Good evening, ladies and gentlemen.

Welcome to a regularly scheduled meeting of the zona commission of the city of Damry January 13th 2026 at 6 o'clock special time tonight.

Let the record show we're going to begin with a roll call at 6 11.

Commissioner Bennett is absent.

Mr.

Botello.

Present.

Commissioner Fuchs.

Commissioner Fuchs, if you would just unmute and just uh say you're present, please.

I'm sorry.

Present.

There you go.

Great.

Uh Commissioner Hall.

Present.

Commissioner James is absent.

Commissioner Jowdy.

Here.

Commissioner O'Neal.

Yeah.

Commissioner Trata.

Yeah.

Commissioner Nee Jane Alternate is absent.

Commissioner Novas.

Yeah.

Commissioner O'Laughlin.

Here.

And I'm Chairman Haddad.

One, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine.

One, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine.

It works.

Commissioner members, the next regular meeting is scheduled for January 27, 2026.

And that is the start time of seven o'clock.

They're all start times at seven.

Tonight was special because of the training.

If you would all please stand.

If anyone has any flags, you're welcome to put it in front of your camera and Pledge of Allegiance.

I pledge allegiance.

One nation under God.

Oh.

Thank you.

So other under other matters.

We have a workshop session.

And I am going to have other matters.

We'll read into it again just before we adjourn in case anyone has anything to talk about besides this.

Number one, the workshop session with corporation council regarding zoning commission procedures and statutory requirements.

Uh for a workshop session.

It's uh I've heard it a million times and still always learn something.

It's very, very critical, very useful.

I will apologize in advance to the new commission members.

Sometimes this can be overwhelming.

Uh sometimes this doesn't make sense for somebody that's been on for a little while that would go through this workshop session.

It falls and falls into place a little bit more than it would tonight.

Uh, but you do have copies of it to always uh be able to um reference.

Uh, but it's very, very helpful.

Um, and it's very, very well done by corporation counsel, which we appreciate.

Um, so with that, I'll turn it over to attorney Dan Casigrani and attorney Robin Edwards.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Uh uh Attorney Edwards and I, as we have done in the past, uh, we're gonna divide our remarks.

Rob Robin will start first and basically take you through what we call the underlying principles of zoning as a way of, especially for the new members, understanding what your charge are, what your authority and what your responsibility is.

I will then cover um more administrative matters like hearings, conduct of meetings, site site walks, etc.

We are gonna try to limit this to an hour, uh, and you'll see that we'll we'll skip over some of the slides, at least I plan on doing it, um, because it's something you could just read on your own.

Uh we also ask, because I know you have other matters that you uh hold your questions uh until the end of the presentation, and we hope to be done by 710 or so.

Sounds good.

Thank you, Attorney Cassagrani.

Robin.

Attorney Edwards, you're on mute.

And also let me ask the commission members for everyone else to actually mute their mics during this presentation.

Good evening, members of the commission.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

As Dan said, I will take you through the first part of the outline and then he'll pick up in the second half.

Um, I think you'll find this very valuable, and we do hit a lot of information.

Um, hope it's not too overwhelming, but our door is always open.

Um these remarks are really a quick outline to the applicable requirements of the statutes and the zoning regulations and governing court decisions.

It's not intended as a substitute for direct review of these authorities.

And as I said, you certainly can consult with us if if you have any questions.

So having said that, um, Joanne, are you gonna would you be able to share the outline for members of the commission?

Thank you.

You're welcome.

And also one thing we're going to be adding tonight.

I'll mention when Joanne's pulling this up, is Walid, uh, Director Waleed has asked us to speak about a few of the basic concepts of concepts and principles of Robert's rules of order.

I'm going to go through some basic comments as well.

We could do a whole session on Robert's rules.

Um, and we don't have time to do that, certainly, but uh I will give Joanne a copy of my remarks tomorrow and she can share them with you.

Ali, can you do the sharing?

Excuse me, Robin, I can't get it to work.

I don't know what I'm doing wrong.

Umid, can you do it?

Let's see.

Give me a minute to you as well.

Okay.

I think I just have to put it there, but I don't have it there, so I've got to move it.

Okay.

Yeah, I don't have it to share either.

Um we're not doing very well with the technicalities tonight, are we?

No.

Wally'll get it.

He's Mr.

Share, he knows how to do it.

He will skip going with him.

I'm going to, I'm just going to say that when you're pulling up that that up, Wally, for the members, I'll I'll start talking.

So basically, um, zoning is a creature of statute.

Uh, if you look at section um statute 8-1 of the Connecticut General Statutes, that's where authorities, municipalities are authorized to create zoning commissions.

And in DAMBRY, we've created our zoning commission through our charter.

It's in section two of our charter.

And the function of the zoning commission is to act in the public's interest in zoning the municipality and administering the zoning regulations.

You have nine members on your commission with three alternates.

You need a quorum of five to conduct business.

And as such, as members of the commission, your meetings are conducted in accordance with Robert's rules of order, except where they're it at variance with the bylaws.

And that is noted in section 6-1 of your bylaws, and you're governed by the most current version of Robert's rules, which is the newly revised 12th edition, which was released in September of 2020.

If if you are interested in that, you're certainly welcome to pick up a copy of it.

But that your chair is excellent at running meetings and following the rules.

So if you if you follow his lead, you you should be in good shape.

And it's also kind of interesting to me, anyway.

Robert's rules actually has a website, and it's Robert's rules.com.

If you find yourself interested in that, and they do have a section of frequently asked questions, which sometimes may answer a question that you might have.

So feel free to check that reference as well.

And generally, why do we have Robert's rules?

The general principles of Robert's rules are to provide a manner of courtesy and decorum for all members to maintain an orderly meeting to make sure that all sides are heard.

And then ultimately, when a decision is reached, the decision rests with the majority.

You vote, majority vote prevails.

Everyone on the commission has a right to speak and be heard.

The chair is impartial.

He presides fairly without bias.

And as I said, all members have the right to participate in the discussion if they wish.

And generally, um, it's a it's a good idea for the chair to go and let everyone speak before he goes around the second time for other members to speak, just to give everyone an opportunity to speak.

And I know he does that having watched him for many in action for many years.

Um just as a general matter, only one item can be on the table at a time.

So you focus on a single topic.

I see Waleed's pulling up the outline, but this is is good anyway because you don't have these comments.

Um you follow the same basic structure for an agenda at every meeting.

You'll see that um Joanne sends out your agenda, and generally you'll see it's starts of the roll call and acceptance of minutes, then move to the public hearing, uh new ones, continuation of public hearings, then you'll turn to old business for discussion and possible action, new business, and then adjournment, generally with some other items such as correspondences and things of that nature, interspersed at different places on the agenda.

Again, an orderly fashion within which to proceed.

And probably in terms of Robert's rules, the way they will be applied the most is through the motion process.

And a motion is simply made generally under a topic under discussion.

Uh someone might start out the discussion with I move to approve the application that's before us, for example.

After being recognized by the chair, any member can introduce a motion when no other motion is on the table.

We all know a motion requires a second to be considered.

If there is no second, then the matter is not considered, and each motion ultimately is disposed of.

It's either passed, it's defeated, it's tabled, it's postponed, various things can transpire.

And you'll see in the outline or of my comments that Joanne will give you tomorrow.

I've just kind of outline what happens.

The member addresses the chair, chair, Mr.

Hadad recognizes a member.

The member makes the motion.

As I said, it's seconded.

The chair may then state the motion.

This is what we have before us.

Uh, so the group uh can hear it, and then there's a debate.

People speak for the motion, or they might speak against it.

Um everyone is entitled to a turn.

Um, and the chair may decide to go around and provide a second turn as well.

And then there is a vote.

The chair calls for a vote.

It can be a voice vote.

Everyone in favor, raise your hands and say aye, or sometimes a roll call vote is called for.

And lastly, the chair will announce the results.

