When we'll go ahead and call this hearing to order first.

Wow, that was loud.

Happy Earth Month, everyone, and also happy tax day.

Hopefully, there are no folks who need to run home and get their taxes done.

That was my Sunday plan.

So it worked out.

I want to thank you all for joining us for our second public utilities and sustainability committee hearing this year.

Today we're going to cover the need for an advisory body to consult on policy initiatives moving through council from a health and sustainability lens.

We'll also talk about the issue of surveillance data pricing and an update from the Columbus Green Fund, followed by a presentation from the Department of Public Services Refuse Division on the City's Recycling Contract RFP.

Before we begin with the presentations, let me see if my vice chair has some opening remarks.

We can just sit and chat with the folks while you uh pull your stuff together.

All right, we'll give you a chance to give some closing remarks instead.

To kick things off, we're gonna start the discussion around the need for environment environmental advisory body and why it's a priority for this committee.

Since joining council, I've seen many pieces of legislation moving through the process that at face value, they do not have an obvious sustainability component.

However, sustainability encompasses so much more than just clean water, clean air, and climate resilience.

It's most importantly how we best serve our people.

And in order to best serve Columbus residents now and into the future, sustainability should be considered in everything we do here at council.

We should be reviewing all of our policies to ensure that they are written in a way that mitigates environmental impact, preserves our finite resources, and prepares our city for a future where our climate will look very different from today.

When I work on policy, that is the perspective I come from and often find myself reaching out to experts for input.

But is this the best approach?

Across the country and Ohio, cities have established committees whose focus is to provide guidance, policy recommendations, and research to city leaders on issues such as sustainability, climate change, and pollution control.

While researching how to while researching to determine how best to establish a similar committee in Columbus, uh I was surprised to find that there is currently an environmental science advisory committee already in City Code.

The committee was established in or the ordinance was signed in uh 1993 for the purpose of issuing independent technical advice to city officials on the scientific basis underlying current and proposed federal and or state environmental regulations and the appropriateness of current regulations giving local environmental situations.

Think the Derby or the public and private tree code.

These are things that this committee could have been used for to kind of help guide policy decisions there.

However, there are no records to determine if this committee was ever even appointed or if they've ever met.

That is why I've invited some experts I've worked with on past policies to speak to the need to reinvigorate and possibly revise this committee.

Um call up our first speaker, the Central Ohio Regional Director for the Ohio Environmental Council, Annalisa Rocca.

Anna Lisa, thank you for being here.

Yeah, good afternoon.

Um Chair Weiss and members of the Public Utility and Sustainability Committee.

My name is Annalise Raka, and I am the Central Ohio Regional Director at the Ohio Environmental Council Action Fund.

Thank you for the opportunity to testify today.

We work for a clean, healthy Ohio where our democracy empowers communities to thrive in harmony with the environment.

I am here today in support of reactivating and updating the environmental science advisory committee as currently outlined in chapter 143 of the Columbus City Code.

Columbus is at a pivotal moment.

This city is growing quickly, and with that growth comes policy decisions that will shape the region's environmental and economic future for decades.

These include land use and zoning decisions, conservation priorities, and broader efforts to implement the city's climate action plan.

These decisions impact water, air, energy, biodiversity, and health with long-term effects.

Good policy lowers cost, builds resilience, and improves quality of life.

Expert informed decisions maximize these benefits.

And an environmental science advisory committee brings this expertise to city decisions.

A well-functioning advisory body provides key benefits.

First, it provides technical expertise.

Staff and officials address so many issues at one time.

An advisory body creates a forum of experts who will give consistent informed input across policy areas over time.

Second, it offers early guidance.

Too often environmental concerns come in late to the game.

An advisory committee highlights risks, trade-offs, and opportunities early, leading to better results in policy.

Third, it helps evaluate co-benefits and systems thinking.

Environmental decisions are rarely isolated.

For example, protecting riparian corridors and restoring restoring stream habitat, improve water quality, reduce flooding, support biodiversity, and create cooler, more livable neighborhoods.

Expanding tree canopy, improves air quality, reduces heat island effects, and supports pollinators.

There are the types of these are the types of interconnected benefits that a dedicated advisory body can consistently bring into policy conversations.

To be effective, the committee must be updated to reflect best practices and city needs.

I encourage council to look at peer cities like Cincinnati's environmental advisory board is a strong relevant model.

Their clear mission support the city's sustainability plan, recommend policies, track progress, and report outcomes.

Columbus should consider a few key elements from that model.

First, alignment with the climate action plan.

Columbus has adopted an ambitious climate action plan.

This committee should follow that plan.

It can help turn high-level goals into action, evaluate progress, and hold stakeholders accountable.

Without this structure, tracking and momentum can lag.

Second, formal integration with the city's health department and sustainable Columbus.

Environmental and sustainability issues cut across nearly every department.

It is critical that this committee can be connected to the work of Sustainable Columbus and the Department of Health.

Public health and environmental outcomes are deeply intertwined, from air quality to extreme heat to water quality.

Ensuring both entities are engaged will strengthen the relevance and impact of the committee's work.

Third, clear expectations for reporting and community engagement.

A modern advisory body should not work alone.

Regular reports to council and the public ensure transparency and relevance.

The committee should expand and improve public engagement on technical council issues.

By translating these complex policies, hosting discussions, and raising community input, the community the committee will involve residents more.

Cincinnati's annual reporting model is a best practice to follow.

Fourth, a diverse and qualified membership.

The effectiveness of this committee will ultimately depend on who is at the table.

Membership should reflect a range of expertise, including environmental science, planning, public health, and community-based perspectives.

It should also reflect Columbus's diversity, ensuring that the benefits of environmental policies are equitably distributed.

Toledo provides a strong example of how structuring this intentionally by specific representation from different professional backgrounds and stakeholders, such as legal, engineering, industry, and the public to ensure well-rounded and informed decision making.

In particular, it is important the committee has residents from the city's opportune neighborhoods where inequities are often pronounced.

Taking a similar approach in Columbus would help ensure that this committee is not only diverse, but also equipped with the technical and lived experience needed to meaningfully inform policy.

As Columbus grows, today's choices will shape water, neighborhoods, ecosystems, and residents' quality of life.

A strong environmental science advisory committee will ensure those choices are informed and science-based.

In closing, I urge council not only to reactivate this committee, but also to update it to reflect the current needs and best practices.

Done well, this body can become a valuable partner in shaping policy, supporting implementation, and helping Columbus continue to lead on sustainability and resilience.

Thank you for your time, and I'm happy to take any questions.

Annalisa, thank you for being here.

And again, thank you for your advocacy.

One question I did want to have ask you, and if you're unfamiliar with it, you can just let us know.

We've toiled with this idea of Does this body need to have residents who are only in the city of Columbus, or is this one in which, because we are at the center of a very large region, we are taking in experts where we can find them.

And I'm curious if you know if Cincinnati has a residence requirement or even Toledo.

Yeah, um, I do know that Cincinnati has resident requirements, but I'm not sure if they're required to be in the city or if they do have some residents from just outside.

I think that's a really good question and a really good thing to think through.

You know, what we what we do in Columbus does affect the suburbs and um the townships around us.

So I will go back and I'll talk to my colleagues in Cincinnati, see what their experiences are, um, and we'll be happy to connect back with you.

I appreciate that.

Councilman Rumi, did you have any questions?

Sure.

Um, just thinking about deliverables, like in the first year, I mean, what are the some of the things that you know we we should expect out of a committee like this or a commission like this, like an annual report, policy recommendations, dashboard, uh, public forums, that those types of things.

Yeah, I think all of that.

Um, and I think there's a lot of opportunity for this committee to shape what that would look like in the first couple of months of bringing people on.

Um, I know I personally wouldn't want to set out that these are the priorities for a group of people when I'm not even sure what the makeup would be.

Um, because I think the makeup will inform a lot of some of those priorities.

Um, but I see it doing exactly all of those things.

Um, you know, hosting forums, an additional way to engage residents.

Um, and I think it could be a great place to, you know, analyze policy, give report outs, um, and I think that can come from a variety of different ways.

Do you know um so where does it sit down in Cincinnati, for instance, because they've always been a great model as it comes to the environmental issues, but is it under a particular department?

Um that's a great question.

I know it is linked to their um Department of Sustainability down there, so I believe it sits with them, um, similar to how ENCODE this sits within the Department of Health.

Um, that was definitely a suggestion I received from my colleagues in Cincinnati that it made it a much stronger um board when they had um the sustainability team in the room with them, um helping them make decisions, um, and just continuing to be a voice so that there's a really cohesive sustainability move, all government sustainability movement.

And should something like this remain like purely advisory, or should it have some formal role and like project review, grant review, you know, budget recommendations, that sort of thing?

Yeah, I think um I think that's a great idea to expand it past just being purely advisory.

Um I think a lot would come down to the the amount of time that you want the committee to spending on this.

