Counselors that is seven o'clock.

Good evening and welcome to the committee on appointments and briefings.

It is November 18, 2025.

It is 7 p.m.

in the City Council Chambers.

Please note.

This meeting is being live streamed and recorded.

City Council and Committee meetings can be viewed on the City of New Bedford's homepage under quick links, then meetings.

In the chamber, we are joined by Concert Lodge, Ian Abrew, Council Ward 2, Maria Giesta, Council Ward 1, Leo Choquette, Councilwood 5, Joseph Lopes, Councillor Lodge, Brian Gomes.

Council Ward 6, Ryan Pereira, Councillor at Lodge and Second Vice President, Linda Morad.

Council Ward 3, Sean Oliver.

And Councillor from Ward 4, Derek Baptiste, and myself, Naomi County Councillor at Large.

Thank you all for being here.

Do we have anything to read in the records?

There are no letters to read in the record.

Okay, can we item number one is citizens' input time not to exceed the first thirty minutes of the meeting?

Each individual recognized is able to speak for three minutes.

Ms.

Rowley?

I don't see.

Oh, this she is.

Oh.

Madam Chair.

Yes.

Before the resident begins, could I speak?

Yes, you may.

Ms.

Rowley, could you give her a minute, please?

She can stay right there.

It's fine with me.

Oh.

Madam Chair, I I never speak before a resident in any meeting.

In any meeting.

But I'm making an exception in this case.

Joyce Rowley has filed.

Excuse me.

Joyce Rowley has filed multiple federal imputing another person's character, and Miss Morrad has no problem with violating the council's rules.

And I do object to her speaking before I'm even allowed to speak.

She may say what she wants when I am done, please.

Rowley, who acts as her own attorney in these suits, has cost the city in excess of a hundred and fifty thousand dollars in taxpayer money.

The most recent case was dismissed in 2024, where U.S.

District Court Chief Judge Dennis Saver, the fifth, stated, and I quote, Rowley failed to present any evidence that the zoo failed to properly care for its two Asian elephants.

He added that Ruth had received consistent and high quality veterinary care.

Yet Joyce Rowley has appealed this most recent decision and is asking for a new trial where she claims she has newly discovered information.

In addition to filing frivolous lawsuits, Rowley is harassing and bullying our fellow city employees.

Excuse me, Miss Rowley.

Additionally, Miss Rowley has filed multiple complaints against our 27-year-old veterinarian, a city employee with the medical board that oversees her veterinarian license.

What an awful thing for a young woman, a young employee to deal with for simply doing your job.

Ms.

Rowley continues to disrupt zoo operations.

And it and the experience that visitors have going to the zoo, many of which are children.

Recently, when our zoo team was dealing with the last hours of their beloved Ruth's life, Rowley was violating the restraining order, throwing herself on the ground, screaming and yelling, and making an awful scene for the zoo team and the New Bethardt Police Department to deal with.

So I will not give Ms.

Rowley any encouragement by pretending to listen to her words here tonight.

I'm leaving the council chamber, and I hope that many of my fellow full employees do as well, in support of the city employees that work for the zoo.

Joyce Rowley does not deserve any credence to her words, Madam Chair.

And fellow colleagues, I'll hope you concur with me that this is not what citizens import time was designed for.

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Council Moorad.

Oh, don't go away, Matt.

Oh, Adam, just go away.

Okay, Ms.

Rowley, you have three minutes.

I'd like to have some time to address her highs.

I have not been harassing anyone.

And my right to appeal is guaranteed by the U.S.

Constitution.

It doesn't surprise me that Ms.

Morad throws a fit over somebody who actually follows the law when she has been notoriously in violation of ethics.

But again tonight, she chooses to do that.

I am here for three reasons tonight.

One to tell the truth about what happened to Ruth after she died.

Of course, it's Asian elephant Ruth.

An elephant I have been caring for for about 15 years.

After she was euthanized, whether humanely or not, they decapitated her, they cut off all four feet, and they tossed her headlessly headless, footless torso into a pit.

They had filed false allegations against the city.

I'm sorry, Ms.

Rodney.

We might have to have a quote.

We have no quorum now.

We have no quorum.

That is in the necropy.

Thank you.

Okay, I'm going to take a moment.

I'm going to recess right now.

We are in recess.

We have no quorum.

We can't recently have someone.

Or does the meeting automatically?

She can recess the meeting right now and call it back everyone.

You don't need a motion to reset.

Before I go to uh second citizens and port, Councillor Gomes.

Thank you very much, Madam Clerk.

Madam Clerk, I thought it was important that I stand before you recognize the next person, the citizen import time here in the City of New Bedford.

As the maker of citizen import time when I got here, I believe that the people of this city should have an opportunity to speak to their counsel, not being scared to go before that podium to speak to the those that they put in place to govern their city in New Bedford.

Tonight I walked out in unity with my colleague from the not far north end simply because enough is enough.

And that's why I walked out, and I just want the people of the city to know that this has never happened in the City Council.

I have never walked out on anyone.

But I'm going to walk out when it becomes the nuisance that it has been.

And uh I don't want to say damage, that's not the right word to use.

Just the damage to our employees, the whole system.

The lady has fought her fight.

The fight is over.

And enough is enough.

You've cost the City of New Bedford a lot of money.

Thank you for the opportunity.

And I want the people of the city to know that as long as I'm here, citizen import time is always here for them.

And I believe supported by this entire city council because the people should have a place to speak and to come before their council to speak.

But when you come before the council to continue the situation that has been going on, I I just can't stand here.

I'm going to support my colleague.

Never thought we would be in this situation, but we were tonight.

No rudeness to the general public, to the person that was before us simply because of her nonsense.

Thank you.

Thank you, Councillor Gomes.

Okay.

One B.

One B, please.

Uh speaking on keeping our city street clean.

Mr.

Gannetto.

Oh, you want my ad.

Good evening.

Uh Alan Ganneto, 415 County Street, Roosevelt Departments.

I've been well, I was a male mayor for 32 years in this uh city, and 14 down in the um Bay Village area, and I was been walking around because I'm in the process of buying property in Ward 4.

And really discussed that property at 319 cell second, which is vacant.

It's been vacant for like about 20 or 30 years.

And the other day I walked by then and I was speaking to the new letter carrier down in the area.

It's a bird, it's a it's a it's a more or less a pigeon cool.

It's all boarded up.

I knew the uh the owner, and I had spoken to her a while back about when I was a letter carrier there about um process of uh working on their house, she said, well, no money.

I don't know what that man, but she I knew she didn't have the money to work on their house.

That was years ago.

And speaking with uh community development, I spoke with Jordan or community development uh yesterday, and she re they reached out to this lady, Mrs.

Fortz, and that was 18 months ago, but no response.

The property is the ISO.

Everybody on that whole street, South 2nd Street had done a great job on their property.

That's an eyesore.

I can remember the day that I was delivering mail on Purchase Street, and Steve Borgide comes running down the street.

He said, Alan, uh Virgo's funeral pile is on fire.

The kids lit it up.

Okay.

They just lit it up in the daytime.

They will light this thing up over here, and what has to happen, what's going to happen probably is somebody's gonna get hurt or a place that doesn't even belong there, it should be knocked down or whatever.

They need to put the pressure on this lady because it's an eyesore.

Three 319 cell second.

It's it's terrible.

And the other thing I was talking about when I went reference to the uh cleaners, the leaves are ridiculous down that area on that on Cushion Avenue, South 2nd Street.

I know they've done a good job as far as cleaning the leaves on the right side, but whatnot has to happen is you gotta put signs there and have the people on the left side move their car for a day so they can clean that side because what you have is one side's clear, the other side has tons of leaves all over the place.

I was there this just walk because I do that every day.

I take a walk just to walk through what's going on in the community because I lived in Province for a while, and uh I wanted to come back here because I'm coming back here to work with the kids because that's what I do.

I received the um Martha Briggs award a few years ago for outstanding work in the community, but I work with kids and I always contribute to kids, and I'll keep on before they told you over.

Because that was my uncle Benny Rose, okay?

And my godfather Danny Gustace.

But the thing is, when the area has a house like that and nothing's not being done, so the ladies, what she's probably doing is waiting for that land of the value of it.

I don't know what she's doing, but it's it's terrible.

It's disgusting.

The whole area looks nice.

So if you buy property, now you have a it's a terrible thing.

It's a terrible situation down there.

That's what I get to say in reference to that.

I mean, I'll be honest with you.

I'm really happy with New Bedford.

I think you're doing a great job here.

I really have to say that's why I came back.

Because people say, Oh, you want to move to Brown Island?

I wasn't, but no, I my home is here working with the kids.

I did it for um quite a few years in the uh community in South End, West End, and that's my that's my thing.

But uh but when I see stuff like that, just I know we can do something about it.

That's it.

Thank you.

Does anybody have any questions for Mr.

Gannetto?

Yeah, Council Council Capp.

Thank you, madam chair.

I was just gonna say maybe they could uh appeal to Jordan over in the problem properties with the housing department.

Um, we can drive up liens and all kind of fun things to cause the person to give up and then just sell the property uh so that somebody else can get it and maybe you know demolish it and then start from scratch.

So if somebody's sitting on it, is my point is that it's gonna continue that way until someone like Jordan, you know, or or Josh Amarall down in housing are made aware of it.

So thank you.

Thank you, Council Cat.

Council Baptiste.

Thank you, madam chair.

Well, um, we're trying to rectify that situation as well.

It's been a while now because we had to clean up the whole area because the apartment next door burnt down to a crisp.

It was also abandoned.

So it was an abandoned garage and two abandoned houses.

One house burnt down, burnt some of the garage.

They had to go through all that stuff with the Department of Public Health had to handle all the little things that they had to handle with that property before they had to clean it up because the problem was it was turning into a dump site.

So we had mattresses over there, refrigerators over there, et cetera, beds, whatever they were throwing up over there.

So after they um got all the okay to clean the site, they cleaned the site up.

So and then now they're working on the property next door, which is the only other abandoned property on the lot.

So this has been probably it's it took a while for the first lot to get fixed.

The so you know how it you I can't call it how things go around here, but um it's on the radar, you know, whether it's gonna get sold, whether it's gonna get refurbished, because we have a couple of um houses in that area, so second purchase street.

Um Pleasant Street, South South Sick Street.

So that's what they're working on that.

So I don't know how long it's gonna take, but it don't happen overnight.

All right, thank you.

I yield.

Thank you, Council Baptist.

Anybody else?

Yeah, Councilor Gums.

No, this is this the burnt house.

No, 319 South Seconds, that big next move.

Is that the one next door?

Okay, through you, uh madam co um chairman to uh Derek.

Is this the house where we had all the mattresses and all that stuff removed and all that stuff from SSH?

Yeah, I just want to support my colleague.

It there was a l big problem there with uh asbestos and all kind of stuff that they had thrown.

We even we even kind of blocked off the front of it until they could go in there or whatever.

That took a while, so it's all the body took a while.

Well, I didn't see the we'll do a follow-up, Alan, where where we're at with that piece of property.

It's a pigeon coup that broke book and windows, the pitches are all in there and I understand what you're saying.

It's just uh a match away.

