David, I think we can get started I would like to welcome everyone and call tonight zoning board meeting to order.

I'm David Stein, Chair of the Zoning Board, and it is 6 33 on January 26, 2026.

The members of the board and the staff are holding this meeting by Zoom video conference.

And the public is a public is in attendance both on video conference and by telephone.

I'd like to do a roll call of the board and the staff first.

Bill Morris.

Here.

Roseanne McManus.

Here.

Jerry Bozak.

Here.

And now for the staff, Benita Matter.

Here.

Okay.

The board's mics will be on throughout tonight's meeting.

Applicants' microphones will be on during the public hearing when their application is being heard.

However, I would ask applicants to please mute their microphones when not speaking in order to reduce background noise.

The first part of the meeting tonight is the public hearings during which the public will have an opportunity to speak.

Each member of the public will be muted until it is your turn to speak.

Here's the procedure for the public to let us know that you would like to speak.

If you came in through Zoom, please use the raise your hand function and you will be unmuted when it is your turn to speak.

If you called in on one of the Zoom telephone conference call phone numbers, please press star nine, and this will raise your hand, and then press star six to unmute when it is your turn to speak.

When members of the public speak, we ask you to please give us your name and address for the record and whether you are in favor of or opposed to the application.

The board requests that members of the public limit your comments to three minutes so that everyone will have a chance to speak.

If you're having a problem letting us know that you want to speak or you're not being heard or some other issue with speaking, please send an email to Vanita.

Her email address is V, as in Victor, V M A T H U R at Stamford C T.gov, and she will do whatever it takes to get you on.

You can find the agenda for tonight's meeting and the meeting applications and other materials by going to our website, www.stanford ct.gov slash zone.

For those people who are on tonight, um expecting that we would be getting to the applications, the two applications for 1150 Summer Street, which is the daycare center.

Um, those are not being heard tonight, and they are being continued until our meeting on March 9th.

So the two Summer Street applications are not being heard tonight.

First application we have is application 225-37, 5 Harbor Point Square LLC, Harbor Point Master Unit S5, AKA 0, Washington Boulevard No.

S5, General Development Plan, Site and Architectural Plans, and or requested uses in coastal site plan review.

Applicant is proposing to transfer 34,000 square feet of commercial floor area from block P7 to the property S5 to facilitate a new health and wellness use known as the Bath House.

So please proceed.

Good evening, everyone.

I hope you all dug out of the snow safely.

But we're here.

My office is in Stanford at 1055 Washington Boulevard.

I have uh my whole team back with me tonight, but I want to be sensitive about your time.

Um I know you have other matters before you, and we spent a lot of time with you uh on the fifth.

So when we left you on the fifth, you asked us for some additional information.

This included revisions to the site plan, incorporating the canopy over the bike parking and adjustments to the location of EV parking, lighting details, including an update to the photometric plan, incorporating all of the building lighting, details on the location of security cameras, and um renderings with closer views that better depict the proposed building facade details.

We also prepared a memo uh with referenced attachments responding in more detail to some of the questions that were raised by the board and members of the public.

Um I am happy to present any of this information tonight, all of this information tonight, um, or simply respond to any questions that you may have after reviewing it, whatever your preference.

Okay.

Um why don't we um go around the board?

I'm gonna uh start.

Uh one of the issues we raised was the uh design of the building and um the exterior design, and I continue to be concerned about that.

Um the uh regulations for SRDS uh do contain uh design criteria, and um I'm I just don't read that way I read them, it doesn't look like the the building um follows them.

Uh and I would just like to mention a couple of them.

Um, this is SRDS section five HH6.

Uh one of them says large expanses of blank walls shall be avoided on exterior walls of new buildings visible from public and publicly accessible spaces.

Um we've got large blank walls here, um, particularly on the back with no windows um or other design features, other than some very I think some very subtle um maybe um inundations.

Uh uh in F5, it says new building shall have a significant amount of transparent glass on the ground floor for non-residential use is running on public and publicly accessible spaces.

Um ground floor shall be designed to enliven the street and promote pedestrian scalable development.

Um I'm just I'm not seeing how this building does that.

Um and the third uh uh architectural design principle that that jumped out at me was uh F3.

Um new buildings shall be sensitive to the um surrounding neighborhood.

And I'm just not seeing how this um this these large blank walls do that.

Um so those are my comments on the building design.

Um before we um turn it back to you, attorney Feinberg, let's see if there's anyone else on the board who has any comments on the design.

Uh David, I agree with your concerns that you mentioned uh regarding design.

And I originally brought that up at our last meeting, and uh I agree with you totally.

Yeah, I think you were you would were especially concerned about the the back wall, as I remember, which the West, the West the Western Wall, correct, on the west side of the building, yeah.

That and also the uh which I assume we'll get to at some point, the lighting in that area also, how they improved it.

Yeah.

Um else.

Well, I would just like to see what other whatever um um presented tonight uh any of the changes made to the design.

As you two just mentioned.

Okay, Jerry.

Yeah, uh, I I know Lisa heard our feedback um or what our thoughts were.

So I'm really interested in hearing that feedback of those concerns that Bill brought up.

So uh I'll wait to reserve my comments.

Thank you.

Okay.

Good.

Uh Lisa, your uh Well, Mr.

Chairman, it sounds like uh it we would benefit from a brief presentation from the architect related to the design and sort of the design intent, and then we can circle back to some of those more uh specific comments that you made related to the regulations.

Does that make sense?

Sure.

I agree.

Yeah, sure.

Looking forward to it.

Okay, great.

Eugene, do we see Eugene?

And if you would if the architect would please um include in his presentation how the design um meets the design principles in our regulations.

I'm assuming that he had read them before the he designed the building.

Of course, Mr.

Chairman.

But I mean, I I'd like to address some of that because I think some of the language, you didn't you didn't necessarily complete the sentence.

There's language to the effect of to the extent possible.

Um these are guidelines, they're not hard and fast rules, as makes sense because I know some of you may disagree with me, but the the law is pretty clear when it comes to architectural design and the you know jurisdiction of a zoning board to influence architectural design.

So in this instance, you know, we did our very best to interpret those design guidelines within the the realm of the possible when it comes to a use like this.

So you may say that we have blank walls.

I would say that we have you know texturally diverse walls that have you know architectural interest that Eugene will walk you through there.

It's not just a large blank wall with nothing going on, but we we we have a very distinct use here that necessitates uh a lack of windows.

Um so I think that that's important to take into consideration.

Okay.

Um Mr.

Kolberg, I want to introduce yourself and um good good evening all.

My name is Eugene Kolberg, and I'm principal at Colbert Architecture, the architect for the project.

And I would like to run you through quickly some of the umdated uh images that we have um that were requested last time.

And we can, as I go through it, I'll highlight the um the windows, the lighting, um, and some of the other components that that we've hopefully clarified for you this evening.

I'm gonna share my screen.

Uh let me know if you can see it.

Yep.

All right, great.

Um, so where we left off last time, uh, we were describing the different um different elements of the buildings, the different volumes, different materials, and we produce updated um images that show up close what uh what our thoughts are and to uh to refresh your memory, we have three key materials.

One is a handcrafted uh long format brick, which is what you should uh you see here.

That's the bulk of the volume that faces uh Washington Boulevard.

Um, and the point of that is is twofold.

One is uh it is a handcrafted brick with a lot of texture.

Um, and it's also a material a little dissimilar from what's across the street, but where you are um using a material that is typical for not only this area, um, but carries a rich history in in the in the sort of the general um new England area.

We also have we highlight the corner, the entry with again a texture rich uh stone.

Um we've some of the design we based on some of the volumetric design, some of the textures we based on um some of the old uh quarries up stayed a little bit from Stanford over in Portland where brownstone used to be quarried, um, and the impact that that had on the building industry.

And we're trying to to um kind of reach to that and have some of that expression shown on on the facade.

That stone carries inside into the lobby and and some of the um expressions that we have inside.

And lastly, um we have the um on on the sides and in the rear, so north, south and and west, we have a textured cement panel um that varies um in kind of tone a little bit.

Uh you'll see some some up close references um to that, but back to the facade on Washington Street, we have large, we have a large expanse of glass at the entry, right?

So for reference, um, this is a double door, which is about seven feet wide, right?

Um, and then over in Washington, we have a large expanse of glass that faces onto our lobby, and we're connecting it to the street.

As architects, we always try and connect our buildings to the street.

We think it's our civil duty, not only uh, you know, following the the guidelines of the different municipalities that we work with, but also um, you know, as a as we're always trying to encourage walkability in cities, connection to the street, connection um to the surrounding area.

So that's something that we take uh that we we give a lot of importance to.

Um, and so here's a close-up of of that entry, right?

It's it's that you can see the different materials interacting, the overhang for the for the uh bike parking, which is close to the entry, um, and some of the detail on the north facade.

Again, everything that faces Washington Boulevard and and that kind of surrounding um frontage is the highly textured brick, um, which is of a similar color, it's a sort of beige beige brick to to the cement panels.

Any questions before I yeah, well, what's on the east side of the building?

I haven't seen that view.

That this is the east side right here.

Can we see the whole thing, please?

Uh I can I can dig up one of the images from last time.

Uh give me one second.

That the the that's showing the area that's directly on Washington Boulevard, correct.

Yeah, this is the corner.

So let me let me go to that for a second.

So that's the corner, right?

That's the over here.

This is the sidewalk on Washington, right?

And this is and this is our pedestrian entry.

So we're looking.

This is the south elevation, yeah.

And this is a portion of the east elevation.

Okay.

So let's see the this is the rest of let's see the rest of the east elevation.

I know you're showing us the corner.

Right, right.

We prepared close.

I haven't pulled up, Eugene, if you want me just to share real quick.

Uh, yeah, sure.

We prepared close-ups for this presentation.

Um, but yeah, Lisa, if you can pull it up if you have it handy, I'll stop sharing for a second.

The the the program that we have facing Washington.

Uh, so here you can see on the left side, right?

That's the um that's the floor floor to ceiling glass.

And then we have windows, um basically floor to ceiling windows on the rest of of the facade.

On the left side, we have our lobby and reception, right?

And the idea is that there's a connection to the street.

That's it indicates more amount of glass indicates where the public um is supposed to go in, especially there and around the corner.

And then on on the uh towards the north, we have the staff offices, um, where we still have full um floor to ceiling windows, um, but they're not a full extent to create a hierarchy so folks know what the what the public entry is.

So this is the east elevation, right?

That is the east elevation facing Washington, correct.

Okay, can we see the Atlantic?

Uh elevation.

Yeah, I can if you want to switch back to me.

Um Lisa, we have that.

Yeah, we have the updated view of that.

Okay.

Yeah.

So okay.

So this just before you go there, this elevation here is the north.

This is the south.

The south.

And it has other than the windows in the lobby, it's got no glass at all.

Correct.

Okay.

Um, show us the other.

Let's see the uh well, they they're gonna show us the updated version of that because that's not the final.

I don't think it's I don't think well, there's the question.

Did it change or did you just showing us more up more up close views?

We're showing more up close views.

There was no change in it.

Yeah, but it's easier to see the up close views.

Right.

Right.

But I I thought Roseanne, you said let's see there what they had changed.

Um, and I misunderstood you.

Yeah.

It's mostly because you couldn't see it from the previous images that we had seen.

So this is a close-up of the entry.

Again, Washington Street is on the right.

Uh floor to ceiling glass at the entry.

This is the north.

So you can see on the left the windows, floor to ceiling glass, both at the entry towards the rear over here, and then the offices and floor to ceiling glass at the offices.

This is facing north.

So the only glass on that side is the those three windows for the offices.

Correct.

Okay.

Is there another side?

Then right.

So this is the west side.

This is facing facing the the uh parking.

And this is this, the main amenity of the space, which is the pools and the thermal rooms and so on, are behind this facade.

So this faces away from the street.

So I Mr.

Colbert, I gotta ask you when you saw the design requirements of the zoning regs.

How is it that you came out with something that like this?

Because the zoning requirements, I believe, speak to the interaction and connection to the street.

And this facade, the north and the south face into our private property, which is the the uh the parking and the interaction with the street and the pedestrian activity, we're providing large expanses of glass that are floor to ceiling and and lit and complemented by landscape.

Um I guess I don't read it that way, and even the portions along the main streets.

Um I question whether that complies um any other comments from the board on this.

Well, the only comment well, what are the comments I have is that you know we're looking at a rendering, which has been perfectly shaded and perfectly lighted and perfectly made, so it's gonna look beautiful.

But if when you get in the real world, when you get out there on a day like today, it's not gonna look like that.

It's not gonna look anywhere near as good.

It's gonna look like a a long cement wall.

That's my opinion.

Well, along along Washington Boulevard, we do have that volume of brick, um, which for reference, um, this is uh uh you know close-up of that brick.

So it's a highly textured uh handcrafted brick.

Um and this is a so you said that was on Washington Boulevard?

This is on on Washington Boulevard, okay, on that phase, and the returns both on the north and on the south.

So I'm gonna go back to the rendering and and highlight those areas are right.

So this area here to about middle of the building is the brick, and then the entire face of obviously except the windows and the stone, right?

Is brick, and then on the so that's the entire expanse of Washington, and then about half of the expanse on the north side is brick.

Okay.

I have to ask where the regs say new buildings shall have a significant amount of transparent glass on the ground floor.

Do you think this is a significant amount?

I yes, I believe so.

At the entry, we have a significant amount of floor to ceiling glass, and and so that's at the corner, right?

And then about half of our facade has glass, one area, which is a large expanse, again, floor to ceiling, um, which indicates our kind of public space, and then the rest of the area, floor to ceiling, but with mindful privacy of offices that don't necessarily want pedestrian interaction, right?

The entire program is not a storefront that you want to highlight a display window like you would typically see in a downtown area.

Well, let's let's do this.

Give us please the square footage of the outer walls, and then what percentage is glass?

It because you said it's a significant amount.

Can you just give us the percentages?

I can come back to you with those numbers, yes.

Mr.

Chairman, if if you'd allow it, I'd like to ask Jordan to speak a little bit about the rationale for the lack of glass.

I mean, I I hear where your line of questioning is going.

That's not in it.

The rationale it is fine, but it doesn't change what the regs require.

I I strongly disagree with that.

The regs do not have a specific amount of glass that is required.

