Good evening, everyone.

Welcome to the committee on city property.

The date is February nineteenth, and the time is seven o'clock PM.

Welcome to the city council chambers.

I'm joined tonight by my colleagues in government.

Councilor at large, Ian Abrew, Councillor of Ward Two, Scott Pemberton, Councillor of Ward One, Leo Choquette, Councillor of Ward Five, Joseph Lopes, Councillor at Large, Brian Gomes, Councillor of Ward Six and City Council President, uh Ryan Pereira, Councillor at large, James Roy, and Councillor at Large, Naomi R.

A.

Carney.

I'm Sean Oliver, the Ward 3 City Councillor, and the Chairman of City Property.

Please note that this meeting is being live streamed and recorded.

City Council and Committee meetings can be viewed on the City of New Bedford's homepage under quick links, then meetings.

Dear Chair Oliver and honorable members of the committee, I'm inviting to inform you that I am unable to attend tonight's committee meeting due to another commitment.

All those in favor say aye.

Aye.

Opposed?

The ayes have it.

Number two is a written motion, Councillors Pemberton and Oliver requesting that the committee on city property meet to begin the process of the disposition for the Phillips Avenue Elementary School located at two forty-nine Phillips Road.

It was a third here on January eighth, twenty twenty-six.

Seconded by Councillor Shokett.

All those in favor say aye.

Aye.

Uh I guess uh do you have anybody that you'd like to speak to first?

So we just bring up Josh uh Amerall or we can just bring up Josh of first, yeah.

Thank you.

Mr.

Ammo.

Good evening, counselors.

Good evening.

Uh I guess just kind of an overview of what's happening with that property.

Yeah, absolutely.

Thank you.

Uh as you know, in the Building New Bedford housing plan, we set out to dispose of a number of city buildings for housing.

Uh Phillips Avenue School is one of those that's been on the list for a long time.

Obviously, there's a history with that building and previous attempts at that.

Um we've tried to prioritize those that have uh in our view and what we see from the development community, the most demand for housing development.

And so uh given the previous history at Phillips Avenue, uh that one fell kind of on the list below the Kempton and Taylor School dispositions, which we put out last year.

Um those need to be redone.

So we've been strategizing on how to do that this year.

Uh we do have a Phillips Avenue RFP drafted and ready to go, uh, as we do Kempton Taylor.

Uh we've also been looking at the armory uh and other municipal buildings, and so uh we plan to file those uh within the next couple weeks, including Phillips Avenue School.

And um given the council's interest in that, we can certainly prioritize that uh as one of the first ones that we issue this year.

Um we've had a lot of conversations internally about you know trying to get approval for all those and then staggering them throughout the year.

I think we learned last time uh there are advantages and disadvantages from doing all of those dispositions at the same exact moment, right?

Uh it's not a uh totally crowded development market, and so uh we want to make sure that there's uh equal opportunity and access to those RFPs from you know a variety of sources that uh seem to want them.

But Phillips Avenue School, I think, lends itself well to housing development and uh is one that we'd like to see uh what the market uh wants to do with.

Colleagues, any questions for Mr.

Emerald?

Council Abram?

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Good evening, Josh.

Good to see you.

Uh you know, without naming names, have there been any uh developers or any possible builders who have reached out to your office inquiring about this property?

Uh it's been a little while since someone's reached out specifically about it.

I want to say maybe two years ago, uh there were some some developers that were interested, and we walked through the building uh with the help of DFFM.

Uh there wasn't an active procurement at the time.

It was more uh for us to gauge you know level of interest and how feasible it was.

Um I was you know pleased that the building appeared to be in good enough shape for redevelopment.

I think from a developer's perspective, it's it's a relatively small project.

Uh I think even the proposal that had been considered here before was something like 15 or 16 units.

Uh I think with the use of historic tax credits, which is likely in that development, it's probably going to be smaller than that.

I think 14 units maybe.

Uh I think the footprint and physical size of the building is very similar to Dunbar School.

And so I know that's a property the council is very familiar with.

That project is set to move forward.

I would say the developer is probably going to close on their financing in the next quarter or two in 2026 and then get started on that project, which is now 14 units.

I would expect something similar in scale at the Phillips Avenue School.

Um that said, you know, there's it's sort of a niche market of developer that looks for a project of that size and with the level of effort you need to access all those subsidy sources.

So while I think there's demand and interest in it, it's not like you know the the most lucrative or uh you know, people aren't lining up necessarily for that opportunity.

It's kind of a niche development.

Okay, thank you.

Last question for me.

When when RFPs go out for these public projects, these public properties and buildings, um, when we do our due diligence, we do our jobs, and then no no other department needs it here, and it goes out.

We have a successful um applicant and we reward a bid to somebody and they get it.

Or even before that, how do how do we network or market that property out before we get to that point of getting into the end zone?

I mean, do you just put a a link on your website and hey, you know, let the phone ring?

Or are you is your office a little more proactive, like making calls to known developers that you know, or is there a network that you have of people, like a pool, if you will.

Hey, hey, this group of 40-50 people just letting you know this is coming online just so you know when how does that all play out?

Yeah, no, I I appreciate the the question.

Uh I think we've we've been fairly aggressive in marketing those properties, particularly Kempton Taylor, uh the two fire stations and police station that we've talked about recently as well.

Uh so purchasing is very helpful with this.

Uh the city uses a bid net system, and I defer to Director Gilfeather to expand on that.

But um all of our developers and folks that we work with, we encourage to sign up for that system, which provides automatic notices when there's a housing disposition or municipal building disposition for them.

Um that also tracks the folks who take out the bid documentation so you can see who's sort of looking at it, who's interested in it, and it also makes sure that they stay informed if there are amendments to that bid package at any period in time so they get all the notices.

Nobody can nobody can miss the notices.

But even outside of that system, we've marketed it to all the developers we've done business with here in the city of New Bedford or that we know of.

We do research at times to see who's done successful school conversion projects in other nearby communities, for example.

We also use the help of the economic development council in networking to their developers and construction contacts to help us market those buildings.

So we get them pretty far and wide.

I will say while we were unable to get to the end zone with Kempton and Taylor specifically because of some uh sort of technicalities with the RFP.

Um we saw pretty much unprecedented demand in those buildings.

Um I think we had nearly a hundred different developers take out the bid packages.

Molly's nodding, yes.

Um and then we got I think seven or eight bids on each building.

Um in the past, our experience has been we're lucky to get one or two, uh, but those we got several, um, which has given us some good feedback for us to revise those RFRFPs to be a little bit more specific and um get uh engender better responses, I think, from the development community.

But we do a lot to market them, counsel.

Yeah, thanks a bunch, Josh.

The reason why, and I knew the answer, I've been here a little bit, but you know, I I wanted you to explain it and expand upon it because there are developers who do watch our meetings who are following what we're doing, especially in this committee and other similar committees where it relates to economic development.

So I wanted them to learn the process, the processes that we have internally uh if they want to come into New Bedford because obviously we're we're we're addressing a lot of bureaucratic and red tape measures this year and from the administration to us, we're working together on that in many ways.

So this is another step, I think.

So I think it was important for you to explain the process of how it all kind of shakes out.

So I thank you for that.

I missed the chairman.

I'm all set at this time.

I'll yield.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Any further questions of our guests?

If if the uh the body no objection, uh the body has the chair has a few questions.

No objection.

Uh Josh, um, you did say that this was a ni a niche kind of project, um, but there was some interest in it, correct?

Was it uh multiple developer?

I wasn't here for that, so was it multiple developers or uh yes.

Okay.

There was it was a little bit before my time, but I've followed the process and have sort of read up on it.

Uh there was one developer uh that took that property through this committee unsuccessfully.

I think it was rebid at another point in time, at which point another developer emerged.

And this is purely speculation on my part, but I think if we were to issue it again today, we'd have more than one developer interested in it.