And I like I said I just want to bring it back up to because I was talking to Jordan over that committee, and she said bring it up, please.

Because the thing is it's been there's no communication between Jordan and the owners.

We'll do a follow-up.

Myself and the counselor had been working on that um through the South End organization that had gotten in touch with me, I'm sure got in touch with him.

We'll work on that and we'll let you know.

Okay.

Thank you very much.

Thanks.

Thank you, Councillors.

Okay.

Item number two is a communication move.

I'll set thank you.

Mayor Mitchell to the city council submitting an appointment of Connor Warden.

Uh New Bedford Mass uh to the Conservation Commission.

Mr.

Worden will be replacing Denisaw Dett, who has resigned.

This term will expire June 2027.

It was referred here on September 25th, 2025, um, where it was uh before you on the 25th.

It was heard on the 23rd of October when it was tabled.

So number two is before you and it remains on the table.

Motion removed from the table.

Second.

Motion made by Council Murray to remove from the table, second by Councillor Lopes.

All in favor say aye.

Oppose the ayes have.

Is Mr.

Connor here?

Connor?

Yeah, yes, yeah.

Because you approached the podium.

Thank you.

Would you give us a little background and then I'll open the floor for the colleagues to ask questions?

Uh so my name is Carl Warden.

My background, uh I've been in natural resources and conservation for many years.

I have went to the C Lab program to the city when I was a kid.

I continue on to Crystal Aggy.

Can you get some microphone?

Okay.

How's this?

Better that's better.

All right.

Then I continue on to Bristol County Agricultural High School for Natural Resources Management.

I went off to New York where I got my degree in wildlife management.

And now I work for the Department of Conservation and Recreation at Horseneck Beach.

Thank you.

Uh Council Abrew.

Thank you, madam chair.

Good evening.

Thanks for coming in.

Certainly, based on looking over your paperwork and what you said, you certainly, in my opinion, have quite the resume for the commission.

Just wondering um what prompted your willingness to serve, or were you approached by someone to serve, or how did that all kind of shake out?

I was approached by uh the conservation agent and another per another member of the conservation committee.

I also am avid worker of the city in South End of New Bedford, and like to have some input on what's going on in the city.

Great.

So you you willingly want to serve, and this is something you want to do.

Oh, very much so.

Great.

That's all I wanted to know.

Thank you.

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Council Abreu.

Anyone else?

Your pleasure, Councillors.

Motion Full City Council's positive recommendation.

Motion motion made by Councillor Abril to refer to the city council, full city council with a positive recommendation.

Second by Councilor Baptiste.

All in favor say aye.

Aye.

Opposed?

The ayes have it.

It'll be reported at our next uh city council meeting.

You are more than welcome to come and get sworn in.

And the date is November 25th.

Thank you very much.

Thank you.

And thank you for your service.

Item number three is communication.

Mayor Mitchell to the City Council submitting the appointment of Cheryl Ann Vivaris, New Bedford Mass to the traffic commission, replacing Angela Johnson, who's term expires December 2024.

This term will expire December 2027.

It was referred here on October 23rd, 2025, and is now before you.

Second.

Motion made by Council Oliver, second by Council Moored.

All in favor say aye.

Aye.

Opposed, the ayes have it.

Council Oliver, did you want four?

Okay.

Okay.

Ms.

Good evening, Miss Faverez.

Just give us a little background and you can bring the microphone down.

You can push it down.

You can push it down even further.

There you go.

Very short people.

My name is Charl Ann Vivos.

I live at 102 Durfee Street, of course, here in New Bedford.

Thank you for having me here this evening.

Actually, New Bedford High School.

And that was my passion until my retirement.

Now I get a little bored at home.

Just a little.

But the mayor's office approached me.

I get into trouble every time there's a parade because I assault people.

Well, maybe not assault, but I harass people when we're at the parade with my dog.

And I was asked if I would be willing to do something.

And I said, sure.

In teaching at the high school, one of the things I taught was New Bedford history and culture.

And we always wanted to instill in all of the kids that it's not just living in New Bedford, it's about being part of the working of the community and being dedicated to what the city is all about.

So I'm kind of hoping that this is a part of that philosophy.

Thank you.

Any questions?

Council Oliver.

Thank thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Mrs.

V for being here.

You said that you were approached by the administration.

Was there any other um commissions or boards that you were approached for?

Or was it just this particular one?

There were several.

And uh one of the things I kind of fell into was the traffic commission.

Um Mr.

Vivaris and I owned a medical transportation company for 25 years, and I have a decent background in the workings of livery transportation.

Um that the city is requiring now and what the state requires through around here, it's usually GATTRA, um, Greater Attleboro Regional Transit Authority.

Um so that was one of the reasons I decided traffic was something I would be interested in.

Okay, good.

That's what I was wondering why traffic.

So thank you for explaining that.

Um obviously you have no problem making the meetings, the night meetings, right?

Oh no.

No.

And um, you know, folks are gonna come uh in front of uh the commission and ask for uh some exemptions and and special parking and curb cuts and things like that.

Um in your previous work, you have no problem saying no uh on no.

Um I I'm sure that you'll handle each um uh individual in front of you on a case-by-case basis and make the best um decision uh there.

But the ability to say no sometimes is definitely gonna be needed.

So I'm glad that you're able to do that.

Um I look forward to giving you a favorable recommendation and hope that you'll serve on the board for a few years.

Thank you, sir.

That's all Madam Chair.

Thank you.

Thank you, Council Oliver.

Anybody else?

Seeing none.

Motion to refer out to the full city council with a favorable recommendation.

Motion made by Council Oliver to refer out to the full city council council for a positive recommendation.

Seconded by Councilor Lopes.

All in favor say aye.

Aye.

Opposed the ayes have it, and it'll be reported out.

You're more than welcome to come on November 25th, and we can sway you in at that time too.

Thank you very much.

Thank you.

Number four is a community committee communication, city clerk, clerk of the city council to the city council on behalf of Duria Arsanos doing business as New Bedford Transportation, LLC, 11 Franklin Street, New Bedford Mass, 02740, hereby submitting a copy of the application requesting a new private livery license to carry passengers for hire over the streets of New Bedford.

The license will expire on June 30th, 2026.

It was referred here on September 11, 2025.

October 23rd, 2025.

It was tabled.

Number four is before you and it remains on the table.

Motion removed from the table.

Motion made by Councillor Morrad, second by Councillor Oliver.

All in favor moving from the table say aye.

Oppose the ayes have it.

Is Gary?

Yep, oh make it away.

Go right ahead.

Good evening.

Um so you can state your name and address for the record.

Okay, and um you can just let us know a little bit about your background and your service.

My name Dunia Arsano.

I live in Frankenstein.

The micro.

There you go.

My name Dunya Arsanios.

I live in the Freikle Street, New Badford.

Her background.

She had the same business in Lebanon.

And she would like to do the same thing in here.

Uh New Bedford Transportation LLC is gonna call the company.

Uh transport people to doctors' offices and to hospitals.

All that we need is to use three cars.

And we have plenty of parking lots.

And uh we're gonna be running the business together, hoping we get a chance.

That's all.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Any questions?

Is it Council Baptist?

All right, so so you said you got you have off-street parking?

Yes, yes.

All right, so it's not is never gonna be on the street.

No, no, no, no.

Uh I just I just wanted to make sure that that was part of your yeah, because I know is especially with the with the business being at um 11 Franklin, that's a tight area um residential.

I know the church is on the corner, and I know they have a lot, a big lot in the back.

I don't know if you're gonna be are you gonna be using the old church lot or do you have another lot?

We have our parking lot.

You have your own parking lot?

The house and the parking lot.

All right, I just wanted to make sure the all right, because those that you know those those are issues that we have um with transportation companies throughout the city is um parking and residential areas um and not having places to park with multiple vehicles.

You can send somebody and check.

I will check a little around the corner.

Um, that's that that I just wanted to make sure.

Okay.

Good luck with with what you was planning on doing.

I I wish you all the luck in the future.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Anybody else, Council Morrad?

Thank you, Madam Chair.

What type of vehicles will you have?

Okay.

Excuse me.

What type of vehicles?

Uh big vehicles like uh Ford Cars.

Yeah.

Okay, not vans, just regular cars.

Vans, okay, comfortable.

Okay, and um what type of hours will you be?

24 hours.

24 hours.

Okay.

And those vans, do they have uh beep beep beep beep when you back up or no?

Uh no.

No, okay.

Because I'm just worried because as my colleague said, it's a tight neighborhood, and if you're 24 hours a day, I'm concerned about the sleep patents of your neighbors.

That's why I'm asking you.

I know we're done.

Okay.

And how many employees will you have?

We have four or five, but we're gonna be using three cars.

Three cars, four or five people.

Okay.

Thank you for answering my question.

Good luck.

Thank you, madam chair.

Thank you, Council Morrad and Council Abrew.

I'm actually all set.

Thank you.

I had a waved, had waved you down, but I'm okay.

It's okay.

Thank you.

Thank you, Council Abreu.

Anybody else?

Saying none, your pleasure.

We referred to recommendation to vote second.

Motion made to make a full recommendation to grant the license.

Made by Councillor Gomes, second by Council Lopes.

All in favor say aye.

Opposed, the ayes have it.

And this will be reported out on our next city council meeting on November 25th.

Thank you.

And good luck.

Thank you.

Number five is a communication city clerk, clerk of the city council's meeting and application for a new private livery license on behalf of Jelene M.

Guzman Carrero doing business as DJ Transportation 458B, Maxfield Street, New Bedford Mass.

The license is to expire June 30th, 2026.

It was referred here on October 2nd, 2025.

Number five is before you.

Motion received and place on file.

Motion made receiving place and file by Council Morrad, second by Council Lopes.

All in favor say aye.

Opposed the ayes have it.

I take you can step up to the to the podium.

Okay, you can state your name and address for the record, and you can tell us about your livery service.

Okay.

Um good evening.

My name is Jilly M Guzman.

Um here because I like to open like a small business um family company.

It's for transportation for the kids to school.

And we want to start with one van for now, and it's gonna be for um seven kids.

And I'm gonna be the driver.

I have the license and 7D.

I drive in before uh with my sister, she has uh small company too.

So I think that's it.

Thank you.

Do you have any questions?

Uh Council Baptist.

So what kind of vehicle do I are you gonna be driving?

Um like a minivan.

It's it's uh Dutch Grand Caravan.

All right, yeah, it's uh Ludavan.

All right, and you have a place to park it that's off the street.

Um I live in housing and I have registered my car, so we have the space for you have the space for yeah, because you only get one car too.

Four five four five uh Maxville Street, right?

Maxville 3, yeah.

Yeah, my award.

Okay, got it.

Just making sure you know.

You can pass to if you want.

Thank you.

Thank you, thank you.

Again, uh the cops, I ain't the cops.

I'm here to help.

I'm on your side.

Um, so so I I wish you luck with with what you're trying to do, and uh, and you know I'm saying I hope this this uh helps you leapfrog, you know, and to better things in the future as well.

Thank you.

Thanks for the floor.

Thank you, Council Baptist.

Anybody else saying none, your pleasure.

Send to the city council uh for a favorable recommendation, please.

Made by Council Baptiste, second by Council Morat.