You know, that to me is um a lot of different great opportunities would very quickly take a lot of time from from folks.

Um, and so I think having a really clear direction on what the lane of this group is will be important.

Um, but I do think that there are a lot of opportunities outside of strictly advising on policy that's coming up.

Thank you.

Thank you for your testimony as well.

Annalisa, thank you for being here and for your advocacy.

Uh next we have Craig Toothman, the executive director of the Franklin County Pollinator Pathways.

Craig was instrumental in helping me craft the pollinator garden ordinance last year.

Uh and Craig, your timing is perfect.

We were just having discussion around mowing.

And is fall the right time to mow pollinator gardens, or should you wait till spring or not mow at all?

So appreciate you being here.

Chairman Weich, I'm glad to be here.

Uh I'm Craig Toothman.

I'm a retired Columbus resident from District 3.

I'm the Xerce Society for Conservation of Invertebrates, Ambassador for Central Ohio, and the founder of Franklin County Pollinator Pathway, a local conservation group whose mission it is to create connected corridors of native plant habitat for pollinators throughout Franklin County.

In short, I think this is a great idea.

There's an old phrase, think globally, act locally.

It's usually attributed to a Scottish biologist, Patrick Geddes from a 1915 book he wrote.

He believed in working with the environment, advocating for careful analysis and planning that considers the wider environment while addressing specific local needs.

Along that line of thinking, Columbus recently renewed its commitment to achieving our community climate goals by updating the climate action plan for 2025, seeking to reduce greenhouse gas emissions by 45% by 2030, and reaching carbon neutrality by 2050.

But questions arise.

How do you actually achieve those goals?

For example, what exactly is a sustainable neighborhood?

As legislatures, how can you develop effective policies for our city?

For example, you may be quite familiar and concerned with the urban heat island effect, where cities experience significantly higher air and surface temperatures compared to surrounding rural areas.

But what about sea level rise?

Why would that be of any significant concern to the city of Columbus?

Sea level rise is going to make many coastal areas less attractive and in some cases uninhabitable.

By 2050, climate change is projected to drive significant internal migration in the United States, with millions of people moving away from coastal and southern regions due to extreme heat, sea level rise and wildfires.

The northern midwest and Great Plains are expected to become primary destinations for these people.

Experience economic and population growth as residents relocate.

The so-called rust belt cities are likely to experience a renaissance as they become considered to be safe havens for these climate migrants.

If the Morpsey population estimates for 2050 are approximately 3 million, what if that actually turns out to be 4 million?

Sea level rise matters to the Columbus community.

As another example, how can you possibly, as legislators, be expected to keep up with relevant current events, such as a couple days ago on April 12th, when the Toyota Motor Corporation decided to team up with Daimler Truck and Volvo Group, an eventure focused on hydrogen fuel cells for heavy-duty trucks and industrial vehicles?

When most people think of the future of clean vehicles, we think of batteries, and that's partly true, especially for cars.

Heavy duty trucking is a totally different story.

Long haul freight brings different challenges.

Hydrogen fuel cells offer tremendous advantages.

The question becomes where are they going to refuel?

And where and how is that fuel going to get there?

Hydrogen pipelines are going to be essential for transporting this hydrogen, connecting production hubs to industrial users.

As a major national transportation hub, how does all this impact Columbus?

How about something more peaceful?

How about bird watching?

The National Audubon Society's national alignment, what they call their flight plan 2023-28, is a national strategy of reversing bird population declines.

The plan emphasizes habitat restoration, bird-friendly communities, and addressing the climate-related threats to migratory birds, with a 2028 goal of creating, quote, a better world for birds.

Positioned within a major bird migratory corridor, Ohio and specifically Columbus will be impacted by these impacts, by these efforts, rather.

Again, from a Columbus perspective, so what?

A November 2024 report from U.S.

Fish and Wildlife reflects some amazing numbers.

There are estimated 96 million birders in the United States who spent more than 107 billion dollars in 2022.

They purchased binoculars, feeders, cameras, went on hobby-related trips, and covered other costs, both large and small, housing, food, everything you can imagine, plant subscriptions, purchases, field guides, even campers.

They contributed 1.4 million jobs and generated billions to local, state, and federal tax revenues.

So how does this impact our city from a quality of life perspective to an economic perspective, all the way down to bird watchers?

There's a lot for legislatures in the city council to know, and they can't possibly keep up with everything that is valuable to know without an advisory board that hopefully is trying hard to keep up with at least some of these things.

I think Columbus has, as a lifelong resident, has historically struggled to establish a wide ranging definition of itself.

When people think of other cities like Boston, Atlanta, or Chicago, they often have a picture in their mind.

I think with good decisions and thoughtful planning, Columbus has a tremendous opportunity to define itself.

It's not too big, it's not too small.

How's outstanding educational resources, an educated workforce, and a desirable cultural ethos?

And it has a great football team.

The policies that you develop over the next decade will shape our future, determine the success of our families right here in Central Ohio.

I believe that you need an environmental science advisory committee to do just that.

Thank you.

Well, Craig, appreciate you coming down.

And your point around hydrogen fuel cells is real.

I think we went to a uh presentation at OSU that Morpsey had organized, and that was one of the conversations as it related to the zoning necessary to even make that work, right?

And this is an industry person stating what they felt like was the appropriate way to kind of handle this.

Um, but I'm not a hydrogen expert, right?

And who on council or in our legislative research office is.

And I think it's important to kind of have that slate of experts who can kind of review technical analysis to make help us make informed decisions on where we're going to do.

So I appreciate you mentioning that and being here.

I would share with you a comment from what I read in Chapter 143 about the purpose of this committee to be an independent science-based uh advisory group without speaking disparagingly against anyone.

Uh if you have uh advice coming from a corporation, they have a fiduciary responsibility to their shareholders.

Uh it's a different kind of advice.

It's sound, it's proper, but it has a different purpose.

And I think for your legislative efforts here in council, uh, having that independent science-based advice would be extremely valuable.

Any questions?

Sure.

Um, thank you for coming down today.

Um if this committee were functioning well, what what would you want them to do differently as it releases like the tree canopy, habitat, biodiversity, and then pollinator gardens for that matter, supportive policy?

Um, I'm just a lay citizen.

I'm not a professional environmentalist.

Sure.

Um I will say that when I recently uh put together Franklin County Pollinator Pathway, three words seem to keep popping up.

They all began with the letter C: uh communication, cooperation, and collaboration.

There are uh very fortunately a large number of conservation-oriented organizations here in Central Ohio.

They're all doing wonderful things, but there was a perception that there's a limited amount of cooperation and communication between them.

Um, I would view the same kind of scenarios with an advisory committee like this.

There's lots of information out there.

For example, the state climatologist of Ohio is right here at Ohio State.

But is City Council aware of the U.S.

drought monitor or state climatologist information?

I mean, all these things.

Uh I just think that there's a lot to be aware of before you can distill that down and create good policy.

Yeah.

Yeah, thank you.

You're most welcome.

Thank you so much.

Thank you again for being here and for your advocacy.

Uh and our last speaker on the topic is Joe Flarida, the executive director of Power Clean Future Ohio.

Joe, thank you for being here.

Appreciate your advocacy on the issue.

Yeah, thank you, Chairman Walsh and members of the committee.

Um, thank you the opportunity to speak on this important topic.

My name is Joe Flirda, and I'm the executive director of Power Clean Future Ohio.

PCFO is a nonprofit organization that supports local governments who are taking action on climate and clean energy.

We have 54 uh member municipalities all across the state.

As such, we have been able to see firsthand what works well in cities across Ohio.

One tool that cities can rely on to bolster their sustainability work is establishing an advisory council, commission, and committee.

One that was mentioned earlier was Toledo's Environmental Protection and Climate Resilience Commission.

I work directly with the City Council in forming that uh specific commission, along with the several others uh in the state that have either revamped and relaunched or been formed anew.

Meaningful ongoing engagement with community members, stakeholders, and energy and environmental technical experts is a necessary component of pushing forward initiatives, programs, and policies that benefit both the residents of Columbus and their environment.

Codified advisory bodies and independent community organizations are complete are complementary components of a healthy local climate ecosystem.

Strong communities often have both.

Establish advisory structures uplift local expertise and lessen the strain on municipal resources and grassroots community organizations that uplift the needs of residents.

The City of Columbus has already, as been mentioned, codified the Environmental Science Advisory Committee outlined in Chapter 143 of Columbus City Code.

As I understand, here is where things currently stand.

The committee is not currently meeting and not currently a functioning entity.

To be clear, this is not an unusual occurrence within city governments or any level of government for that matter, and does not indicate a problem per se.

The committee's original purpose, as outlined in the in the city code, needs to be updated to ensure the committee is providing valuable input to city leadership.

I will outline my suggestions to change for changes under key topics that PCFO recommends as critical to an advisory committee's success.

