That was weird.

Yeah, I heard more.

Here.

Oh, Kane.

Here.

Chainer.

Here.

That's water standard.

Stand for a moment of silent career, followed by the Pledge of Allegiance.

Under the small library.

We have no proclamations.

We have no interviews, so we'll go to the consent agenda items two through 11 C.

You can consider to pass unanimously, unless a separate roll call vote is requested by a council member.

If you want to speak on an item, please come up as I read that item.

If you want to speak on an item not on the agenda, please come up under citizen concerns and always remember to state your feet for the record.

I'll move the consent agenda.

Second.

Two is a reading of the September 8th City Council minutes.

Three is a motion approving Drew Parvoo for the to the environmental advisory board.

Four is a resolution appointing Teresa Fitch's interim assistant city manager.

Five is a resolution awarding a purchase order to IState Truck Center for five vehicles with landscape dump and plow for the streets division.

Six are actions relating to street closures.

A is a resolution temporarily closing.

Sections of Grandview Boulevard and 13th Street on October 3rd for the Bishop Heel and Homecoming Parade.

B is a resolution temporarily closing various streets in the Morningside area on September 29th for the East High Homecoming Parade.

C is a resolution temporarily closing a section of West 19th Street on September 25th for the West High Homecoming Parade.

Mayor.

Yes.

I forgot.

I wanted to ask a question back on five.

Okay.

And Spiro, I don't know if this is a question for you or who would maybe be able to direct this to.

I look, I'm glad that we're getting trade-in on these vehicles.

I know nothing about the vehicles that we are as far as the numbers of what we're trading in on that.

Um but I did want I did wonder, you know, if these are 200,000 vehicles, is a good trade in value seven grand a piece.

I mean, it would would they get more at auction?

Do we not want to worry about that?

Again, I'm I'm ignorant.

I'm just asking the question.

I could probably I think Jeff these come with plows, you're selling them with the plows.

So first question.

Yeah.

Uh the value that we're getting on was about what I estimated.

Uh the engines with the amount of hours that they have on them plus the miles, really take them pretty much to their B10 life, their usable life before they need uh a major overhaul or rebuild.

Uh part two of that is the condition of the bodies themselves, are a little lackluster if you've seen them around.

Yeah.

So right where we're at is right where we got offered was what I would expect to get out of Gov deals in this situation.

Okay.

I I look like I said, I trust you, I'm just surprised that expensive a vehicle, and I understand we deal more on you know the the amount of hours and then the expectancy of you know 10 years or how after however often we want to rotate through, and I know we're not gonna just be upgrading just to upgrade, but it just seems like a pretty drastic difference in my opinion.

Um the only thing that I could yes contribute to maybe a higher uh trade offer would be the miles and conditioned overall when they're with their traded in.

But these are of course three, two, three years past what yeah, yeah, yeah.

You selling them with plows?

So these ones will come with plows.

Um thing that we've tried to do is try to get some uniformity across the fleet in just so far as the plows themselves.

So the style of plows that are on them now, we can't get any more.

If we have to repair some of the existing ones, we have to go out, have the parts fabricated and then reuse them.

So now everything starting since the I think it was the 2022s, all those plows forward will be the same moving on, so they can be interchanged between vehicles.

Which bothers the heck out of me because that means you got a single source.

Well, you do.

I mean, so now that next guy that bids are these guys the only is i state the only people that have access to that plow?

Because now we're buying I state trucks forever.

No, the plow the plows are actually um a little bit separate.

They're part of the body bid, and the mount is what's used by the state of Iowa, so it's a universal mount.

That's what I was gonna ask because I wondered if the mount specifically, if at least that was the same and you could buy different plows or the attachments.

So you actually have three different printers that will make that.

Cool.

And then really the plow is the same except the attachment type, and they all make a universal depending on what width you want.

I don't know how bad those trucks are, but there's a I mean, I do subscribe to municipal bid deal, and seven's awful cheap, but I think you'd almost get that for scrap.

That I cannot say.

I have not scrapped one out yet, so I don't know what uh and the delivery doesn't happen until next spring.

April 6th because or April 6, April.

Uh 14 years old.

Right.

And so far as the two bids, there was only there's only two OEMs that make a cab chassis like this.

So that's why there was just international freight liner.

And I mean, I I understand the mayor's point too, especially about single source and worrying about getting in on those types of deals, you know, when you're locked in on that, but it because I remember Dave Carney and I used to talk a lot about that with street lights, you know, is that then you have certain parts for certain types of lights, you know, as far as and I mean traffic signals, not just like the cobra heads, but then if you can't use the parts interchangeably or stock them, then you're having to stock multiple different vendors, and so you want to go to something more uniform, but sometimes that locks you into something as well.

And in this case, what one thing I want to try to do is at least get from the plow applications everything moving forward on the same page where we did have options.

So with the plow, the different vendors and the hydraulics have all that at least uniform.

So if something truck A uh something happens to the plow, you can take a spare one off and put it on.

We kind of ran into that last year a little bit.

So I think this will help uh at least keep keep the trucks moving as things happen.

And did we look at what you thought they would bring on sale or auction or so?

Usually when I try to get a at least an idea of what they're gonna bring on sale, I'll go on to uh Iron Planet, you know, those types of machine trader.

See try to find something equivalent, comparable, yeah.

At least the same hours, sometimes conditions are a little different.

Um I make my suggestion, I guess, based on that.

And in your opinion, seven was a good good number to land on at least and not roll the dice.

My my fear was if you put them out sometimes when you put them out on gun deals, sometimes we're really surprised at what we get for uh you know equipment or what we put on there, and other times it's not a good one.

Yeah, I yeah, you're rolling the dice, I get it.

Usually I approach it with a minimum of what I'd like to see back, and if I don't see that, which was right about at seven, then I would have declined their trade and sold it outright.

I mean, I don't have any evidence of the contrary, so I'm gonna trust you, man.

No problem.

I just wanted to ask.

Right.

Thank you.

Actions relating to agreements and contracts.

A is a resolution approving number one amendment number one to the service provider agreement with AG construction for the utilities concrete construction project.

B is a resolution adopting the ADA transition plan for facilities and the public ride-of-way.

I had a question about that.

I just wondered um uh Gordon andor Brittany uh Gordon, um, about if we and I don't know if it was in the hard copies or different area.

I wasn't looking.

I just wondered if I could have access to a copy of this plan or at least some of the details.

I thought maybe it'd be in the homework, but I didn't see it.

Uh Gordon Ferrari City Engineer, yeah.

I can get you a I can email you a copy.

There's the hard copy.

That's what I wondered in the folder that I just yeah, then I just didn't find that, so I apologize.

I printed out.

No, no, no, no.

No, I wanted electronic.

But yeah, I'll be able to look there.

If I can't find it again, I'll look again.

But if I can't, I'll email you.

Okay.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Avenue.

D is a resolution approving city facilities asphalt overlay reimbursement agreement with the Jewish Cemetery Association for Streets in the Independent Veyron Cemetery.

E is a resolution approving change order number one to the contract with Knife River for the city's facility asphalt overlay project.

F is a resolution approving a contract to KP construction for the West Clifton Avenue Sanitary Sewer Siphon Improvement Project.

G is a resolution approving a purchase agreement with the auditorium shopping area and approving an appointed agency agreement with the NAIA United for property at 100, 112, and 124 Pierce Street.

We're not giving them the an agreement now to sell.

That's only because of that new I or that new federal law because of all the lawsuits that occurred.

You have to appoint an agent, right?

Yes, and I believe in this documentation that indicates that there's dual agency.

It's the listing.

Right.

Yeah.

Marty public is really wanting to know, and I do too.

We talked earlier today.

It would be a lot more comfortable for somebody like me to vote if we had at least a developer saying we can't hardly wait to put a shovel in the ground there.

It's really tough to spend three million dollars, and you can say, well, it's not really taxpayer money.

I get that, but it kind of sort of could be, depending on how you use that money.

And I might abstain anyway.

And the reason I would abstain, I'll tell you up front, is that one of the majority owners in this partnership was a very good friend of mine and his family still, I believe.

I can't have no, I haven't checked, but I got to believe that they're a seller in this property, and so I don't have any connection to the family, but I don't want people running around town saying I took care of a friend of mine because that's not the case at all.

I don't even know if the family still has an interest in the property.

But I'm probably going to abstain, but just for that reason I'll be abstaining potentially not a real conflict of interest, but kind of sort, I guess.

But I I'm curious I think that from what I read on social media, half the people are kind of for this, half the people are wondering about it.

I guess I'd like some sort of what your best guess is time frame of how long it'll take you to get a developer.

So we have talked with some developers.

Uh we see this as an opportunity to turn around and redevelop an area that is at the front door to the city.

Uh in all honesty, it's kind of run down at this point in time with vacant building and and um another building that's likely to be vacant within two years.

So it's an aggressive step.

I guess I would uh uh compare it to what we did with the badger building, which was similar type of thing except a vertical structure where we took a building that was vacant and had sat empty for a while and um did an RFP process, were able to locate a quality developer that put you know millions of dollars into it and it's been very successful.

Still needs the ground floor, you know, commercial space to be leased, but the apartments are full, and I think is an example of of what we can do.

It's it is kind of aggressive for a city to do this sort of thing, but I think it given the location, the history of it and the condition of it, it's called for at this time.

Um I think I you're absolutely right, Mayor, to ask the question.

Um we see this as a uh potential for a mixed-use development, commercial retail, perhaps residential multi-story building, similar to a couple of uh developments that have taken place in downtown Sioux Falls, where they were also aggressive in assembling sites and bringing in developers and um perhaps a mix of developers where you might have uh more than one.

So that's kind of the vision that we have.

I think it will take a year at least to get something organized.

Well, not gonna bet you, mayor if you want me to, but um I I think we have seen interest, and I I think we will get to work immediately on it and look for developers to put together an RFP and put it out there as soon as we can.

Well, it's obviously to be of highest priority to our staff, and uh we will devote our full attention to to making that happen.

