Happy budget hearing day.

One of my favorite days of the year.

Always great to see you.

The floor is yours.

I appreciate that.

Thank you, Council President.

And I'll actually start talking respecting everyone's time.

So good morning.

Thank you to this honorable body for the opportunity to present to you today.

My name is Julianne Pastoral.

I'm the director of the Department of Appeals and Hearings.

I'm honored to be here with my colleague Letitia Perry.

I'm also joined by attorney Joylin Hunt and Mika Smith behind me.

They're my managers at DAH who make up my executive management team.

Before diving into my presentation, I'd like to thank the OCFO, in particular Malcolm Walker, Rachel Wood, Matthew Spaith, and Interim Budget Director Donnie Johnson for their invaluable support and assistance during this budget process.

I also want to recognize all of my colleagues at DAH.

This presentation reflects their hard work and dedication to the city.

Lastly, I acknowledge receipt of the budget questions from LPD earlier this week.

I will be providing written answers to those to this honorable body as soon as possible.

DAH's strategic priorities include further expanding equitable access to justice and continuing to modernize our operations through process improvements.

This will be accompanied by a forthcoming request to this honorable body for a new case management system software.

And let's start with who we are.

For those of you not familiar with DAH that can hear my voice, we are the city's independent administrative hearings bureau established under state law and the Detroit City Code.

Our goal and mission is to provide fair, timely, and impartial hearings while assuring that city ordinances are enforced through an accessible and transparent process.

DAH performs three core functions.

First, blight court, second, administrative appeals hearings, and third, blight clearance certifications.

DAH provides an opportunity to challenge blight tickets.

We also have the authority to determine compliance and uphold fines and fees.

The five-step process through our blight court is first, a ticket is issued by B seed or DPD, which includes a hearing date.

Second, at the hearing, both the city and the respondent have an opportunity to pre opportunity to present evidence and testimony regarding their position.

Third, the hearing officer will make a determination based on the evidence presented and issue a judgment such as not responsible or responsible.

Individuals can appeal responsible judgments to the Third Circuit Court.

And lastly, DH takes affirmative steps to collect unpaid judgment.

Post and judge post-judgment enforcement activities include collections activity and the filing of liens or garnishments.

Moving on to numbers.

Tickets in fiscal year 25 decreased by 44,000 compared to the previous fiscal year.

Either through an admission of responsibility on the part of the property owner or through dismissal through by the ticket issuing agency, such as when compliance is achieved prior to the hearing.

As to fiscal year 25 revenue, the total amount of judgments issued was 18.4 million dollars.

DAH collected 5.6 million, which was 5% over the adopted budget, resulting in an overall collection rate of 30%.

And before we leave this slide, I did want to highlight that this uh artwork is one of our murals completed by local artist Kayleen Abernathy or Free Love K as part of the Detroit Artist Apprenticeship Program City Walls Initiative.

I got that correct.

Next is our administrative appeals bureau.

This bureau reviews certain decisions made by city departments and agencies.

If a decision is eligible to appeal to DAH, the decision will include how to request a hearing and the deadline for filing that appeal.

Through this process, DAH provides an independent forum where individuals and businesses can present evidence and have those decisions reviewed by an independent administrative hearings officer.

Examples of decisions that come before the administrative appeals bureau are business license determinations, emergency demolition designations, and business and building closures.

This photo, the photo on this slide, I just want to briefly highlight is local artist Armadeash Roy and his mentor Grabster working on another DAH mural.

We're very proud to have in our public space.

Now we'll move on to administrative appeal statistics.

The total number of matters doubled over the prior fiscal year.

While we saw reductions in recreational marijuana license, sign variants and pre-compliance review appeals, business license matters increased sevenfold, emergency demolition hearings more than tripled.

And we also started tracking business closure hearings.

DH is also responsible for issuing blight clearance certifications.

This is the first year we are including this core function in our budget budget presentation to City Council, and we're very excited to present this information.

These certifications confirm that no outstanding blight fines or fees exist for any property currently or previously owned within the city of Detroit.

There is no fee for filing a blight clearance application.

In fiscal year 25, as part of a process improvement initiative, we moved the blight clearance application process online to make it easier and more accessible.

We also transitioned the Wayne County Treasurer tax foreclosure auction blight clearance process to a dedicated online application as well.

Blight clearances are required in several key circumstances.

For example, to obtain business licenses, permits, certificates of compliance or variances from BSEED when engaging in procurement activities with the Office of Contracting and Procurement, including bidding on contracts and being awarded city contracts, for participation in the Wayne County Treasurer tax foreclosure auction, where a blight clearance is required both to bid on properties as well as to receive a deed, and also to purchase real property from either the City of Detroit or the Detroit Land Bank Authority.

Let's examine our blight clearance activity.

Since implementing our process improvements of November 2024, DH has processed more than 4,400 applications.

64% or more than 2800 of those have been resulted in a granted clearance.

18% have been denied.

When an application is denied, the applicant receives a blight clearance report outlining the outstanding issues and next steps.

While we communicate that processing generally occurs within three business days, our current processing time stands at one day.

And again, just highlighting that our turnaround time can vary, so we encourage any applicants to submit their request as soon as they are aware a clearance may be required.

As part of the initiative, we also added a blight property history report for those that are potentially selling or buying property in the city that will give a complete blight history of outstanding judgments on that particular process property.

With that inaugural overview of our blight clearance activity, I'd like to now turn to the staff who make our work possible.

For fiscal year 27, DAH has 19 FTEs and a total expenditure of 2.2 million dollars.

This represents an increase of $104,000 over the prior fiscal year.

This increase incorporates funding for two positions into date DAH's baseline budget that were previously ARPA funded.

We have one vacancy with interviews in progress.

The next slide is our fiscal year 27 organizational chart for your reference.

Our one vacancy is represented near the top right, which is for my administrative assistant position.

That individual will also be processing blight clearances and motions, and as you can imagine, my whole team is eager to complete that interview process and fill that role as soon as possible.

During the previous fiscal year, several enhancements were implemented, including our public-facing motion and blight clearance initiatives.

DAH has also reinstated the filing of liens and introduced text messaging as a communication method for individuals with unpaid judgments and collections.

Our training and community outreach efforts support all three of our core functions and will continue moving forward.

In the coming weeks, DAH will be submitting two contracts to this honorable body for consideration.

The first would be the new case management system software, and the second contract is a request to extend our collections contract.

Looking ahead, our future goals include launching the community blight court, rotating through council district, and finalizing our website redesign to further improve resident access to not only information but our services.