It doesn't say 80%, 90% of the wall needs to be glass.

It uses language like significant.

These are all guiding principles.

No, no, no.

Wait, the beginning, the intro says all developments with the SRDS shall conform to the review standards and the following standards.

Shall conform is the wording.

Yes.

And I'm telling you, I that we I believe that we do conform.

Well, that's what I want to know.

What percentage of all of the wall space is glass?

And then let's decide if we think that's significant.

Mr.

Mr.

Chairman, if I if I may, if you don't mind me speaking again, my name is Jordan Hummel.

I'm the vice president of real estate at Bath House, uh, including including this development.

We're uh under construction with eight developments nationally, you know, for our our our rollout.

Uh when you discuss um the the lack of glass, you know, this is a uh a a concept very specific to our use and and and health and wellness.

Uh so from a safety standpoint, if you uh if I can familiarize familiarize you with our our programming at all, the majority of the space, of course, on the ground floor is is amenity space, right?

You have pools, you have saunas, um, you know, um contrast therapy throughout, and our customers are in their their bathing suits.

So if you have glass, you you you're then uh it's really uh a safety and privacy issue.

Um and and that's the purpose, you know, for the the lack of glass, you know, for for our use.

So we we do not want to encourage voyeurism, we do not want to encourage we we want our customers to come into the facility uh to be able to have a restorative process and and not worry about being seen from the outside.

Um the majority of our customers are are also women.

Um it just would create an uncomfortable environment.

So the the purpose, I think to Eugene's point, right, where we tried to put as much glass um as we're able to given our programming and the specific use in which we we offer uh on that corner, right?

Which that corner is the the entrance lobby prior to the guests changing into their bathing suits.

Um and then the other glass panels there is uh a small backup house uh operations office that bathhouse will will have.

But if we were to put glass uh on the on the other parts of the facility, uh it it becomes a privacy issue.

And then if you're you're kind of darkening out the glass, it's less aesthetically pleasing as well.

Um, and and we create kind of our own world, right?

So the the thought process and and the way we create these spaces is somebody comes in um and they enter their own world and they're private and they're kind of tuning out the rest of the world, they're putting their phones in their lockers.

Um they do not have kind of access to the outside.

So um it's it's part of programming.

Uh I would uh as a couple analogies.

I would say if you were going to a physical therapist and you were getting treated, you know, at a physical therapist, you wouldn't have windows where people can see you from the outside getting treatment.

Uh I would also offer uh uh probably a uh a better analogy uh such that uh a theater, right?

If you go to a theater, you don't have windows in a theater.

Uh so we are very much in line with uh with with that concept.

Uh and and that's again, it's it's a it's a safety and privacy um reason more than it is um that that uh that that's really the the main uh important uh part to understand of our programming.

Okay.

I'll also add, and and Eugene's gonna get to this, but um I know uh lighting and and security, you know, was a was a concern.

You know, this building will be beautifully lit, uh, and and there will also be multiple um 24-7 surveillance cameras, you know, on the on the building.

So, you know, safety and security of all is is about most important to us, um as well as yeah.

24-7 cameras, will anyone be looking at them?

Yeah, they'll be in a live stream where people can can be monitoring, correct.

Yeah, what 24-7 or just a couple hours a day, what'll the monitoring be?

Well, our uh certainly certainly with our within our our uh business hours of operation, but now they have cameras where if something you know happens a lot of times, it kind of triggers something to you and you're notified of of of an activity on the camera.

So I'm I'm sure it would be along the lines of something like that.

Okay.

So you're saying that the reason for the the lack of windows and large expanses of blank walls is um because privacy and safety of our customers.

Okay, and you can't, but you could put in windows that can't be seen through, right?

Fake windows, you're saying or no, I've seen windows where you can't see through them.

You can see out, but you can't see in.

Um yeah, we we don't want so so in in none of our facilities um are there any windows where customers can see out.

So we don't we don't want our customers to feel a connection to the outside world, right?

The the thought process in our programming is that they are entering this world uh and and and not seeing the outside world.

I mean, similar similar to a movie theater, right?

Right, it's a it's an inward, it's an inward experience as opposed to having a connection, right?

We wouldn't want windows in a movie theater.

But it's an inward experience that doesn't meet our requirements.

Mr.

Chairman, I need to just go on the record to say that I believe again, we absolutely do meet the requirements.

These are not large blank walls.

There is movement all over these building facades, there's changes in building materials, and I understand that that's your interpretation of the regulation, but that is not our interpretation of the regulation, which is why a regulation that has such subjectivity just can't that's why I was asking.

Just give come back and tell us the percentage of wall that has glass.

Does it okay?

And then we can discuss whether that we think that meets our regs.

Eugene, are you calculating that?

I would I will have to come back with a with a specific number.

Okay, I suspect it's a fairly small percentage.

Um given percentage of the entire building or the percentage of the street facing facade.

It's fronting on public and publicly accessible.

So I'd say any parking areas are publicly accessible.

No, that's private property.

It's not a publicly accessible area.

That's private.

Sure it is.

You invite the public to come in and park.

That's not again.

I disagree with that interpretation of the regulation.

It's the public facing facade where there is a public sidewalk.

Okay.

Well, why don't you give us each side, the percentage on each side, and we can deal with that?

And you can note the ones you think are not publicly accessible.

Um other discussion on the this design issue and our regulations.

Is there umberg, is there any is it your position that our regulations are optional for these design guidelines?

Design principles, rather.

It's my interpretation that there is subjectivity in them, and it is my interpretation that any position that you take where you you say that this building should be denied because you don't think that it's designed properly is contrary to law.

Even though our regulations have certain requirements.

Yes, I am saying that.

And any interpretation that you take where you think where you where you suggest that you can turn down uh a permitted use because you don't think that the building is designed appropriately is contrary to law.

That is my position.

Okay.

So you're saying these regs you think are not legal?

To the extent that you use them to say that I don't have enough windows or that the walls are too blank.

Yes, to encourage certain design characteristics, fine.

We did that.

These are not encouraging, these say shell and form.

So you're saying that part is illegal.

I think it's illegal if you suggest that any that these buildings are entirely blank when there is movement all over them.

There's changes in materials.

I think that's a hundred percent subjective, Mr.

Chairman.

Okay.

Okay.

Could could we look at the parking lot side one more time?

Up close.

Sure.

That's the one on the west, and this is the one on the north.

Well, I'm mostly concerned with the west.

Can you go in as close to that as possible?

Okay, that's good.

I mean, I'm certainly not expecting windows here.

Um this is a closer.

This is a closer view.

Okay.

And we don't have enough space to add any uh landscaping along there to break it up a little.

Okay.

Well, if the building were set back a little more, yeah.

You would you're saying landscaping between uh where and where?

Between the cars and the building.

Gotcha.

So that it's not all white facade, and it would be broken up a little with.

I mean, it can be broken up in any ways.

It doesn't have to be windows.

We know there can't be windows here.

Um but windows aren't your only option.

We have on the um Lisa, I don't know if you can pull up the uh the current landscape plan.

Um, but the the parking spaces are broken up by plantings and trees.

Yeah, but that doesn't break up the um the plane facade.

The facade seems to have some color variation, some um some pattern, like I think it's a little bit more of a random pattern, but um could you zoom to the Benita?

I'm having trouble hearing you.

I don't know if it's my computer or you no, no, I was yeah, I was having trouble as well.

Um is there a detailed view of the no you're breaking up the meter.

Uh maybe I need to join my phone as well.

Um you have a sample of the material on you on the on a board.

I think it was part of one of the slideshows.

We have um we have a um a sample of a of previous of a previous project, right?

Using uh the cement board, cement panel.

So there is color variation, and the idea here is to break down that that volume in two ways.

One in the the size of the panels, right?

And introduce a cadence to do that design.

And then the other one is to have it usually it's either two or three um kind of tone variations within that, and the the panels are not smooth, they do have a texture which catches the light, whether it's artificial light or sunlight, a little differently.

But yeah, you can see here an example of what of what that looks like built, right?

So there's a handful of shades.

But that's not in our rendering.

Go back to the rendering.

Let's see if that's the same.

So we have the color variation between the panels, and in our case, the panels are larger because we have a larger space, a larger facade, but we do have the color variation to the degree that we can represent it on a on a rendering.

But it will look like that previous image you just showed us in terms of color variation, yes.

No, in terms of different than for this rendering.

Sorry, I missed the the first part.

I said that's very different than this rendering.

I mean, what the different design.

That's what we're seeing.

Color variations.

That's why we're showing the reference images, so you can actually see a built project and not a rendering.

Okay.

So why doesn't the rendering show the color variations?

We've showed it to the best degree that we can.

Um, but that's why we're providing uh a reference of a built project.

Both both for the the brick and for the cement panels.

Yeah.

Okay.

Would would you say that Dave before we go?

But these cement panels and you're showing in this building look totally different than the cement panels that are on the building which you're proposing because the wall's a lot bigger.

Isn't that not true?

They're different sizes.

That's because the walls look at it.

It definitely look like this rendering here.

Never.

The color variation.

Yeah.

Well, I don't understand.

Why can't you show it on a rendering then?

You can do whatever you want to the rendering.

Show what it'll look like.

You're not a designer, David.

No, but I've seen that we've seen enough rendering to know that if anything, they're usually overpromising.

This one is promising.

We don't want to overpromise, but that's why we provided the the actual photo of the color variation.

Well, I'd like to see it in the rendering.

Um, so that we know what it is where you're proposing.

Um at this point, it still looks like an expanse of blank walls.

Um, let me ask you a different question.

Would you how would you say this meets the requirement of um uh enlivening the street and promoting pedestrian scale?

We have the facades that face the street, we're enliveling by the use of both architecture landscape and we're providing texture rich materials.

Let's see this, let's see the street walls.

Is this a street wall?

So this so this a portion of the street wall is here.

No, the whole wall.

Lisa, would you mind pulling up the previous rendering?

Um stop sharing.

Just as a reminder, the western facade faces spray energy.

Right.

So on the landscape side, we're continuing similar plantings um along the boulevard.

We do have towards the entry the the large floor to ceiling glass.

The entry is also highlighted in the corner by the natural stone, and we do have on that entire facade the entire expanse of Washington Boulevard, and about half the building, half the depth of the building going towards the west on both the north and the south.

We have a highly textured handcraft brick product that we're using on the facade.

And because the building is not flat, obviously on the north and the south, we're we're taking those on the south where the entry is.

We're taking the glass and the landscape, and on the north we have the uh the brick and and some of the windows for those offices.

Let's see the so what are these windows?

What's on the other side of them?

It's that I shared when I was uh discussing though that so that's our backup house office um for staff.

That is that is uh not for customers.

Can we see Atlantic Street again?

Just as a reminder, it's pretty far from the Atlantic Street frontage, it's probably like 300 feet.

I'm having trouble seeing how that wall enlivens anything.

Again, it's not a public facing street.

This is this is 300 feet from Atlantic Street.

Atlantic, yeah.

It's 300 feet from Atlantic Street, so the the large surface parking lot that exists today is still on that portion of the property.

And we are landscaping the perimeter there as well.

Okay.

Um let's continue.

Uh well, Ford, any any other discussion on this.

Okay.

Let's um continue.

Um, anything else that you would like us to focus on, or is this just our chance to ask questions?

Again, I defer to you all if you'd like us to take you through all of the submitted materials.

We can, or we can we can ask questions.

I wanted to be sensitive to your time.

I would like to see the improvements you made to the lighting, if you don't mind.

Yeah, we got I can share that.

Let me know if you can see my screen.

I'm showing the uh updated photometric plan uh from our lighting designer.

A little bigger, please.

Is that good?

Yes, yeah.

Okay, great.

Um, so the areas in red are the areas that are the brightest, right?

And they are five uh foot candles, which is the maximum per the Stanford lighting ordinance, and then the areas in blue around the perimeter represent zero foot candles, which is light spillage, which again uh is per the Stanford lighting ordinance against the property lines.

So we've added um uh lighting in the rear, lighting along the north.

Um, and then we do we still have the lighting on the south, but you can't see it unfortunately here because it's under the it's under the perimeter of the building, so similar to that.

Um, but in terms of the the lighting coverage, um again, we have the maximum allowable, which is which is five foot candles for the lighting ordinance, and we have at the perimeter throughout represented in blue is is zero, so we have zero light spillage, and then on the walkway around the building, um we have the uh the required lighting for both safety and um and pedestrian use.

Uh and so and you increased it to five from what in those areas?

Was it well it was it was five on the on the parking areas, yeah, and then on the building perimeter it was two.

Uh but we added lighting, we added lighting to to reach the the allowable maximum.

Got it.

Okay, thank you.

So what is the green?

The green yellow, whatever color is.

So the so red is the brightest, and then it goes to like an orange yellow, then it goes to a green, and then it goes to a blue, right?

So for example, at the perimeter where we have zero, right?

That is blue, and then in the middle, so say in the red, right?

We have five, which is the which is the maximum, right?

And then in the the green areas, right?

There's like two sometimes three.

Okay.

And where is the entrance?

The entry is over here.

Okay, so someone and it's someone parking in the back.

What would their route be to get to the entrance?

If you if you were say parking here, right?

Um, isn't that the front?

The the front's over here.

Right.

So if you if you park that if you parked on the west, so say back here, smack in the middle, right?

You would be parking under a bright light.

You would walk south under a bright light.

You would walk east.

You wouldn't walk through the spaces.

So there not through the spaces.

I'm drawing the line a little bit.

You'd walk along the there are sidewalks.

There's sidewalks, right?

So you would when it was walks, you would walk through here, which is a completely lit facade.

Back to your go back to your uh colored thing a second.

What's the foot candle on on that sidewalk?

Right where your line is going through the spaces.

Yeah.

This is calculating the site lighting.

The building lighting, uh, the minimum uh for safety is two, and so we would have somewhere between two and five.

The lighting along here is represented on this image, right?

So the entire uh volume of the building would be lit from the overhang.

So this entire front would be complementary lit from the building plus the side lighting.

If you were in the back of the building, I guess that's the west.

That's the west, correct?

You would walk.

Would you walk north or south to get to the entrance?

It depends probably if you're closer to the sidewalk.

If you're if you say parked here, you would probably walk towards the sidewalk and then around, would be my guess.

