Um April sixteenth.

Calling this utilities committee to order.

Present.

Right.

Here.

Present.

Thank you, madam, madam clerk.

We have uh a couple of pieces from the Department of Public Utilities, and then we have one from the Office of Sustainability, but I understand that we have public comment.

Uh, so we're gonna start with the public comment.

As soon as we get your name, hang on.

David Beach.

Um, welcome to the table.

I understand you have public comment, so we'll give you three minutes.

Uh good morning.

Uh, thanks for the opportunity.

My name's David Beach, I'm a resident of Ward 3.

Um, and I've been a participant in energy and water issues in Cleveland probably almost as long as Councilman Palency.

Um, so I want to um express my appreciation for two of the ordinances today, uh 406, um, which is the city's aggregation program.

Um, I'm not able to be on uh Cleveland Public Power.

I'm on first energy where I live.

Um, and the city's aggregation program through SOPEC allows me to get affordable 100% green renewable energy, uh, which I really appreciate.

So the city's aggregation program is one of those underappreciated uh services that the city provides.

So I I really appreciate it.

And then ordinance 410, um, which uh deals with investing or reinvesting in the CPP substations.

Um I just want to flag that that it's so important to keep reinvesting in our municipal uh utility.

Um, you know, as our lives become more and more electrified, you know, everything's gonna be electrified in the future.

And as big corporations build data centers to monopolize our energy system beyond our borders, it's gonna be more and more important in the future that we have a strong municipal utility.

Um it can, you know, it's one of the most important things for the future sustainability of Cleveland.

Um we have our own utility, it's under local democratic control, um, and we need to keep uh investing in it.

So thank you.

All right, thank you, Mr.

Beach.

Appreciate that.

And you're more than welcome any time to come down for public comment.

We appreciate it.

Good morning, Director.

Good morning, Chairman, members of the committee.

Ordinance number 363, 2026 by council members Casey and Griffin by departmental request, an emergency ordinance authorizing the director of public utilities to enter into one or more requirement contracts without competitive bidding with Murphy Tractor and Equipment Company Inc.

for the purchase of proprietary replacement parts for heavy duty construction equipment and labor and materials to repair and maintain the proprietary equipment for the division of water, Cleveland Public Power, Water Pollution Control, Department of Public Utilities for a period of two years.

That's correct, Chairman.

So throughout the divisions, we utilize heavy equipment such as tractors, excavators, mini excavators, backhoes, lift trucks, wheel and front end loaders, the majority of which are John Deere.

John Deere has a selected vendor, not only by way of warranty, maintenance and repair for those vehicles.

So this uh list legislation would allow us to continue that relationship with Murphy Tractor for the approximate amount of 325,000 dollars over the next two years, uh seeking approval.

Any questions on 363 2026?

CNN 363 2026 stands approved.

Please sign up.

Ordinance number 407, 2026 by council members, House Jones, Hudson, Santana, Slife, Casey, and Griffin by departmental request, an emergency ordinance determining the method of making the public improvement of constructing the Archwood Avenue and West 39th Street, Bradgate Avenue, Clyborne Avenue, East 58th Street, and Luther Avenue, area sewer replacement projects authorizing the director of public utilities to enter into one or more public improvement contracts authorizing the director to employ one or more professional consultants necessary to design the improvements and authorizing the director to apply for and accept any loans and grants for any public or private entity.

Chairman, that's correct.

Typically, hopefully we come every year with a list of projects for the Division of Water Pollution Control's Capital Improvement Plan.

These uh projects are selected by the Commissioner and his team for a number of different uh variables that are analyzed on a regular basis.

These are the recommendations for 2026 in an approximate value of 5.4 million dollars.

That is a bunch of different funding streams, and also we continue to look for grants and other opportunities to fund these improvements.

All right, uh Commissioner, how is it that you actually choose these streets to be done?

Well, it's based on on sewer main, um the age of it, um if there's any breaks or uh failure of the mains.

Um we our engineering team is out there uh televising, die testing, and checking out uh areas you know all week long to see, and that's how we come up with typically our list of streets that we need to handle.

Plus, we handle uh flooding conditions and issues from residents, so that very uh plays a factor in it as well.

All right.

Any questions on 407 2026?

Councilwoman Hudson.

Thank you through the chair.

Um for this project, even though you know it's being approved in 2026.

What's the time frame for making these uh replacements?

Well through the chair to the councilwoman.

It it depends on the length of sewer main that we're replacing.

Um determines the length of time for the project.

Um so recently I submitted um Clydeborne Avenue to be repaved this year, and then it was um sent back to me, I believe, because of this project.

Yes.

Um, but it was um said that it would be two to three years out, and um, so I'm you know currently trying to figure out what to do because uh Clyborne Avenue is in really really terrible condition.

It's an F street, but it's not just like an F, it's a very low F.

And two to three years is a long time to wait for um you know repaving it'll you know basically be gravel in two to three years.

So um, but I also understand that if there's going to be sewer work done, um, you know, I don't want to repave it just for it to be ripped up.

Um so I'm kind of in uh you know conundrum about what to do.

Yeah, that well that's that's a question I could um get to you an answer for uh based on the length and um yeah, typically we don't want to do that, we don't want to repave or tear up a street that was just repaved, so I can get more answers for you on that.

Does the project this year?

Yes, it should start this year.

Is there any way to you know order the streets based on how do you order the streets?

Well, of course, we go through obviously funding's important, and then it's got to go through the process of going to border control and all those things, and and so a lot of times it's a guesstimate on how long a project will take, but we we can get some more definitive answers for you on that.

Okay, thank you.

I'd appreciate that.

That's a that's a two million dollar street, right?

So that's one of the bigger streets.

Chairman to the council members, so these projects are identified, um, but we can get you a timeline.

We have we do have to get the specs and go out to bid and find the contractor and then get a start date.

So it's not necessarily we prioritize, it's the process prioritizes itself, but we can we can get you that timeline, and maybe there's some other um necessary utility work that we can do that we will then be able to modestly upgrade the condition of the street, but we're happy to sit down and go through all of the available resources that we have.

It's hard to give a timeline now because it's openly publicly procured, right?

And a lot of things can happen.

We hope that they don't, but it we now understanding the priority, not only of you but of us from the sewer side.

Um, I think we can sit down and coordinate.

Okay, thank you very much.

Thank you.

All right, thank you.