Community engagement is a core priority for DAH.

In addition to participating in both citywide and district-specific events, including city council and mayoral community meetings, DH staff has taken part in a variety of outreach efforts, including the Department of Neighborhoods Doncass, as well as B Seeds Landlord Tenant Fair, and the Assessors Faith-Based Event and several other community programs.

We are already saw the photos that we participated in the City Walls Initiative program, and we support the shadow program as well as the mayoral fellowship.

Finally, we're committed to supporting and encouraging our staff and their own professional development, recognizing that their growth strengthens both our department and the services we provide to residents.

I want to briefly highlight our text messaging messaging initiative for unpaid judgments.

These messages are being sent directly by our collections law firm.

And because protecting residents from scams is so important, several safeguards are built into the system that I'd like to highlight today.

Messages are sent using a verified short code.

That's the first green circle at the top of the uh sample message all the way to the left.

It's a type of secure number used for bank authentication and uh bank alerts, making them more reliable and harder to spoof.

In the second green circle, you can see that each message clearly identifies the respondent by name, the recipient by name includes a valid 1-800 number to the uh to the vendor and link to that firm's official website.

We also provide full transparency, including disclosure links, a frequently asked questions section link, and a very simple opt-out option.

And finally, the law firm's branding appears on each message at the very bottom, the final green circle.

So recipients know who the message is coming from, and language on DH website confirms that we use text messaging and includes this branding and information as well, so that people can feel comfortable.

Moving on to DAH's overall budget, proposed expenditures of 2.4 million and revenue of 5.9 million have been identified for fiscal year 27.

Some highlights from our budget breakdown.

As I noted earlier, the increase in salaries and benefits reflects the incorporation of the two ARPA funded positions into the D DAH baseline budget.

Can you flip thank you?

Thank you, Letija.

There is a slight reduction in operating supplies of approximately $3,000.

The training budget under other expenses has been removed, and professional contractual services, operating services, and equipment acquisition remain unchanged.

For my final slide, I invite the public to connect with DAH online via telephone at DivDAC kiosk located throughout the city or in person in suite 1004 on the 10th floor of the Colminay Young Municipal Center.

I would like to thank OCFO for their support in this process.

And I also want to uplift and acknowledge my staff again and express my gratitude for the dedication and they talent and talent they bring to their work every day.

Lastly, I'd like to thank this honorable body for its time.

I am confident that DAA can operate, which in within the fiscal year 27 budget as proposed, and I welcome your questions and comments.

Thank you, Director Pastula.

Appreciate it as always.

I'm going to start down to my left, and that's Member McCampbell.

Thank you.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Good morning, Director.

Good morning, everyone.

Um good to see you all.

I just had um I have a few questions, but wondering, I guess I'll use one of my questions wrong on the text message messaging system.

Um definitely appreciate like if someone goes to the website to see those legitimate but wonder is there anything that we could put in that text message to say like on behalf of the city of Detroit or on behalf of um the department just because you may have I'd go on to the website is just an extra step, and I folks may ignore that aspect, even with a law firm that they may not be familiar with.

Right, and through through the uh chair to um council member McCamill, that's an excellent question.

And the sample that we provided was contrasting toll booths and a California court.

Our text messages do um incorporate Department of Appeals in hearings, and we'll make sure uh that that on behalf of language can be added as well.

We'll reach out to our collections law firm.

Thank you for thank you.

Thank you.

And uh additional question on wondering around are there and maybe uh apologize uh you might have a uh exhibit on this, but if you can just go further into what type, what is the highest amount of appeals that our appeals are you all seeing?

Um and are if you could just go deeper into um maybe some of those the reasoning that is coming out of those as you all are finding if that makes sense.

Sorry, I'm all jumping around that, but just uh the most type of uh the highest amount of appeals and that type that you're hearing, and if there's any uh reason that you have all have identified that it may be coming up, and the reason I asked that that uh maybe we could get to the bottom of the need of folks not having to appeal to you all with that.

So I um just referencing back to the slide uh that was setting forth our administrative appeal numbers.

The highest uh number of appeal we're reaching at this point is for our business license determinations, so those would be um an opportunity for individuals or businesses that receive letters from B seeds business license center, that their business license is either suspended, revoked, or denied, and they would have that opportunity to appeal that decision to DAH and have a hearing uh in front of a hearing officer.

So that would be the the number one reason that we're seeing uh in in that bureau.

Okay, thank you.

And and I see also the um dangerous buildings number up there as well.

And uh Dove has some questions around um what we're seeing in dangerous buildings as well with PHS, uh, but I know that is more appropriate for BC.

So thank you all so much.

I appreciate it.

Thank you.

And um Council President, uh, again to address the council member McCampbell's concerns.

Uh DH does serve as the the hearing uh stage before those dangerous buildings hearings uh go to council and uh for appeal.

I don't know, Joelyn, if you had anything you wanted to add for dangerous buildings or sure.

The dangerous buildings appeals do come before our tribunal before they become before you and our hearing officers work with the constituents or the citizens to try to work with BC to make those buildings safe, and more times than not, those buildings are made safe.

And so once they're made safe, BC will remove them from the dangerous building docket so that you all do not have to see those.

So typically very few come through from what I am aware of to the council.

Hopefully that was responsive.

No, it was.

Thank you.

I appreciate it.

Thank you all so much.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

All right, thank you.

Uh member Benson.

Thank you.

Thank you all for being here today.

Um, like to see these numbers.

You all are an actual uh revenue stream for the city of Detroit, i.e., you bring more revenue in than we than you expend to our general funds.

Number one, thank you for that.

Looking at your blight court ticket numbers, uh looking at like tickets issued by B seed or DPD for 2025, 77,000 um tickets adjudicated by your team, 60,000.

So we got about a 17,000 ticket delta there.

What what happens to those tickets?

How do you count for those?

Thank you both.

Through the chair to council member Benson, thank you.

And before um I respond to the blight ticket uh number question, which is a an excellent question, let me just touch on the revenue um the revenue aspect.

So our our role that and the critical role we provide is the opportunity for anyone that receives an alleged blight violation to come and have their hearing and challenge that blight violation.

Prior to that hearing, we encourage uh individuals to contact the ticket issuing agency to discuss compliance uh and if the ticket issuing agency could um work with that individual uh prior to the DH hearing.

So while we do acknowledge that that we are a source of revenue for the city, our goal and our mission is to provide impartial hearings, and the more people that attend their hearings, uh we welcome that.

That's why we're here and and we'd love to see those numbers uh increase.

