Manita, am I a uh co-host, or if not, could you make me please?

I will make you a co-host.

Um, we can get started, David.

Okay.

Um I'd like to welcome everyone and call tonight zoning board meeting to order.

I'm David Stein, Chair of the Zoning Board, and it is 637 on February 9th, 2026.

The members in the board, sorry, the members of the board and the staff are holding this meeting by Zoom video conference.

The public is in attendance both on video conference and by teleconference.

I'd like to do a roll call of the board and the staff.

Uh Bill Morris.

Here.

Roseanne McManus.

Here.

Jerry Bozak.

Here.

And um so we have all the board members here.

And now for the uh staff, Ralph Blessing.

And Vanita Matter.

Good.

We have everyone.

Um the board's microphones will be open throughout tonight's meeting.

The applicant's microphones will be open during the public hearing when their application is being heard.

However, I would ask the applicant to please mute their mics when not speaking in order to reduce background noise.

The first part of tonight's meeting is the public hearing during which the public will have the opportunity to speak.

Each member of the public will be muted until it is your turn to speak.

Here's the procedure for the public to let us know that you would like to speak.

If you came in through Zoom, please use the raise your hand function and you will be unmuted when it is your turn to speak.

And we'll call on you at that time.

If you called in on one of the telephone uh phone numbers, uh please press star nine, and this will raise your hand, and then star six to unmute when it is your turn to speak.

When members of the public speak, please give us your name and address for the record and whether you are in favor of or opposed to the application.

The board requests that members of the public limit your comments to three minutes so that everyone will have a chance to speak.

If you have a problem trying to speak, you you want to raise your hand and it doesn't work or some other issue, please send an email to Vanita and she will do what she can to get you on.

Um her email address is VMT at the VMATHUR at StamfordC T.gov.

This meeting is being recorded and will be posted at the zoning board's website.

And you can find the agenda for tonight's meeting and the meeting applications and other materials by going to our website, www.stanford ct.gov slash zoning.

The first application that we're taking up tonight is a continuation from our last meeting on January 26th is application 225-37.

Five Harbor Point Square LLC, Harbor Point Master Unit S5, aka zero Washington Boulevard, number S5, General Development Plan, Site and Architectural Plans and or requested uses and coastal site plan review.

Applicant is proposing to transfer 34,000 plus or minus square feet of commercial floor area from block P7 to the property to facilitate a new health and wellness use known as the Bath House.

So attorney Feinberg, welcome.

And you please take it away.

Great.

For the record, my name is Lisa Feinberg.

I'm a partner with Carmen Torrent, Sandack, and Hennessy.

As you know, I am here tonight on behalf of the applicant in connection with the Bath House proposal.

This is our third night of a public hearing, so we will do our very best to be brief.

When we left you on January 26th, you asked us to give some additional thought to the SRDS design guidelines and consider ways that we could increase window transparency and provide some additional enhancements to the building facades.

You all should have received a package with an updated architecture narrative, which includes new rendered views as well as a memo from my office describing compliance with the SRDS design guidelines.

We also included an updated landscape plan and civil plans uh depicting the new landscape buffer on the western side of the building.

These materials were also posted on the zoning board's website.

In terms of tonight's presentation, I thought I would just briefly walk you through the facade changes and then turn to any questions that you may have.

So, Mr.

Chairman, may I share my screen?

Yeah, please go ahead.

Okay.

You all see that?

Yep.

Yep.

Yes, ma'am.

Okay.

So this is the Washington Boulevard facade.

Um you can see the windows on the northern half of this eastern side of the building have been enlarged, uh, thereby increasing the glass transparency from 17% to 42%.

I have also uh provided a side-by-side of each of the images just to make it easier uh to see the changes.

So on the left, you can see what we had previously proposed, and on the right um is the current proposal.

What's the difference?

I'm sorry, can you go back?

Sure.

They look pretty similar.

These windows got significantly larger.

That's how we went from 17 to 42 percent.

So most of them really doubled in size.

You can see it here and here.

Gotcha.

They did it's not the addition of windows, but the enlargement of the existing windows.

They got larger, exactly.

Okay.

Okay.

So on the northern facade, um, our team took another look and uh recognized that an interior hallway is located along that edge of the building, which provided an opportunity for new windows to be added on this facade as well.

And you can see them down here.

So this increased the glazing on this facade from 3% to 44%.

And this is a side-by-side of that facade.

On the western facade, uh, as Ms.

McMahon has suggested, we have added a landscape buffer along the entire frontage.

We can see that here.

And then here is that side by side.

So lastly, uh, we felt that the southern facade appropriately addressed the design guidelines with multiple building materials.

There's both vertical and horizontal facade plane changes.

You can see them throughout here.

Um, and then of course, landscaping.

So uh this uh rendered view of the facade is also taken from inside of the parking lot.

So if you were walking on the sidewalk or driving down the road, you wouldn't have this exact view.

You'll be looking through all of the new street trees and the parking lot trees.

All of that said, um, we truly want to be as responsive as possible.

So uh since our submission, we have made one additional change for your consideration.

And you can see that here.

So if you prefer this treatment, the applicant would commit to the addition of this is weeping juniper uh plantings along the rooftop edge, which would grow down the building.

And here is that side-by-side comparison.

And just for frame of reference, this is that the plant weeping juniper.

Is that um a nice improvement?

Thank you.

And those are that's at full growth or after several years, it would look like that, or I think that planting, yeah.

It grows Matt Pop, he couldn't be here tonight, but he said it'll get it can get up to you know six to eight feet.

Um, so it's it's substantial.

Okay.

That's really all I had for you tonight.

Uh, as I said, we've tried to be as responsive to your feedback as we could be while not jeopardizing the integrity of the use or the privacy of the guests.

So we we really hope that you agree.

Okay, I think that's a uh really good improvement.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Um let's go to the board.

Uh Bill.

Yeah, um, I agree with David.

The effort was definitely worth the effort that you put into this.

Uh and uh eyes of boardman appreciate uh you're doing that.

But I do have a question on the planting plan for the rooftop.

I I noticed that in the renderings that you're showing plantings on the rooftop, but I don't see any planting plan for that.

Are you going to provide one later?

Or um no, Mr.

Morris.

We had talked about that early on.

The plan would be to come back to staff with that planting plan um as a as a final you know approval design.

You you will provide a plan.

Absolutely, yes.

And we're happy to accept a condition of approval requiring us to do that.

Okay.

And then on the northern side.

I'm sorry, they'll be built one sec.

Vanita, could you just make a note of that?

Please that are for conditions that um we need to add that.

Thanks.

Sorry, Bill, go ahead.

Okay, and on the uh the northern side, could you put the side by side up again?

Sure.

Yeah.

Oh, there it is.

Sorry.

I it appears to me when I've been looking at the rendering that you've also added uh additional windows or glass to the northwestern edge of this building.

Is that correct?

Or is that these got bigger?

I don't believe.

I'm sorry, you're right.

These got larger, and we added more of them.

Okay, that's what I okay.

That's what I thought.

And uh with the planting plan, would you supply it for the western edge of the building or western side of the building?

Um I personally don't no longer have a concern regarding how that looks.

Thank you.

Uh I think that's it for me, David.

Okay.

Uh Roseanne.

Uh Bill asked all the good questions, and I really appreciate uh the improvement.

I think that it'll look uh great in the neighborhood.

Okay, good.

Thanks.

Jerry?

Yeah, I just want to echo the rest of the board members on the really thoughtful consideration.

It really the plantings of junipers coming down has really softened up the building.

It's a real pleasant surprise, and and thank you very much, the um speaking of the junipers.

Do we need it needs okay?

Is that where we're gonna have a um planting?

That'll be the roof planting plan that it shows up on later on.

Exactly.

Okay, okay.

Good.

Well, okay.

If there's nothing else from the board, um, let's go to the public.

If there's anyone from the public who would like to speak on this, um please raise your hand when we call on you.

Um please give us your name and address for the uh record.

Uh first we have Mr.

Cody Heisinger.

Yes, hi, can you hear me?

Yes.

Excellent.

Uh yeah, hello.

Uh, my name is Cody Heisinger, and I'm a resident of 181 Brookdale Road and North Stanford.

I've been a frequent user of bath house locations in New York City already, and believe it has a positive impact for those in the growing wellness community.

In fact, it had such an impact on me that I've attempted unsuccessfully to invest in the company, and as a result, had been speaking with other investors about bringing the bathhouse concept to Stanford.

Um I would be driving from North Stanford through downtown, but likely it would promote me to stay in downtown and dine.

However, I believe many users would actually be coming from the Harbor Point area and be walking to the facility.

Uh a lot of people down there.

Um I think the new proposed building design is attractive, modern, and clean.

The windows seem kind of pointless as we users appreciate the privacy.

And it seems that the windows are more geared toward uh curious eyes from the outside.

Um, I don't know.

Um phones and cameras aren't even permitted.

So you know, the current facilities have no windows, and I appreciate that kind of privacy and immersion of the experience.

Um, mind you, it's neighbors right now, a blight of fuel tanks, I believe.

Uh the booking system is generally only allows for a certain amount of people every 30 minutes or hours.

So I think that traffic flow would be reasonably limited.

I have been not an advocate of overdevelopment in Stanford as it reaches its saturation point for traffic in the downtown area uh with more residential plans.

So uh, you know, this uh location seems to be perfectly fine.

Um Stanford should approve the bathhouse application and construction so residents can enjoy a social healthy activity outside of the gym or less healthy options, such as the bar scene or stagnant idling of a movie theater.

Um I'm missing any other activities.

Um we need healthy things to do.

And if you're in the city, I urge you to enjoy one of their current facilities, have a good sweat in the dry sauna or steam room, dip in the cold plunge, and then quickly hop in the uh hot tub, have a healthy snack, and of course, hydrate a lot.

Um I'm sure any technicalities to the exterior design can be resolved.

And this is a good company with a good service that will benefit the people of Stanford.

Uh thank you.

Thank you.

Thanks.

Um, Vaniti, you're keeping time here, right?

Yes, I am.

Yeah.

Okay.

Is under three minutes.

Now we have Mr.

Barry Michelson.

Uh yes, my name is Barry Michelson.

I live on Idlewood Drive.

Uh, and uh I looked at the application and the uh and I think it's quite a stretch.

Basically, I would consider this a non-conforming use.

We have zoning regulations that are permissive, and that means everything that's allowed in the regulations is clearly stated.

Nowhere I did a word search of the raw regulations, nowhere does it say it's uh we provide for bath houses.

Gymnasium and cultural and physical cultural centers are two different things.

I read the memo from uh comedy uh indicating uh uh uh their their uh their uh consult with the uh staff and not just stretch.

It's a zoning board that interprets the regulations.

They worked as both a legislative body and an administrative body, not the staff, not the applicant.

I just said nowhere does it appear uh in our regulations as a bathhouse.

I saw the letter from the mail clinic.

That's very nice.

All those things no one can argue with.

There have been bath houses around for centuries.

But I'd also like to remind the board most recently, not too or not too long ago, there was one in the neighborhood I used to live in in the in the uh West Village.

It's called Plato's Pay House, and that became the epicenter of the AIDS AIDS epidemic.

I think the board should deny this application.

It's not permitted use in our regulations, and it is a um it it presents many, many problems.

I don't know whether they received any kind of attention or if there's been any uh health requirements with regard to state licensing of this kind of a facility, but this is not something that uh we should just go into, and we as we have no provisions in our regulations, I said before, should we accommodate it?

Basically, the board has been uh I feel, and this is my personal opinion as a planner, a little bit too lax.

And I used to stay when I was on the board.

We would make uh we would generally uh instead of having projects conform to the regulations, we'd make the regulations conform to the projects.

I think the board should be more rigorous in the uh in the in the regulations, and it's believe me, I don't like all the new regulations that are coming uh that that have come about recently.

But this was one that uh as I said, there's absolutely it's uh is a most far-reaching uh and far-fetched uh interpretation.

And I thank you.

Good.

Thank you.

Next, we have Mr.

Michael Falvin.

Please unmute and uh give us your name and address, Mr.

Palvey.

Mr.

Palvey.

Okay, why don't we go on to the next one actually?

Yes.

The next speaker is Ms.

Sue Halburn.

Hi, good evening.

Um, this is Sue Halpern 30 Elmcroft Road, but I also have my neighbor John DeRose here too that wanted to say a couple of words.

So I just wanted to add I appreciate you worked on the aesthetics of this building, which is great.

However, nobody's you know, there were comments from neighbors about the noise from the roof tap pool and rooftop bar, and they're they are gonna be serving alcoholic beverages, and you know, nobody seems to be addressing that.

That's gonna be an issue down here, a quality of life issue.

Um, you know, I appreciate it's that there's a healthy aspect to this, but it is for adults only.

It's not a community center that um people have tried to make it seem like it's gonna be so great for the community.

Yes, you know, I mean, all the people in Harbor Point, it'd be great.

They do have their own pools and they do have their own gym.

But how many people actually in the neighborhood are gonna be able to utilize this, afford to utilize this um building here.

But in the meantime, if you don't mind, I'd like to get have John DeRosa speak.

He's sitting here with me.

So go ahead.

Sure.

Good evening.

Rosa, why don't you uh introduce yourself and give us your address, please?

My name is John DeRosa.

I live at 62 Elm Croft Road.

I've been a resident of the South End for over 35 years.

And with that said, you know what changes I've seen.

And um I'm appalled that something like this is even discussed to be used in the South End.

You know, the gentleman that first got on spoke about he lived in North Stanford.

That's fine in North Stanford, but what does he know about the South End?

And why is it that so many times people that are out of towners like to bring in different businesses and retail into the South End, and they're not even here.

My main objective right now is what this building looks like.

Sue has sent me a picture, and I mean it looks horrible.

It looks like a factory.

I hear what the other gentleman said about more window space.

Does that mean people are gonna try and look in and see or whatever, whatever?

But just the whole building reminds you of a factory that was in the South End years ago.

So design the design, I think is horrible.

How be ever I wonder what the requisition is gonna be when this building is open if it does get uh approved.

You know, what kind of clientele is gonna be coming down here in the South End for this building?

The other piece, this business, the other piece is is that many of the buildings, as was said earlier, have their own gyms, have their own pools and whatnot.

So I don't know how much business this is going to generate.

I hear someone spoke about uh a place like this down in Manhattan.

That might be fine, you know.

Maybe they don't have a lot of buildings in her area that have gyms and pools and so on and so forth.

So I think that uh it's unnecessary.

I think that it's horrible looking.

I think the clientele is gonna be a downer to the South End rather than an uplift.

We have a lot of new residents here, and um I would like to think that we come up with something better.

I don't want to go into the fact that we need the food market.

You all know that you've had many discussions on it, but yes, we're talking about a gym.

Anyway, that's all I have to say, but I'm totally against the project.

Mr.

DeRosa.

Yes, sir.

Um it's been a while since you've uh spoken before the board.

So uh welcome back.

Thank you.

Thank you, thank you.

Part of that is Dave, it's just a turn off with so many things taking place that isn't um very accommodating to the residents that have been here for many years, and I know there's not many residents still here like myself, but I would like to think it would be a better plan.

And one of the better plans is as I said before, a supermarket, but so much of that.

That's not on your agenda tonight.

Well, it's it's not we agree with you, by the way.

We would love to have a supermarket there, and if we could make it happen, we would, but you gotta find uh a supermarket willing to open.

And um that's that's our hope too.

Right, right, right, along with the landlords.

I understand.

Yeah.

Okay, well, thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Next, we have Ms.

Um Mr.

Vinny Montemuro.

Good afternoon.

Um, my name is Vinny Monteiro.

Um, I live at 256 Washington Boulevard.

Um, I own a condominium at the Bridgewater condo complex, which will be on the the northern side.

And we've chatted, and our biggest concern is specifically mine is the noise that could be generated from the rooftop.

I've noted that the hours go till till midnight.

Um I think we all know the parking lot and those oil tanks are an eyesore, but um generating a bunch of noise when these condos have families, uh people who get up early in the morning.

Um that type of noise is really going to be impactful to quality of life.

Um, we would like to see a noise study done and potential mitigation proposed um as part of the the facade uh that would go on the north side, whether it's a screening wall.

Um we also want to see improved um uh landscaping on the northern side as well to really block out the view.

Um looking at the site plans and um I'm a background, my engineer, I'm an engineer background, civil engineer, professional engineering licensed, and um looking at these site plans.

I have concerns about how it's oriented.

It it feels like the condo association is really getting um the the bad parts of the orientation with the um with the loading units and the ventilation units, the HVAC units, all of that's gonna contribute to noise that's going to be impacting our quality of life.

So we I would specifically really like to see a noise study done, especially with um some of the the crypto related items that might be going on and the noise and heat that'll be generated from that.

So um currently I am against the project unless we see uh additional changes.

Thank you for your time.

Okay, well, the um when we're done with the public comment, the applicant's attorney will respond both and hopefully she will um address the noise issue because you're not the first person to uh bring that up.

Got it.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Next, we have Miss Marie Ruka.

Hi, I don't know if you can hear me.

Um introduce yourself and give us your address, please.

Um my name is Marie Roca.

I reside at 100 Tressor Boulevard, uh less than a mile from Harbor Point.

I'm writing in support of the application for the proposed use of space for a bathhouse and wellness facility.

In my opinion, this proposal represents a thoughtful future-oriented investment in Harbor Point.

Consumer behavior, particularly among millennials and Gen X has shifted away from alcohol-centered socializing toward more wellness, health, and restorative experiences.

Younger residents are drinking less and intentionally choosing environments that support mental clarity, health, stress reduction, and long-term well-being.

A bathhouse supports steady predictable use throughout the day because of booking um um platforms, and with minimal um disruption to surrounding residential and mixed use spaces.

As a Stanford resident, a business owner, I find it offensive that people are equating bathhouses to that of brothels.

And for me and many others in my community, especially in the building that I reside, we have chosen to pay for wellness experiences, even though our buildings offer gyms and fitness amenities.

Wellness facilities are now substitutes for residence or gym.

They offer um complementary experiences focused on real recovery, relaxation, and overall wealth.

These are the types of amenities that attract professionals and long-term residents who want to live, work, and spend locally.

It is also important to clarify that bathhouses are professionally run and operated wellness environments, not like night clubs.

They align with high standards of conduct conduct um and contribute positively to neighborhood character.

Beyond quality of life, bathhouses tend to support good job creation and economic um growth, wellness facilities in general, tend to generate year-round employment across operations, hospitality, and maintenance, as well as specialized services.

While also driving traffic and benefits to new by businesses, this model supports repeat visitation and diversifying local spending rather than concentrating activities into late night hours.

I look forward to this.

This is the decision that aligns with Harbor Points in Stanford's long-term vision to attract and retain sustainable economic um residents as well as um lost in communities um with in economic values.

Thank you for your consideration.

Thank you.

Um Mr.

Michael Falby has rejoined on I believe this.

So do you have now?

Yes.

Okay, thanks again.

Sorry, sorry so much for that.