If you're parked somewhere here, uh it's probably six of one, half a dozen or the other, whether you walk this way or you walk uh along the sidewalk.

Is there lighting there at the top?

There's this the street lighting, which is at the top, which is on uh on Washington Boulevard.

Is there any lighting provided by the building?

There's no exterior lighting provided by the building.

There would be the street lighting that's on the existing street lighting that's on the sidewalk.

Okay.

We have lighting lighting spilling out from the the glass at the entry, right?

So you would see it as a as a beacon, but you have the street lighting on the sidewalk because you're you're the pedestrian is taking the sidewalk to come into the entry.

Okay.

Anyone want to see anything else?

Mr.

Chairman.

Yeah.

Okay.

You want to see the lighting in the building.

I'm sorry.

Bill, did you see what it is you were looking for?

Yes, the lighting uh aside from the design of the building was the lighting that I was interested in.

Yeah.

Okay.

Well, since he's got this up, why don't you show us where the camera's gonna be?

The cameras, we have a whole host of interior cameras.

The exterior cameras are gonna be on on the corners of the building.

Yeah, we said there's 16 of them.

Yeah, why don't you just count them out for us if you would?

I this the building is not represented in here for um for me to do that.

I can we can include a plan highly accounts.

Yeah, that the plan was submitted, Eugene, to them with them all on it.

Yeah.

Okay, you want to pull that up, please?

Lisa, is that something you can pull up?

Yes, give me one second.

While we're doing that, can I ask the hours of operation?

I think we heard before, but I can't remember.

Uh yes, our typical hours of operation in New York are 7 a.m.

to to midnight.

Um, whether or not that would be the same programming in uh Stanford, we haven't fully decided yet, but but those are our typical hours of operation in New York.

Yeah, be my be mindful on this uh drawing north is up, so Washington Street is to the right.

So camera, camera, camera, camera, camera down here, two here, two here camera, camera, camera 15 close enough.

Close enough.

Okay.

So the so the west side of the building has the least number of cameras, but it's the most hidden side of the building, is it not?

I'm just curious what the thinking was on that.

Or that gives you coverage of the entire west side.

Yeah, there's three cameras over there, Mr.

Morris.

And I I mean I deferred it to Jordan, but yeah, that that would cover the entirety of there's there's two on each corner, and then there's one in the center, and that would cover the entirety of the space.

In the rear.

The reason we have more cameras in the north and the south is because of the the um the building goes in and out, and you have a couple of blind spots there.

So we're we have additional.

That makes sense.

That's more rational answer than just okay.

Thank you.

Anything else from the board.

Sure, Chairman.

Uh, just like to make a comment, if I may.

Yeah.

And I and I don't know if it's so much um with the applicant.

I think it has to do with our board, and maybe uh staff can help me along with this.

I think uh attorney Feinberg has done an excellent job.

I saw her response in her letter, and it goes to be the um gym physical as uh cultural establishment is not defined in our regulations as we I was looking last week.

Um however, uh Trinity Feinberg really uh crystallized things by saying a business where a group of people participate in an activity related to the body.

I I have an issue with our regs with that because that could be applied to you know to a massage parlor.

That could be it's very very general, uh real broad, broad strokes.

Um and and I want to know how we're gonna clean that up or how we're gonna define that because it really isn't the applicant's issue.

Um that I could see that maybe someone can that is wiser than I that can give me a little clarity.

Nita, you want to take that one?

Yeah, turn my video off if that helps.

Okay.

Can you hear me now?

Sure.

Yes, yes.

So you know, gymnasium and physical cultural establishment is not defined.

I see.

But this you know, this is very much in line with the with how it's interpreted for all the gyms and health and wellness facilities that be all over the city.

You know, the reason why we're very comfortable with this, um, is because you know, the adult physical cultural establishments, including massage parlor, those are defined in you know, very detailed manner in our regulations.

So, you know, if this the this does not fit any of those definitions in that very detailed description in our regulations, so you know it's purposefully.

Are there so Vanina is is there on the services, and I'm not I'm not trying to be flip on this, but I just need clarification on this.

So in this facility, the bathhouse, is there a opportunity for people to have services of a massage?

They are so what is and I understand I'm not you know, I'm not trying to be coy.

I understand.

So if we're opening up a if there is a massage rather which underwalls underneath the department of public health, I understand when they're you know for regulation purposes, but I think we're missing mincing terms here.

It's very, very broad as a gymnasium cultural, you know, cultural uh establishment.

I I think we we have a problem with something like this.

I I don't maybe I'm the only person that feels that way, and I'd love to hear the rest of the board about this because it was just it was changed that definition.

Um it was amended from the book.

Which one?

The adult uh the gymnasium and yeah, no, it was never adopted.

Um the gymnasium and physical culture establishment definition is one that staff and the CEO uses, but it's not in our regulations, if I've got that correct.

So I I don't it was it was gonna be there um as part of the high ridge part lifetime fitness.

Um but it because that was um overturned, our action was overturned.

The uh definition never got into our ring.

our regulations if I've got that correct so I I don't it was it was gonna be there um as part of the high ridge park lifetime fitness um but it because that was um overturned our action was overturned the uh definition never got into our rig I see I didn't you raise a you raise a important point I think yeah I meanberg made a great point on this so I you know and I I like to hear from staff about this sure I think you know it it makes sense for us to add a definition of gymnasium and physical cultural establishment um to kind of further distinguish it but I I think you're well covered by having a definition of the kind of uses that we don't want um so those are well defined those are stated as not permitted so um you know this I don't think there's any conflict you know this is similar to other you know uh uses that might exist in gym gymnasiums uh throughout the city so there's you know pools there is there are um other wellness facilities that might be sauna as well so it's not that different it's just that it's in one facility focused on you know just this type of uh wellness yeah other otherwise it the others might be a part of you know a gym or um you know other amenities and buildings but here it's just um located in one one um uh particular building and remind me is a spa a separate definition no so a place that offers massages facials um what are those considered that's you're right it's also a personal service um establishment we lost you there but need to say that again there's a personal service establishment use that uh can that can cover like barbershops uh salons so um some of these some um of these you know salon type uses could fall under that but you know there are other larger facilities with pools and um saunas those all fall under the gymnasium use and it's been yeah it's been applied that day for you know all of the the time that the zoning is in in has been in place okay dog thank you that's it mr chairman okay um if there's nothing else um why don't we go to the public if there's anyone from the public who would like to speak on this application um please raise your hand and when you uh do that uh give us your name and address please first we have uh cat and arrow i um i live on 256 washington boulevard and uh thank you for that presentation um just from like an aesthetic comment and uh i i just feel like the building looks very utilitarian it almost screams like the khaki pants of buildings and forgive me for making that comment because i just saw um renderings of actual renderings of buildings in sweden there's like 50 buildings from like what was proposed and what the buildings ended up looking like and i almost i'm a so maybe that's top of mind for me but you know having like a a mostly brown whether it's textured or not i mean i just wonder like when you go down a lot of the buildings in stamper you can pretty much pick out which buildings are older than the newer buildings and I just have a feeling that yeah a building like this in five years when you know it looks a bit weathered that it's just gonna scream like a just one big brown utilitarian office building with no windows and that's just from a pure like reaction I don't have a design background but you know trust me our building is not aesthetically pleasing either and I think that's part of the reason why I'm sensitive about it but um two I do wonder about the materials that were um picked for the facade is there like um like a functionality to it or was the the man-made brick um just um um selected for like a purely aesthetic reasons okay is that it uh yes okay good thank you the um the applicant and their team will answer all the questions that people ask when we're uh get through all of the public okay hi hi oh um can you hear me yes Susan hi this is Sue Halpern I live at 30 own craft road down the south end and you know I appreciate you guys I've sent in I don't know how many emails

The um the applicant and their team will answer all the questions that people ask when we're uh get through all of the public.

Hi.

Oh can you hear me?

Yes, Susan.

Hi, hi, this is Sue Halpern.

I live at 30 Alm Croft Road down the south end.

And you know, I appreciate you guys.

I've sent in, I don't know how many emails about this, but since that time, I see there's been a lot more material that's been presented to the application.

And I just want to make another comment.

Um, you know, I worked on the front lines as a registered nurse during the COVID pandemic, and it was very difficult in an emotional time.

Now, all the information provided about the benefits of these public baths and saunas does not eliminate the fact that these facilities are breeding ground for disease, especially with vaccines being abandoned, and herd immunity is not protecting us.

During COVID 19, bathhouses and sauna facilities were flagged as high-risk venues due to close physical proximity, shared air and steam.

Viruses spread despite high temperatures.

In all the referral comments that were obtained, I don't see anything from the director of health.

The city of Stanford requires a specific permit to operate a massage establishment.

According to city regulations, no person or entity may conduct or operate a massage establishment without obtaining a permit from the director of health, and a public pool license would also be required in this case.

All massage therapy practitioners must be licensed by the Connecticut Department of Health.

In the initial presentation, attorney Feinberg stated that well, there will be a rooftop bar serving alcoholic beverages.

Alcohol consumption combined with saunas increases the risk of hypotension, arrhythmias, and in extreme cases death.

There are health and safety risks along with the benefits here, and all issues should be taken into consideration, please before going forward with this application.

Thank you very much.

Thank you, Sue.

Um good evening, Elizabeth McCauley.

I just wanted to follow up on a letter that I had sent earlier today.

Could you excuse me?

Could you give us your address, please?

Oh, I'm sorry, property owner at 18 Walter Wheeler Drive, which is a stone's throw from this lovely corner that's going to have this ugly looking building.

Hopefully, it it's not going to have it, but anyway.

Um I wanted to just represent Homely Name of Jesus Church, which is a little bit up the street there on Washington Boulevard.

And as long time parishioners of Holy Name, we were opposed to the city of Stanford pursuing the construction of a bathhouse at zero Washington Boulevard.

This adults-only physical culture establishment would be in very close proximity, about 500 feet to our church at 325 Washington Boulevard, our convent, Saturday School, daycare center, rectory at Fort Pulaski Street, and our property at 274 Washington Boulevard.

While we understand that the parking lot is owned by BLT, we're very grateful to have been able to use the lot for our special events and overflow parking over many years.

We would prefer to have this property used for green space and a lovely extension of the Mill River Greenway with a south entrance.

That would be or at least a building that would be better and more reputably served all community members and residents of Stanford.

A bathhouse would be used only by a niche minority, bringing potential loud and disruptive conduct, which can come with this proposed rooftop pool and bar.

We respectfully ask by the land use committee and the zoning board to take this into sincere consideration.

We're heartfelt about our beautiful historic church and the surrounding area where we carry on the legacy of our ancestors who built it over a hundred years ago for the glory of God.

Thank you.

Okay, thank you.

Next we have to Ted Potse.

We don't hear you, but Ted Potsey next.

Name and address, please.

My name's Ted Potsey.

I live at Seven Oakwood Avenue in White Plains, actually, but I find myself in Stanford more and more often.

I think that it would be the bathhouse at large would be a great place for me and my friends to be able to go and enjoy like a time where we didn't have to consume alcohol.

We could just be around each other and have that like alternative space to be.

Additionally, um while we're working through the large blank walls.

Um maybe we should consider uh putting up a mural in that space to break up the large blank wall.

So it'll be less blank.

Thanks.

Good.

Thank you.

Um next we have, and I apologize if I get the name wrong.

Um Rizarda Kusowitz.

Yes.

So uh I live at 256 Washington Boulevard, which is approximately 150 linear feet from the proposed building.

We will have direct view on the pool and the whole building.

But with me, let's start with questions.

I would like to hear the designer and the attorney respond to me.

There are treatments rooms shown on the first floor.

What are exactly the treatments?

We would like to see the descriptions of the treatments for that area.

Secondly, we believe that the assessment for this building as a gymnasium in physical culture is incorrect based on current zoning board.

Uh, those establishments supposed to have classes and the special trainings, which I believe BAFTAs does not follow, but they are just following with the socializing and bathing and the massaging, which technically falls into adult establishment category for the Stanford City of Stanford.

Secondly, uh we have we have provided a written questions to to email to to to the zoning board.

We have emailed it approximately 4 p.m.

Uh today, and we would like to receive all the responses to the questions that we have.

Second one, we have a noise from the rooftop.

We have discussed the walls, but essentially the rooftop has the open full of the alcohol consumption.

The proposed hours are from 7 a.m.

to 12 p.m., including weekends.

Also, the pool is supposed to be open 20 year round, including not just summer days.

It's gonna be 20 winter, summer, fall, and springtime, which is gonna create tremendous light, tremendous sound pollution to our property and 256 Washington Guru.

Everything is spelled out in our letters.

So we I request that you you you respond to every single bullet points for us.

Um the second one, the next question that I have is the noisy from the mechanical equipment.

We our property is way higher than the rooftop line of the building.

So we will have a direct view for the pool and we have a direct pool view for the mechanical equipment.

We would like to know what are the noisy levels from this mechanical equipment as well.

And what are the provisions to eliminate the ugliness to seeing from us from our bedroom windows?

Actually, you know, the main reason why we are we are bringing this up.

Our bedroom master bedroom windows are facing this building.

So any noisy pollution, any any activity on the pool will directly affect the quality of life of 18 units in our condominium association.

So the next question that I have is whatever there will be any food service, any things like you know, KX equipment, how the the smell from the fruit preparation is going to be addressed, if any.

The second one also, the loading Doug is located directly approximately like 100 feet from our property when the after hours deliveries will take place.

We would like to know what does this mean.

How many trucks, how many hours loading unloading is very loud activity?

We know that, and we would like to we would like to know an exact hours of operation for loading and unloading.

Uh, the next question that I have is we have provided pictures uh from the New York facilities of the BAFTAs.

This is not a wellness center.

There are multiple on many many public platforms.

There are multiple, multiple records of people reporting, getting UTIs, getting, you know, seeing molds in the facilities in New York City.

There are also multiple people having um complaining about the noise in the crowd.

Mr.

And then when I yeah, I have one comment.

You're up the time is up.

Yeah, the time is up.

The comment that the facility shows around 240 lockers.

So the traffic study that was associated with, we believe that the traffic study that was associated with with uh with this building is not appropriate to the plans of the amount of people visiting this facility.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Um next we have Miss Gina Calabries.

Sorry, David.

Go ahead, Fanina.