As to the number of blight tickets, so the difference between the tickets adjudicated, uh, which as council member Benson noted uh was uh just over um sixty thousand and the it tickets issued by B seed and DPD was just over 77,000.

The difference between those numbers represents those tickets that were either uh the property owner admitted responsibility and paid before the hearing date, you receive a 10% discount and that fine if you pay before the hearing date.

For example, um I know uh most everyone here has heard a community presentation where I talk about Betty Blight.

If Betty Blake gets an excessive weed ticket and she says, you know, that's that's true.

My my property had uh the grass was over, you know, six, eight inches tall, ten inches tall, and I receive that ticket, I'm gonna pay the ticket of $50.

It would receive a 10% reduction, and then of course, have that lawn mode.

Um, so it would either be that an admission of a responsibility, council member Benson, or it would be an instance as I highlighted, we really encourage people when you receive a correction order from B seed when you receive a ticket from BC or DPD to reach out to them to discuss compliance.

So the before the hearing, the ticket issuing agencies can dismiss tickets, and then that would account for that number differentiation that it was not adjudicated.

The hearing never happened.

So all 17,000 are accounted for either somebody came in and paid before it came to your hearing, or they admitted um responsibility and paid the reduced amount.

Correct.

They either paid in advance or or the ticket was missed dismissed by the ticket issuing agency.

DH does not dismiss tickets.

Okay.

And then is that a warning to our residents?

Oh, I we hold hearings.

Um then looking at your blight court uh total judgments 18.4 million, then total amount collected 5.6 million, about a 30% collection rate.

Correct.

So what's the what's that's a 70% Delta?

You can act either say a 30% is a great collection rate, or you're gonna say a non-70% non-collection rate is a terrible.

So help me to understand the numbers here.

Excellent.

Uh so through through council president, the chair, uh, to council member Benson again.

So I again I want to highlight that that our our goal is for an increase in in hearings, whether that results in a not responsible determination and no fees or penalties are owed, or whether that results in a responsible by determination decision and and there are and the fines and penalties are upheld by the hearing officers.

So the total judgment amount um and the 30% collection rate.

I would like to say that we've we've seen a trend towards increased collection rates since since I've uh been appointed director.

I think that that is again through our community outreach.

We're trying to get people to engage more with our department and and trying to make it easier for people to access the services of our department and attend hearings.

We've also increased and implemented enhanced collection efforts, more streamlined communication protocols, and more clear uh more clear direction, in my opinion, to uh those that come in front of front of our department.

So I think all of those things are working together to again increase that collection rate.

Um the 70 percent, again, as you noted that the flip side of that, those are still valid and enforceable judgments, and we have uh instituted um filing of liens, and we've got increased garnishment filings.

So again, when I say come to your hearing, please do not ignore blight tickets, please do not ignore blight judgments.

Um the DH process, you know, we want uh everybody to engage and participate in that process and prevert preserve their rights.

Is that responsive, Councilmember Benson?

Very responsive.

Okay, thank you.

Just for my own notification, then the 70% non-collection are all of those dollars accounted for either through there's a list pendants or a lien or some other item.

I just want to make sure that these don't law they didn't pay oh well that we're at least doing something to hold people accountable.

So through the chair to council member Benson, so the 70% again, those are those are valid and enforced as as we sit here today, those are valid and enforceable judgments.

So unfortunately, um we are not able to file Liz pendants on those.

The liens that we're filing um the under the state law, DH has the ability to file liens or garnishments.

So we select our remedy.

So if our uh collections law firm is pursuing a garnishment on a file, we would not that would not be eligible for us to file a lien, and vice versa.

If we are pursuing a lien filing on uh an individual property, then our collections law firm would not be pursuing a uh a uh garnishment, excuse me.

The other collections activity that I'd like to highlight in addition to the the new text messaging is our collections vendor does um letter sweeps and phone sweeps and skip traces, they are constantly working on the files that we transfer to them, and so again, those the that 70 percent is being actively pursued, uh, all of them on the collections activity level, and then again those further subsets of either liens or garnishments under under DAH's authority.

Uh the other item I'd like to highlight is uh for the collections activity.

Um we talked about liens and garnishments.

I believe I believe that's it.

Thank you, Councilmember Benson.

All right, thank you.

And one of my bosses says, I am tired of my neighbor or the house around the corner that never cuts its lawn, never brings its trash container in.

I if I go to Warren, they don't they don't authorize that.

So our competition, they hold people accountable, and I appreciate the level of accountability and the ability for people to work to not have a financial impact if they compare if they were compare to compliance.

And so I know that's the ultimate goal, but my boss is they like the accountability.

So thank you for what you do.

Thank you.

And and council uh president, uh, just to respond to council member Benson.

Um, please encourage, as we all do, uh, to report it's improved Detroit uh either on the website or the app to report blighted conditions, and the ticket issuing agencies are responsible for going out and investigating that, and if conditions warrant a ticket can be issued, and do not ignore your tickets, do not endure your judgments.

Uh, please come to DAH for your hearing.

Thank you.

Uh member Santiago Romero.

Thank you, Mr.

President.

Good morning, everyone.

Good to see you.

Thank you for being here.

And um, I'm excited about uh community courts.

You mentioned that you're working on this, correct?

So that's exciting.

Uh look forward to that.

Um want to emphasize the need of these community courts to also be accessible in the languages in which the community they're in.

Um, I know that we used to have one in Southwest.

Um, I'm gonna assume we had Spanish speakers there, um, which will lead me to my question around language access.

I believe we let you know that we have received reports uh that folks that are non-English speakers have tried to go through the process um and literally turned away saying, like, no, we don't speak Spanish here, and just did not support the residents.

Um, so wondering um where you are in making sure that we have language access and that staff is trained to communicate with with folks that are going through hearings.

Uh through the chair to council member Santiago Romero, thank you uh for the question and and allowing us to be here and talk about this really important topic.

So DEH is a department that has been doing lack land language access well before the language access program and programming.

We certainly um are thrilled that the resources are so much easier accessible now and are integrated within the departments.

When we uh when we receive um reports that a situation may have occurred, we uh oftentimes work directly with that individual, and I and I know that the situation you're referring to, I do apologize.

Um that email was in between my actually my my lien filing garnishment, uh, my lien filing uh queue of 30 documents.

So it was right smack in the middle, and I did not catch that as soon as I normally would in answer to it.

So I do apologize for that.

But generally, what we do is reach out to the individual directly and work with them to try to see you know when they called what type what number they called, all those things.

A lot of times it's they're not dealing with DAH, they've called a different department.