Councilman Palency.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman, honorable colleagues, and to the director and the commissioners that are here.

So um the total dollar amount for this project is 5.4 million.

The loan that we receive or we are attempting to receive.

Um have we applied for those loans already?

Chairman of the council member, that is included in the ordinance on the if come.

We do partner with a number of different agencies, including the regional sewer district for the community cost share funds.

So we apply regularly for every project and then work diligently to get awards on those.

So uh when you're speaking of a loan, I think it's the language in the authority that we're requesting.

We apply for any number of different from the state revolving loan fund, but this is predominantly our capital budget that council approved back whenever and then any uh additional funds we can find to limit our capital and use that on other infrastructure.

Okay.

So when we do apply for a loan, what is the interest rate?

What what do they charges?

Through the chairman to the council members.

So by example, the community cost share would not be a loan, that would be a grant.

Okay.

Um the state revolving loan fund is typically long-term zero interest.

Okay.

If if say we get into design of any one of these projects and our estimated costs, which are typically at the division of water pollution control, very, very close.

Say we realize that there's some underground issues that need to be addressed and the number escalates dramatically, then we do have other opportunities that that we would either use the state revolving loan fund, community cost share, any available resource to make sure that the infrastructure gets improved.

Okay.

And um, you've indicated in your um summary, the age of the sewers on the streets in question.

On every sewer line that we have in the city, do we have a date when it was installed?

Chairman of the council member, we have approximations in some of our uh areas, which is just based on the can uh the um materials that were used in the sewer, any number of different variables, but uh it's pretty close.

If we have the records, those are it.

If not, we use a uh a good approximation based on analysis.

Okay.

So uh I think what two or three of these sewers were built in the 1800s?

Correct.

Okay.

The um the other point I wanted to um learn a little bit more on.

Uh, in this last um crazy storm we had from what two weeks ago, um I experienced flooding on streets that I had never experienced flooding on basement flooding.

And to through the chair to the director to the commissioner WPC.

Are we tracking because I've I've been at every meeting with say again tonight I'm going to never meeting, um, that I'm urging everyone to notify WPC that had flooding.

Because a lot of people don't.

They just take it upon themselves and they call whoever to come and help them or they do it themselves, um, if especially if the water is going down after the storm.

Um, but are in this last storm we had, were we able to track citywide where we experienced the flooding?

Chairman of the council member, yes.

We do keep a very good record of the calls that we receive and what our the commissioner did dispatches his inspectors in a storm event and they record what they see.

We do have good data on that.

Okay.

So I'm with Mr.

Chairman.

I'm gonna request through the chair uh to the director and to the commission.

I'd like a list of the streets in Ward 10 uh to the best of your knowledge where you experienced basement flooding.

I'm trying to track this in my own um in my own way as well, because I was out um middle of the night on on that storm, especially by Euclid Creek, due to the fact that the creek rose to flood stage level, uh, which was you had to see it to believe it, um, how high the water rose.

Um, and I know we've been working with uh Northeast Regional Sewer District on some issues as well.

So I'm gonna make that request through the chair uh that I'd like to get that because I'm just trying to figure out um again, like 179, Brian, 178.

Never had flooding on those streets, and they're and they're so high above the the the creek itself, I could not understand why those streets um experience flooding.

So again, I'll look for that information.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Thank you.

Uh Brooke, do you have the the request?

All right.

Any other questions on 407 2026?

Seeing none, please sign up.

Ordinance number 408 2026 by council members Casey and Griffin by departmental request, an emergency ordinance authorizing the purchase by one or more requirement contracts of plumbing services and backflow testing and inspection, including labor and materials necessary to repair, replace, and install existing and new equipment and appurtenances and the purchase of the necessary equipment and appurtenances for the various divisions of the Department of Public Utilities for a period of two years.

Director, this is the backflow stuff for city buildings.

Uh yes, that's correct, Chairman.

That was uh that's part of it.

This is also uh routine plumbing services, primarily for the division of water pollution control in their facility, or I'm sorry, for CPP.

Those are required under the EPA certification to be regularly tested and reported on, if not replaced.

Um we use this contract with Communel uh SA Communal to provide those services for us.

And this is going out to bid.

That's correct, Chairman.

Okay.

Director, this was first introduced March 30th.

And the current contract expires June 6 or April 16th.

Today.

Today.

Yes, Chairman.

So we we do have existing delivery orders, DOs in place with SA Communal to provide for anything that we anticipate.

Anything that's under the current contracts, we did have the opportunity.

We do work, um, I do work with the commissioners and their staff to make sure that we get these ordinances in in a timely manner to give council an opportunity to review it.

Um this was just um it was uh we have the services, but we we should have been here a little earlier.

All right, and we're we won't have a disruption in service.

That's correct, Chairman.

Okay, absolutely.

All right, just making sure.

Any questions on 408 2026?

Yes.

Uh Councilwoman Gray.

Thank you.

Thank you, Chair.

To the um to the director.

Um trying to just understand uh the work that you're gonna be doing.

Is this going to help you know various um homeowners sometimes have backup um sewage problems when they have a lot of uh rain, and then they have they believing that a lot of the water flood their basement does just have something to help um help with that not to have homes, foundation.

I don't know if that's I'm just trying to have a conversation with you.

They believing that a lot of the when it rains and they basement flood, it comes from the uh sewer line or the water line.

Uh will this help this or or um and or is this something else?

Chairman to the council member, no, this is something else.

So this is in the Department of Public Utilities facilities, like when the when the at Cleveland Public Power, when the West Side Service Center um shower breaks or the bathrooms break, they need a plumber.

We don't have any plumbers on staff.

So this would come and fix the plumbing at our facilities for our employees or for our customers that come to our facilities.

Okay.

And then the other side of it is the backflow devices that are required in our facilities to not only uh install them, but to test them and and report them.

So it's a two-fold um for anybody who is experiencing or has concerns about their waterline sewer line.

We do partner with home serve for the waterline sewer line protection program.

Um so we do encourage participation in that.

Um and anybody who does have a complaint as Councilman Palency was just referring to, make sure that they call the division of water pollution control.

We can get out there and inspect and TV.

Okay, thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you, Councilwoman.

Any other questions on 408 2026?

Seeing none 408 2026 stands approved.

Please sign up.

Ordinance number 40949 2026 by council members Casey and Griffin by Departmental Request and Emergency Ordinance Authorizing the Purchase by one or more requirement contracts for various sized PVC and FRE duct line materials for the division of Cleveland Public Power, Department of Public Utilities for a period of two years.