I think it's critically important.

Uh we've had a lot of great things happen in downtown.

We've had, you know, the Benson building, the badger building, as I mentioned, a number of other buildings with significant investment.

But I think the uh perception is, and uh maybe a little bit the reality is that some of the areas of downtown need some help, need some investments front door to the city.

It's a unique opportunity.

Um I think all of us maybe that have lived here a while have thought I wish we could someday do something about that site.

It's such a great site right there at the at the entrance, uh major uh visibility from the highway and from the interstate and from the from Gordon Drive.

Uh highest traffic counts in the area, really, are right there on that interstate, visible from there.

So I think it's an incredible opportunity.

Um there's some risk to it.

I will admit that, but I think uh it's worth the risk at this time for the city.

We have we are using a mix of funds, uh, some of which came from previous uh real estate transactions, as you know, mayor.

So um I think it it makes sense.

We consulted carefully with the finance department before proceeding and with talk to you as well and and the legal department.

So uh I think it's uh gonna be well worth the investment or the city.

Two things.

My friend who's since deceased always told me that he owned half of Pierce Street.

I want to make sure we're buying that half of Pier Street if that's the case.

I'm not aware of that.

Well, I know you're not, but that's what he always claimed that he that they owned half of Pierce Street.

Now, I don't know how you can claim that when you've let us drive on it all those years, but it's something to make sure we check.

Check that with the title as well.

Check to skill examples.

Yeah, well that I think.

I'm just telling you what he always used to tell me.

Well, as mentioned, Mayor, we do have a 120-day due diligence period.

So we will ask you to check it.

And number two, in that 120 days, I think it's terribly important.

You say you want to get ideas from the council and that, and I would hope we get some from the public.

But I think it's terribly important that we I think what the public is asking, what's going to go there?

And I think we need to answer that question.

When you're spending three million dollars of taxpayers' money, I think they should have some input as to what that possibly should be.

Okay.

Sure.

Well, and to be to be fair, the reason that we have been aggressive on this is because there were several interested parties.

So it is it is something that people were vying for, and uh several businesses I think have expressed an interest in operating in that space.

So I I don't think we're starting from a blank slate here necessarily.

Didn't say that, but if you should have a paid attention to Facebook over the week.

I don't read it very often, but Julie answers it better than I do.

But I at least read it, and people are saying, what is a city going to do with it?

Right.

And I think if you're going to have a mixed use, we should begin that process of what we mixed use to me can mean a lot of things than what it means to you.

And we can uh provide the opportunity through our um website, council concerns wherever they go, you know, to email us any other time, or maybe we can get a little link or something going from social media.

But yeah, people were really wondering, you know, well, what are we going to do with it?

We're not going to put another car wash there, are we?

We're not going to put another, you know, bank or this or uh McDonald, you know, kind of flip like that.

So I did ask them.

I understand.

What you like to see there.

I'm interested in knowing.

It's absolutely fair to ask those questions, absolutely.

And we will we, you know, I think maybe what would be would make sense would be for us to bring forward a plan, uh, some drawings or some concepts and try those out on the council and the and the and the citizens and see how if that makes sense to everybody.

And as I said, we're not going to rush in the first phone call we get.

We want to do an RFP process and make a make an uh strong effort to bring in quality development for this site.

Um, first we have to drill down to find out what is our interest because the developer needs to see our vision as well for our city.

And if he has a vision, that's great, we can consider it because sometimes somebody else's idea is your best idea.

I understand that.

But this is um for anyone who is doubting it.

This is four acres in the heart of our city, entrance and exit to the interstate.

It's right across from the Tyson Event Center.

River front.

River front.

This will be it's it's a once-in-a-lifetime in our lifetime in this room possibility to control the land to make it allow it to be what we would like it to be for our community.

Because I'll tell you what, I don't want a windshield replacement company in there that has the doors cut in the side of a building and looks like a jiffy lube.

I mean, that's just not an appropriate place.

No offense to anyone, but I think that we can find a better use for those four acres than putting things like that in there.

Right.

We want to find the highest and best use, and as I said, uh analogy to the badger building, we sent out information to I don't know, eight eighty or hundred developers and talk to many of them and were able to get interest from four or five.

Who's coming in?

What's back space going to end up being?

I mean, I know we'll probably have people say a park or a lot of green space, but those don't bring tax dollars in to offset residential taxes either.

So we have to consider that too.

What's going to be the return on our dollar by taking this leap and making that investment?

Agreed.

I think we need to show return on investment here.

It's a significant investment by the taxpayers and by the city, and we need to show uh at the end of the day a strong multi-million dollar investment that does have a good return on our dollars.

Marty, uh Marty, a couple of things.

Over here.

Sure.

Uh first when you you confirmed for me the 120-day due diligence.

What when will that period start?

120 days.

That's four months, correct?

So we'd probably put it into if we were to start today, it would be mid-January.

I'm going to look at Nicole for when would that start?

I believe it's from the date the agreement is executed, which would be upon approval of the council today if that's the executed today.

So then so with 120 days due diligence, are we of the mindset that whatever we may discover we're going to try to deal with it and find a solution for?

Or is there a chance that in the due diligence there could be something grave enough that it would either it would either uh impact the purchase price or possibly uh impact the whole idea of the project?

That's why.

Always a possibility, Councilman, that's as you know.

And I think we will we we we're going into it wanting this to be successful.

We plan on it being successful, but there is the there is the chance that there could be something that would come up due diligence.

Okay.

And my second question or point is uh so that would get us probably into a closing in January, February sometime.

So some of that rental was figured in as to offsetting some of the three million dollars, but that's going to shorten that period.

Do we have a little more accurate figure what the rents would be that we would start collecting, say February one or March one to the end of whatever the lease terms are, just to have an idea.

I think at one point we were thinking a million dollars.

Yeah, it's close to a million.

But I don't know if that's true when you cut off four months.

Over two years.

Maybe five months, yeah.

Yeah, we can give you that.

Okay, we would just look at monthly growth.

I think that's bro, that rent for us and we capture the rent at the end of the closing or no.

No, that usually usually not.

I don't think we would get the rent until we own it.

Okay.

But I I think that the public wants to know too what some of this offsetting amount is.

So yeah, if you could do a little more fine-tuning to that calculation, I would appreciate it.

Yep, of course.

And you stated a lot of good reasons.

You started a lot of good reasons a lot of good reasons why we're we're taking a look at this.

So thank you for that, Marty.

Yep.

One more question.

The 120-day due diligence.

Now, is that up to 120 days if we are satisfied and the work gets done typically yes.

Quickly.

I believe so, right?

Can we sooner?

We could.

Yes, that's the outside.

That's the up to 120 days.

Okay.

So just to be clear, what Dan was talking about is we will the city will be paid the rent that Walgreens is now paying the current owners.

And per same amount.

So we would be capturing that for two years until Walgreens lease is up in 2027.

So that totaled about a million dollars, which would offset one million out of the three months spending.

That included the Burger King.

Oh, and Burger King, right, right.

So we'll get those numbers and be affected because we have the due diligence time frame, four months of that will be trimmed off or at the most four months.

Right.

But Marty, I well said.

I I would caution you on the due diligence.

So for example, just the environmental audit that you'll be doing, environmental study.

You want to make sure that we really cover the entire area for those drillings to make sure and not just pick one or two or three just for the sake of time.

And it's going to take time to do an environmental and to do it the right way.

And I think that's critical to having having that done as and I I know you know that, but I just want to state it that that's going to be part of that's a huge part of what you'll be doing.

Absolutely.

Okay.

And the reason I told Dan that is because I remember with the Perkins, there was a Sears auto store there, and I think they had some environmental issues because of that that they had to do.

It's always a possibility.

Yeah.

That's right next to where you're buying.

So Marty.

Just wanted to.

I know everyone kind of has some comments, especially on a development and something in an item I think this is significant.

And so I just wanted to at least share some of my thoughts.

Uh a couple things.

Number one, first and foremost, I want to commend staff for looking for opportunities like this, putting it together, presenting it to the council.

So I really thank the economic development team, but also the all the other teams that were involved in putting something like this together.

Secondly, what I would want to say too is you know, I think a lot about our peers.

I think a lot about different communities and cities and the growth that they've experienced, um, and the growth that I hope that someday we're able to capture and able to capitalize on.

And I think sometimes if you look at the investment that our neighboring communities are investing in areas like their downtown and otherware and other places throughout their communities, but you look at the old market, you look at Phillips Av or the new steel district in Sioux Falls, you look at the East Village, all of these different areas required significant investment and cities to be aggressive and go after opportunities like this.

And I agree with Julie.

It's it's certainly a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to be able to capitalize on something like this, and I have no doubt in my mind that there would have been people that would have wanted to put you know money into or a business into one of these properties or you know any one of them, but it takes someone stepping forward like the city to try to have a strategic vision for the entire property rather than letting it piecemeal out, and I think that that's what makes this significant.

It's not just one property, but it's the entire four acres, which is amazing.

And I know that it went we had good experience with the badger building.

Um, and gosh, the developer that ended up landing on that project has stuck around and wanted to continue investing in this community, and I think that's worth noting.

And so I think um that really the future is looking great for opportunities like this, and do we always want to be the one taking the lead on that?

Not necessarily.

Um, but I think that if you want to be great, we got to make sure that we're leading and investing as well.

Uh the last thing that I would say is gosh, I've been a part of a lot of these strategic visioning conversations, right?

Or different exercises that we've done.

I remember some where they brought different community members or students and all different kinds of people and brainstorming exercise.

I think one of the last ones was a Simcoe group or something, and had people sketching out what they would invest in and what areas of um uh Sioux City they would want to see different things in and where they thought the best money would be spent.

Almost all of it was in these corridors, right?

In places like this.

Um, or it was at least one of the top ones.

And so I think a lot about that that we need to be thinking 10-15 years from now and what that vision looks like.

Um, and I think you have to have plans and proposals like this put together in order to enact that or really starting to do that.

