Good evening.

We will now call to order the Monday, April 20th meeting of the City of Carmel Common Council.

First thing on the agenda is the agenda approval.

Move for approval.

Second.

Thank you.

We will now move on to our invocation.

I'd like to welcome Rabbi David.

Grossbaum of Shab.

Thank you.

Please, sir.

People mispronouncing that, so you're in great company.

Master of the universe.

We beseech you to bestow your blessings upon this distinguished body as they diligently fulfill one of the universal Noah Hyde commandments you've given unto humanity to govern by just laws.

In these divisive times, we strive to live by the teachings of my mentor, the Lababacher Rebbe of Blessed Memory, who taught that differences need not lead to division.

To the contrary, the ultimate divine unity and productivity is only found where the vital differences between people are overshadowed by what is common to all of us.

That we are God's creations.

The E.

Pluribus Unum, because of the in God we trust.

Almighty God, please bless this body and all of us.

So that we successfully foster an environment of liberty and a deeper appreciation that within each individual lies remarkable potential for good.

Please, Almighty God, help us sanctify our lives.

Dedicate our resources, harness our time and our talents to be a force for goodness and godliness.

Inspire us to work diligently in making the world a better place, starting with ourselves and then extending to our families and then our communities.

And may these local acts accumulate to a much larger force.

As the great Maimonides writes, each person must see themselves and the entire world as an even scale.

And with a single good deed, they can tip the scale to good, ushering the fulfillment of the prophet Isaiah's words that nation shall not lift up sword against nation, nor shall they learn of war anymore.

We eagerly anticipate this world of peace and brotherhood, as foreseen by our prophets of old.

So may it be your will, and let us respond.

Amen.

And to the Republic for religious stands.

One nation under God, indivisible with liberty and justice for all.

Good evening, Council.

Thank you.

It's an exciting night here after a very rigorous screening process.

We have four gentlemen here who I'm very excited to welcome to our police department.

Really, really talented guys.

So I will introduce each of them.

First of all, Tyler Winnings.

Tyler comes to us from Lebanon Police Department, where he worked as an officer and has nine years law enforcement experience.

He also served in the National Guard for six years prior to beginning his career in law enforcement.

And many years ago, Tyler was also a Carmel Police Cadet.

So he finally came back around to us.

Jeremy Foltz.

Jeremy comes to us from the private sector prior to that time and while uh pursuing a career with Carmel Police Department.

Marine Corps for four years.

Next, Daniel Eans.

Danny comes to us from the logistics field where he worked as a warehouse supervisor.

He studied psychology at Calumet College of St.

Joseph, where he attended on a golf scholarship.

And Evan Smiley, Evan comes to us from New Powell High School, where he worked in the education field for seven years.

And a teaching, in addition to teaching and working as a staff member, Evan has coached wrestling at several area high schools and also earned his bachelor's degree from University of Indianapolis, where he was a member of the wrestling team.

So those are our four new recruits here tonight.

I state your name.

Do you promise to faithfully and judicially faithfully and judicially?

Support the Constitution of the United States.

Support the Constitution of the United States.

The state of Indiana.

State of Indiana.

And discharge the duties of the office of the city of Carmel.

Discharge the duties of the office of Carmel.

So help me guide.

So we got welcome to Carmel.

Any family want to take photos?

Almost goes.

Thank you.

Congratulations.

At this time, I'd ask Chief Sterling to remain at the podium and do one of the most special things he gets to do.

And that is the presentation of Life Saving Awards.

Chief Sterling.

Yeah.

Very lucky tonight to have a couple officers and a number of firefighters with us as well as a survivor.

So at this time, I would like to ask Officer Mary Potvin and Sergeant Jeremy Meyer to please step up.

And Ricardo, you are welcome to as well, but feel free to stay seated if you want.

On March 4th, 2026, at approximately 1125 p.m., officers with Carmel Police Department responded to an unknown EMS call at a local address.

Officer Mary Potman arrived first on scene and was immediately met by a female Maria, who advised that her husband, Ricardo Perez, was unconscious.

Officer Pottman quickly assessed Mr.

Perez and determined that he had no pulse.

Without hesitation, Officer Pottman applied an AD and immediately began CPR.

Sergeant Jeremy Meyer arrived shortly after, at which time the AED advised uh advised that shock was advised.

Officer Povman noted that this was the second shock delivered since the AD had been applied.

Sergeant Meyer and Officer Pottman continued administering life-saving measures until Carmel Fire Department personnel arrived on scene.

Additional shocks were administered by medical personnel and medics later advised that Mr.

Perez had regained a pulse and was transported to St.

Vincent Heart Center for further treatment.

Medical staff at St.

Vincent later explained that if in it if it had not been for the officers' rapid response and immediate application of CPR and the AED, Mr.

Perez would not have survived.

Officer Potvin and Sergeant Myers Swift Actions, decisive response, and commitment to preserving life directly contributed to saving Mr.

Paris's life.

Their professional and professionalism and dedication reflect the highest standards of the Carmel Police Department, and therefore tonight they are being awarded the life saving award.

We also want to thank Bolt for the Heart for their continuous donations of AEDs to the Carmel Police Department.

Without their help, we wouldn't have the ability to outfit each of our Carmel Police cars with an AED.

To date, they have donated over 150 AEDs to our department.

And I know Pierre is here tonight with the Bolt team, and he was kind enough to join us on short notice.

And I know that he uh will be recognizing the survivor as well with a nice uh medal.

And then I know Chief Dakker uh would like to say some words about his firefighters as well.

So Chief Thacker.

I'd invite those firefighters that were a part of uh this incident to please step forward with the police officers as well.

And again, this is just a testament to the collaboration of the Carmel Police Department and the Carmel Fire Department.

I've had the opportunity to work in uh a few other places, and this relationship simply just does not exist in every community.

To see our police officers be dispatched or arrive already with the uh mentality of grabbing that AED and being prepared uh for our 911 uh dispatchers who are not here tonight that are really the first link in that chain of survival, receiving that phone call from the loved one, and then trying to provide information to them to do CPR on their loved one, something that every one of us in this room cannot imagine, and to bring in calm to that uh situation, and through the uh incredible training technology that we have afforded, Mayor Fincom, thank you, council members.

Thank you for that.

Uh we have a survivor here, and uh nationally, you know, when we look at return of spontaneous circulation nationally, it's around 25 or 30 percent.

Here in the city of Carmel, it's almost 50 percent because of the training, the equipment, the dedication of your heroes here tonight.

And so we just want to make sure and thank him, and then again, so grateful to have our survivor and his his wife here as well.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you very much.

Because we have a very long agenda tonight, and out of respect for our deputy mayor and the fact that he has class tomorrow, um, we are going to move rearrange slightly, and um if we could have the um council mayoral comments, observations uh done now, that would be great.

Good evening, city councilors.

My name is Artishman Chakra Borty.

I'm a fifth grader at Prairie Trace Elementary School, and I will be delivering tonight's mayor council report.

Tomorrow evening, the city will kick off the 2026 neighborhood pop-up series.

The first one will be held in the South Central District at the Western Mayor Commons Playground parking lot.

This is a great opportunity for neighbors to get together and for the residents to learn more about the city um services and community organizations.

Stay tuned to find out more about the other five neighborhood pop-ups we are planning this year.

On Friday, the City of Carmel will host the annual Holocaust Remembrance Ceremony.

It will take place at noon at the Charkington Theater.

This is an event where we honor the millions of people whose lives are lost during the Holocaust.

It also reminds reminds us the importance of standing against hatred and working to prevent such tragies in the futures.

Finally, mark your calendars for Japan's Springfest on March May 2nd.

This fun event celebrates spring and Japanese culture.

Families can enjoy delicious Japanese food, watch cultural performances, and try hands-win activities.

It's also a great chance to learn more about our sister city in Japan.

The festival will also begin with a special ribbon cutting ceremony to celebrate celebrate the reopening of the Carmel Japanese garden.

The event is free for everyone to attend.

I have no additional comments at this time.

Thank you very much.

Thank you, Mayor.

Thank you, Deputy Mayor.

Any council comments?

I just want to take a moment after you know swearing in our Carmel Police officers and seeing that wonderful presentation about um life-saving awards here in the city.

You know, it really does important to take a pause and recognize how safe our city is.

I think there was a press release put out recently by uh the mayor's office that crime is actually gone down in the city of Carmel while our population is increasing, which is kind of really unheard of nationwide.

And then um, you know, as we talk into the mayor, I think there was even uh a safest city study that we would have probably made.

We didn't qualify for this safest city list because we didn't have a single murder.

So uh it's kind of uh something that I know we take for granted, but to have a city over 100,000 um with the safety.

I just thank you again to all our first responders.

Absolutely.

Um I want to just reiterate two of the things that the mayor brought up.

Uh the Holocaust event this Friday uh at the Tarkman Theater at noon, very moving, very, very wonderful message about hatred from all directions and what it can lead to.

And I also wanted to reiterate the um uh Japanese Springfest, which is May 3rd, um celebrating the reopening of the beautiful uh Kwachinagano uh sister cities garden that um Hoishi Kurasu, the um 80 five-year-old designer and builder.

Um I spoke with out there today while he was moving stones because he didn't feel they were in the appropriate spot.

So uh truly truly a brilliant individual, and we're so blessed to have had this relationship with Kowachinagano and such an amazing uh phase one of our garden to our south.

Any other comments?

Okay.

So we are going to move on to the if I can pull up my notes here, excuse me.

Uh wishing to a public comment section, and I uh we've got quite a few, and they're all pertaining to mostly one topic.

Um, but I want to thank you all for being here tonight over the past couple months.

Um the council administration has spent a lot of time listening uh through your public meetings, the town halls, which I thought the last one was great, frankly, demonstrations, uh hundreds of emails, phone calls, and I know this issue has raised real concerns for many members of our public, and if it raises concerns for the public, it raises concerns for us, and I want to acknowledge that we do take those seriously.

I also want to be clear and transparent about something that we've discussed at almost ad nauseum, um, and that is that the city does not have uh authority over the leasing decisions of private residents and private businesses.

What we can do, and what I am hoping our role continues to be, is to continue listening and to focus on what we as a city can do, actionable items, whether that's identifying ways to support uh residents within our within our authority or ensuring that accurate helpful information is available to the public.

What would be most helpful this evening for us as a community would be specific, constructive ideas on how the city can support residents and new and clarifying questions that we can incorporate into the city's um ICE FAQ that the mayor put together uh and is on our website to improve uh information we have available.

We have and it's no fault of anybody speaking tonight, a huge agenda tonight.

Um a lot of the people's business to get through.

Um so we're gonna structure the public comment as follows.

Uh it's it's gonna be 45 minutes.

Now, based on the number of cards, I don't think that's going to be an issue.

Uh, we're gonna prioritize non uh agenda item comments first.

I still think we get through everybody.

Um for some reason we don't, I will say after and listen to anyone that wants to speak.

But our goal tonight is to listen, be respectful of one another, be regardless of point of view or perspective, and ensure we can both hear from the public while still carrying out our responsibilities this evening as a council.

Um before we begin, I am going to have as just an educational moment.

Um we've two independent attorneys here.

