police commissioner Michael Cox, uh Chief of Staff Nicole Taub, uh Chief of Bureau of Administration and Technology, Lisa O'Brien, uh Superintendent of the Bureau of Field Services, John Brown, uh Superintendent of Bureau of Investigative Services, Paul McLaughlin, and Superintendent of Bureau of Intelligence and Analysis, Lenita Kulinane.

Right.

Okay.

So with that uh said, I'm going to oh, we've been joined by uh Councilor John Fitzgerald.

Yep, uh, but there's another John Fitzgerald who's who's here, uh, my constituent so uh from the police department.

So we have two John Fitzgeralds in the room.

Um, so again, thank you, panel, for for coming in this morning, and uh I'm gonna the floor is now yours.

Good morning, Council President Breden, Committee Chair Weber, and the city councilors.

I appreciate the opportunity to testify before the ways of meet committee today today regarding the FY uh 27 operating budget for the Boston Police Department.

Um you've already introduced my panel here with me today, but I want to just start off by saying I appreciate that the proposed 27 year budget represents a significant commitment to our taxpayer dollars for public safety in a time when not only the city uh is facing financial struggles but the state and uh maybe the country as well.

Uh for those who are at home that may not understand that our budget uh is uh represents 89% of it is goes to personnel cost, and 11% of it goes to the operating uh budget of what we do, basically keeping the lights on.

And so we're focused on using our resources efficiently and transparently in ways to support public safety and community trust.

Uh a key area of focus is controlling overtime spending through improve staffing deployment, uh, stronger supervision, and ongoing monitoring to ensure that we're using our overtime appropriately and aligning operational needs.

We are in fact trying to reimagine how we uh look at the work that we do on a daily basis to curtail any unnecessary spending to be as efficient and effective as possible.

We're making progress, but recognize that we we will always have more work to do in this area.

Uh I'm here to share with council and residents that might be watching uh what these operating budget investments mean for our city.

Uh the men and women of the Boston Police Department are committed to building trust with the community and keeping our neighborhoods safe.

Every interaction between a Boston police officer and a community member is an opportunity to build and strengthen trust.

Whether it's responding to calls for service, helping people in crisis, investigating and solving crimes, or proactively engaging with young people as seniors.

Officers are making a difference every day.

We are seeking continued success from these efforts with sustained decreases in crime and violence, making us one of the safest major cities in America.

And we're making progress in building and strengthening relationships with the community, as evidenced by city residents taking more civil service exams and partnering with us in many different ways.

We have significant challenges coming up this year as far as major events, particularly this summer between FIFA, the World Cup, the celebrations of 250th anniversary in Sale Boston, and the many other annual celebrations and events that take place throughout the year.

I can assure you that we are prepared for these challenges as we are every year.

We have extension of extensive operational plans in place, significant experience in managing large-scale events.

Our officers and supervisors and commanders are well trained and equipped with cultural and restraint.

I mean, with a culture of restraint and de-escalation.

The critical work done by our Boston Regional Intelligence Center provides us with the intelligence annual analyst.

We need to deploy resources and adjust real time to prevent and mitigate potential threats to public safety, all while protecting privacy, civil rights, and civil liberties of our constituents.

The Boston Police Department is committed to community policing, building trust with the community, and working in partnership to prevent and reduce crime and fear of crime while strengthening public safety.

Every day of the year and in every neighborhood.

Before we get to our questions, I'd like to give a brief presentation highlighting some of the work that we've been doing and the results of those efforts.

Okay.

All right.

So again, our mission really is about officers are guided by our mission, which is again dedicated to working in partnership with the community to fight crime and reduce fear and improve quality of life in our neighborhoods.

Some of the goals that we have are to prevent and reduce crime violence and fear of crime.

Um we proactively engage in all our communities and connect those in need of services.

We're trying to enhance our professionalism and accountability and improve our public uh police services and operations in general, and of course, we try to take care of our employees' health and wellness in general.

One of the ways in which we're meeting our mission is around efficiencies and accountability.

We are on track for early January January for one of the first milestones that we need to meet for clear accreditation, which is international accreditation, regarding our standards and practices and making sure that they're all best practices within our industry and that we actually do those practices.

Another way that we're trying to make sure the organizational meets this efficiency and accountability goal of ours is we reorganized our organization multiple times trying to align different units, putting our academy and professional development together, and some of our other units to be more efficient and effective, making sure we meet the missions that we're out to do.

We're rolling out a critical decision-making model citywide within the police department to deal with uh mental health issues, at least running across folks that we might see that actually are armed with um with weapons other than firearms that might be having a mental health crisis to make sure that we're able to dis uh de-escalate in a way that keeps uh that person safe and our officers safe.

Um another uh point, which we're trying to say around efficiencies and effectiveness is within the last three years, fiscal years, our overtime budget is is it's been decreased uh over those three years.

Um 13.4 percent decrease from 24 to 25 and a 5.9 uh decrease from 25 and to project it for the 2026, I should say 5.9 percent uh decrease if we continue along the course where we are.

As far as staffing concerns, we are trying to maintain our staffing.

We've increased it uh you know somewhat uh from 23 and 24, and we're continuing to try to recruit and have some have success recruiting to try to maintain a staffing level, particularly within the patrol force on crime stats.

Our major crime statistics, our violent crimes has been reduced from 2024 by 6%, with a five-year average of a 7% reduction if you if you look at it over that period of time.

If you go over a 10-year average, it's been reduced by 14%.

Property crime has been reduced at least another 2% from 2023, and then we've had a slight increase of 5% if you look at the five-year average on that, but uh continue.

Uh that reduction goes down to 2% over the 10-year period.

It's always good to have a barometer to compare our city.

Uh, we don't really have any peer cities in New England, so if we we go throughout the country to look to other cities similar in size, or what we call major cities, and crime statistically, as far as that goes, we are doing quite well in comparison to the other cities, averaging about you know 3,433 uh violent crimes per city uh residents, which is uh a leader within our country by far.

And if you go look at homicides for the year, no no any homicide is too many, but the but in comparison to other cities, we are doing quite well, again leading the country in that way.

Firearm statistics, uh we are doing well in virtually all categories.

Confirmed shots fired, we're down.

Um total incidents and guns fired, we're down shots victims who have been fatally shot from last year.

We were down by one one person uh again, non-fatal shooting victims, we're down like four percent.

Total shooting victims were down five percent.

Four percent, excuse me.

So we are down in almost all categories regarding violent crime.

Excuse me.

Uh gunfire incidents, overall incidents of gunfires in the city has declined by two percent from 2025 with a 30 uh in a 36 decline.

Um 36% decline compared to our five year average in 2025 was the lowest year for incidents of gunfire in the city since we started keeping records in 2011.

Portion shots shooting victims have declined as we mentioned before 4% from 2025, 34% if you look at the five-year average, and 40% if you look at the 10 year average uh of shooting victims shot in the city.

Uh our offices continue to do really good work retrieving and taking guns off the street with over 871 last year.

590 of those guns, crime guns, 280 were surrendered, and 54 were privately manufactured firearms, better known as ghost guns.

And the last time, uh last slide we want to put we are always looking for good men and women who want to contribute and um serve the public, and so uh for those at home that might see the slide.

If you'd like to join the BPD, you can text us at join BPD to uh 617 752 8673 and try to connect with a recruiter.

And so thank you very much uh for this opportunity, and we are looking forward to your questions.

Okay, thank you very much.

Um, so we're gonna go to my uh colleagues here in order of arrival.

We're gonna go with uh seven minutes um for the first round and uh whenever you're ready, Councillor Murphy.

Thank you.

Thank you to the panel's here.

Um in 2025, the Boston police handled 493,622 calls and texts to 911.

That is hundreds of thousands of times.

Boston residents reached out in moments of fear, crisis, danger, uncertainty, or need, trusting that someone would answer and that would come and help them.

As we review the department's budget today, we should focus on whether Boston is providing the staffing, training, and resources needed to answer those calls and keep every neighborhood safe.

Some people try to weaponize the conversation around policing and public safety, but residents are not served by buzzwords, political labels, or slogans.

They live on streets where they need to feel safe in homes where they want peace and in neighborhoods where they expect help to come when they call.

The work of the BPD is not limited to enforcement.

Offices and dispatches respond to emergencies, support victims, build relationships in neighborhoods, and work with partners to help residents in crisis.

Accountability and community trust matter.

So do staffing, training, response time, and resources.

This should not be about being pro-police or anti-police.

It should not be about whether officers should be paid overtime for work they have already completed, or whether the police department budget should be cut to fund other city departments.

It should be about being pro-resident, pro-safety, pro-accountability, pro-common sense.

Boston cannot be a thriving city if residents do not feel safe.

We have a responsibility to support public safety in every neighborhood.

So I want to thank the offices, the dispatchers, detectives, civilian staff, and all of the public safety partners who answer that call, show up for our residents, and work every day to keep Boston safe.

Thank you for myself, my family.

Um, I appreciate that.

So we are a city also that can and always has been able to fund both.

There is to me this belief that if we fund one thing, we can't do something else.

And we know time and time again, for decades, we've been able to support youth jobs.

We've been able to support senior programming and expanding partnerships with our mental health partners, all things that are part of the conversation, which all of first responders understand that it's never just policing, it's all of the other things.

It's housing, it's jobs, it's food, it's good schools.

So thank you for also working so closely with all of the other city departments and nonprofits across the city.

So I have one question, um, well, two, I guess.

Um, if you could speak to um like the public health, mental health.

I know we're increasing, like with youth build and wanting more social workers, and we've had some you know direct hearing conversations.

We're not at a place yet where like every department has a social worker at a station, knowing though we're placing them where the need is most.

If you could speak to that, and if there's other partnerships that are directly trying to support that mental health support, either working alongside our offices or giving them the tools they need to do that also, sure.

Um, and thank you for your comments.

We currently uh work with um Youth Connect who work in quite a few of our stations throughout the throughout the city, and they have a very very strong partner as far as the referrals and helping uh young people that we come across that are in need of uh many different uh areas.

Um, oh yeah, and of course, we have the best clinicians that that are uh public health commissioners from public health that we currently work in, co-respond to certainly uh a certain number of calls in general.

We you know, mental health in general is is something that seems to be growing, and so we could always use more resources or more partnerships.

I'll say around that in that space uh to do that.

But um, the fact is is that we are very active with the resources that we do have, we we use them to the maximum that we can.

One thing I've been hearing, it's alarming, but I think true that there's an anticipation that there'll be more sex trafficking, sex assaults when FIFA comes into the city.

And if you could speak to um how we're preparing for that.

Mr.

Song, you don't have to take it.

Yeah, for the panelists, just don't touch the buttons, we'll take care of it.

Um, so uh to answer your question about uh in in anticipation of FIFA from the investigative um uh standpoint of the police department.

Uh we have um for several months been working on different plans to identify significant um crime areas that that tend to uh see increases during long-term events like this, especially international events that bring a lot of people in.

Uh, one of those things that we have seen mentioned through different intelligence uh uh materials and discussions we've had with other cities is in fact uh the uh prostitution, human trafficking, uh and potential for you know kind of sex-related domestic violence things to go to be on the rise.

Um family justice center, uh Captain Thomas, Deputy Evans who's here, have been very proactive in trying to put together a network of people to be prepared for that from our human trafficking cross-training within all within all of the family justice detectives so that we're prepared to respond both to specific incidents as well as uh do demand reduction and things like that, also looking at kind of public uh public information uh being put out ahead of time so that we can uh get ahead of uh letting people know that we're gonna be looking at that, we're gonna pay more attention to that, uh, and we'll be taking it very seriously.

So, so there's been a lot of work, it's been going on for uh since last year, um trying to set this up and make sure that we're prepared for that and have all the things that we need to be prepared for that.

That includes you know, outside of that, uh tech uh technology uh uh we're um you know, uh people within the technology divisions that do uh cell phones and um and computer uh forensics and things like that because most of this stuff like a lot of crime is is being done on you know online as opposed to kind of in any traditional way.

Do you work with the hotels or like Airbnb?

Yes, yes, we we've active outreach to the hotels through uh through our critical infrastructure people at the BRIC, as well as just the relationships that um Sergeant Detective Mark Sullivan and his group at Human trafficking have developed across the city and over the last several years and the investigations they do.

So that will continue.

Uh we will ramp that up as we get closer, uh, but that is definitely happening.

Thank you.

Thank you, Chair.

Okay, thank you.

Counselor Culpepper.

Thank you, Chair, and thank you, Commissioner, and your leadership team for joining us this morning.

I had great relationships with the past commissioner going back to Evans and Davis and Ross.

And uh I think our relationship is probably one of the strongest.

Even though we may not always agree on things, we can still talk it through.

Here's here's my concern.

I'm concerned that we have two cities within the city.

I look at South End, and I look at the community policing model, and in the past I think we've had some of the strongest community policing models in B-2.

And then I look at uh the South End, and I look at what's happening in the South End with Mass and Cass and the focus on community policing there and getting out into the street, and then I look at B2.

I look at what happened and what's happening with regard to many of the folks that were in the Mass and Cass catchment area moving down to Nubian Square.

And I'm concerned because not much is happening there in terms of the community policing.

And I think we've had strong community policing in Roxbury in the past, especially when violence was at its height.

I know we just have a new captain, but I'm concerned that the community policing model with regard to being on the street in Nubian Square is not as strong as where it needs to be.

And how can we, and what do we need to do to really make that stronger so that we're dealing with on the ground issues that the businesses are complaining about?

And he's really upset we're having a meeting tonight.

It's called an emergency meeting at the Urban League where hopefully the captain from B2 will be there.

But he said he went over to the station, he walked over to the station, and he told them there was a problem down by his business, and they told him to call 9-1-1.

And I think that's a kind of concern that I have that we don't have, and and I think with community policing, we need policing on the street, walking up and down the street.

They need to know who's in the neighborhood, they need to know the businesses.

And so tell me what we need to do to form, and I've gone to the South End meetings with uh Girati there, and he's given his presentation.

They know the district.

I hope the B2 captain, when he comes to this meeting tonight, he can give us an update on what they're doing in B-2.

But we don't see the kind of on the ground movement in B-2 like we do in B4, right?

The South End is B4.

So, um, so some of what what you make uh mention is uh that one of all, we practice community policing everywhere.

Um the success of it always depends on partnerships that we have from everyone from the public to our officers, actually engaging them to listen to the problems and issues.

And I, you know, particularly New Bean Square.

We've had success and then kind of went back a little bit and then had more success and then went back a little bit.

Uh right now, currently we have a new captain there, and he's actually introducing himself to the entire community, and um and all I've heard from the folks that we've been in touch with is that that they're happy with the engagement and the level of engagement that the officers are actively doing very recently.

This is you know, that's the trend that I've heard.

There's no doubt about that.

Um but this is something that we always have to do.

I mean, it's this is it's always a work in progress, making sure that we're engaging the community to hear from them because problems move.

They move street to street, uh neighborhoods, corners.

It it it moves, and the fact is that we don't know it if we because we don't surveil the world, we don't do that, but we need to hear from the community about where the problems and activities are, and then we actually adjust our, you know, what we do to make sure that we're in those areas to address their needs.

And so the communication always has to be ongoing for us to keep up real time with all the issues that come along the way.