I'd rather you do this.

Thank you.

Good evening.

My name is Gina Calabries, and I live in the Cove at 300 Seaside Avenue.

I think a lot of my concerns were already covered by the members of the board.

I wrote an email expressing that this project is squarely within the definition of an adult physical culture establishment under the zoning regulations.

There's no way that it easily fits the definition of gymnasium or physical culture establishment.

And I think no matter what anyone's subjective view on this project is to just be honest and admit that it does not that it's an adult physical establishment as the rules say, and that it's not that's not.

And that includes things like treatments by licensed physicians.

So I don't see how there's any way around this.

You might want to review the regulations again.

Maybe you didn't intend to capture this kind of establishment.

I know there was a little discussion.

I had to step away about what land use category a spa would fit into.

And I went through the revised regulations.

It was hard for me to find that as well.

I think there was an answer to that question.

Um, in terms of this being a wellness facility, wellness usually doesn't include drinking alcohol.

I mean, you know, no judgment, but usually it doesn't, you know, that's not part of wellness.

In fact, that's usually the opposite.

So this is more than just wellness and saunas, which are perfectly acceptable parts of various cultures, just not American culture so much, right?

There are Korean um public baths, Korean inspired.

I lived in LA, there was a place there, there's a place in Queens, there's a place of New Jersey.

Some of them are more family-oriented.

This is some sort of hybrid of all of them, and it is intended for adults.

So let's just be honest about what we're talking about.

This is not Manhattan, so the concerns of people who, you know, the church that's 500 feet away in Manhattan, you you're you might have a church on the same block as an adult shop, but this is not Manhattan, and people don't want it to be.

There's something special about Stamford in our diversity and variety, and I think we need to respect our neighbors.

It's certainly not meant only for local patrons.

The person from White Plains just expressed that.

Um, so the people living in the area are the ones who are going to feel the impacts of this positive or negative.

If you don't live there, then I think maybe you should consider whether you know you would welcome the business and the impact and the volume in your neighborhood.

Um then you're up three minutes.

Okay.

Well, I read my definition, the definition.

So if I can just have one more thing to say, sure.

The owner of the Williamsburg facility has gotten lots of criticism.

I don't know if he's involved in in the entire business, but it was not a well-run location.

There, and they're not just social media Yelp gripes, they're pretty well documented of poor hygiene there.

Um and I think part of the part of the alarm people have is the name, bathhouse, which has certain connotations for certain people, but maybe that's also part of the appeal to who they're trying to draw.

Finally, about the windows.

Um, there's such a thing as beveled glass, and I understand the need for privacy.

We had to design some, you know, off rooms with privacy where I work, and we used beveled glass near the top to let light in.

I'm no architect or or contractor, but my two cents.

Thank you very much for hearing me out.

Thank you, Gina.

Uh-huh.

Next, we have Miss Paula Waldman.

Yes, thank you.

Good evening.

Name and address, please.

Paula Waldman, 110 Old North Stanford Road.

Thank you for thank you.

Thank you for the opportunity for me to speak this evening.

Application 22537 proposes transferring 3,400, 34,000 rather square feet of commercial floor area from a 14-acre boat yard site to the large surface parking area at zero Washington Boulevard in order to construct a bathhouse facility that includes the hot and cold baths, massage services, and a rooftop pool and bar.

While the use may be marketed as a wellness facility, the scale and program make this a high intensity designation commercial use.

The proposed structure would significantly increase mass activity, voice lighting, and late night use in an area that already experiences congestion and cumulative developmental pressure.

What is it especially concerning is the missed opportunity because this site currently is a large expanse of pavement and it could it instead move in the opposite direction towards green space permeability and public benefit?

Replacing asphalt with trees, landscaping, and open space would improve storm water management.

It would reduce heat island effects, enhance the walkability, and provide genuine community value rather than another mammoth structure that overwhelms the uh streetscape.

The transfer of developmental rights further compounds the problem by concentrating density where impacts are already greatest while offering limited public benefit in return.

I respectfully urge the board to consider whether approving more square footage on this site truly advances the long-term planning goals of the city, or whether a greener lower impact alternative would better serve the neighborhood and the public.

For these reasons, I ask that the application 225-37 be denied or substantially reconsidered.

Thank you very much.

Thank you, Paula.

Thank you.

Next, we have Miss Monica Twal.

Good evening, Monika Twell.

37 Hanrohan Street.

Um I I think I would start from the beginning.

This is not um an appropriate site or an appropriate building to be put on Washington Boulevard.

I am disgusted by BLT and their reaction to transfer property from one a cement block from the boat yard to Washington Boulevard.

Again, this is like the air rights that they've that that uh everybody has been talking about, which was knocked down because air is free.

Now there are many things that should be concerning to this board and to the public.

Uh the fact and Mrs.

Uh Vanita had said that this is very comfortable with this.

Well, I don't think anyone is comfortable with a whorehouse, a sex house, a uh marijuana dispensary, uh a prison cell block, or a or anything of that negative connotation, which this bathhouse is putting upon Stanford citizens.

You can decorate it any way you want, textured brick, homemade brick, uh quarry, whatever you want.

It's a cell block of nothing but cement.

It's ugly, like the first woman cat said, very ugly, very um very ugly.

Uh all the other prior public speakers spoke exactly to the point.

They laid it out.

This there, we are we you are looking at nothing.

This lighting program, who has ever seen a A8 a design of lighting based on red, white, and green and blue for what?

And 16 cameras, that should be a concern for everyone.

That should be a there is no there.

This is a disgrace.

This is a disgrace.

And to that, I am a parishioner of holy name as well.

A lifelong parishioner.

And I lived in the South End.

Pitney Bow's manufacturing had windows.

You could see inside, they could see outside.

And that was a job site, a manufacturing job site.

This is a adult gymnasium.

I think uh the Stanford community, the latent center has a nicer gym gymnasium.

That is a gymnasium where you play basketball.

Hoops.

Well, you can run, where you can do physical activity.

This has no windows, nothing.

Um, I I am against this.

I think this is like a drop-off for the train station for hookers to go in and out.

This is not there is no there is uh we are degrading our society by putting this in the South End or anywhere in Stanford.

Thank you.

I am against this.

Thank you.

Next, we have Mr.

Jose Aguilar.

Mr.

Jose Aguilar, could you unmute, please?

Yes, thank you.

Thank you.

Mind your name and address, please.

Yes, sir.

My name is uh Jose Aguilar, and um I'm a resident at 355 Atlantic Street.

Um, I've been a resident of Stanford for nearly 10 years.

Um, I'm a working professional um in my mid-30s, and um I am frankly the type of person that would use a facility like Bath House.

Um, this is a um a facility that is used by my colleagues at work.

These are used by my peers.

Um, people like me that are in a long-term relationship, and unlike um the prior public speaker, um, I don't agree that this would invite nefarious activity of any kind.

Um these are people who belong to gyms, fitness studios, wellness clubs, and we have um a desire for a legitimate and structured way to invest in our health and our quality of life.

So um to leave Stanford without access to something like this really does create a bit of a vacuum and candidly a miss opportunity.

Um a lot of times um I find myself without access to certain things, and that discretionary income goes to other places, namely New York City.

So um, again, just a general comment here.

Um, I think that this space has been underutilized for my entire time here in Stanford.

Um, if it could be used for a better purpose, it would have been done already.

So to know that it is going to be used for a membership club that um centers around the things that I seek out, which is a sense of community, a place to relax and to be able to have focus on my health and wellness, um, sounds like a splendid idea.

So again, I would um just finish my comments with just um highlighting that I am in support of the development of bathhouse, and um yeah, I I respectfully would um just submit my comments as such.

Thank you.

Thank you, Jose.

Next, we have Mr.

Michael Salvi.

Oh, hi, can everybody hear me?

Yes, yes, oh great.

Uh well, thanks for for having me.

Uh Michael Falvey 256 Washington Boulevard.

There was uh a couple of other owners here.

I think there's a few more behind me.

Uh, we did submit a letter.

Uh so as uh Mr.

Akuchevich uh requested earlier.

If you can review those uh things in respond to them, we appreciate it.

Some of the things that were mentioned, I'll go through again.

Um five years in my bedroom is on the third floor.

Um, and as was previously mentioned, the noise impact is first and foremost.

Uh hours of 12 a.m.

I understand that it was mentioned that maybe those hours aren't gonna be because they're New York City hours at this point.

Uh, but we would like an answer as soon as possible on that.

But even with that, you know, even if it goes to 10, even if it goes to nine, having a bar with alcoholic beverages and an open pool area.

I can tell you when you stand in the middle of that parking lot and you have a regular conversation, I can hear it in my bedroom, and that's talking normal.

So that's something that I actually will test and send in.

So noise is a big issue, but also um exhaust mechanical was mentioned previously, it's also on our side.

There's an aesthetic to it, but there's a question of drainage of the pools as being mentioned every night.

So there's two questions.

How much water is being used in this facility?

The board, I I think should be interested in that, right?

How much is being drained out?

Um, and then the exhaust.

Mrs.

Halpern mentioned earlier about chemicals uh and health.

Well, if our windows are open, what are we going to be smelling with this drainage or with the exhaust?

Okay.

So these are some of the other concerns.

Traffic flow.

Um Michael, I'm sorry.

Excuse me, one sec.

Exhaust from where?

Are you concerned about it?

Well, that's a qu that's a question that I have.

So apparently it's it was in some of the paperwork.

There's these pools that have chemicals.

What chemicals are being used in the facility?

How often are the pools being drained?

Uh uh, what what type of exhaust is potentially coming out of the facility that could potentially be hazardous to us as we're sleeping or throughout the day?

There are babies that live here as well.

So, you know, there's 18 units is one of the other things I wanted to mention, and we have 12 names on the letter that we submitted.

Um so it's pretty significant, right?

And we're 145 feet away.

So the dumpsters on our side, the loading dock is on our side.

And then I think another big point for now, and I know we're tight on time, is uh the the structural aspect of things with the parking lot.

Is a retaining wall going to be needed for our property?

Bridgewater uh condominiums.

You know, the I I don't it's above my pay grade, right?

But uh with the construction that's going to be happening, what noise is gonna happen from the construction, what pollution is gonna happen from the construction?

Again, we're 145 feet away, we're right next door, 18 units.

Uh, but is there a retaining wall that's needed along that whole side of the parking lot uh that butts up to our property?

Um I mean, aesthetically, I you know, you know, I I agree with everybody else.

But to me, that's sort of uh secondary to the to the rest of some of these issues.

Um plan, you know, I I you know I I will chime in and say that this type of uh is it a missed opportunity to have this type of establishment come in.

Uh there's so many other great things in my opinion that that could come to this area.

I'm not against health and wellness.

Uh I do have dispute and kind of question the zoning capabilities as well.

And that continue, it sounds like it'll continue to go on.

But um it just looks like a cinder block.

You know, I can appreciate the architecture, Eugene.

I I look at I think it looks great for for what it is, and I and I get the aesthetic, and and and you're on brand, but on our strip in in the community, it to me it just doesn't fit aesthetically, and uh the type of business that it is, there's such a missed opportunity.

I speak to the board, there's a great community down here, everybody walking their dogs.

I think community park would be great.

I think some you know, coffee shops and food establishments and um a lot of missed opportunity.

So thanks for the time.

Um, and appreciate the feedback and answers from what we submitted.

Thank you.

Next, if we have Mr.

Dave Adams.

Good evening, members of the zoning board.

Uh Dave Adams, I live in Glenbrook on Glenbrook Road, and uh I just wanted to second uh many of the comments that you've heard this evening.

Um I am concerned because I do think this was filed under this on the under the wrong regulation.

I do think this is an adult physical culture establishment.

I think that's pretty clear, just given on the definition of what the uh adult physical culture establishment incorporates.

Um, and it's very clear, as uh Ms.

Calabriese had spoken about earlier.

I can understand why it wasn't submitted under that uh designation, because it's nowhere, you know, it there are religious uh uh institutions within you know 325 feet, uh 350 feet.

Uh this would definitely not uh there's a park right right on right on the west side of the property.

Um this is you know, it it definitely would not fit in this space.

And I uh, you know, I get BLT wants to use the space.

Uh I get that they don't want to give out free parking because they're you know they they have tenants that uh pay for parking in those buildings and they're supposed to use that parking and there's free parking in those buildings too.

Uh I don't think uh and one of the things is like you know, this company, this company is established in Stanford and and Chicago, one location in Chicago, two locations in in in New York is uh as I as I recall.

Why Stanford?

You know, why not LA?

Why not New Orleans?

Why not, you know, Miami?

Why Stanford?

You know, we're a popular place.

Yeah, good city to live in.

Yeah, you know, great city to live in.

Uh, you know, we're all we're all having a grand old time here.

Um, and you know, we are, but you know, I just don't think that um, you know, we've got you know, I looked at uh the long list of other uh health uh and wellness facilities that are are throughout the town, and none of them include uh uh services like uh massages and body rubs.

Um you know, they do give you a lot of the the other things, red light treatment, you know, saunas, you know, but uh they're they're all private.

You know, you you go in, you have your own time in in that uh that booth.

Um it's just you.

Uh if you wanted to bring a friend, you can bring a friend.

Uh, you know, I know HOT Healing.

Uh I know the the owners of Hope Healing on Pacific Street.

I've been in their facility.

Um, and it's that's that seems much more appropriate for our culture here in Stanford.

Uh I I don't um, you know, I not I I understand that this is you know trying to reawaken, you know, the the old concept of the of the bathhouses historically been the Romans, the the Greeks, the you know, the Russians, they they you know, this is this is a long-standing practice in in history.

But if you go back and look at the kind of conduct that was was you know ex uh uh exhibited in these facilities, uh you might second guess, you know, what what the real intention is here.

Uh and that's been mentioned.

I'm not trying to be hyperbolic.

I'm trying to just be realistic.

Um I think that there's more if you want to have this in Stanford, I think there's more appropriate places to put it.

Um I I understand we're we're a hot commodity being 50 50 minutes from from Grand Central Station.

Um I I get it.

Uh I keep it.

I haven't seen that two minutes.

Thank you.

Um I I get it.

I just don't think it's appropriate for this.

And I think it is misclassified.

Thank you very much for your time and I appreciate your uh consideration.

Thank you, Dave.