Remember that, Alex.

That was at the uh when we hosted the Iowa Planning Association here last year.

Yeah.

We had something like that when we sat for our presentation for the five-year Donton infrastructure.

They gave us 20 million or 10 million and said, what do you what would you do with it if you had that kind of money?

Yeah.

Mine was Bulldoz Walgreens in Ashley.

So anyway, thank you.

Thank you.

All right.

H is resolution awarding a service provider agreement to McGill Restoration for the Sergeant Floyd Monument Repair and Restoration Project.

I moved we delete.

Did you want to call that for a second thought?

Or you just want to submit an extension.

Just no thank you.

Is that Bill Dave or do what you want me to move we delete that?

Second.

Oh, Kane.

Hi.

Waters more.

Hi.

Data reactions authorizing payments.

A is a resolution authorizing payment to Libra Construction for the Highway 75 Regional Stormwater Improvement Project.

B is a resolution approving change order number 12 and authorizing payment to RP constructions for the annual sewer cleaning project.

C is a resolution authorizing payment to Vanderpool or excavating for the South Fairmont Street Reconstruction Project.

D is a resolution approving a partial settlement of the tort claimant authorizing payment.

E is the resolution approving fund transfers for August.

F is a motion approving the total expenses for August.

Nine are applications for beer cigarette tobacco.

I'm sorry, for cigarette tobacco, nicotine paper product permits.

Anybody to be heard on any of those items?

No one spoke on the on the uh project.

Under G7G, did they?

Nope.

I find that interesting.

Yeah, exactly.

For now.

We'll talk.

For now.

Yeah.

For now.

Passes 5-0.

Recommendations of planning and zoning 12s and ordinance vacating a portion of the property adjacent to 4510 Van Buren Street.

The petitioner is Barry Bulkey and Melissa Einhorn, B and Z recommends approval of the vacation of Mattis.

But denial of the vacation of 45th Street.

The first consideration was approved August 21th.

It was deferred from September 8th.

I'll move second reading.

I'll second that, but did that include the denial?

No, then you'd have to move that because we did that last year.

No.

No, deferred.

We deferred.

Okay.

Right.

The first reading passed for vacation of both of the streets that were stated as the applicant had applied.

And did and then if you want you have to read this, and if you want to amendment, you do the amendment now.

Okay.

Do you want to I'll make another otherwise I'm gonna open it here?

Well, I guess I don't have to open here.

Go ahead.

Well, I'll make a motion to amend the main motion.

Do not deny the vacation of 45th Street.

Zero second.

Second.

I and actually, and this is for just voting on it, right?

This is not a vote.

Yeah, this is this the vote, or to change the motion in general.

I'm confused.

I just no what he's there was a second to the main motion.

Then if you want to amend, you amend and you seconded the amendment.

And now there's discussion, and then you'll vote on the amendment and then you'll vote on the motion.

Perfect.

So yeah, before so I wanted to at least have a little discussion prior to the vote.

All I was going to say was after talking with more um planning and zoning commission members driving up past the property, learning a little bit more about the discussion and hearing from uh not only the petitioner but also those that oppose the development.

I mean, I think it's clear to me, especially um uh Barry.

I think from your standpoint that you you want what's best for you and your family and that property and to build something that you've dreamed about, you know.

We should all be so lucky, it's a beautiful piece of ground.

Um, I agree with all of those things, and it'd be my hope that you would find the ability um to or that your neighbors would find the ability um to be able to have everyone be able to win on this and work together um to be able to find the best location for you.

Um it seems to me that there are other ways and people and things that happen on 45th Street that would keep me from vacating that.

Um, and I think I should have perhaps thought through or at least had time um to be able to go up there initially, and I apologize for that.

I do think that um the recommendations of planning and zoning, I think they do do do their due diligence quite thoroughly, and especially when we have other neighbors that oppose, it's usually in the best interest to go along with that recommendation or listen to those.

And so it would be my hope that you could continue to move forward with building your dream home and having it in that property, even if it's not the exact location that the two of you were dreaming of.

Um, but I think that that opportunity presents itself that way.

So I hope that you'll be able to work with your neighbors.

Um, and I hope the neighbors will will understand and want to work with you on that as well, just to continue to improve that area.

I think it's a beautiful piece of land, and if it continues to be developed, I think that'd be great.

Um I would have that hope as well.

Um, and so thank you for for bringing it forward.

And and I thought everyone was fairly respectful in the process, and I think it's just we need calmer heads and more conversations, you know, neighborly conversations.

And so um, I thank you all for at least sticking around in this process and and P and Z for having at least thorough explanations and being willing to take calls and answer questions.

I got a question for Patrick as long as he's here.

Do we maintain that street?

The alleyway or access access one or 45th, you mean 45th street.

Right, 45.

How do you maintain that street when it's about this wide?

Yeah, Patrick Field Services.

Um something like that we don't maintain just because it's it is overgrown the way it is right now.

No, I'm talking the street in.

Van Buren.

Van Buren.

It's extremely tight.

Typically, that's just handled with a motor grater.

Looks like everybody's building the right-of-way to me.

I don't am I wrong?

Uh you're talking about the access going up to that property?

No, we we do not maintain that.

That's managed to be a process.

That's what's managed.

That's managed by the property owners.

Correct.

The access.

No, no, I'm talking from 46 down to this property we're talking about.

The little access road?

Thank you.

Yes.

Well, it's the road.

I think it's listed as an access road.

Yeah.

Gordon, you can pull it up.

Well, it's an alley, but are we maintaining it?

Because it looks like things are right on.

That's an alley.

Okay, but it looks like it's about this wide.

Have you driven up there?

Yeah, I drove up there.

Yeah, there's all kinds of it.

Stuff seems awfully close.

Isn't this where you take a look?

Yeah.

No.

Where's 46th Street?

No, it's this right here.

This.

Yeah.

Yeah.

We don't must not have much right-of-way on that alley.

No.

Huh?

Measure it.

Do we maintain that, Patrick?

Just for clarification, you're talking that access right there?

South off of 45.

Yeah.

This one, this one right here.

That's an access road.

Yes.

That's an alley.

The question is, do we maintain it.

Pow it or no?

To my knowledge, no.

We do not have staff go down there.

I guess if yeah, if you want to come forward, sir, I know you live on it if you want to speak to it of who maintains it.

I bet you plow it.

The guys run their motor graders down there?

Absolutely.

Yeah.

So what happens?

You gotta say your name, sir.

Uh Brian Reynolds, 4524 Madison Street.

And the mayor brought up a very good point, and I was gonna bring it up, but totally slipped my mind.

That piece of property, 45th is big for the city of Sioux City, just what he brought up is the road grader pushes all the snow and the overflow of snow onto 45th Street, and he goes up there, and occasionally he has to turn around there and come back down.

And in the future, he with them building a home, he'll have to go further, and the butt end of the road grader will have to go back and come back down.

But he's been doing it in the neighbor's driveway.

So back to what the mayor said on a city street, when our plow comes down the street and shoves in your driveway, and you're going, oh wow.

Well, they can do that because that's city frontage.

But down our street lane or alley, exactly right.

There's only 16 foot from the back side of the pole over to the other thing, and then it's all private property.

So you can't go dumping all the city snow onto our property.

And if the road grader cannot get up there to 45th street and get rid of the snow, then these kind of things are gonna be these kind of things, and the expense for the city is gonna be to bring straight trucks in and loaders in and get all this snow out where we've never had to do that before.

So 45th is big for the in the winter time for the city of Sioux City, so that was a good point.

But that's not why I'm asking because we don't normally maintain these.

That's why I'm correct.

Huh?

Correct.

That's why I'm asking why we're why are we maintaining it?

That is a street that that is a legal street.

What's the I don't think so?

Madison Van Buren is placard.

You just go right up the telephone pole.

It says Madison's on the right side, Van Buren's on the left side, and mailboxes, the whole works.

It's our street.

You mean that's each side of the street has its own name?

Yep.

So here I think somebody made that up.

No.

I mean, seriously.

No, no, really, yeah, exactly.

It was a mistake.

It was a mistake.

Are the signs of pink?

You're right.

The guy that owned all the dwelling.

What are you doing printing signs here, buddy?

Come on.

No, I think you just lost your snowplay.

There are two signs up there.

No, today no, they're on the telephone pole.

They're up there.

It's all Van Buren's on the left, Madison's on the right.

Well, yeah, because then we're all of the streets on the other sides that are half whiter and right-of-ways.

Yeah, and they're vacated.

There is there's never in the history of the world.

Oh no, don't say there has never in a history of the world been a Madison Street up there.

It's been in the history of the world.

Well, you know, from the beginning of time.

From the beginning, I think you're just baiting me on more and more of every state.

True story.

You're digging it.

You're digging it.

No, it really is.

There's never been.

I'm calling George Lindblade.

We got to discuss.

Yeah, we gotta get a historian on this.

Yeah.

Tom Munson, if you're watching, help us.

I had I've been there my whole life, and I had to go down here to the city.

You never moved away.

No, I've been here all the time.

How long have you owned this property to the 21 year going on 21 years?

Even the lots that you picked up.

The big corn.

No, them all come, them all come and Madison Street, and that was because the city guy said, hey, you could do this, and that dwelling to the north of me, which is abides by 45th Street.

He said, if you was to vacate that Madison Street, he says they could get their part of it and he could put a septic tank in because it was red tag.

And I said, Yeah, I'll do that.

A city employee told you that?

Yes.

What was their name?

I don't remember it was labeled.

I'm just kidding.

Oh, yeah, you would know him.

Um, how long have you owned the cornfield?

Uh that came a few years after I had bought the my my uh prop my dwelling, my house.

Yeah, because you will be the third guy since I've been around in 85 that's told me I'm gonna put houses on that lot.

Guess what?

I don't have a lot of years left.

I neither do I don't think we'll let you know houses on that.

Rod Lieber, I'm waiting on Rod.

Why?

Why are you waiting for him?