So, you know, we're always looking to improve.

There's no doubt about that, and what you made mention is it's if you're talking about certainly um, you know, uh drug addiction and mental health issues, that's a worldwide problem, and it it happens, and you might see it in all parts of our city, all parts of almost any city, and so uh, you know, we are doing all we can to you know mitigate you know what we what's out there and connect them with services.

Uh I you if you've been here a long time, if you look at the mass and cast area, it looks nowhere near like it did years ago.

I mean, it is you know nowhere, it's like a total different thing.

I I wish, you know, sometimes that you see the news media talk about that area, if they would reflect it, look at the old pictures and the things that were going on there now, look today, would look like two.

No, I see it.

No, I see it.

Every day I ride right through there.

That's my point.

So the things about success sometimes is that um, you know, as you have more success, there's more expectations or more, and we should try to do more, and we are trying to do more, but we're looking for incremental success, always involving the public, always involving that communication between what's going on.

And I agree that it moves.

You have your highs and your lows, I agree.

But I think part of that depends on who the captain is.

With the captains, it moves, you have your highs and your lows.

Uh and I'm hearing just the opposite of what you're telling me.

Let me be specific with you.

Yesterday, we wanted to talk to the captain, we've been trying to talk to the captain.

We called his, no, let me finish.

Can I ask you this, Council?

Let me finish.

Let me finish.

We called the office to talk to the captain.

We keep getting this sergeant.

We don't have the same kind of well, let me when Captain Hussein was there, I had him on speed down.

Just call him.

I'm trying to meet this captain.

I haven't met him yet.

And so my point is that hopefully he's there tonight with this community meeting, because I'm hearing just the opposite of what you're hearing.

And I'm I'm not talking about me, I'm talking about what I'm hearing from the community.

And when you look at Nubian, you don't see the results that you see in the massive cast area.

And you and look, I rolled by that big truck again, that with the lights on it, the corner of mass, and uh uh Albany, right?

I haven't seen that big thing once in Nubian Square.

So, yeah, if you if you have a response.

So, first of all, uh the captain who's there, and by the way, all our captains work very hard in a sense.

We use the same tools and techniques almost in every district.

So it's not about the individual, it's the strategies that we use.

Um, and that particular happen is it's very responsive, and so um I have to beg to differ because I've actually gone to and talked to some of those people in the businesses, and I've heard nothing but you know, it's not made up of nothing but rave reviews about the work that they're doing there.

Um we work hard daily, all our officers have all ranks of making sure that we meet the community and and address those needs, and I'm pretty proud of the work that we're doing.

We will always try to get better and we will work on that.

But the fact is is that um uh I think that the one little window snippet in time or whatever you're making reference to is probably not a uh uh a good good enough uh uh I know sample to to make a uh characterization that the we're not doing a good uh good enough job there.

So give us some more time to work with with that, not only that district, but with all our officers.

It's just that one place.

We're a whole department, we work as a team.

Yeah, yeah.

If you have a comment, fine.

I mean, Commissioner would say let's take that walk through the movie in the two of us, and let's hear what they're saying.

So we can be right on the ground, we can hear the same thing.

Let's take a walk through there next week.

Okay, thank thank you.

Uh thank you, Councillor Culpepper.

We'll come back for a second round.

Uh, we've been joined by Councillor Flynn, Councillor Papen, Councillor Braden.

Uh you're up next.

Thank you.

Good morning, everyone.

Good to see you.

Um, thank you for all you do.

I wanted to echo um comments from my colleagues about how important the work is.

And I was just wondering in terms of measurable outcomes.

How do we evaluate the effectiveness of our community?

Like I know the crime stats probably speak to that, but what ways do we evaluate the effectiveness of our community policing?

Well, so that's an excellent question.

Like stats, you may mention the crime stats.

When you're in a community that there's trust, people call the police, they tell us about stuff.

We're able to actually adjust our strategies to meet the needs.

They actually, you know, tell us stuff.

A perfect example, I think, our tip line has in the last few years has I don't know, tripled the amount of tips that we get from the public.

And that comes from trust and feeling as though if we tell you something, you're gonna do something about it.

Um, I and I I could I I yeah, and I don't want to interrupt you because I realize I've got a limited time when we've got lots of colleagues here this morning, which is very good.

Um, in terms of I you the trust the trust thing is really critically important.

I'm just wondering in the present climate, like nationally.

And uh no, this is an additional question, just as a sort of a segue into the next.

Have you felt that we're still getting a good response from our immigrant community?

Are they still confident that they can call the police department and and be um confident in their own safety and and so I so I can't say that, right?

Uh, in a sense that um, you know, so we are in all communities.

We hear from a lot of folks, um, particularly, you know, uh people in the work in hospitals or or or certainly um faith places where they say that their membership you know doesn't need to come to services as much or and or you know take get services in general.

Um, because we don't keep data on you know, immigrant services, things of that nature, it's we're not gonna have any data on that.

Yeah, but anecdotally we do hear from people that you know that that there are some communities communities that absolutely um are fearful right now in general and of government in in general, and even though I think we have a long history of building ties uh with our immigrant communities, uh the the atmosphere of the world is impacted us anyway.

Sadly, um I was just looking at the at the the the um budget in terms of the Bureau of Community Engagement is seeing a six point one percent decrease.

Uh would would you like to speak to that?

Like how will that impact our community policing's uh status?

No, I I'll be quite honest.

At some point, it's community engagement will go away because we're gonna be engaging the entire police department is doing community engagement.

In some places, community engagements are created for one unit to do it for an entire police department.

Yeah, in our case, our entire police department is now trying to be at the same level as our engagement unit.

So the goal is is not to make engagement that unit bigger, the goal is to get rid of it, and they the actual uh goal is to make sure that every level, every part of our department, both swanted to being and engaged in community policing to help us be the best police department we can be.

That's our goal.

Excellent.

Um, and and I know I'm sure we have that we have this problem all across the city, but for chronic pro uh pro chronic property proper um chronic problem properties.

It's too early in the morning for tongue twisters.

Uh what are the required forms of reporting tools for officers to complete if uh to ensure that incidents are consistently documented and tracked across the department?

It may seem like a small thing, but we are also trying to hold uh landlords and and property owners accountable for not keep having unruly pla unruly houses um and if and we're also trying to develop some penalties for them and you know to try and hold them accountable over the longer term.

But if we don't have good documentation, we're sort of sunk a little.

Sure, I'm gonna let Superintendent Brown answer, but it begins in the end, but letting us know about it, reporting it.

So incident reports, that's the first data point that we start to collect.

Yeah, Superintendent Brown.

Good morning, Council Burton.

How are you?

Good.

Good.

Um so when uh problem property is identified, uh, usually it happens when the with the officers in the street um when they're responding to calls, whether it be loud parties on the weekend or whatever, whatever the situation may be.

Um based upon those reports, those reports will go directly to the community service office, and during meetings between captains and the community service sergeants, those problem properties will be identified, and then we will also get in touch with the city agency, of course, to kind of work ISG, whatever it may take.

You know, we had a couple of those down in district three and some over 18 last year, as you know.

So that's pretty much kind of the route that it goes, but it stays documented and they stay on top of it until we can get something done either through ISG or any of the other problem property groups we work with.

Okay, that's grand.

Um, and then uh I had I'm keeping an eye on the time here.

Uh in terms of uh the issues with folks in a mental health crisis.

Um I know it's a particularly challenging situation.

Um are we learning or exploring other I know I know you are, but I know it's a sort of a very sad situation where folks are in a mental health crisis, and very often they end up there's been there's a shooting and they end up um they end up dead.

Um I know how de-escalating somebody who's in a in a mental health crisis is not the easiest thing to do.

Just uh how successful are we, and can we learn from other police departments in other parts of the world, even of how they handle that?

Excellent question.

And so, you know, we have partners, we have best team clinicians, we we do a co-response.

Uh we do a lot to try to mitigate um, particularly when you know someone is in the mental health crisis or bringing in other professionals to help deal with that.

Um but the reality is that we go to so many call-out calls, you don't always know the person is in a mental health crisis, and when they have a weapon of some type, and it it almost doesn't matter at that point around it if they they can harm others and themselves in some way.

And so we work quite a bit with um not only with our uh our teams, um, our best team clinicians with the co-response uh you're saying what can we do to learn from it?

Well, we evaluate every encounter we have after the fact to see if we can do things better.

Um, we we've increased I think the best team clinicians that we have with us throughout the city uh during that time period from the yeah.

Uh we've increased.

I don't know the number right offhand, but I do know every station has one.

Uh we uh even with referrals, even with the young folks when we heard me talk about youth connect and and social workers and trying to engage the families and hopefully to reduce the likelihood that that they'll ever you know be involved with the police again, trying to get them the help that they need.

It's a very, very, very tough thing.

It seems to be growing in nature, like uh the mental health crisis, you know, throughout the certainly our country, is growing.

And the fact is our officers need to be trained uh in not only identifying it, but you know what to do if they're on their own when we don't have professionals with us because the fact is we just don't know.

There's no crystal ball out there of knowing you just can't look at someone from the outside and tell before you ever get there that they're in crisis and things of that nature.

Um, and even when we I hate to say it, we had more incident recently where there's someone who's trained in all of the above, and it still was not helpful.

No, I know.

Uh and so that it's a very, very tough thing.

The fact is we evaluate what we do daily.

We try to keep our officers trained as much as we can.

We have all these co-response and other uh um, you know, partners to help us uh as much as possible.

Thank you.

Um I'll come back for more questions later.

Thank you so much.

Or did you have another comments?

I'd also just like to add that you know, we have uh over 300 officers who've been trained in the CIT program.

We also have a CIT class starting um this month in May, and the new recruits who are in the academy now will be getting an eight-hour block of the CIT training.

And of course, you know, our co-response with you know um Kelly Young and Erica Green and the NES team and everything else is what's really kind of been uh you know driving the ball down there in um the mass and cast area.

So um we're continuing to work.

We're also gonna be doing the ICAT training, which will allow officers to make you know better tactical decisions when they're out in the street, um, relative to how they deal with people and the positioning of where they're standing when they're engaging in a different type of incident.

Um so I believe with the ICAT training and the CIT training, we'll be able to put a better product out there and deal with the community and people in crisis.

Thank you.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Okay, thank you very much.

We've enjoyed my counselors Durkin and Louie Jen.

Councillor Fitzgerald.

Uh, we're doing seven minutes for the first round.

Thank you, Chair.

Uh, and as this is a hearing on uh substance use response, uh we'll keep it on Mass and Cast that is squarely in my district list, stole a little bit of my thunder uh in some of those questions, but I'd like to just sort of continue to expand on it.

First, I want to uh say thank you very much uh to yourself, uh Commissioner, to Sergeant Giroud, Captain Burns, uh, and all the members and uh the men and women uh in the police at D4 uh have done an exceptional job, especially over this past year.

Uh the notice the difference is noticeable.

Uh hearing it from my constituents uh in the South End, uh, they are extremely happy with the way things are going, knowing it's still plenty of work to go.

Um, and with the warm weather heating up, I know that that only makes us uh sort of focus even more, um, but still want to give my continued appreciation.

We put a lot of work in on both recommendations and uh working with your you as well.

Um so in that uh I want to, you know, one of our recommendations is to expand the NES team because we've seen this model continue to produce good results.

Um, we've had this conversation before, Commissioner, and I just want to think, like, you touched upon it uh as well, uh, with Superintendent Brown, but the the training of how to make I think the last time we spoke, we said every every officer will be a nest officer at some point, right?

That's the goal.

That's the goal, right?

And and do we know like what is the timeline of that and and what is the what more of the training will it take to sort of allow that where uh this type of engagement that occurs at Mass and Cass specifically now can occur citywide?

So that's that's twofold.

It's one is a culture change, and it's really a strategy, uh, and and actually empowering officers, one understand what that is, and that they can incorporate it in their toolkit, you know, everywhere, you know.

Uh, and not just it's not just one set of you similar to how I said the engagement unit when I said before a lot of places they think that those are the only people that are supposed to engage, and the fact is we need everyone to.

Well, the same thing around the NES strategy philosophy that they use, all officers could use that about how to engage and um and deal with some of those issues.

And so we're we're currently um you know trying to model that uh with it.

I don't know how long it will take.

It might, you know, we have quite a few officers.

Um so currently we're using them as uh you know uh as many places as we can, but we're trying to grow the number of people who are having them train the trainer, so to speak, of exposing uh their philosophies and techniques to other ones so people both understand it and have the confidence in doing it.

Uh it's there's no tricks involved with it, it's just really just you know, this part of your toolkit, you can engage in this way, and then every officers can be responsible of doing that.

And um, they do a tremendous job doing that.

I I'm happy you mentioned you know, um Sergeant Giroud, and you know, that work started actually in Nubian Square.

Yep, did such a tremendous job that we actually moved it to another place, ironically, that um, you know, I wonder where he'll go next.

But we're working on it.

I guess your question is when would the whole department don't know, but that's the goal, and we're trying, uh, as fast as we can amongst all the other trainings and things that we do.

Yes, and I will uh to to Reverend Culpepper's point I I do want to back him up on that uh that the some of the issues at Newbie and in my previous job I had to do a lot of property management in that area, was just there the other day.

Um, and you know, and you see the drug dealings happening in plain sight, and there so there are uh definitely other issues there, and just want to make sure people understand that the the recommendations that we're making for police and that's it's not just for mass and caste.

This is a city wide.

This is the hope that right we can go to the hot spot and uh deploy our resources to tamp down an area, and uh I I do recommend that uh I would love to take that walk with you, Reverend and Commissioner, uh, to go through Nubian as well.

Um, I think it would be helpful.

Um, that being said, uh switching to oh has there been any feedback from from your staff uh both on the ground uh and internally about the relationship with the CRT team and Kelly Young and our CRT.

It seems to be working well, but I just want to make sure, right?

Any any criticism I can bring, anything we can do better, anything I can advocate for to help that relationship grow to even get better results.

Thank you, counselor.

So the NES team, as you know, we've expanded a little bit more.

We've got a got on Sergeant Jureau, a couple more people over there.

So they're they're up to 14 police officers now.

Um also we rotate um officers through the district to work with Sergeant Giroud so they can get some exposure to how the NES team operates.

Um so guys are actually being trained kind of on the job.

Um, of course, tour of duty.

And um, and they so they get an experience, they get in the know-how of how to do this different work.

Um, the the relationships between the police, the NES team, and the officers who've worked with NEST and Kelly Young and Erica Green, um, is phenomenal.

Great.

Um, it's been, you know, nothing but positive on all sides.

I've never heard anything negative relative to that relationship.

The model's really working.

Uh, the command post, you know, we started that thing, as you remember, down here downtown with the spring initiative, then we moved it over to Mass and Cass, and we have been getting over to Nubian Square here and there, but we will make more efforts to get that way and help Adam uh Captain Adam Amoney get what he needs over in that Nubian Square area.

Uh, we've also trained additional officers up in the bike.

Uh our bike units.

Only we only have about maybe eight to ten guys in the bike unit now.

So we're expanding training uh in the districts and getting the as you remember before, we're trying to get them the uniforms and the bikes and everything.

We've kind of got that up and up and running, so um, which should be fine.