There are many motions.

Some of the common motions are what we call a main motion that introduces a business.

There can be a motion to amend the motion on the table again, which needs a second before it continues on.

There can be a motion to table, which postpones the discussion.

Uh member could ask for a point of order, which would correct a rule violation, potentially.

It's it's um asking generally for a clarification, or it could be uh called a point of information, which requests clarification, and lastly, a motion to adjourn, um, ends the meeting.

Some general rules of debate, just to be cognizant of um.

Everyone should have a chance to speak um before members are called on again.

All remarks you'll notice are always addressed through the chair.

Members do not speak directly to each other.

They go through Mr.

Hadad, your chair, um, for different items to be addressed.

Debate, remember, addresses issues, not personalities.

And um members may not disrupt the assembly.

It has to be carried out in an orderly fashion.

Uh, for example, at your meeting, sometimes you may have members of the public who wish to speak.

There's a place and time where they speak, and they can't jump up in the middle of the meeting and ask to be recognized.

So everything proceeds in an orderly fashion, which helps uh because everyone knows what's expected and what the rules are.

So that's uh just a brief summary of Robert's rules.

Again, I will give Joanne the outline tomorrow.

She'll pass it on to you.

And uh, if you have any questions, you can startly uh start with uh Waleed and um let us know if you have any specific questions.

Now I will head back to the outline.

If you could go to the next slide, Joanne, that would be great.

Thank you.

In the zoning commission has two functions, legislative functions and administrative functions.

It functions in two fashions.

Uh, the regulations can be amended or modified whenever time and experience reasonably indicate the need for a revision.

The zoning commission has a broad discretion over the contents of its regulations.

The regulations must promote the public welfare, and uh they must be um done in a reasonable manner.

And the zoning commission either amends the regs or the map in its legislative function, in its administrative function, it considers special permits.

The the commission hears and decides special permit applications for restaurants, liquor stores, cafes, taverns, grocery stores, package stores, breweries, distilleries, and brew hubs to the extent the sale of alcoholic beverages is involved.

What's sort of interesting, which we like to cover, I think is kind of just interesting is the constitutional origins of zoning.

How did zoning come about and why do we have it?

I think it makes it interesting for you to know that.

But um, I'll kind of go quickly through this, not take up too much time, but uh please please read it.

It is interesting.

Zoning came about in the United States in the late 1800s to early 1900s.

Um with growth in numbers and concentrations of the urban population, things came that we deal with today.

Congestion, traffic, that type of thing.

There were incompatible uses, industrial use is mixed, and commercial uses mixed with residential uses and vice versa.

So the original zoning ordinances were actually nuisance ordinances, and they gradually involved into plans for overall development of the municipality in furtherance of the public interest, which is really what you're still looking at today.

Um till about 1947.

You may have heard of the Supreme Court case, which is called the Village of Euclid versus a U.S.

Supreme Court, and that basically upheld the rights of towns and cities to adopt regulations, dividing a municipality to municipality into several districts and segregating the districts, for example, into residential, business, and industrial uses, all apart from each other, and hence you had the concept of what's known as Euclidean zoning, uh, which is still practiced today, basically, and zoning was upheld as a legitimate police power, enabling the commission to act in the interest of the public health safety and welfare.

It was known as the concept of geometric mapping of the districts on a zoning map.

And you can see uh some of the legislative roots in Connecticut in uh Connecticut General Statutes, Section 8 2, and I encourage all of you to read that because really that's the basis of your powers that sets forth the things you can and you cannot do.

Um, it's it's very important.

We're happy to get you a copy of it if if you don't have it or you don't have access to it, or I'm sure Joanne can get that to you.

There's 16069 towns in Connecticut, every town has its own regulations, they're not uniform throughout the state, and the key language in section 8-2 reminds us of the overriding planning purposes of the zoning regulations.

As I said, it's a source of police power and tells you what you can and cannot do.

And as time has evolved, zoning has become more complicated.

Um, there's complex parcels of land that remain left to be developed, and um it's sometimes it's very challenging.

The major provisions um uh I can quickly highlight for you, but the really the overall goal of zoning is to establish a plan that works for the community.

Um the regulations that are applied should be uniform throughout the district, the regulations and standards should protect the public health safety and welfare, convenience and property values, uh, the zoning regulations are um to be made in accordance with the comprehensive plan.

You'll hear that, and that's really a way of saying it's the zoning scheme, it's the regulations and the map.

The core principles of zoning, um really we have just a few highlighted here.

I just mentioned some of them that are in 8-2, but number one, the regulations have to be uniform, they have to be uniform as to each class and type of use.

Contract zoning is generally not allowed, meaning conditions on zone changes are generally not allowed.

The police power to zone is not unlimited.

The regulations have to reasonably relate to the police power purposes set forth in section 8-2.

Otherwise, it will be to be declared to be a taking if they're so restrictive that they prevent all reasonable use of the property.

In other words, the police power allows legislation because uncontrolled uses would be harmful to the public interest, but they can't go so far to deprive the property owner of all of their reasonable use of the property.

Regulations cannot be vague.

They will be declared unconstitutional if they're uncertain or vague.

They have to provide a sufficient standard for enforcement.

A few years ago, we had a um a case that involved how you measure the separation distance for liquor stores.

And the challenge was that the standard was too vague.

So there's always an argument to be made, but they should be able to be interpreted by people and applied.

The zoning regulations do limit property rights, therefore they're narrowly construed in favor of the property owner.

Zoning is in derogation of common law, therefore, as I said, they are construed in favor of the property owner.

Our zoning regulations are permissive, which means that which is not expressly allowed is prohibited.

We do have a comprehensive plan, and that's really a simple way to say if you adopt a regulation or zone change, it must be part of the comprehensive plan.

So, what is the relationship of zoning and planning to the plan of conservation and development?

Good planning is critical to good zoning.

A planning commission, as you know, adopts a plan of conservation and development.

That's pursuant to uh section 8 23 of the Connecticut General Statutes.

That's a plan that's drafted by staff, and it provides for the overall development of the city.

It's basically a plan that says what types of uses go where.

What is the most desirable area of the city for density in various districts of the city, what area should be conserved, what are the goals for the physical and economic development of the city?

So when the zoning regulations are amended, the zoning commission, as you know, has to make a finding that the amendment is consistent with a plan of conservation and development.

However, the plan of conservation and development is a recommendation, but the zoning commission still has to consider it as I just mentioned.

The uses allowed in a zoning district must be compatible with the stated purposes of the district as found in the regulations and the POCD.

If that does not transpire, the district becomes a mishmash of incompatible uses, destroying the integrity of the zone, reducing property values, and destroying the property owner's reasonable expectation.

In other words, bad zoning undermines the plan for the community and its health safety and welfare goals.

Both the zoning commission and the planning commission have to consider the POCD, make express findings on it when they are considering changes in the regulations or the zoning boundaries.

Some regul statutory and regulation references for you to look at if you wish when you're reviewing the outline.

A principle to remember is that zoning is not nuisance, nuisance abatement.

A nuisance is a use of a property which is offensive and unreasonable, but zoning is not simply an abatement of an offensive or unreasonable use.

It has to be based on an overall plan that's in the best interest of the community.

Just because the proposed use is a nuisance, it does not mean that is not a nuisance.

I'm sorry, it does not mean it is appropriate for a particular zone.

For example, a small office building may not be a nuisance to a surrounding residential neighborhood, but it may be inconsistent with the city's overall plan of development.

Another point to remember is that the highest and best use does not control zoning decisions.

That's actually an appraisal concept.

The highest and best use of a particular piece of property is not a controlling purpose of zoning, nor is the maximum possible enrichment of any particular landowner.

The purpose of zoning is to control the use of the land to promote the public interest.

Again, look at the interest of the community as a whole.

It can be described as singling out for special treatment, a lot or a small area of land in a way that does not further up further the comprehensive plan.