Director, this is a requirements contract.

That's correct, Chairman, and it will go out to bid.

Um this is for the uh various materials used in the distribution of power at Cleveland Public Power, predominantly underground with the PVC FRE, fitting spacers, expanders, reducers, adhesives, etc.

Um, this contract has expired uh unfortunately, uh, but we do have the necessary um paperwork in place to have these materials.

We have a lot on hand to accommodate for anything that could come up today, but also the necessary uh preparations to ensure that we continue to get these needed parts.

Approximately 500,000 per year.

Again, it is a requirements contract.

We budget a little high.

Um historically, we don't go near it, as you will see in the last contract to the award to the expiration date of March, it was 367,000 total.

So we buy what we need to deliver power to our customers.

Um thank you.

Director, if you could please just keep an eye on expiring contracts so that we don't have an overlap in a possibility of interruption of any type of service or anything that we just want to be prepared if something goes wrong.

Understood, Chairman.

Any other questions on 409 2026?

CNN 409 2026 stands approved.

Ordinance number 410 2026 by council members Casey and Griffin by departmental request an emergency ordinance authorizing the purchase by one or more requirement contracts of labor and materials necessary to maintain and repair substations, including roofs, landscape loops and roofs and landscaping, and to evaluate, test, maintain, repair, and replace substation equipment, including but not limited to transformers, switch gears, circuit breakers, batteries, fiber optics, splicing, and training if necessary for the division of Cleveland Public Power for a period of two years.

Director, this has everything to do with our substations, correct?

That's correct, Chairman.

Uh including not only the foliage management, the roof repair, fence repair, all in compliance with the uh federal regulate regulations that were required to follow, but also to augment CPP's existing workforce on the testing and maintenance of the CP or the uh substation infrastructure uh by way of the switch gears, et cetera, as you as you mentioned in the um in the caption.

We do budget approximately three million dollars per year, uh, and it will go out to bid the current contract expires in August.

This is an essential ordinance for us to continue to maintain this very important infrastructure in delivering service to our customers.

So, director, the the the contract that expires in August, uh we've already awarded there's there was a six point one million dollar award on that, right?

Chairman, that's um is that what they were awarded or is that what they have spent?

That was the award amount.

I can provide what they've spent.

All right, if you could get us what they what they've spent on that.

Yes.

And my second question is is this six million dollars an approximate?

We have 33 substations, right?

So is this an approximate amount?

Because the the one before that was 7.1 million, right?

The the contract that was awarded before the the current one that we're in.

Do we spend roughly six million dollars a year upgrading substations?

Chairman, to the council member maintaining and upgrading is important point, and yes, it is a requirements contract when you when council passed our budget back in a month ago.

Um, this was in the capital line item.

So these are these are our customers' dollars that we assign to specific substation maintenance and improvement.

Um so yes, we we were heavy in the last uh round, and this is what the budget dictated for for this two-year cycle.

And this is not capital dollars coming from the administration from from the general fund, correct?

These are these are enterprise dollars.

Chairman, that's correct.

Okay.

Any questions on 410 2026?

Yes, Mr.

Chairman.

Councilman um Austin Davis had his hand.

Councilman Davis.

Thank you.

Thank you, Chair to the chair to the director and commissioners.

It I'm not sure this is answerable question.

Do we know which substations are going to receive the most work through this contract?

Chairman of the council member, we do not.

Um, I mean, it's there are so many uh facets of a substation and the maintenance of, and we are regularly in there, not only our our crews, but the vendor that we select.

Um at any time, it could be any of the 33 substations, and that's why um this is so important to augment our staff.

Right.

Through the chair, so this is more of a um like urgence urgent needs arise, and this is the contract under which those needs are addressed.

Chairman of the council member, that's correct.

That makes sense.

Uh through the chair to the director, this is something I guess I should pay attention to next budget cycle.

We we were reducing the amount of this contract from 7.1 to 6 million uh last year to this year.

Chairman to the council member, I believe the oh um it's not necessarily a reduction and and I think that was an awarded amount that the contract ended up with the current existing contract.

I think once we get the spend to date on that, it'll be maybe a better conversation.

But I my opinion was it was always around six million dollars that we allocated to substation maintenance, and I would defer to the commissioner if he has any additional details.

Excuse me, through the chair uh to the council member, that is correct.

One additional wrinkle when we look at this particular contract and the related budget and how we're planning, say into the next five years, is that we are planning substantial investments into like proactive replacements and upgrades, so we expect to spend more money there and a little less money on this.

Through the chair to the commissioner, thank you for clarifying that.

So this is more of the like I said, the urgent need contract, the long-term needs are spent elsewhere.

Through the chair, mostly, yes.

Mostly uh I I would say that like if um, for example, one of those huge transformers that's in one of the bigger substations.

I would say that like if um, for example, one of those huge transformers that's in one of the bigger substations, if that needs to be rebuilt, we're talking about maybe $300,000.

And the rebuild should still last for probably decades.

So it's it's kind of a combination.

It's not quite the same thing as getting a whole new transformer that will be budgeted through the capital process, but we still expect long-term improvements as a result of the investments through this contract as well.

That makes sense.

That's all I have.

Thank you.

Thank you, Councilman.

Councilman Polentzik.

Thank you.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman, my honorable colleagues to the director and to the commissioner.

Um who do we retain?

Who's telling us or pinpointing what needs to be repaired?

Mr.

Chairman, to whoever.

Through the chairman of the councilmember, that would be a combination of both our staff, our substation folks, and in a contract like this that we engage with to do the inspection of the substations.

Okay.

In fact, I believe it was Quasar Energy, didn't have power, I think it was for 10 days.

And right around the corner from the turbines, CPP turbines, um, on 140th Annasman Wall.

So I don't have to tell you what I heard from that company, um, Mr.

Mel uh Kurtz, who called me repeatedly, uh, plus families that had their uh food all lost that were planning um for the Easter celebration.

Easter is a big, big um big deal on the east side of the City of Cleveland in our neighborhoods.

Um, and again, people not having power, and this was on top of the fact that some people had flooded basements as well.

So it was a double whammy.

But what I what my frustration frustration level was, and that of my constituents, we know storms come, we know there's bad storms that come and power goes out.

