Good morning.

I'd like to call to order the city council special meeting of February 26, 2026.

Clerk, please call the roll.

Deputy Mayor Bushnell?

Present.

Councilmember Diaz?

Here.

Councilmember Heinz.

Here.

Councilmember Palmer.

Councilmember Rumba?

Here.

Councilmember Sidalgay?

Here.

Councilmember Scott?

Here.

Councilmember Walker?

Here.

Mayor Ibsen?

Here.

All right.

I'd like to call on Ben Thurgood, our facilitator for today's interviews to get us started.

Good morning, Council.

Hello, I'm Ben Thurgood, Continuous Improvement Officer for the City of Tacoma.

And I'm here to facilitate this interview.

My role is to open and close the interviews, clarify who will ask which questions, keep the interview on time and ensure consistent experience across interviews.

Before we begin, I'd like to give you and the viewing public some background on the process.

The City of Tacoma has been working with Profman and City Human Resources since August of 2025 on this important recruitment for our next city manager.

The process included a national search, which resulted in 72 applications from 16 states in the District of Columbia, 40 from within Washington, and 32 from outside of the state.

Profman conducted an initial screening of all applicants, reviewing resumes, cover letters, and written responses submitted as part of the application process.

Based on the qualifications outlined in the city manager's formal position description and input from the mayor and the city council, 19 applicants were identified as meeting or exceeding the minimum requirements, and were invited to participate in preliminary Zoom interviews with Prothman.

Following these interviews, two applicants withdrew from the process.

Profman then conducted in-depth interviews with the remaining 17 candidates and prepared detailed interview notes and application materials for your review.

After reviewing those materials, the council invited five candidates to advance to the next step.

One additional candidate withdrew at that stage.

And the council completed interviews with four remaining candidates.

Following deliberations in executive session, the council voted in open session to invite two candidates forward as finalists for the position, bringing us to today's interviews.

And now transitioning to the interviews.

As you know, there will be two interviewing candidates today, Hyan Kim and Yolanda Lewis.

Each interview will last 45 minutes with a 15-minute feedback session in between interviews.

The goal of the interview is to assess each candidate fairly and consistently against job-related competencies and requirements, using a structured process that minimizes bias and ensures equal opportunity for each candidate.

The interview process provides an opportunity for both the panel and candidates to learn about one another and assess how effectively they can work together.

It is also a chance to evaluate the candidates' leadership and management abilities as well as their capacity to lead the organization and serve the community.

During the interview, please ask questions as written in the same order for each candidate.

Feel free to ask follow-up questions to gain clarity and understanding, but try to avoid asking substantially new or different questions to ensure consistency across the interviews.

Let's begin by assigning the interview questions.

So there are nine questions.

I heard one idea to have it be by your position number on council, or we could start in one place and go clockwise.

Is there a desire?

Preferences.

So make me go first.

Let's do it.

Okay.

Iceberg.

And that gets us all the way one through nine, correct?

Well, maybe taking nine.

I can do nine, sure.

Perfect.

Okay.

So now our first candidate will be ready at 10:30 a.m.

Um.

Host will bring them in at that time.

So we are ready if there's no other questions from you about how this process will proceed, then we have about 10 minutes before the first candidate drives.

Very well.

Councilmember Walker.

Thank you.

Um, just because we have a little bit of time.

Can we?

I know you walked through the process of like how many candidates, how many rose to the top, how many we interviewed, and that is that available online?

Because I know we've gotten a couple questions about the process and just making sure we're transparent in the process.

I'll check on that for you, and I'm sure we can make that.

I think it'd be great just as a little synopsis of how we got to this point in these two candidates.

Great, thanks.

Thank you, Councilmember.

Any other questions?

Any other questions?

May entertain a recess to let people get settled before we start.

Okay.

Is there a motion for a recess until um shall we say 1028?

So moved.

Second.

All those in favor say aye.

Aye.

All right, welcome back.

We're back from recess.

Uh, before our first candidate shows up at ten thirty, uh, we've uh we've received one recommendation from one of the council members, which is uh for any slight revisions you might want to make to any of the questions that you're responsible for, that's fine as long as it's consistent for both candidates is uh all that we ask.

So feel free to take with within the scope of the question creative liberties as long as it's consistent.

So with that, uh, we are just gonna wait forty seconds and change for uh for Mr.

Shem Kim to log in.

Accounting for technology by logging, I mean walk in.

All right, welcome.

Good morning.

Good morning.

We have a number of questions to ask you, so what we're going to do in the interest of consistency is we're just going to align each question with the number of the district or council position.

We'll just take turns and at the end we'll have opportunities for you to ask questions for us.

All right.

Welcome.

We'll start with Councilmember Hines question number one.

Good morning.

Mr.

Ken, are we doing this morning?

I am doing great.

Oh yeah, I had to remember to turn the mic on.

Thank you, Councilman Romba.

First question.

What stood out to you after our first interview and how has that shaped your thinking going into today?

Yeah.

Thank you very much.

And uh for the record, um, thank you very much, Councilmember Hines, Mayor Ipson, Deputy Mayor and Council members.

Um, my name is Young Kim, and I'm the interim city manager here.

Um, what stood out for me from um the first interview that I had with you all is um it's just being in lockstep with the fact that uh this council aspires to do great things.

Um not being reticent to the fact that when it comes to uh constraint theories or theories upon which we feel like we don't have recognizing that this council has a clear-eyed vision for um the aspirations for a community and for all Tacomans.

That really is exciting.

Um you had a public meeting uh after that, even talking about uh prioritizations for the community.

Um I do believe that I can provide value, and I I'm sure your other candidate as well.

So it's it's I think we're in good hands wherever you go with this and wherever uh the coming days uh comes.

Okay.

Thank you, Councilmember.

Uh Councilmember Rumbaugh.

Okay, I have the second question because I'm district two.

Tell us about your experience with long-range planning and strategic planning initiatives.

Yeah, absolutely.

Um Councilmember Rumba, um, I have extensive experience.

I actually did the math.

Um, I probably should have done it sooner than this year in the run-up to an application for a new job.

Um, I have 20 years of experience in municipal local government, um, 15 of those years in a leadership role.

Um, every community that I've served has set upon long-term plans, not just from a comprehensive plan for land use, but putting it all together.

Um, and I have extensive experience in supporting uh land use regulations, comprehensive plans, um, economic development plans, um, not just for what the community will be known for today, but what the community will be known for tomorrow.

And uh subsequently if I could follow up with more details in this setting, if you would like, um, but I do believe that um it's actually been an enduring part of the process.

Um what I would describe as kind of the the cycles of progress for any communities.

Um range planning uh is incumbent on having a clear-eyed vision set by the city council for the community, um, and then um uh an actual strategic plan to actually get to that uh long-range plan.

Um it's incumbent on having buy-in and dialogue with the community.

That's the second part of that cycle of progress.

And then the third progress is a continuous improvement process upon which uh staff, the team works to execute upon that long-range plan.

Whether it's codified in RCW, state law, or in local ordinance, um, it's not the more important thing is we are progressing.

We're not just planning to be better, but we are actually making progress.

At times, uh it may be uncomfortable if it's incremental, but what is it setting up for tomorrow?

Thank you.

Can I ask you to say more about specifics?

Yeah, things you've worked on.

Yeah, absolutely.

Under that category, is that okay?

Yeah, um, specifically when it comes to infrastructure uh from a standpoint.

Um I've had the the fortune and the the benefit and privilege of working for a community adjacent to Tacoma on uh not just the 167 gateway project but also the uh Port of Tacoma Interchange project.

Um it was our team, and I give all credit to the team that I was entrusted to work us alongside with and lead uh to drop a project in 2017 from a one-phase plan to just get it done, recognizing that the collective vision for the community uh was not gonna match up with the fact that the gateway project with 167 was gonna be going out at the same time.

