Okay, if everybody's ready, we'll go ahead and get started.

We're going to take the roll.

Be sure in this room.

For uh for everybody online to hear us.

And for the recording.

So we can so we can hear you.

Yes, and then turn it off when you're done.

Okay.

So Clark.

Kinslow.

Okay.

He'll be here in just a few minutes.

Runyon.

We have say that again.

I'm sorry.

PV house was proxy.

Size more.

Here.

Okay.

Let's see.

So the minutes were sent and updated.

Having read all of that, do I have a motion to accept the minutes for the previous meeting?

The last copy I got didn't have the updates on it.

Okay.

All right.

I will make a motion to approve the minutes.

However, the the request that I made was the there was a roll call vote.

And it just showed eight.

It just showed the vote count.

It didn't have the names of the vote.

Yeah, that was updated.

I put that there was on that vote that eight voted to approve, and Chief Sizemore was opposed.

That was on the update.

Okay.

I I don't I guess I didn't get that one.

Okay.

So motion to approve the minutes.

Second.

Okay.

Move to approve.

Right.

Baker.

Second by Hearn.

All in favor?

Any opposed.

Okay.

All right.

So on the agenda, we talked about what we're going to do for the 2026 year and then a slight discussion into the 2027 year.

As most of you known, uh, after this last meeting, we took the Motorola purchase to the Fort Smith Board of Directors.

Uh and it was defeated.

Uh that said, uh we were asked to take a look at our uh procedures, or not our procedures, to take a look at at our plan uh and to come back to a study session.

That said, uh I've had several conversations with um finance, uh also with the Arkansas State um 911 board.

And to that point, the Arkansas 911 president CJ Ingle is joining us online as we get through this.

If there's any questions for him, he will be uh available for questions.

So what we did is we went and looked at what we need to do to cons for consolidation.

The building is out.

Until we get consolidated, trying to find a location, uh it will prove difficult because there's many factors going into this, namely the switching over of the budget from the 911 EC fund at Sebastian County to the River Valley Communications Center in 2026.

Okay.

So that said, I want to uh ask the board.

Go ahead.

I'm sorry.

I just just first to those points.

I mean the you know, as was recognized, as has been recognized by this board, uh especially at the last meeting, and then uh you know the just the overall cost of the plan that we had been um in terms of you know buying the Motorola equipment, building the building, all of those things that amounted to 10 at least 10 million dollars capital expense that none of us really had a good handle of of where that was gonna come from, other than the city and county's general funds, uh, which already have problems.

And so um that was a um uh of large concern when the Motorola agreement was brought forward to the city's board of directors.

Um course they you know they recognize the of the um the five-year lease and then when the lease payments start, not until 27.

I mean there was a recognition of that, but it was still an overall five million dollar five plus million dollar uh project.

And couple that with the need to you know spend a similar amount of money on the building that we've identified and really um to to build that sort of building any place, whether it's that location or any other location, it was gonna be a significant cost.

And so um that that discussion was held.

I mean the Wes brought the the initial item after our last meeting on November 4th.

We had the study session discussion on November the 10th following that, and just uh an overall, you know, I guess uh call to reckoning from our board of directors that you know we're not gonna be able to afford this.

And so the instruction then to Wes and myself, and then as we were relaying here to you all today is let's find an alternate location, let's do something different, whether we have to call it temporary or not.

Let's do something different, whether we have to call it temporary or not.

Let's meet the objectives of the legislation that requires us to consolidate, get it consolidated, operate however that has to happen for uh any amount of temporary time, and then continue to build towards what we do on a permanent basis for locating a either a standalone or some other operation uh some other location for the consolidated PSAP to operate.

And so that is what that's really the direction that our the city board of directors has given us.

I think in the meantime, uh Wes and I think uh Judge Hotz has met with some of the the mayors from the smaller cities in the in the county um just to hear um concerns about the over overall cost.

And I think um it is prudent upon us to reconsider our plan and back up and choose a different path.

Thank you, Jeff.

So to that end, in January, this board approved a resolution to locate the RVC C at 4501 borough.

As it is quite clear that that is no longer an option, I would entertain a motion to cease all design and engineering at 4501 borough road and remove the location from consideration as the RVCC site.

I'll make that motion.

Okay.

Hotes second move moved.

Any discussion.

Hearing none.

Clark.

Cooper.

Yes.

Kingman?

Yes.

Hearn.

Yes.

HOTS?

Yes.

Kinslow.

Yes.

Runyon, PBS.

Yes.

Sizemore.

Yes.

Baker?

Yes.

Okay.

Motion passes nine four zero opposed.

So now that it is quite clear that we need to um move forward on consolidation.

That is the primary focus of where I will be uh putting my attention uh for this point in time.

Real briefly, what I have is uh the need to move forward with consolidation.

The whole purpose of our consolidation in January of 2027 was predicated on the fact that we were going to have a a building in which to do it.

All right.

Since that is no longer viable, I see no reason why we have to delay consolidation any longer than is absolutely necessary necessary.

I've met with uh several entities.

I've met with CJ, I've met with our CAD folks.

Uh I've sent emails out uh especially to uh Sheriff Runyon uh in order to to start the process of getting Sebastian County onto the Pro Phoenix CAD.