All in favor say aye.

Aye.

Opposed, the ayes have it.

It'll be reported out to the full city council on November 25th.

All right, thank you.

Have a great name.

Thank you.

Number six is a communication, City Clerk, Clerk of the City Council submitting an application for a new private livery license on behalf of Delphoo Amado, doing business as Grace Transportation, 837 Charmett Avenue, New Bedford Mass, license to expire on June 30th, 2026.

It was referred here on October 9th, 2025.

Number six is now before you.

Motion received and place on the file.

Second.

Motion made by Council Oliver, second by Council Lopes.

All in favor say aye.

Aye opposed the ayes have it.

I see that Mr.

Mado is approaching the bed the podium.

Give us a look give us your name and address for the record and a little background about your delivery service.

Uh yeah, all right, good night.

Uh my name is Thank you.

Uh now I live in uh 112 Virg Street.

Address Shaumot Avenue is for just the parking vehicle.

Okay.

You want to tell us a little bit about your transportation service before I get open the floor for questions.

Um just for school bus.

School.

You want to do uh school bus bus.

Okay, council Oliver.

Thank thank you, madam chair.

Okay, so you're gonna be doing school bus trans uh uh school transportation only, no medical or anything like that, correct?

Yes.

Uh one vehicle, two vehicles.

We'll start with one vehicle.

With how many?

One vehicle for now.

One, okay.

I thought I heard twelve.

Okay.

Okay.

Um the property at Shaman Avenue.

Um, that's where the vehicle is gonna be parked, correct?

Yes.

That's where that you're doing business out of that residence as well that that address.

That you're gonna be running the business out of that address.

The transport business.

That's my father address.

That's you, I'm sorry.

My father address.

Okay.

I know that they have a substantial amount of land in the back for parking, right?

There's enough room back there for parking.

Um so one vehicle, and um just obviously there's no parking on on that side of Shaman Avenue, so the vehicle is always gonna be parked in that lot behind the house.

Yes, there's enough uh parking lots for five, six vehicles.

Yes, yes, yep.

Awesome.

Okay.

Um, uh, I wish you luck um and and success, and hopefully um it does turn into 12 vehicles one day.

Yeah, thank you, madam chair.

Thank you, Council Oliver.

Anybody else?

Seeing none.

Motion or referral to the full city council for a favorable recommendation.

Motion made by Council Oliver to refer out to the city full city council for favorable recommendation.

Second by Council Baptiste.

All in favor say aye.

Aye.

Opposed, the ayes have it.

We put it out on the November 25th agenda.

Thank you.

Number seven is a communication city clerk, clerk of the city council submitting an application for a new private livery license on behalf of Joan Empire.

Um business as Blue Line Transportation, 62 Upton Street, New Bedford Mass.

The license is to expire on June 30th, 2026.

The matter was referred here on October 9th, 2025.

Number seven is now before you.

Motion or receive and place on file.

Motion made by Council Oliver to receive and place on file.

Second.

Second by Council Morright.

All in favor say aye.

Aye.

Oppose the ayes have it.

Okay, I see that Mr.

Pyrez.

I've been living here in Massachusetts New Bath for over 20 years.

So now I see the Oprah needed to help my community.

And uh I decided to do uh business uh blue lines transportation.

So this is why I'm here before you today.

Okay.

Council Oliver.

Thank you thank you, madam chair.

Uh Mr.

Pyers, thank you for being here, but I thank you both for being here.

Um is uh one vehicle, two vehicles, how many vehicles are you looking at to start?

I want to start with uh two vehicles.

I have a Toyota Sienna and uh Niaison Central.

Okay.

And um are those new vehicles, those are new vehicles or vehicles that you own now, the vehicles you own now.

So the vehicle I own and now okay.

Um have you done this type of work before?

The uh the transportation I do do the transportation, but now it was was no my business.

Okay.

Um because you're taking those vehicles off of because your personal vehicles right now, correct?

Yes, and you're gonna make them part of the the business.

Um so I assume that you guys will probably get new vehicles to replace those for personal use.

Um I have the other vehicle I can uh yeah for the kind of use for my personal the vehicles that are gonna be used for the business.

Um you're gonna be able to park those in the driveway.

Yes.

Okay.

Um when then when they're not being used.

Just because I I really care about the the neighbor across the street.

No.

Just kidding.

Uh I'm gonna go by and check.

I will do it since I'm doing everybody else.

I want to know if the neighbor puts his vehicles on the street.

My transportation vehicles are are on the street.

Yeah.

Uh no, I I wish you guys luck.

You guys have been great neighbors.

Um I wish you success in this venture.

So that's all I have, madam.

Thank you.

Thank you, Council Oliver.

Anybody else?

See now your pleasure, Councillor.

Oh, Councillor Gomes.

Thank you very much.

Wish you luck.

Does he park good in the driveway?

Yeah.

He does.

He's been good neighborhoods.

He's been good, okay.

Yeah.

All right.

I had to ask the question.

All right, thank you.

Thank you.

If if he isn't, let us know.

We'll take care of it.

All right.

Second.

Motion made by Council Gomes who refers to the full city council for approval.

Second by Council Lopes.

All in favor say aye.

Oppose the ayes have it.

And it'll be referred out on November 25th meeting.

Thank you.

Okay.

And good luck.

Thank you.

And if you have any problems with that name, will you let us know?

Number eight is a written motion, Councillor Zabucho Cat and Pereira requesting it the HR director, Jose Ruvea, has CFO Bob Axram appear before the committee on appointments and briefings to discuss the city's current prescription drug plan and possible savings options available.

It was referred here on September 11th, 2025.

Um is uh now before you.

Should I?

Motion motion made by Council Abros to receive and place on file, second by council lopes.

All in favor say aye.

Oh the ayes have it.

Mr.

Gilvey, you can approach the bench.

The bench, the podium.

Good evening.

Good evening.

Do you want to just give us a little background on the drug plan before I open up the floor?

Thank you.

Sure.

So um I believe part of it was discussed in the last meeting that I was present here.

Can you hear me okay, by the way?

Yeah.

Great.

Um and one of the things that we were doing at the time is we always are looking for options to look into other vendors of carriers.

And at that time, we had started the process also through the PEC meeting, but at the same time exploring other options to reduce some of the savings that we cost that we have.

That being said, we have embarked in in one of them that had three plans way earlier in the year, I would say sometime around the summer time.

But what we have, the probably the biggest um advantages that would be, it was more with the with the with the uh with the three plans that they offered, and one of them had to do with international planning, which means for all the prescription drugs that would come from overseas.

So that appeared to be one that could be a potential option for us, but with all the stuff that we have going on, unfortunately, there's there's still tariffs going on and issues with that.

That one um what we were advised, and and based on the information that was not probably a good option.

Then we went with another one called Benastar.

So don't forget that the prescription plan that we have is to Blu Cross Blue Shield.

So that's the health plan that they provide, but there's a side one that we work with them.

And one of the things that came up with this one is they're looking at some of the information still.

We don't have all the information at this with this one yet.

However, there may be some potential savings when all the study is done from their part and putting some recommendations to our consultants.

There is locked in, and I believe last time when I was here, I was talking about locked in as well.

Um but what is happening right now is because we have to through book loss blue shield, they will not be able to release claims, which has some specific information regarding some prescription that some of the employees take.

That being said, they are calculating whatever they can in terms of the plans to provide the services for us to decide if this could be some savings savings involved, but that has been done on projections, which means number of people that we have, prescriptions that we see overall.

So it is coming in general terms.

It does not mean there's not some potential savings from what we understand now, but none of those are concrete to the point that we can say we can move forward with that.

The good news with that though is we don't have to move on with this in January 1st per se.

We can start this once all this is finalized sometime in March or even April.

So it's not an open enrollment situation, it's not a January 1st situation, it's not a July first situation.

We can open that and and then take it from that piece.

One of the items that I think it's important to understand is through Pillar RX.

So Pillar RX is still from Blue Cross Blue Shield, and what is happening with that, it is providing a plan that has been working with us for quite some time.

Now, prescription drugs change, medications change, people's conditions do change.

But just to give a little bit from from a perspective, through Pillar RX, when the prescription drugs are consumed, then there are some rebates that come directly from the manufacturers.

And that's based on the process of price that they paid and the amount that was consumed for one or two or three or more persons.

That being said, in in terms of savings, and this will diminish from time after time as we start with these programs.

In terms of savings for the year of 2022 was 72K, 712K, sorry.

For 2023 was 483 K of rebates and savings.

And for the full year of 2024, that was 440K.

For this year, because the year did not close yet, we only have an understanding somewhere for half of the year, which just would take us till about June.

And so far we have 262K.

So once the year closes, then we have an understanding of what the rebates are coming and what that would look like.

So that being said, we also want to close the assignment in order to continue with the with the with the exploring other prescription drugs vendors that could work with us and close the side of the rebates and reimbursements from that piece.

So that's where we are at now.

So at the end of the day, they're still working with us, providing some additional information.

Lockton is still working with Benastar, which is the one that we are exploring.

They also have um looked at some of them.

Unfortunately, there are some activity that is still not set in stone with with the plans with the prescription drugs, as I said, with the manufacturers with the tariffs, and a few other that than what we have cannot compete with what we have in place.

So we are going from probably what it looked like a larger option to a uh a smaller one, but we're not closing the doors until we have a full understanding if this possible savings that we see now are they going to all the way into fruition then and then make some decision.

So from a prescription standpoint, that's where we are.

Thank you.

Council Pereira.

Thank you, Madam Chair.

So uh Locked in is our consultant doing uh on who we should if we should stay with Blue Cross Blue Shield or if we should go somewhere else.

We're still talking about so we don't get confused like last time.

The prescription plan is what they do, they take a look at at what Pillar RX, which is independent plan through Blue Cross Blue Shield is working for us.

That's one thing.

And then as this phase out, because the numbers going down in terms of savings, so as as prescriptions change, as new products are introduced, then that plan could be either renewed, we can take a look at what the rebates would be, or then go overall with a whole different carry with a whole different prescription plan.

So Pillar RX is offered through Blue Cross Blue Shield is what you're telling me.

Okay.

And so Lockin is doing this work to uh um see if Pillar RX is something we should stick with or switch to another vendor.

Which the other vendor is Ben Star.

Benastar.

Benastar.

And and Bennastar is the one that is is still finalizing some potential savings based on what they can project.

Because they don't have any claims with us yet.

There will be a new vendor, so they can only work in projections.

Okay.

And is Pillar RX also giving projections for the same period?

Pillar.

Well, they'll give you actuals because they have the information.

So Pillar X still have an advantage with us because they have been with us for quite some time.

So they have the rolling claims on the prescription drugs that's been rolled on month after month.

So they have demographics, they have some history, they have some uh employees that they know are taking certain types of medications for a longer period of time.

Some medications are short-term, some medications are long-term.

Okay.

And my what I'm seeing right now, or what I've heard uh um through through some newsletters from the MMA and MMIA is that um GIC is projecting um uh prescription increases up to 20 to 25 percent, or sh town should plan for that.

Are you hearing that as well?

Yes.

Okay.