Um address, please.

Oh, yes.

So Michael Falvey 256 Washington, I was here at the last meeting.

Yeah.

I do appreciate everybody's time here today.

I know it's uh valuable.

So I did submit something here this afternoon.

Um it didn't entail some questions.

Uh great Mr.

Felby, we did get it and it was um distributed to everybody.

Well, that's great.

I and I and I appreciate you getting back with any questions that are there.

Um just to get some clarification.

I I would like to read through what I submitted uh just for the record as well, which really kind of covers a lot of my points.

It's uh what Mr.

Felvey, what you submitted is in the record.

No, I understand that.

I I want to verbalize it for the community if if you don't mind.

Oh, okay.

Maybe you could summarize it a little bit.

Yeah, I mean, really the the main focus is the noise analysis, as when it's previously mentioned, classification of the data mining center uh and the equipment that is being considered for that, uh the possible future project of the 60 units, and how all that relates to the question of a special permit and whether that's needed or not.

Now, you know, as of as you can see under the section two C1 Stanford zoning regulations, that special permit is required for uses that because of their unique characteristics cannot be distinctly classified or regulated without evaluation.

So considering the neighborhood properties, public health, safety, noise traffic.

So the application has positioned the rooftop pool and the bar as a wellness physical culture concept, but an accessory feature must be clearly incidental and customary subordinate to the principal use, which is the spa.

Um, I want to highlight one thing that was mentioned at the meeting on the 26th, where the uh applicant's representative ref referenced the comparable business named the hideout.

It's located at just Chelsea Pier.

You know, that's a much smaller venue, uh, and they don't serve alcohol.

As a matter of fact, the owner himself uh uh had mentioned on their website, and and I quote, the world doesn't need another bar.

It needs places that bring people together through health fun and good vibe.

We serve contrast therapy instead of booze, share sauna benches rather than bar stools, and chase endorphins overall hangovers.

Their hours are Friday, Saturday, Sunday, no later than 6 p.m., Monday, Wednesday, Thursday, 9 p.m.

Obviously, this ties into our concern of alcohol use, late night use, uh, and the and the large pool that this is.

Uh, you know, out of the 10 examples of the establishments that they that they offered in their example, only two have outdoor uh pool facilities and no none of them have alcohol.

So it's really not a fair comparison.

This is 120 foot or nine 90 foot pool by 20 feet, I believe it is.

Um so I I'm asking the board to consider these sections that I'm mentioning in my letter to C2 requires the board to evaluate whether such a use will be injurious to the neighborhood by reason of noise, lighting, and intensity.

This all ties into the special permit.

Yet no acoustical study, no hours of operation, no occupancy load, no mechanical noise analysis has been submitted.

Without these materials, the board cannot make the findings required under this section two C.

So uh a few quick questions.

Uh can the board confirm whether any special permit application have been submitted?

Mr.

Falcon, do you pass three minutes?

Well, my my one my my well she has to list the questions, so I I I appreciate the time.

We will ask um the attorney for the applicant to look at your questions and respond to those when she responds.

And if you could respond to to the special permit, yeah.

There was no special permit.

And then if if there should be, yeah.

Oh, okay.

All right, thank you.

Next, we have Mr.

Dave Adams.

Um I live on Clipper Road.

And uh, you know, I already focused twice on this on particular application.

Uh as I think before, I don't think it's appropriate for the uh neighborhood that it'd be put in.

I think it'd be much more appropriate if you put in a more industrialized area.

Or even, you know, shelter here.

Shelter here is a site where it's a park.

Uh not open.

Uh so it's a different environment.

And I think you know, this is not established, but much more appropriate that while I don't think it's that uh, you know, audio rate of noise.

I think I'm thinking of myself.

Well, how do you leave the disability?

I remember hearing.

Mr.

Adams, your voice is a little unclear.

I don't know if it's just for me or everybody.

No, it's I can't understand a lot of it as well.

Dave, uh, you may be on a phone in a place that has bad reception.

Um, so we're just not getting most of it.

Uh yeah, for a second, I'm gonna change my head.

Stand by standby.

I am so sorry for that delay.

Um is that is that better?

Yeah, is that better?

Okay, so um sorry, I'm in the vehicle, and you know, vehicle Bluetooth are terrible.

Um so uh what I was trying to say is that you know, uh and I don't know how much you how much you caught, but I you know, as I had stated in previous uh public comment periods, I believe this is much more appropriate for a different uh setting.

Yeah, um, you know, I the the example of the hideout is in Chelsea Pierce, which is a park.

It's uh it's a park for this for these types of purposes.

It's much more an industrialized area.

Uh it's not you know having uh other residences right on top of it, it doesn't have a church straight straight across the street, you know, 325 uh feet.

It's um and and I was sitting there thinking to myself about how you would clean this facility.

Uh if I remember correctly, the applicant had said that stated that um you know, overnight they drain the pools, they drain all the water, they go around, they they wash everything down.

I imagine a lot of that work is being done with power uh pressure washers, which is gonna be mechanical noise that's gonna be going on.

And I realize the building doesn't have uh a ton of windows, and we've been discussing, you know, the the pros and cons of the windows and blah blah blah.

But the reality is is that that noise is still going to be generated.

And so I am just as concerned as as uh many of the other neighbors that there is going to be a noise issue here.

And I also want to back up uh the statements about how uh you know alcohol doesn't scream health uh or wellness.

Uh not that I don't partake in alcohol, but alcoholic beverages just like uh anybody else does.

I'm saying that you know, you won't what when we're talking about this kind of environment and we're trying to avoid being classified as an adult um uh you know, an adult establishment, I I think serving uh removing serving alcohol would be a great uh act of of good faith uh you know towards the neighborhood that you are not going to be uh you know falling into any of the very very historical uh patterns of behavior that have been seen in these types of establishments over the course of history.

I'm not saying anything against this particular applicant or anything negative against this applicant.

I uh you know uh Cody spoke very well of them.

He's uh you know, he's been to their other establishments.

I unfortunately did not get the opportunity to go and visit the one in Brooklyn or the one in Manhattan, but I I do uh I do have concern that that these things tend to get.

That's that's fine.

If you give me two more seconds, we're living in a world where we are getting some pretty serious disclosures, and you have to understand why people are apprehensive considering the environment in which we are politically.

Um there's a long history of the shit.

And that's all I have to say.

Thank you very much, sir.

And I hope you I thank you everyone for all your hard work and have a wonderful evening.

Thank you.

Next, we have Mr.

M Chruskovitz.

Uh hi, my name is Matt Kruchkewitz.

We actually own two properties, one in North Stanford and the other one at 256 Washington Boulevard.

And I have very specific question actually to the board and to the applicant.

The first question is to each board member is why the special permits were not asked.

So and and whatever the rooftop, whatever the rooftop plans were reviewed when you have 90 feet by 20 feet by five feet deep pool with 90,000 gallons of water that are scheduled to be discharged to the Stanford sewer system, inclusive of you know, using 90,000 gallons each day of the fresh water.

Whatever I I'm gonna question every single department in the city of Stanford, how this was missed in the review of the zoning.

And the next question is um there was a lot of people, there was another uh another person talking about um investing in bathhouse.

So bathhouse is using crypto technology mining, which essentially designates bathhouse as a data center.

They need water, they need outside pool to cool the servers.

And I don't know if any of each of the zoning board members actually knows about this fact and whatever this was disclosed by the applicants.

They open the open the owners of the bathrooms opening, telling people on the YouTube videos on the media that they are using the mining cryptocurrency.

So that's one.

We would like to know what equipment is gonna be used and why it was not missed by the zoning board with the review, and who got approval without you know talking about the data center.

The second was about the pool.

If you have such a big pool for even if the daily pass, it's clarifies as the amusement pool area.

It's no longer a dream and the fitness and and the and the spa system.

So that's this that's automatically disqualify and denies the application.

The second one's the noisy, right?

We and and there was a lot of talk about the privacy.

We're gonna from our bedroom windows, we're gonna have direct view to the bathhouse people, you know, running in the in the bath suits and everything like that, right?

I have four months old kid.

I'm just asking any of your board members, which one of you, whatever your son or the grandchildren, you're exposed by your decision by approving this application to live in such a condition.

The board responsibility is to protect the public and to make the space more beautiful and more livable, not the other way around.

And I've heard the comments that no one else is interested in the space, so we have to take what we can.

That I didn't like that at all.

Uh, the second one is the noisy, right?

The noise study needs to be performed.

What we propose, we I'm not against the the bathhouse at all.

It needs to be the pool needs to be enclosed, four walls ceiling, and it's gonna be quiet, right?

That's one.

The second one is cryptocurrency, and and how the water is gonna be discharged.

We have to, and I have a question.

If we are going enter into the drought, that the residents are not allowed to use the water.

Are we so you're at three minutes?

Thank you very much.

I appreciate thank you.

Next, we have Mr.

Aaron Williams.

How are you doing?

I'm Aaron Williams at 256 Washington Boulevard.

Um, thank you for having us uh here.

I know you heard a lot of us over here at 256, but yeah, we are very concerned with the noise.

Um, there's no doubt about it.

I mean, there's many things.

Uh again, I don't know much about this crypto mining or anything like that, but again, the noise.

Um, there's there's a lot of things, but I think you've heard them all.

Mike uh expressed them well.

The last gentleman did as well.

Um, I'm just voicing that I'm Aaron Williams, and uh, yeah, I don't approve of this as well.

Thank you very much.

Thank you, Mr.

Williams.

Um David, those are all the hands that I could see.

Um we have Miss Monica Twell.

Good evening, Monica Twal from 37 Hanrahan Street.

Uh being uh a lifelong resident of Stanford, lived uh in the South End.

My mother has a property there.

Um my church is there, the holy name of Jesus Church.

Uh a faithful parishioner to this day.

My school was there as well.

So uh the South End is very deep and uh significant to me, whether I live in the neighborhood or not.

Uh Stanford is very uh concerning for me.

We are a moral and a very virtuous society.

That's how our our our constitution state was brought up.

Uh, I do not feel that this is anywhere close to being moral.

Let's not forget how Rome fell because of such such disgust and disgrace towards humanity.

Um the arguments that Mrs.

Uh Feinberg gave regarding expanding the windows was just a few few inches, and basically it was for the staff to just have more uh I guess air or light coming in.

There, there's no light and air coming from this uh from this place, obviously.

Uh it's very closed in, dark and dungey, like I said, a marijuana dispensary, anything you want, a cell block, it is very, very unsouth end is uh my concerns are uh that if uh if we continue down this path um for Stanford in the South End and in general, uh this will not end well.

This will not end well.

Uh I am against this proposal.

Uh the general requirements in section two, 2.8 compliance remote requirement, no building or structure shall be moved or uh moved to any designated for any use other than is permitted in the district.

Uh as Mr.

Uh Michaelson had indicated, this is out of bounds.

This is a no you can't play this game with us.

You can't transfer property.

Uh the gentleman Cody Hissinger saying that windows uh uh closed windows geared for curious eyes.

Well, hello, Mr.

We are we are uh the United States of America, and we uh like to see what's going on.

It is our neighborhood, it is run by the people, for the people and by the people.

And uh we do not accept this uh this type of the only can he says no phones or cameras allowed, but there's phone cameras allowed, 16 of them in this uh time sensitive environment, uh, where you get to see a picture of uh who's approaching or not, but inside you can't see what's going on.

Uh this is non-conforming, there's no state licensing, there's vaping to while you're at three minutes.

Uh I'll just wrap it up.

Uh as uh like I said, this is not appropriate.

This is a woman exploitating exploiting women at its finest.

Thank you very much, and I am against this.

Next we have Mr.

Saratosi.

Hello everyone.

Please uh introduce yourself and um give us your address for the record.

Um my name is uh Salvatore Zarella.

I live on the water side.

And uh I I don't have any comments directed to zoning uh regulations related to this.

Uh I per se nor for nor against it in principle.

However, I do have questions that uh I raised, and I do share the very initial um understanding about the priorities.

Uh I have a questions that I like to be asked.

So the questions that I like to be asked, uh Stanford, and in there are some statements, but Stanford needs zoning to recognize the few opportunities available to us for health, uh healthy grocery store options, which we are in great need of.

So zoning can recognize that.

Now they may not be able to put grocery store there, of course, but they can recognize the importance of what the allocations for our zoning ordinances is in the questions that I have is this the social club with adult contact appropriate for the location?

Is it appropriate in the location of schools, new families, churches?

I can identify with the church, I went to school there.

These are the questions that I think should be asked.

It's a big it's a bit curious that scantily dressed folks and hot saunas numbering 50 or 60 or 70 plus people at a time.

Isn't something that somehow raises an eyebrow?

Are the windows truly going to allow visual transparency or is they just glazing in the so these are questions?

Is it truly in the name of health and well-being?

So why is there adult only context conditions being set?

So if it's in that name only, why is alcohol health and well-being somehow strangely converging here?

So these are just strange things and questions that I think should be raised.

And those two don't seem to converge.

So the zoning can enforce and lay claim to the appropriate priorities of our city, I think.

Uh nourishment via what Mr.

Stein had pointed out.

I thought was something that I he had mentioned by his own admission that it's something they'd love to see.

So the best way to encourage that is to set an example by prioritizing what is far more beneficial and truly about health and well-being provided.

It seems to me a healthy driven grocery store designation, which served our city best, especially when we have very few options.

But thank you very much, everyone, for all your involvement and time and consideration.

Thank you so much for the opportunity.

Thank you.

David, those are all the speakers that we had.

Okay.

Um attorney Feinberg, I guess there's a few points that were raised.

Um that need to respond to.

Um, I would like to know about the data mining that is going on there while you're answering those questions, too.

Mr.

Chairman, that's that's a good place to start.

Why don't I ask uh co-founder Travis Talmage to respond to the Bitcoin mining before I get into everything else?

Do you see Travis, Vanita?

I think Travis, if you can raise your hand.

Yes.

Okay.

I'm trying to promote him to panelists.

Do you want me to try it or are you sure?

Somehow it's not showing up here.

Okay.

There you go.

All right.

Just introduce yourself for the record, please.

Hey everybody, my name is Travis Talmadge.

I'm the uh co-founder and co-CEO of Bathhouse.

Can you hear me?

Yep.

Okay, great.

Thanks for thanks for having me.

Thank you all for your attention.

Thank you, everybody, for your enthusiasm.

Um we're really excited to open in uh in Stanford.

I'll address the questions.

I want to be respectful of everybody's time.

So the first one is about this concept of a data center.

Um, unfortunately, I think there's a big misunderstanding here.

We are not a data center.

We're the furthest thing from a data center.

We use Bitcoin miners in our current facilities as fancy pool heaters.

That's all they are.

I wish I could tell you there was something more and that there was something brilliant.

Um Bitcoin miners are computers that get really hot.

We extract the heat from them, we throw them into the pools.

It's kind of like a two-for-one deal where we have to use electricity in New York to heat pools.

And so we choose to run Bitcoin miners, we recapture that heat, and we reuse the energy, we recycle it into our pools.

They're internal, they go in electric closets, they make zero noise.

Um, there's no noise associated with them, and we're we're not a data center.

Um, so I hope that resolves that point.

I think that's just a misconception.

Um, if you don't mind, just in one minute, I heard some other things that I think are worth addressing.

Um, you know, my hope is that I think there's some ignorance around our concept, which is fine.

We got that in New York when we opened here.

Um these are not noisy places on the rooftop.

Um, it's mature adults having conversations.

Our average age tends to be in your mid-30s.

Um, we get, I would say a lot of our core customer or late 20s to late 40s.

Um, these are health-oriented people that are choosing not to go to a bar, not to go to a rave, not to go to a nightclub, and to do something healthy.

If you guys want something interesting, Google finished sauna study and you'll see all the impacts of sauna.

Sauna is really the core of our business.

It makes happier people that live longer and are healthier.

Um, the rooftop is just an extension of the experience.

It's really intended for mature adults to continue the social aspect of bathhouse.

If they want to have a glass of wine, that's great.

We're in perfect standing with the Sape Liquor Authority in New York.

We've operated for six years.

And on the subject of noise, we have a 120-foot-long pool on a rooftop in Williamsburg.

It sits less than 10 feet from several people's apartments.

We've never had one noise complaint since we've been open.

Um, in fact, there was a very enthusiastic um person who was very, very, very much against us opening him and his wife.

He lives across the street, terrorized us at the community board meetings since we opened, they come over once a week.

Um they've told us that we were right.

We told them we live by our word.

They've never had a noise complaint.

They live across the street.

So um I hope it'll be the same thing with the neighbors here.

Um and then the last thing is just the use.

I kind of touched on it.

Um we are a social wellness facility.

These are mature adults who are making a decision to do this.

The whole concept of scantily clad people.

People wear bathing suits to sauna and use pools.

Um, this is a pretty mature audience.

That's that's what we expect.

That's why we design these things to such high standards.

That's a culture we've created.

Um, I think you'll find we'll be a great neighbor, and we intend on creating a lot of jobs and making a lot of people happy and healthier.

That that's really all our businesses.

Couple of questions, um, Mr.

Talmadge.

And will there be amplified music on the rooftop?

We would like to play music in small speakers.

We actually have a very sophisticated system where we do a lot of small speakers.

If you've ever heard great sound, it's the kind of sound where you can have a conversation over it without having to raise your voice.

Um, you wouldn't even hear it outside the fence around our premises, which wouldn't be our intent.

If it's loud enough where you could hear it, it's too loud for the experience that we're trying to create for our guests.

So at most, we would have small, a large volume of small speakers would play very low decibel music that's intended to be in the background.

But you'll never see this is not a biggest pool party.

You'll never see big music up there.

It's just not what we do.

Okay.

So you'd be okay if we had a condition saying that the music it you can play the music on the rooftop, but it won't be heard away from the rooftop.

Yeah, no problem.

That's easy.

Okay.

Um and this bitcoin mining, which I don't completely understand.

But do you do you own these bitcoins that are mine there?

So it's a little bit of a nuanced question, not to get too granular on it.

Um when you mine Bitcoin, uh large-scale operators are really who mine Bitcoin.

So if we were trying to mine our own bitcoins, it would be a roll of the dice.

Maybe we'd mine one every every seven or eight years, and we'd kind of get lucky.

So instead, we contribute our mining power to what's called a slush pool, and we effectively get dividends for the um power that we're providing to the network every day.

So we make little dividends for basically sending our computing power to a larger pool.

And then we own the Bitcoin that we're paid in compensation for doing so.

It's kind of like uh I wouldn't I would analogate the magnitude of our Bitcoin mining to asking what kind of shampoo we provide in the showers.

It is a very, very, very minuscule part of our business.

It's just something we do for efficiency.

Okay.

Okay.

Um board, any questions for Mr.

Talmadge?

No, I find the whole Bitcoin using the heat.

Uh I find that fascinating and what a great way to recycle.

Thank you.

Yeah, we're proud of it.

You know, there's uh people that get upset about the power usage of Bitcoin, but we have heat pools anyway.