I've scheduled some training to uh get the system administrators for Sebastian County that we determine uh to get them on board and trained in February.

And my goal is to get Sebastian County on the CAD by April or May, and I would like to be fully consolidated by July the first.

At that end, the location that we will uh that makes the most sense is gonna be at the Fort Smith Police Department.

We have eight consoles.

I have six radios, but I have four radios at the EOC that I will move to the police department, and we will consolidate temporarily at the Fort Smith Police Department until such time as we can revisit the location.

I want to emphasize that this uh will be a temporary location.

We will be able to uh we will be able to consolidate and we'll we will be able to dispatch out of the police department using the equipment that we have.

Um we would have a couple of expenses uh in order to move the radio and a few other expenses to get us ready for consolidation.

Uh that will will come in early of 2026.

And we'll bring to you uh at that time whenever that need presents itself.

That said, I want to make sure that we understand that this is a temporary location.

consolidation uh that will come in early of 2026 and we'll bring to you uh at that time whenever that need presents itself that said i want to make sure that we understand that this is a temporary location i'm asking for two and a half years to reside at the fort smith police department as a fully consolidated facility until we come back and and i can bring a uh proposal for this location that uh is acceptable to you the board as well as all those other stakeholders in sebastian county my job until that point this gets us consolidated as per the state legislative right uh regulations and so that'll also allow us to get the budget in line to get an understanding of what the true costs are what some of the uh issues that we may arise with consolidation how to solve those and then when it is time for us to revisit a location I can bring back uh a wealth of information for any and all possible locations um for that point but what I would like for us to do is to um make it clear what the plan is moving forward so I would enter tone entertain a motion to set the date of full consolidation to July 1st 2026 temporarily locating the RVCC PSAP at Fort Smith PD for a period of two and a half years from date of consolidation and to proceed with any necessary action to accomplish said cons said consolidation.

I'll make that motion second okay so let's move to the discussion I would like to go over with you what the budget's going to look like for 2026.

Okay so that now that we have this motion on the floor we can start kind of honing in and whether or not we want to go this route okay the 2026 budget is presented to you all was predicated on the fact that we are going to be building a new building there were construction costs involved there was the uh Motorola costs involved uh there was increased operating costs involved because of the likelihood of moving into a new building so I've removed those operating costs further I met with CJ and we went over the requirements of Arkansas statute 1210 323 and what what 911 funds can be used for.

And this is the biggest change because of that legislation there are some things in the operating budget that the 911 funds should not be used for those funds the personnel reimbursement for Fort Smith EMS is part of it the um the tower lease the the NSH properties and the what's the other one besides NSH the tower lease for that it was oh kgb lc because those tower leases are for the the paging of fire departments is to my understanding and not directly related to the receipt of 911 calls the way he explained it is that that cost is for the four walls of that building anything that comes into that PSAP okay where the CAD is involved the paging is different.

And if that and and you may you're you're ready to correct me if if that's not the case I need to know so looking at those two tower sites one is located at White Bluff Rahill the other is located on Poto Mountain and they are specifically used for paging of first responders and fire department and also EMS and to the caveat of those frequencies and those tower sites that are also utilized for paging and the notification alert for all of the uh tornado sirens in the county as well.

Okay.

So we just want to make sure clear on the and that's and that's what I thought they were okay the interface is something that we do with CAD in order to send it to the towers.

Fortsmith Fire Department also has a paging and alert system that y'all pay that service agreement on that we just do the interface to that right one of the other things that came into play was the tornado sirens.

I know that we talked about at one point that the tornado sirens would be housed within our VCC um the service and maintenance of the tornado sirens cannot it is not a part of the 911 funds.

Um the service and maintenance of the tornado sirens cannot.

It is not a part of the 911 funds.

However, the commander system that sets off the sirens that rests in the 911 center can be.

All right.

So that is part of that conversation and a reason why those were taken out.

Right.

And if I may add, so currently uh countywide to include the city of Fort Smith, all tornado sirens are operated and maintained by that municipality.

So we'll just let it be known that no tornado siren in any shape or form is maintained and operated by Sebastian County.

Right.

As far as servicing and service requests for the paging and alerting that has been operated through uh county and 911 funds in the past.

Okay.

Um there was um we will keep with the ATT customer premise equipment.

You know, that's that's a necessity.

One of the things that I want you to to be aware of and put on your radar for 2027.

Um, and I think this is going to go towards more of Fort Smith.

Right now, Fort Smith's Motorola service agreement uh is for the entire city.

As you know, Motorola, um we have radios and services with them for not only the police department, the fire department, sanitation, utilities, and transit.

Uh once we we've got one more year of that contract and we'll have to renew it for 2027.

I'm going to work on carving out or or identifying that costs for the dispatch radios.

So that'll be part of that.

Okay.

Um what you got?

Go ahead.

Travis Cooper.

So just to add to uh what the city has, the county also has an agreement with that.

And so by pulling that in the Well, and that's and that's the question.

I started with that to ask this question.

In this budget, we have the Motorola service agreement.

Is that only for your radios and dispatch and not for anything else?

Yeah, so that agreement is specified only for dispatch resources only.

Perfect.

Okay.

All right.

So those are some of the cuts that I've made.

Any other questions about that?

