The meeting of the parts, Arts and Culture Committee of Denver City Council.

Join us in the Parts Arts and Culture Committee starting now.

Parks Art and Culture Committee, the best committee.

And I will start with introductions with Council President to my left.

Thank you.

Good morning, Amanda Sandoval, Northwest Denver District 1.

Good morning, Garrett Watson, City Council District 9.

Good morning, Diana Romero Campbell, Southeast Denver District 4.

Great.

And I will just love to introduce our guests from CBCA.

If you can introduce yourself and your organization and go ahead and take it away.

Absolutely.

Where do I look?

Look at us.

Okay.

Sorry.

Hi everyone.

I'm Meredith Badler.

I'm the deputy director at the Colorado Business Committee for the Arts, the CBCA.

And I'm delighted to be with you today.

I have a bunch of data to share, but also some important stories, some calls to action, some ideas for you all to take back to your individual districts and collectively as Denver City Council and members of this committee.

Some things I think you'll be interested in.

So with that, I will I'll dive in.

So just a little bit about CBCA.

I'm actually with some familiar faces in the room.

But for those that don't know, CBCA is a nonprofit organization.

We're a 501c3.

So we are not part of city government or state government.

We're not a funder, which gives us a lot of flexibility to do the work we do, which is to advance Colorado's creative economy by connecting arts and business.

We do that on a statewide level, though we are based here in Denver, but we do get to travel around a bit.

And we've been doing that work for 40 years.

That's what this beautiful, beautiful graphic indicates there.

And we uh we're a membership organization.

We do advocacy research, which I'll share a little bit more about, uh various programs, training, arts engagement, and volunteer opportunities.

A little bit more, these are just some of our programs.

We're a small and mighty team of three that do a lot again on a uh metro and statewide level, again, connecting businesses and their employees to arts and culture, either through free tickets or leadership training.

We help artists with the business side of their practice, so connecting them to pro bono legal assistance or business skills trainings, and then we do uh advocacy work really to elevate arts, culture, and the creative industries and its value.

So, whether that's our economic research, which I'm here to talk about, actually lobbying a little bit at the state legislature, our annual business for the arts awards, and a variety of other things that we are honored to get asked to help with.

So, this is really what I'm here uh to share.

Um, CBCA has been quantifying the value of arts, culture, and scientific nonprofit organizations for over 30 years.

Uh, we have been doing this economic activity study every other year since 1993.

It has always been done in partnership with the SCFD, the scientific and cultural facilities district.

That's our special taxing district that covers the seven counties of the metro area that funds uh about 300 nonprofit organizations from the zoo and the Denver Art Museum and the Botanic Gardens to our mid-size organizations, the Symphony, the Colorado Ballet, to small community-based, all volunteer organizations in arts, culture, and the creative industries, arts, culture, and and science.

Uh, so we've been partnering with the SCFD uh to collect this data and talk about the impact of those organizations.

Uh what else do I want to say about this study?

Here we go.

So again, it's biennial.

This is who we're talking about.

Um, because we do this study every other year.

I'm gonna show you data from 2024, and then we're able to make comparisons back to the prior study, which had data from 2022, as well as 2019, as well as some of our longitudinal trends.

So, this report was really helping us look at sort of the impact of the pandemic and kind of that long tail and where we are now.

So you'll see us make comparisons to sort of pre-pandemic levels in 2019, that bounce back, and then I think 2025.

Anecdotally, we're seeing some of these trends continue, and some interesting and frankly concerning ways.

I think it's important just to also clarify what is not included in this study.

So this is just looking at those SCFD organizations.

So it doesn't include Red Rocks.

It doesn't include Taylor Swift at whichever arena she performed at.

So just know I'm gonna show you some uh what I think are pretty impressive numbers when we talk about economic impact and jobs and attendance in arts and culture, and just know that if we were to include the entire for-profit creative industries and beyond, those numbers would actually be exponentially larger.

Um any questions before I dive into the numbers?

You can just get through the presentation, we'll make people ask questions after.

Love it.

Thank you.

All right, let's see some big numbers.

Uh, so this is really the big one.

We quantify the total economic activity generated by those SCFD funded uh arts, culture, and scientific organizations, which totaled a whopping 3.12 billion dollars in economic activity.

