Call the meeting to order.

We begin with the pleasure of allegiance.

I invite you to join us.

Roll call, please.

Call Pack here.

Pepcorn?

Here.

Strand?

Here.

Turnburg.

Here.

Mahoney?

Here.

Is there a motion to approve the order of agenda?

So moved.

Second.

Moved and seconded.

All those in favor say aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Motion carried.

Is there a motion to approve the minutes of the regular meeting February 2, 2026?

That's a move.

Second.

All those in favor say aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Motion carried.

Zero motion to approve the consent agenda, items one through thirty-six.

So moved.

Is there a second?

Second.

Moved and seconded.

Roll call vote, please.

Aye.

Strand?

Yes.

Pepcorn?

Aye.

Turnberg?

Hi.

Mahoney.

Aye.

Regular agenda 37, application for pavement of refund of taxes 4638 on a property located at 905 first three north, requesting reduction of value for 2025.

Mike Spankowski to explain.

Good evening, Mayor and Commissioners.

The property before you is we received a call for a recheck on the value and the overall condition of the property in our uh in our records for the current assessment year.

We did do that review, and as a result of it, we did do a small uh reduction of the value about six percent based off of the current sales for it.

As a result of that, the owner filed an abatement uh that is currently before you saying that the current uh the the prior year's value should be the same as the current year's value.

Our analysis showed that there was uh many comparable sales to this property, and the value is well supported as well as as equalized between the comparable properties.

There are some conditions issues with the basement of the property, but the overall condition of the property is an average condition.

So with that, uh, we are recommending that there is no change in value on this abatement.

Uh the owner may be present and wish to speak to this, and I will stand for any questions.

Does the owner here want to speak to this?

Are there any questions the commissioners have on the bike?

Otherwise, do I have a motion to retain the certified value?

I'll make the motion.

Second.

Any discussion.

Roll call vote, please.

Pepcorn?

Aye.

Turnberg?

Aye.

Call Pack?

Aye.

Strand?

Yes.

Mahoney?

Hi.

Turnberg.

Aye.

Mahoney.

Aye.

39.

Bid award for downtown parking operator.

Mark as well, I'm sorry.

Uh good evening, Mayor and Commissioners.

Um tonight in front of you.

I have the introduction of uh the selection committee's results for the uh open RFP we had for the municipal parking operator services.

And uh members of our selection committee are also here.

And if you perchance have any questions for the uh the chosen operator, he's also present if you have some questions.

Uh happen to come in town today.

Uh so uh you might remember um actually back in 2023, you uh the commission asked us as part of the finance committee to do an audit and review of our entire uh parking system.

And uh we shared that results, those results with you in a uh study um in 2025.

And then working with the uh a parking consultant, we had this informational meeting with the City Commission.

Um and then in October you asked us to uh request uh an RFP.

We have an existing contract with Interstate Parking.

It is expired.

Um it has six different parts of it and had been amended and modified over the years, and it was time to renew that.

It was a 10-year-old contract, and um we were basically on a month-to-month uh type of contract.

So um the selection committee, uh, unlike when we did this back in 2014 and had the parking commission at the time.

This time we had um uh six or seven different pl uh departments, including uh the finance department, engineering, police, public works, facilities, and information services.

And um uh and in the second every interview it included representation from DCP and uh Commissioner Pepcore was able to join us a little bit in some of those interviews just to see the the breadth of that work.

And um we I will say we didn't go into this process expecting to recommend somebody other than our incumbent.

And we're surprised on the um process, and it shows you a little bit about the extensiveness of the process and what we learned along the way.

And we'll be glad to share that with you as as our Mark is here representing the selection committee if you have any questions.

The criteria we used for the review included uh qualifications, uh professional services, and budget and costs.

We had five submissions um from all over the country, including our incumbent.

We interviewed initially all five, uh shortlisted to three, and then did a second round of interviews.

Um this is the score sheets that we have, and PCI services who were recommending is was the first candidate, and you can see uh the four other candidates and how they scored.

Um the I would say our incumbent was actually the third third eligible uh candidate, and we have a different candidate as number one.

Um the next steps we recognize our oper this I'll just say the operations are the the selection process really focused on the technology, the operations, the knowledge of parking and management.

I think what stood out with this company is that they're only a municipal they s they focus on municipal services.

They do not have private uh company uh private operations they do uh public only, as well as having over 35 years of experience across the country.

They're still small though, kind of like Interstate.

But um what we're finding is we're the largest, we're one of the largest clients of Interstate, and we may have outgrown some of their services, whereas um PCI services works nationwide with many more tools that we actually weren't even aware were out there until we went through the RFP process.

Um probably what we're most excited about is their technology options that they have to share share with us.

Um next we uh normally we would not be in front of you at this stage.

We would just start working on contractual negotiations and bring all of that to you as part of the uh RFP process.

However, with transition and change and findings along the way, we want to make sure to check in with you as we go through that process.

Again, we have selection members and and Mark here to talk about it in more detail.

We recognize um this is mainly operations, and we aren't really talking about downtown strategy.

We know downtown strategy has a lot more at its plate, have a lot of things happening, and we uh foresee many more informational and stakeholder meetings as we go through the contractual negotiations and to include you as well as our uh stakeholders in the downtown arena.

So right now we're really just talking about that operations manager that can help staff and be that front door in terms of the technology and operations and to begin those that next level of work.

Uh we're glad to answer any questions, and again, Mark is here, and we have um yeah, Tanner is really uh it's been really a joy to work with Tanner and the procurement specialist as part of this process as well.

I haven't had the opportunity to use that service before inside the city, and so um be glad to answer any questions.

Nicole, can you just explain there's a difference?

There's two garages that are still stay with interstate.

Do you want to talk through that?

Um the contract with mercantile expires in about two years uh based on the P3.

The how the contract was set up with NP was a 30-day revolving uh agreement.

So that could transition.

Okay.

We do have two speakers.

Randy Thorerson is first.

Or Warren Ackley's first, I guess.

Are you two?

Am I going to alphabetic with you both or what?

My name is Warren Ackley.

And uh just have three points that I want to uh highlight here.

Uh the first one being that I have been a downtown program for 48 years, and uh the same issue comes up every year.

It's usually about parking.

Uh this parking issue needs to be resolved in order for downtown to progress.

That's why I'm asking for more time to table this recommendation that the city staff has before you today involving new management of parking downtown.

I believe that we need more conversation and more transparency regarding the decision for parking lot management.

The second point right now is that you know there is a citywide survey going on regarding food vendors.

Interesting.

Food vendors are allowed in the city property and sidewalks because they have purchased a $50 permit to use uh city sidewalks and public areas downtown.

Right now there are nine vendors that have permits for a total of $450 a year coming to the city.

If you look at the parking ramps and street parking, we have potential to bring in a million dollars uh with the parking uh agreements that are in place.

We don't have a city survey going on for the parking issue.

We have one for city vendors for 450 dollars.

Very interesting.

I think more conversation needs to be done regarding this parking situation and with the stakeholders, with business owners, building owners, and residents.

The third item is the decision made by city staff, again, regarding NP Avenue.

We have two buildings, two businesses on NP Avenue.

NP Avenue has been under construction uh for the last two summers, and fortunately our businesses remained open.

NP Avenue at one time had four lanes of traffic.

In the new design that has been reduced to two lanes of traffic with two lanes of parking and two eight and a half foot lanes of bike lanes adjacent to the sidewalks.

No one really understands this idea, including me.

There are no street signs regarding this new arrangement.

So people are confused.

When people are confused, they will sometimes refuse to come back.