Uh no, that that's great.

Um, I appreciate that, and it's good to hear that the relationship is working well, and uh I know that we've put a lot of people on to recovery through this model, and that is the end goal.

It is not to arrest them, it is not to uh, you know, put them in jail, it is to get them on a path to recovery um and put the nest and CRT together.

Uh, we have seen a lot of folks be on the path to recovery, and that is the goal.

So, thank you so much for your role in that.

Yes, yes, sir.

Also, um, this weekend during the Boston Relief Association award ceremony, the CR team, CRT team all received awards.

Oh, did they?

They did.

Oh, I didn't know that.

Oh, that's great.

That's uh great to hear.

Um switching a little bit down the street, uh, South Bay, uh, just the efforts that we're we're seeing there, uh, any trends.

Uh, you know, at one point that was a hot spot for some youth activity, um, and last summer uh had an amendment in the budget to sort of focus on that that I think helped out.

Um, but um are we have we seen anything recently, any uptick or or uh things at South Bay are looking good.

According to Captain John Conroy over at C6, he says there has been uh a decline.

There's this constant COVID 19s there, and officers will respond if something happens.

We were having an issue a couple weeks ago with the with the youth coming in after school and disrupting the area and stuff, but um they've put some resources down there, and I I let him know any additional resources you need, let me know, and we'll get them to him.

Great.

Uh my last comment would just be uh the walk in the beat uh of Bowden Geneva with Sergeant Golden uh has been very helpful uh over at C11.

So uh a big thank you to Captain McCarthy, Sergeant Golden at C11 for all the work they've done.

Uh we've seen great strides over there as well.

Um I'll continue.

Save my questions for the next round.

Thank you, Chair.

Okay, thank you.

Counselor Flynn.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair, and thank you to the police commissioner on the team for being here.

Um I also in my district represent a large section of Mass and Cast.

Just wanted to highlight that as well as um Reverend Cole Pepper as well.

I live just down the road from Andrew Square, as you know, Commissioner, and that area of Andrew Square is um is impacted by what goes on at Mass and Cass as a probation officer for eight years prior to this, and spent a lot of time getting getting people into recovery.

Um, Commissioner, one of the issues I focused on over the last eight years, as you probably know, the crime lab.

I want us to have the best crime lab in the country, like New York, police department.

Boston police opted for a three-member board of directors who have worked at the crime lab previously with the issues with experience for several years now.

Was it all considered?

Was it considered, or were there any continued concerns about a fresh perspective in new directions and culture of the crime lab?

So we're always looking for um new directions that'll make us more efficient and effective.

I know there were, you know, there were some vacancies that were open for a while.

Um you want to speak to it?

So uh counsel, um I guess is your question.

Should we be looking outside?

Is that a question?

Well, why do we why did we create a board of directors instead of hiring strong leadership?

Um, and I know we did struggle over the last several years with leadership, including one person, it appears that was on an extended leave of absence for a period of time.

Um, but my goal is certainly it's wide screening, a state of the art crime lab, but strong positive leadership, someone that's there day to day that's doing the job.

I I want to I want to keep that drama out of the um out of the office so people are able to do their job efficiently effectively.

Um but we we haven't had that in a while with um transitional uh managers in there.

Well, I don't know if I agree fully with you on that, counselor.

Right now we have we have very strong leadership at the crime lab.

It may not look it traditionally the way it did before when we had a crime lab director, a latent print direct uh person in charge of latent prints and firearms.

We now have it brought all together.

But the leadership under Sergeant Detective Jefferson, under Kevin Larrad, and and under Rachel Lemery or Rachel Camper, uh has been very strong.

Yes, there was some transitional time periods there, but we continue to look for people for the open spots that we have that are gonna contribute to that, and whether that's from internal or from outside remains to be seen.

But the idea is we all agree the crime lab plays a significant role in everything we do, especially in the investigations division, um, the investigation bureau that everything we do rely on the crime lab, uh, from the quality of the work they do, the integrity that they show, the leadership that they show.

So I would I would push back just a little bit to say that you know we're looking for the same type of leadership you are.

Wherever we find that it's gonna be the best person that we can get for that job.

And dealing with the kind of the issues of the Y-screening and things like that, those are also a priority for us as well.

But we have challenges there when it comes to um, you know, paying for what we want to get, uh, the budget issues and things like that.

So I just want to add to it that we're we're nationally accredited our crime.

I know, I know.

And uh I think their last review um was almost exceptional.

So I'd say the leadership is fairly strong, and and I and I I go a little further to say the leadership starts at the top.

I think I'm like part of leadership at the police department, and so we work pretty hard.

Uh the crime lab is an outstanding reputation, and and so I I don't know where you would get any other information from.

Commissioner Robin.

Commissioner Council, just I'm pausing your time.

Just uh for anyone silence your phones.

I hear some beeping for text messages.

So I apologize.

I pause your time, continue.

Yeah, Commissioner, there was challenges at the crime lab for a number of years.

I've focused on this issue, trying to get positive leadership at the crime lab.

There were there was a person there that was on an extended leave of absence, maybe for two years.

When you have someone that's on a leave of absence for two years, there is really at times no accountability.

Sometimes there was a manager filling in.

Commissioner, I come from, you know, when I served 24 years in the Navy, it's about leadership, it's about responsibility.

When no one's responsible at the crime lab, things can get, things can get caught in the system of past.

My main goal is to provide the best leadership we can to test the use the most advanced technology, why screening, of course, but we did have challenges there and I have I have worked with state officials as well on this issue, but I I just can't I did I have to acknowledge that we had problems there.

It's not it wasn't it wasn't perfect.

But let me let me go on let me go on and and continue Commissioner how many police officers do we currently have on Boston that are active and how many do we need to give you exact number coming up here.

How many do we need I you know that's a that's a loaded question there in a sense I would say this well it's it's not it's not really a loaded question.

My concern commissioner is when police officers are working 16 hours a day um consistently it's hurting their families it's hurting the officer it's hurting the communities I don't want to I don't want to see an officer be working 15 hours a day make a mistake and then be before internal affairs knowing that we put that officer um in that situation because we we made him work 15 16 hours a day the first conversation you and I had commissioner we became commissioner police officers working 20 hours or 18 hours a day and that's what I want to make sure is we don't set up police officers for failure and I think you want the same the same thing Commissioner but I do have a problem when an officer's working 16 hours a day and thinking that police officer is going to be on top of her is his or her game for an ex for that period of time.

Lisa we'll give you the answer but yes that when I first came there certainly were some issues about us you know you know forcing overtime a lot more than we we did we've reduced that quite a bit uh and and the fact is is those days of triple triple shifts and things that nature don't exist anymore right now answered one question about that good morning counselor as of May 4th we have um thousand one hundred and two officers with a hundred and thirty two recruits in the academy right now so for a total of uniform total it'll be 2,234 but obviously with the understanding that the crew recruits will not graduate until this fall thank you Mr Chair I'm out of time but do I have the ability to ask one more question.

Sure I I paused you in the middle of the okay comments.

Commissioner are you concerned at all over the next six months or over the next year that we're going to see a lot of retirements from police officers including police officers that may not have reached their mandatory retirement age and are we prepared for that um so retirements are something we deal with almost every year particularly as you know people age out and get within that range of retirement time and so that's why they we we spend so much time and effort on recruitment uh making sure that we're bringing people in and the mayor's been good in the sense that we the last few years we brought we've had at least two two recruit classes each year um that's being able to maintain the number that we've we've had if not increased it so um you know we we're going to have to continue that there's no doubt about that because uh you know as people become eligible for retirement uh you know they've earned that and so that's their right if they choose to to leave us early my my goal is I think we need to hire consistently 300 police officers every year for the next at least the next 10 years and also for elected officials to support police officers that are currently on the job so that they know that city officials do have their back um we have to support police officers.

We have to support police officers' families as well.

Mr.

Chair, thank you for giving me an extra minute.

Okay, thank you very much.

Counselor Pipin, you're up.

Joined by counselor Santana.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

And good morning, everyone.

Thank you so much for being here.

Thank you so much for the work that you all do I always say this, I'm very grateful for the work that the Boston police department does in my district and across the city.

And I do not envy your work it's a it's hard work.

And I also want to give a shout out to a gentleman with a gold tie in the back.

I knew him as the detective John Fitzgerald.

He's my my first favorite John Fitzgerald, second to this counselor.

Distance second.

Distance second.

But when I got to the job, I was um was able to tour the B3 station along with Captain Flynn.

And um just really grateful for the warm embracing that you all had with their B3.

And I also want to give a shout out to the officers at E18 and E5 for the work that they do.

And that leads me to my first set of questions, which is the support for the community service officers.

Um they're the officers that I I see every day.

I'm in a meeting with them almost every night, or I see them at the Archdale hot dog nights, I see them in a on a walk and in Cleary Square, or they were just with the community service officers at the loop in Mattapan.

They were trying to help with resident concerns.

And what I see is that they're always out in the community, and they're actually do a lot.

I wanted to quite a bit actually.

I wanted to know what are there any funding support for them, or do what flexibility do they have in order to be able to support community efforts like hot dog nights, like little leagues, like community walk the beat efforts.

Um, so uh outside of uh, you know, I mean they don't really have budgets, city budgets for that, but we have a police foundation that actually raises money to actually for us to do those additional things in the community.

Um that you know I'm happy you mentioned that.

Um, and so um, you know, that's one of the sources where we uh actually are able to do stuff in the community.

We uh we whether whether it's the hood who donates money to our our you know our ice cream truck that people might have seen in the neighborhood, or the foundation who gives us um additional funds to be able to uh support the um the ice cream truck and other things with the city that helped us build trust, particularly with the young community.

So those community service officers, you I I agree, they work really hard.

They're in all our communities.

Uh they do tremendous work day in and day out of connecting us uh to the communities, community meetings, uh community comstat meetings that we have, you know, they support every district captain uh uh in a in a big way.

Yeah, yeah.

What I've noticed is that the officers that are the ones at those meetings, they're the ones the the residents really feel comfortable going up to them, and I've seen them do mentoring with young adults, I've seen them um visit schools, I've seen them go to just different parts of my district.

So I always like to mention them to support them.

I think that's a type of policing that I want to see across the city.

I know that you mentioned already that every officer event eventually is going to embody that.

I think that's the nature of the Boston Police Department that we have that advantage compared to other places, but it's definitely more community policing oriented.

Um, I want to pivot over a little bit towards the mental health support for for officers.

Um the reason why I said I don't enemy your job is because I know it takes a lot on the mental toll.

And I and I've learned from some of the police officers that I represent in my district that takes a toll on their families.

Um it takes a toll on if it's either the long shifts that they're working or just what they went through throughout the day.

I want to know what type of support there is for if a police officer needs some sort of mental health um assistance if they need to take a day off that is caused because of a case that they're working on.

I just want to know what is the overall wraparound services that a police officer is able to get.

So um, well, thank you.

So we have a peer support for all our officers in in general, and they have access to mental health services uh as well as you know the service services that they have access to because they're all obviously their own insurance.

Um we we more recently in the last year uh have a uh uh an app that helps with some of their mental health uh issues or they might have with just resources and tools that helps them um deal with some of those things covering from uh uh I don't know from financial to meditation to all the things that that could increase their wellness.

Uh and then from time to time we have uh a physician that comes in and um gives them screenings and um just uh overall access to uh mental health check-ins.

Uh when you know, certainly if they want it, but we we generally try to open it up as much as possible uh for all officers.

Um we'd like to be able to do it more uh in a larger way, but um again uh that is something where funding is uh is necessary for that.

Thank you.

Um yeah, that's a big that's a big topic for me.

I'm big on mental health.

Um I like to speak very publicly about it in my personal life and here in the in the chamber as well, just I think it leads to a healthier life in general.

So I'm glad to hear that the yes, sir.

And I should mention also contractually, even within the last contract, um, they now have 30 minutes a day that actually can you know work out or and or you know, meditate or yogurt or do certain things uh even within the work day to help uh sort of certainly increase their wellness.

Okay, that's good.

And I know that there's gyms inside each of the precincts, right?

Correct.

Some better than others.

So we uh but that it's also included all right.

So that's good.

Um another thing that I like to focus on is representation, and and when I mean by representation is just that there's people that look like you, that they speak your similar languages, that they come from different backgrounds.

I know that the police department is a pretty diverse body, but I wanted to know what you take into consideration when you're looking at, for example, E18.

There's a large Asian population, there's a large Latino population.

How do you make sure that there's officers that represent that body at those precincts so that the residents have someone that they know that they can speak to in their language and make sure that they feel like they're welcomed?

Well, it begins by the number of people that you have that are diverse in your department in general.

So you know, certainly diversity is something that we care about.

We want people from all neighborhoods and communities in our city, where diverse is the city, so when we do that, we bring in diversity throughout our department.

Umce you do that, it's a whole lot easier to make sure that you know there are certainly people who represent all communities in each district.

But if you're not able to bring in diversity, it's a lot harder to make sure people represent those communities in the districts.

And the cadets that are coming in, I'm noticing.

Yes, it is it is a pretty diverse body of cadets, correct?

And so the last thing I'll ask is like how do you make sure that you are hiring a very diverse staff, um, starting young with the cadets programs.

So it again it goes by, you know, the we're recruiting we're trying to recruit, whether it's in the public school system, uh we we have a really robust uh recruitment drive in general.

Um maybe Lisa can speak a little bit more about that, but particularly around the cadet program, but the fact is is that uh cadets are you know highly diverse individuals that we bring in and and hopefully those are our future officers or leads recruit officers to go into the academy test.

We've um over the past couple years we've launched um uh very hard-driven in recruitment process, more so for the recruits going in the academy, but also not forgetting the cadets because they are future officers.

Um we call constantly going into the schools, we get invited to some of the schools to talk about um how it how you become the cadet, how do you apply, and we're concentrating those neighborhoods that we want to make sure that we represent the city accordingly.

But we have strong recruitment um efforts in our HR department, and I think they've grown um and we we've really done made some great strides in recruiting people that represent all communities within the city of Boston.

Yeah, and we have uh at least about I think 25 anticipated cadets going in in September.

Uh and of the breakdown of our 28 cadets that we have now, we have like 21 males, seven females, 18 speaker second language.

Wow.

Um, yeah, and um, and so they and then they range in age from 19 to 23.

So, I mean a lot of the classes that we've been bringing in have been highly, highly diverse, uh both the cadet program and the recruits that are going into the academy.

And and they're usually they're almost always from our city, and in that way too.

So that's why I say it's important to, you know, go throughout our city and our department should represent what our city looks like, and and that's what we're doing, and we've been fairly successful at least.

Thank you.

Can I add one thing on the uh assignments and diversity?

Um you mentioned District 18, so from the the BIS perspective, as we're filling spots um in our Detective Bureau, um, you know, and in particular the lieutenant detective the commander position in E18.

We first of all, obviously, have to pick from a pool of applicants.

We pick looking for the qualities we want, the leadership, the skill sets that we believe are important for that position.

But in the last round, we I think we appointed I think five new lieutenant detectives around the city.

District 18 in particular when we came when it came time for our decision making on that.

Uh Lieutenant Daniel Pussi, who was a creole Haitian speaking uh lieutenant first and foremost, a fantastic leader, has a great skill set, great abilities, but also had that uh the um connection to district 18 through the Haitian community, and so that was an easy fix for us.