Okay.

So it's something that's that's probably lucrative to do, but there'll be some interest in it.

Um the other thing, I think you had mentioned that you had um gone through the property some time ago.

When was the last time that we've been through that property?

I'd say it's about two years ago.

About two years ago, okay.

And do you think that the condition is similar?

Worse?

Do you know?

It's it it's I'm sure it's not better.

Yeah, but I doubt it's drastically worse.

Uh the exterior of the building, the sort of brick facade, I think needs needs some significant work.

Yeah.

Um it looks worse on the outside than I think it is on the inside.

But of course, any redevelopment for housing is gonna be a really substantial renovation.

So even if it were in slightly worse or slightly better condition, I don't think it would make much difference.

Yeah.

Okay.

Thank you.

Thank you, colleagues.

Uh anyone else?

Any other further questions?

Uh I'd like to make a motion.

Uh the motion I want to make is the move the percent to section 265 be one of the city code.

The committee notified the department heads that the committee is considering to see that the Phillips Avenue Elementary School located at 249 Phillips Avenue, and notify the committee whether said property is needed for municipal purposes.

Okay.

Motion by Council Pemberton.

Second.

Second by Councillor Pereira.

All in favor?

Aye.

Opposed?

The ayes have it.

Thank you.

Mr.

Chairman, point of order through to the clerk.

Should we table item two now?

Well, it's gonna stay anyway, right?

So we'll just leave it.

All right.

I mean, either way, it's gonna be here no matter what, right?

So all right.

Item three is before us.

Read them all together if that's okay.

Uh three is a communication mayor mentions to the city council submitting requests for proposals draft for the redevelopment of a portion of the municipally owned whaling city golf course has an advanced manufacturing campus AMC.

It was referred to in January 23, 2025.

February 20th, 2025, it was tabled.

March 19, 2025, it remained in committee.

3A is a request for proposals draft for the redevelopment of a portion of the municipally owned whaling city golf course as an advanced manufacturing campus AMC.

Referred here on January 23rd, 2025.

February 20th, 2025, it was tabled.

March 19th, 2025, a vote was taken to determine that the property is not needed for the municipal purposes.

And a vote that the city offer the property for lease.

Vote for that the purchasing department proceed with issuing the RFP and a vote took place that the city also offered the property for potential sale.

And it remained in committee.

3B was a communication mayor Mitchell to the City Council in conjunction with the request for proposals draft.

For the redevelopment of a portion of the municipally owned whaling city golf course as an advanced manufacturing campus, AMC, requesting that the Committee on City Property vote to authorize the planning department to conduct an appraisal of the property being contemplated for potential disposition and authorize the planning department to conduct a survey of all city departments to determine whether the property is needed for municipal purposes.

It was referred to on the 23rd of January 2025.

February 20th, 2025, a vote to authorize the planning department to conduct an appraisal of the property being contemplated for potential disposition.

A vote that the Committee on City Properties send a communication to all city departments to determine whether the property is needed for municipal purposes.

It was tabled.

On March 19th, 2025, a vote was taken to determine that the property is not needed for municipal purposes.

A vote took place that the city offer the property for lease.

A vote took place that the purchasing department proceed with the IRF with the RFP, and a vote took place at the city also offer the property for potential sale, and it remained in committee.

3C.

Here's a proposal.

Motion receive and place a file.

By Councillor Pereira, seconded by Councillor Pemberton.

All in favor?

Aye.

Opposed?

The ayes have it.

Items three, three A, three B, three C.

Without Mr.

Chairman, we could proceed and place on the file.

No.

All we need to do is receive and place on file.

At this time.

Is that made by you?

Second.

All those in favor?

Well, the motion motion received and place on file.

The RFD by Council Pereira, seconded by Councillor Abrew.

All in favor?

Aye.

Aye.

Opposed?

The ayes have it.

Come on, Neil.

Yeah, he's going to speak.

Thank you.

He's going to speak first.

I'll have uh Neil come up in uh speak in reference to this.

Thank you, Chairman Oliver.

Thank you, Mr.

Oliver.

And the uh members of the committee.

Uh the advantage of coming to the mic after Josh Amaral is that it becomes pre-adjusted.

Thank you, Josh.

We're here to recommend a selection of the bidder pursuant to the RP that uh was just described.

And if the committee is agreeable uh to the recommendation of the evaluation committee, uh we would seek permission to begin to negotiate a uh purchase and sale agreement uh and or a development agreement.

Um I thought I would just offer a few words uh before we get into the presentations uh about where we are with the project uh for new counselors and for the the public.

This is ten years, nearly ten years uh in the making.

Uh there have been we've been through a pandemic, we've been through uh drastic change in the capital markets related to the Ukraine war, which impacted the the project.

Uh throughout that, we've uh we are appreciated the collaboration that we've had with the committee and with the council together.

We passed the home rule petition that addressed all of the Article 97 uh challenges associated with the site.

Uh we passed a zoning ordinance specific to the site.

Uh and over the past year we've been engaged in a uh refined RFP effort.

Uh so we are glad to be here uh tonight for an important procedural step.

I would uh uh add to that that there is nothing binding about uh the council votes uh tonight.

Uh the work that proceeds following any uh permission we receive from the from the committee tonight uh would require us to come back to the committee and the full council uh to present the draft purchase and sale agreement or development agreement.

Uh the council and the committee have full approval authority over that.

So what we are seeking tonight is simply simply the permission to continue uh to work with a prospective uh uh developer uh if the proposal is uh uh selected.

Um with that, uh I just I do want to acknowledge uh some of the support and the partners that we've had.

Uh the multiple administrations at the state level have supported this project.

Uh we've received, I think, two site readiness grants uh from mass development.

We've also, more recently in the fall, the Hilly Administration committed a $600,000 mass works grant to allow us to continue design and plan for the project.

Um we are uh at present uh we are uh um reluctant to engage in the use in using those funds until we have a development uh prospect uh sit across the table.

You know that we've we've designed this project uh uh we we've invested significant resources in designing uh the project using the previous state grants, uh, but at this point uh to further design and plan for the project is designed and planning for its own sake.

So we're really looking to have a development entity across the table so that we can begin to both uh negotiate the purchase and sale and to do the necessary design work that still needs to uh uh to happen.

Um locally, I just I do want to acknowledge the town of Dartmouth and the Dartmouth Natural Resources Trust, which are partners to us in resolving the Article 97 issues related to the project, and certainly the entire New Bedford delegate the legislative delegation has been critical in their support, uh which has been unanimous.

Uh on the city side, the number of departments here tonight, as well as a number of consultancies that uh have advised us, um, uh including Robert McNeil from Northeast Golf Company to address the golf course related issues.

Uh NIC Consulting has worked with us on the design layout and engineering uh geotechnical work.

And here tonight we will be receiving presentations from RD consultants, which has been our advisor on the RFP, uh, as well as CBRE uh appraisal services, which conducted the appraisal that you'll hear from uh you'll be hearing from them tonight.

I also want to acknowledge the evaluation uh team, which consists of a number of city departments, including the chair.

We've invited as in his capacity as ward counselor, we invited uh council uh all of score the proposal uh as well.

And so tonight from the EDC on the evaluation committee was Derek Santos, Jennifer Carloni, the city planner, um, uh Josh Amarall uh from community development uh and Marley Gilfeather uh Rodriguez as well supported us at purchasing throughout the RFP process.

Uh so with that with all of that said, um what I would suggest to the chair and the members of the committee is that I think the first order of business that we would like to brief you on are matters related to the uh appraisal of the property.

Um I suggest that because I I think it would be uh helpful, it would be in the city's interest uh to be able to present that in an executive session to preserve our ability to negotiate with the prospective uh partner.

Uh and so with that uh I would ask the the chair to consider that and we can move on.

We can either do that at the beginning of the meeting or we can do that some point further on.