But it was the fact that on Saturday, when I drove the neighborhood again to see no crews out there, and then to be told that people would not report to work, only added insult to injury.

So what I am gonna continue to stress at this table, um, that we've got to really pinpoint what is wrong, inherently wrong within the system, why areas continue to go out, and then and not not only go out but then stay out for a long period of time.

Um then I don't have to tell you again what residents experience trying to get through to CPP.

That was a nightmare.

So then I became the call center for CPP once again.

How did I spend my Easter Sunday?

I sat in my son's car in my daughter's driveway, because they were tired of me uh disrupting um the Easter celebration.

I sat in my son's car with my clipboard, making phone calls and taking phone calls on Easter Sunday.

In all my years in public office, I've never ever experienced that.

Um the number of calls that just kept coming in because people felt that they could not get through, or uh they were not getting any um explanation as to why the power was out and when there was going to be a reasonable response to get the power restored.

So I know the chairman has raised this issue during the budget hearings about the system, about the grid I have as well.

I appreciate the the issues that he has raised.

But I got to tell you, man, I got some people out there, and and not only myself but Councilman Conwell in East Glenville and in what we call Collinwood Village, that are just they are besides themselves with the number of times the power.

And I will tell you again, because the Commissioner, you know, 124th, I cannot understand why the power continues to go off on East 124th north of St.

Clair Avenue.

I can understand why the power continues goes off in other various sections of the community when there is not a storm.

And then again, trying to get that power restored.

So as we look at these contracts and request for legislation that's coming before us, I've got to be assured by somebody here at the table that we are going to pinpoint what is wrong with the system.

We know there's greater demand on system there before.

We look at our own homes, all the electronic electrical devices, electronic devices in our own homes.

There's more demand on the grid than ever before.

We know the grid on the east side is extremely old, and the system is extremely old.

But I got to have assurances by somebody that you guys are going to pinpoint what the heck is wrong here.

What is wrong with the system in Glenville and in Collinwood and why we continue to have these power failures?

And then again, with what to hear grandmas and moms on the phone crying how their Easter celebration is destroyed and their families cannot get together and they lost all their food that they stocked up for the Easter celebration.

Um you had to be listening to those phone calls.

Listen to them like I did, and um give you a different perspective on on how people uh thought about our city and our system over that Easter celebration weekend, which should have been a celebration, but it wasn't.

So I don't know if someone wants to respond.

But I got to have assurance.

This was not a specific incident or a specific neighborhood.

If I had an ordinance that could assure you of anything, it would have been passed a long time ago.

Okay.

Uh power the delivery of power is complicated, right?

And it is not flawless, it is not perfect.

Um what happened on that weekend, and and the commissioner was on those phone calls too, and it was unpleasant, and we apologized to every customer that we have that suffered through that, as we did.

Uh but that was a culmination of several storms, right?

As in our system, we have redundancies that are built in that we rely on heavily in the event of any storm hit pole, act of god, tree down, whatever.

Those redundancies were exhausted by the previous storms, which did not afford us an opportunity to get back in and make the necessary repairs, both above ground and underground.

So those redundancies were exhausted, which resulted in our customers having an awful weekend like we did and you did, apparently, that we've discussed.

Our apologies to those customers, the delivery of service, the reliable of delivery of service is why we exist.

We did not have enough people in the call center for that outage, nor will we ever have enough people in the call center for that outage, which is why we utilize the um front messaging and the outage map to make sure that our customers know that we're aware and doing everything possible.

We did have every available resource respond to that outage.

We did, as well as contract assistance.

So it was all hands on deck.

So I join in your frustration.

The commissioner joins in your frustration.

Every employee of Cleveland Public Power, every member of the administration and council joins in your frustration.

And if there was a fix, we would have had it.

This is a a lot of work that goes in by a lot of people and a lot of money of our customers to make these necessary improvements that have been done in the last week and a half.

I know that uh the commissioner's team has been sharing those publicly as the social media giants that they are, not me.

Um but I uh again, yes, I join in your frustration.

This will improve all of our substations, which will better serve the customers in the North Collinwood, Collinwood Village area.

But it is all of our customers that we focus on, all of our customers' reliability and our accountability to them in attending those public meetings and receiving those phone calls is why municipal electric exists, and it's our focus to make it better.

Did thank you, Mr.

Chairman, to the director.

Did employees refuse to come to work?

Director.

I there were I'm there were employees every day in every division that I'm in charge of that don't come to work for any number of reasons, which is their right.

But again, I want to say, I want to ask again, I'm gonna be very blunt.

I was told that crews would not report to work, and that was a big part of our problem, especially on Saturday.

Chairman of the council member, our all of our employees have uh afforded benefit time, which they are permitted to take advantage of.

If any of those afforded benefits are violated, we do take the necessary steps of proceeding through the discipline.

But when you say something crews refusing, those have not been brought to my attention.

Did you utilize Mr.

Chairman?

We're private contractors.

Chairman of the council member, we did.

And who were those contractors?

Council thankfully gave us the authority to go out and solicit a uh contractor, a vendor to support our regularly employed staff.

The current contract is with JF Electric.

JF Electric was deployed on Saturday to replace the hit pole at East 140 and rugby.

Okay.

So they were utilized in that.

There was some underground work at 162 and homes, to my knowledge that they worked on.

Um again, all of all of the resources that we have uh were deployed and used to the point of that the rules allowed.

Okay.

Well, Mr.

Chairman, again.

Um not a um pleasant experience for my constituents for this councilman.

Uh, would we experience again on the um holiest time of the year for Christians in our community?

And so I um I want to be assured that the legislation is coming before us to address concerns within the system are the things that need to be fixed.

Things that need to be fixed.

The system is got to be upgraded.

The chairman has said this.

I've heard this from other members of the body, including myself.

Um, I'm the only one left here that fought to keep Cleveland public power.

And I I didn't do it for my health, I did it for my community.

And I want to make sure that the system we have in place is meeting the needs of my constituents and not just mine, but all the constituents that are serviced by Cleveland Public Power across the city.

And again, I my problem is I don't really feel I have that assurance at this point uh that our that the system um is gonna be addressed in a way it needs to be addressed.

I just I'm not I'm not assured yet.

I hope to be assured at some time shortly.

Um, but I'm gonna leave it at that.

I um I'm just um very upset what happened over that period of time.

Very upset what happened.

So thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Thank you.

And I mean, I've been saying it for years.

