I am calling to order the special committee on reducing red tape.

It is Wednesday, March 18th at 1203 p.m.

Madam Clerk, please call the roll.

Alderman Narayan.

Vice Chair Browning.

Present.

Audible woman Velasquez.

Present.

Alderman Aldridge.

Alderwoman Cox Antwerp Chair Sweiser.

Present.

Altum and Ryan.

Alder Woman Cox Antwi Four Present.

We have a quorum.

Thank you, Madam Clerk.

Quorum being present, we'll move on to approval of the minutes.

I do want to note that the minutes from Wednesday, November 19th, at the top, it says 1230 a.m.

So if that could just be added to say 1230 p.m.

Um and with that edit, I would entertain a motion to adopt the minutes from Wednesday, November 19th, 2025.

So moved.

Second.

Madam, it's been moved by the Alderwoman from the sixth, second and from the Alderman from the 14th.

Madam Clerk, please call the role.

Audible woman with Lascass.

Aye.

Aye.

Audible woman Cox Antwer.

Yeah, I know.

I'm trying.

Chair Sweitzer.

Aye.

Altman Narayan.

Madam Clerk, I think there, Madam Uh, Alderman Narayan and Alderwoman Cockry are just need to be moved over.

So why don't you move them over if you could do the roll the second time through the wonderful.

Okay.

Alderman Ryan.

I woman Cox Antwin.

I we have six eye votes.

Thank you.

With that vote, we have passed the motion of or passed the minute approval of the minutes from Wednesday, November 19th, 2025.

Um moving on.

We will move to board bills for review.

We have one board bill to review today.

That is board bill number 15 introduced by Alderman Aldridge.

Alderman Aldridge, you are recognized on board bill 152.

All right.

Thank you, madam chairwoman and members of the red tape committee.

Uh Board Bill.

Uh eventually we will have a committee sub, but I'll just high level talk about what the bill is, and then hopefully we can adopt the committee sub to talk about the changes from the original bill to uh the committee sub and then have some amendments.

So board bill 152 um is ultimately uh repealing and amending sort certain uh ordinance uh within our food truck and vending district uh code.

So this has been a long in the works bill.

I think this is probably the third year that uh this bill has been filed and worked on as got out of committee last year.

Uh and I think we're at a really good point of getting out uh and hopefully getting it to the floor uh this year.

This is a piece of legislation that has truly been um uh a group effort of many individuals.

So I do want to thank all individuals that have been at the table this year to kind of work on this piece of legislation.

Uh we've started to meet weeks ago with a lot of stakeholders.

Uh we had a stakeholder from the Central West M, Mr.

Jim uhier.

Uh well, make sure I get his last name right, Mr.

James Page from Downtown, uh DNA uh neighborhood association, Mr.

Matt O'Leary, who is over the downtown forward.

We had the president and the vice president of the food truck association.

We had the president of the food or the restaurant association who's here with us today, as well as individuals from the street department.

My office, Mr.

Matt Heskamp, as well as Ms.

April, who was amazing taking notes.

Somebody from the present office, Ms.

Janika Hayden helped on this policy.

And in the previous years, some of the language that we incorporated came from the mayor's office when KC was helping on the last version, as well as the streets department.

So what we plan to do when we eventually adopt the committee sub is we're ultimately trying to cut red tape for food trucks for them to be able to operate.

One of the things I heard as I spoke with a lot of food truck owners is it wasn't really clear between SLDC and the streets department when they would get their map of where they actually can operate and vend.

So we want to clear that up and give more options but make it very detailed of where they can.

Food trucks uh throughout other cities have been very successful, as well as even in our city.

I know Tower Grove kind of do their food truck weekends.

Uh food trucks also set up in various spots, either in like the Central West End or in the Washu area.

Uh, but it is to give food truck operators more ability to hopefully uh know what the rules and regulations are so that they can van.

A lot of food trucks actually also have brick and mortars.

There's studies that show that a lot of food trucks who do not have the capital to go into brick and mortars, they start as a food truck to then hopefully open up a brick and mortar.

So before I walk through the bill and just talk about uh some of the changes that we're trying to do to make uh operations easier for our food trucks, I would just uh ask if we would uh be able to suspend the rules to introduce the committee sub to Board Bill 1520.

Okay, thank you very much, Alderman.

And with that, I will entertain a motion to adopt the committee substitute for board bill to suspend the rules to adopt the committee substitute for board bill 150.

I move that we suspend the rules to adopt the committee substitute for board bill 152.

Second.

We have a move and move by Alderman Alder Woman from the sixth ward, seconded by the alderman from the 14th ward to adopt to suspend the rules to adopt the committee substitute for board bill 152.

Madam Clerk, please call the Alderman O'Reilly.

Vice Chair Browning.

All right.

Alderman Aldrich.

Aye.

How the woman Cox Antwin.

Aye.

Chair Sweitzer.

Aye.

We have six aye votes.

Thank you.

Your vote, you have sustained the motion from the Alderwoman of the Sixth Board and suspended the rules for the purposes of introduction of adopting uh board bill number 152 committee substitute.

Board bill number 152 committee substitute is now in front of us, in front of us.

Alderman, you may proceed.

Thank you, Madam Chairwoman, members of the committee.

Uh, a lot of things, and I sent a red line version to everybody as well as the the bolded clean copy of it.

So there is several things that is going to stay in the current uh food truck ordinance.

At some point, the goal is to uh work with all those stakeholders and bring back to the table next session to do an overhaul cleanup of the food truck uh ordinance because when you look at it, it addresses food trucks, it addresses sidewalks, and one of the things that we will change is it talks about food vendors.

So with uh working with the streets department, we did clean up just striking out the food vendor on page through four of uh the clean version, and we inserted what a food or mobile food vendor is or vehicle vendor, which means any person who sells or offer the sales of goods, merchandise, service goods, or beverages from self-contained uh motorized vehicles.

So it wasn't very clear in the vehicle language uh what a kind of food truck is.

So instead of uh just keeping the vehicle vendor, we end up uh changing that and including mobile food truck or or mobile food vendor or vehicle vendor.

On page five of the bill, and I'm trying to on the same page, I'm trying to keep up the red line version and the actual clean copy.

On page four, one of the things you'll see is we took out all the word districts because what these will ultimately be called is uh commercial or vending commercial markets.

So in the previous ordinance, it says a lot of vending districts, a lot of vending districts, which later throughout the bill, we got rid of all the vending districts as we created uh more uh direct uh centralized uh food truck kind of markets.

So you'll see districts striked out throughout the bill, starting on page four where it is uh bolded, and then the red line copy, you'll see it on that.

So it's not in the clean copy where you see the strikeout of districts, but in the red line copy, we striked out the districts.

One of the things that we did keep in with the districts on the next page is uh the wharf district, which was already uh in ordinance.

So the wharf district is located uh down at the arch.

It is uh kind of a district that was established a long time ago that is agreement with the Arch Foundation and the City of St.

Louis that they have the rights to be able to sell right there on uh the arch grounds where they typically sell that amazing popcorn and lemonade.

So we did keep that uh exemption in there for the arch, as well as there was in a previous ordinance, there was language that uh had an exemption for like South of Downtown, which mainly is uh Bush Stadium.

So we made sure that that exemption for Bush Stadium stayed in.

Uh they kind of own the rights to those grounds and they already have food truck events.

Um that was an agreement that the food truck vendors were fine with because if uh the the Cardinal Savion event, they usually call the food trucks and invite the certain food trucks that they want uh kind of on their property.

So we did keep in uh the wharf district and then areas south of downtown, which is uh the Cartinals.

What you will see on page five is where we established the new uh vending commercial markets.

So there will be an amendment that will change one of those, but we established several as well as uh at one of those markets.

So what we did is we established uh a central west end market, a Cherokee commercial vending district market, a citywide parks vending market, which was already in the uh bill, and we work with the parks department uh from last year to say that the parks have the ability to maintain and direct if a food truck can go in a park.

There's language later in the bill that there's a process that people would have to go to if they would like a food truck in the park.

They would have to reach out to the parks department.

It only can happen on Fridays due to limited staffing.

We want to make sure that we're not pulling our uh parks department and stretching them thin.

We also included a downtown commercial vending district, uh, and I'll walk through the areas.

So the Central West End, which there will be an amendment uh very soon to probably strike that out, is along Duncan Ave between the intersection of South Sarah and South Boyle.

Uh after some conversations with uh Cortex, which will strike that out.

They already have, I think uh the Aldman can speak to this a little more a little bit more.

I think it's a common ground area, but they already have events where they have food trucks in the areas.

They're also looking to bring restaurants kind of along Duncan.

So uh they're already kind of participating in the process.

So we didn't want to add another layer that probably will complicate that.

In the Cherokee district, I worked with the Alderwoman of the 7th, and I know she worked with the SID, where we created intersections at Cherokee between Jefferson Ave and Compton.

Uh and uh Jefferson Ave and Compton and the curb lines of Cherokee Street at the first alleys located north and south of the block.

So basically when you travel down uh Cherokee, we're looking at streets like I'll uh uh Iowa, uh Nebraska, uh, and those streets are very unique where they are very close to residential.