But I think it's best uh addressed up front, and then we can move into charters presentation and the substance of their proposal.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Mr.

Mell.

Uh Council Abrock.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

At this time, I make a motion to move that the committee go into executive session for the specific and exclusive purpose of discussing value and pricing of the property that may need to be negotiated as part of this transaction in order to accommodate various contingencies that may need to be built into the contract for the purchase consistent with the open meeting exemption under General Law Chapter 30A, Section 21 subsection A6, and further that the committee will reconvene an open public session following said executive session.

Okay.

Motion made by Councillor Abro.

Second by Council Pereira.

All in favor?

Need a roll call vote.

Sorry.

Two new executive session, Council Abroom.

Yep.

Yes, Council Abrew, Councilor Carney.

Yes.

Yes, Council Carney, Council Choquett.

Yes.

Yes, Council Choquett, Councillor Gomes?

Yes.

Yes, Council Gomes, Council Loebs.

Yes.

Yes, Council Lopes, Council Oliver?

Yes.

Yes, Council Oliver, Council Pemberton?

Yes.

Yes, Council Pemberton, Council Pereira?

Yes.

That passes.

That passes out.

Council Roy, I'm sorry.

Yes.

Sorry about that.

Okay.

Okay.

Okay.

All right.

We're going to uh enter into executive session at this time and we will reconvene for public session after what we hear from uh the executive session is over.

Gus, would you please pause the recording?

We are back.

We are back from executive session at seven fifty-three p.m.

Um no, I think that we're gonna have a presentation now.

Is this one?

Yeah.

So what do you have?

What do we have?

A lot of a lot of technical stuff.

Right, I believe Charter is passing along uh some information.

Can I get a motion to receive and place that on file?

Uh and also no, this is another one.

And the um I believe this one as well is a different one.

I need to go.

Motion motion made by Councillor Lopes, seconded by Council Gomes.

All those in favor?

Opposed?

The ayes have it.

Thank you.

So both of these were received by Councillor Lopes?

And Gomes.

Thank you.

I believe Charter is now going to give us a presentation when they have it up there.

You know what?

I can plug it right into here.

As if government TV wasn't already boring here.

I don't have cable for that.

Okay.

I think we're are we good?

All right.

We're going to have uh members from uh Charter um come and give us a brief presentation.

If whoever comes up to the microphone, if they can just give their name for the record before they speak, that'd be greatly appreciated.

Thank you.

All right.

Well thank you.

Uh good evening, members of uh the city council.

Uh my name is Robert Delholm, and I am the uh president and CEO of the Charter Companies, Charter Development and Charter Contracting Company.

Uh we appreciate the opportunity to be here this evening just to walk through uh excerpts of our proposal.

Um it's really a privilege to be here and to be considered as a long-term partner to the city.

This isn't just about a transaction, this is about a collaboration to deliver certainty of outcome on uh on a project that's been long planned and and thought through by the city.

Uh with me this evening is Mason Sandel, uh principal of charter development, and uh Lucas Cohen uh development associate at Charter Development.

Yeah, thank you for having us.

Uh again, I'm Mason Sandel with uh Chartered Development.

And the uh the handout that we've uh passed around in this presentation is really just an extract from the RFP itself.

There's no new information being presented here.

It's everything that's in the uh the proposal.

And so uh what what uh what we thought we'd do is tell you a little bit about charter so you know who we are, uh tell you about our team, uh give you a flyover of our development concept, talk a little bit about timelines, potential timelines.

Um uh address the project sources and uses of funding, which is a critical element.

And then uh certainly want to leave time for questions from from from everybody.

So we'd organize it um that way.

So just uh a word on charter.

We're we're 30 years in business.

And uh at our heart, uh we are a brownfield redevelopment firm with uh an affiliated uh civil construction, environmental remediation, and regulated materials management capability.

Um each part of our business can and does uh go to market independently, but when we're able to combine those capabilities, we find we're able to deliver some really unique solutions to some of the most challenging Brownfield sites uh in in New England.

We're headquartered in Boston, but our focus is and our and our and our real passion is in developing projects in the Commonwealth's great gateway cities.

Um we're active right now in Everett.

We're part of the ownership team that uh acquired the former ExxonMobil uh oil terminal, the 95 acres.

Uh uh the Davis companies are the general partners there, making great progress there, turned over one of the first phases uh just uh at the end of last year.

We're the uh named redeveloper in Brockton for the Trout Brook URP and making great project uh progress there.

And recently just turned over a uh a signature waterfront park.

For the city of Lynn, uh 30 acres on the waterfront, the former landfill and an MGP site.

So again, it's our passion to tackle projects uh like this.

And we're uh we're looking forward to partnering with the city to deliver uh uh a really special project here.

So with that, just a uh just a quick overview of our team.

So charter development is gonna uh uh function as the master developer and working with the city.

Um charter contracting, our uh contracting arm will handle the site work, any remediation.

Uh it's a significant earth moving project, as you're probably well aware.

Um VHB are uh uh a well-known a blue chip engineering firm that we've worked with on on many occasions, and they'll be doing site civil and uh a lot of the environmental permitting.

Uh Dane Torpe, we've worked with for well over a decade on a number of very challenging projects.

And CBRE uh is our commercial broker and uh doing tenant outreach and looking at the follow-on uh vertical phase.

So finally, uh yeah, Anderson Strategic Advisors is a uh an advisory firm that we've worked with to uh help secure public funding uh from a number of sources on a number of projects, and and they're uh they're very well regarded.

So our development concept is uh uh to tackle the project in in two phases, uh ultimately delivering uh approximately 1.1 million square feet of advanced manufacturing buildings uh over two phases in support of the city's goals for redevelopment as well.

Uh phase one is six hundred thousand square feet.

Uh it's just under 40 acres, and it um it's uh comprised of uh you know this is a preliminary conceptual outline, but uh we think it's illustrative.

Uh a new road coming off a Hathaway Road and uh 600,000 total square feet.

Um importantly, to to implement phase one, there's a significant earth-moving component.

And there's about 300,000 cubic yards of material that needs to be regraded on site, uh of which about a hundred thousand yards needs to needs to leave the site to deliver a pad ready condition.

Um that's where phase two we think is integral to the overall project.

Phase two ultimately another 500,000 square feet following phase one.

Uh phase two will require potentially 700,000 cubic yards of imported material to get to a pad ready condition to support follow-on redevelopment.

This is the original timeline from the RFP.

I think we're just uh you know, this this process is obviously well underway.

We're we're probably six months behind what what you know again.

This is from last May, right?

But illustratively, I think the relationships time time timeline-wise still hold, you know, contemplating a uh you know being named, you know, uh shortly, you know, we'd be able to get to ideally a closing, probably by by uh Q3.

Um there is some question about sort of overall timing of a closing relative to the MEPA process.

I think this shows us uh closing first and then running through the MEPA process.

There's a there's a case that uh that the closing could be delayed to the end of that process.

Um but that's uh but that's uh uh to be determined you know upon selection.

These are the illustrative sources and uses for the total project uh for the land development phase of the project.

Uh three-year total, approximately 12 million dollars each of sources and uses on the sources side.

You know, Charter is prepared to commit uh six million dollars of uh its own equity to tackle the project.

Uh we think an another six at a minimum uh via public funding via a MassWorks grant.

Um on the uses side, the the primary use that we see is related to the earth work and getting the site ready.

And you know, we've got a we've got a line here for earth work, 3.2 million that's to handle the 300 plus thousand cubic yards that it's gonna take to grade the site to a pad ready condition.

Um notably I think one of the impediments to development around the earthwork, you know.

I think it a traditional vertical only developer would have a hard time doing this work for the $3 million, and moreover, the 100,000 cubic yards that would need to leave the site, that's about 200,000 tons.

