6 p.m.

in the automatic chamber and duly noted in two places according to the city's website with in accordance with the requirements of RSA 91-a semicolon two Roman numeral two and a roll call will be taken uh all committee members uh here in the flush so there's no need for uh uh voice roll call okay so yeah can you just take the role sure so I this is my first time doing this everybody you're doing a fine job so I can just say that they're here yeah you just ask call out the name they'll say okay present here alderman at large Michael O'Brien oh see you always should do me last or backwards I'm gonna do first I get the swing boat okay alder woman Benja Pilata Smith present alderman uh Paula Johnson present alderman uh Richard Dowd present alderman Alicia Gregg I'm here uh are you sure somewhat not all the way alderman at large Michael O'Brien present and we also have um alderman Tom Lopez in attendance Alderman uh Amber Morgan and Alderman Patricia Clay also can have this one and then do we have anybody on the list oh and we have alderman Derek Tebow thank you all right um and I failed the first test so let's no you're doing fine a fine job um and Derek okay tonight we've got a little bit of a conundrum somebody writes legislation and then it don't come and the thing is I hate to call it so I'm gonna open the discussion on what is the we can bring it here but usually the courtesy is to delay it until the person shows up but that didn't happen so opinions yes Alderman Johnson thank you I'd like to table both of them until the maker of these ordinance can show up and speak on them and I think that would be the only fair way to do it it would be the a thing of courtesy yes don't write nothing if you're not gonna show up but may I also say you know a lot of people came tonight to speak on it and I wouldn't want them to leave without speaking on it to tonight so I would like to give them that opportunity and then table uh both ordinances they always can come back there welcomed I would love having thank you yeah yeah you want to speak okay all right so anyways that's it uh what we'll do yes Alderman Clay um I I I apologize I know I'm not on your committee um um alder woman um Kelly had sent me a message that she was trying to get on and she was trying to get on before and and so on but um she too would like it to be tabled she's asking for you to table it she was trying to get through to everybody so okay but I think I think we should do public comments.

Okay so I've ordered a motion was made do we want to act on the motion and then no we gotta go we're gonna go through the procedure public comment we got people here that want to speak so let's hear them and uh so we'll go right into public comment I didn't take a list on who wants to speak and who doesn't so please use the quorum act accordingly give your name and your address good evening uh Mary Lou Blazedale 32 Webster in Nashua and I'm call um here to speak um about the ordinance to repeal the camping I also uh would like to say I chair the downtown improvement committee and I also am a business uh I own a business downtown I'm opposed to repealing this ordinance uh in October the board of uh your board voted to prohibit cab camping on public land and I do not understand why after a few months that we're re um talking about this issue again um did you I'm opposed to this I don't believe allowing camping provides a safe shelter for people and I uh would argue that it creates negative issues environmental sanitation set uh safety and others uh we discussed this issue at our last downtown improvement committee meeting and um the majority of not majority all of our committee was uh in the same uh opinion that they did not want to see this repealed it isn't uh an us and them issue of business and unhouse and we worked

And I would argue that it creates negative issues.

Environmental, sanitation, safety, and others.

We discussed this issue at our last downtown improvement committee meeting.

And the majority of not majority, all of our committee was in the same opinion that they did not want to see this repealed.

It isn't a us and them issue of business and unhouse and we work together.

We work very closely closely with uh Bobby Bagley with Jane at the shelter to try to work with our unhoused people and our businesses.

I have a call a comment here from one of our other members, which I would like to read because I think he said it much better than I am.

Uh Fuad Mafus, who owes PRG rug, and he stated as a downtown business owner, I'm against the repeal of no camping on public land.

Since this has been an enacted, and with the added on foot police officers downtown, uh, and among other initiatives, we have seen an improvement in the various challenges we have faced in the downtown recently, which I do not need, which I do not think need to be discussed again.

With the summer coming and the recent closure of the warming station, I am very concerned this was this will derail any progress made this made since we met since we met last year to discuss humane and empathetic solutions to the challenges we have faced.