We lost Lieutenant Detective Beth Lear, you've made captain, great lieutenant, but we were able to put somebody in there who fit right into the fabric of that community.

So we try to take that into consideration when we're making those assignments within the pool people that we're picking from.

Also, last night we had the community com statut in high speaker 18 at the pride building, which is amazing building, and Lieutenant Pusi did a fantastic job.

Really good kind of feedback from the community that last night, and um and the diversity of the officers who were there, um, you know, kind of reflected that.

So, yeah.

I really appreciate the proactiveness in this in this particular subject.

So thank you.

I know my time is up.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Okay, yeah, just uh reminder my colleagues, uh, recruiting and diversity is on the agenda for this afternoon.

Uh no, no, it's I think you know it's good to get the all good questions.

Uh so next up is Councilor Durkin, then Councillor Louie Jen and Councillor Santana.

Thank you so much, and thank you so much to the commissioner for being here.

Um, it's always great to be in your presence.

Um, you know, you represent the best police department in the country, so it's always an honor to really get to serve alongside you and see the work that you're doing in our communities.

Um, I have some questions about um just things that have you know come to my attention and things that like over the past few years we've worked on, just sort of curious about your thoughts.

Um the first one is how do you feel like the implementation of the encampment ordinance has gone, and do you think feel like it has been successful?

Uh what you know, what are what are the main takeaways?

That was one of my first votes on something police related.

So, no, I um and thank you.

Uh city council, you know, without the ordinance, and then um we were able to, you know, you know, let people notify the people that it exists, and for the most part, there's been a high level of compliance since then.

And it was the first step in us being able to address some of the concerns they had down in Mass and Cass in general.

Uh, and so uh I I think it's been highly highly successful.

I mean, since that ordinance has been there, you don't send see the tents and tarps all throughout the city, or particularly in the mass and cast area, as once you know once we saw before, it's kind of like a thing of the past in some ways.

Yeah, it's really I think the issues that my district has are really mostly on state owned property at this point.

So, and I know that's a partnership, you know, and there's a lot of work that's being done, and it really comes down to contracts too.

A lot of the things that need to be removed are like hazardous materials and you know, things that require a certain level of but it was a really good tool to begin for our particularly for our officers and some of the other partners that we have to begin the conversation with people that maybe even connect them to services or uh, you know, rehab and the things that they need because the fact is now that it's a law saying that what they're doing is is it's actually in violation of the law, so um it was quite helpful and I think it's very successful.

Thank you, and um I I'm curious um also what one another thing that the past few years we've talked about is the surveillance ordinance, which I think is a really important um is really important thing that's been implemented, but I don't think it's based on our last conversation about the surveillance ordinance.

I don't feel like it has been fully implemented, given that um, you know, we did receive notification after um a surveillance technology was implemented.

And I'm just curious, um, and I know we had a talk, you know, and I know um we have our folks from the BRIC here.

I'm just curious um how you feel about making sure that we're fully implementing that ordinance, and that the city council has the authority to, you know, given in the ordinance to approve or deny the use of surveillance technology.

Do we feel comfortable moving forward um, you know, in a way that gives us the opportunity to um to weigh in prior to um you know, as per the ordinance.

So I I know we we have it's coming up too, and we were going to certainly uh meet that, and I'm sorry.

What portion of that question do you need me to answer again uh about?

Oh so I guess um, given that we had not received notification the last time a surveillance ordinance, uh the last time our surveillance technology, and I know there was certain circumstances, exigent circumstances that were that at least at least that the um police department said there was exigent circumstances.

My curiosity is that if if you feel that you at this point can fully implement the ordinance and make sure that the city council has the authority, you know, because we given by the ordinance that that we are able to vote to approve or deny surveillance technology before it's implemented.

And so, I mean, that that is you all's lane, certainly around the ordinance and and you know what you vote for or against.

Um we just need to make sure that we meet our requirements around that, and uh if we didn't do it in the past, I apologize for it.

But we're gonna make sure that we meet the deadlines and things that are that are required for that.

I um outside of that, I don't see you know, challenges around it.

I think sometimes it might be just a little misinterpretation of prior, like what we were you know required to do before that, you know, uh during ex circumstances and things of that nature, but uh I think the more we talk and speak about you know anything requiring, you know, in that ordinance, the more uh I think it'll I think everyone will will have some value in and appreciating the ordinance and understanding that we're trying to be as transparent as possible what we're doing and how we're doing.

And just my take is anything that involves social media or a contract, I feel like you have the time to get approval from the city council, given that this is just my take is that um, you know, contracts take time to implement, so um so I I know that we had a long hearing on that and that we've talked through that issue, but I just my advocacy is that the city council vote to approve or deny surveillance technology, and that because I do think it's a it's a um transparency issue, and just making sure that um the all the work that's gone into to that work through the city council is um you know represented um through the work that the city and the police department does.

I understand your question.

Okay, thank you.

Um, and um I noticed that there are some external um funds that we've gotten in previous years that are not um that we are not obtaining this year, specifically um the COAP program, the cold case project, um cops hiring program, and then I noticed that the DMH jail diversion program has gone from 140,000 to 50,000.

I was just curious um if you could sort of go through those quick quickly and just um, are those because we haven't applied for funding or are they all different cases?

I believe the cops grant they go away.

They do go away.

Yeah, it went away.

Um does it exist before the cops grants came around um right around COVID, but they weren't a grant that continuously renews, so they do go away after um period of time.

Um so they they are gone and we have finished them, but I want to point out that we've fully expended those grants, so we take advantage um on behalf of uh research and development um unit, they are constantly like researching new grant programs that would be applicable to the programs and services that we provide.

So they're continuously looking at new grants, but we do have several grants that continuously renew year on year, such as the J Grant, um such of some of the DNA grants that we currently have, so they do renew every year, but we have constantly looking for new grants and opportunities.

Yeah, and I just um really briefly, if the chair will oblige, um I I really love our captains in my district, and I haven't getting gotten the chance to meet that our new captain, um uh Mamon, and um, so I would love to have the opportunity to uh be introduced to him, but uh the captains that I work with every day, they're so transparent and like so collaborative with our office.

Um, you know, specifically A1, uh Captain Driscoll, I love love working with him.

So thank you for uh thank you for placing these amazing captains in my district, and uh it's amazing, it's an amazing opportunity for us to work together um to ensure safety and transparency, and um and a lot of collaboration with our district.

So thank you, Commissioner, and thank you all for being here.

Okay, thank you very much, Councillor Louie Jim.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair, and thank you uh to the members of the Boston Police Department for all the work that you do.

Um, starting with you, Commissioner Cox, on behalf of the residents of the city.

Um, it is uh noted, and um I'm grateful that uh there are open lines of communications when things are going well, uh, when there are questions about things to get better every day as a city.

So I wanted to just um note that.

Um, and I also grateful for the constituents who are here.

Um, you know, last week I sat down, Friday sat down for a meeting with uh a few residents in Roxbury, and it turned into a walk uh around Nubian Square, and there are some officers out, and there's like a new machine that is being used to try to help deter some activity.

So just want to thank the residents from Nubian Square, and also want to thank uh you know Councillor Culpepper continues to work on this issue, um, and there's you know a lot more attention that we need to give to places like Nubian Square to ensure that people are able to have a good quality of life.

I don't believe that the entire T of it is a police response.

Um, it's a police response mixed with like how do we be helping people get jobs, hurry up when people get opportunity, but I do think that there is an important police role um in that area.

A lot of my questions are focused on overtime as sort of the biggest uh one of the biggest cost drivers here.

Uh so uh first question is what specific provisions in the collective bargaining agreements um have the largest impact on cost, um that includes that includes staffing rules, um, shift coverage, callbacks, court time, and code stacking.

And which of these provisions is uh does the department believe should be revisited in future negotiations to help us bring down costs of the city?

Yes, to the first one.

Um I was nervous that you would respond that way.

So I mean one of the biggest ones that we've identified um are the uh the code stacking that happens with overtime.

I don't know if there are other code stacking.

So some of those uh issues are really about us being we need to be more vigilant and making sure that you know we're aware of codes and things of that nature when officers fill out overtime.

So that's a supervision thing, and that's something that we are addressing actively right now.

So I can't say you know, it's contractually, there are issues around it.

We are trying to be saying reimagine how we deploy our troops almost all the time now.

It's like events, we don't just traditionally do what we normally do.

We're looking at how can we do it uh more efficiently, more effectively.

Well, we're both making sure we're addressing public safety need, but also reducing uh or almost eliminating the need for any overtime whatsoever.

So we're bringing people from other parts of the city.

We are using all our resources to deal with the problems.

So we're we're split up in districts, but we're trying to make it so our whole department addresses uh a crime problem or an issue in general, so it's not dependent on one area and then the need for additional overtime in general.

So we we're doing multiple things to try to address it uh contractually.

Um I don't want to speak to it because it's some of that is is bargained, but and I can't think off at the top of my head how you know minimum manning is is something that you get to a certain number, but even that is being revisited about what that means.

The minimum staffing.

Yes, correct, around that to make sure that we're we're in uh we're having a more efficient effective impact on it.

So what I say, like traditionally how we did things is it's not really how we're looking at to do it going forward, where if you know, if X happens, we do Y when it comes to like overtime in particular.

So now it's about you know, do we need to do that?

Is that currently uh going to impact crime in the way that we think it is?

You know, how can we do it with on duty personnel?

How can we do this in different ways?

And so that's actively something we're doing right now.

Uh and it's having it's been having an impact.

Definitely has been having an impact.

So, thank you.

Um, that's question is about community events and what does it look like to staff at community events, whether it be open streets or um uh small parades, block parties, protests, um how do you make the decision on staffing for those issues?

For example, I remember the open streets.

There were there's like a police officer every block in JP, and thinking whether that was something that you know was revisited, and what you learn from staffing, those sorts of events.

Yeah, and so remember that reimagining that's what we were trying to do, and I think open streets is a good example.

I think the first year we had a lot of police on every you know corner to make sure that you know the streets are blocked off, no one's coming through trying to ram people with vehicles, things that nature.

The next year we reduced the police quite a bit and then asked other partners in the city, whether it's DPW and other people to help with blocking trucks or things of that nature.

Now we have more barriers in general.

We've been uh purchased some more barriers to do uh to be in the place where people were prior to that.

So we're still um having the public safety uh uh concerns addressed, but maybe less officers to have to do that work by using you know technology or equipment to do it, and so we're doing that all the time and we're re-evaluating, we're not just doing the same plan.

We're looking each and every time about how can we provide good public safety without maybe as many numbers where we're having to order additional people and always using people that are on duty.

We have a lot of people work every day of the week in different places and bringing those in to address those.

Thank you.

Um, I'm gonna go back to our question about overtime spending.

Uh, when we are negotiating those contracts, um, does BPD provide the finance cabinet and labor negotiations with a written estimate of how proposed contract terms will affect overtime?

Like, did we do that this past year?

I so I don't know what we require, but it's something I think that is is calculated, right?

I mean the the one portion of overtime that is contractual is the court overtime, which is the four-hour uh roll-up.

But I think we've made great strides to keep that down.

I mean, since 2022 to today, we're down 43% in court overtime, and I think that's measures that they've taken in the different courts to make sure officers are getting called, they're not sitting there waiting, or if they're even needed.

But that is the one um contractual agreement that they look at when they're doing contracts, but that's that is in the contract the four-hour minimum for court overtime.

Since you mentioned that, extended extended tours are the largest category of overtime, accounting for 40%, and it's just that some of the demand is driven by like low acuity calls, and so sick assist, mental health crises, and quality of life complaints.

So I know you talked about it earlier, but what are we doing to ensure that in some of those instances there are more, there can be more of a uh non-police response, so that feels low uh acuity calls that then lead into increased overtime or handled by other entities that are capable that are capable of handling those calls.

And so if you dial 911 and you call us, we respond.

Uh, the fact is, you know, we also have best team clinicians, we have other uh folks that might come.

If we're not needed, we're not going to stay and be there, right?

So the officers aren't just gonna stay and hang around.

Uh, but the reality is um, you know, the the system that we work in when they call 911, they're calling for police, and so we have to get there and investigate and see what's going on.

If our services are needed, then we try to leave as soon as possible.

If they are, then we have to follow up on that.

Um I can't speak to other agencies, but you know, as far as our agencies being created to handle those, then not within our department then for sure.

But the fact is we're willing to partner with almost anybody and everybody uh in uh to not only address public safety issues, but also issues that are out there in this in the city.

We have a lot of work in general.

We we don't need any additional work, so partners that can take offload some of those things.

We we well, thank you.

Yeah, thank you.

Thank you.

Just to remind my colleagues that um overtime specifically is is on the agenda for this afternoon.

I mean, I think everyone here can answer questions about that, but we'll be able to follow up on overtime this afternoon.

Uh if you have any more questions, thanks thanks uh to the panel for being prepared and being ready to answer questions.

Um so councillor Santana.

Uh, morning, thank you, Mr.

Chair, and um good morning to you all, super um commissioner, uh, superintendents and chiefs.

Um thank you for being with us um this morning and also this later later this afternoon.

Um, I first wanted to start off by saying just uh, you know, as the Chair of Public Safety and Criminal Justice on the Boston City Council, really appreciate um how uh there's been an open line of communication um, you know, not just with you, Commissioner, but with um your entire staff and um your professionalism.

Um it's it's not an easy um job or career, and um, I think as one of my counselors previously said, I I definitely do not envy um the uh the roles that you all play um in our city.

Um I actually had a few questions that I think actually the last few um colleagues have actually brought up some.

You know, I did have questions about staffing levels at um at different events, um the surveillance technology, like Councillor Durkin brought up, I think um, you know, as the chair that there have been colleagues have come to me and said, hey, there's been I think there's been two instances um over the last year and a half where there's been technologies um that have been uh that you have used without the approval of the Boston City Council.

I think you after um that there was a hearing when you all came and spoke about that.

Um, but I think uh the surveillance um report or so the the ordinance itself states that um you get approval before um it's actually an insulator.

So um as a chair of the committee, I'm gonna continue to make sure that that there's open line communication and that that's the case uh moving forward.

Um with that, um I don't know if someone touched on this like unsolved cases um in the city.

I know you have uh investigators um who I've met many of them will do incredible work.

Um but being a community um, you know, I think I hear a lot from residents of um who have experience and their families have experienced many different difficulties, and um a lot of these cases have been um unresolved.

So can you just speak to about unresolved cases?

Um, what residents can and residents and families um can expect moving forward, um, and if there's a timeline, and for you know, after a year or after six months or after two years, a case is not resolved.

Um, you know, what happens after that?

No, I appreciate that.

And so one of the good things is that each year, certainly, historically, we've had less and less homicides across the city.

So the fact is because we're having less and less homicides hopefully uh there'll be less fewer and fewer uh you know older cases that are sitting out there than unsolved.

So that population pool of cases is getting smaller and smaller across the board.

Uh, as far as families, you know, you know, we do all we can to communicate with them and and we'll try to do a better job at least keeping them updated.

I'll have um certain superintendent quat and talk a little bit about about what homicide does with the families, but we do um have liaisons with them and uh we do quite a bit uh with some of the families.