So we are getting two purposes served in one.

So um that's all it is.

Okay.

Yeah, it's a good way to use the heat that's thrown off.

Yeah.

Never heard of that before.

Okay.

Um any other questions for Mr.

Talmadge?

Mr.

Chairman.

Yes.

Just I want to address a question that was put out there about is it is it recycled water?

How does that all work?

Are we, you know, vacating all the water at the end of the evening?

And then, you know, there is a concern about, you know.

So talk to us about the water usage.

Sure.

Yeah, we have a uh very, very sophisticated aquatics program that we've built over years of learning to do this and making mistakes with our original facilities and hiring really great consultants.

So um the larger the pool, the easier it is to keep that pool um balanced, which means correctly chlorinated, correctly acidic.

So unless there was a problem, you wouldn't drain a pool every day.

What we do is frequently throughout the week, maybe once, twice a week, depends on the use.

You'll do a partial drain of a pool.

And a lot of times you can kind of suck the water back, circulate it again.

But the way that our pools work is every single drop of water in any of our pools is completely turned over every 30 minutes.

It runs through a system where it goes through sand filters that removes sediment, hair, all the things that come in a pool.

Then it goes um through chlorinators, which obviously balance the levels.

It also runs through UV filters and ozone filters, those UV and ozone filters till 99.99% of bacteria before the chlorine even hits it.

Um so we run a very sophisticated aquatics program that runs through our pump room through our systems, and that allows us to basically recycle the water through.

And then as a matter of protocol, we do do partial and full drains of the pools ahead of the schedule that is required, but by no means is it uh is it every night unless there was an issue.

If somebody broke something in the pools, we don't serve glass, but let's just say that's something, you know, then we would drain the pool and sweep it.

Um, but this isn't a this isn't a noisy process.

Again, in Williamsburg, we have a hundred and twenty-foot-long pool.

It's literally a stone's throw.

My four-year-old could throw a stone from our pool to the apartment next door.

We've never had a noise complaint.

Well, thank you very much.

I think that's uh it dispels a lot of kind of rumors and you know, conjecture that's out there.

I appreciate it.

Thank you.

Yeah, listen, there's a lot of history with our business in in in America.

The reason we started this business is because uh there's a very big sauna culture outside of the US and the US never really caught up.

Um, so our business is not the same as the culture that you might think of 30 years ago.

It's just simply not.

Right.

Okay.

Um Lisa, you want to hit the other questions that were asked uh and we can uh refer any over to Mr.

Talmage's we need.

Happy to.

So um, you know, notwithstanding our efforts, I think there continues to be some confusion about this use.

Some of the comments tonight have been irresponsible at best and incredibly prejudicial and discriminatory at worst.

I can't change these people's minds.

I can only hope that if you all approve this application, that in time as they see the facility operate, as as Travis said, they'll understand their fears were unfounded.

Bathhouse is a place of tranquility.

It's a place where people can go to find a little bit of peace.

Um, contrary to what has been said, we've never called it a community center, but it is absolutely a place where people can find community, something that is incredibly important today.

I read recently that nearly half of all adults report feeling disconnected or lonely.

Bathhouse is an option for many of these people.

Many folks who have opposed this application are characterizing the use as a bar.

But uh as Travis noted, uh it was actually created as an alternative to a bar, a place where people can go to be with other like-minded people and not feel pressured or obligated to drink.

Yes, limited alcoholic beverages will be available on the roof.

It is not an open bar.

It will not be alcohol will not be served, nor can it be consumed in any other location on the property.

And as I mentioned previously, food and beverage make beverage makes up less than 10% of the revenue for bathhouse.

It's provided as an option for people who want it.

It is by no means the reason people will go to Bathhouse.

It is also not unique to Bath House.

Uh, there are other health and wellness uses that have cafes where alcohol is available.

If people want to go to a bar, there are plenty of options in Harbor Point and all over Stanford where they can go drink alcohol.

They don't have to go to Bath House to do that.

People will go there to relax, not to party.

You know, that said, uh, this is a development site and outdoor polls are permitted as of right uh to be clear to answer this question.

This is not a special permit use, and no special permits are required for this proposal.

Bathhouse is committed to being a good neighbor, as as Travis said, um, and will absolutely comply with the Stanford noise ordinance.

And as I said last time, they're happy to accept a condition requiring submission of a noise study uh confirming that they do, you know, prior to building permit.

Um as you all know, uh this site plan approval process is just the beginning of the road for this development.

Numerous other departments will be reviewing this proposal before they can open their doors.

The WPCA, the health department, the building department.

I can assure everyone listening that they will not be able to open unless they satisfy every applicable code and regulatory requirement.

Period.

End of story.

Uh but for purposes of tonight and the application before this board, I think the record is clear that this proposal meets all of the applicable requirements of the zoning regulations.

Uh it's a permitted use, as I've said.

Uh I'd like to just quickly, Mr.

Chairman, if you'd allow me to share my screen one more time, just to remind everybody of what's there.

Is that okay for me to share?

Yep.

Go ahead.

Thank you.

This use will significantly improve existing conditions.

I mean, you can see it here.

I have every single view.

We've worked hard to be responsive and hopefully, you know, create a use that that you all will be proud of that that the community can be proud of.

Um, we thank you for your time.

I think I've uh addressed the questions generally.

I try not to go one by one, but if you think I've missed something, please let me know.

Okay.

Um board, any last questions for um either attorney Feinberg or uh Mr.

Talmage.

Nope.

No, no, thank you.

Okay.

Um good.

Uh before we close the application, um just one related matter.

The the memo from the applicant's attorney that we had received.

Um took the position that the zoning board did not have the authority to implement regulations that govern design um of buildings.

And I think that's certainly a position that we disagree with, and I'd like to have Ralph Blessing, our um Land Use Bureau Chief address that, please.

Yes.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

So I do believe that the zoning board um has the authority to uh regulate design.

Um I agree with attorney Feinberg that uh it has to be specific.

Um and outlined in the zoning regulations, uh in the zoning regulations uh for this district.

Uh in uh section five H H six F.

Uh there are some specific uh urban design criteria.

Um for example, that there has to be a continuous street and sidewalk network.

Uh that uh major frontages and entrances have to be on major streets uh and so on.

Um at the same time, um obviously um I acknowledge that in zoning and in land use, um there are often um uh things that are open to interpretation.

Um if you read uh uh the state statute uh and uh especially the section uh what zoning is supposed to do uh supposed to do.

Uh there's there's many examples there uh where the language is rather vague, um, such as uh promote health and the general welfare.

Uh that is certainly up for interpretation, provide adequate light and air, what is adequate light and air, uh, and so on and so forth.

So um I think um the board just wanted to make sure that um uh it is on the record that the board believes uh it has the right um if it's provided for in the regulations uh to regulate um um urban design.

Um and um that's um all I have to say about this at this point in time.

Good.

Thank you.

Um before we uh close this application, um any last questions or comments from the board.

No nothing.

Attorney Feinberg, you um it sounded like you were finished.

You completed your presentation.

Yes, sir.

Okay, then um application two two five dash three seven is closed.

Thank you all for your time.

We really appreciate all of your feedback.

Thank you, um next is uh application two two five-three nine, Peter Sakura for Ramatul Alamim Mosque, 80 Lockwood Avenue special permit.

Um Mr.

Security, can you mute?

Um I see two names, two Mr two joinees with the same name.

I'll put both of them on and Mr.

Silvor can then turn his video on and his audio on um Mr.

Secora, can you unmute, please?

All right.

Um we lose David.

Yeah, I believe he grows I think he's trying to rejoin.

Yeah.

So Mr.

Secor, you can uh begin your presentation if you still desire.

Uh you have to turn your volume on, please.

Yes, you hear me now?

Yes, yes, is there an echo?

Is there an echo?

Yes, there is bill.

No.

Apologies, I can't imagine what the problem is.

I'm gonna we even rejoin.

Um, I can maybe mute the other um thing that you have.

I you've joined, I think maybe on two devices.

Let's see if I can.

The other one.

I get I don't think, yeah.

That's what that one's not unmuted on my end, so I don't know why the echo is.

Yeah, if you want to rejoin, that would that might help.

There, I think I got it.

You got it.

Okay, that sounds better.

Oh my gosh.

There was a sorry.

Okay, my fault.

Hi, everyone.

Sorry about that.

Um thanks to the board for the hearing uh and the public for your interest.

Um, Peter Sakora, I'm the architect for the Moss project at 80 Lockwood Avenue.

For anyone watching, I want to reiterate our goals for the project and where we are in the process.

Uh last week I presented five slides, and we discussed how the project has been designed to be right sized for the lot, the building, the neighborhood.

It conforms to the spirit and the letter of the existing zoning code.

So it requires no exceptions to the existing rules and reduces the traffic and parking impact compared to the prior use.

This week I'm excited to share seven new slides that focus on how the project improves the aesthetic performance of the property with minor but important upgrades that both improve the privacy and separation and also make the building uh more welcoming and accessible.

Um, I'm also pleased to say that we worked with the city traffic department to come up with a revised site plan with 29 parking spaces, which is 10% more spaces than required by the regulations and the warship capacity.

So let's start with that.

May I share my screen?

Yes, go ahead.

David, you're um muted, David.

Thanks, Bill.

Okay.

You're back in charge.

You were doing great.

Um this is the uh can everybody see the screen now?

Yes.

Yes.

Okay.

Uh this is the revised site plan.

You can see that we reoriented the spaces.

Um, and uh made the traffic into a one-way loop.

So by doing this, we were able to get 29 spaces as opposed to the 26 that we had before while maintaining the accessible spaces.

It's a big improvement.

I'd like to thank the city planners for that.

Um we also, as part of the parking management plan that we submitted since the last meeting, developed this valet parking plan.

Um with this, we can hold 44 parking uh car cars, vehicles, um, and still maintain the ability to enter and exit um on the same plan.

So this is a great increase.

We can use this um during the rare periods when uh we're operating at high capacity.

I want to point out, of course, that the code requirement for the uh number of worshippers that we have is 26 parking spaces.

So we have on a day-to-day basis 29 parking spaces and the ability to bump that up to 44 parking spaces with this plan.

Umita, I believe that the that we got the message today.

My interpretation of it was that the city has accepted the parking management plan.

Uh-huh.

Is that that's something that the board accepts?

Oh, um, okay.

It may have been approved by TTP, but it's up to the board to uh include it as part of its approval.

Then I look forward to that still.

Thanks.

Sorry.

Okay, so that's the old business.

Um and then I want to get to the new thing.

At the last meeting, you asked uh for some things.

Um, so I'd like to show those.

And it also occurred to me at that last meeting that people didn't necessarily hadn't necessarily seen uh the building elevations, which were of course part of the original submission, but not I didn't have a slide for them.

So I'd like to correct that omission.

So as a reminder, this is the building that we are talking about at the quarter of 80 Lockwood.

Um in a quarter of Lockwood and Lillian.

And this is the front elevation that we are talking about, and the change that you can see here, most of this is existing.

We are adding some steps, a water feature, a planting, and new doors to the front.

The side elevation, we are replacing the windows.

These windows exist and will remain.

Number of these windows have been bricked over and are going to be replaced with new windows matching the current windows in style and material.

This is the north elevation faking the facing the parsick parking lot.

Um the thing of note here, we aren't really changing much here.

These are the locations of the lights that you will see in the lighting plan.

I'll talk more about that in a bit.

Those exist, and the plan is to put new fixtures there.

Same thing on this is the back elevation or the east elevation.

It has a light fixture, and there are a few bricked over former windows that are gonna stay bricked over.

There's now uh things in the way, they they they're not really able to be to be reutilized.

Um you can see on this elevation how we're using a fence around the dumpster to provide cover for the AC condensers.

Um, but there's not much going on here.

And then the word S for uh renders.

So I'd like to share um the two renders that I developed.

Um one this is the render from the intersection.

Um so this is a little further out.

You can kind of see the scale of what we are talking about doing, adding these steps.

You can see the way that the planter and the water feature integrate the the ramp.

So the ramp is going down behind those towards the parking lot, but we are still leaving a plaza in front.

Um as a sort of a community space.

You can see the wrought iron fence uh that was always included and is there and how that sort of protects the parking lot but maintains the visibility.

And uh I have one more render.

Before you leave that one.

At the back of the parking lot.

Um, yeah, back there.

The green is that um landscaping?

That hedge exists and is the neighbors.

Gotcha.

Okay.

Okay, thank you.

There is an eight-foot uh fence, and I will go.

I'm gonna take you for a moment back to the existing condition where you will see that this eight-foot tall hedge is there and um is quite effective.

And I don't think that part of our plan not including the hedge, is that uh it won't serve anyone to have two competing hedges here.

Yeah.

Okay, so this is where we were.

Um and this is an up close version uh where we can see that the um how the ramp is behind here and is integrated.

Um what this does really is sort of you've got two separate approaches.

You've got an approach from the parking lot, which is from the private area, and then you've got an approach from the public, and they've been integrated together uh to feel welcoming no matter which way you approach.

Okay, the five round I was asked for the board.

I'm sorry, before before you leave that.

If a member of the public is disabled and needs to get up to the front door, they would go around to the parking lot and use the ramp.

Yes.

Which is where the parking lot uh that that's where the the handicapped parking, the accessible parking is in the lot, right?

Um if you rolled up uh it from the street, there is a there is an entrance right here just off the camera.

Um, so it's not it's not far to go.

Okay.

The board asked for a light map.

Um, so this is showing if we mount floodlights in the locations of the existing.

This white line is the 0.5 foot candle uh isolux line.

So it's well within the property bounds, and it shows how it quickly sort of diminishes down to zero before we really get to the property lines.

Zero is a little much, it's probably not zero, but it is falling rapidly.

We're not contributing to light pollution.

These are down facing floodlights.

Um, and this is well in the private property part of the of the parking lot.

Um present the new renders and the drawings.

We're excited to share how we're improving the aesthetics with subtle but warm and welcoming tweaks to an existing handsome building.

That's what I have for you, and I will stop sharing.

Good.

Thank you.

Um let's go to the board.

Um, Jerry.

Uh any questions?

Sure, Mr.

Mr.

Chairman.

Um, and I know that the it meets the regs with the 29 spaces.

I am awfully still awfully concerned about the parking.

Um, I'm not gonna be able to get my arms around that.

And um they tend to be um uh I think this board, I think we need to do a better job at when these houses of worship begin to operate because it causes a lot of congestion in the neighborhoods, they're parked on sidewalks.

Um all houses, you know, uh these newly operated um houses of worships, not just the mosque.

Um, and it's an overall concern.

Uh police department has to get involved, and and I really think that we have to um be we have to consider the special land high holidays.

Um again, uh look at Strawberry Hill up at you know, Temple Bethel, they use St.

Bridget's parking lot.

They coexist in that area.

It's you know Shalom.

Yeah, sorry, Google Shalom.

Um, you know, and Temple Bethel as well up in, you know, uh but towards North Stanford.

So we really need to um really need to consider this uh with a sobering eye with the with this, especially on Lockwood Avenue.

Uh it's congested as it is at this point, and we're adding to that.

Uh 29 spaces with with valet parking lot is not gonna do it for me.

Can I can I respond?

That wasn't a question aimed at me.

Can I respond as though it was?

Sure.

So I'd like to read to you uh from the uh comment that we got back from the traffic department today.

Um and just to clarify, um, the 29 spaces is the day-to-day parking, the valet parking takes us up to 44 spaces, which is um so far above what the is required.

But the memorandum comes with the stipulations from the parking management plan uh that the that we do reporting.

Um let me just read that bit here.

Um parking reporting in a manner determined by the department will be required on a quarterly basis for the first year of operations and then yearly after that for three years.

If the department receives complaints from the parking operations and/or the parking reports indicate a lack of on-site parking and parking spillover in the neighborhood, then the applicant shall implement their proposed parking management strategies in concert with the city.

This does not preclude the applicant from implementing their parking management strategies during high parking demand events.

The use of parking management strategies is encouraged during peak times.

One of the things that uh I don't really have a slide for, but that is included in this is that we are investigating an off-site parking uh places so that when there are very high demand um times that we have a place where we can go to park extra cars.

So the applicant is well aware of this concern.

It's been thoroughly worked on with the city planners, and I think we're doing everything that could possibly be done.

And it and in fact, there is not any kind of demonstrable at the like we're comparing our parking to parking in places that are within other city sort of known congested areas.

Um, as though in other words, you're comparing it with places where there are not parking, but we do have parking.

No, no, he was comparing it to places that have parking.

That's not a lot of things.

Lots of parking.

It's during the high holidays that they you know that you all experience.

Um that, you know, um, and I and I have a challenging time with TTP as well as uh the city parking plans because I I uh I don't think a lot of times it's a true uh test testament to what is happening in the field.

And um, in fact, uh the the examples I were giving have plenty of parking.

It's during those high holidays, uh during those times that that those areas are are are challenging and your site um uh you know is something that's going to shut down that street at times, possibly.

It's it's a challenging street.

And that's your that was your choice for development.

Well, I think it's I think we need to, yeah.

This is something the board needs to discuss, Jerry.

Some good issues.

Of course, and when we discuss the conditions, we can talk about what might be appropriate.

I understand.

Thank you, Mr.

Chairman.

Thank you.

I I appreciate it, Peter.

Uh Roseanne.

You're on mute.

Sorry.

The dog was barking, so I had myself on mute.

Um, can you confirm, Peter, that um the high holy days, you will still um lease or rent out a different location um because this won't be large enough.

Yes.

That is work that is a commitment that we have met made to the town planners.

We are working on a list of sites that we can go to so that in the event that it looks like we're going to have a large uh congregation that we have already a solution ready in hand.

Thank you.

Peter, how many members?

I'm just gonna say the ground improvements, I think are terrific.

I think the black fence looks great, and the improvements to the building look great.

Thank you.

Peter, how many members does the mosque have?

Uh the current is 100 um and 15.

Individuals or families.

Individuals.

Okay.

During the um uh holidays, the major holidays, does it draw non-members as well?

This is not going to be one of the bigger mosques in the neighborhood.

And these um they they mosques that do draw there there are bigger mosques that I think draw more people.

Um so I I don't this is not envisioned as being a destination mosque, if that's what you're right.

Yeah, yeah.

For someone who's not a member of a mosque, would they come to this one for the the major holidays?

Was my what I was asking.

Um again, this is not going to be a major.

This is a small community mosque.

It's sort of would do people go to a small church maybe on the holidays.

I I don't know exactly how to answer that question, to be honest.

Um, they have a current location, right?

Or no.

No.

Oh, okay.

So they can't really look at past experience to get an idea.

Uh there, I believe they're there, they they have a rented, they have a place that they are renting.

They don't have their own place.

And if you were going to rent a larger place for high holidays anyway.

Correct.

You could do that, and that's been discussed, but I don't think that they're considering that to be a likely to be necessary for this.

Oh, I'm sorry.

I thought from what you answered my question before that you would be renting a different location for the high holidays.

You were yeah, I thought you asked about parking, Roseanne.

