Good evening, ladies and gentlemen.

Awesome to see a full house.

Almost like you guys are here for something.

And I'm sure it's not to hear us drone on.

We will call to order the Monday, June 15th meeting of the Carmel City Council here at Carmel City Hall at 6.03 p.m.

First up is the agenda approval.

Move for approval.

Second.

Thank you.

We are going to move into our invocation with us this evening.

We have seminarian Jerome Knappa.

You just correct?

Counselor Taylor just gave me the pronunciation on Butcher.

I apologize.

Sir, from Artular Mount Carmel.

Thank you for being here.

Thank you.

Let's bow our heads in prayer.

Amen.

Dear Heavenly Father, we give you thanks and praise for your unmeasurable immeasurable love and providence towards us today in allowing us to gather in safety.

We thank you for fellowship and community.

Thank you for health.

We thank you for our country and the freedom of speech and of free ideas.

Heavenly Father, as we gather here, we ask you to fill this room with your spirit.

We particularly ask for the gifts of wisdom and understanding and counsel.

We ask for the fruits of patience and gentleness.

Above all, we ask you to cover us in love, help us to love you more fully, help us to love our fellow men and women.

Please help us to be charitable in everything we do.

And above all, finally ask that.

Help us to live our lives for you.

Help us in our speech and our actions to glorify you and everything that we do.

We ask this through Christ our Lord.

Amen.

Thank you.

Next up, our deputy mayor, Matthew Donaldson, will lead us in the Pledge of Allegiance.

Excellent.

Great job, Matthew.

Excuse me.

Next up, recognition, yes, recognition of city employees and outstanding citizens.

We do have something on here.

Recognition of the Collegewood Math Pentathlon team.

Come talk about this.

Good evening, Mayor, City Council members, families, students, and guests.

Math Pentahlon is where math meets fun.

Created by the Indianapolis-based STEM nonprofit pentathlon institute.

It is a board game-based academic enrichment program for students in kindergarten through seventh grade.

During after school and evening practices, students learn and practice five grade-level mathematical strategy games that develop critical thinking, problem solving, logic, and spatial reasoning skills.

The season culminates in tournaments where students known as pentahletes compete against other students from other schools, earning points for their performance and their sportsmanship.

Math and Tathlon teaches the students so much more than math.

It helps students build confidence, perseverance, strategic thinking, and teamwork while discovering that learning can be both challenging and fun.

Tonight, along with Julia Stanko, it is our privilege to recognize these outstanding accomplishments of the Collegewood Elementary Math and Tathalon team, the 2026 national champions.

The success would not have been possible without incredible support of our families and volunteers, as you can see from all of the orange shirts.

We had 73 students this year, which is fantastic.

I would also like to recognize the student staff and administrators of College Woods who support an academic enrichment opportunity to help our students thrive.

Most importantly, we celebrate our students that you all see here.

Some of them are here tonight.

On behalf of our coaches and families, thank you to the city of Carmel for recognizing these exceptional students and for supporting educational programs that inspire lifelong learning.

Love that.

Next up, recognition of persons who wish to address the council.

Man, it cleared out fast.

You're all alone, young lady.

On deck, uh Ms.

Chris Caden.

Hi.

I wanted to bring up two things.

Um trash recycle receptacles that Republic supplies for the city of Carmel.

We've been over in Fair Green Tree Subdivision for over 20 years, and we started out with a thirty-five gallon trash container and then moved to a ninety-five gallon recycle container so we could recycle.

The thirty-five gallon container broke, the top broke, and so they had to replace it about a month ago.

And we called and asked for the exact same size we had, which was a thirty-five gallon.

Long story short, Carmel's signed an agreement with Republic, and I don't know how many years back, but it said we could not, no nobody in Carmel can have a thirty-five gallon trashery container.

I called the city of Carmel to find out why that was the case.

And they transferred me to somebody named Aaron.

And he promised me that he would check into it because I said I would like to come to the council meeting and I would like to have as much information as I can, you know, about the situation.

And he never called back.

That's been a month ago.

So I'm asking you if you could somebody could tell me why.

Maybe not tonight, but let me know by email why we cannot have a 35 gallon trash container.

I mean, one thing I think it definitely takes away the incentive to recycle because you're getting in a 65 or a 95 gallon trash container, so why would I clean out my peanut butter jar and put it in recycle when I can just throw it away because I have a bigger container?

It just doesn't make any sense why we can't have a 35-gallon container, and it is in Carmel's contract.

So that's my first thing.

The other thing I want to ask you about or talk to you about was the crosswalks at the roundabouts.

Um I love the roundabouts, and I know there's more coming to Carmel, but I'm specifically referring to right now Carmel Drive and Rangeline Road.

If you are in the roundabout and you are headed south on Rangeline Road, and you are coming around, that's a two-lane, and there's two lanes coming off of Carmel Drive.

The crosswalk on Rangeline Road is right barely outside of the circle.

Barely.

So if you were in the roundabout and you saw somebody that wanted to cross and you stopped for them, if I am behind you, I'm looking at the people on the right hand side coming off of Carmel Drive to make sure that they're stopping before I proceed.

And I might not see the car in front of me make a complete stop for a pedestrian that's three feet from the intersection.

My suggestion would be on future roundabouts is to move that crosswalk at least three or four car lengths away to prevent somebody from having to stop practically in the circle when you're trying to pay attention to the other traffic and just avoid something who could end up being a very serious accident at some point.

That's all I have.

I did forget to put my email address on my card.

So if I could get that back, I'll put it on.

Because I would like to hear back about the trash container.

You know, we you know, we and our subdivision we have to have our trash containers in our garage.

They won't let us put them out on the side of the house.

So we now have to have a 65 and a 95 gallon trash container in with two SUVs, all the stuff that people keep in their garage, which is a lot of stuff.

I'll get back to you on that.

So when you get your email address in there, we'll get that taken care of.

Pardon?

That's me over here.

I'll get back to you on that.

The mayor just said she'll be.

I'll get back to you on that.

Okay, thank you.

And I will fill this out quickly so the next person can get up here and I thank you very much.

And I wanted to thank those kids and congratulations, but they all left.

They can watch it later.

Thank you very much for listening.

Appreciate your time.

Thank you.

Ms.

Caden.

Thank you.

And just to refresh her on the rules, three minutes.

Green is good to go.

Yellow, you've got about a minute left.

Red, finish your sentence, please.

Okay, my name is Chris Caden.

I live in Carmel.

Stormwater is collecting in my backyard since the Carmel elementary school was built.

And the school and the parking lot were graded, so my yard is below the parking lot and uh the school.

Some neighbors have had flooded basements.

I have a flooded backyard.

The beehive in my backyard doesn't drain storm water very well.

And after each storm, water collects in my yard, and it looks like a lake.

It's getting closer and closer to my house.

I am afraid my basement will flood.

Some neighbors' basements have flooded already, and my utility shed has rotted at the bottom.

And I think it would help to have French drains put in so the water can be go away from my yard and go to the proper place.

Thank you, Chris Catton.

Thank you.

Allie Mistler.

I just put this here.

Is this show automatically?

Do I have to turn something on to turn the camera on for example?

Yeah.

Can you turn the projector on?

I thought you said Al.

That's me.

I don't know how I do it.

Okay.

My name is Allie Mistler.

I have appeared before this council more times than I can count to speak about the same two issues.

Flooding caused by failing public infrastructure and the urgent need to provide a secondary access road for Carmel Elementary School that was promised.

I want to say something plainly.

I worry that because I have been civil, I have been patient, and I have been respectful that I have been mistaken for someone who will simply accept less than other Carmel residents receive.

Please do not make that mistake.

The issues I am speaking about tonight are not the responsibility of homeowners.

No resident could replace storm collapsed stormwater infrastructure or redesign failing roads, nor could they create a secondary emergency access route for Carmel Elementary School.

Only the city can do those things.

At the suggestion of Councillor Warell, I worked with my district's counselor Teresa Ayers to schedule a follow-up meeting on July 7th.

And then just one day later, I received an email saying a separate meeting had been scheduled for July 14th.

And I shared this not to criticize any individual, but because it highlights what we have been experiencing for years: a lack of coordination, a lack of clarity, and a lack of accountability.

And you can imagine my frustration when I watched the city councilor loop my cul-de-sac a couple of times during recent heavy rains, yet failed to knock on my door to see the reality of my flooding experience.

You see, it's not visible from the front of our yard.

Our lot slopes to the south.

The devastation is behind our home.

I am also deeply concerned about the proposed 1.2 million dollar fix for Lexington Boulevard, including replacing the center concrete section with asphalt and the installation of pavers designed to retain water.

That proposal does nothing to ameliorate stormwater flowing into our neighborhood from higher ground behind our homes from both the east and the west.

It also risks increasing vehicle speeds through an already precarious school zone where children are not provided bus transportation, where sidewalks remain broken, and where students continue to walk in the street because they have no safe alternative.

We are not asking for special treatment.

We are asking for equality.

Carmel is a wonderful place to live.

But the measure of a great city is not the next hotel, the next sculpture, or a proposed convention center.

The measure of a great city is how it cares for the residents whose tax dollars made the greatness possible.

We simply cannot afford to wait for what our neighbors already have.

Thank you.

Okay.

Good evening.

My name is Carrie Gonzalez, and I've lived in Concord Village for over a decade.

I'd like to follow up on some topics discussed at the town hall meeting at the library earlier this month, discussing stormwater drainage issues and the proposed extension of Richmond Avenue.

The Carmel Current wrote a piece in the town hall that said the residents of our neighborhood were in favor of the extension of Richmond Avenue through our neighborhood.

And I wanted to voice a different opinion.

Our neighborhood's an incredibly family-friendly community.

It's a quiet place where our kids can safely play outside, where neighbors naturally connect while riding bikes, walking dogs, or working on our yards.

It's an established area that has that classic old school caramel charm.

That's getting harder and harder to find.

Furthermore, we already face severe rainage rain drainage issues.

As you can see from the pictures, this is uh the street I live on.

Um I think in part though those drainage issues have gotten worse because we've been losing our surrounding green spaces, such as Wooddock Fields, when the new elementary school was built.

Um, while we need and very much welcome stormwater upgrades, um, fixing our infrastructure should not be connected to this road, which I consider unwanted.

Um proper drainage is a baseline necessity that the city owes its residents and is massively past due for our area as voiced by my fellow neighbors.

And just wanted to say my peace.

Thank you.

Thank you.

What road is that?

Sorry, just Concord Court.

Thanks.

I appreciate your service to the community.

And I know that these roles uh extend far beyond these chambers, and I just want you to know that your work is appreciated.

Also want to note that I'm speaking this evening as John Shapiro Carmel resident and not on behalf of any other community entity.

I'm here tonight to strongly urge the council to find a solution to the Richland Avenue extension and the related flooding that the previous speakers have alluded to.

At its core, this is a two-part problem, both a safety issue and an infrastructure issue.

Carmel Elementary, as you are well aware, has a single point of access in and out.

Access to the library is limited, and I don't think I need to explain to any of you what traffic around the high school looks like any day its students are there.

In the event of any type of large scale emergency, getting people in and out and first responders in will be a serious problem.

And Carmel Elementary is most acutely at risk.

With regards to infrastructure, our neighbors near this area have been dealing with flooding and property damage driven by the city's rapid growth.

It's well documented and it's not isolated.

There are other parts of Carmel that are facing similar issues.

We've built a beautiful award-winning city, but our infrastructure has not kept pace with that growth.

It's worth noting the Richland Avenue extension has been part of conversation since the 80s.

Carmel Elementary would not have been positioned physically the way that it is if that road extension wasn't expected to happen.

I'm not sure whether the issue has been deprioritized because it isn't glamorous or any other reason, but frankly, it doesn't really matter.

Many of us like to talk about doing what's best for the common good.

This is one of those moments.

Let's protect the safety of our kids and our community before something happens.

Let's fix the things that aren't flashy.

Our city has grown tremendously, and we've fallen behind on some of the fundamentals.

I don't have the specific answer.

I've seen a proposal.

Thank you, Mr.

Shapiro.

Comments, observations.

Deputy Mayor.

Good evening, City Council.

My name is Matthew Donaldson.

I just completed fifth grade at Cherry Tree Elementary School, and I will share tonight's deputy mayor report.

First, Carmel is working with ideas for change.org on a new program called Civic Dialogues.

This program helps residents share ideas about how to support our local businesses.

From now until July 6th, you can go online to share your own ideas or vote for ideas from your neighbors.

