No, I'm not vice chair.

We'll do it.

We have 30 seconds or so, right?

All right.

All right.

Good morning, everybody.

Call to order the special meeting of the Marine Advisory Board on January 28th, I believe it is, to discuss the issues surrounding in a letter for Stevenson Creek.

David can introduce yourself.

I'm David Farawa.

And welcome to the group, I guess.

Good, good.

Welcome.

Glad to have you.

I presume we have someone from Stevenson Creek, or do we need to have some discussion of the the purpose, I think, has been to finish this letter, and uh assuming the board agrees to go ahead and send this letter.

Um I had one question just to start.

I I see this letter is addressed to the city council.

Wasn't there some discussion about something for the county?

Because everybody has approved the the dock act as I understood it on Stevenson's Creek with the exception of the county.

Is that is that right?

Anybody enlighten me or not?

No, the county approved it.

The county did approve it.

Okay.

Okay.

So this letter today is indeed just a letter to the city council proposed letter.

Very good.

Good morning.

Any comments or additions that you gentlemen want to if you introduce yourselves, please.

Hi, I'm Tim Hughes.

I live very close to Stevenson Creek Aquatic Preserve.

And uh we fully support this letter.

We being the Stevenson Creek Advocacy Group, uh, Mike Foley here who's spoken on several occasions.

Um so we fully support this letter.

Uh it really um provides the data, it supports the data that's been uh collected by the Stevenson Creek uh experts.

We got some subject experts that's uh the uh navigation uh safety guy and uh also the manatee uh expert.

So anyway, to keep it all short, we just really support what you're doing with this letter.

We think it it should go forward.

Um we uh also want to emphasize that we think the manatee protection zone should go from the bridge all the way to the headwaters of the aquatic preserve.

We think that's very important.

Uh especially at the bridge where it's a narrow channel, and that narrow channel is gonna you got boaters and you got manatees alike conflicting uh uh traveling through that channel.

So we think that uh the manatee protection zone just outside the bridge into the aquatic preserve will be uh very appropriate.

Um like the heading.

Yeah, um my name is Mike Foley, I live at 1809 Apache Shale, and I've been working on the Stevenson Creek project for about 30 years.

Um many neighbors gathered around and we had a public meeting with over 400 people showed up to oppose the channelization, and that was the effectively we saved the creek from destruction at that time.

Uh now today, and then and the and the important thing is that that started a process of restoration.

Urban Creek restoration is not common.

Usually they degrade over time in urban areas.

Uh we have a website, Stevenson Creek.org.

And it went from a polluted ditch 30 years ago into an urban model of urban restoration.

And we want it to be a model for the state of Florida.

An important for not only the wildlife, but eventually in its final stages, we hope it's going to bring fishing back to some degree as an estuary.

So it's good for the environment in general.

This letter that you've written, if we decide to peel the county's decision to approve, this cannot be introduced as evidence because that appeal process only allows evidence to be presented that's already on the record.

However, they do have on the record our manatee habitat report from Save the Manatee dot org the state group that uh protects the manatees, and it also has on the record the marine safety report that we have in our files that it's the um done by a former uh master um captain in the U.S.

Coast Guard.

So I just here to say thanks uh for your support.

Um we're glad everybody's figured out what's going on there, it was not well known.

And um additionally, I'd like to say that Clearwater has stepped up on Stevenson Creek.

They were originally the plan was to pave it back in the 90s, and that would have removed uh any possibility of the creek ever being restored.

It was Clearwater that made the decision to step up and build the Glen Oaks, I call it a water park.

Um Glen Oaks is cleans the water, controls the flooding, and provides a valuable parkland.

And because of Glen Oaks, there are the along the whole uh creek watershed, the city of Clearwater has implemented many uh Clean Water Act improvements, and that's why the manatees are coming back in because they require fresh water, they they feed out in the harbor where there's seagrass, and they come into Stevenson Creek for uh fresh water.

Thank you very much.

Thanks, Mike.

Are there any questions?

Questions, yeah, comments from board members?

Yeah, I I certainly do.

Uh there's been a uh manatee count yes in Stevenson Creek, right?

Yes, sir.

I don't know who drafted the letter for us to review, but no mention of the count was in there.

So what is the count?

Uh at uh at the beginning of this month it was over 200 per uh a period of nine months.

We the report goes on.

We're doing the study for 12 months, but we felt that the number had hit so high that people ought to know.

So we released a preliminary report.

How far upstream have any of those manatees?

All the way up to Betty Lane.

Okay.

Uh Betty Lane is where the freshwater and the salt water tend to start, right?

I think maybe and they like to go all the way up to Betty Lane where it's easy to get the freshwater.

My question, reason I asked that question.

What's the water depth on the balance of that watershed?