And um, and when they when they are dealing with DAH, uh this council and and the mayor's office and the entire community has our commitment that we are gonna work with you.

We have posters and all of our public facing offices for people to uh indicate what language they need.

We are all trained on reaching out for that support over the telephone, the app, and through uh requesting um translator services at hearings.

Uh I don't know if a manager Hunt wanted to add uh what her hearing officers are doing when they're in their courtrooms and encounter that uh situation as well.

Thank you.

Um so in real time, when a resident calls in and they're having difficulty with their the language, we do a couple of things.

One, we immediately pause at that moment, do the best we can to try to communicate in real time using whatever we have from CREO to be able to do that.

We also reschedule their hearings.

Myself along with Letitia, we are connected to Creole so that we can immediately jump in, identify an interpreter and be able to reschedule that, and we will continue to reschedule that until we get that interpreter available to them so that they can have that hearing.

And so we we do a multi a multitude of things from trying to communicate them in real time if we can, if they have someone there, because sometimes they'll bring someone along to their hearing and we'll swear that individual in and we'll allow that person to be their translator if if necessary, or we'll communicate to that individual to let them know that we'll reschedule and we'll bring an interpreter in from the city to do the hearing, whatever.

Um, and sometimes we've even had people from BC who's been able to kind of help facilitate this because they are able to speak multiple languages.

So we do a variety of things to try to ensure that that respondent has the opportunity to have their day in court.

Okay, thank you.

And then just again to really clearly state that that is critically important to both myself and my entire staff, and that we're gonna continue to work uh in that regard to make uh that access more clear.

Uh, part of our website redesign is also getting all of our um flyers and materials translated into different languages and having that as well on our website so people have have make it as convenient as possible, as manager Hunt said for people to engage with us at at every step of our process.

Thank you.

Do the chair, thank you.

I appreciate that, and I need to ask um because we are we are we are being held accountable to make sure that we are communicating with everyone, and I appreciate that.

We will change the culture.

I do believe one time at one point we will get to a point where we're not asking for this anymore.

It's just gonna be the norm.

Um my other set of questions are um so often we will get a resident that lets us know that they have received multiple blight tickets for the same issue, and they may have been away.

Um, they may have been on vacation or whatever the case may be, and when they re and when they come back, they have you know five to ten thousand dollars worth of tickets.

Um it's a lot of tickets to pay, they may not have the money to pay it, um, but they want to address the problem, the blights, the unapproved structure that they laid out, right?

Whatever the case may be, they want to fix it, but they can't pay those blight tickets.

They've asked me, can you help us waive these tickets?

I cannot as a council office.

We cannot do that.

We've asked BC to if they can.

They tell us that they can't.

So I'm I'm I'm gonna assume it lies here.

And I'm wondering what does help look like for residents that cannot pay those five to ten thousand dollars worth of tickets that want to do the the good work of removing that, and this is I know someone in my family, they erected a structure to park their trucks.

We can't have trucks in our residential areas, they have to put those down, right?

So they have we have to go through that whole thing and they're asking for help.

I'm not gonna help you in that.

You have to follow the the protocol, right?

So we we we will do that, but they can't pay five to ten thousand dollars worth of tickets.

Is there any help?

Do tickets get waived if there is a plan to address um whatever issue there they they they they may have, um, because it is a lot of money.

And I and I know that they don't have it, and and we are putting a lot of people through a lot of stress having to pay that much money in tickets.

Uh, through the chair tech council member Santiago Romero, that's an excellent question as well.

And just for clarity for for the listening for those of uh that are listening to us, um, under the Detroit City Code, every day a blight violation exists, it's eligible to be ticketed.

So the ticket issuing agency can come out with my Betty Blight example for the excessive weeds.

Uh, they could ticket her every day that the condition exists and and those hearings um would be scheduled.

And uh so the you had mentioned about um community members reaching out to you about waiv tickets and that your office uh is unable to do that.

Uh B seed is unable to do that.

I'm here to tell you I don't waive tickets either.

So that is that is part of uh we always encourage people to think of DAH like uh the parking court, right?

Like or going over to 36th district for a moving violation.

You were speeding, you weren't speeding.

With that being said, the the foundation of your question is what can be done.

Yes.

So let's get to that, which is really the the crux of it.

I just wanted to highlight again that blight tickets and particularly blight judgments are not something that any other department in the city has has any authority to waive or or reduce.

So working that's why it's so critical when you particularly if you're receiving a correction notice before a ticket is issued by B seed that you work with them and and say, Oh, I got a correction notice for excessive weeds.

Uh that's been it's been taken care of.

Please come out and and check and and can the ticket be dismissed.

So that's one option.

Another option is, and I think for your example was about multiple days of ticketing, correct?

Uh or multiple instances of ticketing, and those fines can vary.

I know part of your example was for uh an excessive weed, which is a lower fine ticket, and then you mentioned maybe an unauthorized structure.

That is a very different type of ticket.

Uh solid waste fines also tend to be for illegal dumping and solid waste violations also tend to be higher fine amounts generally.

Um I will say that our collections law firm uh offers payment plans and has settlement authority.

So again, we are always we're always incre encouraging people to communicate, communicate with DAH about your hearings and about your judgments, and if your ticket is in collections, our law, our law firm that we uh have retained to do collections has payment uh plans and they're able to negotiate settlement um would be options.

And in the instance where uh I would also like to highlight in the instance where um uh when there's settlement requests made to us, uh we also work with that law firm to to come to come to an ending.

Is that responsive to your question?

Through the chair, it it is it it just uh we we really can't do much after the fact the tickets have been given, is what it sounds like.

And what I'm trying to do is avoid people really from getting so many tickets, but in order for that to happen, they have to know the laws and the policies.

Um sorry, Mr.

President, just have one quick question for LPD.

Has there ever been um a quick book or booklet on policies, you know, um home ownership or just I'm trying to avoid people from getting these money tickets in the first place if there really is no way to waive the fee.

If you have to then pay this much because you didn't know, it sounds like maybe a solution here is education arounds.

Um how you can't get ticketed, and I'm just wondering if the city has ever provided guidance to the public um outside of maybe you know um a press release stating you know this new law has passed.

Um has that ever been an effort um through the city?

President Sir I I don't really know.

I know that that LPD or the old RAD never never we were never directed to do that when these um ordinances came into being, we never produced it.

I don't know whether or not the city departments did.

I think we could explore that.

I think if there isn't um a informational booklet prepared, you know, you should give us some instruction from the table, and we will either um undertake to do that in conjunction with the department or do it ourselves.