So we put language in there that said uh very close to the alleyway.

So we have worked with the SIDs and the Alder Woman to be very clear where uh they cannot go beyond the alley because beyond the alley is where you kind of get into the residential.

And the downtown commercial market, we're looking at the public right away among Market Street between the intersection, the South 8th Street and South 16th Street.

So they would be located up and down market from 8th to 16th.

One of the things that is been talked about as I talk to uh people that work downtown is there's not a lot of food options uh for people that you know work downtown, and you know, we have Bobby who's out on the corner who sells amazing food, but there's not a lot of options for people to get food uh kind of during those work hours.

Another market that we're adding is the downtown West Commercial Vending Market, which will be right outside of the intersection on Olive and 18th Street and 19th Street, uh, right near the uh police station uh in conversations with MLS Soccer.

Uh, they was in agreement with being able to add this location so as people leave the soccer game that they could be able to go to a food truck, and we also added uh a location at North uh Leffingwell and Bermuda uh right uh that was one of the suggestions from the food truck associations right outside of Worlds Fargo Wales Fargo.

They used to have a lot of food truck options out there, but they kind of stopped.

So we're adding that back in.

One of the another location that we're adding is a Grand Center Commercial Vending District with talking with Grand Center Arts.

Uh, they was in support of this location.

It's kind of right outside of Sophie's uh bar, and uh that is located right at Josephine.

So this new location would be along Washington between Compton and Josephine.

Again, there's not a lot of food options there.

Typically, if you go to Sophie's, there is a food truck that pull up there, but technically, uh, just the way that it's written, you know, probably shouldn't be there.

So we just want to clarify to make sure that they have the right to be there and to give that food option to them.

Again, we talked with the grand center, and they was in very uh support of making sure that there's more food options in the grant center.

As you get to page nine of the bill, this is where we talk about.

Give me a second.

Actually, page 11 of the bill is where there's language that already talks about sidewalk and vehicle vendors.

I want to be very clear, we did not touch anything when it comes to sidewalk vendors.

Again, in the code, when you look at food trucks and sidewalk vendors, they're kind of all into one.

Uh, we did not want to touch sidewalk vendors.

That was never uh the goal when we worked on the legislation last year, and also this year is to uh touch the sidewalk vendors, but to start with the food truck.

Hopefully, when we come back around and ultimately do a huge cleanup of the code because it's all in one that we will be able to touch the sidewalk vendors.

But we did add on page 11 on line five uh that these designated uh commercial vending markets that are established in the previous section of the mobile food truck should not be uh applied to the sidewalk license vendor.

So basically we're just keeping those separate.

We're keeping the food truck and the sidewalk vendors uh separate.

All licensees from the sidewalk vendors uh currently have to go through the streets department, which they already currently do, and any sidewalk vending operate operating uh prior to this passage of the ordinance will still be able to um operate in the current form.

So we didn't want to pass this bill and then make it even more confusing for the sidewalk vendors.

We want to be very clear.

This was only uh about our food trucks.

On the next page, this was just an addition that the streets department thought would be important is when we talk about insurance that also there must be uh on their insurance, they must be listed uh with the city of St.

Louis.

Right below that, again in our code.

Uh originally the bill said sidewalk and vehicle vendors shall uh only be permitted to operate from 6 a.m.

to 11 p.m.

Since we are changing the operating hours of food trucks, we end up striking that out.

We created a new A and B.

The A is uh for the businesses that are sidewalk vendors, we're keeping them at 6 a.m.

to 11 a.m., which is in the current ordinance, and we're extending the hours for food trucks from 6 a.m.

to 1 p.m.

Further down on that page in section on page 14 line 15.

We talk about O, which basically the street department shall maintain all applications of licensed uh vendors and shall publicly post those on the website so that people can know exactly who are the licensed food trucks that are allowed to be in those areas.

Uh in section or line 21 on page 14 at 8.108A, we created this new uh mobile food vending permit display, which ultimately will display a permit price or a permit number on each food truck uh vehicle so that people can be able to identify what the food truck is and who the food truck is.

And we talk with the streets department, they are in full support to be able to kind of create this new placard that will now be displayed on each food truck.

Uh, they shall have a decal that is no less than six inches in diameter uh and six inches uh of kind of a square footage uh on all sides.

Uh these must be displayed on the outside of the food truck.

The streets apartment will work with the food trucks to create these new placers so that these decals can be scannable and also it will be a link that will go to the city uh public database to know if this food truck is actually a uh food truck that is licensed with the city of St.

Louis.

When we get to page 17 of 21, uh we struck out a lot of language that was in the old bill, and we just added again the cleanup between vehicle and a mobile food truck, and just added all vehicle vendors must comply with this display display uh requirement of the section that is above, which is talking about the permit or the decal that has to go on the food truck uh that the streets department is now in favor of doing.

When we get to it's a lot of strikeouts here from the O one on page 20 of 21, uh we did add a complaint in violation uh kind of process so that people that have issues with either food trucks that uh are not operating in good faith or food trucks that are operating out of the hours of operations, um, can have a process to be able to file a complaint with uh CSB.

And we did put like a process of how many complaints uh will lead up to uh potentially a suspension uh and violations against the food truck and even potential revoction uh of their food truck license up to one year, which is right below that.

So it does give kind of due process just because somebody file a complaint with a food truck.

It will be investigated by the street department.

If three uh legitimate violations are actually found to be deemable, the food truck permit shall be suspended just for two weeks, and we'll work with the street department to make sure whatever actions is corrected.

If five violations are determined or that actually exist, then the food truck permit will be revoked for a one-year uh process.

Again, we wanted to add some kind of accountability in there to make sure that uh we know why a lot of our food trucks are operating in good standing.

But if there is a complaint of a food truck, that there's a complaint process.

And on the very last page, page 21 of 21, uh, we added that uh we will review this uh legislation within one year.

The goal is to continue to keep all the stakeholders at the table to make sure where these vending areas are, that uh things are going fine, that there's no issues, and then review, review it if we need to uh remove maybe certain vending zones or hopefully some alders say, hey, this is a great piece of legislation, or we would like to add some vending zones within our area.

Um, so we will have a one-year uh review from the Board of Alderman uh that I'm personally committed to.

And I know I've talked with everybody who's at the kind of working group that will review this legislation in a year to uh follow back up to see what needs to be cleaned up or what needs to be improved on this legislation.

But again, the the goal of it is to ultimately, since this is a red tape committee, cut a lot of red tape uh that our food trucks are currently going through so that they could be able to operate in more areas, but being very clear where those areas that they can operate in so that not only is it clear for the food truck operators, but it's also clear for people in the city where food trucks can and cannot be.

If there is a special event, this does uh there is exemptions where you know, if there's an event downtown where they close off the street and they want to have food trucks, this is not uh stop them or any other neighborhood from being able to have a food truck at a special event.

Uh, there is language in there that also separates uh food trucks a certain amount of feet from brick and mortar.

There will be an amendment that will be coming that increase that distance that we worked with the restaurant association to move it from 150 feet to 200 feet.

However, all these areas where uh we are looking at having these food truck markets are far enough away from restaurants, as well as we talked with um we talked with the individuals in the areas and make sure uh that it was okay for these food trucks to be at these certain locations.

So before we go into questions, madam chair, uh if we want to maybe adopt the amendments, then we can have like the pool bill in front of us to walk through any questions that committee members may have.

I think that is a great idea, Alderman.

Let's start with amendment number one to board bill number 152.

I see Alder Woman Jamie Cox Antry has proposed this.

Um if uh Alder Woman Cox Andrew wants to make a motion to adopt, and if someone else seconds it, we can have discussion of that.

Thank you, madam chairwoman.

Yes, I would like to move to adopt amendment one to board bill 152.

Second.

It's moved by the Alderman from the eighth ward, seconded by the aldermen from the ninth ward.

Uh discussion on this amendment.

Alder Roman Cox Anthony, you are recognized.

Thank you, Madam Chairwoman.

Yes, amendment one uh is specifically designed to add Seoulard onto the list of neighborhoods and areas that are included in this board bill.

Um, the reason that we felt it was necessary to add Soulard, similar to a lot of the other areas that Alderman Aldrich designated.

Um, there is a lot of activity, foot traffic, and interest in the Seulard community as well.

Um, and as the intention of this bill is to make sure that we're clarify where food trucks are and aren't allowed to operate.

Um, we felt it was necessary given that uh Seulard would be a very attractive neighborhood where some food truck trucks may want to consider operations to have a clear designated place for them to operate as well.

Um, already uh in the section of the code Soulard Market was um discussed and carved out.

Um, and my amendment doesn't necessarily restrict any operations for vendors inside of the Soulard Market footprint.

Um, rather it would allow a small stretch of Seulard outside of the market area for food vendors to park there.

Um, this area um as discussed with the Subaru Restoration Group and Seoulard Business Um District Association uh meets the similar descriptions as Alderman Aldridge described of other areas where uh we're not near any high residential area.

Rather, this area is already an active commercial strip where we do have restaurant activity and tourist activity, but again, this stretch is away from the main restaurant commercial stretch.

And so we would be separating the food trucks out so that they are not parking directly in front of restaurant and brick and mortar establishment.