Yeah.

Are we premature in voting to move it to Fort Smith PD since we do not even have a budget?

We do have a budget in front of us.

I am I am altering it.

Okay.

That what I've done is the budget that I've given you, that amount is being reduced.

Okay.

All right.

So should we not see that in front of us prior to us even voting on this?

I mean, I wouldn't vote on this for that in any other time.

So we don't have a budget, so uh I think we should wait that budget's in front of us before we even consider voting on this.

Well, what I can do is I'm uh right now, if you are don't have any other questions, I'm gonna walk through the costs that I have in this budget, the overall costs, personnel operating for all of it.

So let me if y'all are okay or have any other questions, go for it, Chief.

I do, but I thought I thought we were sticking to the budget discussion, but I mean, so you're you're suggesting consolidating Sebastian County dispatchers and FSPD at the police department.

Did I hear uh July the first of 2026 for two and a half years?

Correct.

Is this a I mean uh and this may be more of what you're about to get into?

Um are we consolidating everything?

Are we just physically consolidating or are we uh what what is your plan in regards to that?

The plan is to consolidate police and fire dispatch 911 in the police department.

I know at one time we had talked eventually when we got to the new building, we were going to bring emergency medical into the into the play.

That's no longer the case.

We will still operate as we have with transfer of medical calls to Fort Smith EMS in order to provide that dispatch to the ambulances.

The fire first responders will remain with dispatch and all police will remain with dispatch.

Does that meet the need for consolidation?

Yes, yes, it does.

CJ, can you hear I gotcha?

And I can confirm that consolidating the two PSAF, Sebastian County dispatch and Fort Smith police department dispatch, if you consolidated those two entities together, that would meet the statutory requirements for consolidation of funded PSAPs, which would in turn meet our dead or take our deadlines off of you guys.

So any future moves or needs could be done on your timeline.

So what we'll have to consider here also is if uh I realize you're saying the uh we won't get a subsidy, but you still want to rely on us to dispatch 18 first responder agencies that are not under our preview.

You're one that's to bat dispatch Sebastian County EMS.

So that will cost money.

Okay.

So we'll have to put that back in the budget.

Where it comes from, that's the one.

When we dispatch first responders, it the first responders of the fire department.

That's what we that's how we operate now.

Is we will transfer to the medical, and when we the first responder is needed, we enter the first responder call and we send the first responders.

So we will take up that aspect where you will only dispatch your ambulances.

So your dispatchers are going to then go ahead and be trained in EMD.

No, because that's how you're making that is then that.

So we will eventually get there.

I want to be clear with that.

We can't we can't do that eventually on July 1.

You're either going to have to have them or not have them.

Okay.

Okay.

So if you don't have them, I'll just tell you to the board, you're making a mistake.

Okay.

It doesn't, it doesn't bother me to not do it for you, but it bothers me for the people that live in those areas.

We are still giving the MD instructions to those areas to first responders.

They're talking with us.

We're we're communicating to the paramedics in the field that are coming.

You're going to have to tie that back together, or you have isolated that care from consolidation at all.

So we are a secondary PSAP.

I realize we're not required to consolidate.

It's only the PSAPs.

That's why we're meeting consolidation.

But it does cost to do that.

Fort Smith, we we pay most of all the cost of the dispatching because it's in the city of Fort Smith, with exception of barley.

We we take care of borrowing.

And then our dispatchers work closely with all the all the first responder agencies.

I don't know if it's 18 or 19, Freddy.

18.

Okay, so we work with all of them.

We stay in communication with them.

We stay in communication with the paramedics coming, whether it be us coming down in the county or whether it be Sebastian County MS.

So there's there's you've got a void to fill still.

Okay.

And I'm more than willing to work or let anyone get hung out to drive there from Fort Smith, that's for sure.

Right.

And also too, is under EMD, that patient or that call taker that's that's taking that call talking to the patient or they're asking those questions and relaying that too for the first responders and the paramedics both.

And so it has to be very, very trans right, you know, transparent throughout the whole call where now you're asking to have another dispatcher.

Right.

Basically two dispatchers.

Well, let me ask this.

Taking that call.

When we take we will eventually take over EMD.

That's that's coming.

That's within that two and a half years is eventually I would like for us to do M EMD in the consolidated center.

So having said that, when that happens, what happens to your dispatch center?

Well, that's something we have to discuss down the line.

If we choose uh to let you take that over per se.

Okay.

That would be our service.

Uh but if we're having trouble meeting the numbers for full consolidation and a new plan, and they've just told us this meets for full consolidation.

Maybe we all start thinking about something that gets us back into a realistic budget to pay for.

We're getting 1.7 million and we're still at, you know, 2.4 million just in salaries plus.

I mean, I think that we can do this on a better set of numbers.

Well and I'm getting to that point.

To show you this, and we will come back and we can tweak these numbers.

Okay.

So I'll tell you what, let me let me walk through this real quick.

All right.