Because the depth where the docks are and the depth under the bridge, um, you should kind of see where I'm going with that.

If a manatee needs three feet of water to swim in, obviously when he gets to three feet, he's not going to go any farther.

So my question is if that depth is right at the three feet, and you go impede that with floating docks, with vessel hulls, etc., then you you kind of block them.

Yeah, I understand.

Um I'm gonna throw a number out there at three foot, is the average depth.

Uh it's as low as one foot in places, but there's a channel, and it's a narrow channel.

I wouldn't call it a channel, more ditch, like a like a wheel ditch.

But the point is, if you put all that structure to the to the south of that over by the shelf board court, that's very, very shallow.

Yes.

And so your deeper water is to the north, which is where the docks are going to go.

If you impede that with docks and boats, then obviously they cannot get around across the flats and cannot get to the brackish water blend up by Betty Lane.

So if there were six feet of water out there, I don't think we'd be sitting here today talking to you.

Well, they would the fact that it's only one to three foot, it gets up to four feet in a couple of places.

Um it makes it really hazardous for boats and manatees.

Very tough sensitive.

Yeah, but if the docks are there, they're gonna swim under the dock.

The docks not gonna swim.

Assuming there's enough, that's what that's important.

So you can get a boat in order out of you couldn't get a boat to the dock if it's no three feet of water.

If there are boats moored in those slips, your three feet now is down to one or two feet, and they that would block them effectively.

Those boats will be on lifts.

Yeah, that's the other thing.

Because they'll sit in the mud if they don't if they aren't.

Right.

That's what I mean.

So they're I knew that what you're saying.

So they're all on lifts.

Had they been asking for lifts?

I hadn't seen that.

It just said docks.

I guess once you've got a dock, you can do what whatever you want.

It looks to me uh yes, sir.

It it it to me it begs the question of uh what kind of boats are gonna be in there.

I mean, we were talking earlier.

What's the clearance under the bridge at that high tide and at low tide, and if it's at low tide is not a not a clearance problem above the boat, there's plenty of room for above, but they're gonna prop dredge down low at low tides.

But the two things I don't think it's passive at low tide.

Yeah, so the my point is what kind of boats are going to be able to get in there, and I haven't seen anything about dredging in there.

So the only idea I have is then they are advertising for the Serena, uh, they have pictures of small motor boats.

Uh I don't know.

Uh I'm I'm gonna say 17 foot or something like that would be the biggest one.

I mean, it's just you can't get in there with a boat with a T top.

At high tide, you're gonna duck your head down low to get through the thing.

You're gonna lower your mini top.

You can't get through it with that.

If you've got a T top, you're not getting through it at all.

No, you're not gonna get it through.

It's very restrictive, and I have letters on our website that reparian residents who vote that area uh have submitted, who claim that there's only three hours when they go out, and then if they don't get it, they can't spend a day out.

If they try to get back in, they can't get back in.

You gotta skip the high, skip the low.

So why isn't that mentioned in the draft letter?

Uh it's a pretty key point.

Uh I wasn't in on the drafting of the letter.

But um your group drafts there's a lot of information that's not in the letter because it's just we try to keep it to one page without going.

I I understand that it just seems like first of all, the mention how many manatees are in there to drive that point home, and then it it seems like with the clearance is as we were saying the the clearance uh from the bottom of the bridge to the water level, depending on high or low tide, right?

It it restricts the number of boat types that can get in there.

Yes, sir, it does.

Um to your point, and it's a very good point.

Um, if you were to attach the reports, the uh navigation safety report by the captain, who is this you know, subject expert, as well as the manatees safety report by that subject expert, we think if you attach it to the letter, it'll it'll provide the information that you have just brought up.

And and I understand that.

I think my point is if we send a letter like this, or we put a we put our okay on it, right?

I I don't think it's complete, is what I'm saying.

And this is a lot of points in your favor.

Yeah, I I absolutely does.

And and I think that from my standpoint, as it stands right now, I would reword it a little bit and put these kinds of items in it.

Uh keep it to one page.

But um, as of right now, I know I wouldn't approve this because I don't think it does what you want it to do.

I think it's stop short, absolutely.

When you you need water depth, which is not mentioned, I read the report that you're uh that your captain uh uh presented.

It doesn't really address water depth, especially in the area where the where the docks are to be.

Because that to me is what is going to be restricted.

That's a choke point, and then potentially the physical location of the docks is another choke point because you have no water to the south.

And if you highlight that, then it appears, you know, even a lay person would potentially say, gee, it looks like the docks are in the way.

And the same question he just had.

By the way, what can you bring into the docks besides a kayak?

I've been under that bridge many times in a kayak in a flats boat, and it's yeah.

We we I see it as two issues.