So again, the small stretch of Lafayette Avenue is away from residential activity.

It's far away from existing brick and mortar restaurants, and it's on the other side of the park from the Seulard Market itself.

So we thought this was probably the best place to designate for food trucks in Seulard, and that Seulard would be a good community to add to this list of already good communities.

Thank you, Alderwoman.

Any other discussion on this amendment?

Alderman Aldridge?

Thank you.

I'll just add and I appreciate the Alderwoman for uh mentioning it, uh mentioning that there is uh the the carve out that was already in the language for the Sular Market.

We know that people pay uh to you know vend at the Sular Market.

So without uh creating uh more competition, I do appreciate in competition, it's not bad, but I appreciate the Alderwoman from the eighth with uh working with her neighborhood to try to identify areas that wouldn't be as close to a good option uh where there is lack of food, but in the uh language that there is or in the bill that's already in the carve out for Soular Market as well.

So I appreciate uh flagging that.

Okay, any further discussion?

Okay, it's been moved by the alderwoman from the eighth, seconded by the alderman from the ninth to adopt amendment number one to board bill one fifty-two committee substitute.

Uh all in favor, signify by saying aye.

Aye, aye.

Any opposed motion carries.

We have adopted amendment number one to board bill 152 committee sub.

Looks like amendment number two is um alderman Aldridge.

So if you'd like to make an amendment to adopt amendment number two, board bill 152 committee sub as amended.

Continue.

Thank you, madam chairwoman and members of the committee.

Uh amendment number two.

Please make a motion first.

Okay.

Can I make a motion to adopt amendment number two to board bill 152 committee substitute as amended?

Second.

Been moved by the alderman from the 14th, seconded by the alderwoman from the sixth.

Alderman uh from the 14th, please proceed.

Thank you, madam chairwoman.

Amendment number two on page three.

Uh uh, on page three where we talk about all the vending districts.

What we're doing is we're striking out the central west end vending district.

And then uh since we adopted amendment number one that creates Soulard, we just correctly put them in alphabetical order where now we will have Cherokee uh vending district, the city wide vending district, the downtown commercial vending district, downtown west commercial vending district, uh the Grand Center uh commercial vending district, and then adding in uh Alderwomen uh from the uh eighth Suulard vending district, but uh within conversations of people in cortex, uh we felt that it may uh make sense to strike that one out because there's already food truck activity where they do invite food trucks um to uh come within that area.

So we're striking out the central west end vending district and then just re-alphabetizing uh the rest of the districts as well as the one that's added by the Alderwoman from the eighth.

Okay, and is this on page five or page three?

You're actually right, it is actually on page five.

Okay, madam clerk.

Can you please note that in the amendment?

It's beginning on page five.

Okay, yes.

So amendment number two says beginning on page, making sure that it's page five.

Not page three, correct.

Page five.

Thank you for that.

Check out woman.

Yes, you're welcome.

Let me just make sure.

Okay.

Okay.

Okay, any further discussion on amendment number two.

Seeing none, we have a motion to adopt amendment number two to board bill 152 committee substitute as amended from the alderman from the 14th, a second from the alder woman from the sixth.

All in favor, signify by saying aye.

Aye.

Any opposed motion carries.

We've adopted amendment number two to board bill number 152, committee substitute as amended with that change um from page three to page five.

Okay, Alderman Aldridge, you are recognized uh first to make the amendment.

Amendment number three.

Um if you'd like to make that amendment.

All right, motion.

My goodness.

I'd like to make a motion that we adopt amendment number three to board bill 152 committee substance.

Second.

It's been moved by the alderman from the 14th, seconded by the Alderwoman from the 6th to adopt amendment number three to board bill number 152 as amended.

Alderman Aldridge, you may be seen.

Thank you, Madam Chair Wellman.

We did get the page right this time and the line.

This was one of the requests from the Restaurant Association and negotiating a gift faith so on line 12, where we talk about, and this was already language that was uh currently in our code where it says no license vendors shall can uh vend with their business within 150 feet.

We're changing that from 150 feet to 200 feet again.

Um it was uh negotiated with the restaurant association to just uh make sure that there's that kind of protection between brick and borders and food truck, even though uh the distance that we are looking at will not be uh within the kind of that range of those restaurants.

So that is amendment number three.

Okay, any further discussion.

It's been moved by Alderman from the 14th, seconded by the Alderwoman from the 6th to adopt amendment number three to board bill 152, committee substitute as amended.

All those in favor signify by saying aye.

Aye.

Any up any opposed motion carries.

We've adopted amendment number one, two, and three to a board bill one fifty-two committee substitute as amended.

Alderman Aldridge, you may proceed.

Thank you.

Uh I will take questions unless if we want to go to the public.

I know other people here to speak.

So great.

Thank you so much.

I will uh do public comment before we move forward with members of the committee.

So if you are here to speak on this, make sure you've signed in with the clerk on the table up there.

Uh once you've done so, we'll move to have everyone sworn in at the same time.

Um, and every speaker will be allowed three minutes to speak.

So we'll just give people one minute to get signed up if they'd like to, and then we'll move forward.

Okay, madam clerk.

Uh, you have people signed up.

We have three people signed up.

Wonderful.

Everyone, anyone online as well?

No, just in the chambers.

Okay.

Well, if you are online and want to speak, make sure you raise your hand to let the clerk know.

But first for now, we'll start with the people who are in the room.

If you do plan on testifying, can you please raise your right hand?

Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?

Great.

All right, madam clerk, please have the first speaker called to the podium.

Mr.

James Dwyer in opposition.

But undecided.

Thank you, Mr.

Dwyer.

Please proceed.

Let's see.

Um, um first of all, I want to say that I applaud Alderman Aldridge.

Thank you.

Oh, thank you.

Applaud you twice.

So um I really appreciate the process that we have been engaged in now for well since early 2024.

So it's two years that we've been engaged in this uh effort to help shape a bill that works for all affected parties, and I think we have made phenomenal progress.

I don't think we're there yet, and that's why I'm here to testify today.

So um the first matter I want to bring to your attention, and I know I've only got three minutes, but I want to bring a procedural matter or question to your attention, and that has to do with Board of Alderman Rule 642, which requires that um proposed legislation be circulated by a certain time, 24 hours in advance of a committee hearing.

Uh I'm not certain of this, but my understanding is that that rule was not conformed with or to yesterday, and therefore I think there is a procedural question about whether the outcome of this proceeding today will have standing.

I just want to get that on the record.

So into my substantive comments.

Um, Madam Chair, members of the committee.

You may recall that an earlier version of this proposed legislation was first introduced as Board Bill 14 in April 2024 with the intention of creating a citywide vending district.

To their credit, a working group was convened by Alderman Aldridge and Greater St.

Louis, Inc.

with the objective of addressing concerns, reconciling differences, and achieving consensus on the details of that proposal.

Although substantial progress was made, critical matters remained unresolved, and Board Bill 14 was withdrawn from consideration in January 2025, with the understanding that the working group would reconvene to complete its mission.

Regrettably, no further action occurred over the following 12 months until the working group was reconvened by Alderman Aldridge four weeks ago on February 18th.

The group has met five times since then, most recently last Thursday, March 12th.

As before, substantial progress has been made, including a transformational switch from citywide to a concept of identifying defined zones, as was just described by the Alderman in multiple locations in which food trucks would be authorized to operate.

Multiple zones were proposed, each of which required review and reaction by the affected neighborhoods.

Meanwhile, several critical issues remained unresolved, including mandatory closing time, distance from established brick and mortar businesses, rules and regulations, and a process for filing and adjudication of complaints.

When the latest version of Board Bill 152, and I wrote this before the three amendments just introduced, uh, was generated this week, it contains sweeping last-minute provisions regarding sidewalk vending, a category that was not subject to meaningful consideration by the working group.

Instead, it was understood and agreed that either current provisions regarding sidewalk vending would remain unchanged from existing legislation and would be dealt with separately at a later date, or alternatively, all references to sidewalk vending would be removed from Board Bill 152.

Regrettably, the proposed legislation presented for your consideration today, contains problematic provisions that have not been reviewed or discussed in the working group.

Bottom line, in its present form, this legislation is not ready for consideration by the Alderman.

Important work remains to be done.

There is no compelling reason to rush this still incomplete legislation out of committee today, nor is there any reason why the working group cannot continue its work until a consensus is achieved, and legislation can be reintroduced early in the upcoming 2026-27 session.

So I urge you not to pass the bill out of committee today.

Thank you.

Thank you, Mr.

Dwyer.

Any questions from Mr.

Dwyer from members of the committee?

Alderman of the Ninth you recognize.

Thank you, Mr.

Dwyer.

It's always good to see you.

If you could say up here, we might have some questions for you.

I I don't have a question for you.

I just wanted to address the first point you made about the timeline.

We did suspend the rules at the beginning of the meeting in order to accept the committee substitute.

Uh you are right, there is typically a requirement of a 24-hour um period where the bill has to be submitted before the meeting, but we did suspend that rule uh by vote today.

So that that point is addressed, but we I do hear your concern about that, and um that is something I I plan on addressing uh in a bit about just the timeline this has been on.

So I do appreciate it.

