So I'm just like a month back that the other people who were you know we admitted the month.

And of course it would be not so like go down to the parking lot at some point and like we're the bus.

Oh yeah, so it's just like meanwhile, and I'm not speaking with us because I said she does now.

Oh, this one's a little I think we can get going, yeah.

All right, everybody ready.

Um, um Dick was not able to be with us tonight, so I will be chairing.

It's very exciting.

Um so good evening and thank you for joining us.

Uh before we begin, I'd like to share a few reminders to help you follow along and participate in public comment.

You can attend or watch this meeting and future ink meetings in several ways in person here in the city commission room, live streamed on your computer via the meetings video page at Bozeman.net on cable TV channel 190, or by joining via video conference using the link in the meetings calendar event on the Bozman's main webpage where ink agendas are posted.

You may also call in using the phone number and access code listed on the agenda.

Please note this option is listen only and does not allow for public comment.

To provide public comment, you may comment in person here in the commission room, use the raise hand feature if joining by video conference.

When it's your turn, Emily Kiley will call you by name or submit written comments by emailing comments at Bozeman.net.

Written comments received by noon on the day of the meeting will be distributed to and read by the Inc.

Now let's begin with introductions.

Be sure to talk into the microphone.

Okay.

Paul Burns from Arlene neighborhood.

Paul Disley, Kirk Park neighborhood.

Kathy Rich University neighborhood.

Jim Webster, South Central Association of Neighbors, otherwise known as Scan neighborhood.

Emily Mason, Figgins Edition.

Angika Toick, the Northeast Neighborhood Association, otherwise known as Nina.

Beth Boyson, New Highlight View.

Douglas Fisher, you're a city commission representative.

Or liaison.

Hi everyone, Emily Kylie, Community Engagement Coordinator.

All right.

Let's see.

Okay.

Hold on a second.

We do have Zara online.

I got a promoter.

Yeah.

Well, she's on there.

She's online, and so but we can move on.

Okay.

Disclosures.

Any disclosures.

No.

Okay.

All right.

Changes to the agenda.

Yes, I have one.

Before I do that, should we specify that Zara Osman is the rep for the Valley Unit Neighborhood Association?

Voona, is that right?

Okay.

So we're on an action item agenda item today.

Myself as a subcommittee member for the bylaws update, along with Zara Osman and Kath Crumrine.

Kath was not able to make it today.

Zero's online.

And we're requesting to delay our uh presentation.

We were prepared to give a presentation on our recent work on the bylaw update.

We had a meeting with Anna Severud from the city attorney's office and had a very productive meeting.

We learned about things that had to revert back to original language because of code.

And we also learned that there's some latitude as well.

Um however, in preparing our presentation, we discovered that some text in the version that was sent out to you for this meeting is erroneously showing up as newly added text when it actually is original text.

And because we as the subcommittee want to do our due diligence, we're requesting that we delay our more full presentation about the changes that have occurred since we met last month, and that we um we get you a final version that's accurate as to what actually changed from the August 2024 version, and one that's more commensurate with the product that we would want to send along to the city commission for ratification.

And uh I also wanted to mention something that we learned in our meeting is that for a bylaw vote to occur, um you need to have two-thirds representation in the vote, uh two-thirds of all INC delegates.

So assuming we approve a new neighborhood association today, I believe our number will come up to 15.

Is that correct, Emily?

So two-thirds of 15 is 10.

So, in order for us to actually vote on the bylaws update, we would need 10 people present for the vote.

Uh uh 10 INC delegates present for the vote, and all 10 of those to get to two-thirds would have to agree that we want to send those on for ratification.

Oh, yeah, uh online counts.

I just mean in in attendance.

You can start a meeting with only one third quorum, but if you're voting on the bylaws, you need two-thirds of all INC delegates.

I know it gets really tricky.

So it's really important to be clear.

So hopefully next month we'll have at least 10 INC delegates in attendance so that we can have a vote on the bylaws.

And then, if, in that case, all 10, two-thirds of all INC delegates agree that they're worthy of being sent along, then they will be sent along.

Does that make sense?

So we have to have 10, but all in have to agree and majority.

So I asked that specific question because I wanted clarity for that.

And my understanding, and Emily will uh let me know if I have this wrong, but in my um feedback from the city attorney's office, my understanding is that for a bylaws amendment, which this would be, we would need a two-thirds vote of all INC delegates, which currently would be 10, and that means not only voting, but would have to vote in favor of moving them along for ratification, at least 10.

Yeah, yeah.

Thank you.

And sorry for the delay, but I think it'll be a better product if we wait.

Thank you.

I guess it's up to the chair uh to decide if it will be on next month's uh uh agenda, but that's our hope.

All right, uh public service announcements.

Okay, okay.

Uh public comments on non-agenda items falling within the purview and jurisdiction of the board.

Do I read this little?

No, you don't have to.

Okay.

Public comments.

Anyone?

Anyone?

Hello.

My name's Amy Hoitzla.

I am the president of the Nina Association.

And I'm here just to listen today.

I'm um was interested in hearing about the bylaws, but I'll have to wait on that.

Um, but I'm very interested in the uh discussion about the uh interim zoning because I'm very excited about the NCOD update, and you know, the city commission just voted to approve the public engagement plan and the INC will be very important as as part of that.

And I think I'm super excited that uh the consultants that we've hired sound like a good fit and sound like they understand what the issues are that they understand we need clarity between what is required and what is just advisory in the design guidelines and the the stress, the importance of preserving neighborhood character that I think a lot of us have been involved in and cared about for a long time.

approve the public engagement plan and the INC will be very important as as part of that and I think I'm super excited that the consultants that we've hired sound like a good fit and sound like they understand what the issues are that they understand we need clarity between what is required and what is just advisory in the design guidelines and the the stress the importance of preserving neighborhood character that I think a lot of us have been involved in cared about for a long time but the other reason I I have to leave early because I'm attending another um event so I wanted to comment now mostly I wanted to take the opportunity to thank all of you for the volunteer work that you do um because you know the city commission has made public engagement a priority and this is where the rubber hits the road you are the people who show up um consistently and um put in your time and and energy and um hearts and I just want to thank you and also let you know that for me as the president of the Northeast Neighborhood Association having Angie on this board um she informs me what's going on what's coming up things that I might not know about and and then I can reach out to the neighborhood and it's just a it's a super important link from so I don't have to attend every single meeting and we've got different eyes and ears on the ground and you know the more we're engaged and involved the better Bozeman's gonna be so thank you.

All right thank you anybody else any other public comments all right move on to act what oh anybody online with public comment no okay uh action items um uh first one approve the Valley West and the Lakes Neighborhood Association as a city recognized neighborhood association Anne would you like to come to the podium do you want me to say do you want me to say my little thing do you want me to ask me questions how do we do this yeah okay well I am Ann Vince Guerra with Valley West and the Lakes Neighborhood Association and I've lived in Bozeman since 2005 and I lived in Valley West twice a sand in between was a stint in the Northeast neighborhood so you know I think there's a lot going on in our country and in the world and after last fall's election I learned that there's a lot going on in Bozeman and sometimes I felt like people were just at each other they were so ready to put people in categories and neighbors against neighbors so I wanted to figure out something that I could do to just start to address that and the neighborhood association I thought was a pretty easy way to get started.