Uh one is the manatee protects the zone.

And I think that's uh documented enough in our manatee habitat report.

It is, but then again, there's no there's no structure in the way, there's nothing impeding the manatees right now.

So fast forward, if that impedement is present, what will that potentially prevent?

You're gonna block the water depth that the manatees need at low tide, they're either going to be trapped upstream or trapped out until the tide allows them to move past the choke point.

Well, what is the depth of the channel in front of the docks at low tide?

At the at low type output, uh foot, foot and a half, two foot it you know it's it's uh the morphology of the uh creek there, and the there uh there's a rule of nature that even if it's dredged um deeper that in a moving body of water, the morphology will re revert to its former morphology over time.

We know this, we fill them in.

I mean, we dig them out and then we fill back in all I dredge behind my house, I don't know.

Um it's a complicated issue, and the depths the depths have been measured both by the developer and the county.

And um uh on our website we have some depth reports that are um we're not prepared to do it in depth.

This our group is not prepared to do that.

It's so are we saying that the water is deeper under where the docks gonna be at low tide than it is in the channel?

Well, then my list maybe I'm in the minority here, but I'm really not understanding why it's a big deal to have the docks myself because the docks are not there's I've not heard one thing that says that the docks are an issue.

Um they're at low tide, they're not restricting the or I mean they're not doing anything for the manatees, it's the same depth there it is in the channel, and with the the docks and the boats up, the manatees can swim under the docks, they do it my house, you know.

Um but how much water is under the dock at your house?

Then it's on where at the least least amount.

Um two feet.

Okay.

If the part I didn't dredge, the part I did dredge is five feet.

Okay, but all I'm saying is the pilings are not restricting a manatee, and they're not restricting the flow of the boats.

And at low tide, you've got minimum amount of boats that are gonna get in and out of there anyway, so they're not in the middle of the way.

I just other than the fact of somebody doesn't want to dock, I don't really understand what's the big deal with the dock.

Well, here's here's how I look at it.

The channel meanders, yeah.

And at the docks, the channel is over by the docks.

Right, they're built right up into it, actually.

Exactly.

Into the channel.

Um the channels narrow, and at low tide, that is not passable by anything.

But it still wouldn't be passable if the docks weren't there because it's still a foot and a half deep of water in the channel and out of the channel.

So anyway, you look at it, you're not going up and down that channel at a foot and a half unless you're in a flats boat anyway.

No, and you're gonna, and there's gonna be prop dredge.

Oh, I understand.

Which is a detrimental in itself.

That's gonna exist with or without the dock, because it's still foot and a half deep water.

The only people who use it at those times are kayaks.

So we don't have crop no dredge issues because kayaks don't have procs.

Kayaks and paddle boards come in there all the time.

Yeah, well, that's what I'm saying.

I I think we're arguing against ourselves because the same reason we're saying we don't need them, we're saying doesn't exist.

So that's a part of missing prop dredge is an issue, but but there can't be a prop dredge.

I understand.

I'm not even trying to argue, I'm just looking at it on a logical side of it as an outsider looking in, going, I'm still missing what the problem would happen.

What I'm seeing, I know that body of water fairly well, and the I don't really even call it a channel, but the the swash runs very close to the shoreline to the north shoreline at the point where the docks are proposed, which is probably one of the reasons they proposed them where they did, because the the deep water deep being subjective, the docks appear on the drawing to go through all the way across the what I'm gonna call the swash.

It's not really a channel, it's not a drive, a maintained channel.

But as the water flows, of course, it's gonna follow the follow the bank, and that's why it swings in close there and it comes back out and uh goes under for the most part under the main span of the bridge, under the center span.

But the dock itself, the whole structure is gonna occupy that swash channel.

But you're talking tilings, you're not talking about a wall.

I mean, the water is still gonna flow under the dock just like it would be.

Right, but if the water if the water's only three feet deep and you've got a floating dock, they're not floating dock.

Are they floating docks?

Those aren't floating docks, are they?

I think they are.

I thought they're fixed docks.

How are you gonna put a boat left on a floating dock?

Honestly, I I can't tell.

What I've seen, it was like is it a floating boat or is it yeah, yeah.

If I haven't seen the permanent know it's released, so I don't know what changes were made.

I've I've not seen anything that made me think it was a floating boat.

If if we had um a drawing uh or uh or an aerial view, it would show that the docks come out approximately a hundred feet and eighty feet wide, you got over 40 pylons, and I think it would be appropriate if we had if we could display a print showing that.

So if we have 40 pylons, there are no floating docks, especially as it relates to its proximity to the bridge.

Now, a lot of the manatee data that uh Mike has alluded to, um, a lot of the manatees have been sited where the docks are proposed to be built.