I've been asking in reconciliation, I've been asking for capital until there is an investment and a commitment from not only the administration but council leadership as well.

Um really who needs to take the the bull by the horns on this and start pushing it forward as well.

Um as chair, I can do so much.

I know, right?

And I can only take it to those who are in charge of making the decisions.

I've done that.

I've been doing that for years.

Um so until we get a commitment from the administration and council leadership that this is gonna become a priority.

We're we're gonna we're gonna rely on Cleveland public power doing things like this that we have within our own control of with what they bring to us, and if it's six million a year, seven million a year, I don't think you'll get a council person who's gonna bat an eye who won't authorize the money to go out the door to to fix what it is you need to fix.

But this is a problem that's much bigger than this piece of legislation here, although this is a very important piece of legislation to maintaining and and making sure that our substations are working appropriately.

Thank you.

Councilwoman Gray.

I did have a question, but uh the director covered all bases with his answer, so I'm good.

All right.

Any other uh questions or comments on 410 2026?

All right, seeing none, Director 410 2026 stands approved.

Please sign up.

I believe that's all you have for us.

Thank you, Director.

Yes.

All right.

Thank you, gentlemen.

I appreciate your help.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Good morning, Chairman and committee member.

Good morning.

Ordinance number 406, 2026 by council members Casey and Griffin by departmental request and emergency ordinance authorizing the city of Cleveland to participate in the sustainable Ohio Public Energy Council electric aggregation program to serve residential and small commercial customers, and authorizing the director of finance on behalf of the Office of Sustainability to enter into one or more contracts with the Sustainable Ohio Public Energy Council to implement the electrical aggregation program for a period of up to 36 months, beginning with August 2026, meter read cycle.

Director, um this is a big this is a big contract and it's a big deal for the city of Cleveland.

So can you um first of all just explain what the aggregation is?

This is for our first energy customers and small commercial um customers.

So if you could just explain the whole aggregation process to start with, certainly.

And um, good morning, Chairman, thank you, and committee members, thanks for hearing this legislation today.

So a quick note as the chairman requested an explanation on aggregation.

In a nutshell, we have an electricity bill on your electricity bill.

There are two pieces on every electricity bill in the state of Ohio that comes from an investor owned utility, and that's important.

So this program pertains only to investor owned utilities in the state of Ohio, and our investor owned utility that is local is the illuminating company, also known as First Energy.

So if you are a first energy customer and you're looking at your electricity bill, you have a supply, so the actual power, the electricity, the electrons, and then you have the wire portion, so how those electrons get to your house.

This program helps with the cost of the power, the actual electrons.

So in Ohio, customers can shop for that part of their bill.

You can go out and shop on your own.

You can go to Apples and Apples and shop on your own, but that takes time.

There are a lot of companies with complicated teaser rates, like an intro rate where they will say you get a low, low rate for three months, and then it might hike up dramatically or become a variable rate.

They also have often these complicated contracts have auto-renew on them that you might not notice as an individual, and they have often termination fees.

So what this city program does is it helps Clevelanders get competitive pricing by bringing for that top part of your bill, just the electrons, and it brings all of a large number of resident and small business accounts into one bucket, basically.

So all of the electrons from not just Sarah's house or Mike's house, but all of our houses as first energy customers.

And in order to for us to get a better rate than an individual get on their own.

So this program is again Clevelanders who are customers of the Illuminating Company, it's residents and small businesses, as um chairman, you already expressed.

And basically, the city has selected and is recommending an aggregator after doing a competitive RFP that does the legwork on behalf of households and small businesses to get a competitive rate compared to what First Energy would have as their standard offer rate.

And in Cleveland's case, we have also committed to a program that includes renewable energy, and we have a three-year cycle.

So we're coming to you today after a three-year cycle that's going to wrap up in August with August reader meter read dates.

The actual timing of that is the end of July, is when those meter read dates start.

And this most so we will wrap up our current three-year agreement this year.

This legislation is requesting authorization for sustainable Ohio Public Energy Council or SOPEC to provide the next three-year program.

All right, so this went out for competitive bid, correct?

Correct.

How many, how many um responses to the RFP did you get?

So to the chairman, we received six competitive responses from certified aggregators.

And then did any of those have a locked-in rate when they responded to the RFP?

Uh, to the chairman, no, that is we do not have locked in rates, they're all estimated rates, which called which is known as indicative pricing.

And then with the selected vendor, we work with the department of finance to set that final rate.

All right, and then so no matter so this is an open-ended contract with indicative pricing, does not set a rate, correct?

Uh to the chairman, it does not set a rate at the moment, correct?

Right.

Today we we're passing the legislation today.

There's no rate attached to it because the indicative pricing doesn't open up until June, correct?

Yes.

Or the the bid.

I I get the I'm trying not to over talk over over talking.

Complicated it, yeah.

Yeah.

So the the competitive pricing for them to go out to purchase their power to then provide it to our customers does not open up till June, but we need to pass this now so that we don't get a lap, a lack in a lapse in service for July and August, which has happened in the past.

Yes.

So we want to pass this now, even though we don't have the pricing attached to it because we won't know the pricing until that opens up in June, correct?

That is correct to the chair.

So the what's called the price to compare, if someone were to go on to Apples and Apples, they could see that.

The price to compare, we know right now goes through May 31st, 2026.

And we don't know, that's why we don't have a locked-in price.

We don't know what the price is to compare to.

So that's first energy's price, right?

Right now we know in April and May what the price is, but we want to lock in and watch pricing now and then lock in in when it makes sense.

We have to lock it in before June 8th.

And what is the current rate?

Uh the current rate for price to compare is 9.88 cents per kilowatt hour.

That's the again, those electron part of your bill.

Right.

And then there's also there has to be an administrative fee to this contract, correct?

Yes, correct.

This uh the administrative fee of any aggregator contract is what they use for their operational cost to run their business or their organization, I should say.

And for the city of Cleveland, this is paid for by the customers.

This is not a charge to the city of Cleveland, correct?

That is correct.

This is not paid.

Right.

So what is their administrative fee?

So for to the chair, for the this proposal, SOPEC, theirs is two tenths of one cent per kilowatt hour.

That's that is charged to that so they're charging currently 0.0982 per 988 or whatever it was percent, right?

Oh, sorry, SOPEC is 9.236.

Okay.

And first energies is 9.88.

All right.

So we're charging our customers are paying 9.2 of that 9.2, SOPEC is taking 0.02 as an administrative fee, correct?