No, I asked about whether they'd have their services elsewhere.

Oh no.

Uh okay.

I think there was a misunderstanding there, but the question is about identifying a parking space and tour offside parking.

Right, which we which we know they're working on.

Right.

Yeah.

So Peter, as you mentioned at the last meeting, if it's a high holiday, you won't look to find a different location.

This site holds 100 and four worshippers.

The parking management plan call include implements a number of strategies, including staggered worship times.

So by having when when there would normally be a worship at one, we can have a worship at 12:30 and at 1.30 and thereby accommodate 200 people.

We could up that with a third staggering to make it to 300 so that you're sort of turning over and and using the the services are not long.

The service is 45 minutes, so you can break it into an hour with 15 minutes to turn people, have people come and go.

Um, and I think they're often shorter than that, even on the high holy days.

So there is there are provisions for how to deal with slightly larger crowds.

If it gets sort of beyond anything like that, then we're then yeah, you would be talking about needing some kind of massive facility, which of course could not.

This this facility is not intended to, nor could it handle that.

And there are bigger mosques around, and there also are convention centers that could be that could be used.

So there's a number of strategies that we've got to sort of expand the capacity without burdening the current parking or the local neighborhood.

Just um, and that's all covered in the parking management plan.

Okay, thanks.

Bill.

Um I don't really have anything further to add to the questions that have already been uh discussed.

Okay.

Umita, was there anything else that we were um had requested that the applicant provide, or was this everything?

without burdening the current parking or the local neighborhood just um and and that's all covered in the parking management plan okay thanks Bill uh I don't really have anything further to add to the questions that have already been uh discussed okay umita was there anything else that we were um had requested that the applicant provide or was this everything I believe the applicant provided all the items that were requested last time okay good um if there's anyone from the public then who wishes to speak on this application either for or against it um please raise your hand first we have miss Kathy Kigler hi um I'm Kathy Clickler at 21 Friar Tuck Lane I'm glad to see an older building preserved the only thing I couldn't determine is are there any gonna be any planting anywhere because you know we're all concerned about global warming and adding a tree or a or some trees would be a gift thanks that's that's um funny you mentioned that because it was a discussion that the board had and um when we get through with the public um I'd be interested to see the current landscape plan from the uh from the applicant thank you Kathy thank you um next we have miss Monika Tall um excuse me one second Panita am I uh still co-host I seem to have lost my uh if you could do it again yes please okay thank you are you done Mr Stein may I begin yes please uh continue thank you good evening brothers and sisters in Christ I come before that's enough I come I come before that's this is a secular government meeting and um any religious references here are um really inappropriate and offensive so um we um we're not going to uh to have that said here um we'll move on to the next speaker um next we have miss regina bagum good evening everyone how are you um I'm actually um a resident of Stanford I live over Strawberry Hill but um we uh my family actually attends the or we will be attending this mosque so um I know a lot of concerns are about the parking but we have a a good amount of mosques around the town um whether it's on Washington Boulevard I believe we have one on uh the west side and what's gonna happen is a lot of these uh people who live further away from those mosques who are closer to Lockwood would be really attending so there's gonna be a lot of local families as well as we do a lot of car pooling so it's not gonna be that heavy as a flow of cars that we're worried about not to mention you know the prayer times are are staggered very much and majority of the prayers I don't think any of them last more than an hour.

Plus it's a really good place for the community to get together usually places like this bring the best out in the neighborhood you know there's a lot of family gatherings and kids feel a little bit safer having you know somewhere safe around the neighborhood I'm hoping that what it's gonna do is just you know build up the community even more and make it look you know make it a safer a better neighborhood for everyone good thank you thank you.

Next we have Mr.

Jamal Ahmed Hi there my name is Shamal uh spoke in the last hearing Stanford uh but all I wanted to say is honestly the monotheistic faiths we have Islam right we have Christianity we have Jewish our Jewish brothers you know our Christianity Christian brothers have a Sunday to sort of congregate congregate and celebrate their faith our Jewish brothers and sisters have Saturday and and the Muslim brothers and sisters have you know Friday to kind of congregate right where we come together and kind of praise the God and come together and worship him.

So essentially, if parking and uh traffic is the concern, uh, you know, on Friday prayers, we have something called where we can separate the prayers and we can sectionate them where you know we limit the amount of people that come by sectionating a first prayer and a second prayer, and that will kind of allow us to basically you know limit the amount of traffic that comes to us our area.

So it's a isn't it's a solution, and a lot of mosques around the country um do this specific method so to reduce the traffic.

So that's all I wanted to say.

Jamal, is that what when we heard about staggered um services?

Is that what you're talking about?

Correct.

Um, so obviously you have the five daily prayers.

Right.

And not a lot of people come to those.

It's just usually like maybe a couple of people, but the majority of the people do come on Fridays simply simply because it's like a congregate day.

But like I said, um, where you can actually like separate a first prayer and second prayer and kind of limit the amount of people that come.

So it'll be that solution, you know.

Good.

Yeah.

Okay.

Thank you.

No problem.

Next, we have Ms.

Farhan Memo.

Thank you.

Uh good evening, board.

Um, I too spoke at the last.

I'm sorry, would you just introduce yourself and give us your address, please?

Sure.

My name is Farhan Memon.

I reside at 15 Pequot Drive in Norwalk, Connecticut.

I'm the chairperson of the Council on American Islamic Relations uh Connecticut chapter.

Um as I mentioned at the last meeting, um, in addition to its own zoning regulations, uh, the city of Stanford also has to provide by the provisions of the religious land use.

Mr.

Memon, we can't hear you.

Are you there?

Okay, is there anyone else that we could you want to go on to the next speaker and then come back to Mr.

Umman?

Next, we have the user by the name Forkan.

Yeah, please.

For please introduce yourself and give us your address.

Hi, good evening, everyone.

My name is Furkan Ahmed.

I'm from uh Strawberry Hill area, 210 Fifth Street, to be exact.

And uh so my family has been in Stanford since uh 90s.

And uh we have a couple of mics that we attend all the time.

Just to buy have this mosque is another option, and uh we realize that parking isn't one of the biggest problems.

However, um by having this mosque, actually, it would be uh like a lesser traffic and the other mosque.

So we don't have to just um be all in one spot to have a multiple location throughout the city.

I think it's a best for us.

And that's all I wanted to contribute.

Thank you so much for your time.

Good.

Thank you.

Um I don't see any other speakers.

Um we can go back to Mr.

Meman.

See if you let's try that.

Mr.

Memen, would you like to try to speak again?

I don't see him.

Oh the screen.

Yeah, I'm trying to unmute him.

Yeah.

Some reason it's not working.

Okay.

Let's see.

I think he's rejoining.

I don't see his name listed yet.

Well, there was there was a phone number just now.

Was that him or was that just someone who was uh an attendee?

Right.

That might I'm not sure if it was him or another attendee.

Um so I'm not seeing any hand.

No, no, they're Mammon, can you uh raise your hand?

Can I go ahead and take uh stab at responding to the comments that we did have?

And if he comes, then um, yeah, please do that, Peter.

Can you interrupt me?

That'd be all right.

Um I think the last caller made a really interesting point that that I'd like to highlight, which is that the parking that we are taking that we are including here is coming from parking at other facilities currently.

So not only are we accommodating the parking that we right, our parking needs, but this should reduce the parking problems at other facilities, right?

That it's a sort of a zero sum.

Um that the because this is for the the our congregants are having to warship elsewhere, they are potentially part of the parking problem that's being held against this project.

So that I think that I don't know, I don't know how to mathematically handle that, but I think it's a really interesting point.

Um I can share my screen.

I'd like to address the tree controversy a little bit.

Sure.

Please go ahead.

Can you guys see this?

Yes, yes.

Okay.

The green areas are the places where we could conceivably put a tree.

They are uh ground level, and this one currently holds a large old tree.

This one is right up against the building.

This one is small, these are very small, and this one is adjacent to a power line to the lines that run right next to it, and a tree just off the map over here.

So I didn't see a good place to put a tree that would like with what we've got to work with.

I'm open to comments and working with the town.

I would love to have trees here.

Um it sort of becomes a trade-off, I think, of cars versus trees on this.

Um and we have heard the message very very clearly that we need all the parking we can get.

This here is the parking is the sidewalk, and you can see how it tapers down to being why we didn't have uh an accessible way to do it.

Um this is a fire hydrant and some signage, and you're approaching the corner here.

And at even at this point, it's not really wide enough to put in a cutting that would allow for a tree to thrive there.

So I just wanted to respond to those things.

How wide is it at the corner?

This is nine feet at the widest point.

Over here by over here, it gets bigger.

There's a plaza over here.

Where I'm sorry, where are you?

Down down here by the front.

Gotcha.

Right.

You're kind of getting you got the steps, you got a clear space that you need to have in front of those.

There's a fire hydrant, and then it's tapering down.

Umita, the required street uh sidewalk width is five feet.

Um yes.

Um, but you know, the the application itself is not triggering any of the sidewalk requirements.

Understood.

Yeah.

The problem is also that the trees obviously uh if if the uh area is too small, um, they don't have a good chance to uh survive and grow.

Um, but maybe there's there would be an opportunity in the plaza area.

Um just something to be explored.

Um, but I think the sidewalk is is very difficult because of the width.

Um I think Peter, hadn't we talked about putting something other than a tree in those green areas?

Like some sort of landscaping other than just grass.

Uh remember we talked about a hedge, and you said it right next to the driveway, it could be an issue.

Um we have talked about landscaping in the green areas.

Um the the traffic the the idea of putting there can be a low ground cover.

I'm not sure how that's better than grass.

If the board for if if that's preferred, then we could do that.

I initially had a hedge that got pushed back for the new parking plan, and also there were concerns about the visibility with traffic and the sidewalk at the at the at that place.

So I went with the low, so it needs to be low.

And I think if there's a preference for something besides grass, that would certainly be we're certainly open to that.

Um but I the neighborhood is a residential neighborhood with lawns, so it sort of felt.

Yeah.

Board, any preference one way or the other for this on this property.

I I think there's plenty of options that are lower than hedges but a little more interesting than just grass.

We did actually not there must have been conversation because we did I did identify something and I I apologize.

I'm not going to be able to put my hands on that right now but I will come back with a planting idea.

We can if and when this is approved we can put in a requirement that you would come back with a planting plan to the staff.

Okay.

Okay.

I see we have Mr Memon back.

Mr.

Meman, can you unmute?

Yeah there we go.

Good.

I I apologize for that my internet came uh got cut off and of course as Mr.

Morris you know remarked earlier it's problematic with technology.

What I was trying to express um was that in addition to your own zoning rules you have to also be cognizant of the federal laws regarding religious land use requires that um religious institutions not be burdened by regulations and requirements that exceed non-religious uses.

So in the past if you have allowed non-religious um institutions or um facilities to meet uh the parking threshold without any extra requirements you have to follow the same rule for this particular facility.

I understand that you know parking is an issue of it's a quality of life issue um but that's not necessarily what any religious applicant has to resolve as long as they meet the rules that are stated within your in your zoning rules so insofar that you know I think that the mosque has worked with your planners to get three extra spaces out of the the property that's right it'd be nice if they can find some other parking as well but it's not a need to have and you shouldn't impose that burden on them and that's not a burden that's also allowed by the laws of good okay thank you do we have um I have a question for Peter Mr.

Chairman yeah go ahead Peter is this uh on the west side is one of the um one of my concerns of the congestion with that mosque is it going to uh absorb that mosque for you know for some of those members to come on over or is it going to stay is that mosque on the west side going to stay open because you know they're troubled with with parking there is or is it just um is that imam coming over to that to the uh the mosque on that side on the Lockwood Avenue you're you're on mute Peter thank you uh it doesn't much matter because I don't know the answer to that question um yeah uh and like the West side is on more of a temporary facility as it's a smaller mosque and you know and and unfortunately um and wonderful wonderful congregation there but they're troubled with a lack of parking and I would love for them to find a you know be have a home that's gonna be able to accommodate those folks there they have a real yes yeah I I really don't know I on all honesty I don't know the answer to that and I don't want to say something that's incorrect either way.

Of course of course I just thought maybe this was a a continuation or a you know or a transfer over to that site that's all but thank you Peter that's a whole question Mr.

Chairman if you don't mind please go ahead.

Peter on the days what is you're required to have more than one uh service uh is it possible that you can try to designate who comes to which service so you can balance it out where one is an overflow and the other one is empty or is that not possible I think it's very possible um it's also not within my not not in my plans uh it seems very possible um but I would want to check on that to all right food for thought flu for thought yeah okay thank you I I in in in point of fact I think this is where the city parking management and the sensitivity to complaints and the applicant's desire not to have any complaints becomes very this is the burden is going to be on them to organize and make sure that that kind of system works and I think they're very clear about that every communication that I have had

All right, food for thought.

Yeah.

Okay, thank you.

I I in in point of fact, I think this is where the city parking management and the sensitivity to complaints and the applicant's desire not to have any complaints becomes very this is the burden is going to be on them to organize and make sure that that kind of system works.

And I think they're very clear about that.

Every communication that I have had um is that the people who are in this congregation uh drive on Lockwood themselves and live in this neighborhood and have no interest in seeing Lockwood be blocked or a negative impact to this community.

Um so they are very motivated to make sure that the parking systems work.

That's every indication that I have.

Thank you.

That's it for me, Dave.

Okay.

I Venita, I see hands.

Are those left over from before?

Um people who spoke already.

I I know we we have one one new speaker.

Um, Mr.

Mustafa Ahmed.

So let me know.

I I can unmute him.

Yeah, you wanna good evening, everyone.

Thank you so much for the opportunity to let me speak.

So I'm I'm answering the question to Mr.

Bosek.

I'm sorry, just can you introduce yourself and give us your address, please?

Moshtak Ahmed, 14 Howard Avenue, Stanford, Connecticut.

Thank you.

Mr.

Bosek, so you asked the question saying that the exit six mosque congregation imam, we're gonna move to the R our facilities, which is Lockwood Avenue.

No, answer to that question is no.

Okay, thank you, Musta.

Thank you, sir.

You have a good evening.

Thank you.

Uh we have Porkan.

And then Mr.

Regina, Miss Regina Begum spoken who spoke earlier.

Um David, do you want me to go back to them?

Four pan.

Hi, good evening.

I'm sorry.

Actually, last time when I was talking, I was kind of got nervous.

I was driving and I had to pull over.

So Mr.

Bosak, actually, I wanted to address something to you.

So here's the thing, right?

Stanford has a limited Muslim population.

So what I meant to say is that more masks we have, we are spread out.

So currently I had I do have to attend like the six moshid, the mask.

And by having the one unlocked with the new facility, we can also attend that.

So same time that the load from the um the people from all the east side people, they do go to exit six mashid at this moment.

So the traffic flow is overloaded there by having this one plus the Washington Boulevard, and I have a more option to um attend whichever mask it is.

So yeah, to your question, the Muslim population in Stanford, we don't have like a new commerce coming to Stanford.

However, people here, we more mosques we have, the more option thus to have on the table, the parking slider and all around.

So to answer my question.

My pushback to you, sir, is that you have a growing population to the responsibility of the houses of worship, with whichever it is, is to grow their population.

So I have many friends that are Muslims and they're they're their families are growing.

Um and we're that's that's welcoming to Stanford.

So that is my pushback.

It's not limited.

It's it's it's a privilege that you're growing in our community.

So with that being said, um, you know, we just have to make sure we do our due diligence and making sure that we keep people safe and um, you know, you know, making sure everything is um in an appropriate manner, parking and so on and so forth.

So respect just much respect to see our Stanford um the the board and everyone.

But so here's the thing with that, right?

As the population growing, the Muslim population for ourselves as a Muslim, we know that we need more must.

So this must came about because we saw the traffic flow at the sixth, so we decided to open this one.

And because we saw there is uh uh the push uh early early 2000 when there was a problem with the um the population again, the increase.

We won't open one on uh Washington Boulevard.

So according to um according to the uh congregation, we are actually God willing in the future we're gonna have a more mosque if you need it to.

Yeah, and it's a wonderful community down there on the on the west side.

We will love to have you guys come over.

All of them, all of them.

Yeah, sure.

I've been privileged to be there several times.

But but definitely thank you so much for your time.

Appreciate it, guys.

Thank you so much again.

Thank you.

Thanks.

Um I don't see other speakers.

There's a hand up for Mr.

Begum.

Miss Regina Bigham.

Um yes, I think we heard from her before by Alan Mutter.

Miss Begum, could you uh speak, please?

Regina Begum.

Um, I just wanted to um just add something really quick.

I know that we were talking about the major holidays, and um we have two major holidays um throughout the year.

Um it's two different eed prayers that we have that would probably have the most amount of people attend.

And if if it was to ever get to a point where the feels like our groups is too many people, um is gonna be too many crowds, too many cars.

In the past, what has happened with other mosques was we would get um an outside place, such as we've done it in the Italian center before the prayer.

We've also used Chelsea Pier's as a place to do um the prayer, and that prayer is actually about an hour, it's not long at all.

It's more like maybe 20 minutes, 25 minutes prayer, and then everyone kind of you know greets everyone and says hello, and then everyone goes about their day.

So if it ever came to the point where we feel like it's an overwhelming amount of people that we're gonna be expecting, we could always go on that route to avoid any issues.

Good.

Thank you.

No problem.

Thank you.

It's really participant list again.

Um we have Ms.

Kendria Walston.

Yes, please uh introduce yourself and give us your address.

Hi, um, Representative Kendria Walston, 38 Connecticut Avenue, Partment 82 in Stanford.

And um, I just want to chime in because um I have many um Muslim constituents, and I have gone over to the mosque.

Um I I think it was a Saturday, and it was really crowded, and around the high holy days, they do have to go to other um places because um, I guess because of the crowd, but um I just really hope that this goes through, and they really do need another location.

Thank you.

Good, thank you.

Um those are all the speakers.

Okay.

Um good.

Uh board, any um final questions before we uh close.

Not for me.

Nothing.

No, Ms.

Okay, Peter, anything you want to say before we close the application, and you're on mute.

Appreciate that.

Um thank you very much for your your time and your consideration.

And uh, really want to thank everyone who showed up here with all of the information, the valuable information.

Um, besides the design, it's very helpful.

Thanks, you guys.

Good.

Thank you, Peter.

Thank you.

So we're going to close application 225 uh three nine.

Um we now are coming to two new uh public hearings.

Um why don't we take a short break before we start them?

And um because I think they're gonna take a while.

Um it's uh 836.

What if we um recess until uh 845?

Um and um then we'll resume the hearing.

Okay, Mr.

Okay, it looks like we have everyone back.

Um this is the zoning board meeting of February 9, 2026.

It is 946, and we are resuming the hearing.

Um the next application that we have is application 225-46, Saint John Urban Development Corp.

109 Tressor Avenue, site and architectural plans and/or requested uses, special permit and coastal site plan review.

Applicant is proposing an all-affordable apartment building, including a total of 305 units over two levels of parking and double height amenity space.