And so I I understand that there's priorities due to an open enrollment and and you know your team you know has to prioritize, but this should be something that we're looking at, so we're not uh and uh it sounds like QI.

And we are yeah and we but just making sure that we're capitalizing because uh a 20 to 25 percent increase in in drug costs not only really hurts the city, but it also will at some point might hurt the employee.

No, for sure.

And and the factors to that, again, from from the advantage of Pillar RX across Blue Shield, is the data that they have on the consumption and the demographics that we we have that.

The demographic speech we can provide to Benastar.

It's just how many people we have from a certain age group from a certain gender.

That's not a problem.

That's easy.

There already has been provided.

Understood.

But what they don't have is the consumption of what drugs for for what how many of the employees are consuming then.

It's only that will remain with Pillar RX.

So they take a look at the age groups, they take a look at the demographics.

I'm still talking about Benastar.

Yeah, and projections as to within this age group, this is the drug or drugs that's been mostly consumed.

So they put a projection there.

Between the genders, this is the drugs that are more useful.

Again, female and male, they do have different different needs.

And for that standpoint, they can project some of that.

From what it looks right now, it looks at our some potential savings.

But we are then we will be at the mercy, and that's why there's some additional work from Lockton is being done.

In and we need it to understand a little bit better.

If they are just based on projections at this moment, what are the potential risks?

And the risks come from with the market.

The risk comes from the uncertainty.

The risk comes comes from to your point with increase that we have some less, some more, but it's around the 20 that we are seeing.

Okay.

For sure.

And then um the consultant locked in, was that selected through you, or was that here in place already?

So it was in place already.

Um we used to have Gallagher um Gallagher before.

So Gallagher was with us for quite some time, and then Lockton was the was the group that has been.

So by the time that I joined the city, Lockton was already with us.

And um I do have we've had some issues in the past of certain consultants in that office previously with other uh consultants that we've hired for like salary studies.

I know it's another topic, but and how have you found Locked in's support.

Good.

Um I I feel that from one of the things that it's that it's a good thing understanding the city is that one of the main uh representatives from from Lochden now did work for Gallagher for Gallagher.

So he's very familiar with the city, is familiar with some of the some of the opportunities that we are trying to work on.

But he's also that's has been that has been his his role.

That has been his expertise and what his career has been.

So he knows the intricacies in and out.

He can also speak, which is good for us, predictive indexes, which means based on cost, based on manufacturers, based on global movement, based on even some of the politics that are involved in making a decision for our country in terms of medications and things like that, they can look at some of the indicators and say these are the potential risks that we are seeing, this is we are seeing with other municipalities.

So the good news is that we're not mixing someone who has some understanding of the private sector with one or two municipality clients.

They have a lot of municipality clients in which they can take a look at what is relatable and what some of the trends are.

Okay.

Um if if these numbers in in are increasing, which it sounds like they are, and and you're looking at different savings.

I just want to make sure the city is getting the best bang for their buck.

And if this consultant is not doing it, then we we need to to look at that as well.

You know what I mean?

Oh, yeah.

And and not even just look at the prescription plan, but look at the consultant for the that is assisting us because I I feel like having a good foundation is is the only way to build a sturdy house.

There is there is one thing that that it's it's super important.

It's when we are dealing with vendors, when we're dealing with carriers and we are the client, the city is a client, there is there is a part that is called vendor management.

What does that mean?

We set expectations for them, the due dates are the due dates.

We set expectations of what we are looking at, we have those clear understanding that this is what we need to better understand and make some decisions on behalf of the employees on behalf of the city.

Um I think that's that's been very much established.

I think I can be quite clear when I need to be.

Okay.

Madam Chair, I'd like to listen to my colleagues right now, and uh I probably have some more questions to circle back on.

Thank you.

Council April.

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Good evening.

Um what are you seeing with the weight loss drug like Wagovy and Ozempic and all that?

Because I'm seeing what's happening in Fall River, and it's just uh a huge budget buster.

It's just uh what do you what are you seeing from from that on our end?

And how's that driving costs?

I I'm not gonna say this is a great question because I think they are all great questions.

So I'm not gonna exclude anybody and give them edit just to you.

Uh, but it is a good question.

One of the reasons why uh it is is for the simple fact that when we were renewing the the premiums for this year, the the weight loss has become a concern, for example, of of the OSAMPIC.

Intended to take care of a couple of things.

Intel have to take care of some medications that were supposed to take place for other purposes, it has become a trend that people were using OZAPIC as a weight loss mechanism.

So the studies about that comes from three uh three parts that it has become a concern.

So because it became popular, of course, the costs started to go up, and it was it is perceived for diabetes, for example, but can treat other things.

I'm just using the the the OZMP as as one.

But can be perceived for other things.

So people would go to the doctor and use that as a weight loss mechanism.

When we were renewing the rates for this year, if we so most companies, most municipalities, and book crossbou shield and other companies have deviated that type of medication for purposes beyond of what it is supposed to be.

So it would not include would not include it, would not be included for weight loss.

Why does that mean that Ozampic then will be prescribed for true diabetes situations and other things that it can treat, but not for the weight loss?

That doesn't mean in our plan that other things that we have for support of wit loss will be taken away.

They are still there, but that medication is not.

If we did not remove that, our renewal for this year would have been around the 18 to 20 percent increased costs.

And because we were able to go in, tackle what the trends are, tackle what the cost is and what it's supposed to be, we were able to have our increase only at 10 percent.

And of course, at 10 percent seems seems high, but in comparison to other municipalities, in comparison to other other business, and locked and has assured that we have been one of the lowest renewals that we have had.

The trends have been that some of them are reaching the 22 percent, most of them falling between the 14 and the 16 percent.

Okay.

Thank you, sir.

I'll yield for now.

I may have some other questions, but uh uh that's that's good for now.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Anybody else have any questions?

Council Perry, would you like a second?

From Bob at certain point, does anybody else have a couple of questions?

Any more questions for Mr.

Calvea?

Okay.

Bob, would you approach the podium?

Don't go too far.

Yes, good evening again.

Okay, Council Pereira.

Thank you, Madam Chair.

So, Bob.

In discussing a lot of this now, the city switched over to a premium-based um the Switch is dropped to a premium-based uh plan for our health insurance.

So a funding mechanism.

Fund internal funding mechanism.

In the general fund.

Correct.

Okay.

Yes, we um that was done in uh 2025.

It's actually something prescribed by the Uniform Massachusetts accounting system.

Um we used to play, we used to pay 75 percent of the claims directly to the trust fund, and the employees withholding fund paid 25 percent.

Right.

We switched everything over to uh the premium basis now.

We're working, they call it a working rate because premiums mean that the insurer has risk, it's like an indemnity fund.

We have we're self-insured, so it's called the working rate.

So now we pay in with the the health benefits get set by um by Blue Cross every year.

Lockden helps supervise that whole process and they walk us through it.

And then we pay 75 percent of those premiums or working rates into the medical claims trust fund and employees pay 25 percent.

Okay.

And so basically any increase, any so whatever the number was, it was uh eight 21 million.

Oh, for the that was budget.

21 million is the budgeted general fund uh for the 74% of the 7%.

Okay.

Yes.

And that was at 75 percent.

So the other 25 percent is made from employee contributions.

Yes.

Okay.

So paychecks.

Directly out of that paycheck.

All retirees pay.

Fair enough.

The more money that is so the more money that is spent paying out claims, because we are still self-insured.

It's not a the more money that we spend paying out of claims, is less money that gets uh A filtered into the trust fund and B helps try and bring that trust fund into more into balance, correct?

Uh yes.

So the the first part is more true.

Uh so basically if we operate in perfect world, medical claims ratio would be about 97 or 8 percent.

Uh and then the rest of it would go towards paying HR salaries that contribute to this.

So basically all the inflows through the working rates would exactly equal all the claims and administrative fees going out.

Never happens.

That means there is 70 million dollars going through that fund every year.

So you're never going to get uh that to be exactly worked out.

We're operating in an environment where the medical claims ratio is over 100 percent right now, which means that the claims are higher than the working rates.

Um it takes Blue Cross a few years to catch up because they have a 24-month look back period and they apply other things towards these calculations.

So we tend to see a bit of an outflow out of the medical claims trust fund now.

It does have about $18 million in fund balance.

But to your point, um the the balance uh that exists right now, it was uh the the employees have built up more than uh 25 percent.

That's because all those years when we were paying claims, the working rates were higher because medical claims were simply lower than the premiums collected.

And it took is always a lag time.

It took blue cross all that time.

Uh you know, they catch up with lowering the working rates, and then after the pandemic passed, everybody started going back to the doctors, and that's things soared starting in like 2022.

Okay.

Uh we had a great couple of years in terms of claims paid in 2020 and 2021.

And a lot of that fund balance built up at that time.

Okay.

So any savings that we would have on a prescription from our prescription drugs and everything, that would in in effect assist by building our medical claims trust.

That's correct.

Yep, and those savings would be split 75-25 within the medical so within the medical claims trust fund, we keep track of fund balances that belong to the employer.

Sure.

And then belonging to the employee.

Gotcha.

Our pension uh rebates, I mean, I'm sorry, our pharmacy rebates were like 1.7 million dollars, I think, something to that effect last year was really good.

Now it gets split 75 to 25.

Never leaves the medical claims trust fund, which is that the employees own 25 percent of it, and we own 75.

Okay.

Perfect.

Thank you.

Thank you, Bob.

Um I have no other questions at this time for Bob, but I do have another question for Jose, and I know he just sat down and I apologize to making them get back up.

Um does anybody have any questions for Bob?

Say none.

Come on up.

No worries.

This is what we're doing.

Exercise sitting down and locking up.

So you gave us some rebate numbers a little while ago.

Can you repeat those?

So you you 20 I think you said it in 2022?

So 2022 was 712.

2023 was 483.

Okay.

2024 was 440.

Mm-hmm.

And this year is not concluded yet, but uh up until June.

Yeah.

Um about six months.

Yeah.

We are at 262.

262?

262.

Okay.

So now these rebates are negotiated or found by pillar or by locked in?

These the these come from the program that we have.

Okay.

That the pillar uh uh the pillar program takes a look at at this with uh with uh with the number that we have as far as consumers and the amount with the manufacturers and take a look.

For example, if you are consuming a particular medication, are there any rebates from the manufacturers?

And not all of them are just manufactured in the U.S.

They come from other places as well.

But that being said, it's it's what they are doing and that giving some rebates back.

Okay.

Yeah.

Now Bob said about 1.7 million dollars in savings.

Can you explain that?

What he is referring to in prescription drug savings.

Now that's a cumulative from from year over year because the Rec the pillar plan, it goes from year over year.

Okay.

And that's where we are at.

Understood.

And so is locked in consulting on like overseeing pillar essentially.

Yes.

Okay.

So they see they see the trends, they see where we are in terms of the rebates.

If if the rebates are as we know, we we were in in conversations already since 2024 when I joined WD or towards the end last year.

And we knew that this would gradually phase out.

They will not phase out uh um entirely, but any program as such, they do phase out at a after three or four years.

And then we can take a look and renew it because also there's a list of prescription drugs that are applied every year.

These are the ones that have been approved by the plan, these are the ones that have been taken out as the early example of Ozampic being eliminated for wit loss.