First, people, who makes up the committee and how are they appointed?

Second, focus.

What is the defined scope of work for the committee and how is its purview aligned with long-term city plans, programs, and objectives?

Capacity, which I think is a critical one.

Who will manage the committee within the city, and what is the reasonable expectation of the staff in terms of time and resources required?

Authority.

What authority will the committee have as it pursues its charge?

Timing, how often will the committee meet, and transparency, how will the committee report out on progress, ensure public access to proceedings, and share its recommendations.

So starting at the top, people.

People are the most critical component of a successful advisory committee.

Ensuring the committee has a diverse set of knowledgeable and engaged participants is key to creating a resource for the city leadership and staff to get guidance on important environmental climate and other sustainability issues.

By establishing members of the committee, the city can bolster local environmental expertise to aid in decision making.

The council has an opportunity to reconsider and shape how committee members are selected and appointed.

Current code has the Columbus Board of Health make formal recommendations for nominees to the mayor, who then nominates individuals, and with the concurrence of city council, they are appointed.

This may be the most effective approach, but there are a number of other models that you could consider, including ones from Toledo and Bexley, who have representatives from sectors or institutions who have the authority to appoint one member.

I think city council and other city official participation should be considered as well.

Next, focus of the committee.

My honest assessment is that this is the weakest aspect of the current authorizing code.

It currently directs the committee to provide independent, quote, independent technical advice to city officials on the scientific basis underlying current and proposed federal and or state environmental regulations and the appropriateness of current regulations given local environmental situations.

That charge to me is far too narrow.

Not to mention that under the topic of regulations, determining appropriateness is not germane, however, understanding the applicability would be.

However, I don't think regulation review is a good use of an advisory committee's time or capacity.

To determine a potential new focus and scope of work, I would suggest the city council review the ongoing guiding documents on environmental work in the city and determine which of these topics would be best served by additional advisory support from outside stakeholders.

The most notable, of course, would be the Columbus Climate Action Plan, which my organization, PCFO, had the chance to work directly with the city staff in creating the updated version that launched this this year.

For example, tasking an advisory committee to support project scoping or implementation for the Columbus Climate Action Plan would support the city's environmental efforts and add capacity.

Accompanying this review with some briefings from leading city staff on the topics you identify, I am sure would also be enlightened.

Which brings me to my next point: capacity.

The existing code has effectively assigned the management of the environmental science advisory committee to the Columbus Health Department.

I want to preempt my recommendation here with a note that I have not spoken directly to the Columbus Health Department.

However, given the interest in changing the scope and charge of the advisory committee, I would not recommend keeping the management of the committee with the health department.

They should certainly be engaged, but I would recommend reassessing which department might be best to take this task on.

Maybe more importantly is to assess what existing bodies and convenings are in place that either duplicate or align with the future version of the advisory committee.

Cincinnati's environmental advisory board is an excellent example in a peer city, we would suggest you consider modeling a new version of this committee after.

However, in speaking directly with the staff in Cincinnati's Office of Environmental Sustainability, which to the question earlier is where this EAB is housed.

I want to share that the capacity to manage is a serious consideration that they would recommend is taken into account.

It takes considerable time and resources to organize, prepare, and execute on the monthly meetings that Cincinnati's EAB hosts.

As with anything, there is an opportunity cost or trade-off to this.

In speaking to one of PCFO's technical advisors who was previously the director of San Francisco's Department of the Environment, that city had a very active environment commission, so much so that they assigned a full-time staff member to manage it.

However, it was well integrated into the work of the city and a helpful resource.

This is not to suggest that capacity considerations should prevent council from proceeding.

However, expectations proposed in legislation should be matched with appropriate resources.

Next is authority.

As currently written, the ESAC would function only as an advisory capacity.

Although this is valuable, there may be an opportunity to charge the committee with tangible responsibilities, including but not limited to technical review, decision making, program guidance, grant review, or oversight.

At PCFO, we have seen advisory committees with clear advisory purposes tied to specific plans and goals can be the most successful.

For example, tasking an advisory committee to support project scoping or implementation for the Columbus Climate Action Plan will support the city's environmental efforts and ideally add capacity to staff's work.

Some committees are given authority to make budget decisions or budget recommendations, such as the Toledo Commission.

These could come from the form of community organization grants, which is something that Cincinnati is considering, or to uh to address community environmental challenges.

Think of providing direct grants to community organizations or nonprofits.

The committee could assess potential projects and make budget recommendations on community investments that align with environmental priorities.

There's a number of potential avenues to consider, but ultimately, given the commission's some level of authority will ensure greater participation and ideally a more overall effective body.

I will wrap my comments by suggesting that timing and transparency are also important considerations, but that the existing code lays out minimum meeting cadence, which is quarterly, and provides direction on governance to ensure appropriate transparency.

So I think those are sufficiently addressed.

In summary, if you amend this language, focus on ensuring that the new version of the committee has one, a clear purpose in charge, two, the right people engaged, and three, the requisite capacity and resources to manage it on the staff side.

If any one of these are missing, it will likely not work out well.

In general, I strongly support the implementation of advisory committee to bolster the work of city staff and partners on sustainability and climate action and look forward to supporting this work in the future.

Thank you for being here and for your testimony.

Your points are accurate, right?

In terms of capacity, that is something that has been expressed already in term as we kind of look to revise this uh this committee and figure out where it lays, because if you don't have the capacity to do what you're supposed to be doing on a regular basis, how will you take on this additional work?

Um, and it's interesting to hear that in Cincinnati they're doing monthly meetings to kind of make that happen.

And I think your point about the charge is also important, and I think that charge helps to dictate what capacity is going to be needed to kind of support the committee.

I think the the question my colleague asked earlier is like, hey, what would be the faux first focus of said committee?

I think establishing the bylaws, the rules or regulations, the meeting cadence, that that's number one, right?

And so maybe it's over time you see the capacity kind of building up.

So I don't really I don't have a question there.

I just want to say thank you, I guess, for a lot of your testimony.

It does add to additional things that we want to think through as we continue to kind of shape what this committee might look like and what its charge could be to kind of support the residents of Columbus.

Do you have any uh questions, Vice Chair?

Well, I appreciate you being here.

I appreciate all of you coming out and providing testimony.

I'm sure we'll be reaching out again as we continue to work through uh edits and possible suggestions on what this language looks like.

Our hope is that at our next committee hearing, we will actually have some language that folks can critique, uh, comment on, and make further suggestions on what this committee could look like.

Uh so now we will move into the surveillance pricing portion of our hearing.

Um, as many of us know, we are currently in an affordability crisis.

We're all feeling the impact of uh increasing gas prices, increased utility costs, skyrocketing grocery bills, while some of the recent price increases are being caused by an unnecessary and illegal war in the Middle East or the tariffs Americans are paying for, many price tags are being further inflated by algorithms and corporate greed.

In today's modern era of online shopping and loyalty programs, the market is no longer driven, driving the prices we all pay.

These days, most industries are using tech and AI to set prices, and the price is often different per person.

If you proven examples of collusive pricing or real page, used to set rent prices and wages, agri stats used by chicken beef and pork processors to set meat prices, potato track was being used by potato producers to inflate frozen fry prices, and rainmaker is used by hotel industry to analyze competitor data.

Instacart uses AI to price identical products differently per customer.

Uber and Lyft use surge pricing and digital shelves are being utilized at retailers like Walmart and Target to change prices instantly.

There are antitrust laws to protect customers from backroom deals within an industry.

However, those laws were written before these apps came into use, and many consumers don't even know it is happening.

The Biden administration's Department of Justice was actively prosecuting instances of digital backroom deals, but with the current administration gutting consumer protections and friendliness to big tech companies, it is now falling on states and local governments to step up to the plate.

At the end of 2025, over a hundred price transparency state bills have been introduced across 33 states and DC.

And as of March 28, 2025, San Francisco, Philadelphia, Berkeley, sorry, San Francisco, Philadelphia, Berkeley, California, and Minneapolis had passed legislation banning algorithmic rental price fixing software.

And Maryland is about to be the first state to ban the use of surveillance data in dynamic pricing at grocery stores.

Additionally, legislation to update Ohio's antitrust laws to ban algorithmic price fixing has been introduced.

And in February of this year, state senators Bill Blessing and William Blackshear introduced Senate Bill 79, and representative uh representatives Christina Cockley and Tex Fisher introduced House Bill 665 as a companion legislation.

Today we will hear testimony about surveillance pricing and housing and grocery stores.

First, we will kick things over to Dr.

Katie Fallon, Senior Policy Advisor on Housing Policy and Council's legislative research office.

Dr.

Fallon, the floor is yours.

Good afternoon, Chairman White and members of the committee.

I'm Katie Fallon.

As noted, um, I work in the legislative research office on housing homelessness and building, and I am a housing researcher.