So we collectively took a look at the strategic plan and recognized that it was imperative for us to actually phase it down into two phases, get phase one done so that we're not in competition with the region because our project for the community uh for the city of Fife was not just for Fife, it was for the region as well.

We had to recognize our role, but it was incumbent on us in putting that strategic plan that long-term plan that if we were going to be second position for our phase plan, that we would need regional support to actually get our project done, and we were successfully able to get that 150 million dollar project set.

That's a succinct one.

Um I could speak to more succinctly on the comprehensive land use standpoint of the continual improvement when it comes to um not being set with the steady state when it comes to um um land use regulations for developing um as a child.

Actually, I'll admit it, I didn't do it today.

You know, playing the game of SimCity.

As much as I want to say that that's not how land use regulations works, it kind of is.

So it's really incumbent on the fact that you have the foundational aspects of how regulation works alongside with why things are happening.

So I hope that answers your question.

Thank you.

Thank you.

And uh before I move on to a little bit of housekeeping, uh since uh we just had a follow-up question in the spirit of consistency within reason because we have 45 minutes per candidate.

Uh, I will allow if you feel it warrants uh you or one other council member to drill down if you feel like you want more specificity within the context of the same question.

So just for uh clarification and consistency.

Thank you both.

Uh moving on to uh council member Scott, question three.

Thank you, Mayor.

Uh good morning.

Can you tell us about a time when an external when external factors required you to adopt your strategy or adapt your strategy?

I apologize to still achieve results.

Yeah, um, thank you very much.

Um, Councilmember Scott.

Um, you know, recognizing that um what I would describe in the kind of tier layer upon which we have the federal government, state government, the county, and then us, whether we're on the bottom or the top, I always think that local government's on the top.

Um, and and I would say a very acute example of that is um in all of our plan sets up until uh 2024, we're predicated on the status quo when it comes to using and leveraging locally with our own resources that the city council authorizes to leverage ways in which we support our partners.

Um there's been no greater uh, I guess nimble exercise upon which we have found ways and also not found ways to adapt to the paradigm shift that is federal funding for local government and just being nimble to that fact.

It's been led, and and I must preface this for the public that's listening.

Um those pivots, those changes are predicated on the city council being not just comfortable but understanding on behalf of your constituents that when we pivot, we're talking about it, we're explaining why and how, and what we don't know, what's not in our control.

That's a probably maybe a little bit of a broad stroke example of a pivot from federal funding constraints.

Um maybe a more specific um example that would be when it comes to a housing project.

Um so um I was hired as a finance director for the city of Boulder City.

I was also had a title of city's chief real estate officer.

And for context, uh Boulder City is the is the community, the first the federal workforce camp that built Hoover Dam.

And when that property, well, when the city incorporated the town at that time, when it incorporated, the federal government actually gave all of the desert scrub lands around uh the municipality to the municipality as a gift.

It wasn't worth much then.

It's worth immense amount, uh, a little over 200 square miles.

And from a uh I guess from a ratio standpoint, it's larger than Las Vegas Valley.

That's the El Dorado Valley represents that holding.

And we did a lot of um renewable uh power purchasing agreements for solar.

We use those dollars to actually support the general fund to provide services.

When you don't have the constraints to have to have necessarily other local taxes to support revenues, um the parameters were when all the private and public lands essentially are owned by the city and municipality, there's an inherent tension for the community.

When you have the city controlling all the land, um, do you really want let's say the voters, right?

Do they really want to sell excess land for more housing projects or affordable housing units?

Because that would have a potential negative correlation to property values.

And so uh through authorization of the voters, um, it was not an emphatic vote of yes, but we need affordable housing units.

30 acres were put out to bid and authorized by the voters of Boulder City.

Um I had joined the city at the time, and it was the third time that the project was put out to bid with no responsive bids.

Um I got the tacit uh understanding of this project's not gonna go anywhere.

It was voted by the voters, but see what you can do about this.

Um, and that tension, right?

From the standpoint of landowners that that also control we work for the public.

What does that look like?

Um, my team and I, um, and I give credit all to the team.

We were able to come up with a novel three-phase takedown in my tenure in Boulder City, we're able to actually put that bid back out with a three-phase takedown where the first phase we would take the risk off the table and have all the improvements for phase one complete so that if that project stalled out for those affordable housing units, that whatever is returned back to the city, we're better off for that.

And so we got buy-in from the community and the council to do that, um, and we're able to bring that on.

I'm immensely proud.

I did not finish that project because I left.

I would like to finish something when I start something, and this is why I'm here too.

Sorry, I'm jumping into that.

Um, but today I look back at that project, I look at other projects in the communities I've served, and I say, we made a pivot, we made it happen, and uh they made it happen.

And um 128 affordable housing units for the first time in over uh 50 years, brought online, not affordable enough.

I will be the first to admit when people Google that project, um, they will say, okay, but it was something to start with.

So I hope that answers your question.

Yes, thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Council Mr.

Sidalgi, question four.

Thank you.

Uh the question I have is describe your approach to monitoring performance and holding senior leadership accountable for results.

Yeah, let me give you a specific example.

Um, this is on the record as a recording of this for Gateway Project in Fife.

Um, my amazing team and I were working through a consultant process where we were used experts to put together the grant process for I believe it was tigered at the time, federal funds for the project.

Um the project application was due, 11th hour, whatever happened, happened.

Um, the project was not submitted because of a portal issue.

We simply could not uh get the application in on time because we had issues with trying to certify essentially username password.

Um I was alerted to that on a Thursday.

By Tuesday, I came before the council uh and no surprises, I talked to the staff.

I'm taking this one.

Um I propose to, and I did.

I I placed myself on administrative leave so that the city uh city council could understand what happened to have an introspective.

Uh the nominal notions about well, this wasn't us, this was them, this was the no, it's the city of Fife, or in this case, if I were entrusted here, it's the city manager.

Um accountability starts at the top.

Um, I don't I've not done those efforts in service to um who I am or the role, it's the position.

And there's no, in my opinion, um, in my uh my career here in local government, there's no greater benefit or utility or betterment of the community for a city manager than to start the process of installing a culture upon accountability.

Um I will tell you on that Tuesday when I went before council and I shared the news that we did not get this done.

Um here's what we are going to do, here's what we're gonna look at.

I was immensely proud that uh my department directors behind me uh rose up and they went on the record and said, We're gonna join the city manager, we're gonna join this process.

This is all of us, this is a team effort.

And yes, six months later, we were we were on time.

Phase one was complete.

That was a side step, but we could not afford to lose that uh momentum and credibility.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Councilman Sidalgi, may I ask a follow-up to this?

Uh Mr.

Kim, uh so it seems like leading by example would be one of the the cornerstones of how you you believe uh a good administration models accountability.

Are there other facets to creating that accountability culture or deepening that accountability culture that you can elaborate on that that you believe in?

Yeah, I think this is more um philosophical, maybe cultural.

Um, I have emulated the leaders.

I think you know, the the prerequisite to a good leader is that they're a good follower and finding those uh those champions that they want to emulate.

I have come to find that the best way in which to install, you know, uh a culture.

Uh my philosophy is based on the fact that you have to lead by example, but more importantly, good news when things are going well, you should not be hearing about what the city manager did.

You'll hear about the staff and the departments and the divisions that got it done, or the city council that got it done.

When things aren't going well, that accountability is the city manager.

That's when you'll hear about what the city manager did or did not do.

I think that's for any that's just professional management in my opinion.

Very good.

Thank you.

Thank you.

All right, question number five, Deputy Mayor.

Uh thank you, Mayor, and thank you, Mr.

Kim for coming and interviewing with us today.

Um what is your impression of Tacoma's various strategic plans and how would you work to enact and or improve them?

And how would you communicate progress to the council in public?

Yeah.

Um, I'm gonna break that uh question up a little bit.