To survive a spot zoning challenge, the change of zone must be in accord with a comprehensive plan and reasonably relate to the police power purposes set forth in Connecticut General Statute Section 8-2.

There are two elements that courts look at when they're considering whether something is illegal as spot zoning.

Does a change of zone affect only a small area of land?

And is the change out of harmony with a comprehensive plan?

Now there is what we uh reference as the modern approach to spot zoning, and that is simply that a court will not strike down a zone change, which involves a small parcel, even while the change does not apply to other lands in a particular zoning district, as long as the zoning commission makes a determination, the change furthers the comprehensive plan, i.e.

that it does further the public interest.

So that's a bit of a twist on that.

Considerations for you to think about when amending the regulations or the map.

Amendments to the regulations to allow use in a specific zone are effective, not only as to the applicant's contemplated use of its property, but as to all properties located in the zone.

In exercising its legislative judgment, the commission can and should consider the amendment's effect on all properties in the city located in the applicable zoning district.

A conceptual site plan submitted by an applicant with its zone change application does not limit the use of the property if the change is granted.

The commission must consider the maximum development potential on the site if the change is granted.

Voting requirements for the commission.

A majority vote of the entire commission is required.

Five votes.

Um, to think about are in section 10I3.

Again, look at the consistency with a plan of conservation and development.

Look at the plan, read the appropriate sections, uh, then look at the general criteria set forth in the regulation, and any specific criteria as to the application before you.

What is a site plan?

It's a detailed engineering drawing into our map showing the proposed use on a specific site, including all information required by the regulations.

Except a one to three family dwellings.

A site plan can be approved, modified, or denied.

Only if it fails to comply with a regulation set forth in the zoning or inland and wetland regulations.

And the decision has to be based on specific criteria already set forth in the regulations.

At this point, um attorney Casagrini will take over.

Speaking more to the administrative process and the decision making process.

Thank you.

Thank you, attorney Edwards.

Oh, you're welcome, Mr.

Chairman.

Attorney Cassagrandy.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Thanks, Robin.

Can everybody hear me okay?

Yes, I got you.

Okay.

Thank you.

So we're now on to, I don't know if you can see the page numbers, but it's page 15 of the presentation.

Uh special permits and special exceptions.

What what are they?

Um and who issues them.

Uh special permits and special exceptions are really terms that are used interchangeably in Connecticut.

They really mean the same thing.

Some towns call them special exceptions, some count towns call them special permits.

In Danbury, what we've done is the zoning commission is charged with issuing special permits, which as Robin pointed out is for restaurants, breweries, cafes, or anything that involves uh alcohol use.

That's within the zoning commission's purview.

The planning commission, on the other hand, issues special exceptions, which are also provided for in each of the zones uh in the regulations.

You'll see that uses are divided for uses permitted as of right, which means you do not need a special permit or a special exception, and uses that require special permits and exceptions and the conditions that the commission uh may impose in in deciding whether to grant um the permit.

So what's the difference between a use permitted as of right and a special permit in the commission's sake?

A use permitted as of right is one for which the commission, when you would amended your regs or adopted the regulations, you've already made a determination in passing the regulation that a particular use is appropriate in a particular area.

So that all someone needs to do uh is in general, submit a site plan to the planning and zoning department, which is charged with the administrative review of site plans when site plans are the only thing before uh the commission.

A special permit, however, um requires the commission to determine whether the specific use is compatible in the zoning district at issue, and the existing uses permitted in that zone as of right.

Um very quickly, uh you may hear reference uh in presentations to public act 21-29, which was enacted in 2021, and it said that um it amended the general statutes to say that zoning regulations should not be applied to deny any land use application on the basis of a district's character, unless the character is expressly articulated in such regulations by clear and explicit physical standards.

Why did they do that?

Because there was testimony at the legislature that um some commissions were using the word character, uh, which is one of the considerations that you can look at when you're deciding a special permit application.

Some commissions were using it as a pretext to allow for discriminatory zoning or zoning enforcement.

Uh in um we've amended our regs to attract that language, but you still continue when you're considering a uh a special permit, you still have discretion, not unlimited discretion, but a reasonable discretion in deciding a special permit application to consider things like historic preservation, environmental impact, density, location, and suitability of use.

So that this the statute, it's it's kind of been um used as a red herring by some applicants' attorneys that say, oh, you can't look at the character uh of the uh the neighborhood anymore.

I I've litigated that issue successfully, and and basically the courts say that this statute doesn't take away the general powers of the uh and discretion of the commission to determine suitability of the proposed use.

A basic principle of special permits is that they may be they they may be generally compatible with permitted uses in the district, like a church in a residential zone.

But because of their nature, traffic, density, et cetera, their particular location and operation in the particular neighborhood has to be scrutinized in deciding whether to issue a special permit due to various considerations, all of them set forth in the regs, including topography, traffic congestion, neighboring uses, et cetera.

Um the commission looks at that site plan with the guidance of the planning department.

And the the critical thing takeaway here is that even if you as a commission were to look at a special permit and it checked all the boxes about yes, it's compatible, uh, it's not going to be uh uh overly dense, it's not going to create traffic congestion or parking issues.

If the site plan does not comply with every one of the regulations, you have to deny the special permit.

That's the McKenzie case.

So uh that's important to keep in mind that the site plan and the special permit basically go hand in hand.

And you'll see when uh Will Eed and Jennifer provide staff reports, they you know that they will generally uh get into uh those those issues.

Now, uh a commission may you deny you may deny a special permit based on general public health safety and welfare standards that are set forth in the regulations, even if the application meets all the technical requirements of the site plan.

It's kind of the converse of what I just said, right?

Uh you can you have to deny a special permit if the if it if the application doesn't comply with the site plan requirements, but even if it does comply with the site plan uh technical requirements, you can still, in your reasonable discretion, deny the application if you determine based on substantial evidence in the record, which is a concept we could talk about for hours, but there has to be evidence in the record that the use as proposed on the site in the district is uh not compatible with public health and safety standards that are set forth in your regs.

Um can a commission deny an application based on general standards without any evidence of any adverse effect of the proposed use at its particular location.

This gets into the distinction between you can amend your regulations to provide that a use is permitted as a special permit use.

And you can say, well, generally, as a legislative matter, we we believe that this uh uh this proposed special permit use will be compatible with other uses in the neighborhood.

But what if the application comes in and uh some sometimes a commission or some members of a commission will say, well, I'm gonna go back to the um to our decision to amend the regs uh and see revisit the issue of compatibility.

Can't do that.

That's the McKenzie case uh that was decided by the appellate court in um in uh I'm sorry, the Supreme Court in 2022.

Uh you can't, you cannot base the decision to deny a special permit without substantial evidence of its specific effect on a specific site and general fears, general environmental impacts, mere speculation, or general concerns are not substantial evidence, and they do not support a denial.

The standards in your regulations for granting special permits or special exceptions are set forth in 10 C4.

Uh I won't go through those.

You can read them on your at your leisure.

Uh, there's basically four uh standards.

You have to find that each of them is met in order to grant a special uh permit.

Uh additional uh on the next page, uh, we talk a little bit about additional standards for special permits involving alcohol sales.

Um again, I I don't want to get too much into the weeds on it.

You need to you look at 3F2B and D of the regulations, that talks about additional standards that you as a zoning commission have to consider when you're considering a special permit for uses involving the sale of alcohol.

And you can imagine what those standards are.

Are they close to a church?

Are they close to a school?

What's the impact on the surrounding neighborhood?

Is it residential, et cetera?

Will it cause increased traffic congestion in the neighborhood?

And the interesting thing about special permits is that the which the zoning commission has jurisdiction over, is that the planning and zoning department under your regs has to approve the site plan before the special permit may even be filed.

I'm not sure how whether that has been on or only in the breach, but but it's it's there.

Uh and the applicants uh and the commission should be aware of it.