I think that even if you've with you know if your family moved here in 1820 or you moved here in 2020 I think we all came here for the same reasons and I think more or less we all have the same things that are important to us and the same goals we want to enjoy the outdoors we want to enjoy time with our friends and family and we want a safe comfortable neighborhood to live in so I think all those things are commonalities we have despite the fact that Bozeman is growing and a lot of the growing pains are really pain growing is really painful but I think that overall we're in this together and I wanted to be part of something like this so I started the neighborhood association and we had our first meeting last week we had 12 people there who were super engaged and now we have 36 people on our list and there's already been some activity happening in our neighborhood people are there's wetlands that separates the two sections and someone's uh working with a group to build a platform for Osprey and stuff and there's a lot of good ideas a lot of things that we want to do as our neighborhood but also a lot of concerns about some vacant lots nearby our neighborhood and then adjacent neighborhoods and their development and how that affects um where we live so uh did you have any questions about our neighborhood or application or anything oh you have to vote on it I say welcome as well and thank you so excited to have some people from the West side joining or more people I should say yeah I have a question so do you uh have your neighborhood association bylaws already in existence we do awesome does your do your bylaws allow um your representative to cast a representational vote on behalf of your neighborhood association is that we took the boiler plate they do we took the boiler plate from Emily and made a few little tweaks and stuff so great yeah I'll just give a little plug for lakes in Valley West it's um as you saw in the application the first houses went in in 2002 um both of those neighborhoods are centered around a park with paths and a water feature um in between the two sections of the neighborhood is a big wetlands and there's minimal development around there I think there's a church and a school and you know this neighborhood hasn't been around for a long time but we now are in walking distance of the town and country of the restaurants and Ferguson farm and then there's a couple other business um developments there.

Um in between the two sections of the neighborhood is big wetlands, and there's minimal development around there.

I think there's a church and a school.

Um, this neighborhood hasn't been around for a long time, but we now are in walking distance of the town and country of the restaurants and Ferguson farm.

And then there's a couple other business um developments there.

So I have my accountant there, my insurance agent, my eye doctor.

So it's getting a little more walkable.

There's nice connectivity on bike paths and on the bus, and we hope those things get better as well.

I have a little comment.

I think all of my medical providers moved out by you.

So now I can't walk to any of mine.

Oh, I live in the Northeast neighborhood.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Well, those are once-a-year things, you know, it's not that huge.

But you can buy diamonds.

I can buy diamonds, that's right.

And what are the approximate street boundaries of your neighborhood?

Um I have a rough idea.

Yeah, so help us out.

Ferguson and Babcock are the Southeast, and then Ferguson and Durston, and then Cottonwood between Babcock and Durston.

And then there's the wetlands area that I talked about, and then the lakes are over on the other side.

They are Durston is the north.

I don't know the name of the South, and then there's uh Creek by a conservation easement.

These two um neighborhoods are joined by there, there's a big gap between them, but they're joined by a homeowners association.

So I felt like keeping them in the neighborhood association together was important because you didn't want there to be any confusion.

Uh and just getting it started.

I think it's nice to have a bigger body of people.

So is our Bronken Fields in your neighborhood?

That's in well, probably not technically.

Okay.

But that's the first western boundary at Cottonwood, then there's like a no man's land, and then you get to the lakes, and that's the next section of it.

Okay.

So and that's how we wrote it up.

Um and I think the southern end of the western boundary has a potential for some more development in there, which wouldn't be part of our neighborhood.

So when that happened, we talked about it at our initial meeting.

Like, would we want to invite those that new neighborhood into ours or not?

So I want to thank you for taking time out of your life.

Yeah.

Get more folks from the West Side engaged.

We often hear that we don't hear enough from the Western, you know, newer neighborhoods.

So I am so glad to welcome you.

Thank you.

How many household might be approximately?

I thought I heard 800.

800.

Yeah.

I mean, it's a nice mix of bigger houses, smaller houses.

There's like duplexes and more condos.

There's also an apartment building, apartment style condos that are individually owned.

So the lots a lot of the like our lot is only a tenth of an acre, and then the other lots.

I mean, I don't even think the biggest ones are pushing half an acre.

So thanks.

You're welcome.

All right.

If there aren't any more questions from Inc., we move on to public comment.

Is that right?

Sure.

Yeah.

Do I need to stand here?

You can stand there.

Okay.

Okay.

Motion.

Uh motion to vote.

The Valley West and Lakes Neighborhood Association as a city record association.

And I'll second.

I move we approve the Valley West and Lakes Neighborhood Association as a city recognized neighborhood association.

And I'll second.

All right.

Approved.

Oh, oh.

All in favor.

Okay.

And we actually we actually have Michelle online too, and she votes yes.

Great.

I vote yes.

And same with Aaron.

So yeah.

Okay.

All right.

So approved.

Okay.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Right.

May I interject with a question?

How many neighborhood associations do we now have?

That makes 15?

Correct.

Okay.

So now we will go on to the case for interim zoning, correct?

Okay, and Jim will present.

Okay.

Thank you very much, Emily.

So as I think everyone knows, this is a current item that is being debated by many corners of the community.

That's kind of as an outgrowth of the UDC that was approved last year.

And again, maybe just to recap how this came to be, although I think everybody up here knows, but just for the benefit of having a fluid discussion, the amendment to go to a 90-foot height allowance in the B3 section of the city, and what the B3 section is, for those that might not know, it is often referred to as the Halo area around the main street historic districts.

So think Mendonol, think Babcock, and it's everything right behind, say alleys would separate behind Main Street from the properties that front on Main Street to those that would front on those two one-way streets, Mendonol and Babcock.

So that area, Main Street itself is not affected by the 90-foot height.

The actual height restriction there, I believe, is 60 feet.

And certainly when the UDC, the second hearing on the 16th of December, that put the end to the commission's UDC hearings, and then the UDC actually went into effect on February 1st.

And I know that many members of the public certainly voiced public comment at meetings, and certainly it was put forth by the commission that let's take a look at this after four months.

Let's give it a chance to see where it shakes out with potential development proposals and go from there.

In meantime, now that about a third of that time has walked through, certainly it was also thought that the INC neighborhoods could be a great source of just let's put a simple survey out there and just gauge some basic sentiment to see how do people feel about this?

And knowing that our meeting was coming up today fairly soon, the survey wasn't actually out there for a long time.

It was really less little less than a week, and we had 428 responses to it.

Now that does not mean that every respondent answered every question.

That did not happen, but in the for the most case, the uh say two of the questions of particular interest, actually that maybe three, there was the uh say the question to pause demolition of large projects for a year, and that would be that was coming out of the uh motion to pause the approval of large projects, and there was a question on the survey.

What exactly are large projects?

Are they 20,000 foot structures, 30,000, 40,000 feet?

Certainly there were differences of opinion there, and that's fine, but that was a worthwhile question to put out there.

And then following um the pause of the approval of those large projects for a year.

The third main question on there was should I and C consider writing a letter of support to the commission in support of the commission holding a public hearing first, because obviously that would need to happen.

That's proper protocol, and possibly coming out of that would or could the commission entertain actually pausing the approval of new projects for a year.

And back to why did interim zoning become such an issue, and how could interim zoning even be contemplated?

Certainly the state, state of Montana statutes stated that interim zoning can be considered by a city or town.

If there is an urgency, not an emergency, but I did see the language urgency in there, and why we thought the survey was at least valid to gauge some public feedback was the fact that there are two items out there with regards to policy items that are not yet totally fleshed out, and I think you know maybe what they are, but again, just to put them back on the table.

One is the NCOD engagement that was just talked about earlier.

The Lakota Group consultants from Chicago were coming next month in April to assist the city commission, city staff, and certainly the historic preservation advisory board, otherwise known as HPAB, on looking at the guidelines and potentially doing, shall we say, a rewrite of some items, an update, maybe is a better way to put that of the NCOD, which again stands for neighborhood conservation overlay district.

And another item in the survey was the fact that there are quite a few neighborhoods in INC that are not part of the N COD, and that was thought to be good because it certainly has been said.

Well, people living in the NCOD, they might have a different view, and those living outside the NCOD areas, which again the NCOD pretty much think of that as being the core neighborhoods in town.

So to put boundaries, the Gallagher Trail is one big boundary on the east.

It goes up as far as L Street and wraps around the north side of the Northeast neighborhood.

It runs over, crosses North 7th, and it comes down through the Jant neighborhood is partially split.

Everything from 11th east back to 8th and Cooper Park, that is in the NCOD.

What's west of 11th is not, and then the NCOD pretty much goes right up to the through the South Side neighborhoods.