So right here.

to pay for we're getting 1.7 million and we're still at you know 2.4 million just in salaries plus i mean i think that we can do this on a better set of numbers well and i'm getting to that point to show you this and we will come back and we can tweak these numbers okay so i'll tell you what let me let me walk through this real quick all right so right here yeah this is the budget that we have for all of personnel and cost and i added the personnel to the sebastian county in this because they're they're going to be fielding their dispatchers for 2026 all of it for now the reason for that is after talking to the yes it's yes it's annualized cost but after talking to the HR director there could be some issues with bringing over the employees and starting them in July so I don't have a problem but I just want to make sure they're body understands that while they may be physically located at the police department they will still be being paid by Sebastian County.

That's correct oh is that a question then if we to that to that point if they consolidate on July 1st they'll start being paid by RBCC at that point.

No unless we can get with the HR director and and work out some of that issue I think that but as long as we annualize this cost Sebastian County has budgeted $684,347 dollars for personnel costs for their dispatchers.

City of Fort Smith has budgeted $2,435000 for their dispatchers annual cost okay that is what's that's going to be the cost for that personnel.

The same thing goes with the operating once I've made the cuts and looked at that the operating cost is $469,465.

Now that's a total budget cost you take away the revenue that we expect all right we have a net cost of $1.8 million dollars now so that said let's start with working out the cost for Sebastian County Sebastian County is paying this amount $6847 for the 2026 personnel costs so we enter that there and then we have a 55% credit for the personnel reimbursement that we've done in the past did I go so five percent that is the credit from RBCC for those salaries we then come back and rather than taking all of it because in 26 this will in 27 it will be different because we're all going to be in one spot but since we're going to have two funding agencies for personnel we're going to split the operating costs.

So explain the 55% for those that may not be aware.

The 55% was set by this board as a agreed upon personnel reimbursement for the total cost of the personnel.

Correct so RVC will pay 55% to the personnel that's essentially what the Sebastian County was paying for Fort Smith for Fort Smith.

It switches now right so then if we take the operating costs 569 and we're going to multiply it by the 30.3% for the interlocal agreement that's 1728 this would be how much the Sebastian County owes RVC.

So rather than going in two directions we are going to take this out of that credit and that brings us the 20343 that we will send to the county if you take that amount out of the budgeted personnel costs that Sebastian County will have total general fund impact for Sebastian County is 480,504.

If you take that amount out of the budgeted personnel costs that Sebastian County will have total general fund impact for Sebastian County is 480,504.

So now let's go and look at Fort Smith.

All right.

Fort Smith, since we are operating this fund, we have to find out what is the general fund impact to Fort Smith.

So the personnel budget.

And then the operating budget.

Okay.

Is that amount?

So let me ask a question.

Where is your 55%?

Since it's all Fort Smith, we're not taking that out.

Consolidated yet, so you shouldn't be doing that.

Well it's that's it's going to be the dispatchers rather than the police department paying them.

The RVCC is paying them.

And so that's all part of that operating cost.

If we're not consolidated, though, it should still be 55% reimbursement to the city, shouldn't it?

It's it's the same thing.

No, it's not.

This is a 9-1-1 fund paying 100% of the salaries at the at the police department.

For the plea for Fort Smith.

So shouldn't it all still be just a reimbursement only?

55%.

55% then.

Take this.

Right.

The revenue we are expecting.

Fully funded or not fully funded by the 911 funds prior to this.

Not fully funded.

No.

No, the county paid 45% of the salaries.

Okay.

And that's what that's what this would be, this number right here.

That would be the 45% of the salaries plus 30% of the operating cost.

Which that used to come out of the 911 fund, the operating cost.

30% of the outstanding costs of the what we get.

Say that again, I'm sorry.

That's that's the county's personnel cost plus the 30% of the operating, which is net of what the 911 fund is covering.

I'm not clear.

Okay.

Right.

The operating costs this year has included both Fort Smith and Sebastian County, the the operating costs for the 911 money.

So the 911 money is here.

Right.

And it's all paid for out of 911 money.

Okay.

Right.

I mean that's what we're doing.

That's why we're operating now.

That that operating is paid out of the 911 funds.

Right.

Because if we go back.

Hey Wes, can I jump in for a second?

Oh, sure.

Well, I'm sorry, and I hate to interrupt.

I just wanted to say if whether you're paying for the personnel or the operating cost or the whole picture out of the 9-1 funds, it's going to equal the same amount back to the county and city general fund.

Because the 9-1 funds are meant to cover the whole operational budget, including salaries and equipment.

Now it won't cover the full amount, but you can use it towards the full amount.

Say that again.

So you were saying use the full amount.

So the 911 funds are meant to go towards the full budget, including personnel and the equipment, meaning whatever's left over after you attribute those 911 funds in is what the county and the city are going to split.

So whether you're doing it from personnel specifically or equipment specifically, it's really the same number back to both entities.

Or a combination.

Your shortfall is going to be the same as my point.

Okay.

So I need to take this 55% out.

Is that right?

Because it's all the same.

Shortfall.

Well, then you need to take if you're gonna take it out of one, then you take it out of both.

Okay.

So this will be instead of okay.

So the full personnel budget, operating costs.

And so if that is the case, then we're not that would be this is basically going to be zero.

And then there's that because essentially you're paying you will be paying your full salaries plus 30% of the operating.

And Fort Smith will be paying full salary and 70%.

So then that in that instance, there's all of the personnel cost.

Okay.

But so then we would need to take it.