The most popular ideas will be discussed by a group of residents who will work together to turn those ideas into real plans.

Mayor Finkum will review the final ideas to see how the city can use them.

Please check out ideas for change.org forward slash Carmel if you would like to join in.

Next, our Americana on Maine celebration kicked off last week and will continue every Thursday evening through July 2nd in the Arts and Design District and along Monon Boulevard.

Each week has a special theme, so bring your family and friends to celebrate America's 250th birthday.

Over the weekend, the Carmel Clay History Museum also celebrated America's 250th birthday and Carmel's 50th anniversary.

They had an event to bury a time capsule that will be opened in the year 2076.

The city's engineering and technology teams have created a new project viewer that lets you see all projects happening in the city's right of way.

You can go to City Projects on our website to see all the work, including road paving, utility work, and other improvement projects.

Finally, starting this weekend, residents can enjoy the world's biggest sporting event right here in Carmel.

Select FIFA World Cup matches will be shown on midtown screen.

You can view the schedule online to see which games are coming up this week.

Thank you.

Anything else, Mayor?

Uh first of all, Matthew, fantastic job.

And uh the best smile following the delivery report that we've had.

Um I want to share some numbers.

Um we get to the Chris Kinnemart piece if we could that if you don't mind, I just have a couple things that just go on with with that.

Well, yeah, if you can't get one of you too, it really was outstanding.

Give him your smile, I was so cheerful.

Oh, no problem.

Um council comments.

One thing I would like to hear is if you could go uh the two veteran things coming up this weekend, if you could just go over those.

Or there's one Friday and one's you're doing a Saturday.

I think Mayor, you know about it.

Uh reverse.

Oh, I'm sorry.

The event is uh veteran stories uh it's part of the 250th anniversary of our country.

And the 50th anniversary of Carmel.

So there'll be veteran stories on Friday, June 26th from 2 to 4 at the uh Carmel American Legion, 155th uh post.

Um that'll be 2 to 4 Friday, June 26.

Veteran Stories.

Um, Mayor Willis will be there among other guest speakers.

Um that's it.

And then the other event.

And then the other one is Saturday, uh June 27th.

I don't have the starting time right here.

It's in the afternoon, I want to say three o'clock.

And it's uh a fundraiser to support veterans' mental health with some um some comments given by myself and others.

Live ban, great food, camaraderie.

Um it'll be a great thing.

So uh check the VFW website for more specific information on that.

What date was that?

I'm sorry.

That's Saturday the 27th.

So after the one that Tony's involved in, um everyone's invited to the one the 27th.

Uh and a local radio host, Carmel resident Jerry Lopez is spearing this up.

Uh and I'm going to do tag along the same event uh because I was asked to.

But on the 27th, is part of that is also the rock and ride motorcycle ride uh for bit for hope building a refuge to support mental health awareness and suicide prevention.

The ride starts at 10 a.m.

And then the festivities the mayor is speaking of starts at 2.

So if you're a fan of the two-wheeler big motor, um please show up and and go for uh for a ride to support uh mental health.

Oh, go ahead, you go first.

Um I was just gonna remind people about Sunday and Carmel Pride as well for um City of Carmel residents who want to come out and celebrate that as well on Sunday at Carter Green.

Um Thank you.

Um I just wanted to um respond a little bit to some of the comments about some of the stormwater issues.

Um I I know we've publicly talked a little bit about this when it regards to the restoracy project.

We talked a little bit about stormwater in the area and uh Richland Avenue, and I know there was a central district town hall recently.

Um first off, my you know, my heart goes out to anyone dealing with any difficulties, and we always want to have that dialogue.

I know I've talked to many of you on the phone and and many of the counselors, and and we want to continue to you know find ways that we can um look forward for productive solutions to the future.

Um thing I might suggest, because I know there was some confusion on some dates.

Maybe we should get a publicly noticed meeting with regard to some of this, because you know, technically, if we have five or more counselors at a meeting, we're violating Indian open door law.

So that kind of limits who can participate in some of these um meetings outside of City Hall.

So if we do do a meeting coming up, maybe we can get that publicly noticed and coordinate with the mayor's office so we can have everyone there as opposed to limiting the number of counselors who might be able to participate according to Indiana State Law at one of these meetings.

Because I'd love I we're the solution would probably have to be council wide, the whole council to talk about this.

So just make sure we get everyone involved, but um if we don't notice the meeting, then we really can't have more than four counselors there.

Thank you, Adam.

Ms.

Mr.

President, yes, sir.

So I'd just like to uh provide a little clarity.

So um you are correct, Councillor Awesome.

And on Sunday morning at an unusually early hour, I sent an email to all of you uh letting you know that um the mayor has agreed to meet on to hold a public meeting just as you've asked on July 14th at the Carmel Clay Library at 5 30.

Now this, and I apologize, Allie, if there was some uh if there was confusion at the meeting, I said I want to hear what the plan is from the city.

There was a lot of talk from um others involved, but to me, having done this for a little while, it is just talk to your point, Allie, unless we are all working together towards a solution.

And I know you've been dealing with this for 25 years, but we are where we are now.

So I asked Mayor Finkham if she would uh be willing to come, and of course the answer was yes, absolutely.

Uh we had to work with date.

I also was concerned about the size of the room as I shared with you.

So I went ahead and waited till the 14th of July in order to get the big room because we're also there's other issues.

There's the uh road extension, there's a a uh stormwater fee increase, there's just so many things flying around.

I don't know who all will come.

So I tried to let my my colleagues know uh that we've done this.

I hope everyone will come.

It will be absolutely noticed.

The mayor uh team will get the word out through the power of the city, and um, and I think our goal there is to use facts and data to um understand all the issues that are being thrown around.

And yes, I have been trying to go out to your neighborhood and look for myself, which is what I do.

I apologize I didn't knock on your door, it was not a good time of the day.

Um so if I have missed something, I'll schedule and come back.

I was trying to, I saw one of your neighbors, I was trying to ask a few questions, but I'm just trying to observe for myself what is going on in that area, and I know other people have done the same.

So we are gonna have a meeting, it will be publicly noticed, all are welcome.

The plan is to allow our city engineer to present uh facts and data, identify the issue, how big is it, how small is it, what can be done, uh, what should be done, um, and then as a city councilor, I will make my decision on how to proceed forward based on if someone said the common good, what is best for everyone that I represent, and that's what I always intend to do.

So that's how I look at this right now, and we are proceeding forward also we did schedule a meeting on July 7th.

Um, Allie, thank you for getting that meeting scheduled.

And I um my plan was with Councilor Snyder with the little bit of communication that we have had that I think it would be important to um get these questions prepared that everybody has drainage, sidewalks, the the road um to the engineering department, so that they are prepared on the 14th to have those some some answers to those questions.

So that meeting will still stand, I guess, with Matt, Councilor Snyder and I.

Okay.

Did I interrupt you?

I'm sorry.

I was wondering if it was noticeable.

Okay, yeah.

And if we're done over um to sort of Jeff's point, I had some conversations with um some uh neighbors in that area.

I didn't know about the seventh.

I'm not available that evening.

I think um I think listening is good, but to the point until there is um engineering has reviewed, third-party engineers reviewed, there's developed a plan.

Um it would just be another listening session.

So I think it's um these uh as I said in the first um town hall.

I'm a details and in the weeds guy, and this isn't a solution that is not gonna be resolved without getting in the weeds.

Engineering looking at a what is a true engineer licensed engineer, true proposed solution, and how and how this could be delivered.

Otherwise, um I think we would still be in the same place as we are today.

Um so I'm glad that the meeting, I guess is there isn't gonna be meeting on the 14th.

I won't be able to attend on the 7th.

Um, not available that evening.

Um I will be there on the 14th and look forward to hearing from I guess what other other questions that are arise.

I want to say thank you to everybody who came tonight to speak.

I appreciate it very much.

I'm not gonna comment on the all this discussion.

I think everything's been said and needs to be said.

Um I just wanted to remind everyone that we do have our neighborhood pop-up on the northeast side of town where you can meet the mayor.

Um, and I don't know which city counselors are available to come, but it's Monday, June 22nd from 5 30 to 6 30, I believe.

Is that correct?

And it's at Plum Creek Farms at the Corn Crib, which I did not know that that was an actual thing.

So hope to see you there.

Um I hope to make it to the meetings on July 7th, 9th, and 14th.

7th and 14th, excuse me, got my dates confused here.

And thank you again.

Appreciate it.

I'll save my comment for the last one.

I I just want to ask, why are we having two meetings?

Go ahead.

I think there was a little bit of confusion on the dates, and I wanted to make sure that all of the questions that our the citizens have, the residents have, um we have that in writing to deliver to the engineering department.

So just making sure will it be the same content at both meetings?

Because I mean I'm I'll go to the I think the meeting on the 14th is the engineering department, the street department addressing uh their findings of uh uh I think they're doing some tests.

Right, am I right?

So here's the reason there's I don't I guess I don't know exactly why two meetings.

Here's the reason I'm holding my meeting at our town hall, there was a plan thrown out that I was not fully aware of.

Um, and I'm happy to consider that plan, but I also knew that uh Brad City Engineer Brad Pease arrived at our meeting and also in order to also share a plan from the city's perspective.

Well, um I wanted to hear it, and I didn't think we got the opportunity to fully vet it on the floor on the um the at the town hall.

So I said in the meeting, I'm going to work to set up a meeting where I get to hear what the city is proposing, how the city identifies this issue, how they uh want to deal with it, and I think that's a prudent way to go forward.

So the only way I could make that happen was to work with the administration to get a date.

I got a date of July 14th.

Um I'll just say two meetings, cool.

Um first meeting, maybe the key will be let's gather the information.

Let's see if everybody that's got flooding.

We can get a list.

Let's pull as much data as we can to give the engineers as much data as they need to figure out what the fix is.

And I will say, 25 years ago, I was hardly born.

Um but flooding in any house that is created by our institutions needs to be taken care of.

And I think really what we're looking at is something that's such a big deal.

Um, something that's gone on for so long that it's become a big hairy, audacious issue that we're trying to figure out how to rectify with scarce resources.

So from a process standpoint, let's get every single piece of data, send it over and let's fix it.

And I want to reiterate my initial statement that when we do something together, collectively, and put one of our residents in a situation where their home is now in trouble.

Uh we're from Carmel, we come together and we make sure we fix that.

So I don't know why or where we got 25 years ago again.

I was a baby and I wasn't even alive.

I was, but the premise of figuring out how to make something rectified now because we've got the means, the ability and the authority to do it, seems right.

So I'm excited to see what the plans are.

Um excited to find the path that works for the people whose houses are flooding, who from the saving and sharing of their own resources to protect their own livelihoods, have spent way more money than we collectively could do to help get them out of that.

Um and we will find a path forward together.

Um, or we won't, and somebody else will.

So thank you for coming.

Thank you for sharing.

If your house is flooding somewhere based on something that is occurring, know that stormwater is something the city should take care of, and please call us.

Thank you.

Are we moving on from this subject?

Or onto more exciting things.

I'm just kidding.

Um, more.

I do want to congratulate the girls' state track team and the girls' tennis team.

They both won state two weeks ago, which I think uh were tallied up to 2020 state championship titles, which is awesome to me, being that I was a Carmel High School student and graduate.

Show the rings.

I do have hardware.

It's old, and there's a there's a runner-up one.

So if anybody's interested, there it is.

And also her state championships were in two different sports.

At Carmel High School, which is very, very rare.

I don't know.

I don't know if you played sports, Councillor Snyder in high school, but two state championships in two different sports or three.

That's impressive.

I haven't been hearing this for 20 years.

Congratulations, you have more rings than me.

Well, this is about the current.

Now, lots of records have been broken since we were there.

So I think it's awesome.

I I I'm really proud.

Being a track runner, I thought it was awesome to see those girls ran.

I don't know how to play tennis, but that's also pretty good.

I still have the seventh grade most touchdowns in a season record at Carmel Junior.

I did verify that.

I'm not hanging on to the past.

Um, looks like the residents left, but I want to clarify a couple things.

Yeah, the seventh, uh, in speaking to people after the meeting, who I think to Council Worrell's point, there was probably a misinterpretation of what he had said.

Um I was under the impression the meeting on the 7th would be to hear the desires of the residents.

We already heard all the concerns.

We know there's issues.

I do think it's a great idea to drill down, gather more data about where everywhere in the neighborhood it is.