Well, you give me somebody else.

I will.

Okay, I'll do that.

All right, I got somebody at line.

Oh, I'll be doggone.

I I've always acres is that.

No, you can't, I'm on record.

Um I was born and raised in Leeds on Madison Street, and when I ended up there, as I told the story, my wife passed away a year ago, she never would have sold it because she's a country girl.

But I always envisioned it out there.

Wow, it'd be great Leeds edition.

It would be, and I have the perfect purpose.

Yeah, and I had a friend come up and said, Are you gonna be able to live with that with all them how I said I'm 68 years old, and it and I can say, like he said, when he's gonna retire from here, he was involved in projects, and he can be proud that he looked back.

I I picked up on it, and that's how I look at at that street, not a cornfield, that there should be homes out there.

Yes.

Okay, go for the greater good.

Yeah, exactly.

And 45th street will be huge for that.

But I suppose my question is, and maybe Nicole has an answer.

Um, I mean, I just want to know legally if that is a street and if we have if we need to be maintaining it, or if or if we just have been maintaining it out of the goodness of our heart, and we probably should not be because of situations like this.

It's it's showing up on the map as just an access street.

If there are signs that are located there, my best guess, and without researching the history, is it's probably for 911 purposes because Madison and Van Buren or mail delivery don't run through.

I would imagine that because the access comes that way.

They've just it's for location purposes.

Yes, and you would have to have somewhere to direct whether it's post office or emergency personnel or whatever.

But as far as maintaining the street, this it comes up as an access street, and I think well can probably say typically we don't.

Correct, just as much as an alleyway that we do the same same way that we put a barricade in the middle of an alley in Leeds and nobody knows how it got there either.

So we have a lot of this that goes on without consistency.

That's both that's always been maintained from day one, and it's always it as a street.

And the street signs will say it.

Well, I know, but we had a barricade and a street sign and a visible address.

Yeah, well, no, it's been a mistake from day one, but still, I mean it's it would be grandfathered in.

Well, it sounds to me like you won the won the battle, won the battle of 45th, and you lost the battle of plowing on your access.

Your neighbors are gonna make it.

Well, then that means they're gonna have to gain it too.

So everyone, exactly.

Now you gotta work together.

That's a beautiful thing.

Beautiful thing.

Brian Reynolds, before you leave, would you drop your contact information off?

Yes.

Can I do it?

All right, thank you very much, everybody.

Thank you.

Anyone else before?

There you go, Patrick.

We're just helping you out.

712.

251.

Yes.

Oh, hold on.

Brian, do you text?

Yeah.

Then you just have a record.

Melissa Einhorn at 4103 Jefferson.

Very bulky 4103 Jefferson.

Go ahead.

Oh, yeah.

So clearly we're discussing 45th Street.

Hopefully you all got to go out and take a look at this and the terrain that's involved.

So for the city to develop that into a street with the utilities.

Like I get I got the quote, $2,000 a foot for a street.

You're gonna spend 1.3 million dollars to run a street across there.

Under ideal conditions.

Under ideal.

This is from Chris.

Yeah.

This is ideal.

This is from nowhere.

This is an the hills that you guys clearly saw.

We are going to pay you guys $10,000.

You were in the black with this.

Like you can use it for whatever projects you guys need to do versus costing the city money for, as it's shown, access to this one corner of the property.

It was discussed that the closest utilities are here on Van Burn.

But as we talked to the city itself, here at 46th and Harrison Street, and I sent you guys a picture.

There's clearly sanitary sewer and water, and that is downhill from Mr.

Reynolds farm.

Like it you walk out there, you see it's downhill.

And as we all know, poop flows downhill.

Like for the utilities to make it there, you guys are gonna have to go uphill and downhill through the north side of our property.

Yet again, more cost to that 1.3 million dollars.

Um it was brought up by councilwoman Shaner.

If houses are built there though, they are not next to the sanitary close enough to the sanitary sewer where they can have city water and septic tanks if they're houses.

They can have it require.

They're not re they're not required, but they can.

Um for us, our proposal is we're gonna yet again use that access street to come up through there.

And it was discussed in the last one by Mr.

Friedell that he was concerned about access to his for a septic tank being replaced.

Um it was brought up by Councilman O'Kain that are we willing to put an easement in for that, and we actually discussed that with him.

I was hoping that he would show up to say yes, we did discuss it, and we are willing to put in an easement so he has access for that.

Because that was his only concern.

He even said that to you guys that he'd be willing for us to purchase it.

Like he would have less of a problem if we gave him this easement.

The problem he has now, and if you guys drove up that access road, you saw that that was a five-foot hump there right now, currently.

Yeah, he can't get to his septic tank right now before we do anything before anything happens with 45th.

He can't get to his septic, and that wasn't caused by us.

Yeah, that was caused by the vacation of Madison back in 2011.

He's terrain locked right now, and he can't get to that area.

But once we fix it and make sure that he has an easement, and we're hoping that you can mandate that as part of the sale of 45th.

We're gonna fix it so that he can get to his property again because right now he can't.

The only way that he could get through is to Madison, but that's been blocked off.

And you point out that hump while you're at the There's no way to get a semi-truck up that hump with a septic tank on it.

So the hump is right there.

Right there.

And that is where clearly like they didn't want to go any further with it because there's no reason to.

And I did send you guys pictures.

I don't have the picture with me of my truck stopped right at that hump where I didn't want to damage my truck, and I can't imagine a semi-truck with a concrete septic tank making it up over that.

Right.

So right now he's blocked out.

He can't get there right now.

We're the ones who are going to fix that for him because that's the right thing to do.

He's our neighbor.

He was led to believe that we were going to put retaining walls and do landscaping and landscape.

We're not landscaping people.

No, we're we want to make sure that we can access our property and that he can as well.

Um it's our intention to leave that because we need to be cognizant of how water's gonna drain.

We don't want to flood him out, and putting a road there without being careful about how water is gonna drain is gonna leave him in a worse predicament.

We were considering him before any of this came up.

So we're where are you you're gonna come in?

Where are you we're I guess I looked at your property and wonder why you can't build a house right there in the clearing?

Where are you gonna build your house?

We've got that.

Yep, we've got those papers.

We brought uh it's buried underneath there.

Oh, yeah.

Okay.

So if we can switch to the little projector thing here.

Oh turn it properly so you guys can had to focus it.

Sorry.

Because we wanted to make it clear.

So currently, if we build our house without that property.

So the blue is our house, and the gray is our driveway here.

As you can see that green line up there.

That is that ridge that's over there.

It's a cliff.

That's not a ridge, that's a cliff.

It's the top.

Yeah.

And so therefore, because we gotta be 45 feet back, we can't be like we can't be close like everybody else's on that access road.

So we have to set back from that.

Step back is 45 feet there.

That is that's 45 feet because the street is 60 some feet.

But zoning is telling you 40 five feet?

Yes.

Okay.

I thought that was 25.

Is that right?

It's 25, isn't it?

We're gonna be 45.

Right.

It's depending on the street, right?

Or Chris Madge and Plenty Manager's setback would be 25 feet, front yard setback.

Right, not 45.

Okay.

So shift it half that distance up.

Put it closer.

Yeah.

It'll put it closer, but we're still on that cliff there.

So that that was the main purpose.

Sorry, that was the main purpose of buying 45th Street because now we can do this.

Yeah.

That but still it's not.

What's that back rectangle?

The front rectangle is the garage, the back rectangle is the house.

And you turn your house the other way.

And it's tough going down the hill, because the that that's not flat ground, that's a slope.

So it's how we're going to have the walkout planned.

Yeah.

I mean, people are talking, well, you have two acres.

We don't have two acres of the city.

Yeah, the two it's not all developable, right?

Yeah, like that.

Most of that what we have is that tiny little corner.

And we have to try to work it within that corner of our property.

So that's why we were hoping to get the 45th is so that we could have a little more room with our setbacks.

Not that we're gonna push up against our neighbor or block anyone out.

We don't want to do that.

We just wanted more room with the setbacks, although now we're uh we're kind of getting to a point where we think we may need to have that access just to protect ourselves in the future.

When we start building, if we have cement trucks or if we have you know construction crews that are going to be blocking that alley, what's to stop someone from taking pictures and saying, I need my access right now, I'm entitled to this access, and slowing down our construction, halting construction, sending police out there to us, coming to zoning meetings.

Doesn't seem like something like that would happen just when you're building your home.

But you don't know we don't know a lot, but sorry, I just don't think something like that's gonna happen that's gonna hinder your house building.

We've already been threatened to be sued twice.

Twice all just being here.

Just being here, just outside the council chamber.

You can understand our concern then because you want to be protected as well.

Right.

Yeah.

So it's I mean, we're gonna have to come here to ask for for permission to um for temporary closure of the of the streets so that we can grade our access.

So are we gonna have to come in here and fight every single time?

We just we're looking to we're looking to avoid confrontations in the future.

We want to make sure that we address all the issues, reasonable issues of people, like Mr.

Fridell, we've talked to.

Um we had our real estate agent who's representing Jacqueline Brumman has and once he found out that you're willing to do an eatment, he was completely fine with what we were doing.

So as long as the city can work that into agreement to purchase, we want to make that happen so that he's protected.

Andrew, the other question I had that uh another um uh member had talked to me about was the farmer using that land to be able to go through to get the sprayer or equipment through to the farm land.

Is that accurate?

Do you remember that being part of conversation?

Yeah, that's our understanding is the access from the field comes up the alley through across 45th street to get into that field because there's currently get up that hill.

You drive out there.

Yeah, I dro I drove out there.

Yeah, it's a it's a stability goat hill.

Yeah.

I wasn't taking my truck up there.

For the access is currently from what we can see in what from there's a gate from Mr.

Reynolds' property on 46th Street where he has direct access into his field, and that's all flat.

There's no hills there.

Is that where the the farmer or the person doing the field is getting in, or is it in the past it has been used for that from people who have done work there?

It was it was stated to us at at our meeting that they use that alley access and come up to 45th Street and come across into there.

