I'd like to call to order the historic design review commission for Wednesday August 6, 2025 to order.

May I have a roll call, please?

Mammon.

Savino.

Here.

Velasquez.

Galloway.

Mazuka.

Here.

Givada group.

Cervantes.

Holland Fetzer.

And Gibbs.

Here.

We don't really have a quorum until Commissioner Group can.

There she is.

Commissioner Group, can you indicate your presence, please?

Just give us a here.

Thank you.

Thank you.

We have a quorum.

Thank you.

May I have translation services, please?

Hello, good afternoon.

See, buenas tardes.

Qualquer persona can necessite services of traductional espanol.

Favor de Passarla Cabina de Aquiatrás por su equipo.

Muchas gracias.

Thank you.

The Historic and Design Review Commission is an advisory board appointed by the City Council.

I am J.

Maurice Gibbs, Chairman, and the Vice Chair is Jeffrey Fetzer.

It is a function of the Commission to advise the city manager and all relevant city departments concerning all applications for permits for properties in historic districts for landmarks on city property and a river improvement overlay and for demolitions.

And considering whether to recommend approval or disapproval of an application for a certificate of appropriateness, the commission shall be guided by the city's Unified Development Code and design guidelines and standards that have been adopted by City Council.

And appeal of a decision by administrative official can be filed in accordance with the city's unified development code.

If anyone present wishes to speak in favor or in opposition to any item on today's agenda, please sign up on the public comment sheet.

It is not necessary to sign up if you are the owner of or representative for a project on the agenda.

You will be called on as the case is called.

Case representatives will be given no more than 15 minutes to present their case with an additional two minutes to respond to public comments.

Speakers for or opposed to a case will be limited to two minutes each.

Speakers may also sign up to yield their two minutes to another speaker who has signed up.

Anyone who is yielding their time must be present at the time the speaker is called upon.

Speakers will be called upon in the order in which they are signed up.

Following public testimony, any commissioner may call upon any speaker to respond to further questions.

Approval by the commission does not take the place of any type of permit.

Permits must be attained for all work.

Certificates of appropriateness for work approved by the commission will be emailed to you within 10 days.

No work of any type is to be started without obtaining the appropriate city permits after a certificate of appropriateness has been issued by the Office of Historic Preservations.

At this time, please silence your cell phones.

Good afternoon, everyone.

At this time we can take a look at the screen.

So for item two, I have several.

Second.

It's been moved and properly second further discussion.

May I have a roll call, please.

Mammon.

Aye.

Mazzuka.

Here.

Group.

Aye.

Cervantes.

Yes.

Fetzer.

And Gibbs.

Aye.

Motion carries.

Motion carries.

Thank you.

Back to our public comments for item two.

We have Rusty Wallace.

Mr.

Wallace, if you come up to the podium, introduce yourself.

You'll be followed by Mickey Steenberg.

Good afternoon.

My name is Rusty Wallace and I'm the managing director at Omni Lamancion Del Rio in the Makara Hotel and Spa on the Riverwalk.

I've lived in San Antonio and managed our Riverwalk hotels for 20 years.

Omni is a family-owned company and an owner-operator.

And we're dedicated to preserving historically significant properties.

Specifically, two of them are the Omni Parker House in Boston, which is the longest continuously operating hotel in the country, and the Omni Homestead Resort in Virginia, which was America's first resort, and opened in 1764.

Omni Lamancion itself is a historic and iconic hotel.

And our routes date back to St.

Mary's Academy and later St.

Mary's Law School in 1853 is when the building opened.

Le Montillon was also one of the first hotels to open on the Riverwalk for the 68 World's Fair.

Mokara itself is housed in the historic El Frank Saddlery Building circa 1900.

And the facade on both the Commerce and the Crockett Street sides were meticulously designed to preserve the Renaissance revivalist style of the original Sattery building when it was developed in 2001 and when it had to be reconstructed after part of the facade collapsed.

The proposed deck at 214 Crockett would have a detrimental effect on La Mansion on Mokara Hotel and Spa, an effect on 214 Crockett.

It would block views of both buildings from LaMontcion, the street, and the riverwalk itself.

Most importantly, it'll destroy the tranquil environment of our most premium riverview guest rooms at Mocara.

Mokara has a hard-earned reputation as the city's only Forbes four-star hotel and spa, an honor that we've held for over 20 years.

Our loyal guests have include people like Mokara, Shakira, the former uh prime minister of Great Britain, Tony Blair.

And all of our guests appreciate our hotel as a quiet and discreet location, and they pay a premium for the peaceful balconies overlooking the riverwalk.

A dining deck with 60 or more people plus service staff just a few feet away from the balcony of our best guest room would be a direct assault on their experience and would significantly degrade the views and violate the peaceful atmosphere our guests have come to expect.

Sir, I may ask you to wrap up your comments, please.

Yeah.

Sorry.

The last thing I'd bring up is that only 17% of new restaurants survive past the first year.

And the longer that goes, the worse the statistics get.

There's no guarantee that if we allow a dining deck to be flown across Crockett Street next to our hotel, that that restaurant is going to remain in business or that it's not going to become something else in the future.

So since your purpose is to preserve the historic integrity of our city, I would ask that you deny the request.

Thank you, sir.

Mickey Steenberg.

Followed by Micah Keene.

Good afternoon.

My name is Mickey Steenberg.

And I have the privilege of serving as the hotel manager at Mokara Hotel in Spa.

When I returned to San Antonio in two hours in June 2024, I was honored to join a hotel that stands as a symbol a symbol of authenticity.

A former salary building, now the only Forbes four-star property in San Antonio, and one of the few along the riverwalk that still reflects its original architecture.

Each week when I cross the Salina Bridge and look back at Mokara, I see what our guests and our associates see.

A building that still fits its landscape, not just in style, but in spirit.

Our guests, many of whom return year after year to celebrate life's most meaningful moments, will notice.

And when the experience is no longer no longer feels the same, we risk losing them.

That matters not just to us, but to the city.

A Forbes Four-star hotel brings in loyal, high-value travelers, international attention, and lasting economical impact.

Behind it are 100-plus associates, real people who rely on this hotel to feed their families and build their future.

This isn't just about a sky bridge.

It's about preserving San Antonio's identity, identity, the legacy of our riverwalk, and a guest connection that keeps people coming back.

Thank you for your time and for all you do to protect the historic history of our city.

Thank you.

Micah King.

Mr.

King will have um four minutes.

Brian Davis is here and has yielded his time.

Thank you, uh Chair and Commissioners.

My name is Micah King with Win Said BC, and I'm here on behalf of our client, uh the owner of the Mokara Hotel.

Um we are opposed to this, not the entire request, but to the proposed elevated platform uh restaurant deck that would span 60 feet from the facade of this historic structure uh towards the river walk.

It uh has maintained its integrity, that the structure itself has maintained its integrity for over 120 years.

That's generations of people working to preserve and protect this building.

And when I look at the 1976 nomination file for this property as a national landmark, um it talked about some alterations to the commerce street side of the building.

Um, but it appears that the Crockett Street side, the riverwalk side of this building, the one that we're talking about, is relatively unchanged and preserved for 120 years.

People have been able to appreciate the view.