Um, but I'm looking forward to hearing what what the desires are.

And as far as the plan that was put out, um I want to be clear.

I put out a funding mechanism for stormwater all over the city.

The plan is the same plan that has been talked about forever.

Um I verified.

I mean it's 2015 it was talked about digging out the entire all of the con all everything at Lexington neighborhood in 2019.

It was talked 17, it was talked about again.

Um I threw out a 20 million dollar for Richland and all of the Lexington neighborhood.

That number actually was came from a conversation on the golf course with our current engineer and our former engineer.

Um I was told 16 to 18 million, but I didn't want short people, so I rounded up to 20.

Um so that's that's if you're wondering where I came up with 20 million dollars.

I rounded up from what our city engineering staff gave me.

Um but the plan's been the same with the exception of trying to avoid some homes.

So on the seventh, I'm very much looking forward to hearing what the desires of the neighborhood are.

We heard you know uh Ms.

Gonzalez talked about not wanting the road.

We heard from others that do want the extension, but really I'm more interested in do we want sidewalks you can walk side by side on?

Do we want traffic calming measures?

What is it you want?

Because you've dealt with concrete panels for since 1970.

Um that's my thought for the seventh.

Uh I look forward to anybody that wants to come from anywhere.

Uh last thing, yesterday I want to acknowledge um uh flag day.

Big day in our nation's country, especially as we celebrate the 250th anniversary.

That was June 14th, 1977, uh, when we adopted the flag as our national symbol.

Also, yesterday was uh the United States Army's 251st birthday.

That's important because our army is a year older than our nation.

Um so we were fighting for something that didn't exist yet, but we believed in a promise and um fought like hell for it.

So I just want to acknowledge that.

Any other comments or announcements from the council?

I'm just gonna reiterate that I think the meeting on the seventh is open to everyone, and that means if you're having issues on other sides of the city or other areas, you should at least come and see what um some of the proposals may be, and so that you can take that back home and think about drainage issues from your backyards as well.

Approval of minutes from the June 1st, 2026, regular meeting.

Second you want to write your number down awesome.

Number or email, and I'll get you that photo.

You are so welcome.

Thank you.

Great job.

Claims.

Payroll in the amount of $4,499,303 and 60 cents.

General claims $2,211,903.

20 cents and purchase card $39,222.35 cents.

Wire transfers, $2 million $62,219.

Move for approval.

Thank you.

Committee reports.

Counselor Taylor of Finance.

Thank you, President Snyder.

At the finance committee, we reviewed the apologize here.

We reviewed the ordinance 28-23-26.

Simply to amend that ordinance to rename the name of the fund, the public infrastructure and insurance recovery fund.

The uh if passed unanimously with a recommendation to amend the name tonight.

Um the full council will need to determine with if whether they agree to amend the name and then also we'll hold the public hearing for that ordinance because it is an appropriation ordinance.

The next item uh was 28-24-26, excessive vehicle noise.

Uh that uh return from finance committee with a uh unanimous positive recommendation.

However, um Councilor Austin attended and he brought up a good point.

He was aware, and uh legal will discuss later a possible recommended amendment from uh from legal because of you know Indiana state law has a supremacy clause issue, um, and and hopefully legal's uh amendment will address that issue for us to consider.

We also reviewed um the abatements that are listed on the agenda today, all were in compliance and uh return from uh finance with uh positive recommendation to keep those abatements in place.

Thank you, sir.

Dr.

Joshi.

Uh so land use met on uh June 3rd, and we also reviewed two ordinances um D 2826, which you're gonna dash 26, which you're gonna hear about um shortly, and that is the right of way disturbance permit maintenance and restoration.

Um and that was once again sent back to council with a positive recommendation, and the second was establish Z 707, which was establishing fees related to zoning and development, um applications and violations from the city's engineering department, um, which is also returned with a positive recommendation.

And our next meeting at this point is set for Wednesday, June 17th at 5 30, and we will discuss that later.

Thank you, Dr.

Joshi.

Moving on, Chris Kringle Martin.

Our new uh the new Chris Kernemark CEO is gonna present the financial report.

Uh this is something that's done historically because of the timing and the financial season, it takes a few months after the winter season to for all the books to settle, which is why you're getting the financial report in the middle of the year.

Take the floor, sir.

Uh yeah, is there a cable right there?

Okay, sorry now.

The mic's on.

So this.

Yep.

Just plug that in.

Okay.

We'll just keep plugging things in until it works.

Okay.

We are ready to go.

Okay.

Thank you for your patience while I figure that one out.

So uh thanks again for the opportunity to share uh another successful year, I think uh on behalf of Carmel Chris Kendall Mark.

We are excited about what happened at last year and excited to share that with you.

Uh, before I get into the details, I want to take a second and do some thank yous.

Uh first and foremost, thank you to the city of Carmel.

We certainly couldn't do the market or a lot of our programming throughout the year without the city's support.

Uh, and gratefully thank you uh for that as well.

I think too, uh, from an organizational perspective, when you have a successful year, uh that's always attributed to great leadership from your board, uh, great commitment from your volunteers and your staff, and I think last year certainly we can say that.

So I want to take a second and thank uh we had two uh members of our board of directors roll off.

And just want to take a second and thank Matty Augustus and Zach Jackson for their service and leadership.

We really appreciate that.

And also I think with last year being a transition year in terms of staff leadership, I think it's really important to acknowledge great leadership that we had internally on behalf of Michael Namius and Julia Davis.

The year that we had just simply wouldn't have been possible without their commitment and their leadership.

So thank you, Michael.

Thank you, Julia.

So we'll get into the details.

I'm gonna go line by line of the annual report.

I'm just kidding.

I won't do that.

We're just doing the highlights tonight.

So certainly have time for some questions afterwards.

We'll start on the special event route.

Uh took two pieces out of the annual report that I thought were interesting to share.

Uh just one shares the creativity of our team.

Uh we expanded our Sunk Martin's Tog event in and focused on a interactive story session where our staff created an actual children's story, and then we rotated families in into our spiel house every 15 minutes to share that story and have this interactive moment.

So it was a real hit.

Uh and I just just wanted to highlight that uh tweak.

We're always looking to tweak our events and our offerings.

And the second piece we have up here is uh an event that I think most people are familiar with.

It's our 5K, the Glue Vine Gallup.

We had 2,600 runners registered and participated in that event.

I think that's double from two years previous.

So our special events that are part of the market are certainly very popular as well, and I think it's important to highlight those.

We'd be remiss not to talk about uh the national recognition that the market was able to shine and help shine the spotlight on one of the best cities in the nation.

Uh one unique one I think was new uh was this amazing opportunity to be highlighted by the NBC's Today show for their merriest uh main street segment.

And I think we've got a really cool picture up here.

We've got Al and Savannah and the crew holding up their glue vine mugs.

So now they are part of the Carmel tradition, and that was really really neat.

Uh second piece we're highlighting uh for the fifth time, we were highlighted as uh the national uh number one holiday market by the USA today.

So again, it's something we we hold uh dear that we want to shine a spotlight on on this amazing place and community that we live, and we'll continue to add that as a as a bar that we're trying to reach.

As many of you know, our mission is is about educating people and uh kind of just giving them the experience of Germanic culture, and so I just want to talk about that a little bit.

So at the market, I'm sure many of you have taken advantage of this.

During our open hours, we have free programming uh to explore and invite people into to learn about that Germanic culture.

So just we we put a little piece up here.

Uh I think it just in terms of scope, uh, gives you an idea how many people are coming through those opportunities.

9,000 uh kids do crafts uh during the market last year, so pretty neat opportunity there from the mission standpoint of educating people on this amazing culture.

Something new last year.

I think it's important for any nonprofit organization to be a good neighbor, and we we committed to that last year in a big way.

Uh we launched a free shuttle service, ADA accessible.

You can see a pretty cool picture here of people loading up uh from their time at the market, kind of at the old CNO property.

Uh we had 11,000 riders take advantage of that.

And so just doing a quick estimate, think about you know, a little over three people per car, that means we're able to move 3,000 vehicles from the normal hustle and bustle of hunting for parking lots around Carter Green and parking garages.

We're able to move 3,000 cars out to that area, and we want to build upon that next year.

So, again, it's important that we're good neighbors, and we invested in that last year.

So, when I started, people were like, hey, this this the market is growing, it's expanding.

There's so many people, we we have so many people every year, and and that's kind of a misnomer, is what I've learned in my short time is that we've really stabilized in terms of market attendance.

So we're in that about 300,000 guest uh attendance number each year for the last three years, which makes sense if you think about you know our market footprint is is is what it is right now, and any kind of change to that from a growth perspective is a very complex piece with a lot of different stakeholders and a lot of details that we would need to work together with with a number of people on another number of stakeholders.

So that number makes sense to me.

Um we've added some other details just to show we usually shoot for about 30 operating days depending on when the calendar hits, um, but that's it just depends on the calendar.

So we have that, and then of course, weather uh gets us to we had 24 operating days last year, and you can kind of see 25 the year before that.

So that always varies a little bit.

So that'll that'll uh influence that number a little bit.

But I wanted to share that just just so that we understood that we we really have stabilized from an attendance standpoint.

Uh we're not growing exponentially every year.

These numbers I'm sharing here are not in the annual report.

I thought it was important to share this uh with the council.

Uh these are really annual numbers from our organization.

So year end, uh counselor Snyder uh mentioned our our calendar year is a little different because of when the market is.

So this is year end uh for our organization, which it ends in March.

Uh so as an organization, from a revenue standpoint, we pulled in 3.1 million dollars, and uh expenses were two point just under 2.5, which created a good year, a stable year of a little over $600,000, $620,000 of uh net operating revenue.

So I'm sure you're all thinking, well, what do you do with that net?

And it's actually quite simple.

To start up next year's market, there's quite a bit of supplies, quite a bit of startup costs, that we're able to take our net and move into next year and launch our market next year.

So that's a big piece of that number.

Uh it talks about operational resiliency, right?

We don't have to ask for support to get next year's market going, we don't have to take out a bridge loan.

So this is a good sign from an organizational perspective.

A second piece that our our board of directors and our staff have decided upon is is again being stewards of this organization and this tradition long term.

Uh we we're gonna begin a contingency fund as an organization.

Um we all as homeowners and and we take care of our homes and our cars, and we try to put money away in our savings account, no different for a good steward of an organization.

We're gonna do that this year.

So we it's not a rainy day fund, it's a snowy day fund, pun intended.

Um we have a bad winter weather week where we have to shut down for a whole week, that has a significant impact on us from an organizational standpoint.

So we need to take some steps just to have some money set aside to mitigate risks like that or other implant pieces, so that again we're resilient as an organization financially.

So want to share those those pieces.

Diving into some specific market financials, and before I get back into the business side, uh something that's really impressed upon me in strategic planning conversations we've had internally is is revenue that that we collect as an organization is not only a business number, it's a mission number.

Because we're so disciplined to ensure that our products, our experiences are authentically German.

That means every dollar spent in our programs is is literally a taste of German culture, right?

So the products, the food that you're eating that you're you're buying, you're getting that real taste of the culture, and that's our mission, right?

To educate people on this amazing culture.

So it's not just a business number, it's a mission number.

Last year, uh the booths that we operated, um, again, we operate several booths, uh, not other vendors, uh it's not the ice skating rink revenue.

We we brought in 2.1 million dollars of revenue for the market uh organization for CCI.

We'll zoom out, right?

And we like to talk about this as economic impact numbers.

So now we're talking about our our vendors, our partners.

Uh, and and um they generated $8.1 million at the market.

And why is that an economic impact number and why is that important to our community?

I've learned that that the majority of our vendors are local vendors.

They're Carmel, Hamilton County, Indianapolis area, most of them.

There are certainly some in other states that have very specific specialties in some of the products they provide, but most of our vendors are local, and so we're helping generate revenue through this market to these.

I I think are really more likely small business owners, right?

So that's it's a really important number to think about impact on the community.

Uh we always like to share the ice rink revenue number.

As you all know, that's not uh a part of our organization officially, but obviously connected to the market.

But I think that's also an economic impact number because that's revenue being generated for part-time jobs, for the businesses that operate the market, etc.

And obviously it's an amazing quality of life experience.

The last piece on there is a tourist impact estimate.

As we we look at our place for AI data and our our conversations with Hamilton County tourism, we can estimate that one in six guests at the market use a hotel, they stay at a hotel, right?

And so when you stay at a hotel, our local hotels are happy.