If you don't remember any other number from today, remember this one.

It is almost pi, if that helps you remember 0.12, and that is billion with a B.

That is not a typo.

Um, and that we saw a huge increase over 2022 and a 36% increase over 2019.

Um, what is included in this number is uh direct and indirect spending from audiences, you and I, operations, what those organizations have to spend to keep the lights open and performances running and so on, as well as capital projects.

Um, so when you think about it, when you go, I live in District 7, so I'll shout out uh Swallow Hill.

If you go to a performance at Swallow Hill, you're paying for your ticket, maybe you're taking a kid to a class, maybe you're buying a subscription to go to several concerts, maybe you're seeing them out and about.

Um, but before and after that, maybe you're paying for a babysitter, maybe you're going out to dinner, maybe you're putting gas in your car, maybe you're taking out-of-town guests with you.

Uh, suddenly you are spending a lot more than that reasonable ticket cost.

And same for those organizations.

They have to pay for maintenance on their facilities, they have to pay their staff, they have to buy equipment, art supplies, uh, et cetera, instruments.

And because of that, that then fuels further into our economy.

Because that uh music teacher at Swallow Hill is getting paid and getting that job, she can go pay her mortgage and take her family to the Denver Art Museum and get dinner after the show, et cetera.

Um, so all of that is what gets us to this 3.12 billion dollars.

And you can see sort of how it breaks out there, really audience spending is the key here, and you're gonna hear me talk about that a lot because I think that's one of our really calls to action for our community and ourselves to get back out there.

No, those are very valuable dollars.

I would argue maybe the most valuable dollars, are the ones that aren't already here in the seven county district.

Um, so that total economic impact of cultural tourists was 692 million dollars.

That was also a record-breaking figure, also a significant increase over the past several years.

We saw a huge increase in international visitors in 2024, which is fabulous.

You better believe they're uh spending money at the airport, getting transportation around town, lodging, restaurants.

Um, so even if they're not coming here just for Pizarro at the Denver Art Museum, maybe they're here visiting family, maybe they're taking in an extra day before they go up to the mountains.

We're giving them something to do, another way to spend their time and their money when they are here in the area, and showing off our cultural assets.

Uh, I think there's still a perception that we don't have the arts and culture we do here in Denver and Colorado that rival the coasts, and we absolutely, we absolutely do, and we want to show that off.

Um, and there's a significant economic impact to that.

I'm gonna talk a little bit about attendance and education, how we're reaching uh people of all ages and getting them engaged in arts and culture.

So attendance was 14.5 million uh engagements in 2024.

That's a 12% increase over 2022, so still seeing that bounce back from the pandemic, which is wonderful.

However, we are still behind where we were in 2019.

2019 was a banner blockbuster year.

Um, but we also know attendance behavior has changed.

I work in the arts, and I can tell you, I don't attend as many things as I used to.

When we had our event to roll out this study uh just a month ago, one of our panelists made the comment that arts and culture used to be in competition with other leisure activities, you know, people hiking, spending times in our parks, doing, you know, going to sporting events.

We are now in an era where we're in competition with the couch of people just leaving their home and that extra effort, the extra time, the extra cost, um, putting on real pants.

Um, it's it's a true thing.

Um, so we're not, you know, this is something we're gonna continue to pay attention to.

Again, looking, thinking back to that audience spending, there's an economic uh effect when we're not out attending things as much as we used to, as well.

Um, so this is something we're paying close attention to.

However, I have to say this because it's what it's the second, if you don't remember, if this is the second thing you remember, this is what it will be.

Um our research analysts also uh calculated the total attendance at our major sporting events in 2024.

So when you combine total in-person attendance at the Broncos, Avalanche, Nuggets, Rapids, and Rockies, it equaled only 4.9 million in 2024.

This is three times as much attendance.

And we love them.

It is not, it is not a competition.

There's time and place for both.

But if you think about it, how many times a year are the Broncos in town?

And how much can you literally walk within a mile of where we are right now, and how many different performances or museums can you attend just in a one mile radius from the city building?

And how much more accessible are those opportunities as well?

And I could go on and on about the other benefits of participating in arts and culture.

Um, we are doing really great though in how we're reaching our youth and school children.