0.2, correct.

I know we're talking in decimals.

Right, yeah.

Without writing, I had to write it down.

Right.

So they're taking 0.2.

Correct.

Right, which accumulates to about how much a year.

Do we know how many kilowatt hours SOPEC was able to, yeah, was able to aggregate last year?

Yes, to the chair.

So this is historical information.

So we have an aggregation amount, so getting all that in one bucket is about 390 million kilowatt hours.

It's a big number.

That is, but that equates into that 0.2 cents.

Right.

So that's 10 two tenths of a cent.

Uh equates to 780,000 dollars annually for the value of a contract.

Okay, so the value of this contract is roughly, right?

Because we don't uh 780,000 dollars is what our residents of what our residents who are customers of first energy pay SOPEC to provide the service.

Yes, roughly, and by comparison for the past couple of years, the same organization, SOPEC has been able to save uh residents 20 nearly 21 million dollars.

Okay, so with that statement, right?

The savings of over 20 million dollars, how do you come up with with that amount?

How do you come up with how did you so how would they say we saved you 20 million compared to what?

Thank you for that question.

And to clarify, it's compared to what the individuals would have paid if they had stayed on the standard rate offered by first energy.

So if they had said the way this works, and I did not mention this if I can go into a little more detail, Chairman.

What happens is the city in collaboration with council works with an aggregator, they send letters to eligible customers that says, hey, we have this program, it's a city of Cleveland and City Council program, and we've done the work for you.

Here's the price.

If you want to go out and shop on your own, you could still do that.

There is no fee from SOPEC or the city for you to do that.

There are no penalties, you do not have to join this program, but so people can do that if they want.

And what we are always comparing things to is the price to compare from first energy's standard offer.

And then um every first energy customer is automatically enrolled into the SOPEC program.

So to the chair, every eligible, and I'll talk about eligibility in a second, first energy customer below a certain amount that qualifies for small businesses or residence, right?

Right.

And so that if someone is in a already in a payment plan, for example, it's called PIP, they would not receive this letter because they already have a program that they're a part of.

Right.

Um, but yes, that's correct.

But yeah, but uh but that's the eligible part.

Unless you're enrolled in in a financial um assistance program, you're automatically as a Cleveland resident in First Energy, you're automatically enrolled into SOPAC.

And then SOPAC actually has three different layers that people could choose from, correct?

Yes.

Where you can opt out of one, two, or three.

I think there's a default one, the default.

Which is what we yes, right.

And but then there's an energy one, and then there's a I think is a brown one.

Yes, that's what we do.

So yes, and that's our current program, and we can do that again for this program.

So our current program is to talk uh about that, and you can go on the website and find this information, is that we have for the default rate, that's what you would automatically get enrolled into, and that is a hundred percent renewable energy rate.

And then if you want to opt into a different rate, a lower rate, you can do 100% brown power, it's called, so that would be without the green energy attached, and then there's an in-between rate.

Right.

So any customer who receives their their letter, right?

They have they're automatically enrolled into which one?

The the top one, the green rate.

Right, which is the most expensive one.

It is slightly more expensive.

I can get the comparison for you afterwards.

So they're automatically enrolled into that one once they get their letter.

Have the letters gone out yet?

No, um, to the councilman, our program letters would go out in June, assuming that uh with the authority here.

Right.

So everybody's enrolled in the top one, but you have the option of calling SOPEC or contacting SOPEC and saying, hey, wait a minute, I'm gonna stay with SOPEC, but I want to go to the second tier or the third tier, and the the the lower you go down the spectrum, the less expensive it is, correct?

Yes, very slightly tenths of a sense, but yes, I'm sorry, you are correct.

Make a big deal to some people now, right?

Because it's price of electricity is is very very expensive.

Um I think we've covered everything.

I do want to mention that there is a reason that this piece of legislation is in utilities, okay.

And I have all the confidence in the world in the director of utilities.

Um, and not that I don't in the director of finance, but I think there's gonna be an amendment to make sure that this stays through the Department of Public Utilities as well as the Department of Finance to make sure that it comes back to this committee so that we can keep an eye on an over it's just another set of eyes on everything that that the council feels comfortable with as opposed to this piece coming back up and it going straight to finance.

Do you know what I'm saying?

So um at this point I'm gonna open it up to questions on 406 2026, Councilwoman Gray.

Thank you, Chair.

Just have a question um from what um the chair asked pertaining to the uh three different tiers.

Yes.

If someone decide to drop to the second or the third tier.

Are there other um qualifications or means to that second and third tier to say um is uh are those fixed breaks or uh and or are the benefits less than the first tier?

Oh, thank you for that question through the chairman.

The benefits stay the same other than a slight cost savings, and I can get those exact numbers for you for our current program, so you we can tell you what that exact savings are.

What I will say is that that offer has been in place for the past three years, and out of uh 50 to 55,000 accounts, we've had 20 accounts take advantage of those different prices.

But it's important that we have the options to have them there.

But other benefits stay the same.

So there's a fixed price no matter what it is for a certain amount of time.

And the goal of this program is to keep a fixed steady rate uh at least for a year.

Or it would not change more than once a year, is how I would put it by comparison.

So we're always comparing to our standard offer rate from illuminating company.

The illuminating company in 2024 and 2025 had the customers of eliminating company would see their price change six times a year, and that has to do with riders on electricity bills, and I can send that information as a follow-up.

But our program is a price that changes only once a year.

Okay.

All right, good answer to that.

Uh, Cause a lot of residents, which and I would on the first energy, uh, have those questions on quite a bit.

Yeah.

So due to that, um, since this is year-to-year uh um, if they go to apples and apples, would that be a fix or flex rate if they decide to not deal with the frozen second tier of uh SOPAC.

Uh thank you for that question.

Yeah, director.

Uh through the chair um to the councilwoman.

Thank you for that question.

Apples to apples.

When uh these letters go out in June, a person getting that letter can look at the rate, and then they can go to apples to apples and shop.

What I would say is that often if you're shopping on your own, we wouldn't have the city wouldn't have the information on each contract in apples to apples.

It would be up to that individual to look at those contracts.

And there are quite a few, and you would have to really read all the details to not get caught in something that I mentioned before, which is a teaser rate where they say, Hey, sign up, we have a low, low rate.