This decision was that was brought to you by the city staff with no involvement of people on the streets that that are here there that are there every day, and building owners, business owners, residents downtown.

I am in downtown every day, and I have never seen a bike on any of the bike lanes.

Bike lanes take up one-third of NP Avenue right now.

Makes you wonder.

All of these things should be corrected with better communication with all people involved who are trying to keep downtown in the right direction.

Randy, you're going to speak.

Randy Thorerson.

Randy Thorison.

Um so the last few days I've been piling through some of your studies, your parking study, your uh your city commission brown bag uh discussion, and I think what we're talking about here is we've had no chance to discuss any of this with any of the city staff.

When it came down to this brown bag discussion, you could come to it, but you can't ask any questions.

Early on when the RFP came out, I said it I was on the parking commission for at least 10 years.

And and I know a lot about what was going on prior to that time, and that um I'd like to have been on the committee to ask some of the questions.

And they would not allow me to be on that committee, only city staff.

Some of the questions that I see, they're so numerous through the entire study.

But I think to start with, I'm just gonna get to the fact that you know last year you lost $541,000 on your bottom line.

Well, that's the uh the prior year you had $340,000 in revenue, so you had an $800,000 swing in losses.

And I just wonder, we never had those kinds of things when when we had a parking commission, and so I wonder where all this money goes.

By 3032, you have to have $900,000 in increased revenues.

And I would I wonder how you're gonna do that.

The Brown Bag Lunch says, how are we gonna how are we going to get there?

And it and it says we're going to uh modify the municipal code, we're gonna indeed uh increase the fines.

Doesn't sound too inviting or welcoming for people to come downtown.

The one thing that we worked on for years and years and years we did that.

When we had your first parking ticket was free, so that you got to say, oh, I understand how this works now.

The other thing is to utilize shorter time limits on the streets to more to promote turnover and long-term parking.

That means to get them into the parking garages.

But they want to take away the the one-hour uh free parking, or the two hours that you have on some.

Free parking, and then they want to extend the parking into the evenings and the Saturdays.

Well, you can't do that because you have agreements with people like myself with the with certain groups that you you have to have free parking after five and all weekend.

That is a group.

So the marketing study that they have here.

Is that it?

Is that how that works?

All right.

Well, I'm done.

I'm not done.

I have so many questions, so many things to say, and so many things to look at, and we don't get a chance to ask any of those questions.

Any questions for the commissioners of the McCall or Mark?

So just a few things.

First of all, Interstate did an excellent job for us.

I think we were very fortunate to have them.

And the way I would describe it is we're gradually maturing as a downtown with our parking.

And so I do the thing that uh I got to sit on in some of the interviews, and the thing I like the best is it will now be a combination of all these things, the on-street parking, the flat parking, and the ramp parking.

And so I do think to have it combined, so it's a combined effort, that's very important.

And I I guess for the for the future coming back to us, if you could have us some estimates as to what will the revenue be, what's the projections for this company?

If they are awarded the bed, what what what will they uh project for us in the future?

I guess that's one thing.

And I will say to Randy, the the ramp that they built uh next to the old Broadway, that's still under construction.

And so it is an opportunity.

That's a great ramp, but we still need to do more to make sure that we get people to start using it, and especially once all the construction is done.

And so we've already talked about that.

But to me, I look at this as the next level in our parking uh from the city's perspective.

And I this group uh the the other thing is the amount of technology that they are using.

That's that's what we're gonna be using in the future.

So I'm looking forward to that.

So with that, uh when you're ready to make the motion, I'll make the motion, Mr.

Turk.

Do I have a second?

Second.

Second, Vice Trad.

Thank you.

Mr.

Turnberg.

Um just a question.

I have had some other business owners reach out to me on specifically having a business on Broadway and having workers working on other buildings and then parking their work vehicles for days on end because there isn't much of a fine to pay, or they would rather pay the fine than move their vehicle.

How much enforcement is actually done with the parking downtown?

Did you want to take some point?

I would say there's uh pretty decent amount of enforcement in the parking downtown.

We have had some issues in the last couple of years with equipment.

Um, I do think the the contractor parking is something we'll have to look at as far as the strategy when we put together this contract, because that has made people upset, as well as when dumpsters have shown up in these parking spots and are there for a long period of time.

So that's something that we're gonna have to work on with the strategy when we do put together this contract.

I think you can make an excellent point.

Sometimes businesses are working on a building there and then they park right in front all day and they take the fine.

So we do have to look at our ordinance for that, because that's not right.

They shouldn't be taking crop parking that other people would want to park in those areas.

Mr.

Kolpak?

Yeah, uh a couple of comments and a question.

Um, after reviewing the information, this RFB process was was fully vetted with the eight new staff that replaced the parking commission and was transparent along the way.

And my understanding is the criteria that were evaluated for this ultimate vendor that began with five, was whittled down to three, and this one selected, was really truly focused on number one, the criteria that they met really was superior to all other four, but also cost was a factor here.

So excuse me.

Um so can you speak to the conversation we had earlier about operations versus next steps and strategic involvement with community stakeholders and the transparency that's gonna happen when it comes back to commission for final approval?

Yeah, absol absolutely.

And and I will say too uh Randy and Warren's uh feedback.

I certainly appreciate those comments and concerns.

Um we've evolved a lot as an organization since you know I've been here since 07.

Um, I had the privilege of working under Jim and uh Bob Stein and to watch the um, you know, I think we're on our fourth DCP administrator um since I've started.

And um, you know, who we are as a city and how we've evolved as an organization has transitioned a lot.

You know, when Bob Stein managed parking and we had um uh Rodney um as our operator, you know, we were operating asphalt parking lots that had potholes in them and um and using um you know handwritten we weren't doing enforcement, you know.

And so we've transitioned along with the Renaissance of downtown.

Now we have over you know a hundred million of assets and buildings.

We have a buildings facilities director who is working with us in the day-to-day operations of that building.

We're part of three different condo associations as we manage these public buildings, and it requires all eight of the staff representatives to be involved in the day-to-day parking management.

Um there's still absolutely the need for public engagement, community outreach, the evolution of downtown.

Obviously, we have these, you know, kind of veteran business owners who've survived a lot of transition in downtown, and that's very important.

I think parking is part of that formula.

And admittedly, you know, the planning department with the community, with DCP, with bid works on that strategy development with the downtown task force and community at large.

So you can see us having um future informational meetings and focus groups.

It's really going to be some really hard decisions on ahead of us.

Um, you know, Randy's not wrong, in terms of those financial operations.

We have a debt management of these facilities.

The reason the two-hour free parking went away is because that finance went into the debt management program of that ramp.

And so when we saw that wasn't quite working, we did work with um Kilborne, the owners of operators of the um Avery ramp to remove that.

We haven't that's like in the days coming.

So there's a lot to op uh think about on a daily operations.

Um I think um this future vendor, whether it's PCI or others, really will become a staff lead in this discussion and work with the eight departments and and with us.

I think um one I I can't remember if I just said this, but one of the things that distinguishes this is that they work purely in municipal operations as opposed to other investment priorities that we see with the other vendors.

And so that was one of the things that that we were party to, our interest to.

But yes, there's a long-winded answer to I think as much as the city commission will give us in their time, we are glad and the public to work with these difficult strategy discussions moving forward.

Could that representative just come to the podium and introduce themselves, please?

Jack, would you even Jack Skelton?

I'm an owner of PCI Municipal Services.

Mayor Commissioners is an honor to be here tonight.

Thank you, Jack.

And just the commissioners can reach out to you, Nicole.