I understand that, but with a piling, they're gonna swim around the piling.

The pilings are not gonna stop the manatees from swimming up there.

It can't be floating docks if you've got that many pilings because a floating docks are gonna have very minimal amount of pilings because they're gonna be floating.

Beg your pardon?

There's I think there's lifts involved.

That's what I'm and that's the other one.

If you've got floating docks, you're not gonna put a lift in on a floating dock because you couldn't even get around it then.

So that's why I'm saying I've not seen any I get I get what you're saying.

I I tend to agree with you.

The point I was making earlier, though, is uh it it is this to me.

This is more a marketing ploy by the developer to appease people who are gonna live there and want a boat, whether it's a kayak, uh a rowboat, or or maybe a 17-foot with a motor, because uh the the restrictions getting under that bridge are gonna dictate a lot.

And um and water depth, if it comes out a hundred feet, that's that's the entire width of the channel.

I agree a hundred percent that would keep any other vessels from coming in or out because that dock would block the deep water.

If you look along Edgewater Drive, there are older uh piers.

None of them have boats because they just can't have them there.

They built the piers, they tried to put the boats in, boats ended up on their sidewater, the head, the high water comes in and floods them out.

Also, on Stephenson Creek, there were nine other docks owned by homeowners.

Four of them are not used because they tried having a boat and it was senseless.

And the expense of a boat that just sits there, they sold the boat.

It's gone.

Uh there's a few boats in there, and a few only I only know of two boaters who actually use their boats, and they're they've got letters in there saying they can only get out at a couple hours a day.

It's they don't use it very much.

So they're really using their dock to go sit on in the afternoon and watch the manatee switch.

That's right.

Um Lakey here has a boat, and he can speak to that issue personally.

Yeah, so it seems to be like, correct me if I'm wrong.

The biggest issue is the fear is if you build a dock, there's gonna be more boats.

And the more boats is gonna are is the issue with the manatees and the environment, correct?

We're also concerned that it sets a precedent.

Well, and that's one of our concerns.

If it if they build it, the next guy they have another development going on right next to it.

Are they gonna put nine more?

Is it going to be turned into a marina?

But I think the presidents was set when they built the first two docks in the from the homeowners that it's okay to have a dock in the on the water.

I mean, that's kind of where the president is.

And I think that stuff's turning.

Beg your pardon?

That stuff's turn of the century.

Doesn't matter if you're there.

I mean, it's kind of like going, I can't have one, but you can't.

You know, you open up a whole nother can of worms.

I got it, but I'm just saying I'm going back to saying I believe the issue that I've heard at every meeting is there's gonna be more boats back there.

But I think the flip side of that is you just in your own argument is the water's so shallow that there's not gonna probably be more boats back there, just more people sitting on docks.

Well, there's been talks about at the at the lawn bowl center to put in a dock for kayaks and paddle boards, and that came up first about 2000, when the restoration was in in full play.

And I had at that time I said to Tom Miller, who was the department head of the environmental department in the uh Clearwater, don't do it.

He said, Why?

I said, because of Marshall Street.

Marshall Street had not been upgraded, and there was effluent coming into the creek a lot.

There was so much it was it was uh the bacteria count was evened affecting the harbor and and uh the the pass and the clear water beach.

There were fecal counts all up and down the entire section, and that's not healthy.

So at that time I was on the environmental board, I said to Tom Miller, I wouldn't put docks there.

I think it's too too reliable because somebody gets sick.

And um so but now that's changed quite a bit because Marshall Street's been upgraded, and I think it's perfectly suitable for a kayak uh dock, uh paddle board dock.

I just don't I think okay, my mind I live at Serena.

Uh my relatives visit teenage boys, I like to use the boat, I hand them the keys.

He goes down there, spinning around in the hook in the estuary where the manatees are.

That's not I mean it's it it's a fiction, but it it will that kind of thing will happen.

I've seen boats out there, uh flat bottom boats.

I agree with I was I lived on um Mandalay, I mean on uh um up in Palm Harbor back in there.

Well, you know, there's and I've seen all that stupidity that you're talking about.

Okay, at low tides, you know, half of that was and and here we have spent uh millions and millions of dollars on the upgrades, the uh clean water implements, the um Marshall Street plant, all the maintenance that takes place on these parks, these water uh treatment, uh natural water treatment, vegetated parks, a lot of a lot of effort's gone into bringing this estuary up to the point where it's actually becoming viable.

And I and to your point about the advertising, that's what it really in I believe that's what it is.

It's an advertising issue.

It's uh if I put docks out there, next guy walks in the door, is gonna want to buy one, you know.

But I think you've also just answered what I said.

You're not against the dock, you're just against the power, the motor boat, the power boat.