We were delighted to see these numbers continue to increase.

This was something we were definitely watching post-pandemic of how we were bringing arts and culture back into schools, into classrooms, field trips.

Um, so delighted to see uh four and a half million educational experiences, again, um consistent increases over 2019 and 2022.

Talk a little bit about jobs.

I think it's important for people to realize that arts culture and these scientific organizations are major employers.

This is a workforce sector, and it's not just musicians and artists.

These are accountants, marketers, uh, executives, people at all levels.

Um, and we continue to see record breaking numbers in total jobs in arts and culture.

So 14,466, an 8% increase over 2019.

So again, further than we were before the pandemic.

And this does include full-time, part-time, and contract workers.

So we know a lot of people, particularly artists, performers are working several jobs at once.

So that's counted here.

However, again, the flip side to this.

So that 8% increase in total jobs from 2019, there was a 46% increase in total personnel costs from 2019.

So it's wonderful we should be paying our cultural workers, our artists, our nonprofit professionals more.

They deserve it.

They work hard.

But this becomes an operational challenge for many of these organizations when jobs are in or personnel costs are increasing at this rate.

There's a lot of things that factor into this.

This is fairly nuanced, but in general, we just know it costs more to hire people and run these organizations these days.

I know then also again thinking back to our attendance numbers lagging.

That was something we saw post-pandemic, and we're continuing to see that sort of misalignment at the moment.

So how, aside from earned income, what are the contributed income sources for these cultural organizations?

Aggregate and then by their source.

So aggregate, 286 million dollars contributed to cultural organizations in 2024.

And there was a slight dip there compared to 2022, and really this the primary reason for that is federal support related to the pandemic that went away.

So in 2022, we saw a massive influx of federal support to help organizations make it through some pretty dark times.

Those were one-time grants, those were ARPA funds, those were shuttered venue operator grants.

You know, it was incredible to see that level of support, but we knew that was one-time giving.

And unsurprisingly, that went away.

We saw a 90% decrease in support from the federal government between 2022 and 2024.

So that's largely where that dip comes from.

We did see a nice increase from donation uh from individual donations from people, you and I, um, and foundations, those increased uh 10% and 36% respectively.

Um, however, corporate giving only increased about 4% from 2022 to 2024.

So you can see here sort of those breakdown by total.

So these are the 2024 numbers, how much money came in from all of those different uh categories, and then here you can see them as relative percentages of the whole.

I will say corporate giving has always been one of the smallest uh slices of the pie.

Um, I as this Colorado Business Committee for the Arts, we pay very close attention to this.

This is something we absolutely believe is an important call to action to our business community.

Um, and I think it's also important to see the role that state and local government is doing to help fill some of that gap.

Um, and that's a number we've seen increase over the years, which is great.

Uh, and then I'll mention that I'm gonna go back, 85 million dollars from this SCFD, the Scientific and Cultural Facilities District.

That is the single largest funding source for arts and culture in the region.

It is the second largest uh dedicated uh taxing district for arts and culture in the country.

$85 million dollars, that's 30% of the pie.

That is incredible.

That is is truly sustaining culture for all.

Um, and we'll be, you'll be hearing a lot more about it.

I think Andrea will be coming to this committee in February.

In February, great.

I mean, she'll be talking about that road to reauthorization.

As voters, as citizens in the seven county area, we get a chance to take a look at that statute and reaffirm it in two years in 2028.

That's two years, three years.

So yeah, I just think it's important.

Again, there's some big numbers here, there's some exciting stories here, but I do also believe there's a call to action here.

There are some concerning trends around some of that philanthropy and giving numbers, some of that attendance numbers.

It really takes all of us to do what we can in our capacity as elected officials, as our capacity as community members, as neighbors, as donors, as people who love and support the arts.

You wouldn't be on this committee if you didn't do what we can to keep us moving in the right direction.

That was just a snapshot.

I did bring copies of our one pager in both English and in Spanish.

There's a 20-page white paper research report.

If you want, there's tons of graphs and longitudinal data.

I encourage you to dig into that if you'd like.

I wanted to end with just this one piece.

We did about a year and a half of community engagement to ask people what they wanted in terms of policy priorities for our arts, culture, and creative industries.

And I just wanted to share with you the high-level framework.