We'll have a email contact.

Yes, sir.

Okay.

Thank you.

Welcome on board.

Appreciate it.

Any other discussion?

Mr.

Strand.

I'll just say this, Mayor.

I I I'm okay with where our staff has taken us on this, and I'm not going to micromanage what they've uh led us to.

Any other discussion?

Roll call vote, please.

Epcorn?

Hi.

Strand.

Yes.

Aye.

Mahoney.

Item 40.

11236th Street South.

Nicole to explain this little issue.

Yeah, um, I have a lot of time with you tonight.

Um so um, let's say get my head out of parking and on to historic preservation.

So we have a very unique case in front of us tonight.

Um I think in my time here, this is the first time I've seen an appeal on our certificate of appropriateness with the Historic Preservation Commission.

And uh we really have a unique situation here where we have an existing homeowner who uh came to us in um uh well, I'll just start from the beginning.

So the owner and her contractor is um present today for any questions, but um this is a property at 1123 6th Street South.

It said the Hawthorne neighborhood, and in within the Irkskins Historic Overlay.

And uh what's in front of you tonight is an appeal from the Historic Preservation Commission action or lack of action on uh just last week and uh February 7th.

And um in front of you tonight is um when an appeal happens, you the commission hear this as if it's a new case.

So um you're open, you don't really necessarily need to consider the factors that the HPC you're here to use the own the factors related to you separate.

I will say it does require a supermajority um to to um to support this appeal.

And um so I'll explain the case in in more detail.

So we have an existing home, um, it's the gray house uh on the left-hand side.

And um they are um have they have started construction, it's almost done, um, where they're adding to the uh almost double the square footage uh or a quarter of the square footage to the um to the west.

And back in September of 25, they came in front of the historic preservation to receive a certificate of appropriateness.

They received that certificate of appropriateness and were off in the receive their building permit and were off doing construction.

And it wasn't until January of this year, the inspector went by the site and was doing their five some of their final inspections and noticed that there was changes on site.

And so the inspector notified us, we started looking at those changes and realizing that one of those changes included increasing the height of the second of the addition, and that height exceeded what was allowed by the historic overlay standards.

It met the land development code and the building code, but it did not meet the historic overlay standards.

When we reviewed the historic overlay standards, we noted that there's an option for a variance that they can exceed that duration, but it requires that variance support from the historic preservation commission.

And so that's what was the case at February 6th.

We had a special call meeting for the Historic Preservation Commission because the owner was nine months pregnant and the contractor was constructing, and they had an informal stop work order on it, and obviously they were in a hurry to try to get the project done.

And so since that was uh that failed at the Historic Preservation Commission, um the appeal is in front of you today.

A little bit about the case here.

So the black and white or the rendering here off to the right, that's existing building, and the red hatch, if you can see that red, this this hatching that's going the opposite way is the addition that's being proposed.

Um the elevation uh includes uh a lot of discussion if you watch the historic preservation commission meeting was a lot of discussion about the existing windows and future windows, and there was some confusion, I believe, by the existing uh city or historic preservation commissioners on what is changing and what's not changing and how it relates to the building footprint.

Um this is a new drawing.

Um the historic preservation commission did not see this clearity, but uh the blue build the blue windows um here are a possible addition.

So meanwhile, um these two uh windows here, I think one of them is new, and the owner can talk to that if you have more questions on that.

But I think what I'm trying to point to is the inspections or the owner kind of got tricked up between what was required by code, building code and safety for egress, and what was required by the historic preservation.

And in my mind, um the inspections review is more important, the egress standards should should drive the permit.

And at that point they hadn't had the inspection solution figured out yet before it came in front of the historic preservation commission.

So it's a little confusing.

And so um with that you'll see um I'll come back to the windows here in a minute.

So this is the addition, um, I will say the value of the building construction is um close to 250,000 of investment.

And um, and so this shows you the building and construction.

And what is in conflict with the historic overlay is the fact that this addition is about five to eight inches taller than the primary building.

And um, by the historic overlay standards, they aren't allowed to exceed the roof height of the existing building, but based on the rafter height and some other inspections things related to interior of the building, the roof height bumped up a little bit.

And so the variance in front of the historic preservation was can this addition be taller?

And um and the uh historic preservation commission denied that uh review, divide denied that approval.

These little windows here, um, so it's kind of unique.

You'll see this little window on the existing building, and then these two little windows off to the side.

Um, those created quite a bit of conversation at the um HPC if you watch the last meeting, and um and partly the conversation um quite honestly became a little confusing, and um, and that's where I'm making the recommendation that the inspections and egress um should drive that decision.

So um so inspections, the good news is inspections and um the applicant are working to um confirm the wind window changes, and I believe uh Sean is here to answer any questions related to that.

And um the um and then just as a reminder to look at the appeal, it's like it's a new new item.

One of the things that we are trying to relay, it's outside the purview of the Historic Preservation Commission, but I believe it's within your preview as City Commissioners, is really what the core neighborhoods plan is trying to encourage as part of this work, as well as the growth plan of 2024.

So from a staff perspective, and if you look at our strategic plans and in full view, we believe the investment and trying to make this house modern and for a family that's in the market rate is a good thing.

And so the conflicts between the building code, the historic preservation ordinance, which will be looked at as part of the LDC review, is difficult.

I will say in your packet, the owner, I would say the customer service handoff between the planning department and inspections and working directly with a homeowner, some miscommunication happened there.

There's a lot of different staff contacts along the way for a homeowner.

And I will say since then, uh Sean's office and my office have worked to get that better better service.

We have a lot of new staff in the mix there and trying to get that solidified.

So we are asking for your consideration of the variants and therefore the certificate of appropriateness.

So uh the new mother can move into our new house accordingly.

And um we're here to answer any questions.

We have other staff here, and the um homeowner and her contractor are here to answer any questions.

Any questions in the call by commission?

You have a motion.

I'll make the motion.

A second.

Any discussion?

I would say I'm pretty confused from all of these variances, and I can't imagine.

So if there was a lack of communication between all the different departments, apologies, that is a wonderful investment and to the core neighborhood.

Congratulations on your new baby.

Commissioner Strain.

Thank you.

What teeth exist in our historic preservation ordinances?

I'm sorry, John, keeping it.

What teeth exist in our historic preservation ordinances?

Honestly, it's a bane of our existence as well as I'm sure you've probably heard from sitting board members as well.

Um we actually run this trap through this.

You know, if you were to deny the variants and to deny this, her mediation would be to tear it down and and build new or remove the roof and build new.

Um otherwise we can find them, and that fine would have to go through municipal court, and we'd have to have those findings related to how the judge would rule.

Um I think those findings are typically a thousand dollars a day or remediation.

And so when we look at zone and code violations and um the teeth with that, it's difficult to implement to to that degree.

Um I think that this is an interesting uh and I'd like to sit down with the historic preservation board members.

I haven't had a chance since February 7th in this meeting.

But uh they are we have you know Heather Fisher is their chair, she's been one of the subcommittee members, and I uh as well as uh a couple other um Mike Dawson and um Nathan Larson and uh Matt Baren who are on the board have been part of the LDC focus groups, and uh we do see this as an element that can get ratified somehow in the new LDC.

And so we're working on that right now.

If I might continue, I'm an old building hugger.

And I have a history of fighting for historic buildings.

This just seems an honor uh odd to me that our our preservation, historic preservation commission is is going down the I'd rather see them fight for old buildings that are at risk rather than somebody trying to improve a building.

And and I don't know that that the you know that's just my I I'm surprised by this.