Umita, did we receive the affidavit, the sign affidavit?

Yes, he did.

And the certificate of mailing.

Yes.

Okay.

Roseanne, could you please read the planning board letter?

I I don't have it.

Um there was one in the package, David.

There wasn't one.

I don't have it either.

I assumed it was just me.

No, Benita sent it out today.

You know, David, I might have sent it to you.

Let me double chat to me.

That's all right.

I'll read it.

Um Mr.

David Stein chair City of Stanford Zoning Board, Ray Z B application 225-46, St.

John Urban Development Corp.

109 Tressor Boulevard Special Permit.

Dear Mr.

Stein and members of the zoning board, during its meeting held on Tuesday, January, I'm sorry, February 3rd, 2026, rescheduled from January 27, 2026.

The planning board reviewed the above captioned application referred in accordance with the requirements of the Stanford Charter.

Applicants is proposing all affordable apartment building, including a total of 305 units over two levels of parking and double height amenity space.

Raymond Mazio, Redness and Mead made a presentation and answered questions from the board.

After a brief discussion, the planning board voted by a vote of 301 in favor, Godzino, Linder, Salad, Abstain, Sub Romanian to recommend approval of ZV application 225-46 and found this to be in general harmony with the comprehensive plan, mixed use core, future land use category.

Stanford Planning Board, Jennifer Gazzino chair.

Okay.

And welcome.

Thank you.

John's Urban Development Corp.

And Heritage, who are uh together the owner and uh co-applicant uh and developer, respectively.

Um and here I will share my screen as we get started.

Um we are before you uh on a site that I think everyone is very familiar with.

Um it's been a long time coming uh for this redevelopment.

There have been uh a number of different challenges that have kept it uh from being redeveloped sooner.

Um and I think the much of the board is is probably probably well versed.

Um as I think you have uh likely reviewed uh extensions on on funding sources for for the redevelopment here uh at least once in the past.

Um and uh just for clarity, we're talking about uh the St.

John's Towers at the corner of Washington and Tressor Boulevard.

Um tower A was redeveloped uh around 2014 and is now the the Smith that sits at the uh the opposite corner, uh the northeast corner of Washington and Tressor.

Um and then to the east of that is the lifetime building.

Um, and then uh Atlantic Station on the other corner of our block at the at the southwest corner of Tressor and Atlantic and 75 uh 75 Tressor uh across from the government center on the western side of of Washington Boulevard.

Um I I think as was discussed maybe when Lenar was looking to uh take down tower A.

These towers have a lot of contaminants in them, which made their on site rehab pretty much impossible, which was the goal of St.

John's for some time was to kind of rehab in place, and that ended up not being feasible.

We were before you last year with the general development plan and special permit and coastal site plan application, which was approved, and the the final site plan application is very much in line with everything you saw during the GDP phase.

So I will just take us through some of the details, but all of the main points of the application remain the same.

It's still 305 units in a mix of different affordability levels ranging from 30% to 80% of the AMI.

At the beginning of March, that application is due.

And then the remainder of the site really broken up almost evenly among ones, twos, and threes, with uh 98 one bedrooms, 97 two bedrooms, and 92 three bedrooms, and and I think even one four bedroom unit.

And that is as much as the lower income levels is critical, the the higher bedrooms uh are also critical uh as those are really family units that a lot of times don't exist when uh we get um affordables as part of a market rate development, which tend to uh deliver a higher number of studios and ones than than this building has.

Um so just to refresh us, uh the existing on the left proposed on the right, it's very much the same um orientation and shape of the building uh that's being proposed uh with instead of it being two separate towers at 16 stories, we now have one contiguous uh 12-story building.

It's a little bit lower uh than the towers are today.

Um with its primary vehicular and pedestrian access uh off of Tressor Boulevard in the middle of the site here.

There's also a secondary in-only uh kind of a service drive around the building, uh, which will serve larger vehicles uh like trash deliveries, uh emergency vehicles, you know, uh those types that uh may not necessarily fit uh under the the garage.

Uh so we have that as a secondary access.

Um we're also maintaining the vehicular access out to Guernsey uh or the former Guernsey Avenue at the rear of the site here, which exists today and will continue to uh for the occupants and and visitors of the the site, not necessarily a public thoroughfare.

Um this is uh the rendered view from the corner of Washington and Tressor, and uh everything we've heard from from all the presentations we've had so far, whether it's uh uh planning board, DSSD, um, the the building design has really been well received.

And I have to agree, I think Binefield uh did a tremendous job here of deploying some different materials, um, some different movements throughout the building, but both vertically and horizontally um with the recessed portions um creating these kind of different bays of the building where it almost looks like it's uh separate, um, and then also um able to focus on the the corner and and highlight this corner element um both with the uh the increased cornice at the top of the building, uh the blade sign, um, and also uh the the landscaping uh changes it its tree cadence a little bit um as it gets to the corner here.

And then here's a closer up view of it.

And we can come back to any of these uh if you guys have questions as we go.

Um this is the view uh from the eastern edge of the of the site.

So this is closest to Atlantic Station on the tressor side.

And uh again, what they've done is is use some different materials where there's a brick material that makes up this portion of the building, and then they have a kind of a darker metal panel grid that serves as uh a transition piece and really sits directly over the garage entrance and where the uh the the public through block connection will be, and then we have some other renderings that focus on that uh so we can talk about that in a little bit more detail, but really serves as as kind of a transition between the other two elements um on the east and west sides of the building.

This is the right.

Do you have the renderings from the other uh from the other sides of the building?

Um we have some that do show that side of it.

We'll I'll get to those.

Um they're kind of focused on the courtyards that sit on the rear, but they do show the back side of the building.

Okay, good.

Thank you.

Sure.

If you would show them uh when we get there.

Yes.

Um so this is the ground floor plan.

Um, and this kind of shows how the how the building functions at at the ground level.

Uh so again, the main vehicular entrance here, um, main pedestrian entrance uh here, and uh additional entrances uh at the amenity levels uh along the way here.

Um what's shown in this kind of tan color, and we can focus on that uh later in the presentation is the proposed um pedestrian connection, public pedestrian connection through the site.

Um and that is the special permit request that was included as part of uh this application, where we are requesting kind of an alternate uh means of compliance, as the proposed doesn't necessarily uh comply with all of the um dimensional requirements uh of section six.

So we've uh asked for that special permit, and I can take you through the details of that a little bit uh later in the presentation.

Um but along the the ground here, it is all lined with mostly double height uh amenity space that serves um to give kind of a a grand view um of the building at the pedestrian level, activate the street front, and it also completely screens the two levels of garage from from pretty much the entire uh two street frontages.

Um so uh along along here, there's a mix of different uses, some gaming play areas, um, some workout space, uh a half-court basketball area, uh, things like that.

Um on this side is uh a laundry area, um, which is kind of serve as uh a laundromat and a lounge um for the tenants of the building.

We had discussed earlier whether this become a quasi-public space and uh ended up moving away from that to keep it a true tenant amenity uh and private to the building.

Um is there double height windows looking in at a laundromat?

No, this this is a single height space.

Um, and there I'll I'll I'll show you uh on the second floor what exists uh or is proposed above it.

Um so this will be uh private tenant amenity space.

Um the the units will not necessarily have washer and dryers within them.

They'll have the hookups if people want to or are able to get their own.

Um, but this this is meant to serve the building.

Um, and then we have uh our part of our class A bike storage um over here on the Washington Boulevard side of the building, um, class B bike spaces within this little kind of cutout of the garage area, so they're accessible uh from the ground level.

Um again, this eastern driveway, which connects back into the garage or can exit out into Guernsey.

This is a one-way flow.

Um, we'll really serve as kind of the back of house service drive.

Sorry, say can you I'm not seeing the cursor.

Where are you?

At the left side of the screen, which is where we're a little bit upside down here.

There's the east end of the site.

So you have this entry here that goes around the building.

So this is all open to the sky here.

And that was this you said that was for deliveries and larger vehicles.

That that's that's going to be its primary use.

I mean, others could come in that way, but are not likely to and you also said that people could drive out of there onto Guernsey.

Is that correct?

Correct.

This this the driveway uh jogs a little bit to the right and connects to the to the um the easement area over the former Guernsey Avenue.

And then it connects from there to Atlantic.

Guernsey connects to federal and then federal to Atlantic.

Yep.

Okay.

Um and that's that's the way it functions today.

Cars can go out that way.

Um, and it's helpful for the site because if you recall, uh, we do have 93 spaces in the Atlantic Station garage, and that entrance is the pedestrian entrance is right over here.

The vehicular entrance to that garage is off of Federal Street.

Um Phil, were you trying to ask a question?

Is that just answered it?

Okay.

Go ahead.

Okay.

This is the uh the second level, which is mostly garage, all the white is the double height amenity space.

Uh this pink area is uh actually exists on this second level, so some you know, meeting space uh above uh uh the the lobby area there, and then on the eastern side here, there's another bike room at this level uh and some storage space.

So this is what would sit above part of the the laundry area.

And to get your bike out to the street, how would you do that?

Two ways.

There's an elevator over here, and then you can access the the room here, or you could ride up the ramp.

So the ramp from the lower level comes right up here.

Okay.

Um, and then this is level three.

So this is where we start to have uh the apartment level, and then the pink space is the indoor amenity level, which sits right in between the two outdoor courtyard spaces.

And then as you go up the building, it's it's really all units from there.

Um this is the so the next image will be this courtyard here, the the western one closest to Washington Boulevard.

And this is the landscape plan board.

So we have plantings all around.

Uh, this is the child play area, so a little swing set, some uh you know, some play apparatus, uh seating in the middle, and then more of an unprogrammed outdoor space here with some seating that spills out from the indoor amenity space, and then landscaping uh along the edges as well.

Is that with 300 units?

Do you think that's enough play area for the kids in the building?

Uh I think so.

It it's certainly meets the requirement of zoning, and then there will also be some indoor play space.

It hasn't been fully programmed yet within the amenity area here.

So they'll have both indoor and outdoor.

Okay.

And then this is the amenity, this is the outdoor courtyard on the other side, which is really um seating.

Um, you know, this may be your kind of cornhole area here, um, a little less programmed, uh, more flexible to change.

So this is the view of the first courtyard.

So here's the rear uh of the building here.

So that brick material continues around the back.

Then this is the the playscape area here, and then similarly the eastern courtyard.

Um this would be the indoor amenity space here, and then as I said, the units continue above uh that leg of the building there.

And then you can see is there a fence or anything?

Keep the kids from falling off.

Uh there's a parapet wall.

Um it looks pretty true.

But that's the same thing.

So there's two things.

There's the parapet wall here, and then there's also a planted area along the wall to kind of serve as an additional buffer.

And that meets the requirements for the height of a fence.

I believe it does.

I'll I'll ask the architect to weigh in on that.

And I, you know, obviously, if uh a railing were needed, that could that could very easily be added to the top of the parapet wall here.

Okay.

Um so then this is our streetscape planting plan.

So uh West Stout's office has given examples of of all the different uh plantings and trees that are that are being used at the street level, and it it really will be a very pleasant walking experience here because we have we are meeting or exceeding all of the minimum um sidewalk requirements, and that is with an additional roughly six feet before you get to the building that we've um utilized for additional planting.

So you'll have your street tree um along the amenity strip on you know towards the the curb, and then additional foundation plantings uh along the building, and then it gets even wider as you uh get to the Washington Boulevard side where it ranges from uh the 15 foot minimum to I think over 18 feet in some some areas um along the streetscape here.

Um, which this brings us to really the only the new request with the application.

Um if you recall with the with the GDP, we hadn't quite figured out exactly how the public amenity space was going to shake out.

We knew that we were looking to do um a a public pedestrian connection through the site to get out uh to Guernsey, and as um George Comfort, who owns the the property here, um has their well they had a previous development that was approved, not sure if that's going to end up moving forward, but as the rest of the block um gets developed, it it could be a really nice experience uh walking um along Guernsey and serving as you know a pretty efficient uh cut through area for pedestrians so that you don't have to circulate this entire large block.

Um so they were committed to that, and we've able we've been able to execute it as we got into the details.

Um, realized that the through block connection was not able to meet the dimensional requirements of section six, which include um 12 foot clear height um for any covered uh through block connections, the the garage is about 11 feet um and potentially you know 10 feet where there uh maybe any mechanicals that that go through the garage.

Um so we we didn't meet that dimension, and the the through block connection calls for an overall 20-foot width uh with a 10-foot clear walking path.

Now we have the 10 feet for the most part, but there are pinch points um where there are columns along the building that get down to about eight feet clear, and I can I can zoom in on this here.

So we we put some dimensions to it here.

Um so the the through block connection comes off of the the main sidewalk on tresser here, goes under the garage, and then daylights uh as you get out to Guernsey.

So we have you know almost 12 feet at the at the mouth here.

Here there's a column, so it necks down to eight feet and then goes back to 10.

Um it widens out where you make the turn here, um, and then is about eight and a half uh as you get towards the the uh south end of the site here.

Um it's all bollard protected um along the way here, so separating uh and creating a physical barrier uh between the cars and pedestrians.

There's one crossing of the garage here, um, and then another one here, which probably won't get much vehicle uh traffic at all, as there's only six spaces here.

Um and this is underneath the the ramp, which is going up to the second level here.

So not much going on there, but it's all bollard protected around here and then open uh for that crossing.

Um and then we added I'm sorry, go back a sec.

It's bollard protected along the path there.

Where the bottom I'm not seeing them.

Where are they?

There are these little circles here.

Gotcha.

Okay.

And you are um the regs talk about uh deck uh visual effects on it throughout the uh path and lighting and landscaping.

Those are those shown, any of those shown?

Uh yes, I I have a rendered view from the front, and we can talk about some of those things.

Um so this is the view from uh tressor boulevard, and I have a close-up here.

Um so just to just to touch back on what what we had what I mentioned about the architectural.

So this is kind of that transition piece uh in the middle of the building that is is the darker uh kind of grid line that goes all the way up.

Um and it really focuses you on the uh the entry point here.

And what they've also tried to incorporate is in an art installment.

So this will have some 3D elements.

I I don't know that this is necessarily the the design, um, but the idea is to have some 3D elements um and an artistic design that kind of climbs the wall here and provide some visual interest to this area of the garage where it's exposed.

And then the other thought is we can whatever ends up going here, we can kind of marry it in in design to the hardscape uh along the walking path, um, so that it kind of creates that sense of place uh as a public space.

Um and let me see if we get closer here.

Yes.

So this is you know, the underside of the garage for for most of the garage, but along the pedestrian connection, um there's there's an actual ceiling, and you can see these these lines that go across, there's there's lighting uh about every 10 feet as well as uh wall sconces uh along the building.

Um and what's nice is that the building is not that deep, so you can you can see daylight from one end of the uh building to the other because it open you know it's open on on the back side.

So in addition to the interior lighting above, um, you know, for parts of the day, uh you will have daylight as well.

And there'll be lighting.

It looks like that doesn't go all the way through to the back there.

It it does.

So you're you're turning here, so you're not seeing the rest of it.

Okay, but you'll show us the view from the other side as well.

Um we haven't rendered that, but it would just be a continuation of this.

Okay, that's fine.

You can that can be uh something we get after um before building per net.

Yeah, and and that's fine.

And and staff mentioned that that uh those lighting details and things like that may have to come back to you.

Yeah, um, and we'd be fine with that being uh a condition on those details.

Um and that's really all I had.

Um, just touching on some of the points uh in case I missed them during the presentation, but um 305 units of affordable housing.

It includes 31 units at that lower AMI level, um, which is is critical and an underserved uh portion of our population, as well as uh a hundred and ninety, what I'll call family sized units of two and three bedrooms.

Um again, demolition and remediation of this contaminated site that has been resistant to redevelopment for over 10 years.

Um, there's also new drainage infrastructure that will be in putting that um that serves our neighboring properties, similarly, uh new sanitary infrastructure that also serves neighboring properties, new electrical infrastructure, um, the new public pedestrian connection through to Guernsey Street and over 550 linear feet of new wider uh landscape public sidewalks.

Um with that, I'm happy to answer any additional questions.

I congratulate you guys on it.

Um so why don't we go to the board?

Uh Bill.

Thanks, Dave.

Uh Ray, I had to step away from it, so I might have missed this.

But no, the the parking will the parking spaces be assigned.

No, it is it is not assigned parking.

So then are uh is the parking actually bundled?

Uh there correct.

There is not because it's an all-affordable project, uh, there's not an additional charge uh for uh parking a vehicle.

Uh but it'll just be just free parking for wherever we can park where correct.

You would have, you know, a pass or a fob to to get into the garage, but you wouldn't have an assigned space.

Okay.

Because what we found is that assigned spaces, you know, sometimes you need it when you're doing home ownership and things like that, where people expect that their car goes here.

Um, but uh from a parking management standpoint, it it creates waste because you're people don't get to use that space when they're not in it.

Okay.

Now do you have any plans for the approximately 40 additional parking spaces which you have in what you're gonna need?

Or there's gonna be we we are over parking.

Lay out the parking for us, okay, Ray.

What's required and how you fulfill that?

Yeah, because you're gonna have you're gonna have 90 some odd in the Atlantic.

Yeah, though those are there now.

Um they've existed since Atlantic Station got built because part of that project was on what was formerly uh parking area for this site.

Um, so yeah, they've had those 93 spaces.

Um and let me try to have a parking.

Don't you have a parking chart of some sort?

Or not we not part of this.

Let me it's it's in our zoning data.

I I'm pretty sure I have it on a slide here.

Let me just find it for some reason it's not letting me navigate to it for you.

So give me a second here.

Let me unshare for a moment.

So here's the parking.

We have um a requirement of 266.

We have 306 total.

So 213 will be in the garage of the building, and then there's an additional 93 in the Atlantic Station garage, which is the access directly adjacent um to the site.

So do you uh what I started to say?

Do you have any plans or ideas with the additional 40 spaces which you're not required to have?

Do you have any plans for those, or are you just gonna stay there to be used by the residents?

Are you talking about the 5% reduction?

No, they they're only required to have 266.7 parking spaces, and they have about 306 parking spaces.

I'm sure this could happen with the overage.

Just be there to use by anybody, or are you plan on leasing to somebody?

I was just curious.

No, there's there's no plans for for outside leasing.

We we thought the parking ratio was appropriate um to have, you know, because if we if we met the minimum, we'd be less than one to one.

And we do have a decent amount of two and three bedroom units here.

So, you know, when it with affordable housing and and really with downtown housing in general, you do have a population of people that that don't have a card.

So it may very well be that we could live with uh fewer.

Um, but the the developer felt that this was an appropriate ratio uh for the building.

Yeah, thank you.

And lastly, on the on the laundry area, did I hear you say that it is not gonna be open to the public anymore?

You change that.

Um correct.

Um there were there was a time where we thought maybe it could serve as a as a dual use, but uh moved away from it just because there are uh complications with uh having it be uh a public space.