I'll start with um what do I think of the the various plans?

Uh ambitious.

Um, you know, there was a time in which in my young career um where you know, when I was going through school, coming out of this and taking a look, you know, it took it a lot of my missteps and my um my formative years in leading teams.

Um I I came to realize like what I used to think in terms of aspirational goals or um you know envisioning the the the steady state of that destination of being in a great community was not as important, and I've come to realize that is the most important thing.

It's currency, right?

Aspiration is the currency upon which we are actually relevant into the community that we serve.

Um so I've kind of flipped that specifically to our strategic plans when it comes to uh Tacoma 2035, what we've done through 2025, um, the Tacoma 2025, that visioning, um, I think it's really important.

Um what I'm really um happy to see with my predecessor in service to the council yesterday and confirmation that you are still sticking to that, we have to have a priority stack, even if it is 40 plus priorities upon uh a dozen strategic plans, that is important for us.

I think the role of the city manager is to be level setting with council constantly upon which where there's push and pull in terms of what can be accomplished at the same time.

Your city manager, I do believe has to be able to actually take care of the foundation as well, right?

When it comes to the base budget, when it comes to the foundational pieces of response times or being responsive to the the constant, this has to get well.

The the vision, uh, the strategic plan for Tacoma's tenure plan is where we want to go.

And I the way I've described it in other settings is um kind of interesting way.

Um maybe you've heard this this way as well.

The city manager's role, in my opinion, is the bus driver.

We're on the bus together in service to the community.

Um the city council is sitting right aside of it's an interesting bus analogy, but sitting aside right next to the city manager of you're plugging in into the GPS, this is our destination, this is where we want you to go, and who's on the bus, we're gonna get off the bus at many stops.

We're gonna facilitate those tours, it's the city team that's in service to the public.

I think that's why I think it's a good thing, Deputy Mayor.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you very much.

All right, question number six, Consumer Palmer.

Hello.

Um, can you please tell us about a time you coached or developed a senior leader or high potential employee?

Yeah, yeah.

Um without getting into specifics, um, I've come to recognize that um, and not just recognize, I really want it.

So when I'm coaching and supporting leaders, I expect that our leaders, especially our executive leaders, are doing one of three things always right.

The first thing is they're accountable just as long with the city manager.

Secondly, they have to be coaching and mentoring.

If we're not preparing the next generation to take over, I'm not talking generation in the sense of of uh demographics, age, those kinds of things.

I'm talking about the next group of leaders.

If we're not cultivating those leaders on a constant steady state, um we're failing this organization.

Um the third thing in terms of coaching, direct coaching, and um there's one thing that could be said of management that I feel is a detriment to the culture, that we're not kind.

If we are ordering and uh instilling a sense of this is how it's going to be, I think we're missing the mark.

I think the mark of a good leader and a good department director and executive is one in which they can actually influence positive outcomes and give affirmation for new ideas.

Um, and this goes a little bit to what I've heard even in the last interview that I had with you all.

Um that allowance to dare to try, dare to fail, and report that accountability.

I think that is a really good uh culture.

Um I'm proud of the fact that I have somewhat of um some time here at the city, and I have come to find of our 23 department directors here at the city of Tacoma's general government.

Um we have leaders that are always willing to be nimble, lean in and support, and I'm learning from them as much as I'm coaching and guiding them.

They they should know their job, they should be experts, absolutely.

They should know better than me in terms of where they want to go.

Are we having dialogue on a weekly monthly basis?

Absolutely.

And I'm learning from them as well, and that's been great.

Thank you.

Question number seven, Councilmember Diaz.

Thank you.

Um if we spoke with former mayors or council members you worked with, how would they describe your communication style and effectiveness?

Yeah, I would I would hope that they would um uh confide in you publicly and privately that I never surprised them.

Bad news, good news, um, that to the to the care and duty that I have that I had tried to make sure that they were aware of what's going on, both policy, operations, and administrative.

Um that uh am I perfect?

I don't think they'll ever say that I was perfect.

I also think I would hope that they would speak to the fact that I I did some good on their behalf in service to the communities that they allowed me to serve and that I was good for the team as well.

Um and then I hope they also say that I was kind.

Um, kindness takes not much effort, but it takes a lot of effort at the same time.

Yeah.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Councilmember Walker.

In your view, in your view, what factors have limited Tacoma's economic development and what strategies would you propose to address them?

Yeah, um, can I try the I'm gonna try backwards that that answer?

Um I I think what we can try is very much what you are teeing up for your next city manager, regardless if it's myself or the or another candidate.

Um it's getting the foundations right, um, taking a look at um, you know, I I know that I've had an opportunity to meet you all and work with you.

I do believe that you agree with this statement.

Um well-run cities are getting the basics done right.

We need to do that at the same time, aspire to do those great things as well.

Um what limits you know the city of Tacoma?

We've declared a structural gap in our general fund for uh since 2015.

Um I think it's imperative that your next city manager in partnership with you all is both able to look at that problem statement of closing that gap, but also having a plan to propose to you all for not just for blessing, but for you to sanction and say this is what we're gonna do with our labor partners, this is what we're gonna do with our community partners, and then also the city of Tacoma does not have it's not solving all the problems of Tacoma.

We have so many uh rich and wonderful, we have a myriad of nonprofits and private actors too that are risking capital and their efforts too.

Um from an economic development standpoint, job creation, uh livable wage jobs.

I think that is something that you um you will want to concentrate on continually as you've already started.

Um I think those are not limiting efforts, they're just opportunities.

All right, thank you, Councilmember Walker.

Uh my question, uh Mr.

Kim, what questions do you have for us?

Um I you know one question that I do have for you, Mayor, is um the way I've described this.

Let me start with with the the interesting notion of maybe uh some humor and brevity.

My children, and I have four children, um, my youngest has listened to me um in meetings or has watched recordings, and and the question comes up, Dad, what do you do?

What does a city manager do?

Um, and you know, I've tried to describe it, and I get the questions.

Well, do you get to drive the fire trucks?

Are you picking up the garbage?

Are you taking care of the streets?

No, I don't do any of those things.

Then your job sucks, Dad.

That's what I get.

And um, I would like to ask you, um, there is um there is a way in which I I believe like the highest functioning relationships between us city manager that can be accountable to the council is one in which there's true partnership.

Um there is always like the the notion of again back to what I said earlier about the fact that when things are not going well, you're gonna hear and you're gonna hear from the city manager, it regardless of who you hire.

That's just that's professional management.

But are you open to that partnership?

Um, I think I know the answer.

I would ask that question for partnership with your next city manager to do some really hard things and um and and be in partnership.

And I I do think I just want to for for posterity and for the recording, the city management is a rad career, and I hope more people come into this pipeline.

It it is uh both difficult and amazing at the same time.

But are are you open for that partnership with your city manager?

Well, thank thank you for the question.

And uh before I answer, um just we have an abundance of time by the way.

We have until 1115.

So um, so we've been very efficient, and so I definitely want to give you a concise answer and open up um to my council colleagues for that and other questions too.

Uh also just as an aside, speaking as someone who also grew up on SimCity, that's appreciated.

Um yes, we we all signed up to do hard, wonderful things.

That's that's what public service is, and um what makes this one of the most rewarding paths is being able to not just solve problems but to but to look at problems as opportunities for for real meaningful transformative change that betters the lives of a myriad of many people.

And that's that's the beautiful thing.

So absolutely from this this one of nine people here.

Um any other answers to that question for members of the council, Councilmember Walker.

Thank you, Mayor.

Um, and yes, absolutely um yes to the question um of partnership, and I think the the biggest uh question for all of us is how we show the public how that partnership works, because I think um we spend a the ten of us spend a lot of time together again, you know, no matter who's in this seat, this is the the team.

Um how do we show the public how we're working together?

I appreciated your best analogy uh metaphor.