I haven't seen a single example of us trying to save a historic building that's worth saving.

In my years, and and I have appealed them to myself over the decades ago.

But and I'm not criticizing, I'm just saying that's my observation.

The Historic Preservation Commission, in my opinion, hasn't had any uh and the State's not much different.

They gutted the laws protecting historic buildings after some of us in Fargo tried to fight for whole old buildings.

So I'm confused too.

I I we certainly wouldn't, I'm anticipating you're not saying we go find them and penalize them.

You're saying find a way forward and get this done and passed and tweak it in the future so it doesn't happen again.

Is that how Yes?

I'm on pay on that page.

But I'd like to see our historic preservation commission either exist and do something real or not, like our other boards and commissions.

I believe that's going to be a heart of discussion as we go into the next month's uh maybe I'll take this opportunity uh maybe for a nanosecond to do an update on the LDC.

Um in a few weeks, we'll start having some more virtual meetings with the what we call Code Connect connects with the focus groups, those are public, and we've advertised those.

But starting in March through the summer, you're going to start to see some draft outreach and um and some more deeper dive into details like historic preservation, core neighborhoods.

Those right now everything's been really high level, and we're going to be getting in those.

But I I'm hoping this aspect uh will get um uh ratified with the new land development code.

I would just like uh to John's comment is that uh it almost like the builder got ahead and we're ahead and we're building and we're there, and then it's like, whoops, we did something wrong.

It would be better if we look at our our communication to track forward in the future, just because I think if it it all had been worked out prior to them, even starting building, we wouldn't we wouldn't be where we are today.

But uh congratulations, you've done a nice job of making the house better.

I'm happy to see you investing in the in the neighborhood.

And it looks like a wonderful addition.

I think it will be fantastic for your family.

So if there's no other discussion, roll call vote, please.

Turnberg?

Aye.

Epcorn?

I'm stranded Mahoney?

Recommendations and report from the Arts and Culture Commission uh explanation.

Well, Nicole, you're up here all day today, huh?

Nicole Crutzfield to explain.

We have been up here for six months and now I'm in front of you all night.

Um the Arts and Culture Commission, uh, we are in front of you tonight as a result of um we were talking about this already, but January 4th, as a reminder for the public, there was discussion about our volunteer boards and commissions, namely the Arts and Culture Commission, the Human Rights Commission, and the Native American Commission over the last uh year and a half, ever since uh we made a budget request in 2025, that was denied, if you will.

We knew we were going to be refocusing our work over the uh to figure out what that future looks like.

And so over the last year, we've been having um three quarterly work sessions with the Arts and Culture Commission, and prior to the January 4th meeting, you guys just beat me a little bit.

Um we had um we were getting ready to come in front of you to basically just change our operations.

And what we're proposing tonight is um to let the sitting ordinance sit and basically our operations of not meeting unless we actually have business items.

Uh and those business items would include, you know, their a grant just came to us or a nonprofit came to us with um I'm thinking of the red ball as an example where the Plains Art Museum and universities came to us and said we we have a community grant we're trying to do.

So it's very specific elements.

We're not meeting just to meet and we're not meeting just to brainstorm and do.

But um and so if we were to procure or proceed with any public art projects, we would be back in front of the City Commission to validate that uh that work plan.

Otherwise, um, we're kind of recommending keeping those that that ordinance on the books as is unless you want to see something otherwise.

So I'm glad to answer any questions.

Mr.

Copak.

Yeah, thank you, Nicole, and to the staff, but also thank you very much to the Arts and Culture Commission who have been working on this and had conversations over the past year.

I thought it was important we bring it forward since the work really had concluded.

Um it was really their recommendations that I that I support and endorse that are part of this memo.

It's also very similar if you think about even the work of the Historic Preservation Commission, the Economic Incentive Committee.

We have other commissions that meet like this today as needed.

And um again, speaking to the the origins of this request were to continue to find efficiencies and stay focused on core mission of the city.

Um this clearly to me answers both of those calls, and I appreciate the work of the Commission and certainly support and endorse this.

Any other discussion?

No motion.

What is what is the motion, pardon me?

The motion is basically to continue with the Arts and Culture Commission as stands with the understanding it will meet as needed on specific projects.

It will know that the first one is on the second.

Mr.

Turnberg.

I would say as a wonderful example, the Native American Commission has rallied and created their own group meeting on Monday night going to make sure that they continue their work, but not to be part of the city, but knowing that they can reach out to us anytime if they have something that they want to bring forward.

I would say we disband the Commission, still meet, absolutely have the arts people meet that are already meeting.

It doesn't have to be part of the city.

And when there's an agenda item that would be appropriate to bring forward, you have five people that you can contact, and we can put something on the agenda any time.

Mr.

Chair.

Yeah.

In response to that, the difference with the Arts and Culture Commission is the city does hear from granters and grants who come forward with projects like this, specific to the city.

And having this group as needed on call, like the Historic Preservation Commission to do the work on behalf of the city when requested, is the difference in this case.

So I would I would make the motion as I described on the second page.

Is there a second?

Just understanding, Nicole, cost-wise, is staff is basically the cost if we had a meeting just that they would have this facility.

Yeah, I think uh an operational uh so the operational difference is that basically I don't see any foreseeable work in the near future.

And so from a staff energy load, um there's basically none.

And um and so it would be if I got a call from the National Endowment for the Arts and they say we have a million dollars for the City of Fargo, then I would be contacting you.

But um otherwise uh we're not um really meeting until we can have actual work items.

And actually, if you got a grant, you'll be able to charge administrative costs back to the grant anyway if you have to.

Mr.

Strand.

Thank you.

Um a question or two first before I think out loud.

What's the role of the arts partnership going forward under this proposal?

Uh that's a great question.

Uh so I think the right now we're not proposing any changes.

Um I think that's a question for you in the 2027 budget process.

So right now there are line item in the uh in the city budget for $90,000 for the tri-cities grant.

We have to remember that work sits outside the Arts and Culture Commission.

That is basically a small granting for not small groups that's administered completely by the arts partnership.

So city staff doesn't even touch that money, if you will.

It's just a line item in the budget that's been in place for about 50 years.

Um but it's separate and apart from this.

In terms of the planning department's work as administrators of the current administrators of the public art program.

Uh we have very little involvement with the arts partnership unless there was some sort of community event where there is a co-sharing of duties.

My second question, you maybe kind of alluded to this, Nicole, was this entity was created in 2012?

Before that, what did we do if there were grants like the National Endowment for the Arts or other grants?

How did that work then if there was no arts and culture commission?

Uh we did we would probably maybe work with the arts partnership in that in that arena.

Now I'll make my comments.

Um I've lived and breathed in the arts world here in Fargo for decades.

I don't think there's anything more important and valuable in a community than art and culture in that.

But I don't I also don't know that it's I just feel like we're we're kicking the can down the road and putting life into nothing.

We're taking away a commission that had some hope and some opportunities, and we whittled it down to the point where it is ineffective and nothing's happening and we're gonna call it an ad hoc committee and let it continue and who is going to appoint them, who are they gonna be, what's the value for them being there?

I just think it's almost an insult to those folks in that community to say, well, we're gonna call you when we need you, but we don't need you.

We may.

I I think art is way more valuable than that.

Either we go full bore and do arts and culture commission right, like these other boards and commissions, or we acknowledge we're just not doing it right.

And and and I'm I'm of the mindset, let it go.

That's where my head is at.

This to me is just not a way forward that's gonna solve anything except a little paddle on some people that say, well, we don't want to offend you.