Okay, and lastly, uh I guess what what would happen hypothetically if somebody pulled into your parking area and they misplaced their fob, how would they get out?

I I think it would function like pretty much every other garage uh mid up onto Treasure Boulevard though.

That's what I guess I'm worried about.

Um yeah, I I imagine that they're there but I'll I'll I'll double check with um the developer on that.

But I imagine you know, if there's a call box or something where you can you know ring management and say, you know, uh sorry, I made a wrong turn or something, they could open it for you, or if the fob's not working.

All right, that's what I need to know.

And uh lastly, I agree with the David.

This is a uh pretty nice project.

Much better improvement of what was over there.

That's no question about that.

It will be um the largest project single single phase project.

Um, I think in Chaffa's uh history in Connecticut if it gets done.

Well, I'm sure.

Well, let's get on with it then.

Thanks.

That's it for me for tonight.

Thank you.

Okay.

You're on mute.

Um so I understand the parking spaces aren't assigned, and I get all that, but you're not gonna have somebody drive in and there's no parking spaces in the main building, so then they have to go back down and go over to Atlantic Crossing.

That that will be worked out so that people are signed there or something.

I think that might be doable, where maybe certain units are you know, your your primary parking should be the Atlantic station garage.

Um, even if it doesn't we don't want any problems with traffic backing up because no, I I think that makes sense.

I mean, typically what happens as the building um stabilizes is people kind of fall into their routines, but um that may be uh a good thing to include as as part of the management is maybe just um you know, calling out some of the units that your primary parking is here.

Yeah.

Um I I'd love all the trees on the street.

Um, it will be such an improvement.

If um if we get to this in a timely manner, um and you get your financing, when do you think demolition might start?

I mean, how many people are still living in those buildings?

They are less than 50% occupied, I think just under 50% occupied right now.

We discussed last time um where you're gonna house these people during construction.

Um I I think the the plan would be to start the relocation process before demolition, um, so that folks aren't moving multiple times because you know we could in theory move everybody from one building to the other building and then start the demo on that building.

But I think because of the contaminants and because of the fact that both towers are are coming down, it doesn't make sense to relocate people within the site and then off-site.

So they're just gonna start the the relocation process um prior to demo.

And good.

That's the right decision.

Yep, and you should have twice uh a relocation plan that was submitted that in that includes uh significant detail in terms of how that's gonna be done.

So um so say we approve this in March.

Um what do you think in terms of I'll double check?

I think the goal is to maybe start uh demo by the end of the year, but that demolition because of the contaminants is going to be a long demolition.

It's probably gonna be an 18-month demo.

Um it's not gonna be Burlington.

Um, it's gonna be a longer process because of uh they have to do remediation before they can even uh start the demo.

And then probably another 18 months of construction sound about right.

So I think about these three years starting later this year.

Correct.

Late 2029.

That sounds right.

Okay.

Okay, I think that's all I had.

Okay.

Jerry.

Um it's Jerry.

How many um guest parking is there gonna be?

We we haven't designated any specific visitor parking.

But to Bill's point, if after the building is up and operating and stabilized, and we realize, hey, we have you know 20 spaces that nobody's ever using, um, then they may be able to do that.

Okay.

And handicap, what's required over there?

Um, ADA, I know they are meeting the requirement.

They are dispersed throughout the site, I believe.

Perfect.

I think that's about it.

Um, it's a long time coming.

I'm glad it's finally happening.

I was gonna ask, uh, I see the comprehensive uh plan for uh moving folks out of the 50% that are occupied.

So that's all great, and I just hope it we see it.

That's all.

Me too.

Thank you.

Uh David, I have one more question.

Yeah, um, from the sign on your uh rendering.

Um, looks like you're not going to be calling this St.

John's anymore.

You know, I hadn't focused on that.

Um I don't know that they will.

Certainly, St.

John's will maintain uh ownership, but um I think like all the new developments, you know, they they all need some spiffy new name.

I know, but it's a shame.

Uh I'm sure they will have um you know somewhere in the building some uh some history of of what was there.

Maybe it can be the crossing at St.

John's.

All right, thanks.

You just want to get the saint name in there.

Um thought, and I don't remember what it was.

Um just first question for Benita.

Um we still need the staff report on this.

I did send it out right before the meeting.

You might have missed it logging in.

I did miss it, I guess.

Um we need WPCA then.

That's the only department left.

Yes.

Okay.

Um jump to uh landscaping.

Uh there were several comments from departments on the landscaping.

Can we get a revised landscaping plan, Ray, that'll update uh based on EPV and traffic?

The the plan that's in your package has been updated for EPP's comments.

So that one all now has all native species.

Um traffic, I think had some questions uh and some thoughts on the tree layouts and where things were going and bus stops and things like that.

Um so we will likely have some further coordination with them.

Um I think we presented uh during the GDP phase that they were working on um some future plans for both Tressor and Washington Boulevard.

I think they have some have just started the concepts on those and are getting some of that feedback to us, so that's likely something that we're gonna have to continue to coordinate with them through building permit.

So I I think if you want to make that a condition that we well, I think theirs was anticipated to be a building permit level detail, but um, yeah, we may have to shift around some of the the trees uh along the streetscape here.

I was wondering and I I think they also mentioned that the amenity strip didn't meet the width requirements.

Yeah, I I was surprised by that revised typically we had always it's it's a four-foot amenity strip, and you measure it from face of curb.

That's everything that we've done, so I'm not sure why they're asking for four feet measured from the back of curb.

But in any event, say it's a six-inch adjustment, that's not hard to coordinate.

Okay, will you just do that for the next meeting?

Please sure.

I but uh again, with all of their comments, uh I think those are levels of detail that could be done prior to building permit.

I wouldn't want to prolong it uh prolong this for uh a minor detail like that if we don't have it.

It's not gonna it doesn't prolong it, it just you do it before the meeting and during between the meetings, and um we have I guess what I was getting at is I was wondering whether we need a second meeting for this.

Uh yeah, we will um why the can you the we I had earlier requested that the um transportation demand management plan and the parking management plans be separate?

Can you separate those and add in TTP's comments on the uh the requirements?

I think they had said that didn't think that it uh included all of our regs.

So if someone will go back and check both of those against the regs, please and yeah, going forward, let's let's make them separate documents.

It's very hard to try to look at the regs to see what's you know whether the plans uh comply with the regs when they're they're combined like that.

Sure.

Um David, I I believe the transportation division has uh come up with the new DDM format.

Um so going forward you might follow that.

Um so I'll I'll take a look and maybe share with the board um what the latest format is.

Is that for the that's the TDMP or the parking management plan?

D DMP.

Okay.

They have not come up with one for the it's not been DMP yet.

Not for the BMP, but the DDM, yeah.

Okay.

But it's not, you know, we've it's not been released yet.

It's still in the works.

Okay.

Um, on the planting chart, right?

They left off the information on the the uh size of the plants of the trees.

There's at I don't see height at planting or mature height.

I've I believe that I believe that was added.

I'll and if it's not, I'll make sure that's yeah.

David, I did go into the street tree manual to check what size those were, and they were all listed under the large trees in our street tree manual.

Oh good, thank you.

That's good to know.

Um okay, but Ray, if they would for the planting on the list of plants, just make sure they have planting height and mature height.

Sure.

I thought that was done as part of the response uh to the EPB.

So the latest set should have that.

But I'll I will double check it.

I didn't see it on mine.

Okay.

Um engineering requested additional trees.

Were those was that included.

Um I'm not sure that I saw that comment.

Um or where they've requested them, but I think there engineering's comments were pretty recent, so I don't know that any of the plans have been adjusted to reflect those.

Yeah, those just came in, I think.

Um I'm not seeing it.

Um speaking of engineering, I guess the relocation of the pipe.

That's all been um addressed and worked out.

Yes.

And that's it's going to be relocated to be outside the building footprint.

Um, pretty much within the uh the service drive that goes around the building.

Okay.

All right.

I think I think that's it.

Okay.

Um why don't we go to the public?

If there's nothing else from the uh board, no, Mr.

Okay.

If there's anyone from the public here who would like to speak on this application, um please raise your hand and uh when you're called on, uh give us your name and address.

Well, if we have Miss Britney L.

Brittany Lawrence, Stanford, Connecticut.

Um I just have a question.

Brittany, where's what is your address?

I don't want to give my address.

I'll in Stanford though.

How about a street?

You still live in the boulevard.

How about that?

Yes.

Okay, good.

Good.

So I have a question in regards to the capital stack.

Um, you mentioned CHAPTER, so I'm trying to understand the affordability component to this.

Are all of the deeply affordable units?

Are they subject to LITECEC?

Or is the entire building subject to LITEG or a portion of the building subject to like LITEGAC?

Um and the deeply affordable units, will all of those tenants have vouchers attached to them so they continue the affordability.

Or is it different?

And then the BMR units, are those at the same AMI affordability as the deeply affordable um units, or are they at the 50 and above?

I don't think I saw that.

Oh, one more.

Um the tenants that are currently housed at St.

John's Tower.

Do they have as of right tenancy considering there being displaced?

Okay.

We will uh get those questions answered uh when we complete the public comment.

Thank you.

Thanks.

Next we have Mr.

Michael Moore.

Good evening and thank you.

Uh my name is Michael Moore, president of Stanford Downtown.

I'm here to here tonight to speak in support of application 225-46 submitted by St.

John Urban Development Corporation.

Representatives of the owner, including the developer David McCarthy of Heritage Housing Inc.

in Messieurs Redness and Mazio recently presented this application to Stanford Downtown's economic development committee.

The presentation focused on the elements of the special permit request.

At that meeting, the economic development committee voted unanimously in favor of the application.

The committee members focused on four elements when considering the project, including the importance of the project and increasing the city of Stanford's supply of affordable housing, the project's role in activating the highly visible corner of Washington and Tressor Boulevards, including, as was noted before by Mr.

Mazio, wider sidewalks, the varied facade treatments, and the fact that the project will provide public pedestrian connectivity between Tressor Boulevard and Guernsey Avenue.

And it's discussion about the project, the Stanford Downtown's Stanford Downtown's Economic Development Committee considered heritage housing's commitment to delivering a project wherein all units are available to households, ranging with incomes ranging between 30 and 80% of area median income.

Stanford Downtown reiterates its support for this project.

And again, thanks the zoning board for the opportunity to speak tonight.

Good.

Thank you, Mike.

I don't see any other hands raised here.

Okay.

Ray, can you uh answer the questions from uh Brittany Lawrence, please?

Yes.

So the uh and I'll I'm going to ask David McCarthy to jump in here on some of the questions.

Um, but yeah, the affordability uh will range from 30% to 80% of the area median income.

Um most of the units are 60% and lower.

Uh I can give you the breakdown.

There are 31 at 30%, 120 at 50%, and 123 at 60%.

Um, but when when it comes to the uh the capital stack and vouchers and um priority for them to return, uh I think David is uh gonna be uh much much clearer than than I will.

Okay.

Hello everyone.

For the record, David McCarthy, I'm the president of Heritage Housing Inc.

We are the co-developer of this project together with St.

John Urban Development Corps.

Um I'm gonna do my best here to remember what all the questions were, but I think one of them was uh whether the residents have a right to return.

I believe this was discussed at the last meeting, but uh to say it again.

The residents will have a priority, the existing residents of St.

John Towers will have a priority um in the resident selection plan when the new development opens, which means that all things being equal, they would get the first uh opportunity to rent a unit at the property.

However, they do need to meet the properties um occupancy requirements, which would mean meeting income guidelines, for example.

And so we can't allow over income residents to return, even if they want to.

Um I think the other question was about the sources of funding.

Uh this development would be financed very similarly to others that you've seen in the city developed by charter oak communities and would include a blend of um low income housing tax credit funding together with um uh a construction loan and uh state funding from the Department of Housing.

We've also applied for uh SIF funding from the Department of Economic and Community Development.

And then we also have um some commitments for Fianlu funding from prior projects, and we've uh applied to the city for additional funds in the from that program as well.

Did I cover everything, Ray, or is there anything else?

Uh I think so.

I think the only there was a question about vouchers and and whether you know they get to stay.

Um, yeah, uh affordable housing developments must accept applications from voucher holders.

Um and if a voucher holder applies and they meet our occupancy guidelines, and they'd be treated no differently from anyone else.

Mr.

McCarthy, you as long as we have you it the pro the project will be owned by Saint John's or will it be jointly owned?

It it will be a co-development.

Um this is projected to be a very large project and will require very significant um guarantees to be provided to lenders and tax credit investors and so forth.

And so heritage housing will need to remain in in the ownership uh for the duration of the tax credit development period.

Okay, so the heritage will have an equity interest.

Yes.

Wow.

Okay.

Um board, any questions for um Mr.

McCarthy.

No.

No.

Okay.

Thank you.

Um I see we have one other um hand raised.

I see two hands raised.

Umita, you want to um I see Ms.

Monica Twalk.

Um good evening.

This project is fairly extremely huge.

Uh it takes one block of uh to change traffic.

It really does.

Uh and I'm it's in your face.

There's no there's no setback.

It's like everything else that has been built by and passed, approved by these expired chairs that sit in the zoning board over the last couple of years.

So everything's very cold and uh with no uniqueness.

The St.

John's Towers obviously have a unique architecture.

They're round, they're circular, the cylinder, uh it distinguished us from every every other town.

Uh really I oppose it uh because of the structural uniqueness and architecture that is in those buildings.

Despite the fact that Mr.

Mazio says that they're contaminated, every building after so many years are contaminated and they get revived.

Uh and so many precious buildings that have been uh preserved in uh all over the United States uh because of their architecture.

Now uh one of the things is what I very much dislike is that Washington that Tressor Boulevard was always a wide street.

Uh we current and parking has become such a scarce thing.

Um that's why I I'd always like to keep parking open and uh keeping lots open, like the one on Washington Boulevard.

Uh so the deliveries and all these trucks and cars that park on the street just to get to uh businesses, uh the palace theater, all this will be street parking once again.

And that is an annoyance, a deterrence uh and quite conflicting when there's no place to drop off a package because no one in this zoning board thinks about uh a special delivery uh truck that will be coming every time, like Amazon, UPS, FedEx, whatever it is, and they park on the street and block a major highway, like uh the Billy uh Memorial Highway on Washington Boulevard when uh for these buildings.

Uh so I would like to see um something set back so that these trucks can park, moving people can park and and and not occupy our streets and block our streets because trust your boulevard is a very highly uh uh maintains three minutes.

And I I don't think that uh that's one of the issues, the traffic.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Um David, we have some new speakers, uh, and then we have Miss Brittany Lawrence again.

I'll go to the new speakers first.

Yeah.

Um Miss Marie Rocca Hi.

Um, introduce yourself and give us your address, please.

Sure.

My name is Marie Roca.

I live at 100 Tressor Boulevard, directly across this um development.

I am speaking in support of St.

John Tower.

Um, Stanford is growing and downtown has downtown has benefited from new developments, new amenities, and new investment.

I live right across the street, and I can tell you that in terms of traffic, it's not as unbearable as most people who don't experience this residence or this neighborhood um talk about, especially you know, when we tend to have people from North Stanford who are more vocal here.

I see for firsthand what modern and well-maintained housing can offer in my residence.

And I would really love for the people who are across the street from me to have the same dignity that I get to experience in the menu days as well.

I love this design so far.

I love the intention being put toward it.

Um, it is difficult sometimes to walk through certain older neighborhoods and buildings, and I see how unsightly this can be for most people, but overall, this building has not been well maintained.

I'm personally concerned when I see someone sitting on their balcony, just even either trying to enjoy fresh air from across where I live, um, because the St.

John Towers just is just not um just well maintained and just terrible overall.

Personally, I think that an investment in uh reinvestment, I should say, in St.

John Towers represent what the modernization of Stanford looks like, which I know some people have issues with, but I think it's great for a growing city that we cannot help.

It does also acknowledge the fact that there are people who are living here who deserve the same care and attention that newer residents gets to receive, like myself and those who reside at Lifetime and the other buildings that are around there.

Um, this project is not just an upgrade.

I think it's affirming that the long-standing residents belong here too.

So, in my opinion, I think that you know there's been a lot of discussion about parking.

The reality is I do have a car.

Um, my daughter also has a car.

We barely drive, we take public transportation because we actually loved it.

I also own a home in North Stanford, but I've found living down here to be more accessible.

I take the train, I walk, and that's most people that live at the tower.

I've talked to many of them.

That's what they do.

And even as I rely more on more and more public transportation, which I hope to see more downtown in walkable spaces, a lot of the people that live here, they work.

They work full-time, they're really just trying to sort of have comfortable and accessible housing that are proximity to mobility, um, transportation and car ownership is really not at the top of most of these people's mind.

It's not even at the top of my mind, even though I have a car that mostly gets parked.

I think I drive an average of about like 20 miles per week.

And so as I think about Stanford and its mixed housing um needs, I think this development definitely supports that in a full spectrum and a growing population, working families, seniors, young professionals, and people who are simply trying to remain in the city need these kinds of opportunities and housing.

And so I certainly hope that it would be approved.

Like I said, I really support St.

John's Towers in terms of having a two um choices for dignity, uh, and kind of bridge the disparities that can that tend to happen in growing cities like Stanford.

I love living here, and I certainly hope that the board would consider this kind of opportunity investment in our growing city and providing opportunities, dignity, and affordable housing.

Ms.

You have three minutes.

Thank you.

Good.

Thank you.

Yeah, Miss Sue Halburn.

Hi.

Hi, this is Sue Halburn again, 30mm Craft Road.

Um, I just want to say this time I I really have to agree with Monica, as far as you know, delivery trucks and you know, blocking the roads.

I know this is an issue all around town when you have Amazon and some of the delivery checks, they just pull over to the side of the road and they do interfere with traffic.

So I don't know if there's somewhere in this development where they could pull into the uh driveway or a parking lot to get off of the road, um, you know, and moving checks or what have you.

But uh my question actually is related to the people that are living there now.

I'm just curious in this type of situation, does the developer help um and pay for these people to be relocated in this particular instance?

Because I keep thinking about the people at the boulevard that had to, you know, leave to when this was made into dorm space.

I'm just curious in this particular we'll get you an answer to that.

So thank you.

Thank you.

Okay.

That is a oh I think it cut out or something like that on the curb where trucks could pull in.

Um David, you anyway.

Couldn't hear you there for a second.

Maybe you can repeat your comment.

Uh-oh.

He's probably gonna reach out.

Uh disconnected.

Yeah.

All right, what are we gonna move on?

And David.

Yes, we have Miss Brittany Lawrence again.

Hi, I just raised my hand again because all of my questions get answered.

And my support either way is based on the answers to this this question because it is a beautiful building, and I look at buildings like this a lot in my line of work.

And um, I'm just really concerned about having deeply affordable units with no support um attached to it, specifically vouchers, um, and which units are actually lie tech, um, considering that the range and income and rents, like the maximum rents for um these AMI tiers could be deeply unaffordable depending on your AMI level.