It's contributed to the historic character of the overall historic district, and it plays it um a focal point, uh architectural focal point for people not just on Crockett Street, but also on the riverwalk and on uh on boats on the river and in carriages as a main route for that as well.

Uh this deck uh is completely out of scale with the facade and the structure.

And uh there's some beautiful renderings of this structure.

It's not ugly, but it's not historic and it's not in keeping with the applicable standards uh for historic preservation.

It would be essentially a visual aesthetic and auditory distraction on this entire block of one of the most important and visited parts of the city.

It would violate the Rio purposes in multiple ways by pre by allowing for incompatible and sensitive development uh by causing a sound nuisance for guests, erecting a visual barrier, not just for the general public, but also for hotel guests.

Um but the general public is really who's gonna be impacted on a daily basis of thousands of visitors uh every year.

Uh it would add an increased fire risk for fire to spread from the new wooden structure to the historic structure and the adjacent contributing and uh registered landmarks.

And there was a fire uh at this property as recently as as 2019, so we know there's already an existing fire risk, so I add to it.

Uh it would place entertainment right next to guest room balconies.

I did a decibel reading, and the ambient noise is at a level that if you add a restaurant 10 feet from a balcony, you're automatically going to be violating the noise ordinance every single minute you're operating.

And there's no restriction against having a use of that platform in the future for a nightclub or for having a late hour certificate from the TABC.

Um these are things that we requested as reasonable conditions and accommodations that were rejected.

And um this structure would also violate the historic design guidelines by obscuring practically every single significant architectural feature on the facade, which the nomination file for the structure refers to as being uniquely configured as having two fronts, one on commerce and one on Crockett Street facing the riverwalk.

And it really is for the general public and the enjoyment of historic structures the most important side because that's where you see many more thousands of visitors who are enjoying the aesthetic environment, the experience of the riverwalk.

And so in your backup are all the other reasons why this should be denied and um available if you have any questions.

Thank you.

Thanks, sir.

We will hear public comments on the rest of the cases on consent.

Um so item three, we have a voicemail agenda item number three, case 2025 194, 435 Donaldson Avenue.

My name is Robin Foster, Monticello Park Neighborhood Association Architectural Review Committee.

Offering comments on behalf of Bianca Maldonado, president of Monticello Park Neighborhood Association and the MPNA Board of Directors.

PO box 10031578201.

We thank the property owner for investing in this coral gable style home.

We are generally supportive of staff stipulation, but raise concern on the execution of the proposed solution.

Is this the optimal solution for this historic home?

As the repair work will look like repair and not restoration.

Will the width of the ply the pilaster cover part of the arched opening?

Were other treatments such as steel banding, which would be less obtrusive, explored.

We note the lack of footing details in the drawing submitted.

We raise caution with the scope of work as presented and respectfully ask for the inclusion of an additional stipulation for staff to monitor the execution of these concrete columns with their stipulations.

The preservation of the front facade of this home is paramount, and every effort should be made to preserve the historic parapet quinylation.

Thank you for consideration of our comments.

Okay, for item four, we have an in-person speaker, Lynn Canapek.

Hi, I'm Lynn Canapic.

I live at 312 Pearl Parkway, and I'm here to speak about the uh the new putt putt at Pearl.

I'm not against the putt putt at Pearl, even though I look down on it all every day, all day long.

But I am concerned about the trees.

The uh report says that it will not be it they'll have to get final approval on the the uh landscaping, and it says that they will not destroy any trees, but I'm kind of concerned because there are uh four at least four large cypress trees on the property, and the the rec what the plan is is to put Texas palms there.

There are palms on the property at Pearl.

I don't see how Cypress and Palms are gonna look good together, but I also don't understand where the palms would be since the Cyprus fill up a large part of the area where the the putt putt will be.

So I just want to make sure that HDRC makes sure that they don't cut down those huge cypress trees because those are as much river walk as palm trees are but I am I approve I am for the project because I know what Pearl does, they don't do right.

I've lived there for 15 years and I've watched everything happen.

I'll watch this and I'll uh I will encourage it because it will help the businesses in that part of Pearl at 1100 Springs Park, but I don't want to see the trees get cut down.

Thank you, ma'am.

Thank you.

So moving to item six, we have a voicemail.

Agenda item number six, case 2025-167, 1932 West Wesatch Avenue.

My name is Robin Foster, Monticello Park Neighborhood Association Architectural Review Committee, offering comments on behalf of Bianca Maldonado, President of Monticello Park Neighborhood Association and the MPNA Board of Directors.

PO box 100315 78201.

It is unfortunate to see the loss of any structure within a historic district.

This accessory structure is unique in its orientation, massing, and scale, but has experienced an unsympathetic rear addition.

We note that no information was provided on the structural integrity of the accessory structure, and no interior photos were presented as a part of the application to substantiate the claims provided on the SO by Addison Prime LLC.

We respectfully request the inclusion of a stipulation for interior photos of the accessory structure be submitted to OHP prior to the issuance of a certificate of appropriateness for demolition.

Thank you for your consideration of our comments.

Last is item 10, I believe.

Agenda item number 10, case 2025 182, 2127 West Woodlawn.

My name is Robin Foster, Monticello Park Neighborhood Association Architectural Review Committee, offering comments on behalf of Bianca Maldonado, President of Monticello Park Neighborhood Association and the NPNA Board of Directors.

PO Box 100315 78201.

We thank the applicant for working towards the stipulations provided during conceptual approval.

This is a unique situation as the property is wholly within the hundred-year floodplain.

We ask for the inclusion of the following stipulation to address stormwater runoff.

We support staff's recommendations and respectfully ask for these additional stipulations.

One, the gutters be installed on the new one-story and new two-story structures to ensure stormwater runoff does not adversely impact the adjacent historic properties and or the existing historic structure.

Number two, for all stone and or removed windows from the existing home at the one-story connector, be preserved and stored on site.

Thank you for your consideration of our comments.

That concludes public comments on consent items.

Thank you.

Do any commissioners wish to pull any items from the consent agenda?

Uh yes, uh, Mr.

Chairman.

This is Jeff Setzer.

I'd like to pull item number 10, 2127 West of the Woodlawn.

2127 West of the Woodlawn.

And I will be recusing off of case number four.

Um 250 East Grayson.

Thank you.

And now item number six, Mr.

Chair.

Item six.

Chair, I'll pull item number two.

Item two.

And uh hold on, one more.

You see a four, sir?

I say number two and number six.

No, I'm sorry, number three.

Donaldson?

So two and three.

Yeah.

I think somebody already pulled that one.

Hold on, let me double check them.

Mr.

Chair, I'd like to pull item number four.

Item number four.

All right.

Um if no commissioner was to pull any other items, may I have um uh Commissioner Fetcher, you want to recuse right now?

Yes, I'll turn my uh camera and phone off.

Oh, you pulling item four so that he could for his recusal?

No.

So he will just recuse from the vote on consent, and then we will um well he doesn't have to, I guess, just when we get to four.

Okay.

He doesn't have to recuse.

Jeff, you can stay on.

Okay.

Can I have a um motion on the balance of the consent agenda?

Mr.

Chair, I'm gonna attempt to make a motion to accept those items on the consent agenda.

Number one, number five, number seven eight and number eleven with all of staff stipulations.

Second.

Thank you.

It's been moved and properly second.

Any further discussion?

May I have a roll call, please?