The city council retains their own attorney uh from a private law firm, and then we have city attorneys, and I want them to concisely speak to what the authorities of a municipality are municipality are for anybody that has not read the FAQ, so that when those of you that want to speak and let us know how you're feeling, you can clearly identify ways to ask questions that we can actually impact.

So, Sergey, Ted, if you could kind of give us the rundown on limitations of municipal government as it pertains to leasing a private space, would be greatly appreciated.

Sure.

As you all know, ICE is a federal agency that executed a lease to at least to the best of our knowledge with a private entity with a private building.

And we, as counselor Schneider only pointed out, correctly, we cannot affect the lease of relationship between two private entities.

We simply don't have that authority under any of our city ordinances or under our state law or federal law.

So that is something to keep in mind, as far as we know this administrative office, properly leased, that did not require any city approvals.

It would be different if a federal agency wanted to construct a facility here, which ICE has done in a couple of municipalities around the country.

But it's not the case here.

Again, we are leasing from a private entity that we cannot control.

So that's that is really is a summary.

There's no there's nothing more to it.

I would be happy to answer any additional questions as well.

Unless Ted has something else to add.

Thanks, sir Bay.

Um I would also point out that even if there were regulations that allowed you to regulate police.

Um I apologize.

Um even if there were regulations that allow the city to regulate something like a lease, uh, the supremacy clause of the Constitution, and with it, it's called the doctrine of intergovernmental immunity.

Prevents you from doing anything that burdens a federal agency.

So any action you took would likely be illegal under the Constitution.

Um if that weren't enough, the Indiana General Assembly just passed Citabell 76 this past session, which requires you to cooperate with ICE in all aspects.

And that includes detention, um, sharing of information, and actually imposes civil penalties on cities or towns that refuse to cooperate.

So I don't think there's any question that the city's hands are tied as it deals with um ICE entering to this lease agreement.

Thank you.

Now I also recognize that for me in this room uh hearing what the city can and cannot do does not ease any concerns, and I acknowledge that those concerns are real and they matter.

Our responsibility is to focus on what is within our control and how we communicate clearly, how we support members of our community, and how we respond thoughtfully to questions and ideas you bring forward tonight.

So as you start coming up, there are rules, and these rules have been in place for decades.

Um for those of you that have submitted a blue card, I'm reading it directly, so I don't miss step.

Those who have submitted a blue card uh to speak during this part of the agenda shall go to the podium to comment after your name is called.

I will also mention who's on deck so you can be ready.

We will not be entering into dialogue at this time.

The purpose is of this agenda item is for you, the public to inform us, the council about your views.

All comments are limited to three minutes.

The light by the podium will start green, then it'll go yellow with 30 seconds left and turn red when time is up.

At that time, I would ask you please just finish your sentence.

Nobody wants the awkwardness of me trying to interject.

Any form of demonstration, signs, clapping, cheering are not allowed, and failure to comply may result in you being asked to leave.

This is stemmed purely in uh decorum, and that this is a place of business and a place that should feel comfortable for all.

With that said, we do have one individual speaking about an agenda item not related to ICE, and that is a Mr.

John Chipman.

The floor is yours, sir.

I'm gonna prefer to say that you call called the thank you, sir.

Much appreciated.

We look forward to hearing from you via email.

Um next, Ms.

Sharon Baller Bowler, thank you.

I apologize.

And next up, good friend Joey Basou.

You're on deck, sir.

Good evening.

My name, as uh Councilman Snyder said, is Sharon Bowler.

I am the head of a local nonprofit here called From Strangers to Neighbors.

We serve the refugee population who resettles here legally until last year that program existed through the United States Customs and Immigration Service until it was shuttered by the current administration.

But we still serve refugees who are here.

Today, when I checked my email, I had my weekly newsletter from the city of Carmel.

It was promoting its second annual Eid Al Aha Festival, which is an important holiday for the Muslim community.

I'm familiar with it because I serve a lot of Muslim families.

And I was delighted to see this festival being hosted.

I was not aware that it happened here last year.

I was delighted to see it.

I already have the upcoming Japan Spring Fest on my calendar.

And I also have the Holocaust Remembrance event on my calendar for this Friday.

Evidence existed everywhere that immigrants are valued here.

And while I appreciate the recent efforts of the city to provide an FAQ on the ICE office that is here, I feel like that response is those all those responses fall short for me.

And perhaps it's because of the work I do and my daily interactions with the immigrant community.

To me, they don't show a city that fully embraces immigrants so much as right now in this moment as one that perhaps is trying to avoid a conflict with power.

And I recognize legally you cannot remove ICE.

I'm not asking you to do that.

We don't want them here.

And they are finding that the pathway to eventual citizenship is cut.

So a statement from Carmel saying we don't want ICE here.

We don't support the policies and actions of ICE.

We don't feel that creates a community that welcomes immigrants.

Would be a powerful one.

So I ask that you consider doing that in a formal way to let the immigrants who are here know that Carmel cares.

Thank you, Ms.

Bowler.

Joey.

Mr.

Basso, rather.

Hi, good evening, everyone.

Quick uh disclaimer, views are my own, not my employers, not any other organization.

I'm just here speaking as a resident of Carmel.

Uh first I want to thank those on the city council that made an appearance at the uh March 30th town hall on the ICE office in Carmel.

Your presence and uh presence and an important message that you're listening to residents' concerns.

Their turnout in that room and also the turnout in this room reflect what I've been hearing since I spoke that here on February 16th.

Carmel residents are deeply troubled by the ICE office in our community, and they want to know that their local government will protect their constitutional rights.

Formal direction from the council would clarify that this includes oversight of federal operations that impacts Carmel's residents.

I understand that you're navigating difficult legal and political terrain, especially with SB 76 now signed into law.

But the March 30th Town Hall and what I see when I look around this room right now all demonstrated that Carmel residents are looking to their local elected officials for leadership on this issue.

Thank you.

Thank you, sir.

Ms.

Stephanie Stewart.

Up next will be Mrs.

Sarah Draper.

Thank you for your time.

As a person who's lived here since 2012, one of the things I love most about Carmel is its adversity.

I have friends from all over the world.

France, England, Spain, India, China, Argentina, Colombia, Chile, all over the world, all over South America, Puerto Rico, and they work at IU.

They work at the hospital.

They're professors, they're engineers, they are respected professionals, and many of them are brown.

And what I have seen on the news repeatedly is the fact that the ICE agents are very disrespectful of anyone who's brown.

They are racially profiling people.

There is illegal surgeon seizure, as he indicated.

I very much agree, we need to follow the Constitution a thousand percent.

They should not be walking around pointing guns at citizens.

Children should not be detained.

They should not be collateral damage.

This is ridiculous.

It's appalling, it's disgusting.

Look at what happened in Minneapolis.

People have died.

It is inappropriate.

And as Mr.

Asin, Adam, you just mentioned how safe it is in Carmel.

So why do we need ice here?

Except it's a blue county, right?

And this administration has been targeting progressive blue cities systematically.

And it's unacceptable.

It should be unconstitutional.

And I am not okay with it.

I am very proud that my children have grown up, were both born at IU North, and have friends from many countries, and they are colorblind.

They love all of their friends, whether they be white, brown, or yellow.

And that's as it should be.

As the rabbi stated, we should all care for each other and support each other.

It is not about the color of your skin or where you grew up.

Why is ICE here?

To chase an opair, a lawn worker, a maid, seriously.

I already see Carmel police profiling people that are brown that dented car and rust.

I see them pulled over all the time.

There needs to be an example made of any ICE officers that profile and illegal search and seizure.

No, absolutely not.

It cannot be accepted.

And there should be a formal statement accordingly.

Thank you.

Thank you, Ms.

Stewart.

This is Sarah Draper.

And up next will be Shelly Carey.

Good evening.

My name's Sarah Draper, and I'm a 19-year resident of Carmel, and as you see immediately, I'm an immigrant.

I've been a Hoosier for 26 years and a proud naturalized U.S.

citizen since 2013.

Did you know that 13% of Carmel residents, like me, are foreign-born?

That's more than one in eight people in our city.

Two of our councilors have foreign-born spouses.

It's everywhere in Carmel.

This diverse city, which continues to celebrate the many vibrant cultures.

Well, the people have talked about Japan Springfest, EFES.

It's fantastic.

But these outward displays of respect to the cultures here are worth little if the leaders in this place don't stand up for those cultures in difficult times.

Hundreds of people attended the recent ICE no ice town hall, showing how strongly our community feels about this issue.

I'm thankful to Dr.

Joshi for her barnstorming speech and to the other counselors who showed up, the two of them and the council who sent a statement.

But I have to say, I'm disappointed that I did not see all of you there.

It's rare you're given an opportunity to hear from your constituents like this, and rarer still on such a hot button issue.

I can tell you that even as a legal immigrant who followed all the rules, I'm scared.

I have the utmost faith.

I'm dangerous too, apparently.

I have the utmost faith in our outstanding police department.

I'm the board secretary for the Carmel Citizens Police Alliance.

But our police department cannot protect us from masked federal agents intent on trampling on our constitutional rights, especially after the passage of Senate Bill 76.

I've seen U.S.

citizens standing up for immigrants killed in the streets by rogue agents.

I've seen U.S.

citizens detained for no valid reason.

This administration has declared open season on immigrants, and we all know it.

I have immense privilege.

I'm white.

I'm a native English speaker, real English.

And I am terrified.

I saw an unmarked van with government plates pop by my car the other day, and my instant thought was that ICE were here for me.

So think of those many people without my privilege and how scared they are.

It's easy to say that only men in polo shirts will be in the ICE office.

For all of us who feel at risk, even those like me who immigrated legally, ICE is ICE, a clear and present danger, which provokes fear in all immigrants.

Other cities have passed council resolutions stating their opposition to the ICE presence.

We have a list of FAQs on the city website.

It's better than nothing, but it's not enough.

Will you please stand up for the more than one in eighth of us who are immigrants and pass a resolution stating you will not tolerate any attacks on Carmel residents' constitutional rights and insist that any ICE activities are legal, an offer due process.

Make us feel safe again.

Thank you, Mrs.

Straber.

Ms.

Kerr.

On deck is uh Mr.

Henry Winkler.

I also attended the town hall meeting about ICE opening an office in our community.

I wrote Mayor Finkam and Councilmember Ayers asking what is our city's stand against having ICE-filling administrative space here.

I feel until ICE is reformed and not rooted in bringing fear into a community, their presence concerns me.

Our tax money pays their salaries, and we should know what they are working on to determine whether their work is of any value.

I heard back from Mayor Finkham.

Her initial response stated that our elected leaders have absolutely no control or influence as to how this ICE location situation was developed.

We heard that again tonight by our legal counsel.

Mayor Finkham rightfully acknowledged that she knows this is not what I wanted to hear, but that she'd rather focus on things where she can have an impact, and ICE office location is not one of them.

I continued my email exchange with the mayor by asking a series of questions.

She responded to each one, again stating that she and the city had limited jurisdiction over having ICE rent space in a Carmel office building.

Since then, the mayor has posted a list of questions and answers on the website, and I ask that we continue to send questions in to continue to get answers.

The ICE office is for attorneys, I guess.