Um but how do we show the public that that's how we're working together to get things done?

Because we none of us can do it without each other, so that's really important, uh important work.

Council Hines.

Yeah, uh thank you.

And thank you for the question.

Yun.

Um, I would say yes.

I mean I think that um I will be quick to say that you know, I'm a I'm a public school teacher, I don't pick up trash, I don't do any of them, I don't fix roads, and none of that stuff.

Um, but I bring myself to this conversation and I bring what I hear from people, and I want a partner in the city manager's office who can help me take some of the ideas, the concerns, the um notions that our residents have and turn them into actual policy and if not policy into direction and action that can benefit and help their lives.

And I think that uh city manager, uh council relationship that works best when we can give you ideas, you can take those ideas and help us shape them into both policy that supports the work and the administrative action on the other side that actually executes on it.

Um so I'm very ready for that, and uh I'm glad that you asked the question.

Thank you, Councilmember Diaz.

Thank you.

Um I would also follow up with an emphatic yes.

Um I think uh I would hope um the public is kind of aware.

I am not the biggest fan of this form of government.

Um, but I think that one of the best attributes of it is that we do get to have this discussion, we do get to have the hiring process that is public, we do get to engage the community and how we're gonna administer the city, which is a little different than in a strong mayor system where whoever we elect just chooses whoever it is, it could be their friend, it could be someone qualified.

Um, but in this scenario, we actually really do get to pick someone qualified.

Um I think that we can't go forward if all nine of us don't want that partnership because as the city administrator, the role is just inherently so much more in charge of so many pieces of the organization that we just can't have purview over, right?

Like for the state purposes, there's all this permitting work that really does need to happen in permitting land and not an elected official meddling land.

Um, and so there's just uh I think in a really important professional divide there that we need the partnership to be able to say, I have this person who's been vetted by us and the community who we entrust to lead the leaders of the city to do that work.

And I think that that's why it it's a great question, and it's also really important that we all buy in, because the person in the city manager role can only be as effective as the nine of us work together.

Um and so if we start collapsing and being wild, the city manager has to keep all the boats afloat and manage us.

So it is is kind of a both end.

Thank you.

And uh a bit of uh an apology here.

I was just informed by the clerk's office we have until 1128, not 1130.

So my mistake.

Um moving on to Councilmember Sidalgi, followed by Deputy Mayor.

Um Mayor, if I may, um we need to move into executive session by 1115, and then we will end executive session by 1128.

Thank you for the clarification.

Um Councilmember Sidalga, followed by Deputy Mayor.

Sure.

Um, thank you.

Actually, a lot of what I was thinking was was covered uh by Councilmember Diaz and other council members.

Um, this world of partnership also requires uh you know the city manager to be at times blunt and hold us accountable, right?

And so I I did appreciate your your um philosophy on accountability, um, because ultimately to get this form of government right, like the worst form is you know politically, we just say the city manager won't let us do it, right?

Um, and that often has happened in various cities, probably even here.

Um but to move on is to have a group that is willing to be told, hey, city, you know, council member, you also have asked for 20 other things, right?

Which one of these is really important because I have to manage the workload of the individuals that are working here.

There's the everyone concentrates on the the you know the the nice side of it, but the other side is also the being honest and saying, okay, you know, this is a great idea.

How important is it and what are you willing to drop for me to work on this with you?

And I think that's really important for all of us to take into consideration.

Um as well as everything else I said earlier.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Deputy Mayor Fallba Councilmember Palmer.

Thank you, Mayor.

Um, and thank you for the question.

I would say emphatically using one of your words.

Yes, uh partnership is extremely important, especially in this role.

Um I particularly appreciate is is to be a good leader is also to be a good follower.

There are times um to follow and then other times to lead.

Uh, you know, it's important for us to recognize that we don't know everything.

I think the city manager should also recognize they don't know everything, and that's where you have a team, and then you know, the council as a team, the city manager as a team, a part of that team to make sure that we're accomplishing the good work of the people.

Um and I I particularly appreciate the no surprises, right?

Um being vulnerable with each other, being blunt, as my colleague mentioned, you know, it it's I think it's better to give me the bad news uh and be upfront with me than to try and hide something because things don't get better over time.

It just creates fractures and mistrust, which if we're running efficiently as a team, we can weather challenges together and make sure that we're tackling opportunities.

And so I think that's really important for a good functioning team uh with the in partnership with the city manager and as a council as a whole.

So thank you.

Thank you, Councilmember Palmer, followed by Councilmember Rumbaugh.

So, yeah, partnership, absolutely.

Um I I think that again to echo Councilmember Diaz, that's the only way we get this thing right and go forward.

Um I think that uh good partnerships, no matter whether what kind of relationship it is, is always going to be built on good communication and clarity as far as you know, this is our goal, and and this is where we're at with our goals, and we can share that, right?

And we can get there together.

So my biggest thing is that authenticity and making sure that you know, tell it to me straight.

That's how we want it.

And I think community wants it that way too.

I think you know, in times past, there's been a time where you want to be uh you want to you want to be as um positive towards the city as possible when you're communicating things, but I think folks are wanting to know hey, what are your what are you guys dealing with?

Um, you know, what are you working towards?

Um, how could we help?

Um, and that's so it's really a three-way partnership in my mind between the city manager, uh city council and the community.

Thank you, Councilmember Rumbaugh.

Um thank you, Mayor.

And I just want to say ditto to everything everyone else said, and there's really not much more to say except for um I appreciate um that we understand that the fiscal cliff is there, and that um there's been real honesty about that, and I don't I don't think that means you can't be positive in talking about things.

Um we all have things things happen in our lives, and it's the way you communicate it.

And I think that that's really the skill that we need is the communication.

I would agree with council member Palmer.

But I also feel like the um the number one thing that we have here is wonderful staff and an appreciation for what that means and how important it is that we are able to weather what's coming and trying to keep our staff.

Um I think I I've heard you say that that's really important, and um, I think that that is an important part of the partnership.

It's it's really um the collaboration of all these things together.

That's that creates this good relationship.

Um I appreciate a city manager position now, I understand it better.

And so um I think this kind role of government works correctly if you're all communicating.

So thank you.

Thank you, Councilmember Scott.

Thank you, Mayor.

Uh thank you for the question.

I have I agree with a lot that's already been said, and I just wanted to add um, you know it really is again reiterate like it really is about that collaboration, that trust, that respect, that open communication and um the clarity and transparency of what's being communicated.

I think um, you know, partnership is something that we absolutely have to acknowledge that we need, and I think the other thing that we have to acknowledge is that we have a lot of hard decisions coming up, and um I think the best way that we get through making those decisions with as much you know diligence and clarity as we possibly can is to have the relationship of um open communication of trust of clarity, and so I I think that that's just kind of what I wouldn't add to kind of tie up all the things, but um that that part of partnership is really going to be imperative when as we move forward to make the decisions we have to make.

Gotcha.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Uh Mr.

Kim, what other questions do you have for us?

You know, maybe a statement just to close us out here, just for um the time here.

Um I think I would like to leave uh some parting, just maybe commentary and invite maybe some questions on this.

Um professionally, I feel as though that um through my experiences in the communities I've served, you'll take a look and see the progressively larger and complex, you know, even from small town to mid-size to now Tacoma.

So it's kind of interesting.

Professionally, it's all there.

You know, what what I worked on with teams that would, you know, we'd have the you know, the the I guess the privilege of working on for a week, a month in Tacoma, it's like a day, a week, which is awesome, and it's it's really fantastic.

But on a personal side, my wife April and I have four children.

Um this is our second time coming back, especially to the South Sound.

We live in Fife and Northeast Tacoma now.

We live in uh Tacoma again.

Um personally, um, in coming back to not just Washington, but here um there is just alignment personally and professionally.

I want my children as they launch, and I my oldest is going to college um this this fall, um going out of state.