And so it's not a square rectangle, it's kind of an irregular shape, but that is what it is.

So we did find that with the survey, there wasn't quite a bit of feeling.

We got back plenty of feedback from non-NCOD neighbors.

So we thought that was useful for better or for worse, it gave those people a seat at the table to voice their opinion and write comments.

And then that last question on there that was mentioned, you know, do we do we as a board write a letter of support to the commission to move forward, say after four months with a public hearing?

Some people would like to see that done sooner if it's going to be done at all, but we'll start with the commission had laid out on the table to give this a four-month trial, shall we say.

So trying to tee this up in objective terms, that's how the survey was put forth, and Emily Kiley very kindly put the survey out there to all of us, put it into SurveyMonkey format, which certainly I thought was an excellent format, and was my first time really digging into how that was done.

And Emily tabulated the results, which I think we all got this.

I actually, being the data junkie that I am printed off the 160 pages that came back, but it made for such useful reading and just the blending in, say the blending over to the HPAB group.

I think that's important.

And for full disclosure, yes, I am a member of HPAP, but I feel that this is really useful to help educate and just inform more than anything else.

So today, let's just giving the highlights of what came back.

Um that survey, most people felt that a large project was any structure over 20,000 square feet.

So, and again, that's just an objective answer, neither here nor there, but that is where people came down on that question.

Certainly the pausing of the approval of projects for a year, there were 367 total respondents on that, as I recall, 67 people that I remember that was the number for full disclosure here of people that skipped this question.

That was 15% of the respondents.

So fully 85% of those 428 people responded one way or another to the question, shall we pause approval of large projects for a year?

And across all of the INC neighborhoods, 83% responded to the affirmative to certainly say we ought to pause projects for a year.

Then going to the letter of support motion for the city commission.

The number was very similar, a few more responses there.

Certainly, maybe some of you, maybe all of you read through some of those.

They were interesting and ran the gamut as one would think would normally happen.

And certainly there were those that said, oh no, uh, the city needs to grow, we need more housing, let's just keep building.

But the majority of the comments really did support and infer that, gee, we really need to look at this.

Let's have a community discussion, let's move forward with actually taking an objective look at potentially pausing the development for a year because of the policy that is the sense of urgency here was the fact that the NCOD guidelines need to be updated.

And I didn't mention the second one earlier.

Still has not been completed.

It's in the process.

HPAB and city staff are working on that.

And what the landmark is, it's a sense of the historic preservation guidelines, not just for the NCOD, but for the whole city of Bozeman.

So that is essentially why the survey was done.

And I guess I don't think I need to make a motion, but the time for discussion on that, unless we do public comment for, or I guess we do discussion, and then public comment.

Emily, is that I think it looks like we do questions.

Questions.

Yes.

So anybody have any questions about Jim's presentation or the survey?

I have a question.

Sure.

Um, just plain devil's advocate.

Let's say I'm a contractor who's gonna whatever I am, a hundred story, a hundred-foot building.

And I got all my debts in a row, I got the ground ground bot, I got the orders for the material, I got my general contracted bill.

I'm gonna break around June 1st.

What happens now with this letter for the city that says we're pausing this, are we opening the city to lawsuits, the possibility of lawsuits is my concern.

Well, as I understand it, with the window out there, I mean, assuming you're you're planning to break ground, that would assume that the project has been approved, correct?

Sure.

And I believe, and we can ask Commissioner Fisher just to confirm this.

But if the project's been approved, it was done during the window, then that project is okay.

Yeah, it's approved.

Should caution I am not an attorney, right?

My understanding is that um once uh a project receives adequacy, you know, in other words, saying it's complete, it's it's its application is complete and the city is ready to review it, the laws in effect at that time apply.

So um, so in this case, you couldn't actually have a hundred-foot building, but but uh if you were to put a 90-foot building in and and let's say the city were to say, okay, as of um let's say Friday 13th, it might be appropriate.

Uh a uh 90-foot building was was a permit was put in, received adequacy, and then um, and then the commission voted in April to put in a moratorium.

That building that was approved on Friday the 13th would still be allowed to proceed.

That's again my understanding based on several conversations with the city attorney, but I I I am I you're on shaky legal ground with me as your representative.

I have a clarifying question.

So, question um, well, first of all, should one of us make a motion and second the motion so that we can then have a discussion?

Is that what we should be doing before we have our discussion?

Yes, we need to.

Okay, I would like to make a motion.

Um I would like to make a motion that we, the INC, prepare a letter to the city commission asking that they put in place interim zoning while the NCOD guidelines are rewritten and adopted.

Do I have a second?

And now we vote.

No, I think we're gonna have discussion discussion about so I wanted to uh clarify a couple things.

So when I look at the survey, and I feel so proud that we have so many Bozeman citizens who took time out of their lives to answer this survey.

428 people, maybe didn't answer every question, but even 361 people, I mean, that's a solid amount of critical mass.

Um I'm especially proud Northeast neighborhood, we got so many people to we want.

Um but so question number two specifies that we're talking about supporting a one-year pause on demolitions of large buildings within the NCOD while the design guidelines are written, rewritten and adopted.

But questions three and question four, no, no, question three and question five, do not make that same very specific within the NCOD specification.

So when we're saying, like as question three is saying, would you support a one-year pause on new development applications for large buildings while the NCOD and design guidelines are rewritten and adopted?

Um it didn't specify new development applications within for large buildings within the NCOD, as the previous question said.

So my understanding is that we're just talking about large buildings within the NCOD.

Is that correct?

That is correct.

Okay, thank you.

Um so any letter that we would write would not apply to the whole city.

We're we're requesting interim zoning just for within the NCOD.

Okay, I just want that to be clear.

Thanks.

Could I add um one thing to that previous question?

Um I haven't read the lawsuit, but I believe the city is already being sued in the Guthrie over the NCOD.

So I mean, I just want to throw that out there, like there's already lawsuits happening over this.

You spoke to the urgency.

Um I don't know if you mentioned that um a staff person in charge of historic preservation recently resigned, right?

And so there's a did you speak to that at all?

You know more about that than me.

I think that's another element to make it uh makes it urgent, the vacancy that exists.

Sure, and to put that in say objective terms, our city's historic preservation officer, Sarah Rosenberg recently resigned after being with the city a total of eight years, and that does take the main say person with historic preservation experience off of basically that discussion group, shall we say, or that evaluation group that's doing the evaluation, working with the Lakota group, certainly city staff have stepped in to say, hey, we we've got this, we'll take it over.

And that's fine.

I'm sure they're shall we say their their hearts are in the right place if we'd like to think so.

I know there's been debate on that.

We can't control who wants to think what one thing that occurred to me though that was of interest.

So I'll put this out here strictly as information.

The two staff people will be working on this directly.

Aaron George, the director of community development, and Rebecca Harbage, her deputy director, her right hand person, so to speak, that was just hired about last June, so she's fairly new to the city.

Erin has been here a while having been assistant.

Well, she was the deputy community development person uh under Anna Bentley when she was here as community development director.

But why I bring these two up, and it's no fault of their own, it certainly isn't a criticism, it's just the facts.

As I've understood it, their resumes, they have not worked in a previous town or city that had a preservation program because in the case of both of these women, again, it's just the way the towns they worked in, the towns that they worked in forin, it was Kent, Washington for Rebecca, it was Alana, Montana.

These towns have a city-county planning department, and the historic preservation functions were handled by the county.

Now it's too bad neither one's here because we'd ask them directly, but this was something that to me and to others, you know, a sense of urgency, uh just a question.

So we on the HPAB have said we would like to be as much a part of that process as we can.

We know we don't put forth policy out there, but we are an advisory board, so very much our charter to be able to advise comes into uh focus here very much.

So we would like to think of ourselves as partners with the two city staff that are going to be responsible for taking this forward.

Sorry for the long answer, but I feel like that piece of information actually should be you know should be mentioned because that is an integral part of the decision to bring this forward.

Can I interject something?