That's what was stated to us.

Heavily used look factory.

Is if other people are using that, I don't necessarily want to vacate it.

Well, I understand though, because it look, I'm just trying to make sense and see, and I appreciate you guys being flexible and and trying to look for a good path forward as well.

And but that's just it, is it's like, well, I understand your concern, and that's a wide street that if we're not looking at like we're going to put a street in there anytime soon.

I don't want you to have to be so far away.

I want you to be able to build your home in a place that makes sense if we're not gonna do something with it.

But then again, it's like if multiple people are using that area.

I want to keep access open for them.

So one person is claiming the use.

Mr.

Reynolds claiming that the farmer is the ones that work for him.

That that's who.

And he's selling that that property, so that the farm access, he has one more year, and he's selling.

So no developer is going to want to come down an alleyway and then use an undeveloped paper road.

They're gonna go off of 46 and Jefferson.

They aren't gonna use that back road.

And it's 1.3 million dollars under ideal circumstances for the city to connect that road.

You've got a three million dollar project for massive massive city use.

You're not gonna spend 1.3 million dollars for that to connect to the corner of a property and not the center.

I would understand if this was to the center of the property.

I know, and that's where development.

When he brought up the farm ground or the that's where the farmer was getting in, I was like, okay, well, if more people than just Jamie are worried about it.

Sorry, go ahead, Andrew.

And also, too, from uh my understanding, what Gordon stated, it was never about paving 45th Street, it was about getting utilities and we've shown utilities that is not the ideal place for utilities.

Utilities would be coming from Harrison, where it's downhill from the property to Harrison.

Poop, as we've said, goes downhill.

If you're coming from there to our property, you're going uphill.

And Mr.

Gordon had said last time you can't go uphill.

That's exactly what you'd be doing on our property.

So which is it?

And that's what Gordon told us that the best place to access was to come up, hit 45th Street and go west.

Well, the good news is Gordon is here.

So Gordon, why don't you come talk to us how you're gonna pump it uphill?

In this imaginary connection.

Yeah.

So there is sanitary and storm.

Oh sorry, sanitarian water here.

Actually, there's water beyond that, but water's not the question.

Because it does come down this way.

It comes down 46 and it does come down Jefferson.

Okay.

Uh for circulation, it would be better for once you're in there to connect.

But that's that's doable without it.

This property here, approximately about diagonal, not quite perfect.

The southeast portion of it has to drain to the south.

The only other place to do that is down here at 42nd.

That's where the nearest sanitary is to the south, or over here on Van Buren, right about where this cursor is.

You see that on there?

Mm-hmm.

What about Harrison?

Harrison.

Straight north.

Over here?

Yes.

Yes.

That this the northwest portion of it can drain that way.

Oh, but the you're saying not the whole property.

No.

Now this is doing me looking at the our GIS and the uh topography on there, not going out there with survey equipment or anything like that.

From the looks of it, no, just that top corner could.

And then the south property here does have to go south.

Uh although a portion of it can go to the uh east down around onto Van Buren.

So you're saying you don't need to install a little bit so this hill is up to right about here from the from the um buren where it ends to the front of your property.

If it's graded flat, is about an 8% slope.

It does, it does go up in the center, right around here.

It does peak again and then comes back down.

But if that's all flattened out, it can go to an 8% slope.

So you're gonna need a bridge to our property to our house that we have.

No, no, no, no, it just has it's flat right there in front of your property, it stays there.

It that doesn't make sense because if you're going to bring this the grade down that far, our house is up on a hill, and now you've created a valley right beside us.

No, okay, not at all.

Can I show you?

Like we can see it on Google Maps, like it's right here from here, and it peaks right about here, about 10 feet higher than it is here.

So it can be graded this way to this point.

Again, that's if you're doing a road.

You don't have to do a road.

I'm only talking utilities, sanitary.

The sanitary can be dug in and down to this point.

No, no change for you at all.

You're gonna have to do some grading anyway just to get down this alley up to your property, whether it's this way or this way, whatever way you come, no matter what you've got grading to do.

That's not that's not anywhere near close to grading folks.

Can I make a motion to bring this back a week so that they can have some meetings and decide, you know, what really is the best way and what's right, what's uphill, what's down here, what's closer.

I mean, can we do that?

Sure, and and understanding that the council's consideration related to vacation is focused on the transportation system and whether or not the roadway will be used right or is used currently in the transport.

Black I can make that decision based on the information.

I don't think it's in the transportation system, but we I'm not saying we don't need it for utilities.

Right, right.

Okay.

So if we're talking about the water, that house that's to the north of me, that's basically parallel with their property, and they brought they brought it right up, they just brought it right up between Madison and Van Buren to the left of it, is their water, and their property is just parallel.

So they can either come up that same way, or like um the sir the guy down at Thing said, they can come up Van Buren and cut straight across to the property, or they can come up 44th Street where another brand new house is that's already did it and come in from the back side of their property.

That seems a little unreasonable because again, we're talking about one point three million dollars at a time.

Yeah, we're talking one at a time.

Where the house is that already's got water that's straight across from your property is just the distance from the uh street over, and that's it.

So I would say that's the closest way to your property versus coming up Van Buren Street and cutting across.

I'd come right on up and boom, you're right there.

Why would you come up uh Van Buren and cut over on that little house is went right up our street on the left-hand side, and you go so many more feet, and you're at your house.

Well with all due respect to everyone.

It seems like it's easy.

Well, why don't you just go to this corner?

Why don't we do that?

Why would we do this?

I think that you guys really do need to have some future discussions with engineering our engineering department and really look at the topography topography, look at the connections, why we can do something, why we cannot do something because this conversation that we're having now and that we're listening to, I don't feel comfortable making a decision today.

So I'm gonna move that we bring it back in a week.

We need to withdraw our motions and get and does that make sense, Gordon, and everyone and even Andrew.

I like I'm just I want clarity of to make sure who is using it because, sir, can you you can verify you're saying that the people that are operating on your field are putting sprayers, combines, whatever the equipment they need that they're using 45th Street.

That's what you're here saying.

Yes, that's the when I bought that track of land, that was my legal entrance and only legal entrance.

The put what they're talking about is different track.

I sell that to you, you can't cross over the colour.

That's not no.

The question is you're telling me a combine goes up that hill.

I wouldn't even drive not the combine.

Uh I wouldn't drive a four-wheeler maybe.

Yeah, it walks.

I'm asking, where does he get his tractor at the end of the day?

My husband's a farmer, now be careful.

The road grider goes right up.

Where does he bring his tractor and his implement?

How does he get it onto the farm?

He was always going in Jerry Williams on Jefferson Street, and then for some reason he decided not to rent his property no more, and that's where it came in more of the life that it was gonna have to come in from my if you continue farming, they're gonna have to come in over on my side.

And yeah, some of it comes in across two other private prop parcels that I just happened to own.

Okay, but someday I'm not, and you can't cross over, and you're gonna need the same original entry that was given to me when I bought the parcel and that's 45th Street.

I mean, you don't need to concrete it, 46 ain't concrete.

You you don't even need to gravel it at this point, and gravel is all you'll ever need.

So there's no expense.

Thank you for your input.

Yeah, yeah.

Okay.

All right.

So do I have to show up again next Monday?

No, not if you don't want to.

No, you'll have to.

I mean, you can show up, it's not required.

But it won't affect it.

Like it doesn't work.

We're voting next week.

So you might want to, but you don't have to, it's not required.

Okay, good.

Sorry, thank you.

All right.

You're moving to table at a week.

Okay.

Sorry, second.

Second.

And I have one more thing if it's all right.

Um claiming that when he bought this property, if you can show it up there, that his only access was 45th Street.

So he bought this property in, I believe it was where are we here?

2009.

So in 2009, he's claiming that his only legal access was via 45th.

But that's not correct.

This Madison Street was not vacated at that time.

This was a legal access to that property.

He didn't vacate this until 2011.

So he bought Madison after he bought this field.

So he had this as his legal access when he bought that field.

So according to him, because he bought Madison, now he no longer can use it because it's not his access because he owns it.

And I don't see the sense in that.

So she don't know what she's talking about.

45th Street goes into the field.

Madison's stops at 45th Street.

So she's completely wrong.

45th Street goes crosses, and if the it was continued to be a 45th street, it would go all the way across that field over to Jefferson Street.

There is no such thing as Madison in between it comes up to to the south side of 45th stops.

Then it's 45th, then it continues on the other side, and it would go through.

So yeah, 45th Street.

But I think what she's saying is that you'd be able to access your field off of 46th, right?

Is that like you would be on 46th?

Yeah, does she want to write me a check?

No.

Okay, let's enough.

Withdraw your your amendment.

I do.

And who seconded it?

Alex seconded my amendment to the I will draw my motion.

You withdraw second.

Well just now moved it for a week.

Second.

I second.

Yeah.

Channer.

I waters.

I more.

I okay.

I okay.

One moment, Gordon.

Can you please give them your contact information?

So either you or someone else can meet with them.

Sit down and let's get some clarity and so we're all on the same page now where everything is and everybody agrees before we get here next week.

So for clarification for the public, the second reading will be held next Monday.

Right.

Right.

13's a hearing and ordinance amending chapter 25.05 entitled five development of the municipal code to petitioners of the city of Sioux City.

B and Z recommends approval.

I'll move that.

Second.

Public hearings now open.

Mr.

Kleiser.

Um the one thing that we discussed is the amount of time that could take to between now and when the when the uh when we stop allowing people to put up signs for a little bit.

Um more than a little bit.

Have you seen those monsters out there?

I have.

I know they gotta be a good electrical user, but we're just putting the major meter, so and they do already have those in other communities.

I mean, I was just in Sioux Falls and they were or I was up by uh Grand Falls Casino on that side of town, or on that side of town, too.

I mean it's those aren't new, they're doing those too.

Oh, I know, but the one on highway 75 is so big on that lot.

Yeah, it's just gaudy.

No, we we agree fully.