Um where is going to get the support that they're need, they need specifically the lower tier AMI folks and um which building or units are LITEC considering.

And for um this particular item about I think I forget his name, Chris said that folks with vouchers, if they meet the income requirement, they will be able to move in with their voucher.

Um, a voucher in the federal sense, you don't have to meet an income requirement because as long as you get a dollar and subsidy, you meet the income requirement.

And I think in order to get a voucher, you have to be at or below 50% of the AMI level of whatever city or state that you live in.

So I just wanted to make sure that um I got the correct information before I say yes or no to um this particular project.

If someone can answer that question for me.

Oh, but when we're uh get through with all of the questions, we'll uh ask the applicant to answer them.

Thank you.

Um I don't see any other speakers.

Okay.

Um Ray, do you want to um sure those questions, please?

Or pass them off.

Um I'll I'll try to take a shot at Miss Lauren's questions.

Um, and just to clarify, I think what what David said was that if they are if they meet the income requirements, meaning if they are over income, you may not be able to return to the building.

Um, not that you know, vouchers would, you know, somehow not be accepted or or have some type of uh different income requirement.

And he was talking about folks being over income returning.

Um and I my understanding is I believe the entire building is subject to lie tech, um, which is uh a range of affordability, but David can correct me if I'm if I'm wrong on that.

Um and then as far as access and deliveries and those types of things, um, well, first of all, um it it's funny with the towers because for you know, every three people that can't wait to see them come down, there's probably one that uh has a soft spot for them.

And that is true of St.

John's in the in their ownership as well, um, because they have been trying to rehab the buildings in place for uh I think around 15 years now, you know.

The original Atlantic station application, I think was in 2013, um, and they had already um been in discussions and and talked about funding and trying to do um uh something with with the towers, and I think it's just because of the building codes and the contamination, it's just proven to be uh infeasible to rehab the units in place.

So without being able to put in a significant um rehab of the buildings, you know, they just continue to deteriorate.

And I think that's why it's taken so long uh for us to get to this point is because St.

John's was trying so hard to save the buildings, but at this point, um I don't think it's it's possible, which is uh why we have the application before you um that we do.

Um and then as far as the building, you know, being in your face or at the street front, you know, that's that's really a a core tenet of urban design that you create a an active street wall um and activate the the ground floor with active uses, um and really you know you have a beautiful building that is at the front with all of the parking hidden uh behind it, uh whereas now you have uh an open asphalt parking lot in between the two buildings.

Um then as far as um the the tress, uh it's not getting any narrower.

We're not proposing to change the curb to curb dimensions.

Um everything is within the property lines.

Um, and we do have uh a service drive uh specifically for vehicles like that to be able to pull around um the building and and make deliveries or trash pickup or all those things so that they don't have to happen uh in the street.

Um Ray, speaking of that, is there an entrance for these guys when it like a FedEx truck pulls in down that um that open drive that goes along the east side and around where do they enter the building?

Is there a lobby entrance for them back there somewhere?

Let me reshare.

There's not a there's there are entrances, but uh I think the the mail and all of that activity is really at the at the main lobby of the building, if you can see where my cursor is.

You know, so they'd have the ability to really park alongside any anywhere along this part of the building because the driveway is wide enough that you could navigate around them if they were parked along the building anywhere.

But my understanding is that the deliveries would be made to uh the mail area, which is at the front of the building here.

I'm sorry, you're you're in the lower left corner now.

You're talking about I'm talking about the if you can see where the cursor is here.

No, where maybe you can't.

You see where it says amenity um in the right above the word tressor.

Uh-huh.

Um, so that that's kind of the main lobby uh where the mail room is in that area.

So that's um at the main elevator core.

So that's where deliveries would ultimately come.

Which means they would stop on tresser in front of the building.

Or they'd have to walk from the truck to the to the building.

No, then where would the truck be?

They can park the truck anywhere along the service drive.

Okay.

So they actually have quite a long walk to get there need to go.

Yeah.

Yeah, I I think it's you know, it's more than most buildings have for uh deliveries.

The problem is also often that the delivery drivers just don't park in the parking that is reserved for them.

So for example, for the Smith, uh TTP actually reserved a parking spot um on Washington Boulevard.

Um where the public parking spots are.

So either there's someone parking there illegally, so the the delivery drivers can't park there, or the delivery drivers for whatever reason don't want to park there or don't know that they can park there.

So it's also um a matter of um education.

The um lifetime has a pull-in, right?

An area where you a car can stop in front of the building and not block tressor boulevard.

I don't know what you call it, cut-in.

Does that sound right?

Well, there is street parking along that side of Tressor Boulevard.

We don't we don't have that on this side of Tressor.

Okay.

So I think they just have an area along that street parking that they designated for their own.

Got it.

Okay.

Um but to be honest, you know, Tressor is three lanes wide.

You know, you probably don't need all three lanes at all hours of the day.

Um you know, I don't know how well it functions, but you know, there is a complete streets um design where one lane can serve uh kind of a dual function depending on the hours of the day.

We have that on East Main Street, um where there's parking uh along the street during certain hours of the day.

Um I don't know if that's contemplated in the city's future plans for the road here.

Um, but can we require a sign at the uh driveway that says deliveries or something?

We need to encourage the trucks to pull in, or even though they have a long walk to the office to drop off the packages, we need to encourage them to pull in off tressor.

This is me, and there is a dedicated loading area on the east side of the building.

I just wanted to draw your attention to that.

Can we see where that is?

Uh sure.

Ray, can you just bring that up again, please?

And there are there are proposed signs that we're proposing like exists today along Tressor Boulevard that there's no parking on Tressor Boulevard.

Or no standing as we know.

Okay.

Yeah, right.

So there's a there is a loading area right here.

Um now will that be set up to accept uh Amazon packages and FedEx from for tenants.

Uh I don't I don't know that it is.

I think that was more for move-ins and things like that because there is uh an elevator and so that doesn't do much good for um deliveries, yeah.

I I don't know that it that it necessarily does.

Yeah, and the mail trucks gonna be coming, you know, six days a week.

Um yeah, yeah.

We just have to encourage them all to pull in off the street.

Um yeah, okay.

We can designate an area in that in that one way coming in as deliveries, yeah.

I I think their concern is you know, the driver being compelled to use it if he's got a you know walk to the mailroom.

Yeah, and they can't there's no place to park if they if they come around, um if if they come around that driveway and they come around to the back, I guess there's even once they get back towards Guernsey, it there's really no place less they they park in the driveway along the uh pedestrian walk.

Yeah, I mean, in you know there's there's a little bit of room here behind the bikes if you wanted to park there.

I mean, you'd you'd technically be blocking part of the travel lane, but you know, folks could navigate around that.

Um, but they'd have to get into the actual garage area to do that.

No, we don't want that.

Your building doesn't want that.

I mean, TTP actually wanted to do on-street parking along Tress of Boulevard because they believe it's feasible.

Um the problem is that Tressor Boulevard um is a state road.

So uh the state had issues with that.

Too bad.

And uh, I mean, the guys in Hartford know how traffic works.

So yeah.

Yeah.

Okay.

Um Ray, did you cover all the questions that um you received?

I think I did.

I hope I did.

A couple of people.

Um so we've heard from the public um board, or there any other questions.

Well, Ray, we weren't you gonna go back to Dave to address uh Brittany Lawrence's question.

I I thought I hand I thought I addressed them.

Um yeah, you did.

It was not a voucher question, it was whether someone who's in the existing building could move into the new building.

No, no, she also asked about she did you know what you're right.

I have uh my note here, she did ask about supportive services for the the very low income, and I'll ask David to jump in on that if he would.

Thank you, Bill.

Hi everyone.

Um definitely appreciate the concerns about package delivery.

I should I just want to speak to that.

We we operate um about 1,300 apartment units in multiple states.

It's a common problem in apartment complexes, and um we are looking into potentially carving out some space in the laundromat area for an additional package room so that there could be an easier place for delivery drivers to access the building than the one that's in the amenity area.

Um so we're we're definitely um you know aware of that of that issue, and we're gonna do as much as we can to address it.

Um just to go to the affordable housing questions.

Um to clarify, all 100% of the units are going to be low-income housing tax credit qualified.

Um for many years, that program was limited to 60% of area median income.

However, it now allows something called income averaging, which we would be utilizing that creates um four different bands of affordability at 30% of area median income, which I'll call AMI.

Um 50% AMI, 60% AMI, and 80% AMI.

So there'll be a very broad range of units available to different income into income brackets.

Um, we would have loved to have Section 8 assistance, uh, that simply is just not available to us as a resource for any of the affordable units here.

Uh voucher holders, of course, may bring their own vouchers, and we welcome that.

And we typically find that anywhere from 15 to 25 percent of our residents are voucher holders in in many of our properties, however, um you can't uh in in today's world, you can't really uh secure a project-based voucher very easily.

Um and then to address the question about services for the 30 percent.

I think that the question was whether there would be any um property supplied supportive services for the 30 percent of area meaning income residents.

That is not something we're planning to provide at this property.

Um, we do operate you know, several properties with 30% AMI tenants in them that do not have supportive services, and um they we don't have any issues uh because of that particular population not having supportive services.

Um the rents will all be set at affordable levels to those various income brackets, and um those rents are as you know established at a formula that kind of equates to 30 percent of the um of the income limit with uh some deductions for utility allowances.

Does that address all of the questions?

I don't remember any others.

Does uh anyone else remember additional questions?

I think that's I believe you've responded appropriately.

Okay.

I'm here if you have any others.

Thank you.

Um so um it sounds like we've uh completed uh the public and um we um are there any other questions from the board?

No, it's true.

Not at this time.

Okay.

Um before we close.

Well, let me ask board, is there any reason we shouldn't close this?

Uh I thought you had a list of information you wanted, David.

Am I wrong?

Um we have a couple of things we need that we can't we have to have well we need WPCA um before we before we could vote on this.

Um the yeah we need the um the T DMP and PMP um revised and separated, and we need the tree information.

I think that's all but I thought we were instructed uh by our legal counsel that we should not close a hearing if we have information which has to be submitted.

But if you feel comfortable with it, find me.

Well, if I can interject, um I think the the the street information is is on the planting plans, um, which uh have been delivered both electronically and in hard copy.

What what street Ray, what's street information?

The tree information.

No, it's I looked on your planting list and it's not there.

Hold on, let me see if I have that latest plan.

I think we've also uploaded it.

Um maybe we just don't have it.

Let me I have it up on my screen.

Okay, I'm looking at um the 12 12 25.

There is a more recent oh plan.

Was okay.

Is the board gonna get that?

I can send that over.

I'm looking at the the front page of it, proposed planting schedule.

Yes, this one's oh wait, actually date this is the dated 1212, and that the revision um is January 21st.

Oh it's been revised to January 21st.

Oh so I I have it here.

Um the plant schedule is here, and for the trees, they have the the size at planting and the height of the jury.

Okay, what else changed on that?

Uh they added a street tree calculation uh separated by street.

Um good, which is was on my list.

Um so as far as the uh the TDMP and the PMP, um, you have our initial ones submitted, and typically we get a condition that the final be submitted prior to CL anyway.

Yeah, but that's not this one, doesn't meet our standard for even preliminary approval, so we can't get to the final one.

Um I don't I'm okay with the condition that before building permit you come back to the board with plans that um meet our condition and we can approve those as drafts.

I'd be okay with that too.

Yeah, which but what we have is not um approvable.

Okay.

Based on that, David, I guess you can close it then.

Um we but we still need WPCA.

Are we gonna get that, Vanita?

David, we don't have that right now, but you know, based on what the the comments that WPCA provide, they really list items that they need prior to building permit.

They don't, you know.

Vanita, it's something we need though.

We're supposed to have it.

Well, just to be clear, they have 35 days from when referrals go out to submit their comments.

You can you can close without their comments.

It's it's on it's on them to get their their comments in in a timely fashion.

But it's and in this particular case, uh, I believe we do have comments from them from the GDP.

I'm just gonna try to double check what their comments were from the general.

Right?

I I understand what you're saying, but it's on us as part of our due diligence and approval process to have these comments in front of us.

No, I know I know we could say to them, sorry, you took too long your foreclosed from providing them, but that doesn't that doesn't do us any good.

Yeah, but it'll it also doesn't stop them from commenting once we submit a building permit, as they're going to do anyway.

Um also being a city department, I think they we could still receive their comments after the hearing close closes.

Okay.

I'm I'm okay with that.

Um is there anything else um then that we need we need to get?

Um I'm sorry, let's go back a minute.

The revised landscape plans that the board didn't get.

What's there anything in them?

Are there any other changes?

I'd like to get onto the record.

Are there any other changes other than the uh tree sizes and the street frontage?

Uh the species changed uh in response to EPP's comments that they all be native plantings.

Okay.

Is there did anything else change?

I don't believe so.

Okay.

Why don't you um the need are already posted it online, right?

So it's in the record.

Yes, it's part of the record.

Yeah.

But how does that help us?

No, I'm just saying it's in the record.

We need a copy, but we don't have to worry about not being in the record if we close the hearing.

No, no, but really what I want to know is what's in it.

I mean, if there's anything we should be aware of um that changed.

Henry Pullman, we can species height and the treat the street calculations.

Right.

I I heard that.

My question is, is there anything else?

Ray, you you will you confirm that there's no other changes?

Sure.

I'm just taking them a moment to look back um at the two different sets.

I don't believe anything changed.

Look, I don't mind trying to rush this through because this is an important project and you need financing, but we gotta make sure we we at least do it right.

Right.

But our staff got it.

We just didn't get it.

Right.

So it's in the record.

Yeah.

I know it's in the record.

It's 1020, and we have an hour and a half to go.

I'm not trying to move things along.

I look, we're trying to get this closed.

If we if we're not closing it tonight, it'll be easy.

Um so David, I'm looking at you know, the emails that came when the when this uh plan was submitted.

Um, you know, it's talking about the plantings being updated to include native species, the street tree catholic, and a photometric plan was added to the set.

Okay.

Okay, good.

So then um Ray, anything else you want to add before we close?

No, sir.

Thank you.

Good.

Um, okay.

So um we are closing application 225-46.

Next application 225-4A.

Let me let me ask a question here.

Um do we want to hear this tonight?

I mean, it's not gonna close tonight.

Um as I understand, right?

Um there is the issue with the um we haven't gotten comments from uh TTP.

And there was the issue with the um letter that was received today um from uh the attorney yeah uh from the um neighboring um apartment complex okay and we haven't then there hasn't been a response yet, has there to that letter from applicant from Rick?

Uh no, I don't know if anyone from the applicant's team can respond uh to that.

We would have to ask them.

Yeah.

Um but we yeah, we also need to hear from you said that was being sent over to engineering and traffic for their response.

Um so guys, we're not we're definitely not closing it.

The question is, would it given that there's several open items here?

Would we rather have this one um heard at our next meeting?

Yes.

Um how many items are we voting on tonight?

One um just one.

But this is you know, that this is uh another pretty complex application, so it will go on for a while.

And it given that that we can't we can't close it.

Um you want to put a half hour into it anyway, David?

You gotta you gotta open it anyway.

I mean, it might help to get the questions in.

Yeah, half hour.

Yeah, yeah, the 11 o'clock, yeah, approximately come on, Dave.

Okay.

We're veteran here.

Um 11 o'clock.

Hard stop.

You hear that, Rick?

I'm good.

Let's go.

Application 225-48, children's learning centers of Fairfield County Inc.

60 Palmer's Hill Road, site and architectural plans andor requested uses.

Applicant is proposing to redevelop the current existing two-story building that will include the adaptive reuse, construction of new daycare facility connected to the existing building, 60 surface parking spaces, outdoor pavilion, outdoor play area, 11 classrooms, and a gross motor space.

The proposed facility is anticipated to serve up to 220 children.

Umita, did we get the um sign affidavit?

Yes, we did.

And the certificate of mailing?

Yes, we got that as well.

Okay.

Um, because this is just a site plan, there is no um planning board letter.

Um I see we have Mr.

Redness here.

Um, I there was also um the attorney for the neighbors.

Um I don't know if he is here.

If if you're here and still awake, can you uh raise your yeah, there you are.

Um so he is here and would like to speak.

Um so Rick, why don't you um take it away?

We need to leave uh some time uh for um the other attorney peers to uh speak as well.

So no problem.

Go ahead.

Thank you.

So do you see my screen?

Yes, yes, yep.

Okay.

So um first, why are we here?

Um, we're here because CLC is being evicted from its Lockwood Avenue site.

It's ironic, some of the information that we received today talks about a family and children's services was evicted because of URC, and that's how they came to be in the neighborhood.

Um third of all the children entering kindergarten in Stanford come via CLC.

So this pretty important stuff, especially since you consider more than half our budget is related to the school system.

So this new facility maintains a current capacity, basically, for the crucial learning ages of three to five years.

This is not like every other daycare.

This is a special federal head start program serving the most vulnerable families, the low-income households, they may have housing instability, they may have disabilities and be English learners.

Head start and head start supports, health screening, family services, and other barriers to school readiness.

And they yield long-term benefits, higher graduation rates, reduce special ed, and lower juvenile delinquency.

These are all proven outcomes of CLC.

Pronotes economic mobility, long-term earning, parents being able to stay in the workforce, uh job readiness, and also a way to get community services.

Doing this helps reduce the cost to the city going forward.

So I think we have those items, and lastly, we're gonna provide a safe, accessible modern learning environment.

They've been operating out of trail um uh portable classrooms for a long time, way too long.

Um, and better air quality, better playgrounds, better engagement.

So that that's that's what brings us here today.

By way of orientation, this is Palmer's Hill Road.

This is 77 Havemeyer.

This is the private right-of-way.

We we refer to it as Dora Oliver Drive, just because historically that's what it was, and um, this is Edge Hill, and Edge Hill owns, and just to go back a little in time because I know some history was put into the record.

This was all owned by Sir Douglas Alexander, who was uh head of the Singer's sewing machine when most people in the world used Singer's sewing machines, and um so this property ended up being uh uh affordable housing, Connecticut Avenue.

This used to be uh another nonprofit that we turned into part of the hospital and um and Chartero communities.

So this is affordable 6040.

Um, and this was family and children's, and and this was CLC, and this was so sold off for commercial purposes.

It was Dor Oliver, then it was Conair, and then of course we did these 190 plus units here.

So just looking at the driveway, looking at the intersection, we're gonna be coming back to it.

We're gonna be looking closer at this driveway, what's happening on our site with drainage and traffic.

So um, just wanted you to be oriented and we can come back to whichever ones of those we want.

Rick, I'm sorry, excuse me one sec.

Um question for the board.

Did everyone get the uh materials from the uh neighbors who were objecting on this?

Um I did not, Mr.

Chairman.

Okay.

Um, I mean, I I realized we were talking about it a minute ago, and I wasn't sure people had gotten it.

Um just to digress for a sec, the the complex on Havemeyer, uh, where that traffic circle is.

Um they they have some objections to the project.

Their attorney sent us um materials um and a letter um asking that it be denied, um and um that's what we're talking about, uh hearing from the attorney and um also hearing from our own uh engineering and TTP on that this issue.