I've been informed that perhaps we were supposed to have public comment before our motion and discussion.

I don't know if that's the questions and then questions and then public comment, and then you discuss and okay, yeah.

So we're still in the question.

Perfect.

Yeah, thank you.

I have a question, Jim.

Sure.

Um, this is Zara Osman.

Zarah, yes.

Um, I wanted to ask you about the last question.

Um the way it was written in the survey is would you support the INC writing a letter asking the commission to adopt interim zoning?

And so to be more precise, it isn't there.

You go, thank you.

Um it isn't this, they did not say do we support to ask the city commission to um have a hearing about whether or not to um adopt or support interim zoning.

And and I just wanted to be because we had 361 people answer these questions.

Um I just wanted to make sure 303 in support of this.

I just want to make sure that we are um it in this meeting in the same way as those who were asked the questions.

Sure.

And I wondered how you felt about it.

That's that's a good question, Zara, and I would say, and certainly anyone else can chime in, including Commissioner Fisher, but I would say just the protocols I had put in my verbal statement a few minutes ago, just having the public hearing, because before the city would just say take a vote amongst the five commissioners to do this, there would naturally one would assume be a public hearing where people they would bring forth essentially what they had in the survey, and the survey could in a sense play itself out in a public hearing here in this room.

That only seems fair.

And the letter that would be drafted, obviously would be checked for clarity, accuracy, and legality to make sure the right protocols are being followed before it even left our desks and went to the commissioners' desk desks.

Yeah, thank thank you, Jim.

I I just wanted to uh I and definitely the the process of then going forth and having a hearing or deciding if the commission just wanted to decide if they wanted to uh adopt interim zoning.

Um I just wanted to repres because we're um representatives of our neighborhood associations, um so I just wanted to read the the question um as it was written in the survey, um, just so that the 303 people who's who voted yes would voted yes to that particular question.

Um so and I it's it's a nuanced difference.

Um and so it's not necessarily that they're opposed to a hearing, it's just that they are in support of um recommending a interim zoning ordinance.

Understood.

So it's you already have 300 votes in the public hearing.

I I I think is what I hear you saying, Zara and correct me if I'm putting too many words in your mouth there, but um, but it's also what the what the regular procedure would do is certainly other members of the public that maybe weren't a member of an INC neighborhood would certainly have a turn at the podium here if they were so inclined or whatnot.

So that was pretty much why we referred to the public hearing process as part of that.

And I'm sorry that it was left out of the question.

Well, I think if it if I'm understanding Zero correctly, and correct me if I'm wrong, Zara.

I think I mean we as the INC, we can make a recommendation, we're totally advisory, and then the city commission's gonna end up making their decision.

Um so I think in light of that reminder, um, and in light of this question that people have already answered, I think the question for us would just be do we want to write a letter requesting that the city commission adopt an interim zoning ordinance to temporarily pause the projects, right?

Um clarifying question is there was something a reference to the historic preservation advisory board also in with us.

So have have they already or have you as part of the HPAB already written such a letter?

Or um is the idea that it would be a joint letter from both HPAP and INC, or that we would because I I saw some reference to the HPAP, so a little bit more about it.

And you did, and I will take responsibility for putting that in there because I thought it could be useful for us to just give some feedback or sub or support to HPAD if HPAP does the same thing.

Now we have our next meeting March 31st.

I know there is going to be some discussion potentially about this, then all that was meant there was these two organizations can work, shall we say in parallel.

We're not say we have to team up because we are two separate boards, but just uh there's a certain economy of scale there, and if HPAB is going to write a letter to if we have started that process first, what can they learn from us?

I don't know that HPAB will do that.

I certainly can't speak for HPAB here because the only place where this has really been discussed so far is right here at INC today.

So this is brand new.

And for that matter, I mean any of the neighborhood associations might take a vote to see if they, as a neighborhood association, might also want to write a similar letter or in support of any letter that we may or may not send, right?

So it's not just limited to INC and H5 is what I'm saying.

Okay.

And you've been on INC longer than I have, and I hadn't thought about that, but certainly thinking back to another item, Emily Kiley has mentioned to me that yes, Jim, neighborhoods can come up with their say their own bylaws, their own ideas, their own governing thoughts.

So it sounds like Angie, uh, there would not be any constraint for neighborhoods to write their own letter.

And I think Michelle, more public dialogue is encouraged.

Thanks.

Michelle, did you still have a question?

Oh, I was sorry.

I was just gonna second um kind of what Angie was saying, but I think that the purpose of the survey is for us to write a letter, and whatever the commission decides to do is outside of our control, really.

Can you guys hear me?

Yeah, we heard you.

Okay.

Thank you.

Um this may uh be irrelevant beyond this room.

But how many people outside of this room, outside of the city commission are know what the NCOD means?

You should take this survey, but uh if you live someplace in town that's not in the NCOD or you're new to town, how relevant is it?

The NCOD acronym.

I'm wondering that.

And then the second question is if we do the pause.

And these are probably quick questions that the commission has to mull over.

But we is there a risk that we push the big buildings outside of the NCOD.

Now suddenly they're in some other neighborhood who is not happy about that any more than the people in the NCOD would be happy about it.

I think uh when we sent out the survey, there was also a uh write-up by Jim that explained uh in detail what the NCOD was and the thinking behind this uh idea.

Um I think uh in answer to your question, um I don't know.

I don't know that we can pretend to know what everybody's intentions were when they took the survey.

I think everybody I know whether or not they live within that drawn boundary um values, Bozeman's character and um and so uh I would take it at face value that they see it as something that's supposed to be a a conservation district.

It doesn't mean that things are trapped in amber that sometimes people try to like to say no, it's about it's about the whole kit and cabo of the core area.

Um so that's just my thoughts in response to your question.

And am I on?

And I'll add that I do think if uh 90 foot buildings were to be pushed out in other areas, people would be upset.

I mean, I think a lot of people all over town have opinions about large buildings, and no matter where you are, you're not gonna be pleased about it.

So this is entirely anecdotal, but I think one of the written responses said, let's not let this happen to Kirk Park either.

And I don't think they're in the NCOD.

Right.

So there's at least one person out there who's worried.

I think everybody should be worried personally.

Well, and I think you know, I mean, the NCOD guidelines are the thing that's being updated now, so it's a timely action that we can take is how I look at it.

And I think that's the main thing here, Angie, and you just hit the nail on the head is to just get the discussion going to put something out there because we hadn't put anything out there before, and um, or at least you know, from no corner of the community had a survey of this type and done, and this was a very basic survey.

So it's just it's a point of embarkation, but as it turns out kind of an interesting one because other things like looking at non-NCOD neighborhoods, those neighborhoods in INC that participated in the survey that are non-NCOD.

If anybody thought, oh, you might get you know, 30 or 40 percent only might have an interest in this initiative.

Gosh, the lowest neighborhood um say affirmative action on this was 68 percent, which I thought, gee, that's still two-thirds of those living in a non-CN, non-NCOD neighborhood were interested at seeing this go to the next step.

Michelle can I add something?

Yeah, Michelle has a question.

I also want to make sure that we have time for public comment.

Sorry, 525.

Um I I think this goes back to our UDC and might be something that needs to be an ordinance later addressed by them in terms of where toll buildings truly are appropriate in the city.

Um typically, if you travel around, most cities have a historic district and a financial district, and they are not one and the same.

And so that really needs to be kicked back to the city commission in terms of actually planning what our city and what our growth policy is going to look like.

It's not a matter of which neighborhood is getting density necked on top of it.

It is a matter of actual city planning, and that is the issue at hand.

Yeah.

All right, Kathy.

Oh, Kathy.

Sorry.

Oh, I I was just going to say, um, no, I'm I'm okay.

I've got it over here.

Um, you know, in regards to the NCOD, I think every everyone is really concerned about the um the core part of downtown.

I mean, we all that's part of the charm.

I mean, that's we all consider that ours.