The idea being that the site plan should be the province of the planning and zoning department, but the special permit should be the province of the zoning commission.

Uh overlapping jurisdiction of land use agencies and notice and referral requirements.

Again, just be mindful that these uh issues can come up when you're adopting a zoning regulation or or changes to the zoning map boundaries, you have to refer to the planning commission at least 30 days before the start of the planning uh sort of start of the here, the public hearing by the zoning commission.

That's 8 3a of the general statutes.

The planning commission is required to give you a report on whether the change is consistent with the POCD and any other factors the planning commission deems relevant.

The report has to be submitted to the prior to or submitted, when I say submitted, submitted into the record uh uh your record prior to or at the at the public hearing before the zoning commission.

And it at the statute actually requires that it be read aloud at the public hearing.

If the planning commission doesn't report within uh that time period, um its approval is implied, but if it issues a negative recommendation, that triggers a supra majority vote requirement.

You have to, you can only adopt it in that situation when the planning commission is given a negative recommendation upon six votes or two-thirds of the entire commission.

Umtice and referral to other agencies.

Again, there are situations where notices to adjoining municipalities are required.

Um I'll note just as an aside that that's that statute does not appear to apply to zone changes.

Um, but again, the planning department and and uh the planning director will advise you on the specific notice requirements as they arise.

So on certain uncertain circumstances, you need to notify the regional planning agency, Southwest COG and our our uh our case, if you're within uh certain uh distance from a uh another municipality.

Under certain circumstances, you have to give notice uh, or the applicant has to give notice to water companies uh that are uh uh their creatures of statute as well.

Um it says that any application to the zoning commission for any project on any site within the watershed over water company uh has to uh uh provided the water company has filed a map showing the boundaries of the watershed um has to be um uh the the the applicant has to notify the water company and the water company will generally submit a report to you uh for the public hearing.

Wetlands.

Uh if an application for a boundary change involves a site on which there are wetlands or water courses, the commission you need to go back to your 8-2 standards.

That's your Bible.

Um do those wetlands on the site implicate any of the 8-2 standards.

I'm not saying that the zoning commission is a wetlands agency.

The wetlands agency has exclusive jurisdiction of whether to issue a wetlands permit for a particular project.

Um but but what this basically says um is that in your general uh in your your determination of a special permit uh or or even a zoning regulation change, you should consider uh applicable uh wetlands impacts as they relate to your 8 2 powers.

But what this basically says is that in your general determination of a special permit or even a zoning regulation change, you should consider applicable wetlands impacts as they relate to your 8-2 powers.

The statute says that the applicant has to submit the application to the to the EIC environmental impact commission.

That's our wetlands agency.

No later than the day the special permit application is filed.

And that could be grounds for denial of the special permit if that does not happen.

Okay.

Let me just back up for a second and just kind of reinforce what attorney Edwards said a little earlier.

The procedure for a public hearing, as Robin said, is the chair opens the hearing, and what is a public hearing?

It's a it is a hearing that is required to be held by state statute on an application.

All zone changes and text changes require a public hearing.

All special permit applications require a public hearing.

So when you say, well, why are we doing this?

It's because the statutes require us to do that.

The general procedure, which I know the chairman is well well familiar with, is first the uh chairman will uh read into the record uh notice of the hearing, uh, any reports uh from the planning commission, Westcog, and then the general generally the staff report from Waleed or Jennifer.

One one cautionary note I I would voice is that sometimes in the in the past, uh commissioners start to ask questions about the staff report before the applicant makes its presentation.

And that's a little bit dangerous because the whole purpose or the the um underlying uh requirement for a public hearing is that it be conducted in accordance with fundamental fairness, principles of fundamental fairness.

And one of those principles is you do not want to be perceived as prejudging the application.

The worst thing you could say after the staff report is read, and before the applicant even gets a chance to open its mouth is, I really don't like this application.

I think we should deny this application.

That is an applicant's um dream, because if you do go on and deny the application on that basis, the first thing that the applicant's counsel is going to do in court is say you prejudged it.

You didn't even wait for the applicant to to speak or present its case and try to persuade you.

So again, err on the side, if you have limited questions on the staff report itself, that's fine.

But I would generally hold off any questions on the merits of the application itself until the at least the applicant has a chance to make its uh presentation.

And even then, you don't want to make remarks that make it seem or give rise to an argument uh that a member of the commission has prejudged it.

Because if one member is deemed by a court to have prejudged it, the presumption arises that the entire decision is tainted, and the burden falls on the commission to show that that member's prejudgment didn't affect the other votes.

That's not a position you want to be in the corporation counsel's office does not want to be on an appeal.

So just um I'll give you a quick example.

I had a case up in the fairfield years ago where the town wanted to get a wetlands permit um to for a sewer uh uh septic system for the middle school.

And I was town attorney, we brought down the uh one of the people from DEEP, uh a deputy commissioner, and he testified in fair amount of detail that the application complied with applicable deep standards.

The deep representative finished his presentation, and the chairman immediately said, I find your testimony to be arbitrary and capricious.

That's the last thing you want to be saying before at the very least, before late in the hearing, and generally you need to hold off uh on making those kind of comments until after the hearing closes.

You can certainly say, for example, what would you say, uh, Mr.

Applicant, to the criticism of this application that it does not do X, Y, and Z, right?

Ask it in the form of a question to give the applicant or the public, the opponents, the opportunity to understand what your concern is and address it.

But don't come out in such a conclusive fashion that it gives rise to the argument of prejudgment.

So generally the applicant goes first, the chairman will say anyone wishing to speak in favor, those people will line up and they will speak in favor.

Uh, then uh the chair will ask anyone to who's speaking in opposition to speak.

The applicant generally gets an up to the last say, the final rebuttal uh in favor of the application.

The hearing uh you you can certainly ask questions, again, questions before the hearing closes.

Um then you can rely on the staff for any final staff comments that you may wish to receive.

You may wish to close adjourn the hearing to allow that to happen.

Uh and then the hearing is closed, and you move on either at the same meeting or the next uh meeting uh to um to vote on the application.

So uh going back to the outline, um, and this is this is really something that Joanne does a great job on, but it it's important to understand a hearing, uh uh a zoning commission hearing is recorded, it's required to be recorded by law.

And the idea is that if it if the decision is appealed at the Superior, there will be a verbatim record of the proceedings, the entire uh transcript.

And some of these, as we know from certain recent uh applications, some of these hearings can go on odd infinitum.

And it's important when someone gets up, first of all, make sure they identify who they are and what their residence is or what their capacity is, just so corporation counsel reading a cold record a year down the road, knows who said what and when you also want to make sure that you keep a very good log of all the exhibits as they come in.

Someone says, I offer this as exhibit uh an exhibit to the proceedings, and I'm handing out nine copies.

You should say, all right, the chair could say, all right, I accept that as exhibit A or exhibit uh one, and each exhibit thereafter is logged in uh uh a seriatum.

Um always provide interested persons a fair opportunity to comment to introduce exhibits, um, and every party uh, including the public or opponents, has to be allowed an opportunity to cross examine their witnesses and cross-examine witnesses.

Now that that it's not a Perry Mason moment, all cross-examination, all questions must be directed through the chair.

So you would, as a commissioner, you would uh you'd raise your hand, chair recognizes you, you say, uh, through the chair, I have a question for applicants counsel, or through the chair, I have a question for the applicant's engineer.

Through the chair, I have a question for the counsel for the opponents.

So again, the whole point is to maintain the decorum and civility of the proceeding rather than have you know direct one-on-one uh exchanges between commissioners and and uh parties.

Uh Robin's already talked about Robert's rules.

Um again, the point, the point of all this is to create a clean, organized record for appeal.

If the if if a person is not speaking up, the chair is perfectly allowed to say, I'm sorry, we need to catch your remarks for the record.

Can you speak up?

Um Robin's already covered motions, which are governed by Robert's rules.