I think, again, as you are hearing this data and thinking, what can I do?

What can we do?

These are some of the things that we heard from people around the state that they were most interested in from a policy perspective.

So making sure our communities had accessible and thriving arts and culture that community members felt that they could easily participate in and that enriched their neighborhoods, supporting our creative economy.

So really looking at this information and making sure our creative economy has a seat at the table and is getting valued and supported in that way.

That's so we're supporting creative workers, the actual individuals who are making uh these creative products that are providing that for us, that they can stay in Denver and stay in Colorado and thrive here.

Um, and then the last one here is related to arts education.

So again, I highlighted what our SCFD organizations are doing with school children, but there's a lot more that can be done to make sure uh arts education is again equitable and accessible across the state.

So I'll go back here for now.

Um, but yeah, would love to answer questions or see what else I can share.

Great.

Thank you so much, Meredith.

This one's amazing, and also I wish everyone that presented had an improv background because it's so engaging.

Um, benefits of theater, the benefits of the arts right in front of our eyes.

Um I also want to welcome Councilwoman Parity and Councilwoman Lewis to the meeting.

Thank you for joining us.

And Councilman Heinz.

Forgot you weren't here in the beginning either.

Um we'll start with questions with Councilman Heinz.

Okay, thank you.

Um, I'm I wouldn't be here without for the arts.

Um, I was a state-level debater in high school in Texas, which state uh junior senior high school.

Uh, our debate coach required us to uh compete in individual individual events as well, which I do not want to do, but I did it anyway because uh because I wanted it to be.

Um I have a computer science degree in MG and finance.

Um I don't use either of those really.

Um, I will do a little bit of financial analysis uh some of the numbers that you presented, but um uh but the the thing that the one skill, the one taught skill I use the most here is that debate train.

Yeah, um yeah, as an elected official in factor.

So uh my interest in uh you know in arts and um maybe I um uh interpret our proclamations uh a little differently than than a lot of people as opposed to reading them like whereas, you know, we're just trying to uh to highlight the um you know that it is a proclamation uh a little bit more, and a lot of that's from those individual events that my debate could be uh participated in.

So I love that.

Yeah, playing tax phone for decade.

Um I was a radio DJ uh for in college.

Um my grandfather was an art dealer.

Um, where I actually can scratch that.

We're on the record, because he's he's no longer with us on this planet, so um there's no way to hold him accountable.

But uh but yeah, you had an art um pretty magnificent art collection.

Um so anyway, thank you for sharing that.

The uh the some of the you talked about attendance is down, I think 5.1% over 2018.

Um, and uh and yet revenue is quite a bit up.

So that suggests to me that dollar per person is going up.

Um is that am I gathering that right, or is there another something?

Yeah, so our economic activity numbers, that sort of audience spending.

There's an added multiplier that gets put on that.

So what I showed you was not just the pure dollars, not just like these are subscription sales or ticket sales or so on.

Um we use multipliers from the US Bureau of Economic Analysis.

We are the researchers that we hire, not me.

Um use that to calculate that indirect impact.

So that's so it's not quite um, yeah, that indirect those indirect multipliers are added on to that.

Um, but you know, I think many of these organizations are offering free opportunities, they're offering reduced priced opportunities, but again, they got to keep the lights on as well.

So yeah, they have to also be you know looking at pricing and finding ways, maybe they're offering one fewer performance a year, but they're charging more for it.

Um so there's there's definitely a calculation there.

Does that answer your question?

Uh sort of maybe.

Um, but you reminded me of some, I mean, there's a bit of art in financial analysis too.

So my you know, the my MBA was more in the corporate finance side, so financial planning and analysis, and and trying to convert, you know, to answer questions, um, you convert it to a common language, which is dollars, you know, and so like should we buy this company, should we uh diverge this part of the business or sorry, digest this part of the business.

Um, you want to come up with some sort of financial analysis, and a lot of that's including assumptions.

So to your point, um, you know, you're adding some assumptions of uh the the number of attendees, then you add an assumption that is based in based on those multipliers, yeah.

And we, you know, we trust the BEA.

Sure.

Yeah, I mean, you you've got to do something.

I mean you can't just say it's just impossible for us to, you know, technically people want to know what the economic impact is and what the economic difference is from year to year.