During a time of the year where typically in our our area of the country, they're usually not very busy.

So our local hotels are very happy that we have the market going at this level, and certainly our restaurants and shops as well, as that extends out.

So I think that's an important economic number as well.

So talking about our impact, we think mission, we think business, and we think lifting the community up, and I think our annual report is showing that.

Last slide.

So looking ahead, right?

Um we're looking at this in three ways.

So long term, and I mean long term.

Uh, we're trying to move as an organization away from how do we do this market, how do we do our programming every year to how do we set our our organization up so that we can provide these traditions and these amazing experiences for generations to come.

That's the shift that we're moving into.

It's it's bold, but it's needed and we're ready for it because of this great support from the city and our community.

So that's the strategy moving forward.

Um second piece, we're looking internally, right?

Um at our operations.

I talked about the contingency fund.

I talked about strategic planning that we're putting into place.

We're looking at everything.

Banking services, everything you can think of to put us in a good place to be resilient as an organization for years to come.

Um I talk about this with the team.

We're stewards of an amazing organization.

We're stewards of an amazing community tradition, and that's the role that we play, stewards.

And so we want to make sure it's here for whoever we're gonna hand the baton to uh moving forward.

So last but not least, uh, our day-to-day looking ahead.

Uh I've been really impressed with the staff.

Uh we are constantly thinking about and examining how can we make the market fresh and still provide our our tr our traditional, very popular items, and how can we stay true to that authentic German ant culture piece?

Um and there's a lot of thought that goes into that.

Um when we're gonna introduce a new product, there's some risk there for vendors.

We have really great partners uh with our vendors and talking about are you ready for this?

Because they have to buy the supplies, or we do, and um the detail in that is really impressive.

Of course, we're looking at operational details day to day as well.

How do we move our lines faster?

How do we work with our vendors to do those types of things?

How do we work more intentionally with our neighbors with the city in terms of marketing our businesses that are right next to Carter Green, down the Monon, down Maine, um up top at City Center.

Um already engaged in some of those conversations.

So trying to enhance those relationships is the day-to-day focus for us as well.

So that's what we had.

I again want to thank the city, and we've got plenty of sponsors showing up here that supported us last year that we wanted to exhibit and they're there in the annual report as well.

I shared with with everyone, you all have a hard copy of the whole report.

You have a digital copy, you've got my contact information.

I'm happy to sit down with anyone and go into more detail about this over coffee, lunch, what have you.

So happy to do that if you need a break from stormwater complex problems.

I can we can talk about the market if you like.

Um, but want to open up to any questions or any other information you want to talk.

I'm sure there will be some questions.

I know the mayor you have some comments, right?

I I wanted to I wanted to reiterate though.

Um, he was having Zach on that board.

I was a little suspect at first because it was like, where is he coming from?

But the insights that you brought, Zach really opened my eyes to several things, primarily, and you you touched on it.

How much damage one bad weather date does?

I mean, it and I you calculated it down to number of bad weather hours that nukes the market, and I thought you your contributions were measurable, very measurable, and really sad that you know you decided you had more important things like the city's finances to focus on.

But I do really, really appreciated your time on the board, and I think you brought a lot to it.

Thank you.

Uh, do you want to do questions or Mary?

Would you like to make comments first and maybe thank you so much for that presentation?

And I'm sorry that I haven't had an opportunity to sit down and meet with you.

I would love to do that.

So just to hear more about I'll dig into this and and um we'll have more to talk about.

Um I really wanted to say thank you for focusing on and Matt, or excuse me, Counselor Snyder, President Snyder.

Matt.

Um I'm trying to be, you know.

Um, but I was really I was grateful to hear what the what the numbers look like when we have a bad weather day, or you know, whether or not it's able to be open for a certain amount of time.

I was really impressed with the what ride share, or excuse me, the ride, the um the ferry, as I'm going to call it.

What is it?

Shuttle.

Shuttle, thank you.

Sounds like two syllables.

Um, so I was just really impressed with what you put together.

I'm really excited to sit down with you and dive into these numbers a little bit.

Yeah, a little bit closer, and thank you for sharing this.

So, really don't have any questions, just good work.

Okay, good work, you guys.

And good job, Zach.

I'll give you kudos too.

You're a good bean counter over there.

Thank you.

Thanks.

Looking forward to it.

Uh thank you, Mr.

President.

Uh, welcome to the team.

Uh, I think it's everybody's excited to have you on board and really appreciate your professional presentation.

Um, so congratulations on uh on to the team on this year.

I'm I'm curious about the shuttle.

11,000 is significant.

How is that capacity?

Are you going to expand that?

Tell me more about that as we deal with everybody trying to use those facilities during those 24 days.

Just an early conversations as we've done post-event conversations.

I think we can expand on it just with some strategy, adding during busy times another bus or two during that time.

So we were shooting for about a 15-minute loop and really couldn't quite get there.

And working with our partner or our provider, we think we can add a couple of actual buses to maybe we're don't quote me and don't hold me accountable to it, but we're trying to double it going into next year.

So obviously there's some additional costs there.

This isn't a cheap uh, but it's important.

So we're trying to perhaps double it going into next year if we can.

And just real quick, where does the shuttle pick up and drop off?

I yeah, yeah.

So at the old CNL property, the their parking lot and on the streets uh Pennsylvania.

Yes, out in that area.

Uh that's the pick up and drop off.

Uh, and then they'll come right along third and drop off right in front of the market and then pick up and shuttle back as well.

Okay.

Very convenient.

Thank you.

I encourage you to expand that as much as makes sense.

Yeah, absolutely.

Thank you for coming to present um another successful Chris Kindle market.

Congratulations to the team to the current board members and past board members.

I'd love seeing the use of Placer AI.

It provides so much great data.

Um it's a great, it's a great solution.

And so to that point, the hotel help hotel stays.

It'd be interesting to be able to see if we could articulate the amount of innskeepers tax that the county collects based on the Chris Kindle market.

Many times we apply for uh grants through uh visit Hamilton County, and that's great data for us to be able to use to say, hey, we need some assistance with this program or this or this uh uh possible thing the city's trying to accomplish.

Uh visit Hamilton County.

We love your partnership to contribute a grant to our uh to our plan.

So if there's any way to articulate that data, I could follow up with you later.

Yeah, and what type of income the county derives from inn's keepers tax, I think that'd be great details to have.

Yeah, thank you.

Let's dig in.

Um first off, great presentation.

Thanks.

Um in fact, I want to compliment the the board who helped select you.

It looks like uh you're off to a very good start.

So we really appreciate uh your passion, your thoroughness.

Ums one, I I look here at the chart about the um the city's spending on the Chris Kindle market.

I mean, kudos, I mean, in the in the past years of of getting that amount um lower and lower because we do know that you know it was making money and the city did put a substantial investment into it, and so it was the only right to try to lower that mount where needed.

Although I do want to caution the public to say that number should ever get to zero, because this is a huge economic driver for not only the city of Carmel, but the entire region, and it's not unreasonable for us to put some money in to help see a return on investment when it comes to economic development in the area.

So where that number needed to lie, I understood it needed to change, but to get that down to zero, probably um may not be the goal if we're bringing in lots of people spending money in our hotels and shops and restaurants.

Um I would say, and I'm gonna say this as a compliment and a challenge.

It seems like the biggest challenge that you have facing forward is everybody wants to go to the market.

Yeah.

And there are long lines.

Uh parking, you mentioned the shuttle is one way to do that.

Um, and then you can just look on social media and people will say, Oh, it's it's too crowded.

It's almost that old yogi bearer saying it's too crowded, nobody goes there anymore.

But um still um it is something that you have to deal with.

So, what are the ways that you're looking at?

Whether it's I know in the past, years ago they looked at different days, and maybe you didn't work for the vendors and changing the schedule or increasing the number of days.

Um I've you know it's been publicly said that maybe the footprint could change.

Um what are the things that you're exploring to maybe address the um overpopularity of the market?

Yeah, I think there's one immediate thing that's I think communicating the reality of of yes, the weekends are busy, but and and I know my family takes advantage of this every year and has before I even considered being a part of this organization.

We have an opportunity as Carmel residents to have a magical experience on Wednesday evenings, Thursday evenings, come in, ice skate, have a great meal, be back at home in an hour and go to bed, at least me.

I'm I go to bed early.

So getting our our community understand that opportunity, not to say they have to.

Some of our community loves being shoulder to shoulder, and that's just they love being around people.

But just understanding there's still opportunity to enjoy the market when it's not as busy.

So that's an easy thing that we and we're talking about how to do that from a marketing and communications perspective already.

I think the longer term piece in terms of solutions when when we're looking at just crowding is very complex because it is a footprint, a physical issue again that involves not just the market, but a number of city assets and a lot of stakeholders.

And so that's coming to the table together and talking about what makes sense.

One thing we're doing to help that conversation already is that we're embarking in a community assessment that we're funding.

Um we're gonna ask our community.

So our Carmel residents, our Hamilton County residents, those that come, those that don't come, why don't you come?

Why are you coming?

What would your attitude be if we shrunk the footprint and we move this or we took this away, or if we added this, or if we grew this in this manner?

So really getting kind of community attitudes towards a number of different options and what those trade-offs would be is the first step, uh kind of similar to what was being discussed earlier tonight.

There's a lot of amazing attitudes because of what you're saying, right?

Like everybody loves the market.

Um, and so everybody has an idea on how to make it better, is what I'm learning.

Uh, which is great.

I that's where I want to be.

Um, but I think we've really got to get an understanding of look, no matter what we do moving forward, you're gonna have some voices that might be against it.

Uh, but what's the real kind of synopsis of our community in terms of what their appetite is for these different ideas?

Uh and talking about parking and and and traffic and all the things that go along with that.

So that's the first step is gathering that and then sharing that with whoever wants to sit at the table with us and talk through the long term.

Yeah.

Well, first of all, thank you for being here.

I'm so glad you joined the team.

I want to have a special recognition to Michael and Julia because they stepped up with so much extra responsibility and just made this a phenomenal year, even with the weather challenges, even with the big hit of the today show.

I mean, those are all not without challenges in and of themselves.

And uh I also want to underscore the importance of the shuttle.

Because I know we talked about it in 24.

Uh Michael was able to pull it off in 25, and that is so important to that experience piece to the safety piece, which is above all the most important thing we need to be considering.

So I know um our teams have a lot of input in that in the traffic flow.

We'll continue to have that again this year.

Uh so don't want to discount all the work that our teams did either, but I just want to say special thanks to Michael and Julia.

Um, just really looking forward to the partnership as we move forward and seeing you know the results of your survey, I think it'd be phenomenal, so we can talk then.

You get the first one under your belt as a CEO, and then we're gonna sit down and talk about what needs to look differently.

And I do want to confirm uh the president and CEO of CNO has said again, happy to have you know provide that opportunity for you guys to utilize that land.

And I just you know, I was able to thank him for that as well personally.

So uh he understands the value of this uh market to the city and wants to contribute, and so we're ever appreciative of CNO as a great corporate partner as well.

Absolutely, it's great news.

Um, I want to back cleanup, I also want to kind of add some news that's adjacent to the market, both physically and financially, and that is today.

I got a rundown on the giving machine.

If you remember, we've had it in our community for I think this is our third year.

Uh it's been up at Clay Terrace for one machine, and then this last year we added two machines right outside.

Um look, it looks like a purpose-built space for it.

Just happened to be a um a concrete pad outside of the hotel Carmichael.

And we added that on uh December 2nd.

Um it was a huge success.

And they were thrilled.

Uh, you know, in over three years, 572,000 is donated goods and services to these machines in Indiana.

This last year it went to the Carmel Youth Assistance Program, Hatch, Make a Wish, the Dove Recovery House for Women, and Bright Lane Learning, plus two international charities.

Uh, but just significant giving.

Thank you to Carmel residents.

Once again, it shows just how generous we are and make empowering solutions that these nonprofits work for each and every year.

Um, and so uh they have provided me a proposal to bring this a contract to bring this back to Carmel again.

I see no reason why we shouldn't do that and help.

One thing to note that the charities that are supported through this will change every year.

And they'll be making an announcement about who they are here eventually, but they score at least an 80 on the charity navigator score.

So they're well performing uh charities who will use those funds for great use uh to help Hoosers and others.

So I just want to give you that great news that you know it was it was just really amazing impact that these machines were able to make.

It really um uh from an impact spirit perspective.

Um the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints puts these out.

Uh, I think it's like 126 countries and six continents or something like that.