Um lastly, I'll just say a word about conduct.

Speak only when recognized by the chair.

It's not a free-for-all.

There's reasons for it.

Um as I know every member on this commission will be.

Uh they should be polite to each other, civil to each other, civil to the public.

This is not about ad hominem or personality issues.

Uh and it's about reaching the right decision for the right reasons and in the right way.

They are um communications outside the hearing room.

General rule, almost cardinal rule, avoid them.

All they do is create a presumption of prejudice.

If someone finds out about it, uh and it switches the burden in any court appeal from a commission decision to show, as I said before, that the communication did not affect the decision.

So, you know, you're in in the grocery store, and uh one of your neighbors comes up to you and says, Hey, I want to talk to you about this uh homeless shelter application and zone change application out on uh on Mill Plain Road.

Our advice is say, thank you for for uh letting me know your concern.

I cannot talk to you because that would violate the requirement that all communications uh on an application be made through the public hearing record.

And if they they if they insist, say, look, it's not blame it on corporation counsel.

Uh, but the last thing you want to do is have someone get up either at the close of the hearing or after that and say, I just want to I want to let you know that Commissioner So-and-so was seen the other day in Chucks with the applicant's attorney.

Uh, and and it you know what I'm saying.

So if you're uh uh if you're contacted on the phone in person, just respectfully say I cannot comment on it.

And we recommend that at the next meeting, so that there's a record of what you did and that you did the right thing, you should put on the record that I was contacted by um a neighbor, uh so-and-so, uh, and I told them that I could not uh address the comment and invited them to come here and address the commission during the public hearing.

Um even communications among commission members should be avoided.

You all have city emails now.

First of all, never use your personal emails for any city communication.

If you do that, all your personal emails become subject to FOI.

And people make that mistake far too often.

You don't want to get involved in that kind of a process.

Um text each other, don't email each other.

If you have questions, ask Joanne, ask Jennifer, ask Waleid, and ask the questions on the record.

Uh communications between commission members outside of the record are prohibited.

Post-hearing evidence.

Okay, the hearing closes, you get to the next meeting, and the applicant's attorney stands up and says, Oh, we have another piece of evidence we'd like to introduce, Mr.

Chairman.

Can't do it.

The commission cannot consider any evidence, including any public comment, after the close of the hearing.

Um, and again, the reason is because if you do that, it can invalidate the decision.

And and why do we have the rule?

It's it's because if if you're relying on evidence that comes in after the close of the public hearing, and you make your decision based on that post-hearing evidence, you're depriving the public and opponents or the applicant, depending on who the evidence is submitted against of due process or fundamental fairness.

So again, it's it's an important thing to keep in mind.

Post-hearing evidence is not permitted.

Now, that doesn't mean that you can't get a post-hearing report from Waleed or a post-hearing opinion from the corporation council.

You're you're entitled to rely on your experts and consultants as long as the experts and consultants are basing their post-hearing comments on evidence which is already in the record from the public hearing.

So consultants and attorneys' comments are appropriate, provided that they don't go off and start citing evidence which is outside the record.

Um the staff's rule uh is there they are your consultant.

They are your advisor.

Um they provide you guidance on all the technical issues, the city policies, precedents, and procedures, historical information on the regulations, and on uh particular uh sites.

Um and there's a difference between providing the differing roles between the the roles of staff and the roles of representatives for the petition.

The role of staff is guiding you to make a fair independent decision.

The role of a petition, a petition and its advocates, petitioner and their advocates is advocacy.

And that doesn't mean that they can go beyond the bounds of what's what's uh relevant.

But remember that they are representing uh a client, as they're entitled to do.

And every every petitioner is entitled to have competent representation by engineers and lawyers, but just that the there's important it's important to recognize that that crucial distinction.

Uh testimony by experts.

Um oftentimes uh this occurs more at the wetlands commission level when you have technical issues about what's a wetland, what will affect the wetland.

Um but sometimes it comes up in this in the zoning commission uh on hearings on special permits or even on zone changes.

Um the the applicant can bring in its own technical experts, opponents can can bring in their uh technical experts.

And the general rule to remember is the commission, you're like a court.

You don't have to believe any witness, even an expert witness.

Um, but if it's on a technical matter, um such as is this a wetland, um, I'm trying to think of it in another example.

But if it's on a technical matter that's beyond the ordinary, you know, can of uh a lay person, the commission cannot ignore the only expert evidence put in on that technical issue unless you put on the record the basis for your disagreement with the expert allow and allow the applicant and the public an opportunity to address the concerns.

Um that's just another thing to consider.

You you are the judge of credibility, but for technical issues, if you've got you know two experts and they're arguing different conclusions, you've got pretty much uh the authority to decide which one is credible, which one is not.

There's only one expert, though, you got to be careful before you reject that person's opinion.

Uh and as a corollary to that, if you'd want to use your own expertise or knowledge of a site, you have to disclose that expertise or knowledge during the hearing, uh, as well as any material facts on which you're relying.

So, for example, someone lit some a commissioner lives around the corner uh from a proposed uh development uh and can testify as to the traffic uh that's there on a particular day or the accidents that are there or the congestion level.

That's fine, but you just have to disclose your knowledge to the applicant during the hearing and give them an opportunity to address it.

Site visits.

Site visits are authorized and appropriate.

That's simply a visit to a particular site that is the subject uh of an application.

So, for example, a restaurant on a special permit thing.

Um zone changes are a little bit different because zone changes generally don't apply to a particular site.

Um, but um they apply to every property in the zone uh for which the regulation is amended.

But but oftentimes what will happen is an applicant will come in and present you uh on an application for a zone change or a text change.

It'll present you with what they call a conceptual site plan.

This is what we plan on doing uh with this site if you grant this change to the regulations.

Now, as the chairman will remind you, that's fine, but the commission, you're not considering a site plan at that point.

You're considering a zone change.

So you have to look at the potential for whether that zone change, the maximum possible potential for that site and other properties in the district that that zone change allows.

You can't just say, oh, they're only going to put three family two uh two three family units here.

If the zoning change would allow a number of additional units, you've got to consider that in your legislative deliberations.

A site visit is not part of the public hearing process.

Um you um our general rule or rule of thumb on site visits is that we discourage you uh from just going out there on your own.

Number one, if you don't have permission from the property owner, you can't go on the property.

Number two, there's FOI considerations.

There's there's a conflict, at least in my opinion, on whether even a group of meeting of two commissioners could be viewed as a violation of the Freedom of Information Act.

I always argue that you don't have a meeting unless you have a quorum, but there's some disagreement on that uh in the courts.

So we recommend that if you're gonna do a site walk at uh uh get a consensus from the commission members, okay.

We want to do a site walk this Saturday at 10 a.m.

Uh, we're gonna notice it as a special meeting.

Uh is that is that good for everybody?

Everybody comes to the uh the site plan, the owner consents to it.

Um, and the um doesn't mean you're required to attend the site uh visit, but if you do go on the site visit, uh the the rule of thumb is it's not a substitute for the public hearing.

You're only there to observe the site.

You can ask questions of what's that, where's this, uh, how far is that, but you you should limit your questions to those types of general questions and never get into a dialogue with anybody during the site walk as to the merits of the application.

And when you get to the next hearing session, we advise you go around the room through the chair, and each member who visited the site should put on the record what they observed.

Umights of members absent from the hearing to participate in the decision.

If you're a member and you miss the public hearing, you cannot vote on the application unless you put on the record at the time you make the decision uh that um you have reviewed the entire record, including the tape of the hearing and all of the exhibits, and you are uh and and you're fully prepared to vote.

If you don't do that, the the court can overturn the appeal just on that ground.

Alternates can participate in the public hearing, but if not seated by the commission by the chair for the decision, you cannot alternates cannot participate in the decision.

And that means no comments, no questions, not at all, nothing at all.

Um lastly, very quickly, conflicts of interest.