Our downtown seems to be close to a tipping point where we hear on a regular, if not daily basis, how scared and concerned our customers, residences, residents, businesses, owners, and stakeholders have become about visiting, eating, and shopping downtown.

The perception is that downtown is unsafe and intimidating.

Whether or not this is the truth, we face the risks of the perception and reality getting worse at a time while multiple businesses are closing and struggling.

This repeal would take much of the power away from the police who have been doing a great job.

I believe we can keep the no camping law intact and still discuss further and humane solutions to the challenges of the unhoused community in the downtown and our local stakeholders.

Repealing this law will not be a productive way to continue this discussion that to continue this discussion.

And thank you for your time.

And I would also like to say that the police have been an excellent downtown, have been excellent downtown working with us, any issues that we have.

We're all trying to work together to a solution and to make our district, our business district, a safe an environment for people, and um we're really opposed to repealing this camping ordinance.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Um speaker got a little bit more time because my new clerk, this is our first time in running the uh time thing.

So there is a three-minute time limit because we all have families to go to.

So thank you.

Name and address.

Hi, Steve Kenny, 9 Sagmore Road, Nashua.

I'm also the chair for the Mine Falls Advisory Committee.

Uh last year we spent a lot of time and energy creating these laws to create an environment or allow an environment uh an environment in the park to improve, as we all know, there's an encampment issue.

Um the committee itself volunteers, and we have volunteers that show up to do cleanings are called trail days.

We just did one this past Saturday.

The focus of that trail day was the encampment area.

So we currently have about almost 4200 followers on Facebook for Mine Falls Park.

We do a lot of posts and followers do posts about uh the bird, the wildlife, eagles.

Um what they don't like to see what they've commented on is what was the tragedy of the encampment.

I don't have a silver bullet when it comes to where the unhouse is supposed to go, but we represent the park.

And what we've seen since we did a cleaning this past Saturday is a vast improvement in traffic in that area.

We've had people come by and shake our hands.

Elderly couple walking through, thank you so much, we didn't feel safe coming here before.

Now we do.

We get with the the trail teams, the track teams can run in there.

It's vastly improved.

We can't go backwards.

It's insanity to think that such a possibility.

Um we do six trail days a summer.

Hundreds of volunteers show up because they love the park.

The city, and I think most of us understand this, is not a bottomless bank account that we can expect when there's an issue to go and ask for a check.

That doesn't help us, doesn't help our tax our tax base.

So we have volunteers that show up to do that last mile, right?

They get their hands dirty.

And this past weekend, we removed some pretty disgusting stuff.

Matter of fact, we moved about 3,500 pounds of trash that the city didn't get to last fall with its bucket loaders and everything like that.

So 3,500 pounds of trash, to give you an idea, that's about how much a Toyota Camry weighs.

So we had 70 people show up on Saturday, which is the largest turnout we've ever had for a trail day on a Saturday morning to clean up somebody else's mess.

That's because they care about the park.

We can't go backwards.

So I ask that the repeal idea, let's not move forward on that.

Let's just kind of, it's not feasible to say we have a problem, so let's go backwards and allow camping in the park.

We're gonna end up with the same problems.

And if you want to talk about needles, we found plenty.

Revive went in there a few days before, volunteer organization may be filming with them, and they picked up 30 seconds.

Our group on Saturday picked up probably about a hundred.

So, and they're scattered everywhere.

I can't see how the four aldermen that are supporting this possibility of repealing it would want to go back to that.

So I I'd say that our committee is firmly against it, and I would imagine that most of our followers on Facebook and people at Use the Park are also against it.

So thank you very much.

Thank you.

Name, address, and please.

I don't live in town.

David Silva.

You can just say you got it.

400 Sherburn Road, Pellham, New Hampshire.

I'm the co-chairman of Mine Falls Park Advisory Committee.

Um sets a stage.

I've been uh active with Mine Falls for uh 20 years.

Co-chairman, chairman, um the grunt that does a lot of work.