So, I mean, it might not happen in Kirk Hill, Kirk Park, where you're gonna have a 90-foot building, but you if you're in Kirk Park, you're gonna care about what happens on Menden Hall or Babcock.

And I mean, let's face it, chances are the developers are gonna want to build on Menden Hall in Babcock right now because that's what is that's the most desirable area to put up a 90-foot building because everyone wants to walk to downtown and buy those diamonds, right?

Um so, anyways, it's yeah, I I think if we can protect the core, I think it's in everyone's best interest.

Right.

Yeah, I would agree that there's I think there's real economic value in conserving certain areas because people come here because it is different.

Um, and they really enjoy that when they visit.

So, in terms of tourism, I think it's beneficial to conserve certain areas.

Okay, should we move on to public comment?

I can talk about something, there's no doubt about that.

I'm Ken Sinai, I live in the NCOD.

Um, I want to commend all you guys for what you're doing.

It's not didn't happen soon enough, but you're absolutely right.

It does fit with the fact that the NCOD is being revisited.

At the same time, the comment that just came before previously about planning, absolutely excellent.

And I keep thinking to myself, why in the world don't we have big buildings going in on seventh?

And it's obvious, as Emily stated, you know, that the downtown core is very attractive, as Kathy stated, you know, the downtown is the downtown core is what attracts everybody to the entire valley.

At the same time, we can consider that core valuable.

The very concept of expanding the core.

So when we saw East Maine being developed as it is now with architecture, you know, the for those of you who have been around a while, you could just obviously the brick buildings, which are much more contemporary, but still fit with the with the design of the historic town.

They were designed to fit with that with the historic character of downtown Main Street.

And there's no reason not to do that in a lateral direction.

You know, I happen to be in Livingston every once in a while, and for a variety of reasons, mainly because of the railroad and the fact that we don't have a highway going through Main Street and downtown Livingston.

You know, their core, their historic town is multiple blocks in many different directions.

And there's no reason not to do that in downtown Bozeman.

You can only fit so many tourists in downtown Bozeman walking around and visiting all the stores.

Why not have that happen on other streets in all directions?

So in other words, why have a 90-foot building?

You know, let's have some others that fit in that 60-foot range or even 45-foot range that is much more aesthetically pleasing.

Um in fact, I'm not sure what I saw recently.

There was a video I saw on online associated with historic development in various towns in the American West.

And uh it's it's astonishing what has happened in other American Western towns to maintain these the the character and the nature of the historic communities and central historic communities.

There's no reason for Bozeman not to follow the same thing.

It's it's we're not reinventing the wheel in many ways, but we are a unique town and need to address that.

And so there's there's other people have demonstrated this.

And I agree, Lakota Group sounds pretty good.

The question I have for them is why are they Lakota when they're located like in Virginia and Chicago or something like that?

Thank you guys.

Thank you very much for what you're doing.

Thank you.

Any other public comments.

Uh Daniel Cardi, Bozeman resident.

I live in midtown within the NCOD.

A couple of quick points.

Um, all existing HOAs are protected by covenants.

So nobody can ram a 90-foot building in there.

Zoning dictates what gets built where.

So any new green field development that comes in as an annexation and zoning would have to be go before the city commission, and the city commission would have to decide on approving the annexation, and then a separate vote for approving whatever zoning a developer applies for.

Third, the B3 already extends well past Mendon Hall into the north side of uh Bozeman.

Um anybody that's walked through the North Central, that's all B3.

The um open lot to just to the west of the 111 and 2 buildings.

That entire block is zone B3.

So destruction is already being wrought on the north side.

There are a bunch of hotels going in on the east side, on the south side.

Those are all going to be built already because they're approved.

And that's more destruction in the N B3.

So uh interim zoning ordinance is desperately needed.

And the case for interim zoning, that document was attached to your packet.

All the information, all the reasons for writing a letter to the commission and asking them to implement an interim zoning ordinance ordinance are in that document, and I would support the inc writing such a letter.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Any more public comment?

Hi, my name's Linda Simonis.

I'm a Bozeman resident.

I want to thank Jim especially for bringing this as an agenda item.

It was time intensive and very difficult.

And I want to thank Jim also for doing this in a civil and diplomatic manner and pulling in many demographics and many parts of town.

And that leads into my second point, which is we shouldn't be afraid of polling uh other parts of town and other demographics, because I think the NCOD is something that will pull the whole town together, and that we all appreciate and that we'd all like to have some input on the design guidelines, what is important to make required, what should be left flexible.

If we can pull the whole city together over this topic, we will have true public engagement.

And I am confident that will happen.

And I'm very hopeful that the Lakota group will be able to do that.

And then I also want to thank all of you on Inc.

for spending your time and your energy on issues like this that are of extreme importance.

Um you're doing good work.

Thank you very much.

Um, Natsuki Nakamura.

I'm a Bozeman resident.

I'm also a member of the economic vitality board.

Um not speaking that behalf and a member of the Better Bozeman Coalition Action Committee, but um just speaking as an individual.

Um just want to voice support of Inc.

taking a stand on this.

Um I think the main reason is the Guthrie.

Um that was a big reason why I started coming to City Commission meetings.

Um I think the first Guthrie proposal put the commission in a difficult position, put citizens in a difficult positions too, having to ask for the appeal and ask the commission to appeal that and and take that on and sp away from administrative review.

Um that was due to a poorly designed affordable housing ordinance that didn't that missed a mark on affordability, uh missed mark on how much parking was appropriate in this area.

Um for a lot of reasons it was successfully denied that first time.

Um at that time, Deputy Mayor Fisher and Jennifer Magic, Commissioner Magic had considered the idea of a moratorium, saying that this was a kind of a close call, this thing almost got approved.

Maybe we have a moratorium until we can have some of these pieces set.

Um Fisher likened it to a loaded gun of when the next Guthrie or iteration of the Gothic came again, the Commission would again be in that position if the code was didn't have time to update and fix that issue, then we would be in the position of another Guthrie.

We didn't get in the position of another Guthrie.

Citizens are now in the unfortunate position to have to do a lawsuit at their own cost.

Um at that time, another blow was taken when the city kind of said that the NCOD was not compulsory at that time, non-enforceable.

Um members of the commission said that it's outdated and archaic.

So putting this blow on the NCOD that residents had assumed had a certain role, was working in a certain way and was told that it was no longer working in that way.

So now we have at as soon as it's gonna happen in December, it might take longer given that we don't have Sarah Rosenberg and other pieces that might take longer.

So best case scenario, the NCOD guidelines get updated in December, go on in fact maybe next year.

That's a lot of months that a more Guthrie has projects can come to the front.

So instead of putting ourselves in the position of not having any legal standing to deny these products, let's consider the pause so that we can have time to get our code to match projects that we want.

Also want to really emphasize the stay on demolition portion, not just approval of new projects, but let's try to really enforce the stay on demolitions because there are impacts to having buildings destroy vegetation taken out, even if nothing gets built there for a while, just having losing that was still losing um important vegetation historic assets.

So I really want to push that point as well to stand demolition.

Um lastly to just echo Dan Cardi's point, um neighborhoods in the NCOD don't have covenants like a lot of these newer neighborhoods do.

So the NCOD or the protective covenants, and that's why they're important.

Thank you.

Hello again, Amy Hoitzma.

Um I live in the Northeast neighborhood, and so I'm in the NCOD.

I am fully in support of you all pursuing this letter.

You've done your homework, you've uh surveyed the neighbors that you represent.

Um I thought that case for support was really well done and informative.

Um I don't see any downside to this.

I don't think it's controversial.

Um I think the city commission would appreciate the opportunity to um the NCOD is a significant document.

And it's been out of date for a long time.

There have been efforts made to update it that were not so successful, and I just don't see why we wouldn't want to have the discussion um about waiting until we have those things in place.

The the distinction between guidelines um and and requirements um, for instance.

So I think the city commission will do what does, they will do their due diligence, they will hold public hearing, they will get public comment and and have that conversation in um in public.

So I don't see any downside.