Through the chair, thank you.

I appreciate that.

I'm this is also something that even like our offices can do, um, but I'm just wondering, I I think what will be most helpful is knowing what the tickets are that are given the most.

Um I know in Southwest we get a lot of tickets for for fencing, you know, just now I think what I need is a list of most common tickets given to residents because I think if it's the education piece that is missing that could potentially prevent people from getting ticketed in the first place.

Um I will move to um just a conversation just to keep it an executive session.

Um around public education um on most common blight tickets, and this may or may not be something that we need money for, but I think it's something that we can work on.

Um such a motion, Mr.

President for executive session, um resources for public education on most common blight tickets.

Discussion.

Um there's a motion on the floor, colleagues with discussion, member McCampbell.

Uh thank you, Mr.

If I could join you on that, remember Santiago Romero.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Colleagues, any objections?

Seeing none, that action shall be taken.

Thank you.

Thank you, Mr.

President.

Thank you all.

Thank you.

So my quick questions are what what is the percentage of virtual hearings versus in-person hearings?

I may have missed it and I apologize if so.

Mr.

President, you did not miss it.

I did not highlight that, and I should have.

So I'm very glad you asked that question.

So DAH pivoted to remote hearings during COVID, and we are still uh 100% remote on Zoom.

So people do not have to pay for parking.

They can log in, especially for if you're an out-of-city or out-of-state property owner.

You can log in.

But our courtrooms are on Zoom.

Prior to COVID, we had the cameras in the courtrooms for security purposes and other enhanced security initiatives that we no longer uh have current presently after that pivot happened.

Um so while we're open to conversations about returning back to in-person hearings, we have found that people are more responsive to to attending via Zoom.

I would highlight that the telephone number to call in is area code 312 on the tickets, not area code 313.

So we get quite a few people calling our customer service number saying they can't get there's no one in the hearing and they've missed dialed.

So again, that's one of the reasons that we have our wonderful customer service team that um manager Smith is is uh is uh spearheading and and that we work to assist those people um in real time as well as as uh any time during business hours our customer service reps are available via telephone.

Awesome.

So I is there any way to you know kind of bypass the 312 issue?

Because you know we are 313 that is so close, so close.

And you know, there's Google numbers that are out there, and I don't know if that's safe enough, uh secure enough rather, but uh outside of you know having customer service kind of have to walk through the whole process as we talk about again preventative.

Is there any fix to that?

So I'm I'm happy to report, council president, that it does not happen very often.

It does not.

It does not happen very often.

And then pardon me.

And I've the 312 number is is associated and and obtained through Zoom.

Um, but we're certainly happy to uh coordinate with do it and reach out and see if there's something that that can be um something that can be uh explored relative to that that number and that error code.

Okay, and last question I have is uh regarding the um uh any audits on the judgments uh about the uh hearing officers.

I mean, I I don't have any complaints, but I I think there's always opportunity to uh audit to determine if the uh judgments that are uh being rendered are you know um maybe there may be may be a challenge with some of them and maybe a challenge with some of the individual hearing officers um uh hearings uh or judgments, excuse me.

Does that take place?

Because I believe I heard that the the training is not in this budget, there's no training uh budget that's being uh provided this year, or requested rather.

Uh council president, um so training is ongoing, uh and even if as is again indicated in the fiscal year 207 budget that is removed, we're committed to that staff development and and continued professional growth, uh both as a department and within our individual roles.

So the hearing officers have different training needs than our customer service representatives, uh, and then some of their training needs overlap.

So what I will say um about the the auditing on the judgments is the code the the hearing officers are bound by the code.

So much like I use the exam.

Oh we will have to recess to the call of the chair until we obtain re-obtain a quorum.

It has been noted that she will be absent.

House member Denzale McCampbell.

Present, sorry, but member Renata Miller.

House member Gabriela Santiago Romero present.

It is noted that Member Waters will be absent, as well as Member Whitfield Callaway.

Council President Pro Tem Call Meo the Second.

Here.

It's president to have a quorum.

Thank you.

We have a quorum, which means we're back in session.

So trying to remember, was it me or you had well uh president you were completing your response?

Thank you.

I was I was responding to your questions, which I'll highlight the question uh as part of my response that way.

Uh we're all on the same page.

So uh as I indicated earlier, the question about um the judgments and the determinations from our hearing officers.

So as I highlighted earlier about the traffic court at 36th district, this with speeding example, right?

Uh the the officer and the individual come and they were speeding, they were not speeding.

It's the exact same thing at DAH.

So that when the hearing occurs, the inspector or the officer that observed the alleged blight violation is present and presents their evidence first.

The respondent is able to present their evidence, whether it's oral, uh photographs, uh their testimony, and the hearing officer makes the judgment based on that evidence that's presented.

So and the way the code is structured, is the hearing officers do not have an uh it's not a subjective uh determination.

If the if the violation is proven to exist on the day, then the violation is upheld and the penalty is assessed.

If the hearing officer determines based on the evidence that the evidence does not support the alleged blight violation, then uh not determined not responsible by determination judgment would be issued, and there are no fines or penalties or fees due.

Anyone, any individual that receives a responsible by determination judgment has the ability to appeal to the Third Circuit Court.

Uh, since I've been director, there's only been one that has come back for additional um hearing, and it was not based on the outcome of the judgment.

What the third circuit court uh wanted to see was additional testimony on the impact to the community that that had not been presented as part of the case in chief.

So I will admit it was kind of an odd thing, way to get sent back to DAH to have uh of a second opportunity to present a case, but that's what they ordered, so that's what um that's what occurred.

So that is the only uh situation I'm I'm aware of um that something has come back from the third year circuit.

If an individual does not attend their hearing, and the inspector or officer proceeds with that ticket at that hearing, and a default judgment is entered, the respondent has 21 days to file a motion to set aside a default judgment with DAH and obtain a new hearing date.

In that situation, the tick the judgment uh the ticket or excuse me, the judgment is paid as a bond, and if you are found not responsible at your hearing, that bond is refunded back to you.

So again, the the theme is is throughout my whole presentation, and hopefully all of uh my answers certainly is that please attend your hearing, uh please engage with the city uh ticket issuing agencies before the hearing with DAH at the hearing, um, and then again DH uh or a collections law firm after the hearing.

Is is that responsive uh council president?

Okay.

So uh so it it sounds like you all are are very proactive and trying to be proactive in terms of helping folks and providing them leading them to the information that they need.

Is there any once you're called in the the web, so to speak, is there any um uh information that's provided as to what someone's next step is uh to uh if they do um uh disagree with the opinion and want to take it to the court.