So as those changes occur year after year, then these programs are designed to take a look at rebates as new introductions to the market.

Okay.

Yeah.

And uh what is locked in's fee for being this third party approximately.

So Lockton works with us and and and normally on a consulting basis, and we have monthly meetings with them.

Yeah, if we are asking something in addition to, so it runs about 40,000 a year, which is about 40,000 a year.

Around 40,000 a year.

But then again, if we if we were to work on some things that are very specific with them, that's probably a small consulting fee that they may in addition to what the service that they provide.

Okay.

Are you able to provide um to the committee uh at a later date?

Uh what what uh basically whether it's a contract of locked in or um or you can a summary of their of what they're being what we're consulting on with them right now.

Yeah, of course.

All right, I'd appreciate taking a look at it.

I will put a little bit of of a summary of what it is, how long we've been working with them.

Yeah, a little bit of that, yeah.

And then the cost of year over year that since we've been with them.

Okay.

And then we can we can so you have that information, of course.

Yeah, okay.

Very good.

Thank you.

Um I don't I don't have any other questions right now, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Council Pereira.

Anybody else have any questions on this topic?

CNM none.

No, we we we do have an invited guest, Andy Shaw.

I don't know if you're no, that's the next we we're going to the next item now.

Yeah, I know.

I know that, but I don't want to make sure that okay.

No, we have no that's the next clerk's gonna read the next item into the record.

What do you want to do on this?

I think we can make a motion to table until we get some information.

Okay, motion table made by Council Pereira, second by counselor combs.

All in favor say aye.

Aye.

Opposed, the ayes have it.

Okay.

Number nine is a remotion counselors Abreu Carney, Choquette and Pereira requesting the HR director Jose Juvea.

And uh appear before the committee on appointments and briefings to discuss the city's current voluntary benefit package.

Benefits are paid that are paid for solely by the employee.

It was referred here on September 11th, 2025.

Number nine is before you.

Motion received in place on file.

Most being made by Councillor April.

Council Pereira, second by council April, all in favor say aye.

I suppose the ayes have it.

Okay.

You want to start?

Yeah.

Okay.

Of course.

So let me give you a brief summary of the of the um voluntary benefits that we have.

Through Boston Mutual, we have basic life, which is your basic life insurance, as as as you know.

This is the only benefit in which the city sponsors some of that.

Um all the other are truly voluntary benefits that it would fall under the employee.

Still through Boston Mutual, we have optional life, so in addition to other increases, they can they can put in for uh life insurance, they can do that up to seven times their salary, increases of ten thousand.

So all that becomes part of the voluntary option.

That is still through uh business and mutual.

Then you can add your spouse, there's another section of that.

You can have your dependents, there's another section of that.

Then through trustmark, we have voluntary life.

So some people may have smaller components, one through one carrier, one through the other, but they also have that option there.

Through Trust Mark, we have accidental plans, which means you have that additional insurance again.

If you were to to consider that, that is available to you.

Critical illness, which is another one that is that is some people have been enrolling on this one here, which has to do with really critical situations where that would have to be heart attacks, strokes, uh, organ transplants.

So those those circumstances that become extremely difficult and costly.

The disability, it is part of that as well.

That's the short term term, and even a hospital stay.

So all that is part of options that we have through trust mark.

Cafeteria Plan Advisors is offering is a flex spending account, and the flex spending account splits into two areas.

One has to do with the health care, that's up to $3,400 a year that the employees can opt to do that.

That's for uh expenses that in which they will consume that amount of money.

So it's not a health savings account as a flex spending account.

And if it is for dependent care, those who have younger children, that amount changes to 700 to 7,500.

So there's two parts of that as well.

And um we also have spot pet insurance, and it's not many people participating, but even for pet insurance, we have that option as well.

So people have the their full-legged friends in which they want to ensure them as well.

We are we are providing this.

This is newly introduced within the last five, four years, so people are still exploring that, but we also provide that as well.

So this is basically a rundown of of what we have in terms of voluntary benefits.

Thank you.

Do we have any questions for Mr.

Govair on the voluntary question?

Voluntary benefits.

Counselor Council Pereira.

Thank you, Madam Chair.

So um, Jose, on uh this conversation, this motion was filed based on conversations we've had in the ordinance, meaning regarding um FMLA, P PFMLA in regard well, not paid family medically, but paid paternity leave.

Or paternity leave.

So based on that, you know, in discussions with the voluntary benefit package, I wanted to get a better understanding of where we were.

Um in how you felt Boston Mutual Trust Mark and Cafeteria Plan are performing.

And uh you know, you know, we had the wellness fair, who showed up, how was that, and and I'd like to get some of your just oversights on those three as well.

From uh uh from your perspective as the manager of dealing with this, and then maybe some insight on either any uh uh employee feedback or what you see from the employee side.

Yeah.

So there's there's multiple questions there.

Let me answer one.

I'm sorry.

No, no, no, no, no, I got them all.

I got them.

Okay, all right.

So from the health fair, they all participated and attended the two days of the health fair, which was good.

That gives an gives us another opportunity to uh not only provide information, but at the same time make it visible, understanding with the representatives, and also if there was any questions directly from the employees, they were there, which is very, very good.

Then the other thing that we we talked about in terms of of what it looks like and what we are looking into this as well, is some of these things on the voluntary benefits become somewhat trendy.

It's a nice to have, it's not something like your your your medical plan.

So that being said, some of these will phase out, some of these will be increased with other options, some of them will have multiple options.

When it comes to boss and mutual, we've had them for quite some time.

Um, and that's one of the things that I'm that I'm exploring and taking a look at what it would look like if you were to bring another one in.

But to put into perspective, it sounds it sounds nice when someone knows someone and talks to them and shakes their hand and say, I come, an example from FLAC, I come from Govey's company, I come from Pereir's company, and can you get me into the city?

But every professional that understands the intricacies of of plan migration, what does that mean from one option to another?

That is a burden that falls under the city, that is a burden that falls under the administration, that's a disruption to the services the employee are getting through the benefits plan.

That is happening.

So in terms of Boston Mutual, just on basic life, we have 903 from the city side, and we have 1,079, a total of almost 2,000 people from the school side.

So when we are looking at options, when we are looking in and exploring other opportunities, we need to take these factors in consideration.

Now, if I were to change the pet insurance, I would say, okay, well, that's this is an easy breezy one because I have 11 on one side and eight on the other.

That's what I mean.

So with that being said, when we take a look at this, it is something that at the same time, I'm also looking at the administration.

I'm taking a look at the responsiveness, I'm taking a looking at the service they provide.

That goes back to what I said earlier.

That's vendor management that that falls into that.

Trust mark.

Um we have some more uh uh people participating on that one as well, not as significant as Boston Mutual, but it provides other options.

And in that one as well, when it comes to short-term disability, long-term disability, I think, counselor, I think it was you that I mentioned in one of the questions that we were doing open enrollment sessions.

We're planning to do that.

The good news that we actually booked by department myself, we went to the departments where the employees are.

We had four in this building, but then the rest was 17 sessions.

17 for the last two weeks in which we were working on to provide some some opportunity for our employees to show these benefits to them to explain these things to them, including the voluntary benefits.

So as a result of that, some of the employees have come in with some enrollment forms for some of these.

So until open enrollment is completely done, I will have an understanding how many more.

I'm not expecting a drastic change.

But the fact that we got there to quite a few employees and explained that that is a plus.

In addition to that, which I think it's really important, is one of the scenarios that I presented to the employee is the city is very gracious, providing 15 days.

Uh and I say gracious because I come from a world that only had five sick days and I never barely took any.

But the city provides five um accumulation of 15 sick days throughout the year, which you can have that bank accumulate that to 1,440.

That being said, I understand we don't provide FMLA, but for the employees who have been here for 10 years plus, they have that cushion there.

They have that time and an illness they they can use.

Then the problem becomes a little bit more with with new employees like myself.

But what happens with us for me to build that, it will take quite a bit of time.

So in this scenario during the open enrollments, is letting the employees know that short-term disability, long-term disability would be a great option for them for them to enroll because in case something happens, they have some cushion from a finance standpoint that will help them out.

And once they built that sick time, they can just they can just cancel that or continue with it.

There's different options.

There's a short term, there's a long term, and things like that.

So I felt this was very helpful for them to consider these items to consider these options as well.

Because what people don't know, people don't know.

So that was one of the things.

As far as the flex spending is regulated by the government and IRS, which means that that part is is the same thing for everyone.

There's limitations because it's tax deferred.

One of the things to your point, let me if you if you don't mind.

Sorry, sorry.

Yeah, one of the things that was really really important, and I think we touched upon this, which I would like to understand.

Help me understand why we're not offering a dental plan.

Because that came up time and time again during the open enrollments.

And I want to I want to bring this to your attention, if I may.

Do you mind?

Is that okay?

All right.

So let's let me ask you some questions in return.

We offer quite a few of these options.

We even offer pet insurance, but not a dental plan.

Right?

So when we are looking at our employees, you your your dental health is just as important as anything else.

And it's and it's something that when I looked into this since the last time when I was here, and when I get curious, I I get to dig and I and and I go deep on that.

And quite frankly, look, I I lived in Fall River.

Nice place, but I work for New Bedford, right?

But if you look at right across 195 into Fall River, they offer three options of a dental plan.

When I look back to Lockton and said, can you help me understand with your municipality clients how many of them have some sort of of a good dental plan?

And they said way over 95% of them.

So why does New Bedford need to be unique?

No, that's a question.

Why are we so unique?

It's in committee right now.

It's been in committee for a while.

Uh there's been a lot of yeah, I brought it up.

Eight years.

Yeah.

So instead of I brought it up quite a few times and it just keeps going.

Instead of the question being, if I may, instead of the question being why don't we offer a dental plan?

I already know that we don't offer, right?

And manage these.

Yeah.

What's stopping us?

Yeah.

That's what I would like to understand.

I will uh I'll chat back with you offline on that, a little bit about the background history on that.

Uh but it's I've uh counselor eight years, uh, but I brought it up multiple times and uh it's always been met with some resistance, and it's it's a shame to be.

Just justifies as to what we are not doing based on perceptions.

Oh no, facts.

Facts for today is over 90% of the of the customers from locked in do offer one.

Another thing is that a lot of the municipalities around us, most of them do, unless they have some sort of un embedded alternative.

Why don't we?

So the history, okay, will be helpful as to why don't we do it.

But that's been happening for eight years ago.

That's no longer it history.

In my humble opinion, that's an excuse.

Yeah.

And our employees are suffering from this.

We cannot do that.

We can really not do that.

I want you to put yourself in my shoes and forgive me for the time, but it's just between friends, right?

So let's let's get to that point.

Let's put our efforts together to make new Bedford what New Bedford deserves to be, because we have a city that we are, as you know, much better than I.

We have a city with over 104,000 residents that is taken from the city side.

I'm talking about everybody that works from the city side, about 1,200 people that takes from the school side another 27.

And I'm sure, I'm sure it is important that in terms of education, we are getting what we need for our younger generations in terms of being safe, in terms of being rescued, in terms of being safe, when something is happening with you.