I I question why they chose to locate in Carmel, Indiana.

If they are handling lawsuits or appeals from undocumented individuals, wouldn't it make more sense to be in Washington, D.C.

or maybe along the southern border to help expedite appeals to enter the United States legally?

I was assured that our Carmel Police Department will not detain individuals for immigration issues.

Mayor Finkham also shared that public safety remains Carmel's top priority.

She affirmed that we have incredibly well-trained and professional officers here in Carmel who have a heavy focus on de-escalation and protecting civil rights.

Keeping our community informed is important.

Mayor Fingham's response, we have asked that if their office personnel were to change substantially that we be informed.

I think that might be something to put in writing and to have them make sure that they have a copy of that.

And that our elected leaders keep communication lines open with the ICE office and keep us updated regularly.

These agents are supposedly lawyers, and the mayor said they will be dressed in suits or polo shirts.

I just hope we don't see them change from their polos and suits into military gear.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Mr.

Winkler on deck is Ms.

Linda Bailey Zimmerman.

My name is Henry Winkler.

I'm a resident at 411 Jenny Lane, Carmel, Indiana, president of the Central Carmel President Preservation Association.

I'm here to talk and try to convince you to reject ICE's presence in our community.

It's a corrosive, ugly presence that doesn't deserve the good graces of Carmel.

To capitalize ICE, we speak in this way.

Where ICE is, there exists cruelty, death, and loss of due process, incarceration of constitutionally protected persons, horrifying conditions and concrete boxes, children separated from their parents, and uh kept in uh awful conditions without medical care and schooling.

Why would we want such a painful, immoral, disruptive organization in our community?

It's been said that it's only an administrative branch.

Well, that's what the hell administrative branches do.

They enable these kinds of abuses.

This is no way for our civilized community to react, to allow such an immoral rogue organization into our community.

We depend on you, our city administrators, to protect us from the abuses of IC.

Let's understand people on the move, migrants, move, uh have a God given moral right to uh safe uh safety and a life of peace from terrible conditions of murder, torture, and abuse of all kinds.

Uh and we don't expect them to seek this peace and uh uh community uh and find the same kind of treatment here.

Uh this is an uh inalienable moral right that those among us who have to migrate do have.

Yes, the country has the right to protect its borders from criminal elements.

We would uh need ICE, we wouldn't need If ICE uh uh is necessary if Congress would do its job.

That's not what's happening.

What's happening is this the request is for some hundred and thirty billion in appropriation to fund ICE.

This bloated amount would create a personal police force accountable to one person.

Uh as a law-abiding peace-loving community, let us set an example to the state and nation by rejecting ICE in any form in Carmel, we are better than this.

Thank you, Mr.

Winkler.

Um, Ms.

Zimmerman.

Up next will be Mr.

Rob Brown.

Hi.

Um, I really hate speaking publicly.

My name is Linda Bailey Zimmerman, and I live on Spruce Drive in Carmel, Indiana.

There's one point that I haven't heard raised at all about ICE in Carmel or ICE across the United States.

And that, and it was so poignant tonight to see the induction of the new police officers.

My point is, I think it's detrimental to our local police department to have to work in tandem and side by side with ICE.

ICE is not trained as extensively as our police departments are in any form in any faction, not just de-escalation, but just in procedural and in following the U.S.

Constitution.

I find it just abhorrent.

These men and women are their lives are on the line every day, and they're now having to deal with working side by side with ICE.

So I would like to um say that I think that I'm very sorry that all of you have to do that.

And I am opposed to ICE in Carmel.

Thank you.

Thank you, Ms.

Zimmerman.

Mr.

Rob Brown.

Up next.

Um Ms.

Mora.

Do I need to push the button?

Or is it on?

Okay.

Well, I think uh after what I've heard, I understand my comments are probably not going to be as welcomed by some here, but I do respect the difference of opinion, and maybe uh there's opportunity to work together to find common ground among us.

Um, you would say, what does that guy know about immigration?

He was born and raised in Carmel, you know, he's not had to deal with this.

Uh but I was raised by an immigrant and I'm currently married to one, so I've experienced and been around people who've come to this country and given up everything to be here.

So I appreciate those who do want to do that and understand the sacrifices required.

Back when my mom immigrated to this country, they had to have a sponsor and a job lined up before they came to make sure that they would be self-sufficient.

Um they also had to forswear the allegiance to their foreign country and swear allegiance to the United States.

I know that's changed now.

So times have changed, but needless to say, her family, my that side of my family and my wife's family are very supportive of ICE, and I take my opinion based on what they say on that, because they've been through it.

You would never meet more supportive people of ICE than my wife's and my mom's families.

But we must also live in reality and say things that are true, such as there's a legal process if you are a refugee and you have legitimate asylum claims.

Those things shouldn't scare us.

Folks should be following rules, and if they've obeyed our laws, there's nothing to fear.

Now I would also like to say that why are we so fearful of ICE in the first place?

These are men and women who bravely signed up to maintain the laws of our country and deserve our respect and admiration.

They are not here to break our laws but to enforce them.

It's been suggested that ICE might go around asking for people's papers.

I don't see any basis for this fear, but it is possible that a person may be asked to prove their legal status.

But so what?

If you're following the rules, you have nothing to fear.

We must live in reality.

ICE officers are not monsters.

They are people like you and me.

They put their pants on one leg at a time.

They have moms and dads who love them.

They come home to husbands and wives and eat dinner, and they have kids who can't wait for them to come home and play catch in the backyard.

ICE officers are people too.

They have hopes and fears and hobbies and dreams just like the rest of us.

And I would invite you to recall the humanity of these folks and to remember that they are just people who are doing a job that needs done, and that there are two sides to every coin.

I think we can all agree that most people don't take jobs to do harm.

Most people.

There are always exceptions, and those are the ones that find their way into the TV.

Now they do their jobs and they do them well, and we never hear about it.

They're not out shaking people down in every city in which they reside.

And even if they wanted to, they're not allowed to break the rules.

So I would ask in conclusion: maybe there's a way to see both sides of the coin and understand that things that are illegal are illegal.

When is it right to commit just a little bit of robbery or a little bit of arson?

In this case, if something's illegal, there are officers for that, and these ICE officers in our community would be no different than the ones who serve us that were sworn in today.

Thank you, Ms.

Thank you.

Ms.

Morha.

Next up will be uh Ms.

Lorena Lane.

Good evening, Council.

My name is Mike Alejandra Mora, and I'm 16 years old.

If I recall, I spoke about the same immigration topic a month or two ago in front of your very same faces.

Glad to be back.

I want to start by sharing something honestly.

As I follow this issue, I found myself wishing for less helplessness and more assertiveness from our city leadership.

I say that with respect because I know these decisions might be complicated.

I understand that you feel limited in what you can do about the possibility of an ICE office opening here.

But even when options are limited, your voices and opinions still matter.

The way you communicate with the public shapes how people feel, whether they feel informed, included, and supported.

And I want to be very clear about something.

Speaking up on this issue should not be reduced to political labels.

This does not make you extreme, and it does not define you as one ideology or another.

At its core, it's about values, respect for due process, a stance against racial profiling, and unmistakable support for basic human rights for everyone whose feet touch the soil of what is supposed to be the greatest country on earth.

My own family reflects that.

My father was a Mexican immigrant, he is now a citizen.

My mother was born in New Zealand and has dual citizenship with the Netherlands in the United States.

We could have chosen to live anywhere in the world, but we chose Carmel, and we're not alone.

There are hundreds of international families who chose to build their lives and put down roots here, because this city is supposed to represent opportunity, safety, and belonging.

That's why this matters.

Because when people feel uncertain about how they might be treated because of how they look or where they come from, it can change their sense of home.

When you go home tonight, look in the mirror and ask yourselves one thing.

Why did you choose public service?

And what kind of community do you hope to create?

I'm here because I care about this community.

If this office opens and there is any harassment of any sort against any member of our community, it will reflect the legacy of how this issue was voiced here.

Additionally, I'm here to remind you that the rest of the children in Carmel are the future of this country, this state, and this city.

Show the future how you decide to stand up for us today for all of us, whether we're from Mexico, from Europe, or from the USA.

All we ask is that you dig deep and find the courage to continue to help make it a place where everyone feels like they belong.

Thank you for your time.

Thank you, Ms.

Morris.

Ms.

Lane.

Members of the Council, my name is Lorena Lane.

I'm a Mexican immigrant and a 20-year resident of Carmel.

Thank you for the opportunity to speak today.

I come before you both as a concerned resident and as a symbol of the timeless concept of liberty.

Liberty is an ideal that has guided this nation for generations.

That dignity, safety, and freedom belong to all.

And that is why I am here.

In recent months, a new federal presence, as we all know, has been established in Carmel.

With it, there has been a subtle but meaningful shift in how some residents experience daily life.

A quiet unease, a growing sense of fear.

And I would ask you to consider an image.

Any institution casts a shadow.

And the shadow is long.

It stretches across our neighborhoods, across our schools, across our ordinary daily moments, shaping how people move, how they speak, and whether they feel safe in a place they call home.

We know this is not theoretical.

It is reality.

In Minnesota, during a federal immigration operation, a 37-year-old American woman, a member of her community, lost her life in an encounter with an ICE agent.

I ask you respectfully to imagine that moment here.

A woman in Carmel, a neighbor, a parent.

Not as a point of alarm, but as a point of responsibility because it reminds us that federal presence is not abstract.

It has real consequences in real communities.

And here in Indiana, the use of the Miami Correctional Facility for immigration detention has raised ongoing concerns about oversight conditions and the human impact of these systems within our state.

Taken together, these are not distant issues.

They are signals.

And they are part of the shadow now reaching into this community.

I want to be clear, this is not about opposing federal law.

It's about how liberty is upheld locally.

Because liberty is preserved or weakened through local decisions, through the tone set in rooms like this one, through the trust built between residents and those who serve them.

You have taken an appreciated step toward building this trust through the publication of the U.S.

Immigration and Customs Enforcement frequently asked questions on the City of Carmel website.

Thank you for that important step.

However, questions remain among Carmel residents, so I offer this respectfully as a call to action.

I ask this council to adopt a formal statement or resolution affirming that Carmel takes a stand against ICE in our community, that Carmel takes a stand against ICE violence in our community, and that due process for all is required in our community.

And I also request this council ongoingly pursue transparency for from federal agencies operating within your jurisdiction so that this community understands how those operations may affect them.

Members of the council, the question is not whether the shadow exists.

It's whether you will acknowledge it and shape how it falls.

Liberty has stood for generations as a promise, but that promise endures only when it is upheld, especially at the local level.

Thank you, Ms.

Lane.

At this time.

These are all the blue cards we have.

We are going to take a brief recess, because I doubt many of you are interested in the rest of this heavy agenda.

I'm sorry.

No.

So we'll take a maybe a five-minute recess just if anybody wants to leave to shuffle out and then we will readjourn the meeting.

Thank you all, and um appreciate the comments.

Thank you for Carmel residents once again demonstrating what an amazing community we live in with your respect towards each other.

Next up are our committee reports.

Oh, I'm sorry.

Thank you.

I apologize.

Approval minutes.