It's it's one of those things that I'm done chasing problems.

I'm not saying that we have all the problems here in Tacoma.

That's not what I'm trying to infer here.

I'm looking to launch and and and be somewhere where I'm not just starting initiatives and you know getting tacit results.

I want to see them through.

And um, I also fundamentally understand that uh the city manager role from uh from this form of government is a city manager that has to serve a purpose and there is a time to that.

It's a caretaker assignment.

Um that caretaking comes from the fact that there has to be continual value and that when you have two employees here at the city of Tacoma, including the utility director, um, that that your executives are able to be able to get those things done.

So I'm not saying to project that I plan on um you know wanting to be here that forever city manager, but I am too.

So I want to leave that with you as a lasting import.

I'm not chasing things.

Um I want to stay in a community as long as I can, and it's gonna be uh Tacoma.

Interesting anecdote.

Um I had an immense privileged opportunity um when I was moving back from Wyoming.

Um, you know, we had a home to sell and it and it took longer than it than it took.

It took about eight months.

I had the privilege of um uh maybe this is a little bit self-serving, but I had the privilege of um instead of you know just finding one spot, um whether it was short-term rentals or whether it was an apartment and trying to get a um location in every district in Tacoma.

Um I started in Hosmer at a motel that I stayed in for about three weeks uh to Northeast Tacoma to in Hilltop to uh the budding end of of the North Slopes to the West End now and I I gotta tell you I always thought I the one thing I'm not gonna give up is the notion of having a driveway again.

This may be to the chagrin of all uh some folks.

Um I'm probably putting myself out there and being vulnerable here.

I still have a truck.

I should I should probably get rid of that truck, but I still want that, I still want that driveway, but it's really interesting and um it it Tacoma's awesome.

It really is awesome.

So that's but personal professional aims in alignment with this opportunity, and I'm I thank you for this opportunity.

And thank you for uh for testifying and for uh for being vulnerable and for sharing your experiences.

Thank you.

Thank you, Mayor.

Really appreciate your time.

Thank you, Council.

All right.

Thank you so much.

Uh we were ahead of schedule.

Um I believe 10 um 1115 was the appointed time.

Yeah, so I think what you'll want to do next is a motion to convene to an executive session to end at 1128 a.m.

Okay, is there such a motion?

So moved.

Second.

All right, all those in favor of um convening to an executive session pursuant to RCW for 2.30.110.

Councilman Latasha?

I was just ready to That's okay.

To evaluate the qualifications of an applicant, there's a motion and there's a second.

All those in favor, please signify by saying I.

All right, we are reconvened.

Council is an along going into Ms.

Yolanda Lewis.

Welcome.

Thank you.

We have uh nine questions to ask.

We're all going to take turns based on council position.

At the end, you'll have an opportunity to ask us questions.

All right, so starting with uh council hines, question number one.

That is me.

Good morning.

Um my question for you this morning is what stood out for you after our first interview, and how has this shaped your thinking going into today?

Um, thank you all for allowing me the opportunity to be here.

Um, and uh I think the interview for me was um confirmation.

It was confirmation that um much like your mission said that you are focused on innovation, you're for focused on change, you're focused on preparation, um, and you're a strategy-driven um council, but also a strategy-driven city that um really focusing on what those results will be in order to make Tacoma the best city to live work and play and and build a business in the future.

So it was confirmation for me that I was not what you know the job description said, but what the council actually believes is kind of the next phase of opportunity for you.

Thank you.

Very good.

Yeah, um, hi.

Um tell us about your experience with long-range planning and strategic planning initiatives, and then provide an example.

Yeah, so um much like my resume says, I um used to be a strategic planner before I got into working in Fulton County.

I used to be a strategic planner for the state of Georgia, and so in that my job was to design long-range planning for 159 counties, and that long-range planning actually translated to actual outcomes for about 11 million people, which is the population.

Um, and so for me, long-range planning, but not just long-range planning, but planning in general, thinking about what priorities are short-term, what you can accomplish in midterm, but then really having a vision for the future is really an you know something that I've done over the course of my career.

Um as an example, um, in Fulton County, I actually uh designed our first strategic plan that allowed us to um articulate um how we intended to move forward over the next three to five years, thinking about um priorities around service delivery, um high performing uh work environments for our employees, really thinking about um how we looked at customer service, but also just operational design.

Um I think I told you this when we interviewed the last time.

Um I'm very proud that we were able to move those objectives along in a way that set us up to really become one of the best run organizations in the state.

Um in addition to that, I would just kind of share that.

What I've learned is that a strategic plan without a really good infrastructure and framework to actually move that, accelerate change for that, uh, is literally you know, a roadmap without uh engine.

And so part of you know what I think strategically about is how do we build that engine and how do we make um the return on investment make sense.

Good morning, thank you for being here.

Uh can you tell us about a time when external factors required you to adapt your strategy to still achieve results?

Yeah, I mean I I I will say that um for me I'm my leadership style is adaptable.

So uh I don't know that there is a time that I've set course and there wasn't some level of change that needed to happen in order to be successful in that.

Um I think that that fluency allows me to be comfortable whenever we need to shift in order to be successful at something and articulate what that shift is and why that shift is important.

As an example, one of the uh you know things I think we've had to to do I've had to do quite often is when a solution is is put in place, particularly around public safety.

Um, I've had the sense where we were doing crisis response and thinking that maybe the solution that we put forward was the best solution, but after having conversation with individuals with lived experiences, having conversations with community organizations like nonprofits, we had to pivot the strategy in order to be more accommodating to what actually needed to be addressed, but also a solution that made practical sense.

I've done that in the nonprofit space, but also in the government space.

Um sometimes, even you know, I gave an example in in some of the prior interviews about really thinking strategically about how we look at our employees and the value of those employees and having to go through a salary and compensation study that we thought was brilliant, a brilliant strategy initially, but learning halfway through that we needed to pivot because it was not in the best interest of our employees and having to rework that strategy and redesign it so that it really accommodated the outcome that we really needed overall.

Thank you.

Question number four, Councilman Soldagi.

Oh, that's over here.

Welcome to Tacoma, by the way.

Thank you.

Thanks for coming here.

Uh the question I have for you is excuse me.

Uh describe your approach to monitoring performance and holding senior leadership accountable for results.

Yeah, so um part of that strategic planning um strategy that I just mentioned to you required me to set alongside the elected officials who approve the plan, key key performance indicators, really thinking about what success would look like on the other side.

Thank you so much.

Um, what success would look like on the other side of those initiatives.

Um it was an annual uh set of benchmarks that we were able to put in place, and that wasn't just for myself, which I was held responsible for my own benchmarks, but also for each one of our departments and overall benchmarks for the entire organization.

Um part of that was to be able to be clear in uh the expectation of what those benchmarks were and and uh ultimately what what successful performance would look like so that folks were not confused about what we were trying to accomplish on the other end, and more importantly, I think it was being able to, after having the data around performance, um, being able to tell the story and uh telling the story of what we were successful at, being able to support the leaders, department heads that were able to uh ensure that we were making those performance metrics, um, and then also being able to tell the story when we didn't make good on a performance metric and having hard conversation with conversations with the department heads to rework our strategy and rework our performance to ensure that we were able to accommodate that long term.

Thank you.

Deputy Mayor, question number five.

Thank you.

Thank you so much for being here today.

Um what is your impression of Tacoma's pre various strategic plans and how would you work to enact or improve them?

And how would you communicate progress to the council and the public?

Yeah.

Um so my impression of the strategic plan is it's ambitious.

Um and uh I think that ambition is great because ambition uh I think is the fuel that really gets us to the next phase of opportunity.

Um I I would be I would not you know think that the city would just do a strategic plan that you can accomplish everything in there.

They have to be big goals that will set you up for uh the population growth, the economic uh you know, development uh that you're expecting to be a well-run organization that is efficient.