Yeah, and it's not just a sign, it's with a big billboard like that, let's just say.

Um, does that protect someone who's already got a sign there that owns a business?

Uh um, you know, there's off-premise, on premise, and is that gonna overshadow my uh Julie's home cooking sign in because they're so close together, they're two different signs.

So I think that's a good reason for us to take a step back and say we need to separate these ordinances and unfortunately we missed that last year when we put the moratorium on to revisit the ordinance.

We did miss that.

Yeah.

We all agree.

Have a moratorium for the rest of my life on the council.

You can deal with it.

It's gonna take six months.

I really don't.

Chris Magic Planning Manager, we'll use the next couple months to look at the code, look at what other cities are doing.

Uh whether that's a larger separation, separation between on-premise and off-premise, or even like the mayor said, maybe just a full moratorium on them.

We'll look at all options and bring that back for planning and zoning and your vote.

You want to put that on my committee schedule too?

We can.

Absolutely.

She was a lot smarter than we.

Anyone else be heard?

Hearing is closed.

After this vote.

Yeah.

Mr.

Gleiser.

Five zero, go ahead.

Could we could you send out um the criteria that we look for on under the transportation on streets street rights of way?

You had it in your report, but could you send resend that to us so we would have that again?

Not 100% sure what you're doing.

Yeah, I think you're asking for the standards for vacation.

Stand and what is considered by the standards.

Is that better?

Yeah, that's a better term.

Okay, yeah.

The standards for deciding what to vacate what not to vacate.

We we can provide that from the or the guidelines.

We used to go through guidelines and if somebody was using I'll make sure Chris gets right on it.

It's right there.

He already stepped up.

You know what I'm talking about?

Do you reading my mind from 25-30 years ago?

Those are in your staff.

We still use those guidelines, and those are listed out in the staff report.

Could you yeah, but could you just resend those to council?

Absolutely.

Just so we have and we'll include them as well in the staff report that will be part of the RCA for next week, too.

Okay.

You're welcome.

I know I don't talk about job here.

Did I have the mayor convinced that I'm 30 years younger than he?

Lady Bird Who.

But thanks.

Thank you.

Go ahead.

Good evening, Council.

My name is Jack Hogavine.

I'm a here uh from Hydman Law Firm, appearing on uh behalf of Global Foods Processing.

Um, we're not there yet.

Just give us give us a minute.

I'm sorry, just you can just we gotta waive rules and get past the one for your next.

Anybody opposed to awaiting the statutory rule?

No.

No.

Move that.

Second.

Scott.

Aye.

Waters.

Aye.

More.

Aye.

O'Kane.

Aye.

Hainer.

I'll move second, third.

Waters.

Aye.

More.

Aye.

O'Kane.

Aye.

Tayner.

I Scott.

Now that you stood up to ask Mr.

Moore, he'll tell you how you can charge twice for this meeting.

So apologize for that.

I was both back.

I've got to open it.

Yeah, I know.

Again, Jack Hoogan.

Just one second.

Okay.

14's a hearing and resolution.

Don't sit down, though.

Stay right there.

Keep it.

Accepting the proposal of global foods processing authorizing the sale of land commonly known as 506 Cunningham Drive in the combined Florida River Urban Renewal Area.

I'll move that.

Second.

Public hearings now open.

There we go.

Third time's a charm.

My name is Jack Hogaveen.

I'm from uh the Hydman law firm appearing on behalf of Global Foods.

Um we're just respectfully requesting that uh the council proposes or approves the uh resolution for the purchase and willing to answer any questions that the council may have.

I don't think so.

I think we're not happy.

Good job.

Public hearing just talked to David and Dolores.

I'll tell them you're doing a good job.

Awesome.

I appreciate that.

Thank you very much.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Yes.

Okay.

Passes 50.

Uh 15's resolution approving and directing submission of a grant agreement authorized by HUD under the community development grant agreement funding approval.

I'll move it.

Second.

Mayor.

Yes.

We not do all three hearings on number 14 today.

No, it's not that type of deal.

Not that kind.

Just the ordinance require three here.

Yep.

Passes 5016 resolution approving directing submission of a grant agreement authorized by HUD under the home investment partnership agreement funding approval.

I'll move that.

Second.

17 Gill hauling solid waste collection recycling disposal services.

Alley exiting strategy.

Hi, Air Montane Environmental Services.

Justin Franks, uh District Manager for Gill Hawley.

I'll run through this pretty quickly, and then we'll just mostly have like just the discussion if you have questions.

Um just trying to get some of the collections out of our unmaintained alleys in the city.

Um this is a situation that we can see in the city.

Um containers tipped over, furniture and alleys.

We want to be more clean, more sanitary.

But now we'll see them tipped over in the front of in the street.

Exactly.

I'm sorry.

We will see them tipped over.

Do you know the problem that it's not their fault?

But I've had it twice at my place.

Is homeless people grab garbage cans from three and four blocks away and they tip them out to see if there's anything in it, then I get to clean it up.

So you're not gonna change that no matter where you have them.

I I don't understand.

I mean, I there may be other reasons, but that's not gonna change anything in this community.

Right, and and we'll get to that portion of it.

Um customer service, alleys aren't consistently um serviceable, weather conditions, cars blocking it, retaining walls.

Um, there's decreasing maintenance in those unmaintained alleys, there's potholes.

Our residents are maintaining them.

I mean, it is their responsibility for upkeep at that point.

There's not gravel, there's again potholes, sinkholes starting.

Um, the trucks are heavier than a normal car, uh, health and safety concerns, uh, the alleys, a lot of them are out of sight, out of mind.

Again, that's like the public health.

Uh winter weather is like a major concern for ours when we get those alleys with the snow in it.

We can't get the trucks in.

You know, the city doesn't have plows, so it's up to the residents to clear them out.

So we end up with people calling in saying they're not getting their trash picked up because we can't access it.

So again, just some roads things.

So, kind of commenting on the winter situation.

I think that is the biggest concern for us, right?

I know that you guys don't like residents calling into the city.

We don't like it either.

And the biggest issue is unmaintained alleys, overgrown alleys, um, and not being able to service in snow and ice.

And as you all know, we're coming up into winter weather very soon.

Um, we're not looking to do all of it overnight.

Absolutely not.

Um, we're gonna go over kind of what our ideas were, but this is why it's a discussion where we want feedback.

How do we do this correctly?

Uh, because it's all a customer service issue.

We have about 10 to 11 percent of our customers are in alleys, and the other 89 to 90 percent are out.

So on snowy days, the roads are plowed, they get service, but the alleys do not, and it's not fair to those customers.

We're not proposed all of them are gonna ever get done.

There's always alleys that will never be curbside in our city.

Our terrain is just not made for it.

Which we've talked about, some in public works, I mean, and teams just discussion.

I mean, just for disclosure with the council, like we talked about some of them, just it's not going to be a possibility, you know, whether you can't access the front of the house, or you wouldn't be able to necessarily drag it all the way down the alley and then all the way around the house, whether it's a retaining wall situation or something else.

I mean, there will be those that are still going to have to be serviced in the alley, but it's just an effort to at least assist collection of these different ones as well, or just and make it safer for your drivers too, I'm sure.

Correct.

Our phase one trial would be these addresses on this phase one, small areas.

I put them on a map for you so you could see where they were at, and these are pictures that are actually those alleyways or a few of the alleyways.

I mean, they're very small increments, usually like a block long, that would be pulled out.

Some of these do actually have street side end alleyway pickup right now.

We don't know, I don't know what the how we got there, but so we're double dutying it.

They're driving down the street and then coming up the alley and then going down the next street.

It's that because it's just the way it's been.

Some people, some people aren't bringing it to the end of the alley, then I guess that's what you're saying.

Well, so like for instance, um, I don't have a street in particular, but say 21st Street.

Half the half the residents on say the left side, they're bringing it out, but the right side sets it in their alley.

So we do the left side, then we turn around and go back up the alley.

Are are people in the alley all supposed to bring it to the end of the alley?

No.

Currently, you drive down there and get we drive down the alleys, correct?

So that you can't drive through uh a lot of like yesterday's thunderstorms are rolled through, low hanging wires, trees fall down.

We can't go down the alleys until they're cleaned up, and that's our residents.

What was that?

But there were low-hanging wives.

There's always low-hanging wires all the time.

We work with them in America, we'll report it, and it's whenever they get there to fix it, then we'll go down.

But where if it's a city street, the the road departments are typically on it much quicker than than the alleys.

And just for transparency, too.

I know you weren't in these meetings, but at public or and the other council members weren't either, but uh in the public works team, we did talk about other solutions.

I mean, we talked about what other opportunities there would be, such as a collection area at the end of the alley, you know, and having more dedicated space at the end, so that you would just have to stay on the city street and be able to do that.

And I think that could be a solution, but then the problem becomes, and that and staff brought this up, is you know, that's private property that you're then creating an area for all of these dumpsters to be on.

Like that is someone's property.

There isn't necessarily right of way, you can't necessarily use all the area that the sidewalk is on, or you know, some of those areas are very tight, and so you wouldn't have space necessarily for a corral or whatever you would call those to be able to put all of those containers, and so that's I mean, we tried looking at other options as well.

Like I understand it's not ideal for someone to necessarily have to try to bring this, whether it's through their yard or otherwise, but it's not ideal for these workers to try to get through the alleys either.

So the other issues along with the power lines.

You can see some of the power lines in these photos, but the trees, if they're on personal property, a lot of the times they don't maintain their trees, and then we can't get through, or we get stuck on them.

Um, if it's in the street and it's on the right-of-way, cities can go out there and and trim it if need be, or if there's an issue, but a lot of the times on the private property, they're not maintained as well.

And and on top of what you said about you know, sometimes they're like the retaining walls, we will not be able to move those.

We fully understand that.

Uh, and currently within the city, uh, there's residents that just can't bring it to the curb, even in the front.

Well, we have a waiver, they sign it.

We do special walk ins, and we'll continue to do that uh even for the alley sets.