Well, I've talked about prejudgment.

Um I won't, I won't uh beat a dead horse on that, but again, you it it this doesn't mean that you can't hold opinions or express preliminary concerns.

You know, um you're entitled to come in, you don't leave your common sense at the door uh of a public hearing.

Um, but avoid statements before or during the hearing suggesting that you've made up your mind.

That's that's the critical thing to avoid.

And you should never speak in favor of an opposition or uh uh to an application during the public hearing.

That's clear, clearly shows prejudgment.

So I know it's hard sometimes because you may have uh serious concerns, but again, just hold your thoughts until after you begin deliberations.

That eliminates that potential issue if you have to have us defend you on an appeal.

Uh generally, there are some general statutes that I cite here about when it's proper or not proper for a member of a planning or zoning commission uh to uh appear before other land use agencies.

Uh and lastly, no no member uh of a land use commission may participate in the hearing or decision on any matter in which a member is directly or indirectly interested in a personal or financial sense.

That is a very fact specific determination.

Some commissions have rules that if some member brings up the potential bias of another member, the entire membership has to vote on whether that member should stay on or not.

We don't have that in Danbury.

Uh it's up, it's up to the member uh acting in good faith to say I really shouldn't be involved in this because you know, my my sister-in-law uh owns property that will be affected or um uh any other personal or financial interest.

And what we always say to people is you have altered it for a reason.

Then that is to step in when a regular member feels that he or she simply should not participate in the decision.

And the best rule of thumb is if you're in doubt, get out.

Step down.

Don't create the issue for yourself or your family or the commission.

The decision itself, I just want to say uh real quick, uh, when you when you close the hearing, the next step will be okay.

What do we want to do on this application?

There would be generally there would be a motion to approve.

Why do I say a motion to approve, even if everybody's champing it the bit to deny it?

A motion approve is better from a parliamentary point of view because if a motion to approve fails, the application fails.

If you frame it as a motion to deny, however, let's say the motion to deny the application fails.

Three people vote to deny, six people vote not to deny.

That doesn't mean that those people who voted not to deny might on the same by the same token be willing to approve it.

So it creates a confusion.

So the best way is to, Mr.

Chairman, I make a motion to approve.

You can say for discussion purposes only, but that gets it on the record.

There's a second, and then you discuss it.

Um we've had several complex cases over the past a number of years.

And in those cases, what we recommend is that you don't need to make a motion to approve right after the hearing closes.

What we advise sometimes is that the commission through the chair conduct a kind of a straw poll uh analysis to see if there's a consensus whether to deny or approve.

And depending on that non-binding consensus vote, you would then direct the director and our office to prepare a resolution, either of denial or of approval uh for the reasons uh that are that you set forth.

Oftentimes it's very difficult to come up with a resolution, especially on a case where we know there's going to be an appeal.

You want to make sure that the resolution of denial is complete, it's comprehensive, because when you adopt the resolution, it the court will only look at what you said were the basis for the denial.

It's not going to go back into the record.

If you say, oops, I forgot to mention this one other factor.

They will you need to adopt a collective statement of your reasonings, and and again, that doesn't happen in every case.

Some cases may be very simple, where some member can simply say, I move to approve for these reasons, get the second, vote on it, and you're done.

But in complex cases, sometimes the better course of action is to take a straw poll, get a consensus, and then direct the staff to prepare a resolution that you can then vote on at the at the next meeting.

That concludes our presentation.

Uh, Mr.

Chairman, thank you very much for your time.

I hope we didn't go too far over.

No, not at all.

As usual, at this, I always find this fascinating, and uh, and I I really appreciate it.

And I know to some of the new members, this could be overwhelming to you, but you have copies of this.

Take it, take some slow breaths, read it over.

Um, it's funny because um over the I've been on here so long that we've had petitions that almost um everything that was discussed tonight from attorney Edwards and attorney Casagrani, we've experienced in some form or fashion, uh, a lot of it.

Um there's a lot of legal stuff here, but um, there's one thing that's always very, very critical to me, very important to me, and it's very difficult at times, but you'll get used to it, and that's ex parte communications.

It's like it took a while, but I don't discuss the zoning commission in my own household.

And I so that means that you don't discuss it amongst yourself, you don't discuss it amongst people.

And when somebody comes up and talks to you and says, Can you tell me about this petition?

What's your opinion?

You may think it's hard to avoid them and have one have a conversation, but it's not.

You just say, I can't, I can't talk about it.

Um, you just can't.

You can't have conversation.

If you can't have conversation amongst each other, you clearly can't with the public.

And that's very, very important.

And every once in a while, as far as the post post hearing evidence, sometimes somebody might not mean it, but they'll go to the city hall and they'll get a list of the zoning commission members' names, and they'll put together a letter as to their opposition or asking you to read the letter about their feelings on it.

And if that comes in after the public hearing is closed, you know, generally I'll recognize the return address.

I won't even open it.

If it gets by me and I happen to open it because I don't know what it is, you know, I'll mention it at the next meeting.

And you can't take that into consideration.

And it's a lot of times it's done by accident by people uh out on the outside that don't understand that.

Um but uh there's a lot of good stuff that's always said tonight by by uh attorney Casagrani and attorney Edwards.

Um before I ask commission members if you have any questions, you can go ahead and turn your unmute and turn your mics on.

For the record, uh let me mention that uh uh Commissioner Bennett was here um just moments after attorney Edwards began.

So he was here for for this whole meeting.

Uh so we'll welcome him.

I'm taking him off the absent portion.

I'm putting him down here as present.

And as a matter of housekeeping, this agenda was filed in the town clerk's office on Thursday, January 8th, 2026 at 421 p.m.

Commissioner members, do you have any questions or anything you want to talk about?

Um and if you don't have any questions now, if you come up with some after you digest this further, you could always bring it up at a at another meeting or talk to corporational counselor or myself.

Um Commissioner O'Neill.

I don't think I really have uh city email, do I?

Oh, yeah, as at Turney Cassidy Granny, we don't have city emails.

Oh, really?

Okay, yeah, they don't give them to them unless they ask for them, Dan.

Uh I should if they want them, I can arrange it, but if any if anybody wants when I have Dan Bray zoning at AOL.com and I use that just strictly for for zoning, and I know it's all subject to FOI.

Uh, I don't use it for anything else.

Um, but I guess if I guess if somebody wants to get a um uh gets it get a city email, they're welcome to it.

Uh or just have an email that's separate from their regular email.

Or just have an email that's separate from your from your personal email.

Um, Commissioner O'Neil.

Yeah, uh Commissioner O'Laughlin.

Uh just a couple of quickies.

The as an alternate, uh, I expect to be at every meeting.

How do how does our involvement and and when do we get involved in the decision making process?

Well, well, you know what attorney Cass Grandy, do you want that?

Or do you want to go ahead, Mr.

Chairman?

You know this better than I do.

Actually, actually, it's it's it's it in my opinion.

I think it's critical for all alternates to be at every meeting.

Yeah, because you can have um, well, before we started doing Zoom, you can have a snowstorm where some uh commission member might not make it that's a regular member.

So let's let's play this one out.

Let's say that we have all nine regular members and the three alternates that are uh here a petition and they're there and they're present, and it goes on for a couple meetings.

It doesn't close after the first meeting.

And on meeting number two, one of the commission, one of the regular members is not here, and then um we close it that night, and then we go to a vote, and that commission member is either not here or is here, but is not uh qualified because they didn't hear the tapes.

I would call an alternate uh to sit in for that member.

Uh and what I do is, and with the help of Ms.

Reed, she always helps me is we call that we call that alternate the on-deck batter.

I put it in rotation so that the public doesn't think that I'm um showing any favoritism by saying uh putting in the same one at the same time, or by me reading so I don't so the chairman doesn't get accused of uh the chairman is is uh favorable uh or not favorable to petition, and they put somebody that they know is gonna see it their way to to try and uh throw the vote.