If I'm understanding what you're trying to accomplish, we are essentially swapping roles for 2026.

Yes.

That's it.

That's it.

And bringing county dispatch into the department.

The last half of 26.

But on 2027, all this will be one spot.

That's that's the difficulty that we've been having is that we are trying to look at two separate PSAPs while trying to move over the fund balance and the revenue that we're getting.

And then taking all of that into consideration and splitting that in an equitable way, which was set 70-30.

The 69.7 and 30.3.

Right?

Yeah.

And that 30%.

So what if we come back over here, if we add all of this, this is the all of the cost associated with operating a 911 center in 2026.

You take away the revenue that we're going to get.

That's the net cost.

So let's do this.

Equals the net cost.

So that's 552.

That's that's after the 911 revenue.

That's after the 911 revenue.

Correct.

If we have the total cost for operating minus the revenue, we get the purple net cost.

30 to 70, that's amount, that's the amount of money.

Okay.

So if we go and we do this, we want to do the 50%, 55% personnel stipend.

Go ahead.

You've already spent all the money.

So if we're going to do that, we're going to do that net cost.

Right.

You already spent all the revenues, so you can't pay for more.

Okay.

So we're not doing any.

I'll just say again that I I think the only way for us to look at this reasonably is already have this in print so that we can look at it.

Right.

You know, it's it's too hard because it's bringing up too many questions on that.

I think this should have already been presented to us before we got here.

I would agree.

And that Sebastian County 552,000.

Remember, half of that needs to be paid for by the cities, the smaller cities outside of Fort Smith.

All the cities outside of Fort Smith.

So I don't know what that number looks like compared to where it is today.

And I'd I'd say also that it's I don't think it's a foregone conclusion that we can't consolidate by July the first I think that's uh I think that's a discussion we can still have to see there's a patent I think we'll know that relatively soon I think I I think right still a possibility okay all right is couldn't you take the county money put that in that I assume that came from a spreadsheet that had those percentages for all the and if that's something that you would like to see then yes I assume they they would for each certainly it's it it's also I'm sorry go ahead.

Which means we need to get our agreement with the board with all these cities as well but of course they don't know what to agree to because they don't know what the numbers are.

Yeah.

Okay sorry I I was just gonna say that um while it's going to be nominal in consideration of the budget that we were looking at we need to uh assume that are going to be some costs associated with the moving additional personnel into the police department I additional radios are gonna have to you you say you're gonna be moving those from yeah the EOC and that what those I had planned to do with that is to get the state reimbursement that 400,000 dollar reimbursement from the state towards consolidation cost I was going to use all of those costs for that that that amount was not going to as much as possible I am not going to keep that in the budget.

We've got that 400,000 from the state that's what it's for that's what I'm gonna use it for is to get us consolidated.

So with that being said are we looking at having operational costs that we can actually see a budget and approve approve on but also are we able to see in the near future of what that transfer of those radios and anything else that you may have to do in the PD uh to actually see that that's not going to be a capital expense that's going to be just operational and then of course the 4000 that could go towards that.

So that 400,000 is going to go towards that it's go any time when we move the radios that's what's going to be and that's something this board will be able to approve before before I do that move I will bring to you that costs so that you understand that that where that cost is coming from okay and then I will send it to CJ uh for the reimbursement can you reread the motion on the floor I've completely forgotten what you all right motion to set date a full consolidation to July 1st 2026 temporarily locating the R V C C PSAP at Fort Smith PD for a period of 2.5 years from date of consolidation and to proceed with any necessary action to accomplish said consolidation so can we can we should we maybe table that until we get a budget set in front of us I would be in favor of that I would not be in favor of voting on this knowing we don't even have a budget setting in front of us.

I would make a motion to table until we have the budget setting in front of us.

Okay.

Second so there you go which what we'll do um so motion to table to the next meeting was made by seconded byman okay all right Cooper yes Dingman yes yes yes Kinslow vote yes can I ask a question real quick certainly is the budget you're gonna present break it down I'm assuming it's for we can tell the rest of the cities I will at that time that will it will yes thank you runy yes yes baker yes Clark yes all right motion the table approved okay so I have my work cut out for me that for the um for the next meeting we have it's set where you before you go to that I've got I've got a question.

That's correct.

Just temporarily.

So we just approved.

Purchase for software, and I didn't see that up there anywhere.

Right.

I was not going to move forward with that purchase.

I was going to wait until we found a consolidated center in a new building that could sustain that before I moved forward with that.

I was going to withdraw that.

But in order for us to have the resources available for that, I was going to include that in the look after two and a half years.

So that this was only going to be temporarily until the location could be selected.

But we already approved the expenditure, right?

The board has a bit has approved it, but I've not got the contract signed and we've not moved forward with the the purchase.

I mean, the if we're talking two and a half years down the road, that it's not going to be that quote's not going to be any good anyway, right?

It is not.

I would move that we stop all purchases until we know what we're doing.

Or at least well, that's the only one we've approved, isn't it?

Yeah.

That's correct.

The board the board approved that purchase on November the 4th.

We've also approved the budget for 26, and it's not going to fall in.

So I think there is several things we just need to rescind or hold off on.

Whatever, however that works out for us.

And I realize we're going to have to do something if we do consolidate temporarily.