Really a timeline issue for us.

It's just a matter of adequate time to do our work properly.

Mr.

Dreyer, for the record, can you say have you been part of the working group and you've been part of the working group from day one?

Yes.

I was invited to participate on day one, and I have been engaged.

Oh, I'm sorry.

I yes, um, and I have been engaged continuously from that point forward, as have a dozen other people.

Okay, thank you, sir.

Okay.

Uh Madam Clerk, if you could call the next speaker.

Brian Scott, Mr.

Scott, thank you for being here.

Just make sure to say your full name for the record.

Brian Scott.

Okay.

And are you uh resident of the city of St.

Louis?

I am born and raised in St.

Louis and a business owner.

Wonderful.

Please proceed.

Thank you.

Um, Madam Chairwoman um Alderman Board.

Appreciates you convening this today.

Um, I want to give special thanks to Alderman Aldrich, who has uh really taken up this um task, this monumental task of um benefitting the St.

Louis City, and this is what this is really about.

Um I am a food truck owner.

I am a restaurant owner as well.

I've had two restaurants in the city of St.

Louis, and I own a food truck, Doggy Max food truck, and I've been operating for eight years now.

And um, as I was said, uh born and raised in North St.

Louis, Euclid and St.

Louis Avenue.

Um, so I've been living in the city of the city of St.

Louis uh for the bulk of my life.

Um in that time as small business owners as a small business owner, as a black small business owner in St.

Louis, it is difficult to break in to um the American dream.

It's difficult to break into the um the chance to build something from nothing.

Um food trucks are a way to do that.

Um I've owned rest, like I said, restaurants and food trucks.

There are equal expenses in both, but to get into the food truck business is slightly easier to get than to get into the restaurant business because of um the mobility sake.

And that's what we're talking about here, and that's what this bill is really putting together.

It's allowing uh these mobile food truck owners who are just getting started to really uh make the best out of this business and grow and to be able to expand if they want into a brick and mortar.

Um it's really important to have places to vent.

In the last eight years that I've owned a food truck, there are places on the map to be able to vent, but um they are very limited and they are not necessarily what the map says they are.

So this bill is the start.

I agree with my friend Jim Dwyer, this is not the end.

This is just the beginning of something that's going to transform the St.

Louis community.

Um we definitely uh want to lay this groundwork so that in a year we can come back and readdress and hopefully build once this is a success.

Um Mr.

Dwyer did I want to make sure before my time runs out that I uh that I he said there's no compelling reason to pass this bill now.

Um I disagree um vehemently.

The compelling reason is that food truck owners are closing by the dozens every single year.

And it's because we don't have places to vend, primarily.

Um I disagree that there's not a compelling reason.

I think for the sake of taxpaying business owners in the city of St.

Louis, that that is the most compelling reason to get this started now.

Thank you so much for your comments.

Any questions?

Okay, seeing none.

Thank you, sir.

I appreciate you being here today.

Thank you.

Beal Gavel in support.

Wonderful.

Thank you, sir.

Just make sure to say your full name for the record and your city resident, which ward or business owner, and I appreciate you being here.

Billy Gomel.

And uh I'm not a city resident.

Okay, please proceed.

Um, I just uh I'm here today just to uh say thank you to uh Alderman Aldridge.

He's done a great job in uh in carrying this bill forward, uh forming a uh a red tape committee.

Uh we worked uh very well together and looking forward to continuing that work.

Um the restaurant association is in support of the food truck bill.

Um we believe that uh you know, food trucks uh present an opportunity of entrepreneurialism.

Uh we think that it addresses uh some of the growing issues that we have in St.

Louis.

I I live not far from here, but not in St.

Louis.

And uh, you know, where we've you know, we're as an industry, we're kind of falling on some tough times.

Kind of post-COVID increased cost in a lot of ways.

We have a lot of our restaurants that are leaving.

Uh we believe that uh food trucks are a big part of that community and help fill those some of those.

Um I don't really like to use the term food desert because we're not there yet, but thinking ahead, we could be that.

And uh so I also want to say uh thanks to the committee.

Uh we had originally proposed that uh we move them the food trucks 300 feet away from a brick and mortar with written permission.

Uh in the spirit of compromise, the alderman uh asked me to take back to my membership and poll them.

Um in the spirit of compromise, they were willing to bring that number down to 200 feet to help move this forward.

And uh we are also as an association uh in favor of the districts, the markets.

We think that that's a good opportunity um to help build the community in St.

Louis and help move the uh food trucks forward.

Thank you, sir.

And how many restaurants do you represent in the city of St.

Louis?

In St.

Louis, 714.

Wow, okay.

Statewide, we are the oldest uh restaurant association in the United States.

Statewide, we have 12,000 plus food establishments, many of them which are food trucks.

Many of them are brick and mortars that also have food trucks.

Thank you.

Any other questions from the members of the committee?

Alderman from the sixth, you're recognized.

Thank you.

I just want to clarify 714 within the city of St.

Louis.

Yes.

Thank you.

It is a 715, 714, I'm sorry, licensed establishments.

Um, in St.

Louis, some of them are uh sometimes street walk uh street side vendors, uh restaurants, brick and mortars.

So it's kind of a a broad variety there, but 714 licensed establishments.

Great, thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Any other questions from members of the committee.

Thank you.

Appreciate you being here.

Thank you very much for your service.

Of course.

All right, Alderman Aldridge, if you have any comments, uh then we'll go through members of the committee for questions.

Uh yes, uh I want to thank each person that was actually up here.

I've been part of uh the working group uh that I think has been two years now or since last year.

Um I do hear uh Mr.

Uh Jim's concern of uh, you know, we're dealing with groups uh with all different uh interests.

Uh just like at the Board of Alma, we never get like a hundred percent agreement.

Um I will say, you know, this board bill was filed at the last day of session.

We actually sent out this committee substitute to all working group members last week as well as every working group member that uh attended that meeting that we had Thursday was able to see uh before we put it in bill format, the draft of what the committee sub was.

So um everything that is uh in the committee sub was visible to all members.

Um there, you know, I hear the the sidewalk, we're not touching anything with sidewalks.

I don't know if maybe that's uh confusion.

There is language.

Um I think on page give me one second page 11 that mentions and this just came from the street department that mentioned sidewalk vendors.

I don't know if that's maybe where Mr.

Jim is getting confused, but that language again is just saying uh that the sidewalk language for sidewalk vendors because when you look at the chapter, uh they talk about food trucks and sidewalks all in the chapter, which is ultimately confusing because they also have different rules and regulations as well as operating hours that we will need to clean up, but we just want to make very clear that um you know this does not pertain to the sidewalks.

And I hear the suspension of the rules uh that was because of the committee substitute.

Uh I think it's like 30 something hours per arruse, but it's something I would say that's uh first before even committee members seen it.

I made sure that the working group seen it, and I know it's not in common.

I think all the women uh the HUDS committee, we suspended a committee substitute for the ARPA bill, which uh myself, you Alderman Browning, uh Sanye, Clark Hubbard, and Shane all voted for to suspend that rule to introduce that uh ARPA bill.

As you know, a lot of changes happen as you talk to all the people, and outside of talking to all the people is also uh meeting with uh stakeholders to try to get everyone uh I think as close as possible, and I feel really good about where we are, especially going from the citywide language and really tailoring it to uh descriptive areas and working with those autos to see if it works with them.

So I'll open up for any questions.

I really appreciate all those comments.

We'll move through the committee in order of seniority, starting with Alderman Narayan.

No questions, thank you.

Thank you, Alderman Velasquez.

Uh can you just talk through a little bit of the process of how you or how the bill ended up with those those areas?

Yeah, so originally the bill before we adopted the committee substitute.

I think Board Bill 14, as Mr.

Uh Jim uh or Dwyer had mentioned, the previous ordinance talked about a citywide approach.

Um, because the goal was like, how do we make it easier for food trucks to operate?

Um and one of the concerns that I heard from uh not just alders but the restaurant community um by making it citywide, not taking into account of the brick and mortar um locations that are there.

So one of the cool things I think that was a real huge change that came out of um that came out of uh this piece of legislation is to create those areas.

Some of them, you know, was individuals that was at the table of the working group.

So having downtown myself, uh represent downtown and Alderwoman Jamie Cox Antwerp represent downtown, uh, Mr.

Page and Mr.

Matt O'Leary was at the working group.

So we was like downtown would make uh sense.

Mr.

Jim uh was representing the Central West End.

So we wanted to include the West End Um Grand Center was a location that one of the stakeholders had brought up in the working group, and we have reached out to the grant center uh group to make sure that it worked with them uh outside of at least for the Central West End.

I know it may have been a tight turnaround, but I did have conversations with the Alderman on the floor.

If this worked, I talked with you Alderwoman Velasco as if there was any areas that would work for your area.

I reached out to Alderwoman Sweitzer to see if there's areas in the first ward before we get to hearing that would work.

Uh the Alder Woman from the seventh, which she indicated that she would love to have them on Cherokee Street.

So outside of reaching the stakeholders, I also reached out to uh every alder that uh would potentially be impacted by it by just saying, hey, would you like to have an area?

You know, as I talked to Alderman from the fifth, he said he wanted to keep the hill out of it.