They do not take any type of financial support for themselves.

This is part of their mission.

And uh they were just so pleased with the impact this had.

And uh the gentleman today shared with me that one of the charities you shall remain nameless, um, was expecting around six thousand dollars, got twenty-seven thousand dollars or something like that.

My numbers may be off, and Lily cried on the spot when they realized the impact that they can make then to our residents because what they do uh in their mission.

So uh I just want to say it's it's nice being on the periphery.

We want to make sure it wasn't within the the uh borders of the Chris Kinemark because we didn't want to do anything to you know negatively impact the the giving and other things that occur inside that, but to have it adjacent on the Monine Trail where over 8 million people run uh walk, bicycle, uh, or scoot by uh in a given year.

Uh that we knew there was a lot of traffic in December coming out of the hotel Carmichael into the palladium, and it was uh it was a great choice.

So thanks to our city staff, uh streets, CRC, uh engineering, and others who had a say there.

It was it was a double thumbs-up win for us.

Thank you, Mr.

President.

Yeah, thank you, everyone.

Moving on, old business AB remaining committee C resolution CC 0518-26-05 resolution common council of the city of Carmel.

Approving a transfer of funds between the general fund 101 and the public infrastructure insurance recovery fund 927.

Sponsors Councillor Taylor and myself.

Um we need to first amend the name of this, correct?

Uh on this one, this one was just held back because since it was a resolution, the name, the name was create uh uh was fixed.

Uh, we had then also created the fund.

So we can't act on this uh resolution tonight as presented as the infrastructure insurance recovery fund.

This resolution is for the transfer.

Um the other step would be under A and um public hearings to where um we properly noticed it with the new fund name, or we need to amend ordinance D-2823, the uh appropriations ordinance to the correct name and then hold the public hearing for it.

Excuse me, counselor Taylor.

Yes, at the last council meeting, we did not amend it.

It was only amended in committee.

So we do need to officially amend it to this resolution.

This this resolution as presented does say the public uh infrastructure insurance recovery fund, and it was noticed that way.

And since it's not an ordinance, I believe we can act on it tonight.

Is that right, Sergey?

Yep.

Okay, it just had to be properly noticed with the proper fund name since it's just a resolution.

Okay, and this is tied to the third reading of ordinance D-2823, which is actually an appropriation of the funds after the public hearing.

Do I have a motion to approve resolution CC 0518 2605?

Go to second.

Second.

Any discussion?

Open the roll.

The resolution carries unanimously.

On to second reading of ordinance D 2826-26, an ordinance of common council of the city of Carmel, Indiana amending chapter 8, Article 65, Section 865 of the Carmel City Code.

Sponsors are heirs, Joshi, Minar, and Snyder returns from land use.

Councilor Joshi.

So this ordinance amends the excavation right-of-way disturbance permit, maintenance, restoration requirements, as well as amending penalties for a violation.

Um we did actually discuss this, and I'm going to have both Sergey and Engineering come up and present.

The land use committee discussed the ordinance and uh it's returned to you with favorable recommendation.

The really the only substantive change was uh the reduction of application fee from 150 dollars to 50 dollars and also um I went through the ordinance at the direction of a committee to clean it up with um making sure that it's consistent throughout the terminology.

You know, I use the permit holder permittee uh a little bit too liberally and also just eliminating of verbose language outside of that that's that's the only substantive changes, the um application fee got reduced to where it was to $50.

And um Director Bs would like to again to give uh uh Brad Pete's director of engineering uh some context on how we got this here.

So we've kind of been working on and off on this since probably last fall or earlier with a couple different iterations of land use.

Um it's to get better um compliance of restoration mainly um uh for working the right-of-way um about steel plates are in there now, more details, um how long they have to restore things.

There are two new fees uh besides the fifty dollar application fee, which remains the same from what our previous was, and those are uh street cut fees and path cut fees, those are 500 and 200 respectively, so that covers the administration inspection, the impact it has to our uh asset uh because of the street cut, um, and the disturbance of the public, etc.

That all add up to how we kind of calculated those fees.

Um there's um some cleanup to the bonding, which is um just to sort of streamline it.

Um then there are some punitive measures in there for violations.

I think we previously had some, but those are the language is tightened up that makes it easier for us to enforce those.

Um I think that's about it as far as the update.

Um there is an appeal process now as well.

So any questions thank you, President Snyder.

Um, yeah, Brad.

Um, first of all, I want to I want to say that I really enjoyed watching the land use meeting, and I want to give kudos to Eleanor for pulling together all that information.

Great work.

I know you I know you put a lot of work into that, so just want to say thank you.

Um second thing is is I did talk to and I I understood the reason why the permit fee went down back down to fifty dollars an hour or fifty dollars for that permit, and I agree with Councilor Locke's uh assertion that we shouldn't be dinging homeowners for commercial work in a residential area.

And I did discuss with um Councilor Locke the the idea that at some point once this uh ordinance gets rolling and working and seeing how it it acts, um how it reacts, um, that maybe at some point we can actually bring that to zero dollars for our homeowners, residential, commercial, slash residential at some point, because we do do not want to have to make our taxpayers pay any more than they have to.

So um with that, I just want to say that I am totally in agreement with this um ordinance, and I want to congratulate land use and uh this is his this was in here, this was there when I was there still.

So glad to see it's finally coming here.

So thank you.

Anything else?

I just had more of a question.

Uh Sergei, um, it came back amended, so does the council need to take action to amend I move to amend based on as presented by Sergei and approved by land use.

Second.

This will be a roll call vote.

Council Green.

Yay, Councilor Ayers, Council Well, Councilor Taylor, aye.

Aye, Councilor Locke, aye, Councilor Austin, aye.

Counselor Joshi, aye, Councilor Minor.

Aye, carries unanimously move to approve the amended.

Can we make uh go ahead and move to approve unless there's further discussion in council that I would move to approve the ordinance as presented and amended?

Second, second counselor green, yay, councillor Ayers, Councilor Well, Counselor Taylor.

Aye, aye, Councilor Locke, Council Hawson.

Hi.

Counselor Joshi.

Aye.

Council Minor.

Aye.

Carries unanimously.

Okay.

Well, second reading.

We're on the E, right?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Second reading of ordinance D 2A27-26, or the Common Council of the City of Carmel.

Um adding Chapter 6, Article 5, Section 6-85 to the Carmel City Code, and amending chapter 3, Article 2, Section 3-5A, Sponsors Minor, Taylor, Josh War, Austin sent to the Finance Counselor Taylor.

This ordinance prohibits excess excessive vehicle noise returns without amendment from the finance committee with a positive recommendation.

However, Sergey, if you want to um bring this up and discuss the amendment that you discussed with possible language amendment that you discussed with Councillor Austin.

Absolutely.

So uh this ordinance regulates three different types of behavior.

Number one is revving of engines, number two is excessive aggressive acceleration, and number three is a modified exhaust system.

So um Councillor Austin brought up uh a an issue with potential preemption from a state, where is a uh city code of sorry state code, which is nine-19-eight three and four that regulates mufflers.

Uh it's uh we believe that we intent of that uh state code is a little bit different than ours.

It regulates installation maintenance, operation of mufflers, but among other things, it prohibits removing or modifying mufflers to avoid their operation.

We our ordinance tries to regulate particular specific behavior modification of amplification of a noise.

It's slightly different the city uh in the state code, however, there is language that states that modification of any similar device to the ones listed are prohibited.

So that is a catch-all provision.

I we believe that it can be used as a um argument for preemption of a state code, and so our recommendation is to remove that language in our ordinance, not to have a procedural argument of preemption.

Uh what we will do, however, is we will work with our police department to see if they can cite under the state code when it comes down to muffler modification and see how the uh prosecutor's office and and our court will react to this.

If they will say that, hey, yeah, no, it's it's really is a different trying to uh address a different issue.

We'll come back to you and we will include it then.

But we would like to see and try it out first to see if that state code will apply in that particular scenario.

So again, our recommendation is to remove subsection A2, which is definition of a modified exhaust system, and also remove reference to it in a second line of subsection A5 uh line uh 61.

Uh that is the only recommendation we have from committee.

So you just looking to see if you can site the state code, which is great news, because then we can still have enforceability there.

Um in the state code it did exempt vehicles over a certain age, like classic 25 years.

Yeah.

So that would exempt them from that part of the law, but the other aspects of the law, they would still not be exempt from.

Correct.

So the revving the vehicles, the excessive noise created, regardless of whether it was a classic vehicle or not, you know, the modifications may be allowed, but the noise still is not.

Right.

That's absolutely right.

Uh classic vehicle, of course, is a stretch of definition.

I think then the state code was written 25 years ago.

That's that my first vehicle was Nissan Century, and it was older than 25 years from we want to move to amend it.

Is there further conversation?

Uh motion to move.

Motion to amend.

Second.

Councilor Green.

Counselor Ayers.

Aye.

Council Well.

Aye.

Aye, Councilor Locke.

Aye.

Councilor Austin.

Aye.

Aye.

Councilman Rye.

Uh move to approve someone.

Move to approve.

Second.

Councilor Green.

Mr.

President, could could we have a little bit of discussion?

I just want to uh want to uh so um as you've worked with our police department.

Is this officer visualization only, or are residents okay calling in when there is an issue in midtown?

So just give a little bit of of um guidance as to how what's the functionality of an ordinance like this.

Absolutely.

Um it doesn't have to be in in midtown anywhere in the city if you experience you know aggressive acceleration, reving, uh sustained repetitive revving, just call a non-emergency number, and uh it's obviously the uh ticket will have to be written by a police officer.

So uh, but you can call an emergency uh non-emergency number and uh you know have attention to that kind of behavior again.

Midtown is probably the biggest violation area, but also anywhere in the core, it's fairly common as well.

Okay, so you're recommending don't call 911, call use non-emergency, which I'll bet you you know many people don't know what that is, but um is that your recommendation?

Yes, absolutely.

And I uh unless it's such an egregious behavior, then um the COTO 911 might be might be a good good way to do it as well, but probably non-emergency number would be better.

Okay, for most types.

Can you share that number with us?

You know, that I did not remember the top of my head.

Uh well, I'll look it up, I'll look it up.

Thank you, Mr.

Vote.

Yeah, we have uh the question was called and seconded.

We were in discussion, so now it's ready for the roll call vote.

Council Green?

Council Ayers.

Aye, Council Royal.

Aye, Councilor Taylor.

Aye, Councilor Lock.

Aye, Councilor Lock.

Aye, Councilor Austin.

Aye, counselor.

Aye, Councillor Minor.

Aye.

Carries.

Thank you.

Public hearings.

So this one we have to amend first and then have the public hearing.

Yeah, Sergey, you confirm that that ordinance D 28-23-26 needs to be amended by the council, though we're on the third public hearing to rename the name, the um public infrastructure insurance recovery fund.

Uh the synopsis of this is this ordinance appropriates 1 million seventy-four dollars and uh 70 74,842 dollars to cover repair and maintenance costs for city assets.

Uh the new fund name is the public infrastructure insurance recovery fund you move to introduce councilor uh president Snyder will just open up the public hearing.

We'll open it at uh 35 after 7.

We need to amend it first.

We need to vote to amend to the new name.

I move to approve uh amending the name in the ordinance.

The fund name's been created.

The funds have been created, that fund name has been passed.

We're just um um amending the appropriation ordinance to the correct name.

Second any other discussion?

Councilor Green, aye, Councilor Ayers.

Aye, Council War.

Aye.

Council Taylor.

Aye.

Aye, Council Locke, aye.

Council Austin.

Aye.

Council Josie, aye.

Council Minor.

Aye.

All right.

Now we'll open the public hearing at 736.

Seeing no one moving, we will close it at 736 plus some time.

Move for approval.

Councillor Green.

Aye.

Counselor Ayers.

Councilor Well.

Aye.

Counselor Taylor.

Aye.

Aye, Councillor Locke.

Aye.

Counselor.

Aye.

Aye.

That was Austin Joshi.

Minar, for the record.

Carries unanimously.

Second reading of ordinance Z-707 or the common council of City of Carmel, Indiana, establishing fees with a zoning development.

Applications of violations in the UDO for the city's engineering department and amending the UDO fees comply with HEA 1001.

Sponsored Councillor Ayers returns from land use and special studies.

Counselor Ayers.

This ordinance amends the filing fees in Article 1 of Section 1.29 in the unified development ordinance.

Thank you.