So those could come back up, but again, which I think we need to protect our fund for now because we don't know where we're heading.

Was that EMD contract in the budget that we approved?

It was I make a motion that we resend our approval of the 2026 budget that was passed whatever date that was.

I'll second that.

I'll actually put an A-man on it, Danny.

All right.

So the previously approved 2026 budget.

The motion on the floor is to rescind that budget.

Motion by Baker.

Second by Hearn.

Any discussion?

All right.

Oates?

Yes.

Kinslow.

Yes.

TVOs.

Yes.

Sizemore.

Yes.

Baker?

Yes.

Clark.

Yes.

Cooper.

Yes.

Motion passes 940 against.

Can I ask just because I'm still unclear.

So you're saying for the next two and a half years, we're we're going to continue to have EMS and fire dispatches segregated.

So that would the ambulance dispatch would be from there, but first responders would come from us, the fire departments.

You're talking about starting now or five of 2020.

In July.

That's correct.

Okay, because uh, you know, if if you if you if they remain segregated, then that would preclude any of the fire departments from moving to the CAD or you know, we couldn't move to a dedicated CAD if we're dispatched from two different CAD systems.

So the reason I need to get everybody in Sebastian County on the new CAD system.

So that fire and police and an EMS can have that mobile stuff.

All right, which that that would be on the MDTs on the apparatus.

That's that's what I'm trying to get up there.

Um and so what we have left is I've got to uh get essentially all of the radio designations and units and personnel in the system so we can start using that.

I could probably even start doing that before we physically locate into the temporary position.

So what you're saying is that first responders fire, you know, going to anything medical, they would be getting the notification from RBCC, and then they'd be communicating back to Fort Smith EMS for any additional notes uh actions taken.

Is that is that what you're saying?

That's correct.

Is that how how do you how do you guys go?

I was gonna say, is it like how we do it now?

Because they get the 911 call, and then if the caller hits one of the keywords in our list, they'll go ahead and send us, or if it goes to EMS, then they wait for EMS to make the call if they want first responders.

But we communicate with our dispatch center.

That's kind of how I was thinking it would be.

Because essentially when when we don't talk to EM Enforcement DMS's dispatch center, we talk to RBCC.

Correct.

We do have a unique situation in Fort Smith.

I mean, uh, especially with the fire department having so many stations, and you know, I'm not worried about that.

We've got a good system going now.

I think it works real well.

The thing I worries me is when you go out the counties when you're a long way uh further away from you know, how far is Hartford from the EMS station and and you need first responders?

We're gonna be doing a lot of communication with them.

We do a lot of communication with those.

We do black bluff, all these rural areas.

Our dispatchers spend a lot of time on the phone with them now.

Okay, we don't now because Daryl's group here is is most of the time it's there before our group is.

And so our tiered system inside the city works flawlessly.

You know, uh out in the county, we have a little bit longer time.

That's why we don't have to continue communicating with them as first responders.

When we get out in the county, it's going to be a little bit different.

We've got a long distance to go.

Uh, you know, our closest one is is Tommy's and in Barley.

Uh, we communicate with those guys, and we also communicate with White Bluff, they're close to us.

But once you get on further out there, it's a new ball game.

So uh we're gonna need medical dispatchers to stay with those people and those first responders to help them.

So I I mean that's just something we need to look down the road at how we're going to accomplish that.

You know, and go ahead.

I thought you were through.

Yeah.

Okay.

That's my concern.

I'm concerned we're building the foundation and we don't know that we can afford the house.

When we do this temporary move, hopefully we'll get some numbers, get an idea of what if we can afford that, and can those cities afford that.

But then follow that up with we've already been told when we consolidate it's going to cost us more than it does under our current system.

How much more?

So that concerns me.

Um we just got too many unknowns looking at us.

And quite frankly, and I'm not trying to be Mr.

Negative here, but I'm told our system works fine, it's not broke, and we're trying to fix something that's not broke.

Um I don't know that it still wouldn't be prudent to go back all the way to step one and ask the state if Sebastian County can be exempted just like several other counties are from doing something.

I understand consolidation fixed some problems in some parts of the state, but I keep hearing there's nothing wrong with ours, and it runs cheaper and provides the service needed.

So why change it?

I don't know if that is something to uh think about, but uh I'd feel better about knowing that, whether it's going to the legislators or who CJ, whoever, to ask, is that still a viable option?

And to that question, I would ask CJ to weigh in on that.

I mean, I can't stop you from asking to be put on the agenda, but I will tell you 99.9% that you either would be denied the spot or uh the board's not going to hear that request.

The deadline for requesting additional PSAPs was two, three years ago now.

Uh, even if you would have most of those were declined, including counties that were of your size.

Uh I think the concerns I've heard some concerns from the city board by watching their meeting last week, heard some from you guys.

Um I I don't know that I agree that you know the cost here actually aren't going to be or shouldn't be more than what you're already paying.

Uh Wes and I we've gone over those numbers of the new numbers he was trying to present today, and actually it looks like it may cut some of the cost in the long term.

So I think you know, you guys stop you from putting in the ask, but um no, that the path forward in the state of Arkansas is consolidation of Peace Apps, period.

Well, if the numbers show that we can consolidate and save money, then I'm all for it.