Um so I reached out to colleagues as well as um took input from the people that was at the working group.

Great, thank you.

And then my last question, um I know that uh part of the process, it it has been kind of uh uh oftentimes a little bit complicated process for vendors.

So with this new process and the decals, um, how are you feeling and how streets feeling about being able to move some of those?

You know, they have obviously they have a lot of work to do too.

So uh moving those quickly so it's not caught up in in you know the red tape that we're here trying to avoid.

Yeah, so that was also one of the suggestions that not only came from the street department, but like our fruit truck uh association that uh they would love to be able to have these decals so that one of the the things that came out of the working group is how do we uh like that complaint process or that uh uh identifying which food truck is what, just in case if again, not trying to say that any food truck would be a bad actor, but if some are not following the rules and regulation, how to identify them outside of maybe their name, which may not be the name or their license.

So the street department, that was one of the things we asked Ms.

Sandy, hey, will this be a like you say, more red tape?

Uh they took it back to uh the people that they work with and said this would be something that they can start to implement.

They already have the list of already the license trucks.

So they're looking at this legislation and seeing as it moves as they start to create those decals.

Somebody from uh GSL who is at the table seeing this was done in another city.

So we're taking the model from the other city of that decal that they have to be able to implement here in the streets department feel pretty confident that this shouldn't be anything that would uh slow down the process.

And which city was that?

I can't remember.

I would have to ask that very soon.

Okay.

Thank you.

No other questions.

Thank you, Madam.

Thank you, Alderwoman.

Thank you, Alderman.

We will move to Alderman Cox Antrie.

Thank you, Madam Fairwoman.

Um, and thank you, Alderman Alders, for bringing this bill to the fore.

I know you and I have talked about this extensively.

Um, first as we do share downtown, and I know a number of our stakeholders um have been engaged both in your working group and also monitoring this bill very closely.

And I know it's taken um quite a long time uh for it to get this point.

And I appreciate your persistence, as I do think this is an extremely important thing for our city to get right and to do well to help benefit um both existing businesses, aspiring businesses, and also the patrons, right, of all the different areas that would hopefully benefit from this.

Um, I appreciate you also being willing to um add in uh one another one of uh my neighborhoods that are going to be impacted by this and appreciate the committee for adopting the amendment.

My only question for you, um, as I think it'll be I'm an interesting thing to talk about, as I know we continue to work on this legislation is the um additional revision of this uh section that you mentioned with the sidewalk vendors.

I know you mentioned it was very important to you to make sure we distinguish between the food truck vendors and the sidewalk vendors, and you spoke to to revisit that section at another time.

So can you just explain that a little bit more?

Yes, ma'am.

So the goal, even when we when the bill was originally filed, I think my first year didn't uh move it and as we started to work on it last section uh session, which just to address food trucks.

But and then what we noticed when you look at the code that uh talk about food trucks, it really has food trucks and sidewalks all mixed into one.

You know, there's different rules for food trucks and sidewalks because one's a vehicle, one's like a push car.

Um, there was different requirements of certain licensees because sidewalk vendors don't have to get like a um uh certain stuff that vehicle uh food truck individuals have to get.

So uh the goal was never to uh when we was doing the food truck last session to touch the sidewalks, and I'll be real, as uh things got a little bit more political within our ward with the sidewalk.

I really wanted to stay away from that until uh we have a kind of holistic approach of redoing that whole code and not uh jump into a fight that will look like we are uh supporting one or the other as more conversations are being um worked out in our downtown area of what that sidewalk operation looks like.

So it was always just to stay with food trucks.

The challenge is when you do look in the code, you know, they reference food truck and sidewalk vendors uh sometimes in the same sentence.

So we wanted to just be very clear that language that I I think talked about on page 11 or 13 that we added was just very clear that this does not pertain to sidewalk vendors.

Um so there's nothing that we're doing in this legislation that addresses a sidewalk, only the food trucks.

Uh and the goal is to hopefully come back and look at licensees, working with the license collector because she has brought up her concerns of just the process that some food truck and sidewalk vendors have to go through and uh do a whole look at a revision of our food truck code to just make it more clear.

Um, but licensing is a little different from the operation.

So we didn't want to touch uh the licensees aspect until we clear some of the red tape for the food truck uh to be able to operate, which the sidewalk vendors don't have that uh actual red tape.

And I think Miss Sandy said within the city, we only have actually like three uh sidewalk vendors that are actually licensed with the city, properly licensed.

Now if you see at a festival than pushing them down the street, you know, maybe the festival invited them, but we actually have three properly licensed.

So I want to stay away from the sidewalk and just continue to focus on what we originally was focused on with the food truck and cutting the red tape for that.

Okay, perfect.

I think that clarity is really important.

So I appreciate you walking us through that and no further questions.

Thank you for your partnership, Alderwoman.

Thank you, Alderman.

Uh Vice Chair Browning.

Uh thank you, Alderman Aldridge.

And um, I know a lot of work has gone into this bill uh for quite some time, and I appreciate everyone who's given their time and effort into improving this bill uh to the working group and everyone else who has just uh put uh their feedback into this.

Um I have a few questions about uh the bill.

Um I'll start with uh the streets department is in charge of permitting and investigating and violations.

Any reason why it's the street department and not the health department, which usually uh would do inspections of our food establishments?

So we the we continued on with the uh streets department because uh this was even though the health department does do like making sure if you know they got to get their food certification because they sell food, we stuck with the streets department because they have more ongoing uh conversations and interactions with the street vendors.

So outside of the health department just certifying them, saying that their food is safe.

A lot of times our from what I heard from the first uh and or from the individuals who are actually doing it, they're in more communication with the street department to make sure that they are uh aligned in the right location, make sure that they know where they're able to then.

There's more of a uh relationship already established between our streets department, which Ms.

Sandy works with our food trucks.

I mean, she probably can tell you about 80% of everybody on that list just off the top of her head.

And uh the food association works very close with the streets.

So since that relationship was already there, we thought it would be smart to live in the street department instead of the health department.

So our street department currently processes these uh I guess permits right now.

Yes, they uh they process them.

They do have to get a license from the license collector.

They do have to get some from the health department so that they could be able to serve their food.

They even, I think, got to go to the fire department to get a fire suppression.

So I mean there's there's several different groups that touches food trucks, um, but they're more hands-on uh with the streets department who they also have to get like a I think a 500 license to be able to operate on our streets and then realize that they can't operate anywhere but in a select area.

Okay.

Um for the parks department.

Uh I noticed that there's some language in here about uh that food trucks can operate in city parks.

Is that only parks with roads that go through them, like Forest Park, Coronette, uh there's a few others, or would people be able to pull up on the street next to any park?

So the parks department language was already in there.

Only thing we they had language around parks already on the red line version on page on our bill on page five, since parks was mentioned already in the code, we just end up putting that the city park uh vending market shall mean any area maintained by the parks department recreation forestry.

So they cannot currently pull up to a uh at um in a park, so they can't just pull up in O'Fallon Park, which have roads uh unless they actually coordinate with the streets department.

So the the uh current ordinance already mentioned like parks, but it wasn't clear, so we just wanted to define uh parks and Commissioner Hagelman was at uh our working group last year and said that uh if a food truck wanted to vent in a park that they would have to reach out to the park, but um they would have to go to the park to do that.

But we did not change anything besides just defining what parks meant with city parks.

So the parks department would still have authority to dictate what happens in each park.

Correct.

Uh so no different than that.

So fairgrounds and other things would still be off limits in what parks department says so.

Only park that is not off limits is Tower Grove because they're like a private park maintained by the city, but that would be the only park, or maybe Forest Park because we don't own that, but any citywide park um is not a vending area unless they work with the parks department or if they're having a special event uh in that park and get the green light on their special event application to be able to vend there.

Yeah, I think I think my concern is is really geared around noise.

Um food trucks often operate generators uh that produce quite a lot of noise.

And so if they're rolling up in a park, I mean I I know I enjoy Forest Park, which we do we do own Forest Park.

Um, and uh I would not want you know Jefferson Lake to suddenly have four food trucks next to it running their generators when people are out there to kind of enjoy nature.

Yeah, I think yeah, I mean, as you know, I think Forest Park is what ran by Forest Park Foundation.

So like we can't public private partnership, but the city owns it.

Yeah, so we're not uh we're not I'll say we're not uh allowing food trucks in Forest Park or Towerville Park or any park outside of Tower Grove Park already have agreement with the city, but this will not allow for food trucks to pull up in the parks that's not in the uh ordinate.

And you know, I would uh suggest maybe talking to uh Mr.

Scott, who's a president of the Food Truck Association.

Um, you know, some do have generators, but a lot of the trucks are also moving away from generators.

I think that's a little bit of a um I wouldn't say a myth, but that all food trucks make a bunch of noise when all of them don't necessarily all have generators.

They are changing the way that uh a lot of those food trucks are operating to go away from the generators.

Uh and you know, speaking of noise, I think that that's an important question to kind of ask if there's anything having to do with the permitting and reviewing what kind of power generation these food trucks use, because I I've had issues in the ward about um where a food truck is parked on private property operating with the permission of that private property, but nearby neighbors have to deal with noise and exhaust all day that um ends up creating a little bit of a noise complaint.