You know, this is soil you know coming from a former golf course, so potentially if it goes off-site, that could represent a price tag uh for off-site T and D of you know potentially five, five million dollars or so.

So that's just a lens through which to look at the uh the uh the potential uses.

So I'll pause there and Bob, if you'd like to kind of add any detail or we can keep going.

Summary of benefits.

This is both phases combined.

You know, we see you know 800 to uh 1,000 permanent jobs at full build-out, you know, 2 and a half million dollars a year property taxes, and then uh during the construction phase, 650 to 800 construction jobs.

So that's the high-level flyover.

We're certainly happy to get into more detail on any of the components that we uh that we hit today.

Thank you.

Sure.

Uh colleagues?

Council Pereira.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Um whoever can answer this.

As far as uh what is uh uh lead times to acquiring MassWorks grants, how long does that usually take?

And what is the uh confidence level in obtaining and getting awarded the grants?

I think a lot of the uh work has already been done.

The city has really jumpstarted the process through its initial application.

Um so we would anticipate that that process um will have the ability to be accelerated from the State's perspective once a developer has been designated, it really does then breed confidence.

So we would think in the next application cycle that would have a level of success.

Um the MassWorks grant lately has been a little bit uh dynamic in terms of how it is being administered.

Um but I think that once uh a developer is selected, we collaborate with the city in the next application cycle.

Um I would expect that to be a successful application.

A lot of good work has already been done within the MassWorks program to position the project well.

Thank you.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Thank you, Mr.

Council Pereira.

Chair recognizes Councillor Abram.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Good evening, gentlemen.

Just a quick question.

And uh uh my friend from Ward One was also mentioning it, and it was a question I was going to ask.

Your construction jobs, um, and you said about 800, correct, and the scale, correct?

Um you anticipate.

The contractors you use, do they utilize union labor?

It's typically a mix, and we would say we would adhere to the uh New Bedford Works policy program.

Good.

Because we're a union town here, so I just wanted to get that, you know.

Absolutely.

Okay, good.

You're on the record, okay?

Thank you.

All right, Mr.

Chairman, I'll yield.

Thank you.

Thank you, Councillor Abreu.

Chair recognizes Council Loebs.

So I'm going to stay with that same line of questioning.

Since it will no longer be a city project.

Since it won't be a city project, there's no need for the city REO.

So would you your other projects, have you put a PLA on your other projects?

We haven't necessarily had to have a PLA.

There has been a PLA in one of the projects that we participated in, and that was part of the Everett Wynne Casino.

Uh wouldn't expect that a PLA would be needed on a project like this.

Um our uh stated commitment to uh the city has been to still adhere to the policy.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Yes, thank you.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Thank you, Council Loops.

Anyone else?

Council Golmes.

Thank you very much.

Um I like to go back to um the construction jobs.

You say 650 to 800 jobs.

How do you come to that conclusion, not knowing what has been sold, what is going to come?

Where do you get the numbers from?

Maybe you will be educating me, sir.

You know, a lot of it is uh using historical uh figures that come from published worked examples.

So when you are looking at the square footage to be constructed over a period of time in conjunction with the site work to be undertaken, there's a lot of um just uh public documents filed that provide really strong rules of thumb to apply to it.

So this would have been generated utilizing those manuals, prior experience based off of the square footage, uh, the site work area and the period of time for performance.

Could you answer the question on how you come to the conclusion of 800 to 1,000 jobs not having any concrete um commitment?

It's um the estimate is based off of the concept in the manner that it's been outlined.

So it's really um driven by the square footage that we've stipulated in the period of time to construct that square footage.

So it is it has assumptions built into it and it assumes that those buildings of that square footage will be built in that period of time, and that is then the number of required workers.

So it is not um and to clarify, it's not our uh those don't tend to be um our estimates, those come from published reference manuals that are well established in terms of of uh establishing uh total number of workers required.

Okay, so then uh 800 to 1,000 jobs could possibly not be 800 to 1,000 jobs at the completion of the project, it could be 650.

I'm not I'm sorry, sir.

I don't um I didn't understand the question.

Um I'm going based on your answer just now as uh where you get these numbers from Oh, I apologize.

I was referencing the construction jobs.

I think that's the same.

Okay, I had jumped to the permit jobs within again it's it's uh those number of jobs is also predicated on the intended use under the advanced manufacturing campus, the zoning and what the likely uses are, the square footage of the buildings, and again there's um just public reference manuals that would tell you for planning purposes the estimated number of jobs to be created.

Um so if the project were smaller, or if uh if there were an end user that the city uh was really excited about, uh if there was a local company that was growing um but it had a uh a use within the uh advanced manufacturing campus, but it had a different employee ratio, that would certainly affect it.

Um so today everything is just us applying um industry standard rules of thumb based off of the programming that's been provided.

I'm glad you just pointed out what you pointed out uh as far as the numbers are concerned and where they get them and possibly expansion from other uh uh companies within the city of New Bedford.

I wouldn't want to see the City of New Bedford develop a area and leave another area vacant for us to work at, if you understand what I mean.

That's that's been done before.

That that flip has been done before where um you're gonna build out or whatever, but then I'm losing what I have somewhere else to go to that new site.

I I what did I really accomplish?

I might have accomplished an additional hundred jobs, but I left a large-scale building vacant now to do something with it.

Understood, sir.

Yes.

Thank you very much.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Thank you.

Does anybody else have anything for charter?

Okay without a chair recognizes Council Pereira.

Thank you.

Just really quick on the tax revenues, uh, the estimated value.

That's based off of current assessing values in the system.

Yes, I think so.

Correct.

So as those values and stuff uh change over time, those delayed so you should uh the estimates, yeah.

Okay.

Very good.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Thank you, Mr.

Pearl.

Uh anybody else?

Without objection?

Some questions from the chair?

Without objection.

Thank you.

Uh thank you, gentlemen.

Um I have uh first off some concerns.

Obviously, you spoke about uh the uh extent of this project.

Would this be uh your biggest undertaking, your most uh I guess uh earth-moving, if you will, undertaking that you guys are taking on, or are there other projects I know you spoke about Everett and things like that.

Um are they similar to this?

Is this a completely different animal?

Uh I would um it's a good question.

No, I would say that this uh project in scope and scale um really sits squarely in our wheelhouse in terms of um, you know, really in all aspects, certainly in the technical elements of the work that has to be done, but I think more so in the spirit of uh we tend to be very selective about the projects that we take on.

Um we take on projects on a very strategic basis with engaged municipalities, because it really it's it's not only about the technical work being done, but it's really about having a partnership and collaborating with the city.

And so when we target a project to pursue like this one, we're really um committing and going all in because delivering certainty of outcome and delivering a successful project to the city is is really our priority.

And so the technical work is squarely um in our area of expertise.

Um the regulatory and the entitlement component we're really comfortable with.

And I think that the thing that we do best candidly, and we do the physical work uh really well is that partnering and collaborating to get to the outcome that the city endeavors.

Okay.

And I'm glad that you brought up collaborating.

And obviously there's a tenant that's there now with the municipally owned golf course.

Your uh relationship with prior um, you know, uh or adjacent tenants that you've done projects with.

Um I'm not I'm hoping that you guys will be understanding on how those folks are still want to be able to use the recreation that they've been accustomed to.

Uh could you speak about a little bit of the collaboration that you're looking to do while that uh project is going on and the remaining parcel of the golf course is still being utilized?

Yes.

I mean, I think that uh spirit of collaboration has already started.

I had the privilege of touring the golf course and uh having uh able to spend some time and so we would continue.

I think um this project um has has been long developed and so much hard work has gone to getting it to the point that it's in that all the stakeholder engagement and I think the cooperation is there, and so the foundation is there for us to come in and just continue to do that and and work very closely with the golf course to make sure that everything is done in an efficient and coordinated manner.

Okay.