Is it is uh is that outlined?

Is there where would where would someone find that information?

So that information, thank you for the question, Council President.

Um, and this opportunity to again highlight our our processes and services.

We always I I always liken it to a funnel.

The earlier you get involved with the city and matters of blight, the the more options you have and the less expensive it is.

The further you go down that funnel, um it it your options become um more restricted.

So information on next steps is um provided.

I'll I'll highlight in the appeal context the third circuit.

If a hearing officer issues a responsible by determination judgment, the steps to appeal that are outlined at that time in that hearing on the record.

The paperwork for that appeal um, if requested, is uh emailed to that individual.

The paperwork is also available at our offices uh in suite 1004 of the Colman A Young Municipal Center building.

It is available on our website, and I highlighted as part of my presentation that we're in the middle of um going through a a major website redesign.

We want to add all of our community outreach presentations information on our website, so that information is available to to everyone we're engaging with or anyone that's interested.

We want to have um again centralized all that information so it'll be a lot easier for folks to access.

Um we have the forms and documents currently, but part of that website redesign is going to be a roadmap for blight court for roadmap for administrative appeals and a roadmap for blight clearances.

So while the information is on our website, we're always looking to improve.

Um, and and that is gonna be one large way we're gonna do that is through that website redesign.

Um, but specifically again for an appeal to Third Circuit, that information is provided directly to the person at the hearing, and is it available in a variety of ways after the hearing, should they need it.

And they can always call our office too for assistance uh in obtaining that information.

All right, thank you so much.

Next questions come from Member Miller.

Thank you, Mr.

President.

Good morning.

How are you, ladies?

Uh I have a quick question.

Oftentimes the issuing agency, they claim they cannot dismiss tickets.

I hear it all the time.

Once the ticket is written, you cannot take it back.

Are you saying that is not true?

Uh so through the chair to to council member Miller, thank you for that question.

So um I'm I can speak to my department, I can't speak to anyone else's department.

So what my understanding is from the DAH perspective is we do not dismiss tickets.

So when if you're at your hearing, a hearing officer is either gonna find you responsible or not responsible.

The city ticketing issuing agency can request a dismissal, but again, those conversations are between those ticketing issuing departments and agencies and and the individual or property owner that received the ticket.

So from our from DAH's perspective, uh, when a ticket is issued, the hearing date is is on the ticket.

Uh our expectation is that all parties will appear at that hearing and advocate for their position in front of the hearing officer.

Uh, if there is a situation where you have a vacation planned or something, you have the ability to adjourn your hearing uh one time.

And it's it's okay.

You don't have the year going, you don't you have to go through all that again.

I've heard you several times.

My only question was from your office, if they dismiss it, you don't even know about it, right?

But they always want to do the the curly shuffle around here.

Either you can dismiss a 95-year-old lady's ticket or you cannot.

So I will take that up with the that put the department because they swear they cannot rescind a ticket.

I had a one block where the people were in their 80s and one lady on the corner was 95.

They called because the blight was in the alley.

They cannot get their cars through the alley because that the bitches were really high.

I know some in some areas they divide the alley up, you're responsible for it.

They called out this department.

And instead of addressing the alley with all the overgrowth, they wind up giving all these seniors tickets.

I was wondering what was the guy's issue.

Like you gave these.

So and then when they once they got the tickets, they were they were elderly, they missed their dates.

It was only one ticket, like four houses.

They had missed their date.

What do you do when you have someone that stays in their house and they're of age?

They get the ticket, and they would not know to call 312.

Because most of them, a lot of them still have rotary phones, believe it or not.

They would not know to call 312 and they miss their ticket date.

What do you do for somebody at that age?

Do you give grace or I mean I mean what do you do?

So through the chair to to Councilmember Miller, um, thank you for that question.

So uh the age of respondents, again, I know I keep going to the moving violations, but it's a perfect example and in alignment with uh DAH's uh Blight Court is the the age of the respondent is not known uh when the ticket is issued or or when unless they appear at their hearing.

So again, I think that's why it's so critical that when those tickets are received that they reach out to the ticket issuing agency, they reach out um to discuss compliance.

If they have questions about their hearing, uh, then they can reach out to the DH customer service staff, and and those numbers are are on the ticket itself.

So that information is provided in addition to the Zoom number um that we're referencing.

But our customer service information is available on that ticket.

So the the sooner that those individuals would would reach out, uh, again, it is the the earlier the conversations happen um the better.

Okay, thank you.

That's all my questions uh, Mr.

President.

Thank you.

Uh approach M Young.

Thank you.

Uh Mr.

President, I appreciate that.

Uh Ms.

Pastula, thank you.

So good to see you.

Wow, congratulations.

I remember when I first came uh the research and analysis division, you were the first people to talk to me.

So I appreciate that.

It's such a pleasure to get to see you.

I can't think of a better person to be in this position.

So I just wanted to ask you first and foremost.

I was looking at your presentation.

It shows that um approximately 18.4 million dollars in judgments, but only 5.5 million collected, so it's roughly a 30% collection rate.

What are the structural barriers preventing higher recovery and what changes are being implemented to improve that rate is artificial intelligence a part of that reform.

So thank you.

Uh President Pro Tem, and I remember the day that you came to the city as well fondly.

And um it's wonderful to see to be sitting here and to see you sitting there.

So this is a happy day indeed for everyone.

So I I briefly touched on some of our enhanced collection efforts um earlier as far as uh regarding unpaid judgments.

But I again always want to highlight back to participation in the hearings is what is gonna impact all of those numbers.

It's gonna impact the number of not responsible determinations and responsible determination.

It's gonna lower the number of default judgments, and it it would uh potentially lower our uh collections activities for post-enforcement uh collections um matters.

So we had um the 18.4 million dollars.

I just wanted to highlight that that is our uh adjusted number.

So we had let me find the paper here.

So as you search for that information, want to uh note that uh if you are looking to provide public comment, please raise your hand now in person or online.

If you're looking to provide public comment, raise your hand in person on online.

Uh someone will be available to provide you with a public comment card.

Thank you, Mr.

President.

Uh so through the chair to to pro tem uh member young.

Um our efforts are again focused on the broad collection activities uh by our uh collections vendor, which is the telephones, the letters, uh, and and direct outreach.

Uh we have text messaging now uh that we're gonna be uh having metrics on that as that launches more fully.

It just started in December of 2025, so we're just starting to um get the metrics and statistics for that.

We have uh increased our garnishment and lien filing, but again, our focus is truly on being an impartial uh efficient administrative hearings tribunal.