So, you know, the difference in economic impact, but that is a bit of art as well.

Sure.

So um the the in addition to um the the dollar per um attendee that just that just kind of stuck out in my head, there was also um uh the the numbers were up so much.

When I thought about dollar for attendee, I was like, you know, it's harder to live on a dollar.

I mean, you can't buy two dollars with a dollar these days.

I mean, it's you know, I mean you can't buy a dollar with two dollars.

Sorry, the joke is lost when you can't deliver it directly.

But um uh but the the idea is there's a there's been a lot of inflation since we can I team.

And I wonder if uh if you or the experts have done the analysis of um that inflation adjusted change.

It's a good question.

I believe our numbers take that into consideration.

Um I'd have to double check and get back to you, which I'm happy to do.

I think you see that in our personnel costs though.

I mean, that's I think where you're seeing that cost of living increase, you know, as these organizations are hiring more full-time staff, which is amazing.

Um, one of the things I I didn't mention, the percentage of SCFD organizations that are all volunteer is decreasing, which means more of these organizations are able to hire a part time executive director, their first full-time executive director, they're set you know, they're able to grow and hire more staff, which is incredible.

That's what we want.

We want these organizations to be able to be professional and have the capacity to thrive, but that means they're paying people and they're paying people more than they did in 2019 because of that cost of living.

So that's really what, yeah, absolutely.

So that's really what part of what I'm sharing is sort of that call to action of like if our support of them is increasing at the rate that it takes them to deliver a performance or an exhibit, that's gonna be a challenge.

Well, we have so many artists that are just so fabulous at what they do and are just struggling to pay rent every month too.

You know, the the idea of a starving artist, I mean, is like if I created art in the same way that everyone else saw the world, then wouldn't really be as um uh as you know alluring as if um I was an artist that saw the world in a slightly different way, yeah than everyone else.

And uh but if you see the world in a different perspective, uh it's harder to do a job in a normal way, um, because you know, your gift is also a curse.

Um you see things different and um yeah, it's harder to translate your gift into yeah, finding the audience for it.

And that's why I shared that policy framework because I think again, this this study is very much looking at just those nonprofit organizations funded by the SCFD, but there are a lot of other factors at play of if musicians can't afford to live in Denver, how are we going to continue to support some of these organizations?

I mean, there's related related factors.

Well, no, with that, I don't expect you to have the numbers because your analysis is you're you know, you're doing what you're doing, but I wonder what the cost of living change is uh from 2019 to 2024 in Denver.

And wonder if that's close to 43 percent.

That is really interesting.

I'm gonna make a note of that for our next study and see if that's something we can work in.

Thank you for bringing that up.

Thank you.

I actually need to like write that down because I will forget it.

Thank you so much, councilman.

Um next we have Councilman Watson.

Uh thank you, committee chair, and thank you, Meredith.

And uh I'll concur with the committee chair.

Your improv skills are amazing.

I love the energy, uh, even the juice in the slides, how your slides are these boring blue or gray slides.

I mean, I just think uh you brought it.

You brought the juice.

Um CBCA was one of the uh the uh organizations I had the most fun and enriching experience as a board member, and I loved uh uh co-creating with you and the board um uh for CBCA for a few years.

One of the things that we looked at when I was on that board was a strategic uh view on uh justice, equity, diversity, and inclusion.

Uh expansive outside of the SCFDs, but uh statewide.

I was curious if you wanted to share a little bit of some of those without having to give any numbers, because that's your report is specific to SCFD, but really how is that work looking statewide as far as ensuring that we're elevating art um for folks um in diverse communities and supporting them?

If you don't mind sharing maybe some anecdotes on that good work that CBCA does.

Thank you.

Um I appreciate that.

I mean, I think the the development of that policy framework really speaks to that.

We went um literally out of our way to go to some far reaching corners of the state uh to hear from communities.

Uh I think our focus group for that in the Roaring Fort Valley was almost all uh it was almost all Latina women, which was amazing and a very fascinating conversation and a huge part of particularly that community.

We went uh to La Junta and spoke to folks on the Eastern Plains, which is a very different uh environment.

Um so I think it's it's really showing up for CBCA in some of our in our community engagement and reach like proactively reaching out and physically going to those places to hear directly about their priorities.