And with this type of development, do you guys have partnerships with folks that are already kind of looking for this type of thing, or is it gonna kind of be a build it and they will come type?

Is it you're gonna put the pads up and then look for folks?

Or how how does or are certain pads going to be built around some uh interested entities?

Well, I think it's that's uh that's a really good question.

I would say um it's a little bit of both.

So we've already started having conversations out in the marketplace.

Um it's still premature, but you can never start too early.

So that would continue, and we would do that in a cooperative manner with, you know, recognizing that um it would be our uh primary responsibility, but we would also want to make sure that we're working in a really integrated manner with the city.

I mean, the city has a long track record of attracting really high quality and prospective uh businesses and enterprise to uh to the area.

So we would continue with that.

Um it's really what happens on a site like this is um uh it doesn't it doesn't become real until until you start getting buckets in the ground.

And so um everything up until this point is there's interest, let's talk about the location, let's look at the zoning.

Um and so we would continue to be um having market outreach, uh particularly through CBRE and cooperation with the city.

Um and then you know, the typical flight path on a project like this is you start to you start to create awareness, you start to create visibility, um you try to cultivate interest to the extent that you can, but until permits are in place and buckets are in the ground, it's really hard to get that firm interest, but we would be starting right from the beginning.

And in fact, we started, you know, probably a year or 18 months ago already having conversations.

Okay.

Has there uh been any community outreach that you guys have tried to do thus far with just the general public or anything like that, or is it just all talks have been with the administration as of as of late?

It it's um I would say that the communication has really been limited to um the square corners of the procurement and RFP process.

Okay.

And uh you talked about fill, um, a substantial amount of fill.

Where would that type of fill be coming from?

And um just because uh I assume that you guys will use proper fill, but just some ideas of where this it will be coming from.

Sure.

No, it's uh I mean it's such a you know uh as we all know it's very, very regulated, and so um because of the nature of the site and its current existing conditions, it would all be clean fill source from you know many different projects and locations.

Um we really do believe in the integrated phase one, phase two project because you know we feel like it's gonna deliver the long-term value to uh to the city and to the region by integrating those two projects.

Um it would be very difficult to do phase two at a later date in particular, as Mason pointed out.

Um there is a um there's a there's a uh a surplus of material on phase one that could be utilized in phase two and then really start to unlock the value there.

So it would be um it would be a very uh highly regulated and scrutinized process in terms of how site development activities would take place, and again, that's squarely in our area of expertise.

Okay.

And then I I'll have I have one final question, and then I'll see if my colleagues have any others.

And then I I'll have I have one final question and then I'll see if my colleagues have any others um the um amenity space that was talk about an amenity space in there is that gonna truly be a public space what's the idea of that space uh the RFP had outlined uh some of the intended uses of that amenity space and so I think for today um it's envisioned to be in conformance with um what was uh uh outlined in the RFP process and it's just it's so early um that it's really difficult to tell but it was clear that that was important and so we preserved it and uh really stayed committed to it.

Okay.

Um well thank you uh uh colleagues and uh counselor Golmes.

Thank you Mr.

Chairman just uh triggered me off when we talked about the soil and what you're taking out and what you bring in uh there is a way of using some of what's there and cleaning it and to use for your pad so we you won't be trucking everything out of there correct did we did I understand you correctly I like that idea.

I am not I'm a professional as you are but the the less truck traffic and movement that we would have with this project would be great.

And when you talked about tons of soil being taken and you're saying that um you can use some of the surplus materials from phase one would go to help enable the phase two project.

And that would be getting cleaned and whatever on site or whatever the process is it it would um our assumption going into it is that that material is clean and suitable for reuse.

For reuse it's just a matter of movement.

Yes sir thank you very much sir.

Thank you Mr.

Chairman Thank you Counselor Gomes anyone else for um charter what is it charter no speak with anybody else any of our invitees we've got it's a rare opportunity we got everybody here and the golf course right okay all right thank you gentlemen thank you what's the uh guy standing at the name please name and uh uh can we have your name for the record please yes uh Andrew Andrew Julian with R D consultants okay yeah Andrew Julian yeah okay and we've already received and placed that on file as well so you have a brief presentation for us?

Yes.

Yeah thank you.

So um as I said my name's Andrew um I was the project manager um for the uh procurement process and the real estate advisory work that we did um for this uh AMC RFP project.

Um quick background on uh RD.

Uh we're a real estate and transportation advisory firm uh locally based firm in Massachusetts we've um done a lot of these different disposition processes for municipalities in Brockton in Medford and Malden um kind of all over the place and um so we came into the project and provided um some background on kind of the procurement strategy uh and creation um for this project and we helped develop kind of a robust marketing plan um to get it pushed out um to as many folks as we could we worked really closely with the planning department the purchasing department to make sure everything was kind of square in the parameters of what the um RFP uh was supposed to say and uh made sure that uh it was following a lot of the city's goals uh and objectives uh for the site so it's just a quick background um so I'll try to go through this kind of high level because I think some of y'all know a little bit about the procurement process.

So um we we came into the project we decided to do kind of a two-tiered procurement approach.

We did an RFI and an RFP.

Once we got to that you know RFP standpoint um we um pulled together an evaluation committee uh that evaluation committee was able to review the proposals do um independent scoring come together as a team to provide that recommendation to the council tonight um and uh as a part of that process too we did conduct an interview um during that interview process it was really a good opportunity for the evaluation committee to kind of get out any questions they had for clarification uh meet the team you know in person um get a feel for who they are things like that so it was a really important pro uh component of the process um and then that brings us to today where we're here um uh you know post you know post-RFP process looking to make uh just the recommendation to uh to y'all um for um uh an award uh component so just to cover the proposal scoring um a lot of this was covered in in in charter's pro um uh uh presentation but they they talked they they answered the RFP uh in a manner that was that met both our our two components of the evaluation

And then that brings us to today where we're here, you know, post you know, post-RFP process, looking to make uh just the recommendation to uh to y'all for um uh an award uh component.

So just to cover the proposal scoring, um a lot of this was covered in in charter's um uh uh presentation.

But they they talked, they they answered the RFP uh in a manner that was that met both our our two components of the evaluation criteria.

So we had a part A that was uh you know the minimum qualifications, which was really mostly mostly a pass-fail sort of um uh positioning, and then the comparative evaluation criteria, which really focused on you know, either highly advantageous all the way down to um you know an unacceptable proposal or not advantageous.

And so I think the big the big thing to take away here is that I think for the most part, every evaluation committee member um highlighted a highly advantageous scoring in those components, and those components included, you know, tell us what your um you know program development is, uh give us a narration, give us a description of what you feel the site is gonna be uh you know upon completion.

Give us um an impact analysis, tell us what you expect the annual tax revenues to be, tell us what you think the job creation is going to be.

Um then uh we asked them about the budgets and the financing structure.

Tell us what your sources and uses are, um, tell us how you propose that um the structure will will come together uh upon uh upon a purchase.

Um so that was those are kind of like the main components.

Um those components they answered thoroughly and in depth and in line with a lot of the um goals and objectives that were outlined at the beginning of the RFP process.

So we kind of highlighted some of these.

Um I think I want to get right into, yeah.

So we're just gonna provide, you know, from RD's perspective, just an overall kind of objective um review and analysis of you know what we saw from the proposal.

Um there's kind of five main pillars here that we pulled out, but I really want to focus on like the the three the three pillars kind of in the middle there.

Uh the qualls and experience, the financial capacity, and just the partnership approach on the calls and experience.

Um what we saw was Charter, Charter is a very niched firm that seeks out these types of sites and these types of projects in communities like New Bedford.

And I think it reached an audience, you know, that really wanted to take a bite at the Apple for this type of work, that type of work being uh you know, a site that's just a little bit more complex in terms of you know topography.

Uh they talked about the earth moving um items that you know didn't need to be done, and that's something that is really in their wheelhouse.