Um to me, I you know, what I think of this the strategic plan is that it is a roadmap, like I mentioned before, and I think that it hit all of the markers that are important to people.

Um it it you know, I think it's a commitment to being well safe and a vibrant community situated to accommodate new people to enter into the city.

Um and so I think for me it is really about how do we get there.

And so my methodology that I I think I will bring on to layer on top of the the strategies and the strategic plan is the operational internal infrastructure to be able to accelerate that.

Really thinking about financial operations and how we navigate that to really think about how we can be more thoughtful about risk management and what that looks like, how we communicate our wins, but also the opportunity for individuals to the the residents to be able to give their feedback, how we think about customer service and how that translates to being responsive, and most of all, I think excellence in the idea of being innovative.

I I know that um innovation is hard, particularly when you're under budget constraints, but I think it's very important that if you have a strategic plan, you have to have a framework that activates that plan in a way that makes sense.

Deputy Mayor, may I ask a follow-up on this?

Sure.

Um so you had mentioned uh as you just alluded to in um your answer to number two about how strategic plans need infrastructure to be more than just roadmaps.

So diving a little bit more specifically.

So just for example, with our we have about 40 strategic plans.

So for example, looking at our homelessness plan or vision zero, which is our our plan for um reducing um bicycle pedestrian uh fatalities or or injuries, for example, or urban forestry, you you name it.

Um can you give some specific examples of of what better infrastructure to better execute those plans would look like, like dive in and define that more?

Yeah.

So I think you know, the starting point is to acknowledge what is there, you know, the infrastructure that is there to be able to move the uh the strategy forward now.

It is also about researching best practices from across the country that can be to Tacoma specific things that make sense in this environment that can be adapted and how those things were funded, how they were staffed to be able to bring them here.

And so when I talk about the framework and the engine, it is how examplars of success can be translated to success here.

Who needs to be at the table?

Does that need to be additional nonprofits that we collaborate with?

Does do we need additional staff training?

Do we need levels of expertise?

Do we need um physical um allocation of resources that need to be put in place?

So every single strategy has to have like a tenant, a framework that we move from that really thinks about operations, that really thinks about best practices, that thinks about how that innovation can be adapted, but also what does that mean for our staff and people who are helping to do the work that we have moved to address in that strategy.

So it is the infrastructure.

Um I I just say, you know, I I have worked in government for a long time, which means that I've been the recipient of having to execute unfunded money mandates or strategies that didn't have the right number of people in the office.

And so, you know, part of this is really thinking about when we have these big ideas and strategies, are they properly the infrastructure is proper so that we will see the risk the success on those strategies that we put in place versus having to articulate how to do that without the appropriate background and infrastructure to move things forward.

Thank you.

Moving on to question number six, Councilmember Palmer.

Hello.

Hi.

Could you please tell us about a time you coached or developed a senior leader or high potential employee?

Um sure, I'll give two quick examples.

One um is so part of my leadership style is to always be thinking about how we build the next generation of leadership within.

Um also how we provide the resources that leaders need in order to be more effective as they as they move forward.

Um I'm happy to say that um when I left Fulton County, um, I there was someone who could step into my seat.

Um, and that was as a result of us working closely together, me investing time in ensuring that that person was at the table when really big decisions had to be made to ensure that we were performing well, um, and um being able to support their growth and development.

Um and and so uh I believe in really this idea of secession planning and development for senior leaders, but also being able to support them in being um the leaders that they intend to be in organizations.

A second example is um when I worked in in in Fulton County, we had an employee who had been there for about 15, 20 years.

Uh of course I wasn't there for 15-20 years, so she was there much longer than I, which means that she had intellectual capital that no one else had in the organization.

Um she was also one of the people who might not have been out front, and so um understanding the level of intellectual capital she had.

We made sure that she was able to receive kind of training on leadership, communication, and and things that would make her comfortable, and she became an actual trainer of other individuals who came into the organizations because of the institutional knowledge that she carried, but the support that we gave her in order to be able to step out front and help other individuals in the organization.

Thank you.

Question number seven, Councilmember Diaz.

Thank you, welcome.

Thank you.

Umors, council members, or prior elected officials that you worked with, how would they describe your communication style and effectiveness?

Um I think they will tell you that I'm honest.

Um they will tell you that I'm transparent in my communication.

Um I think it is um great to be able to communicate great news, but it is also important to be able to openly and transparently communicate things that might not meet the mark that we would like.

I think they will tell you that I am an inclusive communicator.

I try to ensure that uh I communicate in a way that doesn't isolate or um have individuals feel that they were not a part of the conversation and a part of the decision making and and um movement.

Uh I think they will tell you ultimately that I am the person that will get it done, and I communicate very clearly the the path that I intend to take to support um their priorities and what they're hoping to get done as a result um of their decision making.

Thank you, Councilmember Walker, question number eight.

Thank you.

In your view, what factors have limited Tacoma's economic development and what strategies would you propose to address them?

So you know, I will say that uh economic development is an important um I think um presence for any city, and I think it is one of the things that we have to engage and invest in.

Um I have never been an economic development leader.

Um I believe that there are folks that have expertise in order to do that, um, including individuals that we have here that are on the front lines of our economic development, green green economic development plan.

I think what I believe is that in order for a city to thrive, you do have to have a good business infrastructure and a good economic um mobilization.

That said, I know that my job, I think, as city manager not having um done economic development in a way other than economic mobility, um, is to be supportive and thoughtful about uh partnerships and approaches and being able to support uh our team that is working on economic development to engage the business community and get their feedback and be able to be open to direction from the city council but also our uh city leaders on how to do that best and be on the front line of helping to build out the future of our our economic development infrastructure.

Thank you.

Uh, my question is um what questions do you have for us?

Um I've asked the same question of all of my panels, and and suffice to say um it's important to me is to know really what you want to see in this new position, the leader coming in.

What is it that you want to see in them?

Comments from the council.

Do you have your hand on the button?

I've been sort of thinking that through is thank you for that question.

I think that that's a great question.

I think um we're really well, I will just speak for myself.

I'm looking for someone who is gonna be a partner to the council and who's um excited about um not only working together to solve Tacoma's problems, but then communicate that back out with the public.

I think we have a challenge often um with questions from the public about who's making the decisions, and so um I think we have a collective um project to uh show folks um how decisions get made in um in the city while also making all the things happen and supporting supporting our directors and that the work that you talked about with you know KPIs for um the work itself, but that that to me is the big one is working in partnership with the council and then communicating that out to the public.

Council Hines?

Oh uh thank you, Mr.

Mayor.

Uh no, I think this great question.

Um I think Council Walker got to a little bit the idea of partnership is really important.

Um, you know, we council is a policy making body, but to operationalize that requires working with the administrator.

I think critically for me, um helping council understand the limits of what the organization can maintain, endure, expand.

Um because there are some real limits to some, you know, to what we're saying.

I think you said very clearly that you know, some of our strategic plans are aspirational in some way cases, which is good.

We want to our we want our reach to out to go past our grasp or however that quote works.

But um, I think what a good manager would be able to do is sell like, well, this is what we can do.

Here are the limits, here are the choices.

And I I think one word I haven't heard that I want to bring up that I didn't say last uh prior is just the idea of options.

You know, how do you help us frame up what are the options?

Because I do think um the often the answer is no when it's maybe.

Um and if it's maybe, then we want to like know what the maybe looks like.

So thank you.

Council Member Deals.

Thank you.

Um I think Councilmember Hines might have articulated what was bouncing around in my head, but just differently.

So I think the way I wanted to articulate it is I need someone in a city manager who will be a good partner, both in thought partner and in um transparency around what's going on on the administration side.

There's a lot of the administration side that we as um the policy setting elected officials have no business in.

Um so making sure to hold that boundary, I think is really important.