Next, we have Mr.

Tim Maloney.

Hi, my name is Tim Maloney.

I live on Millbank Avenue in Greenwich, Connecticut.

So just uh short train ride away.

Um I am relatively new to the Greenwich community here in Connecticut.

Um I've lived here for about six months, and I will say I'm in Stanford a decent amount.

Um, you know, I think Stanford, the previous speaker was talking about why not Los Angeles, etc.

I mean, I think Stanford's a fantastic growing city, very attractive place to live.

I think a lot of young people who are starting careers uh in the tri-state area, particularly in Manhattan and Connecticut, want to live in Stanford.

Many of my co-workers live in Stanford, and I spent a lot of time there.

Um complaint I have of uh of Greenwich and the local area, including Stanford, is a lack of of spots like this.

Um I disagree entirely with some of the previous characterizations of what Bath House is.

Um Bath Pass is certainly not a whorehouse.

Um I've been to Bathhouse many times in Manhattan.

I've never seen any sort of like disruptive lewd culture inside of this bathhouse.

I mean, I feel like it's being characterized super negatively, which is just not in line at all with what my experience has been.

If you look at that reviews, for example, on Google, um, I mean, Bath House has very high reviews, 4.5 stars of the bathhouse I used to go to in Manhattan, thousands of people reviewing.

There are not people saying that is disgusting and unsafe.

And I mean, I just completely disagree with that characterization.

More importantly, to talk about the positive.

I mean, look, there's a big culture moving away from drinking.

I know there's been a lot of focus on the fact that there's a rooftop bar here.

Um, there's so many bars in Greenwich people can go to to drink.

That is not the point of the bathhouse, right?

There's an increasing culture moving away from alcohol as the main activity of fun.

Um, there's a big culture of, you know, NA beer has come up a lot.

Um, people are looking to join run clubs, people are more social.

We're outside.

I think that the bathhouse is a great social alternative to bars, right?

You know, we don't want all of our young people.

I'm 31 years old.

You know, I think it's amazing when I see people that are 22 to 30 prioritizing their health, prioritizing running, lifting, getting massages.

It's not a weird thing to get a massage.

It's very healthy to get a massage.

Um, I think saunas and infrared is great.

So just generally speaking, I think there's so many positives here.

Um, I know there's been a lot of focus on the negative.

Um, you know, I think the characterization's been a little rough.

I do feel the people that live right there.

And you know, I don't I live in Greenwich, so I am whatever 10 minute train right away.

So I can't speak to living across the street.

If there's a problem living across the street, that should be addressed.

But from an actual functional point of the bathhouse, I think it's a fantastic option.

I think it would bring, you know, like a really good energy.

And frankly, it's what we need.

We need less people out drinking at bars until midnight, more people focusing on their bodies and improving their health.

I think it's a very normal thing.

I think it'd be great for the society.

Thanks.

Thank you, Tim.

Next, we have Mr.

Aaron Williams.

Yeah, you know, and I'm Aaron Williams at 256 Washington Boulevard.

That sounds familiar.

Yes.

I just have the same concerns.

Uh, again, uh, you know, I look right outside my window there, and um, you know, worried about the noise uh and the loading dock is supposed to be there.

Um big concerns, big concerns.

Um I agree with Mike uh put it together uh better than I can.

Um and again, we you have the information from our uh our condo association in uh please uh if you can be um I don't even know the word, uh, just take a look at those and get back to us, please.

But uh yeah, we live here.

Um, you know, you can do your bathhouse and whatnot, but uh this might be not a good place to have it.

That's all.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Um, David, those were all the hands that I saw.

Um, I don't see any other public speakers wanting to speak here.

Okay.

Good.

Umberg, do you want to uh start the response to the questions and comments?

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Uh, there were a lot of interesting comments tonight, and I'm gonna do my best to address them.

Um, but the truth is that a good number of them are just really don't have anything to do with a site plan approval process.

I do first and foremost want to to address this question of the use classification.

As Vanita noted, while a gymnasium and physical culture establishment is not defined in our regulations, all of the adult uses are.

And this is square the squarely falls outside of it.

There's a reason that there's a distinction between an adult physical culture establishment and a physical culture establishment.

And all of the adult uses relate to genitals being exposed, nudity, sexual acts taking place, none of those things are happening here.

I also want to be clear that in the definition that was read related to an adult physical culture establishment.

There's a carve out for massage when it's done by a licensed masseuse, which will absolutely be the case here.

This is not an adult use.

This is not an adult physical culture establishment.

All of these uses within the bathhouse already exist.

If we if we go down this road, are we going to start to say that all of our spas where massages take place can no longer exist everywhere where there where there is a uh a sauna can no longer exist?

Are we going to start suggesting that we're going to ask people for their gender identification, their sexual orientation?

I mean, these are these are things that in my mind are thought completely outside of zoning, but also are just an inappropriate.

This is a permitted use.

It fits squarely within the definition of a physical culture establishment.

And even if it didn't, there are a lot of other permitted uses in the SRDS that I suppose it could be.

Is it an amusement, like a like a pool, which is a permitted use, a cafe with or without entertainment, a permitted use.

You could have a club, a swim and tennis club.

That's a permitted use.

Um, there are several uses that are significantly louder.

Uh, you could have an ambulance facility, you could have a laundry and dry cleaning establishment.

I mean, I'm not gonna read them all to you.

There, there are many.

Um, this is a benign use, it is a permitted use, and it is not, it is not an adult use.

Um, in terms of the noise, I think that that's a very fair and uh a question to be asked by the adjacent property owners.

And I will tell you that we would be happy to accept a condition that requires us to confirm that the use will conform to the noise ordinance.

We will submit a study if that is what the zoning board would request.

And we will conform to the noise ordinance, just like every other business in the city of Stanford is required to do.

This is not a club.

This is not a bar and restaurant, although those are permitted and exist all over Harbor Pitt Point.

The idea of the bathhouse is to go somewhere and relax.

There is a social component.

If you'd like to be social, you don't have to be social.

The rooftop pool, it's the same thing.

There's been a lot of weight placed on the fact that alcohol will be served.

Food and beverage represents about 10% of the revenue stream for this use.

It's an amenity that's offered to folks if they'd like to have a snack or a cocktail.

There's no kitchen, it's all pre-made, you cannot get shots.

It is it is a very, very uh tranquil, relaxed environment.

Um the photos that were submitted by our neighbors.

I the the interior photo, the top photo is an interior space in the flat iron that is not part of the rooftop.

Um, but again, people are talking.

No, I don't see an issue with that.

Um, the loading area.

This is not a loading duck.

It's a loading space where deliveries will take place anywhere between one and 4 p.m.

during business hours.

Um, this is this is not a noisy activity.

The location of the dumpster, I think, you know, nobody ever loves a location of a dumpster, but I can tell you it's directly adjacent to the condominiums, dumpsters.

And if you go on Google Street View, you can see the uh garbage truck actually picking up from their dumpster, which is directly adjacent.

So that seems like the most appropriate spot.

Um in terms of the retaining wall question, there will not be a retaining wall along the uh boundary with the condominiums.

There's a six-inch curve at the highest point, which is on the eastern side.

So, you know, closest to Washington Boulevard, it gets maybe up to 18 inches.

Um, so there's not a retaining wall along that stretch of property.

Um making sure if I got all of these.

I really believe that this is a very straightforward proposal.

Unlike most of the proposals that come before you, we haven't asked for a single special permit.

It's a site plan approval for a use that's permitted in the zone.

Um, as I said, the elements of this use exist all over the city, but there's actually a use that is very similar to this use already in existence at Chelsea Pierce called hideout, and it wasn't required to come to this board.

And people are enjoying it and loving it, and the feedback has been great.

Um I would be remiss if I didn't note for the record, uh, you all know in reviewing site plan approvals, uh, the the zoning board acts in an administrative capacity, uh, which essentially means that as long as we meet the requirements of the regulations or the project can be modified so that we meet the requirements of the regulations, it should be approved.

And I believe that we have confirmed that uh in this case.

Uh I want to be clear again, and I forgive me, I don't like doing these sorts of things, but it is my position uh that the board cannot legally turn down this plan because it doesn't like the way it looks or thinks that the proposed proposed use is a poor use for the site or that a different use would be better.

The applicant and the operator will comply with the law.

Uh, they will meet all of the requirements of the WPCA, and that goes to the questions about how you know water will be disposed of and what chemicals will be used.

There is a very intense review conducted by WPCA in connection with a building permit application, as well as the health department.

We will meet the requirements of the lighting ordinance, we will meet the requirements of the noise ordinance.

They shouldn't be held to a different standard than any other business.

I believe you should have received a letter from uh Mr.

Ryan Salvatore, who you all know is a local, very well-respected architect.

Uh, you may recall he designed the Cohen Foundation build building.

It's often a lot harder to get people to come out in support of a proposal than it is to get people to come out in opposition, but you should have also received confirmation that hundreds of residents of Harbor Point welcome and support this use.

It it truly is my belief that any opposition to this proposal comes from a general misunderstanding of the use.

And you know, we've tried our best to counter that.

Um, or possibly frustrations that are completely unrelated to this particular application, and I've long existed down in Harbor Point.

The truth is that this use is a hundred percent responsive to the needs uh of the community and the goals of the South End and complies with the South End neighborhood study.

I went through it in preparation for night for tonight, and you know, participants in the study were pretty united in their support for measures to improve the retail environment, things like upgrades to the streetscape and lighting and the generation of foot traffic and activation of commercial sites were important.

This is a vacant parking lot.

Residents and merchants wanted more types of retail beyond eating and drinking and exercising, um, so that folks would come to Harbor Point, come to the South End and stay longer and spend more money.

Uh, in the focus groups, the newer residents, which were typically Harbor Point residents, expressed a desire for more personal care services specifically.

So I think that that this is responsive to all of those desires.

It also will result in the employment of anywhere between 50 and 70 new people, 50 to 70 new jobs, and the you know, the applicant and bathhouse are committed to making every effort to fill those jobs locally.

There is nothing nefarious or illicit about this proposal.

You all know I live in Stanford, I'm raising my family in Stanford, I believe in Stanford, and unlike some of the speakers that that spoke tonight, I think it's a great sign that Bath House wants to come to Stanford.

This is a place of respite, it's a place of tranquility, it's a place where people can come for peace and quiet.

And if they'd like to, they can interact with other people who are like-minded.

It's just another choice for people, and anyone who isn't interested doesn't have to participate.

So, for all of those reasons, we hope you will approve the application.

And that's really all I had for you tonight.

Okay.

Thank you.

Um couple of questions for the board.

Are you guys comfortable that this is not an adult physical culture establishment?

Or do we need more um you need more whatever guidance on this?

I don't need any okay.

Okay.

Um next.

Do we want to give the applicant the opportunity to um bring the design more into line with what our regulations require?

Well, I might as well go first.

Um I seeing the up close renderings has helped me a lot.

Um I like the brick.

I like the uh just not being able to see the multicolor variations on the parking lot side.

I think it's the west side.

Um is probably the only irritant, but you know, if we put it in um as a requirement, um, then you know, like I say, would I like it if they moved out the parking lot three feet and could add some uh uh some landscaping?

Yeah, but I think we might be too far from that.

But um that wall is the only wall that I want to see improved, and if it's the multicolor, it's a big improvement for me.

Okay, so you're saying you in your wish list it's the addition of landscaping along which wall is that the south, the west?

No, I think it's the west, it's against the parking lot, the one that doesn't face any streets.

The one in the back.

Well, do you consider the north the back or the west the back?

Um the one faces the water.

I think the east faces the street.

So faces Washington.

So the west.

Um where there are no windows and it's not broken up.

Um where we saw the multicolored um in the actual building.

Um in you mean in the other building.

Yeah, yeah, that's that's the west.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And and that's and it faces the parking lot anyway.

Um, so I'm not as concerned about that wall, although I want to make sure that multicoloring is gonna happen.

Uh we can get we can ask for a rendering on that.

I I but I know a lot about renderings, David, and you can't render everything.

So I um I thought it was the opposite.

They render more than we get.

Yeah, but it's also light and shadow that kind of makes things not as uh you know easy to read.

Yeah.

Okay.

Yeah, yeah.

Bill.

Oh, I'm sorry, go ahead.

I'm done.

Okay.

Bill.

Oh, yes.

Um I I the only issue I really have left is that you know, we keep we talk about the design, although according to Lisa, we can't, but the the color degree with that.

Uh the color we have our regulation.

Well, Zaya was talking about I and if the applicant wouldn't mind, they could put it back up on the screen for us.

But when I was looking, I don't the one that showed the dip big difference in color, uh, the vertical striping was very a lot closer together than what's it's going to be on their building.

And I'm concerned that the the difference of color you see on that is not going to be the same as it's going to be on their building.

And I would like you know, if they could show me that again, it maybe convince me.

And but I'm also concerned about you know the uh the south side and the north side of the building, also not just the west side when it comes to the colors when it comes to what the color uh changes or differences because it's all that's all concrete there.

Um yeah, well, there are design requirements talk about a large expanse of blank walls are to be avoided on the exterior walls of new buildings.

Um so the question is would design additional design features make it um less of a blank wall.

Well, it could, but uh I I don't have a comfortable warm, fuzzy feeling about it from what we've been shown so far.

About what so I guess I need some convincing as as to what, Bill?

To having it so it wouldn't look like a blank wall.

Like this rendering does.

I mean, it looks like a blank wall to me.

So they're not supposed to have a blank wall under our rights.

That's what the regulations say.

Do we do we give them an opportunity to come back with something?

Oh, yeah, sir, sure.

Okay.

Okay.

Um Jerry.

Yes, if the the applicant would like to come back, I'd like to afford a minute them any opportunity that we can.

Absolutely.

Well, what if they don't want to come back?

Um one of the things do we do we want them to come back?

That's maybe maybe there's an opportunity.

Yeah, hold on a second.

What Jerry?

You know, I I like to give them the option to um to take that information and you know, of uh from this meeting and just do the way.

Um I'm sorry, Vanita.

You were about to say something.

Yeah.

I think one option could be to see if any greenery can be added, just like the green, the rooftop greenery has helped soften the facade along Washington.

If something can be done on this west side, that could also be helpful.

Well, I think it's more than the west side.

Um it's the north and the south sides as well.

Um, okay.