So today I'm here to talk a little bit about how surveillance or algorithmic pricing affects rental housing and the costs and affordability challenges to people that live in Columbus.

So I mean, first, what is uh rental surveillance pricing in the housing market?

So generally, landlords make decisions about rental pricing in a variety of ways.

Um, they're listening to experts, looking at what other properties in their neighborhood cost, uh, monitor their own applications, late payments, vacancies.

Um, but much of this is expected to happen at the individual property, building, or um company level.

And while housing has never been a perfect market, supply and demand would expect substantial variation in how landlords set prices and respond to the market, giving renters a variety of options to choose from when they're trying to find their housing.

But in the last decade, as you noted, there have been huge advances in technology and the creation of new platforms such as companies like RealPage and YARTI, which are marketed as ways to help landlords in their day-to-day management of their properties.

Um, so helping them do things like communicate with tenants, uh, manage payments, and uh monitor work orders.

So these platforms, as a result, have access to massive amounts of market and landlord data, um, including rental prices, patterns of on-time or late payment, uh, vacancy rates, um, and they have this information at the unit level and across markets across the United States.

Um, and this gives them the ability to both monitor the rental market on a mass scale and also in real time, which as you've noted is something that we really haven't seen before in the rental housing market.

Um, it's also allowing them to give guidance to landlords and property managers on how to basically get the most out of their properties.

Um, so surveillance or algorithmic pricing in the rental market context refers to what happens when that local law of supply and demand no longer operates in the same way.

So companies are able to use this massive data and new algorithms to prompt or suggest landlords charge certain amounts for rent, and it can also aim to prevent landlords from lowering prices even when units stay vacant for long periods of time.

So emerging studies suggest that a staggering number, almost 90% of landlords who use these property management platforms adhere to the recommendations that they're given.

So this means that almost every single landlord that is using these is getting these recommendations and sort of deferring to them.

And this generally weakens competition because it allows coordination across landlords and limits market responsiveness, effectively allowing these companies to monitor and set the highest price possible and allows landlords across markets to sort of set a coordinated price.

So, what is the impact on renters?

The short and sort of unappealing answer is that we don't totally know.

Because many of these processes operate in a black box where policymakers and researchers don't have access to the algorithms, the underlying data, and we can't see what's happening on landlords' computer screens.

We don't really know exactly what this is costing.

But researchers, housing advocates, and journalists have been collecting evidence that shows that these are amplifying housing affordability issues.

And the findings have been included in multiple federal and state lawsuits against companies like RealPage and YARDI.

So, for example, one study published in 2023 estimated that the use of these platforms cost renters on average $70 a month and cost renters across the US a total of $3.8 billion.

Other studies have linked the use of surveillance pricing to higher than market rents and higher vacancies overall in those markets.

And there is also a study that found the use of these platforms lately leads to higher eviction filings.

So one study found that adopting real page recommendations increase turnover rates by 15 percentage points.

So these might sound like small numbers, but when you consider the fact that renters in Columbus are a majority of them are already rental cost burdened, which means that they already spend between 30 and 50% of their income on rent.

Something like an additional $70 per month is not a joke.

That could be the difference between being able to pay for fixing a flat if your car gets one, um, potentially affording child care, things like that.

So these are really serious costs that are being borne by the individuals in Columbus.

There's also some emerging findings that uh the use of these platforms and surveillance pricing affects more than just base rent.

So for example, we did some research studying uh ledgers in Colorado to look at how landlords that use these algorithms are imposing fines and fees.

And so our research is showing that uh there is an increasing use of fees over time.

So landlords are increasing the number of fees, often for things like trash valet, common area maintenance, which are not necessarily disclosed in leases, neither the actual charge nor the amount, um, and they're mandatory.

So, you know, trash valet sounds like it's an amenity, but it's a mandatory amenity.

Um early findings are showing that this is driving up base rent from 10 to 30% based on renters, and that there's also huge volatility month to month.

So between 100 and 300.

So, for example, you could pay $60 one month and then $360 another month.

So not only is it inflating cost, but it's really making the expected cost month to month more difficult for renters to sort of think about and uh evaluate.

And given that they're not required to be uh shown in the lease or in the base rental price in Columbus, it means that when you're signing a lease, you also might be entering into a monthly payment that is a lot higher than you expected that it would be.

So, what are some of the opportunities for action?

Um, the combination of increasing rental prices and additional fines and fees is likely affecting the total cost of rent for many Columbus residents, but there are definitely ways to address these practices.

As you notice, states and localities are starting to think about some of these.

Um, so some of the practices that we've seen that could affect and sort of stabilize this is prohibiting price setting, though, as mentioned, this is difficult to monitor and enforce, requiring price transparency, both in rent and then in the fines and fees that are associated, prohibiting the imposition of new mandatory services.

Um, but overall, there is a big need to better understand how these are happening, how these are being imposed on residents, and how we can prevent uh the additional cost burden that many are being addressed.

Happy to uh take any questions.

Dr.

Felton, thank you for kind of walking us through that.

Obviously, we have tried our hardest to kind of find ways to increase transparency for renters.

I think as we look to utility reselling, right?

One of the requirements is that up front you have to tell people this is how you are going to be charged for utilities here, and this is what you are paying for.

And the hope is really to give folks a better sense of what their monthly billing is going to look like.

It was frustrating to hear from residents who are being told, I am given a portal, I am told I have to go pay my utilities on that portal, and that portal tells me zero information on what my utility usage was and what I am actually paying for.

And the hope is really to eliminate that, right?

And increase that level of transparency so folks can make a real truly informed decision.

Um, but the reality is technology is literally working against all of us in driving up costs everywhere that it can exist.

Um, as you're kind of looking through the the art of the possible, um did it lend itself to legislation that could be done in Columbus.

And are there other components that we might be able to utilize to kind of help arm us with more information?

I think about the rental registry, right?

I think maybe a simple question is are you using software to determine your prices and what is that software?

That's a great question.

So I think it's tough because state level policies might not necessarily be appropriate for Columbus, but I certainly think a lot of the things that are being passed in different cities could certainly be applicable.

And I think what you're mentioning about transparency is definitely one of the most important tools that we have.

So being transparent about what expected prices are, what total prices, um, and putting information in renters' hands.

I think I mean, I was not a renter that long ago, and I think it's it's totally understandable that people don't really totally understand what their rights are as a renter and like how many of these calculations get charged to them.

And so I think giving them more information up front, um, monitoring some of that through things like the rental registry is something that could definitely help at least even the scales a little bit as we search for better solutions to try to figure out how to meet technology where it's at and uh support our residents.

I do appreciate that.

And I I know uh council member Ross could not be here today, but she was like, I gotta watch the video because this is an important topic from a housing perspective.

So I am sure she is uh excited to figure out ways to increase that transparency and eliminate charges that are literally hurting our residents.

Uh Vice Chair Remy, did you have any questions?

All right.

Dr.

Fallon, thank you for being here, and thank you for um presenting on surveillance pricing today.

Uh, next we'll hear from UFCW Local 1059 President Mike Nichols uh to discuss the topic of surveillance pricing.

I thank you for being here.

Welcome to council.

Thank you.

I'd like to thank the council for allowing me the opportunity to speak to this issue.

Surveillance pricing is an enormously important issue facing consumers.

There are new technologies in the retail and grocery industries that threaten families' budget and everyone's individual privacies.

I serve as president of UFCW Local 1059, and our union represents 19,000 workers in Ohio and more than 4100 Columbus residents working in the retail grocery stores, uh, food processing, health care, and the cannabis industry.

Our members puts food on the table for this our city's families.

And unfortunately, the cost of food in Columbus is not affordable for many working people.

Grocery prices are rising.

In the last 12 months, Ohio's food prices have risen 4.4%.

While price increases have several causes, there is one new challenge that can be addressed through government action.

Restrictions on surveillance pricing and ESLs, electronic shelf labels.

Large grocery retailers are adopting new technologies that exploit consumers for profit and make it harder for struggling families to eat.

Corporations collect information about where we go, what we watch, and what food we buy.

Online retailers are already using that data to set individual prices for different customers.

The technology that makes such surveillance pricing possible in brick and mortar grocery stores is used is the use of electronic shelf labels, ESLs.

ESLs are essentially cloud-connected devices that can deploy the use of customer data and surveillance technology to set different prices for different customers.

ESL combined with the computing power of AI, make individual pricing a reality today.

This is not a concern we might have at some point on a future date.

Right now, a store can calculate the maximum amount of money a customer is willing to pay.

Transmit that price to the ESL when the customer is in the aisle in front of that product, and just like that, price gouging gains strategic efficiency.

We know this is happening because we are seeing it in our stores.

Grocery retail chains are already using ESL around the country.

Kroger began using ESLs in dozens of stores in 2018, and Walmart announced it is adding ESLs to every store.

If companies have the ability to treat groceries like an Uber ride, then our communities must come together to regulate the tools that would facilitate discriminatory food pricing.