March 16th regular meeting and our April 2nd claims meeting.

Move to approve.

Second.

Thank you.

Claims.

Payroll in the amount of $4,493,748.

General claims $3,245,084.71 cents.

Wire transfers $2,108,844.84 cents.

Second.

Thank you.

Now Mayor Ovito's nun committee reports.

Dr.

Joshi.

Scheduled a trip many, many months ago.

And uh before our council calendar was set and is not here tonight.

Did anybody else from land use have an update?

The next meeting, as I recall, is a week from Wednesday.

We moved it to Tuesday the 28th at 6 p.m.

Tuesday the 28th at 6 p.m.

So it will be here and not at the library.

Thank you.

Or uh caucus room.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

City Hall, Tuesday, the 28th.

6 p.m.

6 p.m.

6 p.m.

All right.

Counselor Taylor.

Thank you, Council President Snyder.

The finance committee met on Tuesday, April 14th.

We have one item on our agenda.

That is ordinance D-2811-26.

We'll talk about that more, but the amended and amended ordinance was unanimously approved to move forward with a favorable recommendation of the full council.

Thank you, sir.

Other reports.

As I started to say at the wrong time, we have one deletion, and that is uh Carmel Historic Preservation Commission.

Um the Chairman was unable to make it.

That'll be in May.

Uh Henry Mestecksky, Carmel Redevelopment Commission monthly report, please.

Good evening, City Council.

Henry Mistetsky, Carmel's redevelopment director.

Could I please have a screen, Hal?

I'm gonna we're gonna do a two for one today.

The first is the report of the Carmel Redevelopment Authority.

For the last half a year, they did not meet.

Uh the second is that uh Indiana law uh requires that uh once a year um the redevelopment commission, every redevelopment commission put together a tip management report of all their spending for the previous year, which means it's already been authorized by previous votes.

This everything in this report gets filed with the Indiana Department of Local Government Finance, which has been done.

Uh the law requires that this be sent to all of the city council and the mayor, which it has been, but basically here's a report that it's a little hard to see, but it basically talks about every single dollar spent by the redevelopment commission in the previous year, what it was spent on, and it also reflects a report of every dollar captured by every TIFF allocation area in the city and how that relates to what we spent the money on.

Um if anybody wants to see this report, I'm happy to make it uh accessible, but it's also all live on the Department of Local Government Finance.

And uh that concludes my report, and I'm happy to answer any questions that the council might have.

Thank you, Henry.

Thank you.

Uh not much construction has occurred since the last one, so out of respect for this council and the timing.

I was gonna this was uh this concludes my report.

Much appreciated.

Thank you.

Uh climate action advisory committee.

Thank you.

See if this is truly plug and play.

All right.

Thank you, uh Eric Mill, uh administration planning director for Carmel Clay Parks, but also the uh chair for the Climate Action Advisory Committee.

So real quick, uh out of respect for your guys' time, I only have two slides for you.

Um just a recap of this last year.

Um we completed one of our 43 action items.

We actually have three fully completed action items, but as of last year we we completed another one.

Um I know it doesn't seem like a lot, but over the years um a lot of these action items take a lot of effort and a lot of time for us to be able to complete.

Um some of them may not actually ever be marked as complete because they are some things that we have to do ongoing um as policies and things and continue to manage over time.

So um, but we did complete one, which was the commuter line feasibility study.

Um that was lumped into the overall um uh transportation study that the engineering department department completed this last year.

So we marked that one off as complete because that included um looking at a commuter line and its feasibility for uh Carmel residents.

So um, but what I wanted to point out mostly was some of the action items that we are making significant progress in.

So this list is a little bit longer for you guys.

But um public education, we've been working really hard with the city's marketing team to uh have a whole section within the newsletters that are going out to the residents that's focused on some of the climate action things that we're doing.

Um with municipal energy efficiency evaluation.

I know the city's starting to work on this a little bit.

Um, but us as the parks department, we did um a guaranteed energy savings study for the Monon Community Center.

This last year was our first year of having a full report back.

Um so it was a really good benchmark for um seeing how that is working.

Um and that hopefully maybe um the city can help uh kind of implement some of those same strategies uh moving forward um across the board there as well.

Um the city's EV and hydrogen fleet purchasing retrofit policy.

We're making some good progress on that um as of even this last month.

Uh street department is working on including some language um that's been turned over to the finance department to kind of help with how we manage the uh overall city fleet purchasing and trying to see when it's appropriate to be able to look at alternative fuel sources for some of our city vehicles.

Um expanding our uh bicycle and alternative transportation.

Um as you guys worked through last year, the micro-mobility uh ordinance that you guys put together, much appreciated on that side helps to to promote some of those aspects within the community.

Um the water usage assessment, so the um city utilities has done a really great job of having um putting together uh a fully automated automatic uh water meters throughout the city so that residents and the city themselves can have real-time data uh looking at how much water usage each individual resident is using at real time.

Um so implementing that has really helped to kind of have a lot more data on how the city and residents are using water over across the board.

Um food waste composting and a composting private uh pilot program.

Um those are two items that are kind of linked together.

Uh again, city utility utilities, wastewater um worked really hard to try to figure out a way that we could bring this in-house to have this uh you know as an opportunity for the community.

Um ultimately deciding right now the infrastructure is just not there to hand handle it in-house, so they did work really uh really hard to uh sign an agreement with Earth Mama um to then provide that service to Carmel residents at a discount.

Um so if they want to work with composting that they can do that.

Um and then finally the community orchard pilot program, um Carmel Clay Parks has received a grant from DNR um for roughly about 10,000 worth of trees that we plan on on planting in West Park that are fruit and nut trees.

It'll take some while to for those to germinate and actually produce um fruit and nut, but um worked out a on a grant uh through the DNR to obtain those, and so those will go in hopefully sometime next year or this year.

And we'll start to see that kind of start to work forward, and then it'll there'll be some public education around that and everything.

So those are the main things that we've been working on so far.

So throughout all the different departments, so happy to answer any questions.

Given that you're giving a formal presentation, but that we've had time to review it, and this will be posted online.

Maybe stick to the highlights if you wouldn't mind, sir.

Happy to do so.

Alright, so uh uh Zach Jackson, CFO and controller, the city of Carmel.

Uh I have uh really four things to update you on tonight.

Uh first of all, uh revenues for the first quarter.

Uh sorry that the font is so extremely small here, but the major takeaway is that uh for the first quarter we exceeded our forecast by 1.2 million.

1.1 of that was the uh reimbursement uh from the Keystone uh bridge damage from insurance, and so had it not been for that, we would have been only been uh less than 100,000 off on our uh quarterly revenue forecast for the general fund.

Moving on to uh expenses, and this is general fund expenses.

Uh this is planned spending versus actual spending for the first quarter.

Uh we were one percent less than planned 352,000.

Moving on to uh MVH uh spending, the two departments uh funded from there uh underspent by 3.7% or 177,000 for the first quarter.

Uh an issue I do need to update council regarding is our uh municipal wheel tax uh uh for this year.

Uh we originally believed that we were going to receive 641,000 uh from that uh new tax.

Uh we noticed that revenues weren't quite uh coming in at what we expected uh by March 10th, and after uh reaching out to our contractor who had put together the estimates, they realized that they had double counted the uh trucks over 11,000 pounds in both the surtax and wheel tax calculations.

That means our revised wheel tax estimate is now 178,000 uh uh 463,000 less than what we originally projected.

Um after talking with the street department, we believe that there's an opportunity for them to uh absorb that within their existing appropriation for this year from the MVH.

Um we may be coming back to council to uh ask for assistance with a transfer, uh, but right now it appears that they can absorb it within their existing appropriations, uh, just in that things have been coming in uh under bid compared to what they budgeted for.

Um but I'll note that our our municipal surtax, the larger of the two, uh, that uh estimate of 2.9 million uh still remains accurate.

And lastly, uh Project Cornerstone, our EMERP implementation of two major updates here.

Uh, first of all, uh we have uh the IT department has extended an offer to their uh new full-time employee that will be the ERP project manager.

Uh the gentleman starts in May, and then in terms of evaluating our ERP uh system solutions, uh we are recommending workday as our ERP system and the implementation partner to do that implementation.

We've done this procurement through uh nationally recognized purchasing cooperative known as Omnia Partners, uh, which allows us to utilize master contracts that have been awarded to other public agencies.

Uh at this point, we think our ongoing licensing costs will be roughly the same, if not lower than what we're currently uh paying, and uh for those new licenses and the implementation cost uh are still being evaluated.

Uh we probably have two scenarios there.

One would be uh uh do we want to pay for the implementation up front, or two, uh do we want to smooth it over the life of that uh contract.

I'll be bringing back a recommendation on that front uh uh probably at the May meeting.

With that said, happy to take any questions.

I just want to give a kudos one for how you've handled the budget situation, but also uh with the ERP.

Um you know, uh I know that some of the numbers seemed a lot higher over you know, maybe six months a year ago we were talking about this.

Uh very impressed of doing this basically at the same cost as our existing licensing.

Uh I'm familiar with work day, I know the program.

Um so again, you know, we're critical at times, but we also want to give praise when praise is due.

And uh great job here.

Thank you.

Ditto what he said.

Sounds disingenuous, but it's true.

Thank you so much.

Um couple questions about the the wheel tax and the MVH.

To be clear, and I'm it's just just for my own knowledge, the MVH that goes towards paving, correct?

The 400 and the the loss would come from basic like paving or yeah, there is um underspend so far, projected underspend of about a half million dollars in their uh uh paving budget at the street department within their MVH appropriation.

Okay, so any projects that we wanted to maybe slip in there, we won't be able to then just to cover this little shortfall.

Probably uh uh future conversation.

Okay, sounds great.

Thank you so much.

Appreciate it.

Zach, thank you.

I know that um I was a little shocked when I learned you hadn't hired them yet, but then I was reminded that while we are a very slow and methodical, deliberate council when we're wrapping our heads around new things.

Once we come together and agree on it, we expect it to be done yesterday, and you were doing the right thing and continuing to be slow and methodical, and that is appreciated.

Thank you.

Okay, moving on to old business items A B and C remain in committee.

We'll start with excuse me, items A and B remain in committee.

C came out with a positive recommendation.

Counselor Taylor.

Thank you, Counselor Snyder.

Uh a great part about what happened at the finance committee meeting um was is that two neighbors, a commercial office and the HOA president of the residents on Autumn Drive.

And I want to thank Councilor Warrell for also reaching out to the neighbors to the South, had actually uh met and discussed um pros and cons and concerns and ways to come to a mutual agreement on to way to address parking on autumn drive.

So there will need to be um we did have uh address an amendment during the finance committee meeting, and Benjamin Lay uh Corporation Council uh drafted the language.

So we're discussing uh uh section 8-47 no parking areas uh under item A.

Uh the changes instead of on both sides of Autumn Drive, it is on the south side of Autumn Drive.

The additional amendment, which I apologize, I thought that this was added to the um folder, but Benjamin had sent it out and asked for feedback from the finance committee members if this lake would language met what we discussed in committee.

So the additional amendment would be in item B, which you actually have those in your emails now.

I apologize.