The Mine Falls Park Advisory Committee is a working committee.

We don't hold meetings every Monday at seven o'clock and shoot the breeze and then we go home.

We plan for trail days, we plan for things that need to be done, maintenance issues, and just cleaning up the park.

The last couple of years has been a bear.

And for me, it's personal because I have personally and Steve pulled out empty homeless camps because we got tired of waiting for the city to do it.

These things are visible to our visitors who come into the park.

And it's ironic that today's Wednesday, and like Steve just said, five days ago, we had all hands on deck for Pine Street to clean it up.

And then to find out, I just found out today, and I don't know who else did, that somebody wants to repeal this.

Now I'm assuming that people here have gone to the Pine Street and saw it at its worst.

I don't know if anybody went there and saw it after during the cleanup, but I can tell you last Saturday it was disgusting.

And I told these people, my co-workers, my co-guys, this is disgusting, and we shouldn't be doing this.

I picked up a bucket of human waste before I realized it was human waste.

We found a dead dog.

We found, I found personally needles all over the place, all types of garbage.

You cannot do this to Mine Falls Park again.

But I can tell the people the all the men who are proposing this better have a pretty damn good reason why they think that we should go back.

And then the second, and we're on top of that, and then expect the minefalls advisory committee to pick up afterwards.

When that new bridge opened at Gate City several years ago, our committee opposed that, and we we didn't oppose it because we want people coming into the park.

We oppose it because we know what the outcome was.

Within two months when that bridge opened up, I myself and two elderly volunteers pulled five shopping carts.

Thirty seconds from the the trail.

So I'm my as a Mind Falls Advisory Committee member, I'm advising the city of Nashua not to rescind this uh ordinance.

Thank you.

Stephen Scarrow 11 East Hobart Street.

I spoke to you a few months ago about how I made a trip in January to the Cove area of Mine Falls Park, and no one was there, which can't be true because the people that stay there have nowhere else to go.

I've heard that repeatedly.

The homeless encampments we have at Mine Falls Park are there because we allow it.

People do, in fact, have other places to go.

Some of the people who are living there brought in trailers.

I mentioned decks, canopies, gas grills.

One place had a canoe by it.

Other people living in absolute squalor.

And these are people that probably should have been in some sort of a rehab.

My biggest concern is for the people there.

We're encouraging people to stay out of doors.

And we're also encouraging people to not treat their addictions.

And we're not only encouraging it, we're enabling because some people apparently are providing things like tents and sleeping bags for people to be out there.

And I from my when I spoke last time, I got a little bit of an idea of a reason why.

People talk about the homeless people are neighbors.

Well, I never said otherwise, not all are drug addicts.

I know.

Well, the whole reason that we're allowing these so many people to camp out, there are a lot of them is that we'll have a marginalized group so we can love our neighbors and look after them rather than helping people get the help they need in being independent.

As long as we allow people to sleep outside, they will.

And we will continue to become another Seattle or Portland, as I said before.

The solution is to not let people camp there.

If we remove the ordinance we have altogether, the problem will just increase, and the place will continue to become more unsanitary and dangerous.

I love Mindfalls Park.

My daughter used to run cross-country there.

The whole cove area, unsafe, unusable.

Please use common sense and don't make it legal to camp there.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Next.

Good evening.

My name is Morgan Hollis.

I live at 11 Bartlett Avenue, which backs up to Greeley Park, and I also have an office downtown and have been there for over 40 years.

I grew up in Nashua and love the city.

I'm here speaking in opposition to the proposed ordinance.

I'm not making a judgment on whether public places or public parks are a good place for homeless to encamp or to live.

I'm here simply saying from a land use perspective, which is my expertise, the city doesn't allow people to go forward and uh build indiscriminately without some sort of plan or regulation in place.

If there is going to be public park uh public camping in parks, uh there ought to be designated areas, there ought to be rules and regulations, there ought to be a plan in place.

So I would urge you before you vote on this in favor to repeal that there be some effort put forward on plans, rules, regulations.