Um but the biggest thing that I think um we need to have in the next city manager is um a strong sense or ability of how to manage up.

We are nine very different human beings with very similar values, but very different ideas about how we get there.

Um some of us have districts that we're really beholden to for a lot of really important reasons, and like others of us have um are at large, but we have different constituencies that we bring to the table and to the forefront at any given conversation.

And so managing that I think is a really unique um piece of any city manager, but I think particularly for this city, because we all tend to row in the same direction.

I think it's actually harder than managing a council that would be more adversarial towards each other on most issues.

Um so there's a real, I think, flex in that around how do you manage a bunch of cats who are um more alike than they're different and a lot less willing to admit that.

Councilman Sidalgi.

You're probably gonna get some of that in all of these answers.

Um, um what I was what is important to me actually, quite frankly, one of the reasons um we chose you as one of the finalists is I want someone I can be confident can be a leader of leaders here.

And for me personally, um that also means it's someone who can connect with our staff for me.

That's slightly higher than being able to connect with council because you need to be able to connect with the up to 4,000 individuals that work for this city in various capacities because that allows you to be honest with us, and it allows you to be creative and aspirational and ambitious.

Um that will lend itself to the next kind of outcome I'm looking for, which is um stability.

Um in particular a skill that I'm looking for um is around budgeting because ultimately as many policies we make.

I think you actually mentioned it in one of your uh examples.

We can make every budget, uh, sorry, every policy, but if it's unfunded, it's probably not gonna get done.

Right.

Um and I think if we have that, we'll get some of the other stuff that we want, which is honesty and someone who can set those boundaries in a in a um honest, believable way when you concentrate on the staff, understanding how the city works and moving up.

Um, and then it'll naturally get into someone who's willing and curious to understand and believe in the city.

Councilmember Romba.

Thank you.

Um I would say like the partnership is really important between our city manager and our position because it's not a strong mayor position, it's uh he's just one of us, and at the end of the day, it really matters that we get along.

Um but I also think connecting with staff like council member Sidalga just said is really important.

I also think understanding the influence we have in our region and the plate, the spaces that we as council members might have on other things like the Pierce County Health Department or on our domestic violence commission or um on a unified regional approach to homelessness, how important those things are in the relationships that that city manager has with other city managers, I think is important.

Um I'm I'm just really looking for someone who um can have us guide as a leader but also be a partner.

So I'm I'm that's really important to me at this time because we are have we have limited resources and we need to work together with the other cities and our county more effectively to really spread those dollars um to get some of the the big issues done that are happening in our county council Palmer.

I think partnership is the word of the day, it sounds like um so yeah, I agree with my colleagues around that, and I well will say again that I think uh good partnership is always determined by good communication, and good communication to me is is clear communication and often communication and making sure we're uh providing each other with the amount of information that we need.

But the other thing that I'm particularly looking for in this time is meeting this time.

Um there's so much that's happening right now that is new, and you know, a lot of uh cities have not faced uh these types of um situations, and so um I I think I I need to know um it's great to have the knowledge in that in order to this is how cities work and that sort of thing, but I think there needs to be some flexibility and adaptability um and meeting the needs of our city in in creative ways because a lot of the funds that were there are not going to be there anymore.

Um and so I think having an ideas around other ways to fulfill that or reaching out to community to maybe meet some of the needs where they haven't had to do that in the past, um, that's what I I'm looking for.

Thank you, Mayor.

Um, and thank you again for being here.

Um again, I think partnership is really important and has been talked about by a bunch of my colleagues, um, you know, thought partner uh limitations uh on what the organization is able to do and being very clear about that.

Um, you know, honesty and integrity is extremely important to me, um, especially in a in a management position like this, and that and that goes up and down uh you know, with employees with the council, but then the community more broadly, the different partners, nonprofits, and all the organizations that rely on the city to be a partner.

Um, professionalism is what I also expect out of a out of a city manager, um, you know, not playing favorites and being very clear and concise about expectations and accountability, um, not only for the folks that um are under you but for yourself as well as you know those around you.

Um, I think that you know it's really important to be, you know, as as I guess the best way I would put it is the way councilman Sidalgate mentioned it is is being a leader of leaders, um and being a leader uh means also to be a good follower and making sure that the team around you that you've built around you is is as successful as possible, and I really appreciate you talking about infrastructure a lot because the the team is only as good as the infrastructure that you build to allow for that foundation to occur for the goals to be reached.

Um that's what I expect.

Thank you.

Councilmember Scott.

Thank you, Mayor, and thank you again for being here.

Yeah, I I agree that partnership is super key.

And so, you know, having that partnership between the city manager and the council, both as a whole and on an individual basis is really key to building trust, to learning each other's communication style, to making sure that however people prefer to communicate that it's efficient and clear for the relationships.

And I think you know, I really personally just really appreciate honest communication, clarity, um, a willingness to to do your best to kind of like obviously we're gonna all have some ideas that might be unhinged, they might be spot on, um, and some of them, even if they are unhinged, might be doable, but um maybe it's you know, I being curious enough to say, well, like, is there a version of that we can do, but also having that knowledge and that discernment to um and the the you know the the clarity of communication to come back around and say, I hear you, I see you know, I see what you're trying to get at.

Now's not the time for whatever the various reason is, or yes, we can do this, but it's gonna have to look this way.

Um but I think it's just a matter of, you know, and it's on us to not send you down a bunch of rabbit holes that take time away from the you know the immediate initiatives and things that we're working on.

Um but I think that there are times, you know, like just having we have a a very specific understanding of of how our policy comes together and how it might impact people, and so having the city manager's knowledge of staff, of community initiatives, of other things like that is it's just really important to help um inform the work that we uh bring to study session to the dais and ultimately um as a directive to for staff to kind of uh work on.

Um I appreciate that you already mentioned that your leadership style is one of adaptability.

I think that that's especially um you know in serving the public is one of the main things that you know somebody needs to have to um you know, I think it's good when there's some consistency and that's important for um day-to-day operations as well as you know the overall kind of continuity of of how things go in the city.

Uh, but I think being able to not be so married to something that we find, you know, 10 years down the road, five years down the road, or even two years down the road that uh we've been doing something longer than we need to do just out of the sake of of doing it.

Um and so people, you know, a leader who has the ability to kind of um, you know, know when it's the time to say, I think we need to give this more time to work and get more data for ourselves, um, but also have the ability to say, you know, um, maybe this maybe we didn't work on this as long as we were like people would have liked us to, but we're getting this information in and and based on that we have some um, you know, it leads us to believe that we need to shift and adjust and kind of move forward from there.

So um I like when people can work in kind of an iterative way and take what was good from what we've what we've done and where we've been, uh bring that with us for the next step.

Thank you.

And uh what I would say myself, Ms.

Lewis is in the theme of partnership is I I think one of the central pillars of that is creativity.

Because when we are facing uphill battles, whether it's fiscal realities, uh the reality at the federal level, and and just things that either have stopped working or no longer work in the current context is is finding ways, whether it's getting to yes or just considering something that we haven't considered before, uh, that that isn't just the status quo, right?

Something that it is genuinely novel, um, or at least being open to those kinds of approaches because whether it's resolving our structural budget deficit, whether it's trying to wrangle our suburban partners to supporting a regional homelessness plan, for example, uh, whether it's just funding basic infrastructure, um, the old ways are less doable right now just because of the current constraints, and we can we can either just admit defeat, we can just do a lesser version of what we did previously, or we can try to still be ambitious but in a different way, and and just trying to be um a little bit less reverent of notions that may have once worked but are no longer as capable.

So that's something I think is really important at the institutional level.

Um we actually have until 1215, according to um our staff, so there's certainly time for at least uh one other question.

Do you have any additional questions for us?

I do.

And um, I do, and I think uh this question will pivot from your your comments.