So we do it on a rotating basis, which is what the Connecticut General Statutes tells me that I should do.

It's it's clearly written there.

So it's it's really helpful for all alternates to always be present at the meetings.

Now it's really funny is in the old days, we used to, if we weren't at a meeting, we would go to the city hall, we would report to uh Ms.

Reed, she would give us a cassette tape, a bunch of cassette tapes, a cassette player, and some notepad notes, and we'd go into a room and we'd waste our day there, and we'd have to go through it and then we'd have to report at the next meeting that we are qualified because we saw uh we we heard the tapes and we read all the documents, all the exhibits right now.

Right now, everything is uploaded to the internet, everything is on YouTube.

You can go and you can watch it real easy, real simple.

So somebody that's not qualified for whatever reason can get it can get qualified pretty simply nowadays.

So yeah, it'd be good.

Let's just say that you come to every meeting, Commissioner Laughlin.

There's gonna be you're gonna get called upon, or you're not going to be at some certain point.

So it does come in handy that you were always here.

If you miss a meeting and it gets carried over, uh, we're not voting on it that night or whatever, then very simply you could go and become qualified as an alternate for the next meeting.

Okay.

Okay.

Good enough.

Yeah.

Um attorney Cascarandi, is that uh you agree?

Yes.

Uh commit any other commission members with any questions at this time.

Anyone take any notes that they want to discuss?

I don't know if I have anything else.

Attorney Casigrani, thank you very much for not mentioning Pompeii versus the Dam Rizoni Commission in 1996.

But let me say, before everyone says that uh the city of Danbre lost that one because the chairman did not read the um uh the planning commission recommendation.

Planning commission recommendation.

Let me just say that that chairman was Theodore Hadad Jr.

And Hadad Jr.

did read the recommendation from the planning commission into the record, but the actual typed and printed recommendation was not submitted to the chairman in time for the meeting.

So he did not read the exact recommendation on paper, only verbalized what was the recommendation.

And we actually lost it in court.

Um, so we've we try to dot the I's and cross the T's here quite a bit.

And uh uh, but there's an awful lot of um uh appeals that were filed that the city of Damray did win and won strongly, and because we have good corporation counsel that defended our actions, um, plus we we dotted the I's and crossed the T's.

Uh anything else, Commission members, at this time.

Again, I want to thank corporation counsel and attorney edwards.

We will take you up and attorney Cass Granny up on your offer to the commission members that if they're if they need you for whatever reason, maybe to go through uh uh um uh Ms.

Reed first uh to get to you.

Um but um you'll see commissioner members, we do do a good job here.

We are very strict.

Uh we are very by the by the book, by the rules.

Uh sometimes it seems silly, but I have to take the position that everything we hear could get challenged, could get appealed, and we want to make sure that we have good strong records uh and we don't do things silly.

We do things because it's important to do things that way.

Thank you, Chairman.

Attorney Cascarani, Attorney Edwards, thank you so much.

Appreciate it.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Our pleasure.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thanks.

Director.

Director, did you want to just touch on you gave some notes to us?

Did you want to touch on that?

Uh, or just simply say, read it.

I'll let you have the floor.

Hey, tip.

A lot of information tonight.

It's enough for one night.

Okay.

It's more for Fons.

Whatever I have a chance, go over it.

If you have any questions, let me know.

Okay.

So uh Commission members, there's a document that says notes to zoning commissioners.

That was from the director.

You have that in your possession.

Read it over.

Um, Ms.

Reed also sent a document.

Uh it's only a few pages of zoning commission basic concepts of Robert's rules.

Read that over as well.

Um, there's gonna be there was something that attorney Edwards mentioned that uh Ms.

Reed was gonna send to us.

Um we'll get that shortly as well.

Uh you might want to look up, it's very simple online.

Roberts rules.

Um, you could find that.

And uh the only thing really, I think that you're missing that if you want to get a copy of, which would be useful to you from uh Ms.

Reed would be a copy of our bylaws, um, which from time to time we do update, and I think we updated maybe 10 or 12 years ago um on a particular note, and we shot that around and and um updated that as well.

Oh, I forgot.

Who?

What I forgot to send them.

I was gonna send them separately.

I didn't want to attach them to the agenda, and I forgot.

I'm sorry.

I will send them out tomorrow with everything again.

Yeah.

Oh, beautiful.

There you go.

Okay, so we'll be we'll be getting that uh okay.

Uh the memo from uh well lead, let me get oh, and and again, I mentioned earlier before the way that this agenda is set up tonight, is only because we're having the workshop session.

You'll see the way it gets set up on all future meetings the way that uh attorney Edwards had mentioned the the layout of it.

Uh Planning Director memo we talked about.

Uh so right now, what we're going to do is we're gonna go to organizational business, and that is where we uh go to the election of chairman and vice chairman.

Um right now, the only ones qualified for that would be uh commissioners Bennett, Otello, Fuchs, Hall, uh James who is absent, uh Jowdy O'Neal Trata Hadad.

The alternate members um will not take part in this, and I will also not replace the absent uh James with an alternate member uh because there's nothing to discuss for the evening.

Number one, number two, we have a quorum without making that uh seating, and number three, the as I said, the alternates uh cannot take place on the cannot uh play a part in the election of the chairman or vice chairman.

So at this time, uh let me say that this is from exercise excerpts from Robert's rule of for nominating and electing officers, uh, it's from the 12th edition, which is the most recent edition, which I think is in 2021.

Nominations and elections.

Uh nominations are now in order for chairman.

Are there any nominations for chairman of the zoning commission?

Anyone want to make a nomination?

Uh Commissioner Botello.

Yes, uh, fellow commissioners.

I would like to make a motion to elect Ted Haddad as chairman of the City of Danbury zoning commission.

Nominate nominate, nominate.

So nominate.

Okay.

We're gonna vote on it after.

You're gonna make the nomination and then we're gonna vote on it.

I would like to all right, make a motion to nominate Ted Haddad as chairman of the City of Danbury zoning commission.

I make this motion because Chairman Haddad has a long and proven record of effective leadership in this role.

He possesses a deep understanding of zoning regulations and has demonstrated particular expertise in working with our POCD and the newly implemented TOD zoning frameworks throughout his tenure.

He has served as a dignified, fair and widely respected chair, and he has consistently guided the commission through complex and evolving land use issues.

Given the importance of strong leadership during this period of continued growth and regulatory change, I believe he is the most qualified individual to lead this commission forward.

Thank you, Commissioner Botello.

Uh is there a second?

Commissioner O'Neill.

I'd like to second the nomination.

Thank you.

Commissioner members, uh, there's a nomination for um by commissioner Hadad uh by Commissioner Botello to nominate Hadad for chairman, second by O'Neal.

Um I will consent to that nomination.

Uh and I will also ask if there are any other nominations for chairman.

Are there any other nominations for chairman?

Oh, uh Commissioner O'Neill, you had your hand up.

I mean, it's low.

Are there any other nominations for chairman?

Any other nominations for chairman?

Any other nominations for chairman?

Because um uh not seeing any other uh nominations for chairman will put it to a vote.

Uh the vote would be a voice vote.

We'll call roll call call.

Uh roll call.

Uh Commissioner Bennett.

How do you vote?

I vote for you.

Commissioner Bonello.

Absolutely for you.

Commissioner Fuchs.

Uh he's not there.

Oh we lost him.

Yeah.

So I know that uh Commissioner Hall.

Uh, I vote for you.

Thank you.

Commissioner Jowdy.

Yeah, that's the chairman.

Thank you.

Commissioner O'Neill.

Yes.

Commissioner Trata.

Yes.

And I will vote for myself.

Thank you very much.

I appreciate it.

I realize uh now what we'll do is we will now go for vice chairman.

So uh nominations are now in order for vice chairman.

For anyone wishing to make a nomination for vice chairman.