So they would just be on the list, and we just know that we have it's like a it's like a small F 350 pickup with four-wheel drive instead of a full-size trash truck.

And then the map, so then the maps of Tuesday, you can see it's the areas.

Um, the yellow would be that full day, most of the area, those are the alleys that would be on the the removal to the street side Wednesdays.

You can see in that top picture up here, it's an alley that it does have quite a slope on it.

This doesn't really show it that well, but there is quite a slope on it.

The retaining walls.

There's another one with the slope.

A lot of these like with the grass, they're unmaintained.

A lot of people don't mow them.

So you're not expecting you're not expecting them to drag it all the way down the alley if they're in the middle of the block.

You just want it to bring to their front of their home.

Just to the front of their home.

And some of them do have that access.

It's just they've always been an alley pickup.

Some of them are, it would just be a different.

And again, this is kind of your pilot pilot program.

We're not saying it'll be it'll happen in a week, a month that it'll be done.

It could take months for us to get it.

I think this is a good time to start a point for coming upon us.

So you can see if it's actually gonna be an improvement, and maybe it'll prove you wrong.

You know, we don't know.

And there, and there will be the process.

I mean, so our suggestion was so this first these first alleys, the three per day.

It equates for like 146, 147 homes, plus or minus.

And we're gonna go put door hangers on every single, they're on your guys' screens.

Every every single home that it affects, plus they're gonna get mailed a letter prior to us ever doing this.

So they have the opportunity to call and say, hey, I physically can't.

We'll put them on that list for that walk-in.

That's excellent.

That's a that's a great idea.

And from your pictures, my goodness, I'm thinking we're long overdue making these uh changes and having a discussion about it, but I'm glad we're doing it today.

Right.

And that's what I'd like to hear about.

Yeah, I'd like to hear what the public has to say, so this will certainly trigger that.

Absolutely.

My name is John Williams, 1613 with 17th.

Um, I have the perfect example for what they're talking about.

My house faces 17th Street, two houses on the corner, face Ross Street.

There are three of us that put garbage in the alley.

I have tried for I've owned this house 18 years.

I've tried for 18 years to get the trash cans out of there.

Because when the trucks come through there, I maintain my alley because the trash trucks make ruts.

If you drive out there right now, there's ruts because I haven't filled them because I got mad.

Um I'd love to get out of there.

I tried by the alley.

One of the gentlemen's the house got sold before I could buy the alley, and he won't allow me to buy the alley.

He can put his trash in front.

The truck actually comes down the paved alley, drives around the corner, comes back up and backs down my alley to pick up my trash and the first house.

Then they go straight south through alleys like you're talking, they're all unmaintained, all the way down to 14th Street, and there are pretty bad ones.

I'll give them that.

John, you sound like a perfect candidate for pilot.

I I'd love to get them out of here.

Anywhere near any of these?

Me, me and the house in the corner could put them right on the curb.

You're 1316 West 17.

1613.

1613 to flux.

We can put them out front, and the guy on the second house up on Ross could put his out on the street because they drive right by.

Well, I'll have Aira look to see if that's in the vicinity of any of the ones that they're gonna propose.

I know it is, and me and you're gonna need to talk anyway.

Have you had um I I'd love to get them out of there.

Okay, if you're in the vicinity of these tests, these guys will get you added, and let's get it, give it a try and see how it works.

Well, I have no problem with it because I mean the neighbor can put them right on the end of the alley, and the other guy either you can walk down or you can put them out in front of us.

Excellent.

Because they drive right by his house.

Thank you.

To come back around the corner.

Okay, so thank you.

Does does any I need you to stick around enough?

Okay.

We'll get your stick around.

Bobby, anybody else?

Does any of this change?

Does any of that change the the fees, the price, the cost?

No.

Even when you make a in-person personal pickup, it's the same.

Same.

If they so what we do currently, it's like a medical waiver.

Um, and if it's for the same situation, there's no fee.

They just file the medical waiver and we go do curbside pickups or walk up to their driveway or whatever.

Thank you for improving the service.

That waiver is on our website.

Okay.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Anybody else be heard?

Any citizen be heard?

Oh, Michael.

Name and address or not address, just your name, Mike.

Um my name is Michael Bayala.

I have a several I have uh several questions.

Um the first one is about uh the city employees, uh, especially the one working on the inspection uh for the program.

Michael, can I ask you a question?

Is this about the trash?

No, we're done.

No, okay, we're all moved on.

Okay.

I was gonna say we already closed that.

Yeah, okay.

I'm sorry.

So you're saying you're saying no, continue on.

Yeah, go ahead.

No, go ahead, Michael.

No, no, Michael, go ahead.

Go ahead.

Go ahead.

I just want to make sure you weren't gonna talk about trash because we closed it.

I've been dealing with for this issue for almost two years.

In one of my properties, there is a water line belong to the city on the city limit.

And the water line came as a T on each one.

When I have that property for almost 10 years, I never received any letter telling me that you know the city changed the code on that, and that uh I became the owner, I got to pay for all the tenant who has been on that property.

I was paying as a tenant before.

So I came here to pay for the water.

They told me that my water bill is about $800.

I said, what?

What's going on?

And they told me that they changed the code, and then as a landlord, I got to pay for the as a landlord.

I said, in uh in Iowa, nobody can do that without a warning telling you a letter, sending you a letter to change it.

It was no no letter.

They changed it.

But it was not a big deal.

I pay for it.

So it came to a point and they told me if I want to segregate it, I got to uh hire a contractor.

So the and then it will be on my own expenses.

I said, okay, that's not a big deal.

So I did not do it.

When my b my uh building burned down, they came, the city came with the inspector, they shut off the water for the three uh uh properties.

I said, why do you guys uh shut the water for the three properties?

They said, oh no, we cannot open this one because uh each one is uh uh is not dependent.

I said, no.

Each one I've been paying by one person.

If it has been paying by one person, you guys got to reopen it.

So one of the inspectors who was a very nice at that time, uh, went back and then reopened it.

So they told me, oh, you get to rechange, you got to change it.

I said, no, I cannot, because this is not on my property line.

The line is of the water I use.

So last last month, last month, the same issue reappened again.

So I came to pay.

The or they came, I pay for the two properties because uh we never use the property who was burned.

So for me, I don't have to pay for the water because the mirror will come as a zero.

So they came and they told me that I got to pay for that.

I said no.

This is where we start having a problem.

The lady told me you got to pay for it.

If you don't pay for it, we don't open the water, we don't give you the water.

I went back and I pay.

So for that, since that time, I have been having several other issues with uh the city inspection.

One that were uh there were pool or the light what was belonged to the city.

So the city came with a contractor fixing it.

The next thing I get was a bill of $720.

I took that bill, I came here and then I asked them.

I said, why did I have to pay for this bill?

They said, oh no, is that I said the pool, the the the pool, the light pool does not belong to me.

It belongs to the city.

This is the city responsibility to fix that, and then you guys bring your contractor to fix it.

You never send me any letter to fix anything.

So why do you want me to pay?

So at that time I talked to the manager, the manager said, Oh no, oh, we can fix that.

Oh, we can fix it.

You don't need to worry about it.

But the code was really wrong.

I told them that you cannot read that code and ask me how many people you scam that way.

How many people you scam that way?

So he told me, oh, we we uh it's not a problem, we're gonna fix it for you.

But when I went to pay uh for my uh uh appropriate taxes, you show up an extra $720.

Yes.

And I pay for it.

Okay.

Is that a street light you're talking about?

A big overhead street light?

Yes, and what happened to it.

Was it damaged in the fire?

Is that what caused the problem?

City concerned women.

I got some people uh there have been doing uh wrong.

The city of some inspectors who are very rude, very rude, and then uh I can name them, I can name them.

First, I have on my uh on my house, I tried to extend the porch.

So I came here.

I came here to ask them what was the dimension that I need to do.

So they give me, so I went down there, and then first when you ask them, you ask them the question.

I'm not an expert on construction.

So I want them to be the one to explain to me what measurement I need.

The guy was so rude.

It was to a point where I got to back up, and then I have to send somebody else to ask him the same question.

And then that person came, and that person is a Charlie Salman who came and see them and say, hey, this is this, this is that.

So when I came to a point, uh the the reason why I bring that to you guys is this in the city of uh Sioux City.

I don't think that the inspectors got to be rude, one that's improfational, and then it's not acceptable.

It does not matter.

Is it Michael?

Is there anybody?

It does not matter.

If I cannot if if I don't understand something, somebody got to be there to explain to me, to explain that to me.

That's why we vote for them, that's why we pay taxes, that's why we want them to be there for it.

I told them that I'm gonna bring it to the city council.

And I'm bringing that.

That's not finished.

I have the same people that I have my cars that's a park in my house.

They came, they sent me a letters.

They want well first it was the grass.

They did not send me any letter to say your grass is too much.

No.

They went and cut it and then want me to pay.

I say I'm not gonna pay.

They keep sending me letters.

I said, I'm not gonna pay.

You're supposed to send me a letter.

And then I call the mine.

I called the mine.

The wine said that uh previously they got to send you a letter.

They did not did that.

So I did not come for I I came for you guys to take that to maybe educate them, educate them, because if we keep Googleing on, I don't want to use the social media to use for this issue and then bring that.

No, I have a big respect for the city council people.

I have the big respect for the governor of for the government of uh Sioux City.

So please, please, please, please.

If they have a problem, they can fix it at home before to come here.

This is a public service, and then they have to be there for the citizen of Sioux City.

Thank you.

Michael.

Yeah.

Mike uh you want to meet with him and try to figure some of the stuff out.

I'll follow up with inspections, but I'll let you know.

Okay.

All right.

Anyone else to be heard?

John Williams, 1613 with 17.

Bob, you're off the hook.

Um I'm curious on the meridians on West 14th.

Wellesley Parkway.

Whose idea was that?

The what?

The meridians off of 14th Street.

And they make you turn right.

Or you have to turn right now.