Unless action is taken, ESL and surveillance pricing will only continue to drive up the cost of groceries.

Addressing surveillance pricing without simultaneously banning ESLs will not solve the problem.

Stores will still be able to increase prices based on time of day, proximity to a holiday, or even the weather forecast.

The price may not be as high tech as it would be in the combination, but for sale and surveillance pricing, but it's still uh uh predatory.

Without quick action, surveillance surveillance pricing and electronic shelf labels will continue to contribute to the rising cost of groceries and exacerbate exasperate the uh affordability crisis facing the citizens of Columbus.

And thank you very much for allowing me the opportunity to speak today.

Mike, thank you for being here and uh for kind of walking through what you're seeing from your your sector, right?

And what this kind of looks like.

It is interesting because there have been representatives from grocery stores who say, well, this is a way in which we'll be able to real-time lower prices to support residents.

Is that something you think is likely to occur?

Yeah, I don't believe that the system that they they are purchasing was marketed as their ability to when they're you know when they're seeing high demand on product to raise the prices.

But uh you you may notice when you check out at the grocery store and you buy uh a certain item, uh maybe it's Maxwell House Coffee, but every time you go through the checkout, you get a coupon for Folgers.

That's because Folgers is paying a premium to the store to try to gain you as a customer.

And it's because they're collecting all that data and storing it.

So they'll have that data on you, they'll know you're in the store, they'll know what items you buy regularly and be able to raise that price because they know you're gonna buy it anyway.

You're the consumer of that product, but maybe lower the price of something else to get uh you to try it and get paid back from that vendor just like they do now with the coupons that print at the registers.

So I don't I don't believe they're gonna do it in any way to save people money.

I I don't believe they'd be investing this kind of money in the system and the shelf tags alone, the cost of that, if there wasn't a way to earn that back in lots of uh lots of different ways.

Yeah.

And it must be interesting too, right?

With the rise of like online grocery store shopping.

We all used to have to go to the store, pick out the products to purchase.

Now it's one in which it's all online.

You know what I buy on a regular basis, you know my digital profile, you're able to basically determine at that moment in time this is the price that I'm going to show you because you're not in the store to look at anything else.

Vice Chair, did you have any questions?

Let's go for it.

Good afternoon.

Good afternoon.

Um what are you seeing on the ground with your members, you know, working families that you know policy conversation sometimes misses?

So, in other words, like rent, fees, groceries, utilities, all of them moving together at the same time.

What does that mean for your members?

I mean, it's just harder to live.

Yeah, I think it's continually getting harder for them to make ends meet.

And and I I think when you if you add it to groceries where people will literally not know week to week what they're paying for milk and eggs and how they're going to feed their family, I think it just puts more of a of an impact on our food pantries and our services to help people that aren't as fortunate.

So that's why we're really supporting that we do something not just in housing but across the board in every way that they're trying to use surveillance pricing to increase increase their profits.

This is kind of an aside, but would you say since COVID that it seems like grocery prices fluctuate more than they ever have?

I mean, is this is that an accurate observation?

It is typically there's a a one or two uh times a week that prices change depending on the retailer.

Uh, but it's not a daily or an hourly type of thing.

Uh I I worked for Kroger for 20 years and all through the 80s, we would watch items go up a penny one week and down a penny the next, and that was back when we used to have to price it individually.

Uh that when it went to the tags, I think it became more use of that because the item wasn't priced, they didn't have to pay somebody to remove a sticker and add a new sticker.

Uh, but they do go up and down a lot, but this this gives them the ability to do it minute by minute.

Yeah.

Thanks.

Mike, thank you for being here.

Thank you for your testimony.

Appreciate it.

Uh next, we'll move into our next topic of discussion with an update from the Columbus Regent Green Fund.

Here to present on behalf of the Green Fund is Jackie Kimball, the interim executive director.

Jackie, thank you for being here.

Okay, it works great.

Thank you.

Um Council Chairs Weish and Remy, thank you so much uh for the opportunity to tell you about everything that the Green Bank has been doing in the couple of years that we've been in existence and happy Earth Month, and I did my taxes.

Thank you for the reminder.

Um of the people in this chamber and on this council uh might not be familiar with our organization, so I want to start by answering the question: what is a green bank?

The Columbus Region Green Fund is Central Ohio's green bank, and we are joined by a network of over 40 other green banks in the United States.

We collaborate closely with these organizations to share policy, loan products, innovations, and news about our industry.

Nearly every state has a green bank, but we all have the same mission, which is to close the gap on financing clean energy projects, specifically for our underserved communities, but using low-cost loans and grants to make sure that everyone has access to the technology and methodologies used to make our energy more affordable and lower our emissions.

The Green Fund was created as part of the climate action plan in 2021 and capitalized in 2023 and 2024 with $7 million from the city, approved by this body, thank you, and $2 million from the county.

We are supported by the Columbus Partnership, which provides administrative services, and Freedom Equity Inc., who we contract for underwriting and loan servicing.

Over half of these green banks, like the Columbus Region Green Fund were created around the same time with the expectation that we would have access to over 27 billion dollars with a B earmarked in the greenhouse gas reduction fund in the IRA.

This was supposed to go to CDFIs, green banks, and community-based organizations that specialized in investing in low-income areas for sustainable infrastructure.

We also thought that we would still have access to the investment tax credits.

Um, but those are sunsetting in July.

Those account for up to half of the cost of each of these projects.

Specifically, solar is where we're seeing the largest impact.

Despite $27 billion of federal funding being frozen, and the investment tax credit sunsetting in July of this year, the Green Fund has still made a significant impact on our community.

So if you look up here, we have provided 9.2 million dollars utilizing our operating costs, loans, and grants.

So over the next 25 years, just on what we've put out so far, 24 million dollars will be saved by nonprofits, residents, and institutions in Columbus.

And almost a hundred thousand metric tons of CO2 will be avoided.

This is the equivalent of 21,000 cars off the road, which is about half the cars that were sold in Ohio in 2025.

1.7 million new trees, and 12,500 homes for one year.

So if you think about the hilltop area, that is all the power and cost that it would take to run those homes for an entire year.

We've had a massive impact so far in a very short amount of time.

And it's important to note that $6.2 million of this is loans, which means that every time it comes back into us, we put it back out again.

So this impact will be duplicated over and over and over again each time we revolve the capital that the city and the county provided for us.

And this here is a breakdown of what we've spent this money on.

So $4.3 million in solar loans have been distributed to nonprofits, senior living affordable housing, libraries, schools, and social service providers.

$1.9 million has been lent to high energy efficiency housing projects, including the adaptive reuse of a historic downtown building, preserving our skyline, and converting an excess amount of office space into much needed new housing.

This funding has also gone to help building energy efficient affordable housing, specifically for women undergoing behavioral health treatment, which we will learn about on a couple of slides.

We've also secured 1.8 million dollars in grants for energy efficiency audits, workforce development, and home weatherization services for our underserved communities.

And we have exciting projects in the pipeline for our remaining 1.9 million dollars in capital, including solar and additional affordable housing projects.

So a couple of examples of the work that we've been doing, and I think Councilmember Weiss, you're very familiar with this project.

So there is a program that we work with called the Impact Solar Program that was incepted alongside the Columbus Region Green Fund and provided a novel way to distribute solar to our underserved communities, heavily utilizing the investment tax credit.

So this is a photo of Corbin Commons, which is a senior living affordable housing development.

Sorry, it's a mouthful.

Because of the low-cost loan provided by the Green Fund in Fifth Third, the seniors who live here on a fixed income will save almost 1.9 million dollars in energy costs over the next 25 years.

Per an agreement with Corbin Commons, these funds will go to stabilized rent and additional services for these seniors.

I think I may have lost a slide, but that's okay.

So in December of 2025, City Council passed an amendment to our contract clarifying that the what the green fund could do with our existing funding.

Thank you for that.

I want to tell you a little bit about the impact of that change.

Our newest loan product is a bridge loan.

And it's meant to incentivize and support the construction of high energy efficiency housing.

If you've been involved in development at all, you know that a project dies right at the beginning.

These pre-development loans are really common in our green banking community, and they're short-term loans, so we can put them back out and revolve them back in and put them back out over and over again quickly.

And they're supposed to provide a bridge, intended to provide a bridge, to additional funding coming into projects.

So whether that's LITECH credits, whether you're waiting for the Ohio Financing Authority to give you additional funding, philanthropy, local public financing, private commercial financing, or nonprofit financing, all of this money comes in at different times.

And we don't want these projects to stall.

So what we've done is we provide low-cost capital to incentivize building to a certain energy efficiency level.

We know that we are drastically short on affordable housing.

So the more that we can incentivize housing that is energy efficient and saves money, the better.

One of the projects that we've been working on is with Connect Housing Blocks for Amethyst, which is a vital program in Alvis's portfolio of services, which provides behavioral health treatment and support to underserved women.