No different than any other use in this city.

It may be a good use of public uh grounds, and it may not be, but it ought to be uh clear as to how you use it and where you can use it.

Not every public park is appropriate.

Thank you very much.

Thank you.

Next.

Good evening, Mr.

Chairman and members of the committee.

My name is David Godisman.

I live at 18 Indian Rock Road, Nashua.

Uh Morgan is my partner and has been for many, many years.

We have survived uh downtown at the corner of 39 East Pearl Street and Cottage Ad.

Uh just yesterday, uh, as I was uh cleaning the needles from under the bushes in front of our office, or a week or two ago when I was cleaning human waste off of our steps, or when I was chasing people off of our deck who were sleeping there during the night, uh, I I just can't believe we have come to this in our downtown.

We put a huge investment into downtown, and we have tried to maintain our property, uh and there are a lot of people who have made a lot of effort to do that.

Unfortunately, we feel like we are now in the center of a maelstrom where uh everyone who goes to the soup kitchen has to walk by or have a presence near our office.

Uh people come from all parts of the city and need to be fed, and I understand that.

Uh we were promised all sorts of things when the soup kitchen went in, and unfortunately the clientele does not uh live by the same rules that the soup kitchen people seem to have said.

So uh I feel that the more you open this up, the more you put the word out that Nashua is a place that people can camp, they can come, they can put campers out.

Uh, you will have a population that is two or three times at least as big as what you have right now.

And I don't think any of us really want that to happen.

Uh so I hope that you will find a way to oppose these resolutions and uh just ignore this effort to repeal these ordinances.

Thank you.

Thank you, Santa.

Hello, uh, my name is Skylar Wheeler.

I live in the All Street area of Nashua.

Um I am a member of the housing revolving fund committee, but tonight I am here to speak as a member of the GSOP and as an independent resident of Nashua.

Um I am here to add my voice in supporting Shoshana's request to repeal the homeless camping ban.

To those who voted for the camping ban to go through, I really hope you listen to Shoshana and take back your cruel heartless and inhumane action to vote for this.

I understand that your thought process that it was a public health issue, but a public health issue is not worse than stripping away the human right to let these human beings find a place to rest their head at night when they might not have anywhere else to go, and if a homeless shelter or family friend support is not an option.

And yes, there can be a public health issue to letting these people rest on the streets or park where they can, but there are options and actions to counteract those public health issues.

Banning homeless people from camping is just lazy.

Don't be lazy.

Show that you actually care about your fellow human beings by building more shelter beds uh places for people to go to, or at least let them have the right to find where they can rest if that isn't an option.

Thank you.

Have good.

Thank you.

Next I'm Paula Lockhead.

I'm for Westbrook Drive.

I'm also a member of the Mind Falls Advisory Committee.

Um we're talking about people, yes, and I have great empathy for people.

I also want to bring forth some ideas about the environment.

Um certainly there has been a huge movement in the past 30 years that makes mine falls a really desirable area to walk in.

Primarily the fact that the Nashua River has been cleaned up.

You know, we no longer have an orange river.

We no longer have pollution, and we have been very conscious about conscientious about making sure that those laws persist.

If we are encouraging camping, and a lot of times the folks that are camping may not be Boy Scouts.

I mean, Boy Scouts leave no trace.

We have plenty of traces left, and we have lots of pollution in the Oxbow Lake.

We've worked really hard to get that lake to sustain migratory birds to sustain nesting eagles to sustain just amazing creature creatures that you wouldn't imagine to be in a city.

Be aware, please, of the importance of the environment and how we maintain Mind Falls Park to support the environment.

Thank you.

Next, seeing nobody.

Okay.

Sorry, my training is off.

You're doing all right, sir.

All right.

Um is uh Bob Keating from uh five uh Coburn Woods uh drive and a member of GSOP.

I I am support of repealing the uh the ban about uh camping on public property.

And I know a lot of the concerns have been expressed and uh and uh um I see many of them as is very valid uh about it.