I appreciate all the work that you've done, and I think you should go for it.

Thank you.

We also have Jason online.

Uh hi, this is Jason Delmew.

I live um on peach between Tracy and Black.

Um I'm on the community development board, but I'm speaking individually.

Um I saw and took the survey via my um membership in Nina.

Uh I'm not sure how to access the survey questions now, other than just uh the results I saw in the um packet here.

Um I'm just uh curious and a little concerned about what the Inc.

sees as its role.

Um I guess I would think and hope it would see itself as a trusted advisor to the commission.

Um, but you know, maybe it sees itself more of an advocate on behalf of uh neighborhoods.

Um but regardless, I would think that it would want the survey to rec a reflect an informed vote.

Um what I mean, what it looked like to me was uh essentially a pitch, an argument in favor, and then essentially asking people, oh, you know, do you agree?

Um there wasn't any mention of the benefits of development.

Um I did not it didn't to me, and I mean I'm already familiar with this stuff, um, clearly defined the differences between the boundaries of the historic B3C core of downtown, the B3 around it, and the NCOD.

Um it didn't attempt to summarize any of the possible detriments of a moratorium.

Um and it just gave these figures that seemed large.

I mean, 20,000 square feet, 30,000 square feet, it sounds large, but um there were no example building sizes given for people to have a sense of reference.

And my online research suggests or indicated that even the relatively small uh four story guttery is 65,000 square feet.

You know, so if people are thinking of some of these other five and six-story buildings, those are approaching 100,000 square feet.

Um, I just um again just sort of wondering what the board um sees as its responsibility to educate um and get an informed vote.

Um, you know, and if it doesn't see it as having that role, then I would just wonder how meaningful are the results when it's you know presented as essentially an argument and asking, you know.

You agree, right?

Uh thanks for listening.

All right.

Now we move on to any more public comment.

No more online.

So now we move on to the INC discussion vote.

They're discussing whether or not we vote.

Okay.

Um I would like to, I guess, ask Jim if you know we're trying to come up with a 10,000 or 40,000.

Um I had a lot of learning to do in the UDC discussion.

And I have strong libertarian meanings, and it's very hard for me to try to tell other people what to do with their property.

So I kind of hung back a lot.

Um but at the end of it all, what I came up with was I think people deal with incremental a lot better than just about anything else, whether it's an incremental decline in your health as you get older or an incremental, you know, freeing of your kids as they you know, that's just how humans kind of are.

And I feel like we're missing this idea of incremental.

Um, and it's just causing a lot of strife.

So I would just throw that out there as an idea or an alternative to like trying to pick a number, which there's no one number that works everywhere.

But I think you can kind of come up with incremental in most situations.

So anyways, that's one thought.

Can I ask for a clarifying question?

Um the information packet talked directly about 90 feet.

What we're asking for is a pause on the 90 feet and going back to 60 feet in the B3, right?

More that is part of it.

Certainly, the interim zoning covers certainly a uh you know the potential for other large projects, but yes, and that's Michelle, right?

That asked the question.

Yes.

Yes, thanks.

Um the 90-foot initiative that's out there, that's really driven this, you know, as it is going down in the B3 area.

So that is at ground zero of this whole movement.

Now, granted, you know, as Mark was saying, good point on the incremental, there's certainly more work that can be done.

I mean, are we do we have well, certainly at the commission level and our level too, you know, are there are there further things that we would like to see done or refined or fleshed out?

Because I'll be the first to say, and this is not going back in the other direction.

This is just our doing our due diligence.

Do we want to at INC get some more information before we have a motion and take a vote to say to write a letter?

I am all for doing if people feel that hmm, some more work needs to be done.

I mean, we've just gotten this started, and the fact that this discussion has come this far this quickly.

That does say something in and of itself, but certainly I think I speak for many when we say we want to be receptive, responsible, mindful is probably the main operative word here of the process so that we put forth a good process to take this forward.

So invite discussions as to what else you all on INC might want to see evaluated before we go to the next step.

And obviously, we're not going to spend a year on this, say or whatever, but maybe prior to the next meeting.

I'm just trying to be receptive and flexible here because I do sense that maybe there are some that would like a little more work done on it.

That's okay.

This is this is a big topic.

Uh it's as big as any other topic that's bouncing around in the city right now.

So we certainly want to be responsible in how we go forward and how we help and advise the commission to do its job to the best of its ability and give them good feedback.

I have a suggestion.

What if I don't know if this would be an amendment to the motion already on the table, but what if at this meeting um we uh made a vote to create a subcommittee to draft said letter, and then maybe you know, the subcommittee would actually draft the draft letter that we would be thinking about submitting as a recommendation to the city, and next month we can vote on that draft letter.

I personally I I have a little other thing, maybe to say a little bit.

I I personally don't feel the need to do further research at this point, personally.

Um and I'll I'll just share a little bit more about my thought process.

Um it's not unprecedented for a city, our city to pause a process.

Recall that a couple of years back, Mayor Andres paused the UDC update.

Um in this case, we're not suggesting that we pause the NCOD update, but rather pausing the world around it just for a little bit.

Um it it also makes sense because having attended meetings around the Guthrie, for example.

Um it's my understanding that the Secretary of Interior standards are not being properly applied in the city.

Um other people with more expertise in this area can speak to that.

But as a person who listened at those meetings, um there's question around that.

And so until the NCOD update clearly distinguishes between mandatory versus optional actions that need to be taken within the NCOD, we should not be approving demolition or taking new applications.

I mean, to me, that just makes sense.

Um I see us as the INC as trusted advisors.

I don't think any of us are up here to do untrustworthy actions.

Um, I also definitely see myself as an advocate.

Um, and I will make votes on behalf of my neighbors when we poll them and they let us know how they want to be represented.

Was this an exhaustive uh proposal?

No, but we are not paid consultants.

Um that doesn't mean that it's not a worthy pulse check.

And the fact of the matter is that the majority of the people who did take the survey show that they care about neighborhoods, heritage conservation, and have opinions about the size of large buildings.

And um, so I, as mentioned in public comment, I agree, there's no downside to this, it's not controversial, it's okay to take a breath, and um it's just a temper temporary measure that we would be asking for.

What is the motion we have on the floor?

The motion, I believe that I stated earlier, and that was seconded, was um should we the INC write a letter asking the city commission to adopt an interim zoning ordinance to temporarily pause projects in the NCOD for one year while the NCOD guidelines are being rewritten and adopted.

And what's the process within the city at that point?

Then they have to say, okay, Inc.

asked for this, and then do they just say yes, they talk about it?

Is it like a multi-week or month?

Well, we're we're just advisory like any other advisory board.

Um, and it's up to the city commission to decide if they want to take the recommendation.

So it sounds like low stakes, like we submit it and then we just we're at their mercy.

And to Jason Delmi's point, I mean, um, the suggestion that we might be behaving in bad faith.

Um I I'm sorry, I have to I have to counter that and say that I think a lot of us have shown up to a lot of meetings and thought that the development board has a bias, and so if we have one as well, you know that might be a balancing action, if anything.

Sarah and we have asked the residents within our neighborhoods for their input.

I very rarely see a survey that is truly unbiased.

You would need to hire um the appropriate organization for that.

What this is is a citizen resident-led initiative, and therefore um this is done in good faith.

I just want to repeat that.

And again, it's a low stakes.

Um it's a low stakes letter.

So it just it bothers me to have our integrity questioned when we are spending our time.

I'm not with my children right now, I'm not making dinner, I'm at a meeting.

I think that there should be a lot of um respect given to every person who filled out this survey and a lot of respect given to every opinion.

And questioning our integrity um is is deeply problematic.

Sarah, did you still have a comment?

I do.

Um by the way, I um for some reason my speaker phone turned off, but I so I want to make sure you guys can hear me okay.

We can hear you.

Yes.

Okay, good.

Um I I think I just kind of want to um uh I I agree with m what Michelle just said.

And um as a body, we represent our different neighborhood associations.

We're just volunteers.