Mammon.

Savino.

Aye.

Mazuka.

Aye.

Group.

Aye.

Cervantes.

Yes.

Fetzer.

Aye.

And Gibbs.

Aye.

Motion carries.

Motion carries, thank you.

Commissioner Savino, did you mean to include item number 11 in your motion?

She did.

Okay.

Okay.

Good.

Um if you're on the consent agenda and your address is 414 Navarro, 217 Arden Grove, 1841 East Houston, 430 Austin.

And 328 West Ellsmere Place.

Your case has been approved and you do not need to stay for the remainder of this hearing.

If you have any questions, please contact a member of staff or your case manager.

Your certificate of appropriateness or commission action letter will be prepared and emailed to you within 10 days.

Item number two is 235 East Commerce.

It's also addressed as 234 River Walk.

Uh the applicants, Christina Berlinga and Don McDonald are here in person.

Thank you.

Please step up to the podium, please.

Please state your name, sir.

I'm Don McDonald.

I'm the architect on 235 East Commerce.

Um we're involved in this project because we think that there's incredible potential for this stretch of the river walk.

Generally, we've been inspired by what's happened in at the along the river walk uh due west of here in the stretch between St.

Mary's and and the canal.

And I think along that stretch of the river, there's Hogmans, there's the Esquire, there's Tokyo Cowboy, Otro, there's a whole series of restaurants on multiple lever levels, both along the river at intermediate terraces and terraces that are 20 or 30 feet off the ground.

And if you've explored any of these places, they've been phenomenally successful.

And and by successful, I mean we take people, I live here in San Antonio, and we take people downtown for those experiences, for those spatial experiences.

And our goal with this particular restaurant is to extend some of that vocabulary to this block of the river.

If someone walks along this stretch of the river, it's it's so successful that you can't even move during a nice day along the river walk.

And our goal is is to extend the the street uh level here into the river walk.

Right now there's a big four-foot retaining wall that severs the river walk uh from the street above it.

We think that we agree with Makara, this is potentially one of the best streets in the city.

But uh in the late 19th, late late 1900s uh uh the street was raised and and uh there was a basement extended from all of these buildings in order to in order for the pro the city to reclaim property along the river walk between the river walk and the center of the river.

In the process, the street got raised, and it essentially a large lid was was dropped onto the top of this.

It's the reason if you go on Google Earth and look at this stretch of Crockett Street.

Uh this time of day it's incredibly hot.

Pedestrians don't use it, and um, and in the evening, uh there's there's homeless people camped uh along one end of it.

There's charter buses uh uh with the Aztec, and and there's carriages lined up on in any given weeknight.

And we just feel like there's incredible potential on this little stretch of the city, and it's a unique opportunity.

There's no other place where there's a street that parallels the river this way.

And and we'd like to see the the again the pedestrian traffic on the river walk extend up into the city blocks, and we've explored different ways, stairs and elevators, but but we think more than anything, we have an existing elevator we're tapping into.

There's a stair being proposed to link Crockett Street to this particular structure.

And so and so um this is where we're at today.

We've had over a dozen meetings with uh maybe four or five of them with different city uh uh groups, and uh and and responded to everyone's kind of in interest or concerns.

And we've had uh we had one opportunity to meet with Macar at next uh Dort and uh and their primary request was that we find a way to shield it from one room that is adjacent to the hotel.

And uh you can see the balcony right here to the right.

I don't know that's image is in here, but but what we did in response was we came back and that what you see differently on this image from what you saw in the previously uh submitted drawings is vines.

And and so what we did is extended planters along the lower edge of the balustrade where we'll put uh trumpet vines or something that is really durable and really hardy, and there's six very large containers so that they'll um hold up and uh and and and not have to be dependent on sprinkler systems, although they'll be watered, but but we just want to be sure these vines hold up long term.

And the idea is to put Lady Banksia, just a real dense vine that'll last for a hundred years on the roofscape, so that that anyone viewing the structure from up above, because we think that the view from above is as important as the view from below.

Uh we'll we'll see just uh a green swath of of vines and foliage.

Right now, looking out across here, it's it's just reflective heat during the day and horses, horse carriages lined up in the early evening.

And so our our goal is to activate both Crockett and some of these these spaces up above it, and that's that's really where this is coming from.

We haven't, other than the presentation, we haven't had a chance to have any conversations with Macarr.

We were told that that uh any response would come through their corporate office in Dallas.

And so today is the first uh conversation we had with them.

So again, with all the other neighbors, we've been a lot of discussion.

Uh there's been a lot of adjustments made to uh accommodate that.

And and I think that that the vines are are are good not just for the hotel but but for the structure as well.

I think that that west sun that that that this time of day that starts hitting that that building, I think we can mediate, and I think in reality we're showing the Lady Banks she has suspended off the roof is is just kind of you know tastefully dropping down three or four feet, but we think that you could create a really nice veil that would buffer and green up the view from that one room.

I think we have some images, they may not be in this deck, um, from one of Google Earth's images from the hotel room that shows how that perspective would be how you'd see.

So I think in some cases there's a whole potential audience of people that would love that engagement uh and and bringing that life and vitality uh and humans up to up to Crockett Street.

So that's that's where we're at today on this.

I mean, we're we're here because we think there's a great potential to kind of re-invigorate the river walk and more importantly, uh the streets around the riverwalk downtown.

Thank you, sir.

Please stand by for questions.

Commissioner Cervantes.

Yeah, I've got a couple of questions very quickly uh for staff, just uh kind of draw draw our memory and put it on the record.

When we saw this last, uh what was the ultimate uh vote on this and the details that we mentioned?

Just keep it quick.

You don't have to get into a lot of details of the last case, but just where did where did we leave off?

We we left off with a request.

It's for staff.

Oh.

It received conceptual approval.

We see conceptual approval, any stipulations?

Yes, there were there were a few stipulations.

Um there's uh there should be a finding in the findings of fact that uh outline conceptual review.

I kind of wanted them out there for the record real quick, but is it is it a lot?

Hold on, let me do it in the two minutes.

Uh yeah, let me see if they're in here.

Yeah, real quick.

And before you do that, um I'm hearing someone's cell phone.

I start to silence your cell phone, so please check your phone.

And if you have your phone is not on silent, please do so now.

Thank you.

So uh I'll read finding B.

Uh this request received conceptual approval from the Historic and Design Review Commission on February the 5th, 2025, with the following stipulations.

One that the sidewalk lift should feature a door element that lies flush with the sidewalk grade, two that all composite or synthetic material should feature profiles that relate to traditional materials while not including faux textures, and three that all elevator materials relate to those used in the proposed deck and be complementary of the river walk.

Thank you very much.

Now, sir, um how do you respond to the comments that the presenters here, your neighbors just made uh with regards to noise, obstruction of view, you know, changing the the the um it it it is a big change, I understand that.

And and and I understand uh people being apprehensive about any change.

But but but after and and the request from the neighbors to us was to spend more time on Crockett Street, which we did.

We went back and at different times of day, spent time on the street to see uh what we felt could be done to improve on it, and it just reinforced our concern that Crockett Street was was underutilized and and and could be a better pedestrian environment in its relationship to the river.

So uh the big shift for us has been to mediate privacy concerns by greening it up.