But I believe we made an explicit and an implicit agreement uh that when we put this ordinances in effect, in fact, we delayed uh until the time the warming station was uh open.

And so the warming station has stayed open.

Uh we uh uh knew that we had to do something to keep these people uh to give these people some uh option uh uh during the time that the warming station was uh open.

And uh we reached the point, and after much discussion, many conversations about it, uh we did not uh uh find a way to house all the people because we didn't uh create as many housing uh opportunities as as needed.

Uh we minimally minimally should have kept this commitment until the opening of uh until the the warming station uh well excuse me, backing up.

The warming station, I think minimally should be kept open.

Uh if you're gonna keep the ordinance, then they we should at least give one option uh for people to be able to uh uh be sheltered.

Uh I I had one person that I I spoke to uh Alderman uh Smith about it, who doesn't actually go to the warming station, uh, but um when he heard that the warming station was uh closing, he said uh to me, I I I think I might hurt myself.

Uh and so we talked for a little while, he stepped back and then he came back.

He said, he said, no, no, I'm okay.

But I think what he was expressing was that he was concerned that this option wasn't available for him and and his uh colleagues.

So that's the first reason.

Secondly, that uh in at the state, the House of Representatives have passed uh uh a law that says that uh uh you have to have an alternative if you have this ban, and the Senate is gonna take it up tomorrow.

It was unanimous in the House, and uh it was 5-0 from the Judiciary Committee, which I I uh testified uh at saying this ought to pass.

So we're gonna have to change our ordinance.

So I think the the joint things about uh businesses and advisory committee, if we all come on board and say at least keep the warming station get it open, uh, or get an alternative, then you will have that particular option.

Uh attorney uh uh Gotsvin and Alice that for then one of the options was to say that we have a legitimate place that has rules and regulations for camping.

So we can do better, but I think we owe it to keep our word to have a warming station open when we have this ordinance minimally.

So thank you.

Thank you, Mr.

Keating.

Next.

Hello, my name's Tori Marquitz.

I live in Manchester, work here in Nashua.

Um, and I'm just going to back up what what Bob Keating was saying.

Um I was one of the folks who was speaking in uh in opposition to the camping ban last fall, one of the many people who was saying it was inhumane, and I hate that we have to discuss and debate our community members sleeping outside.

I don't think that's anyone's first option.

Um but it's also the reality that there isn't anywhere else for them to go.

The shelters are full.

Um public health has testified that um the folks from the encampment who then went to the warming station are Nashuans.

Um so these are our own people that we have a responsibility to house.

And until there are enough beds for everyone, we shouldn't penalize people for sleeping outside.

Um having to move every 24 hours to find a new place to sleep every single night.

Uh it it increases their instability and makes it harder for them to find get out of the homelessness cycle and get permanent housing.

Um so until there's a place for everyone in the city to rest their head legally, I don't think it's fair to pass the camping ban or have a camping ban.

So I think we should repeal it.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Next good evening, council members and everyone in this room.

My name is Travis Morgan.

Sorry, I don't have an address, I live outside.

I'm not here to decorate the moment.

I'm here to confront it.

Because what we're dealing with, whether we call it policy, ordinance, budget, or development, is not just a series of decisions on paper.

It is a reflection of who we are willing to be when it costs us something to care.

And right now the question in front of the city is simple.

Do we operate from fear or from truth?

Because fear says move the problem, hide the problem, contain the problem.

But truth says if the people are suffering in your city, then the system is speaking.

And you are responsible for how you answer.

You can pass ordinances, you can allocate funds, you can enforce, displace, and repeat.

But let's be honest.

If the same problem keeps showing up in different places, it's not a location issue, it's a design issue.

And deeper than that, it's a human issue.

There are people in the city right now who feel invisible unless they are being removed.

Think about that.

The only time they are fully acknowledged is when they are in violation.

This is not governance.

This is a cycle.

And cycles don't break because we get more efficient and enforcing them.