But it's like, and then the fine print it says for three months, and then it shoots up double or triple, and then you get caught in an auto-renew cycle, and if you terminate you have to pay a fee.

So that could happen in apples to apples.

Not every contract would be that way, but that's the point of this program is to offer a steady rate.

It doesn't change once more than once a year, and it saves that worry.

It gives budget certainty to households, and they don't have to go do that work.

Okay, all right.

Absolutely can if they want.

Yes, absolutely.

There's no okay, thank you.

Thank you.

And I can't begin to tell you how many phone calls I've received from Cleveland residents who go to shop to compare to compare, and then we I get the call saying, How do I get out of this?

I'm like, well, you shouldn't have gotten into it to begin with.

We've done all the homework up front.

Um we know that the price here will stick, right?

Um, and you don't know what you're getting into when you start, unless you're reading fine print and you're an attorney and probably an electric or an aggregating attorney, you're not gonna realize what you're getting yourself into.

Uh and I've had call I I've had my own residents, you know, go to apples to apples, and then they're calling me nine months later going, I don't understand what why this is so expensive, right?

And like, well, this is this is what happened.

Um, Councilman Palency.

Are you done?

Yes, I councilman Pollenza.

Thank you.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman, and to the director.

And I know there is it it can be confusing.

I know I experienced my own difficulties where I was not on the with the aggregator.

And I want to thank the director for the assistance that she provided.

So my question is this bit just based on that.

Do we know how many people who are out there?

Do we have an estimation of how many people within the city of Cleveland that are on first energy who are not a part of this?

Do we have any idea?

Director?

Through the chair, yes, we do, and I can provide that as a follow-up information.

Okay.

Um we are working steadily with our current vendor, and that is SOPEC, to look into that and how we can, especially in addressing energy burden, it's it becomes a really important conversation.

Right.

Um as you said, councilman, we uh through the chair, we we have had some interactions on how did I not get on this program?

Yeah.

And so those that that does happen for a couple of reasons.

You automatically get enrolled unless you're on a payment plan, or unless you might have gone in the past to apples to apples and done your own shopping and they caught you in an auto-renew and you didn't know it.

You would not get a letter if you already have a contract.

Okay.

If you signed up for a do not aggregate list, and you can absolutely do that, you would not get a letter.

So we do investigate those, and I'm happy to follow up with you on what that was.

No, I I I you know, I I just couldn't figure out how I got on on these screwy plans, and my electrical costs were so much higher than being on SOPAC, as I saw when the change took place finally when I was able to get back or get onto SOPEC.

So I'm just wondering how again that's why how many folks out there are just confused with this whole process uh because let's face it, we have large percentages in our neighborhoods that are not on a laptop, they're not on a smartphone.

Um they're getting stuff in the mail, and it's confusing as they they want to save on our electric bill, which I don't blame them.

I looked at my electric bills this um past summer and into the winter, I was like, hey, yeah, yay.

Um, and I was very glad to be on SOPEC once the change took place because I saw a dramatic drop in my bill.

Um I can't believe what some of these other providers um what's the best way to describe these other companies?

What are they?

They're not aggregators.

What do you refer to them?

So through uh through the chair to the councilman, the uh the official term is mark energy marketers.

Um they're governed by the PUCO, they are certified by the public utilities commission of Ohio.

They have to be in order to offer a program, but their programs are complicated.

Man, they ought to be wearing masks, let me tell you that because uh uh what we'll have some of these the rates that they're charging some of our constituents who are confused.

So I'm I keep asking myself what can we do better to educate our citizens?

We have channel 20.

Um is there a way we can put uh develop a brochure that we could pass out in our neighborhood meetings?

Is there something that you could provide to us or draw up for us that we could put in our newsletters to better educate our folks as it pertains to this, um you know stick with the what the cities recommended?

This is how you do it if you're not on on the SOPEC plan.

I I would just make that request through the chair.

I think anything we can do to better educate our citizens, because I I will tell you a lot of people are having rough times paying their utility bills today in the city.

Yeah, I get more calls today than I ever have.

Um gas bills, electric bills, water, sewer, and when you start adding up all these bills and people who are on fixed income or working poor, it really is a hit.

So anything we can do to better educate our public, anything you would suggest that we do within a body, uh, or if you want to draw up an article that we get a boilerplate article that we could put in all our newsletters, I think that's the route to go.

Okay, through the chair, I'm happy to do that.

We have a uh support team here locally who can help us with that.

Okay, and director, we'll work together too.

We'll put something out on behalf of uh Office of Sustainability, Department of Public Utilities, and uh Cleveland City Council.

Great.

Um we'll put we'll get a message.

But my my when people call me, I'm like, you don't have to do anything.

We already did the work for you, right?

You're opted into the program.

Right.

If you want to change your the service that you get, which I do every year, you know, um that's fine within SOPEC, but you're gonna which is one of the reasons that I don't allow door-to-door in my in my in my neighborhood, because 90 percent of them are are energy related, getting me.

I need to see your bill.

I uh we don't I don't know, I don't I don't sign off on those.

But there are companies who don't pay attention that you go out in a neighborhood.

You're absolutely correct, and that's where you get that's where you get it, right?

Um so uh my message today would be don't do if you're a first energy customer, you don't have to do anything, it's already done for you.

Right, it's a service that the city of Cleveland provides.

Um it's the over the long haul, it's going to be the best um your best pricing over over the long haul because it's not going to fluctuate.

Anybody else have any questions?

So my question is um director, is the price of electricity is very unstable today.

Yes, right.

I know that this um contract, they can only fluctuate one time uh in the in the one year, correct?

Uh to the chair, that is our plan.

This is a three-year contract, and we do not want it to fluctuate more than once a year, correct?

Right.

So in in the contract that they'll be signing with the city, it will state that you only you you can only fluctuate one time every 12 months.

Yes.

Okay.

So what happens if the price of electricity, I mean, come word of war, right?

So we don't know what's gonna happen.

Completely goes off the grid, and we'll say, and these are we're just using these numbers.

We'll just say it's five dollars now, right?

What in three, you know, four, five, seven, eight months down the road, it's all of a sudden twenty-five dollars, right?

Increases by five by five times that aggregation cannot fluctuate up and down, correct?

So to the to the chair, correct.

So in that situation, we're actually a little bit in that situation right now.

Um we have a locked-in price in our current program through the end of this July.

Right.

What is the current what are we currently?

9.236.

And now we're going up to 9.8.