In terms of the financial capacity, uh the independent patient capital, I would say is a big, big component that we saw in their proposal.

Independent being you know, they're coming to the table with dollars, right?

They're not you know having other shareholders uh that they need to call to for when it comes to you know this this piece of the project, at least at this point.

Um and the patient capital in terms of uh you know, they see this as the long-term project.

You know, they're not seeking to get the funds in and out immediately.

Uh and that was something that was very clear once we uh had the interview process uh as well.

And then the partnership approach, uh you heard a lot from them tonight on that.

I think just the framework and the mindset that they speak from in terms of really bringing the city in as a collaborative partner, the state as a collaborative partner, um, and other local you know organizations and communities as a part of the community engagement process, that really stood out to us in terms of their um their proposal.

So those are the kind of the three big ones to highlight there.

Um the other thing.

So I'll kind of breeze through this because you saw some of these numbers already, but just an objective review of the components that we pulled out, economic impact, the two and a half million dollars.

Um I think the total budget, if I remember correctly, I might have had the numbers um changed up, but uh uh estimated $500 million in private investment uh over the course of both phases was it was a big component of that.

Uh the job creation numbers, 800 to uh thousand in the permanent jobs, and then the um uh 650 to 800 in the construction jobs.

Um this environmental and more so on the infrastructure value.

I just kind of want to highlight the the superior experience with these types of sites.

Um having the equipment, having the staff, having the brilliant team that they've pulled together to execute um on this type of a project is really something that is is invaluable to you know a site of this size too.

Um and then the community benefits um, you know, supporting uh you know the local unions and uh abiding by a lot of the uh the uh new Bedford Works policies that's uh that's been put out.

And then the community benefits, you know, supporting uh you know the local unions and uh abiding by a lot of the uh the uh new Bedford works policies that's uh that's been put out.

So I think next slide.

So the next actually I'll I'll say the next two slides are really aerial shots.

Uh the one thing I just want to call out on this slide in particular is the golf course will be reconfigured to retain its existing 18-hole play.

Um that was something that was consistent with um the RFP's request and in their proposal, and I know that's been in um continued conversations too, uh as well.

So I just want to highlight that as a component.

But I'll stop there if anybody has any questions about the procurement process or any questions for us.

Colleagues, your uh any questions?

No, okay.

Thank you.

Thank you very much.

Golf course.

On behalf of the evaluation committee.

Okay.

Sorry, just give me a moment.

So I wasn't a member of the evaluation committee.

It was Chairman Oliver, Derek Santos, um, Neil Mello, Jen Carloni, and Josh Amrol.

But I speak on behalf of them that the evaluation team unanimously recommends a word to charter development for all of the reasons already discussed.

Um to recap in awarding to charter, the taxed revenue goal will be met.

The jobs goal will be met.

Charter has robust experience, including in working with municipalities and on municipally owned properties.

They have worked on sites that are topographically complex, such as this one.

Their team is comprised of leaders in their respective fields, and they have patient capital, as has been mentioned, and they're comfortable with a long-term ROI.

Um they've partnered also um not only is their team comprised of leaders in their field, but they've also partnered with um like VHB and Anderson as discussed and their leaders in their fields as well.

So does anyone have any questions about the procurement process or on behalf of the evaluation team?

Colleagues?

No.

Seeing none.

Thank you, Molly.

Thank you.

Uh we have a representative from the golf course here.

Anybody want to talk about that?

Or about that group.

Council Prior, do you have a question?

Uh if there's more to the presentation, I'll yield Mr.

Chairman.

I do have general questions.

I don't know who can answer them, but uh whatever your discretion is.

Okay, I think there is a member from the golf course uh design team that would like to have them come up briefly and so sorry.

I'm sorry, our golf course consultants is here.

Yes, yes.

Robert McNeil, the Northeast Golf Company, Golf Course Architect.

Thank thank you.

Um I just wanted to uh again, because it's been a while.

Uh could you just talk about um the what the the uh the envisionment of the golf course is because uh initially it was gonna be nine holes and it's eighteen.

Now we've got the commitment that it is gonna be eighteen holes.

I just wanted to kind of talk in uh about the for the general public and the users of that golf course, um what type of impact that um they're gonna be under during the reconstruction of the that course.

Sure, sure.

It's always been the intent of the team here to get back to a quality 18-hole golf course.

Uh it's got some history to it as a 1920 Donald Ross golf course.

There's some great pieces and bones to the golf course that we've tried to capture in our process of design.

But uh the challenge was getting it from nine or eighteen back to nine back to eighteen over the course of the phasing of the uh development of the adjacent property.

And that's what we've done, and that's what's represented in this RFP and then this plan that you see on the screen here now.

Uh as far as impact goes, there's going to be some impact relative to the timing of the phasing of the adjacent property.

That's really what it comes down to.

I think there's holes that we can build that are not impacting the golf course at all.

Ultimately there's going to be two to four new holes or pieces of holes on the golf course to reconfigure it as an 18hole golf course.

But the impact will again be dictated by the activity adjacent to the to the golf course.

Phase one encumbers essentially holes one, two, and three in the practice facility right away if that's going to be impacted then we're going to have to replace those holes as quickly as possible.

But just taking those holes out of play is going to result in a quality nine hole golf course in the meantime as we develop the new holes which you can see which are the darker green holes or the new holes on the golf course, the lighter green holes on the planet you see are the existing holes in the golf course.

So there is a sequence uh we can build a couple of these holes uh independently of disturbing the golf course at all but overall it is a it is probably a two season sequence of converting from 18 to 9 back to 18 and having a final 18hole quality project at the end.

Uh at any point during the project would the course have to close completely or can it stay in operation in your opinion throughout the entire development?

We believe it can stay open throughout throughout the entire process.

Okay as at least a nine hole course in that time correct okay thank you.

Colleagues any questions Okay Council Prairie I believe you had uh some questions for I don't know who can answer them.

I'll just direct them out and then whoever can jump up and answer.

All right.

Uh the first is just a request that um I'd like to see all money spent on attorneys, consultants and appraisals pertaining to the golf course to the to the to this project to the AMC.

How much has been spent on attorneys, consultants and appraisals external stuff not internal I can tell you that the I can't say you got to come to the microphone.

I am sorry just to address uh counselor uh outside consultants and attorneys that have been associated with the project uh the lion should the overwhelming share of those costs have been borne by the state grants that I had referenced there are two site writiness grants uh and we do have a mass uh works grant that we received in the fall administration that will be used uh going forward to pay for the engineering and the outside consultation if it's not too much trouble can that be shown how much has been covered by the with the CFO's office to develop a cost sheet on that sure okay perfect thank you.

If we were to so my next question, Mr.

Chairman uh if we were to move forward uh and and at some point this gets sold uh the PNS gets executed what what's going to happen with those funds?

Uh the the proposal before us in this case that we're gonna be voting on shortly is one is in the area of 1.8 million.

Uh all goes well that's what what will become of those funds?

Sure.

So our CFO uh Bob Edstrom is here and he can elaborate on this I'll give you the the the the quick overview.

The proceeds from the sale of real estate under mass uh law require it to be used in only a limited number of ways towards capital investments uh towards retiring uh existing debt and so we envision as I've talked about in the presentations that we've done in in the past we envision using the proceeds whenever they might come in to address the financing costs of uh uh of the city so between the proceeds and the additional tax revenues and Bob has done some modeling on this if you if you would like to get into it further uh we're gonna be in net positive territory um the the cost of financing the debt service and so forth that will be required to support the city's city's costs will which will be restricted only to the golf course where that's that's the city's responsibility all of the costs that you heard about for roads and infrastructure within the business park are going to be addressed uh by Charter and their commitment that they've um put into their proposal and Massworks grants.

So we expect somewhat of a windfall it from those proceeds that will help us pay for the investments that we're gonna be making on the golf course side.