Uh our advocacy work is really where a lot of our emphasis on equity and inclusion is showing up.

Our top level values for that policy framework relate to policy priorities that are culturally responsive and relevant to people in the state, and that also making sure that arts and culture is truly for all, and that speaks to accessibility as well as representation, as well as content.

Um, and I think in this area, when we talk about freedom of creative expression, um, that is also part of the dialogue.

I love that, Meredith, and I think the just the name, the Colorado Business Committee for the Arts, the fact that you don't uh cease any ground to the very clear eyed business focus of what arts do to enrich the lives of folks across not just Denver, but the state.

I love this report.

Um, I love the ability when I was working at that large company I was at when I was on um your um board, that we are able to communicate the benefits not just to folks wanting to move to Denver, but also the benefit of arts and culture as it pertains to really a healthy city.

Yeah, and how you um CBCA always reflects that without losing the art focus, but also making sure the bottom line of our businesses are directly impacted.

So thank you so much, Meredith, for your good work and your excitement and enthusiasm that you bring to this uh everything that CBCA does.

So thank you.

Thank you, Amen Chair.

Thank you.

Um, Councilwoman Romero Campbell.

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Um, and thank you for the presentation.

It's interesting to see we oftentimes just get Denver specific information and to look at the regional impact of the arts.

Is um great.

I was actually looking at the report because I then I wanted to disaggregate the Denver and know specifically for Denver what uh what that impact was.

So I'm looking through the report.

Is that part of the report or you don't?

You just keep it as a whole.

Yeah, and very intentionally so actually.

I mean, we get that question a lot.

You better believe Boulder County wants to see their numbers, Jefferson County wants to see their numbers, tier twos want to see their numbers, visual arts wants to see their numbers.

You know, I think one of one of the many values of the FCFD is how it promotes regional collaboration, and it's actually like baked into how some of these organizations get funded, is demonstrating that they're reaching people and serving people across counties, within their neighborhoods, within their counties, and across, and that they're collaborating with organizations across county and across discipline.

Um, and we all are cultural omnivores ourselves and cross those boundaries.

So we very intentionally don't disaggregate it because we think that regional approach is so important.

So I apologize.

You will not see that the report.

It's worth it for the cultural omnivore.

That's awesome.

Um you also collect uh information about who is accessing the high west.

Yes, the control.

Yes and no.

So we have the benefit of this report.

Um, our data collection method uh comes directly from those SCFD grant reports.

So every organization that gets funding from the SCFD has to fill out a final grant report no matter what tier.

All of that data then comes to us.

So for my my data friends in the room, that is a 100% response rate on our survey, because they have to fill it out, but it also means we're beholden to what the SCFD asks.

And so while they do ask some questions about demographics, they don't get super granular, not every organization answers it, not every organization answers it the same way.

It is something we have spoken to them about for years because we want to be able to say who was included in that 14 and a half million.

And we have some anecdotal information and some qualitative information, but we can't give you sort of hard and fast numbers, at least not across all of those organizations.

Okay.

I wish we could again, it's something we're continuing to talk to them about.

Ask Andrea about it when she's here in February.

Um particularly for the smaller organizations.

Some of them just don't have the capacity to be collecting that.

Yeah, no, I I appreciate that.

And I, you know, you don't want to overtax the um the burden for the organizations to have to do that reporting, but sometimes just that supplemental, like, and if you have the time, a supplemental piece to that report.

And I think, and I I haven't looked at it closely.

I again, I think some the tier different tiers are asked different things, but for for us to be able to aggregate it in total, we haven't been able to, other than, and there is some stuff in that report, I believe, about some of the qualitative analysis that we've gotten, but not necessarily like percentages.

Um, thank you.

Yeah.

The last question I had was if you are, so it's next year that you will be doing this report or do they collect it'll come at the end of next.

This came out last month.

So the next one would happen in 2026.

7.

No.

2027 with data from 26.7 for data 26.

Okay.

And that will be the last report before the reauthorization.

So that would be an important one.

All right.

Maybe already.

Yeah.

Okay.

Thank you.

You're welcome.

Thank you so much.

Um, that's all I had so far.

Uh, but I just wanted to say thank you so much.

This is amazing.