They break when someone in the room decides to see clearly and act differently.

This is where the spiritual part comes in, whether you like that word or not.

Because leadership, real leadership is not just about control.

It's about alignment.

Alignment between what you say you stand for and what your decisions actually produce.

You cannot say you value human dignity while designing systems that only engage people at their lowest point.

You cannot say you want long-term solutions while finding short-term optics.

You cannot keep asking the city to carry the emotional and financial cost of decisions that don't resolve anything.

So tonight I'm asking you to do something harder than voting.

I'm asking you to be honest, honest about what is working and what is clearly not.

Honest about the fact that displacement without resolution is not strategy, it's delayed.

And honest about the reality that every dollar spent without a complete system behind it becomes a re reoccurring cost, not a solution.

This is not being this is not about being soft.

This is about being effective.

Because strength is not measured by how quickly you can remove a problem.

It is measured by whether you have the courage to actually solve it.

And solving it requires something uncomfortable.

It requires you to stop reacting to the surface and start addressing the structure underneath.

It means thinking beyond tonight, beyond headlines, beyond pressure, into systems that don't just manage symptoms but reduce them.

You are not just managing a city.

You are setting the tone for what kind of reality people wake up to every day.

So the question is will that reality be one where people are pushed around until they disappear from view, or one where the system itself evolves because you choose to see clearly.

This is your threshold moment, and thresholds don't announce themselves twice.

You either step through them or you stay where you are and call it stability.

But deep down you already know the difference.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Usually unless I'm wrapped up.

Next.

Okay, seeing nobody, uh, I'm gonna call the end to the uh public comment period.

And tonight we were scheduled for a discussion and presentation on downtown employee permit discount program.

Uh but I think we're gonna delay that to uh another meeting coming up.

So we'll wait on that.

Uh communications.

Um none.

Petitions, none.

Unfinished business, none.

New business resolutions, none.

New business ordinances.

Um we have uh ordinance zero two six zero zero four.

Um, and we have a motion to table.

Okay, well, yeah, you would say you're gonna say like I would like to make a motion to table.

Right, thank you.

Okay, motion to table.

It's a non-debatable motion.

Seeing up.

All those in favor of the motion to table say aye.

Aye oppose motion passes.

Okay.

Um the agenda is can the clerk read, please.

Um, ordinance zero two six zero zero five for feeling the prohibition on campers and recreational vehicles on public property.

Like to make a motion to table.

Okay, tabling again is uh non-debatable motion.

Uh so we'll call for the vote.

All those in favor signify by saying aye.

Aye opposed.

Okay, motion carries.

Um the table we have one, but nobody's discussed the bringing that up.

Uh general discussion, members of the committee.

Seeing none.

Um public comment.

Anyone feel the need?

Or do we get it all covered?

Okay, I'll move close to second public comment and remarks from Alderman.

Alderman Johnson.

Thank you.

I would just like to say thank you to everybody who came out tonight and voiced their concerns and their opinions.

And I think it's very well taken by the committee.

I think there's quite a bit of work that needs to be done, and I think we need to find out what our next step is with the homeless population.

Thank you.

Um thank you.

A good amount of people came out on both issues tonight, so thank you.

Um, you know, unfortunately, uh, we weren't able to go into any detail in the in the first meeting.

I would have liked to hear from Director Cummings and Director Sullivan just uh because there was a lot of uh untruths spoken at first meeting.

I'm not gonna go through them.

Um, but there was a lot of things that just weren't accurate.

So you know, hopefully a later time if we ever take that off the table.

Um, and remember, just because we tabled something, whether in both of these meetings, doesn't mean it's on the table for the rest of you know, it could be come up at the next meeting or two months, three months down the road.

Um one thing I wanted to bring up because it keeps coming up, and I was disappointed actually by someone who changed their mind about the resource center, because I think the resource center is a good first step to something else.

If if we're just gonna put that off and not go down the road of resource center that our director Bagley needs and wants at that location, and she thinks it can house exactly the amount of people that she needs to help.