I think there's a sense from the board.

I would um on this application.

Why don't we continue it and ask the applicant to come back at the next meeting with some ideas for additional landscaping and additional design to break up the large expanse of um of blank walls?

So um application 225-37 is being continued until the next zoning board meeting, which is on February 9th.

And um I think we also there were a couple of other requests.

They wanted to know the percentage of windows on each side.

Um there were a couple of other things.

Hopefully, applicant has made a a list of those and we'll respond uh for our next meeting.

Thank you.

Thank you.

I'm sorry.

Thank you for your time tonight.

Oh, you're welcome.

Uh our next application.

Well, why don't we take a uh a short break now?

Because uh this next application might take a while.

Um it is uh 8 35.

Um how about uh we uh recess until uh 845.

Okay, Mr.

Chairman.

Okay, Doug.

Okay.

Can we um stop the recording, please, Fanita?

Yes.

Thanks.

We'll get to you in a minute.

Can you hear me?

We we're not hearing you.

Can you hear me now?

I can hear you.

I can hear him.

You're off mute, but I didn't I can't hear you when you speak.

All of us could hear him, David, except you.

Can you hear us, David?

I don't think David's heads anybody.

Hold on.

So yeah, Peter.

Can you hear me now?

I can.

That was my fault.

No worries.

My fault.

Okay.

Uh oh.

Are we all back?

Yep.

Yes, sir.

Yes.

Vanita, are you here?

Oh, there you are.

Okay.

I'm here.

It is uh 8 45 on January 26, 2026.

The zone zoning board is resuming its hearing.

Um, for those of you who were not here right at the beginning, we made an announcement that the two applications relating to the daycare center at 1150 Summer Street.

Um, those applications are being continued until the zoning board meeting on March 9th.

Okay.

Now the next application we have, it's a new public hearing.

Application 225-39.

Peter Sakora for Rama Toolil Alamin Mosque, Inc.

80 Lockwood Avenue special permit.

Applicant is requesting a change of use from club to house of worship.

Um Roseanne, could you please read the planning board letter?

Certainly.

Um November 20th, 2025, to Mr.

David Stein, Chair City of Stanford Zoning Board regarding ZB application number 225-39.

Peter Secora representing, and I'm really sorry for mispronouncing this.

Uh Rama Tool, Lil Alamine Mosque, Inc., 80 Lockwood Avenue.

Dear Mr.

Stein and members of the zoning board.

During its regularly scheduled meeting held on Tuesday, November 18th.

November 2025, the planning board reviewed the above captioned application referred in accordance with the requirements of the Stanford Charter.

Applicant is requesting a special permit to allow for a house of worship in the R5 zone, multiple family medium density design district.

Peter Socora architect made a presentation and answered questions from the board.

After some discussion, the planning board voted by a vote of three to zero to one in favor.

Abstain sub Romanian to recommend approval of ZB application number 225-39 and found this to be in general harmony with the 2035 Comprehensive Plan REST Residential Neighborhood Future Land Use Category.

Sincerely Stanford Planning Board.

Jennifer Gadzenno, Chair.

Thank you.

Vanita, did we receive the certificate of mailing on this?

Yes, we did.

And the sign affidavit.

Yes.

Okay.

Well, um, Mr.

Socora, I think this may be your first time appearing uh before the Stanford Zoning Board.

So welcome.

Thank you.

Yes, it is.

And um please uh continue.

Okay.

Uh thanks to the board for the hearing and the public for your interest.

I'm Peter Socora, the architect for the Mosque project at 80 Lockwood Avenue.

We're here to seek a permit referred to as a special permit for a house of worship.

And I'm pleased to say that a lot of work has gone into making this project meet the goals of being right sized for the lot, the building, and the neighborhood.

It conforms to the spirit and the letter of the existing zoning code.

So requires no exceptions to the existing rules.

We are not here seeking any type of variance.

Uh it improves the aesthetic appearance of the property and reduces the traffic and parking parking impact compared to the prior use.

Um so I have some slides, which I'll tend to put up now.

Is that working?

Can you guys see that?

There you go.

Yep.

And fast.

Okay, so slide number one.

Um this is a map of the neighborhood as covered earlier in the introduction.

80 Lockwood is located in an R5 neighborhood, meaning it's comprised mostly of small multifamily residences.

Many of the congregants live in this neighborhood.

I'll share more about that in just a moment.

Uh the building sits on the corner of Lockwood and Lillian.

Lockwood is a narrow, busy street.

Lillian is a quiet residential street.

Across the street on Lockwood is a school.

That campus is slated for demolition next year.

Slide two contains two photos.

On top is the building, on the bottom is an overhead view of the lot.

The building was originally built as a firehouse, but ended up being used more as a warehouse for storage.

Most recently it was a social club and used for hosting events like receptions and parties.

It's a brick building, and at one time it was a beautiful stately building, and it has the potential to be again.

We're hoping to make this positive change because right now you can see the building has bricked over windows, boarded updoors, a six-foot cyclone fence right at the sidewalk.

And in this Google photo, it comes with a shopping cart.

Um, but beyond what you can see in the photos, there are some infrastructure problems related to the way it was implemented for its use.

As a social club of this size, 35 parking spaces were required by code, but the lot only had 32.

So a variance or exception to the code was granted.

As part of that variant, several of those spaces were allowed to be located within the setback area.

Also allowed by that variance was the fact that most of these spaces didn't meet current code requirements for width, length, or aisle space.

Lockwood Avenue was used as the parking lot entrance and exit.

This causes congestion on the busy street that has a lot of traffic on it.

And the the lot in general is 100% paved or impermeable surface, which doesn't look good and isn't good for drainage.

So we're you can see that in the the sort of the photo of the lot from the corner and also in the aerial view.

So in slide three is our proposed changes to the site plan.

First, you'll see that the building stays the same size.

I'm sorry.

Do you have a rendering of what it would look like once you're finished with it?

We're not making any changes to the outside of the building other than adding windows.

And not adding windows, replacing the border, the windows that were um no, I did not do a rendering of the existing building because the new building will look much like the existing building.

Okay.

Thank you.

Sorry, please continue.

Um there are some changes to the front, and if the board really wants to see those rendered, some sort of landscaping, that I certainly could do that.

Um there it didn't seem like it would communicate that much.

That is one of our requests uh that would come up later.

Is that we we do need to see a um a landscape plan uh of some sort from the applicant?

And I think staff suggested that it be added to the ground floor plan.

Is that correct, Benita?

Um yes, does the site plan would be a good place to just add details of the landscaping in terms of you know what plant materials you're proposing to use?

Um, so you can make those in patients.

Okay, so I think that so originally in the original plan, there were sidewalk plantings were planned to go in front of the building, but the edge and engineering report came back that there was not really enough space to have adequate um plantings at the sidewalk and still have the sidewalk be ADA compliant.

And so the plantings along the front of the building on the the streets gate were removed.

The remaining what what remains is areas of grass.

Um, so I I can certainly render those and I can put in a landscape plan that shows but this site plan shows the the grass areas.

The tree that is here is an existing tree, it's not going to be affected.

Um none of those that kind of dark area around the outside of the property, none of that is vegetation.

Uh no, it's um it's removed the asphalt has been removed, and we've replaced it with uh stone fill.

So there are no the green.

This color here is going to be the green.

This is per me is permeable surface, but it's not specifically a planting.

I suppose it could be um I think it would it would be a a welcome improvement, but I'll okay.

Um to see some planting around the outside and maybe in the front.

Oh, the the plant there's plantings in the front, um, and they're on the plan here.

You're looking at a site plan that shows not not plantings, but they become a lawn area.

Let me um originally I had more space in the front.

Um, but some feedback came back that some of the parking spaces were not gonna were were not okay, that the compact, the compact nature of the parking spaces wasn't okay.

And so we lost some of the originally planned green space in the front.

And when we did that, uh the hedges that I had planned to put in the front, be getting that those getting that close to the sidewalk.

I felt like they were going to endanger the car pedestrian interaction to have a hedge right at the sidewalk.

And so it became lawn space rather, green, green sort of lawn space rather than a hedge.

Um, I don't know.

You see lots of hedges along sidewalks.

Um, sorry.

Um could you come back with some landscaping ideas for sure?

Sure.

Um thank you.

Let me um keep walking through the changes that we do have.

And I'm sorry, before before we leave that board, anyone want to add anything to that regarding landscaping.

No.

Okay.

Um what we've done with the the project in general is really a remodel of the interior space.

That's really all that we are we're attempting to accomplish.

But we're faced with this site that seems to be somewhat inadequate.

So we've also taken it upon ourselves to make some exterior improvements.

These are not really what the project is about, right?

We're using an existing building and changing the use.

Um, but what we did take on was that we've created 26 code compliant parking spaces, um, two of which meet ADA handicap requirements.

They're now spaces for motorcycles, scooters, and bicycles.

The parking entrance is now on Lockwood, but the exit is going to be on Lillian.

This improves the flow and allows us to have the angled spaces, which makes it more compliant with the standard with the Stanford parking base place standards.

This will give drivers and pedestrians better visibility, make it safer for both.

The new lawn areas increase the permeable surface for better drainage.

Would you I'm sorry, could could you just make it a little bit bigger, please?

That possible.

Okay.

Oh no, sorry.

Thank you.

Could you highlight the lawn area that you're proposing?

They're these.

Correct.

That's it.

Yes.

Okay.

This was originally came all the way out to here.

In the when they when the plantings were being discussed and were requested by the town.

Um this lawn area was considerably deeper.

But you can see what happened to the parking spaces now.

The parking has crept into that.

And it I'm concerned about putting a hedge here with a car right there.

What are the dimensions of that those areas, that loan area?

It's um five feet by uh 20 feet.

Five feet.

Okay.

So it's big enough for a hedge, but there's going to be a car that is not going to be able to see somebody walking down the sidewalk.

What's in the triangular section right next to it?

Yeah.

Empty space.

Can't that be some sort of landscaping?

A tree with yes, it could.

That is a great idea.

Yes.

Yes.

Um moving up here.

Yep.

I'll do that.

And maybe it looks like in the lower right, there might be a little space there.

You got it.

Yes.

That could be uh, you know, tree.

Yes, it could.

Grass.

Uh, I don't know if a tree will work here, but but a planting could work here.

Okay.

I I'm not an expert on the requirements for a tree.

I'll have to find out about that.

It it seems a little after discussing what was happening with the sidewalk here.

It seems like this might not be enough space.

But I can find out.

That's a parking space.

This right there.

Um if the traffic is that's a two-way driveway on Lillian.

This part of it, yes.

This is a little wider than here.

So this is one way.

And this is two-way.

But you'll tell people not to go beyond a certain point.

Um, well, these these are literally going to be arrows on the sidewalk on the on the ground.

These are arrows communicating direction of travel.

Gotcha.

Okay.

Thank you.

Yeah, any sorry, any, so any place you think could fit some green, would be, I think the board would appreciate it.

You got it.

Basically, the changes to the the site plan.

Um we're bringing the parking spaces into compliance with current compliance with current code.

Um these is to serve the congregants, improve the aesthetics for the enjoyment of the community, and to prioritize traffic and pedestrian safety.

Um now the there's a point about this is that we're losing parking spaces.

So in the original plot, in the in the original plan uh that had the variance, there were 32 parking spaces.

Um this is a little bit so we've lost parking spaces in order to make these space have more greenery and to have the spaces be conforming to the current standards.

Um but there's an important point in our decision making.

It was important that we ensure that the number of parking spaces and the number of worshippers are in alignment.

So we designed the buildings inside to have the right number of seats for worship based on this parking configuration with 26 parking spaces.

So slide four explains this a little bit more.

And I'm gonna try and zoom out a little bit on this one.

Well, maybe I'll leave it.

It's fine.

Um the relevant zoning code for parking for a religious institution is here, and it's for four one parking space per four seats.

I'd like to take a minute and explain how we accomplished that.

For those of you who haven't been inside of a mosque, I'm gonna walk you through how it works.

Each of the three floors has its own purpose.

The first floor is worship, the second floor is dining, and the third floor is for administration.

By religious tradition, when it's time to call for a call to prayer, all the other activities have to stop.

That's what the call to prayer is.

In other words, when it's prayer time, everyone has to go to the first floor to worship.

So there's no instance in which there are large numbers of people on each floor at the same time where where all three floors are at capacity.

These are exclusive uses.

I'm sorry.

But do women women don't take part in the worshiping, do they?

They do.

There is a they they will put up movable screens.

So the tradition wants for continuous lines of worshippers, but the line can be separated and they can have a movable screen that allows women to participate in worship on the main floor.

Okay.

So if they were in the building for some other purpose, um, feeding the homeless or whatever, they would then stop that and come down and worship.

That is correct.

Okay.

Thank you.

Um there's a flow that happens in the warship.

Uh I'll walk you through that flow.

Um, you can see where people enter from the parking lot or up the plaza steps into the foyer.

They take off their shoes and put them into uh the designated shoe cubbies over here.

And uh then they head to the washroom where they'll wash their hands and feet as required by tradition.

Then they enter the prayer space with its individually marked prayer areas.

An example of what that looks like is here.

So there is a these custom carpets are made that designate where people should pray.

The geometry of the prayer line is important, and this is how that is preserved.

Um there's a precise way that people line up on the carpet, one worshipper per space, and those spaces are indicated on our plan, which is 104 seats.

And this is how we're able to make the capacity of the building align precisely to the parking that we have, so that we do not overwhelm the parking because we can support this large of a congregation.

Um, after prayer, congregants can head upstairs to eat and socialize, or they can leave the building through the front door or the side door.

They're facing towards the top there.

Who's facing towards the top?

The worshippers during the no, they're facing this direction.

Ah, okay.

So the the lines of worship are running in this direction and would fill typically from the front towards the rear.

Um there are numerous worship uh times.

The usual weekday worship session gets fewer than 20 people, so there's more than enough space.

The main worship session is on Friday afternoon and typically sees around 80 to 100 people.

For major religious holidays, when more than 100 worshippers are likely to attend, uh, the event moves to an off-site event space.

In the past, the congregation has rented hotel meeting spaces or community centers for this purpose.

Some of you might be wondering if there'll be amplified noise similar to the church bells we're all familiar with if we live near a church.

The answer is no.

There will be no public calls to prayer.