Okay.

Can we hear from Bob if that's okay?

Or from Neil I don't know who Does anybody have any other questions for Neil Mellows?

I have more questions pertaining to this.

I don't know if Bob is more apt to answer to whoever but okay seeing none Bob would you mind?

Good evening.

Thank you Bob Council Pereira.

Thank you.

Bob good evening thank you.

So uh it was indicated that these funds will be restricted for use to specifically would be to for capital improvements or to retire debt?

Yeah, that's correct.

The state law doesn't allow us to spend, nor does our own charter allow us to spend proceeds from sales of assets on anything else.

And is that restricted to just retiring any debt the city has and any capital improvements?

Or is the spirit and the behind that law kind of surrounding whatever the proceeds were from?

Can you is there anything there on that?

Well, I will speak to the spirit, because that is the spirit, obviously, is to try to use the proceeds to s to take care of the next asset to replace the assets you have got planned, or service the debt on that asset.

I don't know if that is legally or literally the state law.

I would have to look that up.

But in this case here, uh with 1.85 million dollars coming in against the planned $8 to $10 million general obligation bond, uh it could go to best use servicing that debt.

Uh you know, we're we're in a position where we have a normal uh yield curve.

So serial, so a general obligation bonds or serial bonds, and you are issuing if you issue 20 years worth of bonds, you are actually issuing 20 separate bonds.

And uh someone who buys uh say the 2046 bond will be entitled to 40 coupon payments over the 20 years.

And those are gonna have very high interest rates, probably in a high fours right now.

My idea would be to use the $2 million uh $1.85 million dollars to pay down the last four or five years.

Which will have the highest.

The problem here is that the money is not coming in all at fr up front.

So I we may have to incur debt, which would then trigger um we would have to have call provisions in our bonds, and those are usually two percent.

It's gonna kind of wipe out a lot of what I was hoping to do.

So trying to find a way uh to best use these funds to get rid of the longer the last four or five years, which are gonna have the higher coupon rates, it brings down the net interest cost, the total interest cost.

And uh a quick model I did for Neil earlier today.

I could pretty much get about 3.8 to 3.9 uh 4.8 to 4.9 percent on the money right now, which is I'm sorry, I said that the wrong is 3.8 to 3.9.

So I can get about 50, 60, 70 basis points more by doing that than I could putting it in the bank or you know, certificate of deposit, treasury, short-term stuff, which is all we really can do.

Okay.

So that's probably the my recommended best use would be to get uh knock off the outer years of this general obligation bond.

Okay.

And then um so it seems like the conversations have been surrounding that you have had, and and Neil is the only can I can ask him, but is to utilize this money to directly go towards any any cost associated with the golf course?

That would be my recommendation to Neil.

Uh certainly there are other things that State Law probably let us do.

As I said, I commented on the spirit short of the law, and I'm not sure about the specifics.

Sorry.

That's okay.

I'm sorry.

I was I was just gonna add one of the things that we have talked about that we might uh explore and against again, this is Bob's area of expertise, but there may be when we come before the council to request the bond authorization uh to do the golf the golf course related uh work, there may be a way to add language to that bond authorization that directs the city to use uh to re for any proceeds that come in to be used to address the debt.

Now, the specific way we address the debt, uh we'll have to think through a little bit, but we might be able to write that right into the bond authorization that we will bring to the council.

Yeah, that would be Bob if you if possible, that actually would be very, very uh comforting to the I don't see any reason why we wouldn't do that if we could if we can.

Okay.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Thank you, Bob.

Thank you.

Thank you, Council Perr.

Chair recognizes uh Council Roy.

Can you remind the public or the council what we would bond?

Wouldn't we be the city's obligation if we went forward?

So the the uh the range that I've got with the slides that Neil has put together is $8 to $10 million, and that right now is basically for the for the relocation of the three holes uh of the golf course.

Most of that money is coming that way.

But there are some um modest renovations to the golf course clubhouse as well.

Not a full rehab, but a few hundred thousand dollars, I believe is what you had said, Neil.

Council has seen this in the past.

So with this kind of usage, I really probably could get 30 years out of the bond because I was concerned that it was mostly clubhouse renovations, and I don't think we were going to be able to get um get a a life's life expectancy certificate for more than say 20 years for a clubhouse, but what with this being much more permanent being earth movement, I think we could probably go 30 years, which would you know spread the payments more, but it gets us into you know even higher coupon rates when we get out to those last 10 years of serial bonds.

So we have uh we have uh a good fiscal advisor that can help us go through several alternatives though to sort of back up what I am saying or or probably or possibly steer me in a different direction.

Thank you.

Thank you, Council Roy.

Anybody else?

I have uh some questions if the body doesn't mind without objection.

Thank you, Bob.

Um although it will be going out for bond uh for the for this money uh based on uh the build-out and uh prospective um tax revenue, at what point would we not with the bonds, but would we kind of be at zero with that money coming in from the money that we've that we are we are putting out?

Even though the bonds will still be out there, we will be accruing some tax once this property gets you know developed.

Sure.

So you are saying the incremental tax?

Correct.

Um at what point will that um be enough on a year-to-year basis to cover the debt?

Correct.

Uh so you know I don't have uh a good idea of how we are going to go from fr first groundbreaking all the way to that $2.5 million.

A lot of it is going to depend on that.

I saw some uh some of the timelines, and there's three basic tracks that cover most of the 100,000 square feet.

Obviously the real dollars don't come in until beyond the pad ready stage where you have to actually get tenants and build out buildings.

Um it's kind of hard to say because of that.

Um I can I can tell you that uh the numbers I saw, I I need somewhere in the neighborhood of $300,000 or so, $300 to $400,000 a year for debt service.

That that's without the million eight five being brought in.

So if you get $2.5 million on the outer line, and I need $400,000, it will be earlier than later, but like I can't really get you much more specific than that right now.

All right.

Thank you.

Thank you, Bob.

Anyone else?

Chair recognizes Council Lopes.

Yeah.

And I know I think I know the answer.

So there's been no phase one as-built tax calculation of what the value would be, including equipment, the whole tax burden, what phase one, not phase two, because everything says that is going to be down the road and more expensive.

Have we done a break-even or an as-built cost evaluation of a phase one?

We'll look later at full build-out.

Uh I have not.

Um, oh, okay.

Sure.

Sure.

This is the most specific set I have seen on this.

It's uh there's a blended rate between uh the um the $70 and the office buildings at $116.76.

Uh and again, those are the assumptions.

The number actually comes out to closer to 2.5.

Uh I think the slide rounds it down to two million.

Uh but the timeline on that is not specified.

Um, so we have no idea if that's a full build out with phase one and phase two or just phase one.

Oh, I'm I'm sorry, that this is full building.

This is this is full.

Yeah.

So, uh $81 million valuation.

Could could we do a phase one tax evaluation?

Because realistically, phase two is going to take longer.

And if we're going to look at you know, short-term needs and cost expenditures, I would like to see just what it would look like at phase one, not a phase two build out.

It's very doable.

Perfect.

That's what I would like to see.

Sure.

Thank you, Bob.

Thank you, Neil.

Thank you, Chairman.

Thank you, Council Lopes.

Anyone else for Bob?

Seeing none, thank you, Bob.

Sure.

Does anyone else have any questions of the invitees?

If you would indulge me in speaking with uh uh engineer uh Sean Said.

Thank you.

Good evening, Mr.

Chair.

Thank you, Sean, for being here.

Quick question.

Um what involvement uh if this is if this group is selected, what involvement of uh infrastructure work is going to fall on the city, not only the city but city workers, or is this something that will if awarded that will be subbed out most of the infrastructure work?

The construction would be subbed out, um, presumably by charter or their their subcontractors who they who they work with.