Nope, not yet.

Um, that's what you they're estimating.

That's so the first energy price is 9.8.

Okay.

So it has already gone up past what we have currently.

Right so we know that that's the situation.

And and just to explain to the people to people, that means that if you do not have an aggregator, and first energy is your aggregator, basically, you're buying electricity directly from first energy.

Yes.

You're paying 0.98.

Correct.

Okay.

But with SOPEC, because we've done this, they're paying 0.92.

Correct.

Okay.

I just I'm just letting people make it as simple as possible.

Thank you.

And that's per kilowatt.

That's per kilowatt.

So that adds up.6 adds up.

Go ahead.

Yes.

So in the case that you described, we would have a price that would lock that would be the same because we've already had that price.

I transparently we are the energy prices have gone up in the past couple of years, as we all know.

Last year there was a a letter from uh first energy, I believe, and also our own aggregator to explain capacity markets, and that is a very detailed thing that I won't explain here, but happy to provide more um information on that later.

But that's something that cannot be controlled by any aggregator.

And so that went up in the past.

That could happen again, but that fixed price in your scenario that you described, if something today we have a price locked in until the end of the year at five dollars, first energy's price or whomever's goes up to ten dollars.

We still have that locked in price.

Okay.

So what happens then if just the opposite happens?

Right?

We're at five dollars now, but some somebody figures something out, right?

And it drops to 40 cents.

You know what I'm saying?

So we know we're not gonna increase if it goes up, but what happens if it actually drops?

So what happens if first energy will say starts providing electricity at at 0.4, 0.4.

You know what I'm saying?

What what happens in that situation then?

So to the chairman, we have the opportunity with SOPAC and their energy team to watch the market and ensure that the next round of pricing is more competitive, right?

So they're so that's what we would do.

And but we can only do that one time a year.

Yes, right.

So if it if we do one price.

It's like playing in the stock market, except only playing at one time a year.

Yeah, the hedging electricity, I think that's a good comparison.

Okay.

Does any other council members have any other questions regarding aggregation and so pack?

First energy is not gonna reduce its rates.

They need that for bribe money.

I'm the one guy that you don't have to tell that to.

But we do have, I believe we have two amendments uh to the to the legislature to the legislation.

Um Mr.

Chair, I'd like to propose an amendment to section two where it says for a period of up to 36 months.

Um I would propose that that be changed to uh one year with a two option to renew with legislative authority.

All right, still gives you the three years.

All right, we have we have a uh an amendment and a second.

Do we have discussion?

All in favor?

Aye, all right.

So it'll be it's still you still have 36 months, it's just it's just comes back here, so you can give us an update once a year.

And I I think we want to that part of that reason is because of the the fluctuation, right?

I think the council just wants to be updated and making sure that we are where we need to be.

All right, and then the uh I think Councilman Davis has uh an amendment as well.

I do, Mr.

Chairman.

I uh move to amend in section two before the board director of finance add the director of public utilities and you have that, Mr.

Lawyer All right.

We have an amendment to add um the director of public utilities and uh do we have a second?

I'll second.

We have uh an amendment and a second.

Do we have any discussion?

All right, um do you have it?

Yes, through the chair, and we're adding the director of utilities just to section two, not to any of the other sections.

Well, no, um does it need to be added to the other sections?

Yes.

All right, so we want to Yeah, let me amend my amendment in every instance we're the director of finance is used.

Let's add director of public utilities and okay my apologies.

No, no, thank you.

Just clarifying.

Thank you.

Do you have that?

Yep.

You good with that?

Yes.

And could I ask a clarifying question on the first amendment?

Let's do this one first.

Sure.

Um we have an uh an amendment and a second.

Any discussion?

All in favor, say aye.

Aye.

All right.

Uh the amendment passes.

Uh yes.

What was the wording on the on the first amendment?

Um for one year with two year options to renew with legislative authority.

Could we do up to one year?

Up to one year.

For up to one year.

Yes.

In case you want to get out early.

For up to one year.

Okay.

Yeah.

I mean, I'm I'm I I can't I can't make that amendment.

It was it to the through the chair to the councilwoman.

Could we do up to the other thing?

So okay, go ahead.

Um through the chair, um uh change the amendment in section two for up to one year with the two year option to renew with legislative authority.

With two one year options to with two one year options to renew.

Two up to up to yes, yeah.

Yeah.

So it would be the same language carrying through two with two up to one year with two one year.

Two up to one year options to renew with legislative authority.

Yes.

Mr.

Attorney, does that make sense?

Yes.

Okay, do so we have a new amendment to the amendment.

Do we have a second?

We have a first and a second, we have discussion.

So through through the chair, I apologize.

So there's also a period of up to 36 months, uh last line of section two.

We would that also need amend amending.

Yeah, yeah.

Um through the chair, can we scratch that?

Yes.

So uh just to be clear to the attorney.

What's happening here is up to one year, right?

If nothing happens in that one year, the administration has to come back to us to renew once a year if they don't get out of it because things have changed or whatever.

But this still gives this still states that every year this piece of legislation is going to come back before the council for legislative authority to continue on, correct?

Uh that is correct.

I was pointing out that the period applies twice in section two.

So we'll just make sure.

Yeah, so I I right.

We'll just make sure everything matches.

But I believe that the the intent is that this piece of legislation comes back for an update after the initial period that yes, we'll it will come back and the options to renew have to come back.

Yes, will be with additional.

Right.

So I I yeah, I what we want is we want to make sure that this SOPEC and the aggregation comes back before council once a year.

Understood.

Right.

Just for updates or whatever.

We now we understand that you don't have to go out for RFP for two and a half years or whatever it is, right?

Thank you.

Right.

You don't have to do that unless you're getting out of it somehow with because we find something better or whatever, but we just want to make sure that before they renew, you've got to come back to council.

Okay.

All right.

Any other questions on 406 2026?

All right, seeing none 406 2026 as amended stands approved.

That concludes this uh utilities committee.

Want to let the committee know we have two more meetings before summer recess.

Um Brooke, the dates.

April 30th, May May 40th.

April 30th and May 14th.

16th, 14th?

May 14th.

Yeah, yeah.

Uh the invites have have been set out.

Um at the April 30th committee meeting, we'll be hearing the uh update on digital C.

So along with along with uh with legislation.

Um hearing hearing no other questions, this utilities committee stands up stands adjourned until the call of the chair.

Directory,