Uh obviously there is noise levels that will have to be maintained, and and and I think there's ordinances in place that control that you commissioners have any other questions for this applicant?

Um Mr.

Uh Chair, I do have a question for the applicant, and I'm glad this was polled um if not for my question on the rooftop, on the very rooftop that is an impervious roof, correct?

It it is a solid roof with the with a dense vine up there because of the density and birds.

We have said let's just address that now.

And and so it's now solid roof deck.

And how much it still has the articulation above the support beams.

And how many square feet is it?

I don't know, Christina.

Do you know?

Two, four, six hundred or it's significant.

It's it's significant.

My question is, what happens to rain?

How is rainwater being handled?

Rainwater will it it cannot be dumped into the river, so it will have to be directed down to the street and into the street drainage.

How so?

How from the rooftop does it get down to the public right of wear?

It it it will either have to flow off the edge onto the into the curbs along the gutters, or downspouts will have to direct it down, in which case we would be directed through the elevator.

Okay.

And do you have downspouts in the in the design in the drawings right now?

We do not have downspouts right now.

We're we're we're st there are some things like that that we are identifying.

But that's a really good question.

Yeah, I think that's part of it.

And equally for pedestrians, I mean, the sidewalks and all that.

So that's uh yeah, that's a really good point.

We've done that in different ways, and there might be a low level where where you have spigots strategically dump, and then for overflow it may go to a more major downspout.

But uh it's a good question.

Yeah, because as we are looking to reduce the number of nuisances for neighbors as they see it, nuisances or changes or obstructions, um, how we're handling rainwater is a huge one over there as well.

100 percent agree.

Yeah.

Um to the comment by the the neighbor of the massing and the size and just the overwhelming um presence of this, albeit wood, uh very grassle, slender steel and plantings.

Um other ways that the rooftop could be lightened up, made smaller, made um partially um transparent or uh we we we've done this several times in uh specifically along the river walk.

And because of birds and and and so on, we within two years we get a request to come back and find a way to cover it.

And so that's why we said let's put a dense vine up there and just be proactive on that.

And so uh and so we have really soft lighting at night that bounces up onto the ceiling, no direct light, so anyone looking up towards it.

And and and the idea there's a the oldest vine in in the United States is a Lady Banksia in Arizona.

And so it's just a good durable plant, and it's we wanted something that didn't uh wasn't a patronizing gesture, and something that was dense and almost like a tree.

The biggest challenge will be to keep it out of the oak tree to the east of us.

There's a great oak tree that that mediates our relationship to the east.

But but but so this the intent is that the the vine will cascade much more like the rendering than this over the east, the west side of the structure.

Okay.

I do have another question, but I want to let my colleagues have a chance to.

Thank you.

Other questions from the commissioners.

I don't have a question, but I do have a comment.

No, you can guys up with your question.

You're gonna come up with your comment.

Sure.

I was on the site visit, and I and I like the design.

I thought it was airy, but I'm inclined to say no because of the uh neighbors.

And I don't know if having a vine on the side is enough.

You might consider having some kind of light wood.

Can I go?

There's nothing you can do about the fact that it's there.

But you can mitigate the sound by having perhaps where it meets the building closer to have that a little higher and more violence.

Something I I do feel that those balconies that are right next to you are going to suffer from having noise.

And just the same.

Sorry, Mr.

Chair.

I don't know if it's me, but I cannot hear anything from the room.

Sorry, I I started gesticulating with my hand and stopped the the microphone.

There's Italian in me.

Um I had said that the uh that there's nothing you can do about the size, that's a problem, but there is something you can do about the sound, and I suggested maybe raising that area of the balcony, the wall part of it, and maybe having wood on the inside, not on the outside, and vines on the outside, but maybe having it a little taller so that that might mitigate sound even more so.

I I I think that's a reasonable response.

That's what we we've had a lot of discussions with neighbors about various concerns, but we've not had the opportunity to have any of these discussions with the neighbors.

So I think that would be something that would merit dialogue.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Sir, I have a question.

Um I just as um Commissioner Savino mentioned, I'm I too am glad this item was pulled because I was going to pull it as well.

And um of the things that stuck out to me, and I'm I'm also going to have um one of the um opposing speakers um to respond to this question as well.

But you mentioned um that you haven't had any contact with Macara, and and when you attempted to do so, that the response was that you their responsibility come from the corporate office.

So you're saying today is the first time you've heard.

Out of maybe a half dozen attempts to contact them, they responded once and and we were offered a meeting.

We met with them maybe within the last six to eight weeks, and and did some drawings to in response to that meeting, but but had no follow-up and in attempting to contact them, had no additional follow-up.

So that's what I'm saying.

The the corporate response came out today.

So with every other neighbor, there's been a lot of dialogue, but we didn't have the opportunity to have this dialogue with the neighbor.

Got you.

So I have another question for you, but I'm gonna ask that you sit down for a moment and I'm gonna have one of the opposing speakers come up to answer um to respond today.

Can have a seat for a moment, please, sir.

Uh thank you.

The first time we found out about this was when it was the sign was posted for the first hearing.

So no one ever reached out to us.

We were never approached.

We didn't know what was happening until the first hearing happened.

And then February, I think.

Um and I've we've met with them twice so far uh and seen the drawings and talked about them and let them know our objections.

Okay.

Thank you, sir.

Appreciate you.

You can come back up, please, sir.

My second question um was brought up by another commissioner, and I wanted to, I didn't really get your response on this, or it wasn't clear to me.

So um the speakers, the um opposing speakers had mentioned about violating the noise ordinance, and then you had made a comment in your um your statement that you know their course guidelines and and um on the ordinance.

So have you thought about you know minimizing or how you can minimize that?

Because I'm I am sensitive to the Makara and when they talk about the noise coming from something that hadn't been there before, you know, now impacting their guests who you know come for you know peace and quiet and things that nature.

So have you thought about that?

Um about how you can mitigate that?

Well uh I expect at some point we'll bring an acoustician into the project.

But but but uh I know that's a big concern up and down the river walk.

And and I I we we know that that's something that we're going to have to respond to.

And and so we've got to meet those standards.

And and and yeah, there are various ways of doing it, whether it's it's it's with simple screening or whether or not it's some sort of a partition wall or or something.

But but but it it sort of works because of the Western Sun exposure.

Uh it it I think this works for both parties.

It works for the terrace and it works for Makara.

Thank you, sir.

Um there are no other questions by the name of Commissioners.

Can I have a motion, please?

You have a question.

I have another question.

Yes.

Uh regarding the neighbors that you spoke with, I'm assuming these are along Crockett Street.

Right.

Um of the different properties, how many different properties did you uh talk to?

This is one, the Makara is one.

Yeah, it's been with different people within the office, but but we've talked with two or three, and and there's only been one other that's been vocal, and and that's been the primary conversation.

Okay.

Okay.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Well, um, I move to disapprove.

I'll second.

Property second discussion, sir.

So I'm taking a lot of my cues from the neighborhood, right?

I'm I'm talking about what they're going to hear.

I'm taking my cues from what people are going to see.

Um, what kind of obstruction you're going to have?

Um and I don't think that fits with the overall aesthetic of where you're trying to put this.

Now I do commend the the effort you're putting in to try and liven things up to try and extend the experience.

Um but they I think and I think I might have said this the last time this came up.