I really feel that the arts are medicine and healing for community.

It supports mental health, which is a big concern that I've heard from our youth.

Um, and I would love to be able to take theater into schools.

A lot of the schools don't provide arts education anymore, and that is what got me through.

And as a young child on the spectrum, I learned a lot from those trips to the Museum of Nature and Science or the Art Museum that I couldn't learn in a classroom the way someone else might be able to learn.

And so I think this is really important to look at the dollar amount because we talk about economics a lot, and I remember when I was a little girl and I told my parents I wanted to be an actress when I grew up, and they said that will not make you any money.

The chances of you being able to make a living are very rare, and um, I'm doing improv just like you.

And um, I really think about children not being able to live out their dreams or being told that they can't live out their dreams, and a lot of our communities not being reflected in the arts community, and I am very proud of the work that Denver has done, and I think SCFD has a lot to do with it.

All these organizations have a lot to do with it.

You mentioned Swallow Hill in District 7, which does our um education for kids all the way through adults, and so I really appreciate you all elevating this and studying this in such a meaningful way.

Um, one of the things that I am concerned about personally, and I know Councilman Watson's probably concerned as well because I know the Park Hill music festival is no longer happening.

I lost the underground music showcase.

This was the last year that we uh will have that, and youth on record is a tier three um or maybe tier two.

Um, but I'm curious how are we quantifying those performance-based uh groups so that we can make sure that we are elevating that as well.

I think we've done a really good job in Denver with you know the bond initiative where we have physical art and physical art, and and we have the tier ones that everyone knows, but how are we elevating those tier and building capacity in those tier ones?

And did is that anything?

Is there any part of your study that kind of talks about that?

Yeah, I don't know if it's something necessarily in our study, but I think you hit on a good point of sort of supporting those grassroots initiatives, those community-based initiatives.

Um, I think some of that goes to what we're seeing in trends of giving.

A lot of those, you know, they don't have tons of capacity, they're not applying for or getting huge grants.

Um, I do think uh Denver Arts and Venues does an incredible job of supporting some of those grassroots uh community-based festivals and opportunities.

Um, for example, I know uh one of the recipients of arts and venues grants this year was the Kiss Fist Mural Festival.

It was in the Rhino Art Park, and it was the first of its kind mural festival exclusively for deaf artists.

So, like that, and you know, it was run by an artist who herself, both of her parents um are deaf and has just supported that community, and she's a muralist and saw that gap and was able to get some funding uh from the city to support that.

But I know there were other grants that she applied for that she couldn't get or was or was denied for, and was just like a person on her own trying to figure that out, and that takes a lot of um capacity building, professional development to do that kind of work, working with the city to figure out I'm sure permitting for various things.

Um so there's a lot that the city can do, both in terms of policy permitting, professional development, as well as funding to help make sure those organizations can start and flourish and thrive.

Really, those first few years are the hardest.

Um, you know, you have to be in existence for five years before you can even apply and be eligible for SCFD funding.

So that's a really critical and difficult time for some of these um again, grassroots community-based initiatives, and then for some of the larger ones that have been around for a while, it became becomes challenges again of sustainability of cost of living, you know, the cost of every porta potty at a festival you better believe goes up every year.

Um, so keeping keeping pace with that.

And then again, thinking about you and I as cultural consumers, making sure we're showing up.

Um, we're showing up, we're buying our our beer or our iced tea, we're buying t-shirts, we're tipping the band.

Um, again, that's on us to show up in that level of support.

Yeah, I appreciate that.

I think when I think about the underground music showcase, there was an emphasis on accessibility.

Absolutely.

There was an emphasis on artists being paid a livable wage and the hands.

Um, and so that all created a cost that was no longer sustainable.

Um, and so thinking about how we find those funding sources that you're talking about, whether it's FDF SCFD or maybe we need to lean more on corporate sponsors, but the fear is always then they disagree with you and pull out, right?

We've seen that happen.

Very volatile.

And we cannot be coming and going at the whims of the political spectrum all of a sudden it's not cool to support communities of color, you know, and so um, I think that's where government really needs to step in, and why I'm so proud of this work.

So thank you so much for uplifting this and coming um to our committee today.

And um there's nothing on consent, so with that we'll be adjourned.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Um,