Uh so I'd be interested in you know, maybe if we future tweak this, making sure that we review how things are powered so that we're uh making sure that we're not only good for the environment, but also just uh the noise pollution in our city.

Yeah, that would probably be in the uh in the a bill that talk about the licensees, right?

When you talk about the street department and um going out to investigate the the truck to see if it makes a bunch of noise or not, that would be kind of in that maybe a future piece of legislation that address licenses, but we don't do anything with noise outside of if it's making a lot of noise.

I know we have a noise ordinance already on the book that people can uh kind of point to with that.

All right, thank you.

Uh so for the 200 foot separation distance, we just did that amendment to make it 150 to 200 feet.

Um I noticed that in the bill.

I go back to that page.

I remember.

Um, but it says comparable goods.

Um meaning not the same uh kind of if it's a pizza food truck, we don't want them to be parked outside of a emotion or Papa John's.

So it's it's not like oh they're selling food and that business sells food.

It's like they're selling burgers and that business sells.

Okay.

Um the the original bill had a fiscal note.

Uh is there an updated fiscal note for this bill.

I don't believe so.

We're waiting to get back from uh Sandy what those decals, that would be the only uh kind of fiscal impact as we're waiting to see what that would look like.

So she's looking to see what other cities does.

That's what I was wondering is just how much time and money this is going to take for the street department to administer this.

Um I I have concerns about the complaint system specifically.

Uh we can't even get utilities to repair their street work correctly, uh, to get an inspector out and make sure that we're having road work done correctly.

So what is the capacity of the streets department to investigate complaints?

Is it just going to be Sandy looking into these or who in the street department would be?

No, there's other folks that uh work uh they have like a food truck team that they um not only help with the licensees, but they also uh help the food trucks to be able to operate.

I think they're like a team of maybe five to six people.

Um, but of course they're not just focused on food trucks, they do a lot of stuff.

If you do have language that you think would make sense with the complaint, definitely open to it.

And you know, I hear you.

I think that's you know, one of the struggles of every piece of bill that we pass is is the enforcement with every city worker being um understaffed, underpaid, uh is making sure that it actually can be enforced.

But we did want to make sure there was a mechanism and not just keep it open.

So if there is issues going on, at least there's a track record one through CSB.

And then we know it's alders if those aren't being answered, which happens with forestry and streets and others that we kind of be that middle person to follow directly up with the streets department if uh somebody in uh the ward is uh having concerns, which I think in this one, Central West End is left out, so you probably won't have to worry about that part.

Yeah, and I I want to address that because um when this bill was brought, I think I was given about four locations uh to check out in the central west end about a week and a half ago.

Um I immediately went and started contacting these areas and their uh the different business districts and everything that these existed in, trying to talk to people, trying to see if they would be okay with that.

Uh and to my regret, we weren't able to uh identify uh any four of those districts as a possible place, mainly due to issues like it was private property that the you know, for instance, the medical school operates their own food truck row, but it's private property, and so they run their own permitting for that.

Uh over in the the grove, we have a you know commercial strip that is full of restaurants, and they all pay into a local tax for a community improvement district, and they had a lot of concerns about competing businesses coming in that wouldn't necessarily be subject to that tax.

Uh similarly over on Euclid and the Central West End.

So I say to my regret, because I do enjoy food trucks.

Um I think St.

Louis does too.

I I think we have some of the best food in the country, and a lot of those places that I enjoy is brick and mortar stores now.

I remember starting as food trucks.

So I know that there's that uh necessary first level that people kind of need to get into.

Uh that being said, I think food trucks also pose different challenges that brick and mortar locations don't.

I mentioned noise and generators.

Uh I think the proximity to brick and mortar stores is being addressed in this bill, and I appreciate that.

Um trash production is a concern.

Uh are the commercial corridors or these vending districts going to receive extra trash receptacles uh and are those gonna be put on like a pickup schedule in order to make sure that uh the trash that these uh food trucks generate is being deposited correctly.

Yeah, so that is uh a lease within the area that I have with downtown.

So the one on uh the market street, there's already I took a drive, there's already several trash bins, either in City Gardens um or the park right across the street, or also further up at 1520 outside of health department that we're looking to add as well as uh close to the soccer stadium.

Um that is in Cherokee, they have several trash bins.

Um that is something that we will look into to see if the alders within those wards, so the one in Grant Arts Center, who the executive director of supportive of of that location as well as Alderwomen Keys, if that there can be some maybe partnership either to war capital to put a few more trash bins out there.

But I will say, because I do, you know, one thing that I don't want uh the conversation to be focused on and not saying that you're not that you're doing an Alderman is um kind of the you know, there's challenges with food trucks.

I would say there's challenges with brick and mortars with noise as well and being too loud.

Um, and you know, sometimes people going outside with their food and and dumping them.

Um food trucks would not, you know, it's and I've learned a lot over this last year talking with Mr.

Scott, they don't want to leave a bad reputation in these areas because and then they know they won't be allowed to come back, or people would not want them to be back.

So uh, you know, trash is one of the conversations that we talked about where sometimes brick and or food trucks have two people driving and cooking, whereas somebody in the food truck will also like go out before they leave and before they get there to pick up trash because their reputation and just like a brick and mortar is a business, a food truck's a business too.

So uh they're aware that uh a lot of times for what I heard, they go out personally and pick up drafts if people drop it.

But we are looking at some partnership of or capital to maybe install more, uh, mainly in the grand uh center area.

Yeah, I think that's just an important thing to address as somebody who likes to do neighborhood trash pickups and other things we often notice where the trash is coming from.

And I'm not saying it is coming from the food trucks.

I I think it comes from a variety of sources, a lot of gas stations.

Uh but um I think there's a concern about yeah, making sure that we just have the receiving end of that, making sure that trash is being uh picked up uh properly.

Um I don't have any more questions at this time.

I I do agree with the overall goal of this bill.

I do question the urgency of passing it, passing it this session.

Uh we did receive the committee substitute at 5 48 p.m.

last night.

We had we just suspended the rules to introduce it.

Um the committee substitute language is not online.

So only alders and apparently the working group have had a chance to read this new bill through.

And it's a substantially different bill from the previous version.

It's not just like an update, which I think we've done with some other bills.

It there's there's a lot to get through here.

It's um and and I I think it's a very a lot of moving parts.

It's a very technical operation that I want to make sure we get everything right.

So if we're gonna come back next session and then polish this up, I'd prefer to wait to do it at that point.

I agree with the spirit of this bill.

I just don't see the urgency to pass it this session on this timeline.

Uh, but I do appreciate the work going into it.

And I'd like to continue to working on it uh because I think this is important.

I I do really think food trucks are uh vital part of our food economy.

And uh I'd really like to get this right because um I I do think this benefits our city when we when we do get it right.

Okay.

Thank you, Alderman.

Uh I have some questions as well.

Um, so first thing walk us through the permitting process.

So say I'm a food truck that doesn't have a license, isn't permanent at all.

Can you tell me a little bit about how they would approach this and kind of changes that are in place if this bill moves?

Yeah, so this bill with doesn't really address the permitting process.

I want to be clear, I'll walk you through it.

But the permitting process and kind of uh licensing is the only thing that's added new is that the decal will now be added so that they can help with the plaint system.

But uh the licensees and uh recently the license collector just uh created a checklist for food trucks um and sidewalk vendors to know before you get your business license, you have to go through this department, which is the health department.

You have to go to the streets department to get your street uh license to be able to vent on the street.

And I think it's the fire department or uh is it fire department for the fire suppression?

Yes.

So they have to get three different licensees before they actually and and pay fees um before they actually can get their business license.

And um this has been the the licensee aspect has been a headache for not only the food truck operators but also uh our collector uh license collector.

Um so she has recently did a checkoff list.

So when people want to get a food truck, uh, which again, the ruse is different for Psywalk.

If they want to get those licensees that they have to go through a uh the proper department to be able to get that.

Okay, yeah, I'm seeing the a website, uh a website where it goes through the various different things.

Um interestingly enough, this isn't necessarily about this bill, but it says stationary sidewalk vendor permits are issued by the parks department.

I think you said they were issued by the streets department.

We're not parks sidewalks vendors is not food trucks.

Okay, yep, I understand.

It just I think one of the things that so I heard it is streets, maybe it's not updated on the website.

Right.

I think one of the things that um I struggle with with this committee uh is that so many of the things that are red tape are less necessarily about what it says in the bill and more about how the person going to get this license or this permit interacts with the city and the process and the steps and the checklists and all of that being kind of opaque.

So if this bill passes, I would love to work with you and the license collector and the streets department and make that that checklist easy to follow and the website match the checklist, match the bill, all of those things.

I think it's possibly really the work of this of this committee more so than any legislation we pass.

I will take you up on that because yes, like I say, during this process, uh even though we're not touching, like I say, the licensing aspect of it, it has been very interesting.

Uh one that's once they get their license is the lack of operations where they can go is what we're trying to make successful so that people actually can stay in the city of St.

Louis, talk with some food trucks, they like, yeah, our process in the city is just so jacked up, I get my license, and then I can't go anywhere, so I just go to the county.