Um obviously one of the things uh that's important to me coming into this interview is to really think about the structural deficit that has been a part of your conversation for years.

Um I know that it is something that is top of mind for you.

Um, and so I just wanted to at least get your feedback about how you're looking for the city manager um to help with moving that into a space where you have a balanced budget.

I know it's your decision, but I I am interested in how you believe this person should work in order to help you resolve that.

Comments Council Walker.

I'll just jump right in.

Um thank you for that question, and definitely accurate that that's um something we've been working through, struggling through for years.

Um and I think every biennium we kind of tackle that in a different and new way.

In my um ideal world, the city manager is presenting us with options on how we solve that problem.

Um, and we have in past years um made some progress on the structural deficit deficit while also saving really priority programs for the interim.

Um one might argue we need to stop doing that with one-time funding, um, but presenting the options um be so that we know what services we are not going to provide to the public.

Because I think that that's the big trade-off that we have to uh work through as a policy body, and so just knowing what those are, it's not just about numbers, whether that's dollar numbers or staff numbers, it's about the programs that we're um able to or not able to provide to the community.

Um so laying out those options for us is what I'm hoping for from the city manager, so we really know what's behind our decision in the end.

Council Rodias.

Um I would definitely plus up that idea around options.

I think um something that is really not unique to Tacoma, but unique to Washington State is our tax code is upside down, so it relies heavily on sales tax, property tax, um, and business occupation tax.

Um we don't have an income tax, so it doesn't grow with the economy, quite frankly.

Um, and it's really over-reliant on the economy in terms of the sales tax.

This city only gets a small portion of what people see sort of in their own assessment of their tax bill.

So when we go out to public on bonds or levies or excise taxes, um there's not a strong concept of why they're nickel and diming me again.

Um so helping us create not just the options but also the narratives that go with that options, I think are gonna be really critical.

Um and um I think just the ability to come in, see how things have been working, see if there are innovations to be done there.

I don't know how much there is left to do there.

We are a pretty well squeezed lime and pretty efficient in the work we're doing and the work that the city doesn't directly do.

We often um I would say we pro uh just a guess we probably pay out much more funds into the community to nonprofits or to other governments or to partnerships to do a lot of direct service work that the city does not do.

So we really do kind of just do the the basic core functions of utilities and roads and police and fire.

Um so thinking through whether that model continues to make sense, what other innovations you might have seen in other places, um, and not just I think nationally, but it within Washington State because we're all sort of working under the same constraints, just some things to think about as as we're thinking through what options could be presented and how we um work in partnership towards resolving that goal and communicating how we how we get through it.

Uh thank you, Mr.

Mayor.

Um great question.

I I would think that one of the benefits of being a new city manager would be able to step into a situation and say here are some sacred cows that no one's touched for a long time, then I wonder why it's still here.

I think that's one of the values of stepping in an organization on the outside is I I'm a teacher, right?

So my background, and I talk about when you you think every classroom looks like yours and you walk out of the classroom, like, whoa, this is like really messed up.

Same thing with families sometimes, right?

Um so you'd be able to come in from the outside or someone, new city manager saying, this is not how I've ever seen it done before.

Why do we do it this way?

There'll be some time in which you'll have to kind of understand that, but I think that's the value is people to come to us and say, here are some things that no one's ever talked about touching, but maybe we could touch them and make some changes.

Um I think that uh another thing I would really want to see if we really want to talk about attacking the structural deficit over time.

Um I you probably could pick up from most of us.

We all people are people here who believe the government can do good things and the public values good quality government services, um, which is unique in some parts of the country, they don't have electeds at all feel that way.

So there's an inherent tension that we have that we still want to deliver services to the public with see value.

You know, we're not gonna come in and say we're just gonna stop doing that because it's a waste of money.

Um so I think with the city manager really being guided in that idea of how do when we make changes we continue to see like effective services being delivered to the public as a kind of a bellwether is something I'm thinking a lot about.

Deputy Mayor.

Well, thank you, Mayor, and uh fantastic question.

And I think you're hearing very similar themes, you know.

I and so I I won't belabor the point, you know, um efficiencies where we can find them is really important, revenues where it's available to us if possible, and obviously making sure that we're talking with our partners and the public about that very um very importantly.

Um reductions, whether that's service levels, whether it's just staffing, and I'll just say that I think it's I want to recognize that our staff and what they provide and the and is one of the most important assets of this city.

We have a lot of great institutional knowledge of very service-minded people that work for the city.

Um, and so any reductions need to be really careful.

Um thinking about trade-offs, um, you know, optionality.

Um, it's like, okay, we're gonna prioritize and fund this, but recognize that we're gonna have to reduce or not fund in certain other areas and being very clear with that, uh, both to the council and to the public.

Um, and I think just um, you know, being being honest with with the the situation that we're in, the constraints we're in, and what why we have a structural deficit.

And I don't think it's I don't think it's any particular one thing that the city did or didn't do over time.

It's a kind of a build-up of challenges, and we've managed to make the math work over the years, um, but that that doesn't mean that can continue in perpetuity.

Um so to to Councilmember Diaz's point, I think the narrative around that is really important for uh the public to and and us and and others to understand and all our different partners.

Um and I know that all our partners also have their own budgets that they're you know contending with and recognizing that and being empathetic about that as well.

Um but I think it's really important to you know it's kind of rip the band-aid off, so to speak, and just be very blunt and clear about you know what we can and can't do as a city.

Thank you.

Um a similar thing, you know, I I think this is one of those um going back to the question of you know partnership and communication, like this is one of those pieces where that partnership really matters, where um that communication really matters.

Like it's um, you know, having grown up dealing with poverty and having to be frugal and things like that, when I when I see this deficit, you know, I I think about in that sense, like, you know, we'd love to not have to cut things and uh and look at that, but I think there are you know, and we might want to make assumptions that like oh, this will level out at this point, or this might change with this.

Um, but really, like, you know, I'd be looking for the city manager to really help us understand um, you know, which of these assumptions are just convenient, um, and which of them are actually like realistic, what what are what how are they unrealistic?

Um, you know, really trying to understand the as to as much in as much detail the kind of the facts of the matter of like what is it that we're looking at, what what programs are structurally unsustainable at this point?

Um what you know what do we need to look at and say like if we leave things as is now, like what what does it look like at 2028?

Um I mean that's just kind of a random number going out a few biennium, but um, but just really trying to figure out like what's the true cost of this.

If we if we you know don't make changes, what happens if we make these changes, you know, what's the likelihood of what it's going to look like uh by mid mod by the next biennium, and just really helping us to kind of get through and understand like what can we make up with by being more efficient on our end, and where do we really need to look to innovation and new revenue and new partnerships and be and how I think that helps us figure out how aggressive we need to be on both ends of addressing the the problem.

Um I see this as one of the you know the biggest responsibilities that we have because we want to do good work for this uh the people of Tacoma because we provide services that people appreciate, and more often than not, people aren't telling us to get rid of something, they're asking us to add more to it.

Uh and so really trying to figure out um efficiently and with clarity.

Um, obviously, our side of things is politics, but really having that non political, just clear view of like these are the things that we do really well, and we should we should drive into.

These are the things we might need to connect with a partner on.

These are the things that we really just can't sustain anymore.

Um, and so we need to kind of figure out a new path for them or what it could look like going forward.

And so I think that that's really just that clarity and that amount of data and understanding that um and as well, I'll reiterate those that what other folks have already said, having options is really important of like, I think being able to kind of understand if this then this, and if not this, then this.

So yeah, thank you.

So at this time, I'll understand a motion to convene to an executive session pursuant to R C W forty two point thirty point one one zero section one G to evaluate the qualifications of an applicant for public employment not to exceed fifty minutes.

So moved.

Move and second, any council questions or comments.

Exact time.

I'd like to call the order back to the city council special meeting, and we are now standing adjourned.

Thank you all.

Have a good day.