But it is offending kind of when that's their life.

And it shows that we don't respect art like we should.

Actually, I'd love to see a half mil for art.

Do something significant.

Be quantifiable.

V be palpable.

Be visual.

Do art.

The SODBuster is a great example.

We have a world class example next to us with the SODBuster.

But anyway, I'm I'm just of the mindset.

Until we come up with a my position is until there's a real compelling reason to bring people to the table to fight for arts.

Unless there's something you are fighting for, don't waste their time.

We have one public speaker on this item, Christopher Cohn.

Christopher Cohn, Fargo resident.

I started to feel less than positive about the ACC and other city boards, commissions and committees due to how the city manages them in some ways.

For residents to donate their expertise to local government, I would add, including their skills and experience while creating a transparency function for the city.

Being public facing, open to public observation, participation and scrutiny via the open records and meetings law.

I support keeping ACC intact for use when the work is next needed, which may be a year from now.

I think this is an opportunity though to tweak it to make it better.

It has certain weaknesses that can be addressed to make it more effective, starting with not having complete control by one individual, the director of the associated department.

Responsibilities would better be shared among staff so that their experience and ability has redundancy for retention when there is change in leadership or staff turnover.

Secondly, the members need to be less pliable by the department leader so that they are freer to depart from potential groupthink direction instilled by a dominant city administrator.

Otherwise they act as a rubber stamp body.

They could also use some help and support with maintaining good public relations, a skill the city is often challenged by, with all of them accessible to city residents, helpful, and never less than entirely friendly, while also being encouraged not to reject art donations to the city based on competitive relationships with other community artists.

Less competitive competitiveness would be a more constructive and responsible tact.

I request a written response to the following question.

Do you have any ideas to improve the ACC to function better when its work is next needed?

Thank you.

So I think the committee or commission has worked hard to come up with a solution, Commissioner Strand, and I think that oftentimes it's no different than uh this historic uh group that gets together oftentimes we don't call them together, but we do sometimes call them together.

And I think for Nicole over the years, sometimes the Arts Commission has had questions of what to do about this or what to do about that, and rather than deliberate that in the Commission has been deliberated by people and artists that are in the community.

Advisory-wise as they could advise us in a variety of things, and there may be some grants that come forward.

As you recall, the SODBuster cost a fair amount of money, and for us to get that, that was fantastic.

But we had to work with a lot of national people to get that and have that happen.

And they've done things within City Hall and activated the arts in that area.

Uh I think this uh Commissioner Kolpak was a compromise on their part, and it seemed to be a reasonable compromise at this point.

But they're appealing to be an advisory, they come together if the staff needs them, and there may be things in the future.

Commissioner Strand, to your point, I hope the artists and the art and culture community does reach out and do a variety of different things.

I was very encouraged by the uh Giving Hearts Day, in which a lot of the different artists got money donated to their organizations to continue to thrive.

Symphony different groups that are out there that have got people did donate to it and do feel strongly about the arts.

So uh I'm gonna support this proceed this going forward.

And the other two uh commissions are looking at it, I think Commissioner Turner did reference the Native American Commission as looking seriously what they need to do.

Uh HRC is looking at getting into the community, working more to get uh involved with community leaders.

So it has been a wake-up call for many of these commissions, but I think this is a good solution for this commission.

Any other discussion?

Roll call vote, please.

Call PAC?

Aye, Hepcorn?

Strand?

No.

Turnberg?

No.

Mahoney?

Commissioner, uh, Dave Sabowski, immigration-related enforcement and use of force overview.

Good evening, Commissioners.

Uh, thanks for the opportunity to uh give you some insight into uh the police department and how we deal with immigration-related issues.

Uh this is certainly an issue that has uh a lot of concern in not only our community but across the country uh based on a lot of things that have happened in the last 30 to 45 days, can cause a lot of stress and concern with the communities, relationships between the police and a whole bunch of other issues.

Uh fortunately, we have not had uh any significant issues in Fargo, which is good.

Uh our folks do an outstanding job of balancing uh the constitutional rights of everyone, uh, all sides of the equation and ensuring safety for everyone.

Uh the uh our whole department has just completed some training uh in regards to immigration itself and our role in it.

Our crowd management team has regular training as well in terms of how they handle protest activities.

Uh we are very good about reaching out to all protest organizers and working collaboratively with them to ensure safety of them and the rest of the public that's uh out there as well.

So I think overall we we do a good job here, and we've been fortunate in terms of not having any significant issues.

Uh however, there are a lot of questions, and um, so I'm gonna give you kind of a high-level overview of immigration and what our role is and what our role is not.

And I'm happy to take any questions at the end.

And then just so I don't forget, I have a couple of announcements uh at the after questions as well, uh, just for your uh knowledge.

So just to start with, uh Rest Authority, uh as you may know, uh U.S.

Constitution gives the Federal Government the exclusive authority over immigration.

Uh ICE, immigration and customs enforcement, one branch of the Department of Homeland Security does most of that work.

Uh but what we've seen over the last month and a half is a conglomeration of multiple federal agencies coming together uh along this effort based on uh some new direction that they've had at the top.

So in the past, it was always ICE individuals, ICE-trained personnel who did these types of removals or actions, and uh they're now in a position where they're blended with other federal entities uh who may or may not have had that experience, may have had some different training and approaches and things of that nature, and that's where some uh a lot of questions have come up about that, um, not just from other law enforcement, but from communities.

Essentially, it's a federal criminal violation or a federal civil violation.

There's two different components.

I'll explain that to you in a second.

Uh there's no equivalent state statute for immigration.

So uh there isn't a law in North Dakota that says you have to be a legal immigrant.

Uh there are some laws that I'll cover at the end that actually uh create a mandate for us to cooperate with these federal entities.

There's also what you might hear of some an exception, the 287G agreement.

So that is a federal statute that allows local and state agencies to sign agreements with the federal government, uh in essence, kind of deputizing them to enforce immigration crimes, make them part of that particular group.

Um department is not a 287 G department, uh nor would we do that, uh especially at this juncture.

We have plenty of local policing to do.

I'm not aware of any 287G agencies in our region.

Um that is there are some across the country.

But in case you hear that term, that's what that means.

So if you see some local agencies or a lot of times the sheriff's offices uh because they have the jail authority uh are involved in these in different areas of the country, and they're out doing that work, it's because they've signed this 287 G agreement.

So there's two categories.

So criminal is best described as unlawful entry.

So these are criminal immigration violations.

Improper entry, meaning someone has entered our country not through a port of entry.

That's a felony criminal violation.

There's been an illegal re-entry following deportation.

So someone who's been deported and illegally re-enters is a is a criminal immigration violator.

And if they enter fraudulently through a port of entry, but they use false documents to gain that immigration status and benefit, that's also a criminal violation.

The civil violations, uh overstaying a visa or a student uh student visa, visiting visa, whatever that is, uh violating terms of the visa.

Uh you're working here to work and you extend and you don't go back when you're supposed to, those are all civil immigration violations.

And then remaining in the United States after being ordered to leave.

So if you're here, likely on one of these visas, you uh you don't leave when you're supposed to, they order you to leave.

That's a civil violation.

Uh so in essence, the things that we are or would be involved in, and I'll go through this in more detail, would be the criminal side of that.

Uh we have no uh authority or dealings in terms of civil uh violations uh from a seizure, arrest, any anything like that uh type of aspect.

There's actual or alleged violation of state law or city ordinances.

Uh those are where we uh get involved.

Our big focus in these efforts, of course, is peacekeeping across the board for both the safety of the public and the safety of law enforcement that is there, be it state, federal, or local, who is involved in their particular actions, and or traffic control.