I I don't think that is appropriate for the river walk as we have it and as we're trying to keep it uh historic.

Um does that mean that you can't build something?

I I yeah, you know, I don't know.

I think it's it's just uh, you know, you you your design uh and architecture kung fu's got to be really strong to squeeze something in there, you know what I mean, and make it fit historically and make it fit uh uh uh uh uh the aesthetic that's already there.

Uh and it is very challenging.

I don't think that this is it as it sits as the way I see it.

Thank you.

Commissioner Group Thank you.

I will uh not be supporting the motion.

Um I think some of the reasoning behind the motion is not outside of our um we have to look at the guidelines.

I appreciate the applicant also working and coming up with some suggestions and is aware of some of the reasons that it could uh potentially have.

I any restaurant will create that news as well.

Um I do believe that Crockett Street also needs some activation, so you know, are the staff recommendations?

I um I will not I will be opposing this motion.

Thank you.

Did you have something sorry?

Okay.

There are no more comments.

Um may I have a roll call, please.

Ma'aman.

Savino?

Nay.

Ms.

Uka?

Nay.

Group.

Nay.

Cervantes?

Yes.

Fetzer.

Aye.

And Gibbs.

Nay.

Motion fails.

Motion fails.

May I have a new motion, please?

Mr.

Chair, I would like to make a motion to approve the request will out with all of staff stipulations, and with an added stipulation that the applicant work with the adjacent neighbor, Macari, during the C D phase or the D D to C D phase to further explore mitigation for their concerns.

And with an added stipulation that the applicant work with the adjacent neighbor, Macari during the C D phase or the D D to C D phase to further explore mitigation for their concerns.

And include Yes.

Leave it at that.

Second.

It's been moved and properly second discussion.

Yeah, I just think there's a lot of a lot of loose ends, right?

And a lot of things that can be done.

Yes, I I am truly concerned about the size and the ominous presence of this.

And that's just my concern, but I would hope there would be ways to mitigate that for the benefit of your neighbors, the acoustic concerns, obviously, the water as well.

And looking at the plans, I'm not getting a clear sense of the public circulation pattern as it relates to the elevator that is public and where it goes and how the public moves around the property on the street level also.

And making that accessible to the public as it is now.

So those are features that you and your team would address.

Oh good points.

And that's um I I yeah, I feel like the changes is dramatic.

Um I have um confidence that your team can um work very productively with with all of those concerns and those obstacles.

Okay, appreciate it.

Commissioner Cervantes.

Yeah, just a quick question.

I want to maybe try and see if I can get a stipulation there.

It may it may be something we can't do, but you you said explore with the neighbors.

Uh can you clarify that one more time?

Um uh continue to work with the neigh adjacent neighbors on their concerns.

Um with results.

Okay.

Right.

Okay, yeah.

I guess what I was gonna ask is if you can give them input, in other words, as part of the stipulation, not just explore and do a paper drill, but have them.

Work with them and give them input.

Sure.

I think you know you know how to um.

But they are a very, very important component on that block.

100% agree.

Yeah.

Thank you.

Any other comments?

Um Sir, I'd like to also um just reiterate.

I mean, is it it's not been beaten at that, but I mean, but it's been uh enough said, you know, concerning the Makara.

Um I think that it was it would definitely serve your project well as well as you know your neighbor that you'll be dealing with that we really really should work with them, you know.

And like I said, I'm I'm it's already been said, but I just want to reiterate that it I think this is extremely important um with um as I mentioned, hotel guests, you know, they come, you know, a lot of them come for peace and quiet, you know, and things of nature.

And then if I understand it's downtown.

I mean it's gonna be noisy and things that nature, but you know, if when you're adding an additional item to this, you know, next to a an I uh neighbor that has been there for so I mean century, you know, it it it can be or appear to be kind of intrusive.

So I just want you to continue to work with them, and I know you say you would, and um I trust that you will do that.

Definitely.

Sorry, um, sorry.

Yeah, uh Chair, thank you.

I just had a comment and possible question for staff.

With with these stipulations, they seem pretty significant in that conceptual design change.

Are we gonna I need to re-review what what is come to terms between the applicant and neighbors uh yeah, so um the applicant's requesting a certificate of appropriateness with the stipulation that's been added, um the applicant would follow up with staff.

We would review any changes if there's a significant change that we feel is not in keeping with the approved design, then this may come back.

But in most cases, it's reviewed and approved at the staff level.

Thank you for that.

Thank you.

Yeah, just commission.

Yeah, Mr.

Chair, even with the stipulations, I'm gonna say I I will not be voting for this.

I think that this is just kind of an eyesore.

Um and I know that the guidelines are there, the guidelines are not laws or rules, they're guidelines, and we take each case at an individual basis and we see how it looks for the greater good of the block or the environment there.

So I will not be supporting.

I'm glad that my fellow commissioner did put a stipulation to kind of give some skin in the game to your neighbors.

That's what I wanted, at least if this is going to go forward, but I will not be supporting this.

Thank you, sir.

Appreciate it.

All right.

My only Okay, sir.

My only comment is that it's important that there be a team or a point person at the hotel to have these conversations.

Sure.

Commissioner just to to address that really quickly sir.

Thank you.

There have been more conversations than was mentioned.

And it's not a problem with communications from the hotel or uh with the architect um you have to get the ownership engaged too.

And so I really appreciate the um the the condition that they work with us but at the end of the day it has to be enforceable in some way.

And so I just don't see how it really changes the game where they they've already rejected and not made any real changes to address the concerns so when it comes to that sir um when we're suggesting that we work with the um to make sure that you know your concerns are addressed we're we're you know acknowledging you know your concerns and we want them to make sure that they're sensitive to that and make sure that they can work with you as either as much as possible.

I mean I in the end of the day you know I don't think anyone here is going to be a hundred percent happy you know with what they what they're getting here.

I mean because I mean he has um as architect you know they're building the structure you know they want to have that and then they want to also um be good neighbors I was I would assume so they want to make sure that they're doing the good on the right thing so I think that's in the conversation that you have if you're still not happy or you feel as though there are things are not going you are you always had the option and had the right to come back to the hearing and and further address that because we know it's been stated here today and then if you feel as though it's not happening or they're not working in good faith with you please come back to that all right thank you everyone for your comments and input um may I require please ma'am Savino aye Mazoka aye group ayez no Fetzer aye and Gibbs.

Aye motion carries motion carries thank you item number three please up next is item number three four thirty five Donaldson uh the applicant Mr.

Jeffrey Stromberg uh is joining us by phone uh Mr.

Stromberg uh to speak via phone uh to unmute you may need to go ahead and push uh star six I believe is what you need to hit uh commissioners I can uh if there are questions until Mr.

Stromberg gets unmuted and is able to uh give feedback um I can try to answer questions as best I can um we as staff have had uh uh back and forth um dialogue with the property owner for probably the past uh six or so months about this house it's a pretty unique house that's got some significant structural issues uh so um if there are any questions I can answer those uh also uh commissioners uh Savino Fetzer and Mazooka attended a design review committee site visit last Wednesday uh they could also potentially provide uh feedback or answer any questions commissioner group has her hand raised and so does Fetzer.