If not yeah I just want to make the comment that I I very much appreciate the work that was done by both Elinor and and yourself because this really did take a little bit of um of reading through but we did have a conversation as to making some small adjustments which I think were reflected in the amendment that's presented or the the document that's presented before you wanted to make sure that we were doing project inspections that didn't affect single family homes.

I think that was a really important conversation that we had was that we didn't want these fees again to impact um residents of Carmel and single family homes so we wanted to make sure that we had a designation of a plot like acreage and I don't know if you want to speak a little bit to that before we do this just for public information.

Yeah so we uh changed the engineering project inspection fee to one more right sized along with projects instead of a flat fee so it increases by the acre depending on the size of the project but single lot um residential homes on an acre or less are exempt from that fee.

And so that covers a large portion of homes the majority of homes in Carmel there are obviously still some larger homes and there's some significant effort after you increase after an acre size for development that takes a substantial amount of time so there's the fee still for those thank you I just wanted to say thank you for those amendments I talked to uh counselor joshi and director peace and not only uh does that help small single family homes but through our conversation the smaller businesses that are kind of tinier um their fees aren't going to be suddenly going up and and pricing them out for those businesses that are less than an acre that's correct they're not exempt from the fees but if they're less than an acre the fees are I mean I gave you a yeah yeah you gave me the you gave me some examples and some of the work that's done does it does have no fees still so some of the ones we went over would have no fee.

Other ones that do have fees again the right size by the size of the project so it's not tens of thousands of dollars or something.

So thank you for thinking of the small businesses.

Oh yeah we're not public hearing first correct yeah so we'll open up the one more small amendment just need to cover this as well um it is there was a slight uptick of a fee based on committee recommendation for engineering PUD ordinance review it was got changed from 675 to 750 very small uptick um and also engineering PD ordinance amendment review got changed from 300 to 400 um PUD ordinance are ordinances take a lot of time to review from engineering department as well as DOCSO based on recommendation from committee that was appropriate uh deemed to be appropriate okay move to amend council grain councillor council world counselor tailor aye aye counselor lock counselor awson council joy aye councilman we'll open up public hearing at six excuse me 740 nobody moving we'll close it at 741 we have an amended so move to approve um the ordinance as amended second councillor green yay counselor counselor world council taylor aye aye council lock nay counselor awson aye council joshi councilmanages eight one right first reading of ordinance d 2825-26 and ordinance of the common council of the city of Carmel Indiana authorizing and approving an additional appropriation from the ambulance capital fund sponsor is counselor awesome move to a move move to uh um introduced this ordinance appropriates funds to cover grant eligible expenses and the ambulance capital fund 102 thank you mr president and members of the council uh Zach Jackson City uh controller and CFO um this ordinance uh matches up with uh the first resolution in the new business section and that uh resolution is transferring 2497 dollars uh from the grant fund over to the ambulance capital fund and this is a grant that the fire department received from uh Indiana Department of Homeland Security for hazmat emergency preparedness thank you for the discussion we'll have a public open up the public hearing at 74 3 we'll close the public hearing at 743 action I make the motion to suspend the rules and act on this this evening second

Thank you for the discussion.

We'll have a public open up the public hearing at 7 4.

We'll close the public hearing at 743.

Action.

I make the motion to suspend the rules and act on this this evening.

Second.

Councilor Green.

Microphones.

Yay.

Councilor Ayers.

Aye.

Council Well.

Aye.

Council Taylor.

Aye.

Aye.

Councilor Lock.

Counselor Austin.

Aye.

Council Joshua.

Councilman R.

Aye.

Motion to approve.

Counselor Green.

Second.

Yeah.

Sorry.

Yay.

Councilor Harris.

Aye.

Council Well.

Council Taylor.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Joshua.

Aye.

Minar.

Does anybody have a problem with me only using their last name as we go through this?

Okay.

First reading of ordinance D 2828-26, orange of the Common Council of the City of Carmel Indiana authorizing and approving an additional appropriation from the motor vehicle highway fund sponsored Councillor Awesome, Joshi and Minar.

Move to introduce.

Second.

Sweetly.

This ordinance appropriates funds to cover grant eligible expenses and the motor vehicle highway fund.

Yeah, this one also matches up with uh a resolution, the second one on your agenda, uh transfer of one million from the grant fund over to the MVH.

And in this situation, we have uh one million coming from uh NDOT through their uh community crossings grant program.

Thank you.

No amendments needed.

We will open the public hearing at 743 or 74.

We will close the public hearing at 74.

Do we want to act tonight?

Move to suspend the rules and act on this this evening.

Second.

Green.

Yay.

Ayers.

Aye.

Well Taylor.

Lock.

Aye.

Austin.

Aye.

Joshi.

Aye.

Minor.

Aye.

Thank you.

Action.

Move to approve.

Second.

Green.

Yay.

Ayers.

Aye.

Well.

Aye.

Taylor.

Aye.

Aye.

Locke.

Aye.

Austin.

Aye.

Joshi.

Aye.

Minor.

Aye.

That carries.

Unanimously.

First reading of ordinance D-2831-26 ordinance of the Common Council of the City of Carmel, Indiana, authorizing and approving an additional appropriation of funds from the ERP implementation fund 928.

Councilor Austin.

Move to introduce.

This ordinance appropriates two million dollars to support the ERP implementation costs.

Director Jackson.

Thank you.

Oh yeah, I wish.

It's my vacation property.

There we go.

All right.

Sorry about that.

So before you tonight, I have uh three uh different uh business items.

One is a resolution uh transferring dollars from the general fund to the ERP implementation fund.

Uh two is the actual creation of the ERP implementation fund, and then three would be the appropriation of that said uh two million in there.

Um I gave the same presentation to uh finance committee on uh Tuesday of last week, Tuesday or Wednesday, and then I I emailed it to council.

I'll I'll just go through it quickly here, but again, our uh referring to our ERP implementation as project cornerstone, just cornerstone emphasize emphasizing the importance of of what we're trying to accomplish here, uh which is to modernize the city's core financial and administrative systems.

Uh uh we have so many outdated systems, processes, and so on, and the goal of this would be to appraise uh replace those with modern efficient systems and processes.

We have so many outdated systems, processes, and so on, and the goal of this would be to appraise uh replace those with modern efficient systems and processes.

We have legacy systems that have become outdated and are hard to support.

Those outdated systems are more vulnerable to uh cyber security attacks.

Um reduce risk and approve improve our efficiency.

Um right now our our systems do not talk to each other, meaning that uh taking something from our purchasing system is a manual paper process uh where duplicate entries have to be made in order to get one thing from one system to another.

Same thing with payroll manual processes where we're moving data from one system to another.

Uh again, better access to our data means uh better reporting for for you, the decision makers.

Um how are we going to measure the success?

Uh we'll be looking for reduced manual work and reduced duplicate systems, improve financial tracking, transparency, and reporting capabilities, higher confidence in the data that we present, uh, better stewardship of taxpayer dollars, and more reliable and supportable systems.

Uh we've been talking about this for for over a year now, uh, just some of the things we've accomplished so far.

We have hired a project manager to lead our readiness and planning.

Uh he's been on board for about a month now.

We have uh selected the ERP that we wish to move forward with, and that is uh workday.

Uh we would like to use the Omnia Cooperative, and so when you when you see a transaction go through, if this were to be approved, uh it might not show up as workday, but their licensed uh reseller is iron brick.

We'd also like to have workday do the implementation.

We just believe that that gives us a better opportunity for for accountability.

Uh whether you want to say that's one back to pat or one throat to choke, uh we we have uh one set of people to to hold responsible with this uh implementation.

I won't go through all these, but you can see these are the uh the modules that we're going to be implementing.

Uh they're all HR or finance related, ranging from uh uh payroll, time tracking, uh absence management, benefits, uh, and and uh the core human capital management, which again is is the the position management side of things, uh, over to the finance side, which is obviously the core financials, uh, financial planning is a budgeting module, um, expense reports, uh procurement, uh, again, doing all these things in one system as opposed to.

I mean, if I looked at this list right now, maybe maybe four of these are done in a in a system, and uh probably four are done by email, uh, and maybe four just aren't even done today.

In terms of the costs, there are kind of two groups of costs to look at.

One is the implementation cost, which is this slide, and the second are the ongoing licensing costs.

Uh the contract with workday uh iron brick is 1.879 million for the implementation.

We'll also need to uh to duplicate licenses for a year.

Essentially, once we sign the contract with workday, uh we we start getting charged for uh the annual licensing costs.

There'll be a period of time for roughly a year where we'll also need to pay for licensing for our existing uh systems, and as you'll see on the next slide, uh our current costs for the the various contracts we have is almost the same as the the new workday uh contract costs.

Uh there may also be some other temporary or contract assistance that we need just as we're going in and scrubbing data to convert from the new system to the old system.

Uh we we may need a few uh temporary accountants or the something like that to assist.

Um in terms of the funding request, so I'm asking for a $2 million to be transferred from the general fund, and at some point we'll also uh seek to recoup $350,000 from the utilities department.

They're part of this initiative as well, and that's uh kind of their fair share.

Uh it represents about 15% of those costs, and and that's uh about the the portion of the city that they make up looking at head count.

Ultimately that will give us uh uh 2.2 million dollars, uh 2.35 million and uh 2.2 million of expenses, so uh a cushion right now of 150,000 for uh extra expenses.

In terms of the ongoing licensing costs, um hopefully you can see the the colors that I've I've put in those ovals on the on the chart up there on the table.

Essentially everything to the left of the red uh oval, those are the costs that we pay today if we were sticking with our existing systems.

Uh you can see our ADP contract is uh for this year about 234,000.

Uh Great Plains is the uh accounting software used by our utilities department.

Uh our contract for Central Square, also known as Pentomation, is with uh Superion.

You see that in the next column.

Uh parks uses and pays for QuickBooks.

Uh the Bond Bank, which is operated out of the finance department also uses QuickBooks.

All of those together, you can see the total, and I'm just gonna call it if you look at the average there in the bottom two uh rows, you know, 320,000 a year ish is the uh is the total for our existing um uh uh systems.

Workday uh buckets there, ongoing cost into to uh two buckets.

Uh one is the licensing, and the second is uh for for training.

Uh obviously training is front loaded, but with some ongoing uh training after that.

The work day total in the blue uh is simply the sum of those those two columns right before it.

Uh new total uh recognize that that column without a uh oval around it just recognizes it's it's higher in 26 and 27, recognizing that we're gonna have a year that I've split between 26 and 27, where we'll have to pay for for licensing of both the old and the new, uh, why it's higher there in 26 and 27.

And so then the last column, the difference, uh, how much would we pay more uh for a new system compared to what we're paying today?

Again, 26 and 27 are higher because of uh paying for the extra licenses, uh, but then after that you can see the the extra cost uh average is about 32,000, 33,000 a year in terms of uh how much more we'll pay annually for uh a significantly more robust system than what we have today.

Uh the the new system cost uh as I mentioned there is 3.6 million uh and that's uh in addition to the the 1.9 million on the other page, but again that's payable uh you know 350,000 a year.

This presentation was for finance the other evening, so as far as next steps, I'm I'm hoping to move forward uh with the creation of the fund, the transfer, uh, as well as the appropriation, and then if those things go according to plan, uh will it be at BPW uh this Wednesday seeking approval for the contract.

Uh all in all we're hoping to go live next summer.

Happy to take any questions.

Mr.

President just um so uh you've made the uh case for the fact that um the current system is not operating as effectively as it should be, and that we do need to modernize the system and streamline the system.

Um it's a large appropriation that we're being asked for, and I guess what I want to know is what did we vet this against, what other systems did we look at, what was the cost that we looked at for those systems?

I mean, how did we bid that out?

It just seems like you know, um, and I understand the process was done, so just for the public and for the transparency to understand what other systems we looked at and why this one seems superior in your mind.

Yep, great question.

Thank you.

Uh so in this space, there's a lot of there are a lot of options for ERP providers.

Some of them are specifically geared towards government, some of them are not and are open to other companies as well.

Uh we have looked at two different products offered by by Oracle, uh, a product offered by uh uh Munis, this product, uh, and then I think there were two or three uh maybe more like homegrown type solutions, maybe not necessarily nationally known type of of ERPs.

Um for the most part the the implementation costs were were largely the same.

One thing to consider is that for a large-scale implementation like this, a uh uh the price tag is more of an indicator of how much work they're going to do versus how much they're going to expect you to do of your own implementation.