So that's our in terms of immigration operations, that would be our role.

Uh I think that's a safe presence, and I think it's a safe thing for the community to see if we're if there is some type of large operation.

Uh we have local police out there to ensure everyone's safety.

Uh hopefully people find some comfort in that and making sure that we are we are there to keep everyone safe while that particular action takes place.

Um we have no means, of course, to prevent another entity, the federal government or a state government from carrying out their lawful authority.

So you might have had heard some discussion about that.

Uh that's not legal for us to do.

What we can do is make sure that it's carried out as safely as possible.

So a couple of terms here I'll describe briefly, but if an officer has reasonable suspicion that an individual already lawfully contacted or detained committed a criminal violation of a federal immigration law, they may detain the person for a reasonable period of time in order to contact federal immigration officials to verify whether an immigration violation is civil or criminal.

And so what happens with these, the feds have entered in, I'm sure it's well over a million uh entries into the National Crime Information Center, NCIC, which is a teletype computer-based crime information system that all law enforcement uses.

So when we stop someone on a traffic stop, or we stop someone during a temporary detention uh or some other contact like that where we have lawful authority and we're stopping them for that reason.

Uh we run them through the system.

It's like when you check your driver's license, we check if they're wanted.

Uh there could be an NCIC entry that indicates that they have some type of immigration-related violation.

There's a number with that.

Uh, we've also got a number here for our local ICE contacts, which are based out of Grand Forks, that we would then call just to verify if this is civil or criminal.

If it's civil, we don't have anything more to do with it.

If it's criminal, we'll we'll discuss that here in just a second.

Um criminal, we can continue to detain them for a reasonable period of time for federal immigration officials.

Uh no individuals otherwise ready to be released should continue to be detained only because questions about their status are unresolved.

That last sentence pertains mostly to your jails and things of that nature who are holding people.

Uh for our part, if there's someone that we have stopped for some other lawful purpose and they have a a verified confirmed criminal immigration violation, uh, either the federal immigration officials would come there and take custody of that person, uh, or if it was going to be uh a period of time, we would convey them over to the Cass County jail who would hold them under that criminal immigration for uh for those officers to pick them up.

If we have probable cause to believe that they have already they're lawfully detained and they uh are here in a criminal violation, uh same thing applies.

Uh and any time we have a criminal immigration offense in which we are involved in any of that detention related activity, uh our shift commander will be notified on that so they can track that as well.

Uh and if that's confirmed again, ICE will pick that person up or they'll go to the jail for that criminal violation pickup.

And that's our only involvement in those uh particular violations.

I'm not aware that we've had any of those since all of this has started with uh the enhanced immigration.

Um so at this juncture that hasn't been any issue.

We have talked with the sheriff's office and uh they are uh available to hold individuals for criminal violations.

These are uh some of the statutes that were codified in this last session is House Bill 1303.

So you'll see that we can't be or yeah, by statute can't be prohibited from cooperating with federal agencies related, any federal agency, uh, but to this point, uh especially immigration and and so forth, uh to verify information.

Um the other part here has to do with what's commonly referred to as a sanctuary city, you know, the city of Fargo couldn't recognize a non-citizen unlawfully present.

Um that is state statute that we also have to follow.

Um, and then this is kind of how we do it based on that policy.

And then just going to some of the use of force questions that came up.

Um, you know, the the application of force, especially deadly force is not based on a particular crime or instance.

I think there was a request to disallow deadly force on any immigration-related violation.

Uh that's not a lawful interpretation or possible.

Uh the use of deadly force has very specific parameters.

It's used to protect your life or that of someone else.

Uh, or there's a fleeing felon rule as well that's in there, but essentially that's how deadly force is applied, and it doesn't matter if it occurs as a result of a traffic stop and someone pulls a gun out, and now we're in some kind of a deadly force situation, or we're making an arrest and something happens, or the police are attacked and respond.

Uh that is constitutional case law and also state and federal law as well.

So uh just to clarify that, and we have extensive training in that area as well.

Our officers do an outstanding job of minimizing the use of force across the board.

Um we've got our we do our annual review of our statistical data and our use of force related to calls for service and also related to those that we arrest are less than one percent of those particular um total numbers.

So we don't have to use force very often.

Uh when we do, we use it appropriately.

I completes the overview.

I'm happy to take any questions.

So any of the commissioners.

Mr.

Stern, I think you had the questions about the well.

I I I I really I wish the community could have a discussion about this more than just being talked to about it because it's so complicated.

And Chief, and I understand you know you're representing our law enforcement, but for the life of me, I just don't know what's the difference between us and Minnesota.

What's going on there versus here?

Well, I can tell you what I think the difference is.

I would like to know.

Um one of the big issues that has caused a lot of problems.

Uh I mean, there's there's things on both sides of the House that are could be done better, should be done better.

In fact, if you watch the ICP was out in front of this right before this even happened, calling on um all of these entities to convene and kind of tone this down.

Uh but in some instances, Minneapolis, for instance, has an ordinance that forbids their officers from cooperating with federal immigration.

So you are pitting one police agency against another, and you are also putting everyone in a position where when something happens or begins to get unruly, the local cops are going to have to respond anyway, but they're in a position where by ordinance they're not really supposed to be doing this, or are they considered helping them because they're trying to keep this from erupting into some kind of uh uncontrolled riot or a lot of people are going to get hurt kind of situation?

Uh so I think collaboration and partnership are the key to all of these things on both sides with the community, with the other agencies, so that they this can be safely carried out.

And the way I describe it is you know just like we would not Fargo PD going and carrying out an official duty, making an arrest or doing whatever it is we do, uh, we would not look kindly and it would be illegal for someone to try and intervene in that official law enforcement action.

It's the same thing if a federal officer is conducting a federal law enforcement action.

Um certainly the you know, the right to protest that and have different opinions about it, everyone recognizes and that's fine.

But the due process piece of our law is not on the street when there's an official action taking place, it's in a court or it's through you know, going through those agencies and making complaints about activity that was either wrong or illegal, and we're seeing that start to play out now, right?

It's in a court, or it's through, you know, going through those agencies and making complaints about activity that was either wrong or illegal, and we're seeing that start to play out now, right?

Some of these instances in Minneapolis, we're finding out the details now, and some of it's not looking very good.

Any appropriate actions, I'm sure will be taken.

But to protect everyone's safety, trying to litigate it or argue about it or confront people about it in those official actions is dangerous for everyone, right?

And so we try to minimize that as best as we can.

And what triggered my reaching out to you last week, Chief, was many of us maybe saw a news release with the pictures of three residents or people that were reportedly or allegedly involved with traffic blocking traffic in front of ice agents.

But I've never, in my years, I've never seen faces of individuals put out and sought out like that through our law enforcement agency to find them to help them be responsible for their stopping ice from it just was an odd moment.

I've never seen that.

And that made me wonder: is this what our flock cameras or our real-time camera real-time crime systems are used for?

Or at what point because we hear these things of other jurisdictions in states and places where somebody somebody gets caught on a camera and they have a 15-year-old warrant for a traffic violation, and all of a sudden ice is breaking in their front door.

But this situation in Fargo, help me understand what happened.

Why were their faces put out to the media?

Well, first, I would caution everyone about what you see, social media, et cetera, a lot of it is not accurate.

And it perpetuates perception and belief, just like when we talk about crime.

Our crime is down 17 percent, but some people think that there's a lot of crime here.

The statistics say otherwise, right?