We are um as representatives, we don't wing it.

We don't bring our opinion necessarily to um uh to the board to this body, other than what we have heard from our neighborhood associations.

Um I have um a number here in front of me, which is that 93 percent of the Valley Unit Neighborhood Association, which is on the west side of town, voted on this survey to an agreement for the INC to write a letter in support of uh in support of the INC writing a letter to the commission to adopt interim zoning w only while the NCOD update is happening.

It's not forever.

It's just uh it's just during this time.

It's pretty we we asked um the the neighbors, uh my neighbors that I represent, and and that's what they said.

So I think um it doesn't have to be any more fancy than that.

It's just um it's not saying that we are going uh abolish any new buildings.

We're just saying that there is um we're trying to have the NCOD guidelines um that update having it catch up.

And that's that was the question.

And also uh a pause on demolitions, new do you know new applications for demolitions.

I don't think there is um it doesn't have to get any more fancy than that.

So I um I'm not winging it.

I'm not bringing my um my bias.

I am representing uh 93% of my neighbors and uh of my neighborhood association and 300 people who voted um citywide in all these various neighborhood associations.

So that's that's a lot, and so um just wanted to kind of say that.

All right, so did you have one more comment?

Just to add one more thing, and I think we could all say that we don't have a financial interest in our opinions.

So I'll leave it at that.

Okay, so should we move to vote on whether we wrote a letter or we have to do a discussion?

This discussion ending.

Yeah.

So should we get a motion to vote?

Yeah, okay.

We have one on the floor.

So we need a second.

We already so now we vote.

And this is a representative to vote.

Are we talking that way about whether or not we write a letter?

Yeah, administrative versus representative.

Or is that something that will happen when the new bylaws are in place?

This is a vote to take patch.

Okay.

Yeah, this would be a representational vote.

You could look at the survey results to see how your uh constituency who took the survey landed.

And for for example, Nina, 77% of the votes voted to support us writing a letter.

So I'm going to be voting.

Yes.

So just as a point of clarification, my I really hope my neighborhood's uh votes go forth with whatever is sent, even though I think I have to abstain because my bylaws restrict me.

So if that's clear that that will happen, I hope their voices get heard.

So but if we're starting the voting, I have to abstain.

Yeah.

So just a point of clarification.

Um this kind of ties to like the amendment of my vote or my my amendment to my original motion.

Is that allowed for me to amend my own motion?

Um to designate a subcommittee today to draft the letter that then we would all have a chance to look at and then vote to send it, right?

Because else we'll be back here again.

Like we need to know who's writing the letter.

So does that does that make sense?

Should I amend?

So it's I don't think two different things, right?

Well, I I'm I guess I think how about this?

Can I amend the original motion?

That would say um I motion that the interneighborhood council assign an interim zoning ordinance letter writing subcommittee for the purpose of sending a letter to the city commission to adopt an interim zoning ordinance to temporarily pause projects in the NCOD for one year while the NCOD guidelines are written and adopted.

And I guess to be more specific.

I'll second that one.

Does that make sense?

Okay.

Yeah.

So now I now can we take a vote?

Um we get something wrong?

No, you got you got it perfectly fine.

Okay.

I I don't want to throw a monkey wrench into this, but I sense a sense of urgency on this panel um to get an you know to get this request to the city commission.

And so you could uh possibly just vote today to just recommend that the city commission pass an interim zoning commission.

But thank you without a letter.

And just base it on, you could put maybe in the you know in the whereas that you based on the survey results.

You recommend and what you're hearing from the neighborhoods, you recommend that the city commission act quickly to pass an interim uh uh uh you know a zone uh past this um an interim interim zoning, you know, bam and then and then you don't have to wait another month, you know, and then that goes in front of the city.

I would take that in front of the city commission on our we don't have a meeting next week, but we have one on the 24th.

I would take it to them, they would get it.

But that I don't want to, it's not my role to direct this.

What do you think, Chair?

I think that's an excellent idea.

Yeah, yeah.

All right, you do something.

I retract the motion in light of new information from our commission liaison.

Um I guess we just go with the original motion because we still want to put it in writing.

Right?

Well, yeah, you might want to just that you would amend like so.

That's that basically is your motion on the screen or in the screen in front of you.

Yeah, and you could just amend that to say you would support the inner neighborhood council recommending to the city commission and writing a letter that uh the city commission adopts an interim zoning ordinance to temporary pause products, right?

But to put the that that you recommend um the city commission adopt interim zoning ordinance to temporary pauses projects, yeah.

Right, and then that would be a recommendation from this advisory board to the commission.

I would like to add one uh thing to that.

I think it's a brilliant idea.

Um, this is Zara Osman.

Uh I would like to add um the data from the survey as part of that recommendation.

Um for example, uh just just to to adequately represent uh the numbers of people who voted in favor of this, um, which is I think 300 uh are there about 300 people and just a side note indeed our bylaws specify that we need to say how we came how we arrived at a decision when we recommend something to the commission anyway.

So thanks, Sarah, for um reminding us of that.

Good point, yeah.

Thank you.

Okay.

So do we need a newly stated one or are we good?

I think I would like some clarity just for the okay.

Does somebody else want to take a shot?

I feel like I've been talking a lot.

All right, I'll I'll try again.

Um move that the interneighborhood council write a letter to the city commission asking them to adopt an interim zoning ordinance within the NCOD while the NCOD guidelines are being rewritten and adopted, which will include our survey results and how we arrived at this decision.

Can I make an amendment or do we have to vote on that first?

Can I ask a question?

Yeah, yeah.

So do we need to write the letter, or can we just do the recommendation?

I I I think um deputy commissioner when I'm saying write a letter, I say right.

We recommend the okay.

Okay, so with all the the supporting information about how we take a month, we can just whatever's in here and give it to the city commission for the next meeting.

Yeah.

Oh, I just meant that we put something in written form.

Okay.

That's what I meant.

Thank you for the clarification.

Do we have a second?

You said you said I'll second, but we need a second.

Are you seconding?

Yes, I can second.

Okay.

Everybody else can second too.

So we have a second.

Okay, so now we vote.

Yep.

Okay.

Uh no discussion.

You could ask for discussion.

Is there any discussion?

Yeah, I just want to make sure that we are recommending to the city commission that they pause all this stuff.

And in simple as that.

Yes.

Yes.

Okay.

So should we first figure out who is allowed to vote in representational voting here today?

Well, it's an important point so that we understand what a majority who's there.

I am not.

Okay, so you're not.

But is everybody else here able to cast a representational vote?

Okay.

Okay, okay.

So we would just vote.

I think we should go around the room.

Go around the room.

You start with Paul.

Okay.

Yes.

Okay.

So Michelle?

Yep.

Sarah Valley Unit is I.

Okay.

Okay.

So that motion passes.

Correct.

Okay.

Thank you, everybody.

Okay.

So we have the language from what you had mentioned in your motion.

And is that already?

Do you need do we need to write something now?

Or you'll just write it.

It's on the record.

I guess I would just like want to know who's writing it.

Okay.

Who is it coming from?

Jim, do you and I want to work that out real quick?

Would you want to work together and we'd send something to Emily?

Sure.

You would submit it yourself to City Commission.

I wouldn't.

Okay.

Do you all right?

Sorry.

Okay.

Okay.

So we have the verbal vote on the record as a recommendation, and we will also submit a formal letter.

Yeah.

The report, yeah.

Survey.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It's going to be short and sweet.

Okay.

Referencing the survey results.

And all and all the questions in the survey as well.

Correct?

Correct.

Yeah.

I'd imagine that we would just attach this agenda packet item that Emily already created.

Yeah, with like a one-line recommendation.

And is email fine?

Electronically.

Okay.

Yeah.

Attached agenda was all the data put together like this, what you see up on the screen.

And then you know, each individual neighborhood.

So we could submit all that.

Okay.

So moving on to FYI city liaison update.

Yeah.

I forgot my notes, so I'll try and remember everything.