Um, if we can't listen to her, um, you know, we're never gonna be able to get a low barrier shelter here.

That's gonna be way too much.

And so that that's what I'm worried.

We can't get something like a resource center.

A low barrier shelter is gonna be a lot more money than that.

And I I heard someone in public comment talk about schools.

The only school closed currently is Elm Street.

Um, and so we don't even know what schools they may or may not close.

That hasn't been decided yet.

And if you close something like New Searles School, to put a shelter or to put something way over there is just too far away from services.

People aren't gonna walk across the highway that are homeless to seek a shelter, and how are you gonna get them over there?

So you need something around you know where they they are, where the services are.

So I was disappointed in the whole school thing.

We can't have 11 years in a row of having a warming station at Elm Street.

That's a million dollar tax revenue for the city there.

At some point, we have to sell that and put housing there.

That's what people keep telling us they need is housing.

We got to put housing there, right?

To help people.

We can't do that if we continue to have warming center there for 11 years straight.

So that concerned me.

I'm sorry, but that I I was hoping for support from a certain side on the resource center tonight, but that's that's I'll leave it at that.

Thank you.

Smith.

Uh thank you, Chairman.

Um, one of the things I want to thank everyone once again for coming out.

I know it's a long day, long night, but I think the the importance of what we do here and uh the role that we've all signed up for is so important that we need to give time to before we make certain decisions.

Um, I'm very pleased that certain things were tabled.

Um, I have to say that I am I continue to be concerned about what some of our next steps you know will and can be.

Um there is no immediate solution, but I would like to to hear more discussion about what are we going to do about our community uh individuals in our community right now who have no place to be.

Um the warming station is closed, but it's cold outside.

I know I have my heat turned on.

Um, so I'm thinking that we do need to look at what are some alternatives.

Um I was definitely pleased to hear you share, you know.

Yes, what schools are closed.

No, but we do have Elm Street where individuals have been, that's where the warming station has been.

I think we need to work with our our our city individuals like um Bobby Bagley, director of the health department, to figure out what can we do to continue to keep the warming station open or to provide a place since it's closed to reopen it.

And what's what are the staffing needs?

If it's going to be temporary until we find other places, great.

Um, I really my heart goes out to all the individuals who helped to clean up the park.

Um, and no, I don't want to pick up a bucket of human waste, and no one, we should not have anyone walking around and picking up needles at a park.

That is just not acceptable.

But I think we need to look at providing a safe space for individuals until there is more a more permanent place.

And yes, if we're if we're able to sell the Elm Street, whatever, great and turn it into housing, but still we have to have a plan in the meantime.

Um we can't just make decisions that are going to quote continue to make individuals either homeless or to take away a safe space for them to put their head at night.

So I want to challenge all of us, and I want to thank everyone in the community who continues to challenge all of us for all of the decisions that we make.

But you know, as we leave here, for those of us who are able to get on the bus or ride a bike or go someplace, I want us to think about the individuals who don't have a place this evening and to make it a number one priority for us to come up with something, whether it's a temporary solution or not.

Um that's it, that's all I could think to say right now.

Almond Dow.

Yeah, just a couple quick things.

Um, it there are a lot of questions that came up tonight in the first meeting, and and I would hope, and a lot of them were based on false information over information that's been corrected.

I would hope somebody on city staff put something together to answer those questions before our next meeting.

And you know, we've been investigating the housing issue for years and trying to do something, and every alternative we've come up with has not worked.

So, you know, if we do nothing right now, you know, it could be another year and a half, two years before we have a solution, or even longer.

Um what do the homeless do in that time?

You know, there is no solution there.

Um relative to the ordinances that we passed, um liaison of the police commissioners along with Oldman Wilshire, and you'd be amazed at the amount of calls that the police department has had to endure because of the situation that these ordinances are resolving, and they're in full support of keeping the ordinances in place.

The other thing, as far as schools are concerned, I've seen people saying, why don't we just close the school right now and put the homeless center in there?