Including more recently, we and having a website where we listed all of the older cases out there, both honoring the the people deceased that were there and also looking for information from the public or people who might have information regarding those to maybe reinvest, restart those investigations again if we would happen to get any new information uh regarding those those cases.

So, yes, so um so as far as the cold cases, um when I when I was speak speaking specifically about homicides, um, uh when a case is assigned to a squad, uh that squad maintains that case, um, and especially as as that squad remains intact, they will keep that case.

So um one of the things that we've probably had the benefit of over the last couple of years with numbers being down and active cases, is that our squads have had the opportunity to increasingly go back to cases that they that they had in the last several years and to reinvigorate the cases, get back into them, look for potential leads, look for things that might have been loose ends that um that that weren't run down and that can be run down now.

So there is that act the active squads that still have the cases that are that are actively going back and looking at those cases, sometimes based on their own uh you know, initiative to do it, sometimes based on a phone call or some tip that comes in that says, hey, you should look at this person for that case in 2021, for instance, and they go back and they start doing that.

So they're doing that.

At some point, that case goes into the cold case squad.

Um you can imagine that you know, with the with manpower being what it is, um, there's a lot of cold cases over the years.

Going back, the the commissioner mentioned the website back to 1965, uh that features the cases every unsolved homicide within that time period.

There's a lot of them.

So what they try to do is they try to go in and they triage cases, looking for things that have the best solvability factors, looking for opportunities for um cases that have potential for DNA evidence uh that now using the latest technology, the forensic genealogy, uh they've had quite a bit of success in going back to cases even as far back as the 70s.

So there's an active effort on the cold case squad.

You know, again, everyone's hindered by manpower issues.

Uh, we're doing everything we can on it.

Um but trying to find those cases that they can that have some, you know, so to speak, meet on the bone, go back, use new use new technology, go back down to the crime lab, try to see what they can come up with for DNA potentially, and then take move the case forward, identifying witnesses, seeing if they're still around, what their recollection is and things.

So the coal case is very, very active.

They're constantly working these cases, but I think it's important to point out, and especially given given the kind of the numbers that we're seeing now, we're at four homicides for this year.

Uh, we had with 31 last year, 24 the year before.

Um, we're encouraging, we're pushing our squads to say, go back into your file cabinet, pull some of these ones out, especially ones that may have been very close but needed a little something somewhere or another, and get back on those cases and start looking at them again.

And to make sure they're maintaining that contact with the families as best.

It's it's a very challenging thing.

And I having, you know, having worked in homicide for 17 years, I know I still have contact with families that go back 20 years ago.

Um, but you know, it's it can be a difficult thing to maintain those those uh relationships.

Uh sometimes because some of the families have already, you know, they've moved on from it, not the sense that they moved on from their their loved one, but they've moved on in the sense they don't want to hear from you all the time.

They they'll say, look, unless you're gonna unless you solve the case, don't call me, right?

So find trying to find that that fine line between making sure you maintain that contact, making sure you're talking to them, keeping them updated, and and them not really wanting to be to hear from you every time just to say we don't have anything on the case.

So it's a it's a very difficult thing.

We use our victim witness offices um who do a great job of dealing with families, both current and cold case um people, uh, maintaining those relationships, running our uh annual homicide event that that reaches back to all those people and tries to bring them back so that they can be part of the event, um, do it running events throughout the year, working with our partners in the peace institute and places like that, so that we can maintain these things.

It's a challenge.

There's a lot of them, but I think we're trying constantly, and this is across the board, to really make sure that we're maintaining that relationship with the victims, the victims' families, and and really kind of, you know, again, there's always a lot of work to do on it.

But that's that's kind of our um that's our position on trying to move forward in these.

Awesome.

Thank you, Superintendent.

Um, I have attended the homicide event, and you know, I think it's uh I'm uh really appreciated um that event.

Um, my time is up, so um again, thank you all for being here and for the work that you do.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Okay, yeah.

Just uh to follow up on Councillor Santana's question.

There was external funds for a cold case project that it was about 150 a year for the last two years, and then it's down to zero.

I think for this year, so is uh is that to that uh program wrap up, or we do know what I'm talking about.

I know what you're talking about, but I'm not sure about the what's the impact.

We still have funding, and that the grant still still exists.

I actually just did the federal financial report as of March 31st.

It says zero here, yeah.

Just in the budget, but I can look into that for you.

Okay, okay.

Uh thank you.

Uh okay, I'm gonna give myself seven minutes.

Um, sorry, before I go, I I I have received the letter of absence from uh uh counselor mehia includes questions.

I did I uh in prior hearings read out questions from uh Gigi Coletta's council counselor Coletta Zapata, who's I don't know if she's given birth yet, but I I said that was sort of I was giving her special dispensation uh for not being here, and I gave her the full seven minutes.

I am not doing the same for Council Mahia or anyone else unless you are you know uh you're about to give birth or on maternity leave or on paternity leave, but not discriminating based on sex here, but um uh just normally I we have questions, and I will be submitting counselor mehia's questions to uh BPD to have answered uh you know promptly and get her answers to those questions.

Um but for anyone else, all my other colleagues, please come to the hearings uh and use your time.

Um, and uh I won't be reading your questions.

Okay.

Okay, so um terms of uh personnel services, like so uh from last fiscal year 427 million, it's going up to 431 million in this proposed budget.

Uh can you just is that uh to account for raises or they're adding personnel, like what could be.

So the primary increase that we that's been reflected in our budget for fiscal year 27 is due to the collective volume agreements that we resolved in fiscal year 24 and 25.

Okay, so yeah, we were we're talking about just increases in in wages, like it was two percent.

Right there collective volging agreements.

Okay, and so just dovetailing with that, um, you know, uh I guess you know, we look we see vacancies, uh, and yeah, I think as Counselor Flynn has highlighted, and you know, there's issues with recruitment, people retiring every year, it's kind of it is hard to keep up.

But just so the the number of vacancies, you know, is as come down.

I think I have for FY23, it was about 505, and then 514 and 24, down to 442 and 25, then down to 325 for FY26, and correct me if I'm wrong.

Um, and then the projected vacancies increase next year, uh, but we're also adding positions.

So, my question is like if we're expecting more vacancies, why are we adding positions?

Should we be working on filling the vacancy?

Like, and that's how does that work and is it yeah, because we're we're talking about two different kinds of positions.

I guess my question is where where are the vacancies, and maybe you don't have to give me like breakdown-like a specific breakdown, but are they civilian positions?

Are they sworn officer positions?

Where are the vacancies?

And then how how does it make sense that we would be adding positions while also in expecting an increase in vacancies for fiscal year 27?

So I mean, uh let um Lisa answers some of these, but I would say this is that uh if it's a new position, it's probably making sure that it's it's meeting a need that we have of some sort uh versus a vacancy for um uh something that's not a a priority, right?

And so in you're try always trying to attract get people to fill the jobs, but if they don't fill them, you have to try to prioritize what you're doing.

Example is like 911.

Uh I mean, those positions are uh priority, so trying to fill those vacancies takes precedence over other vacancies in general.

And you have to also understand capacity.

Um, you know, like HR, we only have so many people to look at so many applications to to vet and do certain things.

So we don't have the ability to fill all positions at the same time all the time, so you have to prioritize and go through that process to fill those positions around it.

Um, and the sworn vacancies, I mean, you you'll see those in the recruit the recruit classes that we have and go through.

And just because you know, we have uh 150 people might go into the academy, it doesn't mean 150 are going to come out of the academy.

So we assume that we're trying to you know fill 150 positions, and through attrition, it might end up being 120, so that's 30 that we'll hold and try to bring around the next time for the next class to try to fill it, yeah.

So during those gaps, it might be creating some of the some of what you're making mention to, Lisa, you can speak to this.

And you know, on that we might also have some vacancies as result of attrition retirements, and they obviously wouldn't be replaced or refilled during the course of the year until we actually have a new class, especially when it can when we're talking about Sworn.

As of now, we have roughly 153 SMORN vacancies, and we have 94 civilian vacancies right now.

Okay.

And then, yeah, what's your projection for next year in terms of retirements and uh right now, um, probably a couple of years ago our average for retirements was uh roughly 131 retirees per year.

That has since gone down because if I'm not mistaken, three years ago we had three um top heavy classes in the 1980s, which came to fruition and as a result of retirement, but now we're seeing roughly anyway between 95 and 100 retirements per year on the sworn side.

This isn't not counting civilian.

Okay, and our vacancies also are dependent on the atmosphere in the world, I'll be quite honest with, you know.

So that's why you always hear about the emphasizing wellness both for the officers and also the importance of acknowledging the good work that they do.

Okay, um, and then in terms of uh I guess this year and for the World Cup, are you are we anticipating spending money on new technologies?

We had a we we've had discussions here about surveillance technology.

So is if is that gonna be are you gonna be uh coming to the city councils, or exigent circumstances?

Do you have what are you projecting in terms of use of surveillance technology during the the world cup?

I don't uh believe I I don't say this about new technology in general.

There's technology all around us when we talk about efficiency and effectiveness uh that every place in the world uses that we currently don't use, right?

Um, you talk about AI and things that nature, but this is not this one's about we don't currently use it, but it's certainly something that we should consider doing to address um some of the efficiency issues that we might have and even just to do the work faster.

That's not for this hearing today, yeah.

But I'm just saying, no, um we have bought, I believe, some equipment, but I don't know if it was bought with grant for the the equipment that we've purchased so far for to prepare for FIFA and sale Boston has primarily been the meridian barriers, which are those yellow barriers that you see around.

That has been our biggest purchase, um, and that's just about it.

I mean, most of I think the cost is probably gonna be around personnel or what we'll have funding for through through France.

Okay, um and then in terms of uh we're talking about mass and casts uh I mean I I think there's a longer conversation to have this afternoon about overtime in mass and casts, which is because of the way it's coded essentially as a special event.

It I think it's mo it's the largest chunk of overtime.

We will talk about this this afternoon.

But uh in terms of responding, um, you know, to try to, you know, help these people on the road to recovery.

I think uh to to paraphrase counselor Fitzgerald, and not to criminalize addiction and and work with people with mental health experts.

What are we doing and what how is it reflected in the budget that you know uh we have sort of we're treating this as the cr as the kind of crisis that uh it is where we're using mental health experts, addiction experts, not necessarily, you know, like uh patrol officers to kind of address the situation.

And so uh I would say this that they've you know the we're referring people and trying to get people as much help as we can when we come across them.

Um that wouldn't be reflected in our budget, you know, around that.

Uh maybe public health could speak to more of some of those issues.

Um but the reality is even in the mass and cast area, I would say our overtime expenditures have gone down again.

Um, this to last year our overtime expenses surrounding mass and casts is down 22.2% compared to this time last year as of May 4.

As I said before, we reevaluate almost everything that we do to be more efficient and effective, uh, where there's no loss on effectiveness, but yet we're being more efficient, and you'll see it, you know, incrementally each year, hopefully, as we as we continue on, because we're not stagnant, we're always looking to try to learn from something and actually address the issue, and then what you see is something better, hopefully, within the next week, day, month, year.

Okay, we could talk talk about that this afternoon.

Uh so I'm gonna go to public testimony.

We've done a first round.

We're gonna go to public testimony.

We got a few people signed up.

Uh, uh, I think it's like five or six.

Um, and we'll hear from each other, each have two minutes, and then we'll go to a second round of questions from my colleagues.

Uh we've got uh Gregory Maynard, Kate Crockford, Antonia uh Edwards, and uh I think agent Jackson, Joseph Rowland, and Clifton Braithwaite.

So uh if you could line up, um you can be at one of either of these two mics.

Mr.

Maynards.

Thank you so much, Chair.

My name is Gregory Maynard, and I am the co-founder and executive director of the Boston Policy Institute.

I'm gonna make a prediction that I know will come true.

The Boston Police Department will overspend its FY27 overtime budget of 55 million dollars by tens of millions of dollars.

The certainty that the FY 27 budget for police overtime is grossly inaccurate, makes having a concrete discussion about BPD's budget and the rest of the city's budget more difficult.

That is because under Mayor Wu deficit spending on police overtime has averaged one percent of the city's total budget.

Here are the numbers.

In FY23, the first budget passed under Mayor Wu, Boston overspent its police overtime budget by 33.8 million dollars or 77 percent in FY24 by 68 million by 68.5 million dollars or 154% in FY25, 41.8 million dollars or 77%.

And in FY26, it appears on track to overspend by 48.7 million dollars or about 90 percent.

City Hall has gotten away with extremely inaccurate budgets because there is a belief that the city will collect more revenue than it formally budgets.

That was true in FY23, 24, and 25, but it was not true in FY26.

And as a result, Boston is now facing its first deficit since the Great Recession.

This is a problem in a vacuum.

The issues driving police overtime overspending have never been adequately explained and raised serious questions about mismanagement at BPD.

However, this isn't a problem in a vacuum.

Boston is facing a deficit in FY26 due in large part to police overtime, and painful cuts are being made in a historically tight FY27 budget.

This is not an unsolvable problem from FY17 to FY20.

Mayor Marty Walsh kept police overtime in check, only overspending 11% to 23%.

The ACLU of Massachusetts has produced extensive analysis about police overtime and raised important and still mostly unanswered questions about the role collective bargaining, scheduling, and minimum staffing requirements play.

Just one second.

At the end of the day, offering this grossly inaccurate line item for police overtime is a choice that the Wu administration, including folks on this panel are making.

The Wu administration can make a different choice.

Thank you so much.

Okay, thank you, Kate Crawford, then Antonia, uh Aja Jackson, Joseph Rowland, Clifton Braithwood.

Hi, uh good afternoon.

It's now afternoon by a couple minutes.

Everyone, uh, my name is Kate Crockford.

I am here representing the ACLU of Massachusetts.

Um I just want to say a couple things.

Number one, um, Commissioner, your team has been very responsive.

Um, you know, when we've raised uh issues around things with respect to the um uh compliance with the surveillance technology oversight uh ordinance, although responsive, but not necessarily on time.

So I'm hopeful that uh this year the council and the public can see the annual surveillance reports, you know, soon, sooner than uh next fall.

Um I also wanted to raise an issue about data quality that the department shares.

Um, there I'm very appreciative that the city uh that the department has published uh arrest data on the analytics website.

I want to offer a couple of um thoughts about how that information could be more valuable to the public.

Number one is it hasn't been updated in a while, and number two, so we need newer data, and number two is that there's no um precise location information pertaining to those arrest data, and that makes the analysis um really difficult and you know not as valuable as it would be if we had more accurate uh location information.

Um, so you know, there may be certain types of cases, you know, child sexual abuse types of arrests, things of that nature, where we wouldn't want precise geolocation data for arrests, but I think for most things, um, it's important that the public have access to that information.

And then the final thing I want to say is about this overtime question, and I'll have more to say about this later this afternoon.

But um, Councillor Fitzgerald, you mentioned that there's been uh that the police have responded to uh concerns in your community around the homeless population, and we've seen that reflected in the arrest data that arrests for things like drug possession and trespassing have skyrocketed in recent years in the Mass and Cass area and in the sort of spillover area where people uh moved after the tent ban went into effect.