Um the discussion between the neighbors and the local business was to only have parking from Monday through Friday, only allow parking from Monday through Friday through 7 8 uh 7 a.m.

to 7 p.m.

That's what the uh that's what they agreed upon.

Everybody felt comfortable with and is the amendment that was added to the ordinance and the amendment states the amended uh section states on the north side of Autumn Drive from its intersection with Third Avenue Southwest to its intersection with Atherton Drive, except parking uh except parking shall be allowed in this area Monday through Friday, only between the hours of 7 a.m.

and 7 p.m.

That passed um out of committee unanimously with a positive recommendation for the council and uh would love to uh see us take action on that today.

Thank you, counselor Taylor.

Uh really do appreciate you and your committee really looking into this.

Um especially in the climate where we're parking is an issue, um residents are an issue.

I'm just really thrilled that you got both homeowners and commercial um landowners tenants to come together.

Uh what would you like to do this evening?

Yeah, comment comment.

Yeah, before we go to a motion.

Um, Brad, maybe you should go to the podium.

Uh so I did reach out to the HOA Parkside Village HOA, and one of the things that I could not answer and said I would clarify is there um can you make sure that there is enough clearance from the car parked uh at Atherton so that the neighbors can see around it to pull out safely.

That's the only um concern.

So I wasn't sure where the parking would stop.

Um I would maybe compare it to the situation when you're you know heading east uh like on First Street at Rangeline, and sometimes you have to kind of sneak out to see.

So they just want to make sure there's enough room to see around that vehicle to the left or to the east uh so that they can pull out safely.

That's the only comment.

Otherwise, they were in favor of this.

Yeah, Brad Peese, director of engineering.

Uh the green line kind of represents that.

So uh you can see it's shy of the intersection.

So we'll place the signs appropriately to help control that too.

No parking here at a corner at either end for Third Avenue and Atherton.

Would you entertain a motion?

Do you want to make the motion?

Yeah, meant, yes.

I'd make a motion to amend as uh just read into the record.

Move to approve.

Great job.

Okay.

Uh counselor Minar to take this one away.

This is the resolution of the City Council City Council approving amendment to our comprehensive plan to incorporate new subject sub-bury plan for the US 31 corridor.

So sorry.

I was so busy reading, I wasn't paying attention.

Uh this resolution amends the Carmel Comprehensive Plan to incorporate a new sub-area plan for the US 31 corridor and makes associated revisions to the mobility and pedestrian plan.

Counselor Locke, can you please go through the timeline of committee?

Sure.

Uh back in the 1950s, we started the process.

Um I'm kidding.

It was uh middle of last year.

Uh this plan came before the land use committee, and it became a work in progress.

Um I don't want to say like no other, but like no other, where uh the community feedback and input uh was pulled in, and we talked to neighbors, residents, people throughout the entire timeline to get the right feedback to ensure that we're putting together a process uh that really gets to the intent of the city council, really land use of that time and plan commission before it, uh, but to set a stage for how people that are trying to and looking to develop in this new uh resurging redevelopment corridor, which is the Meridian Corridor, uh truly have to take into account the other things that are around it.

So really these plans are to help ensure that the market knows when they're interacting with the city what we expect.

So the idea of redeveloping that corridor matters a ton uh for all of us to ensure that the economic health and prosperity of the city moves forward.

Um that didn't mean we had to at the end of the day uh forget about and and not talk about the neighborhoods and the residential communities that surrounded it.

So I've been truly impressed.

Um the amount of people that have come out to be a part of this, the number of counselors that showed up to neighborhood meetings, to land use, the amount of time, effort, and energy that staff and legal and everybody put into it uh was truly transformational.

And I think what we ended up with is something that I am proud of that I think is a tool that can be used by us as a council and the city and others as they come to interact with that part of our city as they look to develop or or build new things, um, and understanding what also they have to preserve.

So thank you all for your effort.

I will say for the record, there are four outstanding tweaks that are in emails.

But but truly it's been a an amazing process, and I was grateful to join land use this year and get to be a part of it.

So with the tweaks, we can make those amendments tonight.

I want to make sure we're are we getting this through tonight with the I'd like to not hold it any longer.

Okay.

Okay.

Um would would you prefer me to read the Honestly?

What was this council prefer?

We've we've read this document hundreds of times.

I mean, do we want Adrian to give a presentation?

Do we want to introduce the tweaks?

What do we what do we what do you guys want?

I think just if you don't mind if we just introduce the tweaks and um vote on it after that, or any discussion after that, then vote on it.

Yeah, I would agree with that.

Um we've had the chance to see those tweaks and ask questions, so I'm I'm good with that.

And I I did ask a question, got my answer.

And just one clarifying, there was one final tweak added tonight based on feedback that is in the email.

Uh, we can probably talk about it on the record here and see if it's something that's amenable to the city, and if it is, I would be happy uh to say we're gonna incorporate those kind of remaining issues and and move it forward, knowing full well that what we're gonna get back is going to Would you go to slide 23, please?

Would you like the final version or the one with all the colors?

Doesn't matter.

So the suggestion was made where it starts implement effective buffers, adding and consider compatible uses.

Adding those three words was four words, excuse me.

Yes, that that was under the um that's under the uh transition area um bullet points.

Any objection from DOCS?

No.

Any objection from counselors.

Do we need to read the these language amendments in to the record?

Mr.

Locke, could you do Counselor Locke, did you do that?

I move to amend the plan with the following changes.

Uh we'll start with that on slide 23 after the words implement effective buffers, add the four words and consider compatible uses.

At the top of slide 12, after the heading focus on early needs and opportunities, add a parenthetical notation that says see map on slide eight of the US 31 sub-area plan for more details.

On slide 15, and at the end of paragraph two, add the words to preserve existing trees and woods.

And on slide 21.

Oh by the line, there's one more.

There are five.

Um the top of slide 521, update the formatting to put the following in bold and remove the bullet, except in corridor residential, existing PDs and transition area development characteristics, colon.

That's what's in bold, and then make the first bullet start at the word incorporate and say incorporate downtown West Development dot dot dot.

And then the fifth and final edit is on exhibit B add at the top after the title recommended update, add a parenthetical notation that says see slides 24 and 25 of the US 31 sub-area.

Plan for more details.

May we have a motion to amend?

Second.

Any further conversation on this document?

Just want to say that I'm very pleased with the final outcome.

I know this was a uh difficult process to get here.

I think this is uh a really good document in the end.

I it never ceases to amaze me when things I don't think are gonna be hot button issues that end up becoming one, but what I was really impressed with was there were many counselors with very different coming at it from very different perspectives, and when when everybody finally just spoke, everybody was aiming for the same thing and just coming from a different direction, and that's what really kind of pushed this over the line.

So thanks to both committees, the full council, everybody that contributed input and most of the most importantly the public that caught things that we hadn't considered.

So with that move to approve.

Second.

Finally.

And item E is the same thing all over again for home place, and this remains in uh committee.

Public hearings, first reading of ordinance D-2812-26, an ordinance of the common council of the city of Carmel, Indiana authorizing and approving additional appropriation of funds from the parks and recreation non-reverting capital fund 103 to line item 44620 0.

Other structure improvements.

Uh sponsors, councilor Royale and Taylor.

Uh Councilor Well or Taylor.

Synopsis, please.

Move to introduce.

Second.

This ordinance appropriates 248,679 dollars to cover costs related to the White River Greenway North Extension Project.

Pretty simple.

Uh it's going from grant fund to the general fund.

Unless you feel very compelled.

No, I was gonna say if this feels like something you already approved, it is.

Uh this was one of those items that DLGF based on new state legislation uh said that it needed to be approved under the new rules, not the old rules.

Uh this is money that we received from Connor Prairie to reimburse us for expenses associated to Conor Prairie for the White River Greenway North extension.

Please help me with process.

We have to have them, it's under public hearings.

Yeah, okay.

Did you have a comment first, Council?

Just this is unrelated, but could you give like a 30-second update for the project?

So the project is quickly approaching a conclusion, which will make all of us very happy.

Uh the trail has been paved.

Um we are working on uh some of the touch-ups to the um sort of the the trailhead area.

Landscaping will not be done immediately, but that will not preclude us from being able to open this early part of May.

And uh the restroom will be like the end of May, but that doesn't preclude people from being able to use it.

Very excited.

Since you're there, can you just say why the restroom is gonna be a month so that nobody with your staff is blamed for it?

Absolutely.

Our friends at Duke have uh they they went to the wrong place at one point to try to do things.

Uh I think you've all heard conversations about friends uh at uh our private utilities, and this one follows that pattern.

Thank you.

We will open the public hearing at 737.

Seeing no one approaching to speak, we will close this public hearing at 738.

Further action.

Make a motion to suspend the rules and act on this tonight.

Second.

We will be acting on this tonight.

Move to approve.

Second.

Thank you.

Next public hearing.

Petition to vacate a public way eight zero five Oswego Road.

Um if this one looks familiar, it's because it is.

We've already done half of it.

Um, however, before approving one amendment I would like to introduce to the vacation is a vacation pending um the execution of the required easements by the city.

Do you have more to add to this?

I do not again.

This is this is just north of Nona Drive.

We have an illustration here.

You already approved the sovereign portion.

It's only been incorporated right here.

So this is to the northern portion.

It wasn't done at the time because I think the neighbors of uh petitioner were racing to start building the new home there.

So that's why we didn't include the the um there neighbor to the north.

So this is just fixes up what wasn't done in the first place.

Again, there is a storm sewer easement agreement that the petitioner agreed to execute with the city because there is a storm sewer line there underneath that land.

So if you were to approve it tonight, as uh President Schneider indicated, I would appreciate the motion includes approval of the or entering into the storm sewer easement agreement for the city.

And this is a public hearing.

We will open the public hearing at 7:40.

Seeing no one from the public approaching, we will end the public hearing.

And the actual approval will come later in the agenda as a four in the form of an ordinance.

So we'll be back in just a little bit.

I'm sorry, so that is there.

No further action tonight.

Uh sorry, to vote to approve, and then the ordinance will be the approving document as well.

You can do it either way, either during ordinance or now.

Yeah.

Okay.

Thank you.

Um item C petition to vacate, excuse me, vacate public way right away, uh, 118 South Rangeline Road to 1132 South Rangeline Road, uh, Carmel Midtown Community Development Corporation.

Uh hi, Mr.

President.

Henry Vaseski, the redevelopment director.

I can uh discuss those two now, or I can wait till you guys have the public uh hearings and then come and speak about it when the ordinance comes back up.

Perhaps we knock because there's two public hearings here.

Let's knock those both out.

So we will open the public hearing for the petition to vacate public right away at 118 South Range Line 2, 1132 South Range Line now, 741.

Seeing no one approaching, we will close that public hearing at 742.

Actually public hearing D.

Petition to vacate public right away west of 1132 South Rangeline Road, also Carmel Midtown Community Development Corporation.

No need to speak on that.

Mr.

Mstecsky, we will open that public hearing at 742.

Seeing no one from the public approaching, we will close that public hearing at 742 plus 30 seconds.

New business.

Resolution CC 04202601.

A resolution of the common council of the city of Carmel, Indiana, approving a transfer of funds between Grant Fund 900 and the General Fund 101.