Nominations for vice chairman.

Uh I will take it upon myself and be honored to nominate uh my vice chairman who I've had for many years, Commissioner Jowdy.

Commissioner Joughty's been by my side and has served the city well and is just served this commission well.

Uh so I would like to nominate uh Commissioner Jowdy for Vice Chairman.

I would look for a second to that.

Is there a second for Commissioner Jowdy?

Second by Commissioner Botello.

Um Commissioner Jowdy, would you consent to the nomination of for vice chairman?

Yes, I will.

Thank you.

Um are there any other nominations for vice chairman?

Are there any nominations for vice chairman?

Are there any other nominations for vice chairman?

Motion to close nominations for vice chairman.

Motion made by Commissioner Botello, second by Commissioner Hall.

All those in favor signify saying aye.

Aye.

The uh nominations for vice chairman are closed.

We will put it to a roll call for Jowdy.

Uh, let me get my paper here.

They're sticking together.

Uh Commissioner Bennett.

I would vote for Mr.

Joughty.

Commissioner Botello.

I vote yes for Mr.

Jowdy.

Uh Commissioner Fuchs is absent.

Commissioner Hall.

I vote yes for Mr.

Jowdy.

Commissioner James is absent.

Commissioner Jowdy.

I vote for myself.

Rick Cowdy.

Commissioner O'Neill.

Yes, I vote for Rick Jowdy.

Commissioner Trata.

And I will also vote for Commissioner Jotti.

Congratulations, Commissioner Jowdy.

Thank you very much.

Thank you.

We have that out of the way.

Um and thank you for the past, Commissioner Jotty, for all that you've done.

I appreciate it.

Thank you as well.

Uh selecting the effective date for approvals granted by the commission.

Ms.

Reed, can you tell us what they are right now?

Um things that you approve become effective the day after publication in the news times.

Thank you.

Unless otherwise specified.

Director, is there any reason to change that?

No, we don't have any civil system.

Thank you.

So we're we will set the effective date as it stands and as it has been for quite a while.

I need a motion.

Is there a motion to that?

A motion by Commissioner Botello.

Second by Commissioner O'Neill.

All those in favor signify by saying aye.

Aye.

Let's see to the new members here.

What we do is we have a ZBA zoning board of appeals subcommittee.

We've always had in the past.

And I think this counted as a we're getting something the censor.

In the background, I hear a voice in the background.

Does somebody have uh somebody talking in the background?

Okay.

Um we've had an appointment of a ZBA subcommittee.

We have three members from this commission.

Uh Ms.

Reed, do you know who it is who's on it right now?

Is it is it Commissioner Jowdy?

Yes.

Who else?

Uh I don't know.

I can't remember right now.

Are you on it?

Botello, maybe.

Yeah, maybe Bobby and maybe Bruce.

I don't know.

Or Jen.

No, not Jen.

She's not doing it.

Okay.

Well, I'd like to ask if Commissioner Jotty and Botello would remain on as a ZBA subcommittee.

And if there's any interest of Commissioner O'Neill or anybody else, maybe explain, but you know.

Yes, I would.

I would definitely like to be considered.

Okay, listen.

We already got you.

So the ZBA the ZBA subcommittee.

Um is a subcommittee.

It's three members from the zoning zoning commission, where at times there may be a petition from the zoning board of appeals, which will require the zoning commission.

Uh the zoning commission subcommittee of three members to go out and do an on-site and to do a report uh and to send back to the zoning commission in the night of the public hearing for that to give their opinion on it as to how the zoning commission would give a referral, uh, an affirmative or a negative referral back to the uh back to the ZBA.

Planning does it too.

Uh and and actually we got it from planning as well.

I should have I should have known that.

Sorry.

Yes.

Um, it's it's very helpful, it's very useful.

And I don't think we've had one in the last couple of years, have we?

No.

So it's not it's not that frequent.

Um, but it is critical and it is important.

Uh so right now we have Jowdy and Botello.

Does is there anybody to expresses an interest?

Uh Commissioner Bennett.

Great.

So um we'll appoint uh Jowdy or uh Botello and Bennett um as the three members of the subcommittee.

And uh all those in favor signify by saying aye.

Aye, those opposed.

So there we have it.

Thank you.

Uh uh Commission members, everybody should have received the schedule of the 2026 meeting schedule.

Uh, the easiest thing to remember is it's always the second and fourth Tuesday of the month.

Um that come into play where that particular month um it may only be one.

Uh for the most part, it's always two.

And sometimes in December, we play around because Christmas will always generally cancels out our second um uh meeting schedule, uh second meeting in December.

Um, everybody's received that.

Um, and it's publicly posted regarding the minutes of the November 25th meeting.

We are going to put that off because of the absence of um James.

Actually, uh actually, we could do that because uh Bennett is here.

Uh so actually, why don't we do that?

Um, so Commissioner Bennett, Botello, Jowdy, O'Neal, and Hadad.

We have enough to do that.

I'm speaking to just us uh regarding the acceptance of the November 25th, 2025 minutes.

Everybody received a copy of that.

Commissioner Botello.

Make a motion to accept and put into the record.

Uh is there a second?

I was second.

Second.

I second the motion.

Amongst us, the the names that were read.

Are there any uh do you see any uh additions, deletions, modifications, subtractions?

No, not hearing any.

We have a motion by Commissioner Botello, second by Commissioner Jotty to accept the minutes of November 25th, 2025.

All those in favor signify by saying aye.

Aye, those opposed, Mr.

Chairman.

Yes, whatever you wrong.

Nothing.

You just could explain that you can you can't vote on the acceptance of the minutes if you weren't participating at the meeting.

Right.

So for those, so uh just in case anybody's wondering why for those that were excluded that they were not here for the minutes for the meeting and were not qualified on November 25.

So that's why uh you were kicked aside on a motion to accept.

Uh, we have no public hearing for this evening.

We don't have any continuation of any public hearings.

We do not have any old business for discussion or possible action.

We don't have any new business uh for reference only to be heard on the next meeting of January 27, 2026.

There's a petition of Salem Plaza LLC to amend sections 5A2, 5A5 and 11B3 of the zoning regulations.

Zoning Commission public hearing is scheduled for January 27th, 2026.

Um, I did say that I would go back to other matters.

It appeared once before where we brought into under other matters the um workshop session.

So I will read other matters.

Uh Commission members, other matters uh never existed on the zoning commission agenda up till about the mid-1980s when I was chairman.

Then I had it added.

The reason why I had it added was we had the public was not allowed to speak, and no one was allowed to speak on anything other than strictly an agenda item.

And the reason why it got I I decided to put other matters on the agenda was we had someone that sat at a lengthy meeting under the zoning commission where other matters were not allowed.

She sat in the front row, and when we were getting ready to adjourn, she asked if she could speak about an item that was was to appear on the agenda, and she was not allowed to speak.

And I kind of thought that that was odd.

Her the item she wanted to speak to was very simple.

She sat there for two hours, but she was not allowed to speak because we had a strict adherence to only agenda items.

So at the next term, we decided to put that in there.

So other matters relates to anything any zoning commission member wants to talk about that's not an agenda item, or any member of the public that had a question on something, and if it's if it's appropriate, I would feel that and address that issue.

So commission members, uh, there is no public here.

Uh, did I say commission members?

Is there anything anybody wants to talk about under other matters?

Other matters, any other matters, any other matters, commission members.

Not seeing any hands or hearing any voices.

There's nothing under other matters.

So at this portion part of the um meeting, I would look for a motion to adjourn.

Is there a motion to adjourn?

Uh Commissioner Botello.

Yes, I'd like to make a motion to adjourn and look forward to a new coming to the age of uh the new commission.

Thank you.

Uh motion to adjourn by commission commissioner Botello.

Is there a second?

Second.

Second by Commissioner Trata.

Any discussion?

All those in favor signify by saying aye.

Aye.