And so the perception that is formed, in fact, in our most recent survey, it was pointed out very accurately, I guess, or very kind of forthrightly that 65 percent of those perceptions are from media reports.

And so remember that what people see is what they pay attention to, it's what they start to think, and all of a sudden it pertains to everything.

And so just suggestion number one.

Uh, in terms of what happened here in Fargo, that was a protest, and there was activity that happened, not like what you described, uh, that we observed uh to be above and beyond what we believe was protected First Amendment protest.

And we've referred that matter to the City Attorney's Office, and uh we'll we'll see what the municipal judge does with that.

And we absolutely do put pictures out all the time about people that we're trying to identify.

Uh what they committed there is an infraction, that's a crime, just like a misdemeanor or a felony.

Uh and we put people out routinely to try and identify them.

And the the other point I'll make on that issue is that we have a very good track record of working with groups here, and we've had, in fact, it was about a month ago, maybe a month and a half ago, I did an interview complimenting the organizers of the protest because they worked with us, they followed the law, they they protested peacefully without issue, and that's fine.

We're we're 100 percent supportive of that.

This group did not want to do that.

This group would not work with us.

And so we weren't able to have that kind of activity, and then this happened.

So our only option really is to identify that and take appropriate action, not that we're getting in the middle of someone's protest, because that would be more problematic than it would be worth.

Uh, but we have other measures to do that, and yes, that is how some of our technology helps us, so that hopefully we can educate these people, or maybe they will be more willing to work with us in the future rather than do things that cross the line because other people have the same rights that they have in those situations.

And so that's the balance that we're constantly trying to navigate.

I'll let others ask questions.

Actually, Christopher Cohen is going to comment because he has public speaking.

Christopher signed up.

Sorry.

Uh Christopher Cohn, Fargo resident, um, at the last City Commission meeting I commented on the need for clarification by the city about when law enforcement and Fargo of any type, whether a city public safety or other government unit may use lethal force, although this issue may have been politicized as a matter of public businesses.

Fargo law enforcement is authorized to use lethal force in limited circumstances officially at least.

I asked you for a written response to the question of could you clarify the policy?

I've not received any response.

With regard to what our chief um talked about, you know, the the issue here is can the city protect the public here in Fargo?

That's the issue.

And um the claim that the Minneapolis police cannot engage with Federal immigration authorities, they do because they they just regularly overlap with Federal immigration authorities in space and in time.

And they again they get involved with each other, and that will happen here too if uh the Federal immigration enforcement descends on the city too.

So the FPD could end up involved in incidents in which uh Federal immigration authorities illegally use uh uh use of lethal force that's happened uh twice against American citizens in Minneapolis in January.

Uh so the the question is is can this be uh clarified?

Uh and uh is there anything the city can do to protect citizens here?

We need to protect the public here.

People are getting murdered.

Um Federal immigration law enforcement may descend on the city enforce at any time.

My other question that I request a written response to is could you clarify when any law enforcement operating within the city's borders may legally use lethal force as well lethal force as well as commit to not covering up misuse of force and illegal killings going forward.

Secondly, I request a written response to whether or not you would support requiring Federal immigration agents to obtain a judicial warrant before entering City of Fargo property.

I think the city needs to do what it can to protect the public here.

Thank you.

Any questions?

The Commissioners of the Chief?

Yeah, um, if we can go back to that presentation, I told Mr.

Cohen, I apologize.

But on the slide, it's got our policy and the link to our website where you can read those policies on use of force.

That's all I have, sir.

I think you had an announcement you wanted to.

Oh, yeah, good.

See, thanks for helping me remember.

Uh too, actually.

So next Monday, uh the 23rd at 1130.

We'll be uh hosting a press conference at the Gateway Commons at the PD to go over our 2025 crime statistics.

Uh so you are all invited to that.

Also on the 26th next week at 6 o'clock at public health, we'll be hosting our beat three meeting.

So you are also invited to attend that.

Uh, we'll be sure that will be pushed on on social media, but just to bring both of those events to your attention while I'm up at the mic.

Mr.

Stran, you had one other question.

Thank you.

And Chief, I would like to thank you and your department for what you do.

And and please know we have your back.

And and I the people are hoping you all have our back.

I think you do.

I'll just lay it out this way.

The the situation in the world is not pretty right now, and what is going across the country right now isn't affecting us the same as is other cities and other places in the country.

And I'm I'm hoping it doesn't come to our doorstep.

And and and I'm guessing you are going to know before any of us what comes our way and what's coming our way and what we're going to be looking at and facing and what our citizens are facing.

But it's just really trying ugly times.

And and and we're all challenged to be the best citizens we can be.

And we do have people in our community who are terrified, who don't dare to look outside, who don't dare talk to others, who don't dare go out into the public, who don't dare go shopping in schools, even sometimes.

We do have people who are absolutely terrified.

For probably no reason almost all the time.

So that's my concern is how do we get back to a state of getting along with each other and peace with each other and respect for each other?

And this isn't so much a local issue.

It's this national stuff that's we're looking out there and going, I hope this doesn't happen here.

We're I hope we're not the next Minneapolis.

And and and I just have the highest regard for law enforcement and what you and your department are doing here.

And I'm knocking on wood.

I'm la we're fortunate that we're a red state.

We're not having the same issues blue states are having.

So thank you for your work and thank you for your attentive to this and hearing the concerns of the people.

I am guessing you know this way better than I could ever articulate it.

Well, no, thank you.

On behalf of the Department, appreciate that.

And uh, we are doing everything we can to maintain that safety and uh transparency.

Pardon the Mr.

Turnberg.

May I make one response to the Chief and the comment?

Sure.

Um yes.

That's okay.

I uh absolutely think we need to protect residents just like Lake and Riley.

Um thank you, Chief, for all you do.

Thank you to the ICE officers, the federal officers for serving.

I asked my good friend who's a new American.

If she was nervous, she laughed in my face.

She thought it was hilarious.

Why on earth would I be nervous?

You can be the nicest person in the world and go rob a bank, you're still going to be charged with armed robbery.

So thank you for what you do.

Thank you for protecting us.

Um I will continue to support police and ice.

Thank you.

Thank you.

And any liaison report in addition to that?

I think you have something about the library.

I do.

Well, I actually have um we don't have engineering speaking tonight for the first time in a while.

But I do want to share um engineering works very hard to get funds.

So the uh bulk is not put on the city of Fargo.

And the City of Fargo Engineering Department was recently notified by the North Dakota Department of Transportation that the city had been awarded a total of 10 million in grant funding for two projects, including two and a half for the reconstruction of NP Avenue and seven and a half for a concrete pavement rehabilitation project on 45th Street.

So those funds are part of the prairie dog and grants program, but they have to go to the work to get the funds to get that money.

So thank you, Tom and the engineering department for all that you do.

You guys are hard workers.

I have um updates on happenings at the library on my Facebook page.

Yeah, and just so we understand, Tom, normally we get about 24 million in prairie dog funds.

This is 10 million over one year or two years.

So what's changed on prairie dog fund?

We used to get the funding, now we have to grant apply for it.

This is fantastic.

But just bear in mind the city of Fargo and Prairie Dog funds typically is 12 million a year.

Yeah, so this is a a new form that was created through this last legislative session.

So our direct allocation um was reduced uh pretty significantly from last biennium to this biennium by about 20 million dollars.

Uh but then this new funding opportunity came about, which is prairie dogs' grants.

Um so we applied for that, like Commissioner Turnberg just shared.

Uh, we're awarded 10 million dollars.

The caveat with it is that both prairie dog fund uh buckets have to fill in order for those um grants to actually come our way.