Sponsors, Councillor War Lsen, and Minar.

Who's got it in front of them?

Councillor Minar, if you would read the synopsis.

I wasn't reading this time.

I'm prepared.

Transfers of 1,112 from the grant fund 900 into the general fund 101.

Thank you, Mr.

President.

Uh this is as uh as counselor mentioned a transfer of just uh 1,112 uh over to the general fund from the uh the donation a grant from the Central Indiana Police Foundation uh to be used for the community connect cop cards initiative.

Not cop cars, but cop cards, trading cards.

Any questions President Snyder, I we need a motion to introduce in a second just for procedural moved to introduce.

Thank you, Jessica.

Next January, I'll remember that.

Further action this evening.

Moved approve.

Second.

Thank you.

Resolution CC04202602.

A resolution of the Common Council of City of Carmel, Indiana, expressing interest in the purchase of certain properties believed to be valued at over $25,000 and associated with city improvement projects.

Councillors Minar and Snyder.

This authorizes the purchase of certain properties believed to be valued of more than $25,000.

The reason this is here in the format that's about to come in was that this council early on in this council's term uh didn't want to be inundated with a mass list of properties, and we didn't really want the public finding out we were looking at acquisition through a meeting.

So that process was changed a little bit.

So there's no one on here that does not know the city is looking at land and to be and for being they may be offered compensation.

Director Pease.

Yeah, I do want to move to the point of the sorry.

Move to introduce.

Sorry.

Thanks.

So uh we've included all properties, whether or not we really know if it's gonna be over or under $25,000.

So just don't want to set the expectations incorrectly.

Some of these are kind of small slivers, so I'm not sure how much they'll be.

But uh this is the Smoky Ironwood project, so there are six parcels in total.

Um one of them we've already acquired, which is the pool, which has been removed.

Um but the rest of the homeowners have been uh approached by us and we've had conversations with them.

So if you approve this tonight, they will receive um appraisals and we will move through negotiations on acquiring their property.

Any questions on this one director peace?

I bring this up because I kind of we were dealing with a similar situation with land acquisition around uh um around about on the list.

So when you do this, you know you get appraisal for bas you know more than you might need land-wise, but then you find out exactly or you know exactly how much land you would need.

Um we know exactly how much land we want to acquire.

And so we but the uh I think what you're referring to is the entire parcel is appraised as far as the total parcel.

Yeah, the entire parcel is appraised, it doesn't mean that you're gonna buy the entire parcel.

So they appraise it as what it is now if we do the take what it is after, and that's the offer that we would make the gap between those kind of does that make sense.

So yes, just want to make sure that was clarified.

Clarified.

And to clarify it's not a take, it's a purchase.

Yes.

Um at this point in the process.

There may be some homeowners that are uncomfortable with this, but you haven't made an offer yet, and they haven't had an opportunity to negotiate yet.

Correct.

Okay.

And I just want I want to thank you so much for um including me in all of this information, and I'd like to thank my fellow counselors Taylor and Snyder for meeting with the neighbors on uh on one of the corners there and having a really nice discussion.

I just just wanted to put that on the record.

I truly appreciate the help.

Thank you.

And thank you, Brad.

Sure.

All right.

This has been introduced.

Nope, not yet.

So there's actually two with this.

So this is uh 116th and river road project.

All under the same.

Oh.

So I just want to make sure there's no questions on this one.

This one has I think nine.

Yeah, nine potential properties.

There's one total take.

Which we've been in conversation with that property owner for uh maybe six months ago.

Well, that one's a take.

That one's a purchase.

It's also not a take, it's a purchase.

So any questions about the river road roundabout.

This has been introduced.

Move for approval.

You beat me to it, Councillor Taylor.

Second.

Okay.

First reading of ordinance D 2814-26, an ordinance of the common council of the city of Carmel.

Indiana vacating a portion of public way located within the Newark subdivision.

Sponsor myself.

Again, uh this is 805 Oswego Drive.

I do not think we need further introduce.

Second.

This is the council has been educated on this.

Are there further questions?

Further action this evening.

Thank you.

Second.

With the condition to execute the storm sewer easement for the city.

Can you restate your motion, Chair, Council Eminar?

I move to approve with the say it again.

Passed and with the execution.

The ordinance be passed on the execution of storm sewer easement agreement between the petition and the city.

So the motion has been it's been moved with the stipulation.

Okay.

First reading of ordinance D 2815-26.

An ordinance of the Common Council of the City of Carmel, Indiana, vacating a portion of a public right-of-way.

Sponsored myself.

This is petition for vacation.

They vacation of the public right-of-way between 11 18 South Rangeline Road and 1132 South Rangeline Road.

Previously lot eight of the Harvey B.

Stout subdivision filed by Petitioner Carmel, Midtown Community Development Corporation.

Thank you.

This and the next ordinance will be going to committee.

And that has been Director Massy has been informed of that.

But we do want to learn the surface level information about it.

Thank you, Council President Snyder.

I have uh with me Tony Berkeley, the developer on this project.

So I just quickly want to go through what would be uh teed up for committee.

Uh last year this council uh approved a project called Persinium 3.

This was the slide that we were discussing uh as part of the approval.

When uh the council authorized bonds for this project, uh authorized bonds at a 95-5 TIF split with a certain bond amount, and uh uh I shared at that time that uh we were going to move the project forward and would be back at council for a final piece, which is to put in the drive that is in that top corner identified as uh city parcel, even though that's a little tough to see, that we would be putting the drive into the project.

Since then, uh the architecture of the project has changed, and the office portion of the project has grown substantially.

So the goal is to show updated imagery of what this project is, and then call out specifically the two vacations.

So here is the the change to the project, and I wanted to have the before and after slides so that it is uh incredibly transparent what the changes are.

So first the office grows from 63,000 to 100,000 square feet of corporate headquarters space.

Uh the retail goes away, other than the upscale hotel is gonna have a uh restaurant, which will be retail.

There is now 154 multifamily units with a top floor being each targeted, and I'll show that in just a second.

And the parking garage and parking spaces have been uh right-sized uh to be 372 spaces in the garage, 440 total.

Part of this is a request that 100% of the TIFF be contributed to the project.

There is not a change to the bond ordinance request, it's the same amount of the bond.

And for anyone watching, be uh after this project passed, the state of Indiana changed their laws to have multifamily projects pay about 30% less in taxes.

And so this project reflects that, which is why we're asking for 100% TIFF, but there is no change to the bond amount.

Uh by the way, uh we do have a project architect here, Studio M.

If uh anyone has any questions, basically, what you have is still the hotel on the corner as before.

It's just better looking now, and then you have an office building there along range line, so you're looking at northern range line here, with the multifamily building uh between the office building uh along Veterans across from City Hall.

So you're looking at northern range line here, with the multifamily building uh between the office building uh along Veterans across from City Hall.

So this gives you a nice view of and remember all almost all the parking here is underground.

That's why you can't see it from the site.

But what you're looking at is you're looking west, you see the beautiful new hotel, you see a multifamily building, and you see an office building.

And there's a feature of that multifamily building, which is a a tower that will allow uh anyone to walk to the top floor and view our beautiful Japanese garden.

So that is going to be a public space up there for viewing.

Here's a uh better image of the office building on range lines specifically.

Again, we know that as soon as we put up an office building, it'll get filled up.

We just need to put up those office buildings.

This is the veterans way side.

So you're looking kind of from where the Japanese garden is today, uh, other than it it's not all grass, it looks much better than that in real life, but this is just a rendering.

So, what this helps identify is how the stair tower really forms kind of the focal point of the uh of the development, and so from the second level, the podium level, from the garage level, from the hotel, from the apartments.

Anyone can enter into that public space, which is the tower, go up to the top.

But that is the way that um that helps kind of um define where circulation in this project happens.

This is another view looking north, so you can see uh that's the portico from the upscale hotel.

You can see that again that tower with that viewing deck at the top that will be open to the public.

Um this is the the concept of a uh park impact fee use for public space on top of the podium.

So those those public plazas there are what the use of the park impact fee will be.

I don't know why it says that.

Okay, uh the which is pretty similar, pretty similar to what was shown last year.

This has though been more thought out, more worked out, coordinated with technology coordinated with utilities, coordinated with engineering.

So just for what it is that we were looking at, basically, this is the site of the project.

There's an option parcel, there's a development parcel, and there's a city parcel.

So the two votes that is are the vacation votes here, takes this drive, splits it in two, puts the southern portion of it into the option parcel, along with this.

Is your other vote for this piece of it?

There you can see this drawing right there, and then this northern part of the drive would join the private owner's parcel.

This would all go into the project.

The one thing I will mention is we have an option agreement.

So once the council vacates, this northern half of the city parcel becomes part of this parcel right here, which is a private parcel.

And if the project doesn't move forward, for zero dollars, I have the option to pull it back and make it a CRC or a city parcel again.

So that should give everyone comfort that we have put the developer in a place where they can go out and they're get their construction loans, but at the same time, if the world falls apart, our vacation of this land doesn't forever give away the land.

We have the ability to take it back if the project doesn't move forward.

So that's kind of a an overview, and uh Tony, if you would like to say a few words, I'll just uh put this slide up right here.

Yeah, I don't have a lot to add.

Um I've I've had my business here in Carmel for over 20 years, almost 20 years.

Um I own a condo here, my second home here in Carmel.

Um how you guys conduct business today was this is a small event compared to ice and people saving lives and things, but we um we know that there's very few parcels left in Carmel, and you have to take very strong approaches.

We hired Studio M who is a local architect.

They understand Carmel.

The respect that we've tried to give it to this property because of its location next to this building was important to us, and so not having an out-of-town architect was important to us.

And Mr.

Moriarty and his team have done a wonderful job.

Um, I'm proud of this.

Um, and I'm happy to answer any questions if you have any.

So I want to so I want to make sure we're I'm clear that the the this going to committee is not by any means punitive, and regardless of anyone's opinion on the project, um, we also recognize that the developer, the city, landowners all um have a lot vested in this.

Um so I would ask both land use, uh defaulting to land use if you could take this up at the next meeting.

I know you've got home place, but perhaps both as far as how the changes to the use of the land are, and then finance if you could at your next meeting really take a look into what the implications are of moving the TIFF amount, uh understanding that the maximum borrowed not by the city has not changed.

So that is kind of why a vacation ordinance uh has become a project approval stance, is because the total um amount hasn't changed.

But the project has changed, and I don't I don't think anybody could say it hasn't.

Um since we they've been working hard to get this, and we just got it recently.

We really haven't had time to thoroughly vet it, and the dais probably isn't the appropriate place to drill into this the next couple hours.

So is that okay with both finance and land use?

Michael still has a question.

Go ahead.

So um so getting into this, so I mean I voted for Percenium 3, you know, I fought for this.

This isn't the same project any more.

And I'm trying to I'm in my head, I'm trying to think is this better or is this worse?

Um there's no retail, which we value as a city as a part of the walkability we try to create.

Um, so that's been eliminated.

Um the number of uh multifamily, which was a sticking point when it was passed, has been increased while the um the yes it's been increased.

So um the um the uh and then with that too.

I remember last time when we were voting on this, we questioned whether there was enough parking, and now the parking is being decreased.