I would just offer that um, first of all, that's been really costly for the city in terms of overtime spending.

Um, and number two, that the cost is not necessarily borne out in a way that benefits the public.

Uh obviously, people suffering from mental health and addiction problems who are homeless, they don't need to be arrested.

You know, they need homes, they need health care, they need mental health care and drug treatment.

And so I would just ask that, you know, as the city thinks about the budget, we think about the money that we're spending very carefully with respect to, you know, whether we're spending money giving it to the police department to spend on overtime to arrest people who are in crisis, or whether we're using the money for other purposes.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Uh Antonia.

Yes.

Good morning, everybody.

I just want to say thank you for allowing me to have the opportunity to present myself here today.

Um, Commissioner Cox, my name's Antonia Edwards.

I am a legacy resident.

My family's been in the city of Austin since 1940.

I've lived in Roxbury for the last 50 years.

I have never in my life seen it look this bad.

And I've lived through the crack epidemic.

I feel as though you guys celebrate the fact of mass and cast being cleaned up, and I can kudos.

I give that to you.

But what was the plan as far as the spillover in my community?

Roxbury has been historically known to be stereotypical, the dump, the ghetto.

And this was a setup for us.

My mother can't even walk outside on the sidewalks where there's defecation, there's urine.

I just spent the day with the seniors yesterday who live in the Catherine Hottaway building.

They are terrified and petrified to come out of their building.

So when I sat and heard you say that you heard overwhelming glowful reports about Newbie and Square, I don't know who you talk to.

There's not a business or a person in Roxbury that's happy with the conditions.

You guys have set us up for serious dysfunction and lack of quality of life.

And I want to work with you.

I want you, like I took other people on a tour to come see what we did on a daily basis.

Mass and Cast was commercial.

This is business and residential.

And I can't even go in and out of my house and saying without facing the Mass and Cast addicting people.

I'm not quite sure what the plan is for them.

However, why are they being dumped in my community, and why are you not taking the same effort that you did for Mass and Cass to help me clean up my community?

And I need you to go in the day and night.

I had a tour, one of the city council's persons.

She seen what it was like a day at night.

It's like the thriller movie for Michael Jackson.

And they're dubbed a demolishing property like the Citizens Bank.

They're deprecating on the sidewalks.

They are commandeering our backyard.

I have a video that I can show you where there was a lady who actually was butt naked, shot up in her groin, and masturbated in front of my 78 year old mother.

I live across from the police station.

I call the police station all the time.

They've come and got the people, drugs in their hands, and didn't either arrest them or did anything to them.

What I'm more upset about the fact is during the crack epidemic, everybody went to jail, even if you were in this close proximity.

These people are standing there all day long, blocking passage for people to come in and out of Nubian Square.

We have kids coming out of school.

We have people that want to do business in Roxbury.

They can't without being, you know, coming during the sidewalks, having to say, excuse me, excuse me, can you move?

Whatever.

And this causes a serious public health safety thing.

We don't know what their demeanor is.

We don't know if they're gonna get erratic with us because we're asking to walk on the sidewalk.

So I would really like it if you would work me and work with Mr.

Mignard, come to my community, come to a tour with me both day and night, because I want you to see the thriller movie, and I think that you would see a whole other perception.

I don't know who you're talking to.

I don't know who gave you that information, but they lied to you.

We have pictures of people day and night passed out on the sidewalks, leaning, overdosing.

And there's not one business in the Nubian Square to start the thriving at this point because of these issues.

And we already are behind.

We have like a desert anyways.

So the businesses there aren't thriving because nobody wants to come to New Bean Square, but also this element is deterring it as well, too.

So my name's Anthony Edwards.

You can call me, I'll make myself available to you.

I want to make sure people who are making these decisions really see what they're talking about.

Because I think you guys have a whole other perception of what's going on, and I wouldn't lie to you.

I'm really disappointed to live in Roxbury, embarrassed.

That's about true.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Uh Ms.

Jackson.

Good afternoon, Madam President and Counselors.

My name is Asia Jackson, and I'm here today as a longtime Roxbury resident as well.

And someone who's been in this field and worked with these people for over 15 years, and respectfully, what was described in the chamber today does not reflect what many of us are living outside of these doors.

Because Mass and Cass does not disappear, the crisis was displaced.

And now neighbors like Nubian Square are carrying it.

Come walk through the area, come see the needles, come see the open drug use, come see the people in crisis.

Come see the mothers holding their children at the bus stops closer because they don't feel safe.

Come talk to the small businesses and residents who no longer feel safe in their community.

And while residents are crying out for help, we are hearing conversations about cuts.

Cuts to youth programming, prevention, outreach, and the very organizations like mine that are trying to stop violence before police ever have to respond.

I speak with young people in their guardians every single day.

And what they tell me is heartbreaking, they do not feel safe, not on the trains, not walking through Nubian Square, not in the parks, not even in some of their own neighborhoods.

And youth violence, especially gun violence, and youth deaths has increased in ways our communities have no longer accepted.

We can no longer feel normalized.

So when residents say conditions are not improving, we are not speaking from politics.

We are speaking from lived reality.

And now Boston is preparing for FIFA and for tourism cameras and millions of visitors while residents feel abandoned.

Public safety is not enforcement after harm happens.

Public safety is prevention.

It is youth jobs, it is mental health support, violence prevention workers, clean, safe parks, substance use recovery, real estate investment.

Black and brown communities should not be over policed during global events.

Investment this year is very prevalent.

Commissioner Cox, we do not need performative safety.

We need real accountability, real investment, and real care for people living in this life every single day.

Thank you.

Okay, thank you.

Uh Joseph Rowland.

Sorry.

Okay.

Um skip you, Mr.

Baithwaite.

Good afternoon, everybody, council and our prestigious Boston police.

My name's Clifton Braithwaite, and today I'm here as a statesman.

I've gotten a lot of calls from our seniors, parents, fathers, single parents.

How are we gonna stop this runaway situation in our community?

Um mothers, fathers, grandparents are getting 52As, I think that's what they call it, when they're trying to discipline their family and their kids to bring them in the right direction.

Without putting any families out there, I'm speaking on behalf of them.

Right now, there's a house somewhere off Blue Hill Ave.

I'll talk to you guys later, that is harboring runaways.

There's a group of girls and guys that are running away and hiding out at this house.

Um the mother and her uncle found where their daughter was.

The police came, didn't issue any arrest warrants, but there's grown men around our young ladies and young men in our community.

And it's gotten so bad that I personally had to go with some of my security team to certain homes.

How are we gonna stop this pedophilia going on in our community?

How do we make sure everyone deserves a second chance?

I'm not being hard on anybody, but the reality is just now at Northeastern, there was a young man that did something in Northeastern and is a level two sex offender and nobody knew where he was at.

How can we help you without destroying someone's past because they might have changed?

But the bottom line, I care about our children and our parents.

Parents are going to jail for disciplining their children, and children are getting to walk in and out of their home like they're the adult.

I like to be able to sit down with you guys, bring some parents and some grandparents around and see how we can fix this.

If we want to stop crime, we don't have the old days where we have football coaches and people in our community to talk to us.

I came from that era.

That's why I'm into the things that I'm into.

I found a way to use my anger into fighting in the right way.

Our children out here are lost.

Our parents have no voice.

How can we help those families that the kids are a little away with right now?

We've all been there.

We've all grown, we have all done this.

But these homes that are harboring these kids and these older men are harboring these young men and women.

How do we stop that in our community?

Because I knew if that was in Brookline, Cambridge, or anywhere else, we would be protecting these young people and the parents.

They're asking for help.

Especially the senior parents.

They are asking for help.

And I just wanted to put that on the record.

So whenever y'all are ready to speak, I'll get those parents together.

Thank you.

Okay, thank you.

Okay.

So it's about 12 15 now.

We're gonna try to, because we're coming back at two, give central staff an hour.

Trying to wrap up uh this morning's hearing at one, just for my colleagues.

So we're gonna go for a second, maybe third round, uh, depending on how this goes.

Uh, do five minutes.

Uh Councillor Cultepper.

I think you know, starting with you.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Yeah, uh, Commissioner Cox.

I don't want to make it seem as if this hasn't been worked on.

The Madison Cass response came as a result of many different components of the community coming together.

Uh, especially with uh the NES team and CRT, Councillor Fitzchair, and Counselor Flynn.

We met with the community, the police, NASCRT, all winter to get to the point where we are now in the South End.

We need to do the same thing in New Bean Square.

We don't have a Kelly Young in Nubian Square, but we need Kelly Young to train someone.

We don't have a Nest team right now in Nubian Square.

But we need the training that you taught, training the trainer, the trainer training, the trainee in Nubian Square, the same thing we did, and I'm telling you we met hour after hour after hour until we got to the point where uh there was that four million dollar investment by the state.

We need to do the same thing in Nubian Square.

And the things that I was saying earlier, you heard the community folks come in and say the exact same thing that I was saying earlier, because I wasn't trying to sugarcoat it.

Um I've got videos of folks that sent me videos of what's going on in Nubian Square, and I think we have to be uh we have to accept what's actually happening in order to really change what's going on there.

Now I don't want to sugarcoat this, but we've got a lot of work to do.

That's why we're starting these emergency meetings.

We did the same thing in the South End.

We met time and time again, and Councillor Lujon is right that we have work to do there.

And one of my questions is with regard to the NES team and coming into Nubian Square and doing some training there.

How does that really happen?

I know it was kind of it just happened in the South End because we worked over and over and came together.

We even met on our own, but how do we do the same thing in terms of the training that went in to create the Nest team in Nubian Square?

So, you know, part of the strategy of the because that's the strategy more so than anything else.

It started in Nubian Square.

Um, some of the things you may uh make mention of, it's it's the reality is sometimes these things issues move, right?

And so it might be good today, and then tomorrow, you know, it it could you know move to a different area, some people could come from other areas, um, and and that in that nature.

And so the reality is is that we've worked in Nubian Square.

It was a little bit better, certainly, in that area.

Um, some of the individuals we had, we moved to more mass and cast, particularly the South End, and so I had to grow and address some of the issues, and it's been fairly successful.

Now we just need to make sure we concentrate back on Nubian Square again, which is which is absolutely what we're trying to do.

But it's not just Nubian Square.

How do we do that?

How do we do that?

I just should say this.

It's just not this is a you know, drug addiction, homelessness.

This is not a one area issue.

It's it's all throughout our cities, all throughout our country.

And so having the capacity to be in all places and get uh all at once and all the time.

It's that's a challenging, challenging thing.

We need uh input from the public, certainly.

We need them to call us and let us know about where these things exist.

And then when officers actually show up, then they need to know and have all the tools and equipped to deal with the issue when they do show up around that.

And that's what we're we're trying to uh make happen.

Uh, because it is challenging, right?

We're not trying, this is not something you can arrest your way out of.

We've shown that that's not the case.

It's a combination of both getting people uh rehabilitation, getting um mental health uh stuff addressed, getting other partners involved in this.

And it's it's a fairly complicated issue.

Um, but the reality is is that we're always going to be there to make sure we address it, and we're gonna try to do the best we can.

And so, but it's on our radar, so it's not as though we're not aware.

No, I understand.

I understand being on your radar is good, but I think you have to be more intentional about it.

And I'm talking about there's a plan in the South End of how they approach it with NES and CRT.

It's not just an ad hoc and being on the radio.

There's actually, I know, I know.

But when things, hold on, hold on.

Let me finish Mr.

I was part of the plan.

Because my time I got 16 seconds.

Let's talk after.

Let's let's pick this because I only got 10 seconds.

But I do hope that uh we do take that tour, the two of us, right?

We can walk through New Bean Square because I want you to hear what they were saying, and I hope it's not on May 22nd, because you know, that's a day that we expect you to come back here on May 22nd.

So I hope don't take May 22nd off the table for that tour.

Let's do the tour because I think it's important that New Bean Square sees you walk through there with the District 7 Council.

I think it will make a statement to them about how much you're invested in Nubian Square and how this change happens, because we do need to recreate the NES team and the CR team that is doing the same kind of work that they're doing with the Mass and Cast.

And so uh I'll work with your scheduler, we'll get a date to walk through there, but let's take May 22nd off the table because I expect us to be right back here on May 22nd.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Okay, thank you.

Councillor Culpepper, Counselor Fitzgerald.

Thank you, Chair, and actually very happy that I get to follow uh the Reverend and some of the comments there.

Rev.

There is a plan for Nubian Square, and there is it's the coordinated plan.

That's why it's so important in this budget process coming up.

The amendment that I'm asking for is to increase the coordinated response team.

That's Kelly Young and her team.

This is not just a South End specific issue.

This is in this is to create, along in partnership with Nest and the Boston Police, a citywide plan where we can go to the hot spots with the CRT team and Nest to provide deflection and diversion along with lived experience folks that can put that get them back on the road to recovery and allow it the goal of that plan.

When you say that plan's for the South End, I want you to know that plan is for the city of Boston.

Right now, we are attacking the heart of the issue in Mass and Cass.

I do agree, there has been some spread.

I've seen it up in other parts of my district, uh Edward Everett Square, uh Council Flynn is seeing it, Andrew Square, uh, even as far up as Upham's, we've had uh some new residents coming in uh with some of that as those issues have spread.

And so while we've sort of spread it out, I think that by increasing this coordinated response team that we have a plan that can then go and and help these folks uh individually get the help they need.

Um, I did want to talk about also uh just as reference, because I did in testimony, Cade, you said that we had a um the overtime, the spend that we're the time we're spending.

But I do want to make sure I did hear overtime spending at Mass and Cass is down 20 something percent.

That's correct.

Right.

So I think we're I think hopefully we're seeing that.

Hopefully, that that trend will continue where we take care of the overtime issue by focusing on this larger citywide strategy that yes, you guys have been involved in uh and could not do without.

Um, but um regard, just wanted to make sure I want hopefully that continues and happy to work with everyone to make sure that we're doing this, both public safety and public health perspective together as one.

Um, one of the things that really helped that is uh the CIT.

And uh I know now with this is kind of switching gears uh to staffing levels.

Um, some folks that CIT is being kind of moved about.

That was another sort of group of folks just like the CRT team, the CIT team could say, hey, we've got a uh particular issue bubbling up, and you could deploy a number of folks there uh through CIT.

However, with staffing levels, my understanding is, and please correct me if I'm wrong, is that you would lose CIT as a group to cover other staffing and even other precincts, like if Southie was down, C11 would have to send CIT members over there.

And then the van that would drive around with CIT with maybe three, four, five, uh, is down to just the the driver or even the van not going out at all.

Um is am I correct in that in the in that the that's how CIT, very effective, but right now limited in their effectiveness due to staffing levels.

Would be would would we say that that is agreed upon, or is that is there a different issue?

So it how it was formed.

Yes, we knew it was a group of folks that designed this day together, but again, um CIT again is a more philosophy and a strategy that can again be broken out in every district where everyone does it.

So it increases our capacity quite a bit.

But um certainly when we introduced it uh as they began to get other calls from other areas, it it was watered down a little bit.

Um but the fact is I think it was highly effective, particularly in some of the areas you make mention, charges them.

Yes, well, you know, the CIT is definitely big in like Jamaica Plain and some of the other different uh districts, but um, in order to kind of supplement Nest, we use CIT as well.