But so far, that's not what I've heard.

Right.

And one thing that I I did mention that uh that Brian, he's in charge of my communication center told me is uh you know, the helicopter integration, uh most it is on set our screen.

Sorry.

The helicopter integration uh that we do is is most of it, if not all of it, is in the county.

And you've got to be connected to uh EMD 911 center, do that.

And most of our helicopter requests uh are when you say 99% of it's in the county.

We have had some that basically where we're kind of out in the county and we get helicopter integration and uh out in Sebastian County, we we have helicopters land quite often uh for head injuries and stuff to get them to the closest medical facility and and I just don't I just don't want anything to happen that will set us backwards.

And I feel like we're looking a little that way.

Uh I don't want us to set backwards.

I don't want the county to suffer to save money for us here in the city.

And and I think we're kind of headed that way.

But again, I haven't got all the numbers and stuff, and and I think that's what we need to look at.

You you get safe to say you feel like that when we consolidate EMD needs to come with us.

Is that what you're telling me?

I don't know that we can afford it.

Uh the whole package and right now the space is what I'm hearing, is is a is a problem.

Uh we've been a secondary PSAP for many, many years now.

And so I think we branched so far out in what how our system runs.

I I kind of agree with the judge while ago is uh uh 911, that seemed like to be passed to fix a lot of broken systems, and there were a lot of broken systems in Arkansas.

We just weren't one of them.

Uh ours was working and still is working as we're sitting here discussing this, is working really well.

The the people that spooth on the ground out there are doing us a good job.

And uh, our dispatch centers communicate well.

We all have our snappos every now and then, but it does work, you know.

And I think that you know we work well with Fort Smith Fire, we work well with Barling Fire, uh, we work well with all of them, and our communications in between our service, Sebastian County EMS, the first responders, uh, and is our link is setting in my 911 center at Fort Smith EMS.

And so I don't want to do something that will hurt us, you know.

So I think we have to, you know, take a deep breath and look at some of this and see how this works.

If the 911 committee won't hear it, then they might not be our answer.

Legislation might be our answer.

We might have to go back to our legislators and and work on them, and it may push us out further.

But you know, they're controlled by the legislation.

So I'm sure that we could talk to them too.

But I just want to, you know, Fort Smith EMS is we're gonna keep doing our job no matter what we talk about in this room.

We're gonna keep doing everything we do.

Darrell's gonna keep doing his, Danny's gonna keep doing all of his.

These guys are all gonna keep doing their jobs.

But we need numbers to set from us that make, you know, that we can all see and we can see in advance how that looks.

And then Fort Smith is precluded from receiving or Fort Smith EMS, let me rephrase that, is precluded from receiving any dispatching funds from the 911 fund that we've been getting all these years.

Uh, that's fine, but someone still has to pay for it.

So you're gonna have to budget if you're gonna leave it all of it with me.

Uh, and it sounds like that's probably where it will be.

Someone will have to, there will have to be a subsea there too.

So it's only fair that I come in the budget.

Whether it comes out of the 911 funds, it it might be a 70-30 split between y'all.

You know, but just like we've talked in the past, we're we're not going to deny anyone 911.

So uh we're gonna we're gonna fix it.

Okay.

To that end, I you know I we I would like to real quick kind of keep an in mind without consolidation, we lose the funding from the state.

Somebody does.

I understand, Tim, that you've been um compensated partially for uh your personnel operations for a number of years, but and I don't mean this to be insulting at all, but when you run on a medical call.

Direct pay.

We do.

We we bill for our services, not for our dispatching, but we also dispatch everyone.

We subact we dispatch Sebastian County MS.

And but you're you're suggesting that if you're not reimbursed by the 911 funds that the R V C C should pay EMS to answer medical goals.

Okay.

The county's part of it outside the city of Fort Smith.

We're we're Fort Smith EMS.

We take care of Fort Smith EMS.

We take care of Barley because they're so close of a neighbor to us.

We we take care of Rye Hill.

We we creep into the county.

We don't draw the same lines when it comes to we draw to who's ever closest to provide care.

If if the if the mayor's here is on a wreck at Rye Hill and we're closer, we're coming instead of waiting on Sebastian County MS to come further.

We don't draw those lines and we don't care about those lines.

Am I reimbursed in the city?

Yes, I'm I'm reimbursed uh by mainly uh Medicare makes up about Medicare Medicaid makes about 55% of my reimbursement.

Now I can tell you right now the full Medicare payment to me is about ten dollars less per call than it costs me.

Okay, so the only thing that we we actually do some on and the city board approved this recently was because of the legislation that made commercial insurance pay us correctly that Jeff helped me work on.

So you know we that's another story, but I'm just saying that you know we do have costs associated with that, and so we just have to look at everything.

You know, if you guys want to dispatch the first responders and Special County MS, great.

We'll we'll work with you on that too if we have to.

Okay.

I question for CJ.

Yes, sir.

So we're talking about at least temporarily um by temporarily, I guess we're talking up to two and a half years and beyond um continuing to transfer medical calls.

Is that going to be a problem with the legislation?

I know it's certainly not the best case scenario.

That's that's what I would say is it's obviously not the best case scenario, and I know that you guys have tried to build a you know, a center that does everything, which is exactly what we would be shooting for.