You can't close a school.

We can't close the school, only the board of ed can close a school, and it would take them a year, year and a half, at least probably a year and a half to be able to make that.

If they decided today they were going to close the school, it'd be a year and a half before it would actually happen because of the commitment with staff and teachers.

So you can't just say Board of Ed close the school.

They can't do that.

Um they do do it, they'll dance it way ahead and they'll have to make the decision.

We can't.

We have no authority to close the school.

So my turn, I guess.

I want to express my disappointment between these two ordinances.

I'll tell you what.

I held a meeting in November on these issues, and we came up with a solution.

A lot I had, and those of you new to the board, you weren't here.

But those that were here know that right here in front, I had every division director here to express their point of view on this.

I personally think it cost me my vice presidentship of this board because it wasn't popular.

But the thing is, it came up with a solution.

There were problems.

There was rapes, there was muggings, there was everything else.

Now, come up with this.

Straight line, just cross it all off.

I say, where's the beef?

Okay, I'm not against crossing it off.

Anybody can write an ordinance.

But the thing is, you just can't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

The thing is, there's nothing to say.

Can they have fires?

Well, somebody better talk to the fire department.

And if they're having fires, what is the distance between tents?

You know, are we gonna pay for potter parties to get rid of the human waste issue?

It ain't here.

It certainly isn't here.

It's just like get rid of it.

Listen, I fought fires in the city for 35 years.

I have empathy to the people of Nashua.

I have empathy.

I don't 35 years with the homeless.

God bless them.

I understand.

We kept a lot of them alive.

Do you remember the uh safe station?

Were you woken up at two o'clock in the morning because they had issues?

I was and I was happy to resolve it.

But this isn't it.

Now, it seems to be some false information.

Yes, the police department will ticket you.

But the thing is, you get the ticket, you bring the paper that they give you, go down and see Bobby Bagley in the health department, and it goes away.

But you got to make the decision to do something to make it go away.

Come proactive.

So it's not, you know, concentration camp or anything else like that, inhumane or anything.

It's trying to be to show that it's unhealthy to live in February out in the cold.

Yes, we should do something.

And if the warming station is closing too early, maybe that's what somebody should write for an audience ordinance.

Think better.

Think positive.

I mean, I thought we had this to bed.

I'm not that disappointed, but here it is again.

You know, so that's my opinion only.

I'll probably get in trouble for it.

But this ain't the first time.

Yes, Alderman Johnson.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

I wasn't on the board then, but I remember sitting in the ordinance in the audience in the audience, listening to this when you had all the business owners and department heads.

And I don't want you to fall over here, but I agree with you.

Well, thank you.

You're welcome.

And you know what?

You can agree to disagree.

We haven't come up with that.

I would not support these two ordinances because you know, to have the human feces all over downtown and the needles, and to have kids out there to walk and then and my biggest thing is the library.

I saw them passing um packages of drugs, little packages in front of the library, and my concern is the kids that go into the library.

Kid touches fentanyl, they're dead.

So, you know, we're good group here.

We don't have to get along with everything, but we can work together as a team and try to come up with a solution to some of this.

So it's beneficial to the downtown businesses.

We put in that big performing arts center.

If the homeless population takes over downtown, you're not gonna have any businesses, you're not gonna have the performing arts center, and the city's not gonna thrive the way we want to see it thriving.

So I agree with you, Mr.

Chairman, and you know what?

This should be a beginning of a new stock with us, being friends.

We can agree to disagree.

I'm looking forward to it.

Thank you so much, Albert.

You're welcome.

Thank you.

All right.

Anyone else?

Amen.

Good.

Because you know what's next.

Alderman Gray.

Your favorite.

Oh, yes, I'm sorry, we'll let Alderman down.

Like to make a motion to favorite motion.

Like to make a motion to adjourn.

Thank you.

Motion, uh, all those in favor say aye.

Aye.

Aye.

Pose?

Okay.

Uh, we're adjourned at 9.23.

Thank you, everybody.