Well, nobody ever turned.

Yeah.

You sit there and watch.

My problem is who's gonna keep maintaining that?

Because nothing large can go through there without either hitting the curb on the left or going over the curb on the right, which I remember right.

There's sprinklers there.

City buses, city trucks, fire department.

Come winter, your plows are gonna take that centerpiece out.

Because it's not wide enough for a plow to go through.

Where's the set?

It's right behind the Chick-fil-A.

Chick-fil-A.

Chick fil Are you behind like by scooters?

Like behind there.

You have going south?

It's got a pork shop there.

No, either way, coming down the road from 14th.

It's got a pork.

Or coming above Omaha Street.

We have to go right.

You can't cross uh you now have to turn right either way.

Oh, I see what you're talking about.

Well, first of all, people are driving around it.

Yeah, because it's not out for enough.

And there's no room to add on.

Well, my thing is it's not wide enough.

Anything large going through there.

School bus.

I'm having a hard uh city bus goes over the curb.

You're talking about the new Chick-fil-A, right?

On West 14.

Right behind 14th.

Oh, okay.

I'm in the wrong way.

Right where Chick-fil-A is.

Right, but they forced that because traffic like the rear of where scooters would be that street race.

Over by Waller Fix.

Empties out on the West.

Between Lawlers and Chick-fil-A.

Yeah.

Right.

You guys put in curbs.

I'll call them curbs.

I call them already in.

And it's to clarify traffic flow, but you're saying it's not wide enough for it's not wide enough.

Your city plow is gonna take it.

Might as well come up.

We're gonna speak to it.

Oh he's gone.

I wouldn't vote.

I don't vote for median, so you got the wrong guy, but anyway.

I don't know.

Well, no, no, no, it's a lot of things.

Why is the traffic flower?

I was gonna say, and it was one of those to my knowledge, it was just about the traffic flow because of traffic, the anticipated traffic with Chick-fil-A, if I remember right.

And I think that I haven't even known.

Yeah, they did.

I was gonna say I didn't notice it either.

I remembered the discussion of right in, right out, but I didn't know we installed traffic study.

You go about it right now with the clear traffic.

Have you seen this?

Have you ever been out there yet?

I've just no Patrick Simon's field services, yes.

I just drove through there as well.

It was it was one of those deals I I believe through engineering department.

That was again, like you say, to hinder traffic flow.

Yeah, there was some holdup on 14th cutting across the Wesley corridor to Omaha Street.

Yeah, but they were trying to is already trying to eliminate that safety concern with with traffic flowing across four lanes of traffic.

Right.

Like an and I agree.

Did that come up in your meetings?

It came up here.

We voted on the public.

They call it a pork chop to divide the traffic.

But you talked about it at the end.

Yeah, we did.

The problem is people still go straight, they still turn left.

Well, that's on them though.

They have to learn not to do that and opt that they're gonna be able to do that.

You actually made it worse than it was.

Well, because people like to go straight, they like to turn left there.

Now you're technically you have to go clear around the room.

I know I know to get in there.

That was the decision that the traffic study and the engineering made.

Well, like I say, there's not enough room there.

I was gonna say, Patrick, I guess my question is look, I understand we're going to want to, especially once it opens, I think you're gonna see an increased traffic presence, and I think you're going to probably be able to you're it's going to necessitate a right in, right out, and some of those things.

My concern that you're bringing up is if it's wide enough for trucks or for anything.

I mean, let alone your vehicles or semis trying to get in or out because it's not, that's where it's going to take.

I didn't run out of it.

Yeah, not a semi.

Or just any truck.

I watched a semite come through there.

His rear wheels went way up over the curb.

Oh, well, that's too bad.

There were things.

They shouldn't be doing that.

That's not anything that we've had opportunity to experience yet.

Obviously, they're fairly new to this.

I'm gonna drive through there on my way home for you.

Evaluate the bolt work at it.

We need to adjust with it.

I live over there.

Assuming they can.

And maybe even just and I'll have Tom look at it tomorrow.

Yeah, drive out there or see and I'll drive out on my way home because I guess I don't I haven't paid attention, so I didn't know.

It's like if you're coming from Healing and you're going out that backside, Bob.

Okay.

All right, I'll take a look tonight.

Okay.

I don't want to keep paying for that when the plows and everything destroyed.

Yeah.

All right.

We'll take we'll just check it out.

Thank you.

Anyone else?

Come on, Ben.

You've been patient, bro.

Like, what do you want to say?

Good to watch.

Just want to see government in action today.

Okay.

All right.

Taking a class.

Mr.

O'Kane.

Mr.

O'Kane.

Oh, hold on.

Sorry.

Mm is John Searles.

I live at 425 Buckwalter Drive.

Um, it's not a pertinent uh subject that I have, but I'd understand you want to develop downtown.

But you do have businesses downtown that have been empty for four years that you do manage.

I mean, Thorpe and Company Jewelers has been empty for four years.

Now there's boards on the windows.

I mean, you want to bring business to Sioux City.

Well, what about the real estate you have downtown that is empty?

I mean, what are you gonna do about that?

I mean, I moved the city, I I bought three safes from Rusty Clark.

That's how I remember that.

I bought those four years ago.

Is that about our only property that we do own that that would be for rent?

First floor property.

The first floor property at Thorpe.

That's about our only one.

Would be honest.

No, we don't own that.

No, we don't own the whole first floor.

No, we don't own that.

We only have to be a good one.

So no Lou owned everything up above.

Correct, correct.

Louis's part of the back, and we just own the Thorpe and the little building next door.

Yeah, we don't own much.

And it's been under a lot of repairs, water problems, et cetera.

So we haven't aggressively been trying to pursue it until we got it up to SNOP.

And I I would and this is another subject I'll cross over to.

I work for Mid American Energy.

We did a big excuse me, Gordon Drive project in 2014.

There's a lot of stuff buried down along Gordon Drive.

Because we had to cut a lot of main out down there to do that big Gordon Drive project.

So it's surprise, surprise.

Well, and I I didn't know if you are you done.

I'll respond.

Yeah, no, and what was your name, man?

John.

John.

John, I look, I I understand what you're saying, and I don't disagree, right?

I mean, I sit on downtown partners, I believe a lot in the commerce of downtown.

I think we're trying to grow it.

We have more residents that are living down there.

We've had new businesses relocating or opening downtown, which I think is encouraging, but we do still have empty spaces, and that frustrates me.

And I think I would say, I mean uh we're working on a couple of them, um, but I think we need to aggressively go forward on some of these.

They're mostly not ours, but I will say that you know, we've we're doing different grant programs and things that are trying to spur like tenant improvement programs, and then there's also um a rent relief program through downtown partners.

There are different avenues we're trying to assist those properties with.

But what I would tell you too is the big difference in my mind, is if you're a new developer or a large scale developer, or even say a bank wanting to open up a new headquarters in a more downtown location, you're looking for a larger site, or you're looking for a space where you can have a little more creative control with it, and sometimes that's more appealing.

So that's why I think this is a little more better investment for the city.

And what I'll say is with regards to what Councilman Moore said earlier, especially with in speaking about the property downtown that that I think you're talking about.

Um that's that's a big reason why we that have that 120 days, and we are gonna aggressively do an environmental study on it and and hopefully find out what's under the ground.

Make sure that that this is a a worthwhile investment and something that can add to our skyline or add to our future in Sioux City.

We're not gonna sign on to buy it if it's gonna be a lot more work than it's worth.

That's what I'm what I would say.

Right.

I had something else, but I forgot.

But well, you can come back next week.

Well, I'm sorry, man.

Yeah, thank you.

I try to make it once in a while when I can.

Yeah, okay.

Thank you for your comments.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Okay, now Matthew.

Nothing, nothing this week.

Julie.

Nothing this week either.

I think this was a full meeting.

I think there was lots of really good discussion.

I'm glad we had a full gallery, and I hope that folks who had questions got them answered, and we'll see everybody next week.

Alex.

I'm excited for Ben to start his candidacy for whatever he's doing, or maybe his probation officer is forcing him to be here.

I'm not sure.

Your community service.

Exactly.

No.

You miss Larry Twaite and come having to come to the council meeting to get that government credit.

Is that the deal?

All right.

No, I'll all I was going to say um was I just want to say I'm I'm thoroughly impressed and appreciative of the Arts Center staff and all of the volunteers and individuals that come together to make Art Splash possible.

Um I'm anxious to hear their overall feelings about um how it went switching the weekends off of Labor Day weekend.

Um I thought the weather they were trying to do that so that it wouldn't be quite as hot, uh, but it ended up seasonably hot.

Air conditioner work this year though.

That was nice.

It was nice and cool inside.

It's true.

And so it is one of those things where I'm I'm anxious to hear their overall assessment of the event.

But when I went down there for a few hours it was a lot of people were really happy and um appreciative to be there and I thought there were a lot of great exhibits and I just think they did a they do an extraordinarily great job from a volunteer standpoint.

Just taking care of the different vendors running that operation and providing entertainment very clean and what I love is just the overall family atmosphere.

It's not only about purchasing art um you know for those that maybe collect or are looking to buy a new piece but there's a ton of things for kids and I saw a lot of people having a lot of fun with that and so um but then there were a number of different fundraisers going on throughout the community that I was able to be a part of quite a few of them there's always a lot of need in the community but overall I thought in our facilities where we're hosting them our teams were doing really a great job and so I appreciate that work very much.

That's all I have okay I just I want to thank the mayor for his leadership and with the path we're taking with the city manager's position as well as with the assisted assistant city manager position and uh and things are looking really good and really good.

Mike I appreciate working with you as a city manager and uh you're very um you're very responsive timely and and you're doing good work for us.

So I want I want to thank you for that but thank you mayor.

That's all I have I move we adjourn.

So I'm getting ready to get back into the Christmas decoration business in my front yard and I have to meet the young man that's gonna do all the work.

I write the checks he does the work.

I'm gonna second that moment waters more thanks everybody it's magazine you know the guy