What the end goal would be is that you have one 911 center uh that that takes all 911 calls and dispatches all agencies within the county.

But from the concerns that we've heard over the last couple months and that you guys have continued to talk about here and the and the cost and you know the the upgrades and moving into a new facility and needing new room and additional equipment.

What I've what I've worked with Wes on is trying to back up a little bit and look at what we can do to move forward in consolidating the PSAPs themselves.

It is very common uh for EMS dispat private EMS entities, dispatch center, uh Pafford, LifeNet, MIMS, they all do the same thing that that Fort Smith EMS has.

You know, unfortunately, Tim, you know, I'm sorry, but they don't they don't receive 911 funds um either.

They do it on their own by having their own dispatch center.

So, you know, the key here is that it is common.

It's not I'd say it's not rare for 911 calls uh that are medical in nature to be dispatched to fire the fire departments if they run medical.

It's not uncommon for that to be dispatched out of the PSAP and the law enforcement agency to be dispatched out of the PSAP, and then the call transferred to the EMS dispatch for their ambulance to be dispatched.

So I would say that it's maybe not best case scenario, but where you guys are at and what you're trying to avoid in spending ten million dollars, I think it's it's the route to be looking at temporarily until you can find a better better way forward.

Anything else?

My concern is what do we do after two and a half years and what is it gonna cost?

So uh that's not only the two and a half years, but what about after two and a half years?

That's that's why I suggested two and a half years, as that gives me plenty of time to do that.

We get consolidated.

We have met the state legislative requirements.

We don't have to worry about that, and then I spend the rest of the time trying to find a way to come to you.

What to do beyond two and a half years.

That gives me plenty of time to research locations, costs, equipment, options, procedures, so that we all can come together and I present you a table of options that you decide.

But I got to have time to do that in light of the looming deadline to consolidate.

So if we can consolidate temporary to give me time to do that, that's what I'm asking.

And all of those will be new capital projects.

Correct?

That won't they won't be embedded into operational funds, budgets or anything else that'll be completely separate.

If that's where you would like to do it, we can certainly.

If we had done this four years ago when this was first talked about and required, I feel absolutely confident that we would have had plenty of money to accomplish what we wanted to do.

And if we're just looking at buying in two and a half years and then we're gonna be right back here and having the same conversation again, then uh I I don't see the point.

But I mean if we plan for an eventuality of having a dedicated facility, dedicated location, everything is consolidated into one, then I'm happy to loan the space uh for a couple of years to make that happen.

I mean, obviously we're gonna we're going to occur additional costs or or continue costs with this thing operating out of the police department, but I mean we'll certainly make that work.

We're gonna have to consider some things in regards to office space and that sort of thing for additional personnel, but um I I I just I really want to encourage all of us to be thinking long term about this.

I mean, we've we've uh we essentially are buying uh a few extra years to accomplish what we should have done four years ago.

Right.

And don't forget it.

One time I know the city uh was talking about trying to tie in the F 35 project and getting actually getting some federal money to help build this thing.

So yeah, I agree.

We need to find money uh for the long-term project for sure.

To that end, this 26 budget that I'm working on is such that it does not touch the fund balance.

As we are looking for two and a half years to find a location, I'm looking to set aside this money and to start saving this money for that.

So that's 26 budget is not touching the fund balance.

If you look at the uh the prior years from uh the 911 fund, it was operating in a desk uh a deficit and it was slowly eating away at that fund.

I'm wanting to stop that so that we can maintain that fund.

Okay.

So to that end, that to your point, that's my goal is to keep that fund balance uh uh intact so we can rely on it in two and a half years, grow it even.

Sounds good.

Yes, sir.

I had one more question and I'm done.

I'll turn it red.

So on the interlocal agreement, is there anything specific that way we're not wasting you know wasting any time, but is there anything in the interlocal agreement between county and city that specifics have to be changed based on where we are now?

Based on where we are now, the interlocal agreement is what I'm operating on.

So when I look at these budgets and I make these plans, that foundational document is the interlocal agreement.

Does that answer your question?

Okay.

From a county standpoint, though, we definitely need to amend it.

Okay.

Regarding um Judge, I would look to do that in the January one.

Okay.

Is that okay?

Sure.

Okay.

So we'll put that on the uh a January agenda uh to start looking at that, those changes.

Okay.

What else?

Motion adjourned.

Well, second, good, real quick.

The next meeting is scheduled for Tuesday, December the 30th at 3 p.m.

Huh?

Well, and that's and that's that's right around the Christmas holiday.

Oh, always.

But I I want to make sure that we have time on the city side as well.

So then do we need to move this to Tuesday the sixteenth?

Yes, sooners better.

I mean, we need to have a budget adopted before then, and we'll have for better or for worse, we'll have whatever numbers we have rolled into our budget, and then plan to then amend them based on whatever gets approved as the RBCC budget moving forward.

And then um then have a plan for what that budget amendment then needs to look like.

So everybody.

Okay, good.

All right.

All right.

Well, what we'll do is we'll set the next meeting to December the sixteenth at three PM here at the Blue Lion.

Who made the motion to adjourn?

You did.

He seconded.

All in favor.

I see all on the sixteenth.

Thank you, gentlemen.