The city's involvement would be reviewing their design drawings, engaging with the consultants, working through the MassWorks grant that uh DPI and planning collaborated on to uh to receive for the for the design.

Um ultimately we envision that this would be a city accepted street.

Uh so that um in the end, all of the um assets that are constructed as part of the project would be done so in accordance with all city requirements.

Okay.

Uh lighting, all that stuff.

Lighting, sewer, water, uh, telecommunications, everything.

Okay.

And does any of that work um is that any of that work gonna uh uh affect the uh operation of the golf course as far as utilities or things like access or anything like that as far as the plans that you have seen?

No, the way that we phased it is um and laid out the road.

You'll see that the main access road as it's currently planned, sort of loops around uh the golf course so that we can keep the parking lot for the golf course or build that and have that available um to golfers um without impacting their ability to access the clubhouse or the or the golf course, while the construction of the road that goes to the west can can proceed.

And no interruption with uh uh water or sewer or anything like that, or will there be mild interruptions to the golf course for that?

I mean there's always mild interruptions during construction, but we can always sequence it during downtime of the golf course, like during the winter.

Yeah, okay.

Awesome.

Thank you.

Um does anybody else have anything for the city engineer?

No, thank you.

Thank you for the great, thank you to Mr.

Chair.

Oh Council Gomes?

Oh, sorry.

I just think that uh slide is the total spoke to factors have this.

I am sorry.

This was this wasn't fine that microphone.

I'm sorry.

Counselor, the these uh this uh slide deck uh we had brought this just in case there were a question on this, but this is a slide deck that the council has seen a version of this several times before, but so um happy to talk more about it.

So you're telling me did I have this information already?

When we came before the council for the RFP, and I think uh even in the past we have been working, this is something that Dirk Santos and the in the city team developed, but this slide there's an entire slide deck which we just did some briefings for the new counselors on that, and that's where all of this information is coming from.

So we've had this for for some time now.

And we've shared it with the council for some time now.

Have we received a copy of that?

Well, in the past, yeah.

Um I think the last time we shared something like this was in the spring when we came last year.

Okay.

I just don't remember it.

Yeah, you know, it's a lot of material.

Okay.

We can recirculate this if that's uh if it's a help to folks, we can email it around to the to the council.

Thank you.

Sure.

If you can just give that to the to the office, just so anybody who needs it can get it.

No, I've got all of it.

Very good.

We'll do that.

Colleagues, any further questions from our invited guests?

All right.

Seeing none.

The Chair will uh entertain any motions at this time.

Chair recognizes.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

Uh at this point I would like to make a motion to move that the proposals submitted by Charter Development LLC is hereby selected as the successful proposal submitted pursuant to an RFP for the property known as 95.54 acres off of Hathaway Road at the municipality-owned golf course.

Municipality-owned whaling city golf course.

And I'll provide the language to the clerk.

Awesome.

Thank you.

So motion by Councillor Abril and seconded by Councillor Choquett on the question for Attorney Garetowski?

Okay.

Attorney Garitowski, when you have a moment?

Well, I'm waiting for Councillor Garotowski to make it to the podium.

Can I ask the maker the motion where that information was provided to him?

Through you to the counselor's question.

This was language submitted to us by our attorney, Attorney Garatowski.

It was in conjunction with the the city solicitor and our legal team and our our legal uh uh attorney is looking for the Okay, just wondering why some of us didn't get it ahead of time as they did.

Yeah, it was it was uh briefly before the the the meeting tonight in in work with uh both the city uh uh solicitor and our attorney.

Okay.

I appreciate privileged information being referred to the entire city council and not just the selected few, Mr.

Chairman.

Absolutely.

Thank you.

You don't need me now?

Well, I do need you, sorry.

Okay.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Attorney Garatowski.

The motion that uh Councillor uh uh the Councillor uh Abrew made uh accepted the proposal presented by charter.

I had a you know detailed all that.

Is that's authorizing the city to enter into a purchasing?

The first thing you're gonna do is you're gonna have one motion that would say we're approving we're selecting this proposal to be a winning proposal in the bid, right?

That's the first thing.

Once you do that, and now charter is the selected proposal, if that passes, then you would authorize the um administration to negotiate the purchase and sale agreement.

And that would remain in you they'd do that, the committee would do that.

It would remain in committee, and when something was structured, it would come back to the committee for its review.

So there's really um when the chair had asked me what would be the appropriate way way to proceed.

Um those were the two motions.

One motion is to select charter if that's what you want to do.

You don't have to, you can make any other motion you want.

Um, but if you're gonna do if you want to select charter, you would make a motion to do so, and then if that passes, then authorize um the administration to negotiate with them exclusively.

Um and then any any agreement uh development or purchase and sale agreement will come back to you for review, and then if you're satisfied with it, you would then send it to the council for it there for the council's final approval.

Very good.

Thank you very much, uh Attorney Garotowski.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

I yield it this time.

Thank you, Attorney Dorotowski.

So uh we have a motion that has been made and seconded.

Uh we will uh call I'll have the clerk call the roll.

Okay.

Yeah.

According the right vote.

Councillor Abreu?

Yes.

Yes, Councillor Abreu, Councillor Carney?

Yes.

Yes, Councillor Carney, Councillor Triquet?

Yes.

Yes, Councillor Triquette, Councillor Gomes?

Yes.

Yes, Council Gomes, Council Hopes?

Yes.

Yes, Council Hopes, Councillor Oliver?

Yes.

Yes, Council Oliver, Council Pemberton?

Yes.

Yes, Council Pemberton, Council Pereira?

Yes.

Yes, Council Pereira, Council Roy?

Yes.

That passes.

Nine to zero.

All right.

Motion passes nine to zero.

Okay.

I've if you have you got it.

I just I I make a motion to authorize the city to enter into a purchase and sales agreement with the selected proposal.

Uh motion made by Councilor Pereira, seconded by Councilor Abreu.

We'll take a call vote on that as well.

So the motion is that the City Property Committee authorize the mayor and the solicitor to negotiate the necessary contingencies.

Point of order.

It's just Mr.

Chair.

I I know that these motions are very litigious, and we have to get these exactly correct based on what our solicitor and what our legislative council have agreed on.

So I have the language that you were given that you're giving me as the vice chair.

So if Council Pereira's language is cool, then that's fine.

I just want to make sure we're absolutely correct, 100% by the book, so we don't have any follow-ups here.

I I withdraw my motion.

Okay.

Motion and withdraw and seconded by you and you follow the withdrawal.

I can withdraw, that's fine.

Okay.

So we'll recognize Councilor Abrew for on a motion.

Okay.

Um again through you to the to our body.

This was written by our solicitor and our legislative council.

The motion is move that the city property committee authorize the mayor and solicitor to negotiate necessary contingencies with any corresponding amendments to pricing and other necessary issues in order to execute the sale of the property substantially pursuant to the attached proposal and that a final purchase and sale agreement be submitted back to the committee for its review.

All right.

On a roll call vote, Councillor Abrew.

Yes, Councillor Abrew, Councillor Carney.

Yes.

Yes, Councillor Carney, Council Choquett?

Yes.

Yes, Councilor Choquett, Councillor Gomes?

Yes, Councillor Gomes, Council Lopes?

Yes, Councilor Hopes, Councillor Oliver?

Yes.

Yes, Council Oliver, Councillor Pemberton.

Yes.

Yes, Councilor Pemberton, Council Pereira?

Yes.

Yes, Council Pereira, Council Roy?

Yes.

Yes.

That passes 9 to 0.

Okay.

Motion passes 9 to 0.

Do we leave that on the table?

We leave that in committee.

It stays in committee.

Okay.

Seeing no further business in front of us.

Motion to adjourn.

Motion to adjourn by Councilor Roy.

Second by Councilor Pemberton.

Aye.

All in favor?

Aye.

All opposed?

The ayes have it.

We are adjourned at 902.