Uh everybody's gonna charge somewhere around 200 to 250 dollars an hour for their uh uh for their uh system developers basically doing this work.

Uh the recognition of the 1.9 million uh means that they're gonna be doing a significant portion of the work and not expecting us to do uh the implementation ourselves.

We did have uh uh uh a one million dollar estimate from another company, uh, but that was going to be significantly more work pushed to to city staff to do the implementation on our own.

In terms of the uh ongoing licensing, um I've I've seen everything from uh maybe about a hundred thousand less than what I'm we're going for here, which is again around 330,000 a year to to almost twice that.

The reason that I really liked work day, and I think the group did as well is we we've all been part of uh uh an ERP implementation uh in the IT department and the finance department, HR, where um that that implementation was was so poorly done that not only do you have a sys new system that nobody's been trained on to use, but it's it's not been implemented in a way that's that's all that usable.

The great thing about work day is that I think as long as you know if you know that your role is is um accounts payable supervisor, and you generally know what that that means that yes, I'm the one going in there and and and approving and and processing claims.

Workday almost requires no training whatsoever if you know what that looks like to start with.

It it is that intuitive of a system.

And for me, that was the biggest factor is having a an easy-to-use system with uh incredible reporting capabilities, and also just being able to handle uh going to this for a second.

Um we need the ability to be able to firewall off utilities from the rest of the city, the bond bank from the rest of the city, parks from the rest of the city, and uh the system is is one of the few that offers us that types of flexibility.

Zach, thank you.

Hey, so this has been introduced in first reading.

It's not gonna get unless some of the challenges it not gonna get a um rule suspension this evening.

Yep.

It's gonna go back to finance for more thorough discussion.

I think we I think as a council you know you've spent a good year getting us comfortable with the idea of this.

We've set up fund for it at your request, a designated uh non-reverting fund just to make sure you you know you track it all.

Um I think there are still questions just about what it's replacing, what it's not.

That was a good explanation, but um this will go to finance committee, yes, sir.

Um you mentioned we talked about the finance, but so there was some subscriptions you're gonna hold on to for a couple years because you're you still are active with them.

So ADP was one of them, right?

And that was one of the sizable ones, right?

Yeah, so think of it more if if we start this contract roughly July 1st of this year.

Yeah, we start paying for the the workday licenses right away, even though uh we would not be in their system actively using it until uh probably spring or or or summer of next year.

During that same period of time, we'll need to continue using ADP.

Yeah.

If we're looking at like June go live of next year, we're gonna have to pay for all of these other licenses.

And you gotta get the information somehow moved from there.

That's right.

Is there possible because you say it's two years to is it possible to break year two, or do you are you gonna pay for it and still use ADP and integrate it into or are you gonna stop using ADP but still paying for it?

Yeah.

It's it's two years just because we're starting this implementation at kind of the midpoint of our city's fiscal year.

And so I'm seeing kind of six months of duplicate licenses at the end of this year and six months of duplicate licenses the first six months of of next year.

Um we do not intend to integrate ADP.

We intend to use uh work days uh payroll solution.

Okay.

Uh so we're gonna open up before we're goes to committee in the ether here.

We'll have the open up the public hearing for it at 801.

Okay, are you coming up to speak at the public hearing?

I'm just buying time.

Uh we'll close the public hearing at 802.

This will go to finance.

Yes, Mr.

Locke.

Yeah, just some special questions so we don't have to touch them on the next ones, but the would love details on why the fund is being stood up and why that distinction based on the premise that this is going to be an ongoing expense of a department long term.

Yeah.

And how you're going to track the difference, maybe our licenses gonna stay on your budget, the two million is for implementation, and then just why use the non-reverting fund as opposed to allocating it under the contract like you would a regular.

Yep.

My goal here would be to only run the implementation costs through the implementation fund.

It's it's it's one time in nature, two years from now we won't need this fund anymore.

Umgoing licensing cost would be built into the finance department or IT department's uh budget going forward, uh, but just the one-time implementation cost.

Uh I thought it'd be better to create this new fund uh for a few reasons.

Um, I I I want to give as much transparency as I I can in terms of this is these are all the costs.

Um there's not any uh oh I've thrown some labor costs in from my department or Kevin's thrown some labor cost in from ID uh from IT department.

Uh that's that's one reason and probably the more predominant one.

Uh the second being uh just in terms of when you look at like my department's budget or IT department's budget.

Um I I don't want this to be kind of like the the pig in the Python moving through, like why was that department's budget so big that year?

This was a separate project.

This isn't reflective of kind of my department or IT department's uh operating cost.

And then kind of follow-up questions there as you're looking at the implementations of across different categories of things, or all of the expenses now under finance or are they in different departments?

And will we see decreases?

So thinking HR specifically with an implementation of all of the workflows that HR does under this scope moving forward.

Will those stay there or will we see decreases?

And I say that just as you're starting to track as this gets turned on.

Would love for us to be able to see where and how things are coming down.

That way we can make right allocations in the budget process.

Yep.

Yeah, and and it you're right, counselor.

Uh pretty much all of those costs uh to the left of uh yeah, to the uh left of the red oval there uh uh with the exception of the Superior Central Square contract and and uh the bond bank QuickBooks contract, those two are uh paid from my department, although the the QuickBooks bond bank one is is paid from the bond bank uh their balances, uh but everything else is in a different department's budget, so you wouldn't see that reduced out of their budget.

Okay.

And then you brought up kind of the quasi's as we call them in state vernacular.

Um is the plan to implement the workday solution across those separate?

Yeah, this would be a a tool that um that all departments would use uh with kind of the following exceptions or or quasi exceptions if you will.

Um parks would use it for uh for uh paying bills, but they would not use it for for payroll.

We would not be migrating them away at least at this point in time from their existing payroll solution, which I think is uh uh UKG.

Um utilities would be completely crossing over with the exception of they are keeping their uh uh Oracle-based billing system.

Um we would also continue to use uh uh CityWorks, which is used by a few different departments for like asset and uh work order tracking.

Uh but otherwise pretty much all departments would go through here.

Um one more, I guess, caveat to that.

Uh to be determined on um whether firefighters and police officers would actually enter their time into this system.

Um they don't currently enter their time into ADP, they they have a separate system called first due that they enter their time into, and then that kind of translates it, maps it over to to uh to ADP.

We would assume kind of the same type of uh thing going forward.

They would have their more complicated technology for their uh complicated schedules that would feed into our payroll system.

Is there anything that derails it from a two-year implementation implementation?

Nobody wants to have a whole bunch of non-reporting funds on the books.

Can we put something in the ordinance that it would need council approval not to continue or to continue beyond two years?

What's in there right now is uh at the end of uh and I cannot remember if it's 27 or 28.

I have basically any money left in there goes back to the general fund.

Um so kind of symbolically ending it, but but uh I would be fine with more aggressive sunsetting language.

Okay.

Just one more because I won't be at finance, and I might watch it, but only if they ask questions that I wanted to ask.

Um the we talked about special financing back when this came up the first time and different opportunities to kind of create financial mechanisms to help us.

Obviously, we just refunded a bond, so premise of that.

Um wondering how that exploration went and just talked about potentially um uh financing this over uh some term, whether that be uh a a uh a three year, five year, or maybe even a ten year, given that uh we're doing a 10 year on the license.

Um ultimately uh you know, as I look at uh trying to write the the the budget for next year and and looking ahead as well.

We have cash on hand.

It's it's but it's declining revenues that we're we're facing, and so for me it became more of a um I'd rather I'd rather use the cash that we have rather than increase our operating uh cost by two or three hundred thousand more a year to also cover the the implementation.

And so uh what I've been looking at is uh we we started this year with um almost 14 and a half million in the general fund, and that is uh that's that's a little more than twice what our our stated goal of having five percent of the budget in there uh that that five percent number would be uh uh less than seven and a half million, like seven point two.

And so uh potentially we could appropriate this and and still have well above that cap in the general fund.

Was that um was there a discussion in our ratings call related to cash balances?

And did that with that I mean that yeah, they they they're they're always curious about kind of what our balances are and what our revenue projections but this wouldn't impact any anything discussed with the refunding.

Correct.

Okay, thank you.

All right.

Very thorough, Zach.

Thank you.

On to new business resolution CC-06-15-26-01.

Resolution of the Common Council of the City of Carmel, Indiana approving a transfer of funds between the grant fund 900 and the ambulance capital fund 102.

Counselor Austin.

Move to introduce.

Second, second.

This transfer is 24,997 from the grant fund 900 to the ambulance capital fund 102.

Thank you.

If nobody is sorry, yeah, but you you've already approved the uh appropriation, so this is the corresponding transfer.

Action.

So now there's cash behind it.

Since we can pass on first reading, I would make a motion to approve.

Second.

Are we still?

Oh, it's working now.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Uh B resolution C C06-15-2602 resolution common count.

Council of the City of Carmel, Indiana appropriating the transfer of funds between Grant Fund 900 and MVH fund.

Sponsors Austin Joshua Minar, just like the last one.

Move to introduce second.

Uh we've discussed the reason behind this is the actual moving the money.

Move to approve.

Second.

First reading of ordinance.

D-2829-26 in order to the common council of the city of Carmel, Indiana amending Article 4, Section 2-132 of the Carmel City Code sponsor Councilor Austin.

This amends Article 4, Section 2131 of the Carmel Code to establish the non-reverting ERP implementation fund 928.

Well, this is connect to the others.

Sure.

I guess it doesn't matter.

Is there any delay?

If it comes out of committee, there's no this one won't cause any additional delay.

This will tag along with its buddy and finance.

Moved introduce.

Second.

Okay.

Yeah, it's in committee.

First reading of Ordinance D 28230-26 and ordinance of the Common Council of the City of Carmel, Indiana, adding Article 4, Section 2-156 of the Carmel City Code, sponsorers Taylor and Snyder.

Synopsis this adds Article 4, Section 2-156 of the Carmel City Code to establish the non-reverting capital projects fund 931.

This can this creates a fund.

Is anybody have any issue with acting on this tonight?

Nope.

Okay.

We've just suspended the rules and enter into action.

Second.

Move to approve.

Second.

Resolution.

CC-06-15-26-04.

Resolution of the Common Council of the City of Carmel Indiana amending resolution.

CC 11-17-25-03, previously adopted by the council.

Sponsor Councilor Ayers.

Move to introduce.

Yep.

Oh, sorry.

Okay.

This synopsis or this resolution amends the prior council resolution amending and approving the US 31 sub-area plan.

Adrian, on the what you sent out, it had like three innocuous areas of just some one dropped sentence and some highlighted and a color change.

I mean you can go into it, but I wanted to make sure I caught everything.

Yes.

And I want to express on behalf of the Carmel Plan Commission that even though this comes to you with a disapproval, I'm reporting the nicest disapproval in the history of disapprovals.

This was simply these were clarification edits that the plan commission was suggesting to make the document as clear as possible.

Well, unless someone wants to hit me with this gavel, it's not going back to committee.

Go ahead, Ryan.

Sure.

So in discussions and looking at the reviews from Plan Commission watching the testimony, really there are two buckets here.

One is absolutely in line with the intent and the discussions we had at council and at the land use.

So that does clarify how that transition zone will work.

If we want to look at that on screen, we can, but in the final draft, we this is one that we muted so that it would get the intent of uh looking really cool for things we wanted to develop, but also still having the protection.

So that crossed out hashed line on the border, if you look at that section near where it says Roar Road under the green of the Monon Trail, that is the transition area.

Um and you if you follow that along the outside, you'll see that it exists or doesn't exist depending on whether or not there is residential communities that are adjacent to the plan map.

Um and that is skinnier or not skinnier, depending on whether that 300 feet is closer to or further from those houses.

And again, that was an intentional ad after the conversations to ensure that we are protecting the residential neighborhood and the transitions to them.

So again, I'm Ponderview comfortable with that.

The second amendment is on the slide uh page nine, which is on the existing PUDs.

Um, and just for clarification for everybody, this went through a couple iterations.

Um it started it as priority development areas, then we shifted it to existing PUDs, and then at the end we kept existing PUDs and added priority development areas back in.

And the reason we did that is that for specific existing PUDs, the intent of the language is to prohibit and or signal to prohibit, because again, this is a plan and is not operational on its own.

Uh, that we as a council and as a planning department and as a community do not want there to be amendments to that plan that lessen the transition between the residential and the protection of the neighborhoods next door.