Um so Rick, I'm sorry, I just wanted to make sure people knew what we were talking about.

Okay, I'll touch on a little bit of that, not a lot, but a little bit on it.

Okay.

Um so uh on the left-hand side is what exists today.

So this is CLC uh 64 Palmer's Hill Road.

Um, and this they um come in from Palmer's Hill Road, rights and left in and go out here, and this is the parking.

This is the uh parking and playground and use that we've had for I think decades, working with Edge Hill.

Um so this you can go through here if you unlock the gate, you can go through.

This is actually a driveway here.

Um, and what we've been trying to do is this.

We we've been trying to get uh formal permission to um set up a permanent easement so that we could continue that only move it because of the building.

I'm sorry, Rick.

Uh who owns the property between those edge hill edge hill.

Oh, they own it all the way over to the right hand.

Oh, okay.

Yeah, gotcha.

And there's a longer history to all of this in terms of this.

Um Edge Hill used to own to here, like that.

And this was the United Way, and then when United Way left, it went on for sale, and Edge Hill bought it, and we did this parking lot.

I'll get into a little bit of that with the drainage.

Um this was garages for the Alexander estate.

So when they either donated or sold, I I don't know how how much was paid for the property for these nonprofits, but this was not included because this was used to service the Alexander estate before we did Edge Hill.

When we did Edge Hill, we negotiated a driveway and a sanitary sewer easement to go through here and then get to this door Oliver Drive.

And this all happened prior to 77 Havemeyer even existing.

So that's how this all came to be and why it's always been kind of shared and used.

So Rick Dor Oliver, who who owned that property?

This is 77 Havermeyer.

This is the condominium association that I'm not sure which attorney is here because we were dealing with one, but got a letter from somebody else today.

So yeah, that's the guy.

So I don't I don't know who's going to be speaking for them tonight, attorney one or attorney two.

So we'll wait and hear.

So um, but anyway, that's that's what the ownership is here.

And we've had been in conversation with benchmark, who is the operator of it for the owners.

And the owners are recapitalizing this property, which has been going on for a few months, and it is expected to take a few more months until that recapitalization is consummated.

And we we explained all of this in our neighborhood meetings.

Um, you know, this is not anything new that certainly our neighbors are hearing um from 77.

So we we submitted for the record um that the operator of this building, who's been the operator for uh as far back as I can remember, benchmark, um, that they agree with what we want to do here with respect to traffic and drainage because everyone here, uh child care learning center, edge hill, and 77 all experience the traffic and the drainage issues that are here.

So I just I wanted to um, you know, so this what we're asking you to do with this is to approve this in concept, okay, so that you know if and when, which we think is more of a when uh we get permission to do these improvements on Edge Hill property.

We'll be back to you um, you know, or or at least back to engineering and and EPB to make those things happen.

If we have to come back to you, we'll add you to the list.

But but this is something that we've looked at, we've talked to them, and again, I'll get into a little bit more of the detail.

Hey, Rick, ask you a real quick question.

Sure, this sure isn't it this roadway you're just referring to over here.

Isn't that the same roadway that the EPB stated in the report that they didn't think they would be you would need a permit and they didn't think you'd be able to get it.

Wait, what kind of permit?

EPB permit.

We already have an EPB permit for what's proposed, not this driveway.

That's right, but I believe in their correspondence to us, they stated that you were talking about another driveway, and the it would require an EPB permit, and they were not inclined at this particular point in time to do that.

That wasn't part of any thing that I saw or discussed with EPB.

Well, we should find it here while you're doing something else.

Yeah, so maybe Ray or Dave, maybe Ray or Dave can um can look up that EPB permit that we got because we're we're permitted for what we're proposed.

So we're not permitted for this.

This would require a permit.

And my page I have it right here.

It's on the it's your staff report dated January 8th.

EPB staff, it's on page two in the one, two, three, fourth paragraph near the bottom of that paragraph.

What is it?

Start starts the applicant.

It says about halfway through it.

However, the applicant should be aware that the future driveway connection.

I assume this is the one that he's talking about, yeah, indicated on the plans in the northwest corner of the site would require an EPB permit that the board may be reluctant to grant, given so on and so forth.

Given continued access via Dora Oliver will be less impactful.

So is it uh we're talking about the same driveway then?

Yeah, well, I I again point it it it may be what's stated there, it certainly doesn't reflect my conversation with the executive director of the EPB.

Well January.

Why would he have signed off?

You know, if they were so concerned, why would he sign off on Rick?

If if you are correct that they will grant it, then just get us something from EPB saying that.

Well, no, no, I wouldn't you can't get a letter from EPB that they're going to grant an application that they haven't received.

But you can get a letter saying that that statement by them is no longer uh oh, I we can get yes.

I mean, we we can work on getting something from EPB that says because this area needs a lot of cleanup.

Um, and that's part of what we talked about doing.

So, you know, we can talk to EPB about clarifying, you know what that is.

So that's fine.

We could do that.

Okay, but Bill, I'm I'm glad you raised that.

I had um gone right over that.

Thank you.

Sorry, Rick.

No, no, that's okay.

Oh, hey, Rick.

Just going back to Dor Oliver a sec.

On this on the right-hand picture, it looks are you telling me that's part of the Havamaier um road complex?

Yes.

Those how I'm saying the houses on the lower right corner.

Show me no this what you see here in white is all part of the Havamir 77 Havamire.

Yeah, but what we're looking at across the road.

You're talking about this across door Oliver, yeah, are those houses there.

This is Connecticut Avenue.

This is this is all charter oak.

This is all public housing.

Gotcha.

Uh okay.

Two different projects.

This was a rehab, and this was the rehab center that was part of the swap to get Stanford Hospital the land they needed, you know, that they did multiple applications to do that.

This was part of that swap.

Okay.

Okay.

Go ahead.

Okay.

So this is the plan.

I'm I don't have you know, I can go quickly through this.

This is what the building looks like.

This is an oblique view to give you an idea.

This is the architecture, obviously, without the landscaping and the topography.

And that you know, you'll see you know, here this is what people will drive by right along here.

So going back to this one, that's this view, which as you come around here, you see a parking lot, then you'd see the landscaping here.

If you looked over, if you stopped and looked, you'd see the landscaping and then the building that I'm showing you.

And then when you get to here, you're looking inside this courtyard, okay.

Uh landscaped and child's play area, and then you're seeing the existing building.

So just to orient you for this, again, this you're looking at through the parking lot, and then again, it's not shown with the landscaping.

You got to go back to a landscaping plan, which I will show you now.

So here's the landscaping plan, and that's what happens along here.

Then there's a sidewalk around the building, and then there's the building, which is one story high.

Okay.

So that's the architecture, which again, the only people that will see that are going to the school, edge hill, or 77.

So drainage and traffic, and that's what do we have that color landscape plan?

Uh nine.

Can we I believe you do if you certainly you have uh the this year, uh Redness and meet you have this is the black and white landscape plan, we just colored it up for the presentation.

Yeah, just send that over, please.

Sure.

Okay, sorry, Rick.

Go ahead.

Okay.

So um, okay, so I I moved on from that to drainage.

Um and I I you know I went through this with the neighbors.

We talked about it, they said they were hiring someone to do the drainage.

They said they would share that with us when it was ready.

We got the information today, it was dated six days ago.

So we're a little disappointed with the good faith efforts that we had been making with them and their attorney.

It's a different attorney, different set of people.

Um, so I I would be remiss not to express our disappointment in that because the things that were raised and drainage are pretty simple to deal with, and some of them were already raised by the engineering department and already punted to prior to a building permit.

So, you know, you can pick apart anybody's work.

We were never called by either of these professionals or this attorney that wrote the letter today to discuss anything, review anything at all, despite the fact that you know we've been at this a long long time.

This is a final approval.

This isn't our first rodeo here.

So the never say that anything here is your first rodeo.

Uh, yes, that's true.

So um, so anyway, what I what I explained to the um the that when we had our last meeting with a different attorney and a group of neighbors, and again, I don't know who this guy is representing today, but we explained how the drainage is going to be improved on our site without Edge Hill, nothing else.

And depending upon the storm you look at, it it's improved very significantly from the existing condition to the after development condition.

Rick, I'm I'm sorry to interrupt you.

When you say without Edge Hill, do you mean you're not taking about the connecting road anymore, but they're the property adjacent to this.

Correct.

What I when this plan, if you look at this plan, there are two things on it, and we use this same plan with the neighbors.

This is what we just talked about with the connection, right?

This right here is part of a potential drainage improvement that would significantly more significantly.

We're gonna make significant improvements here without this, but if we get this, which we think we will, then we can even uh uh you'll see.

Because we can we have this large area that we can impound water, and I'll give you a little bit about it, and I'm sure we'll hear from some of their um people.

So but this is what we showed, just so people understood how it works.

There's a high point in the road here in this driveway, and all of this goes towards here, and this is 77.

And when it gets down into here and it overwhelms the system here, it gets into their buildings, and it's a it's a big problem.

And we were uh, I don't know what's happening now, but we were helping them with that problem.

Um, this north basin goes into here, but it too eventually finds its way down south.

This east basin goes away from uh 77.

Okay, and when we were talking about this, you'll you'll see in a second, you know.

We we bring our system, we have three systems here, and one of the issues, for example, is there needed to be a liner between these systems.

Okay, not a problem.

Another issue was how much how big should this be, and how big should this be?

And some things oh, this should be larger.

Okay, it'll it'll be larger, it'll be whatever it needs to be, and it'll be subject to engineering prior to a building permit.

So then um, we this is just a blow up of that, and and when we were describing this, we were asked when we kick up this system here, which I'm gonna show you a little more of a detail in a second.

Right now, there is a catch basin here that's about six inches in the air.

Um, so that and that was done to mitigate the sidewalk.

A sidewalk was put in here so Edge Hill could walk from here to here, and to mitigate from this parking lot, which is an overflow special event parking lot for Edge Hill.

Um, so people can park here, workers, however, and they can walk along and get to Edge Hill.

So to mitigate that, um, we put in this catch basin and raised it up so that the water has to build up here, built a little bit of a berm, a little bit of it was natural, and it impounds the water to mitigate the sidewalk.

So, what we've talked about is adding two feet to this, and you'll see he right over here in a second.

If we add two feet to that, right here, we add 15,600 cubic feet of storage.

So, to give you an idea of how does that compare, this is what we're doing on site.

The chamber, this is the re retain it chamber, and our engineers here and um uh but just to give you the overview, and we've got the permeable pavers, uh, and and what their storage is, and it represents at a 25-year storm, and I can give you all the storms, but at a 25-year storm, it's a 29% decrease at the peak, and and that you know, drainage works off of peaks.

It's it's important off peak too, but our the studies are all on on peak.

So right now, when we put in that catch basin, we created 2400 cubic feet of storage.

We can if we add two feet, it's 15,000 plus.

And here if you have the 15,000 plus, will that stop water from flowing on to 77?

It again, there's several issues here.

It comes down from here, it comes down from the road, so it's not going to stop water from getting there.

The the what it the intent is to reduce it significantly so their on-site system can handle it, it doesn't get overwhelmed at the peaks.

You can put it if you can do the 15,000, is it still our water that's going our CLC's water that's going down?

It's not CLC's water.

This is this would be this is water coming down from Edge Hill goes in here, and it you know, some of CLC we could redesign.

This is this would be this is water coming down from Edge Hill goes in here and it you know some of CLC we could redesign I'm I don't know exactly what the redesign and how it's going to work but let me just finish going through this because it's it's a little bit bigger picture because they asked us to look at off site and not well they said can you connect the catch basin here and get it to the discharge down here keep in mind that the the peak of the road is about here but the receiving catch basins are way down here.

So it's Dor Oliver that's door all of it this is Dor Oliver yep okay this is Dor Oliver this is Connecticut Avenue yep okay so this is Edge Hill and this is 77 so we they asked us to at the last meeting we did we obviously didn't hear back from them or their engineer but we did what we said we would do and we got this 664 so this could be connected we the question was asked could we could it physically be done do the elevations work to get it from here to here and I didn't have the answer when we met so I told them we'll get the answer and we got the answer uh I I have not shared this with them because we were waiting to hear from their engineer which of course we didn't until today so that's that's Tig and Bond right that's Tig and Bond.

Okay.

So this is the first thing that we looked at as a result of our prior meeting with them so this is the overall watershed more and what this water eventually gets to is you know a very complex system that involves Westover school it involves Home Depot Progress Drive Rosa Hartman Park all the way down to Binny Park and if you um if you look at what's happening here what what happens is it goes through this way that the um what what we would be doing goes this way and if we diverted it on site it would go this way so what we said was you know that's a diversion but it does end up at the same place so it's not out of the question that something like that might be able to be worked out if the city of Stanford etc you know we're we're interested in helping 77 which according to the meeting that we had with the city and the neighbors present again different lawyer um you know we're we're happy to to explore that and you know what what CLC as a nonprofit serving the most needy is they're not going to pay for it okay we we're already doing more and no matter what their study says all you'd have to do is upsize things and you could fix anything they said in their study and that would all come out prior to a building permit so um you know but if we work together we we could make something happen here um and we're happy to work together despite what happened today so now let's just take a quick look at traffic and then um so we have two issues of traffic and the city of Stanford and and we didn't get the TTP report because they they got this other report today so you know they wanted to wait until we responded to that etc.

But the city of Stanford Rick Rick what's the other issue with TTP that was holding up their report well there their letter and they they asked today despite having our report for a while they asked today for two more pieces of information a queuing analysis and a crash report okay so we worked today to start to do that until we got the letter and then you know now we're just gonna put it all together and we'll answer the opposition letter and and get it all to Luke and you'll get your letter for next week can we hear from the attorney for the uh per 77 no I'm gonna finish how much longer do you need because this is getting continued so it's you know everyone's gonna have a chance to speak again on this you know we've been on this for a long long time and they just threw in a letter today so with all due respect I'm gonna

Can we hear from the attorney for the uh for 7?

No, I'm gonna finish.

How much longer do you need?

Because this is getting continued, so it's you know, everyone's gonna have a chance to speak again on this.

You know, we've been on this for a long, long time, and they just threw in a letter today.

So, with all due respect, I'm gonna finish.

How much longer do you need to finish?

I probably could have been done.

That wasn't my question.

How much longer do you need?

A few minutes.

Okay.

Go for it.

This is the PM peak hour.

This is the most affected hour.

Um, it's more affected than the AM peak.

So we have chosen to use it.

And what comes out of the driveway from the study that was done is 19 cars at the peak PM hour, are using this driveway, use this driveway when the study was done.

And most of them turn right and a couple turn left.

19 in the PM peak.

There's almost 200 units at 77, and 300 units almost at Edge Hill.

That's almost 500 units have access to this driveway, and that's how many cars were counted going out.

So I wanted to put that into perspective.

Um, and then if you add our traffic, it goes to these numbers in the PM peak.

And those are not huge numbers.

That's that's what's happening at this intersection as a result of 220 potential students being added.

And so um, and I want to just say one other thing about the the traffic report and everything else that we'll wait for and express my disappointment at um what was submitted today.

So when you read their letter, or when they speak tonight, you can ask them questions or next time.

You read it in one paragraph, and they say, Oh, you shouldn't use local data.

You should use it data.

You should use ITE, don't listen to these guys and use local data.

So then you go to their next paragraph, and they're talking about um drive-bys, and they say, Oh, you shouldn't use any drive-bys.

Ask them what is it?

What is the same manual that they used to say we should use the ITE numbers, not the local numbers that were generated from studying the facilities that um CLC operates.

Let's not use that.

Let's use ITE data and ask them also what is the ITD I ITE data based on.

How many studies was that based on where?

My understanding is our four studies are the same as what the ITE studied to make their data.

So we should accept ITE from wherever versus what was studied exactly with this use.

So and and then with the drive-by, what is what is ITE allow you for drive-by.

We use five percent ITE uses double, triple, multiple times is allowed with ITE.

So I mentioned these things.

I'm not an engineer, I'm not a traffic engineer.

I I just am so disappointed at the goodwill that we were establishing, working hard to answer questions and come up with solutions here to get what we got today.

That concludes my presentation prior to 11 o'clock with interruptions and questions.

I have 1101, but we did interrupt you a couple of times.

Board, if it's okay, I'd like to um give the attorney for the um for 77 Havemeyer 10 minutes just to go through what he kind of a summary of what his issues are.

And then for the next meeting, um I'd say we could go into detail with the questions for him.

Is that okay?

Yes, Mr.

Chairman.

Okay.

So we have attorney um is it Piers?

Yes, Phil Pierce.

Okay.

Just introduce yourself and um if you could give us a 10-minute summary of what the issues are, please.

Thank you.

So my name is Phil Pierce.

I'm a principal with Conan Wolf.

Um, we represent Palmer Hill Community Association, which is the 195 unit association located to the south and east of the proposed site.

Um the legal address is 77 Havertmeyer Drive.

And as Mr.

Redness noted, uh, we're the uh the owner of Door Oliver Drive, we're the fee owner.

Um they have a uh limited right to use it.

Um but we are the fee owner.

Um we sent the letter to earlier today detailing the concerns of the association.

We also supplied our third-party uh peer review of their traffic impact study from our traffic engineer Simco Engineering.

We also provided a third-party peer review of their drainage plan from Tig and Bond, and we provided two documents regarding the history of the property.

Um, I won't go into a lot of detail on all those documents because I know you haven't read them yet, and you will.

Um, but our two main concerns that the developer has not addressed are traffic and drainage.

Um I know you're not closing the hearing tonight, but our request is that uh you deny the application without prejudice.

Um the association does support the development as a whole, does want to work with the developer, but the developer has not solved these issues yet, which is why we are here today opposing the project.

Um the proposal does not satisfy Stanford site plan review standards for safe and adequate traffic circulation, drainage adequacy, and lawful access on traffic.

Uh the regulations require safe and adequate circulation and prohibit uses that cause unusual traffic hazard or congestion.

Our peer review study found that their traffic impact study understated trips, uh, improperly apply pass by and diverted link reductions and ignored ignored the operational use of the um on-site parking layout.

Um the access to the site now is designed to solely be from a long winding private right-of-way that cannot safely or reliably handle uh the peak daycare traffic.

Necessarily because of that, you're gonna end up with queuing and overflow from the parking lot into the narrow private road.

Our traffic engineer did a minute-by-minute parking accumulation study as part of his report, and he showed that the lot will actually be over capacity during the busiest morning periods.

That's going to result in uh tight three-point turns and result in more spillover into the private road.

Um our drainage engineer um identified a number of uh deficiencies in what's proposed currently.

There were some um aspects of the properties that were not uh sufficiently modeled.

Um, there's a lot of other uh material that I'll just refer to the drainage report on.

Um, and then finally, um, you know, there's a there's a uh more of a legal issue in terms of access rights, which is that the property lacks public uh street frontage and relies and solely on this private right-of-way door Oliver Drive for its legal access.