So one thing, there's a survey out there right now for the IWERP.

And that's up on Engage Bozeman.

There's also a flyer up on that table where you could um just snap a shot of the QR code.

So there's that survey going out.

I believe that was already sent out via email.

Um and then other engagement, just engagement in the city that's not um not the city Bozeman engagement, but other stuff happening within the city is there's a city, uh there's a survey with MSU if you want to give input on their strategic plan.

And then there's also survey out there um about downtown parking um that we're partnering with.

So uh those are just things out there um that you can give input on.

And I think that's all that was on my list.

I think all almost all annual meetings are scheduled.

Maybe there's a couple, so great job.

Um and then yeah, again, if there's stuff that you want in the summer, please let me know so um I can let um Takami know because she'll be filling in for me while I'm on maternity leave.

That's it for me.

Thank you, Emily.

Um okay, Commission Liaison update.

Sure, just two quick things.

Um uh last week the city commission approved a resolution that um to add a uh a non-voting MSU student to all of our advisory to our to our five big kind of super boards and the historic preservation advisory board.

Um we there was a desire to add uh to to add one to the to the to, but city commission has no control over who is on the membership of Inc.

And so I just wanted to um and I think in your inbox is uh is uh is the resolution we passed.

Um just wanted to extend that opportunity um to Inc.

It's uh totally your dis your your design.

It would be uh the way we're envisioning it for our other advisory boards is a non-voting MSU student, that would be basically you know, kind of recruited and vetted by ASMSU, the associated students of Montana State University.

Um they would serve for a uh a one-year term starting in the fall semester and running through the the spring and then the summer, and then that would end on the the following fall.

And um they wouldn't get the normal kind of vetting we we usually give to voting members um in part just to reduce the amount of kind of workload for our board chairs and so forth, but the city commission would have to vote to approve.

Um it might be something different again for Inc.

because we cannot vote to approve any members on this board, but but there is that opportunity.

We could, if you guys desire, um ask ASMSU to include uh a representative for Inc.

Again, something perhaps for you guys to discuss or consider.

I believe Emily uh sent uh you know sent an email to Emily and to Dick and you know, so you have a language and and um in your inbox.

And then the second thing is we also at that same meeting passed our community our commission priorities.

Um and I we made a few final tweak, a few small tweaks, but that final language is also sitting in your in your inbox, and I'm hoping that we can get the the kind of top line goals printed up and put on that that empty bulletin board soon.

I have a question, I may.

So um if the ASMSU uh person is non-voting, what what are they getting out of it?

Well that they the desire the thinking is that students are part of our community.

Um and so you know, they work, they they take buses, they they you know use our transportation system, they they live in our buildings, they they uh interact in our neighborhoods.

And um, and so we could, you know, the desire was to kind of develop more a little more of a relationship with MSU and also to um um you know kind of get their perspective on issues that are our our advisory boards are grappling with okay, so it's to offer perspective, okay.

they they live in our buildings they they interact in our neighborhoods and um and so we could you know the desire was to kind of develop more a little more of a relationship with ms u and also to um um you know kind of get their perspective on issues that our our our advisory boards are grappling with okay so it's to offer perspective okay so is there any other intention that as ms you will then use any information to to bring back to the city again or anything like that down the line or no i i don't i don't know i gotta say i don't know how a msu is going to work with that but it was more desired for us to kind of get a just a different perspective you know yeah maybe we can include this in this is zera osman maybe we can include this in an agenda item for the next um INC meeting um because it uh because we represent all residents including business owners and renters and homeowners um maybe there's a uh an opportunity for us to grab some uh students in those neighborhood associations that um that uh represent you know um that are uh kind of overlap with the campus um or or something like that you maybe we could do a better job and in terms of getting uh membership for each neighborhood association uh that com is comprised of students because it is open to everyone um so like I represent people who rent and then they they may be students I don't know um who is and who isn't but um and then we can maybe talk about how that get re um having somebody actually on the board um as well just a suggestion for the next meeting and if you do decide to put this on agenda I I can work with the chair to make sure we have someone from as MSU here to kind of who know who would you know to explain answer kind of questions like you know and just like what you know what what they intend to get out of this I don't think we have to vote on that if there's no money.

Oh sorry but I would support that yes and we can how do other people thank you for doing that offering that okay so we'll um we've submitted the neighborhood written updates since that we don't need to have a discussion we we did those written updates um but then um we I left five minutes just in case things came up that people wanted to talk about real quick yeah I had a just a couple things from the most recent commission meeting and I have deputy mayor fisher's years so um and one thing I definitely want to share it to my neighborhood and people might be curious it looks like as part of the city's ERP enterprise resource planning software update they are looking at all of their processes and trying to make them more efficient correct mear fisher deputy mayor fish if I am getting this wrong um and I see this as a really positive thing probably you know we're we're we've grown so much and I think it's really good a good sign that they're trying to take a look at their processes and be smarter about it.

So thank you.

And I know Deputy Mayor Fisher has mentioned a couple times keeping an eye on some budgeting items and there is apparently 389 million in deferred maintenance and I'm really appreciate you bringing that up in the meeting and pointing that out it just does seem a little odd that a previous meeting everybody was patting us each other on the back of how we passed our audit with flying colors and it just seems like having this 308 million eight 389 million dollars sort of backlog and I know that's not all some of that's just we're gonna do it later it's not all like right now it just seems a little bit disconnected and and it seems like you actually worry about these things so I just kind of wanted to throw that out there that that seemed a little disconnected in the bigger picture.

So but thank you for keeping an eye on the on the money I had something that I want to say um thank you for helping me right there on the fly as I was muddling through trying to figure out what the best uh course and that ties very well to one of the um priorities sub-goals which is to strengthen city advisory board efficacy so thank you for doing that and um it I I I would love to hear a little bit more from you about understanding that the city commission did not appoint us um and and knowing that you're the deputy mayor you're you're the future mayor and you'll be working with the INC for the foreseeable future um can you speak a little bit more about how you value or weight the input of the INC now and as we keep growing and welcoming new neighborhoods well I don't I don't I don't want to take much I don't know where we are with time wise but I will I will just say that that you know in the beginning of the committee of the new commission we scrap all this all the committee seats are up for up for grabs and the INC is the one I picked um and so I really wanted to sit here I was I was really impressed I mean my first INC meeting was was when we had that joint you or you guys had the joint meeting with the um with the with the with the study commission and I was just impressed with the number what the with the issues you guys are grappling with.

foreseeable future um can you speak a little bit more about how you value or weight the input of the INC now and as we keep growing and welcoming new neighborhoods well I don't I don't I don't want to take much I don't know where we are with time wise but I will I will just say that that you know in the beginning of the committee of the new commission we scrap all this all the committee seats are up for up for graphs and the INC is the one I picked um and so I really wanted to sit here I was I was really impressed I mean my first INC meeting was was when we had that joint you or you guys had the joint meeting with the um with the with the with the study commission and I was just impressed with the number with the with the issues you guys are grappling with and so you know a a chance to be here hear straight from the neighbors is really important to me I can go deeper into that but but you know we all want to get home and start making dinner so all right I have oh I want to put I want to put one more thing on the next agenda which is the next door communication contraption that we all use so currently artificial intelligence creates a survey question that's posted on next door and it says some it does not come from the city it does not come from us no one reads the results but it sure makes people mad the way they're worded and the way they're responded to and there are questions like would you support horses on Main Street I mean they're terrible there they're nothing that's being discussed it discussed at City Hall or inc or anywhere so I wanted to talk about that a little bit maybe we could have an agenda item that is communication within the neighborhood because at our annual meeting we're going to talk about it for sure because everybody hates next door but it but we need a system of some kind so I would just wanted to let you know that is on our mind over there in New Highlight View when you say we need a system you mean like a communication system within your neighborhood.

We tried Google groups um I want that next door thing to work because it's there and it's free and maybe we can figure something out but anything else so we adjourn moved to here all right okay do I hit the gap no there we go