All right Commissioner Group go ahead well I had some questions just because the sound was really really bad and I couldn't hear half of what the voicemail was saying from the neighborhood association but I did get something about some lack of details in the plans I guess it's how the columns are going to be built I don't know if somebody can detail that if it's not in the stipulations I would suggest adding some the request from the neighborhood to the stipulations yes and Commissioner Group the letter that's in your packet um is well actually you're virtual so I'm a packet sorry um well I believe the comments just to summarize um there were a couple things that were brought up why weren't metal straps proposed instead of the the rebar concrete columns um this was what was recommended by the applicant's engineer on the job um and there was probably a question for the detail of the footings I believe um but again I'm you know that is something that would be worked out with the engineer thank you for the clarification okay I have no further correct any additional stipulations there thank you thank you commissioner fesser yes I was on the the side visit and we did discuss the significant detailing on the how on the house and um my understanding is that they are um working with the structural engineer to minimize the width of these pilasters as they wrap the corners that they would not interrupt or obscure any of the windows or arches and the

Yes, I was on the side visit, and we did discuss the significant detailing on the how on the house.

And my understanding is that they are working with the structural engineer to minimize the width of these pilasters as they wrap the corners, that they would not interrupt or obscure any of the windows or arches.

And that the uh pilasters would only go up.

They would not go up to the uh entire parapet height.

They would stop short of that based on what the structural engineer recommends, probably a couple of feet short of the parapet, and then the plyblasters would have a cap on them uh that looked similar to the inside of the house.

And so we were and the owner was uh and contractor were in agreement with all those all of our concerns.

There was also a concern about the finish on the plaster that would go on the pilasters uh in order to uh show that these pilasters are not original to the house.

Uh the existing texture is is a fairly rough stucco texture, and so what was discussed was for the new pilasters to have a smooth finished plaster finish so that um in the future if anyone uh when someone is studying this house, they can tell that these pilasters are not original and are not trying to um you know fake their history.

Thank you.

Thank you, sir.

Has the applicant joined yet?

Uh he he's on.

Mr.

Stromberg, um, can you hear us?

Um and can you try to say something and um maybe hit star six to unmute?

I don't see him anymore.

Give me one second.

We I gotta move them back to panelists.

Mr.

Stromberg, can you on your keypad hit star six?

That's how you there you are.

Hello.

Yes.

Um thank you very much.

I appreciate this opportunity.

Um unfortunately I am uh in the midst of recovering from COVID, which was not not good timing on my part.

But anyway, I'm happy to have the opportunity to participate here.

I'm not sure which Commissioner put his case to actually my questions were answered in in the the other questions that we had here just a few minutes ago.

So I pulled it because I had some questions, but the fellow commissioners that went there and and gave the data answered my question.

So I I don't have any questions.

If you want, I can make a proposal or make a yeah, please, sir.

Yeah, motion.

Uh I move that it's approved with staff stipulations if if that's what the um applicant is good with.

I'll second.

Further discussion.

Have a roll call, please.

Mammon.

Aye.

Savino.

Aye.

Mazooka.

Aye.

Group.

Aye.

Cervantes.

Yes.

Fetzer.

Aye.

And Gibbs.

Aye.

Motion carries.

Motion carries.

Thank you, board.

Thank you.

Thank you, Mr.

Stromberg.

Uh, up next is 250 East Grayson.

Uh, the applicant, uh, Tammy Hernandez uh should be joining us virtually.

And Mr.

Chairman, this is Jeff Fetzer.

I am recusing myself from this case.

Thank you, sir.

Um, I will uh maybe lead off as staff.

Um there were comments about uh site plan and specific details as well as uh tree removal.

Uh and while um outside of heritage trees and trees at the top of the river bank, uh we as staff don't directly have purview over tree removal.

Staff also had the concern about where certain things are going, the impacts.

Um yes, this is within uh private property, but one of our stipulations was that a detailed site and landscaping plan be submitted.

Uh and we are um awaiting that as a stipulation of final approval.

Okay, I did have a question for the applicant.

Yes.

Are they here?

So I have a caller starting in 816, and I'm not sure if that's Tammy or not, but caller if you could um hit star six and identify yourself that way we know.

Hello?

Hi, who is this?

Hi, this is Blaine Towns, and uh I I'm the one who put in the application.

Okay, great.

Uh we're the we're the ones doing the Yeah, we're the ones doing the mini golf.

Um and there's also a John Paul who's on there.

I think he's trying to get unread muted, but okay, I got it.

Um we are we are not yeah, we are not touching any of the trees.

Uh we're leaving the the trees exactly as they are right now.

Correct, yeah.

I just they just got me unmuted.

So yeah, John Paul, uh blame my business partner.

I think somebody came on earlier.

We've been recommended for approval with all up on further kind of site, um a little more in-depth y'all needed that was currently submitted.

Uh I think somebody came on earlier that lived nearby was worried about the cypress trees.

We love those cypress trees as well.

Um, you know, of course, going into the river valley, and of course, obviously offering great shade.

Um as far as the palm trees being inputted, that'll be on the left side of the cistern.

Um on the other side.

Which is currently kind of like chopped up concrete area, if you will.

Okay.

Um Mr.

Chair, that was my primary concern is to confirm with the applicant that the t trees that are existing remain in place.

Absolutely.

Yeah, we'd love them too.

Um we will just only be enhancing and adding on to the landscaping there.

And it won't be the palm trees, of course, won't be going where the current trees are.

Of course, those native Texas bombs.

I'll make all right.

Make a motion, please.

Okay.

Mr.

Chair, I'd like to make a motion to accept the applicant's request with staff stipulation.

Um to let's say staff recommends approval based on the findings A through D with the stipulation that final site and landscape documents showing the preservation of existing Cypress trees be submitted to OHP staff for review and approval.

Second.

Thank you.

It's been moved and properly second.

Any further discussion uh just with the lack of a dimension, fully dimensioned site plan and um notation.

I think it's just cautious of us to include this sort of information.

I agree, thank you.

Any further discussion?

May I have a roll call, please?

Mammon.

Iveno.

Aye.

Hi.

Group.

Aye.

Cervantes.

Yes.

And Gibbs.

I motion carries.

Motion carries.

Thank you.

Good afternoon.

Uh the applicant is here in person.

Uh Mitzi Sandel.

Let me see if you'd like to come up here for the Mr.

Chair.

I just had a question for staff.

That's the reason I pulled it.

Sure, go ahead, Matt.

So the neighborhood asked for um there was a lack of photos on the inside.

But one of the stipulations is that they do the uh the whole plan, salvage plan and all that.

So I'm assuming you're gonna get inside photos, they have to present that before demolishing.

That's correct.

Okay.

So I don't have any further comments, just wanted to make sure that was included and I'm ready to make a motion.

Okay, which question?

Um I also wanted to pull this.

I think there are a number of us who wanted to pull this case.

Um the um staff you can confirm that the house or the ADU or the accessory building is contemporaneous with the original house.

Is that correct?

Yes, it it shows up at the same time on the sample.

Yes, that's correct.

Okay.

And what is the condition of the house to the applicant?

Is it like the house is structural?

Ma'am, before you speak, state your name, please.

I'm Mitzi Sandel.

I'm the owner of the house along with my husband.

Um the house, the ADU specifically, is um it's just structurally unsound.

All wood is rotted, the roof um is caving in, all the rafters are rotted, the shingles have come off the roof.