Yeah, I oh yeah.

So the dock isn't the issue, it's the boat that's the issue.

And as the uh harbor, as the uh captain of the USGS said, it's just overbuilt.

It's just uh he said, I'm not opposed to docks.

He said, and I'm gonna be fair in my assessment.

He says, I I don't have a problem with the dock.

It's the it's overbuilt, overbuilt for the area where it sits.

No, it does it to me, it doesn't make sense if if uh and again I I I I agree with you, right?

I you can build the docks, but what kind of boat are you uh I mean, why would you buy the the dock and what kind of boat would you put there?

And and it so I mean people do crazy things, so somebody's gonna buy those docks, and you know, the creek is gonna just self-regulate.

Another another belief, and it's only a belief, it's not anything that's ever happened that there's a new kind of boat called a jet boat.

I don't know if you have you probably heard of them.

They're vacuum cleaners.

We're a little concerned that if it's the motor boats prove to be as difficult as we think they're gonna be that these little jet boats that'll run in a six foot of six inches of water.

Yeah, but I can tell you the boats I know that they're vacuum cleaners, they suck everything up.

Yeah, yeah, you don't want to go in in seagrass with jet boats.

No, nothing like that.

I don't know.

I think they're not really new.

Really two separate issues.

Two separate issues.

One issue is the manatee protection zone and getting an ordinance for the manatee protection zone, and that's really separate from the docks.

So our first goal is to get a manatee protection zone and get an ordinance written and approved by the city, and then to implement that.

What would that be?

That's that's a separate issue from the docks, right?

There's no signage out there.

What does that mean?

Well, there's no signage out there talking about manatees except for one sign that uh Mr.

McDonald had put up at our request, and it's on the bridge at where the canals trail crosses, and it says manatees, caution.

But there's no speed limit in there right now.

There's been six manatee deaths that have been documented.

I know it's goes back to 2016, but Tim found them on the USGS at the UFW at the um uh FWC.

Uh six manatee deaths, four of which were caused by boats inside the estuary of Stevenson Creek.

Outside the estuary Stevenson Creek, there's been 28 total manatee deaths in the harbor, and there's signage out there.

We just think some signage isn't there a sign just east of the bridge by about a hundred yards facing west.

It's something like that.

But even with the signs, it wouldn't be a no-wake, right?

Oh, yeah, we could well it we're not a concern with erosion.

No, no, but but the speed's what's killing the manatees, not if you're idling.

You can't see them right.

That's what I'm saying.

So most jet skis come in there a lot and race around.

Not a lot, but okay.

Um so once again, why wouldn't we be trying to introduce a no-weight through the the whole once you hit the bridge, it's no weight.

Well, the manatees, we want to we think the manatee protection zone will be.

Yeah, the manatee protection zone, that would uh make that a slow speed minimum weight, just like the other areas say that that's what I'm saying.

So to me, I would rather be fighting for that.

We want you to support that, and that's what we're really that's our main issue.

That I 100% support.

Yeah, if they build the docks, I think it's gonna be overbuilt.

I think it's gonna sit there.

I think the boats are gonna just people are gonna find they good, can't use them, or if they do, they get stuck and all this.

I hate to see them go through that rig and roll.

We're happy to see kayaks, paddle boards that we've uh that I think that's harmless basically.

They're in there all the time.

These guys can come in there fishing with their kayaks and all that stuff, and that's wonderful.

We like to see it.

So to kind of to kind of wrap this a bit.

Yeah, what we're saying is the best thing that could happen there is a manatee protection zone where where you you can regulate the speed.

Speed and and as far as the docks go, if they build it, it doesn't damage or really danger the manatees.

It's just that it it's kind of foolish because of the uh clearances under the under the road under under the bridge.

Well, I think is that I think if they build those docks and we start and we start to see use in there, I don't think it's gonna help the manatees at all.

I think it may be detrimental to their habitat.

I think one of the things we're hoping too in the future to start is the seagrass uh replenishment program, and that's something that uh uh it used to have seagrass in there, even when the pollution was in there.

The Army Corps of Engineers came in there and 2011, 2014 dredged the whole thing because there was three, four feet of muck on the bottom that was urban pollution that had been created over 50, 60 years.

Erosion as well as oils and greases, it was anaerobic muck.

Army Corps of Engineers dredged it out.

They're a part, they're a partner in this whole thing.

Um at the time when they dredged it, it killed everything.

The crabs disappeared.

Uh the fish were reduced in number.

Uh just the wandering fish that came in, and the manatee stopped coming in there.

Um we're seeing the morphology go back to the level, but it's more of a granular materials, not the muck.

And um, so it's an estimate.

One thing we wanted with Marshall Street's gonna get decommissioned in the future, the sewage treatment plant because it's running at capacity, and uh and development is still occurring.