Amethyst is one of a handful of programs across the country that allow children to live with their mothers while they are undergoing treatment.

And we know from research that being separated from your family is a major indicator of recidivism and relapse.

And so too is a lack of reliable housing.

Between 2017 and 2023, landlords terminated the leases on 112 apartments that Alvis was using to house women in this program.

Losing housing while you were at your most vulnerable can be devastating.

And in addition to providing stability for these women and their families, the this development and the way that these modular apartments are constructed, their third-party HERS certified, it insulates these women from the shock of rising energy prices.

They're 30% more efficient than traditional building methods.

They use 70% less building materials, and Connect has a workforce development program that hires from the five lowest income census tracts in Columbus.

That workforce development program is also available to the women coming out of this program when they are ready to make their next step.

So this shows, and Councilmember Weiss, you alluded to this earlier, you know, as we define the scope of sustainability and what it means for our community.

This shows how these investments can have a duplicative effect.

So we are not just investing in lowering energy costs.

We are helping bridge the gap to affordable housing and supporting vital programming for our most underserved residents.

And since these dollars rotate back to us, I'm just gonna keep saying this, we can do this type of work over and over and over again.

So even though we went from when we started a pretty favorable economic and regulatory environment, and we have since found ourselves in something that is the opposite of that.

We can continue as a green bank to innovate to make sure that we can push these solutions forward.

So that's what we've been doing with our loan capital.

But we also got grants, and this is how we're using them.

So I think you guys probably know this, but commercial buildings account for 40% of all emissions in the United States.

It is a staggering amount of energy.

And if you're a building owner, the first step in bringing your emissions down is an energy audit so you can understand what's going on in your building.

But this can be really daunting, especially if you're resource constrained.

You have to find an energy firm.

You need an investment grade audit, which is a specific type of audit that tells you how much it will cost to do all the recommendations that you get.

And each one of these can cost between 15,000 and 25,000 for a 50,000 square foot building.

So we have recently launched a program with the city of Columbus, and we're currently accepting applications, plug to provide 30 to 35 free audits for building owners in Columbus.

We are targeting nonprofits, schools, municipal buildings, multifamily affordable housing, and businesses, again, around the size of 50,000 square feet.

These organizations will receive a free assessment outlining everything they can do to make their buildings more efficient.

This can be anything from replacing light bulbs to making sure you're not heating a school to 72 degrees at midnight in January, to large investments like replacing boilers or a roof.

And when these organizations receive this assessment, the green fund is not going to just leave them alone, right?

To wonder what to do next.

We will be here to help them understand how they can finance these upgrades, whether it's PACE, grants, nonprofit financing, or commercial financing.

We will be there for the entire life cycle, ensuring that building owners feel supported every step of the way and that they go the entire way to make these upgrades to their buildings so they can realize these energy savings.

And depending on the adoption of these audit suggestions, this will save between 5.5 and 11 million dollars over the next 25 years, not to mention the amount of energy that will be alleviated from the grid.

And for our last example, the Google Grid Innovation Fund.

So last year we launched the Grid Innovation Fund in partnership with Google.

And this is a statewide grant administered by the Columbus Region Green Fund.

And we've partnered with incredible organizations around the state that support workforce development and home weatherization in low-income communities.

Lancaster Fairfield, Appalachia, Cincinnati, and Columbus.

And Columbus specifically, $300,000 was granted out between the Mid Ohio Regional Planning Commission and Impact Community Action to support their workforce development and home weatherization programs for our low-income residents.

And we look forward to sharing the impact report of the entire state and Columbus with council in June at the end of the performance period.

So as you can see here, and as I mentioned, these investments and grants are specifically designed to be force multipliers, right?

We're not just looking in one vertical, we're trying to see how far we can spread the impact of the investments that we're making.

So you're looking at housing, workforce development, energy infrastructure, public health, and cost savings.

And we know that energy bills are going up precipitously and that they are going to hit our most vulnerable neighbors hardest at first.

So thank you so much for the opportunity to update you.

And I really am just here to say thank you.

I'm not asking anything of you guys.

I know that's shocking.

Um, other than the opportunity to just keep the conversation open so that we can work with the city and council to help realize the best possible solutions for our neighbors so that they're we can mitigate the impact of the energy crisis that we're in.

So thank you again so much, and I'm really happy to answer any questions that you might have.

Well, thank you for being here for the work that you're doing.

I mean, the savings is real.

I think this has been one of the frustrating things for me in terms of why folks are not moving to a more renewable energy space where imagine if that was a part of building codes years ago, how far along we'd be today at a point where we are seeing energy demand going up.

There could have been solar on roofs all over the city of Columbus and in the region.

One question I did want to ask is obviously today is much different uh than 2024 when I even started on council.

How are green banks kind of pivoting in this time period?

Are you seeing others doing kind of similar things?

Are they capitalized higher?

So it's just kind of not an issue for them.

Like how is the sector kind of responding?

Oh no, so the map that you saw earlier, I meant it when I said it about half of those green banks started at the same time as us, and they're not capitalized by their municipalities and counties at the same rate that we were.

So there's an organization called the GB50 that the Columbus Region Green Fund actually helped start.

And I sit on several advisory boards, but it's kind of a um has become a think tank.

So each time one of us comes up with a really good idea where we find uh a solution that works really well in our community, we tell everyone about it.

And then we can duplicate it, right?

So we're not just working in a vacuum, we're all working together, and that organization has done a lot of work trying to aggregate funding for all of us.

They're obviously not going to be able to raise 27 billion dollars.

Uh, but they've done a fantastic job.

They've given the Columbus Region Green Fund an operating grant, um, and they're actively working with philanthropy to try to aggregate enough funding to make sure that all of us uh stay afloat and can accomplish our mission in anticipation of hopefully brighter days for funding.

We we are all hoping for brighter days some sometime from now.

So it's uh it's kind of an impossible task right now, just kind of given what we're facing at the federal and even state level here in Ohio, where uh folks are are less than interested in supporting this type of work, mainly just due to audiology and not the reality that this is an opportunity to save residents money to impact their health for the positive.

Um, and I think the more we can kind of continue to hammer that message home, hopefully we continue to reach folks and turn them our way.

Uh Vice Chair, did you have any questions?

Yeah, I do.

Thank you for being here again uh today.

Um Department of Energy funded um the Audit program, um what share of the auditive buildings would you expect to move into implementation for improvements.

That's tough to say because this is a pilot program, and there are a lot of other cities that actually have programs like this, um, but they're only two or three years old.

So I hesitate to give you an estimate.

I think that because we weren't quite sure, that's why we designed the program in a way where we're not just going to let the business owner go about their own devices after they have their grant.

Um they get coaching from us.

And so we are trying to optimize the conversion rate of people who have audits to uh the actual infrastructural needs that they can have.

And I think it's worth mentioning that there are several steps to an audit, right?

There's the things that you can do that are no cost, the things that you can do that are operational and low cost, and then those capital improvements that we're talking about that really are the ones that cost money.

Um so at the very least, there will be some gradient of adoption across every audit, right?

Because you'll definitely still have low-hanging fruit there that will make an impact.

And when did that open up the uh two weeks ago?

And I uh have you got an applications in yet?

Okay.

So I just wondered, you know, how people are finding out about it and that sort of thing.

Yeah, so we announced it in a couple of different venues, and we're also working with um the city of Columbus to target some of the lowest performers, if you will, in terms of benchmarking.

It is a requirement to receive the audit that you are part of the benchmarking program that you're enrolled in it.

Okay.

And then what type of um this is just curiosity question.

What type of rates are on like that the improvement product, you know, like the if they get a loan?

Like what are those rates?

That really depends on what the specific thing is.

Oh, yeah.

Um, and I'm happy to send your office a breakdown of that.

That's cool.

Yeah.

But it's gonna range between I think 3% and 12%, depending on the capital stack.

And again, that's really gonna depend on on the thing that you're doing.

A boiler is priced differently than like windows, right?

Uh, you were talking about you know, underserved commit um communities and then emerging developers um as part of the pipeline.

Um, how are those groups being reached in practice?

And then what are some of the barriers that keep you from reaching some of the intended targets?

Sure.

So we would work through community-based organizations that already have groups of developers that they've identified and are closely working with.

We'd like to work with the Affordable Housing Trust with their emerging developers program with the City of Columbus to try to identify organizations that are coming up because we want to shore up this workforce, right?

We're gonna need organizations to do this work.

And if we have small businesses that would like to be part of that ecosystem, we would like to support them.

So as we go through this pre-development loan and we've standardized it, we've identified all the little things that we might run into, especially with a borrower that's newer and might not have access to more traditional types of credit.

That's part of the function of a green bank is to make sure that we can do that.

But your question about what barriers we might run into finding those organizations.