Inside the sheet rock is fallen down with insulation coming through the roof.

Um none of the electrical or water, gas, anything like that is working and is in not in good condition.

The foundation is cracked.

Um it's kind of just leaning.

And so at this point, it's not it's it's really uh a safety concern for us.

We've really kept up with the inside of the house, the front house very well, refurbished the hardwood floors, kept the bathrooms in the deco style, really kept it true to the neighborhood, but the back house just is not salvageable at this point.

Okay.

Um what kind of plans do you have for that location in your on your property if it were to be demolished?

We are lot we've had renters in it previously.

I own several homes in the area.

Um we were trying to sell it.

We've had it on the market for probably since September, and we've cleaned like cleaned as best as we could in the back house, kind of repaired some sheet rock to make it appealing to people to that they could do a remodel.

And the comments that we've had is just that it's either scary or it's too much of a financial responsibility for people, they don't want to come in.

And every comment we've had from our that the feedback from our realtor is that the ADU is just not a project that anybody is willing to take on.

And it's not a place that I feel like I could continue to reinvest in and put renters in because I don't want to put anybody's safety at risk.

The roof has now fallen in, especially with the large amount of rain that we've had.

It's taken a big toll in the structural integrity of the roof itself.

Okay.

I would um I'm cautious about being supportive of uh a request to demolish something without seeing without seeing the interior photos, which you would have to provide.

Um but I as well as not having a a follow-up plan if the building is not imminently in danger of falling.

So my question to you would be um would you be agreeable to uh allowing us to have a site visit?

Of course.

Okay.

And I can provide pictures to them tomorrow.

I'll go after this.

Yeah, I think um having a site visit for a couple of us or a few of us to to take a look at at it ourselves would be really helpful.

As long as you walk through there knowing your own your own peril if you walk through there and the roof falls on you.

Or just seeing the outside also, seeing other aspects would be really helpful.

Okay.

Okay, thank you.

So, Commissioner Groove, go ahead, ma'am.

Well, I just want to start this is economic hardship and not loss of significance.

So whether the building is falling or how it looks inside is a little bit not um what the applicant is asking, right?

Because this is demolition based on economic hardship.

Well, it's economic hardship because I have a home that I cannot rent.

I cannot sell.

I have a mortgage on.

I've invested in this community, but I don't have a hundred and fifty thousand to put into making this ADU.

I have a I've already put 40,000 into new floors and making the inside beautiful for somebody, but I can't continue to pay a mortgage on a house that I can't safely put a family in, and I cannot safely sell.

So it is economic hardship.

I'm I am physically the person paying that mortgage, not a company, not anybody else.

It's me.

It comes from from my husband and I's budget.

And so I can't rent it as it is.

I just I agree.

Thank you.

Uh Mr.

Chair would like to make a motion.

Go ahead, ma'am.

So I'm gonna motion to approve based on economic hardship with the staff stipulations.

Is there a second motion dies for a lack of second?

We have another motion, please.

Mr.

Chair, I'd like to make a motion to um allow the DRC, the design review committee, to make a site visit at the next opportune time.

And um what else?

What else do I have to say?

The next opportunity that is compatible with the owner's schedule.

Is there a second?

I'll second that.

Yeah, I just think just uh out of a you know, step of caution, let's take a look at it and uh see what the interior is like and I I have no doubt that you're having um issues with the marketing of it, the selling of it, moving it to another owner based on this.

I'm having issues with the safety of it.

The electric runs through the casita before it goes to the main house.

So if the casita falls or is damaged, then I have a risk of those are all things to the main house.

Those are all things we can look at and take the case.

It's not about so much marketing and my wish to sell it, it's also just not safe for the neighborhood.

Thank you.

I have a question for you, Commissioner Savino.

So um with the um the request that the applicant is making um due to economic hardship because she basically can't move forward.

Um so having a um DRC um to go take a look at the structure itself, you know, to see if it is basically where she says it is, and is I think it just have we considered that is this going to delay, you know, her her ability to move because if we have to have a DRC then to come back for the next hearing, and then you know, then you know we're we're up against this case again in a couple weeks if we have it just at the next hearing.

So just want to clear the.

Yeah, it's if it's um yeah, I understand that there's another month mortgage that I'm I'm out.

Yeah.

But this is primarily a business decision for you.

It's not, it's personal.

It comes from my personal checking account that I do every day.

It's not a it's not we're not a large company that owns several things.

This is my retirement, and this is what I have three houses there that my husband and I invested in.

So I wouldn't call it a business.

Is our retirement?

And every time that we are delayed, we will just another month that I'm I pay for it and I I you know I pay the electric bill, I pay the water bill, I pay the you know the the pest control, I pay everybody.

It's not a big company doing it.

It is economic hardship.

We rarely approve a demolition um like this without all of the documentation, especially with views on the inside, and almost always we make a site visit.

So when I was given 48 hours notice of some of these items, which I did provide, and I'll give you pictures this afternoon.

Than thank you.

I have a quick question and are we in question we're in we're in uh comments, right?

But I have a question.

Comments, yes.

The the power going to the casita first, is that alley have an address?

Is it is the casita have an address on that alley or is it it doesn't, but when I've had everybody look at it, they say the electric is bound to the casita and then it goes to the main.

And so like the electric meter is on the casita.

It's not on the main house.

That's odd.

Any staff any idea why that is?

Very common in our neighborhood.

Okay.

Um I uh yeah, so for the comment, I I definitely uh I do agree with Commissioner Groot about the hardship of it.

Um I will entertain going to see it, but at this point, uh I if if we come back here again, I think I will be supporting a motion like Commissioner Groot says, but uh I don't have a problem going to see it if we can do it quickly, staff, like within the next week.

It'll be next Wednesday morning, and then you'll be able to come to the next hearing on August 20th.

There we go.

That's two weeks.

I think that's you know, from preservation standpoint, that's probably a little bit of due diligence just to see.

I mean, I think I kind of know where it's going, but that's where I'm at.

Commissioner Group.

Yeah, just uh well, based on your comments around this.

I'm disappointed I didn't get a second on this motion.

This is economic hardship.

We don't get that many demolition requests that are actually have validated and she has provided type of work.

It is not our purview to decide whether her business is a business or investment or whether where the money comes from, it's outside of her purview.

She has demonstrated economic hardship in her package.

There's a salvage plan as a stipulation, which I think is super important.

And if the applicant has agreed to that salvage plan, I really also see this as being uh, you know, an economic hardship and nothing to do with whether there's integrity or you know, even you know, safety I think is a precaution.

Uh to your comment, Mr.

Cedamant, so all the electricity electricity come from the alley.

Um so it's very common that because probably this casita is the age of the house, so it first get the casita and then it feeds the main house, just how it was built.

A lot of uh most homes, I would say uh everybody that has an alley uh fed the electricity comes from the alley to the hanging wires also from the poles to the houses over structures, which is illegal, but that's how it is.

So brand following the thank you, Commissioner Groot.

I got a quick question for for the staff uh Mr.

Chair on this.

So is it possible and then on this?

I mean that we can approve uh demo uh and still stipulate that we do a site visit before it comes down completely just to kind of do our diligence.

Is that is that is that doable staff?

Repeat the question?