So they're gonna pump the uh sewage up to uh the east, north, northeast plant.

When that happens, just like when island estates when they decommission that sewage treatment, they turned it into a marina or uh uh marine display with dolphins.

The aquarium query, pardon me.

Uh we think Marshall Street might make a suitable hatchery.

You know, one or two of the tanks try it out anyway.

We've if you have a hatchery, you gotta have an estuary.

Well, we got an ester.

We want to keep it as healthy as possible.

We want it to be improved and restored more.

And my family came to Clearwater because of the fishing.

My Uncle John used to come down here back in the 50s, go fishing.

Uh he used the charter boats, which you are gone.

Where did they go or go?

They went because there's no fish, or not, you know, not like in the old days.

And so an estuary could be helpful to the economy.

Um might get some more fish going on.

But wouldn't that encourage more boats?

Uh in the ocean, yeah.

But I mean, back in the channel, if they're dumping fish back there, which you're gonna go under the bridge to fish.

No, not full uh to propagate them to get them started.

And we need to get some seagrass back in there.

There used to be seagrass, the turtle grass grew all through there.

So um let me interject here if I can.

Can I can I talk for a minute, please?

Yeah.

So I I think we've heard a lot of discussion, which is really excellent and thorough, and it really gets through the issues quite well, I think.

Um point of clarification, first of all.

This letter was written by the advocacy advocacy group, right?

One of you authored it or something.

She wrote it.

She's our president.

So it seems to me that the options in front of us this morning were A to approve the letter is written, but I think the discussion says that that this letter ought to focus more on the manatee protection zone issue and maybe not even have this paragraph in here about uh opposition to the large commercial docks.

Um that's something we need to decide.

So we may have to ask for this letter to be redone.

Oh, definitely.

If the letter, so okay, so we're gonna ask for the letter to be redone.

And then and then it's a question of mechanics and how that gets done.

Mike, if this letter is redone, do we have another meeting to discuss the letter?

I mean, how many times do we do we meet to discuss the letter before something gets sent?

Introduce it to an appeal at the county anyway.

I understand that I'm not talking about this was not this was not part of an appeal letter anyway.

It was just a letter to the city council.

Mike, what what process wise?

You know, this is gonna be Euros letter, uh, however, you guys like to do that.

Uh you could do that now.

You could edit the letter now and and and come to some sort of consensus, or you can have them rewrite it and send it back, and we go through the process again.

Uh the chairman is you know, he can call a special meeting at any point, or we can reconvene at our next scheduled meeting, which is March 18th.

So it's a trillion for you guys on the vote by everybody, we get a copy of the letter and then we just vote.

Oh, you have to do it in the sunshine, so it has to be a meeting.

Okay, yeah, to vote to approve that letter.

Sweet foot.

So uh I I guess what we need is a is a recommendation from someone as to how to proceed.

I it it sounds to me like the way to proceed is a letter should be rewritten, it should include more facts and data about the manatee data that you've accumulated that it ought to focus on the manatee protection zone.

Um at least that's the sense that I got when I agree.

What is everyone?

And if you're gonna address water depth, get documented information from a manatee expert and say a manatee needs whatever 24 inches of water to to navigate, and then say this so-called channel is only 18 inches at low tide.

Forget the docks, like they were saying.

But if we're if we're after the manatee aspect, the manatee cannot swim up there in less than X amount of water, and that docks are going to be right over top of that.

I disagree with that.

I mean, the docks are not an issue.

No, that's what I'm saying.

For forget the docks.

I know, but you're but you're saying the docks are gonna be over it.

It's 18 inches with or without a dock.

So addressing the depth of the channel for the manatees are really saying we don't want manatee.

Manatees are never gonna swim up there at low tide anyway, with or without the docks.

They're not gonna swim.

I think we all agree that the focus be on the manatee protection zone.

Yeah, but be logical with what we're and we'll uh we'll be happy to edit the letter, rewrite it, exclude for this, because step one is the manatee protection.

So we appreciate your support for that.

Okay, so let's do that.

I think you'll get it.

You got our support for that.

Mike will distribute that just yeah, just a second, but but if we proceed this way, Mike will distribute to us that revised letter, and then I guess we'll either have to have another meeting or get it done in March.

Let's do it.

Okay, sir.

You have something you want to bring up?

Well, you're gonna table, it doesn't matter what I say.

Well, I I let me add to that if if I send you the letter, you can work on it on your own and edit it on your own, and then bring that letter to the board.

Uh right, we just can't send it to each other.

Right, you can't send it to each other.

So that's another option that you can do as well.

You're referring to Mike, you're you're referring to uh a revised correct.