There's things I like.

I like having more space for corporate headquarters.

I do like the tower.

Um, I mean, this isn't just you know because of the vacation.

You if you substantially change a project because it was tied to the bonds for the project, you would have had to come back to us to for a vote, correct?

I if I could, I'd like to address your questions in order if that's possible.

So you would have to you would have had to come back to us, right?

If the bond, if the maximum bond amount was changing, I would have the project tied to the bond is changed.

What we voted on, which was written into the bond is changed.

Which means you have to come back and get it amended.

I don't need to have the bond ordinance amended because the bond ordinance that this council voted for qualifies today.

The thing that does need to happen, other than the vacation, is a conversation in front of council so that no one is surprised.

The change one of the changes is previously this was a 95-5 TIFF split, now it's 100%.

And so there doesn't need to be another vote on the ordinance, but if this council approves this project, the vacation is kind of part of that.

So I'm confused because if we a project can change after we vote on it and it doesn't require our vote, then why do we even debate the project details?

If I could, I'd like to just answer your question from the beginning, which is the previous thing that this council voted on was these parcels with a hotel at the corner, 60,000 square feet of office, and 150 to 160 apartments, 30 or 40 of them being age restricted on this site.

Really, what changes mostly architecture?

Because now what you have is again same office building, just bigger, same hotel in the same exact spot, same multifamily, and actually the previously there was 150 to 160 multifamily units, and now we're set at 154 multifamily units.

So it's about the same multifamily units as before, same parcel.

Previously, this council approved this bond ordinance, and we discussed the project.

So I am right back in front of you in a public meeting discussing the specific changes.

So there's no at no point would the CRC ever move on something that wasn't discussed at council and approved at council.

And so we previously said that we would be back with the vacation, so now we are back, and we are I mean specifically referencing every single change that happened.

So your vote for the vacation is essentially a approval of the slight changes from last year, but the bond amount didn't change, and the nature of this mixed-use project, which is hotel office, and multifamily all over parking.

That is the same.

But we are here in front of council having this conversation public specifically before, because at no point do we want to make any references that aren't true when it's going to construction.

Can you have uh our court uh bond counsel forward us a memo stating all of that that this is all yes?

Um couple things.

Um understanding the SCA one.

Um have a comment about that, but um one that is important to me is uh that there is a corporate corporate headquarters secured from this site.

Also be very interested if we're gonna be putting this much incentive in the project where they're coming from.

Um sometimes we see uh and if this if they're moving from another community or if they're coming from our community, and it's required to retain the company in the community since we're moving when since we're contributing all of the increment to this project.

Um I'd be willing to sign, or I'm sure members would be willing to sign who received the information in NDA to know that.

I think that would be important to me.

Could I could I address that, Counselor?

Um, sure, that's just a statement.

So you can address it if you like, but please continue, counselor.

The um so that's something that's important to me.

Obviously, I'm um you know, we talked, I'm disappointed that the number of age-restricted units had declined in the project, and I'm happy to see that the uh the age restricted still in there.

Mostly I just wanted to make a comment about uh Senate enrolled act one that is now law.

So there's a Senate enrolled act one last session, so we still call it that, but it's one from two sessions ago.

Um this deducts multifamily assessed value by up to 36 percent through 2031.

Okay.

This is a direct this is this shows the direct result of the problems, particularly related to 2% AV in this law and how it negatively impacts communities like ours.

So previously to this project, we had a 95-5 split under existing NELN law because those artificial deductions due uh to multifamily, now we're receiving less total increment, i.e.

less total property tax on a two percent assessed value.

Not these are not single family homes, homestead homes.

And so now it's significantly impacting this project, and we are now losing increment from the project because the actions that were taken under SEA one related to multifamily.

Uh Henry, can you tell me that any new multifamily developer that's coming to Carmel with the deduction of 36% of their SSS value to thirty 2031?

Do they plan to subsidize or reduce rent rents from the current market based on those uh property tax savings?

They're not they're not.

They're increasing they're increasing their margins.

I want to hear your opinion on that.

It seemed like a rhetorical question.

I've never seen developers not take a benefit to their own bottom line.

Thank you.

So just to point out SEA1 AVs deduct 30 36 percent, which means we're not receiving the tax revenue for that to make this project what it is.

Um now we're losing not even gaining the five percent of the increment we could have achieved on this project to use for other great amenities within our community.

And uh we know that those savings by multifamily developers are not being passed along to the tenants when the whole point of this bill was to reduce create uh reduce uh property taxes or i.e.

cost for uh tenants, and it's not happening.

Thank the um thank you.

Um and that's gonna be the theme for the rest of the year is how state legislature has really impacted how Carmel has become the greatest city in the world.

They just kind of turned upside down, and now we're having to rethink how we do everything.

So keep that in mind as you send off fiery emails.

Um, maybe sometimes not just to us, but to the state lawmakers as well.

Um could I add something to what counselor Taylor said?

Because I want to make sure people hear it, because this isn't just about some random person living somewhere paying less taxes or not.

This garage is going to be 80% open to the public, usable by the public.

So the less taxes today, not the future.

Today means we have less money today to provide amenities for our citizens because of what the state did.

So I just wanted to touch on that point.

So I would uh the takeaway, uh, Mr.

Burkle uh Adam said a lot that we're all thinking on the parking is a big one.

The the the fact that the project is different.

Um the kind of wonky process where I wouldn't have known.

I really wouldn't have known that a vacation was a final approval if I hadn't pulled you aside and asked you, because it's just that's foreign to me.

I would have certainly made that point at the dais like I did.

Oh, I'm sure you would have.

I didn't know it going into the today.

Um, I think there's just things we need to wrap our heads around.

We will try to do it in a very efficient way.

Um, but this this is new.

Uh so thank you, counselor, for bringing up the concerns.

I'm sure there's some others.

Thank you, Councilor Taylor, um, for bringing up uh what is going to be a problem moving forward.

Is there any further conversation on this?

Okay, these will go to both committees uh to discuss their respective involvement.

Um we'll let you, Henry, and Mr.

Berkeley know when those are.

You know uh we know that I can't, I've already forgotten.

And news Tuesday the 28th at 6 p.m.

in the caucus room.

Counselor Snyder.

Counselor Snyder, we do need to read D 281626.

I'll do them both.

I want to and then Councilor Taylor will uh let you know when the next finance meeting is.

So I believe works uh next finance committee meeting is um we'll need to keep that May 13th date if we uh want this to come back on May 18th to council.

So that means you guys will have to have a May 13th and a May 20th finance committee meeting.

Shannon.

Yeah, Jeff.

We had it was originally scheduled for May 13th.

But in order to have things back for the May 18th council meeting, we'll need to keep that May May 13th meeting.

Thank you.

Thank you for being amenable.

Um so we have introduced E.

D.

Excuse me, we've introduced D.

That's as far as we've gotten.

Uh okay, first reading of ordinance D 2816-26.

Ordinance of the Common Council vacating public right away.

This is for the other parcel that was shown.

Uh 1132 South Rangeline Road, lots 9 and 10 of the RVB Stout Subdivision, filed by petitioner Carmel Midtown Community Development Corporation.

We'd introduce going to council uh going to committee, the same as the previous ordinance.

First reading of ordinance D 2818-26, in ordinance of the Carmen Carmel of the Common Council of the City of Carmel, Indiana, amending chapter 4, Article 6 of the Carmel City Code, sponsors uh counselors Minar and Taylor.

Councilman.

Move to introduce second.

An ordinance amending requirement.

You skip.

You skip that.

What I skipped.

You must be one.

Climate action.

Climate action.

Oh my gosh, Eric, I'm sorry.

We're always did I read the right number of the one seven.

We're on F, right?

First reading D 2817-26.

Move to introduce.

The ordinance renames the Carmel Climate Action Committee to the Environmental Stewardship Committee and expands the committee's responsibilities and membership.

Thank you.

I love it.

Move to suspend the rules and act on this this evening.

Second.

Comments.

Sure.

So uh glad to make comments.

Thank you, um, everybody for this.

Uh, this is a long time in the making, uh, but the premise is how do we put this committee in a position to help the city achieve its goals from an environmental stewardship, sustainability, and financial resilience perspective.

And we have spent a lot of time and effort as a committee coming around the issues in the climate action plan.

And then other things that come up from time to time that matter to the city.

So the idea of expanding membership to add the library, who is huge in our community when it comes to sustainability perspective, and now hosts us after hours at their glorious privilege.

And then a member of the street department because of all of the things they do from a sustainability and lawn mowing and gas using and electric vehicle riding perspective is also good.

So truly excited about the progress we're making, the ability to communicate between the city and the public, city staff and the public has been increasing every time we get together.

And this goes to a more resilient and stronger stewardship focus moving forward.

And in stewarding our environment in Carmel is not something we take lightly.

Myself included, and mostly because I'm not interested in the global awareness.

That's not something we should be doing with our taxpayer money.

This name really screams all of the fundamental items that every human should be doing to take care of the land around them.

And I know that's what they've been doing, but I think with a name that reflects that there'll be more, much more interest from the community, and really put this committee to a on a pedestal where it should be, as one of the, if not the most prominent committee that we have as a council.

And I do want to acknowledge that the committee president Eric Mell is here, and much appreciated for all the hard work.

You do.

So this has been we've uh we've moved to introduce this this evening.

Further action.

Move to approve.

Second.

If you want to approve, you need to suspend the rule since it's an ordinance.

We didn't oh did I'm sorry, I'm one behind.

Thank you.

Now we are on G.

First reading of ordinance D 2818-26.

An ordinance of the common council of the City of Carmel, amending chapter 4, Article 6, Carmel City Code, sponsors, counselors Minar and Taylor.

Council Taylor.

Move to introduce.

Please, sir.

An ordinance amending requirements of chapter 4, Article 6 of Carmel City Code related relating to the residential rental dwelling registration and permit program.

So there was a struggle getting registrants to register prior to the deadline by the end of the year.

Now some of these that were not able to register were able to show or have been renting their properties prior to 1231 2025.

However, if they miss the permitting, applying for the permit and registering prior to 1231 2025, they were not considered a legacy dwelling unit, which grandfathers them in, regardless if their platted neighborhood was above the 10% cap or not.

So there's some issues with some mailers, some other things.

So only to be fair to those, because the uh, you know, councillor Minar and I talked, the intent of this was to those who were renting their properties as of 1231 25 last year, that they would be grandfathered in.

And so this is trying to execute that intent because those some of those people who should be considered legacy dwellings were not able to register prior to the end of the year, whether they didn't get the mailer in time, they're out of town, whatever their excuse was.

So what this does is make two minor changes to allow those um who are able to show proof that they had a lease in place prior to 1231 25 that they're considered legacy dwellings.

The other change, which I might need uh Director Hallball to explain, but it's related to the um HOA component certification.

Um so on line it would be line 79, it starts uh under A7 for residential rental dwelling is subject to active HOA covenants, a written affirmation, and then this I this section is uh suggested to be stripped from the HOA board or an authorized representative stating that the dwelling is not subject to any HOA rental or other restrictions.

So it's just stating that the person could submit a written affirmation versus the HOA having to certify.

Yep, that's it.