The streets are clean, all this takes a tremendous amount of people, with the support from the residents.

Why don't we take care of the people that take care of the city?

Yeah.

No, I agree.

Look, it didn't my my smile was not cheap.

If I was working for the city for 30 years, I don't think it would look as good as this.

So let's be mindful about that.

I understand, I understand the history, but let's really make a difference.

Let's really make that impact.

I think it's about time.

Wouldn't you agree?

I do.

My last thought just on this before I uh uh yields, because I think some colleagues have questions is um when you did those 17 sessions.

Yes, uh going to the which I think was I think is important.

Yes.

And I I I I thank you for that.

Did you reach out to any of the carriers to come with you?

If needed, they would they they offer because we should offer.

Okay.

But you'd prefer to I I prefer that I that we took care of it because some employees do feel more comfortable with Spanish, which I can speak fluently.

Uh okay.

But the Portuguese, we I do speak fluently, and we don't have many would speak Asians, but I could also help with some of the French if they needed.

So between my team, Vanity was there, she speaks Spanish, Sandy was there, she speaks Portuguese.

Sure.

We just wanted to make sure, then we said if you have questions that are specific to you, we are here to help you and guide you in the language that you feel most comfortable.

Okay.

I yield and want to hear more from my colleagues.

Thank you, Councilor Pereira.

Councillor Shak.

How are you doing?

I'm doing well, how are you?

Okay.

It's been a long night, right?

It's been a long day.

Uh just quick question.

Who who's the who's the broker for Boston Mutual?

Nicole.

I I don't remember her last name.

I know it's in my emails, but uh it's Nicole.

I deal with Nicole.

She's the one who my main point of contact.

Nicole?

Yeah.

Okay.

I can send you that information if you would like.

Yeah, I'd like that.

Sure.

Yeah.

No.

Thank you.

Um I guess I yield.

Thank you.

Thank you, Sweden.

Any other okay.

Uh, Councillor Gomes and then Councillor Loebs.

I'll be real quick.

Have we have you done any um costs to a dental plan?

Just because you brought it up.

I've been here a long time and it was a concern long time ago.

But again, just fell off the radar.

Fell off the radar.

And when you think about it, dental is very important.

Um some people think of it as just a cavity or or whatever.

Some people are affected in in um health wise.

That's correct.

Because of their teeth, and don't even realize it sometime.

So that's a uh heavier burden to uh uh our cost for the health care or to take care of that person if they run into that trouble.

Have you done a cost on uh I in terms of what it would be for dental plan per person very quickly?

Normally dental plans, in my experience with dental plans, they come with three options.

Um is the very basic, which takes care of your maintenance, your annual maintenance.

Two cleanings, probably one X-ray every two years, that's normally what it is.

Um and a few minor things that they can add to that.

Something like that, the cost per employee will be somewhere between the 10 to the 12 dollars for an individual plan, a little bit more around 15 or so.

10 to 12 dollars a week or um bi weekly.

By weekly, every two weeks.

Every two weeks, that's what it runs to.

But they also go into another one which has a little more in-depth services, it's which, for example, if has anything that would cover braces, we'll cover crowns, we'll cover things like that.

That one becomes a little bit more expensive.

That being said, there's also another one that could give a third option that could other things be put in there.

And what I have seen is most places that I have worked in the past offers two options.

And the reason why the two options exist, it would only be if you have children, let's say teenagers, in which they would need a little bit more of dental work, then you stay in that option that costs you a little bit more, but you save on quite a few things on the orthodontic space.

Then once they get out of the house, my kids are out of the house, then I don't need all that.

We don't need to go through braces, but I could use the other one as part of my dental maintenance, that would make more sense.

So from that standpoint, that 10 to 15 could fluctuate based on what we design and based on what we put as alternatives.

Depending on whether you entered into a plan that did two cleanings a year.

Yes.

Um, an X-ray year uh possibly a uh stipend of a thousand dollars for those are the gravities or or um fill-ins or whatever has to be done.

And they also have limitations on the options, let's say 15, 1500, 2,000.

Once you once you cover that, once you get to that limit, everything that after that you have to pay.

Some of them have 2500 dollars if the plan is more robust or even further than that.

All that falls on the plan design.

And if you were to get serious about this, what I would like to do is work on this, but quite frankly, I'm gonna be very honest with you.

I don't want to waste all this time because this is a tremendous amount of work to get here and I will become part of the history.

One more time for another eight years, waste of time for all of us.

But what I could do is if we are serious in contemplating this, then let's take a look at some plan designs.

Let's take a look at some options.

And then will this make sense to provide two options?

Will this make sense to go with just one?

Or we could also do this, provide one option that we find it would be the best and more affordable for our employees year one and explore for year two and three.

What else could we do?

At least as something started, at least as someone's start off with a standard and as we uh gradually get into it, move into a a more in-depth uh dental plan for the the city.

There will always be that side though where the employee will have to have their contribution at at some certain point.

If the plan is completely voluntary, all that this would do is the employee.

I'm not saying uh I didn't mean to interrupt you, you know, for the cleanings and stuff like that.

Yes.

But you possibly excuse me.

You could possibly get a filling or braces.

Yep.

I've had a bad call.

I apologize.

Take your time.

Take your time.

And um there would be a percentage paid by the employee.

Yeah.

And a percentage come out of that package that you put together.

Yes, that will be part of the plan design.

So let's let's use rounded numbers.

If a crunch costs five hundred dollars, I honestly don't know how much it costs this day, but if it costs five hundred dollars, for example.

And and we say in your plan, out of the five five hundred dollars cost or above, your plan covers four hundred out of that or three hundred out of that.

So all that falls in the options of the plan design.

We can take a look at that.

And the last thing I would say is the option for the employer.

Like you said, of standard plan, but maybe there is two plans for I pay ten to twelve dollars by the time.

It can be higher.

I'm sorry.

It can be higher.

Sorry.

10 to 12 dollars bi weekly.

But it can be higher.

What?

It can be higher than the Yes, it can be higher.

And uh I'm just giving an example where I would pay 18 to 21 because I went with the other option that gave me a little more.

Yes.

Bracets for the kids.

Yes.

That type of thing.

Thank you very much.

Let's work on that.

I think it's very important.

One of the things that I think is that the other thing is that the question is.

I think it's very important for the health and well-being of the employees.

You've done a great job on bringing this wellness and all this to the city, and I congratulate you.

Thank you on a job well done.

Not only yourself, all those that are involved, but this is one that I think we should really take a look at that could benefit um our employees in the long run and benefit the city as far as people going out on sick leave or or whatever because of teeth that started off with a cavity that gave me an infection that affected a lot of other things in my body because it can't.

And just one thing that I feel it's important to know in our health plan through Close Blue Shield, children up to 12, some of the dental is pay is paid through that plan, which is which is a surplus.

But that's not going to address the employees, right?

So thank you so much for your support.

I really appreciate it.

Thank you very much.

I appreciate you.

Thank you.

Thank you, madam chairman.

Council Oakes.

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I will add as one of the makers of that motion in 2017.

That these aren't included either.

I visits.

As we have an aging population, more and more people aren't buying readers, they're buying glasses.

And as just as important your dental is, it's also important that you know you have glasses.

I have no clue about that.

Since the fifth grade.

But that was something that you know was discussed.

It wasn't part of the the original motion, but it was in discussion that because the same statute that dictates dictates you know your eyes.

So if you were looking at one and you're going to exhaust your time and the the resources of your office, it would be behoove you to look at both because they fall in the same statute.

Because I bet you there would be a good percentage of you know team members that would like to have optical care as well.

So I agree.

Thank you, Mr.

DeGovea.

Thank you.

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Excuse me, Kate.

Thank you, Council Ubbs.

Councillor Sir Kat.

Thanks, madam.

Uh Madam Chair.

Yeah, Rosjoy, sorry.

Um in addition to that, Nicole Person, could you also send the names of any of the agents that wrote those policies?

I just curious who's making commissions on that.

Okay.

Yeah.

Thank you.

And can you email that to me?

If it I think I should email it to all of you, right?

Yeah, please.

But I I can also put some summaries that I believe would be helpful for you as well.

Yeah, I just want to know who the people are that are doing the Boston Mutual.

You will not get it this week, but I promise you they will get it very soon.

That's okay.

We get time.

But thank you.

Thank you.

I I yield, Madam Chair.

Whenever you are ready.

I yield.

Thank you.

Anybody else?

Anybody else for the um the director saying none?

You may have a seat and um we're gonna call it Mr.

Shaw.

Thank you very much.

Don't go anywhere.

Real quick, I know everybody's it's been a long, it's been it's been long.

Um thanks for for having me.

My name's my name is Andy Shaw.

I represent uh AFLAC, been doing it for 23 years.

It's funny, I feel almost like I'm bad like with my old boss who he had an office right on Purchase Street 23 years ago.

So we started right in New Bedford offering AFLAC.

I I work uh very heavily in the municipal business.

I will echo a bunch of stuff that you've you said.

You talk about dental insurance, it's the second most requested benefit that exists.

I mean, it just is.

Um so no question about it.

That's that's certainly something, and it doesn't matter if you offer it on a voluntary basis or the or the organization is paying for it.

If you if you put it in place, there will certainly be people who participate in that plan, no question.

Which kind of leads me to the to the voluntary to the voluntary products.

Like I said, I work I work a lot in the municipal space.

Um my regional team developed relationships with over 100 municipalities here in this in the state of Massachusetts.

Anything from like Boston to Lowell to Lawrence, Middleborough, all you know, a variety of different types of of companies and in uh of municipal business.

Um it's interesting when I when I find when AFLAC is not offered at uh a municipality.

Uh I I always uh inquire about why.

And in it can be a number of different reasons.

It can be um you know brokers or relationships or what have you.

Um but what we find when we come, if we're not actually active in a municipal in a municipality, um there's a there's there's an existing carrier that's probably been there a significant period of time, and it's it becomes pretty stagnant, right?

So it's just become pretty stagnant in participation in you know some of the education pieces.

Um when we come in with AFLEC's name recognition, we happen to be the number one provider of voluntary benefits.

If you look at the gaps in insurance, uh in terms of the co-pays, the deductibles.

We're doing we're offering the hospital plans, we're offering critical illness policies, AFLAC pioneered cancer insurance.

Um we pay people cash for the diagnosis and treatment of cancer.

Some of these policies, you know, I know as as health costs have increased, and pharmaceutical costs have become the next thing.

Um become more and more necessary uh in the marketplace.

Uh the one thing I would say about uh education, those 17 sessions, uh whatever you whatever carriers you operate with, doesn't matter if it'll be AFLAC or not.

I think it is important to have a carrier rep come in and and present the product.

I agree, like the the language thing is definitely you need the Portuguese, you need the Spanish speaking, uh, but have the carriers bring in Spanish speaking and Portuguese speaking because when you when you educate a population on a product, whether it's dental, vision, supplemental, help, etc.

Pharmaceutical, you'll get significant you'll get participation from them.

Uh but uh I just wanted to to let you know that we exist, we exist down here uh locally.

Uh love building relationships with um organizations like you guys, and uh I appreciate you just having me come in and and just chat really quick.

Thank you.

Don't move any, don't move anyway.

We got questions.