Right.

Um, so we wanted to give more options so that they can feel successful, but there is a goal to come back and look at that licensees for food trucks and sidewalks and to make sure that all these different departments are kind of on the same page that's not pertained to this bill.

But I would say the licensed collectors also have been frustrated with um the the the her the hoot hurdles and hoops that of people have to go through and then get a license and end up figuring out maybe they didn't have the suppression.

So she is changing her internal process um to be able to make sure that it all flows together, but that's more on the that's before they get it, which we definitely need to address and change that too.

Okay.

Um great.

So you mentioned the streets department would be investigating any complaints.

Yes, ma'am.

The police department handles noise violations.

Do you see that being just like has alderman Browning asked like a separate call, or would that be through the streets department as well?

I could see it being through if there's a noise violation that also, which uh we're working with CSB to add that in the food truck that the noise violation also can be part of that complaint process, which the street department could investigate, or uh the police department, but it would be flagged within CSB.

Okay.

Um you all put together the different districts in a 200 foot distance from a brick and mortar, does that limit any of those districts from being applicable?

Um in terms of, you know, you're nodding, Janika's nodding.

So the language that's in there that says they're 200 feet, but the districts is not uh there's kind of like an exemption for the district.

So and within looking at all the districts, like I say, they're not within that range.

I think the one that may be the closest is um right outside of Olive, which may be close to Schlafley, but it's kind of around the corner from it.

Um but the the ones on Cherokee Street, I know the Alderwoman and their SID has been working in partnership of these patients.

Uh that 200 feet, well, the 150 feet was already in there.

We extended it to 200 because the restaurant, but there's also language uh in there that say if a restaurant would want a food truck to be outside a restaurant, they can't have written permission.

But we would try to, we were strategic in making sure where uh the districts are that there's kind of a lack of food opportunity.

So the one from Grand Center, uh, I think the biggest one that they brought up is there's like uh not so much food, but at Compton and Washington, uh there may be they serve food, but they don't serve food, I think after like eight o'clock.

Um, but we made sure that we put language that there's almost like an exemption for these districts, but we kept them far enough away from uh brick and mortars as well.

Okay.

So just to make sure I understand correctly, if you are a food truck, you can operate in these districts.

Only unless you have written permission to operate somewhere else.

Unless if a brick and mortar, because some brick and mortars have food trucks.

So if they're not open on Sunday, uh food truck could operate outside a brick and mortar with written permission.

But not outside of these districts or yes, outside of these districts.

Only in the districts, but they can operate outside of a brick and mortar if they got written permission from the brick and mortar.

What if there's more than brick and one brick and mortar, like on South Grand or something when you have all of these in a row and they're not gonna be 200 feet from the next door neighbor.

That was language we got from the uh kind of the restaurant association.

So that again, the thought was if you have a the thought behind it is there's some brick and mortars that have food trucks and they may not be open on a Sunday.

Um, but they may want to open up their food truck on a Sunday, but what this would do is not allow them to have their own food truck outside of their own restaurant because of that uh foot distance.

So we wanted to also take into account if a kitchen is closed for the restaurant, but if they have a food truck, that they can still operate their own food truck outside of their restaurant.

We don't see it as a way for uh a restaurant to pull up or a food truck to pull up on Washington and say, hey, can I have my food truck here?

But that thought was to make sure that restaurants that already have a brick and mortar that may not open up their brick and mortar can still be able to open up maybe their food truck outside of their restaurant.

But it does it say that in the bill?

It says what written permission from the brick and mortar.

But it doesn't say that it would be their food truck.

No.

So then but they have so then if there's another restaurant next door, but they have one permission from the brick and mortar in front of them, does that supersede that?

That could that could if a if a food truck pull up outside or if a if I'm a uh let me say let me figure it out this way.

If a restaurant gave a food truck permission, the way that the language reads, it would allow for that food truck to pull up there.

We can tighten it and say only from that brick and mortar, but again, that that goal was to make sure that the brick and mortar who has food trucks, so several of them have food trucks if they need to operate their food truck outside of the restaurant for whatever reason that they were able to do that.

Okay.

I think that might need some more clarity in the bill.

Uh, because it right now it'd be two things could be true at once, so that it couldn't operate and then it could operate, and who's making that decision for whether or not they can and who's reviewing that you know written policy, I guess.

I I'd like to see more clarification around that.

Um I sent you a bunch of questions earlier this morning, and a lot of them you've done a great job answering.

You've already mentioned that you have the support of all the aldermen in the districts that are mentioned.

Yes, ma'am.

Um in the bill, it talks about LRA property exceptions.

This is possibly something that's already existing, and I just don't know about it.

Can you speak a little bit about that?

It was already existing in the bill, so uh that was just already in the uh language, and we didn't change stuff that was existing at the end of the year.

In the code for this around this.

So okay.

So if you're like in Kingsway West and there's an LR.

So that language was all the woman ties, and we definitely didn't want to touch that.

So there was a previous ordinance that she passed with Kingsway West and all of that, that also had like LRA language uh that we didn't touch because it was already existing for a reason why she had it there.

But even in this bill, if you're an LRA lot anywhere, you couldn't just operate there.

Correct.

No matter okay.

Um I think there is a just a scribner's error on page eight line C.

It says public.

I'm guessing that means public right of way.

I would also assume we mean public right away when I looked at it and thank you, uh just asking ahead of time.

That was something that was also already in the uh legislation code.

So um Yeah, that was something that existed before any changes, and we didn't change that line at all uh from what we're doing.

Okay.

Um probably should say public right of way, though.

So if we could, Madam Clerk, just note that as um a scribner's error that we're cleaning up here.

Page eight line, is it page eight?

I don't know.

I looked it up, but I don't think it's page eight from what you email.

I'll find it and make sure we get it for the clerk um the page that it's on.

Um we already talked about the streets department maintaining the decals.

Um let's see.

And with the parks department, um I was able to talk to them just briefly about this bill, and they said that their main concern was making sure that they would have the um they would have the ability to limit who's in the parks.

And I know that there's a specific section here letting them set their own parameters because it sounds like they would need to meet the park curfew, which is a concern of mine because this allows to 1 a.m.

or 11 p.m.

depending and the park here feeds are mostly 10 p.m.

Um, but that would be something that they would work out if you're going to go into a park that the parking lot.

Yes, if they were going into the park, they would have to get uh permission from the parks department.

Okay.

Um and the parks department sounds like they would be adding supplying a copy of their business license, which is it which is part of this with having a decal.

Um they're saying they'd want a $500 refundable security deposit, which isn't part of this, but could be part of something that they set.

Yeah, that would be their own policy set.

Um and then which I don't know if that's like when alders do waivers for people for parks, if that's one of the things that could be waived, but that's their own uh process that they have usually not the security deposit.

Sometimes you can waive the permit fee, but not the security deposit um within a park.

Um, and then you already have in here that the there would be a certificate of insurance.

Yes.

And is that that's something that is new?

That's new.

Okay, I think that's a good idea.

And naming the city as an additionally insured.

Yes.

Um, okay, I think those are the majority of my questions.

Um I have some just concerns about process, but I don't know that the process is necessarily addressed here.

This is more about the locations.

This is more the operations after the process.

The process is something that needs to definitely be addressed.

So I'm gonna be like, you know, picking your brain and hanging out with the the guide child to figure this out because it is very uh it's very mushed together when you have sidewalks and streets, but this is kind of the after the process.

This is the operations part so that they can operate uh and not have that confusion, which you can almost say is kind of part of the process on the operations because a lot of food trucks have said it's just very unclear where they can operate.

So we want to clear at least a little bit of the process on the operations and make it more clear, and I think can eventually come back and address some of the processes for the licenses, uh, which a lot of them are already licensed.

We want more and more to be licensed.

But since we have a large variety of food truck already licensed, it was like, okay, let's cut the red tape for them to be able to operate and then come on the back end to start to have those conversations, which the license collector is all in on of what that looks like with all various departments to make that process a better flowing process.

I appreciate that.

I think that is like I said, when in in talking with different organizations about this committee and the goals that should have so much of it was just the process isn't clear, you know, not necessarily something is legal or illegal, uh, but I do see that this piece is around the operation locations.

Um I would I'm not I'm not prepared at this moment to make an amendment on the 150, 200 foot.

I think that's very confusing though, and I would like to do you think you would be interested in having an amendment on Friday.

Oh, yeah, we could so the 200 feet I think is a suggestion.

Maybe me, you and the association can talk definitely open to what that could look like.

It sounds like it's more of maybe the written consent part, but yes, I'm open to working with you to figure out what that could look like uh Friday.

Thank you.

I just find that very confusing with you know, if you have written permission from one business outside of the district, but then you're next to another business, how that could kind of overlap um in terms of what's correct and and for the enforcement piece I can imagine on the back end them being very confused.

And maybe I'm gonna have if it's okay because she's been like my partner crime on this, I'm gonna have Janika come up to kind of explain that once maybe I'm not uh as clear.

Yeah, I appreciate that.

Thank you.

Miss Hayden, if you could introduce yourself for the record and please proceed.

I'm Janica Hayden of Policy Association President Green.