So if they send me a letter or send it to you guys, you guys can work on it individually, and then uh show you know what what you've adopted to the board and they do that with the letter they have now.

No, because I I can't because I don't have the data in here about the manatee observations.

Yeah, but I think there's yeah, we have given uh Mike the uh Manatee Habitat Report, and he's also got the uh safety navigation report.

I would just ask the original person to rewrite the letter, correct?

And put more include all the more staff in there.

Okay, and I'll send you guys all the information that I have when they've reforward made the revised letter.

Okay, yeah.

I mean, I I think you've got general support here with the board.

However, if you're if we're gonna put our name on a on a draft, I think we need to be more focused than and I you know there's some there's some really tough wording in here.

Um using you know words like extraordinary and uh and so on that uh I don't know that that I would strongly urge and things like that.

Well but let's let's focus on what we're trying to really demonstrate.

Yes.

Somebody's gonna pick it apart, yeah.

Which is kind of what we did amongst ourselves today.

Um it's gonna be picked apart, so let's find it find an angle that's that's a little more bulletproof.

Yeah, yeah, we concentrate on the manatee situation, you're gonna choke the boaters out anyway.

And and we realize restrictions you put in the really good focus to be on the manatee protection zone, especially as it relates to it's important.

Your letters, your letter of support is really important with the zone as it relates to creating uh an ordinance that the city will have to draft and and then they have to implement and then we have to send to the FWC.

So we appreciate this focus on that.

We really do.

Yeah, thank you.

Um I think we've concluded is there a gentleman.

Did you have something you wanted to uh bring or well I have gone first?

You have to introduce yourself.

We didn't mean to shut you out there with yeah, Darrell Lakey, 1792 Overbrook Avenue, Clearwater, Florida.

I've lived on the creek for seven years, six and a half.

I am a boater, I do have a dock.

I I have a Tahoe, it's an 18-foot, it's a bow rider.

My draw is 24 inches.

Um where do I start?

You guys have talked about so much here.

Um I should warn you to have three minutes with a little bit of a lot of things.

Yeah, yeah, I know.

It's all right.

No time to do that.

I can get out between a 1.2 tide and a 3.2 tide.

That that gives me about five, six hours a day to go out there at times.

Um the manatee possession zone is needed, and I think Mike, you know, for all of his hard work that he's we've been working on this for two years.

Well, I have the speed zone, is what I'm you're concerned about.

Um, because boaters fly up and down there not regularly, but enough to cause an issue.

Now, Mike said you set up the um what's the name of it?

The between the bridges, you know, last year they put up the speed zone.

Either side of the buttons only between the bridges.

Right.

So between the bridges, you know, they fly like hell.

Right.

Um, and I live between the Panamas Trail and the Douglas overpass or crossing right in the middle there uh on the Pink House, and you're welcome to come by and visit and look and watch the manatees come by.

Anyway, uh getting back to the docks or the manatee protection zone.

We need it because they come flying uh through there a lot.

Now, what happens with the docks?

Last I read, they come out 80 feet from the north shore.

That's where the main channel is.

You can call it a ditch or whatever the heck you want to call it.

It's the main channels on the north side, and I wish you guys would have been with the CDB when they approved this you know, two years ago in the county.

They you guys seem more on the ball than everybody else.

Um that dock comes out 80 feet, you need at least 10 feet you pass that to pass safely.

Now you're in that where the city um laid all that your backfield to plant the mangroves 10 years ago or whatever it was.

It's cut down that channel to that north side, and your manatees need three feet of water to go through.

And with this last two hurricanes, that raised the level of the um the depth about a foot and a half, most of the creek, especially on that north side there, and in front of my house.

Okay, all right.

Well, that Darrell, thank you.

Thank you.

We're seeing a lot of dolphins in there too.

They've mowed the columns, and they they round the mull it up.

It's easy prey for them in there.

Okay.

So I I remember when we when we first discussed in here a year or two ago, the uh idea of uh putting the markers on either side of the bridge, and the hope was that in between the bridges and those markers, there wouldn't be a lot of room for people to really power up and rip through there, but I guess it's still an issue.

So hopefully what we've concluded.

Hopefully, what we've concluded this morning might be a step in in addressing that with the manatee protection.

99% of traffic out there is paddle boards and kayaks.

Kayaks most we could even proposed at the shuffle board facility putting in a kayak launch there.

Yeah, it costs to be virtually nothing.

You've already got parking, parking, you already got the cuts mangroves.

And and they're doing it now, the kayak to walk them through the manual.

Sure.

Tommy picks up trash, uses that site to launch.

You know about him, right?

Our caretaker of the two of them.

He's a retired banker.

Anyway, thanks, Paul's.

Thank you.

Thank you all for coming.

Any other comments next morning?