Right, and it's great because the CIT members now get exposure to the uh Nest theory.

Um, that way we can keep expanding this whole NES thing into all of the different districts.

Um so the CIT teams do have definitely shrunk since we first started it maybe two years ago now.

And um, but with that being said, they're still involved with NEST.

So they're still involved in those communities and still doing those things we need to do, Mass and Cass, Nubian.

Um, I know we've had a number of interactions and incidents um in Nubian Square during the last kind of period that Nest keeps track of.

Um, well over 200 interactions there.

So um so we're gonna keep it going.

Uh Kelly Young and Erica and all the CRT teams.

They they go to Nubian as well.

They're not just they don't just stay in Mass and Cass.

And while we do have the um that emergency command post right there at Mass and Mass and Cass is kind of an anchor, it does get moved around the city.

Yeah.

And I guess just my remaining time.

I do want to the there's sort of this messaging out there that Nubian is taking a hit because of Mass and Cass.

But I I've I've managed a lot of property over my years working for the city in Nubian Square.

There are problems that have persisted throughout that continue to be that.

So I I just want to make sure when folks who are upset, some of the folks testifying saying, hey, the mass and cast is here and now you don't care about us.

Uh that is not I I want to make sure I understand through the strategy we're trying to implement that is not forgotten.

Some of those problems were long existing prior to the spreading out of uh taking down the tents.

Um but I I do I fully admit that there is an uptick in the usage in those areas.

Uh we have not forgot about them.

I know police have not forgotten about them, and this plan is to again address the citywide strategy.

And so hopefully, no matter where there is an issue, uh we'll be able to deploy this.

We've seen it work, and hopefully we continue to see those positive results uh and tweak it along the way as we must.

But uh thank you all for your time uh panel.

Uh very much appreciate your your coordination and collaboration uh with myself and my office along with everybody here on this council.

So uh appreciate your time.

Okay, thank you, Councilor Fitzgerald.

Just to uh minor clarification, or just in terms of the mass and cas reduction, that's in the number of hours.

I think it's 20 percent in the number of hours projected toward the end by the end of this year because uh as opposed to uh uh last fiscal year.

It's not it most likely because wages go up the amount spent, I'm assuming isn't down 21 percent, but it it you know it so that number is going down.

It still may be the largest amount of over pool of overtime.

But uh we're working on that, but we can talk about that this afternoon, in terms of like, you know, no, okay, yeah.

I just want to clarify that the 22 percent decrease that we're reflecting right now is as of May 4, 43 weeks into the fiscal year compared to 43 weeks into fiscal year um 25.

So it's it's it so I am projecting that it's gonna be even down further for fiscal year end.

We always look at hours because of collective bargaining agreements because you know if if we're reporting now is at a lower rate three years ago, they never get true up by code, they get true up obviously by uh by you know a general ledger entry to bring us up to the actual reflective overtime, but the codes don't get true up based on the collective target agreement.

So that's why we always compare ours.

Can I just so we we came out to 22 percent decrease based on the the I think it was 160,000 hours in FY25 and FY24, and then I think with the data we had been provided, and I'm not sure when the data went up to was 100,000, and we just projected that you know pro rata to the end, you know, the end of this year, and we got a 22 percent reduction.

So that was I I don't know if we're expecting more than a 22 percent reduction.

I mean, that would uh but just the way we did the math, we came out at 22 percent, assuming like a s a smooth uh you know amount of hours going for the rest of this year, uh but this is also a discussion for this afternoon.

Um so it comes commissioner if you had something to say.

FIFA and uh a few other things coming up between now and then, but well, also I mean I was thinking that number might not stay at 22 percent just because I mean we know mass and cast there's a people come out when the weather gets nice and uh you know warmer and um the the amount of hours might go up, but I you we I think we can all just agree that you that the numbers are down from l the last two years uh and that's through you know obviously there's an intentional effort to to do that.

So um and and maybe it's a sign that you know tactics are having an impact there.

Um okay, so does that do it?

Are we all on the same page?

I think on that.

Okay, thank you very much.

Counselor Flynn, you're up next.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Commissioner, I work with Council on establishing a firearms trafficking report, um, that is required every year.

I I know 10% of firearms recovered by the Boston police, um, are ghost guns, privately manufactured firearms.

What are we doing to prevent um ghost guns from getting on to our streets?

But are we identifying specific areas of um the city where they're made or how are we coordinating that uh commissioner?

So Paul could probably speak to some of this, but we work actively with ATF and we do pretty major investigations to try you know finding out the people who are both making those and bringing them here in general and making sure we we both take them off the street and the people who are making them and selling them, Paul.

Okay, so I I would say that um when we get information about you know a particular location or particular person that might be involved in either you know getting the parts and putting them together or or the um you know resale or you know, distribution of those guns.

We work closely with uh TFOs, our task force officers at the ATF and the ATF to kind of investigate those.

Um I don't remember the exact location, but sometime in the last month or so there was a significant um operation done where they recovered numerous different parts, uppers and lowers of uh uh designed to be put together as privately manufactured or ghost guns.

So when we get that information, we're finding them, we're arresting people with them, but when we we get information about someone that might be actively involved in that, um having it sent to their house, putting them together, and then selling them.

We're working closely with you know the people that we have assigned to the ATF with our detectives to to try to proactively go after those individuals.

Thank you, Commissioner.

Thank you, Superintendent.

Thank you for years you've been um, you know, you've been very responsive when I had questions about any type of issues.

So just want to say thank you to um being responsive to me and um and on public safety-related issues.

Um Mr.

Chair, I I was going to ask a staffing level question.

I know it's for later this afternoon, but do you think it might be appropriate for me to ask?

I honestly I think it's uh if you're if you're not prepared and you know you need some time to this afternoon to the panel, but I think you feel free.

Okay, I haven't cut anyone off.

I'm just sort of asking it for people.

I just didn't want to ask something that was not appropriate.

I didn't want to catch anyone off guard.

Um but uh commissioner, I was just looking at the staffing level on detectives.

On detectives from 2023 to two thousand twenty-26, two two thousand twenty-three we had two hundred and seventy-two, two six, two hundred and thirty-seven.

Significant reduction, thirty-five.

What are we doing to get through that number up so we can get more detectives on the streets investigating crime?

Uh if you're asking, are we going to promote more detectives?

We probably will fairly soon.

Are we gonna get are we gonna get it up to the 272 that we had recently, a couple of years ago?

Um we're going to evaluate as we add more to it to make sure again we're being efficient as effective as possible.

But because remember, in order to promote detectives, you take it from the patrol force.

And so we'll we'll always have to be cognizant every time that we pull from one force to go to the next to make sure that we're meeting uh the needs of the pool that we're taking from.

Okay.

But yes, we're considering it.

Okay.

I guess I guess sergeants as well, Commissioner.

2025, 291, today 278.

Um what do you think about that?

Again, same thing.

It's the same.

Okay, because to make sergeants, you pull it from both patrolmen and maybe detectives.

And we just did a promotion ceremony.

19 sergeants have left the weekend.

19 sergeants just a week ago.

Okay.

Okay, thank you.

I just want to make sure we have the numbers that are necessary so we can do the job effectively.

I'm not part of the defund the police movement like other people are.

I want to see more police on the street.

I support police, but I want to make sure that we have enough police, and that's advocating for more police in the budget.

And that's what I want to see as we go forward consistently hiring more police every year in the budget.

300 police officers, Mr.

Chair, every year consistently.

We have a hundred police officers retiring every year.

We need more police on the streets, Mr.

Chair.

Thank you.

Okay, thank you, Councilman.

It looks like we'll have time for a third round if anyone wants to come back or stick around.

Counselor Louis Jim.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair, and I want to apologize.

I didn't realize the breakdown before, so I did ask a lot of overtime questions during my first panel, and so um I think I am not sure if I'll have any for the second panel, but um I have questions about that I think are on topic about community policing and about brick.

Um so the first one is about um it seems like there's a reduction in uh funding for the community engagement team, and we know that community policing um and community engagement is a big part of community policing from 4.63 million to 4.35 million.

Uh what accounts for that decrease?

And if on the flip side, there is an overall increase in the police budget.

What account for that increase?

I think the overall increased budget had to do with salaries from the from the collective bargaining, collective bargaining.

That's the primary increase for our budget for fiscal year 27.

I do want to point out that they're there a hundred thousand of that decrease that you've seen under uh Bureau of Communication, included a best clinician.

They do have a best clinician BCE, but we're keeping it all under one department, so we can keep track of it accordingly.

So they didn't actually lose money, it's just that we moved the best clinician over to another department.

Yes, okay.

Thank you.

Um, question about brick.

It receives 4.18 million dollars in city operating dollars.

I see you there, Director Walsh listening attentively attentively.

Is all that funding for the for the BRIC?

Um, and how many positions is the operating budget support, and what are those positions?

And how many do external funds how much external uh support?

Just to clarify, I'm sorry.

I um so we're talking about the Bureau of Intelligence and Analysis.

Yep.

Yeah, okay, so that because it what proportion is the BRIC, yeah.

Okay, I I just I think I heard BRIC twice, but uh uh just wanted to say that.

Yeah, I think I got that.

Yeah, hopefully that was clear.

Yes, so for uh the funding breakdown, the city of Boston budget funds 33, and this is on the professional staff, staffing side.

Uh 33 positions within the BRIC, grant funded position 16.

The operating budget supports 33 positions, 33 positions correct.

Uh grant funded 16.5.

We have two, we currently have two vacant positions.

Uh the UASE grant uh funds 13, one vacant position, uh the cops grant two, one vacant position.

SSYI grant uh funds a half position because we funding uh from one of the other uh grants.

Um eOps um has a brick line item 9.5 that's that other that point five percent uh from the SSY grant position.

Um we currently have four vacant positions um there okay thank you um commissioner cox with respect to our ability to live up to what we stayed in the trust act um we are no longer when someone is arrested they are no they are no longer being held in Boston police department custody in some cases in a Boston police department facility in some cases yes in some cases they are yes in other cases they're not um do we we don't see them all the hall so females female female females go to district four yes so oh okay and for others go to Suffolk County Correct I'm asking particularly about because of the Emmanuel de masse case um we don't control what happens even though they are arrested and put into a facility because of an arrest by the BPD if they are put in Suffolk County we don't necessarily control or know what is going to happen as if a county because we don't know their level of interaction with federal authorities is that correct so what we do know is that we take them there we book them there and until we're done with the booking that was when the person's identified for who they are right then they take possession of them and at that point it cease our involvement ceases whether they you know um whether they take them to court or they get released from there we we're no longer involved in that process but they are placed in custody in like for example South County or Nashville suite because street because of an arrest by BPD.

Right they're in custody once we arrest people with handcuffs on them so whether they're now stationed or there but they're in custody um you know the sheriff's sheriff's office are are suitable like that is their role to actually handle prisoners they have medical staff um they have monitoring they have yeah and I don't disagree with you I I don't disagree with you on that that is what they do for a living and and so when even in ourselves it's just a holding spot until we can get them to either the court or our really to court or they get released and so uh you know it was thought and still is thought that that's the best location for people to do it the people in the business of uh having medical attention there um better so like they're better at it than we are and so we contracted with them to take our prisoners so we don't have to do that.

I'm wondering you know a question about whether it is if if that ends up undermining our trust act because we don't you know we don't have a trust act uh agreement right with the sheriff's department right and they don't have 287g agreements but we also are not clear about what they are and aren't doing so I can only speak for our agency I can't speak for them I think that's part of the problem but I have heard them say that they that they honor the trust act but I don't you know that's their agency I can't speak to that.

Thank you.

Thank you Mr.

Chair yeah uh just um we'll we'll we'll stick around to one so um but I'm gonna give myself a couple minutes um so just uh uh follow up on that that question about the the BRIC so the the Bureau of Intelligence Analysis has a 4.1 million dollar budget does all of that go to the BRIC I don't know maybe did you answer did that did you get that answer Counselor Luigi?

I know it's part of your question.

I just I'm sorry can you ask that question the Bureau of Intelligence and analysis has a 4.1 million dollar operating budget does all of that go to the BRICS yes okay and then um can you so I think you listed some something around 40 employees I you know it could be more could be less but then uh are there fed their federal employees at the BRIC also we do have uh that there are we have partnered agencies that are actively working in the BRIC yes operating out of it.

But in terms of like if I just went there if I was at headquarters or you know in that office there'd be somebody from the federal government there also?

Yes we do okay and it how many like each each day or we have we have four people from outside agencies the Boston Fire Department EMS Boston EMS E FBI and DHS.

That's that actively sit in two federal employees correct okay um okay and it counts that we also included another they've gotten bigger in the sense that dignitary protection unit is now totally located in the BRIC.

Okay.

Okay thank you uh in terms of um you we do we uh talked a little bit about diversity I know we're talking about recruiting and diversity later, but we talked about the cadet program um I guess one one thing I uh I think counselor Flynn was uh talking about his his uh sort of push for us to you know have more full staffing on the Boston police department.

I guess commissioner, like, is there a pool of three hundred qualified people that were just turning down every year?

Uh you know, because my sense was when we were here two years ago, and things have moved since then, they're just people weren't applying to be police officers, uh, you know, following George Floyd.

But so I I just what's the what's the status of that now?

Um what at least you can speak to.

I would say this we always need a large pool of people who are interested because even when you people are interested, we have to screen them to make sure that they're suited for the job, and then there's a bunch of things along that process that can reduce that.

So yeah, I see we've done recruiting, and there's more people taking the exams, but I'm just asking like, you know, are there are we just leaving people on the sidelines?

Because you know, and two years ago the answer was no, we need which more people to apply.

Is that is it any different now?

What's going on?

What does it look like?

I mean, I think we've made significant strides in our recruitment efforts to get um people to more and more people to register and take the civil service exam.

But I would like to point out that the last three, four years, we fully fully have gone through the list both on the residential side and both on the non-residential side.

And what happens through the course of the recruitment process is that you might get flooded with a lot of people that have interest when they come in to pick up their card or sign for their card.

They don't come back for orientation.

Come back for orientation, they don't come back with their completed packets.

And then, you know, we do have round tables where they do extensive background checks, and some might fall fall that way, and then they go through a medical, a pretty strict medical process, and some of them might, you know, drop out of the process from that.

At the end of the day, we also have the MPTC physical requirements, and we do have a significant decline with working with these candidates to get them in our gym with our trainer to get them, um, but but but we have gone through the list.

Even though our recruitment efforts have shown significant increases in people taking the exam, we we're going completely through the list.

No one's being left aside.

And is that different, Commissioner?

I you're gonna say like from, you know, not not to go back too far, but when you like when you were coming up, was that was it different?

Yeah, I think when I came out there was tens, literally tens of thousands of people who took the exam.

Um, and it's a much there's much smaller pool, but we've done a great deal, certainly in the last couple of years to increase that pool a great deal.

Almost to the point where we actually are like leaving some people off at the end, um, you know, right before class, go ahead.

Not a lot.

There's no certainly that that's not the case, but um, but it it takes a while.

Like we have a lot of we're recruiting against everybody in every industry.

Um, the time it takes to from um taking the exam to getting on are you know it's six months, if not longer, and it's hard for people to even hold a spot for that because if they want to, they'll take jobs elsewhere.