Council Abrew.

No, I just wanted to not so much a question for Andy, but uh just a statement um as someone who was um a director uh here at the chamber of commerce for 11 years, uh director of business.

Um I personally had AFLAC as a benefit, but um we had an affinity program through our membership, which was when we emerged with Fall River was over 1500 small businesses strong, and um it's a legitimate product, it's good stuff.

And I just want to you know it's just just for the public to be aware that like you know you're not you're not pitching a pyramid scheme here.

You're not a snake oil salesman.

This is legitimate, and I think anyone who has half a brain has heard of AFLAC anyway, but um, you know, you're not just some rep off the street here just doing a pitch.

So I just wanted that for the record that this is a great product.

I've experienced it, and I've um and I've been promoting its value for a long time.

So thank you for what you do, Andy.

Hey, appreciate you having me in.

Any other questions?

Councilor Shouquette.

Thank you.

Good evening.

So, what are your thoughts on this PRICS?

You know, the prescription cost, uh savings, and I'd like to hear so we have nothing to do, you know.

Affleck has nothing to do with that, but that's the next battle in healthcare.

Um that's what's driving increases.

Um the solutions that Mr.

Gove is seeking through locked in or any broker that he's that doesn't matter.

That every single organization is is doing the same thing because the pharma is is driving all the costs, the claims, the utilization.

Um you're absolutely right.

You had a couple you have a couple years of through COVID of people not filing claims, not and then when that all reverses, you know.

I mean, it's I mean I've I've been doing this 23 years.

I work with brokers, carrier, you know.

Um that's the every projection he's given is is on the money, you know, 15 to 20 percent increases over the next three years.

Not it's not not not real, it's real.

Yeah, so it's a big challenge ahead, so gotta find those solutions.

Okay.

Thank you.

Thank you, Councillor Choquet.

Anyone else?

Any questions for Mr.

Shaw?

Any other questions?

Seeing none just from the chair for a moment, I just want to I've uh you know I've had uh Affleck for probably 15 years in that short-term thing.

So if I get hurt at home, I get paid.

I get a three-quarters of my salary, my my pay gets paid, so if we get hurt, but I just want to say it's I mean I've I've had it for 15 years, I've been very pleased with it.

It's not a big cost out of my wallet.

I pay it directly out of my pocket now because I'm not in any kind of plan with any I just pay it.

The industry 10 years ago was a four billion dollar industry.

Today it's over 10 billion, right?

I mean, there's massive gaps in insurance.

Um it's I mean, supplemental policies 20 years ago were were tough to understand and tough to put in place.

You know, you talk about dental, why do we have to be unique?

Why why don't we have dental in place?

Everybody has voluntary benefits in place now.

It's just it's just a what carrier that you put it in place with.

You know, obviously I'm I'm biased, but uh I've seen the impact it has on people's life.

I mean, like the cancer plan athletic pioneered cancer insurance.

You know, we pay cash for the diagnosis and treatment.

You know, somebody's diagnosed with cancer in the state of Massachusetts on average we'll pay in between 30 and 40,000 dollars, right?

I mean, I have a niece right now who's battling leukemia, she's been in the hospital for um uh four months.

They the parents go back, one is always staying with with the with my niece, right?

So they're taking time out of work to go with their niece, right?

They can't, you know, they can file FMLA now, right?

But it's it's not enough, right?

The mortgage still comes, you know.

You know, the the money you can that that you can receive from a policy like that it makes massive impact.

I'll tell you one other quick thing.

My daughter, so I have all these plans too.

My daughter last year, it's funny.

I you get insurance, you never want to use it.

Uh so she injured herself, she dislocated her knee knee playing soccer.

Umbulance ride, dislocated knee, broken patella, sprained MCL, all this stuff, right?

Um AFLAC paid me for getting the injury checked out, 200, 300 for the dislocation, 500 for the patella, uh, 125 for the crutches, right?

And and the reason I I say this, and the reason it's important is because 50% of Americans, 50 50 percent have less than a thousand dollars in their savings, right?

Think of your population.

50% of Americans have a less than a thousand dollars in their savings, right?

Average deductible is what, 2500?

Right?

That that wipes out your savings, you're onto credit cards.

Plans like this make a difference, right?

You know, but education I think is the biggest the biggest piece.

You know, you gotta your people gotta know it exists, they gotta know they have access to it.

Uh and then you need consistent from representation on a like monthly basis, newly hired employees, filing play, all that stuff.

So it's very important.

Thank you.

Counselor Abraham.

Thank you.

Just uh Mr.

Shaw, my hope is after this meeting yourself and Mr.

Gorvea will finally exchange some business cards and break bread.

I think that'd be nice.

Have a conversation.

Yeah, okay.

You know, so that's all.

All right, and connect.

Thank you.

Thank you.

That was it.

Thank you, Council Avery.

Anybody else?

Seeing none, your pleasure, Councillors.

Take a motion on the table at this time.

Motion has been made to table by Council Pereira, second by Council Choquette.

All in favor of tabling say aye.

Opposed, the ayes have it.

Thank you, Mr.

Shaw.

Thank you.

Number 10 is a communication.

Councillor Gomes submitting a host community agreement proposal application on behalf of Shamar James, founder, CEO of THC Connect, LLC doing business as House of Diesel, seeking to operate a co-located adult use marijuana retail and product manufacturing establishment at 301 Herman Malville Boulevard, New Bedford Mass 02740 was referred here on January 23rd, 2025.

On February 18th, that was twenty it was tabled.

It's now before you.

Motion to take from the table.

Motion made to take it from the table made by Council Gomes, second by Council Pereira.

All in favor say aye.

Aye.

Oppose the ayes have it.

The motion that the motion is out before us.

Thank you very much, Madam Chairman.

Um we want to apologize.

We're having a late night here and um you were lost on the agenda, but uh we wanted to make sure that we had this on the agenda.

Do you have any updates that you would like to um not any updates in particular because we've also had a little bit of a hard time contacting the SCC, which we'll talk about, but the CCC when I say HCC, the CCC.

Um but today we are here for a simple ask from the council.

Our goal today is to ask you to vote to approve a draft template, HCA application that the state, the CCC has created so we can move forward.

The reason the CCC or the state has created this template, the model template, is simply for situations like we are in.

Situation where the municipality has struggled to finalize their own procedure.

Meanwhile, applicants like us are waiting for the CCC to review and or to review and compliance for their compliance review, rather.

Um again, the reason why the CCC has created this model is simply so municipalities don't have to reinvent the wheel.

It's done, it's completed.

Um there's no liability, there's no risk to using the template, the model that they have.

As a matter of fact, they encourage municipalities to use the template that they have created.

So our goal today is that one ask of you.

First of all, we thank you for your time, your consideration.

We ask you to vote yes to move forward with that template so that we can move forward with approval to receive an HCA.

We understand that the city uh solicitor has tried um to reach out to the CCC.

They have been somewhat unresponsive.

We understand that they've been having issues with um, yeah.

So there's lack of personnel to do the work, and you moving forward with the draft HCA that we're talking about here with that template, does a couple of things.

First, the municipality doesn't have to work and reinvent the wheel on something that's already created.

The CCC having shortage of personnel didn't have to again review what they've already done and complied, and people like us, the applicants, we can move forward.

That's our ask for today, and thank you for your time.

Thank you.

Um attorney Drake's could you uh um take the podium in a minute are you aware of this ACA?

I'm sorry, you're talking about the application that they're speaking of.

The Canvas Control Commission has a number of forms that they have online that they approve that communities can choose to utilize.

Many communities utilize those forms.

Many do not, and utilize their own.

The City of New Bedford chose to utilize its own.

As you know, Council, we submitted the SEP.

We have not been able to get a response, despite my efforts, and I've copied you on my efforts, you're aware of them.

The only good news is my last overture was on November 15th, and on Monday, I got an email from the CCC finally acknowledging my overture, indicating that they were assigning it to the investigative team for review, and that a CCC staff member would be in contact with me with additional guidance.

Given their staffing concerns, I don't know when that will be, but I can tell you that after two months of regularly reaching out to them, I finally received a response that says that they're going to send it to their investigative team.

I understand their chief investigator, Dan Huber is still out on leave.

I would be delighted to speak to them.

Frankly, the snag that exists here, I do not believe is significant.

I'll just point those two points out again.

Our SCP was a policy adopted by the mayor as the chief executive officer of the city.

They seem to believe it needs to be done by regulation.

That's not what the ordinance or their regulations say.

I think the policy adopted by the mayor meets the statutory and regulatory requirements.

The other issue has to do with language in the SEP.

And the draft formal templates talk about a one-to-one issuance of licenses.

For every one SEP licensed applicant, you are then able to give an applicant a license or an HCA, who is a non-SEP applicant.

Our SEP policy states that after approval by the CCC of this policy, for the first six months, we will negotiate only with an SEP applicant, and thereafter, license will be issued on a 50-50 basis.

50% of any licenses to an SCP applicant and 50% to a non-SCP applicant.

I don't understand how that language does not mean on a one-to-one basis.

And they've rejected it because we didn't use the words a one-to-one basis.

We've said for six months, only SCP applicants will be considered.

Thereafter, those HCAs will be entered into on a 50-50 basis.

One half SCP, one half potentially not SCP.

I don't know how 50-50 doesn't equate to one-to-one counselor.

And so I think we're fine.

I just can't get somebody to talk to me.

I think that we have a problem definitely with the CCC right now.

A phone call that I must have received earlier addressing this issue.

And I'm being told that the since the reappointment of the head of the CCC, people are taking leave, people are not showing up for work or what's going on.

All I know is that if this application can help them, why can't we consider using it?

I certainly would have to talk to the administration.

What I would tell you is if I properly understand what they're suggesting to this body.

They are suggesting that they submit this template and that this council approve that template and issue the HCA.

The problem with that is if one were to read the ordinances of the City of New Bedford, HCAs go through the mayor's office.

So they can submit their template, but it goes through the mayor's office.

I would have to do research as to whether or not we could move forward without an approved SEP if we use their template.

Then it comes back to you after an HCA is entered into between the city through the mayor's office and the applicant.

Thereafter it comes back to you when it goes over to a planning board for the special permit, that's when your role comes into play.

In the past, we have shown you the HCAs and advances of courtesy prior to the special permit process to keep you in the loop.

But it starts through the mayor's office under our current ordinances.

Would you consider going um bringing that back to the mayor?

That this uh this uh template would not only help get this thing off the ground.

There's also some grant money that's involved or whatever.

If I understood my message correctly, and I'll get uh Connie back up there and she can correct me if I'm not um that could uh subsidize the money that these people have lost over the past couple of years or whatever.

Um is that something that we possibly could do or you could do?

I I can certainly talk to the mayor about a council.

I'm happy to talk to him about it.

What I have to tell you is I would have to do the research to see how we utilize this template that they're proposing, because I don't know.

Okay.

It's come up, I believe, tonight for the very first time.

Okay.

But there's not enough to answer your question, and I apologize.

But you would consider looking into it and taking it back to the back.

I would certainly research it, absolutely, because I don't believe that the CCC is going to move quickly.

This answer that I got came from a general mailbox.