But we track that and currently we're we're still on pace for that to happen within the biennium.

Excellent job applying for the grants.

We appreciate the hard work your team does.

Thank you, Tom.

My Liaison report just wanted to remote that into convention agenda.

We have the Fargo Police Foundation that raised $86,000 to send uh officers to the Fargo Police uh to the National Police Week, wellness conference attendance, two trikes.

We got two more tracks, everybody loves those trikes, and we got a new canine, so we very much appreciate the foundation's work that helps us out.

Mr.

Kolpak.

Thank you, Mayor.

That first report was part of mine as well to call that out on the consent agenda.

Um and secondly, I will be flying to Washington, D.C.

with the chamber this weekend for the second time on the military trip.

So looking very much forward to that and visiting our congressional delegation and other offices out there, so shout out to the military as well and North Dakota support for them coming from a military family.

So very much looking forward to that trip.

Mr.

Stran.

Thank you, Mayor.

I just uh so you all know when you hear from the DCP Mike Almendinger is their new chair of the board starting today.

That was his first meeting this morning.

And this last week Rick Berg is the new chair of the airport authority board of directors.

So we've had some leadership shifts in our in our uh our uh groups out there, but they're they're really all doing good work.

We do have four speakers for public comments.

I'm gonna go to the virtual first.

Uh Grace Brennan, are you on?

Grace, Brennan.

Olivia Fisher, are you on?

Archie, is there an issue?

Hi, this is Olivia.

Was I called to speak?

Olivia, we got you.

Go ahead.

We had you.

Hello.

I think they just have everyone who's going to speak stuck in here.

I don't think we're up yet.

Oh, okay.

I I've been in here for a while, and that's what I've learned.

So that's what's going on for me.

Perfect.

Thank you.

Yeah.

Who's going first?

Olivia, go ahead.

Okay.

Okay.

Can you hear me?

Yes, we can.

I don't know if I can hear you guys on my end, so I'm just gonna start speaking.

Um if you can start restart my time, I'm so sorry.

Um good afternoon, Olivia Fargo resident.

I'm speaking tonight on behalf of myself and a multitude of residents here in Fargo to make it clear that we support our neighbors regardless of immigration status, regardless of if they are housed or unhoused, regardless of whether the current administration or anyone on this commission thinks they should be here or not.

The fact that this country is trying to convince us all to hate and fear immigrants is disgusting.

The real monsters are the men who kill women for fun, like the creeps sitting in the Cass County jail for murdering Isidora Wengel, or the horrifyingly corrupt men who are sitting comfortably in the White House right now, or Jonathan Ross, who murdered Renee Good in Minneapolis last month, just to name a few.

That is who your citizens are fearful of, not our immigrant neighbors.

The laws and regulations that U.S.

citizens are expected to uphold have been repeatedly broken by ICE and politicians, yet here we are tonight, preparing the public on how the police are allowed to use force against anti-ICE protesters and how they will cooperate with ICE.

With the way the city and commission casts site on house community members, it is not at all surprising that none of you have taken steps to at least try to protect your constituents from being snatched off the streets by ICE or harassed in the streets by ICE or shot in the street by ICE.

Those of us who pay attention know that it won't be just be our immigrant neighbors who are taken.

Agents are taking people regardless of if they're here legally or not.

Not to mention lots of abductees are not being entered into ICE databases, so their families are unable to locate them.

And agents are sexually assaulting detainees at their camps.

Are you really okay with that happening to people who are currently residing in Fargo, including children?

I'm certainly not, and I know my neighbors aren't either.

I suggest fellow Fargo residents pay very close attention to the actions of every single person on this commission, along with those running to be a part of it in the upcoming election.

Because as someone that has been watching these meetings, the key things I have seen in the last two years are increased attacks on the homeless, increased funding for the police, the end of DEI, increased attempts to silence constituents, harmful actions taken towards city employees, threats of cutting public health and cultural arts funding, a lack of concern towards the ongoing genocide in Palestine, and a whole lot of political theatrics.

Now is the time to make it especially clear what we as Fargo residents expect of this commission and the future mayor.

I assure you that politicians who support the blatant white supremacist attacks that ICE officers are committing will prioritize profits, not their constituents.

I'll end by saying May Isidora and all other missing and murdered victims whose bodies have never been recovered, rest in peace in free Palestine.

Grace Brennan, are you on now?

Good evening.

My name is Grace Brennan, and I'm a Fargo resident.

I'd like to first say thank you to Olivia for that excellent statement.

Fargo has a contract with Flock Safety to manage city-owned cameras.

However, Flock Safety is under scrutiny for collaborating with federal federal agencies like ICE, along with other data privacy concerns.

With this in mind, I contacted the Fargo Police Department to find out more.

In our correspondence, Officer Matt Christensen stated, our flock cameras are not able to be accessed by any federal agencies.

We control the data collected and would need an official request to release any information.

We would then evaluate whether we choose to release the information requested or not based on the reason they're requesting it.

However, I also requested a copy of the city's contract with Flock Safety.

Section 5.3 of that contract states FLOC may disclose footage to law enforcement authorities, government officials, and or third parties, if legally required to do so.

Or if Flock has a good faith belief that such access use, preservation, or disclosure is reasonably necessary to comply with a legal process, enforce this agreement, or detect, prevent, or otherwise address security, privacy, fraud, or technical issues, or emergency situations.

This very broad contract term seems to contradict FPD's assertion that their permission is needed for outside agencies to access footage.

I've asked Mayor Mahoney and Officer Christensen for clarification on these points in our email correspondence.

I have also asked whether FPD uses funds from civil or criminal asset forfeiture to pay for any contracts with Flock Safety, and whether FPD or Flock Safety comply with mere administrative warrants from ICE without a judge's signature.

These are pressing and timely issues that affect community members' safety, privacy, and general well-being.

I would like to receive a detailed and clear written response to my still unanswered questions.

Thank you.

Two weeks ago did an about face on that when the FPD took it upon itself to appear to support one political side against the other in a street dispute that endangered people, and in which nothing short of warnings to all to ensure public safety was acceptable.

Favoring one side over another is the best way to damage public safety by alienating the whole that whole side and the side chosen in this case will result in the potential endangerment of any pedestrians in the city with drivers feeling immune and emboldened to use their vehicles to express frustrations, reminder and conveniences, inconveniences, or those associated with their political leanings.

This also potentially has created a serious liability issue as well, should any pedestrians in the future be injured or killed due to driver aggression.

The goal for the city was to appear unambiguously politically neutral and concerned most of all with the safety of all the strengthening public safety, not weakening it by alienating part of the public and leaving them distrusting of public safety.

The basic functioning of the justice system requires people to trust authorities and cooperate as witnesses.

The FPD's performance was a fail-on on all accounts.

The question is why would the FPD choose such a foolhardy, irresponsible, and dangerous course of action?

I request a written response to the following question.

Did police leadership act alone or were there others colluding?

And how will the city fix the damage that has been done and ensure that this doesn't happen again?

Do we need uh it's clear police leadership is not acting in good faith or fair dealing, uh, sitting through every one of these city commissions, thus knowing the city leadership has a policy of not picking sides and contentious political issues, yet decided to violate that.

Unfortunately, any of you may be suspected as having colluded in that unless you make it clear, you are not involved.

If police leadership is acting alone, then we need to determine how to prevent it from doing any more damage and to perhaps create uh and I'll leave it at that.

Thanks.

Joseph Garcia.

That's the end of our speakers.

Thank you.

We adjourn the meeting.