All right, meeting stands adjourned.

Would you like a director's report?

For you, would you like a director's report before you oh do I have to undo my gap?

There's citizens to be heard regarding items not on the agenda, which we didn't do.

I didn't follow the agenda as a special meeting.

I wasn't sure if I needed to do that, sorry.

You're good, so we'll just do citizens to be heard regarding items not on the agenda now.

Okay.

And then we'll go to you.

So we're still in session.

Are there any other items to be heard?

Yes, sir.

If I could just make a short comment.

And it will be short.

Okay.

I live on Clearwater Beach, 855 Bay Way Boulevard.

Uh, and the reason I just wanted to share a comment is we have a yacht club that's on Bay Way, and there's a body of water behind it.

Uh the city council had approved the ability of a hotel, a small boutique hotel, now to be a 60-unit, nine-story mana lift with docks.

The docks that had been there even have a sign that says caution manatee area.

When we arrived there back in the 90s, you can go see the manatees.

Nothing, they're gone because of the number of boats, I think, that are now coming into the area.

The seagrass has been damaged, and there's a lot of private homes also on that short body of water that have now added docks with boats.

Kind of a fast forward, what could happen 10 years from now with this specific body of water?

And you had already addressed the protection zone, uh, which which I assume is is from that 1978 act.

Uh the sanctuary uh manatee sanctuary act, so I I don't need to address that.

That's all I wanted to say.

Fast forward where I live now, that's what we have with the development.

Yeah, I may correct you a little bit though.

There are manatees occasionally in there.

We've had a very water yellow.

Oh I've seen I'm the rear commodore.

I have seen manatees in there.

How recently can I ask?

Um back several months ago.

Oh, you know, they're not in there every day.

It's but it there's an occasional siding of oh crap, there's a there's a manatee.

I'm glad to hear that because we frequently go out there and and we have to do that.

And the docks for the hotel existed way before the hotel.

They were part of the the other uh property that was there, the the condos.

They didn't build the docks or the hotel, yeah.

The docks they tore the other property down and build a hotel, but the marina existed way before.

Well, yeah, no, the breakers had it, and and I think they're also getting an additional docks as related to that hotel because the hotel's now gonna have 28 docks on there.

I don't know, I didn't hear anything about additional docks.

That's totally news to me.

Is that entire waterway uh now slow speed?

No.

Okay.

We used to drag race and water skiing there when we were kids.

We'd like to see it though, wait.

Well, I thank you for that.

I I made a point I wanted to share.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thanks.

Yeah, so uh we did the uh feasibility study for Stevenson's Creek on looking at a slow speed minimum wake zone through out there.

We did the presentation to you all.

Uh and the best course of action is through the uh local ordinance manatee projection zone.

So uh with using the citizen science.

So Stevenson's Creek advocacy group went out, uh they got a bunch of data.

Uh I've reached out to FWC, had a meeting with them.

Uh they're in support of this.

Uh so what our next steps are is to define the boundaries of this manatee zone, which is gonna be between the first bridge and the third bridge.

Uh, that after that third bridge, it's slow speed minimum wake through out there.

Uh and so we're gonna draft an ordinance uh uh draft a letter of intent to seek this uh manatee projection zone and uh and provide all the citizen data that Stephenson's Creek Advocacy Group has provided.

So I'm gonna send that over to FWC, they're gonna review it and tell us what if if we need more information, uh if we need to change something that the ordinance says, or something in the letter of attent, they're gonna send it back.

We're gonna finalize everything, then we're gonna take the ordinance to council uh for their approval for the manatee zone, and then we'll submit everything to the state for a permit.

So that's where we're at right now.

That should get in all the draft.

That should wrap this whole thing up then.

Yeah, so uh a part of that is to send you know letters of the the recommendation.

So you know, Stevenson's Creek has provided us some of those letters to share with FWC too as part of the entire package.

So that's where we're at.

I just wanted to let you guys know where we're at, and we are pursuing the manatee zone for that creek.

That sounds like letters forget the docs that we've been talking about from the group.

Uh if if a letter came from the advisory board, that would be that would support the support would be a good thing.

Yes, or the manatee zone, yes, correct.

Excellent.

So all the more all the more reason why the the memo that you guys write needs to really emphasize the manatee protection.

Is the docks almost become irrelevant?

Yeah, they correct.

All right, and I think you you hit the nail on the head there, but just forget the docks.

If they if they're somebody dumb enough to buy swampland, yeah, that's basically what they're doing.

Okay, it's a great place to go sit.

What's the manatees?

Ride your lift up and down to ride that no what's a manatees.

So that's all I have.

That's all.

Thank you very much and one more time.

Is there anything from any other members of the board?

Nope.

Okay, now I think I can adjourn.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.