The organization leadership has procured a van to help with transportation for those with disabilities or need a ride for another reason.

They plan to organize van pools to help those people out.

My final slide is a congregant van.

These are the families that are currently in the congregation of the mosque that live within half a mile.

So this project is not located in one of the city's designated congested areas.

The master plan does not call out this area as having congested traffic or parking.

Just the same.

The fact that so many families live within easy walking or biking distance of the location, and that there is a dedicated van for carpooling means these measures will dramatically reduce the practical impact on traffic and parking.

So I'm going to end the share now.

Come back to you.

This design was created with the goal of having a positive net effect on the neighbors.

As you can see, many of the neighbors are in fact the congregants of this mosque.

It's a small local mosque for the local community and has been designed with these local benefits in mind.

Glad to provide any additional information as needed.

Good.

Just as a general question, you received the comments from the various city departments.

Yes.

Yeah.

Do you um I guess some of them were responded to.

Um I believe all of them were responded to.

We'll hit them as we go through.

Um, Bill, you want to start?

Yeah, I'll start with uh Mr.

Sequoy.

Your letter of January 21st, which you sent to uh Mr.

Uh Bulletnweiser.

Do you receive a response from that?

No.

Uh well, wait, the letter remind me which one exactly you're talking about.

That's the TTP regarding traffic and issues with traffic.

You sent it out on January 21st.

Um one where you got into shared parking and that kind of thing.

Oh, we're not doing that.

There was a follow-up email to that after feedback was received.

Um that was clear that became clear that that was not going to be a workable um way to proceed.

The in and that was really in response to a there, there was a misunderstanding about the parking requirement.

Um we need 26 spaces, and we've got 26 spaces.

So, yes, that was responded to.

Um we got a feedback from after that.

Um I'm sorry, back up.

There was an email from who to who I sent an email to uh Mr.

Buttonweiser.

Um proposing that one way to meet he had said that we needed 56 parking spaces, I think it was.

But there was misunderstanding, it turned out about the nature of the exclusive use of the levels, and also um misunderstanding about the warship space, the occupancy.

Yeah.

Yeah, but yes, the letter I'm referring to is where you responded to when you and you some of his concerns.

Um the parking management plan, uh volunteers will help a parking monitor, monitoring, shared off site parking, so on and so forth.

Did he did you did he respond to that letter?

No.

We have a meeting set up on Thursday to discuss.

Okay.

But I'm not sure.

I when I when I came to understand that what had happened is with the discuss the the real misunderstanding was about the occupancy.

Well, I retracted that proposal that we were gonna do the try and do a parking um exchange with uh nearby residents.

Yeah.

Yeah um but we haven't we haven't seen any of this no uh no we it that you know because it was you know a draft strategy that you know the applicant was trying to check if that would be something that was feasible but you know then staff looked at it we didn't think it was feasible uh and you know didn't marry it kind of developing further so we didn't uh you know share that with the board I think what what you're referring to Bill is the letter that is part of the record which is the one from the January 21st I I can share it we we have that right right and that is more I think it's a comprehensive response to um Luke's comments um you know you're talking about these right did he hear anything nobody's heard back from Luke no i've I've spoken to him since he just needs a little bit of time to kind of uh look at the device plan you know he's he's seen it he I've you know I've had the conversation about the the parking ratio and he understands that you know the ratio is based on um the occupancy that you know there's showing so I think there's there is resolutions on some of this it's just that he just needs a few I I would be happy to explain a little bit about what the miscommunication was it might be helpful well look we understand that it's one to look at everything yeah the game one for every four seats that's yeah that's no one no one is disputing that yeah there's just a number of other things listed in your January 21st letter um which I think followed was after everyone agreed it's one for every four seats um no it wasn't after that agreement I don't think or if it was maybe crossed in the mail okay I guess we'll have to find out yeah anyway we're we're we're we're we're at like a a uh a dead spot here then well we'll next meeting hopefully we'll have some some answers um it does sound like Peter you're gonna do a parking management plan and um well no I I'm not sure that that's still required that that's the if it is required I will certainly do it but I'm not sure if it is but you have a meeting with him on Thursday so you'll find out correct yeah I have nothing else David okay right now anyway no no it there'll be lots of time um Roseanne um yes um could you put the picture up again of the um building in its current state be better for looking at it when I asked my questions yeah can you just enlarge it so we can see the top a little the top image a little better if that's possible perfect perfect thank you oh shoot sorry yeah I do that all the time so um we know the windows that are boarded over your you're replacing um the doors which are the old firehouse doors um what will they be replaced with regular mosque front doors or what or are they staying the same um let me bring up the plans I have a front elevation on the plans there we go yeah great um sorry that's it's actually gonna be beautiful yeah very nice um can you confirm all those um nasty fences are gonna be taken down yes this is a wrought iron fence that's gonna be put up excellent um

Yeah.

Great.

Um sorry.

That's it's actually gonna be beautiful.

Yeah, very nice.

Um, can you confirm all those um nasty fences are gonna be taken down?

Yes.

This is a wrought iron fence that's gonna be put up.

Excellent.

Um that's all on the plans.

These are the plans, yes.

Yep.

That uh answers all my questions.

Good.

Uh Jerry.

Thank you, Chairman.

Um I I actually I'll hold my questions for now.

I'm gonna wait.

Okay.

Um I think staff had some in the staff report.

Um Peter, do you have a chance to review those?

Yes.

Okay, are those acceptable?

Yes.

Okay.

So where required will you revise the plans to incorporate those changes?

Yeah, and I I I think to a large degree that's already been done, and I think that every comment was responded to the only thing that we don't have.

Vanita, correct me if I'm wrong, is the the sort of final acknowledgement from Luke about the traffic and parking situation.

Mr.

Butneweather.

No, that's not what I'm talking about.

I'm talking about her comment.

Um I'm sorry, I missed that, say it again.

So there's a few things.

Yeah.

Can we um if if we can just go through the staff report?

Peter, you have that there.

Sorry, my connection may bring to my um so I there's a few things that I noted in my staff report.

Uh those are just notations on the elevations and the plan, like, you know, what are the materials that you're using for the windows?

You know, we trust that it's all going to be good materials, but just for the sake of um, you know, they're consistent with what's on the building already.

Um, so if you can add those details on the on the elevations, that'll be good.

Yeah.

You want us to go through each of the items in the staff report, Peter, or do you know what they are?

Um I think I received a copy of the staff report today.

Are we talking about the same thing, Benita?

Yes.

Yes.

One staff report.

Yeah.

Dated yesterday.

Yeah, that that's the one.

Um if you would like to go through them, you we can, but I am prepared to agree to everything that's in the staff report.

Okay.

Would you so for next meeting?

Would you go through the staff report, please, and make the revisions to the to your documents?

And requested by staff.

Yep.

It'll just it'll speed up the process of getting this approved.

Sure.

Benita, was there anything in the staff report you thought was particularly important to call out?

I think she's frozen, did everything.

Well, you look like okay.

Um couldn't hear you, David.

I I think that they're not too many asks.

That's okay.

Vanita, are you?

I'm I'm here.

You're done for the moment?

Yes.

Okay.

Um, I agree with uh Roseanne.

This looks very nice.

Um there be fencing all around.

I mean new fences on all sides.

Yes.

Okay.

Is that shown on the plan?

Yes.

Can you show us, please?

Yes.

Yep.

So this is the line of fencing.

Where it where my cursor is moving.

Can you see that?

Okay.

It needs to be labeled.

Um I think I was I think I think it on the plans it probably is labeled.

This is a stripped down one for this meeting for the slide.

Um I will confirm that it is labeled on the plans.

I think it does say Rot Iron Fence and Gate.

I saw, yeah, I saw it up at the front, but not around the the rest of the perimeter.

Here's a note that escaped my my purge of things for the making of the slide.

Um again, this was a these were a slide made.

This was made for the for the presentation.

This is not um I will confirm that it is duly noted all the way around on the plans.

And it'll be wrought iron all the way around.

Yep.

Great.

Does the board um this could be aluminum or actual iron?

Is this of concern to you, or is the style the wrought iron style what you are?

Jerry, what do you think?

I I would love to see the raw iron iron.

Very good.

What's the area that's labeled the community space?

Wait, wait, wait.

Oh, all right.

Are you good with wrought iron, Bill?

Yeah, sure.

Okay.

I'm good with rotten iron or wrought iron.

Um like.

Yeah, I know real rough iron is very expensive.

And I would agree.

Um I would go with wrought iron over the whatever the alternative was aluminum.

Well, it would look like it's just that's fine.

Okay.

Um what was the next question?

Bill, you were about to ask something.

What's in the community area marked community space?

This is an open area for gathering, similar to what is there now.

Is that paved?

It is calling for a flag for for new stone, new paving on this area.

The old one is slightly sloped to because it was ostensibly a driveway for fire engines.

So the idea is to put down something more inviting and and warm and in this space.

And there's another planting in the front where you can put something.

Yes.

Good.

Yes.

And that'll is it possible to you could show us what that community space will look like?

You would like a render of it?

Please.

Yeah, okay.

I I don't have that made, but I can come back with it.

Um Roseanne, did you finish with your questions?

I did.

Okay.

Jerry.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Uh, my overall concern, and I guess we'll have to go to TTP with this, is the um is parking.

Uh, you know, and I know that we have there there are some parking here, but especially uh being a house of worship.

Um having the experience of working with these types of um houses of worships.

Um my concern is the um the street that's there, it's uh very dense and um both sides of the streets.

Uh there's parking uh now.

Uh there's parking uh now and uh and also uh during the house of worship during holidays.

Um is there going to be an adjacent parking lot or uh a secondary parking lot?

Um I'm I'm just concerned how that the the house of work is a question or are you frozen?

No.

Hello?

I'm here.

Can you end frozen?

No, I think Peter is frozen.

Oh, okay.

There you are.

You're back.

Peter, you have a question?

No, I thought you all were frozen.

Oh, okay.

Go ahead, Pierre.

Sorry.

Sure.

Um, knowing the area, uh, and it's very dense with parking and with traffic.

Uh it's a concern, especially with the house of worship.

Having some experience working with these house of worships, they're usually, especially around holidays.

How are we going to address that?

And and my concern is how that's going to impact that area, as it's it's very dense with traffic on both sides of the road as it is right now.

So I'm I'm very and I guess we'll we'll talk with TTP about this as well.

Yeah, I think this is something that has to be brought up with CTP.

That the we have the congregation has about 100 members right now, and we have spaces for 100 members to worship.

And um, we've provided the parking adequate for that, and a sort of overflow situation that you're describing that the facility doesn't accommodate it, and there's both a religious tradition, but also uh an active um uh proclamation that prohibits worship in other spaces besides the worship space.

So to the degree that this can be addressed by having a right size facility, sort of by seats, it has been this is a little bit like pews in uh a church, right?

That this limits how many people can worship.

Um if we're talking about something exceeding that capacity, then it will need to be done elsewhere because this building has that capacity.

Right.

And just to Peter, just to just note there are other houses of worships that have and this um and have been required for additional you know parking, one of them being Bethany Church.

Uh they use the old um historical center as well as Northeast School uh for overflow uh during you know during holidays.

Uh you look at uh St.

Leo's, uh there's you know, uh you look at uh the the additional parking at St.

Mary's in the back.

Um so there's you know there have been provisions made for um fairs, uh uh holidays, that additional um, you know, that those additional um moments that the the houses of worship expand into the community.

And I and I would like to see how we're gonna address that with this, you know, treating it equally.

Um uh there's an equal concern.

Our our biggest opportunity to do that would be with the school across the street, um, which is slated for demolition, and there doesn't appear to be any way to sort of resolve that at this time.

Um I don't know if we can commit to like from our side, we certainly can commit to intending to have a shared parking agreement, but there's no partner on the other side to agree with that.

That space is owned by the town.

And I believe, oh sorry.

How about elsewhere in the neighborhood?

This is a residential neighborhood.

Um so we're certainly open to it.

Okay.

But it's it's not it's not clear what opportunity there is close by to do it.

We did investigate and we came back with um you know that there are residents around, but then we were told that these have to be deeded parking spaces.

So not deeded, but they have to be leased.

Um parked more than happy to do that, and we provided a van for transportation if such a space can be secured.

Well um, and if it's if it's necessary.

Okay, there is you you mentioned the parking management plan earlier.

Our ranks do require a parking management plan for all special permits.

So um 2F.

So uh you do need to have a special a parking management plan.

So we okay we would like to see that and um see how you cover the um the peak holiday times for parking.

Okay.

Uh I think this is very reasonable.

And when we're talking about the peak holiday times, that is much more manageable than the sort of every day having additional parking, which was the context of the my understanding of the context of the first round of this.

So I think that we can definitely secure uh offsite parking for peak times.

Uh I'll need to look into that, obviously, but I feel comfortable that that's going to be achievable.

Okay, and hopefully you'll be able to uh identify that in the parking management plan.

Exactly.

Some sort of agreement with that counterparty.

Yep.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

That's good.

No, that was my concern and my question.

Um see if I had anything that isn't covered yet.

Um, put any lighting in the parking lot, or is it lit or leave it dark?

It has existing, it has existing lights, which will be made sure that they are working.

Um I have not done a lighting plan on it.

Okay.

Um I think Anita, we have lighting standards, don't we?

Um, you know, we have the lighting ordinance, which requires that you know, all there's no light split, you know, outside the property boundaries.

So that's really the parameter.

There's you know there's maximum humans that you can have on the periphery.

Okay.

I can submit a lighting plan for the next meeting.

Okay, just make sure that you meet the city standard.

Um for the sidewalk.

Um is there any I think one of our departments mentioned sidewalk issue.

Um again, this refers to an earlier version of the plans where we were cutting into the plans to put plantings in front of the along the curb, which turned out not to be feasible.

There is a the we're not doing any sidewalk cuts.

The the cuts exist already, and we're taking advantage of them where they are, and the sidewalks appear to already be ADA compliant, or at least the improvements such as uh at the corner uh the the curb cuts at the corners and the crosswalks exist.

Okay, so you'll they are either ADA compliant now or you'll make them ADA compliant.

Um we're not doing anything to the sidewalks, is that where are we talking about?

If we're talking about the plaza in the front, we are I I do guarantee that will be ADA compliant.