Those are the two changes.

Did I hit those correctly, Sergey?

Council Tovers, one correction.

It's uh January 31st of 2026.

If you're the ordinance was amended to include one month, so that's the only difference.

Yep.

And the reason for the other change for the HOA is they were having much difficulty trying to get these types of affidavits from the HOA board.

Some are active, some aren't.

So this just makes it cleaner, easier.

Uh Mr.

President.

Yeah, um, I would be good on suspending the rules on moving on this night.

I know I've gotten a several people who've called and said, hey, I've had owned property and been renting it for 20 plus years.

I didn't know, or I tried and I couldn't get access to it.

Um, you know, there was some glitch online.

Um so you know, whether goes committee, but I'm I'm good.

And I know several other counselors have gotten complaints about not being able to do it and being uh owners and renting for years.

So I don't really have a compelling argument to send it to committee.

Um I know counselor Taylor has put more time than he probably wanted to and investment into this, and and and I trust is his judgment, and and I do want to give thanks to DOCS that was handed a massive project, and if this is the only ball that got dropped, I think you succeeded very well.

So I do appreciate it.

This and I do want to say to the public part part of this, and as state laws change and this gets massaged, this isn't about the city collecting data on people that own property.

This is about the police and fire department being able to contact the owner of a rental.

That that is why we need to know who actually owns the land, the responsible party, because it's just in Joe Schmo LLC.

Um there's no contact information, and there are plenty of times, more than you might even imagine, when they can't get into a house or contact a homeowner.

So the fact that we're just now kind of doing this is a testament to how much we've we've grown very fast, but we we've got to be able to contact the responsible party for a residence.

Yeah, I just wanted to point out to you, thank you for saying that, because it did happen to a friend of mine who the owner they couldn't find him.

The house has just been sitting there for over a year and a half now.

Um but I really wanted to say I wanted to give a uh a huge shout out to Charlie Dean in DOCS.

He deserves a lot of credit for taking on this responsibility and handling the numerous phone calls.

Uh people who are angry, people who aren't angry.

But still, Charlie, who is implementing this program deserves a lot of kudos from this dais.

So thank you to Charlie.

Thank you, Counselor, and thank you, Charlie.

Yes, ma'am.

Thank you.

Um, so if if this is approved tonight, when will people be able to start registering?

Uh tonight.

Okay.

Well, hopefully, it except for just we'll make we gotta make sure that the program can self tourist accepting it.

Okay, so maybe 24 hours provider, but certainly within 24 hours, if not less, it will be accomplished.

Okay, thank you.

And you pretty much know somewhat pretty tightly who out there still hasn't registered based on publicly available tax data, right?

Okay.

So just a real quick question.

Um what would happen?

So if uh if I say that my HOA has no covenants against me renting my home, what happens when I put that on the form and then everybody's all upset uh because that was not true.

They say, oh, I didn't know, I didn't know my HOA had covenants or whatever.

What kind of what happens then?

But that's a it's a permit revocation.

So it's a miss, it's a permit revocation.

So it will be uh considered a misrepresentation on the form.

Because you you do affirm that you either have covenants or your covenants do not conflict with the ordinance, and if it happens to be incorrect, let's say HOA notifies us that hey, this is actually wasn't correct.

We do have covenants, and here's a and here's a section that forbids it, then the permit will be revoked, but we'll be in the appeal process as well, uh, afforded to the petitioner.

Um and BPW uh will be able to figure it out.

And so ultimately they'd have to remove the renter from the and also HOA, of course, would have a private cause of action as well to move directly against one of a property owners within the HA.

But we would enforcement okay.

All right.

And then what does what's the future hold for this?

I'm just where where are we heading with this whole thing as far as the state and the changes made?

As of right now, there is a sunset provision, which is a little a little bit less than two years at this point, that the CAP uh will go away.

But the registration will remain.

So we will likely have to modify this ordinance if that sunset provision stands.

Very obviously a couple of legislative sessions between now and then.

Let's see how it changes.

If it does, if it doesn't, we'll have to modify and remove the cap once the time comes.

Okay.

But the again, the registration will remain.

Okay, yeah, I think that's good.

Thank you.

That's all I need.

And that's a very important point to point out is that this is two separate issues.

One is the registration.

Regardless of what happens to CAP, that's that's in place, and people must register.

That gives us the data we need for code enforcement for public safety, etc., right?

That is exactly right.

And um, which is very important to our uh protecting our residential neighborhoods.

That's correct.

The cap is a separate matter.

Now somebody um if the cap goes away and somebody uh uh affirms that there's no HOA covenants in place, that there's no um there's no action there because they would still be required to be uh to register regardless if the cap's in place or not.

That's correct Sir Gay, so the the uh the tenant who un who is un unknowingly knows they've entered into a bad contract would typically if advised have recourse against the landlord that okay I just want to that's actually a good point where a couple of similar points has been made.

This ordinance does not refute or diminish any private cause of action vis-a-vis landlord and tenant and vis-a-vis HOA and HOA members.

So that does not affect it.

HOA has a private cause of action independent of a city, tenant or landlord, depending on the issue, have a private cause of action independent of this ordinance.

So that does that does not affect it.

Anything else?

Um Tony, did you did you make that motion?

No, I would just a motion to uh suspend.

Second.

And the action.

Move to approve.

Second.

All right.

Agenda add on items.

There are none.

Uh other business.

Notice of cancellation of outstanding checks for fiscal year 2023.

Um in the amount of 1,499.58 cents.

Um this is these are people that received uh a check for one reason or another and never cashed it, and we can't continue to hold it open.

Move to acknowledge receipt.

Sorry.

Also an acknowledgement.

This has been a bit tricky.

Our MOU references changes to the bond projects after deliberation by our council, council's council, bond council.

This really didn't need an acknowledgement, and part of the reason is is that the numbers change is daily an exaggeration.

Daily.

I actually gave you all my copies of 87, I think.

Right.

We we appropriated $96 million worth of projects based on bond documents.

But the gross proceeds were $87,515.

So we did have to retool, thankfully.

Engineering really worked on efficiencies and getting very accurate numbers.

When we got the total project budget down to $90 million, which is anybody that can do simple arithmetic, that's three million over.

That is a comfortable degree to be over.

That's why we that's way overpowered.

And that's not a philosophical position, that is the nature of bond.

Yep.

Okay.

So we can do these MOU updates more regularly.

We can get them probably monthly.

I mean, if you want to, but what I had a hard time wrapping my head around was it is a literal snapshot in time.

I I and I'm in the business.

I should have known that, but I never wrapped my head around it.

So these numbers changed.

And I think when we were looking at the most updated one in Brad's office today, several of them have already changed.

They're not substantive, they're not huge, but the numbers just changed as a product of doing business.

Yeah, and this is the first time I'm aware that we've sort of structured a bond this way that would have the budgets for each individual project versus a total bucket.

So previously, one goes up, one comes under, we just kind of move along.

So that's just one of the stipulations in this that the MOU asked for the council kind of be made aware of the budget changes as the projects move.

Mr.

President, I'd just like to make the point.

Just you know, for the public sake.

The projects that are cut were the ones that because you've ordered the list in priority, probably aren't any surprise to anyone.

No, for instance, the biggest cut would be the the bridge tunnels of the memory.

And at this point in time, while public safety is a priority, uh outlaying 15 to 20 million dollars on a specific crossing was uh outweighed by other public safety projects, but money was then allocated to do enhanced crosswalks and improve additional safety measures at those costs.

Neither of the uh bridge indoor tunnel underneath the monon and 106 or 1111th were fully funded anyway, so we couldn't have built them with this bond without the matching funds.

We've applied numerous times.

We will continue to apply.

If we get the match, then I can come back to you and let you know.

But right now it's best to kind of free those up to build things there.

I wasn't a fan at like 10 million dollars each, but if we could have got the funds, I would have said yeah, go ahead and do it.

Would you be open to making this a sending this monthly?

Just an updated spreadsheet so everyone is fully aware of where we are.

Thank you.

Other more questions on hand.

Okay.

Sure.

Uh with we'd like a motion of acknowledgement.

So move.

Any further comment?

Okay.

Other business.

Item C.

Okay, so I'm gonna we've got a I am going to move.

Um to accept the resignation of the current plan commission appointment and move and also appoint Councillor Theresa Ayers to Plan Commission.

Second.

Move to close nominations.

Any further comment?

Oh, I'm waiting for you to say discussion.

Nope, discussion.

Close nominations.

Yeah.

I'm sorry, a second uh second.

So yeah, so this is microphone to this is non-standard.

I I wanted to ask why.

Uh the my understanding, and they can speak for themselves they like was the current appointment uh had some I'm sorry, I apologize first for personal reasons and no longer work with my schedule.

So it's a scheduling.

All right, so is this just plan commission?

Is there all right?

We can vote on the planning commission, but are you changing the land use as well?

Yes, I because of personal reasons.

Would you like to talk to about that offline?

So there's only going to be three counselors on the land use.

I would say I'm a de facto I am a de facto member based on council rules.

Uh well, I I get that, but when I came on to the council, all right, there's seven counselors.

There's a president, and then there's six counselors.

Each counselor was put on a finance or land use committee.

Um and that's to ensure, you know, kind of everyone gets to participate, but also there's no, you know, kind of uh, you know, that someone's not oh it's all fair, it's equitable, and political affiliation is never taken into it.

Everybody's guaranteed either to be president or on a committee.

Um and when we went to nine city councillors, um my second term, we still did that.

We had a president, four people on the finance committee, four people on the uh on the land use committee, and then when we lost um uh Bruce Kimball, you know, who was incapacitated for two and a half years.

We didn't go without a person.

Miles Nelson volunteered to be on both, so we had four people.

You know, so it ensures the public business is gonna get done.

We don't have situations where suddenly there's only three people on land use, one of them's in another country or somewhere else, and we have to cancel an existing land use meeting because we don't have enough people.

You know, so if we're gonna continue, I I think that we at least have to have four people on the land use.

I get counselor ones and participate in anything.

Um, but I think we need four people on the council.

Uh four people on each committee.

And I'd be willing to fill that position just like Councillor Nelson volunteered to fill that position.

I I acknowledge everything you're saying, Councillor Green, and if you are inclined to serve, would be happy to have you.

Yeah, um, absolutely.

You know, cause if we're gonna set a precedent, and it's been a precedent, that someone can't participate, whether it's because of time commitment or some other conflict, then when will another counselor, you know.

I mean, what's in setting unprecedented, but thank you for we can talk about it offline.

Fine.

Uh I appreciate you being willing to do that, so thank you.

I mean, I I think that's great.

I I encourage you.

I didn't know what what was going on here, but I appreciate you doing that.

Uh it's just kind of a transparency thing.

And what it's very non-standard for us to do something like this.

Uh the land use committee moving forward will consist of uh counselor green.

Counselor Locke, Councillor Ayers, and Counselor Joshi.

I am very partial to that committee.

Um I am sure it will continue.

It's expected level of success.

Well then that will matter.

And it will be even more enhanced with Councillor Green.

But we do have a motion on the table that needs resolved, Councillor Ayers, thank you.

And congratulations.

Any further announcements this evening?

Hearing none.