Um so the thing that plan commission brought up was that there, because we're talking about PUDs, PUDs can be amended, and the way that they read it, it appeared that we were talking about not amending, which is a good reading on their part.

Um, but what we missed was the fact that we don't want to see amendments that do not strengthen that for the existing PUDs.

The reason I bring up the priority development sites is because we added the priority development site back in so that we could use this plan to signal where we as a council in a city are looking to develop, which can include existing PUDs, which then overrides the ability to amend those existing PUDs to fit the nature of the defined plan process in those.

So there are certain PUDs that stay existing PUDs, which we would like to see not amended and or strengthened as they are next to residential communities and have good protections, and then those that we are comfortable with the amendment, like the ones on the southern border to make them fit, are now priority development sites.

So the recommended addition is to throw out the recommend recommendations from plan commission and to amend that specific paragraph to say any future amendments to existing PUDs adjacent to existing residentially zoned areas and those that include residential components should adhere to or strengthen those two words added, the PUD's ordinances, original regulations, or if applicable, UDO standards and requirements related to the preservation and quality of life in place of those residential areas, including all transition landscaping setbacks, height, lighting, noise, and other requirements.

So with all of that, I would move to amend the plan with the paragraph I just read in place of the paragraph that was recommended to be edited, and then with the addition of the phrase measured from the adjacent residential property line on page 23 of the transition area description.

It's been moved.

Second.

Further discussion?

What's the process?

This is the uh final back and forth with the between the planning commission and the council.

So whatever your um your action is tonight will be the final action.

In terms of making the proposed change, um it will be simply an edit to exhibit A, which will be attached to the resolution that is introduced.

And we will get that to Jessica as soon as possible.

It's a simple simple edit.

Yes, sir.

Um I agree with getting more technical about the distance specifically from the property line.

I personally accept that.

Um I reject the strive to comply language, and personally I would rather keep the language that was included in here in there adhere to the PUD ordinances original regulations, or if Apple UDO standards and requirements without a change.

And personally, I I think the last sentence set forth in the PUD are applicable to the UDO standards and requirements is an acceptable addition to me.

Um I haven't I've just seen this and vetting what we went through previously, a lot of back and forth with this.

That's my position.

And can I clarify too for you on that?

As I was redrafting this back to fit, um that clause that moved to the end moved from the center when they made the edit to the top.

And I agree fully rejecting the should strive language is paramount, and that was intended.

So it really goes back to exactly how it was that set forth in the PUD moves back into the center to the if applicable UDO standards and requirements related to the preservation, which is how it was originally drafted.

And the key is that by adding the word or strengthen, we're clarifying that if there is an amendment to an existing PUD, we either don't want it to change or we want it to strengthen the residential.

And in reality, what we're talking about here, um if you look at the PUD map specifically, there's a specific PUD that is adjacent to all of the homes in the spring mill corridor.

Um that PUD as it was passed and negotiated by the people and the council and the city when it went through, included a specific transition area and is broken into two separate UDO requirements or PUD requirements under the UDO.

Half of it is residential, and that half once the intent was to help preserve that if that PUD is transferred or sold to another developer to do something else, that the intent of the city would be to say, hey, we don't want you to amend that to change this premise because it was something that was hard fought for back in the 2006-7 era when those were moving through.

So the clarification, again, back to plan commission's request.

They read it and said, wait a second, PUDs can be amended.

This makes it sound like they cannot be when the entire intent is exactly what you just said, which is to preserve those existing.

I mean, city ordinance and under any state law allows PUDs to amend it.

I don't think we need to clarify in a planning document that that's possible.

That's that's a process.

Anybody could put forth an amended uh uh petitioner could put forth an amended PUD to amend the PUD or in the city.

Um I'm a little frustrated.

Um all the work we've done in this has been brought back.

I I'm against I mean, if we're gonna go that route, we might as well just call that specific PUD out that we're not interested in amending that one at all.

But um this is a guidance document for planning purposes.

Um again, I I still feel that um accepting the transition area distance being more specific and leaving the um languages as stated before uh and adding the very last sentence, I guess.

All right.

Because there's there's a we're just gonna stay at the dais.

Uh we need to get whatever is agreed upon written so that we have a we have a motion and a second, and my request is we vote that down.

There's no time limit for us to decide this, right?

No.

Okay.

I guess I don't know the process to withdraw.

Who does that?

The second, the person who made the motion and the person who seconded and have to agree to withdraw their motion.

Correct, sir.

I don't know what we're doing.

It was it was Tony and Joshi.

It was it was me that made it.

And then Dr.

Joshi second it.

Yeah.

Well, and uh, can I let me take an attempt here?

Well, I just we have to see it in writing.

It's up there right now.

Well, not okay.

Yeah, if you want to see it, so like let me just describe it again and then we'll go through.

Yeah.

So the last clause is in the top, which is how we worked to draft it.

That top paragraph is precisely all of the effort and energy that went in with the addition of two words or strengthen.

I'm looking at the red line.

The red line is what came back from Plan Commission, which I just like you rejected summarily for missing the intent of what we all talked about.

So the red line is out completely, and I rejected all of those additions and then added or strengthened, which is just the only new change to the old language, because that previous sentence on the adhering to the PUD and the UDO exists, that's what they redlined to delete it to talk about striving.

Yeah.

So it goes back in at the top, and it's not needed to be included again at the bottom because it's in the middle of the paragraph, which, and I'm I'm saying that if if we want to take another meeting and read it, we can, but I the goal was to move it back to how it was, how we fought about it.

How it was was what was stricken adhere to the PUD ordinances original regulations or if applicable UDO standards and requirements.

That's yeah, the original writing that was original what we approved in council and what I'm stating is is that what that's what I'd like to see remain as written and approved by council.

Yeah, and it's so what I recommended today is that that top it stays there, all of that top process stays.

So it says should adhere to or strengthen the PUD's ordinance original regulations or applicable to the UDO standards and requirements.

So we're down to two words, we have a disagreement on two words or strengthen.

I I I just we've we have worked on this for over a well oh well over a year, you know, and I I'm very proud of it.

I just want so I want to make sure it'd really be nice to have unanimous support for this.

So I that's what if you did I'm gonna say if there was a vote tonight, I'd support it um with Ryan's amendments.

My my reason being, I know we've had a lot of discussion on this.

If you go back, the map was just a little bit bigger than what we thought, so there was areas in there that needed to be addressed.

If they were going to be left in the map, then the language of the counselor lock is provided to help protect those areas is absolutely what needs to be in there if you have that larger map.

To leave those areas in the map and then weaken the language to you know end up with PUDs that we don't want is not the direction we would have taken a maybe a different route there.

So with the map laid out the way it is, I feel like that's the way that we need to go with the language.

When I I just for the record too, I I think Counselor Taylor, we're in exact full agreement that the language that I would need to be in there for my purposes to protect all the work we put in for the constituents is that should adhere to, and then the only addition would be or strengthen the PUD ordinance's original regulations, which was what they deleted and shifted to should strive to comply.

And then because they shifted that, then they flipped to the bottom of their paragraph to add that paragraph to it.

So they re-added the language about the PUD ordinance or the UDO.

If you scroll down one line so we can see the bottom of the edit.

So because they deleted it in the middle, they added the should strive to comply, and then they added the set forth in the PD or the UDO from where they deleted it to the bottom.

But by not deleting it and uh rejecting their change for should strive, that clause stays in it as the operative clause at the top, and it I think it meets your own.

So the addition amendment to it is just or strengthened.

Correct, yeah.

So what we did was we added just or strengthen to again kind of clarify that if there is an amendment to a PUD, which is statutorily okay, the planning of what how we're gonna deal with the existing PUDs that are not priority developments, which are really how we rejected them from being included in that priority development process, is that those amendments should adhere to and or strengthen, which gives us then kind of the clarity of what our intent is with those specific PUDs.

So I I say that I am over-explaining, but I think it's because we're reading two paragraphs in front of everybody and we agree.

Yeah, you uh restate it.

Restate um so you're adding or strengthen only to the our original verbiage that was a uh was approved, and excepting the 300 feet from the property line, which is what they recommended.

Precisely, yeah.

Measured from the adjacent residential property line.

I have a question for you, Sergey.

Well, it's people are thinking.

Um just me being me.

And the loving words.

I talk a lot, I write a lot.

I I like the or strengthen.

My question is, just from an objective legal standpoint of reading it.

Residential components should adhere.

Period.

If it ended there.

If it ended there, it's period.

If it's or strengthen, are we saying that if they went through the PUD amendment process, we would not they couldn't even bring something that doesn't strengthen.

And I and I guess I'm trying to understand how you can legally define strength or weakness on some things.

Yeah, it's it could be it again.

This is a guiding document for the planning purposes.

So it is written for a certain number of years for 10 years plus some of the areas for the city additions to that.

So if the circumstances within those 10 years change, if a development patterns will change, it's can be the PUDs can be amended to lessen certain requirements.

But this is it would be the will of this council as it sits today, considering the development patterns that are known today and what we predict them to be for the next whatever number of years until the amendment to be as a guidance to yourselves and future councils about the intent of this document.

So that's what it does.

It's legislative intent essentially.

To President Snyder's question, define your interpretation of or strengthen it uh if I were to look at it, if I were to interpret residential uh sorry, uh legislative intent in this particular substance, I would think that any amendment to PUD would either adhere to a PUD uh provisions but protect residential areas or strengthen those provisions but protect residential areas.

And I think within within the area uh of the transition zone.

Mr.

President Mayor, yes, thank you.

Thank you, Adam, for yielding.

Uh counselor awesome.

Um, you know, I think when I look at this document and and as it's written, um totally get it, watch the plan commission meeting, have been involved in this since the very beginning.

It's been here for quite a while.

You can sense my frustration.

And um when I look at this, I realize this is a guide as Sergei said, this is a guiding document.

This is not I mean, ten years from now, when we're all gone, or some of us are still here, uh another city council can re-amend this document again, they could amend it again, they could write ordinances that actually are the law and they can't build that way.

Um but the bottom line is it's a PUD, a PUD can be amended.

A PUD can follow this guideline if they want to.

If they don't want to follow it, then that's when the neighbors will come out and petition, and then the public will be there.

So when I look at this, I look at it as I think we've beaten this thing to death.

Yeah, and I think we need to uh move on it tonight.

I need a reminder of where our what we just we we accepted out or excuse me, we've we've moved and seconded the full body of counselor locks amendment.

Correct.

You guys want to vote on that?

Call a question.

Yes, we have the let's vote.

We have a we have a motion and we have a second.

Thank you.

Thank you to DOCS, thank you to everybody that touched this document, which is every single person up here.

Are we and plan and plan commission?

Now, we've moved we have amended it.

We need to want to hold it or you want to vote.

We're let's vote.

Move to approve.

Second, yeah.

Huge thanks, uh planning department and legal and plan commission.

What are we on?

We're on uh add-on agendas.

Oh add-ons.

There are none.

Other business, counselor Taylor.

Item A, we have property abatements compliant with statement of benefits.

Um we reviewed um the dashboards and data provided um as we're required to handling for these uh four abatements for they are alliance for corpor uh cooperative energy services power marking LLC, otherwise known as ACES, mid-continent independent system operator inc, otherwise known as MISO, Schlage Lock Company LLC, ZP Investments LLC, and Zotech Partners LLC, all were all were presented in in compliance, and um we the specific motion, sir gay, is just to um acknowledge, or are we actually in approving re uh keeping these abatements in place?

All were all were presented in in compliance, and we the specific motion, Sir Gay, is just to acknowledge, or are we actually in approving re uh keeping these abatements in place?

It's it's the approval.

It is of an approval.

I have a question.

Then are they independent all at once?

And is Schlage Lock Company goes by different numbers?

Should we or different name?

Do we acknowledge that as well?

I mean it's or does it it's how they filled out the form?

Yeah.

And what they submitted.

What they submitted to us.

Okay.

Was it one by one or all at once?

I'm sorry.

Move for approval to continue these abatements.

Fantastic.

Thank you for reviewing those.

Any announcements?

Councillor Snayer.

What is I did want to uh notate just for the public the non emergency number for Carmel PD is 3175712580.

Thank you.

Hang on, I'm putting it in my phone.

Yeah.

Mr.

President.

Yes, ma'am.

I just want to uh set give an announcement as well.

The housing commission has done its final educational piece with the site selections, and we will be discussing all of that information at our next meeting, which is July 9th at 9 a.m.

in city council chambers.

Everyone is welcome.

Thank you.

Thank you, Councilman Art anything else.