Can you ask your question again, Auto Roman?

Because I heard you, I just don't think auto.

I appreciate that.

So I I am confused about the there's the districts that yes, vendors are allowed to operate, those are clearly specified.

Yep.

And then there's some information about not being able to operate within 200 feet of an existing brick and mortar unless you have permission.

So you think what page you're looking at?

I'm sorry.

Um, where is that amendment?

13 page 13 line 12.

So if you are a yes, no licensed vendor shall conduct a vending business within 150 feet.

Yeah, except when operating within a designated vending market, which we already said.

But explain that.

I can explain to you.

So the 150 feet that's now 200.

That license that language existed prior to the passage.

We wanted to preserve that to make sure brick and mortars some autonomy of the situation, but we tried to carve the districts in a way that weren't really near restaurants.

So if we went through the districts that are in the bill, the only one that would raise concerns from restaurants would be Cherokee.

Now we talked to the Alder Woman.

They talked to the SID.

There's restaurants up and down Cherokee.

But Cherokee Sid, as if I'm hoping I'm not mischaracterizing.

They're not so much concerned about food trucks operating around the Cherokee area.

So we tried to make tried to make kind of an exemption for Cherokee because they are restaurants up and down the commercial corridor of Cherokee, but it's pretty general consensus that we want that area to be a food truck market.

So that language after says accept when operating within a designated vending market.

That is not on a principal arteria located on the that's Cherokee Street.

Okay.

So there is no written permit.

There is no written language.

But if a brick and mortar did have their own food truck, they can prop it out in front of their brick and mortar.

That's no problem.

That doesn't really affect this private property.

What we really tried to address was vending markets designated districts.

And we tried to to our best stay away from brick and mortar.

So the 150 feet is kind of moot unless there is a restaurant in the district.

So for instance, on Market Street, the downtown Vendimark, the downtown area, which is eighth street to fifth sixteen 16th Street.

There's no real restaurants on that stretch.

So yes, the 150 feet provision is there, but it was it wouldn't really it wouldn't really matter because there's no restaurants on market.

And that was an clear exception in the bill.

So if you have a vending district, yes.

If you're in the district, doesn't matter if there's a restaurant right next door.

No, it does.

It needs to be within it needs to be within 150 feet.

If they're in the market, not located on a principal arterial street.

Cherokee.

Except when operating within a designated vending market that is not located on principal arterial street.

So okay.

So the exception is okay.

So that when it is operating on a principal arterial street, they just but if they are operating, trying to get back to the language on a principal arterial street that is located within the local commercial office district as a zone like per zoning, that is only applicable to Cherokee Street.

Downtown, that's commercial, downtown West, that's commercial, Grand Center, that's commercial.

The only the only place that has that exemption is really Cherokee Street.

So they could prop up over there.

I think the written consent, yeah, is something from the past.

Yes, I think so.

Right.

Just allowing written consent of the owner or manager of the property.

And we don't really have that issue anymore because they're not gonna be uh operating citywide.

We were contemplating citywide vending, but since we've had conversations with stakeholders, we've narrowed it down to these districts, so it's not really applicable there.

Okay.

One of the things I do really like about this bill is the sort of one year um re-up of this.

Um, you know, it's interesting to see how that will work in it in a year from now.

Um, when we're passing this kind of right before we go on break and there's gonna be an election, I assume alderman holders will be here to carry that bill.

But is that something that the president's office is committed to carrying forward no matter or maybe that that's also on the ballot too?

So that's gonna be an interesting time to see who does that.

Um, if we do need to you'll be here, Alderwoman.

Okay.

It's on me.

Got it.

Fair enough.

Okay, fair enough.

Fair enough.

Um Yeah, so God forbid we're all here.

Yeah, committed to coming back.

Okay, shoot.

We are committed to coming back and reviewing the legislation.

But is that something where like the streets department flags it for review?

Yeah, so I've talked to Sandy, um, and I think the plan for right now uh is to see how these markets are working, see if there's stakeholder feedback, if there's anything we need to adjust, so we need to conversations with the food truck association to adjust anything.

Um I'm hoping not, but if so, we'll need to come back.

We we made that commitment to the working group, right?

It will come back in a year.

I appreciate that.

I think that's great.

I think that I could see adding one or requesting to have added um to the board different areas within the first ward.

Um, but I am kind of wanting to take a second to just see how this goes.

We did have a food truck parked on private property somewhat recently.

They had, you know, all the permits, everything was right, but they had the really loud generator and it caused, you know, a week and a half worth of complaints, police calls, really angry neighbors, really intense.

And then they changed it, which was great.

Yeah.

Um, but that is something that changed the generator.

They changed it, they changed it to a different um power source.

Yeah, I think they worked with the brick and mortar that was on the property to use their power, which worked a lot better because that became a huge huge issue for the neighborhood.

So um, okay.

Uh, does anyone have any further questions?

Any aldermen in the audience have any questions?

No.

Okay.

Okay.

Alderman Aldridge, you're recognized to close.

Thank you, madam chairwoman, members of the committee.

Uh first, uh, I do again I want to thank the working group.

This has been an uh ongoing uh conversation for the last kind of year and a half.

Uh I'll be remiss to not thank you know every individual, so I just don't miss anybody.

I won't say names, but uh it has been important to uh kind of have these stakeholders and then what I've learned it's you can't all you know you can't always have every stakeholder uh kind of at the table.

We tried our best to get as many as possible.

Thank my colleagues for the ones who uh also added some location um to these vending districts.

Uh definitely looking forward to working with you, Alderwoman Sweitzer on the licensing part because when you look at the code uh for our food truck and our sidewalk vendors, which all wrapped into one, and I want to be very clear.

We are not touching sidewalk uh push carts as they still call them, but sidewalk vendors were only touching the food vendors.

Um it is a very complicated uh code because this is one uh code that's probably been changed like 2023 times just from uh previous uh alders doing changes here, tweaks there, and tweaks there.

So we do plan to revise the whole code.

Um, but I think this is a huge step forward to uh right now it's kind of the Wa Wow West for food trucks and they can't operate.

I understand some concerns of like uh let's let's wait, but I think you know, a lot of food trucks are really asking for guidance for the city of St.

Louis of uh a uh ordinance that's been on the books that's not really either supporting them to be uh financially successful in being a food truck because they can't operate anywhere or don't know where to operate.

So I think what we're trying to do is be very clear and lay out where these areas uh of these vending food markets can be.

Hopefully, there'll be more added.

I know the all the woman from the 12th had a location uh that she wanted.

Hopefully, we'll get to the floor, but also I keep the invitation open for any colleagues that want to maybe add some markets on the floor.

But I think this is a good first step with a lot of feedback from neighborhood associations, a lot of SIDs, uh stakeholders from the Food Truck Association as well as the restaurant association, and it's been so great to see uh them both work together because for like the last year and a half there's been kind of these, you know, uh pitting food trucks and brick and mortars like kind of against each other uh instead of trying to figure out how do we all in the city of St.

Louis secede together instead of uh trying to put two sides against each other.

So to have the restaurant and the food truck on the same board on this piece of legislation is a historic moment, and I appreciate uh everyone again who's been at the table.

You know, there's probably never enough time to get legislation perfect, but I do think we got it to a spot that uh is a really good spot to help cut some red tape so that the operations can be a little bit more clear.

And you have my commitment, God willing that I'll be back uh as well as the president be back, and the alder woman from the sixth is back because I know she cares about food truck too, that we all can work together to get this done to address the licensees aspect of it, um, because I know this is extremely important.

So with that, uh thank everybody for the long hearing and the questions, and I'll ask for a do pass recommendation on bill 152 committee substitute as amended.

Thank you so much, Alderman.

I appreciate it.

I agree we've had quite a robust discussion here, and it sounds like lots of discussion uh has happened in the past and and more still to come.

Um, I'm sure.

So uh with that, I will entertain a motion for a due pass recommendation of board bill number 152 committee substitute as amended.

I move that we pass uh board bill 152 or committee substitute for board bill 152 out of this committee with the due pass recommendation.

Okay, okay.

Second prior to getting it's been moved by the alderwoman from the sixth ward, seconded by the alderman from the eighth that we pass board bill 152 committee substitute as amended with the due to pass recommendation.

Madam Clerk, please call the roll.

Alderman O'Rion.

Alderman Browning.

No.

Vice Chair for Lascas.

Aye.

Alderman Aldrich.

Aye.

Alderwoman Cox and Twee.

Aye.

Chair Brown, Chair Sweitzer.

Aye.

Five I votes, one no vote.

Thank you.

By your vote, you have sustained the motion of the Alder one from the sixth board and pass Board Bill 152 committee substitute as amended out of committee with a due pass recommendation.

Thank you, Alderman.

We have no resolutions for review, no committee discussions.

Madam Clerk, do we have any written testimony?

We have none.

Any announcements from members of the committee?

Hearing none, all members were present today, so we have no excused members.

And with that, I will entertain a motion to adjourn.

Second.

All those in favor signify by saying aye.

Who made the motion?

Alderman from the ninth made the motion, seconded by the alderman from the 14th.

All are in favor.

And we are adjourned.

Thank you.

Thank you.