I think if we continue to work closely with our nonprofit organizations and our community leaders and community-based organizations, and make it known that these resources are available to them.

I I don't foresee any huge barriers.

And then what role should we play, you know, moving forward and you know, and the city?

I mean, you know, whether it's stronger referrals from departments, um, you know, more coordination with our housing efforts, you it more capitalization, I'm sure, but you know, like what are some things that we could do to help improve our relationship.

Sure.

I think a great first step is just opening up the conversation.

Um, we've been really heads down for the last couple of years just doing our work.

And so we're kind of coming up for air with these standardized loan products that we can put out into the community.

So, what we'd really like to understand is the priorities of council and other bodies around the city and stakeholders that are really invested in this work so that we can make sure we're marching in step with all of you.

Um, and I think from there, once we develop a strategy that addresses that, you know, I'll have lots of ideas for you guys.

But yeah, that's where we are.

I was gonna say, man, she said she had no ass for us.

Let's just take the window.

I mean, if you want to open the door, I can walk through it.

That's fine.

Well, thank you very much.

I appreciate you being there today.

Yeah, thank you.

Jackie, thank you for the work that you're doing.

Appreciate you being here and kind of walking us through.

I think when we talked, it was important that we continue to have this conversation to put this in front of council.

I think sometimes we do things and we're excited it gets done, and then we forget it's happening, and we don't realize kind of all the good that kind of ripples out of the impact that you all are doing.

So appreciate you being here.

I'm sure there'll be more conversations and anything we can do to kind of help support and promote the program that's out there, please let us know.

Thank you so much.

Appreciate it.

All right.

And last but certainly not least, we are uh we will hear from the Department of Public Service, division of refuse about the upcoming RFP process for the City of Columbus's recycling contract.

Presenting on behalf of the department is DSU Oshodi.

Did I get that right?

Yeah.

Oh I was trying all day.

Uh the refuse collections operations coordinator.

Uh the floor is yours.

Uh good evening.

Good evening, Council Chair, uh Wish, Councilmember Ring, and you both for having us here today.

Um these social questions for you reference collection.

Is it three?

Is that good?

Can you okay?

Uh good evening, Council.

Good evening, Council Chair.

Council Chair Wash.

Uh Councilmember Remy, thank you both for having me here today.

Um my name is Disor Shodi.

I'm one of two operations coordinators with the Division of Refuge Collection.

I'm joined here with my colleague Katrina Whitlock, and we're gonna be talking a little bit about the recycling contract RFP for 2027.

Um City of Columbus is accepting bids for residential recycling, uh, weekly recycling and yard waste, biweekly collection and disposal for approximately 221,520 households.

Uh the service area will be split into three zones with each 65,000 to 85,000 residencies.

Uh bids must be submitted for five years with the option of five one-year extensions and must show the collection and disposal costs.

Um, the current contract that we have expires March 31st of 2027.

Um, by our estimation, we um there's a is there is to be uh a new service provider come online.

So uh that being said, um, this current contract will be from 2027 all the way to 2032, uh, with of course the the five year options.

And just moving over, moving on to the service overview.

Uh weekly recycling has been largely successful.

It's about three years old now since June 2023.

Uh we have uh bikely biweekly yard waste as well, uh pedestrian recycling program.

Um essentially that's the metal receptacles you see in our commercial corridors.

We have about 150 recycled containers uh stemming from the short north uh through the Orchie off campus area.

We do also have the recycle and high program uh where we partnered with 40 or so businesses to just collect nothing but glass, you know, keeping that away from the land field is always uh a sustainable goal of ours.

So we do have 125 carts that we deployed on in the field as well.

And what you see here is a depiction of what the map is gonna look like.

Uh zones one through three, uh zone one being the southern eastern part, the city with the most households, zone two, the western part, and then zone three, the northern eastern part.

Um conceptually, what we did was um distribute uh the nine council districts between all three different zones uh just for equality purposes.

So if there were to be three different uh service providers, there's some form of accountability put towards that.

Uh Rumkey Murph is located in Council District 4, uh zone three.

I'm sure a lot of people are familiar with uh the the Murray for Joyce Avenue as the material recovery facility that they have where a lot of the materials uh go.

Uh just talking a little bit about the prerequisites that we put in place, uh mandatory bidding for all zones.

We um we would like for you know service providers to build to bid on individual collection zones and then bid um on all zones as a collective uh responsibility and frequency uh of course maintain and handle all service requests, all the hot spots or the service level or agreements that we have and make sure they're in line with uh our expectations.

Uh special collections, the awarded bidder of zone two shows some collections on Glass and High and Pedestrian Recycle Program around the city three times weekly for non-consecutive days.

And uh the subcontractor limit is um we put this in place to encourage um a lot of major players to partner with smaller minority businesses that would like to uh come on come board.

So you know, when you look at all three zones, you can have a subcontractor that could that's eligible to be in all three zones.

So you can have as many as six service providers, three major players, and three subcontractors, or you can have as many as four three major players and one subcontractor that's eligible to go in all three zones, or you can just have one, depending on you know the prerequisites.

And then um, I would say from a yard waste perspective, the subcontractor aspect is um it's extremely important while we put it in place.

So if you look at a zone that has 65,000 residential households, you know, on a bi-weekly collection, you're talking 32,500 on a five-day work collection schedule.

You know, we're talking approximately 6,000 collections per household a day.

Um that we think is doable from uh a small business minority standpoint.

So it's definitely an encouragement and a lot of thought was put into uh put into it.

Uh transportation and disposal, we expect and hope that 75% of the materials are processed by end users and remain within the state of Ohio.

Um as far as holidays, the city um uh has and recognizes approximately 10, 11 um holidays, um, but with this contract, um this should be just the six main holidays.

House count variations and cost and cost justification really essentially what this means is if there is to be an excess of 10,000 plus, then we get to renegotiate.

Um but if it's 10,000 or less, then the contract stays the same.

Uh future collection programs may be added to this contract by mutual agreement of the city and contractor service provider, as you guys uh potentially know or may know.

Um we have our two convenience centers that's uh pulling out a lot of material diversion materials, especially on the recycling and yard waste front.

Um the 2100 Allen Creek and the 1550 Georgesville uh waste and convenience centers.

Uh we do have our city office recycling program, and then we have our pilot program, a multifamily.

So we put a uh uh a clause pretty much stating that uh a thousand tons, any you know, will be accommodated with this contract as well.

Uh a couple of timelines and outreach and the process towards um getting this RFP together.

Uh, we did meet with uh our friends and partners at department of neighborhoods at 311 to discuss the several the SLAs, the service levels level agreements that we have with our current service provider.

Uh in November 25, we did have internal discussions within our public service leadership.

Uh, we did have discussions with our uh Solid Waste Authority as well.

Um in December of 25, we did meet with Rumkey.

January, we did meet with uh waste management and local waste.

Uh just a couple of uh events and dates.

Um invitation for bid advertised today, April 15th.

Uh the pre-bid meeting, April of 27, April 27, 2026.

Uh the questions will be in by May 1st, 26th, and then the bid will be due by um May 8th.

And then uh here are a couple of exhibits that uh we think or we know would be extremely important for service providers.

Uh exhibit A essentially is the tonnage um that we've had since 2014 till date.

Um it encapsulates everything from recycling and yard waste.

Uh exhibit B is typically like a a tag that um if there was a hot spot or a couple of service complaints, then uh we would put that in serviceable on serviceable tag and uh contact our our R311 service center.

Exhibit C is the correction uh current collection zones and dates.

Uh exhibit D, I kind of touched on with the recycling house counts, 221,520.

Uh we have a right recycle on hire participants, uh, which is the 40 businesses that we partner with.

Um, and then just moving on, I and J exhibits I and J kind of just touches on the pricing and making sure that everybody bits bids or bidders, service providers, bid on each individual collection zone and uh bid them on a collective front.

And then finally, I think uh exhibit L is the tree canopy and assessment.

I know a couple of people touch on that earlier today.

Um, but that having that information from 2011 to 2021 allows again service providers that want to come online to know where the the yard waste is primarily stationed within the city.

So um I we feel like it's good information for uh the populace.

Uh that concludes my presentation.

Well, thank you for being here and for kind of walking through the presentation on the process itself.

It isn't we're choosing tax day for everything.

So look at that.

The bids out there, and we're doing our part to kind of help market that this is this is occurring.

Um, one thing I did want to ask you on the timeline selection.

Like when do you anticipate or when does DPS anticipate choosing the uh the bid to accept for this?

I'm not particularly sure, but I think uh by May 13th, we should or dare about.

Of this year.

I believe so.

Okay.

Yeah, I mean, I was just concerned that this is a process that would run very long and then get to a point where um we're we're hitting the end of our current contract.

So just looking for that clarification there.

Um one of the options, and I I think based on what you said, this might be uh might be acceptable or might happen.

Wanted to talk as you look at that five one year extension.