I have written to Huber, his voicemail and his mailbox says forward it to this CCC mailbox, which I did repeatedly after he went on leave, and I've never gotten an answer until my most recent nasty gram that I copied you on that says I've been at this for four months.

I've emailed you four times, I've called you repeatedly at the CCC.

Folks, you don't get back to me.

The council has brought me before them twice and they're not happy with me.

I can't give them an answer until I hear from the CCC.

And now I got this email response from the general mailbox.

I'm not convinced it's not a form response that just says, hey, we'll get back to you.

And I looking at the proponents behind you, sort of nodding their head in agreement with me that there's a problem there.

I I believe I believe.

Um Corney.

Could I have you back for one second?

When I want to hold anyone here any later than we already have.

Corney, um, is this something that we could consider?

We uh we don't want to violate what our laws say here in the city and possibly mess everything up or whatever.

I understand what you just said, and I was listening to the consultant, um, and I'm sorry I didn't get to hear that call earlier as it was called into me.

Um is it something that we could consider and then to bring this back in um um 30 days or so if that's possible?

I know the strain that's been on you on your but you're hanging in there, and we're trying we're trying our best.

And uh, you know, to the credit of the attorney, he's taken uh uh a whip in here a couple of times that he has been here from us, and he knows that we weren't happy, but uh he has ex shown the ability to try to get through to the CCC.

And what I'm understanding from the CCC is that the place is in turmoil right now.

And uh nobody's happy, and some things are being done purposely just kind of screwing everybody up.

Correct.

I mean, obviously, you know, disappointing, but absolutely we definitely will table that and come back and will you give us that opportunity?

Um I do just want to mention that.

Step up to that mic.

Uh what I do want to mention is what we're talking about and what he's working on with the same.

I need to know your name.

Uh, Shamar James.

I'm sorry.

I'm sorry.

It's all right.

It's all right, I understand.

Um what we're talking about is uh social equity policy and a social equity process to get applicants through.

We've done everything.

We we're at the point where we need approval.

So I understand that being approved and how you usher people in and how many licenses are going to be given to social media equity equity applicants before non-society equity equity applicants.

I understand all of that, but we're kind of past that process.

We're we're fine going through it.

The the normal channels and having an HCA given given that way.

But for me, if you are worried about running a file of the CCC because you don't have a social equity policy in place, I think show having a social equity applicant be approved is showing good faith to the CCC that you're working on that policy.

So for me, it just it kind of feels that you know it it we're we're fighting ourselves here.

You know what I mean?

When I think we can use I'm not necessarily seeing an issue in it once again, you guys have your own bylaws, and there's other things that you know that may govern, but I I'm not seeing quite an issue if we follow their template and you show that you have a social equity applicant, that kind of shows that you're you're but I gotta get the guy upstairs to be on the same train with us and say, okay, this is another avenue that we possibly can take.

And until we have that under the R laws that the way it was written or whatever.

Um for us to take a vote like that tonight.

I don't want I don't want to send you home thinking like uh we've gotten the train rolling and we're on our way to the next stop and we're gonna be moving and picking up uh the pieces as it is supposed to be.

I don't want to send you home like that.

I want to make sure that we're doing the right thing.

We don't we've somewhat held you back long.

I say we have held you back.

Not intentionally.

Um I don't think it's intentionally.

Uh uh one point I was feeling that.

I'm feeling a little different, and I threw the rocks where I threw them, and uh that's how it is in this business, and uh so be it.

Um give me an opportunity to send this upstairs with um uh uh city solicitor and see what the mayor can give me on this, and then we come back, and if it's a vote of the city council to to move forward, I just don't want to do anything in violation that would mess you up or mess the city up.

Sorry, Paul Fortez.

Your name?

Paul Fortez.

I also want to mention that with the the uh SE status, it's more of a cut in line rather than a um just the policy more for us to cut in lines do the process faster.

So if we go to the normal channels, you'll still get us as SE uh applicants.

So if we go through everything the normal way, which we can skip this process of the SE uh status and the this this um special HCA.

We don't have to worry about that if we just go to the normal channels and you'll still get us as SE clients.

The only thing is we won't get the benefits of the skipping of line, but we're already in front of the line.

So it doesn't even matter anymore.

So we can just go through the normal process and get us through as well that way.

So we don't have to go to the this SE status, but we still will count as your SE applicant.

So it won't even matter if you process the regular way right now.

Okay.

Can you let us run this upstairs?

Absolutely.

And I I know it's been a struggle, but we're on we're on your side.

Uh I know this body is on your side, and we will stay by your side.

Want to move this along as fast as we possibly can.

And I'm I'm having some faith in uh city solicitor um Jakes, who has been speaking to me.

I I know that we've corresponded a couple of times, but he has been speaking to me, and he knows the foot is on the gas and what we're looking for, and I hope that he would try to help us in some way.

And if he takes us back to the man, the mayor has an open mind and says, okay, go back to the council, tell him past this thing, and we'll ride with it.

And you can still put in our provisions and all those things from what I understand from the consultant.

And I'm gonna read I'm gonna listen to this again as soon as I get out of here.

Um, I think we'll be okay.

All right.

Thank you.

All right, thank you.

I'm not considering to take that off to the end.

Thank you so much.

Thank you.

Thank you.

I don't know if anybody has any questions.

I have a question for from the chair, if you don't mind from attorney jakes.

Attorney Jakes, the chair has a question for you.

Exercise.

Just a couple of quick questions.

Okay, so um there's the templates that have been floating around with the CCC.

If we were to use one of their templates, would you think it would move faster if we just use theirs?

I'm not positive, and I was gonna speak to the proponents outside after the meeting because my understanding, and I may be wrong, but my understanding is the license cannot be issued unless the city has an approved SEP.

That unless you have the approved SEP, you can't move forward with anybody.

Uh they can come in as a non-SEP process, but I understand we can't go forward if you don't have an approved SEP now on the CCC.

There is a template that they excuse me for an SEP policy.

You don't have to adopt it.

There are portions of it that the administration does not want to utilize.

Right.

And so we have chosen to create our own SEP, but we believe our SCP that's submitted meets with the guidelines, and it's been accepted by the CCC for other municipalities.

Part of the problem, and forgive me, I don't want to belabor this, is they're inconsistent.

When I was here in September, I mentioned to you that we presented two amended HCAs for existing licensees with the exact same language.

I'm making up the name.

John looked at one of them, said it's fine, except I don't like this.

Susan looked at the exam exact same document and said she had a problem with something that John didn't have, but the clause that John had a problem with, Susie said was fine.

They're inconsistent reviews previously.

So the problem I think that exists with this SCP right now is the person who looked at it isn't happy with it, but other persons who have looked at the exact same language for other municipalities have said it's fine and it's been approved.

Right.

I I get that because we've been going back and forth with all that with the can we can this body get a copy of what the policy is, the SCP policy that you put in place.

Why should the template?

And the template that's a very important thing to do.

I can look for the template when I need their template.

Right.

There's more than one template.

Oh, you want the SCP template.

Right.

That's what that's what we're having the issue with is the SCP template, correct?

Well, I'm not sure which template they were speaking of, and that's why I want to speak to them in the hallway to make sure I'm on the same sheet of music.

Right.

Because I I I'd like to see that you're going to be the SCP template, and I can get you a copy of our proposed SEP, which is up on the planning board's website.

Right.

And then could you highlight that where the problem is with Susie that has a problem with this, and this one that has a problem with that?

Because you're saying that there's no meeting of the minds with this.

So there's somebody doesn't like this piece of that, and somebody doesn't like this piece, so nothing's coming together.

Well, they're they're slightly different.

I gave you examples of HCAs.

This is a template that I know has been approved by other municipalities.

Okay.

But not for us.

So I can show you the template that is on the website for the CCC for an SCP, and I can show you the SCP that we have proposed.

Right.

So that's the same thing.

That's what I yeah, the SEP that we proposed to the mayor's office.

Right.

Because that's what seems but that's what seems what the hang up is, correct?

That is the hang up is I can't get somebody to talk to me, yes.

Right.

And it's the one it's it's the proposed from the city to the CCC, is that's what we're having the issue with because you are presenting our proposal from the city of the SCP to the CCC, and you're not getting any feedback or any approvals with that.

Correct.

Okay.

So there's our hold up right there.

So that's what we need to get moving on.

Okay.

Okay.

Thank you.

And then like you said, in the ordinance to move forward with what Council Gomes and and uh Diesel would like to do, we can't do that because the ordinance specifically states that the mayor does the approval.

Right.

The A HCA is negotiated by the mayor.

Correct.

It's ultimately approved by you as part of the special permit over in planning.

Right, but the mayor is a very important thing.

Right.

But the mayor has the ultimate approval according to our ordinance.

The initial approval, yes.

Okay.

So if we wanted to change it, that's true.

Right.

Thank you.

Thank you for answering my questions.

Yes.

Uh council Gomes.

If I may, I want to do that.

Absolutely.

I just want to clarify something.

Paul, go ahead.

Uh the mic, okay.

So our television picks up.

Yeah, no problem.

Um the um template that we're talking about is actually on the CCC's website right now.

They they've had it up for already over a year now.

So that that's already been in place for for a year, so it should be able to, it'll go through right away.

Um also that this application, if we can get our application in, just getting it in to the CCC, just up just getting the application to be processed.

Will let us apply for the SE fund that is coming that is out right now, and our application deadline is December 11th, and it goes from being uh 250 250,000 to 2500 uh 25,000.

So it's a big difference in a jump.

So if we can get the application in it right away, that's the big difference that'll help us with the money that we've already been wasting go through.

So I mean that's why we're asking for this now.

Extreme putting that pressure on right now because it's that much of a difference.

It's less less than a month.

Less than a month.

Okay.

So um back to attorney Drakes.

Please.

Last time, attorney Drakes.

I'm gonna get everybody going home.

Asking you to take this to the mayor.

You understood uh what was just explained with that template or whatever.

I understand his comment.

The issue that I still need to resolve with them is there is an HCA template and there is an SCP policy template.

So I need to clarify with them if they're talking about both or only one.

I can easily do that in the hallway council.

Okay, could could we do that after could we do that after the meeting and the information that will be provided to you?

I think will be very helpful in your deliberation with the mayor on this issue.

Um I I'm not begging you, but I'm asking you to uh put the foot on the gas on this one.

They have a December 11th deadline with this application that possibly could help them recoup some of the money and get some grant money that they have lost over the period of time.

I hear you, counselor, and my intent is absolutely speaking to them after this meeting, and I'm just suggesting that if I speak to them in the hallway, I'm not belaboring your meeting and making it last any longer than it needs to while I resolve the issue in the hallway.

I appreciate you, attorney Jakes, and um counselor Pereira has no questions for you this evening.

And that I truly appreciate, Counselor Gomes.

Okay, so Edward six parts and a blue book.

So I I anybody else have any questions at this point on that like to make a motion and the motion to the table.

Motion to table.

Motion table made by Councillor Gomes.

Second.

Second by Councillor Pereira.

All in favor say aye.

Oppose.

The ayes have it.

Motion adjourned.

Second.

Motion is adjourned.

Second by Council Oliver.

All in favor say aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Opposed?

We are adjourned at 911 p.m.