I don't think I understand is it possible to do an amendment where we approve demo, but pending a site visit just to kind of get the data, and if the site visit doesn't provide anything, I mean how would that work if just in the instance in the issue of time?

I mean I don't think it would work.

Okay.

Commissioner Groot, I'm sorry, I didn't process all the data until after we were talking more after your motion.

You couldn't undo the action that had already been done.

Right.

Okay.

Just know that when those permits are pulled and we're doing deconstruction, staff is already making that documentation.

I have one last question for staff.

Um conditions do you like to see replacement plans?

We request those pretty frequently, don't we?

Um the code says, and this is why there's confusion that we do not if the if there is new construction plan that we do not issue demolition of a landmark approval through permits until that new construction is also permitted, and that's to prevent vacant lots.

This is a little bit different because the code A doesn't get like uh anticipate that um that section would be applied to an accessory.

It usually is assuming that the primary is what's being demolished, but then B, there sometimes isn't a plan.

Sometimes there's a game on my cardship even without replacement, and so there's not a requirement, but sometimes we are reviewing them hand in hand when there is a replacement that's proposed.

Okay, thanks.

Thank you, everyone.

Um may I have a roll call, please?

Ma'am.

So can you state the uh motion again?

Restate the motion, please.

That um we uh have a DRC site visit at the next opportune date and time.

Thank thank you.

Roll call, please.

Saveno?

Aye, Mazuka?

Nay Group.

Aye.

Fetzer.

Aye.

And Gibbs.

Aye.

Excuse me.

Um, Cervantes.

Yes.

Motion carrying Mammoth.

She should get me at me first before the second question came in.

Yes, I have uh Commissioner Mammon.

I asked before uh Commissioner Mazuka asked his question.

All right, motion carries, thank you.

Item number 10, please.

Um 2027 West Woodlawn Avenue.

The applicant, Mrs.

Chase, is here in person.

Uh Mrs.

Chase, if you can introduce yourself to the commission, um, and they'll ask their questions and uh yeah.

Hello, Janelle Chase at 2127 West Woodlawn.

Yes, this is Commissioner Fetzer and I uh asked to pull this for some questions.

Um looking at drawing 18 specifically, which is the section showing the uh carport for the uh RV and the raised uh deck.

Um how tall is your RV?

Do you really need almost 16 feet for that RV?

I currently don't have an RV, it's just in anticipation.

I don't want to be limited or it's we're most likely gonna get a van, but um it's also to um just have a vantage view of the lake.

Okay, and then uh the other question is the second floor of this addition.

Um nine foot seems quite tall for a uh for an addition to a house of this style and and design?

Um we just went with what we have at our in our main house.

Um so it's it's just consistent with the interior of our primary structure.

So you have nine foot ceilings in your existing house?

Yes.

Okay.

You've met all the conceptual approval uh stipulations, but that those drawings that come at conceptual did not have any uh building heights and ceiling heights.

Um would you would you be willing to or consider dropping that ceiling height to eight feet or even dropping the plate height at the perimeter down to seven feet or seven six and then sloping the ceiling up inside the building up to get nine feet, uh but it basically slope at the walls, exterior walls just to bring the mass of this download.

I am I'm not a builder, sorry, I don't know what this means.

My mother-in-law can answer that better, but um I I don't I'm not a builder, that's not my uh expertise.

Um but we have put a considerable amount of money already into these plans, and going back to the drawing board cost more money.

Um I'm not against it, it's just we've we've already done a lot.

And we did I don't know if we provided it to you, um, but there are some uh views from the street and how it would um barely be visible.

I can get it on my cell phone if you'd like to see pictures of vantage points if it's not in the packet.

Uh we don't have anything in the in the submitted packet um showing that type of height, but if you have it on your cell phone, we can't.

Yeah, I can get that real fast if you don't mind.

If you'd like to see that yes, please.

Okay, hang on one second.

And then this is a question for staff.

Um are there other this is almost an accessory structure.

It's at the uh located at towards the back of the lot.

Um are there other accessory structures on this block that are two-story sure.

Um so it's kind of an interesting block.

Um I'm not aware of any existing two-story um rear accessory structures.

Uh, as the applicant noted early in discussions um before they came for conceptual review, and as noted by the Monticello Park Historic Group neighborhood group, the property is located within the FEMA floodplain, and so um there was consideration made about whether or not to keep it wholly detached or to attach it to the main structure and how to adhere to federal guidelines uh for new construction within those floodplains.

Um I short short answer is is that I don't believe that there is a two-story rear accessory structure, but the applicant has worked with their builder to accommodate those federal regulations about height and uh material and such at the first floor level.

Okay, and then two more short questions that were brought up by the neighborhood.

Um providing a drainage and water collection or or runoff plan to um keep that from any runoff going on to the adjacent properties.

Is that something you can provide?

I can answer that while I'm looking for my uh photos.

Um the stipulations on uh water runoff.

We are working with stormwater um and we have been, we're not against gutters.

Um my primary house has gutters, so that's um we're we're okay with that.

I just would rather default to stormwater's um recommendations.

Okay, and then uh the last question was uh removal of some windows where you're adding on.

Can those be salvaged and reused?

We won't be removing any windows, um, we're just adding on.

Okay.

Thank you very much.

Well, you're looking for their photo.

Um, Commissioner Group, I see you that you want to ask your question now or wait till she shows a photo.

Well, actually, I had a question um just to staff because yes, based on the comments from the neighborhood on the gutters, and I agree with uh applicant, you know, whatever the storm proposes suggest because I don't can we dictate where gutters go?

Is it even within our program?

Uh generally when we're looking at gutter installation uh for an application that comes in, uh the only stipulation that we can provide is that it match roughly the fascia height and that the color match, not necessarily the location unless it's uh going across like a gable portion, but um there's not really a mechanism within the guidelines that determines uh water runoff whenever they are uh getting their permit, uh that's when they work directly with stormwater.

Thank you.

Yeah, that was sex verification I wanted.

Thank you.

Commissioner Fetzer.

It's not I guess the color maybe make it darker or something.

Um check in a question Commissioner Group.

Yeah, it was probably also to Commissioner Fetzer's just um this is also a very big lot, and there's a lot of two stories on the other side just to staff.

Uh um I know she's coming up with pictures and the butt really um you also put in a findings that you find that within you know appropriate within because of the size.

So there's really not a concern from staff on that thing, correct?

That's correct.

We're recommending approval um and very quickly.

Uh very quickly.

So the applicants provided a um rough drawing of the perspective view of the proposed two-story rear edition uh from right of way.

Um Commissioner Fetzer on the screen.

I don't know if you can see it.

And there are some homes that are um single story with a second story ADU in the back in the neighborhood.

I can also um provide the addresses for those if you'd like to.

Well, since staff is recommending approval and commissioner group has described the immediate neighborhood.

Um you're working with stormwater with the city to uh contain runoff onto your property.

Um move for approval with staff stipulations.

Second.

Thank you.

So we moved them properly second.

Any further discussion?

Thank you.

May I have a roll call, please?

Mammon.

Aye.

Savino?

Aye.

Group.

Aye.

Cervantes.

Yes.

Fetzer.

Aye.

And Gibbs.

Aye.

Motion carries.

Motion carries.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Item 12 has been postponed.

That is the last case.

Thank you, everyone.

We are adjourned.