So the more people engage with not only the city but uh through the ticketing issuing agencies, but attend their hearings.

I think you'll see all of those numbers.

Um it will impact all of those numbers.

Okay, excellent.

No, I really appreciate that.

And uh, I also asked you did you have anything um involved artificial intelligence that you're looking at in terms of doing that, can you just kind of go into that for me a little bit?

You you did ask that, and I apologize that that I didn't address that directly the first time.

So the proposed uh case management system software contract that we anticipate bringing before this honorable body within the next couple months um is is going to um drastically change what our public what our software for Blake Court would look like.

Uh there is no AI as part of that contract.

They have it written.

The law department made sure to write that very clearly on the top of each page.

Uh so there is no AI um that is being considered being used as part of that contract, and there is no AI currently being used in the Department of Appeals and hearings.

If you call you speak to a customer service representative, if you call after hours, you have the ability to pay over the telephone using an automated surface service, excuse me, and um there's always the our website that people can engage with as well uh or in person.

So their their DAH is um not using AI at this time.

Okay, as well.

I will I highly encourage you that you do, and uh and I'll explain later why, but I just want to ask you from my second question.

I just wanted to ask you.

36 district court has amnesty days with reduced fines for or waiving of fine, as reduced fines, waiving of fines, and added fees.

Has your office considered hosted a day like that for the outstanding 70 percent unpaid fines?

Uh through the chair, that is one of my favorite questions, and that is on my wish list uh pro Time Young, most certainly.

When I um was appointed to this role at the very end of 2023, uh that was something we identified internally as a department as part of our strategic planning agenda.

What we have focused on since that time is process improvements and streamlining our operations that so when we have our amnesty day, everything is running smoothly and everything is running well.

One of the things that the OCFO had asked was when we're going to be examining what that day looks like and when it occurs, but that definitely is um something that we would like to do, and um we we have not abandoned that that desire.

But again, where our focus has been since I've been in this role has has been um on those internal process improvements to have a positive impact on what our residents and those who engage with the tribunal are experiencing.

No, that's excellent.

I and I appreciate that, and I think that's really good.

I'm glad it's your favorite question.

That's a lot of things that my constituents ask.

I look forward to that.

I just want to just convince you with our I first of all, I hope that everyone takes all my ideas that I give them, and I would hope that you would take my idea and you know, and give me credit afterwards.

Um, but for with artificial intelligence bar modernization, uh automated classification, data extraction, and completeness checks, it would be a 40 to 60 percent reduction in your staff time, so faster case flow.

Artificial intelligence retreat retrieves similar cases, highlights, relevant rules, we have 20 to 35 percent faster prep, improved consistency, plain language notices, multilingual support, automated reminders, it'd be a 10 to 20 percent increase in compliance, fewer missed hearings, predictive analytics for volume, hot spots, and repeat offenders, it'd be a 15 to 25 percent reduction in your backlog risk, uh artificial intelligence flags, duplicate filing, suspicious patterns, protects 250,000 to 500,000 in potential losses.

Your auto indexed or auto-indexed decisions and searchable archives will be a 30 to 50 percent faster for you response time, and then automated reminders, risk scoring and targeted outreach will be a one to three million dollar annual revenue uplift, and then the automation of routine workflows will be 500,000 to 1.2 million dollars.

So just to a bridge your financial summary, uh upfront implementation cost would be 750,000 to 1.5 million one time.

And then you and that's that's your uh capital, your CapEx, your capital expenditures, and then your operating costs will be 150 to 300,000 dollars.

Your annual operational savings though would be $100, it would be $500,000 to $1.2 million.

Your annual revenue increase be one to three million dollars.

Your total annual benefit would be $1.5 million to $4.2 million, and then your net annual gain would be $1.2 million to $3.9 million.

Your payback period would be 12 months.

Your case processing speed would be a 40 to 60% improvement.

Your hearing officer efficiency would be 25 to 30 5% improvement.

Your resident compliance would be 10 to 20% improvement.

Your backlog reduction would be 15 to 25% improvement.

Your four-year response time will be a 30-50% improvement, your consistency of decisions, significant improvement, and your public trust your public trust and transparency be high positive impact.

So I hope that you implement the ideas I gave you.

Thank you so much.

Always good to see you.

Congratulations again.

I will those materials because again, we do have that contract forthcoming, and I'd like to be able to take that back to the team that's been working on this issue and be able to digest that information that you provided and and then uh always give credit where credit is due, certainly, sir.

So thank you.

And thank you for outlining that.

I really appreciate that information.

Thank you.

I appreciate it.

I will send that to you, ASAP.

I appreciate that.

Thank you, sir.

Thank you.

And we'll close off the cut off the collection of public comment cards and give you the last word for your budget hearing, Director Pastor.

The one thing that I did not prefer prepare for uh council president.

So I will keep it very, very brief.

I truly enjoyed all the questions and the discussion and the discourse.

I always renew my offer uh to be available for your community outreach uh events and meetings.

Uh, the more we engage with the community, the happier we are.

Um, and I just want to thank everyone for the time being able to participate.

Um, I know that I love my job and I love the city, and I can tell that my staff feels exactly the same way because they uh I'm very, very lucky to have such a wonderful team and to be able to support them is is truly an honor and a privilege.

So I appreciate everybody's time today, and I look forward to receiving any questions, and we'll turn those around as quickly as possible.

Thank you.

Thank you.

All right, wish you all the best.

Let's move forward.

This now closes out the budget hearing for the department of administrative hearings.

We will now go to public comment.

As I mentioned, um, have been previously mentioning, we will be having abbreviated public comment sections for the duration of the budget hearings to remind folks, these are not public hearings, they're budget hearings.

The public hearing for the entire budget will take place on March 30th at 5 p.m.

and 5 p.m.

So we're gonna put one minute on the clock, sir.

We've got one individual in the committee of the home, Mr.

Maurice Weeks.

Just all right, we want to thank you for being here, sir.

And uh the floor is yours.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Um, I uh am just commenting about two of the hearings that are happening this afternoon, uh, both B seed and CREO.

Um I just wanted to note in reviewing the the budget from uh the mayor's office uh and reviewing last year's FY2026 budget.

It appears that for B seed, there is the same number of FTEs in construction and inspections as well as dangerous buildings as there was last year.

Um this is obviously a large concern, made larger by the Leland House story, um, but you know, large regardless, uh, given the state of some of the buildings that we have here in the city.

Um similarly on CRIO, it seems that the same number of FTEs have been allocated for language access.