So we have a lot of challenges with recruitment, but the fact is is that um we're doing all we can to keep that pool large because we need large pools to make sure we have um qualified people to come on to the job.

And just to follow up on that chair's privilege here to go over the buzzer, but uh, you know, the other side of that is you know, recruitment, you know, I think over time, Boston Police Department has done a uh a decent job, you know, diversifying its ranks, you know, maybe even a very good job, you know, since the 70s, but if you know, Nicole, I don't want to go back to the Smith case or you know, but in terms of the higher ranks that hasn't played out over time.

I know there's a new list now.

You've given the exam to uh to make promotions off of.

You know, uh and I am my I you know how do you see that playing out in terms of uh diversifying the ranks of sergeants, lieutenants, and captains, and I would just say in terms of we we're we're using alternative pathways for cadets.

Can we do that for uh and maybe you know, I I I don't think we can do it.

We have to give an exam or something for the promotions, but what are we doing to increase the diversity in those ranks?

So it always begins as I made reference to the the pool.

You have to have a diverse group to start off with, so you need patrol officers, which we are doing a really, you know, hopefully a much better job of getting people uh that are diverse into our department.

And then the second half of it is about making sure people are developed and want to be supervisors and take the exam and encouraged it.

The last exam we had, which I'm very happy we did.

We had a how many people approximately 800 people took the exam.

800 officers actually took the exam.

That was a large group of people, and that was what's very good.

And so um, as a result, we were able to you know have some promotions and the poll here we'll speak to what those numbers were.

But we're doing a lot to both develop our employees and give them opportunities and encourage them to both take exams and and see if they want to have leadership roles within the department.

Yeah, sure.

Thank you, counselor.

It's always nice to relive the old days.

Um so since the certification of the new promotional list, we've made promotions at all three ranks, sergeant, lieutenant, and captain.

Of the five captains promoted, 40% of them were women.

Of the 12 lieutenants promoted, 25% of them were people of color, and of the 19 sergeants promoted, 31, 31% of those were people of color.

So certainly making progress, increasing diversity in the higher ranks, but to reinforce the commissioner's point, we have to continue to focus on increasing diversity in the pool of patrol officers because that is ultimately where we draw from as we elevate our officers based on the exams.

Okay, thank you.

We currently have two female captains that I don't know if we've had on a department, you know, at the same time, and you know, in a very, very long time, if ever.

Yeah, Captain Batson, I think is that she's who are the two women captains.

Captain Bethlehem, Captain Nicole McMullen.

Oh, okay, okay.

Oh, yeah, Nicole.

Um, okay.

Uh thank you very much.

I mean those numbers.

I mean, I think when we did the Smith case, the numbers of lieutenants who was in the single-digits uh people of color and uh um to be making those promotions.

I know Council Culpeper talked about Captain You know Hussein uh uh, and you know, to have people in those places, they need to make their way up the up the ladder, and this is you know, in the past they've largely been kept out of that ladder, and so thank thank you very much for continuing to work on that.

Um, so just quickly last uh round of questions, like divide uh 11 by three.

Uh I would be in a different job, so I'm not sure.

But um, how about three minutes each?

Thank you.

Thank you, Karen.

I do want to just from my perception, uh, and you know, perception is in the eye of the beholder.

Uh I beg to differ with Council Fitzgerald with regard to the movement of folks from Mass Cats, Madison Cast to Nubian, because that is happening.

They are moving from Madison Cast to Nubian Square.

I mean, we see it, and so that's one of the complaints that some of the businesses in Nubian Square had, they have now seen more folks that have come from Mass and Cast into Nubia Square.

I do have a few questions for Commissioner Cox regarding the NES team.

Because I was part of the group when they first started, we met and met and met, and it just came together kind of it's plan, right?

And there is a plan for it to go citywide.

It's not citywide right now.

I know it's not.

So my question is for the NES team, uh Commissioner, what is, or who makes up the NES team that we have working in the South End today?

And I'll have John Brown speak to that of the group, but I was I've been waiting to hear from no, but I think I think you have to understand Ness is the philosophy.

Sometimes you these acronyms were thrown out there.

People seem to think that this group of people, it's really about how they go about doing it, right?

Interacting with the folks.

Um we we we have some people with uh with exceptional skill set and actually uh uh addressing it, and and that's probably the leader of it, and so what we're trying to do is expose that to more and more officers so they can have the confidence in the tools to do the exact same thing, so we can do it in all districts at all at the same time.

No, I understand, I understand.

And so but I'm trying to get to numbers because when you have a plan, you want to know who's implementing the plan.

And I know how the plan was implemented in the South and who's implementing it, but uh and again is it's is it superintendent Brown?

Yes, sir.

I thought so, okay.

Good to hear from you.

Yes, sir.

And I only have 48 seconds left.

So that's right.

You know, I'm really trying to focus on establishing commissioner.

You call it a philosophy, but there is actually a team that's that's living up to that philosophy, and it's the Boston Police Department, sir.

And the point is is that the more like community policing, the more of it do it, the more you see almost everywhere.

Right, and what my question is, how do we establish that in D2?

Because we don't have it, you call it a philosophy, I call it, and we called it a team because they're going out, and they've been identified as a nest team in these meetings.

They've been going out to do the work in the in the South End.

We want to establish that same Ness team or philosophy in Nubian Square, Commissioner, where it began, by the way.

And I don't know what happened over time, but uh if if it's that if it begun there, let's let's establish it.

Part of the reason for this meeting tonight is to talk about that and how to get it established or re-establish it in Nubian Square.

Because I do disagree with uh my counselor Fitzgerald.

They are moving from Mass Air because of the work that's being done there into Nubian Square.

Okay, Rev.

So as you know, uh the Nest did start on district B2, you know, back in the day, and then Ness was kind of the evolution, was kind of Ness kind of evolved and moved over to A1 when we did the spring initiative.

I think we're going on maybe two years ago now.

Then we moved into District 4 in order to and C6 in order to deal with the mass and cast stuff.

So, but in answer to your question, we have one lieutenant, one sergeant, and 14 police officers in Nest.

Um, I think maybe two weeks ago they had like maybe six or eight officers.

We've got them a few more officers, and um, like I said, the districts, the two the three different districts also participate with NEST to kind of address the different issues, and we are definitely looking at Nubian Square, because as you know, Sergeant Jared Giroud originally came from there.

Um, and detect um Captain Mamoney was also lieutenant at uh B2 before he became a captain.

So he's well aware of the different issues that are going on down there.

Well, maybe we should bring them back, yes.

Well, look, let me thank you for your testimony.

Thank you, Commissioner, for your leadership team.

Uh I told you when we were on the phone, I wasn't gonna hold back when you came, because I think we gotta have tough discussion in order to come out with a good probability solution.

So I thank you.

And and Superintendent Brown, I'll be working with you on the newbie.

Come to the meeting tonight, like the Urban League at six.

I'll be there.

And uh I would love to.

If we're done here first.

So, yeah, that's uh about that.

Let's move on so you can take the Mr.

Chair.

Central staff uh break before the afternoon.

Okay, thanks.

Thanks.

I I doubt that, but uh okay.

Uh Counselor Flynn.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair, and just want to say acknowledge uh Reverend Cole Pepper's strong and positive leadership for his constituents.

That's exactly what he should be doing fighting for his neighborhood.

Um Commissioner, um, and I I'm glad um to know that the cooperation with the FBI is or ATF as well is working effectively on trafficking of guns.

I also know that the FBI is partnered with the Boston police on human trafficking related issues, interests.

Um so that cooperation with those federal partners is critical, especially as we go into this summer with many tourists expected to Boston into Boston.

Commissioner, human trafficking is is an issue I I focus on a lot.

I have a lot of hotels in my district.

Um, you have a good plan for that for this summer.

Yeah, I think Paul may mention it.

Well, we we are partnering with quite a few folks for that.

So uh so our human trafficking you know going back into 2025, we started to kind of anticipate the FIFA.

Um you know everything that's going to surround FIFA.

We started to look at from the investigative standpoint what crimes we might see increase during those times, looked out to get intel from different cities that were that had held uh hosted this before.

Certainly human trafficking is one of the issues that is often brought up as uh as we see prolonged events over 39 days in our case and the concerns that go along with that.

So the Family Justice Center Captain Thomas Deputy Evans uh Human Trafficking Sergeant Mark Sullivan have been talking about this putting together a plan working with our uh both the FBI uh state police partners our social service agencies that work within that human trafficking uh space um and the entire family justice center to kind of consider the response to human trafficking um both in a demand reduction standpoint and response to incidents um and also within the the whole family justice uh violence against women sexual assault and things like that so uh we have we we we got ahead of this um you know obviously you can always use more manpower more uh assets but we have a plan in place that um uh while still developing is is been worked on for quite some time thank you superintendent I re also represent a large immigrant community in my district and um thank thanking Boston police for the important work um they're doing on human trafficking and I do know a lot of immigrants um are used exploited as part of as part of human trafficking let me just make one last point as it relates to hiring police officers certainly it's an issue I've been focused on my entire career also part of it is the retention of current police officers in ensuring that we provide them with the critical support they need and their families need as well I also think elected officials need to be more respectful and helpful to police officers and their families I think that's part of retention.

Knowing that if there's an issue that city counselors the mayor has their back and I think I think Boston police officers want to know that city elected officials have their back and if they don't if they don't believe we do you know that does impact retention and I talk to police officers like like everybody else does almost every day and and they want they want us to support them and support their families as too that's why I focus a lot on the 16 hour shift because I do think it has a negative impact on a police officer's family and impacts someone's marriage it impacts their their health and their family and children also impacts the residents of the city.

Mr.

Chair thank you okay thank you very much counselor Louis.

Thank you and I'm honored to be the one to close out well you probably might have questions too but um I have a question regarding um attrition and attrition at the academy what accounts for attrition that happens at the academy and what is the what is the culture like at the academy and what have the what what changes have been made in the academy over the years.

So the attrition that we do have at the academy is either from academic failures uh physical fitness failures uh and where people who just outright quit they decide in the academy that's not the job for them or they don't want to be here and and those are the primary the three uh fundamentally um ways in which attrition happens in the academy the culture has changed over the academy probably quite a bit in some time uh you know um we we do first of all the training is longer we do more things in general across the board the requirements are more uh just because there's uh more state requirements that we have to put out there uh and the fact is that we you know we introduce community policing in the academy.

We we have a lot more de-escalation uh simulated in the academy.

We have more tools to you know uh including taser that we didn't have before in the academy so um and and we're always looking uh to make sure the academy culture is fits today's needs, and and we're always going to look to make sure we evaluate and make sure we don't have incidents where people are being hurt and or unnecessarily bounced out the academy for no reason.

Because we're not being proactive enough to look to make sure that we're instilling the right things in the offices, but more importantly, that you know we're not just overly you know driving them out for no reason because we just want to keep things the same from 50 years ago.

So we're always looking to reevaluate it.

We have some really good instructors here, and I think we're pretty happy with the performance that we're getting.

Would you say um attrition has flatlined like it's the same, or have you seen increase?

Does anybody or that's a question I could maybe submit through the chair?

If like entering and entering the academy and leaving before, I would say they graduate.

We have that data with us, but I think the injuries have gone down because uh some of the training that we do are a little different around that, like the physical fitness standards, how we do certain things are a little different.

Have become more competitive, like no, I mean like I think we we do more uh I want to say like cross training fitness versus some of some of the other things that we used to do before the past.

Um I can get you more information a little later.

I wasn't totally prepared for that one, but the fact is is that uh we do do things differently in the academy in some ways to you know meet today's need, um, you know, just even the requirements to get in uh what they used to measure is some of the things we don't use those measurements anymore.

Thank you.

Can I ask one more question?

Sure, hopefully so.

Oh, go ahead.

Yeah, so just um for a frame of reference, we have a class currently in the academy, and they're reporting as of this week a 14% attrition rate from the start date, which is a significant reduction in the attrition based on the classes that we've seen prior to that.

So the changes that are being made are supporting kind of a uh uh getting our recruits from start to finish.

So can you give it uh give us an example?

This is not my other question, but of the a number of recruits, for example, in the last class, the number who started and the number who graduated.

Do you know that and and while I my this is my final question, I'm sorry, Mr.

Chair.

Um so for example, I was out with uh uh my chief of staff this week, we saw someone who we believe was in medical crises, and we called 911 for an ambulance, and there were two police cars that also showed up.

Now, is that just a matter of of protocol that police show up when it was you know it was a request for 9-1?

Same thing with if there's a fire, like the the decision to have police show up, just in terms of like how we can make sure that we are being as nimble as possible.

Yeah, it's it's it's like a triple response in our 911 system.

So if someone's having a medical emergency, because we are CPR trained, and so the idea is to get the fastest responses possible.

Uh the fact is we don't need to stay if EMS gets there before us or fire, but the reality is that it's it's a triple response because you want to get people health from the fastest person when we get there, and so it's always a triple response.

Um I believe you certainly on some of those, but what happens is because we use the same system, uh, EMS is pretty responsive, and the fire department's very responsive, you know, on some of those, and so they they usually do get there, and then we can call each other off.

And tell each other, okay, stand down.

We like for so in that situation.

If the EMS had, because EMS did not make it first, it was the police.

We stayed, the police made it first.

Then the MS.

And so, but we're not there that we're not the primary.

We're just there just as someone from public, you know, safety to be there until the other ones show up, and you know, um, some officers have defibular leaders in the car, and as well.

Like I say, we are CPR trained.

A lot of office goes to certified, and um um uh tourniquet, so we know for bleeding things of that nature.

So we are trained for some form of medical um, you know, certainly attention, but not certainly all forms, whether physicians, doctors, and things of that nature.

So I think the idea is for the public to get help as fast as possible.

Thank you.

Do you want that?

Yeah, just by way of example?

So so the class that's currently in the academy that started on March 30th started at 152, they're currently at 131.

The class that started in the academy on May in May of 2025 and graduated in January started at 68 and graduated 46.

And 116 recruits entered the academy in January 2025 and graduated at 97 in August of 2025.

Thank you.

Those are my questions.

Have you picked out what you're already not spending money on for the next fiscal year?

Are you canceling contracts?

What what does that decrease mean?

Other requests for new items and other contractual reductions based on the actual spending and it was reduced accordingly.

So like our run rates on some of the contractual agreements that we have.

Some of them are variable, they're not fixed contracts like axon is a fixed contract, our RMS is a fixed contract, but any contracts we have for uh repairs and maintenance, um, you know, any kind of service agreements if they're not being used, they they were reduced accordingly based on actual run rate.

Okay, I'm just adding in terms of like something like shot spotter.

I mean, are you stopping anything that's being uh programmed?

Absolutely the shot spot of contract goes up anywhere between three and five percent um each year.

Last year the cost of SHASPA was 297,000 and we have budgeted 316,000, which is purely contractual increases that we've seen over year on year.

Okay, thank you very much uh for this morning and uh we'll connect try to try to come back at two uh and uh we'll uh get that that I think that hearing will be longer.

I think there'll be some uh public testimony that we'll try to uh work in again after our first round of questions, depending on how many folks are here and and figure that out.

But uh okay, so thank you very much.

This morning's hearing is now adjourned.