My question was basically do we have the option to add on services, make changes, make additions kind of within those one-year time periods.

But I think based on your presentation, that could probably happen sooner.

Absolutely.

It was put in there that uh the option to add additional services will be discussed depending on uh the conversations with our our leadership.

Yeah, mutually agreed upon conversations with them.

Yeah, one of the reasons I wanted to ask is really just around composting, right?

Food waste.

We know how detrimental that is environmentally is if it you know if it is ending up in the landfill.

So if it is, you can just sell me.

It's not.

But is that something in which the department sees becoming kind of a component of our collection in the city, either through a contractor or through DPS itself?

Absolutely.

I think that's a good question.

I think from a food waste standpoint, we're always looking at good op um new opportunities to explore.

We currently do have nine locations around the city, uh including our two convenience centers that we collect a lot of food waste.

Uh we did collect um about 120 tons last year.

So as far as that is concerned, I think we're always looking to explore, you know, expanding the current services that we have.

But more like residential pickup, like that's kind of where I'm trying to understand.

Is that something that eventually we anticipate being a part of what the city is doing on a regular basis?

Not currently at this time, but could be.

Yeah.

Appreciate that.

One other question I had before I uh kick it over to my vice chair, recycling high, which I love, right?

I love that we're collecting glass in areas that we know they're going to accumulate.

I would have to assume that cans are also in that same area.

Like have we not considered doing both glass and aluminum pickup from those locations too?

We haven't had those conversations at this time.

Um we've just primarily um focused on because it was started as a pilot program, as you may know.

Um so we just uh especially because you know we got a lot of our glass, you know, from from where we take them to Rumkey, it stays within, it goes to Dayton and stays within the state of Ohio.

So it's one of those things that we piloted, and we wanted to make sure that you know the end user stays within the state.

So um definitely an option to consider.

Well, you know, I love DPS.

You guys have some of the coolest pilots that are out there, whether it be on the refuse side or even on the uh the service transportation side of things, you guys are always willing to be innovative, which is exciting to see.

Uh Vice Chair, did you have any questions?

Uh what were some of the biggest lessons you learned from the current contract that helps shape the RFP itself?

That's a wonderful question.

Um basically is really having conversations from previous to now and having conversations with the major players, local waste, Rumkey, um, really is all the prerequisites that I just mentioned.

So the holidays, for instance, was uh was a sticking point from from their standpoint.

Um really having a subcontract subcontractor get into the game was one thing that a lot of people wanted to explore.

Um having the ability to do some expansions from a tonnage perspective, especially because we have the convenience centers, the multifamily pilot, and um the office recycling that we that we currently do.

So a lot of those things really helped us just make some amendments for this contract.

And then what you know the decision to of course have the three zones, but to make a mandatory requirement to to bid on all the zones, what does that what advantage does that give us as far as like price service continuity and competition so um just overall pricing, overall collection, um the collection days.

So I think there's uh there's an exhibit there that outlines the shows, I think is C that shows the current collection schedules because um currently what we have I think is Tuesdays and Thursdays and that we currently do our recycling uh and yard waste.

Um it gives us a vivid picture of something different that we're not necessarily used to.

So we're the flexibility of being able to maybe uh you know, a lot of the the private organizations, they do a lot of their commercials maybe on Friday.

So if they wanted to finesse their schedules, uh we wanted to be able to make sure that their accommodations and nothing necessarily to hinder them from getting getting into the getting into this uh in this bid.

What um what type of transition plan is there to do ensure you know service continuity like as we transition into a new potentially new providers, for instance um just conversation, you know.

We have our couple of meetings coming up with the um with the questions.

Uh I think we're a lot of those will be answered during that time period.

Um we do want to make sure that um R 311 and our and our staff and and um they're well aware of what's to come if it was to be awarded to somebody, somebody totally different, because a lot of our calls come from uh uh our friends and partners in neighborhoods.

So uh we'll make sure that we're well prepared if there was to be a change.

And you also, you know, the RFP mentions about route route balancing and you know, could be potential changes, you know, for that.

Are they responsible for the communication or you guys would handle that if there were changes and then you just went through a major route balancing?

How has that gone so far and what's that done?

You know, the purpose of that.

I know what the purpose is, but what what could you let the people know what the purpose of that was?

Um, we like to consider it an unbalanced uh rather than a b rebalance.

Um we looked at oh well, the growth is coming, and uh we try to we know that the structures that we have, the stations in the space and the trucks and all of the resources that we have.

Um, the structures cannot change, but we can change how we do things.

So we essentially did a rebalance based on what's to come.

For instance, if we have we have a lot of development on the west side, so we moved a lot of our resources to our Georgia View Road Station to make sure because they have the capacity, they have the building space, they have the functionality and the structure uh to accommodate.

So knowing fully well in the next couple of years where the growth is coming, we actually need that unbalanced uh to rebalance and give us put us in a in a in a safe space for years to come.

And I just want to remind everybody that this is the only department that goes to every single household every single week.

Absolutely.

We're we're we're extremely gratified and proud to be the department or division.

Well, you guys do a great job, and we're really appreciate the work that you do.

So thanks for coming in today.

Thank you.

And thank you for walking us through the process.

Appreciate you being here and uh providing that overview.

Um, we only had one speaker sign up prior to the hearing, and that is Tia Johnson, CEO of Fresh Environmental Services.

If you wanna step up to the podium, thank you for being here.

Good afternoon.

Okay.

Good afternoon, council members.

My name is Tia Johnson.

I am the owner of Fresh Environmental Services.

Columbus Refuge serves about 360,000 households through the U.S.

refugee collection and over 35,000 tons of recycling.

However, our city is growing with more residents, more multifamily units, means more diversion opportunities.

So my question is simple.

Why is waste and recycling still structured like a few major companies should be allowed to help solve the problem?

If Columbus is serious about sustainability, then sustainability cannot only live in a goal statement, it has to live in contracts.

Because when contracts are written to allow collaboration, local participation, flexibility, the result is stronger service, smarter systems, and better long-term outcomes for our taxpayers.

Currently, the rules are written in a way that local haulers cannot realistically participate.

Our city does not lose in competitive pricing, it loses innovation, neighborhood-based solutions, and a chance to grow the next generation of environmental businesses.

Then the procurement language has to match that.

So I'm so excited to hear the new refuge collections participation and outline.

Our operating budget highlights modern systems, stronger data-driven work, and continued weekly recycling.

So much so the city is willing to fund it from multiple sources.

That tells me this work matters.

Why are you doing everything in the waste industry except for collecting trash?

The question stayed with me because it's the truth.

But sometimes what changes a business owner is not just policy, it's CM possibility.

When you can see growth in your industry, you start to think differently.

You start to build differently, and you start to believe that local businesses can do more.

This issue is not whether small or minority-owned companies can grow.

The bigger issue is whether the rules can the rules that are given give them a chance to.

And it connects to the bigger idea.

We buy clean trash.

We buy clean trash is a reward-based system for participation because trash is not just a disposal problem, it's a sorting problem, it's an education problem, and it's a logistics problem.

When we create cleaner streams, we create more diversion and better recovery and less pressure on our landfill.

So I'm asking counsel for two things.

First, let's visit Title 13 and make sure code reflects Columbus where Columbus is going and not where it's been.

Revisit RFP language is written so that sustainability is not something we talk about and goals, but something we build into access, collaboration, and smarter outcomes.

Technology and data tracking change are changing fast.

Diversion strategies should too.

And if Columbus wants to be serious about stewardship, then procurement must be created to include collaboration, support cost savings, and give local businesses a fear path to participate.

Well, thank you for being here and appreciate the work that you're doing out there.

I was gonna ask you when I saw you signed up.

These changes do you feel like gives smaller businesses an opportunity to kind of pick up work?

Yes.

These changes are so what um we've been advocating for from a smaller hauler community.

The reality is if you look over the bids over the last 10, 15 years, there's normally one or two people that they just kind of share wives with, right?

You get them for five years and then they share them back, but that also restricts the possibility of innovation.

That limits what we can do locally and how we can be flexible within, especially the multifamily community, which we have a hyper focus on.

Well, I appreciate you being here.

And as you're thinking, if you're seeing other things like in code that you think makes sense for changes to kind of add for additional innovation and additional ways in which smaller business owners can kind of get into the game of refuse collection.

Please reach out to our office and make some suggestions.

Uh Vice Chair, I don't know if you have any questions.

Thank you so much.

And we're so open to cab with the larger companies and work with the smaller companies as well.

Well, thank you for being here.

Thank you.

Uh at the start of the hearing, my office received no written testimony.

I will say everyone can review the presentations and testimony given today by visiting my webpage at uh Columbus.gov.

Uh, before we officially close out the hearing uh this evening, is there anyone else who would like to sign up and speak on any of the topics covered today?

Seeing no one, thank you, everyone.

Appreciate you being here.