Um we know that that's also something that's a huge need inside of the city um with our uh with populations that don't necessarily speak uh English.

Um so I'd just like to get clarity on that.

Thanks.

Thank you.

We have uh lost the quorum, so we are not able to respond back to you, but uh we'll have somebody from my office just connect with you, get your information, we'll see if we can get you some insight.

We've now trans.

Um we'll now go to our own online public commenters.

How many callers do we have, team?

And who do we have first, please?

Good afternoon, Council President.

There are six online callers.

Our first caller is Jadante Smith.

All right, caller, the floor is yours.

We have one minute general public comment.

Good afternoon, maybe I'll be heard.

Yes, perfect.

Uh I don't uh do not respect uh the fact that you guys went at Mary Waters yesterday over her comments about the land bank, especially you, James Tate, for you to imply that I uh that I clap for Mary Waters because she had a performative uh speech about the land bank, and she's been fighting for the land bank for quite some time.

For you to imply that I uh that I clap for Mary Waters because she had a performative uh speech about the land bank, and she's been fighting for the land bank for quite some time.

Very, very interesting.

Also, the speech that David Whitaker gave was unimpressive.

Also, I'll be sending you guys a couple emails about how I feel about the situation.

Uh, just because you guys appoint somebody like Donna uh Given Davison, who's just a clapper for Mary Sheffield, who I've been arguing with on Facebook about the situation for a while is very disappointing.

Also, I'm still gonna talk about uh Kronos and the fact that you guys immediately after budget season should look at down zoning this place and how you guys got Scott Benson and Ronalda Miller talking about the Southeastern Council, Southeastern Michigan Council of Governors in local zoning and ignoring local residents who want to zone down zone or something in their neighborhood.

Also, down zone cronos, like you did core city.

All right, next caller, please.

Our next caller is to Hira Ahmed.

Caller, the floor is yours.

You have one minute general public comment.

Thank you.

Uh, this is regarding the DIA.

Uh, we want them to to do more about dispelling these false narratives.

Uh, in in the book, the first Americans were Africans.

Documented evidence by David M.

Hotep documents.

Uh, Dr.

Goodyear says that 51,700 years ago.

That um uh Africans, uh Africans were the people who populated the Western Hemisphere and have uh uh evidence of that.

And in uh North America, black people were here first.

That dispels the false narrative.

Uh uh Santiago Romero that black people are immigrants.

No, we're not.

Everybody else is immigrants except black people.

So you want to go, I can give you all the evidence so you can stop uh putting out that false narrative.

Uh and uh uh if you'd like to call me, I'll give that to you.

Dr.

Albert Goodyear.

Next caller, please.

Our next caller is William M.

Davis.

William M.

Davis, the floor is yours.

You have one minute general public comment.

There are African birds.

I don't like you leave me the board.

Mr.

William M.

Davis, are you there?

All right, let's put Mr.

Davis at the end of the queue and go to the next, please.

Our next caller is Foster.

All right, Mr.

Foster, the floor is yours.

You have one minute general public comment.

Um, good afternoon.

Um, through the president, just a few things.

Um, I wanted to say uh absolutely like what DIA has been doing.

Uh like to see them have more marketing, get more community out.

And like the young gentleman that you guys presented award to, you know, start opening up opportunities for them while they're young and bright man publishing some of them their their things and accomplishments as well.

So uh like what I'm saying.

But when it comes down to the department of appeals and hearing, I think there's a uh big disconnect there.

Um the people have to know the community and wish they're policing.

Um, if parking meter comes around, right?

They can only write one ticket.

They can't come around every hour and keep writing another ticket if you steal in the uh park zone.

So their analogy don't add up when it comes down to blight in our community, they have to do better.

Don't enforce our community when the city owns majority of the black.

Thank you.

Next caller, please.

Our next caller is owner Papa.

Caller, the floor is yours.

You have one minute general public comment.

I'm sure that was you.

Uh, good afternoon.

Or yes, good afternoon, and through the chair may Abby Heard.

Yes.

Yes, I agree.

The DIA did a terrific job with their presentation, and it looks like they're really working with the community.

My problem is, too, with uh uh the hearings.

Um can you tell me how much money B said has brought in in terms of revenue from blight tickets?

And I would know how much I would like to know how much they have received in blight tickets from Munos, who was on the docket or on your agenda for many months and then just disappeared.

This person has properties that people are complaining about.

And I would also like to know how much money and uh have we received from the owner of the Leland House in terms of blight tickets.

Um, yes, we'd have to do better with being equitable.

Uh we can't just put everything on the backs of the citizens.

We have other entities.

You know, you all dismissed a whole lot of blight tickets from some owner of a lot of property, which is illegal.

Thank you.

Next caller, please.

Our next caller is Samsung S M.

Caller, the floor is yours.

You have one minute general public comment.

Caller, are you there?

Let's put that caller at the end of the queue and go to the next, please.

Our next caller is Betty A.

Varner.

Miss Betty A.

Varner, the floor is yours.

You have one minute general public comment.

Uh, good afternoon to all within the sound of my voice.

I'm Betty A.

Varner, the president of the Soda Ellis World Block Association.

Just here again today, uh humbly asking the council to advocate monies to help uh associations 501c3s black clubs to uh pay that land use hearing fee when they're trying to do projects to beautify uh their neighborhoods.

Uh for us, we want to have a playground for the children.

We want to expand our park and we must get the okay from uh the city of Detroit and the application.

I was told it's $1,500.

That creates havoc on a small black club.

If we uh have money, if we are able to raise $1,500, it should be going towards the playground equipment, not to uh city of Detroit.

Thank you.

Next caller, please.

Council President, we are now going back to William M.

Davis.

Mr.

William M.

Davis, the floor is yours.

You have one minute general public comment.

William M.

Davis going once.

Going twice, Mr.

William M.

Davis, are you there?

Going three times.

Unfortunately, we're gonna have to move on.

If you would like to provide your comments to the clerk's office, they will be placed on to public record.

Next caller, please.

Council President, we are now going back to Samsung.

Right, Samsung, the floor is yours.

You have one minute general public comment.

Samsung, are you there?

Going once.

Going twice.

Caller, are you there?

Going three times.

Unfortunately, we're gonna have to move on.

If you would like to provide your comments to the clerk's office, they will be placed onto public record.

Next caller, please.

Council President, that was our last caller.

All right, that takes us to the end of our public comments.

Uh, we will now uh uh recess until two o'clock, where we will then reconvene for our additional budget hearings for the day.

Should now recess to the 2 p.m.