If we're talking about the sidewalks going the existing sidewalks that go past where we're not touching the curb cuts, we're not putting in trees, we're not doing anything.

That's what we're talking about.

Yeah.

To already be compliant.

Is that are you?

I think it's the isn't it the applicant's responsibility to make sure they're ADA compliant, Benita?

Um the sidewalk requirement is triggered for a certain size of development.

Um this project is doesn't hit those thresholds because of the size.

If it were a larger project, then yes, they they have an obligation to ensure that the site, you know, sidewalks are upgraded.

I I um okay, yeah.

Um, I think it it leaves it the one um item in our site or requirement is it it's as determined by the zoning board for any application for special permit.

Um so it does have some flexibility in the requirement.

Okay.

But it Peter, at this point, you think the sidewalk, the corners have already been made ADA compliant?

Yes.

Or the corner.

Yes.

Okay.

The bicycle parking.

Can you show us where that is, please?

This is the front ramp to the front.

This is the bicycle parking.

Ah, okay.

It has been moved to be very close to the front.

It is separated from the cars by a small space and out of the traffic pattern of either the pedestrians or the vehicles.

Good.

Thank you.

Um, we talked about the landscaping with a list of uh plant species for AB per uh environmental protection boards request.

Um by the way that they've requested native and or non-invasive species on fire marshal.

Is it I think the fire marshal's letter was looking for a response is the best I could tell.

Um has there been one?

Yes.

We should get you, David, a copy of I I collated all of the uh official comments and responses together into a package.

Well, we have we have the response to TTP, we've got the response to engineering.

There no response to fire and no response to ECB.

Um I think you know, if it were wasn't the last week, it would have been after the mailing went out to the board already.

So you might have gotten emails with those uh responses, but you know, we can send out the physical copies um when we do the mailing for the next reading.

Email them.

I didn't I didn't see email responses.

Um maybe I missed them, but if you could email those again.

Sure.

Yeah.

Thank you.

So that would be fire and EPB.

Okay, that's all I've got.

Um board, anything else before we go to the public.

No, Mr.

Chairman, I'm good.

Nothing for me.

What's that?

Okay.

So if there's anyone here from the public who wishes to speak on uh this application, can you um please raise your hand?

And when you're called on, uh give us your name and your address.

And um Peter, the way it works is we'll get through all the time.

Yeah, we'll get through all of the public and then um then you can respond.

So don't you don't need to respond to each one as they speak.

Uh we'll do it at the end.

Okay.

Dave Adams, go ahead.

Uh thank you, uh Chair Stein, and uh thank you, uh zoning board uh for another opportunity to speak this evening.

My name's Dave Adams.

I'm uh from Glenbrook.

I live on Glenbrook Road.

And uh I just wanted to make a couple of comments.

For one, I am in support of this project.

I think that uh, you know, increasing the diversity of of religious institutions in the cities uh and the diversity of it is important.

I think that's you know um the kind of inclusivity that we've been trying to achieve.

Um, but I am concerned about uh the increased traffic uh that may occur here.

Uh I know that Lockwood is not the widest street, and uh there is a big push to uh Titan streets, but I um I'm really against that.

I think it's makes things more dangerous.

Uh so I'm um, but uh, you know, I just concerned about the the traffic more than anything else.

Um otherwise I would I would love to see this project go forward.

Thank you for your time.

Good.

Thank you.

As you probably know, uh it does not require a traffic study.

Uh yeah, no, uh I'm I I understand that.

I just uh know from my own experience driving down Lockwood Avenue that it can, you know, it it's Pete.

There's fair amount of traffic that goes down that road already, and it is a tight street.

And that's all I mean it's it's it just something to note, not something to perseverate about.

Okay, thank you.

You're welcome.

Next we have Mr.

Farhan Memoon.

Good evening, uh, Chairman and members of the zoning board.

My name is Farhan Memon.

I'm a Norwalk resident at 15 Pequat Drive in Norwalk, Connecticut, and a community leader with the Norwalk Islamic Community Center.

And also I'm the chair of the Connecticut chapter of the Council on American Islamic Relations, a national civil rights organization.

Thank you for the opportunity to speak in support of the application to convert the Lockwood property from a private social club into a mosque and community center.

As you know, this request is not about changing the character of the neighborhood.

It's about continuing the property's long tradition as a place where people gather, connect, and serve their community.

For decades, the site has been used as a social and assembly space, and the mosque is fundamentally the same, a place of worship, reflection, and community service.

The Stanford community, as you know, has grown significantly in the past years.

Families who live and work in the city need a safe and accessible place to pray, educate their children, and gather peacefully.

And this proposal responds to the real and demonstrated community need.

And as I know that you recognize this evening, the applicants have carefully designed the project to meet all of Stanford's zoning requirements, including parking and traffic standards under the code.

And additionally, they've thoughtfully planned for peak attendance during major religious holidays.

And for those high attendance days, the community has committed to using alternative off-site venues for worship to avoid congestion and neighborhood impact.

And this shows responsible planning and a genuine effort to be good neighbors.

And while the mosque community has expressed a willingness to work collaboratively with nearby residents and the city on parking management if needed, it's important to recognize that the proposal already complies with zoning laws.

Any additional parking considerations or conditions should be based on objective standards applied equally to all houses of worship and assembly uses.

This law requires that religious assemblies be treated on equal terms with other places of assembly, and that zoning decisions not impose substantial burdens without compelling justifications.

In Connecticut, specifically in Norwalk, we've seen the consequences of this when the principles aren't followed.

The city of Norwalk settled with a mosque here for approximately 2.5 million dollars related to a zoning issue in light of a special permit application that was made in 2016.

And I raise this just as a reminder that decisions need to be grounded in neutral land use principles, which protect both religious freedom and the town of Stanford itself.

I would say in conclusion that beyond worship, the center will provide a positive contribution to Stanford through youth programs, food drives, interfaith dialogue, and charitable services that will benefit the broader community.

You want to just wrap it up?

I will I will do that, sir.

Thank you.

The mosques across Connecticut and Fairfield County routinely partner with schools and promote understanding.

I respectfully urge you all to approve this plan.

Thank you for your time and consideration.

Good.

Thank you.

David, uh I don't see any other hand.

Okay.

Oh, but actually, I do see another one.

Um Miss Monika Twal.

Good evening, Monika Twal, 37 Hannahan Street.

Um, I oppose this application.

One, it was quite disgraceful by the it was quite disgraceful, shameful by the planning zone to just throw this in as a special permit, uh going from a clubhouse to a house of worship.

Uh uh the clubhouse is a this was a firehouse initially in the 1900s.

Now it's a uh it was a Greek American uh clubhouse where they had wonderful festivities.

I lived next to a Greek Orthodox church.

I know that they were very peaceful, uh loving, and they united the community in the South End.

Uh they also uh now we have this mosque, which is a concern for me.

I live on Wash, I live not far from Washington Boulevard, and when the Islamic Center on Washington Boulevard was conducting illegal uh illegal gatherings of mosque services uh on Fridays, the street on Washington Boulevard was impacted from sidewalk to sidewalk, meaning that traffic on this uh Brian Bill Memorial Highway was blocked, and nothing was done about it.

No true no traffic tickets were given, no violations were issued, nothing of that sort.

So that concerns me on Lockwood Avenue on the Cove area.

Uh growing up Lockwood Avenue, as I would come down the the, we would I would take the bus from Catholic High down to Lockwood Avenue, get to the south end.

Obviously, there was always traffic.

Three o'clock dismissal of the school, traffic.

Uh uh Cove going down Cove Road was traffic.

Uh so this is a concern for me.

Maybe 104 people, but when you have a mosque which doesn't follow the rules and regulations of the city of Stanford, we have a chaos, chaos on our street.

You you don't know what this mosque will do.

They they have pledged to follow our Mr.

Let me follow, let me finish my three minutes.

Uh there is a there is concern.

The other concern is the name of this the the name of this uh this mosque.

Uh I don't know what it is.

I can't even pronounce it.

It's in Arabic.

We are in the United States of America, our first language, the planning zone made a that's enough.

That's enough.

Um do we have anyone else who wants to speak?

Manita, you're muted.

I don't see.

Um, actually, we have Tamal Ahmad.

Okay.

Mr.

Ahmed, uh please proceed.

Hi there.

Can you hear me guys?

We can just give us your name and address, please.

Sure.

First name's Chamal, last name's Ahmed.

Uh address is 75 E.

Lane Drive, Stanford, Connecticut.

I live here on the north end of Stanford.

Um, just as a representative of the Stanford community.

Um, as a Muslim living in Stanford, you know, I am fully um, you know, supporting this project simply because I know these people, I know the community members here, and they will all support and follow along the rules that you um kind of point out.

Um, and like the previous sister was mentioning what the what the name of the masjid is.

Um, essentially what that means, mercy to mankind.

And that's exactly what will happen.

Being merciful towards people, being merciful towards other people, and creating projects, creating um different initiatives that will help other people and our internal community as well.

So that's exactly what I wanted to say.

Thank you.

Good.

Thank you.

Uh it looks like that's it, Panita, right?

Right.

That's how okay.

Um Peter, and any of those comments.

Um other than the ones that were so disrespectful, but any of the the ones that apply to this application.

Any responses you want to make?

I think I'd sort of just like to make a closing statement on which it seems like maybe you didn't get maybe maybe some of the board did not receive everything that was submitted.

And I think everything that was brought up was answered and either incorporated it into the drawings or we um intend to as soon as the information becomes available.

Um so uh our intent is to fully comply with everything.

And I and that represents uh the instructions that I have received from the client.

And so I want to stress that that it is our intention, whatever this board and whatever the municipality says are the governing rules for this.

We intend to fully comply with them.

And uh hopefully by the next meeting that will be clear when you receive everything.

And if there's still any unclear points, um we'll we'll clear that up.

Uh that's my closing statement.

So um we're gonna be continuing this hearing to our next meeting.

Let me just go over what I I think um you will be providing.

Um and board, if I leave anything out, please please add it in.

Um first is the uh landscape plan.

Um next, I guess we're waiting for the outcome of the meeting between applicant and TTP and staff on Thursday.

So we um whatever comes out of that um should be um added into the the documents.

Um staff report had some changes that they requested.

Um so um those should be added in to the documents.

Um to the extent it's not there, just indicate the wrought iron fence around the entire perimeter.

Um we asked for a rendering of the community space that's in the front of the mosque.

And um last is the uh parking management plan.

Did I leave anything out?

No, I don't think so.

No.

Looks right.

Peter, did you get that or did I read that too quickly?

No, I got it all.

Okay, good.

So um what we'll be doing is um continuing the hearing to our next meeting.

Um if you could provide these items.

Um try to do it uh several days before the meeting, please, so that we have a chance to read it.

Um application 225-39 is being continued until the next meeting of the zoning board on February 9th, 2026 at 6:30 p.m.

on Zoom.

So um Peter, we'll see you then.

Any questions on anything?

Um, please give Vanita a call and she'll I'm sure she can take care of it.

Thank you very much for your time and consideration.

Thank you.

Thank you, Peter.

Okay.

Next, we have um two applications relating to 1150 Summer Street's um daycare application.

First one is application 225-43 Summer EP LLC 1150 summer street map change.

Applicant is seeking a zoning map change from the current CI intermediate commercial zoning district to the CG general commercial zoning district.

The second application is application 225-44, summer EP LLC, 1150 Summer Street, General Development Plan.

Applicant is proposing to convert the existing office building to include a child daycare center use, including proposed improvements and additions.

Um Roseanne, could you please read the um planning board letter?

Muted, Roseanne.

I'm sorry.

I was reading that whole letter.

Well, it was great.

We enjoyed it.

Okay.

Um, 2025 to the zoning board regarding ZB application 225-43 Summer EPLLC.

Dear Mr.

Zine and members of the zoning board.

During the regularly scheduled meeting held on Tuesday, November 18th, 2025.

The planning board reviewed the above captioned application, referred in accordance with the requirements of the Stanford Charter.

Applicant is seeking a zoning map change from the current C1, intermediate commercial zoning district to the CG, General Commercial Zoning District.

Raymond Mazio, Redness and Meade made a presentation and answered questions from the board.

After a brief discussion, the planning board unanimously voted to recommend approval of ZB application 225-43 and found this to be in general harmony with the 2035 Comprehensive Plan MU3 mixed use urban future land use category.

Sincerely Stanford Planning Board Jennifer Gadzeno, Chair.

Thank you.

If anyone has a question, GDPs don't get planning board letters.

So there's only one planning board letter for the map change.

Do we have the certificate of mailing on this, Fanita?

Yes.

Okay.

And we have the sign affidavit.

Yes.

Okay.

So applications two two five dash four three and two two five-4 are being continued until the zoning board meeting on March 9th.

Correct?

So that's a little more than a month away.

March 9th, 2026 at 6 30 on Zoom.

Thank you.

Okay.

Continuing.

We are now into the regular meeting.

And the first item we have is the minutes of January 5th.

Dyn Morris McManus Pozak.

Everyone was there.

Good.

Do we have any uh changes or corrections to the minutes?

Nothing for me.

No, Mr.

Chairman, good.

Can we get a motion to approve the uh January 5th minutes?

So moved.

Second.

Okay.

Any further discussion?

All in favor say aye.

Aye.

Okay.

Minutes are approved for zero.

Um next we have pending applications.

And um none of them have closed.

No.

So we're done.

Um anything.

Uh well, Vanita.

Um, can you give us a preview of our next meeting?

Yes.

And that's February 9th, right?

It is.

So in addition to the continuations from tonight, we have the St.

John's new building for final site plan approval.

And we also have special permit C building for fine site plan.

Yes.

Um, so we have the St.

John's, which would take the place of the uh two towers.

The two round towers downtown.

Um and what's the second one?

CLC at 60 Bom Marcel.

Children's Learning Center.

Didn't we do that or did we not do the final site plan?

Was that it?

Yes.

Um, good.

Um, so those are two new applications.

Uh in addition to the bathhouse and the uh the moss.

Okay, good.

Yes.

Umyb have any questions?

Uh okay.

Then uh bill 10 o'clock.

That's not bad.

Not bad.

Okay, can we get a motion to adjourn?

So moved.

Second.

All in favor.

We're adjourned.

Thank you, everybody.

Thank you.

Bye bye.

How do I get on here?